WEBVTT - ITS Home Edition: Gracie Abrams 0:00:01.040 --> 0:00:04.600 Welcome to Inside the Studio presented by I Heart Radio. 0:00:04.800 --> 0:00:12.880 I'm your host Joe Levy, So like a lot of us, 0:00:12.920 --> 0:00:17.480 pretty much all of us. The guest on this episode 0:00:17.520 --> 0:00:20.520 of the home edition of the show, Gracie Abrams, started 0:00:20.560 --> 0:00:25.120 out with a totally different plan in mind. She had 0:00:25.239 --> 0:00:28.200 moved from putting her music up on SoundCloud and then 0:00:28.240 --> 0:00:31.440 Instagram and sometimes she was just sharing snippets, just pieces 0:00:31.440 --> 0:00:33.919 of a song, to signing with a major label and 0:00:34.000 --> 0:00:36.239 releasing her music that way. And she had lined up 0:00:36.240 --> 0:00:39.479 shows in London, New York and Toronto to celebrate the 0:00:39.520 --> 0:00:42.640 release of her first EP, which is called Minor and 0:00:42.680 --> 0:00:45.960 which is full of hushed pop songs that deliver really 0:00:46.040 --> 0:00:50.640 big feelings in a very quiet way. Except then and 0:00:50.640 --> 0:00:53.720 Gracie ended up playing her first ever shows is live 0:00:53.760 --> 0:00:56.760 streams from the same place that she had first started 0:00:56.760 --> 0:00:59.639 making her music, which is her bedroom in Los Angeles. 0:00:59.720 --> 0:01:01.960 You know, the home edition of Inside the Studio is 0:01:02.000 --> 0:01:04.840 all about letting you know how the pandemic has impacted 0:01:04.880 --> 0:01:08.800 the lives of artists, and Gracie told our Quarantine correspondent 0:01:08.880 --> 0:01:11.520 Jordan Runtalk that she really wouldn't be writing songs like 0:01:11.560 --> 0:01:14.440 her new single brush fire if COVID hadn't happened. She 0:01:14.520 --> 0:01:17.839 also talked about how she first turned to songwriting because 0:01:17.880 --> 0:01:19.840 she had lost her journal and she needed a way 0:01:19.840 --> 0:01:22.440 to process things. Writing songs is how she figures out 0:01:22.440 --> 0:01:25.440 her feelings and expresses them, and she talked about leaving home, 0:01:25.560 --> 0:01:28.839 coming back there, and drawing power from once again being 0:01:28.880 --> 0:01:33.160 in a room alone by herself, creating as always. If 0:01:33.160 --> 0:01:35.360 you enjoyed this episode, be sure to check out the 0:01:35.400 --> 0:01:38.520 I Heart Radio podcast that Jordan's hosts, which is called 0:01:38.640 --> 0:01:43.120 Rivals Music's Greatest Feuds, and which is available wherever you 0:01:43.160 --> 0:01:49.600 get your podcasts. Hello everyone, My name is Jordan Runtalk. 0:01:49.720 --> 0:01:52.880 But enough about me. My guest today was preparing for 0:01:52.920 --> 0:01:58.440 her first ever concert tour in a coronavirus had other plans. Instead, 0:01:58.520 --> 0:02:01.480 She's returned to her musical root, her bedroom, where she's 0:02:01.480 --> 0:02:05.240 been thrilling fans across the globe with virtual concerts. It's 0:02:05.240 --> 0:02:08.200 a fitting homecoming for an artist who first attracted listeners 0:02:08.240 --> 0:02:12.640 with self produced songs shared online platforms. The fearlessly personal 0:02:12.720 --> 0:02:15.920 lyrics were taken directly from the pages of her own diary. 0:02:16.360 --> 0:02:20.080 Last summer, she unveiled her debut EP, Minor a deeply 0:02:20.160 --> 0:02:23.200 vulnerable collection of songs that detail the emotional peaks and 0:02:23.280 --> 0:02:27.680 valleys of romantic relationship. She says her latest single, brush Fire, 0:02:27.800 --> 0:02:29.919 there's her way of closing the book on that tumultuous 0:02:30.000 --> 0:02:32.639 chapter of her personal life, and she's looking ahead to 0:02:32.680 --> 0:02:35.160 the future in a new year. I'm so happy to 0:02:35.200 --> 0:02:38.840 welcome Gracie Abrams. Thank you. I'm so excited to be here. 0:02:38.880 --> 0:02:41.160 It's really cool for me, So thank you well, first 0:02:41.160 --> 0:02:42.720 and foremost, how you doing? I know if I feel 0:02:42.720 --> 0:02:44.560 like every conversation I have lately has to have the 0:02:44.560 --> 0:02:49.400 prerequisite like status check, how you feeling, feeling good, feeling grounded? Yeah, yeah, 0:02:49.520 --> 0:02:52.720 hanging in. I'm really grateful to be with my family 0:02:53.200 --> 0:02:56.560 um for the holidays, and and to just be home 0:02:56.600 --> 0:02:58.840 together is like, despite the fact that that's been this 0:02:59.040 --> 0:03:01.480 entire year, it feels a specially kind of comforting to 0:03:01.520 --> 0:03:05.160 be able to have them give me close by this time. So, yeah, 0:03:05.160 --> 0:03:07.080 how are you that, I'm good? I'm good, sort of 0:03:08.080 --> 0:03:10.120 deal with the same thing, kind of We at our 0:03:10.120 --> 0:03:12.880 first Thanksgiving without our family for the first time. So 0:03:13.639 --> 0:03:16.160 cook the turkey first time, didn't set it on fire. 0:03:16.280 --> 0:03:18.520 That's a plus. As far as I'm okay, that was 0:03:18.600 --> 0:03:22.320 me too, exactly exactly where we were doing all right, 0:03:23.440 --> 0:03:27.200 small small winds these days exactly. Yeah. Well, you have 0:03:27.200 --> 0:03:29.280 a new song out in that brush Fire, and it 0:03:29.400 --> 0:03:32.840 is absolutely exquisite. I mean the words are vulnerable and 0:03:32.960 --> 0:03:35.160 brave and at times brutal. I want to ask you, 0:03:35.200 --> 0:03:38.720 what does that song mean mean to you? Thank you? Um? 0:03:38.800 --> 0:03:43.160 It felt like a book and song kind of for 0:03:43.240 --> 0:03:46.440 what I released this year and having put out Minor, 0:03:46.480 --> 0:03:49.840 which is like the first body of work that I've 0:03:49.880 --> 0:03:53.560 ever made, and it was kind of about the same 0:03:53.600 --> 0:03:56.839 theme in terms of like a different stages of a relationship, 0:03:57.040 --> 0:04:00.520 and I feel like brush Fire leaves it kind of 0:04:00.600 --> 0:04:03.760 a bit of a cliffhanger in terms of returning to 0:04:04.160 --> 0:04:07.160 bad habits in a relationship and kind of like fueling 0:04:07.200 --> 0:04:10.760 the fire of of like treating somebody else poorly and 0:04:10.760 --> 0:04:12.440 then them doing the same to you. And it's just 0:04:12.520 --> 0:04:14.120 kind of a bit of a cycle. But you really 0:04:14.120 --> 0:04:16.760 do feel a kind of since your love, So it's 0:04:16.760 --> 0:04:20.320 a challenging I just was trying to like leave it 0:04:20.360 --> 0:04:24.040 on a note that I felt good about and and 0:04:24.240 --> 0:04:27.240 you know, the Tobias Jesso Jr. And Blake slackin wom 0:04:27.279 --> 0:04:30.000 I wrote the song that they're both like so unbelievable, 0:04:30.040 --> 0:04:32.239 So to be able to work with with them made 0:04:32.279 --> 0:04:36.040 it a really seamless process, and so I'm super grateful 0:04:36.080 --> 0:04:38.120 for that. I'm a huge fan of Tobias is work. 0:04:38.200 --> 0:04:43.000 I I love his contribution incredible. Yeah, do you feel much? 0:04:43.000 --> 0:04:46.280 Fire sort of closes the chapter that that you had 0:04:46.320 --> 0:04:50.280 written on on Minor in a way, Yeah, I think so. 0:04:50.400 --> 0:04:53.800 I think, like I mean, it definitely sounds super different 0:04:53.839 --> 0:04:55.520 from the rest of the music that I'm making right now, 0:04:55.560 --> 0:05:01.400 which I'm relieved about because I wanted my to feel 0:05:01.400 --> 0:05:05.800 like a foundation that was honest and super true to 0:05:05.839 --> 0:05:07.520 the kind of music that I write when I'm alone, 0:05:07.600 --> 0:05:10.760 which is just like super stripped back and it's like 0:05:10.839 --> 0:05:14.240 guitar or piano and you know, the lyrics and that's it. 0:05:14.320 --> 0:05:17.480 And I feel like I'm working now a little bit 0:05:17.520 --> 0:05:21.040 differently in terms of of writing to track sometimes, and 0:05:21.040 --> 0:05:22.880 that's just changing the way that I'm right. I'm just 0:05:22.920 --> 0:05:25.880 really learning every single day, and I'm trying to step 0:05:25.880 --> 0:05:31.320 outside of the little world that Minor was because I 0:05:31.360 --> 0:05:34.520 would love to be somebody that can grow as they 0:05:34.640 --> 0:05:37.919 like age. So I'm trying to like step outside my 0:05:38.360 --> 0:05:40.520 incredible quote you gave recently where you said, I'm more 0:05:40.560 --> 0:05:42.440 scared to put out a song, but I don't feel 0:05:42.480 --> 0:05:45.279 as honest than put out a song that's oversharing. I 0:05:45.279 --> 0:05:47.120 thought that was just such an incredible sentiment and a 0:05:47.160 --> 0:05:50.640 really admirably high standard that I feel like an artist 0:05:50.640 --> 0:05:52.800 should have. I just want to ask you more about that, 0:05:52.880 --> 0:05:55.080 like why do you feel that way? The reason that 0:05:55.160 --> 0:05:58.360 I love songwriting is because I like need it to 0:05:58.560 --> 0:06:01.040 feel like saying and can died to myself and like 0:06:01.120 --> 0:06:04.760 I it's just the way that I've always um processed 0:06:04.920 --> 0:06:08.440 feelings and like I'm an introverted person, so I don't 0:06:08.520 --> 0:06:14.480 necessarily shared like how I'm really doing with people in 0:06:14.520 --> 0:06:16.919 my life all the time. And that's fine because I 0:06:16.960 --> 0:06:22.400 have songwriting. But if I ever like contaminated that practice 0:06:22.520 --> 0:06:27.000 by being dishonest, then I would be like fully betraying myself. 0:06:27.160 --> 0:06:30.800 I feel like I don't know what I would like 0:06:30.960 --> 0:06:36.520 really have if I weren't being like entirely transparent, And 0:06:37.000 --> 0:06:40.520 I also like would feel shitty weird about like I 0:06:40.520 --> 0:06:44.800 wouldn't know how to kind of like like look at 0:06:44.839 --> 0:06:47.080 myself if I if I because you know when you're 0:06:47.120 --> 0:06:49.479 not telling the truth, like it's you know, so I 0:06:49.760 --> 0:06:52.920 you know, yeah, I mean, it's it's an incredible thing 0:06:52.960 --> 0:06:55.480 to feel. I'm always fascinated by people who are able 0:06:55.520 --> 0:06:57.679 to write songs, and I'm sort of blessed without ability. 0:06:57.720 --> 0:06:59.880 At what point did they start thinking about other people? 0:07:00.000 --> 0:07:02.560 When you sit down? Is it primarily to to get 0:07:02.560 --> 0:07:04.720 a song out of you and get feelings out of you? 0:07:04.880 --> 0:07:06.800 Or are you trying to connect with somebody else or 0:07:06.880 --> 0:07:09.200 is it a mix above When I'm releasing music, you mean, 0:07:09.480 --> 0:07:10.920 or when you're when you're writing it. At what point 0:07:10.960 --> 0:07:13.280 in the creative process do you actually start thinking about, oh, 0:07:13.280 --> 0:07:16.000 people are going to hear this, and do you adjust accordingly? 0:07:16.200 --> 0:07:19.320 Or I never think about it. No, I don't think 0:07:19.360 --> 0:07:22.520 about it. It was It's interesting because I I um, 0:07:22.560 --> 0:07:25.720 because this is the first year that I've ever released 0:07:25.760 --> 0:07:30.360 anything on like a streaming service. I am realized that 0:07:30.480 --> 0:07:35.120 I don't really get the like a wave of emotion 0:07:35.400 --> 0:07:38.160 when a song is being released. It's just when I've 0:07:38.320 --> 0:07:40.840 finished writing it that I'm like feeling all the things. 0:07:40.880 --> 0:07:43.640 And because because again, like it is a really it's 0:07:43.680 --> 0:07:46.680 just such a personal thing for me, which I am 0:07:46.720 --> 0:07:51.120 super grateful for um, they're definitely like I don't I 0:07:51.120 --> 0:07:55.400 I don't ever read comments really because I because of 0:07:55.440 --> 0:07:57.920 how personal it is, and I try to have thick 0:07:57.960 --> 0:08:01.440 skin about everything owned me all the time. But like, 0:08:02.000 --> 0:08:06.240 I don't know, I'm I I feel so excited when 0:08:06.280 --> 0:08:09.920 I see that anyone is either listening or connecting to 0:08:10.000 --> 0:08:14.920 the to the words. But um, I I don't think 0:08:14.920 --> 0:08:19.239 I even have enough experience yet to really be able 0:08:19.280 --> 0:08:22.040 to think about, like, how are people going to receive it? Weirdly, 0:08:22.040 --> 0:08:24.280 because I've never I've never even played a show yet, 0:08:24.320 --> 0:08:26.520 so I don't even know what that like in person 0:08:26.600 --> 0:08:30.680 reception looks like. And and so I I'm sure my 0:08:30.840 --> 0:08:34.479 like answer would change in a year after shows are 0:08:34.520 --> 0:08:38.200 are up and running again hopefully, but um, you know, 0:08:38.240 --> 0:08:40.640 we'll see. When did you first know that music was 0:08:40.679 --> 0:08:42.640 a way that you wanted to express yourself and express 0:08:42.679 --> 0:08:47.959 these feelings? What was you remember? Your first song? Yeah, 0:08:48.040 --> 0:08:50.440 I mean it's so stupid, but I like I had 0:08:50.480 --> 0:08:53.920 been journaling for really the first song that I ever 0:08:53.960 --> 0:08:57.240 wrote was a result of losing my journal, which was 0:08:57.960 --> 0:09:02.320 my like everything, and I had only my first instrument 0:09:02.360 --> 0:09:05.280 was rock drums, So like, it's not even you can't 0:09:05.280 --> 0:09:08.440 really write a song over that. But I like managed 0:09:08.480 --> 0:09:11.360 and it was it was just like a pretty like brutal. 0:09:11.960 --> 0:09:14.320 I was kind of like resorting to songwriting because I 0:09:14.360 --> 0:09:18.000 lost what was incredibly important to me. So, yeah, what 0:09:18.040 --> 0:09:21.120 about you started journaling in the first place. Is It's 0:09:21.160 --> 0:09:22.920 always something I wish I was able to do, was 0:09:22.960 --> 0:09:25.080 more disciplined than doing but I've never been able to 0:09:27.520 --> 0:09:32.160 my Well, I I was kind of just like raised 0:09:32.240 --> 0:09:40.400 around um like people who loved poetry and storytelling, and 0:09:41.520 --> 0:09:47.720 I felt like someone that like I just wanted to 0:09:47.920 --> 0:09:50.400 document my I don't know why. I just really wanted 0:09:50.400 --> 0:09:53.080 to document my feelings I had. I think I liked 0:09:53.160 --> 0:09:55.480 the drama of it. I think I liked feeling like 0:09:55.559 --> 0:09:59.760 I had something secret, and I think um that once 0:09:59.800 --> 0:10:03.640 I started doing it, it really became like a safe space. 0:10:03.720 --> 0:10:06.280 And then that was kind of it. Like I still 0:10:06.320 --> 0:10:11.200 I mean, like I do not like leave this anywhere 0:10:11.280 --> 0:10:13.240 far away from me, Like it's always with me, and 0:10:13.280 --> 0:10:15.480 it makes me feel safe and it makes me feel 0:10:15.520 --> 0:10:17.960 like I have kind of like a touchstone of like 0:10:18.400 --> 0:10:21.080 different chapters of my life. And it's the most useful 0:10:21.120 --> 0:10:25.600 tool in my songwriting that I've found, so far besides 0:10:25.640 --> 0:10:28.520 like referencing people that I am incredibly close to or 0:10:28.559 --> 0:10:32.840 like have had you know, detailed conversations with about you know, 0:10:32.840 --> 0:10:34.520 stuff that sticks out to me because I just I 0:10:34.640 --> 0:10:46.719 just try to write everything down. What has it been 0:10:46.760 --> 0:10:51.480 like working with producers on these recent Bastlord songs, with 0:10:51.640 --> 0:10:53.240 songs that are so personal and it was that a 0:10:53.240 --> 0:10:55.920 big adjustment from working on them sort of privately in 0:10:55.960 --> 0:11:00.840 your room and putting them directly on on streaming platforms. Yeah. Originally, yes, 0:11:01.200 --> 0:11:04.480 um for sure. When it was like before I before 0:11:04.840 --> 0:11:08.679 I signed to Interscope, I was kind of when I 0:11:08.720 --> 0:11:11.600 was sixteen, I was allowed to have like my first 0:11:11.720 --> 0:11:15.360 meeting with um, you know, anyone from anywhere, and it 0:11:15.880 --> 0:11:19.200 was my parents are like super protective, but a very 0:11:19.320 --> 0:11:21.240 kind woman had reached out and I think they felt 0:11:21.240 --> 0:11:23.199 safer because she was a woman and they were not 0:11:23.280 --> 0:11:25.920 just like some like dude anyway, So I I had 0:11:25.960 --> 0:11:28.360 a meeting and she kind of helped. Originally when I 0:11:28.400 --> 0:11:32.160 was sixteen, hooked me up with like speed dating kind 0:11:32.160 --> 0:11:35.840 of like trial with different producers, and that was weird. 0:11:35.960 --> 0:11:41.920 But it also like interestingly, I didn't feel as strange 0:11:41.960 --> 0:11:45.520 as it does now because I didn't know, kind of 0:11:45.520 --> 0:11:47.960 like what I wanted to say as much as I 0:11:48.000 --> 0:11:50.600 do today. So I didn't really feel like I was 0:11:50.720 --> 0:11:54.839 entering every session with like the most extreme amount of vulnerability. 0:11:55.080 --> 0:11:57.000 And I feel that way now, which is why I 0:11:57.000 --> 0:12:00.640 feel really lucky to have kind of like met a 0:12:00.760 --> 0:12:03.679 handful of people that I love and trust entirely, and 0:12:03.720 --> 0:12:06.760 so it doesn't feel like there's a like they have 0:12:06.840 --> 0:12:10.160 walls up um And at the same time, like if 0:12:10.160 --> 0:12:14.640 I do feel scared for whatever reason to be vulnerable, 0:12:14.760 --> 0:12:17.760 it's like the power that I feel I have is 0:12:17.800 --> 0:12:20.960 to be able to be in my room alone and 0:12:21.000 --> 0:12:22.560 write a song and then bring it in and I 0:12:22.600 --> 0:12:27.240 don't feel like I'm working through the language and the 0:12:27.320 --> 0:12:29.960 vocabulary in front of them, where I'm like there's a 0:12:30.160 --> 0:12:33.280 you know, a clock running out and we have until 0:12:33.280 --> 0:12:35.880 eight pm, and like I don't. I think it's like 0:12:35.960 --> 0:12:40.800 the pressure to write is not something that I have 0:12:42.000 --> 0:12:45.040 I've been familiar with until this year, just like being 0:12:45.080 --> 0:12:47.760 signed to a label, knowing like what I need to 0:12:47.800 --> 0:12:51.960 deliver and also wanting to never release anything that doesn't 0:12:52.000 --> 0:12:56.280 feel true and honest. So it's like an interesting but 0:12:56.320 --> 0:12:57.920 it also doesn't really take up too much space. I 0:12:57.920 --> 0:13:01.160 feel really lucky to have such a supportive UM team 0:13:01.280 --> 0:13:04.440 around me and everyone is I feel lucky to be 0:13:04.600 --> 0:13:07.480 like working with them. So it's it's a it's a 0:13:07.520 --> 0:13:10.679 cool situation. Yeah, Now that you sort of closed the 0:13:10.679 --> 0:13:14.199 book on the on the minor chapter and process those emotions, 0:13:14.559 --> 0:13:16.440 what themes are you looking to touch on in your 0:13:16.679 --> 0:13:18.240 and your work that you're in the songs that you're 0:13:18.240 --> 0:13:24.240 working on Now, I think that I would not have 0:13:24.360 --> 0:13:32.880 been writing about the same stuff had COVID not happened, honestly, because, um, 0:13:32.920 --> 0:13:36.800 I'm like, I've only really ever been used to writing 0:13:36.840 --> 0:13:39.840 about what is in front of me, and like if 0:13:39.920 --> 0:13:42.320 I'm meeting someone new or if I'm going to a 0:13:42.320 --> 0:13:46.080 new place and kind of like experiencing things for the 0:13:46.120 --> 0:13:49.280 first time in some capacity like that is has always 0:13:49.280 --> 0:13:52.000 been attractive to me and kind of like writing about 0:13:52.000 --> 0:13:56.640 first experiences and feelings. Um, But now, because of how 0:13:57.920 --> 0:14:00.880 isolated we've all been and kind of like stuck in 0:14:00.920 --> 0:14:06.000 one place, I've been thinking back to the year that 0:14:06.040 --> 0:14:09.320 I lived in New York because that same year was 0:14:09.320 --> 0:14:14.200 was when I had my first like like real breakup 0:14:14.200 --> 0:14:16.720 and that's what miners about. But at the same time, 0:14:16.840 --> 0:14:22.720 like in hindsight, as important as that event was, like 0:14:22.840 --> 0:14:25.360 the year itself that I was there was filled with 0:14:25.440 --> 0:14:28.720 so much more life than just like you know, being 0:14:28.760 --> 0:14:30.680 sad at the end of the day and like you know, 0:14:30.800 --> 0:14:33.160 journaling about how much you might miss someone or how 0:14:33.200 --> 0:14:35.880 much you might hate them. It's like I met the 0:14:35.880 --> 0:14:39.120 most amazing people that year. I like had kind of 0:14:39.160 --> 0:14:42.120 my first experiences as as an adult, like not living 0:14:42.120 --> 0:14:45.280 at home and feeling that freedom is such a specific thing. 0:14:45.360 --> 0:14:49.960 And and so I'm kind of writing in with like 0:14:50.080 --> 0:14:53.960 a sense of nostalgia that I, um, I'm only now, 0:14:54.080 --> 0:14:57.040 like I think finally just barely old enough to be 0:14:57.120 --> 0:15:00.240 able to feel nostalgic about something, and it's just that 0:15:00.280 --> 0:15:05.160 city and and having had the opportunity to live there. Um, 0:15:05.200 --> 0:15:09.560 so I'm kind of exploring that at the moment. It's 0:15:09.560 --> 0:15:13.480 funny because I also went to school in New York 0:15:13.840 --> 0:15:17.200 and leaving a a sort of more suburban area, and 0:15:17.240 --> 0:15:20.400 I remember that that moment, and when you leave to 0:15:20.480 --> 0:15:22.360 go to New York, you could come back home. It 0:15:22.360 --> 0:15:25.560 could be three weeks later, and everything still feels so 0:15:25.680 --> 0:15:30.560 different being back home. It's just this huge dividing point 0:15:30.600 --> 0:15:32.440 in your life. And I know that sounds dramatic, but 0:15:32.480 --> 0:15:36.440 I remember feeling that too immediately. No, exactly it is. 0:15:36.480 --> 0:15:39.560 It's also interesting, like because I am I'm writing about 0:15:39.560 --> 0:15:40.760 this a lot to you and kind of trying to 0:15:40.760 --> 0:15:42.600 figure out how to say it because it is such 0:15:42.600 --> 0:15:46.360 a strange thing. But like, I love school so much. 0:15:46.400 --> 0:15:48.880 I never dropped out. I'm like technically on a leaf 0:15:48.920 --> 0:15:53.200 about since, but I I love it and the fact 0:15:53.280 --> 0:15:56.160 that like all of my best friends, all of my 0:15:56.320 --> 0:16:00.000 peers for the most part, are still there and I'm 0:16:00.120 --> 0:16:02.520 doing this thing that I love. But it is really different, 0:16:02.600 --> 0:16:04.680 Like it's not there's not a day to day like 0:16:05.240 --> 0:16:08.280 locked in schedule. It's like everything's up in the air, 0:16:08.360 --> 0:16:11.920 and you know, touring could have been a reality this year, 0:16:11.960 --> 0:16:14.160 but it will be next year, knock on wood, and 0:16:14.240 --> 0:16:17.960 like that is a whole other, like kind of experience 0:16:18.040 --> 0:16:21.560 that I can't necessarily like call my roommate from school 0:16:21.600 --> 0:16:23.920 and like be like over, you know, tell me how 0:16:23.960 --> 0:16:25.440 you got through that, because it's a new thing. I 0:16:25.480 --> 0:16:27.840 don't know. I just like so, I'm I'm kind of 0:16:28.440 --> 0:16:32.280 trying to figure out how to write about that, like separation, 0:16:32.400 --> 0:16:38.120 and that's been a super emotional part of of like 0:16:38.240 --> 0:16:40.240 doing music. At all in a great way and in 0:16:40.240 --> 0:16:43.760 a hard way. But it's it's, um, yeah, it's fascinating. 0:16:44.640 --> 0:16:47.920 And you're also at this moment on world tour, a 0:16:47.960 --> 0:16:49.840 very different kind of world tour. I mean, you're in 0:16:49.840 --> 0:16:52.160 a world tour in your bedroom. Tell me about how 0:16:52.200 --> 0:16:55.400 that's going. How are these digital concerts going. It's like 0:16:55.520 --> 0:16:59.400 the coolest thing I've ever done, I think because I 0:16:59.560 --> 0:17:04.840 having or played a show, um, and also being introverted, uh, 0:17:04.880 --> 0:17:09.800 and having like my entire like experience in terms of 0:17:09.800 --> 0:17:12.800 sharing music with people. It's been on Instagram except you 0:17:12.840 --> 0:17:16.119 know until this past year. But so I have like 0:17:16.760 --> 0:17:20.119 or had the worst stage fright ever, like I was. 0:17:20.400 --> 0:17:23.000 It made me yeah, yeah, like I thinking about it 0:17:23.080 --> 0:17:25.360 when I was younger, because I would think about it 0:17:25.560 --> 0:17:27.679 when I was writing songs in like middle school, in 0:17:27.720 --> 0:17:30.240 high school and whatever. Like I would sometimes think about 0:17:30.240 --> 0:17:32.560 it so hard that I would cry because it freaked 0:17:32.600 --> 0:17:34.240 me out. I was like, I don't want this thing 0:17:35.000 --> 0:17:38.920 to be the reason I can't pursue music, because it 0:17:39.000 --> 0:17:43.040 was like so debilitating and weird. Um. And yet that 0:17:43.119 --> 0:17:47.040 was clearly a spawn of like my crippling anxiety, like 0:17:47.160 --> 0:17:50.240 not being able to even I was basing that fear 0:17:50.280 --> 0:17:55.160 on nothing. But um so, these shows have been unbelievable 0:17:55.440 --> 0:18:00.919 because it's like the most dream me version of like 0:18:00.960 --> 0:18:03.439 a transition between playing stuff for no one in my 0:18:03.560 --> 0:18:06.440 room and playing things on a stage for people. It's 0:18:06.440 --> 0:18:08.040 like I am in my room, but I see their 0:18:08.080 --> 0:18:10.879 faces and their live reactions and we're talking throughout the show, 0:18:10.920 --> 0:18:15.160 and it's like crazy. It's like a really weird thing 0:18:15.240 --> 0:18:18.600 that's like possible and like manageable and amazing. And so 0:18:18.840 --> 0:18:22.560 I'm now just like revved up and excited for shows. 0:18:22.800 --> 0:18:26.160 Um So, I can't believe that, like that's the thing 0:18:26.200 --> 0:18:30.000 that we can do today. But it's amazing. Yeah, it 0:18:30.040 --> 0:18:33.359 has to be so surreal being in the very place 0:18:33.400 --> 0:18:35.320 in your bedroom where you would you know, write these 0:18:35.359 --> 0:18:40.280 songs years ago. It must be so just that juxtaposition 0:18:40.400 --> 0:18:43.040 of being sort of where it began and also performing 0:18:43.080 --> 0:18:44.760 for people and being sort of where you want to be. 0:18:44.840 --> 0:18:48.119 That must be really incredible. It's cool. It's like I 0:18:49.080 --> 0:18:52.640 was nervous for the first like two or three shows, 0:18:52.680 --> 0:18:58.479 and then I I kind of realized how comfortable I 0:18:58.600 --> 0:19:02.479 was not because of like just the ability to like 0:19:02.680 --> 0:19:05.800 sing in front of people, which was a new discovery. 0:19:05.880 --> 0:19:09.480 But like I know so many of the faces that 0:19:09.520 --> 0:19:12.800 were at these shows because of how many years I've 0:19:12.800 --> 0:19:14.960 been interacting with a lot of these people all over 0:19:15.480 --> 0:19:19.040 the place, and like that's a crazy thing in and 0:19:19.080 --> 0:19:22.520 of itself, but like I feel like a really strong 0:19:22.600 --> 0:19:26.320 sense of community with the people that for some reason 0:19:26.400 --> 0:19:28.679 listen to my music. Like it's like it's a really 0:19:29.080 --> 0:19:32.360 um special thing that like they've allowed me to have. 0:19:32.480 --> 0:19:37.959 And especially during the pandemic, Like the most amount of 0:19:37.960 --> 0:19:40.400 faces that I've seen at one time where have been 0:19:40.480 --> 0:19:43.600 during these shows, Like and it feels it's like it's 0:19:43.760 --> 0:19:46.760 really it's like serotonin. I'm like I can get through 0:19:46.840 --> 0:19:49.679 the following month because I just got to have a 0:19:49.680 --> 0:19:52.919 conversation with like a hundred fifty people and it was 0:19:52.960 --> 0:19:55.399 weird and funny and like they're in Germany, but like 0:19:55.440 --> 0:19:57.600 it was so fucking fun and like it was amazing. 0:19:57.640 --> 0:20:00.879 It's just like the best. So I'm I love it 0:20:00.960 --> 0:20:03.679 more than anything. Well music for you, it seems to 0:20:03.680 --> 0:20:06.000 have always been I have this element of social media 0:20:06.040 --> 0:20:08.080 to it, as you said, putting songs on Instagram and 0:20:08.119 --> 0:20:10.840 also back in like SoundCloud. It wasn't just a way 0:20:10.880 --> 0:20:13.119 to listen to music. It was a way to connect 0:20:13.160 --> 0:20:15.159 and almost have a dialogue with the audience, how you 0:20:15.200 --> 0:20:18.359 could comment on specific points in the song and SoundCloud 0:20:18.400 --> 0:20:20.359 to tell me more about like just sort of the 0:20:20.760 --> 0:20:24.640 funny blend of of social media and music for you, Well, 0:20:24.680 --> 0:20:27.520 I mean it like is you said, but like yeah, 0:20:27.520 --> 0:20:31.080 so I wasn't allowed to have social media in middle 0:20:31.160 --> 0:20:33.640 school when everyone else was getting it for the first time, 0:20:33.680 --> 0:20:37.439 and I felt, uh kind of like a bit of 0:20:37.440 --> 0:20:40.159 an outsider obviously, being like in sixth grade and like 0:20:40.200 --> 0:20:46.400 insecure already, and my uh just like I was, I 0:20:46.440 --> 0:20:49.440 was using the internet to discover new music anyway, found 0:20:49.480 --> 0:20:52.760 SoundCloud and and just like kind of went off there 0:20:52.800 --> 0:20:55.480 and was one of the people that was commenting like 0:20:55.920 --> 0:20:58.440 four times a song at like every section that made 0:20:58.440 --> 0:21:01.080 me emotional, and then like reply to people's comments who 0:21:01.200 --> 0:21:03.879 also felt the same. And so I was like really 0:21:03.920 --> 0:21:06.639 interacting with people there. And then by the time I 0:21:06.880 --> 0:21:10.640 got on Instagram, it was like just a really obvious 0:21:11.320 --> 0:21:14.160 kind of like bridge. I was like I'm already posting, 0:21:15.800 --> 0:21:17.680 you know, like this is like this is how I'm 0:21:17.800 --> 0:21:21.320 I'm comfortable using the internet is to share music and 0:21:21.359 --> 0:21:25.040 to to do it that way, and um, so it 0:21:25.200 --> 0:21:29.200 felt it felt obvious to me and at the same time, 0:21:29.320 --> 0:21:32.480 like it's an interesting instinct, I guess, to be able 0:21:32.480 --> 0:21:36.200 to like hit a button and then walk away from 0:21:36.280 --> 0:21:39.480 your computer and like not be scared, despite the fact 0:21:39.480 --> 0:21:42.119 that like that lives forever versus like a live show, 0:21:43.840 --> 0:21:46.119 you know, if people aren't documenting it is there for 0:21:46.440 --> 0:21:48.480 you know, an hour and then never again. So I 0:21:48.520 --> 0:21:52.440 don't know what my psychology is behind that, but um, 0:21:52.480 --> 0:21:55.639 that's that's how I started posting stuff anywhere. Did you 0:21:55.720 --> 0:21:58.080 ever use their comments to sort of refine your songs, 0:21:58.200 --> 0:22:00.760 refine track lists or anything like that? Is it is 0:22:00.760 --> 0:22:05.000 almost like a collaborative process. I wouldn't stay on I honestly, 0:22:05.160 --> 0:22:08.240 I don't spend too much time on SoundCloud anymore. Sadly, 0:22:08.359 --> 0:22:13.600 Like I think my because of like the community that 0:22:13.720 --> 0:22:18.040 I've found on Instagram, Like I feel really personally connected 0:22:18.080 --> 0:22:21.840 to all of them, um, and so I probably should 0:22:22.640 --> 0:22:26.200 read comments elsewhere, but I definitely feel like a sense 0:22:26.240 --> 0:22:28.520 of like it is a bit of a collaborative process 0:22:28.560 --> 0:22:31.280 with strangers. It's cool being able to test out clips 0:22:31.280 --> 0:22:34.439 of songs on Instagram too and see like how is 0:22:34.480 --> 0:22:38.359