1 00:00:02,759 --> 00:00:07,240 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. 2 00:00:08,280 --> 00:00:12,440 Speaker 2: Finally, charge Point is announcing the EV industry's first cut 3 00:00:12,480 --> 00:00:16,320 Speaker 2: resistant charging cable, as well as an alarm system that's 4 00:00:16,360 --> 00:00:19,960 Speaker 2: as it attempts to deter theft and vandalism. It expects 5 00:00:20,120 --> 00:00:22,880 Speaker 2: the cables to be available for licensed by the middle 6 00:00:22,880 --> 00:00:24,960 Speaker 2: of this year and joining us now to talk more 7 00:00:25,000 --> 00:00:28,200 Speaker 2: about that as charge Points CEO Rick Wilmer. Rick, great 8 00:00:28,240 --> 00:00:31,160 Speaker 2: to get you on the program. I want to ask 9 00:00:31,280 --> 00:00:34,000 Speaker 2: how big of a problem this was in the first place. 10 00:00:34,040 --> 00:00:36,320 Speaker 2: I mean, I know a lot of people are disappointing 11 00:00:36,320 --> 00:00:37,839 Speaker 2: when they pull up to an EV charger and it 12 00:00:37,840 --> 00:00:41,400 Speaker 2: doesn't work. Is that happening a lot more often? And 13 00:00:41,520 --> 00:00:42,839 Speaker 2: is it due to vandalism? 14 00:00:42,960 --> 00:00:46,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, it definitely has been a problem that has been 15 00:00:46,360 --> 00:00:50,720 Speaker 3: pervasive and getting worse. I think the rumor out there 16 00:00:50,800 --> 00:00:53,640 Speaker 3: is that as copper prices go up, thieves believe they 17 00:00:53,640 --> 00:00:56,640 Speaker 3: can make money stealing charging cables and taking them into 18 00:00:56,640 --> 00:01:02,240 Speaker 3: recycling centers. And seen hundreds and hundreds of chargers get vandalized, 19 00:01:02,280 --> 00:01:05,240 Speaker 3: and I bet industry wide it's in the thousands. Seems 20 00:01:05,240 --> 00:01:08,400 Speaker 3: to be concentrated in different areas. It surges in certain 21 00:01:08,440 --> 00:01:11,720 Speaker 3: parts of the country and then builds up again in 22 00:01:11,760 --> 00:01:13,920 Speaker 3: another part of the country. We've also seen it with 23 00:01:13,959 --> 00:01:16,520 Speaker 3: some of our customers in Europe where they've got charging 24 00:01:16,520 --> 00:01:18,959 Speaker 3: cables of chests to chargers. So it's been a real problem. 25 00:01:19,000 --> 00:01:20,400 Speaker 3: It's been very frustrating. 26 00:01:21,760 --> 00:01:21,959 Speaker 4: You know. 27 00:01:22,040 --> 00:01:24,960 Speaker 1: One reason the vandalism exists also is to get access 28 00:01:25,000 --> 00:01:27,840 Speaker 1: to that copper that's underneath the surface there. And I 29 00:01:27,920 --> 00:01:29,360 Speaker 1: want to pull it back to the price of copper 30 00:01:29,400 --> 00:01:31,960 Speaker 1: because interestingly enough, it has been back on the rise 31 00:01:32,480 --> 00:01:35,559 Speaker 1: after a fairly steep decline at the end of last year. 32 00:01:35,959 --> 00:01:39,680 Speaker 1: I'm wondering what this means for you in terms of pricing, 33 00:01:39,720 --> 00:01:43,240 Speaker 1: in terms of what your inputs are costing right now. 34 00:01:44,120 --> 00:01:45,000 Speaker 4: Yeah, good question. 35 00:01:45,080 --> 00:01:48,520 Speaker 3: But quite frankly, the cost of copper as part of 36 00:01:48,560 --> 00:01:51,080 Speaker 3: the overall cost of a charging station is not all 37 00:01:51,080 --> 00:01:54,200 Speaker 3: that significant. And I think a lot of the thieves 38 00:01:54,200 --> 00:01:57,520 Speaker 3: aren't that intelligent, and you know, here a rumor or 39 00:01:58,200 --> 00:02:01,520 Speaker 3: see something that makes them think they can make money, 40 00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:03,920 Speaker 3: and it turns out there's just not that much value there. 41 00:02:04,800 --> 00:02:07,120 Speaker 5: I want to talk a little bit more about reliability. 42 00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:10,440 Speaker 5: Of course, if your chargers are being vandalized, that would 43 00:02:10,440 --> 00:02:13,560 Speaker 5: be a point of reliability becoming an issue. But let's 44 00:02:13,560 --> 00:02:17,360 Speaker 5: also talk about software, like Matt mentioned, making sure that 45 00:02:17,720 --> 00:02:21,520 Speaker 5: these chargers work every single time for all types of evs. 46 00:02:21,919 --> 00:02:25,080 Speaker 5: How much time do you spend on the software making 47 00:02:25,080 --> 00:02:26,600 Speaker 5: sure that that actually is the case. 48 00:02:27,280 --> 00:02:30,639 Speaker 3: That is our single biggest area of investment in innovation. 49 00:02:30,880 --> 00:02:33,360 Speaker 3: Like many other industries, software is going to eat the 50 00:02:33,400 --> 00:02:36,280 Speaker 3: world at EV charging, So we spend a lot of 51 00:02:36,320 --> 00:02:41,080 Speaker 3: time not only making charging reliable through software making it 52 00:02:41,160 --> 00:02:43,720 Speaker 3: easy to find, use and pay for charging, but also 53 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:47,360 Speaker 3: to develop all kinds of interesting new features that our 54 00:02:47,400 --> 00:02:51,160 Speaker 3: customers can take advantage of to not only drive utilization 55 00:02:51,240 --> 00:02:53,960 Speaker 3: of charging at their institutions, but also to drive their 56 00:02:53,960 --> 00:02:54,600 Speaker 3: poor business. 57 00:02:56,160 --> 00:02:59,000 Speaker 4: Rick, I wonder about EV growth. 58 00:02:59,040 --> 00:03:02,520 Speaker 2: There had been clearly a big backlash, and with Donald 59 00:03:02,520 --> 00:03:05,560 Speaker 2: Trump coming into office, you may think, well, he's going to, 60 00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:10,320 Speaker 2: you know, remove the credit and slow EV sales even further. 61 00:03:10,440 --> 00:03:14,519 Speaker 2: On the other hand, Elon Musk has purchased himself a 62 00:03:14,600 --> 00:03:15,840 Speaker 2: place at the table here. 63 00:03:17,200 --> 00:03:20,040 Speaker 4: Do you expect EV growth to pick up. 64 00:03:20,080 --> 00:03:23,000 Speaker 2: Again or is it going to continue to slow in 65 00:03:23,040 --> 00:03:23,840 Speaker 2: twenty twenty five. 66 00:03:24,520 --> 00:03:26,079 Speaker 3: No, I don't think it's going to slow at all. 67 00:03:26,160 --> 00:03:29,960 Speaker 3: In fact, Bloomberg New Energy just forecasted earlier this week 68 00:03:30,000 --> 00:03:32,880 Speaker 3: twenty eight percent growth for EV's in North America this 69 00:03:33,000 --> 00:03:35,720 Speaker 3: year and thirty three percent in Europe. And I think 70 00:03:35,760 --> 00:03:38,960 Speaker 3: what's really driving that and it overcomes you know, government 71 00:03:39,680 --> 00:03:43,240 Speaker 3: incentives or lack of is really market forces. And I 72 00:03:43,280 --> 00:03:47,080 Speaker 3: think what's held EV's back in the past on one 73 00:03:47,120 --> 00:03:49,720 Speaker 3: side of the equations just the lack of selection of vehicles. 74 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:52,480 Speaker 3: So we're going to see dozens of new EV models 75 00:03:52,480 --> 00:03:55,880 Speaker 3: introduced this year, you know, different types of vehicles, lower 76 00:03:55,920 --> 00:03:58,280 Speaker 3: price points, and I think that's really going to help adoption. 77 00:03:58,960 --> 00:04:01,280 Speaker 3: And then on the charging side, you know, we continue 78 00:04:01,320 --> 00:04:04,160 Speaker 3: to grow our networks, we continue to deploy more chargers 79 00:04:04,680 --> 00:04:09,680 Speaker 3: and innovations like we announced today around making chargers more reliable, 80 00:04:09,680 --> 00:04:12,600 Speaker 3: but preventing vandalism is going to help the other side 81 00:04:12,600 --> 00:04:15,480 Speaker 3: of the equation, you know, where drivers are concerned about 82 00:04:15,480 --> 00:04:18,160 Speaker 3: finding a charger and when they do find one, making 83 00:04:18,160 --> 00:04:18,960 Speaker 3: sure that it works. 84 00:04:20,000 --> 00:04:23,160 Speaker 2: Is it possible, Well, I mean it's possible to charge 85 00:04:23,160 --> 00:04:26,960 Speaker 2: Tesla at charge point station, But do you have a 86 00:04:27,120 --> 00:04:31,120 Speaker 2: significant number of Tesla owners charging at your stations? 87 00:04:31,920 --> 00:04:32,840 Speaker 4: Yes, a lot. 88 00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:35,360 Speaker 3: If you walk into our parking lot, there's probably more 89 00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:38,279 Speaker 3: Tesla's out here charging than there are any other makeup vehicle, 90 00:04:38,400 --> 00:04:40,080 Speaker 3: just because they're so prevalent on the road. 91 00:04:41,279 --> 00:04:43,480 Speaker 1: What do you think this means for Tesla? You know 92 00:04:43,520 --> 00:04:46,280 Speaker 1: a lot of people are talking about Elon Musk's closeness 93 00:04:46,279 --> 00:04:48,880 Speaker 1: to the President elect at the moment. Do you think 94 00:04:48,920 --> 00:04:51,599 Speaker 1: that that's going to give him an advantage relative to 95 00:04:52,040 --> 00:04:56,160 Speaker 1: other ED companies out there, especially because they're already very 96 00:04:56,240 --> 00:04:58,280 Speaker 1: much in the lead when you think about the standalone 97 00:04:58,440 --> 00:04:59,120 Speaker 1: D companies. 98 00:05:00,040 --> 00:05:00,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's so. 99 00:05:00,520 --> 00:05:01,000 Speaker 4: Hard to know. 100 00:05:01,480 --> 00:05:04,440 Speaker 3: I really believe that what drives EV sales is the 101 00:05:05,160 --> 00:05:09,920 Speaker 3: superiority of an electric vehicle versus an internal combustion vehicle. 102 00:05:10,480 --> 00:05:13,200 Speaker 3: And again, like you mentioned earlier, as more models become 103 00:05:13,240 --> 00:05:16,919 Speaker 3: available that meet the needs of different types of drivers, 104 00:05:16,960 --> 00:05:19,920 Speaker 3: that require different kinds of vehicles, and at a variety 105 00:05:19,960 --> 00:05:22,160 Speaker 3: of price points, the market's going to grow. I think 106 00:05:22,200 --> 00:05:25,240 Speaker 3: they're just a superior product to the internal combustion vehicle. 107 00:05:25,680 --> 00:05:25,880 Speaker 4: Rick. 108 00:05:25,920 --> 00:05:29,279 Speaker 2: As you know, I have a podcast called Hot Pursuit 109 00:05:29,320 --> 00:05:31,920 Speaker 2: with Hannah Elliott where we talk basically about our love 110 00:05:31,960 --> 00:05:34,640 Speaker 2: for cars, and there's some exciting evs coming out. I 111 00:05:34,640 --> 00:05:38,240 Speaker 2: think Hannah's going to drive a Porsche Macon EV next week. 112 00:05:38,480 --> 00:05:39,000 Speaker 4: What are you. 113 00:05:39,040 --> 00:05:41,720 Speaker 2: Most excited about in terms of product offering in twenty 114 00:05:41,760 --> 00:05:42,320 Speaker 2: twenty five. 115 00:05:43,400 --> 00:05:46,440 Speaker 3: Wow, there's so much coming. I think the Mcon is 116 00:05:46,480 --> 00:05:49,760 Speaker 3: an exciting vehicle. I'm excited to see some of the 117 00:05:49,880 --> 00:05:54,080 Speaker 3: Slantis vehicles come out. There's just a lot coming that 118 00:05:54,120 --> 00:05:56,039 Speaker 3: I'm excited about. By the way, Matt big fan of 119 00:05:56,080 --> 00:05:58,240 Speaker 3: the podcast. I listened to that pretty regularly. 120 00:05:58,720 --> 00:06:00,000 Speaker 4: Well, I really appreciate it. 121 00:06:00,240 --> 00:06:02,679 Speaker 2: Rick, thanks so much for joining us on Bloomberg Television 122 00:06:02,680 --> 00:06:06,360 Speaker 2: as well. Charge Points CEO Rick Wilmer. For more on 123 00:06:06,480 --> 00:06:09,000 Speaker 2: all things auto. Go ahead and check out my podcast 124 00:06:09,320 --> 00:06:12,240 Speaker 2: with Hannah Elliott. It is called Hot Pursuit and you 125 00:06:12,240 --> 00:06:15,400 Speaker 2: can get it on Bloomberg dot com or anywhere you 126 00:06:15,520 --> 00:06:17,159 Speaker 2: get your podcast. 127 00:06:17,200 --> 00:06:20,039 Speaker 1: I'll be listening to the Maccon episode. Yeah, that's the 128 00:06:20,080 --> 00:06:20,640 Speaker 1: car I want.