1 00:00:00,560 --> 00:00:02,720 Speaker 1: Taking a walk, And I said, is it true that 2 00:00:02,880 --> 00:00:06,080 Speaker 1: he grows Sam Cook and Floyd Dixon home? And he 3 00:00:06,160 --> 00:00:09,040 Speaker 1: lightens up right away. Man, I used to drive all 4 00:00:09,080 --> 00:00:12,119 Speaker 1: the time. And that was my introduction to rach Arks. 5 00:00:13,200 --> 00:00:15,840 Speaker 2: I'm Buzznight, the host of the Taking a Walk podcast. 6 00:00:15,880 --> 00:00:20,360 Speaker 2: Now imagine stepping onto a winding path where every note 7 00:00:20,400 --> 00:00:24,520 Speaker 2: tells a story and every story finds its rhythm. On 8 00:00:24,600 --> 00:00:27,200 Speaker 2: today's episode of Taking a Walk, We're just not going 9 00:00:27,280 --> 00:00:30,480 Speaker 2: to stroll through any musical landscape. We're going to journey 10 00:00:30,520 --> 00:00:36,440 Speaker 2: alongside Aj Crochey, a masterful songwriter he and whose life 11 00:00:36,560 --> 00:00:41,560 Speaker 2: and music are woven with resilience, reinvention, and a touch 12 00:00:41,560 --> 00:00:45,480 Speaker 2: of legacy magic from the echoes of his father's legendary 13 00:00:45,640 --> 00:00:50,240 Speaker 2: songs to the bold, bluesy footprints he's made on his own. 14 00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:54,080 Speaker 2: Aj invites us to walk with him through the moments 15 00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:57,760 Speaker 2: that shaped his sound and spirit. So lace up, tune in, 16 00:00:57,840 --> 00:01:01,360 Speaker 2: get ready to discover how music, memory, and a good 17 00:01:01,400 --> 00:01:07,560 Speaker 2: walk can lead to unexpected destinations. 18 00:01:08,720 --> 00:01:09,479 Speaker 1: Taking a Walk. 19 00:01:09,560 --> 00:01:12,399 Speaker 2: Well, Aj, welcome to Taking a Walk. Thanks for being here. 20 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:15,520 Speaker 1: Hey, thanks so much. You know I got to take 21 00:01:15,520 --> 00:01:18,400 Speaker 1: a walk every day, so I dig it. 22 00:01:18,880 --> 00:01:21,040 Speaker 2: So if you could take a walk with somebody living 23 00:01:21,160 --> 00:01:24,840 Speaker 2: or dead. It doesn't have to be in the world 24 00:01:24,880 --> 00:01:27,240 Speaker 2: of music, but we like when it can be. Who 25 00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:30,080 Speaker 2: would you take that walk with? And where do you 26 00:01:30,120 --> 00:01:32,399 Speaker 2: think you would you would go on that walk? 27 00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:38,080 Speaker 1: That's a that's a good question. There are so many 28 00:01:38,120 --> 00:01:44,399 Speaker 1: people I would love to walk and talk with. But 29 00:01:44,720 --> 00:01:48,880 Speaker 1: I would probably say that the first name that comes 30 00:01:48,960 --> 00:01:51,880 Speaker 1: to mind would be my father, because he died when 31 00:01:51,880 --> 00:01:56,480 Speaker 1: I was very young, and I think that being able 32 00:01:56,560 --> 00:02:02,800 Speaker 1: to get his perspective on life would be kind of magical. 33 00:02:04,400 --> 00:02:08,120 Speaker 2: I dare say it would be, Oh my god. And 34 00:02:08,280 --> 00:02:14,359 Speaker 2: his career was really a short career considering the amazing 35 00:02:14,600 --> 00:02:16,760 Speaker 2: amount of work that he put out right. 36 00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:21,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, you know it was three albums in eighteen months, 37 00:02:22,320 --> 00:02:29,280 Speaker 1: and all of it written, recorded, and toward it in 38 00:02:29,360 --> 00:02:29,960 Speaker 1: that time. 39 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:36,240 Speaker 2: Do you have a sense, as you studied your dad's 40 00:02:36,639 --> 00:02:41,800 Speaker 2: life if he was caught by surprise at the quick 41 00:02:41,960 --> 00:02:43,480 Speaker 2: pace of his stardom? 42 00:02:44,720 --> 00:02:48,280 Speaker 1: It was? It took I think it took about, you know, 43 00:02:48,320 --> 00:02:51,119 Speaker 1: a dozen years for him to be an overnight success. 44 00:02:52,680 --> 00:02:55,359 Speaker 1: You know, he started playing in the late fifties and 45 00:02:57,400 --> 00:03:01,040 Speaker 1: through college and he graduated and he went you know, 46 00:03:01,120 --> 00:03:04,680 Speaker 1: he was in groups in in college and then in 47 00:03:04,680 --> 00:03:07,800 Speaker 1: folk groups and then you know, went in sixty four 48 00:03:09,240 --> 00:03:12,919 Speaker 1: did a State Department tour of you know, of the 49 00:03:12,960 --> 00:03:15,280 Speaker 1: Middle East, which was a very common thing back then 50 00:03:15,320 --> 00:03:18,760 Speaker 1: in North Africa. And I think he felt like he 51 00:03:18,960 --> 00:03:22,480 Speaker 1: was going to be able to you know, that was 52 00:03:22,520 --> 00:03:26,400 Speaker 1: going to be what he was doing. You know, he 53 00:03:27,360 --> 00:03:31,760 Speaker 1: did everything he could to avoid a steady job. He 54 00:03:31,760 --> 00:03:34,079 Speaker 1: he you know, he went, he got two master's degrees 55 00:03:34,120 --> 00:03:37,080 Speaker 1: and then and then took odd jobs and he joined 56 00:03:37,120 --> 00:03:45,960 Speaker 1: the army in sixty four sixty five, and then you know, 57 00:03:46,040 --> 00:03:49,040 Speaker 1: he my mother met in sixty three and they started 58 00:03:49,040 --> 00:03:55,040 Speaker 1: writing together and performing together, and in sixty seven they 59 00:03:55,120 --> 00:03:58,600 Speaker 1: got a break. They got signed to Capitol Records. They 60 00:03:58,600 --> 00:04:03,280 Speaker 1: released an album that no one bought, and it was 61 00:04:03,360 --> 00:04:06,119 Speaker 1: kind of over and they didn't even They toured for 62 00:04:06,240 --> 00:04:09,320 Speaker 1: maybe two weeks. You know, that was it, and then 63 00:04:09,400 --> 00:04:14,680 Speaker 1: it was back to work. And I think that he 64 00:04:14,960 --> 00:04:20,360 Speaker 1: had up to that point had really become a good player, 65 00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:24,920 Speaker 1: became a good writer, but he hadn't really found his voice. 66 00:04:25,560 --> 00:04:28,960 Speaker 1: And when my mother was pregnant with me, and it 67 00:04:29,000 --> 00:04:30,719 Speaker 1: was this is kind of a rare thing to be 68 00:04:30,720 --> 00:04:35,159 Speaker 1: able to see in an artist, but he recorded everything 69 00:04:35,360 --> 00:04:38,280 Speaker 1: all of the practice that for a concert he'd play 70 00:04:38,320 --> 00:04:39,960 Speaker 1: on the weekend at a little bar. It could be 71 00:04:40,000 --> 00:04:42,479 Speaker 1: a roadhouse or a coffee house, it didn't matter what 72 00:04:42,600 --> 00:04:45,320 Speaker 1: kind of place it was. He kind of tailored the 73 00:04:45,440 --> 00:04:48,360 Speaker 1: set to that group, and they were covers, mostly covers. 74 00:04:48,360 --> 00:04:51,720 Speaker 1: He might throw something of his in there. But it 75 00:04:51,920 --> 00:04:55,880 Speaker 1: was when my mother was pregnant with me. I think 76 00:04:55,960 --> 00:04:59,640 Speaker 1: he felt like he had maybe one more chance before 77 00:04:59,640 --> 00:05:04,720 Speaker 1: he had to really get a serious job. And I 78 00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:09,320 Speaker 1: was archiving a bunch of his music, maybe twenty five 79 00:05:09,400 --> 00:05:15,800 Speaker 1: years ago, and I came across a cassette and it 80 00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:19,839 Speaker 1: was all of the songs that he was planning to 81 00:05:21,279 --> 00:05:24,440 Speaker 1: perform that weekend, and then it was all these great 82 00:05:24,440 --> 00:05:28,960 Speaker 1: old blues songs and early country stuff, Jimmy Rogers and 83 00:05:29,760 --> 00:05:33,039 Speaker 1: Mississippi John Hurt and Bessie Smith and all of this stuff. 84 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:34,760 Speaker 1: And then I flip it over and on the other 85 00:05:34,920 --> 00:05:38,279 Speaker 1: side this beginning of time and a bottle, And this 86 00:05:38,480 --> 00:05:43,440 Speaker 1: was the epiphany for him. It was all of a sudden, 87 00:05:43,800 --> 00:05:46,039 Speaker 1: all of those covers that he had done, and the 88 00:05:46,120 --> 00:05:50,520 Speaker 1: album he did with my mother and an early solo 89 00:05:50,560 --> 00:05:58,159 Speaker 1: attempt at a recording called Facets self produced, was it 90 00:05:58,279 --> 00:06:01,560 Speaker 1: was all really standing on the shoulders of giants in 91 00:06:01,600 --> 00:06:03,599 Speaker 1: the way that you know, you could really see where 92 00:06:03,600 --> 00:06:08,159 Speaker 1: the influences were from. And it wasn't that original until this. 93 00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:11,560 Speaker 1: And at this point, all of a sudden, with time 94 00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:15,240 Speaker 1: and a bottle, it became like the floodgates opened, and 95 00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:19,360 Speaker 1: you know, in the next six to eight months, everything 96 00:06:19,400 --> 00:06:22,719 Speaker 1: for the first two records were written. So Don't mess 97 00:06:22,760 --> 00:06:26,240 Speaker 1: around with Jim Operator was finished. A lot of these 98 00:06:26,279 --> 00:06:29,799 Speaker 1: things had been started, like leaving New York City after 99 00:06:30,120 --> 00:06:33,440 Speaker 1: moving there in sixty nine. My folks moved there trying 100 00:06:33,480 --> 00:06:35,919 Speaker 1: to make a living play music, and and on the 101 00:06:35,960 --> 00:06:37,960 Speaker 1: way out my dad started New York It's not My 102 00:06:38,040 --> 00:06:42,359 Speaker 1: Home and Box number ten, but they were unfinished, and 103 00:06:42,440 --> 00:06:47,960 Speaker 1: it just went on, you know, and so it became this. 104 00:06:49,760 --> 00:06:52,600 Speaker 1: It was, you know, it was kind of magic. It 105 00:06:52,680 --> 00:06:55,839 Speaker 1: was like lightning had struck. 106 00:06:57,040 --> 00:07:01,279 Speaker 2: I'll say, yeah, we're going to talk about Croachy plays 107 00:07:01,360 --> 00:07:06,440 Speaker 2: Croachy and certainly the Heart of the Eternal tour as well. 108 00:07:06,960 --> 00:07:10,480 Speaker 2: But let's talk about the Heart of the Eternal. What 109 00:07:10,720 --> 00:07:14,800 Speaker 2: inspired you know, those songs and sounds and how does 110 00:07:14,840 --> 00:07:18,320 Speaker 2: it reflect where you are as an artist today? 111 00:07:19,800 --> 00:07:22,840 Speaker 1: You know, I think it's really very representative of who 112 00:07:22,920 --> 00:07:25,080 Speaker 1: I am as an artist. It draws from a lot 113 00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:31,600 Speaker 1: of different places. I was conscious in selecting the songs 114 00:07:33,240 --> 00:07:36,320 Speaker 1: with Shooter Jennings because I had a lot to choose from, 115 00:07:36,320 --> 00:07:39,520 Speaker 1: a lot, you know, probably twenty five songs that I 116 00:07:39,600 --> 00:07:42,640 Speaker 1: was really proud of to choose from. I didn't want 117 00:07:42,680 --> 00:07:45,520 Speaker 1: anything to be too similar from the next, but didn't 118 00:07:45,560 --> 00:07:49,800 Speaker 1: want it to be too different. There are kind of 119 00:07:49,960 --> 00:07:56,080 Speaker 1: pairings in the sense that you know, certain couple each 120 00:07:56,360 --> 00:07:59,360 Speaker 1: song has has a partner in the sense that they 121 00:07:59,440 --> 00:08:02,760 Speaker 1: kind of live in the same world. So on. On 122 00:08:02,800 --> 00:08:06,960 Speaker 1: that album, Uh, there's a couple songs that are kind 123 00:08:07,000 --> 00:08:11,000 Speaker 1: of rock and roll songs, one sort of psychedelic soul 124 00:08:11,120 --> 00:08:16,640 Speaker 1: influence that I got a feeling, the other being, hey, Margherita, 125 00:08:16,760 --> 00:08:19,240 Speaker 1: both of those are kind of living in the same world, 126 00:08:19,360 --> 00:08:22,760 Speaker 1: just as uh, just as Complications of Love and Finest 127 00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:25,200 Speaker 1: Line are kind of living in the same sonic world. 128 00:08:25,560 --> 00:08:27,640 Speaker 1: I like to be able to have things that can 129 00:08:27,680 --> 00:08:31,480 Speaker 1: be very different from the song before it, but but 130 00:08:31,720 --> 00:08:35,439 Speaker 1: will kind of take you on a on a little 131 00:08:35,480 --> 00:08:39,520 Speaker 1: bit of a of a journey, you know. I like 132 00:08:39,600 --> 00:08:44,160 Speaker 1: to think of of an album in its entirety because 133 00:08:45,040 --> 00:08:48,800 Speaker 1: it helps me to to have a well rounded story. 134 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:55,400 Speaker 1: But I don't know that anyone else outside of outside 135 00:08:55,400 --> 00:08:57,400 Speaker 1: of me is ever going to listen to it that way. 136 00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:00,240 Speaker 1: Where we live in a world of singles, it's like 137 00:09:00,280 --> 00:09:03,480 Speaker 1: the nineteen fifties or early sixties again. You know, people 138 00:09:03,480 --> 00:09:07,320 Speaker 1: are they're not even getting two sides. They're getting one 139 00:09:07,400 --> 00:09:10,400 Speaker 1: song and that's it. You know, people download one song 140 00:09:10,960 --> 00:09:13,199 Speaker 1: and if they like it, they'll download another, and then 141 00:09:13,200 --> 00:09:15,480 Speaker 1: you've got a smaller group of people that want to 142 00:09:15,520 --> 00:09:19,520 Speaker 1: hear everything that a particular artist does. I love those people, 143 00:09:19,600 --> 00:09:22,640 Speaker 1: but it's like, you know, it's few and far between 144 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:25,320 Speaker 1: compared to the number of people that hear a song 145 00:09:25,360 --> 00:09:27,679 Speaker 1: on the radio or a friend shares it with them 146 00:09:27,679 --> 00:09:31,400 Speaker 1: and it becomes part of a playlist. I think that's 147 00:09:31,040 --> 00:09:34,440 Speaker 1: it's it's all valid, it's all important. But all of 148 00:09:34,480 --> 00:09:38,120 Speaker 1: those are facets that I consider in recording it. You know, 149 00:09:38,400 --> 00:09:41,960 Speaker 1: it was a really fun record to record. It was 150 00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:45,760 Speaker 1: super relaxed. We had been on tour for two and 151 00:09:45,760 --> 00:09:50,079 Speaker 1: a half years when my band went in to record this. 152 00:09:51,240 --> 00:09:53,560 Speaker 1: You know, my rhythm section, bass player and drummer, we 153 00:09:53,600 --> 00:09:56,800 Speaker 1: had played with me for over a decade. At that point, 154 00:09:57,720 --> 00:10:00,360 Speaker 1: we had played every one of these songs live. I've 155 00:10:01,600 --> 00:10:05,280 Speaker 1: accept the last song which we played live, but it 156 00:10:05,320 --> 00:10:11,600 Speaker 1: was in a different form and and it was just 157 00:10:12,080 --> 00:10:15,280 Speaker 1: very comfortable. You know. I've never had a lot of 158 00:10:15,320 --> 00:10:18,839 Speaker 1: time in the studio budget wise, so we recorded the 159 00:10:19,360 --> 00:10:25,440 Speaker 1: the basic tracks in four days. I had overdubbed. If 160 00:10:25,480 --> 00:10:27,560 Speaker 1: I was playing guitar and needed to play piano, I'd 161 00:10:27,600 --> 00:10:29,640 Speaker 1: go over play the piano part of the orgon part, 162 00:10:29,720 --> 00:10:33,520 Speaker 1: whatever it was sung, whatever instrument I started on. I 163 00:10:33,600 --> 00:10:36,200 Speaker 1: was singing live because I want people and you know 164 00:10:36,520 --> 00:10:39,360 Speaker 1: that come to see me perform. I want them to 165 00:10:39,400 --> 00:10:43,040 Speaker 1: be able to connect with the album as if it's 166 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:47,160 Speaker 1: actually organic. It's me singing. There's no pitch correction or 167 00:10:47,840 --> 00:10:51,840 Speaker 1: or any tricks in that way. I wanted to feel 168 00:10:51,920 --> 00:10:57,760 Speaker 1: alive and yeah, so it was. It was a unique, 169 00:10:58,200 --> 00:11:00,920 Speaker 1: unique project. It was it was fun. 170 00:11:02,080 --> 00:11:03,840 Speaker 2: I want to talk about some of the folks you've 171 00:11:03,960 --> 00:11:08,600 Speaker 2: worked with in your career, but before getting there, I 172 00:11:08,640 --> 00:11:13,280 Speaker 2: think about that unbelievable list of people that you've collaborated with, 173 00:11:14,040 --> 00:11:18,160 Speaker 2: and it's a diverse group, and you're very diverse in 174 00:11:18,200 --> 00:11:25,800 Speaker 2: your approach. Do you intentionally choose these collaborations because of 175 00:11:26,200 --> 00:11:29,520 Speaker 2: those folks and their diverse outlook? On things. 176 00:11:30,360 --> 00:11:35,920 Speaker 1: Absolutely. I think you know, diversity is a spice of life, 177 00:11:35,960 --> 00:11:40,680 Speaker 1: you know it is. It's the thing that makes music interesting. 178 00:11:41,400 --> 00:11:45,000 Speaker 1: I think that it's not necessary. You can you can 179 00:11:45,080 --> 00:11:51,440 Speaker 1: hear great artists who have very very limited knowledge of 180 00:11:51,600 --> 00:11:54,760 Speaker 1: music outside of what they do. That's what they know, 181 00:11:55,480 --> 00:11:58,319 Speaker 1: and it can be magical and they can be the 182 00:11:58,880 --> 00:12:01,240 Speaker 1: greatest in the world or one of the greatest in 183 00:12:01,280 --> 00:12:03,920 Speaker 1: the world in their field. But I love it when 184 00:12:04,080 --> 00:12:08,080 Speaker 1: music is brings in a lot of different elements. And 185 00:12:08,120 --> 00:12:12,600 Speaker 1: I think because every chord's been played, every melody has 186 00:12:12,640 --> 00:12:16,600 Speaker 1: been written, every combination of words have been spoken and sung, 187 00:12:17,160 --> 00:12:19,440 Speaker 1: I think that we I've come to a place for 188 00:12:19,520 --> 00:12:22,920 Speaker 1: myself as an as a as a creator of music 189 00:12:23,920 --> 00:12:29,400 Speaker 1: that the best way to create something that's unique and 190 00:12:29,600 --> 00:12:36,160 Speaker 1: uniquely representative of me is to incorporate lots of different 191 00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:40,400 Speaker 1: genres and finding interesting ways to incorporate all of these 192 00:12:40,440 --> 00:12:44,560 Speaker 1: different sounds and textures and scales and chords and put 193 00:12:44,600 --> 00:12:47,240 Speaker 1: them in in a together in a way that hasn't 194 00:12:47,360 --> 00:12:49,840 Speaker 1: yet been put together that way. 195 00:12:50,559 --> 00:12:56,960 Speaker 3: We'll be right back with more the Taken a Walk Podcast. 196 00:12:58,600 --> 00:13:00,960 Speaker 3: Welcome back to the Take a Walk Podcast. 197 00:13:01,920 --> 00:13:04,920 Speaker 2: When you pull back and think of the list of 198 00:13:04,920 --> 00:13:08,920 Speaker 2: people I'm going to talk about. You must sometimes want 199 00:13:08,920 --> 00:13:13,480 Speaker 2: to pinch yourself thinking of being alongside. All right, I'll 200 00:13:13,480 --> 00:13:18,720 Speaker 2: start with Leon Russell as an example. I mean, what 201 00:13:18,800 --> 00:13:20,160 Speaker 2: was that experience? 202 00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:25,160 Speaker 1: Like, well, I'm not really starstruck. They're just they're people, 203 00:13:25,520 --> 00:13:30,959 Speaker 1: you know. And and with Leon, you know, it was funny. 204 00:13:31,559 --> 00:13:34,360 Speaker 1: We'd played on a couple festivals in the nineties together 205 00:13:34,760 --> 00:13:39,640 Speaker 1: and we really connected on he and he and Willie 206 00:13:39,679 --> 00:13:42,480 Speaker 1: Nelson were on tour and I and I they were 207 00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:45,480 Speaker 1: doing a duo show. It was the best I'd ever 208 00:13:45,520 --> 00:13:48,480 Speaker 1: heard these guys. And I had had the opportunity to 209 00:13:48,520 --> 00:13:52,280 Speaker 1: play with Willy, sit in with him and play keys 210 00:13:52,320 --> 00:13:55,560 Speaker 1: and stuff, and he was always super supportive. And so 211 00:13:55,640 --> 00:13:59,440 Speaker 1: I go backstage onto Willie's bus, which was dangerous in 212 00:13:59,480 --> 00:14:03,520 Speaker 1: those days, and uh, you know, you don't get a 213 00:14:03,559 --> 00:14:10,600 Speaker 1: contact tie from gummies. So so anyway, he, uh, Leon 214 00:14:10,679 --> 00:14:12,760 Speaker 1: and I started talking about piano players and we spoke 215 00:14:12,840 --> 00:14:16,400 Speaker 1: for like, we just talked about our heroes for for 216 00:14:16,480 --> 00:14:19,120 Speaker 1: an hour. You know, I think we bored. Will he 217 00:14:19,280 --> 00:14:24,880 Speaker 1: have to death and and and you know, a little 218 00:14:24,880 --> 00:14:26,920 Speaker 1: while later, I got a call that he wants to 219 00:14:26,960 --> 00:14:30,840 Speaker 1: write and so you know, we have the same influences. 220 00:14:30,920 --> 00:14:36,760 Speaker 1: I wasn't thinking about him as this iconic songwriter, piano player, 221 00:14:36,880 --> 00:14:40,840 Speaker 1: studio musician, or or producer or any of the hats 222 00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:44,600 Speaker 1: many hats and very cool hats that he's worn. I 223 00:14:44,880 --> 00:14:49,480 Speaker 1: just thought that, you know, here's a kind of a fellow, 224 00:14:50,800 --> 00:14:54,960 Speaker 1: you know, traveler. You know, he's inspired by all kinds 225 00:14:55,000 --> 00:14:59,600 Speaker 1: of music and and his and uses uses it in 226 00:14:59,640 --> 00:15:03,400 Speaker 1: the same way that that I have, you know, in 227 00:15:03,480 --> 00:15:06,280 Speaker 1: a different in his way. You know that's magical. 228 00:15:07,360 --> 00:15:10,760 Speaker 2: Could you possibly nail your favorite ly on Russell's song? 229 00:15:11,040 --> 00:15:13,200 Speaker 2: I know that's probably impossible. 230 00:15:14,040 --> 00:15:21,320 Speaker 1: You know, there's there's so many good ones, but and 231 00:15:21,320 --> 00:15:24,280 Speaker 1: we wrote a bunch together, we wrote probably ten songs together. 232 00:15:24,600 --> 00:15:27,479 Speaker 1: But I really, you know, a song for you is beautiful. 233 00:15:27,680 --> 00:15:34,440 Speaker 1: There's something about the self titled Leon record and Carney 234 00:15:34,880 --> 00:15:38,960 Speaker 1: in particular that really resonate for me. And and again, 235 00:15:39,040 --> 00:15:43,080 Speaker 1: you know, I loved his music. I still love his music. 236 00:15:43,920 --> 00:15:47,360 Speaker 1: But he was not like my what he was not 237 00:15:47,480 --> 00:15:50,720 Speaker 1: Ray Charles for me or Ray Charles for him. You know, 238 00:15:51,000 --> 00:15:54,880 Speaker 1: we both had that connection to to Ray and and 239 00:15:54,880 --> 00:15:58,080 Speaker 1: and to Little Richard and to Johnny Johnson and to 240 00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:01,000 Speaker 1: the boogie guys. Those were you know, they were kind 241 00:16:01,040 --> 00:16:04,960 Speaker 1: of our piano playing heroes, regardless of songwriting or anything. 242 00:16:05,840 --> 00:16:08,320 Speaker 1: But Leon wrote so many great songs, and those two 243 00:16:08,360 --> 00:16:11,440 Speaker 1: albums just have so many cool things, and I love 244 00:16:11,520 --> 00:16:15,240 Speaker 1: how raw it is and just just it's just great 245 00:16:15,280 --> 00:16:19,120 Speaker 1: because how much fun the band is having. 246 00:16:20,160 --> 00:16:25,440 Speaker 2: Oh man, I'll say. Then you think about his record 247 00:16:25,520 --> 00:16:31,240 Speaker 2: company executive period, which is incredible as well, right, I know, Freddie. 248 00:16:30,920 --> 00:16:35,000 Speaker 4: King was on his label, and and JJ Kale and 249 00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:37,760 Speaker 4: and then of course the studio the church which he has, 250 00:16:37,840 --> 00:16:41,640 Speaker 4: which is you know, or had and and that's that's 251 00:16:41,680 --> 00:16:46,280 Speaker 4: pretty amazing. And and his son Teddy Jack's very talented 252 00:16:46,320 --> 00:16:46,680 Speaker 4: as well. 253 00:16:47,080 --> 00:16:51,240 Speaker 2: You know, I find when I listen to his catalog 254 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:53,760 Speaker 2: or my wife and I just you know, just have 255 00:16:53,880 --> 00:16:58,160 Speaker 2: a night of just you know, swinging through playlists and whatnot. 256 00:16:58,840 --> 00:17:01,480 Speaker 2: You then like read this cover something that you knew 257 00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:04,280 Speaker 2: was great, like you know, Magic Mirror, and you go, 258 00:17:04,400 --> 00:17:06,760 Speaker 2: oh my god. Then we just play that, you know, 259 00:17:07,080 --> 00:17:10,639 Speaker 2: fifteen times in a row because it's just so amazing. 260 00:17:11,920 --> 00:17:14,600 Speaker 2: All right, you brought up Ray Charles, So let's talk 261 00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:18,960 Speaker 2: about that collaboration and how magical that had to be. 262 00:17:19,680 --> 00:17:23,280 Speaker 1: That was pretty magical and it you know, obviously he was. 263 00:17:23,560 --> 00:17:25,439 Speaker 1: He was a hero of mine. I got turned on 264 00:17:25,520 --> 00:17:29,359 Speaker 1: to him when I had lost my sight, and you 265 00:17:29,359 --> 00:17:32,720 Speaker 1: know it was it was funny. I When I was 266 00:17:32,760 --> 00:17:35,679 Speaker 1: about sixteen, I started touring around southern California with a 267 00:17:35,920 --> 00:17:39,840 Speaker 1: with a blues piano player named Floyd Dixon. Floyd was 268 00:17:40,720 --> 00:17:44,840 Speaker 1: just an eccentric kook who had a tendency to drink 269 00:17:44,840 --> 00:17:48,080 Speaker 1: a little too much. He wrote, Hay Bartender wine, wine wine, 270 00:17:48,160 --> 00:17:54,280 Speaker 1: one Scotch, Wimberg and one beer, and a great boogie 271 00:17:54,280 --> 00:17:58,399 Speaker 1: woogie player. And and he told me this story about 272 00:17:58,880 --> 00:18:01,280 Speaker 1: hanging out with Rage Charles and Sam Cook back in 273 00:18:01,320 --> 00:18:06,000 Speaker 1: the late fifties, and they were on Central Avenue and 274 00:18:06,080 --> 00:18:08,200 Speaker 1: Sam Cook and he had had too much to drink. 275 00:18:08,359 --> 00:18:11,479 Speaker 1: So they had the brilliant drunken idea to get Ray 276 00:18:11,600 --> 00:18:14,800 Speaker 1: Charles to drive him home. And so they get into 277 00:18:14,840 --> 00:18:18,680 Speaker 1: Floyd's Cadillac and they tie a string to raise left 278 00:18:18,720 --> 00:18:21,880 Speaker 1: wrist and a string to raise right wrist, and they go, Okay, Ray, 279 00:18:21,880 --> 00:18:24,399 Speaker 1: you you've got a mile of green light. Step on 280 00:18:24,480 --> 00:18:29,560 Speaker 1: it right. So five years after I hear that story, 281 00:18:29,960 --> 00:18:35,639 Speaker 1: I'm out on the road with Ray Charles, and I'm 282 00:18:35,680 --> 00:18:40,800 Speaker 1: not starstruck. But he was a huge you know influence, 283 00:18:41,119 --> 00:18:45,359 Speaker 1: and so I'm a little and I had heard a 284 00:18:45,359 --> 00:18:49,159 Speaker 1: lot of stories about him being challenging or difficult offstage 285 00:18:49,240 --> 00:18:52,520 Speaker 1: or whatever. And I see him smiling on the side 286 00:18:52,520 --> 00:18:54,879 Speaker 1: of the stage after the show, and he's sitting there 287 00:18:54,920 --> 00:18:57,919 Speaker 1: and you've seen this, the way he looked, and he 288 00:18:57,960 --> 00:19:01,400 Speaker 1: seemed approachable. And I come over and I a Ray, 289 00:19:01,480 --> 00:19:05,600 Speaker 1: is it true I heard this story from Floyd Dixon. 290 00:19:05,600 --> 00:19:08,800 Speaker 1: And here's Floyd Dixon and his smile disappears, and he's 291 00:19:08,880 --> 00:19:13,240 Speaker 1: just like mm hmmm. And I said, is it true 292 00:19:13,320 --> 00:19:16,639 Speaker 1: that you drove Sam Cook and Floyd Dixon home? And 293 00:19:16,680 --> 00:19:19,120 Speaker 1: he lightens up right away. He goes, man, I used 294 00:19:19,119 --> 00:19:21,760 Speaker 1: to drive all the time. And that was my introduction 295 00:19:21,920 --> 00:19:26,600 Speaker 1: to Ray Charles. He you know, he was super encouraging. 296 00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:29,919 Speaker 1: He dug what I did. He thought that he was 297 00:19:30,040 --> 00:19:32,840 Speaker 1: grateful that I always that I had had a piano, 298 00:19:32,960 --> 00:19:37,560 Speaker 1: because because it made sure that he had that he 299 00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:40,200 Speaker 1: had a great piano too, because he didn't always ask 300 00:19:40,359 --> 00:19:43,080 Speaker 1: for a great piano, even though he could. Anyone would 301 00:19:43,119 --> 00:19:46,320 Speaker 1: have given him whatever he wanted. It was just an 302 00:19:46,320 --> 00:19:49,679 Speaker 1: old fashioned way of doing things, you know. So he 303 00:19:49,720 --> 00:19:52,399 Speaker 1: always had the wurlitzer and a keyboard or something but 304 00:19:52,880 --> 00:19:54,919 Speaker 1: on tour that was that was a dream, you know. 305 00:19:55,000 --> 00:19:58,640 Speaker 1: And I'd heard all these insane stories about his tour manager, 306 00:19:58,720 --> 00:20:04,840 Speaker 1: Joe Adams, who I was terrified of meeting, and you know, 307 00:20:04,920 --> 00:20:07,560 Speaker 1: he would fire a bus driver and drive drive the 308 00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:09,840 Speaker 1: rest of the tour. He would fire a pilot and 309 00:20:09,920 --> 00:20:10,800 Speaker 1: fly the plane. 310 00:20:11,040 --> 00:20:11,320 Speaker 3: You know. 311 00:20:12,320 --> 00:20:17,159 Speaker 1: It was like, and I meet him and he couldn't 312 00:20:17,160 --> 00:20:19,320 Speaker 1: have been more of a gentleman than the whole you know. 313 00:20:19,359 --> 00:20:21,720 Speaker 1: It was just I felt like after that, I must 314 00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:23,760 Speaker 1: have been twenty one years old when I did that. 315 00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:27,360 Speaker 1: I'm like, Okay, if I never do anything amazing in 316 00:20:27,400 --> 00:20:28,880 Speaker 1: my career, I've done this. 317 00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:34,280 Speaker 2: Well, You've continued doing amazing things. Hard of the Eternal 318 00:20:34,960 --> 00:20:40,439 Speaker 2: Wonderful Project. We had John Oates on this podcast some 319 00:20:40,560 --> 00:20:45,719 Speaker 2: time ago, and he spoke so wonderfully of collaborating with 320 00:20:45,840 --> 00:20:50,240 Speaker 2: you on reunion. Talk about your view of collaborating with 321 00:20:50,520 --> 00:20:52,120 Speaker 2: the amazing John Oates. 322 00:20:52,680 --> 00:20:55,720 Speaker 1: John was such a surprise. We met. We met at 323 00:20:55,760 --> 00:20:58,000 Speaker 1: the Rhyme and we were both performing. It was a 324 00:20:58,600 --> 00:21:04,080 Speaker 1: John Prime tribute a couple of years back, and after 325 00:21:04,320 --> 00:21:06,159 Speaker 1: after I played, he came over and said, hey, you 326 00:21:06,160 --> 00:21:08,400 Speaker 1: want to get together. I'd known that he lived here 327 00:21:08,400 --> 00:21:11,920 Speaker 1: in Nashville, but didn't know, had never met him. And 328 00:21:12,080 --> 00:21:15,960 Speaker 1: so he comes over a couple of weeks later. He 329 00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:19,439 Speaker 1: had just gone to see his his father, who was 330 00:21:19,480 --> 00:21:25,920 Speaker 1: one hundred years old in Philadelphia, and and he comes 331 00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:27,919 Speaker 1: over and he says, you know, I saw my dad 332 00:21:28,200 --> 00:21:31,600 Speaker 1: and you know he's one hundred and he he said, John, 333 00:21:31,640 --> 00:21:36,040 Speaker 1: I'm ready for my reunion. You know I've had I've 334 00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:39,080 Speaker 1: had a great life and I'm and i'm I'm grateful, 335 00:21:40,280 --> 00:21:43,199 Speaker 1: but I'm ready to see the people I have. You know, 336 00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:47,560 Speaker 1: I love and lost and ready for my reunion. And 337 00:21:48,280 --> 00:21:50,879 Speaker 1: that was all it took. The two of us took that, 338 00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:52,640 Speaker 1: and he said, I've got an idea. I didn't want 339 00:21:52,640 --> 00:21:55,880 Speaker 1: to call it reunion, but I don't know exactly where 340 00:21:55,920 --> 00:21:58,920 Speaker 1: to go with it. Kind of hear it as a 341 00:21:59,040 --> 00:22:01,000 Speaker 1: kind of a gospel thing, but he was playing it 342 00:22:01,040 --> 00:22:02,440 Speaker 1: in four to four and I said, well, we got 343 00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:04,640 Speaker 1: to play it in three or in six, and it's gospel. 344 00:22:04,680 --> 00:22:08,240 Speaker 1: And so I started played the opening part to it, 345 00:22:09,040 --> 00:22:12,600 Speaker 1: and that was that we wrote it. Bam. It just 346 00:22:12,680 --> 00:22:17,840 Speaker 1: kind of wrote itself. And John is such a talented musician. 347 00:22:17,920 --> 00:22:23,560 Speaker 1: The thing, there's very few musicians that I write with 348 00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:31,119 Speaker 1: who understand the possibilities as far as not just you know, 349 00:22:31,200 --> 00:22:35,080 Speaker 1: the way it feels, but also theoretically what is going 350 00:22:35,160 --> 00:22:38,480 Speaker 1: on in the music. So it's a place where I'm like, 351 00:22:38,720 --> 00:22:40,280 Speaker 1: you know, we want to go to the four, but 352 00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:42,399 Speaker 1: I don't want to. I don't want to stay on 353 00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:45,919 Speaker 1: this four again. We're going back to this and so 354 00:22:46,000 --> 00:22:48,560 Speaker 1: we play a mine or two instead, which was his 355 00:22:48,640 --> 00:22:51,920 Speaker 1: suggestion in kind of the leading up to the chorus. 356 00:22:52,400 --> 00:22:56,240 Speaker 1: And it's basically the same chord the way it's played, 357 00:22:56,400 --> 00:23:00,560 Speaker 1: but it has a different tonality. And and I there's 358 00:23:00,640 --> 00:23:05,000 Speaker 1: not a lot of collaborators that I have who have 359 00:23:05,200 --> 00:23:09,160 Speaker 1: that ability, you know. Of course Leon was one, and 360 00:23:09,160 --> 00:23:12,960 Speaker 1: and I've had you know, I've been able to collaborate 361 00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:17,040 Speaker 1: with some great, great folks. But but John really understands 362 00:23:17,080 --> 00:23:20,879 Speaker 1: the music and the possibility of of of a song, 363 00:23:21,640 --> 00:23:25,200 Speaker 1: and you know, he's he's a master of what he does. 364 00:23:26,280 --> 00:23:33,359 Speaker 2: You both share this incredible passion for the history of 365 00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:36,400 Speaker 2: what you're doing as well the history of your craft. 366 00:23:36,520 --> 00:23:40,439 Speaker 2: So I think that's what's remarkable about both of you. 367 00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:44,600 Speaker 2: There's another force of nature that you collaborated with them 368 00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:49,240 Speaker 2: on the latest project, Heart of the Eternal, What was 369 00:23:49,280 --> 00:23:51,800 Speaker 2: it like working with Margot Price. 370 00:23:53,119 --> 00:23:56,160 Speaker 1: You know, I wasn't familiar with Margot. I knew her 371 00:23:56,280 --> 00:24:00,920 Speaker 1: name and have friends who play with her, but I 372 00:24:01,359 --> 00:24:05,280 Speaker 1: had never met her before. And she came in she 373 00:24:05,400 --> 00:24:08,800 Speaker 1: was in Los Angeles and stopped in the studio I 374 00:24:08,840 --> 00:24:13,159 Speaker 1: think the second day of tracking, just to say hi, 375 00:24:13,240 --> 00:24:17,560 Speaker 1: to shoot her and she heard what we were doing, 376 00:24:17,600 --> 00:24:20,800 Speaker 1: and she apparently dug it and said, hey, if you 377 00:24:21,200 --> 00:24:24,520 Speaker 1: want someone to join in and you know, sing on anything, 378 00:24:25,119 --> 00:24:28,159 Speaker 1: let me know. And I had. I had written this 379 00:24:28,359 --> 00:24:33,359 Speaker 1: song initially on guitar, and then the day I was 380 00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:37,920 Speaker 1: leaving for Los Angeles, I was played it on piano 381 00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:39,880 Speaker 1: for my girlfriend and I said, what do you think 382 00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:41,760 Speaker 1: of this? She's like, where has that song been? And 383 00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:44,800 Speaker 1: I said, well, you know, I've had it for a while. 384 00:24:44,840 --> 00:24:47,119 Speaker 1: You heard it on guitar, but it just came alive 385 00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:51,840 Speaker 1: on the piano. And so I looked at the lyrics 386 00:24:51,840 --> 00:24:54,119 Speaker 1: to this, and I realized that if I broke the 387 00:24:54,359 --> 00:24:57,760 Speaker 1: verses in half, that it was a real conversation, almost 388 00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:02,160 Speaker 1: a question and answer or to statements. And it's such 389 00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:06,520 Speaker 1: in athereal piece of music that there was something kind 390 00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:13,960 Speaker 1: of ghostly about it, beautiful, gentle and forceful at the 391 00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:21,280 Speaker 1: same time confident. Maybe anyway, I felt like having those 392 00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:25,159 Speaker 1: facets kind of fit, you know, I think that I 393 00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:27,679 Speaker 1: think it worked for for us to do that in 394 00:25:27,720 --> 00:25:30,960 Speaker 1: that way. It just it was really unique, completely unexpected, 395 00:25:31,040 --> 00:25:34,479 Speaker 1: and you know, we met. We met twice and I 396 00:25:34,520 --> 00:25:35,440 Speaker 1: haven't seen her since. 397 00:25:36,800 --> 00:25:41,120 Speaker 2: It's a wonderful collaboration. It really is well in closing 398 00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:44,119 Speaker 2: what's next after this album and tour? What are the 399 00:25:44,160 --> 00:25:48,520 Speaker 2: new collaborations or creative projects that are on your horizon? 400 00:25:49,600 --> 00:25:52,159 Speaker 1: Man, I'm not sure, you know. I have a lot 401 00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:56,760 Speaker 1: I've gotten, you know, another album, you know, worth of 402 00:25:56,960 --> 00:26:00,280 Speaker 1: songs that I'm that I'm continuing to write, even that 403 00:26:00,359 --> 00:26:05,680 Speaker 1: I wrote with John co wrote with John and Gary Nicholson, 404 00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:11,640 Speaker 1: who's been a longtime collaborator. I got a message from 405 00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:14,040 Speaker 1: Ben Harper the other day and that could be an 406 00:26:14,040 --> 00:26:19,879 Speaker 1: interesting collaboration. He's living in France right now and wanted 407 00:26:19,920 --> 00:26:25,080 Speaker 1: to maybe collaborate long distance. I have a project that's 408 00:26:25,119 --> 00:26:29,840 Speaker 1: been sort of a real passion project for several years. 409 00:26:29,920 --> 00:26:34,359 Speaker 1: It took many years to sort of organize the concept 410 00:26:34,440 --> 00:26:38,560 Speaker 1: for its origin stories, using a lot of almost the 411 00:26:38,560 --> 00:26:41,600 Speaker 1: World Music project in a way, because there's a lot 412 00:26:41,640 --> 00:26:45,920 Speaker 1: of really unique instrumentation, a lot of interesting stories, and 413 00:26:46,000 --> 00:26:50,640 Speaker 1: they're coming from folklore, coming from mythology, coming from science, 414 00:26:50,720 --> 00:26:56,760 Speaker 1: coming from religion. And the similarities of these origin stories 415 00:26:56,800 --> 00:27:00,840 Speaker 1: from each continent is so amazing and so similar that 416 00:27:00,920 --> 00:27:03,320 Speaker 1: you realize how similar we all are. And I think 417 00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:07,120 Speaker 1: it's such a beautiful project that when when the time allows, 418 00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:11,399 Speaker 1: I will And you know, that was initially started with 419 00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:14,439 Speaker 1: a group called Anti Ballast, who's, you know, kind of 420 00:27:14,440 --> 00:27:18,679 Speaker 1: a world music band. I think five languages are spoken 421 00:27:18,720 --> 00:27:21,119 Speaker 1: in that group. It started in Mexico City, but the 422 00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:26,000 Speaker 1: lead singer and percussionist is from Nigeria and the band 423 00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:30,679 Speaker 1: all kind of met in Brooklyn and and but they're 424 00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:33,080 Speaker 1: you know, they all play with a lot of different groups, 425 00:27:33,119 --> 00:27:35,280 Speaker 1: So I just think there's going to be a lot 426 00:27:35,280 --> 00:27:38,760 Speaker 1: of collaboration when this thing comes together. I think it'll 427 00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:39,640 Speaker 1: be really interesting. 428 00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:43,240 Speaker 2: Oh man, I have so enjoyed speaking with you, AJ Crochy, 429 00:27:43,480 --> 00:27:46,639 Speaker 2: And for those that want to check out the Music 430 00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:50,840 Speaker 2: Save Me podcast, you should check out that version of 431 00:27:51,040 --> 00:27:54,600 Speaker 2: the AJ Croche with Lynn Hoffman on Music Saved Me. 432 00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:59,119 Speaker 2: That's also fabulous. But Aj, congratulations on the new project, 433 00:27:59,200 --> 00:28:02,840 Speaker 2: the tour and everything, and thanks for your generosity and 434 00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:04,720 Speaker 2: all you continue to give us. 435 00:28:05,280 --> 00:28:07,720 Speaker 1: Man, thank you so much for having me. I appreciate it. 436 00:28:09,560 --> 00:28:12,000 Speaker 3: Thanks for listening to this episode of the Taking a 437 00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:15,960 Speaker 3: Walk podcast. Share this and other episodes with your friends 438 00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:19,520 Speaker 3: and follow us so you never miss an episode. Taking 439 00:28:19,560 --> 00:28:23,440 Speaker 3: a Walk is available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 440 00:28:23,680 --> 00:28:25,960 Speaker 3: and wherever you get your podcasts.