WEBVTT - 4/7/25: World Panic As Trump Doubles Down, Billionaire Warns 'Economic Nuclear Fallout', Poll Shows Americans Reject Tariffs 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:01.599 Hey, guys, Saga and Crystal here. 0:00:01.680 --> 0:00:05.200 Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election, 0:00:05.360 --> 0:00:07.840 and we are so excited about what that means for 0:00:07.880 --> 0:00:08.720 the future of this show. 0:00:08.880 --> 0:00:10.760 This is the only place where you can find honest 0:00:10.760 --> 0:00:13.280 perspectives from the left and the right that simply does 0:00:13.320 --> 0:00:14.680 not exist anywhere else. 0:00:14.760 --> 0:00:17.080 So if that is something that's important to you, please 0:00:17.120 --> 0:00:19.599 go to Breakingpoints dot com. Become a member today and 0:00:19.640 --> 0:00:22.800 you'll get access to our full shows, unedited, ad free, 0:00:22.800 --> 0:00:25.600 and all put together for you every morning in your inbox. 0:00:25.680 --> 0:00:27.560 We need your help to build the future of independent 0:00:27.560 --> 0:00:29.920 news media and we hope to see you at Breakingpoints 0:00:29.960 --> 0:00:33.519 dot com. 0:00:33.840 --> 0:00:34.839 Good morning, everybody. 0:00:34.920 --> 0:00:37.960 It is a gloomy day here in Washington, gloomy fitting 0:00:37.960 --> 0:00:39.960 the mood of the global economy in Crystal. 0:00:40.040 --> 0:00:41.160 So what do we have today? 0:00:41.280 --> 0:00:44.720 Yes, indeed, Trump is doubling down on his tariffs, no 0:00:44.840 --> 0:00:48.239 sign of some big negotiation or walk back insight, and 0:00:48.440 --> 0:00:51.360 global markets already in freefall this morning. This is before 0:00:51.479 --> 0:00:55.080 the US market's officially open. So we decided to spend 0:00:55.120 --> 0:00:58.240 the whole show basically talking about tariffs because this is 0:00:58.400 --> 0:01:02.600 such monumental news with such massive cascading effects for everyone here. 0:01:02.640 --> 0:01:04.720 And globally. So we're going to start with just the 0:01:04.760 --> 0:01:06.920 details of where we are, what we know. Jeff Stein 0:01:07.040 --> 0:01:07.560 is going to join. 0:01:07.600 --> 0:01:09.960 He's going to weigh in on his latest reporting of 0:01:09.959 --> 0:01:13.720 how this tariff scheme was developed. And also big fight 0:01:13.800 --> 0:01:16.560 developing between two Trump supporters, Bill Ackman, who has now 0:01:16.560 --> 0:01:18.720 come out against the tariffs, and Howard Lutnik, who of 0:01:18.800 --> 0:01:21.720 course is the Commerce Secretary. We also have the very 0:01:21.760 --> 0:01:25.160 latest polling about how Americans are feeling about all of this, 0:01:25.240 --> 0:01:27.520 with the caveat being all of this polling really occurred 0:01:27.560 --> 0:01:32.759 before the massive market movements, before these massive announcements, so 0:01:33.160 --> 0:01:37.160 getting early indications though about how nervous Americans are about 0:01:37.200 --> 0:01:40.880 this direction. Elon appears to be breaking with Trump over 0:01:40.959 --> 0:01:43.720 tariffs and specifically getting into a bit of a battle 0:01:43.760 --> 0:01:47.880 with Peter Navarro. Protests have also broken out nationwide. These 0:01:47.880 --> 0:01:51.080 are not just about tariffs, but about overwhelming sort of 0:01:51.080 --> 0:01:53.800 resistance among the Democratic base to Trump and Elon and 0:01:53.840 --> 0:01:55.480 everything that's going on. So we wanted to take a 0:01:55.520 --> 0:01:57.840 look at that as well. Was the first really big 0:01:58.200 --> 0:02:02.320 nationwide organized resistance to Trump two point zero, and we're 0:02:02.320 --> 0:02:06.960 going to have a nice discussion debate between Rocanna and 0:02:07.240 --> 0:02:10.080 orn Cass should be interesting to get both of their perspectives. 0:02:10.160 --> 0:02:13.640 Grow us not some neoliberal like Free Trader. He has 0:02:13.680 --> 0:02:16.160 a nuanced view on tariffs. I'm interested to hear or 0:02:16.200 --> 0:02:19.720 and explain exactly how he feels about everything that is 0:02:19.760 --> 0:02:21.640 going on and how this plan is being implemented right 0:02:21.639 --> 0:02:22.239 now as well. 0:02:22.280 --> 0:02:24.320 That's right, or the more serious person that we could 0:02:24.320 --> 0:02:27.280 find that will actually defend some of at least what 0:02:27.400 --> 0:02:28.959 is going on here, So we wanted to make sure 0:02:29.240 --> 0:02:31.600 we did that. Yeah, as Crystal said, though, it's going 0:02:31.639 --> 0:02:33.639 to be a tariff special here. Thank you very much 0:02:33.800 --> 0:02:35.919 to all our premium subscribers out there. By the way, 0:02:35.960 --> 0:02:39.080 the best way that everybody could help with our show 0:02:39.200 --> 0:02:41.680 right now is really just like subscribe and to share it, 0:02:41.760 --> 0:02:44.280 especially if you're listening on the podcast is texted to 0:02:44.320 --> 0:02:47.640 a friend. Especially, I know tariff's very sensitive subject and 0:02:47.960 --> 0:02:49.679 a lot of people are trying to wrap their heads 0:02:49.720 --> 0:02:51.560 around what's going on. So that's why we wanted to 0:02:51.600 --> 0:02:53.880 really dedicate this to everybody, and it is I think 0:02:53.919 --> 0:02:55.959 best listened to as a whole. All right, let's go 0:02:55.960 --> 0:02:57.919 ahead and start with the tariffs, is Crystal said, Let's 0:02:57.919 --> 0:03:00.680 go put this up there on the screen, major movement 0:03:00.800 --> 0:03:03.600 in the Asian and the European markets, basically a massive 0:03:03.919 --> 0:03:07.160 implosion of all of the stock value across the globe 0:03:07.160 --> 0:03:09.840 since the announcement of the tariffs. For those who are watching, 0:03:09.880 --> 0:03:13.080 you can see various stock indices across the world that 0:03:13.120 --> 0:03:15.760 are down. The minimum is in China down five percent, 0:03:16.000 --> 0:03:18.880 although things changed actually just since we made this graphic. 0:03:18.960 --> 0:03:21.360 The Hong Kong Stock Exchange having its worst days since 0:03:21.440 --> 0:03:25.880 nineteen ninety seven in some fifteen percent drop overnight. Germany 0:03:26.040 --> 0:03:29.359 down almost ten percent, Canada down, the UK down, the 0:03:29.440 --> 0:03:32.800 United States down over fifteen percent in the Japanese Nicky Index, 0:03:32.880 --> 0:03:34.960 I believe, with one of the worst days in the 0:03:35.000 --> 0:03:37.480 history of that they even I think had to flip 0:03:37.520 --> 0:03:40.720 their circuit breaker to set yeah trading over in Japan. 0:03:40.800 --> 0:03:44.280 So you can just see what is occurring globally. No 0:03:44.480 --> 0:03:46.600 sign from Donald Trump yet that he is backing down. 0:03:46.680 --> 0:03:49.480 He spent the weekend in Florida golfing. We'll return to 0:03:49.520 --> 0:03:52.120 that in a little bit on Air Force One, though 0:03:52.160 --> 0:03:53.560 he did take a few questions. 0:03:53.600 --> 0:03:56.760 Here's what he had to say, the pain in the market. 0:03:57.080 --> 0:03:59.600 At some point, you're unwilling to tolerate this idea of 0:04:00.480 --> 0:04:01.440 you're a threshold. 0:04:02.160 --> 0:04:03.800 I think your question is so stupid. 0:04:03.960 --> 0:04:06.560 I admit I think it's a I don't want anything 0:04:06.600 --> 0:04:09.520 to go down, but sometimes you have to take meticine 0:04:09.560 --> 0:04:15.080 to fix something. And we have such a horrible We 0:04:15.200 --> 0:04:19.400 have been treated so badly by other countries because we 0:04:19.480 --> 0:04:22.680 had stupid leadership that allowed this to happen. They didn't 0:04:22.680 --> 0:04:24.560 get it spoken when. 0:04:24.640 --> 0:04:26.200 They look at the fact that we have. 0:04:26.200 --> 0:04:30.200 A billion dollar trade deficit. When you look at the 0:04:30.720 --> 0:04:34.800 trade deficit that we have with certain countries, way over 0:04:34.839 --> 0:04:38.520 a billion per country. With China, it's a trillion dollars, 0:04:39.160 --> 0:04:41.760 and we have to solve our trade deficit with China. 0:04:41.800 --> 0:04:43.400 We have a trillion dollar trade. 0:04:43.120 --> 0:04:47.200 Deficit with China, hundreds of billions of dollars a year 0:04:47.240 --> 0:04:50.400 with us with China, and unless we solve that problem, 0:04:50.480 --> 0:04:51.600 I'm not going to make a deal. 0:04:52.160 --> 0:04:54.400 Those comments would make sense, Crystal. I thought there were 0:04:54.440 --> 0:04:56.400 just tariffs on China. Maybe some of us could get 0:04:56.440 --> 0:04:58.400 behind that, but that's not really what's going on here. 0:04:58.400 --> 0:05:01.240 We got to basically it's average some thirty percent tariff 0:05:01.480 --> 0:05:05.600 across the world, including fifty percent or whatever on Vietnam. 0:05:05.720 --> 0:05:10.040 Multiple countries calling the White House over the weekend might 0:05:10.080 --> 0:05:12.360 be a bit difficult because the President is down golfing 0:05:12.400 --> 0:05:14.960 in mar A Lago. He did win his golf championship though. 0:05:14.960 --> 0:05:18.560 Congratulations. Well some good too, That's great, that's right. Let's 0:05:18.600 --> 0:05:19.800 put this up there on the screen. 0:05:19.880 --> 0:05:23.280 This is his latest from truth social We have massive 0:05:23.279 --> 0:05:26.440 financial deficits with China, the European Union, and many others. 0:05:26.440 --> 0:05:28.760 The only way this problem can be cured is with tariffs, 0:05:28.760 --> 0:05:31.200 which are numbering tens of billions into the USA. 0:05:31.279 --> 0:05:33.480 They are already in effect and a beautiful thing to behold. 0:05:33.480 --> 0:05:36.040 The surplus with these countries has grown during the presidency 0:05:36.360 --> 0:05:37.560 of Sleepy Joe Biden. 0:05:37.600 --> 0:05:39.760 We are going to reverse it, and reverse it quickly. 0:05:39.760 --> 0:05:41.960 Someday people will realize the tariffs for the United States 0:05:41.960 --> 0:05:44.880 of America are a very beautiful thing. So there is 0:05:44.920 --> 0:05:48.880 still yet no major movement there by the White House. 0:05:49.000 --> 0:05:51.960 In terms of where we are here in the United States, 0:05:52.000 --> 0:05:54.560 things are a bit all over the place. As we said, 0:05:54.560 --> 0:05:57.520 the Japanese Index and the Hong Kong Index just absolutely 0:05:57.560 --> 0:06:01.560 got destroyed overnight the United States markets. It's roughly like 0:06:01.600 --> 0:06:04.560 two point five percent as of US right recording. Right now, 0:06:04.560 --> 0:06:06.440 we can put that on the screen just in terms 0:06:06.440 --> 0:06:10.040 of where everything is. The Nasdaq was down by about 0:06:10.040 --> 0:06:13.760 two point eight percent. It honestly could extend much much worse. 0:06:13.800 --> 0:06:16.800 It was even worse whenever the futures did open this morning. 0:06:16.880 --> 0:06:18.240 Nobody really quite knows. 0:06:18.520 --> 0:06:21.560 If, though, that the S and P does fall today 0:06:21.640 --> 0:06:23.920 more than four percent for a third day in a row, 0:06:24.000 --> 0:06:26.680 it will be the first time since the Great Depression. 0:06:26.680 --> 0:06:27.880 And I think that's one of those. 0:06:27.720 --> 0:06:31.640 Where it's always difficult to contextualize history, you know, when 0:06:31.640 --> 0:06:34.280 it's actually happening. But the truth is is that we 0:06:34.320 --> 0:06:36.800 are in one of the five great market crashes in 0:06:36.880 --> 0:06:39.919 modern American history from the Great Depression, not just me 0:06:40.000 --> 0:06:42.719 saying that the data indicates this is the worst crash, 0:06:42.760 --> 0:06:46.080 not a listens March of twenty twenty. And then finally, 0:06:46.080 --> 0:06:49.440 you know, to get to the inevitable retort, they're like, well, 0:06:49.480 --> 0:06:51.400 why doesn't matter, and it's like, well, even if you 0:06:51.400 --> 0:06:53.920 don't own any stocks, and that's fine, I think fifty 0:06:53.920 --> 0:06:56.359 eight percent of Americans do. But for the rest of 0:06:56.400 --> 0:06:59.440 the country and the bottom of the income scale, the 0:06:59.520 --> 0:07:02.800 market and the liquidity in that market and the decision 0:07:02.839 --> 0:07:06.120 making being driven by those companies that will affect one 0:07:06.240 --> 0:07:07.919 hundred percent of us. You know, you could have owned 0:07:08.200 --> 0:07:10.720 zero stocks in two thousand and nine and you still 0:07:10.760 --> 0:07:13.080 would have suffered the consequences because you would not have 0:07:13.120 --> 0:07:15.440 any access to the company wants to hire you, doesn't 0:07:15.480 --> 0:07:17.600 have any access to cash, they have no market, they 0:07:17.640 --> 0:07:20.080 have no liquidity, they have no ability to borrow. They're 0:07:20.120 --> 0:07:23.040 going bus. You know, these capital markets, for better or 0:07:23.120 --> 0:07:25.960 for worse, and I think for worse now do absolutely 0:07:26.040 --> 0:07:27.239 rule our entire lives. 0:07:27.240 --> 0:07:28.120 And we'll talk about that. 0:07:28.360 --> 0:07:30.520 I think more in terms of tariff strategy, and what 0:07:30.560 --> 0:07:33.000 I think the biggest flaw in the overall roll out 0:07:33.040 --> 0:07:34.960 in the strategy was is that fact is is that 0:07:34.960 --> 0:07:38.560 we're basically asking private markets to you know, act in 0:07:38.600 --> 0:07:40.760 a way that we believe is beneficial to the state, 0:07:40.760 --> 0:07:43.120 but with no real incentive, you know, both to the 0:07:43.160 --> 0:07:46.480 company for the employer to minimize any sort of short 0:07:46.520 --> 0:07:48.840 term not even short term, long term economic pain. 0:07:48.920 --> 0:07:50.400 Now at this point that's another thing. 0:07:50.440 --> 0:07:52.480 Everyone's like, oh, well, he could cut a deal, and 0:07:52.720 --> 0:07:55.040 he could cut a deal and things could sert, just like, yeah, 0:07:55.080 --> 0:07:57.040 they could. But you know, in the interim, there are 0:07:57.040 --> 0:07:59.440 a lot of companies, even in this week that will 0:07:59.440 --> 0:08:02.480 pay literally millions of dollars in tariffs. You can't just 0:08:02.520 --> 0:08:05.480 take millions of dollars off of somebody's bottom line and 0:08:05.560 --> 0:08:06.880 expect nothing to happen. 0:08:06.920 --> 0:08:08.760 I mean, it just doesn't really work that way. Yeah, 0:08:08.840 --> 0:08:11.000 I mean that's where I continue to fall. 0:08:11.320 --> 0:08:13.760 Even if this is a short term strategy, there's a 0:08:13.800 --> 0:08:16.720 lot of pain in that short term strategy for millions 0:08:16.720 --> 0:08:19.600 of people, not to mention them. Level of uncertainty in 0:08:19.640 --> 0:08:22.360 the markets, in the overall pocketbooks, the amount of consumer 0:08:22.400 --> 0:08:24.560 spending that's going to shrink as a result of this 0:08:24.920 --> 0:08:26.400 genuinely cannot be overstated. 0:08:26.520 --> 0:08:30.960 Yeah, it's I don't think anyone really knows how massive 0:08:31.080 --> 0:08:33.320 the fallout is going to be. Like, there is no 0:08:33.440 --> 0:08:36.560 limit to how bad it could be. And yeah, Trump 0:08:36.640 --> 0:08:38.800 could walk back from it at any time. I mean 0:08:38.840 --> 0:08:41.200 he walked back from the you know, the height of 0:08:41.280 --> 0:08:44.320 the Canada and Mexico tariffs. This man, he's a mad man. 0:08:44.400 --> 0:08:47.600 He's all over the place. But there's a big debate 0:08:47.720 --> 0:08:50.840 on econ Twitter at this point of like we may 0:08:50.880 --> 0:08:53.280 already be past the point of no return in a 0:08:53.320 --> 0:08:56.400 certain respect because let's say today he comes out and says, 0:08:56.440 --> 0:08:58.880 you know what, I've deals with fifty countries good enough, 0:08:58.920 --> 0:09:01.360 We're rolling this back to you know, a lower level, 0:09:01.559 --> 0:09:03.599 and we'll revisit it a month from now, which is 0:09:03.679 --> 0:09:06.920 kind of the playbook that he's been running. Do you 0:09:06.960 --> 0:09:10.960 think if you are someone making decisions for a major business, 0:09:10.960 --> 0:09:13.959 a major manufacturing concern, like, is this going to give 0:09:14.000 --> 0:09:16.640 you confidence to want to invest more in the United 0:09:16.640 --> 0:09:17.640 States of America? 0:09:17.679 --> 0:09:19.040 Of course not, of course not. 0:09:19.400 --> 0:09:21.679 I mean if you're running any company, including our own, 0:09:21.720 --> 0:09:23.800 by the way, thinking about how things are going to go, 0:09:23.960 --> 0:09:26.560 and you know how people are feeling with a potential 0:09:26.559 --> 0:09:30.040 recession coming and how their premium membership budget is looking 0:09:30.080 --> 0:09:32.960 at this point like you are going to freeze in 0:09:33.040 --> 0:09:35.920 place at best, and at worst you're going to start saying, 0:09:35.920 --> 0:09:38.760 you know what, these people, this project that we had going, 0:09:38.800 --> 0:09:40.640 that we were hopeful for for the future, this is 0:09:40.720 --> 0:09:43.679 just not the environment to do it in. So in 0:09:43.720 --> 0:09:46.760 some ways, even if at this point Trump were to 0:09:46.760 --> 0:09:50.120 come out and say, just getting guys, you know, late 0:09:50.160 --> 0:09:54.560 April Fool's joke, Liberation Day is over. Who is going 0:09:54.640 --> 0:09:57.520 to want to invest in this climate? And you know, 0:09:57.679 --> 0:09:59.840 I used to get really irritated with all the like 0:10:00.200 --> 0:10:03.880 uncertainty talk because this was used against you know, any 0:10:03.880 --> 0:10:06.880 sort of like progressive economic policy that would benefit working 0:10:06.920 --> 0:10:10.640 class people or whatever. But at certain point, you really 0:10:10.720 --> 0:10:13.880 do as a business owner, as an investor, as someone 0:10:13.880 --> 0:10:16.320 who is an executive in a company, you need some 0:10:16.440 --> 0:10:20.359 sort of stable policy climate in which to make decisions. 0:10:20.800 --> 0:10:23.520 And you will not have that with this present period. 0:10:23.720 --> 0:10:27.000 You will not have that with this president. And I 0:10:27.040 --> 0:10:30.400 think given the you know, seesaw nature of American politics, 0:10:30.480 --> 0:10:32.000 I think there are a lot of countries and a 0:10:32.000 --> 0:10:34.440 lot of companies here and around the world that are saying, 0:10:34.480 --> 0:10:35.760 I don't know if we'll ever have that with the 0:10:35.880 --> 0:10:36.400 US again. 0:10:36.800 --> 0:10:37.240 Period. 0:10:37.640 --> 0:10:39.800 You know, a couple things that I just wanted to 0:10:40.040 --> 0:10:44.040 emphasize from Trump's comments and why they sent the markets 0:10:44.040 --> 0:10:47.080 into such a free fall. You know, last week, of 0:10:47.080 --> 0:10:51.240 course there were significant market losses, but I think we 0:10:51.320 --> 0:10:53.680 both had the feel of like it actually. 0:10:53.320 --> 0:10:54.080 Could have been worse. 0:10:54.200 --> 0:10:55.120 Oh, it could have been much. 0:10:55.000 --> 0:10:57.080 Worth And the reason for that is because there was 0:10:57.160 --> 0:11:00.680 still a hope on Wall Street of like Trump's going 0:11:00.760 --> 0:11:03.680 to come on on Sunday before the future's market opens 0:11:04.000 --> 0:11:06.640 and he's going to announce a bunch of deals and 0:11:06.760 --> 0:11:10.040 he's going to step away from this and instead he 0:11:10.120 --> 0:11:12.840 makes this comment sometimes you have to take the medicine 0:11:13.120 --> 0:11:16.760 number one and seems to not care at all about 0:11:16.800 --> 0:11:19.600 the nuclear bomb that he's dropped on the global economy, 0:11:19.600 --> 0:11:21.720 which just on like a personal level, thinking about this 0:11:21.760 --> 0:11:24.679 person's psychology, I cannot wrap my head around someone who 0:11:24.720 --> 0:11:26.839 would drop this level bomb and then just go I'm 0:11:26.840 --> 0:11:29.199 gonna go play golf, I'm gonna go host a fundraiser 0:11:29.240 --> 0:11:32.800 at mar A Lago like insanity. But so he says 0:11:32.840 --> 0:11:36.800 that in no indication of making these deals, and the 0:11:37.440 --> 0:11:39.560 in fact, he told his surrogates, I don't want you 0:11:39.600 --> 0:11:41.760 to say these are a starting point for negotiations. No, 0:11:41.880 --> 0:11:44.400 these are in place, and that's that. And then the 0:11:44.480 --> 0:11:48.320 other thing he said that was so disconcerting is he's 0:11:48.360 --> 0:11:51.720 holding onto this idea that if you have a trade 0:11:51.760 --> 0:11:55.079 deficit with any country, no matter what the dynamics are, 0:11:55.080 --> 0:11:57.520 Like we talked about Lesotho last week, right, this poor 0:11:57.559 --> 0:12:00.760 African nation that we buy diamonds for and they're too 0:12:00.800 --> 0:12:03.240 poor to afford our products, and in his mind, that 0:12:03.320 --> 0:12:08.200 means that Lesotho is ripping us off. Okay, idiotic, stupid, 0:12:08.520 --> 0:12:11.319 like the most Kindergarten level of understanding of trade you 0:12:11.360 --> 0:12:15.320 could possibly imagine, but he reiterates that. And it matters 0:12:15.360 --> 0:12:17.880 not only for understanding how stupid the policy is, which 0:12:17.880 --> 0:12:20.880 most people I think already understand, but it also matters 0:12:21.200 --> 0:12:25.120 because what deal can Lesotho make with us that's going 0:12:25.160 --> 0:12:26.160 to fix that problem? 0:12:26.280 --> 0:12:27.200 There isn't one. 0:12:27.600 --> 0:12:31.360 So, you know, countries that had, in anticipation of Trump 0:12:31.400 --> 0:12:34.040 loving tariffs had rolled back their terrri straight trying to 0:12:34.040 --> 0:12:36.439 get ahead of it, say like Israel is one example 0:12:36.440 --> 0:12:38.199 of that, like, look, we don't even charge you any tarffs. 0:12:38.240 --> 0:12:39.480 They still got hit with tariffs. 0:12:39.559 --> 0:12:42.720 There is no deal that you can make with virtually 0:12:42.760 --> 0:12:45.240 any of these countries that's just going to close the 0:12:45.240 --> 0:12:46.520 trade deficit overnight. 0:12:46.679 --> 0:12:48.120 That is not how this works. 0:12:48.440 --> 0:12:50.840 And so that was the other thing that made a 0:12:50.840 --> 0:12:54.840 lot of investors go what the fuck because that indicates 0:12:54.960 --> 0:12:58.000 there are no grand bargains or deals. This is not 0:12:58.080 --> 0:13:01.800 just a negotiating tactic. May really be serious about moving 0:13:01.800 --> 0:13:04.640 forward with this, and it is just as nonsensical as 0:13:04.679 --> 0:13:06.960 it appears on its face when you're looking at you know, 0:13:07.000 --> 0:13:10.200 the Penguin islands and this stupid formula that we're going 0:13:10.240 --> 0:13:12.160 to talk more about that they may not even be 0:13:12.160 --> 0:13:16.720 applying correctly. It really doesn't matter to him what the 0:13:16.760 --> 0:13:19.760 carnage is, what the fallout is. You know, he has 0:13:19.800 --> 0:13:22.080 this idea and has had about Terris number one and 0:13:22.200 --> 0:13:22.720 number two. 0:13:23.360 --> 0:13:24.560 He likes that. 0:13:24.720 --> 0:13:28.200 He likes that the whole world is jumping at his moves. 0:13:28.600 --> 0:13:31.400 He loves that all these countries are having to call 0:13:31.440 --> 0:13:33.520 and scramble, that all these companies are going to come 0:13:33.559 --> 0:13:35.920 on bended knee to try to get their car ount 0:13:35.960 --> 0:13:39.240 to try to get their exemption. And he loves that 0:13:39.320 --> 0:13:42.640 he can do all of this apparently without having a 0:13:42.640 --> 0:13:43.800 consult a single person. 0:13:44.200 --> 0:13:47.119 I mean, the power to raise. 0:13:46.880 --> 0:13:50.559 Revenue and institute tariffs is supposed to be with Congress. 0:13:51.200 --> 0:13:53.600 He's using eyepen in a very similar way to how 0:13:53.640 --> 0:13:55.920 he's you know, using these sort of like national security 0:13:56.000 --> 0:14:00.120 or national emergency car bounds to claim extraordinary powers from SOLFF. 0:14:00.200 --> 0:14:02.920 That's what he's doing here with tariffs. There will be 0:14:02.960 --> 0:14:05.160 court challenges. I don't know how that will go. I 0:14:05.160 --> 0:14:07.640 don't think anyone knows really how that will go. But 0:14:07.880 --> 0:14:11.240 he also likes. What he loves about this is that 0:14:11.320 --> 0:14:14.240 it all comes down to him, and he can be 0:14:14.280 --> 0:14:17.720 the dictator and he doesn't have to ask anyone for anything. 0:14:18.040 --> 0:14:21.320 And all the chaos around him doesn't bother him one bit. 0:14:23.960 --> 0:14:25.440 Well, I mean, why would it bother him? 0:14:25.440 --> 0:14:28.280 As you said, it's very you know, it's something that 0:14:28.640 --> 0:14:31.920 feeds his own conception of what's going on. But what 0:14:32.040 --> 0:14:35.040 I just simply cannot move away from is there's genuine, 0:14:35.080 --> 0:14:38.920 like massive pain not even being done necessarily to billionaires 0:14:39.040 --> 0:14:42.120 or companies or anything. That's like real folks who have 0:14:42.200 --> 0:14:46.040 retirement accounts who are watching these just evaporate. I mean, look, 0:14:46.120 --> 0:14:49.480 let's also contextualize it correctly. You know, one year of 0:14:49.560 --> 0:14:52.320 gains in the S and P five hundred are erased. 0:14:52.920 --> 0:14:55.720 That means basically, if you had money over the last 0:14:55.800 --> 0:14:58.200 year and you were chunking it away into your four 0:14:58.280 --> 0:15:00.360 oh one k, and you were doing everything that you're 0:15:00.360 --> 0:15:02.680 supposed to do, that money's gone or it's you know, 0:15:02.720 --> 0:15:05.240 it's now it's actually down. And if you look at 0:15:05.240 --> 0:15:07.000 over at the five year period, who was a common 0:15:07.040 --> 0:15:09.080 talking point, oh my gosh, the SP five is up 0:15:09.200 --> 0:15:11.080 over one hundred percent. Well now it's down to eighty two. 0:15:11.200 --> 0:15:13.400 So now we're already back to twenty twenty four, you know, 0:15:13.440 --> 0:15:15.720 style valuation. Let's wait another week. What are we going 0:15:15.760 --> 0:15:17.680 to go back to twenty twenty three. You know the 0:15:17.720 --> 0:15:20.360 backward clock that's ticking here for a lot of people, 0:15:20.480 --> 0:15:24.280 layers of what preciseable percentage of the country which is 0:15:24.280 --> 0:15:27.080 over sixty five, and size of percentage even more that 0:15:27.160 --> 0:15:29.200 are over seventy. I was telling you this morning there 0:15:29.200 --> 0:15:31.200 are a lot of people who are on retirement to 0:15:31.400 --> 0:15:34.000 have mandatory withdrawals, you know, from their IRA accounts. So 0:15:34.040 --> 0:15:35.840 what if you're literally forced to sell at the bottom. 0:15:35.920 --> 0:15:38.320 I mean, that's a that's a horrible thing to be 0:15:38.400 --> 0:15:41.320 inflicting on people. Finally, as you and I just want 0:15:41.360 --> 0:15:43.960 to really stick on this point with the capital markets, 0:15:44.120 --> 0:15:48.520 the way that this is being basically rolled is we're 0:15:48.520 --> 0:15:50.920 implementing this massive tariff and so if you want to 0:15:50.960 --> 0:15:53.160 build here, you have to move here. We will not 0:15:53.240 --> 0:15:56.360 compensate you at all in the interim. We are not 0:15:56.360 --> 0:15:58.640 giving you a tax break. In fact, Steve Manution, the 0:15:58.680 --> 0:16:01.840 former Secretary of the Treasury, was onto CNBC on Friday, 0:16:02.120 --> 0:16:04.080 and I actually thought he gave a great answer. 0:16:04.240 --> 0:16:06.640 He was like, look, of course we can have tariffs. 0:16:06.720 --> 0:16:08.280 I mean, you know, I'm pro tariff. 0:16:08.320 --> 0:16:11.240 I know you are in some cases yeah as well, Yeah, 0:16:11.280 --> 0:16:12.960 you know what that needs to be paired with a 0:16:13.040 --> 0:16:17.760 dollar for dollar manufacturing credit and or infusion from capital 0:16:17.800 --> 0:16:21.440 of Congress, which would mean what for Apple. Let's say 0:16:21.440 --> 0:16:23.640 we want Apple to build an iPhone here in America 0:16:23.720 --> 0:16:25.440 or build more of it. Okay, let's say five to 0:16:25.520 --> 0:16:27.520 fifty percent of it something like that here in the 0:16:27.640 --> 0:16:28.160 United States. 0:16:28.160 --> 0:16:30.040 Well, that's going to cost X, Y, and z. 0:16:30.400 --> 0:16:33.520 We will then acknowledge that we can have Apple pony 0:16:33.600 --> 0:16:36.240 up some of that cash. Congress and then others the 0:16:36.680 --> 0:16:40.080 administration will say we will also kick a tax credit 0:16:40.320 --> 0:16:42.280 or a break to make sure that you don't fire 0:16:42.320 --> 0:16:44.640 people in the interim and you don't rehab it on 0:16:44.680 --> 0:16:47.240 our overall equities markets, which is what we're currently having. 0:16:47.440 --> 0:16:47.960 There's none of that. 0:16:48.040 --> 0:16:51.560 Actually, the Congress wants to remove manufacturing tax credits right 0:16:51.600 --> 0:16:54.040 now so that they can pay for a permanent extension 0:16:54.120 --> 0:16:55.000 or whatever. 0:16:54.960 --> 0:16:56.720 Some of these corporates. That's that's why I want people 0:16:56.760 --> 0:16:57.200 to understand. 0:16:57.200 --> 0:16:57.440 That's right. 0:16:57.480 --> 0:16:59.200 So the problem is that not only do we have 0:16:59.240 --> 0:17:02.160 a massive teriff regime in place, we are actually currently 0:17:02.160 --> 0:17:05.199 have a gop led Congress which wants to reduce the 0:17:05.280 --> 0:17:09.119 amount of social spending that there is while extending corporate 0:17:09.119 --> 0:17:13.320 tax rusts and not increasing manufacturing tax credits, which would 0:17:13.359 --> 0:17:16.680 actually benefit all of the stated goal of bring things over. 0:17:16.720 --> 0:17:18.960 And that's why I'm just like, this is so it's 0:17:19.000 --> 0:17:19.760 not even stupid. 0:17:20.000 --> 0:17:23.439 Stupid is something that doesn't necessarily bear consequences. 0:17:23.560 --> 0:17:25.760 This has massive consequences. 0:17:26.000 --> 0:17:28.359 And you know that's another thing too, where you know 0:17:28.400 --> 0:17:30.800 the administration is really banking on like, oh well he 0:17:30.800 --> 0:17:32.720 said he was going to do just like, well, okay, 0:17:32.880 --> 0:17:36.480 hold on a second. Nobody nobody, And this is why 0:17:36.520 --> 0:17:39.639 the markets crashed as they were ever floated a thirty 0:17:39.640 --> 0:17:41.119 five for forty percent tariff. 0:17:41.359 --> 0:17:42.400 Nobody floated. 0:17:42.600 --> 0:17:45.600 When you say reciprocal tariffs, that's a word, it has 0:17:45.640 --> 0:17:48.840 a meaning, it has a definitional term, right, And that 0:17:48.960 --> 0:17:52.040 Bess Crystal. With the actual calculation from what I can 0:17:52.040 --> 0:17:54.640 tell of whate reciprocal tariff would mean, even with currency 0:17:54.640 --> 0:17:57.720 market manipulation and all, that is maybe five to ten percent. 0:17:57.880 --> 0:17:59.800 Whenever it comes to China, on Japan, it would be five. 0:18:00.119 --> 0:18:02.199 Actually it might even be zero if you factor in 0:18:02.440 --> 0:18:04.560 a few other things. Do you know why he decided 0:18:04.560 --> 0:18:06.800 not to do that because the number was not big enough. 0:18:07.000 --> 0:18:10.040 So that's where this is ten times out of step. 0:18:10.320 --> 0:18:13.040