1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:04,720 Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 2 00:00:04,800 --> 00:00:09,119 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 3 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,079 Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A 4 00:00:12,240 --> 00:00:25,599 Speaker 1: production of My Heart Radio. Hello, welcome back to the show. 5 00:00:25,680 --> 00:00:28,440 Speaker 1: My name is Matt, my name is Noel. They call 6 00:00:28,560 --> 00:00:30,840 Speaker 1: me Ben, and we are joined as always with our 7 00:00:30,920 --> 00:00:35,960 Speaker 1: super producer Paul Mission Controlled deconds. Most importantly, you are you. 8 00:00:35,960 --> 00:00:39,240 Speaker 1: You are here, and that makes this the stuff they 9 00:00:39,360 --> 00:00:43,960 Speaker 1: don't want you to know. We are required to say. Look, 10 00:00:44,040 --> 00:00:46,280 Speaker 1: we made a book. Check it out. You can also 11 00:00:46,400 --> 00:00:49,560 Speaker 1: hear it as an audio book. You can also see 12 00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:53,720 Speaker 1: us live. We are going on the road in a 13 00:00:53,920 --> 00:00:57,680 Speaker 1: couple of places and we would love to hang out 14 00:00:57,720 --> 00:01:00,760 Speaker 1: with you in person. On We're a Lemon, the day 15 00:01:00,760 --> 00:01:02,720 Speaker 1: the book comes out, we'll be here in Atlanta. On 16 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:06,080 Speaker 1: will be in d C. And on we will be 17 00:01:06,160 --> 00:01:09,200 Speaker 1: in Massachusetts. Check out stuff you should read books dot 18 00:01:09,240 --> 00:01:12,440 Speaker 1: com to find more, and definitely come and see us. Please, 19 00:01:12,720 --> 00:01:15,679 Speaker 1: if you're even close, come and see us. We'd love 20 00:01:15,680 --> 00:01:20,000 Speaker 1: to see you. And for everyone who has written to 21 00:01:20,120 --> 00:01:23,760 Speaker 1: us or reach out to us as individuals or on 22 00:01:23,800 --> 00:01:28,480 Speaker 1: our show social media asking us to go to other cities, 23 00:01:28,880 --> 00:01:33,399 Speaker 1: other countries we're with you, make a bigger stink about it. 24 00:01:33,720 --> 00:01:36,720 Speaker 1: Get your friends to say the same thing. Fight the 25 00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:41,319 Speaker 1: power today we're gonna do Oh gosh. I was recently 26 00:01:41,360 --> 00:01:46,320 Speaker 1: watching the Newest, uh, Newest Rick and Morty season, and 27 00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:51,120 Speaker 1: I love the way that they describe things and they 28 00:01:51,120 --> 00:01:54,120 Speaker 1: can be a bit meta, which isn't for everyone, But 29 00:01:55,080 --> 00:02:00,680 Speaker 1: I love those moments where Rick, voiced by just In Royland, 30 00:02:01,160 --> 00:02:04,800 Speaker 1: says something like it's it's a one and done. We're 31 00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:09,080 Speaker 1: gonna have a simple adventure Morty. More to it's just 32 00:02:09,280 --> 00:02:12,720 Speaker 1: wanted done. Classic, classic freaking Morty. That's kind of what 33 00:02:12,760 --> 00:02:17,400 Speaker 1: we're doing. Uh. Recently, you may have heard claims about 34 00:02:17,440 --> 00:02:23,919 Speaker 1: how the United States lied about its stance on UFOs. 35 00:02:23,960 --> 00:02:27,840 Speaker 1: That is absolutely true. You've probably also heard about other 36 00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:33,840 Speaker 1: governments doing the same. That is also true. But but 37 00:02:33,960 --> 00:02:43,040 Speaker 1: today's episode concerns a recently disclosed photograph that has garnered 38 00:02:43,160 --> 00:02:46,960 Speaker 1: a lot of attention in the world of ufology. Shout 39 00:02:47,000 --> 00:02:50,760 Speaker 1: out to our pals like Chris Cogswell from Mad Scientists Pod. 40 00:02:51,360 --> 00:02:55,600 Speaker 1: Also shout out to our colleagues at the Breakfast Club 41 00:02:56,120 --> 00:03:01,440 Speaker 1: who have also, it turns out, discussed this. But before 42 00:03:01,560 --> 00:03:04,960 Speaker 1: we do, our big reveal and give you our opinions. Folks, 43 00:03:05,200 --> 00:03:08,680 Speaker 1: We've got to start at the beginning. Here are the facts. 44 00:03:09,160 --> 00:03:12,680 Speaker 1: I'm sorry, it's a wamp wamp moment. There are as 45 00:03:12,760 --> 00:03:17,960 Speaker 1: of now no proven photographs of alien spacecraft, but there 46 00:03:18,000 --> 00:03:22,000 Speaker 1: are tons and tons and tons of photos of UFOs. 47 00:03:22,800 --> 00:03:25,520 Speaker 1: Riddle me this, what what's the difference there? Well, their 48 00:03:25,560 --> 00:03:28,920 Speaker 1: photos and videos, right, and recently the videos have been 49 00:03:28,919 --> 00:03:31,600 Speaker 1: making a lot of news. Uh. The thing is they 50 00:03:31,600 --> 00:03:35,880 Speaker 1: are UFOs or now U A P s unidentified aerial phenomena. 51 00:03:36,240 --> 00:03:41,640 Speaker 1: They are not conclusively known to be alien or extraterrestrial spacecraft. 52 00:03:41,760 --> 00:03:45,600 Speaker 1: That's the difference, right, Because anything that you, as the 53 00:03:45,640 --> 00:03:49,080 Speaker 1: photographer snap a picture of or take a video of 54 00:03:49,120 --> 00:03:51,080 Speaker 1: that's up in the sky that you're unaware of what 55 00:03:51,120 --> 00:03:53,520 Speaker 1: it is, is a U A P. Well it's a UFO, 56 00:03:53,680 --> 00:03:56,280 Speaker 1: I guess U A P is, Like I don't know 57 00:03:56,360 --> 00:04:01,560 Speaker 1: the is that the overall category? I guess because I 58 00:04:01,560 --> 00:04:03,400 Speaker 1: think that's how I would put it. At least, weird 59 00:04:03,520 --> 00:04:05,720 Speaker 1: rain could be a U A P. Yeah, that's right. 60 00:04:05,960 --> 00:04:09,640 Speaker 1: An oddly shaped cloud perhaps. Um. But gentlemen, you know 61 00:04:09,680 --> 00:04:12,720 Speaker 1: we've got all these photos unproven of course, and now 62 00:04:12,840 --> 00:04:14,800 Speaker 1: these you know, tic tac videos and all of that. 63 00:04:15,400 --> 00:04:18,800 Speaker 1: But what about antiquity? What about art? You know, what 64 00:04:18,839 --> 00:04:21,560 Speaker 1: about things that maybe we didn't really with a keener 65 00:04:21,720 --> 00:04:25,520 Speaker 1: I at the time realized, may have actually been depicting. 66 00:04:26,160 --> 00:04:29,800 Speaker 1: Um you u A P. S or UFOs. Yeah, that's 67 00:04:30,040 --> 00:04:31,920 Speaker 1: you know. What that reminds me of is the old 68 00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:36,680 Speaker 1: question to whom does a work of art belong? Does 69 00:04:36,720 --> 00:04:40,080 Speaker 1: it belong to the owner, does it belong to the creator, 70 00:04:40,560 --> 00:04:43,560 Speaker 1: does it belong to the audience, you know, those who 71 00:04:43,600 --> 00:04:50,320 Speaker 1: perceive it. A lot of the stuff about ancient aliens, 72 00:04:50,360 --> 00:04:53,279 Speaker 1: a lot of the Eric von danikin lore and so on, 73 00:04:53,760 --> 00:04:57,880 Speaker 1: really depends on interpretations. So you're taking a modern cultural 74 00:04:58,000 --> 00:05:04,040 Speaker 1: lens and you are applying that cultural framework too something 75 00:05:04,080 --> 00:05:08,479 Speaker 1: that was made hundreds or you know, thousands of years ago. 76 00:05:09,560 --> 00:05:12,600 Speaker 1: What you can say, if if we kind of bracket 77 00:05:12,760 --> 00:05:16,680 Speaker 1: the messy question of interpretation, what you can say is 78 00:05:16,800 --> 00:05:22,440 Speaker 1: that people, at least since the dawn of drawing have 79 00:05:22,960 --> 00:05:28,040 Speaker 1: drawn and carved depictions of strange things in the sky. 80 00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:31,880 Speaker 1: And a lot of that I'm sure is artistic license. Uh. 81 00:05:32,000 --> 00:05:35,680 Speaker 1: No one in ancient civilization has straight out said there 82 00:05:35,720 --> 00:05:39,520 Speaker 1: are aliens in the sky. Here is you know, a 83 00:05:39,600 --> 00:05:42,960 Speaker 1: drawing I made of them on this papyrus, or here 84 00:05:43,040 --> 00:05:45,880 Speaker 1: is the thing I carved into rock about my wonderful 85 00:05:45,960 --> 00:05:50,800 Speaker 1: meeting with people from beyond this earthly realm. Well, I 86 00:05:50,800 --> 00:05:53,479 Speaker 1: mean except for really like the Dogon tribe, right, they 87 00:05:53,800 --> 00:06:00,480 Speaker 1: pretty specifically noted serious amb serious. Yeah, exactly right. Yeah. 88 00:06:00,680 --> 00:06:02,880 Speaker 1: Also again, I love that you bring this up, Matt, 89 00:06:03,160 --> 00:06:08,000 Speaker 1: because then we have to ask about another kind of 90 00:06:08,320 --> 00:06:15,200 Speaker 1: application of cultural framework. The people who originally reported the 91 00:06:15,320 --> 00:06:21,120 Speaker 1: Dogon story to the wider world, where European and may 92 00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:27,360 Speaker 1: have brought some of their own interpretive baggage. Let's say 93 00:06:27,400 --> 00:06:29,520 Speaker 1: to this story, we should actually do a do an 94 00:06:29,520 --> 00:06:32,320 Speaker 1: episode on the Dogon We've mentioned them in the past 95 00:06:32,839 --> 00:06:37,880 Speaker 1: multiple times, but it bears investigation. You know already we're 96 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:41,360 Speaker 1: talking UFOs, right guys, So some of our more skeptical 97 00:06:41,440 --> 00:06:47,159 Speaker 1: conspiracy realists maybe rolling their eyes. But if you find 98 00:06:47,160 --> 00:06:50,080 Speaker 1: yourself in that number, if we caught you mid eye 99 00:06:50,200 --> 00:06:54,039 Speaker 1: roll with that statement, you might be interested to learn 100 00:06:54,520 --> 00:07:00,760 Speaker 1: that belief in not just UFOs, but extraterrestrial intelligence is 101 00:07:00,800 --> 00:07:04,760 Speaker 1: increasingly common. It's less and less rare now. As a 102 00:07:04,760 --> 00:07:07,120 Speaker 1: matter of fact, if you live in the United States 103 00:07:07,240 --> 00:07:11,720 Speaker 1: and you believe that extra terrestrial beings have visited Earth. 104 00:07:12,480 --> 00:07:16,480 Speaker 1: You are in the majority. Yeah, there's a research poll 105 00:07:16,520 --> 00:07:20,400 Speaker 1: that found fifty one of people living in this country 106 00:07:20,440 --> 00:07:24,400 Speaker 1: the United States believe quote UFOs reported by people in 107 00:07:24,440 --> 00:07:29,360 Speaker 1: the military are likely evidence of intelligent life outside Earth unquote. 108 00:07:29,640 --> 00:07:32,440 Speaker 1: And it makes sense there's now a modern reference to 109 00:07:33,120 --> 00:07:37,640 Speaker 1: recent UFO footage, right or UAP footage that people It's 110 00:07:37,640 --> 00:07:40,800 Speaker 1: at least at the front of more people's minds. Um 111 00:07:40,960 --> 00:07:45,320 Speaker 1: The question there is really are those craft extra terrestrial 112 00:07:45,440 --> 00:07:49,560 Speaker 1: or not? And yeah, but whether or not we have 113 00:07:49,800 --> 00:07:54,000 Speaker 1: more you know, quote unquote confirmed videos or at least 114 00:07:54,040 --> 00:07:56,840 Speaker 1: the acknowledgement of the government that there's something going on, 115 00:07:57,320 --> 00:07:59,680 Speaker 1: we still don't exactly have anything in the form of 116 00:07:59,720 --> 00:08:03,640 Speaker 1: as or you know, actual you know, pieces of these 117 00:08:03,680 --> 00:08:06,640 Speaker 1: crafts or something that we can really like, you know, analyze. 118 00:08:06,960 --> 00:08:10,400 Speaker 1: It's still kind of in the realm of conjecture, at 119 00:08:10,480 --> 00:08:12,800 Speaker 1: least in terms of like, you know, what we where 120 00:08:12,800 --> 00:08:15,160 Speaker 1: we think these things are from, because the government sure 121 00:08:15,200 --> 00:08:17,760 Speaker 1: isn't saying that, even if they are kind of tacitly 122 00:08:17,800 --> 00:08:20,880 Speaker 1: acknowledging that there's something there. Yeah, we certainly don't have 123 00:08:20,920 --> 00:08:26,520 Speaker 1: anything that's been publicly acknowledged. No physical evidence has been acknowledged. 124 00:08:26,520 --> 00:08:29,360 Speaker 1: We've heard tons of stories about that physical evidence that 125 00:08:29,520 --> 00:08:33,719 Speaker 1: exists somewhere out there, right, but we've never actually seen it. Yeah, 126 00:08:33,760 --> 00:08:37,880 Speaker 1: it's a it's it's touted as is somewhere between a 127 00:08:37,920 --> 00:08:43,120 Speaker 1: camp fire story and a weird never explained superpower. Right. 128 00:08:43,160 --> 00:08:48,559 Speaker 1: Shout out to Big Low Airspace, who have repeatedly publicly 129 00:08:48,640 --> 00:08:54,080 Speaker 1: stated that they are in possession of um materials and 130 00:08:54,240 --> 00:09:01,040 Speaker 1: artifacts unknown to humanity, and for one reason another, they 131 00:09:01,120 --> 00:09:06,400 Speaker 1: have yet to release any physical evidence of those claims 132 00:09:06,440 --> 00:09:08,520 Speaker 1: to back them up at least. But if you are 133 00:09:08,559 --> 00:09:12,720 Speaker 1: a true believer, then you may feel the evidence is everywhere. 134 00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:16,760 Speaker 1: You may feel that people are in fact being willfully 135 00:09:16,800 --> 00:09:22,080 Speaker 1: ignorant or purposely misleading when they talk about these things. 136 00:09:22,960 --> 00:09:27,040 Speaker 1: But also, you know, there's an emotional element to it. 137 00:09:27,120 --> 00:09:30,559 Speaker 1: I would argue, because human beings have been taking photos 138 00:09:30,600 --> 00:09:34,280 Speaker 1: of unidentified things in the sky were so much longer 139 00:09:34,880 --> 00:09:37,959 Speaker 1: then people might know. Uh. And we're not talking now. 140 00:09:38,000 --> 00:09:40,680 Speaker 1: We're not talking about, you know, the von Dannikins of 141 00:09:40,720 --> 00:09:46,280 Speaker 1: the world looking at ancient carvings and putting their own 142 00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:51,360 Speaker 1: spin on it. We're talking about actually there we go, 143 00:09:51,760 --> 00:09:54,680 Speaker 1: shout it up. I like it. Uh, we're we're talking 144 00:09:54,800 --> 00:10:03,839 Speaker 1: about genuine photographs. Since the advent of photo technology, people 145 00:10:03,880 --> 00:10:07,880 Speaker 1: have been tried to snap cool, exclusive picks of weird stuff. 146 00:10:08,400 --> 00:10:14,160 Speaker 1: I was surprised that the first generally acknowledged UFO photograph 147 00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:18,000 Speaker 1: dates all the way back to eighteen seventy one in 148 00:10:18,200 --> 00:10:22,880 Speaker 1: Mount Washington, New Hampshire. And I included a picture of 149 00:10:22,920 --> 00:10:26,760 Speaker 1: this because I would love to get you guys take 150 00:10:26,880 --> 00:10:30,839 Speaker 1: on it. I just gave you the image, so no, 151 00:10:31,080 --> 00:10:33,720 Speaker 1: you're coming in fresh if you haven't seen this. There's 152 00:10:33,720 --> 00:10:37,760 Speaker 1: no caption, just tell us what. I'll tell you what 153 00:10:37,800 --> 00:10:41,240 Speaker 1: I see. I see something that appears to be clouds, 154 00:10:41,320 --> 00:10:45,400 Speaker 1: but is not clouds because of the way they are formed. 155 00:10:45,840 --> 00:10:50,120 Speaker 1: I'm telling you right now, these things are not clouds. Also, 156 00:10:50,240 --> 00:10:52,960 Speaker 1: it looks like there's a tiny little cigar shaped thing 157 00:10:53,760 --> 00:10:56,560 Speaker 1: in two photographs. It looks to be two photographs that 158 00:10:56,720 --> 00:11:00,000 Speaker 1: were maybe taken from a flying craft where the photographer 159 00:11:00,160 --> 00:11:03,680 Speaker 1: is is moving horizontally, so you get a slight perspective change, 160 00:11:03,800 --> 00:11:07,160 Speaker 1: like one shot taken here and the next shot taken 161 00:11:07,200 --> 00:11:11,280 Speaker 1: a little further along. Um, but dang, it just looks 162 00:11:11,320 --> 00:11:14,160 Speaker 1: like a manipulated photograph to me. Yeah, it looks like 163 00:11:14,200 --> 00:11:17,200 Speaker 1: there's it looks like there's some fuzz, you know what 164 00:11:17,240 --> 00:11:21,680 Speaker 1: I mean, there's some schmutz on the lens maybe or 165 00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:26,840 Speaker 1: something went wrong in the development process of the photo. Still, 166 00:11:27,000 --> 00:11:33,640 Speaker 1: but look how textured those clouds are. It looks like, um, 167 00:11:33,920 --> 00:11:36,240 Speaker 1: it just looks like a completely different texture than clouds 168 00:11:36,280 --> 00:11:38,480 Speaker 1: to me. But I don't know, that's just me. Yeah, 169 00:11:38,559 --> 00:11:41,320 Speaker 1: it looks like tissue paper or something. It's got like 170 00:11:41,360 --> 00:11:44,760 Speaker 1: this wet, kind of textured look to it, or like 171 00:11:45,160 --> 00:11:49,079 Speaker 1: some sort of fabric. Very and yeah, and you're right, 172 00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:52,400 Speaker 1: that little thing, that little blip in the foreground that 173 00:11:52,559 --> 00:11:54,800 Speaker 1: is that's not that isn't that doesn't really blend in 174 00:11:54,840 --> 00:11:59,600 Speaker 1: with the surrounding environment at all. Wait wait wait are 175 00:11:59,640 --> 00:12:02,520 Speaker 1: you are you guys telling me this is not fundamentally 176 00:12:02,760 --> 00:12:09,280 Speaker 1: changed your opinion on extraterrestrial life. Uh and UFOs, it's 177 00:12:09,320 --> 00:12:13,320 Speaker 1: not enough. Not currently, I'm just trying to figure out 178 00:12:13,320 --> 00:12:18,720 Speaker 1: how they made those mashed potatoes to look like the 179 00:12:18,760 --> 00:12:21,280 Speaker 1: most fluffy clouds I've ever seen. It looks like paper 180 00:12:21,360 --> 00:12:23,840 Speaker 1: machee or something like it's it really does look like 181 00:12:23,920 --> 00:12:28,920 Speaker 1: a glue, kind of like a papery mass that was 182 00:12:28,960 --> 00:12:32,720 Speaker 1: sort of textured informed it's a super low res image 183 00:12:32,760 --> 00:12:34,560 Speaker 1: to you, guys. I've got it blown up like crazy 184 00:12:34,559 --> 00:12:37,320 Speaker 1: on my screen, so the pixels are doing some blending. 185 00:12:38,120 --> 00:12:42,560 Speaker 1: But there is one tiny bit of the reported UFO here, 186 00:12:42,559 --> 00:12:46,160 Speaker 1: alleged UFO that is on the far left of it, 187 00:12:46,520 --> 00:12:51,559 Speaker 1: that does appear to be similar, if not the same. 188 00:12:52,679 --> 00:12:55,120 Speaker 1: I don't know. I'd love to see a full res 189 00:12:55,200 --> 00:12:56,960 Speaker 1: image of that, or at least a you know, an 190 00:12:56,960 --> 00:13:01,599 Speaker 1: original or something. Yeah. The this was taken by Amos F. 191 00:13:01,840 --> 00:13:06,280 Speaker 1: Kloud and Howard A. Kembell in eight seventy one. They 192 00:13:06,280 --> 00:13:10,920 Speaker 1: were on a meteorological expeditions, so they weren't out purposely 193 00:13:11,040 --> 00:13:18,000 Speaker 1: trying to staff photos of anything but weather related phenomenon. Uh. 194 00:13:18,240 --> 00:13:21,920 Speaker 1: You might be interested to know the photo came into 195 00:13:22,120 --> 00:13:26,480 Speaker 1: the public eye in two thousand and two. It got 196 00:13:26,520 --> 00:13:32,400 Speaker 1: purchased on eBay the original by a guy named Samuel M. Sherman, 197 00:13:32,480 --> 00:13:37,559 Speaker 1: who was then president of the Independent International Pictures Corporation. 198 00:13:38,080 --> 00:13:42,440 Speaker 1: So check that out again. Eight seventy one UFO photo 199 00:13:43,080 --> 00:13:48,600 Speaker 1: Mount Washington. Uh, and let us know your thoughts. We're 200 00:13:49,120 --> 00:13:52,560 Speaker 1: showing you this just to establish the track record that 201 00:13:52,720 --> 00:13:59,880 Speaker 1: humanity has with photographing UFOs, and especially in recent years. 202 00:14:00,160 --> 00:14:04,320 Speaker 1: Shout out to our good pal Jeremy Corbell, there have 203 00:14:04,360 --> 00:14:11,120 Speaker 1: been even more um let's say, high fidelity photographs and 204 00:14:13,559 --> 00:14:18,280 Speaker 1: video coming out that people appear to be at a 205 00:14:18,320 --> 00:14:23,320 Speaker 1: loss to explain. Also, when you're talking about mysteries, I 206 00:14:23,400 --> 00:14:26,920 Speaker 1: was not aware of this. We don't actually know who 207 00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:31,920 Speaker 1: discovered the initial principles leading to photography, the two fundamental 208 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:39,560 Speaker 1: principles camera obscura and the first time that someone said, oh, 209 00:14:39,640 --> 00:14:45,080 Speaker 1: this stuff changes when you put it in sunlight. Those 210 00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:50,760 Speaker 1: two discoveries date back into antiquity. Right now as we're recording, 211 00:14:51,320 --> 00:14:55,440 Speaker 1: all that we know, all that anyone knows is there 212 00:14:55,520 --> 00:15:01,120 Speaker 1: is no record of people trying to make photographs before 213 00:15:02,360 --> 00:15:06,680 Speaker 1: sometime in the seventeen hundreds. But I I feel like 214 00:15:06,960 --> 00:15:10,680 Speaker 1: all three of us are probably old hands at looking 215 00:15:10,720 --> 00:15:17,200 Speaker 1: at UFO photographs, purported photographs of alien craft, and look, 216 00:15:17,880 --> 00:15:22,000 Speaker 1: you know a lot of them are proven hoaxes or 217 00:15:22,440 --> 00:15:28,160 Speaker 1: they have fairly solid mundane explanations. Well, you know, it 218 00:15:28,200 --> 00:15:31,840 Speaker 1: also makes me think of like the coddingly fairy photographs 219 00:15:31,920 --> 00:15:35,600 Speaker 1: that had Sir Arthur Conan Doyle all twisted up and 220 00:15:35,640 --> 00:15:38,440 Speaker 1: basically got him to kind of publicly embarrass himself taking 221 00:15:38,440 --> 00:15:40,480 Speaker 1: a photograph in those days and in the day, the 222 00:15:40,480 --> 00:15:42,440 Speaker 1: early days that we're talking about here was very, very 223 00:15:42,440 --> 00:15:47,160 Speaker 1: difficult to do convincingly. Um. So there's also a certain 224 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:49,960 Speaker 1: amount of like the power of belief involved too, as 225 00:15:50,000 --> 00:15:52,000 Speaker 1: there you know, continues to be today. But I think 226 00:15:52,040 --> 00:15:56,000 Speaker 1: now we're so jaded by fake images and and you know, 227 00:15:56,120 --> 00:15:58,800 Speaker 1: photoshop jobs and stuff like that, that we're all looking 228 00:15:58,880 --> 00:16:02,240 Speaker 1: at things which much more of a discerning eye. Um 229 00:16:02,280 --> 00:16:04,400 Speaker 1: and maybe that power of belief has sort of waned 230 00:16:04,440 --> 00:16:07,000 Speaker 1: a little bit, well, wasn't. It's a really interesting point there, 231 00:16:07,000 --> 00:16:09,680 Speaker 1: not because if you think we we always talk about 232 00:16:09,720 --> 00:16:13,840 Speaker 1: technology as magic, right, just realized and when when you 233 00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:17,840 Speaker 1: think about that time frame right after a new technology 234 00:16:18,040 --> 00:16:21,920 Speaker 1: is being invented and starting to be adopted, there is 235 00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:24,840 Speaker 1: so much maybe wonder and off for the lay person 236 00:16:24,880 --> 00:16:27,920 Speaker 1: that doesn't know about it, right, And it's that it's 237 00:16:27,960 --> 00:16:31,360 Speaker 1: that magic side of the technology where you're still trying 238 00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:34,080 Speaker 1: to understand what it is. So I think there's probably 239 00:16:34,120 --> 00:16:37,600 Speaker 1: a really great window at the beginning of a technology 240 00:16:37,840 --> 00:16:42,600 Speaker 1: to trick lay people with it. Uh for someone who 241 00:16:42,680 --> 00:16:44,600 Speaker 1: is you know, early on in the in the know 242 00:16:44,800 --> 00:16:47,320 Speaker 1: about it. I don't know, Just just make me think 243 00:16:47,320 --> 00:16:50,320 Speaker 1: about that with these sort I agree with you, Matt. Also, yes, 244 00:16:50,360 --> 00:16:53,920 Speaker 1: folks that we know the Arthur C. Clark quote, and 245 00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:56,520 Speaker 1: I think we agree with it. Technology past some certain 246 00:16:56,560 --> 00:17:02,440 Speaker 1: threshold is indistinguishable from magic, I'm paraphrasing. I would also advance, 247 00:17:02,480 --> 00:17:05,399 Speaker 1: I would I would move that argument you're making a 248 00:17:05,440 --> 00:17:10,040 Speaker 1: bit further along and say that people aren't necessarily trying 249 00:17:10,080 --> 00:17:15,160 Speaker 1: to trick one another in that window of wonder. Let's 250 00:17:15,240 --> 00:17:20,480 Speaker 1: call it that people inventors and pioneers often end up 251 00:17:20,720 --> 00:17:28,120 Speaker 1: tricking themselves. History is replete with cases of great inventors 252 00:17:28,720 --> 00:17:32,120 Speaker 1: who thought their inventions did more than they did, right. 253 00:17:32,240 --> 00:17:36,920 Speaker 1: It's not uncommon for one human being to find, say 254 00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:42,680 Speaker 1: a medicinal application of a plant, right, or to discover 255 00:17:42,920 --> 00:17:46,720 Speaker 1: a new treatment for something, and then immediately, just like 256 00:17:46,760 --> 00:17:51,800 Speaker 1: the guy who invented the practice of chiropractics, they can 257 00:17:51,920 --> 00:17:55,640 Speaker 1: say this cures everything. If I just mess with your 258 00:17:55,680 --> 00:18:00,320 Speaker 1: spine in the right way, I will cure you are 259 00:18:00,440 --> 00:18:04,880 Speaker 1: serious non spine related medical condition. All. I will put 260 00:18:04,920 --> 00:18:07,760 Speaker 1: these pins inside your back, on your face, and you 261 00:18:07,800 --> 00:18:11,320 Speaker 1: will be cure. Well. That was also at a time 262 00:18:11,359 --> 00:18:15,960 Speaker 1: before like licensing was even needed or even oversight, So yeah, 263 00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:20,160 Speaker 1: a lot of those folks were really practicing. That's another point. 264 00:18:20,800 --> 00:18:26,159 Speaker 1: When you believe something you can change. You can change, um, 265 00:18:26,280 --> 00:18:27,720 Speaker 1: not only how you think about it and how you 266 00:18:27,800 --> 00:18:30,919 Speaker 1: view it, but sometimes how your body reacts to things. Right, 267 00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:33,840 Speaker 1: when you believe something so fully and strong enough. We've 268 00:18:33,840 --> 00:18:37,959 Speaker 1: seen that. Uh, we've seen that principle. The placebo effect 269 00:18:38,440 --> 00:18:42,200 Speaker 1: is real. Yeah, and appears to be accelerated. I feel 270 00:18:42,200 --> 00:18:44,960 Speaker 1: like the moment is past, but I'm gonna say it anyway, 271 00:18:45,040 --> 00:18:48,480 Speaker 1: because I believe in this thought. Uh. It is interesting 272 00:18:49,359 --> 00:18:53,359 Speaker 1: that no one needs a license to take a photograph. 273 00:18:53,480 --> 00:18:57,119 Speaker 1: It is orwellian to imagine a world where something like 274 00:18:57,200 --> 00:19:00,600 Speaker 1: that is the case. But that's that's another thinging that 275 00:19:01,320 --> 00:19:05,359 Speaker 1: must be considered when we're talking about photographs of things 276 00:19:05,359 --> 00:19:09,320 Speaker 1: that appear inexplicable or strange. That people who take these 277 00:19:09,320 --> 00:19:14,800 Speaker 1: photographs are not necessarily professional photographers, and they don't have 278 00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:19,280 Speaker 1: to be. There's no waiting period or background check when 279 00:19:19,359 --> 00:19:22,840 Speaker 1: you buy a camera. You know, most people have cameras 280 00:19:22,880 --> 00:19:28,280 Speaker 1: on their phones or they have no kias. Anyhow, There's 281 00:19:28,359 --> 00:19:33,040 Speaker 1: one photo that garnered a great deal of attention quite recently. 282 00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:38,639 Speaker 1: Part of this is due to the story behind it, uh, 283 00:19:38,640 --> 00:19:43,480 Speaker 1: And it's a good story. Uh. This photo was also 284 00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:47,200 Speaker 1: kept from the public for years. There's a bit of 285 00:19:47,680 --> 00:19:53,320 Speaker 1: state security around it that's often misreported, and then part 286 00:19:53,359 --> 00:19:57,240 Speaker 1: of it is due to just h just look at it, folks. 287 00:19:57,320 --> 00:20:00,080 Speaker 1: All you have to do is pull up cal l 288 00:20:00,160 --> 00:20:05,000 Speaker 1: Vine UFO Scotland. You can add photo in there if 289 00:20:05,000 --> 00:20:08,520 Speaker 1: you want to enhance your search. But what you will 290 00:20:08,600 --> 00:20:13,680 Speaker 1: see is, uh, well, you know what. Let's pause. Let's 291 00:20:13,680 --> 00:20:16,399 Speaker 1: pause for word from our sponsor. Give all of us 292 00:20:16,400 --> 00:20:18,679 Speaker 1: a chance to look at it. We'll be back to 293 00:20:18,720 --> 00:20:30,440 Speaker 1: explore this question. What is the Calvine ufo. Here's where 294 00:20:30,440 --> 00:20:34,919 Speaker 1: it gets crazy, all right, before we dive in. We 295 00:20:34,960 --> 00:20:39,880 Speaker 1: are not Scottish Calvine, Calvin, I think Calvine. We're going 296 00:20:39,960 --> 00:20:43,200 Speaker 1: with it seems fair v I n E. I mean 297 00:20:43,240 --> 00:20:44,639 Speaker 1: if it was Calvin, I would I would hope they 298 00:20:44,680 --> 00:20:46,960 Speaker 1: would have been kind enough to leave the e off. Well. 299 00:20:47,440 --> 00:20:50,960 Speaker 1: Initial reactions, UM, I know this is not the first 300 00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:55,040 Speaker 1: time the three of us have looked at this photograph. 301 00:20:54,840 --> 00:20:58,040 Speaker 1: H what do you what do you guys think? Just 302 00:20:58,960 --> 00:21:01,560 Speaker 1: I will say it. It looks cool. It looks like 303 00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:06,400 Speaker 1: a steampunk dirigible. Honestly, yeah, it's a cool photo. There's 304 00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:13,560 Speaker 1: no question about it. No such Bizarro cloud shapes and textures. Um, 305 00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:17,439 Speaker 1: the thing is it's almost diamond shaped. It's like a 306 00:21:17,480 --> 00:21:21,359 Speaker 1: squashed diamond, which if you'll recall I've often recounted my 307 00:21:21,560 --> 00:21:25,080 Speaker 1: uh my, my, would be potential sighting of a UFO 308 00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:28,399 Speaker 1: in Nebraska and it was a diamond. This is really 309 00:21:28,440 --> 00:21:30,919 Speaker 1: like like triggering me because it really looked very similar 310 00:21:30,960 --> 00:21:32,959 Speaker 1: to this and it had a similar like you know, 311 00:21:33,160 --> 00:21:36,399 Speaker 1: um distance on the horizon. It's weird though. Underneath is 312 00:21:36,440 --> 00:21:40,360 Speaker 1: that like a small prop plane. It's almost like for scale, 313 00:21:41,119 --> 00:21:45,439 Speaker 1: there's a second plane. Well it's maybe a fighter jet, right, Uh, 314 00:21:45,840 --> 00:21:50,560 Speaker 1: it might be a harrier right right right, Possibly it's interesting, 315 00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:54,159 Speaker 1: but yeah, there's a there's right right. And because they 316 00:21:54,160 --> 00:21:57,440 Speaker 1: couldn't get a banana up into the sky, so they 317 00:21:57,480 --> 00:22:01,639 Speaker 1: got a human made craft. Yeah. This is called the 318 00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:06,520 Speaker 1: Calvine photograph. It looks like a jet, like a fighter jet, 319 00:22:07,080 --> 00:22:12,360 Speaker 1: as we said, harrier jets, very similar thing. We owe 320 00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:14,840 Speaker 1: a lot of the work on this to a journalist 321 00:22:14,960 --> 00:22:20,520 Speaker 1: and associate professor at Sheffield Hallam University, one Dr David Clark. 322 00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:27,760 Speaker 1: Clark eventually brought this photo to the world, and before 323 00:22:27,760 --> 00:22:30,880 Speaker 1: we dive into his story, let's give you the background 324 00:22:30,880 --> 00:22:36,200 Speaker 1: the facts as we know, on August four, two hikers 325 00:22:36,960 --> 00:22:40,679 Speaker 1: who have not been publicly identified and will not be 326 00:22:40,800 --> 00:22:45,400 Speaker 1: publicly identified for many years. They were on this hillside, 327 00:22:45,480 --> 00:22:50,159 Speaker 1: per their story, near Calvin Calvine is about thirty five 328 00:22:50,320 --> 00:22:56,440 Speaker 1: miles northwest of place called Perth in Scotland. And these 329 00:22:56,520 --> 00:23:03,280 Speaker 1: hikers see this metallic object and from what they from 330 00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:05,959 Speaker 1: what they told the press, uh, they could tell it 331 00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:09,159 Speaker 1: was metal and it would look to be about a 332 00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:13,200 Speaker 1: hundred feet long from their observation, and it was they 333 00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:19,640 Speaker 1: associated it with this low hum and they watched it, 334 00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:25,480 Speaker 1: not briefly, they watched it for ten minutes. And then 335 00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:31,040 Speaker 1: they saw the fighter jets. Yeah, well, which makes you think, well, 336 00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:34,520 Speaker 1: perhaps those fighter jets were dispatched to that object because 337 00:23:34,520 --> 00:23:38,760 Speaker 1: the military was aware. Right, That's at least that's the speculation, right, 338 00:23:38,800 --> 00:23:42,400 Speaker 1: that's the story your mind generates. Um. And then also 339 00:23:42,480 --> 00:23:45,440 Speaker 1: according to the story, these guys, after they took the photographs, 340 00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:49,360 Speaker 1: they sent him over to a publication called the Daily Record, 341 00:23:50,040 --> 00:23:52,719 Speaker 1: which you know, if you really think you've got something, 342 00:23:53,880 --> 00:23:56,640 Speaker 1: you probably would send it out and try and get 343 00:23:56,680 --> 00:23:59,600 Speaker 1: it published somewhere. Maybe, I mean, what in hopes of 344 00:23:59,680 --> 00:24:02,560 Speaker 1: like paid either in the hopes of getting paid or 345 00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:05,359 Speaker 1: just in that moment of wonder that we're talking about, like, Wow, 346 00:24:05,400 --> 00:24:07,840 Speaker 1: this is amazing. Look at this thing I discovered. Maybe 347 00:24:09,040 --> 00:24:12,000 Speaker 1: maybe it's real and there are and aliens are real 348 00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:14,200 Speaker 1: and I need to tell the world, or maybe even 349 00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:17,840 Speaker 1: I could get paid, or at least I could get famous. Yeah, 350 00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:20,560 Speaker 1: it's a way, I guess I'm just still stuck on Nope. 351 00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:22,359 Speaker 1: A little bit of that movie is all about getting 352 00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:24,840 Speaker 1: that money shot, you know, and getting paid and like, 353 00:24:24,920 --> 00:24:27,840 Speaker 1: you know, becoming famous for your discovery. I was wonder 354 00:24:27,880 --> 00:24:29,840 Speaker 1: if that any of that was running through their minds 355 00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:32,800 Speaker 1: as well. We cannot know because we do not know 356 00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:37,000 Speaker 1: their identities. That's uh, and they have never made a 357 00:24:37,040 --> 00:24:42,080 Speaker 1: public statement about it. They sent, uh, the negatives of 358 00:24:42,119 --> 00:24:47,360 Speaker 1: the photos to a newspaper, Scotland's Daily Record. The paper 359 00:24:48,160 --> 00:24:54,040 Speaker 1: then sent those photos to the Ministry of Defense, and 360 00:24:55,520 --> 00:25:00,600 Speaker 1: the Daily Record didn't publish the photos. According to the Lore, 361 00:25:01,000 --> 00:25:04,800 Speaker 1: the Ministry of Defense buried the story as well. They 362 00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:09,720 Speaker 1: suppressed it. And we'll see how that's maybe not not 363 00:25:09,920 --> 00:25:14,040 Speaker 1: as extreme as it sounds. So we pulled some excerpts 364 00:25:14,359 --> 00:25:19,520 Speaker 1: from David Clark's website. From Dr Clark's website and he 365 00:25:20,359 --> 00:25:25,679 Speaker 1: name checks a guy named Nick Pope. Nick Pope hipped 366 00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:30,920 Speaker 1: Dr Clark to this series of photographs in a book 367 00:25:30,920 --> 00:25:37,000 Speaker 1: he wrote called Open Skies, Closed Minds. I love the title. Uh. 368 00:25:37,040 --> 00:25:42,520 Speaker 1: This book is an account of Clark's time working in 369 00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:46,040 Speaker 1: a real life X files job. He was at the 370 00:25:46,080 --> 00:25:53,119 Speaker 1: Ministry of Defenses UFO desk, and he says his experience 371 00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:56,720 Speaker 1: working there transformed him from a skeptic to a believer. 372 00:25:57,119 --> 00:26:00,399 Speaker 1: He was a civil servant, That's the only way he 373 00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:04,640 Speaker 1: learned about the Calvine photos. He says, this is one 374 00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:11,000 Speaker 1: of the most intriguing incidents or pieces of purported evidence 375 00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:15,320 Speaker 1: in the entire collection of the m O D. And 376 00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:19,320 Speaker 1: no one in the UFO community had heard of these 377 00:26:19,359 --> 00:26:23,840 Speaker 1: photos other than I guess those two hikers until Pope's 378 00:26:23,880 --> 00:26:27,720 Speaker 1: book was published, and no one in the media had 379 00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:32,399 Speaker 1: talked about them. Clark was eventually able to interview Pope, 380 00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:35,400 Speaker 1: and you can find a fascinating excerpt of the interview 381 00:26:35,920 --> 00:26:39,520 Speaker 1: on Clark's website. Let's do it, I suggest we go 382 00:26:39,640 --> 00:26:46,400 Speaker 1: for a dramatic reading. Who wants to play Clark? Who 383 00:26:46,480 --> 00:26:51,119 Speaker 1: wants to play Pope? Oh? Oh uh? How about Pope? 384 00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:57,040 Speaker 1: Can I be Pope? Sure? For sure, Clark says in 385 00:26:57,080 --> 00:27:00,879 Speaker 1: response to a question concerning a photo take in Scotland 386 00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:05,400 Speaker 1: that was mentioned in Open Skies, Closed Minds, Nick Pope responded, 387 00:27:05,680 --> 00:27:09,879 Speaker 1: it was taken I think in nine and ninety before 388 00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:12,800 Speaker 1: my tour of duty, and it was actually you know, 389 00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:14,880 Speaker 1: I'm a big fan of your voice where You're sure 390 00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:17,600 Speaker 1: about this one though, because this is long excerpt and 391 00:27:17,760 --> 00:27:20,760 Speaker 1: it was actually in post her form, blown up by 392 00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:24,000 Speaker 1: various people who had looked at it and stuck on 393 00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:28,360 Speaker 1: the wall. It was really it really was Fox Mulder stuff. 394 00:27:28,840 --> 00:27:31,040 Speaker 1: It didn't have I wanted to believe on it, but 395 00:27:31,119 --> 00:27:33,520 Speaker 1: it was on the office wall when I joined. I 396 00:27:33,560 --> 00:27:35,359 Speaker 1: don't know why British people always have to feel like 397 00:27:35,359 --> 00:27:37,320 Speaker 1: an old like colonel or something, but thank you Ben 398 00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:40,280 Speaker 1: for not allowing me to continue in that absurd high voice. 399 00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:43,359 Speaker 1: It subsequently came to be removed, but it was there, 400 00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:45,400 Speaker 1: and it had, as far as I can recall, been 401 00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:49,120 Speaker 1: taken by two people who had been out walking in Pilgrim, 402 00:27:49,800 --> 00:27:52,520 Speaker 1: who had heard a low humming sound, looked around, done 403 00:27:52,520 --> 00:27:55,240 Speaker 1: a double take, shot off. I think I'm not sure 404 00:27:55,280 --> 00:27:57,160 Speaker 1: if they shot off a few pictures of just one, 405 00:27:57,320 --> 00:28:01,760 Speaker 1: but it had been sent to the mod the Ministry 406 00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:07,560 Speaker 1: of Defense. Such a fan of your voice work, both 407 00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:10,359 Speaker 1: of you. I've seen so many interviews of Nick Pope 408 00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:13,800 Speaker 1: and you are just spot on there and shut up. 409 00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:19,800 Speaker 1: He We we actually all have a lot of fun, 410 00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:24,639 Speaker 1: uh doing doing voice work. We we do it for 411 00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:28,520 Speaker 1: many other shows in our network. And whenever you hear 412 00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:31,640 Speaker 1: us doing voices that we think are fun, know that 413 00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:35,800 Speaker 1: we are doing it with great affection and respect. Oh yeah, 414 00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:39,000 Speaker 1: I just want to point out here, uh, Nick Pope. 415 00:28:39,600 --> 00:28:41,920 Speaker 1: He makes a reference to Fox Molder there, which is 416 00:28:42,040 --> 00:28:44,720 Speaker 1: very interesting to me because that's around the time the 417 00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:49,640 Speaker 1: X Files is becoming a thing, and I'm just imagining 418 00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:52,120 Speaker 1: him in his office. Uh. I don't know if he's 419 00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:55,320 Speaker 1: at the Ministry of Defense, and I think maybe he was. 420 00:28:55,440 --> 00:28:59,080 Speaker 1: That's where the UFO project was actually occurring for the 421 00:28:59,200 --> 00:29:01,280 Speaker 1: UK government in that time when he was running it, 422 00:29:01,360 --> 00:29:03,840 Speaker 1: or he was at least a major part of it. Um. 423 00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:06,960 Speaker 1: I imagine him in a basement office, much like Fox, 424 00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:09,800 Speaker 1: with that picture on his ball. The way he describes it, 425 00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:14,600 Speaker 1: it's pretty pretty wonderful to imagine that. Agreed. It also 426 00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:18,120 Speaker 1: goes on and he's saying, you know, this had been 427 00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:24,360 Speaker 1: looked at extensively by experts or, as as Nick Pope 428 00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:28,000 Speaker 1: puts it, some people who would know a lot about 429 00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:32,920 Speaker 1: that sort of thing. Uh. And they said, these RMOD 430 00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:36,720 Speaker 1: experts or consultants at least, they said, this looks like 431 00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:41,040 Speaker 1: a solid structure and object, not weird weather. It doesn't 432 00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:44,400 Speaker 1: look like a hoax to them, and they have been 433 00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:49,520 Speaker 1: able to make some guestimations about its size. They started 434 00:29:49,840 --> 00:29:55,360 Speaker 1: speculating on aerodynamics, propulsion and things like that, and there 435 00:29:55,440 --> 00:29:59,040 Speaker 1: was a perception certain quartas that this was for real, 436 00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:02,960 Speaker 1: that it was a good one. And I think that's 437 00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:06,720 Speaker 1: so cool the way he's talking about it, because this 438 00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:11,640 Speaker 1: photo essentially became office art and no one was sure 439 00:30:12,360 --> 00:30:16,000 Speaker 1: what it what it was, but they thought it was cool. 440 00:30:16,600 --> 00:30:20,600 Speaker 1: And Nick Pope has um a funny kind of catch 441 00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:25,560 Speaker 1: twenty two story about how he lost the photo due 442 00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:29,280 Speaker 1: to the news about a craft built by the US 443 00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:33,240 Speaker 1: called Aurora. Mm hmm. I just want to point out, 444 00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:35,920 Speaker 1: I don't know how they can make any assumptions about 445 00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:41,080 Speaker 1: how large that craft is. I don't understand that, you know, 446 00:30:41,320 --> 00:30:45,920 Speaker 1: I think, yeah, I'm with you, I think, to be honest, 447 00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:47,959 Speaker 1: and there's not a ding on the on the folks 448 00:30:48,040 --> 00:30:52,240 Speaker 1: making those speculations. It feels almost to me like it 449 00:30:52,360 --> 00:30:57,120 Speaker 1: was water cooler talk or tea time talk. Maybe they 450 00:30:57,240 --> 00:31:01,760 Speaker 1: got around the poster right and going, you know, by jove, 451 00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:06,920 Speaker 1: look at that shape. How do you think it moves? 452 00:31:07,040 --> 00:31:12,840 Speaker 1: And someone else says, I imagine something sort of propulsion system. 453 00:31:12,640 --> 00:31:15,040 Speaker 1: I'm having a quick bite of their egg salad on 454 00:31:15,200 --> 00:31:24,280 Speaker 1: Rye water Crest. Jeez. Yeah, the Queen's dead. Wow. Old 455 00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:28,200 Speaker 1: woman passes away peacefully in sleep. That should have been 456 00:31:28,200 --> 00:31:32,600 Speaker 1: the headline there. I know there's involved people. I just 457 00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:35,200 Speaker 1: it seems like he will die every day. I know. 458 00:31:35,640 --> 00:31:39,640 Speaker 1: It's it's like she was surrounded by loved ones. There 459 00:31:39,720 --> 00:31:42,440 Speaker 1: is a massive legacy there, and it is fascinating that 460 00:31:42,880 --> 00:31:45,840 Speaker 1: in on the planet there is a new king in 461 00:31:45,920 --> 00:31:50,560 Speaker 1: two which is very fascinating. That's pretty nuts, and a 462 00:31:50,560 --> 00:31:54,560 Speaker 1: new prime minister like like within yes, and Henry Kissinger 463 00:31:55,600 --> 00:32:01,320 Speaker 1: still kicking. The Kissinger is still around. I like, I 464 00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:05,320 Speaker 1: am plugged in. I get news alerts just in case 465 00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:10,120 Speaker 1: he's years old. Yea, I will be turned into a 466 00:32:10,240 --> 00:32:14,760 Speaker 1: different body when my time will come. Yes, just so. 467 00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:18,000 Speaker 1: I think the deal he made is he got ten 468 00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:22,920 Speaker 1: extra minutes of life added to his span for every 469 00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:26,720 Speaker 1: innocent person who died as a result of his actions. 470 00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:30,360 Speaker 1: I thought you're gonna say war crime he encouraged. He's 471 00:32:30,400 --> 00:32:32,480 Speaker 1: a war criminal. I don't even know if the U 472 00:32:32,560 --> 00:32:34,800 Speaker 1: s would storm the Hague for him. To be honest, 473 00:32:36,280 --> 00:32:40,480 Speaker 1: they would legally have to. But yes, we we are 474 00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:45,640 Speaker 1: not meaning to sound callous or cold. For seventy years, 475 00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:51,080 Speaker 1: Queen Elizabeth the Second reigned over the United Kingdom and 476 00:32:51,360 --> 00:33:00,120 Speaker 1: its territories, which means that possibly she was aware of 477 00:33:00,360 --> 00:33:05,400 Speaker 1: this photograph brought it back. Uh, probably not. Probably. If 478 00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:11,320 Speaker 1: you are a monarch of an empire like the UK, 479 00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:14,760 Speaker 1: you probably have other stuff that you have to worry about. 480 00:33:15,360 --> 00:33:18,280 Speaker 1: I'm gonna say, I think if you're a monarch, you 481 00:33:18,320 --> 00:33:22,440 Speaker 1: have a great deal of interest in potential extraterrestrial life 482 00:33:22,600 --> 00:33:27,000 Speaker 1: and or secret technology like that. I think the Queen 483 00:33:27,040 --> 00:33:30,000 Speaker 1: was all over this photo, do you think so? Yeah? Baby, 484 00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:32,680 Speaker 1: all right, you know what, let's go with it. Yes, 485 00:33:32,800 --> 00:33:37,200 Speaker 1: and Matt, Yes, and she was. She was not just interested, 486 00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:40,240 Speaker 1: but she was the one who ordered the cover up 487 00:33:40,640 --> 00:33:45,400 Speaker 1: because she took it. She liked the poster and put 488 00:33:45,400 --> 00:33:48,280 Speaker 1: it in in a bucket of palace in a secret room 489 00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:53,720 Speaker 1: of cool posters. That's that's most of the palace actually 490 00:33:53,800 --> 00:33:57,760 Speaker 1: is that secret room and it's just posters. That's that's 491 00:33:57,800 --> 00:34:00,680 Speaker 1: the big secret. But the queen had a secret chill spot, 492 00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:04,200 Speaker 1: you know, with couches and like a beer fridge and 493 00:34:04,240 --> 00:34:08,120 Speaker 1: like a Neon sign, X files, posters and stuff like that. 494 00:34:09,200 --> 00:34:15,560 Speaker 1: Hope had va lamp, a snooker table, perhaps some foosball. 495 00:34:16,719 --> 00:34:18,759 Speaker 1: You know they call foosball in the UK they call 496 00:34:18,800 --> 00:34:23,200 Speaker 1: it flipper. Do you know that that's cool? Anyway? Alright, 497 00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:26,839 Speaker 1: that makes sense. It makes more sense than foosball if 498 00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:32,439 Speaker 1: we're being honest. Uh, what is the foods anyway? Yeah, 499 00:34:32,560 --> 00:34:40,520 Speaker 1: so the Queen's secret uh secret poster room, chill spot. Aside, Uh, 500 00:34:40,719 --> 00:34:44,319 Speaker 1: we know that Nick Pope did lose the photo to 501 00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:48,600 Speaker 1: his boss because they were getting heat from their friends 502 00:34:49,120 --> 00:34:53,880 Speaker 1: across the Atlantic. There was this debate over what is 503 00:34:55,160 --> 00:35:02,400 Speaker 1: now called the s R Aurora and Nick said his 504 00:35:02,520 --> 00:35:05,359 Speaker 1: boss freaked out and thought, this is a quote from 505 00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:08,880 Speaker 1: Nick Pope. Oh goodness, the Yanks won't like us having 506 00:35:08,920 --> 00:35:11,520 Speaker 1: this on the wall. I'm going to take it down 507 00:35:12,040 --> 00:35:15,600 Speaker 1: because they thought their US colleagues were coming over and 508 00:35:15,640 --> 00:35:20,840 Speaker 1: they said, oh, oh, you know, because a version of 509 00:35:20,880 --> 00:35:24,200 Speaker 1: oh crap, oh crap is like oh, dear, you know, 510 00:35:24,320 --> 00:35:27,719 Speaker 1: we we we've got to remove this in case it's 511 00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:30,320 Speaker 1: the thing they made that we're all supposed to pretend 512 00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:35,759 Speaker 1: his secret, which is hilarious. Um, And he goes through 513 00:35:35,800 --> 00:35:39,520 Speaker 1: the embassy Nick Pope, and he asked, I don't know, 514 00:35:39,600 --> 00:35:42,239 Speaker 1: let's just do the quote. Let's just Matt, you want 515 00:35:42,239 --> 00:35:44,680 Speaker 1: to take a turn into Pope voice? Sure? Sure, sure. 516 00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:48,919 Speaker 1: I was asking through the embassy, through various specialists, Hey 517 00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:51,640 Speaker 1: do you guys have a diamond or a triangular shaped 518 00:35:51,719 --> 00:35:55,080 Speaker 1: hypersonic thing you know that has a low humming sound 519 00:35:55,120 --> 00:35:58,839 Speaker 1: and does zero type five no, no sonic boom? How 520 00:35:58,840 --> 00:36:00,960 Speaker 1: do you? How do you do that? At you know, 521 00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:06,160 Speaker 1: they were saying no do you because we have sightings 522 00:36:06,160 --> 00:36:08,880 Speaker 1: as well, and we were wondering maybe if you know 523 00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:11,120 Speaker 1: it was an r AF a Royal Air Force plane 524 00:36:11,560 --> 00:36:15,879 Speaker 1: and we were saying, oh, I wish we had that. 525 00:36:15,880 --> 00:36:19,600 Speaker 1: That's so that is classic, right, that's very catch twenty 526 00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:23,080 Speaker 1: two stuff. If you have ever worked in a government 527 00:36:23,160 --> 00:36:27,560 Speaker 1: position or been a member of a large military, then 528 00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:31,360 Speaker 1: you've probably also experienced some hey why are you asking 529 00:36:31,360 --> 00:36:35,440 Speaker 1: me type stories like hey, I've got to go fill 530 00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:41,600 Speaker 1: in Form ten seventy eight A and the person who's 531 00:36:41,600 --> 00:36:46,440 Speaker 1: in charge of that said that I need ten eight B, 532 00:36:47,719 --> 00:36:50,040 Speaker 1: but I'm the one in charge of ten seventy eight 533 00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:52,880 Speaker 1: B and they have to send a form to me 534 00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:55,920 Speaker 1: like it's it's very I love I love it. I 535 00:36:55,920 --> 00:36:59,319 Speaker 1: thought it was a very humorous story. And as you said, 536 00:36:59,320 --> 00:37:02,600 Speaker 1: Matt nick Pole is a cool dude. Clark learns of 537 00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:06,800 Speaker 1: this photo, he goes hunting, and he meets dead ends 538 00:37:06,880 --> 00:37:12,000 Speaker 1: for more than a decade until finally he finds a 539 00:37:12,040 --> 00:37:15,560 Speaker 1: former press officer for the Royal Air Force, guy named 540 00:37:15,560 --> 00:37:20,080 Speaker 1: Craig Lindsay. Craig Lindsay has a copy of the photo. 541 00:37:20,160 --> 00:37:23,560 Speaker 1: It's not the original poster like all rolled up in 542 00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:28,080 Speaker 1: a cool tube that's obviously at the Queen's place. He 543 00:37:28,880 --> 00:37:32,560 Speaker 1: does have a pretty good copy of it, and Clark 544 00:37:32,680 --> 00:37:37,080 Speaker 1: learns that Lindsay held onto this original photo still in 545 00:37:37,320 --> 00:37:42,719 Speaker 1: its envelope from the Scottish newspaper, the Daily Record, because 546 00:37:42,920 --> 00:37:48,960 Speaker 1: apparently for years Craig Lindsay had been waiting for someone 547 00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:52,520 Speaker 1: to come looking for that photo. It's a weird story. 548 00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:56,560 Speaker 1: It's a weird story. We did mention that the Ministry 549 00:37:56,560 --> 00:38:00,520 Speaker 1: of Defense has classified some aspects of this story until 550 00:38:00,640 --> 00:38:05,120 Speaker 1: twenty seventy two. So we're gonna pause for a word 551 00:38:05,160 --> 00:38:09,960 Speaker 1: from our sponsor and we'll be back before two. Uh. 552 00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:13,440 Speaker 1: And when we return, we're gonna unbag some badgers. We're 553 00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:23,759 Speaker 1: gonna ask ourselves what this thing actually is. All Right, 554 00:38:23,840 --> 00:38:27,960 Speaker 1: we're back. We're back, and we're bagging and unbagging the 555 00:38:27,960 --> 00:38:33,480 Speaker 1: badgers of this story. What is this thing? I've read 556 00:38:33,600 --> 00:38:36,560 Speaker 1: a lot of analysis about this. I know we all did. 557 00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:42,960 Speaker 1: I was really impressed by the statements of a redditor 558 00:38:43,640 --> 00:38:47,840 Speaker 1: and credit where it's due. It's very important. The regular 559 00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:52,480 Speaker 1: guy zero one. We don't know the regular guy. We 560 00:38:52,520 --> 00:38:57,000 Speaker 1: have not contacted the regular guy. I just feel like 561 00:38:57,080 --> 00:39:00,759 Speaker 1: this reddator nailed a lot of the questionins that I 562 00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:05,360 Speaker 1: had uh and schooled me a little bit on photography. 563 00:39:05,440 --> 00:39:08,080 Speaker 1: So thanks to you, r G, I feel like we 564 00:39:08,120 --> 00:39:11,839 Speaker 1: can just call this person this entity r G. So 565 00:39:11,920 --> 00:39:15,000 Speaker 1: let's look at some of the stuff they point out. Well, um, 566 00:39:15,120 --> 00:39:18,879 Speaker 1: r G points out that nobody has actually identified who 567 00:39:18,920 --> 00:39:21,680 Speaker 1: took the images. We've discussed that part. Uh. The image 568 00:39:21,719 --> 00:39:24,040 Speaker 1: was apparently taken on an Ilford XP one black and 569 00:39:24,040 --> 00:39:27,719 Speaker 1: white thirty five mil camera film, rather um, which is 570 00:39:27,800 --> 00:39:30,200 Speaker 1: a pretty popular brand of black and white film. You 571 00:39:30,200 --> 00:39:34,320 Speaker 1: can buy it at most camera stores or order it online. Um. 572 00:39:34,320 --> 00:39:36,319 Speaker 1: It does have to be process you know, like you 573 00:39:36,320 --> 00:39:38,160 Speaker 1: have to find the place that actually will process black 574 00:39:38,200 --> 00:39:40,799 Speaker 1: and white film. Um. It just so happens that this 575 00:39:40,840 --> 00:39:46,160 Speaker 1: particular film is extremely forgiving when it comes to double exposures. Uh, 576 00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:47,800 Speaker 1: and that's true of black and white. I'm only I 577 00:39:47,840 --> 00:39:49,919 Speaker 1: was taking this because I took a couple of black 578 00:39:49,960 --> 00:39:52,360 Speaker 1: and white dark room photography classes in college, one of 579 00:39:52,360 --> 00:39:55,160 Speaker 1: my favorite things I did in college, And some of 580 00:39:55,200 --> 00:39:58,520 Speaker 1: the images that I took that I have printed actually 581 00:39:58,719 --> 00:40:01,840 Speaker 1: hanging on my wall. Uh, did quite a few double exposures. 582 00:40:01,880 --> 00:40:04,759 Speaker 1: You can keep the aperture open while moving a light 583 00:40:04,840 --> 00:40:07,680 Speaker 1: source around, and then you'll kind of get these burned 584 00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:10,280 Speaker 1: in images that like all kind of occupy the same space, 585 00:40:10,480 --> 00:40:12,480 Speaker 1: and if you do it right, you know, they look 586 00:40:12,560 --> 00:40:14,279 Speaker 1: kind of ghostly where they'll be will be a little 587 00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:16,440 Speaker 1: bit of transparency around the edges. And there's lots of 588 00:40:16,480 --> 00:40:19,680 Speaker 1: fun tricks you can do just with double exposures. Um. 589 00:40:19,920 --> 00:40:22,640 Speaker 1: Here Regular Guy then links to a source on this phenomenon, 590 00:40:22,680 --> 00:40:26,840 Speaker 1: specifically on lomography dot com. Um. You can find it 591 00:40:26,960 --> 00:40:29,200 Speaker 1: by because is a magazine. You can find that by 592 00:40:29,280 --> 00:40:33,759 Speaker 1: typing rare expired Ilford XP one four hundred and has 593 00:40:33,800 --> 00:40:36,399 Speaker 1: some interesting facts about you know, what can be done 594 00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:39,879 Speaker 1: with this trickery. R G also points out the thirty 595 00:40:39,920 --> 00:40:44,839 Speaker 1: five millimeter film uses a three to two ratio UM, 596 00:40:44,880 --> 00:40:48,240 Speaker 1: and the Calvine photo is not in this ratio. Matt, 597 00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:52,520 Speaker 1: you could probably speak to ratios in terms of like, um, 598 00:40:52,560 --> 00:40:55,120 Speaker 1: you know, video and stuff like like what what is 599 00:40:55,160 --> 00:40:56,720 Speaker 1: what are we talking about here? We're talking about literally 600 00:40:56,760 --> 00:40:59,040 Speaker 1: like the shape of the frame, right, Yeah? Does it 601 00:40:59,120 --> 00:41:01,320 Speaker 1: look like a square or does it look like a 602 00:41:01,640 --> 00:41:03,880 Speaker 1: what's known as a sixteen by nine image, which is 603 00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:06,320 Speaker 1: when you're familiar with if you hold your phone sideways 604 00:41:07,200 --> 00:41:09,719 Speaker 1: or is it in you know, some kind of other 605 00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:13,680 Speaker 1: vertical format, like when you've got your phone straight up 606 00:41:13,680 --> 00:41:16,560 Speaker 1: and you're looking at Instagram and TikTok and all those. 607 00:41:17,120 --> 00:41:18,560 Speaker 1: But it just has to do with the shape of 608 00:41:18,560 --> 00:41:22,840 Speaker 1: the rectangle. And well, this is another thing I noticed 609 00:41:22,880 --> 00:41:27,440 Speaker 1: why because of the because of the China intelligence angle. Yeah, 610 00:41:27,719 --> 00:41:32,680 Speaker 1: don't do it, okay, UM, the when when you first 611 00:41:32,760 --> 00:41:35,440 Speaker 1: look at this photograph, you noticed that the UFO or 612 00:41:35,560 --> 00:41:39,560 Speaker 1: U A P is almost directly centered, right, That's one 613 00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:42,880 Speaker 1: of the first striking things about it. UM, where you do. 614 00:41:43,000 --> 00:41:46,000 Speaker 1: It does seem as though there was a you know, 615 00:41:46,040 --> 00:41:49,040 Speaker 1: a piece of film that was then exposed and then 616 00:41:49,200 --> 00:41:52,000 Speaker 1: it was changed, like altered to be printed where the 617 00:41:52,040 --> 00:41:54,719 Speaker 1: u AP is in the center of the photograph. Yeah, 618 00:41:54,760 --> 00:41:58,279 Speaker 1: And it's strange because we also know that came ramber 619 00:41:58,360 --> 00:42:00,520 Speaker 1: I put this in the notes. But we also know 620 00:42:00,800 --> 00:42:07,640 Speaker 1: that the UK took it seriously enough to send an 621 00:42:07,760 --> 00:42:11,920 Speaker 1: image to the CIA and they described this as a 622 00:42:12,000 --> 00:42:17,200 Speaker 1: possible research vehicle. This image then gets sent to the Pentagon, 623 00:42:17,840 --> 00:42:22,440 Speaker 1: and the US and the UK are now having a 624 00:42:22,520 --> 00:42:28,280 Speaker 1: water cooler moment Transatlantic style, you know what I mean. Uh, 625 00:42:28,320 --> 00:42:36,759 Speaker 1: And so they're taking it seriously. But there's another thing. 626 00:42:37,040 --> 00:42:40,920 Speaker 1: R G finds that it is interesting and kind of 627 00:42:42,560 --> 00:42:50,879 Speaker 1: dovetails nicely with our earlier conversation about interpretation right and 628 00:42:51,080 --> 00:42:58,480 Speaker 1: cultural framework. If you look at David Clark's Twitter, you 629 00:42:58,600 --> 00:43:03,440 Speaker 1: will see that there is a proven hoax image that 630 00:43:03,520 --> 00:43:09,640 Speaker 1: looks very similar. Some would say, uh, this hoax was 631 00:43:09,920 --> 00:43:16,040 Speaker 1: made in nineteen comes from Puerto Rico, But if you 632 00:43:16,160 --> 00:43:21,560 Speaker 1: click on it, then what you'll see, or aside from landscape, 633 00:43:21,600 --> 00:43:25,400 Speaker 1: you'll see two objects in the air that appear pretty 634 00:43:25,440 --> 00:43:30,280 Speaker 1: similar in both placement and shape. Oh yeah, uh yeah, 635 00:43:30,560 --> 00:43:35,160 Speaker 1: except this definitely not centered. There's a big tree and 636 00:43:35,200 --> 00:43:37,839 Speaker 1: a bunch of branches in the foreground, and then in 637 00:43:37,880 --> 00:43:41,040 Speaker 1: the background you see a this is more of a 638 00:43:41,040 --> 00:43:45,440 Speaker 1: flying saucer image. It's flatter in the center, with two 639 00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:48,480 Speaker 1: uh I don't know, I don't let you call them 640 00:43:48,560 --> 00:43:50,759 Speaker 1: kind of domed shapes on the top and bottom of 641 00:43:50,800 --> 00:43:54,719 Speaker 1: that flat surface. And the curious thing is, though, and 642 00:43:54,760 --> 00:43:57,120 Speaker 1: I think that's what you're talking about here, Ben, there 643 00:43:57,200 --> 00:43:59,920 Speaker 1: is a fighter jet. This one is clearly a fighter 644 00:44:00,080 --> 00:44:05,920 Speaker 1: jet right next to the UFO in the picture. Yeah. 645 00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:11,040 Speaker 1: And r G also notes, uh, something I really appreciated 646 00:44:11,239 --> 00:44:18,760 Speaker 1: regarding the specifics of the Ministry of Defenses classification orders. 647 00:44:19,320 --> 00:44:23,040 Speaker 1: Did they bury the story. Let's be honest with each other, folks. 648 00:44:23,719 --> 00:44:28,080 Speaker 1: If the United Kingdom wants to bury his story, they 649 00:44:28,120 --> 00:44:33,239 Speaker 1: can do so with great success. Look at Jimmy Saville right, 650 00:44:33,520 --> 00:44:37,840 Speaker 1: Look at the ongoing child abuse cover up in the government. 651 00:44:38,400 --> 00:44:43,239 Speaker 1: Look at Prince Andrew right. That guy is not going 652 00:44:43,280 --> 00:44:46,080 Speaker 1: to get in trouble. He just what can't go to 653 00:44:46,120 --> 00:44:50,640 Speaker 1: certain lunches. And this, like what I'm saying is that 654 00:44:50,680 --> 00:44:56,040 Speaker 1: the UK has the capabilities and the will to actually 655 00:44:56,160 --> 00:45:01,360 Speaker 1: bury a story if the UK wants to so it 656 00:45:02,920 --> 00:45:06,880 Speaker 1: doesn't sound like a cover up. If you're a journalist 657 00:45:06,920 --> 00:45:10,680 Speaker 1: and you're able to find a retired press officer who says, oh, 658 00:45:10,760 --> 00:45:13,920 Speaker 1: I've been keeping this envelope just in case I was 659 00:45:13,960 --> 00:45:16,239 Speaker 1: hoping somebody would come along and ask me about that, 660 00:45:16,719 --> 00:45:19,520 Speaker 1: because that envelope would be gone if there really was 661 00:45:19,560 --> 00:45:25,759 Speaker 1: a cover up. From what I can tell, the classification 662 00:45:26,400 --> 00:45:34,080 Speaker 1: order essentially just disguises or withholds the identities of those 663 00:45:34,120 --> 00:45:39,319 Speaker 1: two original hikers. That's the main secret, which you know, 664 00:45:39,360 --> 00:45:43,720 Speaker 1: when you put it that way, doesn't necessarily it sounds 665 00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:47,400 Speaker 1: like the government is going is having an oh, snap 666 00:45:47,440 --> 00:45:51,520 Speaker 1: Aliens moment, does it now? And and and and regular 667 00:45:51,560 --> 00:45:54,640 Speaker 1: guy goes on to say that he does feel like 668 00:45:54,719 --> 00:45:59,919 Speaker 1: this photo is a hoax. Um and this person does 669 00:46:00,160 --> 00:46:03,680 Speaker 1: consider themselves a true believer in UFO phenomena, but also 670 00:46:04,600 --> 00:46:06,719 Speaker 1: has a pretty keen photographic eye. And I think you're 671 00:46:06,719 --> 00:46:10,600 Speaker 1: looking for the right things. And this is where we 672 00:46:10,719 --> 00:46:15,680 Speaker 1: are drawing to a close. Folks, take a look at 673 00:46:15,800 --> 00:46:21,879 Speaker 1: the s R. Aurora craft and take a look at 674 00:46:21,960 --> 00:46:27,839 Speaker 1: this photograph from Scotland in the ninety nineties, and give 675 00:46:27,920 --> 00:46:31,560 Speaker 1: us your take. Do you think they look similar. Do 676 00:46:31,600 --> 00:46:35,600 Speaker 1: you think this is a hoax? Do you think there's 677 00:46:35,680 --> 00:46:38,960 Speaker 1: something they don't want you to know? I want to 678 00:46:38,960 --> 00:46:44,359 Speaker 1: point out that the Aurora aircraft, this alleged aircraft out 679 00:46:44,400 --> 00:46:47,440 Speaker 1: there in some of the research that we've done on 680 00:46:47,520 --> 00:46:49,480 Speaker 1: it in the past, there are a lot of players 681 00:46:49,480 --> 00:46:51,520 Speaker 1: where you can find information about it. There's not a 682 00:46:51,520 --> 00:46:54,480 Speaker 1: lot of official information that you can find about this thing. 683 00:46:55,080 --> 00:46:58,719 Speaker 1: You can go there is a website called Defense d 684 00:46:58,800 --> 00:47:02,120 Speaker 1: E F E n C E aviation dot com and 685 00:47:02,200 --> 00:47:05,920 Speaker 1: it does have like computer rendered images of what this 686 00:47:06,000 --> 00:47:09,920 Speaker 1: thing allegedly is supposed to look like, multiple ones. And um, 687 00:47:10,480 --> 00:47:13,120 Speaker 1: I just have to point out if you go to 688 00:47:13,160 --> 00:47:15,360 Speaker 1: a website like this and you check it out and 689 00:47:15,360 --> 00:47:19,040 Speaker 1: you're reading information, oh my god, this is crazy. Check 690 00:47:19,440 --> 00:47:23,719 Speaker 1: the website to see if there's a disclaimer on this website. 691 00:47:24,040 --> 00:47:27,200 Speaker 1: If you defense aviation dot com, if you click on 692 00:47:27,239 --> 00:47:32,400 Speaker 1: their disclaimer, you're gonna find something that says, all information 693 00:47:32,440 --> 00:47:35,040 Speaker 1: on the site is provided in good faith. However, we 694 00:47:35,120 --> 00:47:38,680 Speaker 1: make no representation or warranty of any kind, express or implied, 695 00:47:38,719 --> 00:47:43,799 Speaker 1: regarding the accuracy, adequacy, validity, reliability, availability, or completeness of 696 00:47:43,840 --> 00:47:53,719 Speaker 1: any information on the site. Yeah, that's because of family show. Uh, 697 00:47:53,800 --> 00:47:56,719 Speaker 1: tell your kids that c y A stands for cover 698 00:47:56,800 --> 00:48:02,759 Speaker 1: your assumptions. Uh, oh my gosh, goad humor. Uh, yeah, 699 00:48:02,800 --> 00:48:05,839 Speaker 1: it's true. The biggest question about the s R nine 700 00:48:06,280 --> 00:48:11,759 Speaker 1: aurora is whether the US military actually ever made one. 701 00:48:13,480 --> 00:48:18,319 Speaker 1: It's and to be fair, there is secret technology. There 702 00:48:18,360 --> 00:48:24,239 Speaker 1: is classified, even suppressed technology out there. Now. You might 703 00:48:24,280 --> 00:48:31,040 Speaker 1: be surprised by how far along some aspects of technology 704 00:48:31,080 --> 00:48:34,560 Speaker 1: are and they're not released to the public sometimes for 705 00:48:34,640 --> 00:48:39,920 Speaker 1: good reason. Shout out National Invention Secrecy Act, which was 706 00:48:41,320 --> 00:48:47,360 Speaker 1: super dick move bio Uncle Sam, but arguably arguably necessary. 707 00:48:47,440 --> 00:48:52,400 Speaker 1: So is this again a hoax? Is this a secret 708 00:48:52,440 --> 00:48:55,439 Speaker 1: plane that may or may not exist? What is going 709 00:48:55,520 --> 00:48:59,600 Speaker 1: on with this UFO? We cannot wait to hear your thoughts, folks, 710 00:48:59,719 --> 00:49:02,120 Speaker 1: which try to be easy to find online. That's right. 711 00:49:02,160 --> 00:49:04,960 Speaker 1: You can find this on Facebook, on YouTube, and on 712 00:49:05,000 --> 00:49:08,360 Speaker 1: Twitter at the handle conspiracy Stuff on Instagram where conspiracy 713 00:49:08,400 --> 00:49:12,040 Speaker 1: Stuff show. Yes and don't forget our book. There's a 714 00:49:12,040 --> 00:49:15,440 Speaker 1: whole chapter that goes into UFOs, U A P and 715 00:49:15,560 --> 00:49:20,399 Speaker 1: government technology. It's very very very good, excellent work been 716 00:49:20,880 --> 00:49:25,480 Speaker 1: and Matt, I guess, but mostly been. Um. I'm also 717 00:49:25,520 --> 00:49:27,719 Speaker 1: going to point out that the F FOURT team Tomcat 718 00:49:27,960 --> 00:49:33,680 Speaker 1: is perhaps the most badass looking aircraft that was ever 719 00:49:33,800 --> 00:49:37,600 Speaker 1: produced on this planet. It is just the coolest, especially 720 00:49:37,640 --> 00:49:40,480 Speaker 1: if you see it kind of from above. Dang, that 721 00:49:40,520 --> 00:49:45,960 Speaker 1: thing is dope. Uh, it's just so good. Okay, Um, 722 00:49:46,080 --> 00:49:48,160 Speaker 1: you can also call us. We have a phone number 723 00:49:48,360 --> 00:49:51,600 Speaker 1: only smokes. You're right, the rumors are true. If you 724 00:49:51,760 --> 00:49:55,440 Speaker 1: want to give us a call, we are only a 725 00:49:55,480 --> 00:49:58,759 Speaker 1: phone call away. The number is one eight three three 726 00:49:59,120 --> 00:50:02,640 Speaker 1: std too be y t K. You'll hear a message, 727 00:50:02,640 --> 00:50:05,719 Speaker 1: you'll hear a beep like so beep, and then you'll 728 00:50:05,719 --> 00:50:10,160 Speaker 1: have three minutes go nuts get really weird. Uh, Matt, 729 00:50:10,320 --> 00:50:17,160 Speaker 1: you recently sent uh a lovely co sign about my 730 00:50:17,280 --> 00:50:22,319 Speaker 1: dream of living in a billboard and I listened to it. 731 00:50:23,200 --> 00:50:25,799 Speaker 1: I thought it was great. We've got to put that 732 00:50:25,880 --> 00:50:28,520 Speaker 1: on the air next week. Uh. And we'd love to 733 00:50:28,560 --> 00:50:30,560 Speaker 1: put your message on the air too, so long as 734 00:50:30,600 --> 00:50:32,719 Speaker 1: you give us the okay, tell us if it's all 735 00:50:32,840 --> 00:50:35,960 Speaker 1: right to use your name and or voice on the air. 736 00:50:36,239 --> 00:50:39,799 Speaker 1: Most importantly, if you have a story that will not 737 00:50:40,000 --> 00:50:43,719 Speaker 1: fit within three minutes, then don't feel rushed. Don't feel 738 00:50:43,760 --> 00:50:46,279 Speaker 1: like you need to keep calling. All you have to 739 00:50:46,320 --> 00:50:48,479 Speaker 1: do is send this an email, right it out in full. 740 00:50:48,640 --> 00:50:52,560 Speaker 1: We read every single email we get. Drop us a 741 00:50:52,600 --> 00:50:55,480 Speaker 1: line where we are conspiracy and I heart radio dot 742 00:50:55,560 --> 00:51:16,000 Speaker 1: com m H. Stuff they don't want you to know 743 00:51:16,239 --> 00:51:19,239 Speaker 1: is a production of I heart Radio. For more podcasts 744 00:51:19,239 --> 00:51:21,479 Speaker 1: from my heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, 745 00:51:21,560 --> 00:51:24,400 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.