Speaker 1: This show contains mature content and adult themes. It may
Speaker 1: not be suitable for young audiences.
Speaker 2: In twenty seventeen, Harvey Weinstein was outed as a serial
Speaker 2: sexual abuser. Many brave women came forward and told their stories.
Speaker 2: They exposed one of Hollywood's most powerful moguls as a
Speaker 2: vicious sexual predator who operated horrifically and seemingly without consequences.
Speaker 2: But Weinstein was standing on the shoulders of monsters. For
Speaker 2: so many years, those monsters remained unchecked in Hollywood, shielded
Speaker 2: by the millions of dollars they made for their studios.
Speaker 2: Sex for fame is not new. In fact, it's as
Speaker 2: old as Hollywood itself. Today, we'll look at Errol Flynn,
Speaker 2: the Golden Age movie star who, at the peak of
Speaker 2: his stardom at age thirty three, was charged in nineteen
Speaker 2: forty two with three counts of statutory rape of his users,
Speaker 2: Peggy Satterley, claimed that in nineteen forty one, when she
Speaker 2: was fifteen years old, Flynn invited her to his boat,
Speaker 2: spiked her drink with liquor, and reaped her. At the
Speaker 2: time of his trial, Flynn was one of the most
Speaker 2: well known actors in Hollywood. He was famous for films
Speaker 2: such as the Adventures of Robin Hood released in nineteen
Speaker 2: thirty eight, The Seahawk released in nineteen forty, and Die
Speaker 2: Bomber in nineteen forty one, among many others, and that
Speaker 2: fame clearly influenced what happened during his trial. Today, using
Speaker 2: research from the Variety Archives, will take a look at
Speaker 2: how celebrity can impact a trial and how this sort
Speaker 2: of influence over a jury has been happening for decades.
Speaker 2: From Variety and iHeart Podcasts, I'm Tracy Patton. This is
Speaker 2: the secret history of the Casting Couch. Today's episode When
Speaker 2: You're a Star with Me Today is Matt Donnelly, Variety's
Speaker 2: senior Entertainment and Media writer. Welcome, Matt, thank you.
Speaker 3: So much for having me. I'm really interested today to
Speaker 3: dig into our first actor that we're discussing on the show.
Speaker 4: Yes, and it's about time.
Speaker 2: So what is it that drives some A list actors, Matt,
Speaker 2: to commit sexual assault?
Speaker 4: Is it ego or.
Speaker 2: Power or maybe it's just because they think they're a
Speaker 2: star and they can get away with it.
Speaker 3: I think it's a really toxic combination of everything you
Speaker 3: just mentioned.
Speaker 2: Well, to put aero Flynn in his dalliances with young women.
Speaker 2: In perspective, let's look at an infamous sex scandal in
Speaker 2: Hollywood at the time. As Vanity Fair described it, the
Speaker 2: Patricia Douglas case in nineteen thirty seven is probably the
Speaker 2: biggest best suppressed scandal in Hollywood history. Then as now,
Speaker 2: money is often the driving force behind most bad behavior
Speaker 2: in Hollywood. In nineteen thirty seven, near the peak of
Speaker 2: the depression, MGM Studios grossed fourteen million dollars, which would
Speaker 2: be about three hundred and twenty eight million dollars today.
Speaker 2: This was far more than its rivals and twice the
Speaker 2: money the studio had made the previous year.
Speaker 4: Studio chief Louis B.
Speaker 2: Mayer announced that MGM's annual five day sales convention would
Speaker 2: be held in Culver City. He promised the studios two
Speaker 2: hundred or so national sales force a super special production.
Speaker 2: According to Vanity Fair, after a long drunken train trip,
Speaker 2: the salesman arrived in Los Angeles and immediately began groping
Speaker 2: the starlets who were tasked with pinning carnations on their lapels.
Speaker 2: One of those so called starlets was Patricia Douglas. Unlike
Speaker 2: the girls in the Flynn rape trials, Douglas was twenty
Speaker 2: years old, in other words, over the age of legal consent.
Speaker 2: She was, however, very much on the Hollywood scene before that,
Speaker 2: dating movie and stage stars like Dick Powell and William
Speaker 2: Frawley while still under age. Supposedly, famed comic Jimmy Duranty
Speaker 2: was so smitten with her that he tried to convince
Speaker 2: her mother to allow him to marry Patricia, who was
Speaker 2: just fifteen years old. At the Big Sales Convention, Mayor
Speaker 2: wasn't subtle about the festivities he was offering his sales team.
Speaker 2: Vanity Fair reported that he told the hundreds of inebriated revelers,
Speaker 2: these lovely girls, and you have the finest of them
Speaker 2: to greet you, and that's to show you how we
Speaker 2: feel about you, and the kind of a good time
Speaker 2: that's ahead of you. Anything you want. Douglas was one
Speaker 2: of one hundred and twenty young female dancers dressed in
Speaker 2: cowboy hats, bolero jackets, and short skirts and transported to
Speaker 2: a large banquet hall. Vanity Fair described the nightmarish situation.
Speaker 2: Salesmen mistook the professional dancers for party favors and treated
Speaker 2: them accordingly, without telephones or transportation, the young women had
Speaker 2: no means of escape. Tricked into attendance, then trapped into service,
Speaker 2: they were left to fend for themselves. A waiter at
Speaker 2: the event later testified that the party was the worst,
Speaker 2: the wildest, and the rot I have ever seen. The
Speaker 2: men's attitude was very rough. They were running their hands
Speaker 2: over the girl's bodies and tried to force liquor on
Speaker 2: the girls. That night, according to Patricia Douglas, one of
Speaker 2: those drunken MGM salesmen raped her, and when she tried
Speaker 2: to press charges, she discovered the power of the Hollywood Studios.
Speaker 2: LA District Attorney Buron Fits had been elected shortly after
Speaker 2: having beaten an indictment for perjury in a rape case
Speaker 2: involving a sixteen year old girl. A top contributor to
Speaker 2: his campaign was none other than Louis B.
Speaker 4: Mayer.
Speaker 2: What followed Patricia Douglas's attempts to receive justice was a
Speaker 2: sadly familiar campaign of studio finance, publicity, blaming and shaming
Speaker 2: the victim. The accused salesman was never charged, So.
Speaker 3: Really interesting insight into sort of a blueprint for a
Speaker 3: studio covering up an horrific crime like this. But let's
Speaker 3: talk about Errol Flynn's career.
Speaker 2: Yes, of course, Errol Flynn was probably best known for
Speaker 2: starring in the Adventures of Robinhood in nineteen thirty eight.
Speaker 2: That same year, Life magazine named him the most famous
Speaker 2: man in America. He was in more than fifty A
Speaker 2: List films and almost always played the lead. He was
Speaker 2: under contract at Warner Brothers for twenty years and made
Speaker 2: millions for them. Eventually, Flynn bought eight and a half
Speaker 2: acres on Mulholland Drive. He built a sprawling, two story
Speaker 2: colonial party palace in the Hollywood Hills and called it
Speaker 2: Mulholland Farm. It was a perfect secluded spot for his
Speaker 2: debauchery and sexual escapades.
Speaker 3: You know, Warner Brothers first took a big chance on
Speaker 3: Earl in nineteen thirty five, at the start of his career.
Speaker 3: They gave him a lead in this pirate adventure movie
Speaker 3: called Captain Blood. I also believe he's synonymous with the
Speaker 3: word swashbuckling.
Speaker 2: I think you're right, Matt, and it was a huge
Speaker 2: hit that led to starring roles in a list films
Speaker 2: with the biggest names of the day. His co stars
Speaker 2: included Betty Davis, Olivia de Haviland, and Barbara Stanwick. He
Speaker 2: was also one of Hollywood's most self destructive stars.
Speaker 4: He would try.
Speaker 2: Almost anything, at least once he started smoking weed in
Speaker 2: the nineteen thirties. He claimed cocaine was an aphrodisiac. He
Speaker 2: told his friend, the British actor David Niven, that he'd
Speaker 2: tried every drug there was except heroin, but mainly Errol
Speaker 2: Flynn liked to drink. He was a regular at the
Speaker 2: celebrities only nightclubs on the Sunset Strip, and his drunken
Speaker 2: brawls there were reported in gossip columns nationwide. After the
Speaker 2: bars closed, he might take the party with him up
Speaker 2: to his mansion on Mulholland and go all night at
Speaker 2: the studio. In the mornings, he'd secretly keep up his
Speaker 2: consumption by injecting oranges with vodka.
Speaker 3: It's actually kind of impressive and amazing that he could
Speaker 3: keep this up for that long.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, But then toward the end of nineteen forty two
Speaker 2: things started to unravel. On Saturday, September twenty sixth, Flynn
Speaker 2: attended a party at the mansion of Jack McAvoy, one
Speaker 2: of his closest friends. They were celebrating Jack's pending divorce
Speaker 2: from his wife, a standard oil heiress. Like Flynn, McAvoy
Speaker 2: was an adventurer, a world traveler, and thanks to his
Speaker 2: soon to be ex wife, Filthy rich. The two men
Speaker 2: also shared a compulsion for cocktails and female company. It
Speaker 2: was a small party with maybe ten or twelve people,
Speaker 2: including a number of attractive young women. Errol Flynn was
Speaker 2: playing tennis when Cheechy Nap, Flynn's young friend from the studio,
Speaker 2: showed up uninvited. He had brought along a blonde girl
Speaker 2: by the name of Betty Hanson. Betty was new in town,
Speaker 2: straight from Lincoln, Nebraska. Like so many others, she had
Speaker 2: come to Hollywood in search of movie stardom. The next day,
Speaker 2: Betty told her married sister about meeting the famous Errol Flynn.
Speaker 2: She said that he gave her cocktails and then took
Speaker 2: her upstairs and, as she put it, seduced her. Betty
Speaker 2: had just turned seventeen six days earlier on September twenty first,
Speaker 2: the age of consent was eighteen. Outraged, her sister contacted
Speaker 2: the District Attorney's office to file a complaint against Flynn
Speaker 2: as far as the DA's investigators were concerned, there was
Speaker 2: nothing unusual about the fact that Errol Flynn had had
Speaker 2: sex with a young woman. He was known for that. However,
Speaker 2: the big news here was that Betty was underage. That
Speaker 2: meant that they now had a huge Hollywood star on
Speaker 2: account of statutory rape, or so they thought. Los Angeles
Speaker 2: County DA John Dockweiler took the charge to a grand jury,
Speaker 2: but after hearing from Betty Chee Chee and other witnesses,
Speaker 2: the jury declined to indict Eryl Flynn.
Speaker 3: And of course it's hard to know whether the jury's
Speaker 3: decision was based on insufficient evidence or because Flynn was
Speaker 3: a huge star.
Speaker 2: Yes, and in the end it did matter. Despite the
Speaker 2: jury's refusal to indict Flynn, DA Dockweiler ignored the jury's
Speaker 2: decision and indicted him anyway. That may be because another
Speaker 2: DA investigator remembered a similar complaint against Flynn from a
Speaker 2: year earlier. In August nineteen forty one, the mother of
Speaker 2: a sixteen year old girl had claimed that Flynn had
Speaker 2: sex with her daughter on his yacht during a trip
Speaker 2: to Catalina Island. The trip to Catalina was for a
Speaker 2: photoshoot for a feature about Errol Flynn for Life magazine.
Speaker 2: Peggy's role was to be eye candy and candid shots
Speaker 2: with Flynn. Like Betty Hanson, Peggy Satterly had movie star aspirations,
Speaker 2: and in the summer of nineteen forty one, her dream
Speaker 2: seemed to be coming true. It was on that trip
Speaker 2: that Flynn and Peggy had sex twice. But before Flynn
Speaker 2: could be charged, the girl's parents had second thoughts. They
Speaker 2: called the DA and asked to have the charges dropped.
Speaker 2: Their daughter had a promising career in show business and
Speaker 2: the parents didn't want bad publicity that might hurt her career.
Speaker 3: In the end, the DA charge Flynn with three counts
Speaker 3: of statutory rape, one charge for as halting Betty Hanson
Speaker 3: and two for Beggy Saturley.
Speaker 2: And when Hollywood's biggest movie star was arrested, who did
Speaker 2: he call? Hollywood's most successful fixed attorney, Jerry Geesler. Geesler
Speaker 2: was the attorney in our first Variety Confidential episode about
Speaker 2: the rape trial of Alexander Pantages. Pantages was a millionaire
Speaker 2: theater mogul who was accused of statutory rape. In the
Speaker 2: Pantagous trial Geesler set a legal precedent for weaponizing rape
Speaker 2: victim's sexual histories. Thanks to Geesler, Pantages was acquitted after
Speaker 2: the case was retried. Geesler credited that trial with making
Speaker 2: him a successful lawyer. He was known for getting Hollywood
Speaker 2: stars out of just about any kind of jam. His
Speaker 2: client list included Marilyn Monroe, Betty Davis, Charlie Chaplin, and
Speaker 2: mobster Benjamin Bugsy Siegel.
Speaker 3: You know, these types of celebrity indorsed attorneys are still
Speaker 3: around today, and you start to recognize the names of
Speaker 3: some of them if you pay close attention to any
Speaker 3: publicized trials involving a star.
Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely, and those publicized trials can be good for business.
Speaker 2: They really do get your name out there. For example,
Speaker 2: preliminary hearings don't often draw a crowd, but with Flynn
Speaker 2: as a draw, the courtroom was packed for his hearing
Speaker 2: in November nineteen forty two. When Betty Hansen took the stand,
Speaker 2: she said she went to the party at Jack McAvoy's
Speaker 2: house specifically to meet Errol Flynn. She first saw him
Speaker 2: on the tennis court there after a swim, she stayed
Speaker 2: for dinner. Later she followed Flynn into the sun room.
Speaker 2: She said she sat on the arm of Flynn's chair
Speaker 2: and then slid down onto his lap. A little later,
Speaker 2: she said, she got sick from the cocktails, so Flynn
Speaker 2: took her upstairs to lie down. It was then that
Speaker 2: they had sex. They were alone in the room for
Speaker 2: about fifty minutes, she said, and he complimented her breasts
Speaker 2: and her quote. Fanny Peggy Satterly was called next. After
Speaker 2: testifying about the trips to Catalina, she was asked if
Speaker 2: Flynn knew she would underage. She said he did, but.
Speaker 4: How did he know it?
Speaker 2: She was asked because she said he called her his
Speaker 2: little JB, which stood for jailbait Errol. Flynn did not
Speaker 2: testify that day.
Speaker 3: I don't think it gets more incriminating than that.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yes.
Speaker 2: As reported in Variety, jury selections started on January eleventh,
Speaker 2: nineteen forty three. Jerry Geesler's plan was to seat as
Speaker 2: many female jurors as possible. He was betting that Flynn's
Speaker 2: star power would outweigh the women's disapproval of his having
Speaker 2: sex with underage girls. In the end, Geesler succeeded with
Speaker 2: his jury selection plan. There were nine women and three
Speaker 2: men in the jury box when testimony started a few
Speaker 2: days later, Errol Flynn's fans turned out in swarms. They
Speaker 2: filled the courtroom and lined up in the hallway, hoping
Speaker 2: to catch a glimpse of the big star. Peggy Satterly
Speaker 2: was the first accuser to testify. The prosecutor led her
Speaker 2: through events on the trip to Catalina and back after
Speaker 2: Jerry Geesler for the defense, opened his cross examination by
Speaker 2: asking her what she'd done to resist Flynn on the ship.
Speaker 2: Did you scratch him, he asked, no, she replied. Did
Speaker 2: he tear your slip or your panties? He asked next,
Speaker 2: Not that I noticed, she said. Geesler then delved into
Speaker 2: Peggy's sexual history, a favorite tactic of his victim shaming.
Speaker 2: He claims she posed semi nude for photographs but did
Speaker 2: not show them to the jury. He asked her if
Speaker 2: it was true that she had had an abortion. She
Speaker 2: said yes. She refused to name the father, but insisted
Speaker 2: it was not Errol Flynn. On January twenty eighth, nineteen
Speaker 2: forty three, Variety reported that taking the stand in his
Speaker 2: own defense, and guided by questions of attorney Jerry Geesler.
Speaker 2: Flynn denied all charges of improper relations with miners, Peggy
Speaker 2: Satterly Aboordies yacht in nineteen forty one and Betty Hanson
Speaker 2: at a bel Air house party. Flynn remained stoic under
Speaker 2: a withering cross examination by the prosecution. Very likely on
Speaker 2: advice from Geesler, Flynn followed a strategy that's familiar to
Speaker 2: us today, deny, deny, deny. During closing arguments, Jerry Geesler
Speaker 2: reminded the jury about Betty Hansen's sexual experience and Peggy
Speaker 2: Satterley's abortion. His implication was clear they were sexually experienced women,
Speaker 2: not innocent young girls. He also said that the whole
Speaker 2: case smells like a fix. The jury deliberated for twelve hours.
Speaker 2: When they returned, Errol Flynn and his attorneys stood to
Speaker 2: face their judgment. The courtroom was silent as seconds ticked by. Finally,
Speaker 2: the jury for woman read the verdicts not guilty on
Speaker 2: all three counts before the judge dismissed the jury. He
Speaker 2: told them the evidence was sufficient for you to have
Speaker 2: arrived at a verdict in either direction. Under the circumstances,
Speaker 2: I think you have arrived at a proper vertic aero
Speaker 2: Flynn was overjoyed. He pushed past the bailiffs, rushed to
Speaker 2: the jury box, and shook hands with each of the jurors.
Speaker 3: You know, this seems like a really good example of
Speaker 3: how superstardom can impact a case, and it's reminiscent of
Speaker 3: the recent trial of Johnny Depp versus Amberhard, who also
Speaker 3: coincidentally played a pirate, a swashbuckling pirate in Pirates.
Speaker 4: Of the Cabby Yes.
Speaker 2: In covering that trial, Variety's Gene Mattis noted that the
Speaker 2: most consequential decision the judge in the case made may
Speaker 2: have come weeks before the trial, when she allowed Court
Speaker 2: TV to operate two pool cameras in the courtroom. When
Speaker 2: Depp took the stand on Wednesday, live viewership on its
Speaker 2: channel peaked at one point two million.
Speaker 4: Those are some serious numbers.
Speaker 2: That same article also mentioned that observers worried that the
Speaker 2: judge's decision will also have a chilling effect on victims
Speaker 2: of domestic violence. One legal scholar said that allowing this
Speaker 2: trial to be televised as a single worst decision I
Speaker 2: can can think of in the context of intimate partner
Speaker 2: violence and sexual violence in recent history. It has ramifications
Speaker 2: way beyond this case.
Speaker 3: Herds legal team obviously one of no cameras in the courtroom,
Speaker 3: but Dep's team argued for them, saying that mister Depp
Speaker 3: believes in transparency.
Speaker 2: The case was eventually settled and ended with Amber Heard
Speaker 2: paying dep one million dollars, which his attorney said would
Speaker 2: be donated to charity. Exactly one year after the trial,
Speaker 2: the headline story in Variety read Johnny Depp fans swarm
Speaker 2: Can with screams and shrines on opening night. Viva Johnny.
Speaker 3: So when you're a star that are now. The adage
Speaker 3: is true, the more things change, the more they stay
Speaker 3: the same.
Speaker 2: Variety was there after Flynn's trial too. On February eighth,
Speaker 2: nineteen forty three, Variety reported that Errol Flynn returns immediately
Speaker 2: to warners to appear in one sequence of the Thank
Speaker 2: Your Lucky Stars musical, using all of the studio's top names.
Speaker 2: Flynn's sequence in the film had been held up while
Speaker 2: he fought charges brought on behalf of two Minor Girls.
Speaker 2: Variety also noted that the studio was rushing three projects
Speaker 2: into production for Flynn, but first Flynn headed to Mexico
Speaker 2: for a little R and R. Apparently he learned nothing
Speaker 2: from his ordeal. His companion on the trip was seventeen
Speaker 2: years old. Her name was Nora Eddington, and he met
Speaker 2: her during the trial at a cigar shop in the
Speaker 2: courthouse lobby.
Speaker 3: You can't be serious.
Speaker 2: In nineteen fifty four, Warner Brothers ended Flynn's contract. His
Speaker 2: films had made millions of dollars for the studio during
Speaker 2: his twenty years on the lot, but his compulsive drinking
Speaker 2: had begun to catch up with him. It took a
Speaker 2: toll on his biggest asset, his trademark Good Looks. Alcohol
Speaker 2: may also have affected his decision making. In nineteen fifty seven,
Speaker 2: Flynn began a scandalous and very public affair with an
Speaker 2: aspiring dancer named Beverly Adlund. He'd spotted her on the
Speaker 2: Warner B's lot and invited her to a nighttime audition
Speaker 2: at a friend's mansion in the Hollywood Hills. Adlin was
Speaker 2: eager to accept, but first she had to ask her mother.
Speaker 2: That's because Beverly was serious jailbait. She was just fifteen
Speaker 2: years old. She was pixiish and blonde, and reminded him
Speaker 2: of a wood nymph, so Flynn called her his Darling Woodsey.
Speaker 2: The girl's mother, Florence Adlin, was surprisingly on board with
Speaker 2: their relationship, which was, of course illegal. Flynn took Woodsey
Speaker 2: on an extended vacation. They visited Flynn's ranch in Jamaica
Speaker 2: and toured Africa. In Europe, they were photographed dining and
Speaker 2: drinking in London and were mentioned in gossip columns at
Speaker 2: home and abroad. Somewhere along the way, Eryl proposed, but
Speaker 2: his divorce from his third wife, Patricia Wymore had not
Speaker 2: yet become final, and because Woodsey was not yet seventeen,
Speaker 2: In a rare show of discretion, they decided to wait
Speaker 2: a while before announcing their in engagement, but the wedding
Speaker 2: never happened. In early October nineteen fifty nine, the couple
Speaker 2: sailed north from California in Flynn's yacht, the Zaka. He
Speaker 2: was broke, he had to sell his beloved Mulholland Farms
Speaker 2: in the Hollywood Hills, and his trip was set to
Speaker 2: end in Vancouver, where Erro planned to sell his boat.
Speaker 2: They stayed with some friends and partied for a few days.
Speaker 2: On October fourteenth, Flynn started to feel sick. His host
Speaker 2: had a friend who was a doctor, so they took
Speaker 2: Flynn to the doctor's home. Flynn seemed to improve, except
Speaker 2: that he was experiencing intense back pain. Despite the pain,
Speaker 2: the doctor and his wife invited a few friends over
Speaker 2: to meet the movie star. Flynn was regaling them with
Speaker 2: stories about Hollywood, but then suddenly turned pale and stopped.
Speaker 2: He said he needed to lie down. The doctor showed
Speaker 2: him into a bedroom. A few minutes later, Woodsy found
Speaker 2: him there in shock. His face was blue and his
Speaker 2: heartbeat was dangerously faint. They rushed him to the hospital,
Speaker 2: where on October twenty third, nineteen fifty nine, he died.
Speaker 2: The cause of death read myocardial infarction, coronary thrombosis, coronary atherosclerosis,
Speaker 2: liver degeneration, liver sclerosis, and diverticulosis of the colon. He
Speaker 2: was just fifty years old. On October twenty first, nineteen
Speaker 2: fifty nine, Variety published its obituary for Errol Flynn. It read,
Speaker 2: in part, identified with swashbuckling screen roles, Flynn frequently was
Speaker 2: even more flamboyant in his private life. Since his discovery
Speaker 2: in nineteen thirty five by a Warner Talent scout. He
Speaker 2: not only went on to become one of the ten
Speaker 2: top box office stars, but he also became renowned for
Speaker 2: his feminine exploits. Helping him in his pursuits were a
Speaker 2: magnificent physique and a dashing roguish air.
Speaker 3: All due respect to the writer of that oh bit,
Speaker 3: but I don't know where to begin with how problematic
Speaker 3: that is. Biographer Kitty Kelly would call that myth building,
Speaker 3: and I have never seen more myth building. Helping him
Speaker 3: in his pursuits was a magnificent physique in a dashing
Speaker 3: roguish air. That is wow.
Speaker 2: So Matt Errol Flynn and Johnny Depp definitely had some similarities.
Speaker 2: What do you think they have in common in terms
Speaker 2: of having star power?
Speaker 3: I mean, I think the obvious connection is throngs of
Speaker 3: fans and a public that really doesn't want to see
Speaker 3: their idols sort of tartished in this way, and that's
Speaker 3: stuffing the biggest thing.
Speaker 4: Truly.
Speaker 2: It is extraordinary Flynn's trial, the amount of women that
Speaker 2: showed up that adored him, and this was astounding with
Speaker 2: Johnny Depp as well.
Speaker 3: But I think it also all feeds back into this
Speaker 3: idea of hero worship exactly.
Speaker 2: And you know, there is an interesting thing about the
Speaker 2: mystique of fame. Something happens with big stars with their fans. Yeah,
Speaker 2: they imbue these magical traits in them like they're beyond human.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, and it's not lost on me that many of
Speaker 3: the women was involved with our aspiring actresses. But more
Speaker 3: than that, I think the idea of fantasy him and
Speaker 3: I can tell you three movies in production or that
Speaker 3: are about to release that have plot lines of mega
Speaker 3: famous men that find, you know, just random everyday women
Speaker 3: and make them their lovers. And there's one coming out
Speaker 3: with Anne Hathaway where she falls in love with like
Speaker 3: a Harry Styles type and she's a mom. So I
Speaker 3: think that these are kind of common fantasies that also
Speaker 3: again feed into idea of hero worship.
Speaker 2: One last question regarding the me Too movement, Has that
Speaker 2: changed the pattern of male celebrities abusing their power?
Speaker 3: I would say yes, but certainly in the way that
Speaker 3: Johnny Depp's career will never recover.
Speaker 4: You really think so.
Speaker 3: Absolutely. He will work with some directors mostly European has
Speaker 3: always seen so far, there may come a day where
Speaker 3: Johnny Depp gets cast an a may major commercial film,
Speaker 3: but he'll never reach Captain Jack's barrow level fame. Again,
Speaker 3: the idea of eroding this myth of a sort of
Speaker 3: like unimpeachable male movie icon, I think is done. So
Speaker 3: I don't think that we're all the way there yet
Speaker 3: in terms of how we get justice and equity and
Speaker 3: certainly some relief for accusers and victims. But the good
Speaker 3: thing is is that the more we actually speak the truth,
Speaker 3: you know, the less these myths will prevail.
Speaker 2: Well put, let's end with this quote from Errol Flynn
Speaker 2: in just a Note about him at this age, at
Speaker 2: twenty five. He didn't set out to become a movie star.
Speaker 4: It was like.
Speaker 2: Hollywood came to him and reeled him in because of
Speaker 2: his swashbuckling all of that. So that I find that
Speaker 2: very interesting, and that's why I find this quote especially interesting.
Speaker 2: We fritter our lives away in detail, but I'm not
Speaker 2: going to do this. I'm going to live deeply, going
Speaker 2: to affront the essentials of life to see if I
Speaker 2: can learn what it has to teach, and above all,
Speaker 2: not to discover when I come to die that I
Speaker 2: have not lived.
Speaker 1: Well.
Speaker 2: Thanks to Matt Donnelly for joining us and thank you
Speaker 2: for listening to our final episode in season one a
Speaker 2: Variety Confidential. Matt, it's been truly a pleasure.
Speaker 3: I thank you so much. It's been so fascinating digging
Speaker 3: into our archives and you guys have done such impeccable.
Speaker 4: Research from Variety Confidential.
Speaker 2: This has been episode six of the Secret History of
Speaker 2: the Casting Couch When You're a Star. We'll be back
Speaker 2: soon with season two for more sex, money, and murder
Speaker 2: in Hollywood.
Speaker 4: For Variety and.
Speaker 2: iHeart Podcasts, I'm Tracy Patten. Variety Confidential is a production
Speaker 2: of Variety Content Studio and iHeart Podcasts. It was produced
Speaker 2: by Sidney Kramer, John Ponder, and Tracy Patton and written
Speaker 2: by Stephen Gatos, with John Ponder and Tracy Patton additional
Speaker 2: research by Karen Mizogucci. Executive producers are Dea Lawrence and
Speaker 2: Steve Gatos. Variety Confidential is recorded, edited, and mixed at
Speaker 2: the Invisible Studios, West Hollywood. Recording engineer, editor and mixer
Speaker 2: Charles Carroll