1 00:00:02,279 --> 00:00:07,920 Speaker 1: Ephemeral as production of iHeart three D audio for full exposure. 2 00:00:08,480 --> 00:00:20,479 Speaker 1: Listen with that phone. It's both likely and tragic that 3 00:00:20,560 --> 00:00:23,960 Speaker 1: you've probably never heard this piece of music before. It's 4 00:00:24,000 --> 00:00:27,880 Speaker 1: the third movement of William Grant Still's Second Symphony, also 5 00:00:27,920 --> 00:00:33,879 Speaker 1: titled Song of a New Race. Still was one of 6 00:00:33,880 --> 00:00:37,320 Speaker 1: the few black composers to successfully break through the classical 7 00:00:37,360 --> 00:00:40,800 Speaker 1: music world in the early to mid twentieth century. Some 8 00:00:40,880 --> 00:00:44,400 Speaker 1: would even say Still was the most important Black composer 9 00:00:44,560 --> 00:00:48,320 Speaker 1: of his time. My grandfather, William gret Still, is commonly 10 00:00:48,360 --> 00:00:52,400 Speaker 1: known as the Dean of African American composers. That's mostly 11 00:00:52,440 --> 00:00:55,320 Speaker 1: because he has a very long list of firsts, like 12 00:00:55,440 --> 00:00:58,680 Speaker 1: he was the first black man to conduct a major 13 00:00:58,760 --> 00:01:02,680 Speaker 1: radio orchestra. That's Celeste Headley, a journalist, last month the 14 00:01:02,720 --> 00:01:08,240 Speaker 1: Atlanta City Council, musician, author, radio personality. I'm Celest Hedley. 15 00:01:08,280 --> 00:01:11,280 Speaker 1: This is on second thought public speaker. According to Pew Research, 16 00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:14,560 Speaker 1: about a third of American teenagers send more than a 17 00:01:14,640 --> 00:01:18,800 Speaker 1: hundred texts a day, and among many other things, an 18 00:01:18,840 --> 00:01:21,399 Speaker 1: old friend and colleague of mine, I like your hair 19 00:01:21,480 --> 00:01:23,880 Speaker 1: that length and it looks healthy. I actually use like 20 00:01:23,880 --> 00:01:28,240 Speaker 1: proper champoo now. I don't use like three in one. 21 00:01:30,160 --> 00:01:32,360 Speaker 1: If two of that was because of me teasing you, 22 00:01:32,440 --> 00:01:35,280 Speaker 1: then I'll take it as she spoiled for us just 23 00:01:35,360 --> 00:01:40,640 Speaker 1: a minute ago. William Grant Still was her grandfather. He 24 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:43,679 Speaker 1: was my favorite person. My father died when I was 25 00:01:43,800 --> 00:01:45,679 Speaker 1: very young, like less than a year old, and so 26 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:49,040 Speaker 1: my grandfather stepped into that role for me. I didn't 27 00:01:49,120 --> 00:01:54,560 Speaker 1: quite realize he was famous until he died. When celest 28 00:01:54,600 --> 00:01:57,760 Speaker 1: and I worked together many years ago, her grandfather often 29 00:01:57,840 --> 00:02:01,320 Speaker 1: came up as a topic of casual conversation, and both 30 00:02:01,320 --> 00:02:04,160 Speaker 1: Celeste and I were trained classical musicians, so we spent 31 00:02:04,240 --> 00:02:08,120 Speaker 1: a lot of time talking shop. But somehow, prior to 32 00:02:08,160 --> 00:02:11,600 Speaker 1: meeting Celeste, I knew really next to nothing about William Grant. 33 00:02:11,600 --> 00:02:15,880 Speaker 1: Still never in my conservatory training did still music really 34 00:02:15,880 --> 00:02:20,600 Speaker 1: come up, either for research or for performance purposes. As 35 00:02:20,600 --> 00:02:24,680 Speaker 1: Celeste told me, that's sadly pretty common. Much to her dismay, 36 00:02:25,000 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 1: Still all too often gets boxed in as a quote 37 00:02:27,880 --> 00:02:31,840 Speaker 1: black composer. Therefore his works may only get played during 38 00:02:31,880 --> 00:02:36,079 Speaker 1: Black History Month, and that's a big problem. We need 39 00:02:36,120 --> 00:02:40,040 Speaker 1: to just stop treating it like black music. Stop only 40 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:43,720 Speaker 1: performing the Afromaeric con Symphony, stop only performing it during 41 00:02:43,760 --> 00:02:48,400 Speaker 1: Black History Month. Start playing the freaking music. It's available. 42 00:02:48,520 --> 00:02:50,560 Speaker 1: You can get the art songs, you can get the 43 00:02:50,639 --> 00:02:56,560 Speaker 1: chamber works. The piano pieces are amazing. Let's study the 44 00:02:56,720 --> 00:03:00,160 Speaker 1: music itself. I went to school with Aaron Dworkin, who 45 00:03:00,200 --> 00:03:03,000 Speaker 1: went on to found the Sphinx Competition. And Aaron and 46 00:03:03,080 --> 00:03:05,440 Speaker 1: I were sitting there talking about one of grandfather symphonies 47 00:03:05,760 --> 00:03:09,320 Speaker 1: and one of our friends, who's black and a trumpet player, 48 00:03:10,000 --> 00:03:12,280 Speaker 1: was like, the reason they don't play still more is 49 00:03:12,280 --> 00:03:14,960 Speaker 1: because it's just not as good as Beethoven. Okay, let's 50 00:03:14,960 --> 00:03:20,560 Speaker 1: be honest. And I was like, what what are you 51 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:25,040 Speaker 1: talking about? Nobody's Beethoven except Beethoven. So like, this is 52 00:03:25,080 --> 00:03:27,960 Speaker 1: the sort of stereotypes and racism, which is it just 53 00:03:28,080 --> 00:03:31,080 Speaker 1: embedded in our curriculum. We are going to have to 54 00:03:31,200 --> 00:03:37,360 Speaker 1: intentionally get it out of there, you know. I remember 55 00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:42,400 Speaker 1: the NPR Show performance today from a p M American 56 00:03:42,560 --> 00:03:47,200 Speaker 1: Public Media. This is performance today. I'm Fred gild and 57 00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:50,080 Speaker 1: they have their Essential Library where they add, you know, 58 00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:53,680 Speaker 1: one or two pieces each episode. I never knew about 59 00:03:53,760 --> 00:03:57,720 Speaker 1: this piece of music written in ninet by American composer 60 00:03:57,880 --> 00:04:03,000 Speaker 1: William Grant Still, and they did my Grandfather's piece for 61 00:04:03,000 --> 00:04:15,440 Speaker 1: the Sweet for violin and piano. It was like minutes 62 00:04:15,840 --> 00:04:19,279 Speaker 1: minutes into the radio piece before they even mentioned that 63 00:04:19,320 --> 00:04:22,080 Speaker 1: he was black, Like almost the entire thing was just 64 00:04:22,120 --> 00:04:26,279 Speaker 1: them talking about the music. And I cried, like I 65 00:04:26,320 --> 00:04:31,520 Speaker 1: got so moved that they were talking about the music 66 00:04:32,160 --> 00:04:35,240 Speaker 1: and not his color. It was a moment for me, 67 00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:39,360 Speaker 1: and that's really what he wanted. And he could get 68 00:04:39,480 --> 00:04:41,880 Speaker 1: so irritated that people were always calling him a black 69 00:04:41,880 --> 00:04:44,240 Speaker 1: composer because he was like, what do you call Copeland 70 00:04:44,240 --> 00:04:47,320 Speaker 1: a Jewish composer? Every time you introduce him, Like, talk 71 00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:51,040 Speaker 1: about the music. So that's what we're gonna do today. 72 00:04:51,760 --> 00:04:54,000 Speaker 1: But of course it would still be impossible to talk 73 00:04:54,040 --> 00:04:57,680 Speaker 1: about still without also understanding where he came from and 74 00:04:57,720 --> 00:05:00,840 Speaker 1: how race played a role in his career. But all 75 00:05:00,839 --> 00:05:04,360 Speaker 1: of that is purely historical, and the Celest says all 76 00:05:04,480 --> 00:05:07,520 Speaker 1: judgment of steels music should remain independent of his identity 77 00:05:07,640 --> 00:05:12,000 Speaker 1: or life experience. I asked Celeste to start at the beginning. 78 00:05:14,720 --> 00:05:18,120 Speaker 1: He became interested in music at a very young age. 79 00:05:18,640 --> 00:05:22,640 Speaker 1: He took violin lessons with old Mr Price in Little Rock, 80 00:05:22,760 --> 00:05:25,840 Speaker 1: Arkansas when he was still very very young child. He 81 00:05:25,839 --> 00:05:28,480 Speaker 1: would make his own instruments. He would get, you know, 82 00:05:28,560 --> 00:05:32,000 Speaker 1: old cigar boxes and stuff and make little violins. He 83 00:05:32,080 --> 00:05:34,799 Speaker 1: knew fairly early on that he wasn't a great performer. 84 00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:38,120 Speaker 1: Later on in his life, we met one of the 85 00:05:38,120 --> 00:05:40,200 Speaker 1: women who grew up near him in as a neighborhood 86 00:05:40,200 --> 00:05:42,760 Speaker 1: in Little Rock, and she said, when Billy played the violin, 87 00:05:42,800 --> 00:05:45,640 Speaker 1: it almost made you cry. And he said that wasn't 88 00:05:45,640 --> 00:05:51,279 Speaker 1: a compliment. He then, after he left high school, went 89 00:05:51,520 --> 00:05:55,400 Speaker 1: to college. He went to Wilberforce as a premed major. 90 00:05:56,720 --> 00:05:59,400 Speaker 1: At that time, for black people, there was no respectable 91 00:05:59,480 --> 00:06:04,560 Speaker 1: job as a musician. That was the era of Scott 92 00:06:04,640 --> 00:06:08,160 Speaker 1: Joplin and his mother. She didn't want him playing in brothels, 93 00:06:09,880 --> 00:06:13,160 Speaker 1: so he would sneak the music in. He would put 94 00:06:13,720 --> 00:06:17,839 Speaker 1: scores inside his books so it looked like he was studying, 95 00:06:17,880 --> 00:06:20,919 Speaker 1: and he was actually reading scores. And he started musical 96 00:06:21,040 --> 00:06:28,800 Speaker 1: ensembles there, and that's where he first began composing. And 97 00:06:28,880 --> 00:06:33,320 Speaker 1: then he ended up at Oberlin University where he studied 98 00:06:33,320 --> 00:06:39,440 Speaker 1: for quite a while on a full scholarship. He then 99 00:06:39,480 --> 00:06:42,279 Speaker 1: went to New York and he began playing popular music 100 00:06:42,320 --> 00:06:45,120 Speaker 1: like he was the first person to make an arrangement 101 00:06:45,120 --> 00:06:50,680 Speaker 1: of the st Louis Blues with W. C. Handy. He 102 00:06:50,760 --> 00:06:53,640 Speaker 1: became very good friends. As W. C. Handy, he began 103 00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:57,880 Speaker 1: recording things like more tim Panaley songs under pseudonyms. He 104 00:06:58,000 --> 00:07:00,840 Speaker 1: worked at the Black Swan Recording Company, which was the 105 00:07:00,880 --> 00:07:04,040 Speaker 1: first black owned recording company in America. He was a 106 00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:06,600 Speaker 1: musical director there, and at that time, you can see 107 00:07:06,640 --> 00:07:10,840 Speaker 1: pictures where there's like a big horn installed in the 108 00:07:10,880 --> 00:07:13,440 Speaker 1: wall and all the musicians are sitting there playing and 109 00:07:13,440 --> 00:07:15,800 Speaker 1: they're aiming their instruments at the horn in the wall 110 00:07:15,840 --> 00:07:23,880 Speaker 1: so they can be recorded. He did all kinds of stuff. 111 00:07:23,880 --> 00:07:26,480 Speaker 1: He played in the orchestra for Shuffle Along, which became 112 00:07:26,520 --> 00:07:33,520 Speaker 1: a very very pivotal musical. He was having to make 113 00:07:33,560 --> 00:07:36,960 Speaker 1: his living doing some popular things, like he orchestrated things 114 00:07:37,000 --> 00:07:42,840 Speaker 1: for Paul Whitman, the King of Jazz, this white dude, 115 00:07:42,920 --> 00:07:46,520 Speaker 1: he's called himself the King of jazz. And this whole 116 00:07:46,520 --> 00:07:50,440 Speaker 1: time he was studying classical music. He took lessons from 117 00:07:50,440 --> 00:07:54,600 Speaker 1: George Chadwick at Boston Conservatory, he took private tutoring with 118 00:07:54,760 --> 00:07:59,880 Speaker 1: Edgar Varez, and he was writing classical music the whole time. 119 00:08:00,560 --> 00:08:02,560 Speaker 1: But it took him a while to actually be able 120 00:08:02,600 --> 00:08:05,720 Speaker 1: to support himself through classical music. As you can imagine. 121 00:08:07,280 --> 00:08:10,320 Speaker 1: As Celest mentioned, there weren't a ton of opportunities for 122 00:08:10,400 --> 00:08:13,880 Speaker 1: black composers at that time. William Grant still knew it 123 00:08:13,920 --> 00:08:17,320 Speaker 1: would be an uphill battle, and in fact it ended 124 00:08:17,400 --> 00:08:23,480 Speaker 1: up being a path riddled with barriers. He experienced difficulties 125 00:08:23,520 --> 00:08:26,360 Speaker 1: all along the way, and some of them were over 126 00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:30,480 Speaker 1: when he was he was touring with Hubie Blake. Sometimes 127 00:08:30,600 --> 00:08:32,920 Speaker 1: there were no restaurants that they could eat while they 128 00:08:32,920 --> 00:08:35,679 Speaker 1: were on tour, or hotels to stay in. Those kind 129 00:08:35,679 --> 00:08:37,679 Speaker 1: of stories that are awful but that were used to hearing, 130 00:08:38,800 --> 00:08:41,800 Speaker 1: you know. When he was younger, he was really optimistic though, 131 00:08:41,840 --> 00:08:45,560 Speaker 1: and he felt that his music might serve as a 132 00:08:45,600 --> 00:08:50,040 Speaker 1: bridge between the races. That music is ideally suited for 133 00:08:50,400 --> 00:08:54,840 Speaker 1: addressing racism because it transcends language, right. He had some 134 00:08:54,960 --> 00:08:58,000 Speaker 1: really hot, big dreams and high ideals about his music 135 00:08:58,040 --> 00:09:02,640 Speaker 1: when he was younger. Over the course of his life 136 00:09:02,679 --> 00:09:06,560 Speaker 1: you can see doors shutting for him, and by the 137 00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:12,480 Speaker 1: time I came along, he was a little defeated. It 138 00:09:12,559 --> 00:09:17,520 Speaker 1: had been a long life of constant, constant tribulations. Just 139 00:09:17,600 --> 00:09:19,760 Speaker 1: an example, there was one point at which they had 140 00:09:19,880 --> 00:09:24,360 Speaker 1: paid for the recording of music by American composers. He 141 00:09:24,440 --> 00:09:27,800 Speaker 1: was the only black composer included. They sent the discs 142 00:09:27,840 --> 00:09:30,040 Speaker 1: overseas so they could get impressed, right, you know, this 143 00:09:30,080 --> 00:09:34,199 Speaker 1: isn't the age of digital files. And every single disc 144 00:09:34,600 --> 00:09:38,240 Speaker 1: arrived safely except for his, which coincidentally, we're all smashed. 145 00:09:39,040 --> 00:09:41,480 Speaker 1: I mean throughout his entire life, you hear things like that. 146 00:09:41,520 --> 00:09:43,840 Speaker 1: When he went to get his honorary doctorate from Oberlin, 147 00:09:44,240 --> 00:09:47,120 Speaker 1: he decided to drive from l A to Ohio. He 148 00:09:47,160 --> 00:09:49,439 Speaker 1: couldn't stay at the white hotels because he's black, he 149 00:09:49,480 --> 00:09:52,520 Speaker 1: couldn't stay at the black hotels because his wife's Jewish. 150 00:09:52,760 --> 00:09:55,960 Speaker 1: He drove straight from l A to Ohio without stopping, 151 00:09:56,360 --> 00:10:00,000 Speaker 1: and you see him in the pictures and he's like, uh, 152 00:10:00,360 --> 00:10:03,840 Speaker 1: and it's just this. I mean, it's like photographic evidence. 153 00:10:04,920 --> 00:10:07,240 Speaker 1: I could go story after story after story, but it 154 00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:15,079 Speaker 1: was constant. So how was still able to push through 155 00:10:15,320 --> 00:10:19,480 Speaker 1: and overcome these challenges well, at least in part with 156 00:10:19,520 --> 00:10:22,440 Speaker 1: a little help from his friends. First of all, he 157 00:10:22,520 --> 00:10:26,319 Speaker 1: had some very powerful champions. He was good friends with 158 00:10:26,679 --> 00:10:30,000 Speaker 1: the post Takowski. The person who got his very first 159 00:10:30,080 --> 00:10:33,360 Speaker 1: big concert performance was, of course, his mentor at that time, 160 00:10:33,720 --> 00:10:37,559 Speaker 1: Edgar Varez. There were people who were fighting for him 161 00:10:37,559 --> 00:10:39,440 Speaker 1: and speaking up for him all along the way, and 162 00:10:39,480 --> 00:10:42,800 Speaker 1: frankly they were white, which think is informative as we 163 00:10:42,920 --> 00:10:46,040 Speaker 1: moved forward with racism. It's important to remember that the 164 00:10:46,040 --> 00:10:49,079 Speaker 1: people who have the most power to bring about change 165 00:10:49,240 --> 00:10:53,240 Speaker 1: are actually white people. My grandfather's life is a testament 166 00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:57,760 Speaker 1: to that. Of course, there are still many other reasons 167 00:10:57,960 --> 00:11:01,600 Speaker 1: why still became so highly regarded m I mean, there's also, 168 00:11:01,640 --> 00:11:03,360 Speaker 1: of course the question the fact that the music is 169 00:11:03,440 --> 00:11:07,200 Speaker 1: just very good. It's extremely high quality. And the other 170 00:11:07,240 --> 00:11:09,240 Speaker 1: thing that's very unique about his music is we have 171 00:11:09,320 --> 00:11:11,439 Speaker 1: to remember he was writing melody at a time when 172 00:11:11,440 --> 00:11:14,960 Speaker 1: that was not considered I don't want to say fashionable, 173 00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:20,600 Speaker 1: but that is not what people were writing. We're talking 174 00:11:20,600 --> 00:11:23,920 Speaker 1: about the middle of the twentieth century when he was 175 00:11:24,040 --> 00:11:27,720 Speaker 1: really denigrated for writing melody, and reviewers would call his 176 00:11:27,840 --> 00:11:30,800 Speaker 1: music simplistic, or that he was trying to write pop music, 177 00:11:31,480 --> 00:11:34,160 Speaker 1: or that he was appealing to the audience, and they 178 00:11:34,200 --> 00:11:39,319 Speaker 1: said that like it was an criticism he was pandering 179 00:11:39,400 --> 00:11:42,240 Speaker 1: to the audience by writing tunes. There was a lot 180 00:11:42,280 --> 00:11:47,559 Speaker 1: of stuff going on. For context, in the early twenty century, 181 00:11:47,880 --> 00:11:57,120 Speaker 1: classical music was changing folks like Igor Stravinsky and Arnold 182 00:11:57,120 --> 00:12:00,880 Speaker 1: Schoenberg were challenging the norms of things like melody and 183 00:12:00,920 --> 00:12:12,080 Speaker 1: traditional song structure. Modernist composers like Edgard Varrez took this 184 00:12:12,240 --> 00:12:16,800 Speaker 1: even further, adopting what seemed like completely randomized approaches to 185 00:12:16,880 --> 00:12:30,080 Speaker 1: creating music. Vaez, perhaps strangely enough, was one of Still's mentors. 186 00:12:32,880 --> 00:12:34,880 Speaker 1: It was a skilled composer, but I think he wrote 187 00:12:34,920 --> 00:12:40,600 Speaker 1: one piece for two airplane engines. This was a time 188 00:12:40,640 --> 00:12:43,960 Speaker 1: when people really were questioning, I think, in a healthy way, 189 00:12:44,520 --> 00:12:48,040 Speaker 1: what constitutes music. Does it have to have a melody 190 00:12:48,080 --> 00:12:54,160 Speaker 1: to be music? No, But then what distinguishes music from 191 00:12:54,200 --> 00:12:56,920 Speaker 1: just a random collection of sounds? Right? These are the 192 00:12:57,000 --> 00:12:59,800 Speaker 1: questions that were occupying people in the early twentieth century, 193 00:13:02,640 --> 00:13:05,400 Speaker 1: and they also dug into this idea of sort of 194 00:13:06,160 --> 00:13:10,839 Speaker 1: flouting expectations of going for a dissonant chord rather than 195 00:13:11,120 --> 00:13:14,920 Speaker 1: what people would expect of really leaning into those tried 196 00:13:15,000 --> 00:13:21,319 Speaker 1: to ones. And my grandfather has actually talked about what 197 00:13:21,679 --> 00:13:24,520 Speaker 1: is quite a bit, and he expressed a lot of 198 00:13:24,559 --> 00:13:28,080 Speaker 1: gratitude for ed Gard Fardez. He also said that although 199 00:13:28,120 --> 00:13:30,880 Speaker 1: he rejected that idiom, that style of dissonance and a 200 00:13:30,960 --> 00:13:36,040 Speaker 1: tonality It really freed him up as a composer into 201 00:13:36,559 --> 00:13:40,280 Speaker 1: learning how to use dissonance. It's not like all of 202 00:13:40,360 --> 00:13:43,960 Speaker 1: Grandfather's music is tonal. It's not. It's just that he 203 00:13:44,200 --> 00:13:49,800 Speaker 1: learned to use dissonance in a really intentional way. He 204 00:13:50,000 --> 00:13:53,480 Speaker 1: learned to surprise people. If the audience was expecting you 205 00:13:53,600 --> 00:13:56,800 Speaker 1: to resolve down to a four chord, he would surprise 206 00:13:56,880 --> 00:13:59,160 Speaker 1: you and go the other way and and use that 207 00:13:59,200 --> 00:14:02,679 Speaker 1: in a strategic way to create these pieces that had 208 00:14:02,760 --> 00:14:10,959 Speaker 1: landscape and direction. I think that's one of the things 209 00:14:11,040 --> 00:14:14,120 Speaker 1: I really like about Grandfather's music is that a it's 210 00:14:14,120 --> 00:14:16,800 Speaker 1: not long winded, right, it's not Mahler. He says what 211 00:14:16,880 --> 00:14:19,000 Speaker 1: he needs to say and he gets out, but it's 212 00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:22,920 Speaker 1: always moving forward. It always has a place to go. 213 00:14:27,320 --> 00:14:30,240 Speaker 1: You could say maybe that's part of African American heritage, 214 00:14:30,240 --> 00:14:34,360 Speaker 1: because obviously they're very much pardon the punt, driven by rhythm, 215 00:14:34,400 --> 00:14:37,680 Speaker 1: but it's also just part of his personal style that motion. 216 00:14:49,240 --> 00:14:53,160 Speaker 1: As we just heard, William Grant Still was largely dedicated 217 00:14:53,240 --> 00:14:57,560 Speaker 1: to melody, rhythm and motion. There's probably no better place 218 00:14:57,600 --> 00:15:00,840 Speaker 1: to see this than what's Still's most famous p his 219 00:15:00,960 --> 00:15:06,560 Speaker 1: first symphony, also called the Afro American symphony that was 220 00:15:06,600 --> 00:15:11,520 Speaker 1: written in nineteen and he said about it that in 221 00:15:11,560 --> 00:15:15,040 Speaker 1: that symphony he wasn't trying to portray like the upper 222 00:15:15,120 --> 00:15:17,960 Speaker 1: class of African Americans. He was trying to portray the 223 00:15:18,040 --> 00:15:21,160 Speaker 1: sons of the soil, he said, those who still had 224 00:15:21,160 --> 00:15:25,520 Speaker 1: a strong connection to their ancestors in Africa and hadn't 225 00:15:25,560 --> 00:15:30,520 Speaker 1: completely assimilated. Every movement, and there are four movements. Has 226 00:15:30,560 --> 00:15:34,240 Speaker 1: a quote from a Paul Lawrence Dunbar poem, why should 227 00:15:34,240 --> 00:15:39,720 Speaker 1: the world be overwise and counting all our tears and size? Nay, 228 00:15:39,920 --> 00:15:43,880 Speaker 1: let them only see us while we wear the mask. 229 00:15:44,840 --> 00:15:49,640 Speaker 1: Paul Lawrence Dunbar, very very famous early twentieth century Black poet. 230 00:15:51,600 --> 00:15:54,320 Speaker 1: So the first one is where you hear that first theme, 231 00:15:54,800 --> 00:16:04,360 Speaker 1: which is like na da na naa, And then that 232 00:16:04,640 --> 00:16:12,800 Speaker 1: trumpets come in with their mutes. If you're a brass player, 233 00:16:12,800 --> 00:16:15,040 Speaker 1: you have to have all your mutes if you're playing still, 234 00:16:15,320 --> 00:16:18,640 Speaker 1: because he's gonna use all of them. And that original 235 00:16:18,680 --> 00:16:21,160 Speaker 1: melody is played when you very first begins. It's just 236 00:16:21,320 --> 00:16:30,520 Speaker 1: this solo English horn and it sounds awesome. And that 237 00:16:30,640 --> 00:16:35,160 Speaker 1: at first poem is all night long, while the moon 238 00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:38,760 Speaker 1: goes down, love and I set at her feet then 239 00:16:38,800 --> 00:16:41,560 Speaker 1: for the long journey back from the town had but 240 00:16:41,680 --> 00:16:45,960 Speaker 1: the dreams make it sweet, so it's like a bitter sweet. Right. 241 00:16:48,040 --> 00:16:50,400 Speaker 1: Then we get the adagio, which is the second movement. 242 00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:52,840 Speaker 1: In some of his notebooks, he called that sorrow. And 243 00:16:52,880 --> 00:16:55,479 Speaker 1: if you look at the structure, especially the chord progressions, 244 00:16:55,800 --> 00:17:05,840 Speaker 1: it's really structured a little bit like a spiritual It's 245 00:17:05,960 --> 00:17:09,640 Speaker 1: much more chromatic than the first one is there are 246 00:17:10,080 --> 00:17:25,240 Speaker 1: fewer functional chord progressions. Then you get to the third movement, 247 00:17:25,240 --> 00:17:28,040 Speaker 1: and the third movement is a huge change. So you 248 00:17:28,119 --> 00:17:31,960 Speaker 1: heard the role in the timpanies Boom Dun Dun, dun, Dune, 249 00:17:32,440 --> 00:17:36,399 Speaker 1: dune Dune. That one's called an amato. He called it 250 00:17:36,520 --> 00:17:40,239 Speaker 1: humor in his notebooks. So the story was when he 251 00:17:40,280 --> 00:17:43,240 Speaker 1: was in the musical Shuffle along with Hubie Blake. The 252 00:17:43,320 --> 00:17:46,640 Speaker 1: musicians played it so many times that they got sick 253 00:17:46,880 --> 00:17:49,600 Speaker 1: of it, right, so they'd write little, you know, additions 254 00:17:49,640 --> 00:17:52,439 Speaker 1: and improvisations that they'd play along with it. And the 255 00:17:52,480 --> 00:17:55,320 Speaker 1: one that my grandfather wrote was the melody for I 256 00:17:55,359 --> 00:18:02,000 Speaker 1: Got Rhythm. Gershwin came and saw the show. We know 257 00:18:02,119 --> 00:18:09,680 Speaker 1: that he saw it a bunch of times. Ubi Blake 258 00:18:09,760 --> 00:18:11,679 Speaker 1: was mad about that for the rest of his his life. 259 00:18:13,240 --> 00:18:16,560 Speaker 1: You can hear if you listen just not very long 260 00:18:16,600 --> 00:18:19,840 Speaker 1: into the third movement, you'll hear the horns playing just 261 00:18:19,960 --> 00:18:27,800 Speaker 1: a tiny little quote if I got rhythm, which, knowing 262 00:18:27,880 --> 00:18:30,840 Speaker 1: my grandfather, that's his little wink, he was like, yeah, 263 00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:37,040 Speaker 1: I know, that's how that goes. And then the last 264 00:18:37,040 --> 00:18:42,080 Speaker 1: movement is lent o. It's almost to me like a march, 265 00:18:43,080 --> 00:18:47,520 Speaker 1: and then it ends more upbeat. It's like hope, And 266 00:18:47,600 --> 00:18:51,760 Speaker 1: it's this beautiful poem by Paul Lawrence Dunbar. The poem 267 00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:55,960 Speaker 1: was called od Ethiopia, be proud my race in mind 268 00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:58,879 Speaker 1: and soul. Thy name is written on glory scrool, in 269 00:18:59,040 --> 00:19:02,879 Speaker 1: characters of fire high mid the clouds of famous bright sky, 270 00:19:03,400 --> 00:19:07,400 Speaker 1: Thy banners blazoned folds now fly, and truth shall lift 271 00:19:07,440 --> 00:19:13,440 Speaker 1: them higher. And that movement is very much that sort 272 00:19:13,480 --> 00:19:16,560 Speaker 1: of nobility and seriousness at the same time that there's 273 00:19:16,600 --> 00:19:42,800 Speaker 1: that hope. Though still was always most associated with the 274 00:19:42,840 --> 00:19:46,720 Speaker 1: Afro American symphony, he always sought to prove his versatility 275 00:19:46,920 --> 00:19:51,200 Speaker 1: and avoid being pigeonholed by his style. He tried not 276 00:19:51,520 --> 00:19:55,200 Speaker 1: to right in a particularly African American style. For the 277 00:19:55,320 --> 00:19:59,760 Speaker 1: very beginning of his composing career. His grandmother had been 278 00:19:59,800 --> 00:20:01,920 Speaker 1: a flavor whole life until the end of the Civil War. 279 00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:05,800 Speaker 1: He saw the spirituals, for example, as kind of low class. 280 00:20:05,800 --> 00:20:08,320 Speaker 1: He wanted a distance and self for them. So it 281 00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:10,800 Speaker 1: sort of took him a little while to embrace what 282 00:20:10,880 --> 00:20:17,440 Speaker 1: would be considered the folklore music of black Americans. When 283 00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:20,520 Speaker 1: he did do that, and in his very very first symphony, 284 00:20:20,560 --> 00:20:22,880 Speaker 1: that's the first symphony to include an original blues theme 285 00:20:23,240 --> 00:20:27,920 Speaker 1: and a banjo and a vibraphone. By the way, when 286 00:20:27,960 --> 00:20:32,560 Speaker 1: he did, he wrote original tunes. Like Copeland quoted a 287 00:20:32,560 --> 00:20:37,639 Speaker 1: lot of folklore songs. As an example, here's Aaron Copeland's 288 00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:53,399 Speaker 1: hold Out and here's the original tune Bonaparte's Retreat by 289 00:20:53,400 --> 00:21:09,280 Speaker 1: fiddler William Steppe. Totally fine. Win Right still just wrote 290 00:21:09,440 --> 00:21:12,880 Speaker 1: them all new. He composed in a way that most 291 00:21:12,880 --> 00:21:16,680 Speaker 1: composers do not. The vast majority of composers write out 292 00:21:16,800 --> 00:21:19,800 Speaker 1: sort of the sketch of a piece, and then they'll 293 00:21:19,800 --> 00:21:37,480 Speaker 1: write out a piano score, and they'll expand it for 294 00:21:37,560 --> 00:21:40,840 Speaker 1: whatever size, whether it's band or chamber orchestra or whatever. 295 00:21:40,880 --> 00:21:57,159 Speaker 1: They'll expand it in assigned parts. Grandfather didn't play the piano. 296 00:21:57,280 --> 00:21:59,320 Speaker 1: It was the only instrument in the orchestra. He had 297 00:21:59,400 --> 00:22:02,760 Speaker 1: no idea how to play, although he married a concert pianist, 298 00:22:02,840 --> 00:22:06,680 Speaker 1: my grandmother, so he went the other way. He would 299 00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:10,159 Speaker 1: write the melodic framework, and then he went from the 300 00:22:10,280 --> 00:22:12,439 Speaker 1: beginning to the end of each movement and wrote for 301 00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:16,440 Speaker 1: every individual instrument. The reason that he learned to play 302 00:22:16,480 --> 00:22:18,399 Speaker 1: all those instruments is he really wanted to capture the 303 00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:21,520 Speaker 1: fullness of each instrument, right. He wanted to see, what's 304 00:22:21,560 --> 00:22:24,720 Speaker 1: the sweet spot, what does this particular instrument do best? 305 00:22:27,960 --> 00:22:30,439 Speaker 1: And let me make sure I as sign that to 306 00:22:30,560 --> 00:22:35,199 Speaker 1: the instrument that does this particular thing best. Obviously I'm biased, 307 00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:38,040 Speaker 1: but also as a musician, probably one of the best 308 00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:43,439 Speaker 1: arrangers and orchestrators of the twentieth century. There's no mistaking 309 00:22:43,680 --> 00:22:49,720 Speaker 1: a still orchestration. It's so idiosyncratic for each instrument. And 310 00:22:49,720 --> 00:22:52,520 Speaker 1: he would go sometimes at rehearsals and he'd ask the players, 311 00:22:52,800 --> 00:22:54,800 Speaker 1: do you like your part? Is there anything in there? 312 00:22:56,359 --> 00:22:59,439 Speaker 1: I was an obi player, and an infamous piece for 313 00:22:59,480 --> 00:23:01,960 Speaker 1: obi player. This is the Korean folk song that everybody 314 00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:05,280 Speaker 1: plays right when you're in high school because it has 315 00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:07,679 Speaker 1: a trill for the obos between a B and a 316 00:23:07,760 --> 00:23:12,280 Speaker 1: B flat, which is your pinky at the bottom of 317 00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:17,560 Speaker 1: the obo going U is impossible, and they've had to 318 00:23:17,640 --> 00:23:20,600 Speaker 1: like create a little key that goes da dada just 319 00:23:20,640 --> 00:23:23,520 Speaker 1: to allow you to play it. There's nothing like that. 320 00:23:23,600 --> 00:23:28,160 Speaker 1: There's nothing that's unplayable in a still score, whether conscious 321 00:23:28,160 --> 00:23:31,680 Speaker 1: of it or not. By embracing his heritage, still revealed 322 00:23:31,720 --> 00:23:35,359 Speaker 1: a unique talent, something that not even contemporaries like George 323 00:23:35,359 --> 00:23:39,560 Speaker 1: Gershwin could hope to match. His ability to understand orchestration, 324 00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:43,040 Speaker 1: that being how a variety of instruments all fit together, 325 00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:48,720 Speaker 1: was unparalleled, and Gershwin knew that. So grandfather actually gave 326 00:23:48,800 --> 00:23:51,680 Speaker 1: him at least a couple orchestration lessons. Gershwin said he 327 00:23:51,720 --> 00:23:55,600 Speaker 1: wanted to learn how to orchestrate. Remember Gershwin didn't orchestrate 328 00:23:55,720 --> 00:24:07,119 Speaker 1: Rhapsody in Blue. Ferdy Grofe orchestrated it. Yea. Gershon wasn't 329 00:24:07,160 --> 00:24:10,159 Speaker 1: particularly very patient. He was just known as somebody who 330 00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:12,440 Speaker 1: just didn't follow through on a lot of stuff. I'm 331 00:24:12,440 --> 00:24:15,600 Speaker 1: sure it's not surprising anybody that he was quite arrogant. 332 00:24:16,520 --> 00:24:19,679 Speaker 1: There used to be a joke around those times of 333 00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:22,480 Speaker 1: Gershwin walking around Harlem, where a stack of ones going, 334 00:24:23,000 --> 00:24:26,600 Speaker 1: can you holn that again? That's how Gershwin was viewed 335 00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:30,720 Speaker 1: from the African American side of music. On the other hand, 336 00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:36,879 Speaker 1: you can't deny he had great taste, had very great taste. 337 00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:40,040 Speaker 1: There's no way of knowing what among his music was 338 00:24:40,040 --> 00:24:45,440 Speaker 1: original and what he borrowed. But looking back, knowing that 339 00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:49,520 Speaker 1: he was able to do that because the black musicians 340 00:24:49,560 --> 00:24:53,600 Speaker 1: were absolutely disempowered and had no chance of getting copyrights 341 00:24:54,119 --> 00:24:59,720 Speaker 1: or publications, they put sort of a darker spin on it. Also, 342 00:24:59,760 --> 00:25:03,679 Speaker 1: like Ershwin still wrote a number of operas, Celeste is 343 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:07,440 Speaker 1: a singer, so she had a lot to say about opera. Specifically, 344 00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:11,639 Speaker 1: she named Minette Fontaine as her favorite. Still's opera written 345 00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:23,560 Speaker 1: in n I Love a Contralto. I Love a real contralto. 346 00:25:24,160 --> 00:25:28,199 Speaker 1: And there's a character in Minette Fontaine, Marie la Vaux, 347 00:25:28,880 --> 00:25:38,120 Speaker 1: who does this voodoo ritual. The last time I saw 348 00:25:38,160 --> 00:25:41,159 Speaker 1: it was in Louisiana, and she comes out and it 349 00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:45,560 Speaker 1: was this tall statuesque African American contralto and she's like, oh, 350 00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:55,440 Speaker 1: huge spirits, and it's just so effective. The other reason 351 00:25:55,440 --> 00:25:57,440 Speaker 1: I like that is because it's about a mixed race person. 352 00:25:58,040 --> 00:26:00,920 Speaker 1: I'm a mixed race person. It's sort of about sort 353 00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:23,240 Speaker 1: of the racial identities and how they get muddled. Celest 354 00:26:23,400 --> 00:26:26,320 Speaker 1: is also a big fan of another still opera, Once 355 00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:30,720 Speaker 1: You Wanted to make Sure We played for you Today. 356 00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:35,520 Speaker 1: Troubled Island is the one that he wrote with Langston Hughes. 357 00:26:36,119 --> 00:26:46,440 Speaker 1: The lyrics are not surprisingly, absolutely gorgeous. That is due 358 00:26:46,520 --> 00:26:53,760 Speaker 1: for a revival for sure. It's it's outstanding. I mean, 359 00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:57,679 Speaker 1: it's so tightly, tightly written. There's just not a single 360 00:26:57,720 --> 00:27:10,080 Speaker 1: note out of place in that opera. Most of the 361 00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:14,240 Speaker 1: ideas and stories and stills operas are completely original. While 362 00:27:14,280 --> 00:27:16,919 Speaker 1: some ideas originate from his family history in the South, 363 00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:23,120 Speaker 1: others come from more unexpected places. He read a lot 364 00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:27,320 Speaker 1: of novels, and he loved movies, and he had a 365 00:27:27,400 --> 00:27:29,240 Speaker 1: Lazy Boy that he loved, and he and I would 366 00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:33,159 Speaker 1: sit there and watch Bonanza, you know. So he liked 367 00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:36,359 Speaker 1: all that storytelling and the drama that we associate with opera. 368 00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:40,639 Speaker 1: He just enjoyed that. In life like you have Costaso, 369 00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:42,840 Speaker 1: which is one of his operas that was premiered in 370 00:27:42,880 --> 00:27:45,280 Speaker 1: the nineteen fifties, and that's set in the American Southwest, 371 00:27:45,280 --> 00:27:53,760 Speaker 1: but when it was under Spanish rule. That of course 372 00:27:53,800 --> 00:27:55,520 Speaker 1: comes from living in l a which was not his 373 00:27:55,640 --> 00:27:58,240 Speaker 1: native city, but which he fell in love with, and 374 00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:10,680 Speaker 1: he loved that Latina heritage all around him. Still wasn't 375 00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:13,640 Speaker 1: just a fan of TV and film. He also spent 376 00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:18,200 Speaker 1: a not insignificant amount of time composing for TV and film. 377 00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:20,879 Speaker 1: His musical stamp can be found on treasures like The 378 00:28:20,960 --> 00:28:23,600 Speaker 1: Three Stooges, Know Why, There's a Couple of Beautiful blond 379 00:28:23,760 --> 00:28:31,240 Speaker 1: Oh Yeah, Lost, Horizon, China Great, The Perry Mason Show, 380 00:28:37,119 --> 00:28:39,760 Speaker 1: and gun Smoke. I don't enough anger inside when he 381 00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:42,560 Speaker 1: can be a killer, they good one day out of 382 00:28:42,560 --> 00:28:46,760 Speaker 1: his life, we've been in a respectable cemetery. I actually 383 00:28:46,800 --> 00:28:52,520 Speaker 1: really like the stuff he did for TV. Sometimes I'll 384 00:28:52,520 --> 00:28:56,080 Speaker 1: watch an old Perry Mason episode or even Three Stooges, 385 00:28:56,160 --> 00:28:59,520 Speaker 1: and you can tell when he did it, like you 386 00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:12,840 Speaker 1: can you're it. The difference between art music and most 387 00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:16,120 Speaker 1: you know, more pop music is not in value, I 388 00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:19,680 Speaker 1: don't think, or in seriousness or impact. But I think 389 00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:24,000 Speaker 1: that art music composers, they have done all the studying 390 00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:28,280 Speaker 1: right to try and get really in depth into things 391 00:29:28,320 --> 00:29:30,560 Speaker 1: like core progressions and blah blah blah blah blah, and 392 00:29:30,600 --> 00:29:34,680 Speaker 1: it makes a difference. That doesn't mean Aretha Franklin is 393 00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:38,240 Speaker 1: a worse singer than you know Maria Callis. They're just 394 00:29:38,280 --> 00:29:42,080 Speaker 1: two different things. And Maria Callis was capable just in 395 00:29:42,200 --> 00:29:45,560 Speaker 1: terms of range and dynamics of more because she did 396 00:29:45,560 --> 00:29:48,280 Speaker 1: all that study and work. And it's the same thing 397 00:29:48,320 --> 00:29:50,160 Speaker 1: that I listened to like the TV stuff, because there's 398 00:29:50,160 --> 00:29:53,920 Speaker 1: all of a sudden, this like richness comes into the orchestration. 399 00:29:54,800 --> 00:29:58,400 Speaker 1: You can tell that, uh. Serious composer and art music 400 00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:06,760 Speaker 1: composer wrote that, I think one of the things I 401 00:30:06,840 --> 00:30:09,000 Speaker 1: like about that has had such a sense of humor 402 00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:12,200 Speaker 1: when you look back his original scores, like there's this 403 00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:16,280 Speaker 1: one PC wrote called The Black Man Dances, and not 404 00:30:16,320 --> 00:30:19,280 Speaker 1: only did they not have digital finale or whatever, but 405 00:30:19,320 --> 00:30:23,120 Speaker 1: they also didn't have white out. So when he made 406 00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:24,560 Speaker 1: a mistake at a score, he had to use an 407 00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:26,960 Speaker 1: exact o knife to cut it out and then take 408 00:30:27,480 --> 00:30:30,000 Speaker 1: a new little piece in there with the correction, and 409 00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:32,240 Speaker 1: he would write a little note going on the composer 410 00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:36,120 Speaker 1: screwed up again, And at the end of Black Men Dancers, 411 00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:39,040 Speaker 1: it's all these little characters going he finished, He's done, 412 00:30:39,640 --> 00:30:42,640 Speaker 1: that's finished. He had a really good sense of humor 413 00:30:42,640 --> 00:30:45,400 Speaker 1: that I think really especially comes out in some of 414 00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:53,840 Speaker 1: his movie music. I asked Celeste to describe some other 415 00:30:53,920 --> 00:30:58,320 Speaker 1: characteristics of Stills film and TV music. There's no such 416 00:30:58,400 --> 00:31:02,120 Speaker 1: thing as the violin playing the melodies almost all the time, right, 417 00:31:02,480 --> 00:31:05,840 Speaker 1: Like the melody will get tossed around and inner weaves 418 00:31:05,960 --> 00:31:08,400 Speaker 1: and one voice will come out and another and they 419 00:31:08,480 --> 00:31:24,640 Speaker 1: sort of merge back and forth with one another. But 420 00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:27,360 Speaker 1: it almost hearkens back a little bit to French Imprussian 421 00:31:27,400 --> 00:31:30,120 Speaker 1: Ism at sometimes, just the way that he'll play a 422 00:31:30,200 --> 00:31:32,840 Speaker 1: chord and sort of let it ring and live with 423 00:31:32,920 --> 00:31:59,520 Speaker 1: it for a little while. William Grant still was slowly 424 00:31:59,560 --> 00:32:02,960 Speaker 1: gaining voriety in the film industry, but there was a 425 00:32:03,040 --> 00:32:06,480 Speaker 1: dark side to his success. After he became so highly 426 00:32:06,520 --> 00:32:10,160 Speaker 1: regarded in Hollywood, his music was often used while he 427 00:32:10,280 --> 00:32:15,160 Speaker 1: himself was entirely uncredited. He wrote for a lot of 428 00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:19,960 Speaker 1: different celebrities and stars and programs during that time. None 429 00:32:19,960 --> 00:32:23,000 Speaker 1: of that was credited, you know. He wrote for Ben 430 00:32:23,040 --> 00:32:31,720 Speaker 1: Crosby and the Rhythm Boys. He did a ton of 431 00:32:31,760 --> 00:32:35,920 Speaker 1: work for Artie Shaw and that was never credited. Like, 432 00:32:36,080 --> 00:32:38,720 Speaker 1: one of the most popular pieces Alretis Show ever wrote 433 00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:55,400 Speaker 1: was Fantasy and it's so so still it's very very 434 00:32:55,520 --> 00:32:57,760 Speaker 1: very much William Grant Stow. It's hard to mistake that 435 00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:02,160 Speaker 1: still struggle to get credit for his work was just 436 00:33:02,240 --> 00:33:05,760 Speaker 1: one of the many challenges he faced. One story from 437 00:33:05,800 --> 00:33:10,240 Speaker 1: the ninety nine World's Fair highlights yet another tragic misstep 438 00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:14,160 Speaker 1: in our country's history. The World's Fair was there as 439 00:33:14,200 --> 00:33:16,040 Speaker 1: having in New York. What they decided to do was 440 00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:18,680 Speaker 1: have a contest to see who would write the theme 441 00:33:18,760 --> 00:33:22,400 Speaker 1: music for the World's Fair. This was nine. They opened 442 00:33:22,440 --> 00:33:26,560 Speaker 1: it up nationally so people would submit their compositions, and 443 00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:29,520 Speaker 1: they was going to be anonymous. The organizers would know, 444 00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:31,400 Speaker 1: but the judges would have a new idea who wrote what. 445 00:33:31,560 --> 00:33:36,320 Speaker 1: And my grandfather sent in three pieces. The judges had 446 00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:39,480 Speaker 1: two pieces. They couldn't decide between the two of them, 447 00:33:39,560 --> 00:33:41,240 Speaker 1: and so they said, hey, well, here's what we'll do. 448 00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:43,520 Speaker 1: We'll ask both of the composers to come to New 449 00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:45,600 Speaker 1: York and then we'll decide once we've met them and 450 00:33:45,640 --> 00:33:48,360 Speaker 1: talk to them. And when they looked it up, they 451 00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:52,640 Speaker 1: had both been written by William Grant. Still, when you 452 00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:55,440 Speaker 1: look at the photos, you can see the expressions on 453 00:33:55,480 --> 00:33:58,440 Speaker 1: these men's faces. They are not happy that it turned 454 00:33:58,480 --> 00:34:00,560 Speaker 1: out to be a black dude. And you can imagine 455 00:34:00,560 --> 00:34:03,360 Speaker 1: if it had been my grandfather and any white person, 456 00:34:04,720 --> 00:34:17,080 Speaker 1: he would have lost. So he wrote the music. But 457 00:34:17,400 --> 00:34:19,120 Speaker 1: you know, at that time, they didn't just let black 458 00:34:19,160 --> 00:34:22,799 Speaker 1: people on the fairgrounds. They could only go on Negro Day. 459 00:34:23,400 --> 00:34:26,160 Speaker 1: And on Negro Day almost none of the restaurants opened 460 00:34:26,200 --> 00:34:28,799 Speaker 1: because the restaurants were all owned by white people. So 461 00:34:28,920 --> 00:34:31,000 Speaker 1: if he ever wanted to go on to the fairgrounds 462 00:34:31,040 --> 00:34:33,160 Speaker 1: to hear his own music, he either had to go 463 00:34:33,200 --> 00:34:35,239 Speaker 1: on Negro Day when he couldn't eat, or he had 464 00:34:35,280 --> 00:34:40,080 Speaker 1: to be escorted by security to protect his safety. That 465 00:34:40,160 --> 00:34:43,080 Speaker 1: was like almost nineteen forty. That's not that long ago. 466 00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:46,480 Speaker 1: That was our grandparents and great grandparents time. I mean, 467 00:34:46,520 --> 00:34:51,800 Speaker 1: that was super recent. The efforts to diversify the classical 468 00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:55,759 Speaker 1: music world are continually ongoing. According to the League of 469 00:34:55,800 --> 00:35:00,520 Speaker 1: American Orchestras, between nineteen eight and two thousand fourteen, the 470 00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:04,320 Speaker 1: percentage of non white orchestra musicians increased from three point 471 00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:08,520 Speaker 1: four percent to just about four but without people like 472 00:35:08,600 --> 00:35:11,759 Speaker 1: William Grant still leading the charge, that number might be 473 00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:17,600 Speaker 1: significantly lower today. So did still consider himself a pioneer 474 00:35:17,640 --> 00:35:21,399 Speaker 1: for future musicians of color. I'm not sure he thought 475 00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:24,120 Speaker 1: about black artists to come and tell his later life. 476 00:35:24,160 --> 00:35:26,600 Speaker 1: But he was always aware of being a pioneer because 477 00:35:26,600 --> 00:35:29,120 Speaker 1: he was always the only one in the room. There's 478 00:35:29,200 --> 00:35:32,600 Speaker 1: this photo may have been the Hollywood Bowl. They gathered 479 00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:35,120 Speaker 1: a whole bunch of famous composers together who happened to 480 00:35:35,160 --> 00:35:36,520 Speaker 1: be in l A at the time, and they wanted 481 00:35:36,520 --> 00:35:39,000 Speaker 1: to get this picture of all the famous composers. There's 482 00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:42,279 Speaker 1: like twelve or something. Stevinsky and somebody else were like, 483 00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:44,439 Speaker 1: I do not want to be photographed with this black dude, 484 00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:47,360 Speaker 1: and they stood in front of him because he's like 485 00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:51,600 Speaker 1: five nine. At the last minute, the photographer goes, wait 486 00:35:51,600 --> 00:35:55,080 Speaker 1: a second, there's a dude in the back, and in 487 00:35:55,120 --> 00:35:57,160 Speaker 1: the picture you can sort of see my grandfather going 488 00:35:58,239 --> 00:36:02,960 Speaker 1: trying to see up of overse jevinsky shoulder. He was 489 00:36:03,000 --> 00:36:06,279 Speaker 1: always the only one, and he knew that he got 490 00:36:06,320 --> 00:36:10,600 Speaker 1: criticized by black people. Went and Marsalis's dad called my 491 00:36:10,640 --> 00:36:14,360 Speaker 1: grandfather and uncle Tom. Because he was supposedly writing white 492 00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:18,120 Speaker 1: men's music. He got criticized by white people because a 493 00:36:18,320 --> 00:36:21,440 Speaker 1: they didn't want him in Carnegie Hall, but also he 494 00:36:21,480 --> 00:36:24,840 Speaker 1: would be criticized the most when he wasn't writing music 495 00:36:25,000 --> 00:36:27,080 Speaker 1: that sounded like black music. Right. If he was going 496 00:36:27,160 --> 00:36:30,080 Speaker 1: to write classical music, it needed to be black. Here's 497 00:36:30,080 --> 00:36:34,080 Speaker 1: your box, you're the black guy. So he was painfully 498 00:36:34,360 --> 00:36:44,120 Speaker 1: aware of that. Despite this, still always managed to maintain 499 00:36:44,160 --> 00:36:48,240 Speaker 1: a healthy work life balance. Family was incredibly important to him, 500 00:36:48,280 --> 00:36:51,719 Speaker 1: and he always made time for his grandchildren. He was 501 00:36:51,760 --> 00:36:54,400 Speaker 1: just the best grandfather ever. He helped me learn to 502 00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:57,279 Speaker 1: play piano. He would play inch worm with me, where 503 00:36:57,320 --> 00:36:59,800 Speaker 1: I'd play one hand and he'd play the other one. 504 00:37:00,320 --> 00:37:02,440 Speaker 1: He used to make honest to goodness toast which had 505 00:37:02,480 --> 00:37:06,279 Speaker 1: like molasses and weak germ. He created. He did a 506 00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:08,440 Speaker 1: lot of the carpentry in the house. He would make toys. 507 00:37:08,880 --> 00:37:13,799 Speaker 1: He collected model trains. He loved dogs, even he had 508 00:37:13,800 --> 00:37:16,560 Speaker 1: a dog, a beloved dog named Shep that he wrote 509 00:37:16,560 --> 00:37:25,520 Speaker 1: a piece four called quit Debt fool Nih. He just 510 00:37:25,600 --> 00:37:27,879 Speaker 1: had such a good sense of humor, and he would 511 00:37:27,920 --> 00:37:30,160 Speaker 1: read me the Uncle Rema stories and correct all the grammar. 512 00:37:31,080 --> 00:37:34,040 Speaker 1: He always had a puzzle book by his bedside. He 513 00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:38,320 Speaker 1: did all kinds of puzzles. He was freaking genius at them, 514 00:37:38,360 --> 00:37:41,640 Speaker 1: and he had beautiful handwriting. He was just the best 515 00:37:41,680 --> 00:37:44,520 Speaker 1: grandfather ever. You know, he doated on his grandchildren. He 516 00:37:44,520 --> 00:37:46,560 Speaker 1: thought we were the greatest thing in the world. I 517 00:37:46,640 --> 00:37:48,320 Speaker 1: have a bunch of pictures of me with my grandfather. 518 00:37:48,520 --> 00:37:52,320 Speaker 1: I'm always attached to him, like I'm always wrapped around 519 00:37:52,600 --> 00:37:57,600 Speaker 1: him because I just loved him to death. By the 520 00:37:57,640 --> 00:37:59,279 Speaker 1: time I came around, of course, I was born in 521 00:37:59,360 --> 00:38:01,719 Speaker 1: sixty nine, but like the last day of nineteen sixty nine. 522 00:38:02,200 --> 00:38:05,280 Speaker 1: By that time he was born in he was seventy 523 00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:09,480 Speaker 1: five years old, so he wasn't, you know, running around 524 00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:12,480 Speaker 1: playing ball with me or anything. But he had this 525 00:38:12,719 --> 00:38:16,200 Speaker 1: huge record collection. He had a whole closet full of real, 526 00:38:16,239 --> 00:38:19,319 Speaker 1: the real tapes of performances, and he would sometimes get 527 00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:21,800 Speaker 1: out his player for the reel the reels and conduct 528 00:38:21,880 --> 00:38:30,720 Speaker 1: with them. He was really awesome. When her grandfather passed 529 00:38:30,719 --> 00:38:35,640 Speaker 1: away on December third night, Celeste was just eight years old. 530 00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:39,600 Speaker 1: You can imagine Celeste never expected to lose her grandfather 531 00:38:39,680 --> 00:38:43,719 Speaker 1: so soon, but she also didn't predict how impactful his 532 00:38:43,840 --> 00:38:47,239 Speaker 1: loss would be on the rest of the world. It 533 00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:50,360 Speaker 1: was surprising to me that other people cared that he 534 00:38:50,400 --> 00:38:54,200 Speaker 1: had passed. There were all these headlines about his passing, 535 00:38:54,600 --> 00:38:59,160 Speaker 1: and I was like, what is going on. By that 536 00:38:59,239 --> 00:39:01,319 Speaker 1: point in his life, he really was not getting a 537 00:39:01,320 --> 00:39:03,719 Speaker 1: lot of performances. He was pretty forgotten. I remember there 538 00:39:03,760 --> 00:39:05,880 Speaker 1: was one headline and I still remember it because it 539 00:39:06,000 --> 00:39:08,839 Speaker 1: said a great musician has passed in this generation. Never 540 00:39:08,920 --> 00:39:13,680 Speaker 1: knew him, and that was very true. My mother actually 541 00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:16,480 Speaker 1: put in a ton of work trying to get the 542 00:39:16,520 --> 00:39:19,200 Speaker 1: performances going again, and she's been very successful of that. 543 00:39:19,640 --> 00:39:23,040 Speaker 1: And of course that has coincided with a rising realization 544 00:39:23,080 --> 00:39:25,759 Speaker 1: that we've silenced black voices for hundreds of years, and 545 00:39:25,840 --> 00:39:29,080 Speaker 1: so there's been more interests that way as well. But 546 00:39:29,160 --> 00:39:33,200 Speaker 1: at the time, he just wasn't very well known. They 547 00:39:33,200 --> 00:39:37,399 Speaker 1: were certainly weren't teaching him in schools. When I got 548 00:39:37,440 --> 00:39:40,480 Speaker 1: to University of Michigan, for God's sake, in the master's program, 549 00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:45,719 Speaker 1: the American Music class didn't cover William Grant. Still. I mean, imagine, 550 00:39:46,520 --> 00:39:49,359 Speaker 1: we're talking about a transformative figure. I forgot the fact 551 00:39:49,360 --> 00:39:51,279 Speaker 1: that he's my grandfather. And when I think about the 552 00:39:51,400 --> 00:39:54,600 Speaker 1: number of people who were influenced by his music, I mean, 553 00:39:54,640 --> 00:39:58,279 Speaker 1: that's crazy. And it's the University of Michigan when we 554 00:39:58,360 --> 00:40:03,680 Speaker 1: say forgotten. He died thinking he had failed. It was 555 00:40:03,719 --> 00:40:06,960 Speaker 1: really after Troubled Island the opera, which was the first 556 00:40:06,960 --> 00:40:09,040 Speaker 1: opera performed by the New York City Center and the 557 00:40:09,080 --> 00:40:11,799 Speaker 1: first by a black man to be performed by a 558 00:40:11,840 --> 00:40:15,560 Speaker 1: major company, and the critics panned it, and it got 559 00:40:15,560 --> 00:40:18,200 Speaker 1: twenty two curtain calls on opening night, and yet it 560 00:40:18,239 --> 00:40:20,560 Speaker 1: closed within a week because the critics were like, oh, 561 00:40:20,600 --> 00:40:25,200 Speaker 1: these little black guys they tried. After that happened, it 562 00:40:25,280 --> 00:40:28,640 Speaker 1: was almost as though there was this consensus. I'm not 563 00:40:28,719 --> 00:40:31,520 Speaker 1: talking about a conspiracy theory. I'm just saying there appears 564 00:40:31,520 --> 00:40:34,240 Speaker 1: to have been this feeling among people in the positions 565 00:40:34,239 --> 00:40:36,839 Speaker 1: of power and classical music that he'd gone far enough, 566 00:40:36,920 --> 00:40:41,520 Speaker 1: that's enough. Doors just started closing. He couldn't get symphonies performed, 567 00:40:41,560 --> 00:40:43,799 Speaker 1: so he would write for chamber orchestras. He couldn't get 568 00:40:43,840 --> 00:40:46,680 Speaker 1: that performed, so he'd write for band. Couldn't get that performed, 569 00:40:46,719 --> 00:40:49,520 Speaker 1: so he'd write for quartet, and then he'd write for choir, 570 00:40:49,600 --> 00:40:52,120 Speaker 1: and then, you know, towards the end of his life, 571 00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:55,440 Speaker 1: Leopostakowski got him a job writing for elementary school textbooks, 572 00:40:55,840 --> 00:40:59,040 Speaker 1: and at one point the publisher called up Stakowski and said, 573 00:40:59,239 --> 00:41:00,960 Speaker 1: how do we get Ahold Wayne Grant? Still? We need 574 00:41:01,000 --> 00:41:04,240 Speaker 1: his number because we need him to change something. Leoposti 575 00:41:04,440 --> 00:41:07,360 Speaker 1: lost his mind and I was like, you don't ask 576 00:41:07,680 --> 00:41:11,359 Speaker 1: we a gret still to change a note? Are you crazy? 577 00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:19,920 Speaker 1: Throughout his life, still amassed a huge collection of manuscripts, notes, 578 00:41:20,200 --> 00:41:23,840 Speaker 1: and other musical ephemera. I asked celest what happened to 579 00:41:23,880 --> 00:41:27,440 Speaker 1: all of those materials. He left all of his papers 580 00:41:27,560 --> 00:41:32,600 Speaker 1: to the University of Arkansas, which is in Faittteville. Almost 581 00:41:32,640 --> 00:41:34,600 Speaker 1: everything else my mother has, and she has them in 582 00:41:34,640 --> 00:41:38,600 Speaker 1: a giant barn in Arizona with no climate control and 583 00:41:38,680 --> 00:41:44,880 Speaker 1: no protection at all. I don't know what will happen 584 00:41:44,960 --> 00:41:48,200 Speaker 1: when she passes, and I don't know what state those 585 00:41:48,239 --> 00:41:51,160 Speaker 1: things will be in. I hope that they will be salvageable. 586 00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:53,680 Speaker 1: I think she has long had a dream of opening 587 00:41:53,680 --> 00:41:56,520 Speaker 1: a museum, and maybe that's why she's held onto them. 588 00:41:56,600 --> 00:41:59,319 Speaker 1: But opening a museum is quite expensive. I don't think 589 00:41:59,360 --> 00:42:02,960 Speaker 1: that's gonna probably happened in her lifetime. So yeah, I 590 00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:07,000 Speaker 1: don't know. I don't know if they're still extant. I 591 00:42:07,040 --> 00:42:09,600 Speaker 1: have one of his batons. I have one of the 592 00:42:09,680 --> 00:42:12,920 Speaker 1: tables that he made with his own hands. I probably 593 00:42:13,000 --> 00:42:16,319 Speaker 1: his wing tips shoes. I associate his wing tips shoes 594 00:42:16,320 --> 00:42:18,200 Speaker 1: with my grandfather. He was so you know, he would 595 00:42:18,200 --> 00:42:20,200 Speaker 1: get up every day, and he would dress in a 596 00:42:20,200 --> 00:42:23,279 Speaker 1: three piece suit with vest and wing tips, shoes and 597 00:42:23,320 --> 00:42:25,880 Speaker 1: a tie to go into his own back room and 598 00:42:25,920 --> 00:42:29,160 Speaker 1: make music and write music. It wasn't about what he 599 00:42:29,160 --> 00:42:31,400 Speaker 1: thought about himself. He was trying to show respect to 600 00:42:31,440 --> 00:42:35,080 Speaker 1: the craft that it would have felt disrespectful for him 601 00:42:35,120 --> 00:42:38,280 Speaker 1: to do that, to write music and you know, sweats 602 00:42:38,360 --> 00:42:42,239 Speaker 1: or whatever the mid twentieth century version of sweats was. 603 00:42:43,480 --> 00:42:45,959 Speaker 1: He also had a music type writer that had music 604 00:42:46,000 --> 00:42:50,480 Speaker 1: notes instead of letters that I thought was really really cool. 605 00:42:50,520 --> 00:42:55,440 Speaker 1: He had he used onion, this onion skin paper. Celeste 606 00:42:55,560 --> 00:42:57,920 Speaker 1: maybe didn't get as much time with her grandfather as 607 00:42:57,960 --> 00:43:01,960 Speaker 1: she likely wanted, but his influence on her was undeniable. 608 00:43:02,719 --> 00:43:05,680 Speaker 1: Celest would follow in his footsteps, going on to be 609 00:43:05,719 --> 00:43:10,480 Speaker 1: a successful musician. But I didn't ever want to be 610 00:43:10,520 --> 00:43:13,920 Speaker 1: in classical music. But I had music around me my 611 00:43:14,000 --> 00:43:17,040 Speaker 1: whole life, and I loved it. I wanted to be 612 00:43:17,120 --> 00:43:24,800 Speaker 1: Annie'll Come Out Tomorrow as a young child, I wanted 613 00:43:24,800 --> 00:43:28,399 Speaker 1: to do Broadway. I don't think I'm ever gonna love 614 00:43:28,440 --> 00:43:33,480 Speaker 1: a too analty and dissonance, and I'm sure that a 615 00:43:33,520 --> 00:43:35,960 Speaker 1: big part of that is from his influence and a 616 00:43:36,080 --> 00:43:41,080 Speaker 1: love for melody. My work as a musician is so 617 00:43:41,320 --> 00:43:46,480 Speaker 1: different from my work talking about grandfather's music. I performed 618 00:43:46,520 --> 00:43:48,840 Speaker 1: his music quite a bit, although I refused to perform 619 00:43:48,880 --> 00:43:53,640 Speaker 1: it in February. So that's part of my I think, obligation. 620 00:43:53,760 --> 00:43:55,960 Speaker 1: It's my joy as well, but an also an obligation 621 00:43:56,000 --> 00:43:59,799 Speaker 1: to keep performing this music. But also I do have 622 00:43:59,840 --> 00:44:03,640 Speaker 1: the sort of responsibility to history. You know, if we 623 00:44:03,680 --> 00:44:07,080 Speaker 1: could talk to Mozart's granddaughter, wouldn't you kind of want 624 00:44:07,120 --> 00:44:10,239 Speaker 1: to talk to her and hear what she had to say. 625 00:44:10,239 --> 00:44:12,680 Speaker 1: And I feel like I'm the youngest of the four grandchildren, 626 00:44:12,680 --> 00:44:14,720 Speaker 1: so I'm the last one that knew him in person, 627 00:44:15,440 --> 00:44:18,160 Speaker 1: and so there is this duty. I have a duty 628 00:44:18,800 --> 00:44:23,160 Speaker 1: to keep that story alive and to pass on what 629 00:44:23,280 --> 00:44:25,759 Speaker 1: I know of this composer, who, in the end is 630 00:44:25,800 --> 00:44:29,320 Speaker 1: so pivotal not just in our musical history as a nation, 631 00:44:29,400 --> 00:44:34,200 Speaker 1: but in our racial history, our history as a society. 632 00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:38,200 Speaker 1: And he was an activist in his own way. So yeah, 633 00:44:38,200 --> 00:44:41,160 Speaker 1: I do feel that the musical performance of his works 634 00:44:41,239 --> 00:44:45,000 Speaker 1: is connected to this responsibility that I feel the mantill 635 00:44:45,040 --> 00:44:49,120 Speaker 1: I have kind of taken on. Celeste have done an 636 00:44:49,120 --> 00:44:52,680 Speaker 1: amazing job performing the works of her grandfather at least 637 00:44:52,719 --> 00:44:55,759 Speaker 1: in my humble opinion. So today we're going to go 638 00:44:55,800 --> 00:44:59,640 Speaker 1: out listening to Still's composition Levy land Here, performed by 639 00:44:59,680 --> 00:45:41,880 Speaker 1: Celest Headley with the Northern Arizona University WIN Symphony, treating 640 00:45:52,920 --> 00:45:55,839 Speaker 1: that was thee Lest Hedley singing the music of her grandfather, 641 00:45:56,120 --> 00:46:00,960 Speaker 1: William Grant Still. Find more music by Still online at 642 00:46:00,960 --> 00:46:05,000 Speaker 1: William Grant still music dot com, and be sure to 643 00:46:05,040 --> 00:46:08,520 Speaker 1: call your local classical radio station and request that they 644 00:46:08,520 --> 00:46:12,000 Speaker 1: play more of Still's music, not just during Black History Month. 645 00:46:13,239 --> 00:46:16,279 Speaker 1: This episode of Ephemeral was written by Trevor Young and 646 00:46:16,360 --> 00:46:20,399 Speaker 1: produced with Max and Alex Williams and Matt Frederick. Learn 647 00:46:20,480 --> 00:46:27,560 Speaker 1: more at Ephemeral Dutch show Next Time on Ephemeral. I 648 00:46:27,600 --> 00:46:30,760 Speaker 1: believe that the Okay Laughing Record is the greatest record 649 00:46:30,800 --> 00:46:34,120 Speaker 1: ever made. It's a side of a record where people 650 00:46:34,200 --> 00:46:40,319 Speaker 1: laugh for three minutes. I've listened to it hundreds and 651 00:46:40,480 --> 00:46:46,400 Speaker 1: hundreds of times. Crazy thing is it was a huge, runaway, 652 00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:51,840 Speaker 1: monster hit. Everybody had one, and it stayed in print 653 00:46:52,320 --> 00:46:57,719 Speaker 1: for like thirty years. The question becomes not just what 654 00:46:58,000 --> 00:47:00,920 Speaker 1: is it and how did it becomes such a big hit, 655 00:47:01,360 --> 00:47:08,600 Speaker 1: but why do we know so little about it? Support 656 00:47:08,600 --> 00:47:12,840 Speaker 1: Ephemeral by recommending an episode, leaving a review, or dropping 657 00:47:12,840 --> 00:47:17,200 Speaker 1: this a line at ephemeral Show. The more podcasts from 658 00:47:17,200 --> 00:47:21,560 Speaker 1: my Heart Radio, visit the I heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, 659 00:47:22,160 --> 00:47:25,439 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows and learn 660 00:47:25,480 --> 00:47:28,560 Speaker 1: more at ephemeral dot show