1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:03,280 Speaker 1: The Senate is heading for a nailbiter vote on whether 2 00:00:03,360 --> 00:00:06,960 Speaker 1: to call additional witnesses or to end this impeachment trial 3 00:00:07,320 --> 00:00:09,760 Speaker 1: once and for all. The Senator and I sit down 4 00:00:09,840 --> 00:00:13,280 Speaker 1: in daylight for a change to get his strategy before 5 00:00:13,440 --> 00:00:16,360 Speaker 1: he heads to Capitol Hill. This is Verdict with Ted Cruz. 6 00:00:24,600 --> 00:00:28,160 Speaker 1: Welcome back to Verdict with Ted Cruz. I'm Michael Knowles, Senator. 7 00:00:28,480 --> 00:00:31,760 Speaker 1: I don't remember the last time I saw you in daylight. Well, 8 00:00:31,880 --> 00:00:35,200 Speaker 1: hopefully the sunshining indicates we're near the end of this journey. 9 00:00:35,240 --> 00:00:39,040 Speaker 1: I want to get your thoughts on the likelihood of that. 10 00:00:39,080 --> 00:00:41,479 Speaker 1: I want to get your strategy on the last day 11 00:00:41,520 --> 00:00:45,400 Speaker 1: of questions today. There are some reports coming out that 12 00:00:45,600 --> 00:00:49,560 Speaker 1: John Barrasso, the number three Republican in the Senate, says 13 00:00:49,720 --> 00:00:52,159 Speaker 1: that the momentum is heading in the direction of not 14 00:00:52,240 --> 00:00:55,400 Speaker 1: calling additional witnesses. There are other reports that we might 15 00:00:55,480 --> 00:00:59,120 Speaker 1: get a fifty fifty vote perfectly split, in which case 16 00:00:59,160 --> 00:01:02,000 Speaker 1: I want to know who breaks the tie. You know, 17 00:01:02,040 --> 00:01:06,360 Speaker 1: it's an open question. It is close right now. We 18 00:01:06,400 --> 00:01:10,440 Speaker 1: need fifty one votes to definitively say the trial is done. 19 00:01:10,680 --> 00:01:13,760 Speaker 1: Don't need additional witnesses. Let's move on to final judgment. 20 00:01:14,040 --> 00:01:15,920 Speaker 1: If we have fifty one votes, we can wrap this 21 00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:18,959 Speaker 1: up in the next couple of days. If we don't, 22 00:01:19,080 --> 00:01:21,360 Speaker 1: and I hope the momentum's going that way. As we 23 00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:23,520 Speaker 1: talked about in the last podcast, I think they're at 24 00:01:23,600 --> 00:01:26,760 Speaker 1: least two Republicans who are pretty clearly going to vote 25 00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:29,640 Speaker 1: with the Democrats, Mitt Romney and Susan Collins. That means 26 00:01:29,640 --> 00:01:34,200 Speaker 1: they have forty nine votes. There are the two next 27 00:01:34,280 --> 00:01:37,480 Speaker 1: most likely or Lisa Murkowski and Lamar Alexander. I don't 28 00:01:37,480 --> 00:01:39,520 Speaker 1: know where they're going to be. They're very They're holding 29 00:01:39,520 --> 00:01:42,520 Speaker 1: their cards very close to the vest. They could end 30 00:01:42,600 --> 00:01:44,720 Speaker 1: up on either side of that, and I think they're 31 00:01:44,760 --> 00:01:47,680 Speaker 1: considering it carefully. They seem to be genuinely struggling with 32 00:01:47,720 --> 00:01:52,040 Speaker 1: this decision. If it ends up fifty fifty, we're in 33 00:01:52,080 --> 00:01:56,640 Speaker 1: a little bit of uncharted territory under the scheduling order 34 00:01:56,680 --> 00:02:01,480 Speaker 1: we adopted. I think Republican leadership argument would be fifty 35 00:02:01,560 --> 00:02:04,440 Speaker 1: fifty means witnesses or not in order. In other words, 36 00:02:04,600 --> 00:02:07,880 Speaker 1: let's move on. I can't have additional witnesses, okay. I 37 00:02:07,920 --> 00:02:11,079 Speaker 1: am certain that the Democrats will argue if it's fifty fifty, 38 00:02:11,080 --> 00:02:14,919 Speaker 1: it means witnesses are in order, so who decides them? 39 00:02:15,000 --> 00:02:18,840 Speaker 1: Who knows. Look, look, there's not a whole lot of 40 00:02:18,880 --> 00:02:21,920 Speaker 1: precedent here. There's under the Senate rules, it's not I 41 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:24,280 Speaker 1: can make the arguments on both sides of that. I 42 00:02:24,320 --> 00:02:27,400 Speaker 1: understand the arguments on both sides of that. It is 43 00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:31,160 Speaker 1: possible the Chief Justice will have of you. It is 44 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:33,880 Speaker 1: not clear. So the Chief Justice doesn't play the role 45 00:02:33,880 --> 00:02:35,919 Speaker 1: of the Vice president. You know, normally in the Senate, 46 00:02:35,960 --> 00:02:39,320 Speaker 1: the vice President breaks ties. That's not the Chief Justice's role. 47 00:02:39,320 --> 00:02:42,359 Speaker 1: The Chief Justice's role is to preside. Now, there's some 48 00:02:42,520 --> 00:02:46,800 Speaker 1: historical precedent for the Chief Justice breaking a fifty fifty tie. 49 00:02:46,960 --> 00:02:50,639 Speaker 1: That happened in the impeachment of Andrew Johnson twice. But 50 00:02:50,800 --> 00:02:54,400 Speaker 1: then the Senator's got unhappy with that, and the Chief 51 00:02:54,440 --> 00:02:56,200 Speaker 1: Justice receded and said, Okay, I'm not going to do 52 00:02:56,240 --> 00:02:59,359 Speaker 1: that anymore. So, as with so many aspects of this trial, 53 00:03:00,440 --> 00:03:02,640 Speaker 1: we really don't have a lot of precedent to go on. 54 00:03:03,120 --> 00:03:06,960 Speaker 1: We are in on charted territory. If if Chief Justice 55 00:03:07,040 --> 00:03:10,800 Speaker 1: Roberts decided to vigorously assert himself and make a ruling, 56 00:03:10,840 --> 00:03:12,680 Speaker 1: I don't know what would happen. I don't think that's 57 00:03:12,720 --> 00:03:16,080 Speaker 1: all that likely. I think, you know, you may recall 58 00:03:16,120 --> 00:03:18,680 Speaker 1: it as confirmation hearing. He used the analogy of wanting 59 00:03:18,680 --> 00:03:21,280 Speaker 1: to be an umpire in baseball. I think that's what 60 00:03:21,320 --> 00:03:24,320 Speaker 1: he wants to do. And so one of the nice 61 00:03:24,400 --> 00:03:26,440 Speaker 1: things he did, which he didn't have to do. But 62 00:03:26,440 --> 00:03:30,160 Speaker 1: but yesterday he enforced a five minute time limit on 63 00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:34,240 Speaker 1: answers to question. That was the same thing Ranquist had done. 64 00:03:34,400 --> 00:03:37,040 Speaker 1: There's nothing the rules that makes him do five minutes. Yeah, 65 00:03:37,080 --> 00:03:39,160 Speaker 1: but I think every senator was grateful because if it 66 00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:41,320 Speaker 1: hadn't been a five minute time limit, he would have 67 00:03:41,320 --> 00:03:43,880 Speaker 1: just seen the lawyers on both sides filibuster forever and so, 68 00:03:43,960 --> 00:03:45,400 Speaker 1: and you would have only gotten into a handful of 69 00:03:45,480 --> 00:03:48,600 Speaker 1: questions instead of all okay. But that's an example where 70 00:03:48,600 --> 00:03:52,040 Speaker 1: that was within his discretion. Although that being said, if 71 00:03:52,160 --> 00:03:55,160 Speaker 1: enough senators disagreed, fifty one of us could have overruled it. Right, 72 00:03:55,840 --> 00:03:58,680 Speaker 1: So it's it's that sort of ruling is a perfect 73 00:03:58,720 --> 00:04:02,200 Speaker 1: example of everyone agreed with it. So it was fine. 74 00:04:02,800 --> 00:04:05,360 Speaker 1: But where it runs into problems if the chief Justice 75 00:04:05,520 --> 00:04:09,760 Speaker 1: is is disagreeing with the majority. By the way, you 76 00:04:09,840 --> 00:04:13,560 Speaker 1: saw the House managers suggest something last night. They said, 77 00:04:14,160 --> 00:04:17,800 Speaker 1: we're perfectly fine with the Chief Justice deciding everything, deciding 78 00:04:17,800 --> 00:04:21,520 Speaker 1: evidentry emotions, deciding everything. Now, look, you gotta understand that 79 00:04:21,640 --> 00:04:27,120 Speaker 1: argument makes perfect sense when you're in the minority. They're 80 00:04:27,200 --> 00:04:30,880 Speaker 1: forty seven Democrats. On any party line vote, they're gonna lose. 81 00:04:31,240 --> 00:04:33,600 Speaker 1: They know that. Remember we had eleven motions on day one. 82 00:04:33,640 --> 00:04:36,680 Speaker 1: They'll host all eleven. They understand that. So if you're 83 00:04:36,720 --> 00:04:39,440 Speaker 1: going to lose on any party line vote, it's in 84 00:04:39,480 --> 00:04:42,039 Speaker 1: your interest to find any other decision maker. Give the 85 00:04:42,040 --> 00:04:44,600 Speaker 1: power away, let somebody else make them. Even if they 86 00:04:44,640 --> 00:04:46,960 Speaker 1: think they're not going to win with the Chief, they 87 00:04:47,040 --> 00:04:50,320 Speaker 1: got a better chance if they know that they're outvoted. 88 00:04:50,800 --> 00:04:54,359 Speaker 1: It's sort of like, all right, an election recounts. Have 89 00:04:54,480 --> 00:04:58,440 Speaker 1: you noticed that when an election is close, the prevailing 90 00:04:58,520 --> 00:05:01,960 Speaker 1: party never calls for a recount, right like whoever has 91 00:05:01,960 --> 00:05:03,880 Speaker 1: been declared the winner, even if by one vote. You 92 00:05:03,960 --> 00:05:06,400 Speaker 1: don't see that person saying we need a recount. It's 93 00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:10,080 Speaker 1: always the guy who's lost. Yes, because if you've lost, 94 00:05:11,040 --> 00:05:13,440 Speaker 1: recount is the only thing that can benefit you. That's 95 00:05:13,480 --> 00:05:15,159 Speaker 1: a little bit the same as what's going on here. 96 00:05:15,279 --> 00:05:19,040 Speaker 1: So obviously then today is going to matter a lot 97 00:05:19,080 --> 00:05:21,320 Speaker 1: before we get to this vote. The reason I wanted 98 00:05:21,360 --> 00:05:24,280 Speaker 1: to sit down today before we get to the impeachment 99 00:05:24,320 --> 00:05:26,440 Speaker 1: trial is I want to hear a little bit about 100 00:05:26,480 --> 00:05:29,520 Speaker 1: your strategy, how you prepare when you're going in, when 101 00:05:29,520 --> 00:05:33,200 Speaker 1: you're writing these questions, What are you trying to accomplish? 102 00:05:33,240 --> 00:05:34,720 Speaker 1: What are you going to ask today when you get 103 00:05:34,720 --> 00:05:37,120 Speaker 1: to the hill. Well you're looking at all, right, what 104 00:05:37,240 --> 00:05:39,600 Speaker 1: parts of the story haven't been told, What hasn't been 105 00:05:39,640 --> 00:05:43,120 Speaker 1: told as effectively as it should, What additional facts need 106 00:05:43,160 --> 00:05:47,880 Speaker 1: to be brought out? What weaknesses in the defenses or 107 00:05:47,960 --> 00:05:51,400 Speaker 1: the house manager's case. Should you shine a light on 108 00:05:52,600 --> 00:05:55,000 Speaker 1: some of what I'm looking at some of the areas 109 00:05:55,040 --> 00:05:59,400 Speaker 1: that there are still aspects of the evidence of corruption, 110 00:05:59,440 --> 00:06:02,440 Speaker 1: the evidence of corruption a bearisma the Ukrainian Natural Gas 111 00:06:02,440 --> 00:06:06,760 Speaker 1: company of Joe Biden and Hunter Biden that that still 112 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:09,800 Speaker 1: haven't been fleshed out. And then I think need to 113 00:06:10,600 --> 00:06:16,040 Speaker 1: um so for example, uh, there there is an email 114 00:06:16,160 --> 00:06:19,600 Speaker 1: exchange that that happened when when Chris Hines. So, Chris 115 00:06:19,640 --> 00:06:23,400 Speaker 1: Hines is the stepson of John Kerry. John Kerry was 116 00:06:23,800 --> 00:06:27,840 Speaker 1: was Obama's Secretary of State. Chris Hines was business partners 117 00:06:28,440 --> 00:06:31,880 Speaker 1: with Hunter Biden and with this guy Devin Archer, who 118 00:06:31,880 --> 00:06:35,440 Speaker 1: was Chris Hines's college roommates. Three of them were business partners. 119 00:06:35,640 --> 00:06:38,800 Speaker 1: First Devin Archer and then Hunter Biden both joined the 120 00:06:38,839 --> 00:06:40,919 Speaker 1: board of Barisma. They both are getting paid a million 121 00:06:40,920 --> 00:06:44,039 Speaker 1: bucks a year. And Chris Hines does a couple of things. 122 00:06:44,120 --> 00:06:47,479 Speaker 1: Number One, he sends an email to the to his 123 00:06:47,560 --> 00:06:50,120 Speaker 1: stepfather's chief of staff, to John Kerry's chief of staff, 124 00:06:50,960 --> 00:06:54,720 Speaker 1: and and and he says, apparently Devin and Hunter both 125 00:06:54,800 --> 00:06:57,159 Speaker 1: joined the board of Barisma and made a press and 126 00:06:57,200 --> 00:07:00,880 Speaker 1: a press release went out today. I can speak to 127 00:07:01,040 --> 00:07:04,280 Speaker 1: why they decided to do so, but there was no 128 00:07:04,360 --> 00:07:07,599 Speaker 1: investment by our firm in that company. Trying to clear 129 00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:11,200 Speaker 1: his name, to associate himself, It's fascinating that he sends 130 00:07:11,200 --> 00:07:14,480 Speaker 1: this email. It's also fascinating John Kerry's chief of staff. 131 00:07:14,520 --> 00:07:17,280 Speaker 1: Notice he doesn't say Devin Archer and Hunter Biden. He 132 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:19,760 Speaker 1: says Devin and Hunter. So the chief of staff knows 133 00:07:19,800 --> 00:07:22,840 Speaker 1: exactly who these guys are. He knows what Barisma is. 134 00:07:22,840 --> 00:07:26,920 Speaker 1: He doesn't explain Barisma is this Ukrainian company. You may 135 00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:30,160 Speaker 1: not know it. Chief of staff knew exactly what Barisma was, 136 00:07:30,320 --> 00:07:32,800 Speaker 1: knew exactly who Devin and Archer was, and what did 137 00:07:32,880 --> 00:07:35,840 Speaker 1: Chris Hines do? He went on to say he terminated 138 00:07:35,880 --> 00:07:38,720 Speaker 1: his business relationships with Hunter and Biden, and he said 139 00:07:39,000 --> 00:07:44,920 Speaker 1: it was unacceptable to work for Barisma. Now, the White 140 00:07:44,960 --> 00:07:48,080 Speaker 1: House Defense team briefly got into this, but the House 141 00:07:48,120 --> 00:07:50,559 Speaker 1: managers have never had to ask a question and answer 142 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:53,840 Speaker 1: a question on this. They've they've never had to address. Now, 143 00:07:53,840 --> 00:07:58,160 Speaker 1: wait a second. If Chris Hines thought it was unacceptable 144 00:07:58,200 --> 00:08:01,960 Speaker 1: to work for Barisma, did John Kerry think that? Did 145 00:08:01,960 --> 00:08:08,440 Speaker 1: his stepfather think that? And did Joe Biden that? And Look, 146 00:08:08,480 --> 00:08:11,200 Speaker 1: one of the things to keep in mind also what 147 00:08:11,480 --> 00:08:17,280 Speaker 1: really matters legally? We've talked about in any litigation, you 148 00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:21,320 Speaker 1: want to simplify. Your enemy is getting so complicated and 149 00:08:21,320 --> 00:08:23,160 Speaker 1: you get bogged down in the weeds. You want to 150 00:08:23,200 --> 00:08:25,840 Speaker 1: simplify the question that matters. You know, I did Sean 151 00:08:25,880 --> 00:08:27,559 Speaker 1: Hannay a couple of days ago, and he had five 152 00:08:27,640 --> 00:08:29,880 Speaker 1: points that are critical. Remember, look, that's fine, I said, Sean, 153 00:08:29,920 --> 00:08:33,280 Speaker 1: there's one you want to simplify to what matters? What 154 00:08:33,360 --> 00:08:36,320 Speaker 1: matters legally? As does a president have the authority to 155 00:08:36,440 --> 00:08:39,640 Speaker 1: investigate corruption and credible evidence of corruption? If the answer 156 00:08:39,720 --> 00:08:42,600 Speaker 1: is yes, that's game over. This this case is done now. 157 00:08:42,760 --> 00:08:49,000 Speaker 1: And on the fact side, it's worth remembering that. Listen, 158 00:08:49,080 --> 00:08:52,640 Speaker 1: the question is not really whether Hunter Biden is corrupt. 159 00:08:53,559 --> 00:08:58,080 Speaker 1: Hunter Biden, by all appearances, has led a troubled life. 160 00:08:58,520 --> 00:09:02,600 Speaker 1: This is someone with who's made some unfortunate decisions in 161 00:09:02,640 --> 00:09:07,319 Speaker 1: his life. The question is whether Joe Biden made decisions 162 00:09:07,360 --> 00:09:09,959 Speaker 1: that made him part of that corruption. And I don't 163 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:13,679 Speaker 1: think so far the connection as to why this is 164 00:09:13,760 --> 00:09:17,400 Speaker 1: Joe Biden's decision. I'll give you another example. So there 165 00:09:17,440 --> 00:09:19,120 Speaker 1: was a question and I joined it. It was a 166 00:09:19,200 --> 00:09:22,079 Speaker 1: question that Josh Holly asked that I joined, and the 167 00:09:22,080 --> 00:09:24,559 Speaker 1: two of us asked together, and it was about did 168 00:09:24,600 --> 00:09:27,040 Speaker 1: Joe Biden never seek an opinion from the White House 169 00:09:27,040 --> 00:09:30,000 Speaker 1: Counsel's office if he could keep being the point man 170 00:09:30,920 --> 00:09:33,080 Speaker 1: on Ukraine while his son was getting paid a million 171 00:09:33,120 --> 00:09:36,840 Speaker 1: bucks a year from Barisma. And the White House team said, 172 00:09:36,840 --> 00:09:38,320 Speaker 1: not that we know it, We have no you know, 173 00:09:39,360 --> 00:09:41,280 Speaker 1: you know, one of the things one does in government, 174 00:09:41,320 --> 00:09:43,640 Speaker 1: if one has a potential conflict, you should go to 175 00:09:43,640 --> 00:09:46,000 Speaker 1: the lawyers and say, hey, do I got a conflict here? 176 00:09:46,400 --> 00:09:47,840 Speaker 1: And you get an opinion and they tell you what 177 00:09:47,880 --> 00:09:52,199 Speaker 1: to do, and sometimes they tell you recuse yourself, don't 178 00:09:52,280 --> 00:09:54,680 Speaker 1: be involved. So Joe Biden could have said, you know what, 179 00:09:55,200 --> 00:09:59,040 Speaker 1: this doesn't look good a ton of countries on planet Earth. 180 00:09:59,200 --> 00:10:01,520 Speaker 1: I'm just gonna stay to Ukraine stuff. I'll worry about 181 00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:04,120 Speaker 1: all the other countries. I'm not going to get involved 182 00:10:04,120 --> 00:10:06,600 Speaker 1: in Ukraine because my son's getting rich off of Ukraine 183 00:10:06,960 --> 00:10:09,320 Speaker 1: and maybe it's not right for me to do this. 184 00:10:09,400 --> 00:10:12,960 Speaker 1: So the house managers, the Democrats did not have to 185 00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:17,040 Speaker 1: answer this question yesterday, and you're going to ask it today. 186 00:10:17,160 --> 00:10:19,360 Speaker 1: That's exactly. Are you worried that Adam Schiff listens to 187 00:10:19,400 --> 00:10:21,120 Speaker 1: this podcast and he's going to get a heads up? 188 00:10:22,280 --> 00:10:27,760 Speaker 1: You know? No? Um and And look, I will say 189 00:10:27,800 --> 00:10:31,640 Speaker 1: this though Schiff is talented, he's good on his feet, 190 00:10:32,400 --> 00:10:37,840 Speaker 1: but it's interesting the questions that rattle him. The questions 191 00:10:37,880 --> 00:10:40,200 Speaker 1: that rattle him are when you're getting close to the target. 192 00:10:40,360 --> 00:10:43,040 Speaker 1: So you're going to ask this question, are you going 193 00:10:43,040 --> 00:10:45,800 Speaker 1: are there going to be questions on the same topic 194 00:10:45,800 --> 00:10:47,280 Speaker 1: you're hitting, or are you going to change it up 195 00:10:47,320 --> 00:10:51,079 Speaker 1: and go after another angle in question time today as well? Well, Look, 196 00:10:51,080 --> 00:10:55,360 Speaker 1: I'll give you another example. So Joe Biden told reporters 197 00:10:55,360 --> 00:10:57,960 Speaker 1: that he's never discussed his son's business dealings with him 198 00:10:58,360 --> 00:11:02,960 Speaker 1: and that it was discussed yesterday. But what wasn't discussed 199 00:11:04,679 --> 00:11:08,600 Speaker 1: is there somebody who disagrees with that. And that's somebody 200 00:11:08,600 --> 00:11:14,360 Speaker 1: who disagrees with that is Hunter Biden. And Hunter Biden 201 00:11:15,880 --> 00:11:18,160 Speaker 1: said that he talked to his dad about his serving 202 00:11:18,559 --> 00:11:23,120 Speaker 1: on the Barisma board and Hunter said, quote, dad said, 203 00:11:23,679 --> 00:11:25,840 Speaker 1: I hope you know what you're doing. So one of 204 00:11:25,840 --> 00:11:29,319 Speaker 1: the guys said I do. So why is it that 205 00:11:29,400 --> 00:11:31,559 Speaker 1: Joe Biden and Hunter Biden are telling different stories that 206 00:11:31,640 --> 00:11:33,880 Speaker 1: Joe says he's never talked to about it and Hunter's like, oh, yeah, 207 00:11:33,880 --> 00:11:35,360 Speaker 1: I talked to you about it. One of these guys 208 00:11:35,400 --> 00:11:38,040 Speaker 1: is lying, Joe Biden or Hunter Biden, They're not telling 209 00:11:38,080 --> 00:11:41,680 Speaker 1: the truth another way to put it so, well, this 210 00:11:41,720 --> 00:11:45,040 Speaker 1: sounds very interesting. I mean, I assume that the Democratic 211 00:11:45,080 --> 00:11:46,800 Speaker 1: House managers are going to just try to evade the 212 00:11:46,840 --> 00:11:49,400 Speaker 1: question and filibuster, but it sounds like you've got a 213 00:11:49,440 --> 00:11:52,280 Speaker 1: couple different angles to come at today. I want to know, 214 00:11:52,400 --> 00:11:56,400 Speaker 1: beyond the impeachment trial you have, you have more work 215 00:11:56,440 --> 00:11:59,680 Speaker 1: to do than just sit on this impeachment trial. What 216 00:11:59,880 --> 00:12:03,880 Speaker 1: is is a day in the life waking up doing 217 00:12:03,880 --> 00:12:05,880 Speaker 1: whatever you do in the morning, then going to the 218 00:12:05,880 --> 00:12:08,240 Speaker 1: impeachment trial. I know what you do from ten pm 219 00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:10,800 Speaker 1: until about two in the morning. But what does a 220 00:12:10,880 --> 00:12:12,480 Speaker 1: day in the life look like? All right, So let's 221 00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:15,839 Speaker 1: take yesterday. Yeah, yesterday I got up. First meeting I 222 00:12:15,920 --> 00:12:20,080 Speaker 1: had was at nine was a meeting with Benjamin nah 223 00:12:20,320 --> 00:12:23,280 Speaker 1: Prime Minister of Israel. And so he's staying at Blair House, 224 00:12:23,320 --> 00:12:25,400 Speaker 1: which is the residence right next to the White House. 225 00:12:25,760 --> 00:12:27,760 Speaker 1: So I went over to Blair House and met with 226 00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:30,600 Speaker 1: him from nine to nine thirty. And I know Babie 227 00:12:30,640 --> 00:12:33,120 Speaker 1: quite well. I've met with him many times in Israel 228 00:12:33,160 --> 00:12:37,080 Speaker 1: and in the US. We're friends. When he and I meet, 229 00:12:37,160 --> 00:12:40,000 Speaker 1: it's it's nice because they're one on once. We don't 230 00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:41,600 Speaker 1: have staff in there, just the two of us. We 231 00:12:41,640 --> 00:12:44,480 Speaker 1: sat and had a cup of coffee. We talked. We 232 00:12:44,559 --> 00:12:47,960 Speaker 1: talked some politics. Look, he's in a crazy situation in Israel. 233 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:50,880 Speaker 1: They keep having elections that he hasn't been able to 234 00:12:50,920 --> 00:12:53,000 Speaker 1: form a government, and so I was getting his thoughts 235 00:12:53,080 --> 00:12:56,360 Speaker 1: on what's going on on that and what the dynamics are. 236 00:12:58,040 --> 00:13:01,240 Speaker 1: We also talked a lot about Iran. I think Beebe's 237 00:13:01,360 --> 00:13:05,000 Speaker 1: leadership when it comes to stopping a rand from getting 238 00:13:05,040 --> 00:13:10,319 Speaker 1: nuclear weapons has been extraordinarily important, particularly when Obama was president, 239 00:13:10,760 --> 00:13:13,600 Speaker 1: and when Net and Yahoo we invited him to speak 240 00:13:13,640 --> 00:13:17,440 Speaker 1: on the Joint Session of Congress and he called out 241 00:13:17,480 --> 00:13:21,000 Speaker 1: the danger of the Ayatola Kamayee with nuclear weapons, and 242 00:13:21,280 --> 00:13:23,439 Speaker 1: the adjective I've used a bunch of times for Net 243 00:13:23,440 --> 00:13:27,200 Speaker 1: and Yahoo is church Chillian, because it was like Winston 244 00:13:27,320 --> 00:13:30,960 Speaker 1: Churchill when the Nazis were a gathering storm that he 245 00:13:31,080 --> 00:13:33,559 Speaker 1: spoke out. He spoke out with a clarity, spoke out 246 00:13:33,559 --> 00:13:37,800 Speaker 1: with a gravity and a weight, and it helped stiffen 247 00:13:37,880 --> 00:13:41,600 Speaker 1: the spine, frankly of a lot of members of Congress. 248 00:13:41,640 --> 00:13:45,079 Speaker 1: One of the reasons Trump pulled out of the Obama 249 00:13:45,200 --> 00:13:48,320 Speaker 1: nuclear deal is because Beebe was so strong that he 250 00:13:48,360 --> 00:13:54,199 Speaker 1: had that. You didn't have Republicans in Congress just to 251 00:13:54,240 --> 00:13:56,480 Speaker 1: give up on it, say oh well, this is this 252 00:13:56,600 --> 00:13:58,719 Speaker 1: is done. Let's move on. And so I think that 253 00:13:58,840 --> 00:14:01,120 Speaker 1: was very important. So I started the day meeting with Beebe, 254 00:14:02,600 --> 00:14:05,560 Speaker 1: met with him from nine to nine thirty, then went 255 00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:09,320 Speaker 1: and met with my staff, my team, and we talked 256 00:14:09,400 --> 00:14:13,240 Speaker 1: strategy for the impeachment hearing. We worked on questions for 257 00:14:13,280 --> 00:14:16,160 Speaker 1: the impeachment hearing. We just went back and forth. Okay, 258 00:14:16,240 --> 00:14:17,920 Speaker 1: where do we want to press and spend about an 259 00:14:17,960 --> 00:14:20,720 Speaker 1: hour doing that. Then I went back back to the 260 00:14:20,720 --> 00:14:23,680 Speaker 1: White House and and was there we talked yesterday about 261 00:14:23,680 --> 00:14:28,320 Speaker 1: the signing of the USMCA, the US Mexico Canada trade agreement, 262 00:14:28,960 --> 00:14:30,840 Speaker 1: that was out on the south lawn of the White House. 263 00:14:32,240 --> 00:14:35,400 Speaker 1: President was there, Greg Abbott, Governor of Texas, was there. 264 00:14:35,400 --> 00:14:37,440 Speaker 1: A bunch of senators, a bunch of House members were there. 265 00:14:39,000 --> 00:14:41,680 Speaker 1: You know, wait, look, it was fun. We heard heard speeches. 266 00:14:41,680 --> 00:14:43,600 Speaker 1: The President gave him, gave a pretty good speech. He 267 00:14:43,720 --> 00:14:45,960 Speaker 1: was He was pretty funny. Actually, he was almost like 268 00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:48,680 Speaker 1: a stand up comedian. He was spending a lot of 269 00:14:48,720 --> 00:14:51,320 Speaker 1: times sort of almost tongue in cheek, kissing up to 270 00:14:51,360 --> 00:14:53,720 Speaker 1: the senators and saying, hey, I need your votes, guys, 271 00:14:53,840 --> 00:14:56,160 Speaker 1: my fate is in your hands. And what was amusing 272 00:14:56,240 --> 00:14:57,800 Speaker 1: is he said, House members, I don't need you, guys. 273 00:14:57,800 --> 00:15:00,200 Speaker 1: You already voted. So you're like, yeah, I can ignore you. 274 00:15:00,200 --> 00:15:02,000 Speaker 1: But hey, the senators, you know, I mean it was 275 00:15:03,000 --> 00:15:05,800 Speaker 1: and so he signed it. He was giving out signing pens. 276 00:15:05,840 --> 00:15:08,520 Speaker 1: I've got a sighting pen from USMCA. So that was fun. 277 00:15:10,400 --> 00:15:13,280 Speaker 1: And then from there went back to the back to 278 00:15:13,320 --> 00:15:16,040 Speaker 1: the Capitol and we went into the trial. Trial started 279 00:15:16,040 --> 00:15:18,880 Speaker 1: at one o'clock and the trial went from one o'clock 280 00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:24,200 Speaker 1: till about eleven fifteen at night. Yeah, stayed in the 281 00:15:24,200 --> 00:15:26,520 Speaker 1: cloak room for about forty five minutes trying to see 282 00:15:26,560 --> 00:15:30,480 Speaker 1: if we could find a deal to get us to 283 00:15:30,600 --> 00:15:33,160 Speaker 1: fifty one and end this trial. So it was negotiating 284 00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:36,280 Speaker 1: with other senators. Got in the truck headed over here. 285 00:15:36,360 --> 00:15:41,480 Speaker 1: We recorded the podcast. I got home, oh, probably about 286 00:15:41,480 --> 00:15:44,560 Speaker 1: two in the morning last night, turned on the DVR, 287 00:15:44,600 --> 00:15:48,360 Speaker 1: and watched about a quarter of the Rockets Jazz game. 288 00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:50,160 Speaker 1: Don't tell me who won. I only watched the quarter 289 00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:54,240 Speaker 1: and then although if I will be amazed if the 290 00:15:54,320 --> 00:15:57,720 Speaker 1: Rockets won, because we're so shorthanded, we're missing Harden and 291 00:15:57,720 --> 00:16:00,600 Speaker 1: Westbrook and Capella, so if we want to it's a miracle. 292 00:16:00,680 --> 00:16:02,840 Speaker 1: But I have to believe in miracles. I have to 293 00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:05,120 Speaker 1: admit I missed the Rockets Jazz game last night. I'll 294 00:16:05,120 --> 00:16:10,600 Speaker 1: try to catch it tonight. And then went to sleep 295 00:16:10,600 --> 00:16:13,960 Speaker 1: about two thirty. Woke up this morning. First thing I 296 00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:16,720 Speaker 1: had this morning was a text for my scheduler saying, Hey, 297 00:16:16,760 --> 00:16:19,680 Speaker 1: Lindsay grit Graham, Ney's talk to you on impeachment. So 298 00:16:19,720 --> 00:16:22,600 Speaker 1: I called Lindsay. Lindsay had just gotten off the phone 299 00:16:22,640 --> 00:16:26,280 Speaker 1: with the President, and so we talked about he and 300 00:16:26,320 --> 00:16:28,840 Speaker 1: I are both working to see is there a way 301 00:16:28,880 --> 00:16:32,000 Speaker 1: to get the senators who are not sure where they 302 00:16:32,040 --> 00:16:38,680 Speaker 1: are on additional witnesses, to get them, get them to yes, 303 00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:41,120 Speaker 1: to get them to ending this trial now. And so 304 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:44,560 Speaker 1: we're continuing to negotiate and discuss that. And then I 305 00:16:44,600 --> 00:16:46,280 Speaker 1: headed back to see you. Then you came here. We 306 00:16:46,320 --> 00:16:48,080 Speaker 1: had a cup of coffee and did the show. This 307 00:16:48,120 --> 00:16:51,040 Speaker 1: brings up a fascinating point because in the way that 308 00:16:51,080 --> 00:16:53,400 Speaker 1: I was imagining how impeachment goes, and I think for 309 00:16:53,440 --> 00:16:56,720 Speaker 1: a lot of Americans, it's all kind of pre planned. 310 00:16:56,760 --> 00:16:59,560 Speaker 1: It's all scripted. Nothing is happening in the moment. Nobody 311 00:16:59,640 --> 00:17:01,240 Speaker 1: needs to wake up and call the White House and 312 00:17:01,240 --> 00:17:04,640 Speaker 1: then call your other senator friend and this and yet, 313 00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:07,040 Speaker 1: from what you're describing to me, running into the cloakroom, 314 00:17:07,080 --> 00:17:10,280 Speaker 1: hearing something, writing down a new question, calling Lindsey Graham, 315 00:17:10,359 --> 00:17:12,119 Speaker 1: he's on the phone with the President. A lot of 316 00:17:12,160 --> 00:17:15,119 Speaker 1: this is happening in real time. It's not inevitable. We 317 00:17:15,400 --> 00:17:17,600 Speaker 1: don't really know how this story ends. But look, I 318 00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:21,320 Speaker 1: think that's very much right and that's not true of 319 00:17:21,359 --> 00:17:24,600 Speaker 1: every senator. There are a lot of senators who are 320 00:17:24,680 --> 00:17:27,640 Speaker 1: just kind of sitting there listening. They're going to cast 321 00:17:27,680 --> 00:17:32,199 Speaker 1: their vote and that's it. I like to be active, 322 00:17:32,240 --> 00:17:35,760 Speaker 1: I like to be engaged. As as as I told 323 00:17:35,800 --> 00:17:38,240 Speaker 1: Lindsey this morning, I have to admit I'm I'm having 324 00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:40,359 Speaker 1: a hell of a lot of fun now. It's not 325 00:17:40,440 --> 00:17:41,800 Speaker 1: good for the country. I don't want to see it 326 00:17:41,880 --> 00:17:44,199 Speaker 1: dragged on. I'd like to see it ended. But but 327 00:17:44,440 --> 00:17:52,560 Speaker 1: it is. These are complicated, tough, strategic, legal, political factual 328 00:17:52,640 --> 00:18:00,720 Speaker 1: questions that are there nuanced. They're difficult, and and I 329 00:18:00,760 --> 00:18:04,240 Speaker 1: think we're going to end up in the right place, 330 00:18:04,840 --> 00:18:08,000 Speaker 1: which is the president being acquitted. But how long that takes, 331 00:18:08,119 --> 00:18:10,679 Speaker 1: how long that takes and how we get there is 332 00:18:10,680 --> 00:18:13,520 Speaker 1: a different story. Could you just take us really quickly through. 333 00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:16,480 Speaker 1: You're going to get this vote tomorrow, I guess, And 334 00:18:16,520 --> 00:18:19,760 Speaker 1: whether to call additional witnesses. If they vote no no 335 00:18:19,840 --> 00:18:22,239 Speaker 1: additional witnesses, what do the next two weeks look like? 336 00:18:22,600 --> 00:18:24,920 Speaker 1: So if we vote no additional witnesses, if we get 337 00:18:24,920 --> 00:18:27,560 Speaker 1: fifty one who say no additional witnesses, that we've heard enough. 338 00:18:28,520 --> 00:18:32,560 Speaker 1: I expect that the Democrats will have kind of paroxysms 339 00:18:32,560 --> 00:18:38,119 Speaker 1: of rage. So we'll see several motions. Then the motions 340 00:18:38,119 --> 00:18:40,760 Speaker 1: will kind of be screw you. It'll be there's something like, 341 00:18:40,960 --> 00:18:42,480 Speaker 1: I can't believe you did this to me, so I 342 00:18:42,520 --> 00:18:44,960 Speaker 1: have another motion, I have another motion. And some of 343 00:18:44,960 --> 00:18:46,399 Speaker 1: it is the Democrats will just need to get that 344 00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:50,880 Speaker 1: out of their system. And one of the strategies Mitch 345 00:18:50,920 --> 00:18:53,680 Speaker 1: McConnell is employed, which I actually think is has been 346 00:18:53,800 --> 00:18:57,320 Speaker 1: wise and the right thing is to make this long 347 00:18:57,520 --> 00:19:01,240 Speaker 1: and brutal and painful to all one hundred senators. Mitch 348 00:19:01,280 --> 00:19:03,600 Speaker 1: just told us a hundred times this is not going 349 00:19:03,640 --> 00:19:07,760 Speaker 1: to be pleasant because he wants the senators to want 350 00:19:07,840 --> 00:19:10,399 Speaker 1: to end this. That's exactly right, and there are a 351 00:19:10,440 --> 00:19:12,919 Speaker 1: few things more motivating. This is a strange place. So 352 00:19:13,040 --> 00:19:16,320 Speaker 1: typically we fly out Thursday afternoons to get back home, 353 00:19:16,720 --> 00:19:19,480 Speaker 1: and we're in our home states Fridays through the weekends. 354 00:19:20,800 --> 00:19:23,040 Speaker 1: Often how things get done in the Senate is is 355 00:19:23,080 --> 00:19:25,879 Speaker 1: you're getting to Thursday, everything's at an impass. People are 356 00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:28,320 Speaker 1: there's a roadblock, and then people want to get out. 357 00:19:28,359 --> 00:19:30,800 Speaker 1: They've got a plane flight. And so the phrase is 358 00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:33,800 Speaker 1: jet fumes are in the air, and when jet fumes 359 00:19:33,800 --> 00:19:35,360 Speaker 1: are in the air. You got a bunch of senators 360 00:19:35,359 --> 00:19:37,119 Speaker 1: and some of them are in their seventies and eighties. 361 00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:40,320 Speaker 1: They're looking to get out of here, and they'll agree 362 00:19:41,000 --> 00:19:44,479 Speaker 1: to damn near anything to get out of here. Some 363 00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:47,639 Speaker 1: of the angriest I've ever made my colleagues is on 364 00:19:47,760 --> 00:19:50,720 Speaker 1: fights trying to limit out of control spending when I've 365 00:19:50,800 --> 00:19:53,680 Speaker 1: ended up saying no, I'm going to object, and it's 366 00:19:53,720 --> 00:19:57,440 Speaker 1: ruined their weekend plans. And I mean, you cannot overstate 367 00:19:57,480 --> 00:20:01,719 Speaker 1: how I mean how screaming and in race you're joking, 368 00:20:01,840 --> 00:20:04,520 Speaker 1: I am not at all, I mean literally screaming at 369 00:20:04,560 --> 00:20:11,000 Speaker 1: the top of their lungness. Mitch knows that that's being 370 00:20:11,160 --> 00:20:14,879 Speaker 1: used right now. By having these be long, grueling days, 371 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:20,600 Speaker 1: what he is counting on his senators, both wobbly Republicans 372 00:20:20,640 --> 00:20:23,320 Speaker 1: and Democrats, will say I gotta get out of here 373 00:20:23,800 --> 00:20:28,280 Speaker 1: enough already that they won't want to extend things forever. Tomorrow, 374 00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:31,640 Speaker 1: if we have a vote no additional witnesses, I think 375 00:20:31,640 --> 00:20:34,960 Speaker 1: you'll see several Democratic motions. By the way, each motion 376 00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:36,560 Speaker 1: you've got an hour on each side to argue it, 377 00:20:36,680 --> 00:20:39,800 Speaker 1: so it will be I expect tomorrow is likely to 378 00:20:39,800 --> 00:20:44,119 Speaker 1: be a long night, but then I think we we 379 00:20:44,200 --> 00:20:47,080 Speaker 1: will move to the final judgment, so that would be 380 00:20:47,160 --> 00:20:49,920 Speaker 1: that would be Saturday. You would say, yeah, there's there's 381 00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:53,320 Speaker 1: a period of deliberation, and that deliberation is in close session, 382 00:20:53,400 --> 00:20:56,240 Speaker 1: so the TV cameras are off, the reporters are thrown out, 383 00:20:56,520 --> 00:20:59,280 Speaker 1: and it's just senators giving speeches and talking to each other, 384 00:21:00,160 --> 00:21:04,480 Speaker 1: and then we vote. I'm not sure the exact timing 385 00:21:04,520 --> 00:21:07,240 Speaker 1: of a vote, but but if we if we conclude 386 00:21:07,440 --> 00:21:10,840 Speaker 1: that the additional witnesses are not needed, I am confident 387 00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:15,080 Speaker 1: that that by Monday, this will be Stay of the 388 00:21:15,119 --> 00:21:18,679 Speaker 1: Union is Tuesday, right, and and so if if we 389 00:21:18,720 --> 00:21:21,560 Speaker 1: conclude there are no additional witnesses, I have full confidence 390 00:21:21,760 --> 00:21:24,320 Speaker 1: we will push through whatever is necessary to get this 391 00:21:24,359 --> 00:21:26,120 Speaker 1: resolved before the State of the Union. And it will 392 00:21:26,119 --> 00:21:28,119 Speaker 1: be a very funny State of the Union if this 393 00:21:28,200 --> 00:21:31,159 Speaker 1: is all resolved before then what if it's not What 394 00:21:31,240 --> 00:21:33,000 Speaker 1: if they vote to call more witnesses, what are the 395 00:21:33,000 --> 00:21:36,199 Speaker 1: next two, three, four weeks look like? Nobody knows. I 396 00:21:36,240 --> 00:21:39,600 Speaker 1: mean it is presumably you'll have a motion from the 397 00:21:39,640 --> 00:21:43,680 Speaker 1: Democrats to call John Bolton. If they're fifty one who 398 00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:45,680 Speaker 1: just voted for more witnesses, you have to assume they're 399 00:21:45,720 --> 00:21:48,760 Speaker 1: fifty one for that, presumably you'll have a motion on 400 00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:52,920 Speaker 1: the other side to call Hunter Biden. I am very 401 00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:55,000 Speaker 1: confident we'll get fifty one for that. You know, Chuck 402 00:21:55,040 --> 00:21:57,920 Speaker 1: Schumer's telling reporters there will never be fifty one to 403 00:21:57,960 --> 00:22:00,879 Speaker 1: call Hunter Biden. He is full of it, really, I 404 00:22:00,960 --> 00:22:04,919 Speaker 1: mean it is total spin because he's saying, well, our 405 00:22:04,960 --> 00:22:08,840 Speaker 1: Democrats will vote. Now, we'll look even if four Republicans 406 00:22:08,960 --> 00:22:14,160 Speaker 1: join with the Democrats in calling Bolton, those four are 407 00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:17,480 Speaker 1: not going to say we will only call prosecution witnesses 408 00:22:17,480 --> 00:22:23,040 Speaker 1: and not defense witnesses. I'm confident if we're calling witnesses, 409 00:22:23,080 --> 00:22:25,119 Speaker 1: if John Bolton is getting called, that we'll have at 410 00:22:25,160 --> 00:22:27,919 Speaker 1: least fifty three votes to call Hunter Biden. By the way, 411 00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:30,920 Speaker 1: Joe Mansion also said he might vote Democrat from West Virginia. 412 00:22:31,119 --> 00:22:33,440 Speaker 1: He might vote for Hunter Biden. The point is, if 413 00:22:33,480 --> 00:22:38,200 Speaker 1: we go down this road, we'll have at least those 414 00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:41,560 Speaker 1: two witnesses. An interesting bit of speculation. I've heard several 415 00:22:41,560 --> 00:22:44,680 Speaker 1: Senators say this in the cloak room, that they think 416 00:22:44,720 --> 00:22:49,680 Speaker 1: the Democrats are voting for more witnesses but hoping, desperately 417 00:22:49,760 --> 00:22:53,720 Speaker 1: hoping they lose that vote because a lot of these 418 00:22:53,760 --> 00:22:56,480 Speaker 1: Democrats are terrified if we open the door to more 419 00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:59,399 Speaker 1: witnesses and we bring in, say Hunter Biden, or we 420 00:22:59,400 --> 00:23:01,480 Speaker 1: bring in Joe Bide, or we bring in the whistleblower, 421 00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:05,639 Speaker 1: that things get really bad because what they've managed to 422 00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:08,119 Speaker 1: do in the House proceedings is cover up all of 423 00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:11,760 Speaker 1: the evidence of corruption. We start bringing in witnesses and 424 00:23:11,800 --> 00:23:14,920 Speaker 1: suddenly that corruption. You know, it's going to be real 425 00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:17,760 Speaker 1: interesting seeing Hunter Biden on the floor of the Senate 426 00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:20,520 Speaker 1: be asked million bucks a year? What'd you do for that? 427 00:23:21,640 --> 00:23:25,720 Speaker 1: What services did you provide for a million bucks a year? 428 00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:29,199 Speaker 1: And what'd your dad do to help you out that? 429 00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:32,760 Speaker 1: This almost has me hoping for more witnesses. But I 430 00:23:32,800 --> 00:23:35,080 Speaker 1: just want to be clear. If more witnesses are called, 431 00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:37,199 Speaker 1: this is not going to continue to be in every 432 00:23:37,280 --> 00:23:39,880 Speaker 1: single day, ten hours a day now. I think that's right. 433 00:23:39,920 --> 00:23:43,040 Speaker 1: So if the Senate votes to subpoena let's say that 434 00:23:43,480 --> 00:23:47,280 Speaker 1: we subpoena both John Bolton and Hunter Biden, that's going 435 00:23:47,320 --> 00:23:49,600 Speaker 1: to take some time to shake out. Then those subpoenas 436 00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:52,160 Speaker 1: will be served. I think it's likely you'll see litigation, 437 00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:54,960 Speaker 1: at least on the John Bolton side with the White 438 00:23:54,960 --> 00:23:58,720 Speaker 1: House asserting executive privilege try to block his testimony. That 439 00:23:58,800 --> 00:24:01,520 Speaker 1: could take weeks or even months. And so I think 440 00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:03,679 Speaker 1: what is likely as the Senate would go back to 441 00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:07,600 Speaker 1: regular business for a period of time until such time 442 00:24:07,640 --> 00:24:09,639 Speaker 1: as those witnesses can come. And by the way, usually 443 00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:13,040 Speaker 1: with witnesses, you have a deposition first, and then you 444 00:24:13,119 --> 00:24:16,160 Speaker 1: have trial testimony. So if we go down the road 445 00:24:16,200 --> 00:24:19,159 Speaker 1: of more witnesses, I would anticipate that being sometime in 446 00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:24,119 Speaker 1: the future minimum of a couple weeks. Okay, so we'll 447 00:24:24,160 --> 00:24:25,800 Speaker 1: get a little bit of a break, and then the 448 00:24:25,800 --> 00:24:28,920 Speaker 1: Senate has to go from this very intense trial back 449 00:24:28,920 --> 00:24:31,720 Speaker 1: into the normal business of the Senate, back into possibly 450 00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:34,919 Speaker 1: removing the president from office. Yep, that seems like a 451 00:24:34,920 --> 00:24:41,000 Speaker 1: lot of whiplash. It is. And listen, I think there 452 00:24:41,000 --> 00:24:45,120 Speaker 1: are a lot of Democrats really nervous about the direction 453 00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:48,200 Speaker 1: these facts are going. I'll give it example. Yesterday, in 454 00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:53,320 Speaker 1: questioning Adam Schiff said early on he said, if any 455 00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:59,120 Speaker 1: part of the president's motivation is corrupt, then that's enough 456 00:24:59,160 --> 00:25:02,359 Speaker 1: to convict Hi. No, does this mean there is a 457 00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:06,080 Speaker 1: big angle on this Yesterday, which was the difference between 458 00:25:06,880 --> 00:25:09,919 Speaker 1: a private motive and a public motive you know, private 459 00:25:09,920 --> 00:25:12,960 Speaker 1: interest or the national good. So and I think actually 460 00:25:12,960 --> 00:25:15,040 Speaker 1: Dershowitz did a really good job of sort of breaking 461 00:25:15,040 --> 00:25:18,520 Speaker 1: out three scenarios. Yeah, there is one scenario, which is 462 00:25:18,560 --> 00:25:21,000 Speaker 1: the sort of mother Teresa that you're making a decision 463 00:25:21,119 --> 00:25:24,320 Speaker 1: because of love of humanity and the greater good, no selfishness, 464 00:25:24,400 --> 00:25:27,080 Speaker 1: no selfishness. And he said, look, there are not a 465 00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:29,120 Speaker 1: lot of people in politics making a lot of decisions 466 00:25:29,160 --> 00:25:31,320 Speaker 1: like that. And he is right in that, right, he said, 467 00:25:31,560 --> 00:25:34,359 Speaker 1: there's the other scenario that is the corrupt and venal 468 00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:38,240 Speaker 1: that your motive is purely selfish. Look it's give me 469 00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:41,639 Speaker 1: a bag of cash. It's bribery or for that matter, 470 00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:45,920 Speaker 1: look that's what's alleged about Joe Biden. Give my son 471 00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:47,880 Speaker 1: a bag of cash. I mean it is. You want 472 00:25:47,920 --> 00:25:52,280 Speaker 1: to talk about the three scenarios. The Biden allegations at 473 00:25:52,320 --> 00:25:56,000 Speaker 1: a minimum are in category three, and then category two 474 00:25:56,080 --> 00:25:58,520 Speaker 1: is the big one, and it's mixed motives where you 475 00:25:58,560 --> 00:26:01,159 Speaker 1: have some public interest, you want to do good, but 476 00:26:01,200 --> 00:26:03,959 Speaker 1: you're also looking to political self interest. And one thing 477 00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:07,280 Speaker 1: to keep in mind, listen with elected politicians, just about 478 00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:12,080 Speaker 1: everything you do, one of the considerations you're thinking about 479 00:26:12,280 --> 00:26:16,200 Speaker 1: is will the folks back home like it, and will 480 00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:19,360 Speaker 1: this help me get reelected? And that Look, I think 481 00:26:19,359 --> 00:26:22,040 Speaker 1: politicians think about that far too often. I'm a big 482 00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:25,120 Speaker 1: believer in the proposition that good policy is good politics. 483 00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:28,640 Speaker 1: If you do the right thing substantively, it'll play well back. 484 00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:33,000 Speaker 1: But you see, you know, we just passed the USMCA. 485 00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:35,000 Speaker 1: A bunch of senators, a bunch of House members voted 486 00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:36,720 Speaker 1: for that. A big reason they voted for that is 487 00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:41,720 Speaker 1: their constituents want them to. It's good politics just about everything. 488 00:26:43,080 --> 00:26:46,359 Speaker 1: All right, let me ask this, Let's apply the Adam 489 00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:50,960 Speaker 1: Schift test. If any part of the motive is corrupt, 490 00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:53,439 Speaker 1: and by corrupt he means thinking it will advance his 491 00:26:53,520 --> 00:26:56,879 Speaker 1: partisan interest, that it's impeachable and you should remove him 492 00:26:56,920 --> 00:27:00,679 Speaker 1: from office. Me ask you a question, Michael, do you 493 00:27:00,720 --> 00:27:05,200 Speaker 1: believe any part of Adam Shift's motivation is partisan? Oh? 494 00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:08,560 Speaker 1: It couldn't possibly be, not at it? Well? Maybe yes, 495 00:27:08,680 --> 00:27:10,880 Speaker 1: I think we would all have to say, of course, 496 00:27:11,320 --> 00:27:17,000 Speaker 1: part of Adam Shift's motivation is partisan. What a ludicrous standard, right? 497 00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:21,400 Speaker 1: He literally argued if the president had even the tiniest 498 00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:25,639 Speaker 1: bit of political motivation, he should be impeached and removed 499 00:27:25,640 --> 00:27:27,639 Speaker 1: for office. For high crimes and misdemean So if the 500 00:27:27,680 --> 00:27:31,520 Speaker 1: politician had a political motivation at all, in any degree, 501 00:27:31,760 --> 00:27:34,480 Speaker 1: then he's got to be thrown out. A look, it 502 00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:37,200 Speaker 1: shows this is a game. They know it's a game. 503 00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:41,520 Speaker 1: They know that standard. You know, no politician could survive 504 00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:44,720 Speaker 1: that stage. Look, I'm shocked, shocked, there's gambling in Casablanca. 505 00:27:45,040 --> 00:27:50,760 Speaker 1: But I mean that. Do you remember the compliment that 506 00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:56,800 Speaker 1: was made of Bill Clinton that he's an exceptionally good liar? Yeah? Yes, 507 00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:03,440 Speaker 1: I'm just going to leave it at that. I'm ready. 508 00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:05,960 Speaker 1: I'm not even going to connect that thing. We'll just 509 00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:08,200 Speaker 1: leave it at that. And it seems as though you 510 00:28:08,280 --> 00:28:10,800 Speaker 1: might be paying somebody a compliment. We have got to 511 00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:13,280 Speaker 1: get you to Capitol Hill. We've run a little late anyway, 512 00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:15,160 Speaker 1: and we need to make sure that you ask all 513 00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:18,320 Speaker 1: of those questions of the House impeachment managers, and then 514 00:28:18,359 --> 00:28:20,159 Speaker 1: we will be right back tomorrow to see how it 515 00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:22,399 Speaker 1: all turns out. I do have to make one point. Okay, 516 00:28:23,320 --> 00:28:26,840 Speaker 1: we talked before about milk. This is the most important point. 517 00:28:26,920 --> 00:28:30,560 Speaker 1: Two liquids are allowed on the Senate floor. I need 518 00:28:30,600 --> 00:28:34,480 Speaker 1: to tell you a major landmark currents this week. Please 519 00:28:34,520 --> 00:28:37,399 Speaker 1: go on, let's make some news. Yesterday, I was looking 520 00:28:37,440 --> 00:28:39,880 Speaker 1: over at Richard Burr from North Carolina, and I looked 521 00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:42,760 Speaker 1: over at his desk. On his desk, a page brought 522 00:28:42,880 --> 00:28:48,920 Speaker 1: him chocolate milk. Chocolate milk, What what is the well? 523 00:28:49,240 --> 00:28:51,840 Speaker 1: So I took one of the witness cards, the question 524 00:28:51,880 --> 00:28:53,640 Speaker 1: cards that you write to the Chief Justice, and I 525 00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:58,040 Speaker 1: wrote out a question from Senator Cruz, Mister Chief Justice, 526 00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:00,280 Speaker 1: is is it the case that Senator Burr is the 527 00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:02,560 Speaker 1: first Senator in the history of the US Senate to 528 00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:05,760 Speaker 1: have chocolate milk at his desk? And I didn't send 529 00:29:05,800 --> 00:29:07,520 Speaker 1: it to the Chief Justice, but I did pass it 530 00:29:07,560 --> 00:29:10,960 Speaker 1: over to Richard, who cracked up laughing. So we have 531 00:29:11,000 --> 00:29:14,920 Speaker 1: apparently made a new precedent that I don't think has 532 00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:19,480 Speaker 1: ever occurred, and the Nestle's precedent has been set. When 533 00:29:19,480 --> 00:29:22,320 Speaker 1: the historians look at this moment, they might say, third 534 00:29:22,320 --> 00:29:24,960 Speaker 1: time ever that a president was impeached, first time ever 535 00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:27,520 Speaker 1: a president was impeached without being accused of a crime. 536 00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:30,920 Speaker 1: That's going to be a footnote because the big precedent 537 00:29:31,080 --> 00:29:35,480 Speaker 1: is the first time ever chocolate milk was drunk on 538 00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:38,680 Speaker 1: the Senate floor. And next podcast asked me about what 539 00:29:38,760 --> 00:29:41,880 Speaker 1: John Thune and I are planning to do about this, Khalua. 540 00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:45,320 Speaker 1: We'll have to wait and see to find out. I'm 541 00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:56,160 Speaker 1: Michael Knowles. This is Verdict with Ted Cruz. This episode 542 00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:58,680 Speaker 1: of Verdict with Ted Cruz is being brought to you 543 00:29:58,720 --> 00:30:02,560 Speaker 1: by Jobs, Freedom and Security Pack, a political action committee 544 00:30:02,560 --> 00:30:07,720 Speaker 1: dedicated to supporting conservative causes, organizations, and candidates across the country. 545 00:30:07,840 --> 00:30:11,200 Speaker 1: In twenty twenty two, Jobs Freedom and Security Pack plans 546 00:30:11,240 --> 00:30:14,520 Speaker 1: to donate to conservative candidates running for Congress and help 547 00:30:14,600 --> 00:30:16,880 Speaker 1: the Republican Party across the nation.