1 00:00:01,080 --> 00:00:04,080 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you missed in History class from house 2 00:00:04,080 --> 00:00:14,280 Speaker 1: Stuffworks dot com. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. And 3 00:00:14,320 --> 00:00:18,599 Speaker 1: I'm Tracy and we are officially into a little bit 4 00:00:18,640 --> 00:00:21,240 Speaker 1: of Halloween programming. We're getting there. I mean I start 5 00:00:21,280 --> 00:00:23,840 Speaker 1: in July in my personal life, but I held out 6 00:00:23,880 --> 00:00:29,159 Speaker 1: till now for the just tenter hooks. Barely expect some 7 00:00:29,720 --> 00:00:33,280 Speaker 1: scary things, scary people coming up over the next month 8 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:37,919 Speaker 1: or so. I just think you're fascinating. Uh, It's Halloween 9 00:00:38,000 --> 00:00:40,800 Speaker 1: is my favorite holiday. Um. So today we're going to 10 00:00:40,880 --> 00:00:47,199 Speaker 1: talk about an American phenomenon that happened for about a 11 00:00:47,320 --> 00:00:50,160 Speaker 1: hundred years. It was going on in New England where 12 00:00:50,200 --> 00:00:55,960 Speaker 1: there were these bizarre vampire panics. And while we live 13 00:00:55,960 --> 00:00:59,760 Speaker 1: in an Asian vampires are insanely popular as entertainment, uh, 14 00:00:59,760 --> 00:01:02,760 Speaker 1: and they often become romantic interests, for better or for worse. 15 00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:05,880 Speaker 1: There have certainly been times in human history when fear 16 00:01:05,959 --> 00:01:10,120 Speaker 1: of real and for true, actual vampiresm caused these outright 17 00:01:10,120 --> 00:01:14,319 Speaker 1: panics and for people to really enact some very bizarre 18 00:01:14,440 --> 00:01:18,759 Speaker 1: rituals to try to quell this menace that they perceived 19 00:01:18,800 --> 00:01:21,520 Speaker 1: around them. Every time we every time there's a news 20 00:01:21,520 --> 00:01:24,200 Speaker 1: story that floats by about somebody discovering a quote, vampire 21 00:01:24,240 --> 00:01:26,560 Speaker 1: grave in some place. We get all these requests from 22 00:01:26,560 --> 00:01:28,880 Speaker 1: people talk about that. Yeah, and there have been a 23 00:01:28,880 --> 00:01:31,080 Speaker 1: lot and we'll talk a little bit about one researcher 24 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:35,279 Speaker 1: who does a lot of work specifically in that field. Uh. 25 00:01:35,319 --> 00:01:38,920 Speaker 1: The word vampire, of course, originated in Slavic Europe in 26 00:01:38,959 --> 00:01:41,600 Speaker 1: the tenth century, and there have been a number of 27 00:01:41,720 --> 00:01:47,320 Speaker 1: vampire panics in Europe as well throughout history, from you know, 28 00:01:47,480 --> 00:01:50,840 Speaker 1: the tenth century right up until roughly the end of 29 00:01:50,840 --> 00:01:52,680 Speaker 1: the eighteenth century. But at that point it kind of 30 00:01:52,680 --> 00:01:55,640 Speaker 1: started to fizzle out, like these instances where people became 31 00:01:55,680 --> 00:01:58,560 Speaker 1: convinced on mass that there was a vampire in their 32 00:01:58,560 --> 00:02:03,480 Speaker 1: midst But US Europeans were moving to North America, a 33 00:02:03,480 --> 00:02:06,560 Speaker 1: lot of their superstitions came along for the ride. And 34 00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:10,079 Speaker 1: it's in New England that we're focusing this lens today. Uh. 35 00:02:10,120 --> 00:02:13,440 Speaker 1: And it's actually later in the historical record than people 36 00:02:13,720 --> 00:02:18,600 Speaker 1: might anticipate because it does sound, you know, superstition on 37 00:02:18,639 --> 00:02:21,840 Speaker 1: this level sounds a little wacky, in a little old fashioned, 38 00:02:21,840 --> 00:02:24,480 Speaker 1: but it's a lot more modern than you might think. 39 00:02:24,560 --> 00:02:26,919 Speaker 1: This was happening way more recently than I think most 40 00:02:26,919 --> 00:02:29,400 Speaker 1: people would suspect UH. And so first we're going to 41 00:02:29,480 --> 00:02:33,400 Speaker 1: cover a couple of specific instances of vampire panic that 42 00:02:33,440 --> 00:02:36,520 Speaker 1: happened in New England, and then we'll discuss some of 43 00:02:36,520 --> 00:02:40,200 Speaker 1: the causes and circumstances around this phenomenon that kept repeating. 44 00:02:41,520 --> 00:02:44,680 Speaker 1: And we're first going to start in Jewett City, Connecticut. 45 00:02:45,320 --> 00:02:48,880 Speaker 1: So in the late eighteen forties through the mid eighteen fifties, 46 00:02:48,919 --> 00:02:52,679 Speaker 1: in Jewitt City, there's a vampire panic. So the Ray 47 00:02:52,840 --> 00:02:57,239 Speaker 1: family of Jewitt City experienced the series of tragedies when 48 00:02:57,280 --> 00:03:00,680 Speaker 1: which healthy members of the family, previously healthy members of 49 00:03:00,720 --> 00:03:03,959 Speaker 1: the family just wasted away. And most of the panic 50 00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:07,240 Speaker 1: really was in the eighteen fifties, as this family had 51 00:03:07,320 --> 00:03:09,480 Speaker 1: begun to lose more and more members. So it wasn't 52 00:03:09,480 --> 00:03:13,240 Speaker 1: like a panic that lasted ten years UM, but the 53 00:03:13,280 --> 00:03:16,240 Speaker 1: events leading up to it really lasted that long. So 54 00:03:16,360 --> 00:03:20,600 Speaker 1: first the Ray family's son Lemuel died, and then Henry, 55 00:03:20,680 --> 00:03:22,959 Speaker 1: who was the father of the family, passed away a 56 00:03:23,000 --> 00:03:25,120 Speaker 1: couple of years after that, so this was late eighteen 57 00:03:25,120 --> 00:03:30,639 Speaker 1: forties into early eighteen fifties. And then Elisha was next uh. 58 00:03:30,760 --> 00:03:33,560 Speaker 1: And then the eldest son of the family, Henry Nelson, 59 00:03:33,680 --> 00:03:35,520 Speaker 1: and Will refer to him by both names to keep 60 00:03:35,560 --> 00:03:39,920 Speaker 1: him separate from the father. Henry also fell sick, so 61 00:03:40,520 --> 00:03:42,720 Speaker 1: there was a lot of speculation going on about what 62 00:03:42,800 --> 00:03:45,960 Speaker 1: was causing all of these deaths for this one family, 63 00:03:46,840 --> 00:03:50,920 Speaker 1: and believing that the dead were somehow beating on the living. 64 00:03:51,200 --> 00:03:54,960 Speaker 1: Two of the Ray sons were exhumed on June four. 65 00:03:55,720 --> 00:03:58,920 Speaker 1: Their bodies were burned in this desperate attempt to try 66 00:03:58,920 --> 00:04:02,920 Speaker 1: to end the families bring and we don't really know 67 00:04:03,440 --> 00:04:06,520 Speaker 1: why the Ray family attributed the later deaths to the 68 00:04:06,560 --> 00:04:10,280 Speaker 1: buried relatives, but it appears that they thought that Lemuel 69 00:04:10,320 --> 00:04:14,400 Speaker 1: and alive Show were somehow coming back, possibly as spirits, 70 00:04:14,400 --> 00:04:16,279 Speaker 1: which was part of the vampire lord at the time, 71 00:04:16,800 --> 00:04:19,479 Speaker 1: rather than the modern vampiric concept of the dead actually 72 00:04:19,560 --> 00:04:22,320 Speaker 1: rising from the grave and biting people on the neck uh, 73 00:04:22,400 --> 00:04:25,760 Speaker 1: and that they were draining Henry Nelson, the eldest son. 74 00:04:26,720 --> 00:04:31,520 Speaker 1: It's unclear also why their father, Henry was not a 75 00:04:31,560 --> 00:04:35,400 Speaker 1: suspect in all of this. There was never any indication 76 00:04:35,520 --> 00:04:39,120 Speaker 1: that his grave had been intended to be disturbed, just 77 00:04:39,279 --> 00:04:44,119 Speaker 1: the two sons. We also don't know when Henry Nelson died, 78 00:04:44,520 --> 00:04:47,839 Speaker 1: but it appears that the tuberculosis outbreak which was really 79 00:04:47,839 --> 00:04:53,599 Speaker 1: the culprit ended there. So tuberculosis is an infectious disease, 80 00:04:53,680 --> 00:04:57,680 Speaker 1: as we know now, was not known app time, and 81 00:04:57,720 --> 00:05:00,680 Speaker 1: it's spread through bacteria, So the burn ing of their 82 00:05:00,720 --> 00:05:05,720 Speaker 1: bodies might actually have helped contain the outbreak. Uh So 83 00:05:05,880 --> 00:05:10,160 Speaker 1: this sort of solidified this incorrect notion that what they 84 00:05:10,200 --> 00:05:15,320 Speaker 1: had done had actually stopped the vampires. Yes, so we 85 00:05:15,440 --> 00:05:17,120 Speaker 1: know now that what was going on was that the 86 00:05:17,160 --> 00:05:20,279 Speaker 1: family had what was called at the time consumption. And 87 00:05:20,480 --> 00:05:22,440 Speaker 1: even so, and we'll talk about it, it comes up 88 00:05:22,480 --> 00:05:25,239 Speaker 1: a little bit later that sometimes these cases of consumption 89 00:05:25,279 --> 00:05:28,880 Speaker 1: were actually identified, they were diagnosed, but there was an 90 00:05:28,920 --> 00:05:32,280 Speaker 1: underlying fear about what was causing the illness, right, and 91 00:05:32,400 --> 00:05:37,719 Speaker 1: so because uh, tuberculosis wasn't identified until several decades later, 92 00:05:38,600 --> 00:05:40,960 Speaker 1: even though consumption was identified, it was not known that 93 00:05:41,000 --> 00:05:44,520 Speaker 1: it was bacterial, I mean, it was contagious, didn't quite 94 00:05:44,520 --> 00:05:47,760 Speaker 1: have the germ theory of disease yet, that was not 95 00:05:47,880 --> 00:05:51,520 Speaker 1: quite there yet barely getting started. And if that, like 96 00:05:51,600 --> 00:05:54,720 Speaker 1: the germ theory didn't really spread like it was just 97 00:05:54,839 --> 00:05:57,560 Speaker 1: in its infancy at this point. It wasn't until the 98 00:05:57,600 --> 00:06:01,280 Speaker 1: nine twenties that that really had the idea in their 99 00:06:01,320 --> 00:06:05,240 Speaker 1: heads that germs cause disease. And even so in more 100 00:06:05,360 --> 00:06:09,000 Speaker 1: remote areas, it was entirely possible that that that word 101 00:06:09,360 --> 00:06:12,840 Speaker 1: would not have reached people yet absolutely Uh. And so 102 00:06:12,920 --> 00:06:15,880 Speaker 1: that's the Jewitt City vampire case. And you'll sometimes hear 103 00:06:15,920 --> 00:06:19,640 Speaker 1: them referred to. There's their tours through town, etcetera. And 104 00:06:19,680 --> 00:06:23,279 Speaker 1: you'll hear in um circles of people that like to 105 00:06:23,279 --> 00:06:26,800 Speaker 1: talk about these types of things, Uh, the Jewitt City vampires, 106 00:06:26,839 --> 00:06:29,839 Speaker 1: even though they were not actually vampires. Uh. And the 107 00:06:29,880 --> 00:06:31,719 Speaker 1: next time we're going to talk about so remember that 108 00:06:31,760 --> 00:06:34,680 Speaker 1: one was in the eighteen fifties when that all happened. 109 00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:38,120 Speaker 1: This one is a bit later, and it's quite famous. 110 00:06:38,160 --> 00:06:41,799 Speaker 1: It's the Mercy Brown case. Uh. And so Mercy Lena Brown, 111 00:06:41,880 --> 00:06:44,680 Speaker 1: and she went by Lena was a resident of Exeter, 112 00:06:44,800 --> 00:06:48,440 Speaker 1: Rhode Island, and she died there in eighteen ninety two, 113 00:06:48,720 --> 00:06:53,040 Speaker 1: so much later in the historical record. When she died, 114 00:06:53,080 --> 00:06:56,880 Speaker 1: the town was really struggling. The Civil War had claimed 115 00:06:56,960 --> 00:06:59,400 Speaker 1: a lot of his popular its population, and that was 116 00:06:59,440 --> 00:07:02,120 Speaker 1: really the case everywhere, like the Civil War could just 117 00:07:03,000 --> 00:07:07,880 Speaker 1: eliminate huge numbers of people from a town's population. The 118 00:07:08,000 --> 00:07:10,880 Speaker 1: railroad had also made it really easy for people to 119 00:07:11,040 --> 00:07:14,760 Speaker 1: leave the area to try to find better farmland. Yeah, 120 00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:17,240 Speaker 1: as a brief side note, Exeter was a farm community, 121 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:19,880 Speaker 1: but it's widely recognized that the soil there is not 122 00:07:20,120 --> 00:07:24,240 Speaker 1: great for farming. That's the case in many parts. It's 123 00:07:24,320 --> 00:07:26,400 Speaker 1: very rocky. So yeah, we kind of talked about a 124 00:07:26,440 --> 00:07:28,880 Speaker 1: similar thing in our Brook Farm episode, that these people 125 00:07:28,920 --> 00:07:31,160 Speaker 1: set up a farm in a place that doesn't have 126 00:07:31,200 --> 00:07:34,600 Speaker 1: a good soil. Right, So, yeah, Exeter was it was 127 00:07:34,640 --> 00:07:37,160 Speaker 1: a farming community that got barely got by before all 128 00:07:37,200 --> 00:07:40,040 Speaker 1: of these deaths and and people wanting to leave started 129 00:07:40,080 --> 00:07:41,880 Speaker 1: to happen, and then it really got rough well, and 130 00:07:41,920 --> 00:07:44,200 Speaker 1: once the railroad made it much easier to move a 131 00:07:44,240 --> 00:07:47,840 Speaker 1: farther distance away, there wasn't a huge draw for people 132 00:07:47,880 --> 00:07:53,920 Speaker 1: to stay there, continuing to struggle to just with another nature. Right. 133 00:07:54,680 --> 00:07:57,240 Speaker 1: From eighteen twenty until the time of Lena's death, the 134 00:07:57,280 --> 00:08:01,960 Speaker 1: population had gone from people to nine d sixty one. 135 00:08:02,320 --> 00:08:05,800 Speaker 1: So yeah, over of course of about seventy years, they 136 00:08:05,840 --> 00:08:09,800 Speaker 1: lost well over half of their population. Now, Lena's mother 137 00:08:09,840 --> 00:08:14,640 Speaker 1: had died ten years earlier in two and Lena's twenty 138 00:08:14,720 --> 00:08:17,120 Speaker 1: year old sister had died the year after their mother, 139 00:08:17,280 --> 00:08:22,360 Speaker 1: so about a decade before Lena became sick. Two other 140 00:08:22,440 --> 00:08:26,560 Speaker 1: women in her family had died, and Lena's brother had 141 00:08:26,600 --> 00:08:30,000 Speaker 1: become sick as well, but he left Exeter. He moved 142 00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:33,120 Speaker 1: to Colorado Springs in the hopes that a climate change 143 00:08:33,160 --> 00:08:37,679 Speaker 1: would cure him. While Lena was dying, her brother Edwin 144 00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:42,160 Speaker 1: came back. He had had some health improvements for a 145 00:08:42,200 --> 00:08:45,120 Speaker 1: little while while he was gone, but eventually he got 146 00:08:45,120 --> 00:08:48,800 Speaker 1: sick again. So the story goes that the neighbors, thinking 147 00:08:48,880 --> 00:08:53,680 Speaker 1: that some sort of evil supernatural happening had reversed Edwin's 148 00:08:53,720 --> 00:08:57,360 Speaker 1: remission when he came home. Uh they approached Lena's father, 149 00:08:57,480 --> 00:09:01,080 Speaker 1: whose named George Brown, and they suggested that an exhamation 150 00:09:01,400 --> 00:09:04,719 Speaker 1: of the family members who had already died and at 151 00:09:04,720 --> 00:09:09,120 Speaker 1: this point Lena had passed, might lead to his son's recovery. 152 00:09:09,160 --> 00:09:10,720 Speaker 1: So they thought we might be able to save Edwin 153 00:09:10,800 --> 00:09:14,240 Speaker 1: if we dig up the dead ladies. So their goal 154 00:09:14,800 --> 00:09:17,080 Speaker 1: was to check the hearts of the deceased to see 155 00:09:17,080 --> 00:09:19,440 Speaker 1: if there was fresh blood in them, and that would 156 00:09:19,480 --> 00:09:22,480 Speaker 1: be an indicator that the corpse was feeding on the 157 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:26,840 Speaker 1: living people, and George reluctantly agreed to do this. So 158 00:09:26,920 --> 00:09:31,800 Speaker 1: on March seventeenth, his wife and his two daughters were unearthed, 159 00:09:32,280 --> 00:09:34,320 Speaker 1: and I feel like I should mention. George did not 160 00:09:34,400 --> 00:09:37,840 Speaker 1: believe in this nonsense, and he refused to be present 161 00:09:37,880 --> 00:09:42,000 Speaker 1: at the exhamation. He was really most records indicate he 162 00:09:42,040 --> 00:09:44,240 Speaker 1: was just trying to placate his neighbors because they were 163 00:09:44,280 --> 00:09:48,640 Speaker 1: relentless um and Lena, of course, had only been dead 164 00:09:48,679 --> 00:09:50,920 Speaker 1: for about two months at this time. She died in January, 165 00:09:51,480 --> 00:09:54,560 Speaker 1: and because it was winter, she had not decomposed all 166 00:09:54,559 --> 00:09:58,400 Speaker 1: that much, while her mother and sister, again having died 167 00:09:58,400 --> 00:10:01,600 Speaker 1: almost a decade prior, were just skeletal at that point, 168 00:10:01,679 --> 00:10:04,800 Speaker 1: they were just bones. Uh. There was actually a correspondent 169 00:10:04,840 --> 00:10:07,720 Speaker 1: for the Providence Journal on hand for this disinterment, and 170 00:10:07,760 --> 00:10:10,800 Speaker 1: he reported that quote, the body was in a fairly 171 00:10:10,840 --> 00:10:13,480 Speaker 1: well preserved state. He's referring to Lena. At this point, 172 00:10:14,000 --> 00:10:16,520 Speaker 1: the heart and liver were removed, and in cutting open 173 00:10:16,559 --> 00:10:20,600 Speaker 1: the heart, clotted and decomposed blood was found. The town 174 00:10:20,640 --> 00:10:23,679 Speaker 1: doctor was also in attendance for this, as sometimes did 175 00:10:23,800 --> 00:10:28,160 Speaker 1: happen during the exhumations, and he really was also trying 176 00:10:28,200 --> 00:10:30,000 Speaker 1: to be the voice of reason, and he was like, no, 177 00:10:30,200 --> 00:10:34,000 Speaker 1: she's got tuberculosis. She has a long disease. She died 178 00:10:34,000 --> 00:10:37,760 Speaker 1: of this. She's this is not a vampire um. But 179 00:10:37,920 --> 00:10:41,080 Speaker 1: of course that kind of fell on deaf ears, right. 180 00:10:41,440 --> 00:10:45,000 Speaker 1: Mercy Lena Brown's liver and heart were burned there on 181 00:10:45,080 --> 00:10:47,839 Speaker 1: a site, and the ashes were fed to her brother 182 00:10:48,000 --> 00:10:52,000 Speaker 1: and attempt to cure him of tuberculosis, but that of 183 00:10:52,040 --> 00:10:56,560 Speaker 1: course did not work. No, he died like two months later. 184 00:10:58,160 --> 00:11:01,640 Speaker 1: And because this particular vampire panic happened in the late 185 00:11:01,679 --> 00:11:05,160 Speaker 1: eighteen hundreds and there was a reporter on hands to 186 00:11:05,280 --> 00:11:08,960 Speaker 1: witness it, the story really spread. It actually ended up 187 00:11:08,960 --> 00:11:12,960 Speaker 1: being picked up by the American Anthropologist Journal UH when 188 00:11:13,000 --> 00:11:15,040 Speaker 1: a gentleman that wrote for them went to study it 189 00:11:15,120 --> 00:11:18,240 Speaker 1: after he had read that initial account, and it ended 190 00:11:18,320 --> 00:11:21,840 Speaker 1: up being talked about far and wide. And some historians 191 00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:24,560 Speaker 1: actually believe that it was the Mercy Brown story that 192 00:11:24,640 --> 00:11:29,440 Speaker 1: inspired bram Stoker's Dracula, which published in although there is 193 00:11:29,480 --> 00:11:33,640 Speaker 1: some debate over it um. Some will say that the 194 00:11:33,679 --> 00:11:37,080 Speaker 1: news that had spread out that led to specifics that 195 00:11:37,080 --> 00:11:40,040 Speaker 1: seemed to parallel bram stoker story, not all of those 196 00:11:40,040 --> 00:11:42,439 Speaker 1: specifics had really become public knowledge by the time he 197 00:11:42,480 --> 00:11:45,640 Speaker 1: would have been working on it, So it's a it's 198 00:11:45,640 --> 00:11:49,240 Speaker 1: an unknown although there are some interesting parallels between the two. Uh. 199 00:11:49,240 --> 00:11:52,319 Speaker 1: And the general reception of this story in the press 200 00:11:52,480 --> 00:11:56,120 Speaker 1: and in public opinion was that really this was all 201 00:11:56,160 --> 00:11:59,880 Speaker 1: just because of ignorance of small communities. Uh. And it 202 00:12:00,320 --> 00:12:02,840 Speaker 1: was even characterized by some as a hoax. By the 203 00:12:02,880 --> 00:12:06,040 Speaker 1: time the man who wrote for the American Anthropologist Journal 204 00:12:06,080 --> 00:12:08,240 Speaker 1: showed up, they thought that people were kind of pulling 205 00:12:08,240 --> 00:12:12,040 Speaker 1: his legs. Uh. And the Boston Globe actually even suggested 206 00:12:12,120 --> 00:12:16,240 Speaker 1: that um inbreeding and intermarrying an exeter had resulted in 207 00:12:16,280 --> 00:12:19,000 Speaker 1: this community that was not so intellectual and that they 208 00:12:19,040 --> 00:12:24,600 Speaker 1: were kind of prone to buy into these crazy superstitions. Uh. 209 00:12:24,640 --> 00:12:26,559 Speaker 1: So the world at large thought a lot of this 210 00:12:26,640 --> 00:12:31,280 Speaker 1: was crazy even earlier than this story. But uh, you know, 211 00:12:31,360 --> 00:12:35,160 Speaker 1: these small communities would get the grip of the panic. 212 00:12:35,520 --> 00:12:38,439 Speaker 1: As a side note, there's an episode of The Memory 213 00:12:38,440 --> 00:12:42,880 Speaker 1: Palace that's about this specific vampire panic you all would 214 00:12:42,880 --> 00:12:45,160 Speaker 1: like to listen, and it's called Mary Mary and Mercy. 215 00:12:45,320 --> 00:12:48,360 Speaker 1: Mercy Brown's story is really quite famous in the Vampire 216 00:12:48,440 --> 00:12:51,760 Speaker 1: lawre and New England law on its own outside of 217 00:12:51,960 --> 00:12:56,560 Speaker 1: um you know, sort of paranormal enthusiasm because it is 218 00:12:56,600 --> 00:12:59,400 Speaker 1: such so late in the game that it is a 219 00:12:59,400 --> 00:13:03,520 Speaker 1: little startled. I think for people in To move on 220 00:13:03,559 --> 00:13:07,160 Speaker 1: to another story, a group of children in Griswold, Connecticut 221 00:13:07,200 --> 00:13:12,160 Speaker 1: stumbled onto a previously unknown burial ground and there had 222 00:13:12,200 --> 00:13:15,720 Speaker 1: actually been a serial killer in the area just prior 223 00:13:15,760 --> 00:13:19,000 Speaker 1: to this, and because of that, a police investigation was 224 00:13:19,040 --> 00:13:21,520 Speaker 1: started and the site that the children had found was 225 00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:25,560 Speaker 1: excavated because initially they had just found like some bones, 226 00:13:25,600 --> 00:13:28,320 Speaker 1: and they weren't police and the authorities were not sure 227 00:13:28,360 --> 00:13:30,840 Speaker 1: if they had found a burial site that this serial 228 00:13:30,920 --> 00:13:33,480 Speaker 1: killer had been using. But it turned out that what 229 00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:36,280 Speaker 1: they had actually unearthed was an interesting part of this 230 00:13:36,360 --> 00:13:40,080 Speaker 1: area's history and New England, for anyone who does not know, 231 00:13:40,679 --> 00:13:44,000 Speaker 1: is actually filled with unmarked burial plots left over from 232 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:48,600 Speaker 1: the colonial area era, mostly when families would establish these 233 00:13:48,600 --> 00:13:51,600 Speaker 1: burial spaces, but they didn't always keep records of the 234 00:13:51,640 --> 00:13:56,000 Speaker 1: interments and they had eventually grown over with age, you know, 235 00:13:56,040 --> 00:13:59,240 Speaker 1: as as small townships had fallen away and died off 236 00:13:59,280 --> 00:14:01,560 Speaker 1: and been replaced by bigger cities and people moved away. 237 00:14:02,520 --> 00:14:07,360 Speaker 1: These burial plots weren't always uh maintained visibly right, so 238 00:14:07,520 --> 00:14:11,200 Speaker 1: not quite as far back in history as the many, many, 239 00:14:11,240 --> 00:14:15,360 Speaker 1: many bodies that are now under car parks that were 240 00:14:15,360 --> 00:14:19,160 Speaker 1: constantly hearing about from the UK, but kind of similar 241 00:14:19,280 --> 00:14:22,160 Speaker 1: in how people buried their loved ones and then moved 242 00:14:22,160 --> 00:14:25,800 Speaker 1: on for whatever reason announced something else got there. Eventually, 243 00:14:26,000 --> 00:14:29,520 Speaker 1: authorities uncovered twenty nine graves, and most of these were 244 00:14:29,560 --> 00:14:32,680 Speaker 1: just austere graves where people had been buried in very 245 00:14:32,720 --> 00:14:37,800 Speaker 1: simple wooden boxes. There were fifteen children, six adult males, 246 00:14:37,880 --> 00:14:41,920 Speaker 1: and eight adult females, but there were also two stoned 247 00:14:42,120 --> 00:14:45,760 Speaker 1: crips that the state's archaeology team, which was led by 248 00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:50,760 Speaker 1: Nick Valentoni, were particularly interested in, and one of these crips, 249 00:14:50,760 --> 00:14:53,400 Speaker 1: which was labeled Burial number four, when they were doing 250 00:14:53,400 --> 00:14:57,240 Speaker 1: the excavation, revealed a much different in tumbment than those 251 00:14:57,400 --> 00:15:00,240 Speaker 1: that the team had uncovered up to that point, and 252 00:15:00,280 --> 00:15:02,920 Speaker 1: instead of finding a body laid out simply in a 253 00:15:02,920 --> 00:15:05,000 Speaker 1: wooden box with the arms either crossed over the chester 254 00:15:05,040 --> 00:15:08,720 Speaker 1: or at the side, this had a coffin which was 255 00:15:08,760 --> 00:15:11,920 Speaker 1: painted red and it had the initials J B and 256 00:15:11,960 --> 00:15:14,920 Speaker 1: the number fifty five laid out on the lid in 257 00:15:15,000 --> 00:15:18,320 Speaker 1: brass tacks. And while the feet of the deceased were 258 00:15:18,320 --> 00:15:20,440 Speaker 1: exactly where you would expect to find them in the coffin, 259 00:15:21,760 --> 00:15:24,720 Speaker 1: the rest of the body had been completely rearranged into 260 00:15:24,720 --> 00:15:27,640 Speaker 1: a layout that was similar to a Jolly Roger, but 261 00:15:27,760 --> 00:15:30,720 Speaker 1: with the skull turned face down into the rib cage 262 00:15:31,000 --> 00:15:33,800 Speaker 1: and then the leg and arm bones forming the cross 263 00:15:33,920 --> 00:15:38,320 Speaker 1: underneath that. So analysis indicated that the beheading and the 264 00:15:38,360 --> 00:15:41,280 Speaker 1: fracturing of the ribs and the dismemberment of the body 265 00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:44,680 Speaker 1: had all happened several years after this JB had died. 266 00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:51,280 Speaker 1: Paleopathological evidence also revealed that JB had probably died of consumption, 267 00:15:52,400 --> 00:15:55,360 Speaker 1: and two other sets of remains near JB, which were 268 00:15:55,480 --> 00:15:58,520 Speaker 1: labeled IB the number forty six and n B with 269 00:15:58,560 --> 00:16:01,640 Speaker 1: the number thirteen, which we believed to be age indicators, 270 00:16:02,280 --> 00:16:05,200 Speaker 1: had also died of tuberculosis. IB was a woman and 271 00:16:05,360 --> 00:16:08,320 Speaker 1: n B was a child. Uh And now we're going 272 00:16:08,360 --> 00:16:10,720 Speaker 1: to get into kind of the backstory and what happened 273 00:16:10,720 --> 00:16:15,840 Speaker 1: as a result of that find um so to return 274 00:16:16,040 --> 00:16:20,120 Speaker 1: to our backstory for this this family. Michael bell, a 275 00:16:20,200 --> 00:16:23,560 Speaker 1: Rhode Island folklorist and researcher and author of the book 276 00:16:23,600 --> 00:16:26,440 Speaker 1: Food for the Dead on the Trail of New England's Vampires, 277 00:16:26,920 --> 00:16:30,040 Speaker 1: has studied this New England vampire phenomenon for more than 278 00:16:30,080 --> 00:16:34,200 Speaker 1: thirty years, and in that time he's documented six dozen 279 00:16:34,440 --> 00:16:38,120 Speaker 1: incidents of exhumations, and he believes really strongly that there 280 00:16:38,160 --> 00:16:41,360 Speaker 1: were many, many others that just haven't been discovered yet. Yes, 281 00:16:41,400 --> 00:16:44,160 Speaker 1: so when Tracy mentioned earlier that you sometimes read about 282 00:16:44,760 --> 00:16:47,880 Speaker 1: uncovering a random grave, that he thinks that they're probably 283 00:16:47,880 --> 00:16:50,760 Speaker 1: way more cemeteries that we haven't even stumbled upon yet. 284 00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:54,680 Speaker 1: The earliest exhamation that he's recorded is from the late 285 00:16:54,720 --> 00:16:57,960 Speaker 1: seventeen hundreds, and the furthest away from New England that 286 00:16:58,000 --> 00:17:02,640 Speaker 1: he's recorded is happened in Minnesota. For a context, the 287 00:17:02,720 --> 00:17:06,320 Speaker 1: Salem witch Hunts were primarily slotted in the sixteen nineties, 288 00:17:06,359 --> 00:17:09,320 Speaker 1: so this was sometime after that. Yes, so even the 289 00:17:09,359 --> 00:17:13,080 Speaker 1: earliest incident of this vampire panic was roughly a hundred 290 00:17:13,160 --> 00:17:15,200 Speaker 1: years later than the witch hunts had kind of happened 291 00:17:15,200 --> 00:17:18,840 Speaker 1: and and died off. So, you know, I don't know, 292 00:17:18,960 --> 00:17:21,560 Speaker 1: socially it filled a gap of a need for superstitious 293 00:17:22,280 --> 00:17:29,480 Speaker 1: paranormal situation. But scare that Bell has studied actually involved 294 00:17:29,480 --> 00:17:31,960 Speaker 1: a letter from a councilman which was printed in the 295 00:17:31,960 --> 00:17:36,280 Speaker 1: Connecticut Koran and Weekly Intelligencer. And this letter actually warned 296 00:17:36,320 --> 00:17:39,200 Speaker 1: the editor and readers of the paper about a quack 297 00:17:39,320 --> 00:17:42,920 Speaker 1: doctor who was suggesting exhimation and burning of the dead 298 00:17:43,000 --> 00:17:45,800 Speaker 1: to stop consumption, which was believed to be done by 299 00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:50,160 Speaker 1: these dead bodies, like the consumption had been initiated by them. 300 00:17:50,359 --> 00:17:53,240 Speaker 1: Most of the research into this practice of exhuming bodies 301 00:17:53,320 --> 00:17:56,800 Speaker 1: during the vampire scare is based on handwritten records, and 302 00:17:56,920 --> 00:17:59,480 Speaker 1: many grave sites are similar to the ones in the 303 00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:02,320 Speaker 1: grizz Will Discovery that we just talked about, and they're 304 00:18:02,400 --> 00:18:06,160 Speaker 1: unmarked and sort of lost in time. And the genesis 305 00:18:06,200 --> 00:18:08,439 Speaker 1: of the vampire fear that was happening in New England 306 00:18:08,440 --> 00:18:11,439 Speaker 1: in this period really has yet to be pinpointed, but 307 00:18:11,560 --> 00:18:14,520 Speaker 1: as with any folkloric myth, it's likely that there's no 308 00:18:14,640 --> 00:18:18,480 Speaker 1: single starting point. Rather, a small seed of a legend 309 00:18:18,640 --> 00:18:21,560 Speaker 1: fed the lurking and present fear of the unexplained because 310 00:18:21,560 --> 00:18:23,800 Speaker 1: even though they could diagnose consumption, they didn't know what 311 00:18:23,880 --> 00:18:27,520 Speaker 1: caused it, uh And in turn that would all add 312 00:18:27,560 --> 00:18:30,439 Speaker 1: to the mythology and you know, build the legend, and 313 00:18:30,720 --> 00:18:32,760 Speaker 1: that would feed more fear and so on the way 314 00:18:32,960 --> 00:18:37,440 Speaker 1: these things happen, and certainly a doctor suggesting the idea 315 00:18:37,680 --> 00:18:39,800 Speaker 1: like that we should burn these bodies because they're feeding 316 00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:42,840 Speaker 1: off the living, would allow that superstition to gain a 317 00:18:42,840 --> 00:18:46,600 Speaker 1: little bit of ground. So that incident, you know, probably 318 00:18:46,640 --> 00:18:50,320 Speaker 1: added a significant ground swell to what was already likely 319 00:18:50,600 --> 00:18:53,760 Speaker 1: being talked about in communities. Right, and on top of that, 320 00:18:54,440 --> 00:18:58,639 Speaker 1: you're not actually familiar with medicine or anatomy or the 321 00:18:58,680 --> 00:19:05,480 Speaker 1: way bodies decomposed. It's easy to misinterpret normal decomposition through 322 00:19:05,520 --> 00:19:09,159 Speaker 1: this lens of cognitive bias and a lack of medical knowledge. 323 00:19:09,440 --> 00:19:12,840 Speaker 1: It's easy to misinterpret that as some kind of supernatural 324 00:19:12,920 --> 00:19:16,879 Speaker 1: thing going on. So bloated corpses were often described as 325 00:19:16,960 --> 00:19:20,480 Speaker 1: looking like they had just eaten, for example, or blood 326 00:19:20,560 --> 00:19:23,639 Speaker 1: coming from the mouth was held up as proof that 327 00:19:23,760 --> 00:19:26,720 Speaker 1: this dead body had been feeding on a living Yeah. 328 00:19:26,760 --> 00:19:30,359 Speaker 1: When there are accounts of these exhamations and people have 329 00:19:30,480 --> 00:19:33,800 Speaker 1: kept journals are written about them, they do they reference. 330 00:19:33,880 --> 00:19:35,800 Speaker 1: It was clear this must have been happening, because the 331 00:19:35,840 --> 00:19:38,200 Speaker 1: body was bloated, it had just eaten, and the hair 332 00:19:38,240 --> 00:19:40,359 Speaker 1: had continued to grow. They didn't know that that happened 333 00:19:40,400 --> 00:19:43,640 Speaker 1: yet as part of decomposition. And well, it's the it's 334 00:19:43,680 --> 00:19:47,280 Speaker 1: that your skin received It looks like your hair and 335 00:19:47,320 --> 00:19:50,520 Speaker 1: your nails are growing, but that's not what's happening. Yeah, 336 00:19:50,600 --> 00:19:53,399 Speaker 1: so they were attributing this to this dead body somehow 337 00:19:53,440 --> 00:19:58,560 Speaker 1: getting you know, nutrition from from uh. These people that 338 00:19:58,600 --> 00:20:02,639 Speaker 1: were dying of consumption and the Jewitt City panic and 339 00:20:02,720 --> 00:20:05,959 Speaker 1: similar incidents had all really taken place in rural, fairly 340 00:20:06,000 --> 00:20:10,040 Speaker 1: isolated areas. They were often small farming communities. There are 341 00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:13,280 Speaker 1: records such as journal juries and even newspaper write ups 342 00:20:13,359 --> 00:20:17,240 Speaker 1: from cities and more metropolitan areas that really suggests that 343 00:20:17,280 --> 00:20:20,840 Speaker 1: when outsiders like would travel through these small towns or 344 00:20:20,880 --> 00:20:24,520 Speaker 1: small settlements, they really kind of chalk this up as 345 00:20:24,600 --> 00:20:28,280 Speaker 1: like crazy superstition and that these were just really overzealous, 346 00:20:28,400 --> 00:20:31,879 Speaker 1: uneducated farm folk who didn't know any better than to 347 00:20:31,960 --> 00:20:36,200 Speaker 1: blame common things on the supernatural. Yeah. And what's interesting 348 00:20:36,280 --> 00:20:39,920 Speaker 1: is that in many instances, the consumption that was actually 349 00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:44,560 Speaker 1: killing people had really been diagnosed by a doctor, but 350 00:20:44,600 --> 00:20:48,359 Speaker 1: because people didn't really know what was causing consumption, it 351 00:20:48,440 --> 00:20:50,280 Speaker 1: was still believed that it was somehow the dead that 352 00:20:50,320 --> 00:20:52,240 Speaker 1: we're doing it. Yeah. I think a lot of people 353 00:20:52,280 --> 00:20:55,560 Speaker 1: tend to assume uh, And it's often not clear when 354 00:20:55,600 --> 00:20:58,520 Speaker 1: you're reading some of these articles uh and accounts of 355 00:20:58,520 --> 00:21:02,520 Speaker 1: what happened. They think that people didn't know that people 356 00:21:02,560 --> 00:21:04,880 Speaker 1: were dying of a disease. They just sort of thought 357 00:21:04,920 --> 00:21:07,040 Speaker 1: suddenly people were dying and they didn't know what caused it. 358 00:21:07,080 --> 00:21:09,360 Speaker 1: And and while they didn't know the cause of consumption 359 00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:12,240 Speaker 1: and that it was bacterial, there were doctors saying, this 360 00:21:12,240 --> 00:21:17,199 Speaker 1: person has consumption, they are going to die. Uh, So 361 00:21:17,680 --> 00:21:19,960 Speaker 1: there is still this Uh. You know, there was a 362 00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:24,919 Speaker 1: certain amount of knowledge, but it wasn't enough. And you know, 363 00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:28,119 Speaker 1: it's worth considering the fact that in the face of 364 00:21:28,119 --> 00:21:32,320 Speaker 1: a disease that was incurable at the time, it's understandable 365 00:21:32,359 --> 00:21:35,000 Speaker 1: that there was likely a strong desire to do something 366 00:21:35,400 --> 00:21:38,720 Speaker 1: anything to try to remedy the situation, even if it 367 00:21:38,800 --> 00:21:44,000 Speaker 1: was the bizarre digging up bodies and burning of corpses 368 00:21:44,119 --> 00:21:48,440 Speaker 1: or parts of corpses and sometimes consuming them, and it all, 369 00:21:48,680 --> 00:21:52,440 Speaker 1: it all is kind of wacky and bizarre and seems extreme. 370 00:21:52,520 --> 00:21:55,359 Speaker 1: But if you just have you can't do anything, but 371 00:21:55,440 --> 00:21:58,639 Speaker 1: you feel a need to do something that seemed like 372 00:21:58,680 --> 00:22:01,919 Speaker 1: their avenue. And because there were people who, you know, 373 00:22:02,040 --> 00:22:05,480 Speaker 1: by some combination of luck in their their constitution, their 374 00:22:05,520 --> 00:22:09,000 Speaker 1: immune system did not die, there was a lot of 375 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:11,440 Speaker 1: trying to figure out, Okay, why did that person? Right 376 00:22:11,840 --> 00:22:14,320 Speaker 1: with that that clearly there must be something we can 377 00:22:14,320 --> 00:22:17,959 Speaker 1: do because that person survive. And this is something that 378 00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:21,360 Speaker 1: you know, human beings continue to do today. People will 379 00:22:21,359 --> 00:22:25,560 Speaker 1: try all kinds of stuff when you know, told that 380 00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:29,000 Speaker 1: they have something that's not treatable by conventional you know, 381 00:22:29,040 --> 00:22:32,000 Speaker 1: western medicine. Yeah. Well, and it's worth noting that Mercy 382 00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:36,919 Speaker 1: Brown's father who gave into this request to exume his 383 00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:41,160 Speaker 1: family's remains, though he was not there and did think 384 00:22:41,200 --> 00:22:44,040 Speaker 1: it was huie, he never got consumption even though three 385 00:22:44,040 --> 00:22:47,040 Speaker 1: members of his family, four members of his family died 386 00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:50,720 Speaker 1: of it. Uh. And some people said it was because 387 00:22:50,720 --> 00:22:53,440 Speaker 1: he didn't believe that he somehow had you know, magically 388 00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:56,520 Speaker 1: created this talisman for himself of not acknowledging the spirits 389 00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:59,080 Speaker 1: and so they couldn't get him. And in some ways, 390 00:22:59,119 --> 00:23:02,680 Speaker 1: even though scientifically you would say this, you know, supports 391 00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:06,480 Speaker 1: the idea that this wasn't really a functioning, working approach 392 00:23:06,520 --> 00:23:10,199 Speaker 1: to dealing with this disease, some people were able to 393 00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:13,960 Speaker 1: spend his good health as a way to somehow prove 394 00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:17,360 Speaker 1: that in fact, no, no, the spiritual angle is correct. 395 00:23:17,920 --> 00:23:20,879 Speaker 1: As somehow want to do an episode on the history 396 00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:24,760 Speaker 1: of magical thinking, Yeah, but I think it would require 397 00:23:24,920 --> 00:23:27,560 Speaker 1: all of my research for all time forever, and then 398 00:23:27,560 --> 00:23:30,600 Speaker 1: the episode would be like nine minute, million hours long. Well, 399 00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:32,800 Speaker 1: it's and it's hard to find your way into, like 400 00:23:32,920 --> 00:23:35,840 Speaker 1: where you latch in to start something like that, because 401 00:23:35,840 --> 00:23:41,480 Speaker 1: it is that's a long and storied traditions. So while 402 00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:46,080 Speaker 1: they were uh, many many uniting factors in most communities 403 00:23:46,119 --> 00:23:49,640 Speaker 1: that had one of these vampire exhumations take place, they're 404 00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:53,520 Speaker 1: all rural, they're all battling disease outbreaks, the manner in 405 00:23:53,600 --> 00:23:57,160 Speaker 1: which the ritual work was done was not consistent among 406 00:23:57,200 --> 00:24:00,440 Speaker 1: all of these events. Yeah, some in and says a 407 00:24:00,520 --> 00:24:05,040 Speaker 1: vampire exhamation involved a great deal of ritual. One practice 408 00:24:05,080 --> 00:24:08,359 Speaker 1: documented in some cases in Vermont, Connecticut and Rhode Island 409 00:24:08,920 --> 00:24:12,240 Speaker 1: involved burning the dead person's heart, often mixed with herbs, 410 00:24:12,280 --> 00:24:14,720 Speaker 1: and inhaling the smoke as a cure for a disease. 411 00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:20,040 Speaker 1: There's also the eating the ashes ritual that was used 412 00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:23,760 Speaker 1: in the Mercy Brown exhumation. But there were other communities 413 00:24:23,800 --> 00:24:26,959 Speaker 1: that took a really simple approach. They would uh merely 414 00:24:26,960 --> 00:24:30,240 Speaker 1: open the grave, flip the body face down, and then 415 00:24:30,280 --> 00:24:32,640 Speaker 1: rebury it. Yeah, the thinking being, now when this tries 416 00:24:32,680 --> 00:24:34,560 Speaker 1: to get out, it will just be going deeper into 417 00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:38,000 Speaker 1: their correct like it won't it won't understand its orientation. 418 00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:44,320 Speaker 1: People think ghosts are dog smart enough to feed off 419 00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:50,120 Speaker 1: the living, not smart enough to roll over. So Vermont's 420 00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:53,919 Speaker 1: exhumations and burning rituals were much more of a public 421 00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:56,879 Speaker 1: spectacle than anywhere else, and often they took place in 422 00:24:56,920 --> 00:24:59,479 Speaker 1: the town square. This is probably because a lot of 423 00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:02,639 Speaker 1: township in the area at the time had their cemeteries 424 00:25:02,680 --> 00:25:04,600 Speaker 1: close to the center of town rather than weigh out 425 00:25:04,600 --> 00:25:07,960 Speaker 1: on the outskirts as was customary and other places. So 426 00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:10,000 Speaker 1: this minute would be tricky to carry out the whole 427 00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:13,440 Speaker 1: business of addressing this vampire problem in any sort of secret, 428 00:25:13,480 --> 00:25:16,120 Speaker 1: low key way, so instead it just became this extremely 429 00:25:16,160 --> 00:25:18,960 Speaker 1: public practice. Yeah, and most other communities you read about, 430 00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:21,800 Speaker 1: it's kind of like a group of strong willed men 431 00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:23,399 Speaker 1: kind of get together in the dead of night and 432 00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:25,919 Speaker 1: they're going to go do this gruesome thing to protect 433 00:25:25,960 --> 00:25:28,240 Speaker 1: a town or protect a family, and they kind of 434 00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:31,520 Speaker 1: kept it on the d l really, but in Vermont 435 00:25:31,560 --> 00:25:33,639 Speaker 1: they were kind of like party of the town square. 436 00:25:33,640 --> 00:25:37,320 Speaker 1: We're gonna burn some vampires, is you know. They can't 437 00:25:37,320 --> 00:25:40,280 Speaker 1: really hide it when it's right there. Yeah, hard to 438 00:25:40,560 --> 00:25:43,760 Speaker 1: dig up a grave and plain site and still keep 439 00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:48,000 Speaker 1: it quiet. And of course there is um the Griswold 440 00:25:48,040 --> 00:25:51,320 Speaker 1: case where the body was exhumed and the bones were 441 00:25:51,359 --> 00:25:53,760 Speaker 1: rearranged in an effort to keep the dead from rising 442 00:25:53,840 --> 00:25:55,919 Speaker 1: up to claim the victims. And so this is a 443 00:25:55,960 --> 00:26:00,000 Speaker 1: little different than most of them more common approaches um uh. 444 00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:05,400 Speaker 1: Two researchers, including Nicholas Belentoni and paul As sled Zick, 445 00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:08,879 Speaker 1: which I hope I pronounced correctly, wrote an article on 446 00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:13,040 Speaker 1: the American Journal of Physical Anthropology in about it, and 447 00:26:13,080 --> 00:26:16,800 Speaker 1: they suggested the idea that since this JB character was 448 00:26:16,840 --> 00:26:21,320 Speaker 1: exhumed approximately five years after his death, decomposition would have 449 00:26:21,359 --> 00:26:24,000 Speaker 1: been so advanced that he probably wasn't any more than 450 00:26:24,040 --> 00:26:26,880 Speaker 1: bones to work with, and since they could not find 451 00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:29,800 Speaker 1: a blood engorged heart or other flesh to burn, the 452 00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:33,879 Speaker 1: exhumers likely improvised this rearrangement into the skull and crossbones style. 453 00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:37,719 Speaker 1: Because there have not been a lot of those found, 454 00:26:38,440 --> 00:26:43,119 Speaker 1: that might be the only one in fact, so uh, 455 00:26:43,359 --> 00:26:45,560 Speaker 1: we have all of this knowledge of these things happening, 456 00:26:45,560 --> 00:26:49,280 Speaker 1: but we don't have a lot of evidence outside from 457 00:26:49,440 --> 00:26:52,800 Speaker 1: personal accounts and written word. And there have been instances 458 00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:56,800 Speaker 1: where there are suspected graves where people think if we 459 00:26:58,040 --> 00:27:00,879 Speaker 1: uh could dig up this old plot we found, we 460 00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:03,119 Speaker 1: might find some more evidence. But some communities are like, 461 00:27:03,160 --> 00:27:06,440 Speaker 1: please don't do that. Um, they're they're not always into 462 00:27:06,440 --> 00:27:08,679 Speaker 1: the idea of just digging up bodies in the interest 463 00:27:08,720 --> 00:27:12,480 Speaker 1: of finding vampire lower. Not everyone is as excited about 464 00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:16,560 Speaker 1: exhumations many steph, you missed the miss classless. We are 465 00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:21,040 Speaker 1: so so far. The Griswold, Connecticut JB is the only 466 00:27:21,080 --> 00:27:23,800 Speaker 1: instance where we actually have a visual confirmation of this 467 00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:27,560 Speaker 1: practice of exuming the dead to deal with a vampire threat. Yeah, 468 00:27:27,640 --> 00:27:30,840 Speaker 1: we have lots of historical accounts and journals and articles 469 00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:33,840 Speaker 1: and things, but not so many in the United States 470 00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:37,760 Speaker 1: actual graves. Yeah, well of messed up bones and bodies. Yeah. 471 00:27:37,880 --> 00:27:40,880 Speaker 1: And so you know, the Mercy Brown incident was kind 472 00:27:40,880 --> 00:27:44,840 Speaker 1: of considered the book end by many to this bizarre 473 00:27:44,880 --> 00:27:47,119 Speaker 1: panic and outbreak because after that, as we said, it 474 00:27:47,160 --> 00:27:49,600 Speaker 1: got publicized, it got talked about, I mean, news of 475 00:27:49,600 --> 00:27:54,439 Speaker 1: it traveled to London and to Europe, and uh, it 476 00:27:54,480 --> 00:27:57,119 Speaker 1: seems like people suddenly kind of turned the mirror on 477 00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:00,800 Speaker 1: this practice and went, oh yeah, Plus, they were moving 478 00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:03,160 Speaker 1: out of these smaller communities to bigger places to find 479 00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:06,760 Speaker 1: their fortunes and that sort of group think superstition that 480 00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:10,400 Speaker 1: can sometimes happen. This seemed to dissipate around then. So yeah, well, 481 00:28:10,440 --> 00:28:12,720 Speaker 1: in the state of medical knowledge was just so much 482 00:28:12,760 --> 00:28:15,240 Speaker 1: different at the time. And this is something that you 483 00:28:15,240 --> 00:28:18,520 Speaker 1: and I talked about before we recorded our recent episode 484 00:28:18,520 --> 00:28:23,760 Speaker 1: on Phineas Gage that it was really hilarious in a 485 00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:27,760 Speaker 1: way to me to read these accounts from people who 486 00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:30,119 Speaker 1: were writing as though they totally knew what they were 487 00:28:30,119 --> 00:28:34,320 Speaker 1: talking about, but actually had no idea that pathogen's cause 488 00:28:34,440 --> 00:28:39,520 Speaker 1: disease like it's you will read medical documents from you know, 489 00:28:39,720 --> 00:28:44,680 Speaker 1: before the late eight late nineteen, early twentieth century where 490 00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:48,040 Speaker 1: people just seemed to completely know what they're talking about, 491 00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:50,520 Speaker 1: but what they are talking about is not based on 492 00:28:50,880 --> 00:28:54,400 Speaker 1: the reality of medicine as we know it today. Yeah. Well, 493 00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:55,959 Speaker 1: and some of it's just that they didn't have all 494 00:28:56,000 --> 00:29:00,280 Speaker 1: the the data to interpret the data they did have, right, 495 00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:03,920 Speaker 1: so it was easy to kind of, you know, extrampolate 496 00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:07,320 Speaker 1: things down the wrong path. They weren't necessarily using the 497 00:29:07,360 --> 00:29:11,160 Speaker 1: scientific method to approach questions of medicine. If this if 498 00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:14,400 Speaker 1: these stories interest you a lot, there's an awesome podcast 499 00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:19,600 Speaker 1: called saw Bones Maximum fun Um. It is by Sydney 500 00:29:19,600 --> 00:29:23,280 Speaker 1: and Justin Nicklroy, and Sydney is a medical doctor and 501 00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:28,200 Speaker 1: she talks to her husband about just the crazy, ridiculous 502 00:29:28,240 --> 00:29:31,400 Speaker 1: things that used to happen and sometimes still do happen 503 00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:33,840 Speaker 1: in the world of medicine. And they have done lots 504 00:29:33,840 --> 00:29:37,280 Speaker 1: and lots of awesome episodes, including one on John Harvey 505 00:29:37,360 --> 00:29:40,080 Speaker 1: Killogg that actually has some information in it that is 506 00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:43,240 Speaker 1: not an hour one. So even if you the nice 507 00:29:43,280 --> 00:29:46,040 Speaker 1: interlocking yeah, even if you think you know all the 508 00:29:46,080 --> 00:29:49,320 Speaker 1: things about John Harvey Killogg, just give that a listen anyway. 509 00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:52,840 Speaker 1: So that's the scoop on the Vampire. Do you have 510 00:29:52,880 --> 00:29:55,560 Speaker 1: some listener mail to cap this episode off? I do. 511 00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:58,200 Speaker 1: I actually have two pieces. The first one is from 512 00:29:58,600 --> 00:30:01,920 Speaker 1: h Sarah Kate and it's short. She says, hello, gals, 513 00:30:01,920 --> 00:30:04,600 Speaker 1: Holly like you, I so daily. In fact, I first 514 00:30:04,640 --> 00:30:07,160 Speaker 1: heard about the podcast during a mending session. I was 515 00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:09,560 Speaker 1: teaching about darning, and she says, Now I listen to 516 00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:12,480 Speaker 1: the podcast when I sew. She says, I appreciated the 517 00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:14,520 Speaker 1: episode about the invention of the sewing machine and the 518 00:30:14,520 --> 00:30:17,880 Speaker 1: resulting patent disputes. I'd like to hear a podcast about 519 00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:22,080 Speaker 1: mercerized cotton fred or viscos, which I understand to be 520 00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:25,160 Speaker 1: made of, among other things. Would pulp that's correct, heck, 521 00:30:25,280 --> 00:30:28,280 Speaker 1: nylon spandex elastic Now that was a great invention. It 522 00:30:28,320 --> 00:30:30,960 Speaker 1: was even used in corsets before they faded away. And 523 00:30:31,000 --> 00:30:33,800 Speaker 1: why does elastic lose its stretch as rubber bands do? 524 00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:36,760 Speaker 1: Do they become unstretchable? In time? Yours and the Needle 525 00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:39,600 Speaker 1: Arts Sarah Kate and I. She sent us a link 526 00:30:39,640 --> 00:30:43,320 Speaker 1: to her blog which covers her projects which are very cool. 527 00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:45,959 Speaker 1: She does a lot more of sort of heirloom style sewing, 528 00:30:46,880 --> 00:30:49,760 Speaker 1: which is really really lovely. And I wanted to read 529 00:30:49,800 --> 00:30:52,600 Speaker 1: this because, um, while we don't have an immediate plan 530 00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:56,000 Speaker 1: to talk about those things here, uh as most of 531 00:30:56,040 --> 00:30:57,880 Speaker 1: you may know and stuff if you listen to stuff 532 00:30:57,880 --> 00:31:01,600 Speaker 1: to blow your mind. Robert is traveling and so while 533 00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:03,680 Speaker 1: he is in China, which I know he has told 534 00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:06,760 Speaker 1: their listeners he's doing, I'm gonna sub in on one 535 00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:08,840 Speaker 1: of their episodes. And Julie and I've talked about that. 536 00:31:08,880 --> 00:31:13,000 Speaker 1: We want to talk about textiles because nice, that's my jam. Yeah, 537 00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:15,080 Speaker 1: and so we are going to talk about some of 538 00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:18,080 Speaker 1: those things. One of the awesome things about working at 539 00:31:18,080 --> 00:31:20,680 Speaker 1: a place that has so many cool podcasts, is that 540 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:23,160 Speaker 1: when we do have someone who's on leave for some reason, 541 00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:25,960 Speaker 1: well there's all kinds of cool substitutions that people get 542 00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:28,760 Speaker 1: to play with. Yeah, some of our other editors have 543 00:31:28,880 --> 00:31:32,719 Speaker 1: recorded with Julie already, and I'm gonna talk about Velcrow 544 00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:36,440 Speaker 1: a lot because I'm really fascinated by it from a 545 00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:39,120 Speaker 1: scientific point of view. And our other one is from 546 00:31:39,160 --> 00:31:42,040 Speaker 1: our listener Catherine, and I'm not reading her whole email 547 00:31:42,360 --> 00:31:45,480 Speaker 1: because it's lengthy, but it just talks about food, so 548 00:31:45,520 --> 00:31:47,880 Speaker 1: you know, I want to talk about it. She says, 549 00:31:47,960 --> 00:31:50,120 Speaker 1: Dear Holly and Tracy, I've been listening to your podcast 550 00:31:50,160 --> 00:31:52,840 Speaker 1: for a few months now, usually wall fulfilling the less 551 00:31:52,840 --> 00:31:55,240 Speaker 1: brainy aspects of my job as an archivist at the 552 00:31:55,520 --> 00:31:59,400 Speaker 1: Montana Historical Society. Uh. She has lots of reboxing of 553 00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:02,960 Speaker 1: documents and sorting in microfiche. I have worked in archives before. 554 00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:04,440 Speaker 1: I know there are times when your brain is not 555 00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:06,840 Speaker 1: getting stimulated. You know, it seems like you would have 556 00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:09,640 Speaker 1: to be, but not always. I was on a hike though, 557 00:32:09,640 --> 00:32:11,720 Speaker 1: when I finally got around to listening to your podcast 558 00:32:11,760 --> 00:32:14,160 Speaker 1: on ice cream over Labor Day weekend, which may have 559 00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:16,240 Speaker 1: been a poor decision considering the heat of the day 560 00:32:16,320 --> 00:32:19,320 Speaker 1: and the dirts of ice cream atop Mount Helena. Anyway, 561 00:32:19,720 --> 00:32:22,560 Speaker 1: though it's not my area in particular, the history of 562 00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:25,160 Speaker 1: cooking and other quote women's work is something of a 563 00:32:25,200 --> 00:32:28,240 Speaker 1: specialization of a few of our research center and museum staff, 564 00:32:28,520 --> 00:32:30,920 Speaker 1: so I've been exposed to some interesting tidbits about it 565 00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:33,440 Speaker 1: over the past year and a half. Ice cream came 566 00:32:33,520 --> 00:32:36,959 Speaker 1: to Montana before the days of refrigerators. In the summertime, 567 00:32:37,040 --> 00:32:40,280 Speaker 1: homesteaders would sometimes take advantage of hail storms to provide 568 00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:43,680 Speaker 1: the needed ice Okay, that's so cool, that's really say. 569 00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:46,280 Speaker 1: And there's at least one documented case of people going 570 00:32:46,320 --> 00:32:48,239 Speaker 1: up into the mountains to fetch snow to make ice 571 00:32:48,320 --> 00:32:50,880 Speaker 1: cream for a Fourth of July picnic. One of my 572 00:32:50,920 --> 00:32:54,640 Speaker 1: favorite things about working at MHS has been testing historic recipes. 573 00:32:55,080 --> 00:32:57,200 Speaker 1: We had hand cranked ice cream one afternoon in June, 574 00:32:57,280 --> 00:33:00,760 Speaker 1: as well as a pancake breakfast earlier this spring. Uh 575 00:33:00,800 --> 00:33:03,040 Speaker 1: and more than a dozen of us for Pie Day 576 00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:06,680 Speaker 1: made pies from historic recipes found in the Historical Society's 577 00:33:06,680 --> 00:33:10,080 Speaker 1: extensive cookbook collection. Mine was an odd example of a 578 00:33:10,120 --> 00:33:13,680 Speaker 1: non creamy banana pie. From a book printed in and 579 00:33:13,720 --> 00:33:16,120 Speaker 1: of course everyone got to sample the pies once the 580 00:33:16,160 --> 00:33:18,720 Speaker 1: judges had finished their taste tests, and then it talks 581 00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:21,960 Speaker 1: about some other interesting topics that may become a podcast 582 00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:25,480 Speaker 1: for us. But first that just sounds awesome. I would 583 00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:28,720 Speaker 1: love to work in a place with the Brazilian historical cookbooks. 584 00:33:29,080 --> 00:33:30,880 Speaker 1: As a side note that I know from my time 585 00:33:30,920 --> 00:33:33,360 Speaker 1: in libraries, cookbooks are one of the few books that 586 00:33:33,520 --> 00:33:38,720 Speaker 1: pretty consistently gain and appreciating value because so if you 587 00:33:38,760 --> 00:33:41,080 Speaker 1: have an old one that's in good condition, because that's 588 00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:42,880 Speaker 1: part of the problem is that they get used and 589 00:33:42,920 --> 00:33:45,480 Speaker 1: they get food stains on them and butter on the pages. 590 00:33:45,520 --> 00:33:49,200 Speaker 1: They're covered in flour, in grease and everything. Uh yeah, 591 00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:52,720 Speaker 1: when um my mother passed away was quite a while ago, 592 00:33:52,760 --> 00:33:55,040 Speaker 1: I was working in the library, and she collected cookbooks, 593 00:33:55,040 --> 00:33:58,560 Speaker 1: and the first thing our library had said was, when 594 00:33:58,600 --> 00:33:59,880 Speaker 1: you are ready, I would like to talk to you 595 00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:02,480 Speaker 1: at your mother's cookbook collection. And so a lot of 596 00:34:02,480 --> 00:34:04,640 Speaker 1: those ended up in the library because no one was 597 00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:07,160 Speaker 1: going to use them in the family, not because they 598 00:34:07,160 --> 00:34:10,400 Speaker 1: weren't cool, but I mean, if you're trying to tackle 599 00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:11,960 Speaker 1: three recipes a day for the rest of your life, 600 00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:14,279 Speaker 1: you wouldn't get through them, ye uh. And that way 601 00:34:14,280 --> 00:34:16,280 Speaker 1: it kind of felt like other people could really benefit 602 00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:19,520 Speaker 1: from it so well. And suddenly I spent this past 603 00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:22,319 Speaker 1: weekend in Nashville, North Carolina, where there is a used 604 00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:26,440 Speaker 1: in mirror bookshop called the Captain's Bookshelf. Now I wish 605 00:34:26,760 --> 00:34:29,400 Speaker 1: I had spent a lot more time looking. There was 606 00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:32,160 Speaker 1: a cookbook section and I kind of looked at it 607 00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:36,760 Speaker 1: potentially and said, you already have a joy of cooking, right, yes, okay, 608 00:34:36,840 --> 00:34:39,960 Speaker 1: And then that that was the end of my thought process. 609 00:34:39,960 --> 00:34:41,919 Speaker 1: And I'm like, man, I wish I had plundered through 610 00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:44,880 Speaker 1: that a lot. Yeah. Yeah. And it's not like every 611 00:34:45,200 --> 00:34:47,680 Speaker 1: um cookbook is going to appreciate in value, particularly now 612 00:34:47,719 --> 00:34:51,839 Speaker 1: that we have multiple printings of popular television personality. Like 613 00:34:51,840 --> 00:34:54,040 Speaker 1: it's unlikely that your Rachel Ray book is going to 614 00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:56,239 Speaker 1: be really valuable in ten years. Not that there's not 615 00:34:56,280 --> 00:34:58,719 Speaker 1: good stuff in it, it's just not the same uh 616 00:34:58,760 --> 00:35:02,000 Speaker 1: sort of uh supply and demand issues that some of 617 00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:04,320 Speaker 1: the older cookbooks that were printed, like in the early 618 00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:07,400 Speaker 1: nineteen hundreds have really appreciated in value. If there's a 619 00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:10,600 Speaker 1: good copies to learn out, So just interesting cookbook nursery 620 00:35:11,080 --> 00:35:13,480 Speaker 1: If you would like to write to us about historical 621 00:35:13,520 --> 00:35:16,000 Speaker 1: things you have cooked, or anything you've cooked, or your 622 00:35:16,040 --> 00:35:18,759 Speaker 1: pets or anything we've talked about, uh, you can do 623 00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:21,560 Speaker 1: so at History Podcasts at Discovery dot com. You can 624 00:35:21,560 --> 00:35:23,960 Speaker 1: also connect with us on Twitter at missed in History 625 00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:27,839 Speaker 1: and at Facebook dot com slash history class stuff. You 626 00:35:27,920 --> 00:35:30,520 Speaker 1: can visit us on Tumblr at missed in history dot 627 00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:33,720 Speaker 1: tumbler dot com, and we are on Pinterest pinning away. 628 00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:35,759 Speaker 1: If you would like to learn a little bit more 629 00:35:35,800 --> 00:35:37,560 Speaker 1: about what we've talked about today, you can go to 630 00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:39,359 Speaker 1: our website. Type in the word vampire and you will 631 00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:42,040 Speaker 1: get a lot of things, including how vampires worked and 632 00:35:42,120 --> 00:35:43,960 Speaker 1: a quiz to see if you might be a vampire. 633 00:35:45,440 --> 00:35:47,520 Speaker 1: You can a lot of vampire happening. Yeah. You can 634 00:35:47,600 --> 00:35:49,879 Speaker 1: learn about that and almost anything else you can think of, 635 00:35:50,480 --> 00:35:53,440 Speaker 1: Halloween season related or otherwise at our website, which is 636 00:35:53,480 --> 00:36:00,440 Speaker 1: houseetworks dot com for more on this and thousands of 637 00:36:00,440 --> 00:36:13,680 Speaker 1: other topics. Does it how stuff works dot com. Netflix 638 00:36:13,719 --> 00:36:16,880 Speaker 1: streams TV shows and movies directly to your home, saving 639 00:36:16,880 --> 00:36:20,360 Speaker 1: you time, money, and hassle. As a Netflix member, you 640 00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:23,880 Speaker 1: can instantly watch TV episodes and movies streaming directly to 641 00:36:23,920 --> 00:36:27,040 Speaker 1: your PC, Mac, or right to your TV with your 642 00:36:27,200 --> 00:36:30,560 Speaker 1: Xbox three, sixty p S three or Nintendo we console, 643 00:36:30,760 --> 00:36:34,160 Speaker 1: plus Apple devices, Kindle and Nook. Get a free thirty 644 00:36:34,239 --> 00:36:37,879 Speaker 1: day trial membership. Go to www dot Netflix dot com 645 00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:38,879 Speaker 1: and sign up now.