1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:04,680 Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 2 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:09,080 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 3 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,079 Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A 4 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:25,880 Speaker 1: production of I Heart Radio. Hello, welcome back to the show. 5 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:28,240 Speaker 1: My name is Matt, my name is no. They called 6 00:00:28,280 --> 00:00:31,720 Speaker 1: me Ben. We're joined as always with our super producer Paul. 7 00:00:31,800 --> 00:00:36,120 Speaker 1: Mission Control deconds. Most importantly, you are you, You are here, 8 00:00:36,440 --> 00:00:39,919 Speaker 1: and that makes this stuff they don't want you to know. 9 00:00:40,360 --> 00:00:43,720 Speaker 1: This episode has been a long time in the making, folks. 10 00:00:43,720 --> 00:00:46,120 Speaker 1: It's it's been a long road to get here. Uh. 11 00:00:46,720 --> 00:00:49,640 Speaker 1: I think all of us h Matt Nole, Mission Control 12 00:00:49,760 --> 00:00:54,360 Speaker 1: myself have been a big fan of Jake Hanrahan's work 13 00:00:54,440 --> 00:00:58,760 Speaker 1: in conflict journalism, where he often risked life and limb 14 00:00:59,000 --> 00:01:02,320 Speaker 1: to shed light on worries and conflicts that are rarely 15 00:01:02,440 --> 00:01:07,400 Speaker 1: reported at all in the Western world, much less reported objectively. 16 00:01:07,720 --> 00:01:10,360 Speaker 1: That's been the case for a long time. Additionally, Jake 17 00:01:10,440 --> 00:01:12,880 Speaker 1: is a filmmaker. You've seen him on Vice, You've seen 18 00:01:12,959 --> 00:01:17,319 Speaker 1: him on HBO, pro PUBLICA, Belling Cat, BBC News. The 19 00:01:17,360 --> 00:01:22,480 Speaker 1: list goes on. One personal favorite is Popular Front, grassroots 20 00:01:22,480 --> 00:01:27,360 Speaker 1: investigative organization Jake founded back in eighteen. And if you 21 00:01:27,360 --> 00:01:29,920 Speaker 1: were trying, if you read the headline of this episode 22 00:01:29,920 --> 00:01:31,520 Speaker 1: and you're trying to figure out what the hell is 23 00:01:31,520 --> 00:01:34,520 Speaker 1: going on with Q and On, well, Jake is your man. 24 00:01:35,160 --> 00:01:37,960 Speaker 1: We have no hyperbole, A thousand questions for you, Jake. 25 00:01:38,000 --> 00:01:39,679 Speaker 1: I don't think we're going to get to them all. 26 00:01:39,720 --> 00:01:42,479 Speaker 1: But first things first, thank you so much for coming 27 00:01:42,480 --> 00:01:45,000 Speaker 1: on the show today. No mate, Like I said earlier, 28 00:01:45,000 --> 00:01:46,800 Speaker 1: like this has been my favorite podcast since it was 29 00:01:46,840 --> 00:01:51,840 Speaker 1: about twenty two. Yeah, I'm really happy to be well, 30 00:01:51,880 --> 00:01:56,160 Speaker 1: the feeling is mutual. Q andn Pot is mind blowing. 31 00:01:56,240 --> 00:02:00,680 Speaker 1: Lee excellent and such a tangled web ravel and you 32 00:02:00,800 --> 00:02:03,000 Speaker 1: do a fine job. And that's only three episodes in 33 00:02:03,120 --> 00:02:06,680 Speaker 1: and I just can't wait for what's to come. Yeah, 34 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:11,959 Speaker 1: I don't know what is to come yet. But let's 35 00:02:11,960 --> 00:02:15,919 Speaker 1: start with a question about location. So, your career as 36 00:02:15,960 --> 00:02:19,320 Speaker 1: a war reporter has taken you across the world to 37 00:02:19,360 --> 00:02:21,560 Speaker 1: a lot of places that wouldn't be considered you know, 38 00:02:21,919 --> 00:02:26,200 Speaker 1: top ten tourist destinations to say the least, and you've 39 00:02:26,240 --> 00:02:30,160 Speaker 1: been uh, you've worked in Syria and Palestine, from Prue 40 00:02:30,200 --> 00:02:32,720 Speaker 1: to Rock to Ukraine, as well as Turkey, which we 41 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:36,440 Speaker 1: must explore in depth. In today's show, The first question 42 00:02:36,480 --> 00:02:38,400 Speaker 1: I think a lot of people are gonna have listening 43 00:02:38,480 --> 00:02:41,840 Speaker 1: today is what inspired you to take this career path 44 00:02:41,960 --> 00:02:47,279 Speaker 1: and what was your first actual conflict reporting experience. Like, um, 45 00:02:47,639 --> 00:02:50,320 Speaker 1: that's a good question. I mean I'm not good at 46 00:02:50,360 --> 00:02:52,880 Speaker 1: that many things, and I didn't do well at school. 47 00:02:52,880 --> 00:02:54,960 Speaker 1: Like school was definitely not a thing I was good at. 48 00:02:55,520 --> 00:02:57,840 Speaker 1: And I just like, you know, left when I was 49 00:02:57,880 --> 00:03:00,280 Speaker 1: like sixteen, didn't do college or anything. But the only 50 00:03:00,320 --> 00:03:03,239 Speaker 1: thing I was always like keenon was reading, right, So 51 00:03:03,280 --> 00:03:05,520 Speaker 1: I was always reading. I remember my granddad was just 52 00:03:05,520 --> 00:03:07,840 Speaker 1: saying to me, like, look, if you just read, you 53 00:03:07,840 --> 00:03:10,200 Speaker 1: can teach yourself so much, which is true, right. So 54 00:03:10,240 --> 00:03:13,080 Speaker 1: I've just always been a good, like big reader. And 55 00:03:13,120 --> 00:03:15,520 Speaker 1: then I just thought, right, you know, I can write. 56 00:03:15,560 --> 00:03:17,080 Speaker 1: So I started off as kind of like, you know, 57 00:03:17,200 --> 00:03:20,160 Speaker 1: experimenting with print journalism and you know, I'll do these 58 00:03:20,280 --> 00:03:22,120 Speaker 1: articles and that, and I just thought, yeah, why not, 59 00:03:22,200 --> 00:03:24,760 Speaker 1: Like I can try this. But at the time I 60 00:03:24,840 --> 00:03:27,560 Speaker 1: was a bit like, oh, you know, someone like me 61 00:03:27,760 --> 00:03:30,160 Speaker 1: can't do this, you know, kind of I didn't really 62 00:03:30,200 --> 00:03:32,480 Speaker 1: have a good perception of what journalism was other than 63 00:03:32,520 --> 00:03:34,400 Speaker 1: like the guy on the news with the tie, right. 64 00:03:34,960 --> 00:03:37,400 Speaker 1: But then as I read more and like read these 65 00:03:37,440 --> 00:03:40,880 Speaker 1: books specifically by a journalist that will you know, embedded 66 00:03:40,920 --> 00:03:43,920 Speaker 1: with militant groups and whatever, I was like, yeah, like 67 00:03:43,960 --> 00:03:45,880 Speaker 1: I want to do that. I've always been drawn to 68 00:03:46,040 --> 00:03:48,960 Speaker 1: kind of like the dark things, if you know what 69 00:03:49,000 --> 00:03:52,600 Speaker 1: I mean, whether that's like crime or or conflict or whatever. 70 00:03:52,760 --> 00:03:56,160 Speaker 1: So for me, I just I remember like reading articles 71 00:03:56,160 --> 00:03:58,480 Speaker 1: and reading books by like the journalists and just like 72 00:03:58,720 --> 00:04:00,400 Speaker 1: blew my hair back, you know. I mean I was 73 00:04:00,440 --> 00:04:03,080 Speaker 1: like this is amazing, Like this is real and these 74 00:04:03,120 --> 00:04:06,720 Speaker 1: guys actually went there. So like long story short, I 75 00:04:06,800 --> 00:04:08,840 Speaker 1: was just you know, pushing away. And I guess when 76 00:04:08,880 --> 00:04:12,240 Speaker 1: I started advice, I was kind of already reporting on 77 00:04:12,280 --> 00:04:16,200 Speaker 1: conflict stuff, and eventually I ended up in Man what 78 00:04:16,360 --> 00:04:18,559 Speaker 1: like I was like twenty four. I think the first 79 00:04:18,600 --> 00:04:22,080 Speaker 1: front line I went to was Iraq when like Isis 80 00:04:22,120 --> 00:04:25,080 Speaker 1: were still in most so that was cool and honestly, 81 00:04:25,120 --> 00:04:27,600 Speaker 1: like it wasn't. It was like pretty chill, like you know, 82 00:04:27,640 --> 00:04:29,760 Speaker 1: there wasn't much going on at the time. It wasn't 83 00:04:29,800 --> 00:04:32,120 Speaker 1: what you think, like I just like hanging out with 84 00:04:32,160 --> 00:04:35,279 Speaker 1: the like like soldiers and that. But then like I 85 00:04:35,320 --> 00:04:38,680 Speaker 1: think the big like first big one was like Southeast Turkey. 86 00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:40,640 Speaker 1: You know, like we mentioned a little bit like that 87 00:04:40,720 --> 00:04:44,000 Speaker 1: was like an urban combat, you know, situation where the 88 00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:46,600 Speaker 1: front line is the street, you know, where where the 89 00:04:46,720 --> 00:04:49,800 Speaker 1: corner shop and where people live. So I guess like 90 00:04:49,960 --> 00:04:53,160 Speaker 1: I just I just got a real hunger for it, 91 00:04:53,240 --> 00:04:56,119 Speaker 1: and I felt like I understood it on some level, 92 00:04:56,160 --> 00:04:58,480 Speaker 1: you know, like I feel like I'm that's good at 93 00:04:59,240 --> 00:05:01,320 Speaker 1: you know, talking to of people, you know. I mean 94 00:05:01,360 --> 00:05:03,200 Speaker 1: I don't know what round is, I don't know what 95 00:05:03,320 --> 00:05:05,760 Speaker 1: gun this is, I don't know munitions that is. That 96 00:05:05,520 --> 00:05:07,760 Speaker 1: that to me is not that interesting for me. It's 97 00:05:07,800 --> 00:05:10,159 Speaker 1: like how did these people end up just being normal 98 00:05:10,200 --> 00:05:12,760 Speaker 1: people and then something happens in their lives and they 99 00:05:12,839 --> 00:05:14,919 Speaker 1: kind of have to take up arms? You know. That 100 00:05:15,000 --> 00:05:17,000 Speaker 1: to me has always been really interesting. So yeah, man, 101 00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:20,000 Speaker 1: I just think for me, the fun parts of the war, 102 00:05:20,120 --> 00:05:21,640 Speaker 1: I don't want to say fun is if like, oh, yeah, 103 00:05:21,640 --> 00:05:23,120 Speaker 1: it's a game, you know what I mean. But the 104 00:05:23,120 --> 00:05:26,040 Speaker 1: bits that I enjoy with my job is kind of 105 00:05:26,080 --> 00:05:28,279 Speaker 1: just meeting people you would never normally meet and seeing 106 00:05:28,279 --> 00:05:31,080 Speaker 1: them kind of in these situations and trying to tell 107 00:05:31,480 --> 00:05:33,520 Speaker 1: their story, you know, like why are they there? How 108 00:05:33,560 --> 00:05:36,560 Speaker 1: did this happen? And when they trust you, and so yeah, 109 00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:38,920 Speaker 1: like you know this, this and this. I think that's cool, man, 110 00:05:38,960 --> 00:05:41,679 Speaker 1: it's good fun. I think it's interesting too, like how 111 00:05:41,760 --> 00:05:45,920 Speaker 1: quickly our brains kind of normalize things that are completely insane. Uh, 112 00:05:46,000 --> 00:05:48,000 Speaker 1: And when you're in a situation like that where it's 113 00:05:48,040 --> 00:05:51,919 Speaker 1: literally on your street, in your neighborhood, and yeah, it's terrifying, 114 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:55,719 Speaker 1: but people live. And like, that's to me an interesting 115 00:05:55,800 --> 00:05:58,159 Speaker 1: part of what it must be like for you to 116 00:05:58,279 --> 00:06:01,080 Speaker 1: just be around people as they're living, as they're living 117 00:06:01,080 --> 00:06:03,640 Speaker 1: through these things, but also not like living in abject 118 00:06:03,760 --> 00:06:07,520 Speaker 1: terror twenty four seven. I could imagine maybe I'm overthinking it, 119 00:06:07,600 --> 00:06:09,760 Speaker 1: but no, you're right, it's like that is for me 120 00:06:09,800 --> 00:06:11,919 Speaker 1: as well. Like one of the most fascinating things, like 121 00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:15,000 Speaker 1: I remember kind of a scene in southeast Turkey with 122 00:06:15,040 --> 00:06:18,600 Speaker 1: the Kurdish like youth militants and they're all teenagers and 123 00:06:18,640 --> 00:06:20,680 Speaker 1: we kind of stopped after there was like a bit 124 00:06:20,680 --> 00:06:24,080 Speaker 1: of a firefight, like Turkish military of firing into the 125 00:06:24,160 --> 00:06:27,040 Speaker 1: village from up on some mountains, and then after it 126 00:06:27,120 --> 00:06:29,560 Speaker 1: kind of died down, we just sat there like on 127 00:06:29,600 --> 00:06:31,400 Speaker 1: a you know, on the ground, and these kids were 128 00:06:31,400 --> 00:06:34,880 Speaker 1: like eating, like pouring out coke, like you know, like drinks, 129 00:06:35,040 --> 00:06:36,640 Speaker 1: like do you want this? And then these one kid 130 00:06:36,680 --> 00:06:38,760 Speaker 1: was just playing on his phone with an a case 131 00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:41,599 Speaker 1: slung over his shoulder. I remember just thinking like wow, 132 00:06:41,839 --> 00:06:44,160 Speaker 1: like this is just surreal, you know what I mean. 133 00:06:44,240 --> 00:06:46,600 Speaker 1: So that to me has always been fascinating to kind 134 00:06:46,640 --> 00:06:49,280 Speaker 1: of you know, people get a really dumb idea. They 135 00:06:49,279 --> 00:06:51,720 Speaker 1: think people live constantly in war, and it's like, no, man, 136 00:06:51,760 --> 00:06:53,360 Speaker 1: they're just like you and me. They just want to live. 137 00:06:53,400 --> 00:06:55,760 Speaker 1: And unfortunately, you know, it's on their doorstep a lot 138 00:06:55,640 --> 00:06:58,800 Speaker 1: at the time. Even to all these places where there's 139 00:06:58,839 --> 00:07:03,360 Speaker 1: been real danger to the people living there every day 140 00:07:03,400 --> 00:07:05,360 Speaker 1: of you know, of their lives. They like you say, 141 00:07:05,440 --> 00:07:09,080 Speaker 1: they get into this what is hopefully a temporary situation 142 00:07:09,600 --> 00:07:13,040 Speaker 1: where something must be dealt with, and there is conflict 143 00:07:13,040 --> 00:07:15,800 Speaker 1: that is violent. Um, so there's a real danger to 144 00:07:15,840 --> 00:07:19,080 Speaker 1: those human beings that are there. To put yourself in 145 00:07:19,200 --> 00:07:23,360 Speaker 1: that situation, whether for a job or by your own volition, 146 00:07:24,080 --> 00:07:26,360 Speaker 1: to to put yourself there and to go and talk 147 00:07:26,400 --> 00:07:31,080 Speaker 1: to somebody that maybe in opposition to a government or 148 00:07:31,120 --> 00:07:35,640 Speaker 1: in opposition to some other armed force, that feels like 149 00:07:35,800 --> 00:07:39,200 Speaker 1: a a very scary thing and a very dangerous thing 150 00:07:39,240 --> 00:07:42,160 Speaker 1: to do. But also, as you know, if you've listened 151 00:07:42,200 --> 00:07:44,320 Speaker 1: to the show, you you know that we think that's 152 00:07:44,360 --> 00:07:48,600 Speaker 1: a very important thing to do. And I wonder, well, well, 153 00:07:48,640 --> 00:07:50,200 Speaker 1: I I know the answer to this question. I don't 154 00:07:50,200 --> 00:07:51,960 Speaker 1: mean to pose it as though I don't, but what 155 00:07:52,120 --> 00:07:55,200 Speaker 1: is the what is the most harrowing situation you have 156 00:07:55,280 --> 00:07:58,760 Speaker 1: found yourself in because of your job and what you do? 157 00:08:00,040 --> 00:08:01,840 Speaker 1: Really like my grandma going mad at me when she 158 00:08:01,880 --> 00:08:03,960 Speaker 1: found out I was in Syria, like you know what 159 00:08:04,040 --> 00:08:10,560 Speaker 1: I mean. But then well I just got back and 160 00:08:10,680 --> 00:08:12,680 Speaker 1: was like, no, I wasn't in Iraq. I was in Syria, 161 00:08:13,520 --> 00:08:17,120 Speaker 1: but now they're like, yeah, going to jail in Turkey 162 00:08:17,120 --> 00:08:19,600 Speaker 1: Man definitely was like the biggest issue. Like that was 163 00:08:19,680 --> 00:08:22,640 Speaker 1: just like oh dear, like oder, oh dear. I was 164 00:08:22,640 --> 00:08:25,600 Speaker 1: just thinking, like I knew I was my luck would 165 00:08:25,680 --> 00:08:27,480 Speaker 1: run out, you know, like I knew it was going 166 00:08:27,560 --> 00:08:29,080 Speaker 1: to run out, and then it really did, and I 167 00:08:29,120 --> 00:08:32,440 Speaker 1: was like, oh Christ. But at the same time, it 168 00:08:32,480 --> 00:08:35,880 Speaker 1: taught me some really valuable lessons about freedom and also 169 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:39,480 Speaker 1: taught me how the people like the I guess the 170 00:08:39,600 --> 00:08:44,400 Speaker 1: ultimate um like threat to these people that I was 171 00:08:44,440 --> 00:08:46,440 Speaker 1: filming with, right, you know, Like I remember after I 172 00:08:46,480 --> 00:08:50,360 Speaker 1: got out. I speak to some you know, Kurdish people, um, 173 00:08:50,400 --> 00:08:52,480 Speaker 1: and they were like, now you know how we feel, 174 00:08:52,920 --> 00:08:56,480 Speaker 1: you know, And I was like, yeah, yeah, actually, And 175 00:08:56,679 --> 00:08:58,880 Speaker 1: so in a way it was good experience just in 176 00:08:58,960 --> 00:09:01,440 Speaker 1: terms of like life experience, and it kind of shaped 177 00:09:01,679 --> 00:09:03,800 Speaker 1: my worldview a little bit more. But certainly at the 178 00:09:03,840 --> 00:09:06,319 Speaker 1: time I didn't think that at all. I was like, 179 00:09:06,440 --> 00:09:09,040 Speaker 1: what have you done? You know? So it wasn't good. No, 180 00:09:10,640 --> 00:09:16,000 Speaker 1: So this is um for folks who are unaware. We're 181 00:09:16,040 --> 00:09:20,840 Speaker 1: talking about a situation that occurred in twenty fifteen when JQ, 182 00:09:20,920 --> 00:09:25,600 Speaker 1: you and your colleagues Philip Pendleburry and Mohammed russeul Uh 183 00:09:25,679 --> 00:09:29,600 Speaker 1: and a rocky Kurdish journalists were detained by the government. 184 00:09:29,640 --> 00:09:32,679 Speaker 1: But oddly enough, if I understand this correctly, you were 185 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:36,200 Speaker 1: detained when you returned, right because you were gone to 186 00:09:36,320 --> 00:09:40,240 Speaker 1: Turkey previously. That's right. Yeah, yeah, that is right. We've 187 00:09:40,240 --> 00:09:43,880 Speaker 1: been there twice before filming. But you've gotta you've gotta understand, 188 00:09:43,880 --> 00:09:46,839 Speaker 1: like before when we were filming, the government wasn't as 189 00:09:46,880 --> 00:09:49,559 Speaker 1: restrictive as it is now, right, I mean, I mean 190 00:09:49,600 --> 00:09:51,920 Speaker 1: that's not biased. That's a pure fact. It's like the 191 00:09:52,000 --> 00:09:55,200 Speaker 1: Second Jail of journalists worldwide. You can go to prison 192 00:09:55,240 --> 00:09:57,600 Speaker 1: for saying something bad about the government on Twitter. You know, 193 00:09:57,640 --> 00:10:00,800 Speaker 1: it's crazy. So when we were firs stay, it actually 194 00:10:00,880 --> 00:10:03,160 Speaker 1: wasn't like that. You know, there was a ceasefire between 195 00:10:03,160 --> 00:10:06,400 Speaker 1: the Kurdish militants and the government, and it was it 196 00:10:06,520 --> 00:10:09,000 Speaker 1: was dicey, but it wasn't as bad, right, And then 197 00:10:09,080 --> 00:10:12,360 Speaker 1: when we were there the third time, that's when the 198 00:10:12,400 --> 00:10:15,320 Speaker 1: ceasefire was very over. You know, it was open warfare 199 00:10:15,320 --> 00:10:19,480 Speaker 1: in the streets and in the southeast, and we were 200 00:10:19,559 --> 00:10:21,560 Speaker 1: kind of the first to get swept up like that. 201 00:10:21,600 --> 00:10:23,640 Speaker 1: You know, like a lot of journalists after that started 202 00:10:23,640 --> 00:10:28,280 Speaker 1: getting arrested, deported, hundreds of like local Kurdish reporters just 203 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:31,960 Speaker 1: completely gone, you know, all in prison, MPs, everything. But 204 00:10:32,040 --> 00:10:33,760 Speaker 1: we were kind of at the start of that, you know, 205 00:10:33,920 --> 00:10:36,079 Speaker 1: so whilst it might be like, well, yeah, of course 206 00:10:36,080 --> 00:10:37,760 Speaker 1: you were going to get rested, just like actually if 207 00:10:37,800 --> 00:10:40,280 Speaker 1: you look at the you know, the context of what 208 00:10:40,360 --> 00:10:42,800 Speaker 1: was going on at the time, no, like they could 209 00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:44,840 Speaker 1: have easily just deported us at the airport because we'd 210 00:10:44,840 --> 00:10:47,400 Speaker 1: already made a film with these Kurdish militants one time before, 211 00:10:47,720 --> 00:10:49,280 Speaker 1: so they could have just been like not get out here. 212 00:10:49,320 --> 00:10:51,160 Speaker 1: It wasn't that at the time, right, It was kind 213 00:10:51,200 --> 00:10:54,400 Speaker 1: of the start of the I mean, like you know, 214 00:10:54,480 --> 00:10:58,959 Speaker 1: the brutal authoritarianism wasn't quite there as it started. We 215 00:10:58,960 --> 00:11:00,800 Speaker 1: were kind of lucky because there are people that have 216 00:11:00,880 --> 00:11:03,360 Speaker 1: done like two years, you know, just we just they 217 00:11:03,400 --> 00:11:06,680 Speaker 1: just kind of let us out after like two weeks um, 218 00:11:06,800 --> 00:11:08,839 Speaker 1: after being in several different prisons. There was a lot 219 00:11:08,840 --> 00:11:12,360 Speaker 1: of like international pressure, and you know, I think they 220 00:11:12,360 --> 00:11:14,959 Speaker 1: were like, you know, like just get them out of here, 221 00:11:14,960 --> 00:11:17,800 Speaker 1: this sort of thing. I could certainly tell in the jail, 222 00:11:17,880 --> 00:11:20,480 Speaker 1: like one time the guard was like, you know, they 223 00:11:20,480 --> 00:11:24,080 Speaker 1: were like not that nice, and then after it was 224 00:11:24,120 --> 00:11:27,040 Speaker 1: on TV, they were like much nicer. All of a sudden, 225 00:11:27,040 --> 00:11:30,240 Speaker 1: they were like well right, And I was like, so 226 00:11:30,480 --> 00:11:32,960 Speaker 1: that did kind of help. Actually, you know, it really did. 227 00:11:33,640 --> 00:11:37,000 Speaker 1: At the time. You're working for Vice News, correct, that's right. Yeah, 228 00:11:37,120 --> 00:11:41,199 Speaker 1: So how much help did you get from that organization 229 00:11:41,640 --> 00:11:43,240 Speaker 1: or how much perceived help did you get from the 230 00:11:43,360 --> 00:11:46,040 Speaker 1: organization when you're in that situation? To be honest, a 231 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:48,600 Speaker 1: Vice at the time where like excellent, they helped us 232 00:11:48,640 --> 00:11:51,160 Speaker 1: so much, you know, And there's a lot of issues 233 00:11:51,240 --> 00:11:55,240 Speaker 1: within journalism, specifically around conflict like al Jazer were in 234 00:11:55,360 --> 00:11:57,800 Speaker 1: hot water. The way they allegedly treated some of their 235 00:11:57,840 --> 00:12:00,240 Speaker 1: reports when they went to prison not so or in 236 00:12:00,240 --> 00:12:03,199 Speaker 1: them enough. But there's there's a few cases actually with 237 00:12:03,240 --> 00:12:05,920 Speaker 1: different news organizations. But honestly, like I can't fold Vice 238 00:12:05,920 --> 00:12:07,800 Speaker 1: News enough, like you know, I don't really get on 239 00:12:07,840 --> 00:12:10,320 Speaker 1: with them now. But what they did for us then 240 00:12:10,960 --> 00:12:12,560 Speaker 1: it was a different Vice News then. But what they 241 00:12:12,600 --> 00:12:15,560 Speaker 1: did for us then, like they did everything and more, 242 00:12:15,760 --> 00:12:17,800 Speaker 1: you know what I mean. Like and to this day 243 00:12:17,800 --> 00:12:20,320 Speaker 1: there's still like looking after certain things because the case 244 00:12:20,400 --> 00:12:25,400 Speaker 1: is still ongoing, believe it or not, like five years later. Yeah, 245 00:12:24,080 --> 00:12:28,920 Speaker 1: it's this brings us to I think a macro trend. 246 00:12:29,080 --> 00:12:32,800 Speaker 1: So according to the Committee to Protect Journalists, Uh, they 247 00:12:33,160 --> 00:12:37,680 Speaker 1: issued a report back in early December twenty nineteen where 248 00:12:37,679 --> 00:12:41,320 Speaker 1: they said, the way they phrased it was over twenty nineteen, 249 00:12:41,400 --> 00:12:44,240 Speaker 1: at least two hundred and fifty journalists across the planet 250 00:12:44,480 --> 00:12:47,920 Speaker 1: have been imprisoned somewhere for their reporting. And they also 251 00:12:47,960 --> 00:12:51,680 Speaker 1: said this is the fourth straight year that number has 252 00:12:51,720 --> 00:12:55,120 Speaker 1: been that high. So it goes of course without saying 253 00:12:55,200 --> 00:12:58,240 Speaker 1: for a lot of our US listeners a restaurant the 254 00:12:58,320 --> 00:13:01,720 Speaker 1: rise in the US as well Jake, do you see 255 00:13:01,720 --> 00:13:06,160 Speaker 1: this trend increasing in the future, and if so, why 256 00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:10,560 Speaker 1: I do? And I don't know why specifically, but my 257 00:13:10,880 --> 00:13:15,080 Speaker 1: own theory is that we're kind of this whole post 258 00:13:15,120 --> 00:13:17,760 Speaker 1: truth world idea, Like it is kind of real, you know, 259 00:13:17,960 --> 00:13:20,840 Speaker 1: I am really seeing it where things that used to 260 00:13:20,880 --> 00:13:24,720 Speaker 1: matter don't really matter anymore, right, Like, to be honest, 261 00:13:25,480 --> 00:13:27,120 Speaker 1: I've looked at report. I did a lot of research 262 00:13:27,160 --> 00:13:28,400 Speaker 1: on this when I got out of prison, because I 263 00:13:28,440 --> 00:13:30,560 Speaker 1: wanted to think, like, how can I help other journalists 264 00:13:30,559 --> 00:13:32,520 Speaker 1: to end up in prison in the future, right And 265 00:13:32,559 --> 00:13:34,679 Speaker 1: if you look at like the nineties and whatever, if 266 00:13:34,679 --> 00:13:37,600 Speaker 1: the journalists went to prison, it was a big deal, 267 00:13:37,880 --> 00:13:40,520 Speaker 1: like in whichever country they're from, right like, and people 268 00:13:40,520 --> 00:13:43,600 Speaker 1: were like, wow, they were outraged. Honestly, Now like people 269 00:13:44,840 --> 00:13:47,120 Speaker 1: just kind of like, you know, oh, that's bad tweet, 270 00:13:47,280 --> 00:13:49,880 Speaker 1: you know, done, and it's it's things don't have the 271 00:13:49,960 --> 00:13:53,280 Speaker 1: same cultural impact anymore. And I think I think social 272 00:13:53,320 --> 00:13:54,559 Speaker 1: media is a lot to do with it. I think 273 00:13:54,559 --> 00:13:56,160 Speaker 1: technology has a lot to do with it. And I 274 00:13:56,160 --> 00:13:59,320 Speaker 1: think the whole like post truth thing is a problem. 275 00:13:59,360 --> 00:14:01,720 Speaker 1: You know, the rise of kind of right wing populism 276 00:14:01,760 --> 00:14:04,840 Speaker 1: where things can just be shrugged off like who cares 277 00:14:04,840 --> 00:14:06,760 Speaker 1: about that? And then everyone goes like, yeah, who cares? 278 00:14:06,800 --> 00:14:10,200 Speaker 1: You know, things that you know, like if Watergate happened now, 279 00:14:10,240 --> 00:14:12,840 Speaker 1: I think I don't know if people would be that bothered, 280 00:14:13,120 --> 00:14:15,520 Speaker 1: you know, like I really am not sure. And I 281 00:14:15,600 --> 00:14:17,840 Speaker 1: just think the whole what's the word, like the Overton 282 00:14:17,880 --> 00:14:20,600 Speaker 1: window has changed so it's been like smashed and kicked out, 283 00:14:20,840 --> 00:14:23,680 Speaker 1: you know, And I just think things have changed so 284 00:14:23,760 --> 00:14:28,440 Speaker 1: much that honestly, like people just people don't really care 285 00:14:28,480 --> 00:14:32,120 Speaker 1: that much. So then authoritarian governments realized they can get 286 00:14:32,160 --> 00:14:35,640 Speaker 1: away with more, right, and they do well. I mean, 287 00:14:35,880 --> 00:14:39,400 Speaker 1: the term post truth in and of itself is surreal 288 00:14:39,880 --> 00:14:42,720 Speaker 1: and sounds like something from orwell like I mean, it 289 00:14:42,800 --> 00:14:46,520 Speaker 1: really sounds like a joke, like it's satire, but that's 290 00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:49,000 Speaker 1: what it is. Or it's like postmodern but we know 291 00:14:49,040 --> 00:14:52,800 Speaker 1: what modernism is. Truth is an objective thing, right, like 292 00:14:53,000 --> 00:14:55,400 Speaker 1: it's true or it's not true. But we're living in 293 00:14:55,440 --> 00:14:58,000 Speaker 1: this time that's called post truth, or at least that's 294 00:14:58,000 --> 00:15:00,000 Speaker 1: a term that's being thrown around. I think it's totally 295 00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:07,200 Speaker 1: on point Q and on utterly a product of this concept. Yeah, 296 00:15:07,800 --> 00:15:10,880 Speaker 1: I think they're post post truth, you know what I mean? 297 00:15:11,160 --> 00:15:13,280 Speaker 1: Let's let's get them. I mean, let's let's talk a 298 00:15:13,320 --> 00:15:15,480 Speaker 1: little bit about the podcast, you know. I mean, yeah 299 00:15:16,320 --> 00:15:18,600 Speaker 1: is the name, and you like we said at the 300 00:15:18,600 --> 00:15:21,520 Speaker 1: top of the show, there's this insane web that is 301 00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:24,720 Speaker 1: q and And honestly, we do this show, you know, weekly, 302 00:15:24,840 --> 00:15:26,600 Speaker 1: and when we first ran across it, I was like, 303 00:15:26,640 --> 00:15:29,160 Speaker 1: I don't know what the hell this is. I don't 304 00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:33,280 Speaker 1: understand what this is and I need you I think 305 00:15:34,400 --> 00:15:36,560 Speaker 1: it's it's a headache for me as well. But like 306 00:15:36,600 --> 00:15:39,200 Speaker 1: I mean, I I wanted a little break from constantly 307 00:15:39,240 --> 00:15:42,160 Speaker 1: doing conflict you know, like with my my project, Popular Front, 308 00:15:42,200 --> 00:15:45,200 Speaker 1: it's all conflict reporting. And I was like, man, I 309 00:15:45,240 --> 00:15:47,400 Speaker 1: need I need just like a little break from this. 310 00:15:47,480 --> 00:15:49,000 Speaker 1: But for me, I can't really have a break. I've 311 00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:51,240 Speaker 1: gotta be working. I like being busy. So I was like, 312 00:15:51,280 --> 00:15:53,320 Speaker 1: I know, like I'll do another project. And you know, 313 00:15:53,360 --> 00:15:55,520 Speaker 1: like I said, I've been listening to this podcast for years. 314 00:15:55,520 --> 00:15:57,560 Speaker 1: I love conspiracy theories, you know, Like when I was 315 00:15:57,600 --> 00:16:00,280 Speaker 1: a teenager, I used to believe in the most craziest stuff, 316 00:16:00,280 --> 00:16:02,720 Speaker 1: you know, and then I up what is wrong with me? 317 00:16:03,240 --> 00:16:05,440 Speaker 1: But but now as an adult, I just I just 318 00:16:05,480 --> 00:16:08,680 Speaker 1: still love researching them. Looking into them, finding out why 319 00:16:08,720 --> 00:16:11,400 Speaker 1: they happen, and there's always that one percent of me 320 00:16:11,440 --> 00:16:14,160 Speaker 1: that's like maybe you know what I mean, It keeps 321 00:16:14,160 --> 00:16:16,840 Speaker 1: me interested in them. So when I I you know, 322 00:16:16,880 --> 00:16:19,600 Speaker 1: I you know how people watch like you guys say, 323 00:16:19,600 --> 00:16:22,640 Speaker 1: like trash TV, right, like like reality TV. They people 324 00:16:22,640 --> 00:16:25,560 Speaker 1: watch that. To one wind me, I watched conspiracy documentaries 325 00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:27,880 Speaker 1: like outrageous ones, you know what I mean. So I 326 00:16:27,920 --> 00:16:30,160 Speaker 1: came across cum and On just naturally, you know, like 327 00:16:30,200 --> 00:16:33,800 Speaker 1: watching big Foot, watching whatever, and then and then there 328 00:16:33,840 --> 00:16:37,000 Speaker 1: was Q and On and I was like, this is 329 00:16:37,360 --> 00:16:40,800 Speaker 1: like the mother of the conspiracy theories, right, It's like 330 00:16:40,840 --> 00:16:43,880 Speaker 1: the whole umbrella of every conspiracy theory I've been reading 331 00:16:43,920 --> 00:16:47,240 Speaker 1: since I was a teenager, and everything's under it. And 332 00:16:47,400 --> 00:16:50,320 Speaker 1: when I saw it was taken off, I just was 333 00:16:50,400 --> 00:16:54,600 Speaker 1: like surely not like come on? Like so that's I 334 00:16:54,600 --> 00:16:56,560 Speaker 1: got to the point where I see the election coming 335 00:16:56,600 --> 00:16:57,600 Speaker 1: up and I was like, man, I want to do 336 00:16:57,680 --> 00:17:00,720 Speaker 1: something like about this. And there's some great podcast already 337 00:17:00,760 --> 00:17:02,920 Speaker 1: out there, you know, Q and On Anonymous and you 338 00:17:03,880 --> 00:17:06,120 Speaker 1: know there's other ones out there, and so I was like, well, 339 00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:07,800 Speaker 1: what can the angle be? So I guess my angle 340 00:17:07,920 --> 00:17:10,920 Speaker 1: was like let me bring all these great researchers together 341 00:17:11,119 --> 00:17:13,840 Speaker 1: in my research and we can kind of get you know, 342 00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:15,120 Speaker 1: by the end of it. We want to be able 343 00:17:15,160 --> 00:17:17,240 Speaker 1: to say, look, this is who we think Q is, 344 00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:19,639 Speaker 1: not just because of this hunch, not just because this 345 00:17:19,720 --> 00:17:22,520 Speaker 1: guy says so we want to be like A to 346 00:17:22,680 --> 00:17:24,800 Speaker 1: a B to be you know what I mean, this 347 00:17:24,840 --> 00:17:28,680 Speaker 1: matches up, that matches up, um, and at the same 348 00:17:28,720 --> 00:17:31,520 Speaker 1: time kind of tell the true on story and unwrap 349 00:17:31,560 --> 00:17:33,399 Speaker 1: it all for everybody. You know, this is not a 350 00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:36,440 Speaker 1: podcast for people that already know about cute. I wanted 351 00:17:36,520 --> 00:17:40,400 Speaker 1: to be accessible for everyone, right Um. And it's hard. 352 00:17:40,760 --> 00:17:44,880 Speaker 1: It's very hard to write and like this incredible web 353 00:17:44,960 --> 00:17:49,040 Speaker 1: of like information that is just so unbelievably far fetched, 354 00:17:49,440 --> 00:17:51,359 Speaker 1: but to then kind of be like, well, this is 355 00:17:51,400 --> 00:17:53,280 Speaker 1: maybe why they believe it, and this is where it 356 00:17:53,320 --> 00:17:56,480 Speaker 1: comes from. And and ultimately, you know, I'm not actually 357 00:17:56,520 --> 00:17:58,199 Speaker 1: trying to laugh at these Q and on even though 358 00:17:58,240 --> 00:18:00,400 Speaker 1: I am kind of laughing, Like, ultimately it's quite sad, 359 00:18:00,600 --> 00:18:02,720 Speaker 1: you know, like there have been families torn apart from 360 00:18:02,760 --> 00:18:05,520 Speaker 1: these and it's sad that so many people can believe 361 00:18:05,560 --> 00:18:09,840 Speaker 1: in things so outrageous. Um. While saying, you know, fake 362 00:18:09,920 --> 00:18:12,600 Speaker 1: news at the news, you know, and I think that's 363 00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:16,120 Speaker 1: a failure of not just the establishment. I think that's 364 00:18:16,119 --> 00:18:20,360 Speaker 1: a failure of a lot of things. Media education. Um, 365 00:18:20,400 --> 00:18:23,240 Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, it's like the ultimate endpoint of all 366 00:18:23,280 --> 00:18:25,840 Speaker 1: the conspiracy theories in the last twenty years. I think 367 00:18:26,200 --> 00:18:29,679 Speaker 1: that's a long way of explaining it. But this is 368 00:18:29,720 --> 00:18:32,679 Speaker 1: perfect because one thing that strikes me about Q Clearance 369 00:18:33,040 --> 00:18:37,720 Speaker 1: is that you've taken on a herculean task of unraveling 370 00:18:38,160 --> 00:18:43,080 Speaker 1: you know, the almost like the folkloric etymology of how 371 00:18:43,119 --> 00:18:47,280 Speaker 1: this came to be, the future, of where it, where 372 00:18:47,320 --> 00:18:50,359 Speaker 1: it might go, how it evolves. There's there's an excellent 373 00:18:50,400 --> 00:18:53,680 Speaker 1: interview where you talk a bit about Q and on 374 00:18:53,880 --> 00:18:58,280 Speaker 1: as a meta conspiracy, and there there's so many conspiracies 375 00:18:58,320 --> 00:19:01,359 Speaker 1: that reach that meta point. It's just usually they take 376 00:19:01,400 --> 00:19:04,840 Speaker 1: several decades or centuries to get there exactly, and this 377 00:19:04,880 --> 00:19:09,840 Speaker 1: one just went like three years. Yes, well, well you guys, 378 00:19:09,960 --> 00:19:12,680 Speaker 1: you guys, I remember, and you probably do to it. 379 00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:16,200 Speaker 1: I know you have been looking at above top Secret 380 00:19:16,280 --> 00:19:20,119 Speaker 1: and of other forums like that and reading you know, 381 00:19:20,160 --> 00:19:23,040 Speaker 1: an anonymous post was somebody saying they've got all this 382 00:19:23,160 --> 00:19:30,840 Speaker 1: secret information. Well, but like so, I mean, we would 383 00:19:30,840 --> 00:19:33,080 Speaker 1: look at that stuff and do our level best to 384 00:19:33,240 --> 00:19:36,280 Speaker 1: attempt to prove something or to find some kind of 385 00:19:36,320 --> 00:19:39,320 Speaker 1: evidence somewhere of stuff that's being said there. And it 386 00:19:39,400 --> 00:19:44,280 Speaker 1: was for me personally a very exciting hour to two hours, 387 00:19:44,320 --> 00:19:47,280 Speaker 1: maybe a couple of days of like going down rabbit holes. 388 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:52,919 Speaker 1: And I'm wondering how much this phenomenon, this idea that 389 00:19:52,960 --> 00:19:55,400 Speaker 1: there is a secret person named Q, is playing into 390 00:19:55,440 --> 00:19:58,879 Speaker 1: those same things, those same chemicals that were being released 391 00:19:58,920 --> 00:20:03,560 Speaker 1: in my brain when that was my pursuit. No, no, no, definitely, 392 00:20:03,880 --> 00:20:06,080 Speaker 1: I think you're right. That's the crux of it. Actually, 393 00:20:06,119 --> 00:20:08,719 Speaker 1: that's how it kind of spread, I think, because it's fun, right, 394 00:20:08,720 --> 00:20:12,200 Speaker 1: it's exciting because Q says to them, you do your 395 00:20:12,240 --> 00:20:15,040 Speaker 1: own investigations. You are the news now, so you get 396 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:17,359 Speaker 1: all these like wine moms and whatever. Like no offense 397 00:20:17,359 --> 00:20:18,840 Speaker 1: to wine moms, but what I mean is they don't 398 00:20:18,840 --> 00:20:20,400 Speaker 1: have anything else to do a lot of the time, 399 00:20:20,520 --> 00:20:22,960 Speaker 1: right the kids or wherever, and so they're just like 400 00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:25,520 Speaker 1: all day on the computer. They've got time to research it, 401 00:20:26,320 --> 00:20:29,800 Speaker 1: and they just feel they have like there's an accomplishment, right, 402 00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:31,879 Speaker 1: and then you can share it with other people and go, hey, 403 00:20:31,880 --> 00:20:33,600 Speaker 1: look what I found. And then they go, oh wow. 404 00:20:33,920 --> 00:20:35,880 Speaker 1: Then the community starts to form, and then you can 405 00:20:35,920 --> 00:20:39,000 Speaker 1: reaffirm each other's value based on the research you've done. 406 00:20:39,000 --> 00:20:41,600 Speaker 1: That person is useful to my group, that person is useful. 407 00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:43,800 Speaker 1: And then they're all in this big thing where they 408 00:20:43,840 --> 00:20:47,639 Speaker 1: think they're being led by intel from the White House. 409 00:20:48,119 --> 00:20:51,160 Speaker 1: They feel like the foot soldiers of a revolution from 410 00:20:51,200 --> 00:20:56,160 Speaker 1: their desk. And that's what's very addictive, I think for them, 411 00:20:56,200 --> 00:20:57,800 Speaker 1: you know, and it kind of doesn't matter when it 412 00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:00,920 Speaker 1: when it pans out, it's like, oh, that didn't happen, 413 00:21:01,080 --> 00:21:03,480 Speaker 1: even though you said it was going to happen. Literally 414 00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:05,679 Speaker 1: at this time and day. In fact, as we record 415 00:21:05,720 --> 00:21:08,960 Speaker 1: this right now, this is three years to the day 416 00:21:09,000 --> 00:21:11,800 Speaker 1: of the first ever Q drop on four chan when 417 00:21:11,880 --> 00:21:14,480 Speaker 1: she said he was going to arrest Hillary Clinton or whatever. 418 00:21:15,040 --> 00:21:17,879 Speaker 1: Didn't happen. But but it almost doesn't matter when the 419 00:21:17,880 --> 00:21:20,120 Speaker 1: predictions don't come through because they're having so much fun. 420 00:21:20,119 --> 00:21:22,560 Speaker 1: They're so wrapped up in it um that it's like, 421 00:21:22,600 --> 00:21:24,600 Speaker 1: we'll just find a reason why that didn't matter. I mean, 422 00:21:24,760 --> 00:21:26,800 Speaker 1: you know, ironically, it's it's who is Q and on 423 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:29,800 Speaker 1: the friends who made along the way, right, But unfortunately 424 00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:34,119 Speaker 1: it's not it's not that chill at all. It's zero 425 00:21:34,200 --> 00:21:37,880 Speaker 1: percent chill, you know, so unfortunately it could become dangerous. 426 00:21:38,359 --> 00:21:41,560 Speaker 1: They just want to follow up the with that statement 427 00:21:41,600 --> 00:21:47,080 Speaker 1: about herculean task. So one thing that is cult like 428 00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:50,680 Speaker 1: frankly about this is a bit of the choose your 429 00:21:50,680 --> 00:21:55,560 Speaker 1: own adventure vibe. If you remember those old paperbacks, have 430 00:21:55,760 --> 00:21:58,520 Speaker 1: you have you run in when you're when you're exploring 431 00:21:58,520 --> 00:22:00,760 Speaker 1: this story. I don't want to spoil things for the show, 432 00:22:00,800 --> 00:22:03,680 Speaker 1: but have have you seen much of what I would 433 00:22:03,760 --> 00:22:07,679 Speaker 1: describe as individual customization? Like have you seen someone be 434 00:22:07,840 --> 00:22:11,520 Speaker 1: the voice of reason in one of these Q forums 435 00:22:11,560 --> 00:22:14,600 Speaker 1: and say, look, this part of it's true, this part 436 00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:19,000 Speaker 1: of it is not. Does that happen or more or 437 00:22:19,040 --> 00:22:22,000 Speaker 1: less locked up? No? No, no, it does happen. Man. Actually, 438 00:22:22,040 --> 00:22:24,359 Speaker 1: it's like that's a good question because I was reading 439 00:22:24,359 --> 00:22:26,760 Speaker 1: something just the other day where like a guy that 440 00:22:26,840 --> 00:22:29,240 Speaker 1: was an ardent Q I started looking at his posting 441 00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:34,080 Speaker 1: like progress and he was just getting like, hang on, 442 00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:36,760 Speaker 1: what when is it going to happen? When is you 443 00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:38,400 Speaker 1: know they call it the plan. No one really knows 444 00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:40,399 Speaker 1: what the plan is, but don't worry about that. So 445 00:22:40,480 --> 00:22:42,639 Speaker 1: they're kind of like, when is it going to happen, 446 00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:45,840 Speaker 1: and this guy was just like this is nuts. Like 447 00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:48,440 Speaker 1: he literally like got himself out of it. He was like, 448 00:22:48,800 --> 00:22:51,360 Speaker 1: none of these predictions have happened, you know, Like, and 449 00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:53,320 Speaker 1: he kind of left, and the other people are like 450 00:22:54,040 --> 00:22:56,359 Speaker 1: more so, there's a guy that I watched, right and 451 00:22:56,400 --> 00:22:59,520 Speaker 1: he seems like such a nice guy, and but he's 452 00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:02,800 Speaker 1: deep in Q and on very believing in conspiracy, and 453 00:23:03,400 --> 00:23:07,240 Speaker 1: he's like more moderate, Like he's he's not an anti semi, 454 00:23:07,400 --> 00:23:09,960 Speaker 1: he's not a racist, you know, and he's not really 455 00:23:10,640 --> 00:23:13,399 Speaker 1: deep deep in the more wacky side of Q. So 456 00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:15,080 Speaker 1: he was what he might be able to call like 457 00:23:15,080 --> 00:23:17,479 Speaker 1: a more moderate CE. And then you have like the 458 00:23:17,640 --> 00:23:21,119 Speaker 1: far far extreme version of Q where it's all satanic 459 00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:23,320 Speaker 1: and babies are being eaten and all of that. So 460 00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:26,359 Speaker 1: there are levels to it. But I say that even 461 00:23:26,440 --> 00:23:29,400 Speaker 1: he's like, oh, this guy seems lovely, and then he's like, well, 462 00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:32,360 Speaker 1: when we get away, will hang all the Democrats for treason, 463 00:23:32,880 --> 00:23:35,760 Speaker 1: And you're like, oh, he's not that nice, you know. 464 00:23:35,960 --> 00:23:39,080 Speaker 1: So even the like well kind of to do ones 465 00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:43,159 Speaker 1: are like have this very dark concept of violence at 466 00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:44,680 Speaker 1: the end of this, you know, And I think that's 467 00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:49,560 Speaker 1: something that interested me, where kind of from what I'm 468 00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:51,600 Speaker 1: doing with conflict. Actually, you know, like I spent like 469 00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:54,879 Speaker 1: what seven years reporting from conflict, and I you know, 470 00:23:54,920 --> 00:23:56,800 Speaker 1: I engage in Twitter a lot, and I'm I'm a 471 00:23:56,880 --> 00:23:59,240 Speaker 1: very like, very online guy. Like I always have been 472 00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:02,679 Speaker 1: a you know something awful like big time into like 473 00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:05,040 Speaker 1: four channe when it's cool when like you know, Anonymous 474 00:24:05,040 --> 00:24:06,800 Speaker 1: were on there as a kid and whatever. So I've 475 00:24:06,840 --> 00:24:09,040 Speaker 1: always been very online. And then I see these guys 476 00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:11,879 Speaker 1: that treat war like a football match. I'm on this side. 477 00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:14,240 Speaker 1: I'm on this side, Jake, who's the you know, who's 478 00:24:14,280 --> 00:24:16,320 Speaker 1: the win, who's the good guy? And then there'll be 479 00:24:16,400 --> 00:24:19,600 Speaker 1: some horrific video where decide that they like you know 480 00:24:19,840 --> 00:24:22,160 Speaker 1: one and then they're like yeah, great, and it's like, well, 481 00:24:22,200 --> 00:24:25,480 Speaker 1: what you're cheering on is like mass death and horrific violence, right, 482 00:24:25,880 --> 00:24:28,280 Speaker 1: the reality of that when you see it, you know, 483 00:24:28,359 --> 00:24:31,320 Speaker 1: I've seen some I'm gonna be like, I've seen stuff, man, 484 00:24:31,359 --> 00:24:32,679 Speaker 1: but you know what I mean, Like, I've seen a 485 00:24:32,680 --> 00:24:36,639 Speaker 1: few Gnarli situations and it's not you don't go yeah, 486 00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:38,959 Speaker 1: you just go like, isn't this sad? Like isn't this 487 00:24:39,320 --> 00:24:41,720 Speaker 1: horrific that this is happening? And I think the Q 488 00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:44,840 Speaker 1: and ons have a similar vibe where they're saying like, yeah, 489 00:24:44,920 --> 00:24:48,320 Speaker 1: well hang everybody for treason and all of this stuff, 490 00:24:48,359 --> 00:24:50,199 Speaker 1: and it's like, do you know what that will look like? 491 00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:52,520 Speaker 1: Like you are you gonna do that? Like you're the 492 00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:54,200 Speaker 1: foot soldiers of Q. What are you're going to hang 493 00:24:54,280 --> 00:24:57,879 Speaker 1: people on mass? You know, like just because they voted 494 00:24:57,920 --> 00:25:00,160 Speaker 1: for a different way. So that's when you start get 495 00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:02,200 Speaker 1: into the into the darkest side of it. So I 496 00:25:02,240 --> 00:25:05,480 Speaker 1: guess my point is like, yeah, there are different levels 497 00:25:05,560 --> 00:25:07,280 Speaker 1: to it, like you said, and some people like, oh, 498 00:25:07,320 --> 00:25:10,880 Speaker 1: don't be silly, that's that's too extreme, But ultimately they 499 00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:13,480 Speaker 1: all have the belief in the plan, and the plan 500 00:25:13,600 --> 00:25:17,120 Speaker 1: is pretty nasty. And we'll be back with more from 501 00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:28,040 Speaker 1: Jake Hanrahan after a word from our sponsor, and we're back. 502 00:25:28,600 --> 00:25:32,720 Speaker 1: This reminds me of something we've noticed in your conflict 503 00:25:32,920 --> 00:25:36,919 Speaker 1: reporting career in Ukraine. You were embedded with both the 504 00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:40,879 Speaker 1: Ukraine Army and then also with a separatist group. And 505 00:25:40,920 --> 00:25:43,880 Speaker 1: so those folks who so I can I can see 506 00:25:43,920 --> 00:25:47,199 Speaker 1: where you would say, well, these are both this is 507 00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:51,399 Speaker 1: tragedy happening, you know, regardless of affiliation, and that's something 508 00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:54,760 Speaker 1: that's something a lot of people miss, uh, and an 509 00:25:54,880 --> 00:25:58,280 Speaker 1: interest of yeah, I know, we're asking some harrowing questions, 510 00:25:58,520 --> 00:26:02,400 Speaker 1: so we thought we thought you might enjoy a little 511 00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:04,520 Speaker 1: bit of a softball that they might have fun with, 512 00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:07,280 Speaker 1: because part of this show is we have to objectively 513 00:26:07,320 --> 00:26:13,359 Speaker 1: look at everything, right, So, Jake, where would you say 514 00:26:13,640 --> 00:26:16,560 Speaker 1: some of the claims from Q and On to begin 515 00:26:16,680 --> 00:26:20,800 Speaker 1: to you know, fall apart just a little? Well, I 516 00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:25,280 Speaker 1: mean the very first post was Clinton is going to 517 00:26:25,320 --> 00:26:27,879 Speaker 1: be arrested in like two days and if she didn't, 518 00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:30,679 Speaker 1: so you know, that was a big one. But but 519 00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:32,680 Speaker 1: the point I always make to a lot of people, 520 00:26:32,680 --> 00:26:34,159 Speaker 1: and I'm going to get a bit dark here, but 521 00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:36,640 Speaker 1: I have to because it's necessary. The point I say 522 00:26:36,680 --> 00:26:39,119 Speaker 1: to a lot of people is like, so Q and 523 00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:41,200 Speaker 1: On is big on save the kids, right, and we're 524 00:26:41,280 --> 00:26:43,880 Speaker 1: queuing on is actually right in some ways? Is there 525 00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:46,200 Speaker 1: are elite Peter far Rings? We've seen it with Epstein 526 00:26:46,240 --> 00:26:49,000 Speaker 1: and the horrific way that you know, the poor young 527 00:26:49,000 --> 00:26:51,919 Speaker 1: girls are treated, the victims, and it's disgusting. And you 528 00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:54,639 Speaker 1: know Trump was involved, Clinton was involved, a lot of 529 00:26:54,720 --> 00:26:59,000 Speaker 1: very important powerful people were involved. Is bipartisan? Right? So yeah, 530 00:26:59,080 --> 00:27:03,040 Speaker 1: that that's very horrific. But then they jump the shark 531 00:27:03,320 --> 00:27:05,880 Speaker 1: in one second, right, and it's like it goes from 532 00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:09,280 Speaker 1: this is serious to like Hillary Clinton is eating babies. 533 00:27:09,359 --> 00:27:11,960 Speaker 1: It's like, oh my god, come on. But so they're 534 00:27:12,000 --> 00:27:14,800 Speaker 1: they're very invested in like save the kids. We hate peophiles. 535 00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:18,400 Speaker 1: There's an elite peedo file ring, So why then do 536 00:27:18,720 --> 00:27:24,360 Speaker 1: there's Q use h chan, which for years openly shared pedophilia, 537 00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:27,399 Speaker 1: like openly there were there were pedophiles on that board, 538 00:27:27,920 --> 00:27:30,560 Speaker 1: like not even coded, really like trying to work out 539 00:27:30,560 --> 00:27:33,679 Speaker 1: how to share pedophilia together. That was this like the 540 00:27:33,720 --> 00:27:36,920 Speaker 1: most disgusting thing about h Chan. Why on earth would 541 00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:40,280 Speaker 1: you go there to dump this information? Right, Like they 542 00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:42,400 Speaker 1: can't give you an answer for that. It's oh, well 543 00:27:42,520 --> 00:27:45,439 Speaker 1: they were forced into these I CUsing intelligence asset make 544 00:27:45,520 --> 00:27:47,640 Speaker 1: your own website, right, Like, surely he has a way 545 00:27:47,640 --> 00:27:49,720 Speaker 1: of doing it. He's got Q clearance. I'm sure he 546 00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:53,320 Speaker 1: knows a few yet, guys, for Christ's sake, So that 547 00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:55,800 Speaker 1: is like for me, just the basic things like that 548 00:27:55,880 --> 00:27:58,560 Speaker 1: are like come on, like why would they do that? 549 00:27:58,600 --> 00:28:01,320 Speaker 1: Because if you say feil prediction, they say it was 550 00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:04,639 Speaker 1: a red herry. You know, anything that doesn't happen was 551 00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:07,399 Speaker 1: a part of the plan, so you can't combat that. 552 00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:09,639 Speaker 1: But like, you know, I've actually had some discussions with 553 00:28:09,680 --> 00:28:13,800 Speaker 1: a few Q curious people down at my books in Gym, 554 00:28:13,840 --> 00:28:16,120 Speaker 1: and I've explained, like I used that example, why would 555 00:28:16,119 --> 00:28:18,600 Speaker 1: he use a place where pedophilia is accepted to rail 556 00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:20,920 Speaker 1: against elite pedophile rings. It doesn't make any sense. And 557 00:28:20,960 --> 00:28:23,760 Speaker 1: people kind of go like, oh, yeah, you know, so 558 00:28:24,480 --> 00:28:26,520 Speaker 1: I think that's a way to kind of break it down. 559 00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:29,080 Speaker 1: But again, there are, like like I said, there are 560 00:28:29,119 --> 00:28:32,600 Speaker 1: like facets of truth, and they've really whoever it is, 561 00:28:32,640 --> 00:28:35,040 Speaker 1: has done a good job of jumping on that because 562 00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:38,040 Speaker 1: everyone I knows anyway, like even like friends that are 563 00:28:38,040 --> 00:28:41,360 Speaker 1: not involved in journalism, whatever, they know about Epstein. They've 564 00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:43,880 Speaker 1: got kids, they've got sisters, you know, they're disgusted by it, 565 00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:46,520 Speaker 1: and rightly so. And when they read about it and 566 00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:49,120 Speaker 1: they're like, wow, Bill Clinton was on his plane how 567 00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:53,120 Speaker 1: many times, or like you know, Trump said what about Epstein? 568 00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:58,080 Speaker 1: It's gross? Right, So then if Q comes along and says, oh, 569 00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:00,160 Speaker 1: but here's the secret side of it. Firstly, it's a 570 00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:04,320 Speaker 1: bit spicier, right, like the lies are always a bit spicier. 571 00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:06,600 Speaker 1: And secondly, there's a whole community that are going to 572 00:29:06,720 --> 00:29:09,000 Speaker 1: fill you in and inform you before you know. You know, 573 00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:11,920 Speaker 1: a friend said to me the other day, he said, um, 574 00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:14,080 Speaker 1: you know, I've lost a few friends to Q and 575 00:29:14,080 --> 00:29:17,080 Speaker 1: on and it's like, yeah, like that happens, like you 576 00:29:17,080 --> 00:29:19,000 Speaker 1: you would just lose people to it, man, And it's 577 00:29:19,480 --> 00:29:21,640 Speaker 1: it's like a drug. It's like they're on a drug 578 00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:24,560 Speaker 1: but they're not. It's it's I don't know, man, It's 579 00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:27,840 Speaker 1: it's very worrying that I never thought, you know, like 580 00:29:27,880 --> 00:29:31,000 Speaker 1: I said, years of reading Above top Secret and like 581 00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:33,640 Speaker 1: listen to you guys and all of that, Like years 582 00:29:33,640 --> 00:29:35,680 Speaker 1: of that, I never thought this would happen. I'll be honest, 583 00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:37,760 Speaker 1: Like it was always a fringe thing that was fun. 584 00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:40,760 Speaker 1: Now it's like I still laugh at it, but now 585 00:29:40,760 --> 00:29:42,680 Speaker 1: and then I catch myself and like I shouldn't really 586 00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:44,400 Speaker 1: laugh at that, Like this is actually serious. You know. 587 00:29:45,080 --> 00:29:47,200 Speaker 1: You've touched on a lot of really important things there, Jake, 588 00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:50,760 Speaker 1: And it feels to me inevitable. It feels like this 589 00:29:50,880 --> 00:29:55,520 Speaker 1: was going to happen because as we have better access 590 00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:59,800 Speaker 1: to the internet, just as humanity, as these real truths, 591 00:29:59,840 --> 00:30:02,600 Speaker 1: like are talking about what the Epsteins and the pedophiles 592 00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:05,920 Speaker 1: that have been uncovered in very high places in government 593 00:30:05,920 --> 00:30:09,480 Speaker 1: and media, and you realize that it's happening more and more, 594 00:30:09,560 --> 00:30:13,080 Speaker 1: and you feel completely helpless to do anything about it. 595 00:30:13,440 --> 00:30:16,440 Speaker 1: You know, like every person walking around knows that there 596 00:30:16,440 --> 00:30:19,040 Speaker 1: are children being abused right now, and you feel like 597 00:30:19,040 --> 00:30:21,680 Speaker 1: there's nothing you can do about it. But when Q 598 00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:25,840 Speaker 1: comes along as even a possibility, as even a glimmer 599 00:30:25,880 --> 00:30:29,640 Speaker 1: of possibility out in the world, that something could be 600 00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:32,960 Speaker 1: done and perhaps I can do something about it by 601 00:30:33,040 --> 00:30:38,920 Speaker 1: researching this, I think it is something very desirable that 602 00:30:39,080 --> 00:30:43,400 Speaker 1: a lot of us may feel inside. That's a great point. Yeah, yeah, 603 00:30:43,440 --> 00:30:46,160 Speaker 1: it's like you're right, it's like they can be useful 604 00:30:46,200 --> 00:30:49,240 Speaker 1: to stop this, Like yeah, and it's hat to keep 605 00:30:49,240 --> 00:30:50,960 Speaker 1: bringing it up. But so much of the Q and 606 00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:54,920 Speaker 1: on mythos, if you like, does revolve around elite pedophile 607 00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:57,120 Speaker 1: rings and it's like, yeah, it's that is the worst 608 00:30:57,120 --> 00:30:59,400 Speaker 1: thing I could have a think of, Like and it's real. 609 00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:01,920 Speaker 1: Then you're right, like people wanted what can I do? 610 00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:04,640 Speaker 1: What can I do? You know, in in lieu of 611 00:31:04,680 --> 00:31:07,040 Speaker 1: setting up some kind of militia and running around doing 612 00:31:07,080 --> 00:31:09,560 Speaker 1: whatever they would, you know, big man talk that they 613 00:31:09,560 --> 00:31:13,080 Speaker 1: often do they can now do Q right, Like, oh, 614 00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:15,200 Speaker 1: like you know, we can we can be with they say, 615 00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:18,600 Speaker 1: like with the digit alarmy, like we're we're They don't 616 00:31:18,600 --> 00:31:20,920 Speaker 1: say serving, but they kind of, you know, they imply 617 00:31:21,080 --> 00:31:25,080 Speaker 1: that we're serving, like the Q agenda, we're the news. Now, Um, 618 00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:27,040 Speaker 1: what do they say? There's there's like all these sayings 619 00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:30,840 Speaker 1: they have and yeah, basically all of them boiled down 620 00:31:30,840 --> 00:31:32,600 Speaker 1: to like what you've just said. It's like we're doing 621 00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:35,800 Speaker 1: something right. And it's and ironically a lot of what 622 00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:39,880 Speaker 1: they're doing is is serious pain for families and and 623 00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:43,640 Speaker 1: serious like upheavals of people's lives, you know, especially when 624 00:31:43,640 --> 00:31:48,480 Speaker 1: they completely arbitrarily accused someone of something horrific, you know, 625 00:31:48,520 --> 00:31:50,520 Speaker 1: and it's like they haven't done anything and just because 626 00:31:50,560 --> 00:31:54,680 Speaker 1: of some insane tiny coincidence, then they decide that person 627 00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:57,840 Speaker 1: is in on it right, And it's like, man, you know, 628 00:31:59,520 --> 00:32:01,120 Speaker 1: it's not a would be the thing to say, but 629 00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:03,800 Speaker 1: I think a lot of them their heart is in 630 00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:06,160 Speaker 1: the right place, you know what I mean, and the 631 00:32:06,240 --> 00:32:08,560 Speaker 1: brain isn't. It's just the brain isn't. And that's why 632 00:32:08,600 --> 00:32:11,719 Speaker 1: it's sad. You know. It's like again, like there's a 633 00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:14,400 Speaker 1: lot of you know, and a lot of I guess 634 00:32:14,920 --> 00:32:17,120 Speaker 1: Q researchers have been doing this longer than I have, 635 00:32:17,280 --> 00:32:20,200 Speaker 1: especially in America. I know, they kind of don't really 636 00:32:20,200 --> 00:32:22,080 Speaker 1: like that. I'm kind of like, no, like, let's talk 637 00:32:22,120 --> 00:32:23,440 Speaker 1: to them, let's see what they've got to say. And 638 00:32:23,480 --> 00:32:25,640 Speaker 1: I respect that that's how they do it. But for me, 639 00:32:25,720 --> 00:32:27,880 Speaker 1: there's a part of me just feel like, you know, 640 00:32:27,960 --> 00:32:31,320 Speaker 1: a little bit of empathy towards it. It's uh, yeah, 641 00:32:31,360 --> 00:32:33,840 Speaker 1: it's sad, right, Like it's sad like if I know, 642 00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:36,120 Speaker 1: like people who are like their mom and dad don't 643 00:32:36,120 --> 00:32:37,760 Speaker 1: speak to them anymore because they're like, now you're a 644 00:32:37,760 --> 00:32:41,640 Speaker 1: part of the kabal and it's like what it's began 645 00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:46,600 Speaker 1: on food Chune. And then also, you know what's interesting, 646 00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:50,640 Speaker 1: I think the point we should emphasize is that earlier 647 00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:53,960 Speaker 1: we said, you know, one of the first things you 648 00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:57,320 Speaker 1: said about que falling apart is that the first prediction 649 00:32:57,760 --> 00:33:03,040 Speaker 1: was demonstrably incorrect. But q Q does something that is 650 00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:07,760 Speaker 1: very common to organizations of this type, which is past 651 00:33:07,880 --> 00:33:12,520 Speaker 1: the burden of validity onto the consumer or the audience 652 00:33:12,560 --> 00:33:15,280 Speaker 1: member or the foot soldiers of Q. So it's kind 653 00:33:15,320 --> 00:33:20,440 Speaker 1: of like when people think, uh uh, an apocalyptic cult 654 00:33:20,600 --> 00:33:24,400 Speaker 1: got there into the world prediction, right, we just misinterpreted it. 655 00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:29,120 Speaker 1: Like how do you see that community handle those corrections? 656 00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:32,200 Speaker 1: Do they say, well, we just misinterpreted what Q said. 657 00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:35,160 Speaker 1: I know, the red herring theory is popular, Like did 658 00:33:35,760 --> 00:33:41,560 Speaker 1: Q knew someone was infiltrating this freely accessible message board 659 00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:44,200 Speaker 1: and threw these red herrings out? Like how how do 660 00:33:44,320 --> 00:33:47,400 Speaker 1: people deal with that when these predictions don't in fact 661 00:33:47,400 --> 00:33:51,480 Speaker 1: come true? Um, well, brace yourself. And I have seen 662 00:33:52,240 --> 00:33:57,080 Speaker 1: is Hillary was arrested when they said and now the 663 00:33:57,160 --> 00:33:59,600 Speaker 1: Hillary we see now is like a body double or 664 00:33:59,640 --> 00:34:02,040 Speaker 1: a cloth own or something like that. So there there's 665 00:34:02,080 --> 00:34:05,000 Speaker 1: one for you. Like that's just too you know, immediately 666 00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:07,320 Speaker 1: jumped the shark at hundred miles an hour. That's one 667 00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:11,000 Speaker 1: kind of way to do it, and then others are 668 00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:15,399 Speaker 1: it's part of the plan. Ha ha, fools, you fell 669 00:34:15,520 --> 00:34:17,719 Speaker 1: for it. What you took that? You took that seriously, 670 00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:20,400 Speaker 1: he didn't mean it. It It was a metaphor, you know 671 00:34:20,400 --> 00:34:22,680 Speaker 1: what I mean, like the ways to snake around it 672 00:34:22,960 --> 00:34:26,960 Speaker 1: um almost as if like you're the idiot and it's 673 00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:28,960 Speaker 1: like hang on you you're just following this guy that 674 00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:32,239 Speaker 1: made a false prediction. Like a huge prediction. But it's 675 00:34:32,239 --> 00:34:35,279 Speaker 1: almost like now you're the idiot. You don't see the message, right, 676 00:34:35,280 --> 00:34:38,240 Speaker 1: And that is kind of powerful, like guests, because surely 677 00:34:38,239 --> 00:34:40,480 Speaker 1: there's a lot of people having doubt, but then when 678 00:34:40,480 --> 00:34:43,040 Speaker 1: someone comes along a sin, don't have doubt. We were right. 679 00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:45,920 Speaker 1: It was them who were wrong. It's gonna happen. It 680 00:34:46,080 --> 00:34:48,360 Speaker 1: just that was he Q had to say it that 681 00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:50,880 Speaker 1: way to get us all flared up. Now we're on 682 00:34:50,960 --> 00:34:54,040 Speaker 1: board and without that right, like he had to make 683 00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:56,680 Speaker 1: the spark to set the fire, and it's it's crazy, man. 684 00:34:56,760 --> 00:35:00,160 Speaker 1: But again it is this post truth thing and like 685 00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:03,760 Speaker 1: it just doesn't matter, you know. And then they also 686 00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:06,279 Speaker 1: do the thing of I mean there are some weird 687 00:35:06,320 --> 00:35:08,920 Speaker 1: coincidences as they will be like there's so hundreds and 688 00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:11,480 Speaker 1: hundreds of que posts, so every now like one in 689 00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:13,880 Speaker 1: a thousand of whatever worth what hell many it is. 690 00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:15,960 Speaker 1: They will be like, you know, a Q will say 691 00:35:15,960 --> 00:35:19,200 Speaker 1: something and then Trump might say something kind of similar, 692 00:35:19,600 --> 00:35:22,799 Speaker 1: and then it's like, well, that's an affirmation for them, right, 693 00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:27,480 Speaker 1: So then it's like, well, the false, the false prediction 694 00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:30,640 Speaker 1: doesn't matter anymore because the affirmation is stronger. So dwell 695 00:35:30,719 --> 00:35:33,160 Speaker 1: on that. Like they don't bring up the false thing. Right. 696 00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:35,080 Speaker 1: They don't go, oh, well forget about that. It's just 697 00:35:35,200 --> 00:35:37,840 Speaker 1: it's gone and here's the affirmation. Well that's good. I 698 00:35:37,880 --> 00:35:41,239 Speaker 1: mean when Trump in the last month is twice as 699 00:35:41,239 --> 00:35:44,279 Speaker 1: the president of the most powerful country on earth not 700 00:35:44,440 --> 00:35:47,560 Speaker 1: condemned the conspiracy theory that started on fortune and and 701 00:35:47,640 --> 00:35:53,040 Speaker 1: thrived on a message board that allowed pedophilia. You know, 702 00:35:53,440 --> 00:35:56,239 Speaker 1: for them, it's a very very big thing, as it 703 00:35:56,280 --> 00:35:59,760 Speaker 1: should be for anybody like that, no matter what political 704 00:35:59,840 --> 00:36:02,640 Speaker 1: So did you're on, I think any straightforward thinking person 705 00:36:02,719 --> 00:36:06,400 Speaker 1: should go, wow, that's very worrying. He didn't say, of 706 00:36:06,440 --> 00:36:09,400 Speaker 1: course this is nonsense, right, So for Q and ons 707 00:36:09,640 --> 00:36:13,800 Speaker 1: that was like Christmas. But like, so, there's a section 708 00:36:13,840 --> 00:36:15,680 Speaker 1: that actually it's the whole episode, the second episode of 709 00:36:15,719 --> 00:36:18,719 Speaker 1: your podcast, where you you explore the notion that Q 710 00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:21,880 Speaker 1: and on is like a left wing prank um. And 711 00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:23,680 Speaker 1: I don't want to spoil anything about it because there's 712 00:36:23,719 --> 00:36:26,080 Speaker 1: a whole thing you go into, which was I've never 713 00:36:26,120 --> 00:36:30,000 Speaker 1: heard of like this potential almost like theatrical kind of 714 00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:33,160 Speaker 1: like performance art group that does this kind of stuff 715 00:36:33,200 --> 00:36:35,400 Speaker 1: really interesting. Don't want to even go into there, gotta 716 00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:37,799 Speaker 1: listen to the episode to find out. But when you 717 00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:41,640 Speaker 1: really start digging into it and just the random absurdity 718 00:36:41,680 --> 00:36:43,920 Speaker 1: of all of this stuff, and then you know, bringing 719 00:36:43,920 --> 00:36:46,880 Speaker 1: in Satanism, which anyone that actually has done any research 720 00:36:46,880 --> 00:36:50,640 Speaker 1: into Satanism knows that Satanic panics are always hoaxes and 721 00:36:50,880 --> 00:36:54,000 Speaker 1: there's always some kind of misunderstanding at the heart of it, 722 00:36:54,239 --> 00:36:57,279 Speaker 1: and true Satanism is really almost more of a punk 723 00:36:57,360 --> 00:37:00,399 Speaker 1: rock kind of like middle finger to the establish man. 724 00:37:00,400 --> 00:37:03,680 Speaker 1: You're not actually like drinking goats blood and like drawing 725 00:37:03,719 --> 00:37:07,040 Speaker 1: pentagrams and like abandoned churches or or anything like that. 726 00:37:07,280 --> 00:37:09,560 Speaker 1: But like so when you start digging into it really 727 00:37:09,600 --> 00:37:12,319 Speaker 1: does feel like it could be that thing. And yet 728 00:37:12,360 --> 00:37:17,400 Speaker 1: it's been mainstream so acutely. And if it was meant 729 00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:20,000 Speaker 1: to be this like left wing prank to make right 730 00:37:20,040 --> 00:37:24,400 Speaker 1: wingers look stupid and it reads that way, how is 731 00:37:24,400 --> 00:37:28,480 Speaker 1: it caught on in such a insane way? Like I 732 00:37:28,560 --> 00:37:30,600 Speaker 1: just I can't wrap my head around. Is it the 733 00:37:30,600 --> 00:37:34,680 Speaker 1: post truth thing? Is it like boredom? Is I don't know? 734 00:37:34,880 --> 00:37:38,320 Speaker 1: I got I asked myself this all the time, Like honestly, 735 00:37:38,560 --> 00:37:41,480 Speaker 1: like the other day I was reading about like are 736 00:37:41,520 --> 00:37:43,759 Speaker 1: we in a simulation? I don't Obviously, I don't believe 737 00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:45,719 Speaker 1: that at all, But it's just a fascinating concept. I 738 00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:49,000 Speaker 1: was reading and I was thinking, like Q and on 739 00:37:49,120 --> 00:37:53,080 Speaker 1: could be like all these years I spent on like 740 00:37:53,280 --> 00:37:56,520 Speaker 1: conspiracy forums and stuff like as someone made a program 741 00:37:56,600 --> 00:37:59,520 Speaker 1: to just mug me off, like you know what I mean. 742 00:38:00,000 --> 00:38:02,839 Speaker 1: It was a simulation and am I like like recreating 743 00:38:02,840 --> 00:38:05,239 Speaker 1: my own monster, like because it's that crazy, right, You're 744 00:38:05,239 --> 00:38:08,280 Speaker 1: just like surely not surely not um. But to answer 745 00:38:08,280 --> 00:38:10,600 Speaker 1: you a question, I think, yeah, you know what it is. 746 00:38:10,640 --> 00:38:14,560 Speaker 1: It's like it's boredom. It's like, well, I think culturally 747 00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:16,640 Speaker 1: we're in a very strange place. I feel like we're 748 00:38:16,640 --> 00:38:19,720 Speaker 1: in between, you know, like the early two thousand's is gone, 749 00:38:20,400 --> 00:38:23,280 Speaker 1: the twenty tens is here. We're really at the peak. 750 00:38:23,640 --> 00:38:26,000 Speaker 1: Well I guess we're always at the peak of progress, 751 00:38:26,080 --> 00:38:28,680 Speaker 1: but you know we've really hit our stride within like 752 00:38:29,480 --> 00:38:33,279 Speaker 1: senseless constant scrolling, you know, like I'm thirty man, and 753 00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:37,160 Speaker 1: I'm so so glad I didn't grow up with that. 754 00:38:37,200 --> 00:38:39,759 Speaker 1: You know, we had a phone and we check it 755 00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:42,120 Speaker 1: for like are you here? Yes? Yes? No? That was it, 756 00:38:42,239 --> 00:38:45,040 Speaker 1: you know, like there wasn't this constant like for me, 757 00:38:45,719 --> 00:38:48,840 Speaker 1: technology was perfect when it was PS one's and Nokia 758 00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:51,080 Speaker 1: thirty three tens. You know, it went too far from 759 00:38:51,080 --> 00:38:54,040 Speaker 1: me after that, But I think it's that the lack 760 00:38:54,080 --> 00:38:57,840 Speaker 1: of connectivity in human you know, face to face, and 761 00:38:57,840 --> 00:39:00,640 Speaker 1: then COVID man that was a real problem, really put 762 00:39:00,680 --> 00:39:02,960 Speaker 1: a lot of people into their bedrooms. That for me 763 00:39:03,080 --> 00:39:06,319 Speaker 1: is when there's a real weird thing that I don't 764 00:39:06,360 --> 00:39:08,879 Speaker 1: think anyone has tackled yet, not with any kind of 765 00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:12,879 Speaker 1: sensitivity anyway. Where I see it where where I'm from, 766 00:39:12,920 --> 00:39:20,040 Speaker 1: like working class communities getting hyper conspiracy, conspiratorial, and it's 767 00:39:20,080 --> 00:39:22,719 Speaker 1: I've seen it there more than anywhere else, right, And 768 00:39:22,800 --> 00:39:25,840 Speaker 1: that comes from we already distrust our government because I 769 00:39:25,880 --> 00:39:29,040 Speaker 1: mean trust me. Where I live, local government doesn't care 770 00:39:29,040 --> 00:39:31,799 Speaker 1: about us. They do not care like you know, we 771 00:39:31,880 --> 00:39:34,319 Speaker 1: have like volunteers have to set up food banks because 772 00:39:34,320 --> 00:39:36,839 Speaker 1: there's just not enough, right And so already you grow 773 00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:39,720 Speaker 1: up knowing the police often will hate me and stop 774 00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:42,839 Speaker 1: and search me for nothing. The government clearly don't hate me. 775 00:39:43,120 --> 00:39:45,160 Speaker 1: And then you're in a place where there's bad education 776 00:39:45,200 --> 00:39:47,040 Speaker 1: as well, because you grew up poor, you didn't go 777 00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:50,279 Speaker 1: into a nice school that you already set up to 778 00:39:50,560 --> 00:39:53,680 Speaker 1: distrust all authority, which you know it's I think it's fine. 779 00:39:53,719 --> 00:39:57,920 Speaker 1: I kind of doing myself, but unfortunately these people you know, 780 00:39:57,960 --> 00:39:59,719 Speaker 1: and these people are smart. Man. Just because you're from 781 00:39:59,719 --> 00:40:01,680 Speaker 1: a bad background or like poor Bagger doesn't mean you're 782 00:40:01,680 --> 00:40:05,600 Speaker 1: not smart. But instead of getting the knowledge and processing 783 00:40:05,600 --> 00:40:08,560 Speaker 1: it correctly, it just kind of sits there and stood. 784 00:40:08,680 --> 00:40:11,120 Speaker 1: So it's like, well, I've read, I'm well read. Now 785 00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:14,279 Speaker 1: it's true, and it's like, na, man, there's there's a 786 00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:16,480 Speaker 1: I don't know what it is. I'm not smart enough 787 00:40:16,520 --> 00:40:18,439 Speaker 1: to know, but there's a disconnect way of being well 788 00:40:18,480 --> 00:40:22,120 Speaker 1: read and reading a lot of research. You can't just 789 00:40:22,160 --> 00:40:24,840 Speaker 1: say Okay, that's real, you know, because that would be 790 00:40:24,880 --> 00:40:26,839 Speaker 1: like saying I know about space because I watched all 791 00:40:26,880 --> 00:40:29,439 Speaker 1: the star Wars. You know what I'm saying. It's like, yeah, 792 00:40:29,560 --> 00:40:33,120 Speaker 1: the processing of the information for some reason is going 793 00:40:33,160 --> 00:40:35,560 Speaker 1: in a weird direction, and I'm seeing a lot of it, man, 794 00:40:35,640 --> 00:40:38,360 Speaker 1: and I'm seeing like friends from the way around the 795 00:40:38,360 --> 00:40:40,239 Speaker 1: way and just being like you know, and they last me, 796 00:40:40,400 --> 00:40:42,960 Speaker 1: you know a j you must have seen this. I'm like, yeah, man, 797 00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:45,879 Speaker 1: I did, but it's nonsense. And they're like, come on, man, 798 00:40:46,040 --> 00:40:48,000 Speaker 1: you're part of you, part of their mean, I see 799 00:40:48,000 --> 00:40:50,239 Speaker 1: you work for the media, what about And it's like, 800 00:40:50,280 --> 00:40:53,759 Speaker 1: oh my god, Like, so my friends, you know, I mean, 801 00:40:53,800 --> 00:40:55,319 Speaker 1: most of my friends are smart enough to not go 802 00:40:55,440 --> 00:40:57,239 Speaker 1: for it, but some of my friends will be like 803 00:40:57,680 --> 00:41:00,919 Speaker 1: I noticed. I'm like, okay, you're believing facebo posts an 804 00:41:00,920 --> 00:41:03,080 Speaker 1: eight Chan post above your friend who if you know, 805 00:41:03,120 --> 00:41:05,439 Speaker 1: in your whole life in a matter of a year, 806 00:41:05,480 --> 00:41:08,120 Speaker 1: that's happened, you know, And it's man, I mean, it's 807 00:41:08,160 --> 00:41:11,040 Speaker 1: happening in all communities, but specifically I'm seeing it with 808 00:41:11,120 --> 00:41:14,520 Speaker 1: this thing. It reminds me. Um. You know, one one 809 00:41:14,560 --> 00:41:18,160 Speaker 1: point I wish people talked about more is that that 810 00:41:19,120 --> 00:41:23,080 Speaker 1: the first conspiracy theory many people learn about in the West, 811 00:41:23,120 --> 00:41:25,920 Speaker 1: they learn about when they're very young. It's Santa Claus, 812 00:41:25,920 --> 00:41:31,080 Speaker 1: a group of powerful people adults colued, uh successfully, Right, 813 00:41:31,160 --> 00:41:32,799 Speaker 1: and then when you learn about it, you have to 814 00:41:32,800 --> 00:41:35,640 Speaker 1: be in on it. I assure you this, the conversation 815 00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:38,839 Speaker 1: that you just told us about happens to us, as 816 00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:44,840 Speaker 1: you might imagine, pretty frequently. And um, I think I 817 00:41:44,920 --> 00:41:47,560 Speaker 1: think what we're talking about here is, you know, you 818 00:41:47,640 --> 00:41:52,000 Speaker 1: can't read a correspondence course on swimming and then just 819 00:41:52,040 --> 00:41:55,799 Speaker 1: go across the English channel, right. Uh, that's part of 820 00:41:55,840 --> 00:41:59,600 Speaker 1: the reason that we have to value primary sources, we 821 00:41:59,640 --> 00:42:02,280 Speaker 1: have to value cross checking, and we have to value 822 00:42:02,800 --> 00:42:09,000 Speaker 1: the credibility of something. But the disconnect perhaps comes from 823 00:42:09,040 --> 00:42:13,799 Speaker 1: seeking agency, right, because what's what's do do you think 824 00:42:13,840 --> 00:42:19,879 Speaker 1: people find psychologically find conspiracy theories comforting because the alternative 825 00:42:20,120 --> 00:42:26,560 Speaker 1: would be rampant incompetence and chaos. I know, well it's 826 00:42:26,640 --> 00:42:28,719 Speaker 1: on some level, But I I can answer this from 827 00:42:28,760 --> 00:42:30,480 Speaker 1: a personal point of view, you know, Like I said, 828 00:42:30,520 --> 00:42:35,600 Speaker 1: I love watching conspiracy stuff, and I think it comes 829 00:42:35,600 --> 00:42:39,359 Speaker 1: from because the alternative is very boring. Actually, like how 830 00:42:39,440 --> 00:42:41,759 Speaker 1: unbelievably boring is it to be? Like oh yeah, like 831 00:42:42,120 --> 00:42:45,680 Speaker 1: all the politicians are just horrific scumbags who come in 832 00:42:45,719 --> 00:42:49,719 Speaker 1: to get their money and power and leave. It's like, 833 00:42:49,760 --> 00:42:52,319 Speaker 1: oh that's I mean, that's obviously what's happening in my 834 00:42:52,360 --> 00:42:55,680 Speaker 1: opinion anyway. But it's like that's a bit more boring 835 00:42:55,719 --> 00:42:59,520 Speaker 1: than you know, eleven was an inside job. It's a 836 00:42:59,560 --> 00:43:03,399 Speaker 1: little bit more boring than all of that. So yeah, yeah, 837 00:43:03,440 --> 00:43:05,960 Speaker 1: maybe it's just and and and again. Like even me, man, 838 00:43:06,440 --> 00:43:08,759 Speaker 1: I watched what is it the New Pearl Harbor, like 839 00:43:08,840 --> 00:43:12,600 Speaker 1: some six hour documentary. It's like the new Loose Change, right, 840 00:43:13,080 --> 00:43:14,680 Speaker 1: about nine and eleven, I was like, oh, this is 841 00:43:14,719 --> 00:43:16,600 Speaker 1: going to be a treat. Let me get into this tonight, 842 00:43:16,640 --> 00:43:18,680 Speaker 1: and like properly, I was like laughing out loud at 843 00:43:18,680 --> 00:43:20,400 Speaker 1: some of it, but then some of it I was like, 844 00:43:21,480 --> 00:43:24,000 Speaker 1: And then when it finished, I was like, come on, man, 845 00:43:24,040 --> 00:43:26,719 Speaker 1: what's wrong with you? But there's that one percent of 846 00:43:26,760 --> 00:43:28,560 Speaker 1: like even in me, Like I feel like I'm quite 847 00:43:28,600 --> 00:43:30,719 Speaker 1: a logical guy, Like even me, the one percent of 848 00:43:30,719 --> 00:43:35,040 Speaker 1: Like that's interesting for me. Cryptids right, Bigfoot, and I 849 00:43:35,040 --> 00:43:38,120 Speaker 1: don't I think they might, you know, and people working 850 00:43:38,280 --> 00:43:40,439 Speaker 1: on Twitter, like someone said to me like, I can't 851 00:43:40,440 --> 00:43:43,319 Speaker 1: believe you're this like serious wa journalist and you're talking 852 00:43:43,360 --> 00:43:45,040 Speaker 1: about Mothman, Like what is wrong with you? And the 853 00:43:45,120 --> 00:43:47,279 Speaker 1: first thing I'm like, bore off, leave me alone. And 854 00:43:47,360 --> 00:43:49,879 Speaker 1: secondly I'm like, well, you know, I don't know, but 855 00:43:49,960 --> 00:43:52,640 Speaker 1: that's that's fine. That's cryptids. But like I think, what 856 00:43:52,760 --> 00:43:54,680 Speaker 1: my point I'm trying to get to is the curiosity. 857 00:43:54,960 --> 00:43:58,359 Speaker 1: People have curiosity like you just mentioned like Santa Claus, right, 858 00:43:58,719 --> 00:44:01,560 Speaker 1: kids love that, man, you know, any kids in my family, 859 00:44:01,560 --> 00:44:04,040 Speaker 1: I'll tell them, yeah, it's real because you see them like, wow, 860 00:44:04,040 --> 00:44:07,000 Speaker 1: it's on the sleigh and it's that's fun, man, that's 861 00:44:07,040 --> 00:44:10,080 Speaker 1: so exhilarating for a kid. And yeah, that's a good 862 00:44:10,120 --> 00:44:11,759 Speaker 1: example you use. I never thought of it that way, 863 00:44:11,760 --> 00:44:14,319 Speaker 1: because it's the same way for a conspiracy theory, like 864 00:44:14,360 --> 00:44:17,120 Speaker 1: don't worry, I've got the inside knowledge. That's so fun, 865 00:44:17,360 --> 00:44:20,319 Speaker 1: and yet it somehow manages to not just like wreck 866 00:44:20,400 --> 00:44:22,880 Speaker 1: your whole worldview and you find out or maybe it 867 00:44:22,960 --> 00:44:26,920 Speaker 1: does for some kids, like it's such a betrayal ultimately, 868 00:44:27,280 --> 00:44:30,440 Speaker 1: like oh, you actively to me on purpose, you know, 869 00:44:30,800 --> 00:44:33,160 Speaker 1: from my benefit, to give me joy or whatever. But 870 00:44:33,239 --> 00:44:35,439 Speaker 1: still it's like, if you're lying your ben, you've made 871 00:44:35,440 --> 00:44:37,160 Speaker 1: this point. If you're lying about this, what else are 872 00:44:37,200 --> 00:44:39,840 Speaker 1: you lying about? Is everybody lying about everything? You know? 873 00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:43,800 Speaker 1: That's exactly want to bring up no, because it feels 874 00:44:43,840 --> 00:44:46,520 Speaker 1: to me like just since two thousand five, which is 875 00:44:46,560 --> 00:44:49,080 Speaker 1: when Loose Change, I think that's when the first loose 876 00:44:49,160 --> 00:44:52,080 Speaker 1: change came out, and in between that one and the 877 00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:55,640 Speaker 1: last one we started the show. Uh, And it honestly 878 00:44:55,760 --> 00:44:58,480 Speaker 1: was because the loose change is one of those things 879 00:44:58,480 --> 00:45:02,040 Speaker 1: that really spurs your mind going to think differently, like 880 00:45:02,120 --> 00:45:06,040 Speaker 1: the matrix coming out in a lot of these the 881 00:45:06,080 --> 00:45:09,080 Speaker 1: media and things that make you want to think differently. 882 00:45:09,560 --> 00:45:13,800 Speaker 1: And then as you know, individuals like you start looking 883 00:45:13,840 --> 00:45:17,600 Speaker 1: into and researching something, whether it's a crypted whether it's 884 00:45:17,920 --> 00:45:20,880 Speaker 1: you know, a human experimentation that occurred in St. Louis. 885 00:45:21,200 --> 00:45:24,160 Speaker 1: In a certain time, you start you start to feel 886 00:45:24,200 --> 00:45:26,759 Speaker 1: like the rug is being pulled out from you completely 887 00:45:26,800 --> 00:45:30,080 Speaker 1: on what you used to believe, the truths you know 888 00:45:30,160 --> 00:45:33,240 Speaker 1: from Santa Claus all the way to how your local 889 00:45:33,280 --> 00:45:36,280 Speaker 1: government works, to how the government in your country works, 890 00:45:36,360 --> 00:45:40,280 Speaker 1: to how the planet itself functions. I mean, you're literally 891 00:45:41,320 --> 00:45:45,840 Speaker 1: I think what the Internet, combined with our curiosities, combined 892 00:45:45,920 --> 00:45:49,400 Speaker 1: with more and more people digging in further, has created 893 00:45:49,400 --> 00:45:53,239 Speaker 1: a situation where we not only like you said, this 894 00:45:53,280 --> 00:45:58,240 Speaker 1: post truth world. It's it's not just an individual posting 895 00:45:58,280 --> 00:46:01,120 Speaker 1: on Facebook something that isn't real and then that spreading 896 00:46:01,200 --> 00:46:04,600 Speaker 1: It is our minds. It is our our inability now 897 00:46:04,680 --> 00:46:08,600 Speaker 1: to know what is true because we feel like we've 898 00:46:08,640 --> 00:46:13,439 Speaker 1: been we've been played so many times throughout our lives, right, 899 00:46:13,480 --> 00:46:16,239 Speaker 1: but in some ways we have like I'm not talking 900 00:46:16,280 --> 00:46:19,759 Speaker 1: about conspiracy theories here, Like you know, I work in 901 00:46:19,800 --> 00:46:21,920 Speaker 1: the media and I've got you know, a lot of 902 00:46:21,920 --> 00:46:25,319 Speaker 1: good friends working what people call mainstream media you know, 903 00:46:25,360 --> 00:46:29,080 Speaker 1: I don't think there's anything wrong with mainstream media in 904 00:46:29,200 --> 00:46:32,719 Speaker 1: terms of individual stories, but as a whole, it is 905 00:46:32,760 --> 00:46:34,680 Speaker 1: a mess. And trust me, let me tell you from 906 00:46:34,719 --> 00:46:37,319 Speaker 1: someone on the inside. I mean, you guys are as well, 907 00:46:37,320 --> 00:46:38,560 Speaker 1: but you know what I mean. Like in the news, 908 00:46:38,680 --> 00:46:41,920 Speaker 1: the news section of it, like, it's a mess, man, Like, 909 00:46:41,960 --> 00:46:44,799 Speaker 1: it's a very serious mess. There are things that have 910 00:46:44,880 --> 00:46:48,560 Speaker 1: happened where, you know, I'm talking to commissioning, editors and 911 00:46:49,000 --> 00:46:51,920 Speaker 1: producers and they're saying like, oh no, it has to 912 00:46:51,920 --> 00:46:55,480 Speaker 1: be like this, And I'm thinking, Jesus Christ, how unbelievably 913 00:46:55,520 --> 00:46:57,880 Speaker 1: dishonest of you to want to sway it like that. 914 00:46:57,880 --> 00:47:00,799 Speaker 1: That's not because they're part of a cabal. It's not 915 00:47:01,000 --> 00:47:04,960 Speaker 1: the Jews, it's not the Freemasons or whatever whatever like 916 00:47:05,120 --> 00:47:07,400 Speaker 1: nonsense people want to say. It's just the way the 917 00:47:07,440 --> 00:47:10,840 Speaker 1: culture is now. We're becoming a culture war, and people, 918 00:47:10,960 --> 00:47:15,040 Speaker 1: without realizing it, sometimes end up securing a story because 919 00:47:15,040 --> 00:47:18,760 Speaker 1: it's like we have to have this angle. It's manufactured 920 00:47:18,920 --> 00:47:22,520 Speaker 1: kind of um. It's like a man of manufactured thought 921 00:47:22,560 --> 00:47:25,480 Speaker 1: process where it's like, well, if they're doing it like this, 922 00:47:25,640 --> 00:47:27,560 Speaker 1: then we have to do it like that. It's not 923 00:47:27,600 --> 00:47:30,759 Speaker 1: really you know, sometimes it is what it is. You 924 00:47:30,800 --> 00:47:33,239 Speaker 1: don't have to bring this angle on it. That's why 925 00:47:33,239 --> 00:47:36,120 Speaker 1: I you know, I remember when I was first advice News. 926 00:47:36,640 --> 00:47:38,680 Speaker 1: It was great. There was no agenda. It's like, what's 927 00:47:38,680 --> 00:47:41,160 Speaker 1: happening this and that's it. There was no well, how 928 00:47:41,160 --> 00:47:43,120 Speaker 1: can we link this to Trump? How can we It's 929 00:47:43,160 --> 00:47:45,000 Speaker 1: just this is happening, you know, And I thought that 930 00:47:45,120 --> 00:47:47,359 Speaker 1: was excellent. But I will say over the last couple 931 00:47:47,400 --> 00:47:50,560 Speaker 1: of years, I've just seen media in general go very strange, like, 932 00:47:51,560 --> 00:47:53,640 Speaker 1: and it's not just the right wing talking point. It 933 00:47:53,719 --> 00:47:56,760 Speaker 1: really isn't to say that like the news is becoming 934 00:47:57,080 --> 00:47:59,880 Speaker 1: specifically in America, no offense, but like I have some 935 00:48:00,080 --> 00:48:03,520 Speaker 1: times sometimes I watch Fox just just to laugh and 936 00:48:03,560 --> 00:48:05,880 Speaker 1: then I'll put on like, you know, the equivalent that 937 00:48:05,960 --> 00:48:08,239 Speaker 1: whatever it is, and and they just be like, it's 938 00:48:08,360 --> 00:48:10,760 Speaker 1: kind of the same thing, just from the different sides. 939 00:48:10,800 --> 00:48:12,279 Speaker 1: A lot of the time, you know, I do think 940 00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:14,560 Speaker 1: the right wingers are the worst. They're the they're the 941 00:48:14,560 --> 00:48:17,560 Speaker 1: biggest cry babies. Ironically, you know, they're telling everybody a snowflight, 942 00:48:17,600 --> 00:48:19,400 Speaker 1: but the second you deviate from what they want, they 943 00:48:19,480 --> 00:48:22,520 Speaker 1: cannot handle it. But I do think they're both actually 944 00:48:22,520 --> 00:48:24,759 Speaker 1: doing it so even when you get to that and 945 00:48:24,800 --> 00:48:28,520 Speaker 1: you recognize, okay, there's floors in the media, Like then 946 00:48:28,640 --> 00:48:30,719 Speaker 1: it's like you just said, the kind of everyone now 947 00:48:30,800 --> 00:48:33,080 Speaker 1: is not just conspiracy theorists. You know. Like even my 948 00:48:33,120 --> 00:48:35,960 Speaker 1: granddad was like, God's sake, can I just watch you know, 949 00:48:36,120 --> 00:48:38,120 Speaker 1: a very smart guy. I remember while because I can 950 00:48:38,200 --> 00:48:41,319 Speaker 1: I just watch something without being told, you know, they're 951 00:48:41,360 --> 00:48:44,680 Speaker 1: implying how you should feel about it. It's like, yeah, 952 00:48:44,880 --> 00:48:47,399 Speaker 1: like come on, I've got a new documentary coming out 953 00:48:47,440 --> 00:48:51,920 Speaker 1: soon about three D print guns. Yeah, yeah, three D 954 00:48:51,960 --> 00:48:54,440 Speaker 1: printing guns in Western Europe, and a few people messing 955 00:48:54,440 --> 00:48:56,359 Speaker 1: me like, oh, I'm very uncomfortable with this joke, Like 956 00:48:56,600 --> 00:48:58,919 Speaker 1: you you haven't really like presented it in a way 957 00:48:58,960 --> 00:49:01,719 Speaker 1: that makes, you know, kind of explains how bad this is. 958 00:49:01,800 --> 00:49:04,920 Speaker 1: And you know, I'm not saying I'm pro or anti. 959 00:49:05,000 --> 00:49:07,959 Speaker 1: It doesn't matter, you know, it's like, why do you care? 960 00:49:08,680 --> 00:49:11,560 Speaker 1: This is the information, here's what they're doing. You shouldn't 961 00:49:11,560 --> 00:49:14,200 Speaker 1: be concerned. I'm not, you know, I'm making you feel good. 962 00:49:14,239 --> 00:49:16,279 Speaker 1: I'm rubbing your belly and telling you what's right and wrong. 963 00:49:16,320 --> 00:49:19,200 Speaker 1: That's not the role of journalism, you know. Even someone 964 00:49:19,239 --> 00:49:20,719 Speaker 1: replied on the Twitter was like, oh, there's a lot 965 00:49:20,719 --> 00:49:23,319 Speaker 1: of Nazis are replying to you here, and I was like, yeah, 966 00:49:23,400 --> 00:49:26,640 Speaker 1: I hate them, but it's not my problem, you know, 967 00:49:26,800 --> 00:49:29,239 Speaker 1: like this is the information, it's not for them. It's 968 00:49:29,280 --> 00:49:32,160 Speaker 1: not for them. That's kind of how it should be processed. 969 00:49:32,200 --> 00:49:34,200 Speaker 1: And I'm not one of these people that believes in 970 00:49:34,239 --> 00:49:37,520 Speaker 1: complete objectivity, because there is right and wrong, you know. 971 00:49:37,840 --> 00:49:40,839 Speaker 1: But at the same time, you shouldn't seek out your 972 00:49:40,840 --> 00:49:43,840 Speaker 1: news to have your your kind of to be rocked 973 00:49:44,000 --> 00:49:46,080 Speaker 1: to sleep at night. The world is cruel and the 974 00:49:46,080 --> 00:49:48,759 Speaker 1: world is nasty and it's never going to change, and 975 00:49:48,800 --> 00:49:51,279 Speaker 1: I think you should take solace in being aware of 976 00:49:51,320 --> 00:49:54,160 Speaker 1: what's going on rather than someone telling you why you're 977 00:49:54,200 --> 00:49:56,320 Speaker 1: scared of that, you know, And I sound like a 978 00:49:56,440 --> 00:50:03,440 Speaker 1: conspiracy theories now, please realist, because the truth of the 979 00:50:03,480 --> 00:50:09,759 Speaker 1: matter is one great error that that the US news, right, 980 00:50:09,960 --> 00:50:13,120 Speaker 1: I would say, like the terrestrial radio the broadcast makes 981 00:50:13,360 --> 00:50:19,959 Speaker 1: is uh this conviction, that a rooneyous conviction that all 982 00:50:20,080 --> 00:50:24,239 Speaker 1: stories can be explained within three to five minutes, which 983 00:50:24,280 --> 00:50:27,719 Speaker 1: is sadly just not the truth. You know, almost none can, 984 00:50:27,800 --> 00:50:29,239 Speaker 1: to be honest, you know what I mean, None that 985 00:50:29,239 --> 00:50:32,120 Speaker 1: are that important, And that's a good point you brought 986 00:50:32,120 --> 00:50:35,080 Speaker 1: it there, because that's the kind of the format, right 987 00:50:35,280 --> 00:50:38,120 Speaker 1: the Internet. That ironically enough, like the Internet when I 988 00:50:38,120 --> 00:50:40,719 Speaker 1: remember loving blogs. I used to read blogs. I had 989 00:50:40,719 --> 00:50:42,880 Speaker 1: my own little blog when I first started, right, and 990 00:50:42,920 --> 00:50:45,160 Speaker 1: they're all gone now like the Internet used to be. 991 00:50:45,200 --> 00:50:46,879 Speaker 1: I see it like it used to be wide open, 992 00:50:46,960 --> 00:50:49,240 Speaker 1: and now it's ring fenced to social media, like barely 993 00:50:49,280 --> 00:50:52,520 Speaker 1: any blogs and that really do well now. And it's 994 00:50:52,560 --> 00:50:56,120 Speaker 1: like the Internet should have been the place where it 995 00:50:56,200 --> 00:50:58,040 Speaker 1: took all that away, right, it took all that three 996 00:50:58,040 --> 00:51:01,440 Speaker 1: minute explainer thing away. But now that we have Twitter 997 00:51:01,600 --> 00:51:04,840 Speaker 1: and now we have the social media's, it's almost like 998 00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:07,680 Speaker 1: back to the three minute explainer, right, Like a tweet, 999 00:51:07,680 --> 00:51:10,240 Speaker 1: people want to know within two or three tweets what's happening, 1000 00:51:11,080 --> 00:51:14,640 Speaker 1: and if not, they're just like whatever, I'll just make 1001 00:51:14,719 --> 00:51:16,520 Speaker 1: up my own mind, or I'll leave it or whatever. 1002 00:51:16,800 --> 00:51:19,399 Speaker 1: So unfortunately, I feel like that format is now being 1003 00:51:19,440 --> 00:51:22,279 Speaker 1: manufactured within the social media. I don't believe it's an 1004 00:51:22,320 --> 00:51:25,360 Speaker 1: attention span thing like that is. Netflix has proved that 1005 00:51:25,400 --> 00:51:27,799 Speaker 1: people will watch something for eight hours at a time 1006 00:51:28,080 --> 00:51:31,799 Speaker 1: if they're interested. I just think the interaction and the 1007 00:51:31,880 --> 00:51:35,880 Speaker 1: social aspect of it and the rapid fire of it is. Unfortunately, 1008 00:51:36,760 --> 00:51:38,640 Speaker 1: I guess what I'm saying, Like you said that, the 1009 00:51:38,680 --> 00:51:41,000 Speaker 1: kind of three minute explain has been recreated but into 1010 00:51:41,040 --> 00:51:43,439 Speaker 1: social media, and it's no good, man, it's no good. 1011 00:51:43,880 --> 00:51:45,799 Speaker 1: All right, We're gonna take a quick step away to 1012 00:51:45,920 --> 00:51:47,920 Speaker 1: hear a word from our sponsors, and then we'll be 1013 00:51:47,960 --> 00:51:57,399 Speaker 1: back with more from Jake. And we're back for more 1014 00:51:57,480 --> 00:52:00,960 Speaker 1: with Jake Hanrahan. One of the kind of repeating themes 1015 00:52:01,000 --> 00:52:03,640 Speaker 1: that you always hear about in like cult type situations 1016 00:52:03,760 --> 00:52:07,640 Speaker 1: is people becoming estranged from their families. Um. And with 1017 00:52:07,680 --> 00:52:10,560 Speaker 1: this Q and on thing, seeing that a ton you're 1018 00:52:10,560 --> 00:52:14,200 Speaker 1: reading about it, but I just I've experienced it personally. Really, 1019 00:52:14,239 --> 00:52:16,600 Speaker 1: dear friend of mine has essentially had to disconnect from 1020 00:52:16,600 --> 00:52:21,440 Speaker 1: our entire family. There's already political differences, but then they 1021 00:52:21,480 --> 00:52:24,560 Speaker 1: start going deep, deep, deep into this Q stuff and 1022 00:52:24,600 --> 00:52:27,720 Speaker 1: it's just like, who are you? We We have nothing 1023 00:52:27,760 --> 00:52:30,160 Speaker 1: in common anymore. How how do we talk to each other? 1024 00:52:30,320 --> 00:52:34,399 Speaker 1: How can I, you know, give you credit for being 1025 00:52:34,400 --> 00:52:37,240 Speaker 1: an empathetic person if you are just you know, spouting 1026 00:52:37,239 --> 00:52:42,200 Speaker 1: off all this stuff. Um. But yet cults typically have 1027 00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:44,759 Speaker 1: like a central leader, and with Q, all we have 1028 00:52:44,960 --> 00:52:48,480 Speaker 1: is this series of kind of disjointed ideas. That's just 1029 00:52:48,719 --> 00:52:51,719 Speaker 1: you know, crapped out on the internet. So is Q 1030 00:52:51,920 --> 00:52:54,080 Speaker 1: and on occult and and if it is, is it 1031 00:52:54,160 --> 00:52:56,239 Speaker 1: maybe like a new kind of cult that we haven't 1032 00:52:56,239 --> 00:52:58,880 Speaker 1: seen before, like one that's a product of the Internet 1033 00:52:58,920 --> 00:53:01,640 Speaker 1: age or I don't know, like it seems so culty 1034 00:53:01,800 --> 00:53:03,799 Speaker 1: but it doesn't follow all the rules, but it follow 1035 00:53:03,920 --> 00:53:06,040 Speaker 1: some of them. Is it making new rules for what 1036 00:53:06,160 --> 00:53:08,880 Speaker 1: I think? Um? I think you're right there. Yeah, it 1037 00:53:08,960 --> 00:53:11,600 Speaker 1: has like it's it's it's hitting there, you're hit thenail 1038 00:53:11,600 --> 00:53:13,440 Speaker 1: on the head with like it's new. Right, it's something 1039 00:53:13,440 --> 00:53:15,160 Speaker 1: else And maybe in ten years there will be a 1040 00:53:15,200 --> 00:53:17,440 Speaker 1: new word for what it is. But right now we're 1041 00:53:17,480 --> 00:53:20,200 Speaker 1: kind of seeing the genesis of it. Right, So you know, 1042 00:53:20,360 --> 00:53:22,279 Speaker 1: for a while I didn't believe. I was like, it's 1043 00:53:22,320 --> 00:53:24,839 Speaker 1: not a cult, man, get real. And then Sarah hire 1044 00:53:24,880 --> 00:53:27,560 Speaker 1: Tower researcher, he's helping me a lot with Q clearance. 1045 00:53:27,600 --> 00:53:30,600 Speaker 1: She's like, you know, the researcher with me on this. Um, 1046 00:53:30,760 --> 00:53:33,040 Speaker 1: she's always been pushing from kind of day one, like 1047 00:53:33,080 --> 00:53:34,480 Speaker 1: this is a cult. This is a cult. And she 1048 00:53:34,560 --> 00:53:37,719 Speaker 1: specializes in researching cults. And the more I spoiled to it, 1049 00:53:37,760 --> 00:53:39,240 Speaker 1: the more I looked at it, and I was like, yeah, actually, 1050 00:53:39,280 --> 00:53:41,759 Speaker 1: it kind of is just because it doesn't have a compound, 1051 00:53:41,840 --> 00:53:45,160 Speaker 1: just because you know, there's no Jim Jones out there 1052 00:53:45,160 --> 00:53:48,239 Speaker 1: in people's faces. It doesn't really matter. Like you said, 1053 00:53:48,239 --> 00:53:50,640 Speaker 1: it's the new thing, right, people live online now, you know, 1054 00:53:50,840 --> 00:53:54,000 Speaker 1: people get there everything, they get their dopamine fixed online. 1055 00:53:54,280 --> 00:53:56,440 Speaker 1: They show the whole world a fake image of themselves 1056 00:53:56,440 --> 00:53:58,799 Speaker 1: online to let everybody know that life is good, even 1057 00:53:58,840 --> 00:54:01,640 Speaker 1: if it isn't. Pull shop online, you know, you don't 1058 00:54:01,640 --> 00:54:03,120 Speaker 1: even when was the last time you went into a 1059 00:54:03,120 --> 00:54:04,960 Speaker 1: shop to try a coat on me on like size 1060 00:54:05,040 --> 00:54:07,840 Speaker 1: large by, you know what I mean. It's so crazy 1061 00:54:08,040 --> 00:54:10,680 Speaker 1: and and it does. It makes sense then that the 1062 00:54:10,680 --> 00:54:13,880 Speaker 1: compound is now online, right, the compound whatever or the 1063 00:54:13,960 --> 00:54:17,320 Speaker 1: leader is online, qu is online, and perhaps the compound 1064 00:54:17,440 --> 00:54:20,080 Speaker 1: is the websites that's he's on, or maybe the compound 1065 00:54:20,200 --> 00:54:22,799 Speaker 1: is the community they put themselves in because they kind 1066 00:54:22,800 --> 00:54:25,080 Speaker 1: of have and it's spilled out into the real world. 1067 00:54:25,120 --> 00:54:27,000 Speaker 1: We've seen it, you know. There's loads of these q 1068 00:54:27,200 --> 00:54:30,400 Speaker 1: and on rallies And there was even a Florida SWAT 1069 00:54:31,080 --> 00:54:34,920 Speaker 1: officer who had a q and on patch when he 1070 00:54:34,960 --> 00:54:39,279 Speaker 1: met Mike Pence. It's out there, you know, it's real world. 1071 00:54:39,280 --> 00:54:41,239 Speaker 1: There was a guy that built an armored vehicle for 1072 00:54:41,320 --> 00:54:43,440 Speaker 1: himself from block to bridge because of Q and On. 1073 00:54:43,560 --> 00:54:48,000 Speaker 1: He had nine rounds and all these weapons. So yeah, 1074 00:54:48,320 --> 00:54:50,160 Speaker 1: it kind of is a cult, I think. You know, 1075 00:54:50,280 --> 00:54:54,080 Speaker 1: it's just like you said, it's different. It's decentralized in 1076 00:54:54,120 --> 00:54:56,319 Speaker 1: a way because of the you know, they don't have 1077 00:54:56,360 --> 00:54:58,759 Speaker 1: a place where they live or whatever, but they live 1078 00:54:58,800 --> 00:55:01,560 Speaker 1: online like we all live online. Now, it's not specific 1079 00:55:01,600 --> 00:55:06,040 Speaker 1: to them. It's almost like, how to explain it? That 1080 00:55:06,080 --> 00:55:09,799 Speaker 1: was a secondary thing. We're all living online already, and 1081 00:55:09,840 --> 00:55:12,040 Speaker 1: then here's the cult thing. It wasn't like you have 1082 00:55:12,120 --> 00:55:14,439 Speaker 1: to live online to be in the cold. We're already there, man, 1083 00:55:14,560 --> 00:55:16,799 Speaker 1: you know. And now it's just kind of coalesced in 1084 00:55:16,880 --> 00:55:20,080 Speaker 1: Q and On for them. But I don't think that 1085 00:55:20,080 --> 00:55:25,600 Speaker 1: that's particularly specific to them. You know, it just is 1086 00:55:25,640 --> 00:55:27,080 Speaker 1: what I mean, you get weird. I remember I was 1087 00:55:27,120 --> 00:55:29,480 Speaker 1: researching the thing I wanted to make a documentary about 1088 00:55:29,960 --> 00:55:33,239 Speaker 1: there's these weird kind of fan girls of school shooters, 1089 00:55:33,280 --> 00:55:35,360 Speaker 1: and I wanted to do a documentary where we go 1090 00:55:35,440 --> 00:55:37,120 Speaker 1: and meet the morning, like why do you love the 1091 00:55:37,160 --> 00:55:40,560 Speaker 1: shoot shooters? Mate? They had a thing where this girl 1092 00:55:40,600 --> 00:55:43,719 Speaker 1: had a pillow with the Columbine Killers faces on them. Right, 1093 00:55:43,760 --> 00:55:47,680 Speaker 1: it's just next level, right, horrific but fascinating at the 1094 00:55:47,719 --> 00:55:50,520 Speaker 1: same time. And when you look at it, that is 1095 00:55:50,640 --> 00:55:53,000 Speaker 1: kind of a cult like thing in a way because 1096 00:55:53,040 --> 00:55:55,160 Speaker 1: it started on the Inn and they formed their own community. 1097 00:55:55,239 --> 00:55:57,520 Speaker 1: So my point is, I think we have to re 1098 00:55:57,600 --> 00:55:59,520 Speaker 1: look at what is a cult and what isn't. It's 1099 00:55:59,600 --> 00:56:01,759 Speaker 1: it's not it's not your granddad's cult, you know what 1100 00:56:01,800 --> 00:56:03,920 Speaker 1: I mean, It's not. It's not that anymore. You know, 1101 00:56:04,560 --> 00:56:08,359 Speaker 1: it isn't you know, I don't think that. I think 1102 00:56:08,400 --> 00:56:11,560 Speaker 1: that's the minority. Now. You know this weird nexium co um. 1103 00:56:11,600 --> 00:56:13,239 Speaker 1: I know you guys have done stuff on that and 1104 00:56:13,280 --> 00:56:16,880 Speaker 1: like that is much smaller now these days than online 1105 00:56:17,040 --> 00:56:20,839 Speaker 1: kind of cult ish things, um. And I think it's 1106 00:56:20,880 --> 00:56:23,200 Speaker 1: the way forward in a bad way. And I don't 1107 00:56:23,200 --> 00:56:25,520 Speaker 1: mean in a good way like let's do more. I mean, 1108 00:56:25,600 --> 00:56:27,879 Speaker 1: like this is how it's going to progress. I think 1109 00:56:27,960 --> 00:56:32,040 Speaker 1: online from now. What's interesting there is any community can 1110 00:56:32,080 --> 00:56:36,319 Speaker 1: acquire cult like characteristics, right, it doesn't have to be 1111 00:56:36,920 --> 00:56:40,600 Speaker 1: really the compound is defined by the commonality of experience, 1112 00:56:40,600 --> 00:56:44,480 Speaker 1: and we know that when groups aggregate and they coalesce 1113 00:56:44,719 --> 00:56:50,279 Speaker 1: around a specific set of commonalities. They tend to self well. 1114 00:56:50,360 --> 00:56:55,280 Speaker 1: I don't want to sound like like some counterintelligence mumbo jumbo, 1115 00:56:55,320 --> 00:56:57,879 Speaker 1: but they do tend to radicalize to a degree. Right, 1116 00:56:57,920 --> 00:57:00,600 Speaker 1: if you have someone casually join a cape up for him, 1117 00:57:00,800 --> 00:57:02,440 Speaker 1: you know, I mean to pick our cape up here, 1118 00:57:02,480 --> 00:57:04,640 Speaker 1: but they casually join a cape up for him because 1119 00:57:04,640 --> 00:57:07,759 Speaker 1: they like a song from a band and they stick 1120 00:57:07,800 --> 00:57:11,759 Speaker 1: with it. Then six months later, study show they'll double down. 1121 00:57:11,800 --> 00:57:14,600 Speaker 1: They will come after you on Twitter like angry hornets 1122 00:57:14,640 --> 00:57:18,560 Speaker 1: as well. They are so well organized, like god forbid 1123 00:57:18,600 --> 00:57:21,160 Speaker 1: they ever become militant, like they will wipe everybody out. 1124 00:57:21,480 --> 00:57:24,720 Speaker 1: But you're right, like the compound is not the building 1125 00:57:24,800 --> 00:57:27,720 Speaker 1: the you know, like Jonestown or whatever. Like let's say Waco, 1126 00:57:27,960 --> 00:57:29,760 Speaker 1: the compound wasn't the house. They didn't just go, oh, 1127 00:57:29,880 --> 00:57:31,560 Speaker 1: let's go and live there because we like this house. 1128 00:57:32,000 --> 00:57:34,919 Speaker 1: They they the compound was just just like a part 1129 00:57:34,960 --> 00:57:36,880 Speaker 1: of the building. Right. But why they're there in the 1130 00:57:36,920 --> 00:57:40,520 Speaker 1: first place is you know, that's the cult, right, And 1131 00:57:40,600 --> 00:57:44,400 Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, just because that's not in a physical building, 1132 00:57:44,600 --> 00:57:47,400 Speaker 1: it can still exist as a concept, right, all right, 1133 00:57:47,440 --> 00:57:49,640 Speaker 1: So I know, I think as we're recording this. We're 1134 00:57:49,640 --> 00:57:54,240 Speaker 1: three episodes into the podcast. You clearance? Is that correct? Maybe? 1135 00:57:54,320 --> 00:57:58,320 Speaker 1: Four three three three? You're right? Okay, Um, so we 1136 00:57:58,320 --> 00:58:01,120 Speaker 1: we we've certainly got more to learn, at least from 1137 00:58:01,160 --> 00:58:04,880 Speaker 1: our end as listeners. Um. I wanted to point one 1138 00:58:04,920 --> 00:58:07,520 Speaker 1: thing out to you. Your show is on the I 1139 00:58:07,560 --> 00:58:10,840 Speaker 1: Heart Radio network, as is ours. You know that Hillary 1140 00:58:10,880 --> 00:58:13,040 Speaker 1: Clinton has a show on the I Heart Radio network, 1141 00:58:13,120 --> 00:58:17,600 Speaker 1: right or her body double? I mean, I'm saying, Jake, 1142 00:58:17,720 --> 00:58:21,200 Speaker 1: I think maybe you actually have a chance to get 1143 00:58:21,440 --> 00:58:24,800 Speaker 1: Hillary on your show at some point. Well, I probably 1144 00:58:24,840 --> 00:58:28,680 Speaker 1: not because in some of the promotional work that my 1145 00:58:29,040 --> 00:58:31,840 Speaker 1: graphic designer made for me, like we put Lary Clinton 1146 00:58:31,880 --> 00:58:36,400 Speaker 1: with like lizard eyes on it, So I don't think 1147 00:58:36,480 --> 00:58:43,160 Speaker 1: so a great sense of humor. Well, in the first 1148 00:58:43,200 --> 00:58:45,320 Speaker 1: episode as well, I'm like, I'm not a Hillary support. 1149 00:58:45,360 --> 00:58:46,960 Speaker 1: I'm not a Trump support. Like I kind of in 1150 00:58:46,960 --> 00:58:49,000 Speaker 1: the first episode wanted to let everybody know this and 1151 00:58:49,040 --> 00:58:51,520 Speaker 1: this and this, But I would love to get Hillary 1152 00:58:51,560 --> 00:58:54,080 Speaker 1: on and be like, you know, are you really you? 1153 00:58:54,320 --> 00:58:56,200 Speaker 1: But I don't know if I can trust myself to 1154 00:58:56,280 --> 00:59:00,240 Speaker 1: not go ridiculous and just be like I would probably 1155 00:59:00,320 --> 00:59:04,240 Speaker 1: cancel myself from my heart forever. But I don't know 1156 00:59:04,240 --> 00:59:06,320 Speaker 1: if I trust myself, but I would love to do that. 1157 00:59:06,360 --> 00:59:08,840 Speaker 1: It would actually be like do you know what would 1158 00:59:08,840 --> 00:59:11,480 Speaker 1: be interesting? Like jokes aside to kind of she must 1159 00:59:11,520 --> 00:59:14,240 Speaker 1: be aware of it, right, I would love to be like, hey, like, 1160 00:59:14,720 --> 00:59:17,520 Speaker 1: how do you look one of the so what is 1161 00:59:17,560 --> 00:59:20,280 Speaker 1: it called fizzle drip or something? Frizzle drip. That's a 1162 00:59:20,320 --> 00:59:23,480 Speaker 1: part of the Q and On mythos where man, this 1163 00:59:23,560 --> 00:59:26,720 Speaker 1: is dark, but they literally believe there's a video of 1164 00:59:26,800 --> 00:59:30,440 Speaker 1: Hillary Clinton cutting a kid's face off and wearing it Like, 1165 00:59:30,880 --> 00:59:32,880 Speaker 1: I would love to be like, how do you feel 1166 00:59:33,440 --> 00:59:37,400 Speaker 1: about the fact hundreds of thousands of people across the 1167 00:59:37,440 --> 00:59:41,040 Speaker 1: world believe this is real? And one interesting part of 1168 00:59:41,080 --> 00:59:44,440 Speaker 1: this is the screenshot that they will say is from 1169 00:59:44,440 --> 00:59:47,560 Speaker 1: this video, right, It's literally a screenshot of like some 1170 00:59:47,600 --> 00:59:50,240 Speaker 1: Brazilian women. I think they're in like a laundrette, like 1171 00:59:50,280 --> 00:59:52,600 Speaker 1: a laundro amount or something. But then some Q and 1172 00:59:52,680 --> 00:59:56,080 Speaker 1: On people kind of black bits out of it, redacted 1173 00:59:56,120 --> 00:59:57,680 Speaker 1: bits of what we had to cover this because that 1174 00:59:57,720 --> 01:00:00,000 Speaker 1: was a dead baby. They put like a red hue 1175 01:00:00,040 --> 01:00:02,800 Speaker 1: on it and it looks kind of sinister. But then 1176 01:00:02,800 --> 01:00:05,040 Speaker 1: when you see the real patriots, just like two women 1177 01:00:05,080 --> 01:00:08,919 Speaker 1: sat there like just watching TV. You know, um yeah, 1178 01:00:09,000 --> 01:00:10,920 Speaker 1: I mean that must be horrible. I mean I don't know. 1179 01:00:11,040 --> 01:00:13,720 Speaker 1: You know, she's obviously like very like bulletproof in terms 1180 01:00:13,720 --> 01:00:15,720 Speaker 1: of thick skin you have to be as a politician. 1181 01:00:16,200 --> 01:00:19,240 Speaker 1: But it must be horrible to think like Jesus Christ, 1182 01:00:19,320 --> 01:00:22,160 Speaker 1: like people think I do this, you know, um, and 1183 01:00:22,160 --> 01:00:30,240 Speaker 1: then I'd be like, did you do it? Hillary would yeah, yeah, right, 1184 01:00:30,360 --> 01:00:33,360 Speaker 1: but but now and it must be strange, like anyone 1185 01:00:33,400 --> 01:00:36,200 Speaker 1: that's in that kind of universe, I mean, I would 1186 01:00:36,200 --> 01:00:37,720 Speaker 1: hate it. I'm sure they're going to come up with 1187 01:00:37,800 --> 01:00:39,720 Speaker 1: something for me at the end of this. I mean 1188 01:00:40,160 --> 01:00:42,120 Speaker 1: I've actually asked some of them. I've like, I want 1189 01:00:42,120 --> 01:00:44,520 Speaker 1: you on. I don't believe in deep platform me. I'm 1190 01:00:44,560 --> 01:00:46,800 Speaker 1: not really about that. And I've said to some of 1191 01:00:46,840 --> 01:00:49,880 Speaker 1: the more rational ones, like, come onto the podcast and 1192 01:00:49,920 --> 01:00:52,240 Speaker 1: make your case for why it's real and whatever. We'll 1193 01:00:52,280 --> 01:00:54,760 Speaker 1: have an actual discussion. I'm not gonna laugh at you. 1194 01:00:54,840 --> 01:00:56,360 Speaker 1: I'm not going to tell you an idiot. Will just 1195 01:00:56,400 --> 01:00:58,240 Speaker 1: say like, you say what you think, and then I 1196 01:00:58,320 --> 01:01:00,560 Speaker 1: can say why I think that's outrageous. No's it. We'll 1197 01:01:00,600 --> 01:01:02,400 Speaker 1: have it. We'll have a civil conversation. None of them, 1198 01:01:02,640 --> 01:01:05,160 Speaker 1: Not one of them has agreed or even replied. And 1199 01:01:05,200 --> 01:01:06,800 Speaker 1: I know they've seen it because I know these are 1200 01:01:06,800 --> 01:01:09,240 Speaker 1: the people that I've already conversed with before. None of 1201 01:01:09,240 --> 01:01:11,360 Speaker 1: them want to do that. Maybe they think that it's 1202 01:01:11,400 --> 01:01:13,560 Speaker 1: a trap. I don't know, you know, I can't really 1203 01:01:13,920 --> 01:01:16,560 Speaker 1: I can't really say, but I think it's important to 1204 01:01:16,560 --> 01:01:19,280 Speaker 1: do that. And you know, it's a good point you 1205 01:01:19,280 --> 01:01:21,560 Speaker 1: say about Hillary, like it affects people in different ways, 1206 01:01:21,600 --> 01:01:24,360 Speaker 1: you know, like I mean, her kids must know about it. 1207 01:01:24,400 --> 01:01:26,320 Speaker 1: They must be online all the time, you know, like 1208 01:01:26,360 --> 01:01:30,480 Speaker 1: everybody's kids are, must be weird, must be weird. I'll 1209 01:01:30,520 --> 01:01:34,000 Speaker 1: ask her, who see Hillary? If you hear this, don't 1210 01:01:34,040 --> 01:01:37,800 Speaker 1: worry about the lizard eyes, Like, let's go. So the 1211 01:01:37,960 --> 01:01:43,280 Speaker 1: artwork is negotiable. So one question that we know everybody 1212 01:01:43,400 --> 01:01:47,600 Speaker 1: is asking that you may not be able to answer, Jake, 1213 01:01:47,760 --> 01:01:51,000 Speaker 1: yet it's it's something we have to bring up out 1214 01:01:51,040 --> 01:01:54,440 Speaker 1: of all the theories, the big, the big badger in 1215 01:01:54,440 --> 01:01:58,520 Speaker 1: the room here is are there any compelling leads on 1216 01:01:58,600 --> 01:02:03,120 Speaker 1: the identity or identities of the so called Q? And 1217 01:02:03,160 --> 01:02:07,520 Speaker 1: by like compelling, we're talking about the gamut of things, right, Like, Matt, 1218 01:02:07,560 --> 01:02:11,440 Speaker 1: you have a you have a suspect, right. It sounds 1219 01:02:11,440 --> 01:02:14,720 Speaker 1: super silly in my head right now, but I have 1220 01:02:14,840 --> 01:02:18,280 Speaker 1: seen a lot of people online questioning whether or not 1221 01:02:18,400 --> 01:02:24,080 Speaker 1: Q actually is Donald Trump the president. Um is that ridiculous? 1222 01:02:24,120 --> 01:02:27,480 Speaker 1: And why he's online a lot? I mean he's on 1223 01:02:27,520 --> 01:02:29,360 Speaker 1: Twitter a lot. Maybe he's on four Channel a lot 1224 01:02:29,400 --> 01:02:32,640 Speaker 1: as well. Um. So actually what's even more fun is 1225 01:02:32,800 --> 01:02:36,360 Speaker 1: so Q and One's believe Q plus is Trump. So 1226 01:02:36,440 --> 01:02:39,240 Speaker 1: there's there's Q and there's Q plus, which is like 1227 01:02:39,280 --> 01:02:42,560 Speaker 1: the extended team, right, and they believe Q plus is 1228 01:02:42,600 --> 01:02:45,400 Speaker 1: Trump because Trump, you know, he does this thing where 1229 01:02:45,400 --> 01:02:47,440 Speaker 1: he points people out in the crowd when he's wandering 1230 01:02:47,440 --> 01:02:49,880 Speaker 1: around and that, and he must have done like just 1231 01:02:49,960 --> 01:02:52,600 Speaker 1: pointed at someone basically, and they're like, look, he's doing 1232 01:02:52,600 --> 01:02:56,080 Speaker 1: a cute plus. I mean, to be honest, actually he 1233 01:02:56,160 --> 01:02:58,439 Speaker 1: does do like a weird thing. But he's just going 1234 01:02:58,480 --> 01:02:59,800 Speaker 1: like that guy there that you know what I mean, 1235 01:02:59,840 --> 01:03:05,080 Speaker 1: as anybody does. Um. But no, I would love if 1236 01:03:05,120 --> 01:03:06,880 Speaker 1: you know, like I know it sounds bad, but I 1237 01:03:06,960 --> 01:03:09,520 Speaker 1: would love if you and on was real and if 1238 01:03:09,600 --> 01:03:12,560 Speaker 1: we will all wrong, it would just be the funniest 1239 01:03:12,680 --> 01:03:17,760 Speaker 1: end to right. It would just incredible. Really, that dude 1240 01:03:17,800 --> 01:03:21,600 Speaker 1: is capable of this much subtext like he's a pretty 1241 01:03:21,600 --> 01:03:24,800 Speaker 1: surfacing guy, you know what you think about his politics, 1242 01:03:24,840 --> 01:03:26,680 Speaker 1: Like he's kind of what you see is what you get. 1243 01:03:26,960 --> 01:03:29,840 Speaker 1: That's always the impression that it would just be great though, 1244 01:03:30,280 --> 01:03:36,960 Speaker 1: like like me like laughing my head off as the 1245 01:03:37,000 --> 01:03:39,360 Speaker 1: stormtroopers kick off my door and send me to prison 1246 01:03:39,400 --> 01:03:43,360 Speaker 1: for like believing. Yeah, you know what I mean. But 1247 01:03:44,200 --> 01:03:46,120 Speaker 1: speaking of Jake, I don't want to alarm you, but 1248 01:03:46,240 --> 01:03:49,000 Speaker 1: your your door that is directly behind the door, just 1249 01:03:49,160 --> 01:03:54,040 Speaker 1: open up seriously, Okay. Yeah, I wasn't gonna say anything 1250 01:03:54,120 --> 01:03:58,040 Speaker 1: like yeah, Hillary is at you, but like, no, man, 1251 01:03:58,120 --> 01:04:01,400 Speaker 1: it's um I mean, no, there's nothing, but obviously there's nothing, 1252 01:04:01,440 --> 01:04:03,800 Speaker 1: but like it's one of these ones where like I 1253 01:04:04,160 --> 01:04:06,600 Speaker 1: sometimes I do actually try and put my head into 1254 01:04:06,600 --> 01:04:08,960 Speaker 1: the mind of the Q and on person And I 1255 01:04:09,000 --> 01:04:11,120 Speaker 1: look back to when I was like thirteen, and I 1256 01:04:11,160 --> 01:04:13,640 Speaker 1: was like nine eleven is an inside job, and like 1257 01:04:13,720 --> 01:04:15,919 Speaker 1: I loved all that. It was like I was like 1258 01:04:16,240 --> 01:04:18,480 Speaker 1: the conspiracy guy before anyone was. I was trying to 1259 01:04:18,520 --> 01:04:20,600 Speaker 1: tell my friends and they were like what what shut 1260 01:04:20,640 --> 01:04:23,200 Speaker 1: up Jake, Like go away, like you're crazy. I mean 1261 01:04:23,240 --> 01:04:24,800 Speaker 1: I probably had like a year of that before I 1262 01:04:24,880 --> 01:04:27,080 Speaker 1: kind of started reading real books and was like, oh 1263 01:04:27,200 --> 01:04:30,200 Speaker 1: what But um, you know, I try and put myself 1264 01:04:30,200 --> 01:04:32,200 Speaker 1: into like my younger self and think like, oh, well 1265 01:04:32,240 --> 01:04:36,440 Speaker 1: and I can I can see the coincidences, which is 1266 01:04:36,520 --> 01:04:39,480 Speaker 1: so unbelievably small. But when they're wrapped up in it, 1267 01:04:39,800 --> 01:04:42,240 Speaker 1: they need anything to make this real. So if you 1268 01:04:42,320 --> 01:04:45,040 Speaker 1: just give them a crumb, it's like they'll take that. 1269 01:04:45,040 --> 01:04:48,000 Speaker 1: That's a whole cake for them, you know. So there 1270 01:04:48,000 --> 01:04:50,240 Speaker 1: are very few and far between, you know, Like I 1271 01:04:50,240 --> 01:04:52,760 Speaker 1: think one was like a typo Trump did and they 1272 01:04:52,760 --> 01:04:57,720 Speaker 1: were like, ha, drop one two whatever. You also used 1273 01:04:57,720 --> 01:05:00,840 Speaker 1: the semi coode on there. We know it's him, you know, 1274 01:05:00,880 --> 01:05:07,040 Speaker 1: and so there is that. Um that's right, right, Oh god, 1275 01:05:07,080 --> 01:05:12,640 Speaker 1: that was so insufferable. Um, but no, there's no question 1276 01:05:13,280 --> 01:05:17,520 Speaker 1: I don't think it's Trump. No, Okay, well, well we'll 1277 01:05:17,560 --> 01:05:19,920 Speaker 1: look forward to what we'll only be able to describe 1278 01:05:19,920 --> 01:05:25,560 Speaker 1: a classic if it does end up being the current president. Uh. 1279 01:05:25,720 --> 01:05:27,880 Speaker 1: At this point, we do want to say, as we 1280 01:05:28,000 --> 01:05:33,120 Speaker 1: pointed out that this show is ongoing, Q clearance is ongoing, 1281 01:05:33,640 --> 01:05:37,120 Speaker 1: there are things that Jake, you cannot reveal to us 1282 01:05:37,200 --> 01:05:41,200 Speaker 1: yet right as as we're in media arrest here. But 1283 01:05:41,720 --> 01:05:47,680 Speaker 1: for everyone who is waiting to hear the conclusion of 1284 01:05:47,680 --> 01:05:50,800 Speaker 1: of this podcast. We don't want to let the opportunity 1285 01:05:50,840 --> 01:05:54,280 Speaker 1: pass without asking just a couple more questions about popular 1286 01:05:54,400 --> 01:05:59,360 Speaker 1: front So this is this is independent, this is something now, 1287 01:05:59,360 --> 01:06:03,040 Speaker 1: it's now, it's across multiple platforms. Is started eighteen as 1288 01:06:03,480 --> 01:06:09,200 Speaker 1: originally as a podcast, and you've interviewed some fascinating people 1289 01:06:09,640 --> 01:06:13,840 Speaker 1: also recently, like you talked about Ivan the Troll regarding 1290 01:06:13,880 --> 01:06:17,560 Speaker 1: three D printed firearms. Uh, you talked about something we 1291 01:06:17,640 --> 01:06:21,680 Speaker 1: explore pretty often, the world of drone warfare. I think 1292 01:06:21,680 --> 01:06:25,480 Speaker 1: that's one of the most recent episodes. With all this 1293 01:06:25,560 --> 01:06:30,959 Speaker 1: in mind, what God is so depressing? But what what 1294 01:06:31,040 --> 01:06:34,800 Speaker 1: trends do you see for conflict in the future. What 1295 01:06:34,840 --> 01:06:37,680 Speaker 1: do you wish more audiences, maybe in the bubble of 1296 01:06:37,720 --> 01:06:42,360 Speaker 1: the West, understood about what's happening out there. M M, yeah, 1297 01:06:42,400 --> 01:06:46,000 Speaker 1: it is. It is. Well, it's not depressing. It is depressing, 1298 01:06:46,360 --> 01:06:49,080 Speaker 1: but I think it's less the pressing to be aware 1299 01:06:49,080 --> 01:06:51,000 Speaker 1: of it, right, It's better to be like, let's be 1300 01:06:51,040 --> 01:06:54,000 Speaker 1: aware of it rather than bury our heads. So I 1301 01:06:54,040 --> 01:06:58,320 Speaker 1: think the trends unfortunately going forward, I see fascism making 1302 01:06:58,400 --> 01:07:02,080 Speaker 1: like quite a largely and I don't mean anything. I 1303 01:07:02,120 --> 01:07:04,880 Speaker 1: don't like his fascism. I mean like real actual like 1304 01:07:05,000 --> 01:07:08,800 Speaker 1: fascism within government's fascism within like militant groups, you know, 1305 01:07:09,040 --> 01:07:12,200 Speaker 1: getting powerful like that fascist militant groups, and that is 1306 01:07:12,240 --> 01:07:14,440 Speaker 1: a real worry man. Like in Europe as well, we're 1307 01:07:14,440 --> 01:07:16,640 Speaker 1: seeing a lot of that. I think this whole, like 1308 01:07:17,800 --> 01:07:19,919 Speaker 1: I don't know, populism is probably not the right word, 1309 01:07:19,960 --> 01:07:22,840 Speaker 1: but I'll use that the whole, like right wing populism 1310 01:07:23,160 --> 01:07:25,680 Speaker 1: is kind of I think that's here to stay for 1311 01:07:25,720 --> 01:07:28,479 Speaker 1: at least the next five years. Perhaps I'm talking about 1312 01:07:28,560 --> 01:07:31,120 Speaker 1: r I'm in Europe um, so that's us. But then 1313 01:07:31,160 --> 01:07:33,800 Speaker 1: in terms of like the wars and the conflicts going on, 1314 01:07:34,000 --> 01:07:38,200 Speaker 1: it's just like it's it's at the brink now where 1315 01:07:38,240 --> 01:07:41,560 Speaker 1: I think a lot is going to start happening. And 1316 01:07:41,720 --> 01:07:43,560 Speaker 1: I don't want to tie it to Trump or anything 1317 01:07:43,600 --> 01:07:46,280 Speaker 1: like that, but I do think there's been a shift 1318 01:07:46,920 --> 01:07:49,520 Speaker 1: and a lot of authoritarian governments can kind of be 1319 01:07:49,640 --> 01:07:52,160 Speaker 1: like we can get away with more now. Now. I'm 1320 01:07:52,200 --> 01:07:55,040 Speaker 1: not arguing that like, oh yeah, let's have more American interventions. 1321 01:07:55,080 --> 01:07:57,360 Speaker 1: Certainly not. I mean that's why Iraq is the way 1322 01:07:57,400 --> 01:08:00,360 Speaker 1: it is right and many other places. But but there 1323 01:08:00,440 --> 01:08:04,160 Speaker 1: is a thing of like people, there's always going to 1324 01:08:04,240 --> 01:08:06,160 Speaker 1: be someone bully the rest of the world, right, and 1325 01:08:06,200 --> 01:08:09,000 Speaker 1: I just think the bullies are changing now. I think, 1326 01:08:09,240 --> 01:08:12,880 Speaker 1: you know China, which you know, it's an absolute fact 1327 01:08:12,960 --> 01:08:16,280 Speaker 1: that they're like like a techno dictatorship, you know, like 1328 01:08:16,320 --> 01:08:18,880 Speaker 1: look at the wager it's been put into concentration camps. 1329 01:08:18,920 --> 01:08:21,840 Speaker 1: It's terrific just for being a Muslim, you know. So 1330 01:08:22,280 --> 01:08:24,880 Speaker 1: that the kind of indifference from the world to that, 1331 01:08:25,000 --> 01:08:27,040 Speaker 1: it's it was a real eye opener for me. I 1332 01:08:27,160 --> 01:08:29,479 Speaker 1: was like, Wow, what about what happened to never again? 1333 01:08:29,640 --> 01:08:33,479 Speaker 1: You know what I mean? Um, there's like evidence, there's proof, 1334 01:08:33,680 --> 01:08:37,240 Speaker 1: and it's just like everyone's just like it just happens. 1335 01:08:37,600 --> 01:08:38,960 Speaker 1: But then it's like, what do you want to do? 1336 01:08:39,080 --> 01:08:41,519 Speaker 1: What we're gonna do invade China? Like no, Like I 1337 01:08:41,520 --> 01:08:45,360 Speaker 1: don't know what the answer is, man um, But I 1338 01:08:45,439 --> 01:08:47,479 Speaker 1: just see it looking bad, you know. I think this 1339 01:08:47,560 --> 01:08:49,800 Speaker 1: thing with Armenia and as by John Is is really 1340 01:08:51,200 --> 01:08:53,840 Speaker 1: a problem, and I think it's one of these wars 1341 01:08:53,960 --> 01:08:59,080 Speaker 1: where in my opinion, it shows that organizations like the 1342 01:08:59,160 --> 01:09:02,960 Speaker 1: U N and NATO and the EU, they're not moral organizations. 1343 01:09:03,040 --> 01:09:05,680 Speaker 1: They might act like they are, but they don't have 1344 01:09:05,720 --> 01:09:08,960 Speaker 1: a moral soul. They're just an organization, you know. And 1345 01:09:09,000 --> 01:09:11,880 Speaker 1: I think when you see these conflicts, it shows that 1346 01:09:11,960 --> 01:09:15,479 Speaker 1: now when it's not as saucy as spicy as Syria, 1347 01:09:15,800 --> 01:09:17,559 Speaker 1: when you look at a place like Armenia and Azer 1348 01:09:17,600 --> 01:09:19,960 Speaker 1: by Joan is just horrific war going on there, and 1349 01:09:19,960 --> 01:09:23,919 Speaker 1: there's there's already been war crimes, beheadings, UM attorney hospitals 1350 01:09:23,920 --> 01:09:27,400 Speaker 1: targeted today in Armenia, and it's it's like the world 1351 01:09:27,479 --> 01:09:29,360 Speaker 1: is kind of like aloof Twitter, and the U N 1352 01:09:29,479 --> 01:09:32,160 Speaker 1: is kind of like we're deeply concerned. Again, you know, 1353 01:09:32,640 --> 01:09:34,680 Speaker 1: there's things they can do, you know, like one of 1354 01:09:34,680 --> 01:09:37,760 Speaker 1: their NATO, you know, Turkey is is supplying UM in 1355 01:09:37,760 --> 01:09:40,640 Speaker 1: some cases Johann's militants to as a bay Joan to 1356 01:09:40,760 --> 01:09:43,600 Speaker 1: fight for you know, for as a by John. And 1357 01:09:43,640 --> 01:09:46,719 Speaker 1: it's like when NATO just goes like, you know, like 1358 01:09:47,360 --> 01:09:49,519 Speaker 1: what what can you do? Then, you know, like one 1359 01:09:49,520 --> 01:09:51,800 Speaker 1: of the most powerful organizations, where is there to go? 1360 01:09:52,320 --> 01:09:54,240 Speaker 1: So I mean, I know it sounds a bit nihilistic 1361 01:09:54,280 --> 01:09:56,600 Speaker 1: in it, but I think what is actually happening is 1362 01:09:56,600 --> 01:10:00,160 Speaker 1: a perhaps like a recalibration of where the power is 1363 01:10:00,160 --> 01:10:02,880 Speaker 1: are and where people's perceptions of what those powers do, 1364 01:10:03,439 --> 01:10:06,960 Speaker 1: you know, like the genocide can happen now, and the 1365 01:10:07,040 --> 01:10:09,160 Speaker 1: idea that the West is going to step in is 1366 01:10:09,800 --> 01:10:12,960 Speaker 1: kind of laughable. I think, you know, it's not gonna happen. 1367 01:10:13,320 --> 01:10:17,320 Speaker 1: And I'm not saying this is gonna sound callous. I don't. 1368 01:10:17,320 --> 01:10:19,679 Speaker 1: I'm not saying the West should step in because I'm 1369 01:10:19,680 --> 01:10:22,519 Speaker 1: not like pro intervention. But some things are just right 1370 01:10:22,560 --> 01:10:24,800 Speaker 1: and wrong, you know, like if you have the power 1371 01:10:24,840 --> 01:10:27,840 Speaker 1: to stop people being put into concentration camp, something should 1372 01:10:27,880 --> 01:10:30,200 Speaker 1: be done, you know what I mean. Like, if NATO 1373 01:10:30,479 --> 01:10:34,000 Speaker 1: forces are committing war crimes on camera, the least NATO 1374 01:10:34,080 --> 01:10:36,960 Speaker 1: can do is say we've seen that and it's bad. 1375 01:10:37,200 --> 01:10:39,120 Speaker 1: I mean there are instances, trust me, man, When I 1376 01:10:39,120 --> 01:10:41,759 Speaker 1: was in Southeast Turkey where there were war crimes happening, 1377 01:10:42,240 --> 01:10:45,200 Speaker 1: NATO's second largest army was committing them in some cases 1378 01:10:45,240 --> 01:10:48,120 Speaker 1: filming them and recording them themselves and putting them out 1379 01:10:48,160 --> 01:10:50,080 Speaker 1: there and go and look what we did, and just 1380 01:10:50,200 --> 01:10:52,439 Speaker 1: no one said anything, you know, And it's kind of like, 1381 01:10:52,600 --> 01:10:55,040 Speaker 1: where do you go from there? I don't know, honestly, man. 1382 01:10:55,080 --> 01:10:57,080 Speaker 1: I guess my answer is I don't have the full answer. 1383 01:10:57,120 --> 01:10:59,760 Speaker 1: And it sounds grim and it sounds miserable. But one 1384 01:10:59,760 --> 01:11:02,880 Speaker 1: thing I will say that's good is always remember the 1385 01:11:02,920 --> 01:11:06,200 Speaker 1: people living there, man, and mostly not bad people, Like 1386 01:11:06,360 --> 01:11:09,200 Speaker 1: they're the resilience you will see specifically in the Middle East, 1387 01:11:09,240 --> 01:11:11,120 Speaker 1: like I've seen on the war conditions. I'm like, how 1388 01:11:11,160 --> 01:11:13,120 Speaker 1: are you living like this? How are you having a laugh? 1389 01:11:13,520 --> 01:11:16,400 Speaker 1: How are you functioning so well? So I think the 1390 01:11:16,439 --> 01:11:18,080 Speaker 1: one thing we can take from it is like people 1391 01:11:18,080 --> 01:11:19,920 Speaker 1: will just keep living, you know what I mean, even 1392 01:11:19,920 --> 01:11:22,679 Speaker 1: when they're getting killed, they will keep living. And that's 1393 01:11:22,720 --> 01:11:25,519 Speaker 1: the only kind of solace I take from it. It's like, 1394 01:11:25,920 --> 01:11:28,439 Speaker 1: the people won't be crushed no matter what I think, 1395 01:11:28,600 --> 01:11:30,680 Speaker 1: you know what I mean. And by the people, I 1396 01:11:30,920 --> 01:11:33,800 Speaker 1: don't mean any political whatever. I just mean, you know, 1397 01:11:34,000 --> 01:11:36,960 Speaker 1: just people, you average people that are caught up in this. 1398 01:11:37,600 --> 01:11:40,880 Speaker 1: They won't be crushed fully ever, So that's the only 1399 01:11:40,880 --> 01:11:44,559 Speaker 1: good thing. I don't know what else they're telling you, man, 1400 01:11:44,640 --> 01:11:48,840 Speaker 1: Like it's pretty grim and unfortunately, like you know, there's 1401 01:11:48,840 --> 01:11:51,200 Speaker 1: a lot of work for me to look through and 1402 01:11:51,360 --> 01:11:54,280 Speaker 1: things to do with Popular Front, because you know, we 1403 01:11:54,280 --> 01:11:57,200 Speaker 1: we do cover all of these bases. If there's a clash, 1404 01:11:57,200 --> 01:11:59,720 Speaker 1: if there's a conflict happening, we will look into it 1405 01:11:59,800 --> 01:12:01,840 Speaker 1: and and honestly, in the last year I've just been 1406 01:12:01,880 --> 01:12:04,760 Speaker 1: like christ I don't even know what to talk about now, 1407 01:12:04,840 --> 01:12:06,320 Speaker 1: Like it's just I've got like a list on my 1408 01:12:06,439 --> 01:12:09,400 Speaker 1: wall and it's just adding up every day. So yeah, 1409 01:12:09,479 --> 01:12:12,400 Speaker 1: it's it's it's grim, it's grim. Well, what I would 1410 01:12:12,439 --> 01:12:15,080 Speaker 1: say is any any time you want to just come 1411 01:12:15,120 --> 01:12:18,639 Speaker 1: on this show and talk about any one specific place 1412 01:12:18,720 --> 01:12:20,880 Speaker 1: or a specific thing, we would be more than happy 1413 01:12:20,960 --> 01:12:23,800 Speaker 1: to have you and you know, do some research with 1414 01:12:23,840 --> 01:12:26,559 Speaker 1: you on something. I love that man, Like definitely appreciate that. 1415 01:12:26,600 --> 01:12:28,240 Speaker 1: Like I would definitely take you up on that. There's 1416 01:12:28,280 --> 01:12:30,840 Speaker 1: there's there's so many do you know what's interesting you 1417 01:12:31,040 --> 01:12:33,880 Speaker 1: guys can maybe look at like conspiracies in the Middle East. 1418 01:12:34,200 --> 01:12:35,920 Speaker 1: I have so many friends in the Middle East because 1419 01:12:35,920 --> 01:12:39,360 Speaker 1: of my work. Everyone loves a conspiracy, even down to 1420 01:12:39,439 --> 01:12:42,360 Speaker 1: like there's a conspiracy with the cafe, you know what 1421 01:12:42,400 --> 01:12:44,400 Speaker 1: I mean. He's like he says that he's trying to 1422 01:12:44,400 --> 01:12:47,360 Speaker 1: he's getting the Israelis are sending him that Homers or whatever. 1423 01:12:47,520 --> 01:12:50,040 Speaker 1: You know what I mean. There's always a conspiracy. It's 1424 01:12:50,080 --> 01:12:53,280 Speaker 1: good fun. Actually, we did a piece on We did 1425 01:12:53,280 --> 01:12:57,160 Speaker 1: a piece on the genre of animals as spies, which 1426 01:12:57,240 --> 01:13:00,880 Speaker 1: is a wildly popular genre of its own in the 1427 01:13:00,920 --> 01:13:04,719 Speaker 1: Middle East. That like the there's also like the sharks 1428 01:13:04,720 --> 01:13:08,439 Speaker 1: and stuff with lasers and stuff as well, exactly, And 1429 01:13:08,479 --> 01:13:10,519 Speaker 1: then you know, what can you what can you say 1430 01:13:10,520 --> 01:13:13,720 Speaker 1: to that, because intelligence agencies in the past did have 1431 01:13:13,840 --> 01:13:16,479 Speaker 1: that bright idea where someone's like, I don't know, man, 1432 01:13:16,560 --> 01:13:19,880 Speaker 1: what can we put in a cat? Yeah, things like 1433 01:13:19,960 --> 01:13:21,639 Speaker 1: that though I always you know, like there's a great 1434 01:13:21,640 --> 01:13:24,280 Speaker 1: book John Ronson did The Men Who Stare at Goats, 1435 01:13:24,479 --> 01:13:27,000 Speaker 1: And I try and explain to people that's not like 1436 01:13:27,320 --> 01:13:30,519 Speaker 1: a whole huge conspiracy. It's one guy with a dumb 1437 01:13:30,600 --> 01:13:33,920 Speaker 1: idea who didn't have enough oversight, and someone went, you 1438 01:13:34,040 --> 01:13:36,680 Speaker 1: had let let Jack do that whatever, get him out 1439 01:13:36,680 --> 01:13:38,639 Speaker 1: of my hair, and before you know it, he's got 1440 01:13:38,680 --> 01:13:41,760 Speaker 1: like a spying looking through walls, killing goats thing going on. 1441 01:13:42,240 --> 01:13:46,280 Speaker 1: And like often the like the biggest conspiracies that, oh 1442 01:13:46,320 --> 01:13:49,280 Speaker 1: they're real. Often it's like it wasn't that insidious. It 1443 01:13:49,360 --> 01:13:53,439 Speaker 1: was just some ideot who like bypassed his middle manager somehow, 1444 01:13:53,760 --> 01:13:56,360 Speaker 1: you know, and he had like a budget, and they're 1445 01:13:56,360 --> 01:13:59,240 Speaker 1: the most fun ones. Yeah, So I don't know, it's 1446 01:13:59,320 --> 01:14:00,960 Speaker 1: it's there's a lot of them. Out there, Like, not 1447 01:14:01,040 --> 01:14:03,760 Speaker 1: all conspiracies are is like Dark is Q and on, 1448 01:14:03,880 --> 01:14:06,840 Speaker 1: but they're the ones I enjoyed it, Like that's why 1449 01:14:06,880 --> 01:14:11,360 Speaker 1: I love Cryptids. You know, Mothman is never gonna hurt me. Man, Well, 1450 01:14:12,000 --> 01:14:15,479 Speaker 1: I don't know. That statue of him and that West 1451 01:14:15,560 --> 01:14:19,639 Speaker 1: Virginia it looks like a he Man action figure. He's 1452 01:14:19,680 --> 01:14:23,000 Speaker 1: got like these crazy sculpted abs and like buns of steel. 1453 01:14:23,200 --> 01:14:29,640 Speaker 1: Literally it's nuts, I'll say it. The Mothman statue is 1454 01:14:29,680 --> 01:14:33,400 Speaker 1: thick with two c's. I mean it's like, yeah, those 1455 01:14:33,479 --> 01:14:39,720 Speaker 1: cheeks are clapping. Yeah. Good. So before we continue objectifying 1456 01:14:39,840 --> 01:14:43,880 Speaker 1: moth Man, yes, shout out. Shout out to Cryptics and Jake, 1457 01:14:44,000 --> 01:14:47,160 Speaker 1: thank you so much for being so generous with your 1458 01:14:47,160 --> 01:14:50,800 Speaker 1: time today. As we said, like Popular Front, if you're 1459 01:14:50,800 --> 01:14:54,840 Speaker 1: ever interested in the geopolitical topics we've covered on this 1460 01:14:54,840 --> 01:14:58,920 Speaker 1: show in the past, then do please check out Popular Front. 1461 01:14:58,960 --> 01:15:02,439 Speaker 1: It's a long running show. I can't say enough good 1462 01:15:02,479 --> 01:15:06,320 Speaker 1: about it personally, and it's worth your time checking out, 1463 01:15:06,680 --> 01:15:11,479 Speaker 1: especially as you are waiting for the conclusion of Q 1464 01:15:11,720 --> 01:15:14,719 Speaker 1: Clearance and listening along to that in the meantime, Jake, 1465 01:15:14,840 --> 01:15:19,519 Speaker 1: where can people learn more about your work in general? Yeah? Man, um, 1466 01:15:19,800 --> 01:15:21,599 Speaker 1: thanks very much. By the way, I'm glad you guys. 1467 01:15:21,840 --> 01:15:24,280 Speaker 1: It's I'm like a fan boy for this podcast, so 1468 01:15:24,320 --> 01:15:25,640 Speaker 1: it's so cool to you. Guys are like, oh, I 1469 01:15:25,680 --> 01:15:29,599 Speaker 1: listened to Popular Front, so it's great for me. But um, yeah, 1470 01:15:29,640 --> 01:15:31,759 Speaker 1: I mean if people check out you go on the website, 1471 01:15:31,760 --> 01:15:35,120 Speaker 1: it's popular Front dot CEO. Like I joke that it's 1472 01:15:35,160 --> 01:15:37,200 Speaker 1: counter offensive, but I just no one would sell me 1473 01:15:37,240 --> 01:15:40,680 Speaker 1: the dot com. But yeah, like you know, you can 1474 01:15:40,720 --> 01:15:42,759 Speaker 1: check me on Twitter. I'm always on there, like moaning 1475 01:15:42,800 --> 01:15:46,920 Speaker 1: about stuff that's like at Jake Underschool hand rahnd h 1476 01:15:46,960 --> 01:15:50,000 Speaker 1: A n h A n and yeah, man, just give 1477 01:15:50,040 --> 01:15:52,000 Speaker 1: me a shout there. I like to talk to cool people. 1478 01:15:52,280 --> 01:15:56,639 Speaker 1: I would just recommend YouTube dot com slash popular Front. 1479 01:15:56,880 --> 01:15:59,840 Speaker 1: That's yes, that's where I would go. If you if 1480 01:15:59,840 --> 01:16:02,160 Speaker 1: you're listening to this and you were a fan of 1481 01:16:02,920 --> 01:16:05,599 Speaker 1: Vice News early on when that stuff was happening, go 1482 01:16:05,720 --> 01:16:08,679 Speaker 1: check out this YouTube site and you will see similar 1483 01:16:08,800 --> 01:16:12,840 Speaker 1: videos but done outside of that organization by Jake and 1484 01:16:13,000 --> 01:16:15,880 Speaker 1: uh people who are working with Jake. It's it's fantastic stuff. 1485 01:16:15,920 --> 01:16:18,439 Speaker 1: I always forget to plug the YouTube. I don't know why, Like, yeah, 1486 01:16:18,520 --> 01:16:22,320 Speaker 1: we do podcast, we do you know documentaries, We do articles. 1487 01:16:22,360 --> 01:16:25,040 Speaker 1: We had a magazine out. Yeah yeah, so definitely YouTube 1488 01:16:25,080 --> 01:16:28,120 Speaker 1: dot com, slash put the front. We've got loads of documentaries, 1489 01:16:28,160 --> 01:16:31,160 Speaker 1: all filming on the ground, you know, shoulder to shoulder 1490 01:16:31,200 --> 01:16:33,760 Speaker 1: with whoever's fighting or clashing or whatever. So definitely check 1491 01:16:33,840 --> 01:16:37,120 Speaker 1: that out and don't forget the podcast. Well, tell us 1492 01:16:37,120 --> 01:16:39,080 Speaker 1: a little bit more just about where to find that 1493 01:16:39,160 --> 01:16:42,439 Speaker 1: Jake Q Clearance, Yes, sir, sorry, yeah, yeah, I shouldn't 1494 01:16:42,439 --> 01:16:46,040 Speaker 1: mentioned that one. Um. Yeah, if you just search Q 1495 01:16:46,240 --> 01:16:48,960 Speaker 1: clearance on any podcast app, you'll find it. It It will 1496 01:16:48,960 --> 01:16:51,599 Speaker 1: be the top one. It's got like this cool um 1497 01:16:51,760 --> 01:16:54,800 Speaker 1: green pyramid with an eye like art for it. Yeah. Man, 1498 01:16:54,840 --> 01:16:57,439 Speaker 1: just check that out. Q Clearance. It's it's all on 1499 01:16:57,439 --> 01:17:00,880 Speaker 1: the all of the apps. Is there. What a wild ride? 1500 01:17:01,880 --> 01:17:04,080 Speaker 1: We hope that we as we said, we hope that 1501 01:17:04,200 --> 01:17:08,320 Speaker 1: you have enjoyed today's conversation and we want to hear 1502 01:17:08,360 --> 01:17:11,320 Speaker 1: what you have to say about the many topics we 1503 01:17:11,400 --> 01:17:15,439 Speaker 1: discussed with Jake in today's interview. You can find us online. 1504 01:17:15,680 --> 01:17:19,519 Speaker 1: We are on Facebook, where on Instagram we're on the 1505 01:17:19,520 --> 01:17:23,080 Speaker 1: other one, Twitter, Twitter, we're on that one too. We 1506 01:17:23,200 --> 01:17:26,240 Speaker 1: like to recommend our Facebook page. Here's where it gets 1507 01:17:26,280 --> 01:17:29,200 Speaker 1: crazy where you can meet the best part of this show, 1508 01:17:29,360 --> 01:17:32,320 Speaker 1: your fellow listeners. Yes, we also want to mention that 1509 01:17:32,360 --> 01:17:34,400 Speaker 1: you can call us if you wish. Our number is 1510 01:17:34,479 --> 01:17:37,760 Speaker 1: one eight three three st d w y t K. 1511 01:17:38,280 --> 01:17:41,040 Speaker 1: As soon as you hear Ben talking and all the 1512 01:17:41,080 --> 01:17:43,240 Speaker 1: stuff going on that you usually would here with stuff 1513 01:17:43,240 --> 01:17:45,360 Speaker 1: they don't want you to know, you're gonna know you're 1514 01:17:45,400 --> 01:17:47,559 Speaker 1: in the right place. Leave a message, let us know 1515 01:17:48,040 --> 01:17:51,519 Speaker 1: if we can use your name, your likeness and everything 1516 01:17:52,040 --> 01:17:55,360 Speaker 1: on our show, because we use those voicemails for the 1517 01:17:55,400 --> 01:17:58,840 Speaker 1: listener mail segments. 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