1 00:00:08,280 --> 00:00:12,240 Speaker 1: Welcome to Playing Dirty Sports Scandals with me, your intrepid host, 2 00:00:12,360 --> 00:00:15,080 Speaker 1: Jay Harris. I have over twenty years of experience as 3 00:00:15,080 --> 00:00:18,840 Speaker 1: a journalist and sportscaster, hosting a variety of ESPN shows 4 00:00:18,880 --> 00:00:22,120 Speaker 1: from Sports Center to Outside the Lines. But I'm playing dirty. 5 00:00:22,160 --> 00:00:24,119 Speaker 1: My role is to gather the facts behind some of 6 00:00:24,120 --> 00:00:27,639 Speaker 1: the most mind blowing sports scandals of all time to 7 00:00:27,720 --> 00:00:43,600 Speaker 1: serve you the inside proteen packed scoop. In our last episode, 8 00:00:43,760 --> 00:00:46,320 Speaker 1: I just shared the dark twist in the Cane Velasquez saga, 9 00:00:46,600 --> 00:00:49,599 Speaker 1: one so dark that it makes beetroot juice look like lemonade. 10 00:00:50,120 --> 00:00:53,600 Speaker 1: Kane Velasquaz, a mixed martial arts champion, had just thrown 11 00:00:53,640 --> 00:00:56,640 Speaker 1: his hard won career success and family security to the 12 00:00:56,680 --> 00:01:00,240 Speaker 1: wind by allegedly trying to gun down Harry Gillart, the 13 00:01:00,280 --> 00:01:03,160 Speaker 1: man who had allegedly molested his four year old son. 14 00:01:03,600 --> 00:01:05,679 Speaker 1: And while we clearly do not live in a society 15 00:01:05,720 --> 00:01:10,240 Speaker 1: where people are legally empowered to practice vigilanti justice, Cain's 16 00:01:10,319 --> 00:01:13,640 Speaker 1: violent attack on Harry Gillart was one that many parents 17 00:01:13,720 --> 00:01:17,760 Speaker 1: empathized with and could rationalize. The glass was cracked as 18 00:01:17,800 --> 00:01:20,720 Speaker 1: far as US public opinion was concerned, and the divide 19 00:01:20,720 --> 00:01:24,200 Speaker 1: as to whether or not Kane Velaska's behavior was justified 20 00:01:24,360 --> 00:01:28,920 Speaker 1: widened with each day in court. So here we are 21 00:01:29,160 --> 00:01:33,479 Speaker 1: at a tipping point. Let's down this catastrophic cocktail together. People. 22 00:01:34,120 --> 00:01:41,920 Speaker 1: Misery loves company, After all, Kane Velasquez looked the picture 23 00:01:41,959 --> 00:01:44,920 Speaker 1: of misery. At his initial court appearance, the Santa Clara 24 00:01:45,000 --> 00:01:48,480 Speaker 1: County courtroom was packed with media, fans, and community members, 25 00:01:48,520 --> 00:01:51,720 Speaker 1: all in shock. Cain, once the center of attention for 26 00:01:51,800 --> 00:01:56,000 Speaker 1: his sports achievements, was now gutted by personal tragedy, his 27 00:01:56,160 --> 00:01:59,840 Speaker 1: hands literally tied at the center of serious legal proceedings. 28 00:02:00,280 --> 00:02:02,080 Speaker 1: He knew he was out of his element. He knew 29 00:02:02,080 --> 00:02:04,520 Speaker 1: that his freedom and future life together with his family 30 00:02:04,600 --> 00:02:06,840 Speaker 1: was on the line, and he knew that the charges 31 00:02:06,920 --> 00:02:11,639 Speaker 1: against him were extremely damning. Ten different criminal counts faced Kate, 32 00:02:12,000 --> 00:02:16,480 Speaker 1: including premeditated attempted murder, using a firearm at a crime, 33 00:02:16,720 --> 00:02:20,720 Speaker 1: and assault. If convicted of attempted murder, Kane would face 34 00:02:20,760 --> 00:02:24,160 Speaker 1: a minimum of twenty years and potentially up to life 35 00:02:24,240 --> 00:02:27,960 Speaker 1: in prison. He might miss his kids birthdays, their graduations, 36 00:02:28,160 --> 00:02:31,680 Speaker 1: their weddings. Everything that was most precious to Caine in 37 00:02:31,720 --> 00:02:35,720 Speaker 1: the world was now in terrible jeopardy. And while Kane 38 00:02:35,760 --> 00:02:40,160 Speaker 1: Velasquez was represented by highly competent veteran attorney Mark Gerrogos. 39 00:02:40,520 --> 00:02:43,320 Speaker 1: He wasn't able to directly defend himself the way he 40 00:02:43,360 --> 00:02:46,920 Speaker 1: had been accustomed to doing all his life. Meanwhile, the 41 00:02:46,960 --> 00:02:50,880 Speaker 1: prosecutors ran their element, and the District Attorney's office itself 42 00:02:50,919 --> 00:02:54,560 Speaker 1: proved to be an important controversial player in this scandal, 43 00:02:55,000 --> 00:02:57,920 Speaker 1: because while the Gallart family and Kane Velasquez has certainly 44 00:02:57,960 --> 00:03:03,080 Speaker 1: crossed lines, many believed that the DA's office behaved badly too. 45 00:03:03,360 --> 00:03:06,480 Speaker 1: You see, it was the same District Attorney's office that 46 00:03:06,560 --> 00:03:10,480 Speaker 1: prosecuted Harry Gallard and seemingly with a far more forgiving 47 00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:14,720 Speaker 1: rule book. In fact, DA Robert Philbrooks's prosecution of Harry 48 00:03:14,720 --> 00:03:18,320 Speaker 1: Gallart resulted in his release with the sole condition that 49 00:03:18,440 --> 00:03:22,320 Speaker 1: he befitted with an electronic monitoring device. For many people, 50 00:03:22,639 --> 00:03:25,600 Speaker 1: especially people living locally with kids of their own, that 51 00:03:25,720 --> 00:03:29,520 Speaker 1: seemed a ridiculously light precaution, given that Gallart was alleged 52 00:03:29,560 --> 00:03:32,280 Speaker 1: to have molested a child. And while the judge may 53 00:03:32,280 --> 00:03:35,120 Speaker 1: have ruled for Glart's release of his own volition, it 54 00:03:35,280 --> 00:03:37,720 Speaker 1: was the DA's case that had laid the groundwork for 55 00:03:37,760 --> 00:03:42,960 Speaker 1: the ruling. Many held the DA's office culpable. Not only that, 56 00:03:43,080 --> 00:03:45,880 Speaker 1: but in the weeks following Harry Gilart's release, even as 57 00:03:45,920 --> 00:03:49,560 Speaker 1: the road rage incident with cane Velasquez was making national 58 00:03:49,600 --> 00:03:53,560 Speaker 1: headlines and stirring up the scent, the judge modified Harry 59 00:03:53,560 --> 00:03:57,280 Speaker 1: Gillard's bail requirements at Galard's attorney's request to be even 60 00:03:57,440 --> 00:04:01,760 Speaker 1: more favorable, including a work allowed its provision, granting Harry 61 00:04:01,760 --> 00:04:04,160 Speaker 1: the ability to move out of the county, and even 62 00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:08,200 Speaker 1: giving him clearance to be around minor family members. For 63 00:04:08,360 --> 00:04:12,000 Speaker 1: many onlookers to this unraveling legal fiasco, it seemed as 64 00:04:12,040 --> 00:04:15,600 Speaker 1: though the DA's office had unwittingly or not made an 65 00:04:15,600 --> 00:04:19,240 Speaker 1: example of kane Velasquez, and people speculated that this was 66 00:04:19,279 --> 00:04:23,279 Speaker 1: due at least in part to his MMA celebrity. Remember 67 00:04:23,400 --> 00:04:27,600 Speaker 1: Meryl Streep's opinion that violence insights violence. Well, at least 68 00:04:27,600 --> 00:04:30,440 Speaker 1: from the outside looking in, it appeared that the DA's 69 00:04:30,480 --> 00:04:34,039 Speaker 1: office shared her thoughts on MMA and was approaching kane 70 00:04:34,120 --> 00:04:38,800 Speaker 1: Velasquez case from a biased perspective. This perceived discrepancy in 71 00:04:38,839 --> 00:04:42,039 Speaker 1: the DA's approach towards the Kane Velasquez and Harry Gilark 72 00:04:42,080 --> 00:04:46,400 Speaker 1: cases rubbed a lot of people the wrong way. American 73 00:04:46,480 --> 00:04:51,080 Speaker 1: Kickboxing Academy head coach Javier Mendez was incredulous it's said 74 00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:54,120 Speaker 1: that California is doing what they're doing. Mendez claimed they 75 00:04:54,200 --> 00:04:57,200 Speaker 1: led an alleged pedophile like Harry Gollard out when someone 76 00:04:57,240 --> 00:04:59,760 Speaker 1: like Caine who did something that the system was not 77 00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:02,840 Speaker 1: doing and handles it and now he's the one they 78 00:05:02,880 --> 00:05:05,279 Speaker 1: can't be let out, but the other guy is out, 79 00:05:05,560 --> 00:05:08,320 Speaker 1: free as a bird. It makes zero sense to me. 80 00:05:08,839 --> 00:05:11,159 Speaker 1: I speak to so many law officers that are involved, 81 00:05:11,160 --> 00:05:13,040 Speaker 1: and they all think it's a bunch of bullshit that's 82 00:05:13,080 --> 00:05:17,560 Speaker 1: happening to him, and it is. Amateur spectators weren't the 83 00:05:17,600 --> 00:05:20,839 Speaker 1: only ones wondering if Kane Velesque's MMA fame and tough 84 00:05:20,839 --> 00:05:23,719 Speaker 1: guy appearance were tipping the scales against him in court. 85 00:05:24,320 --> 00:05:26,960 Speaker 1: After all, the judge was looking at a large, tough, 86 00:05:27,120 --> 00:05:30,279 Speaker 1: bald man famous for his ability to beat other guys 87 00:05:30,279 --> 00:05:33,800 Speaker 1: to a pulp in a giant metal cage. That reputation 88 00:05:34,000 --> 00:05:38,479 Speaker 1: wasn't a fantastic help under the circumstances. Appearances shouldn't matter 89 00:05:38,520 --> 00:05:41,120 Speaker 1: in court or in life for that matter, but it's 90 00:05:41,200 --> 00:05:45,440 Speaker 1: crazy to think that they don't. Science even says appearances matter. 91 00:05:45,839 --> 00:05:49,599 Speaker 1: We form impressions about other people's personalities in just thirty 92 00:05:49,720 --> 00:05:53,960 Speaker 1: nine milliseconds, with an emphasis on survival related qualities like 93 00:05:54,040 --> 00:05:57,840 Speaker 1: health care and threat. People who were judging Cain were 94 00:05:57,880 --> 00:06:02,080 Speaker 1: starting from that scientific place, and let's he looked well 95 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:07,200 Speaker 1: pretty threatening. Caine's defense attorney, Mark Garages recognized this disadvantage too. 96 00:06:07,800 --> 00:06:10,279 Speaker 1: It's obvious to me that the DA is serving two 97 00:06:10,320 --> 00:06:13,480 Speaker 1: masters here and can't be trusted to prosecute fairly. He said, 98 00:06:13,960 --> 00:06:16,839 Speaker 1: there's a degree of irony, and that the accused pedophile 99 00:06:16,880 --> 00:06:19,680 Speaker 1: in his presumed co conspirators are out there trying to 100 00:06:19,720 --> 00:06:22,159 Speaker 1: claim the mantle of victim. I'll leave it at that. 101 00:06:22,720 --> 00:06:26,400 Speaker 1: Cain is strong. I look forward to vindicating him, but 102 00:06:26,480 --> 00:06:28,760 Speaker 1: it would prove to be an uphill battle for Mark 103 00:06:28,800 --> 00:06:33,440 Speaker 1: Garrigos to vindicate Kane Velsquez. Cain looked scary, he looked 104 00:06:33,480 --> 00:06:36,640 Speaker 1: like a fighter. So when the district attorney argued to 105 00:06:36,760 --> 00:06:39,800 Speaker 1: Judge Selina Brown that Cain was a dangerous man who 106 00:06:39,839 --> 00:06:42,440 Speaker 1: needed to be kept in prison, she agreed that his 107 00:06:42,520 --> 00:06:46,360 Speaker 1: assessment was a reasonable one. It is clear to this 108 00:06:46,480 --> 00:06:49,520 Speaker 1: court that there is clear and convincing evidence that there 109 00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:53,480 Speaker 1: is a substantial likelihood that Caine Velesque's release would result 110 00:06:53,560 --> 00:06:57,080 Speaker 1: in great bodily injury, not just to the named complaining 111 00:06:57,120 --> 00:07:00,760 Speaker 1: witnesses in this case, but the Santa Clara residence at large. 112 00:07:00,920 --> 00:07:05,360 Speaker 1: Judge Selina Brown said this case involves allegations of extreme 113 00:07:05,440 --> 00:07:08,880 Speaker 1: recklessness to human life. Ramming a vehicle in the middle 114 00:07:08,920 --> 00:07:11,760 Speaker 1: of the day where citizens are out driving, going about 115 00:07:11,800 --> 00:07:14,160 Speaker 1: their business, and shooting out of a car at other 116 00:07:14,240 --> 00:07:18,720 Speaker 1: individuals is reckless by any standard. Anyone could have been injured, 117 00:07:19,080 --> 00:07:21,920 Speaker 1: anyone could have been killed. And when this Court looks 118 00:07:21,920 --> 00:07:25,240 Speaker 1: at Article one, Section twelve, it is this level of 119 00:07:25,320 --> 00:07:29,080 Speaker 1: risk that the Court must take into consideration. With that said, 120 00:07:29,240 --> 00:07:31,600 Speaker 1: this Court is making the ruling that the risk is 121 00:07:31,640 --> 00:07:34,440 Speaker 1: too great and that there will be no bail set 122 00:07:34,520 --> 00:07:38,559 Speaker 1: at this time. Now, it's difficult to fault Judge Selina Brown, 123 00:07:38,720 --> 00:07:42,000 Speaker 1: even if you're a diehard Kane Velasquaz fan by the book, 124 00:07:42,040 --> 00:07:45,000 Speaker 1: her legal logic is pretty spot on. Although many of 125 00:07:45,040 --> 00:07:49,040 Speaker 1: Alaska's supporters point to Velaska's intended victim, Harry Gillart, as 126 00:07:49,080 --> 00:07:52,120 Speaker 1: the root cause of the road rage attack, most defense 127 00:07:52,160 --> 00:07:54,920 Speaker 1: attorneys say the optics of the case a father taking 128 00:07:54,960 --> 00:07:57,720 Speaker 1: the law into his own hands after being denied justice, 129 00:07:58,120 --> 00:08:01,720 Speaker 1: doesn't actually hold up in a court room. This is 130 00:08:01,800 --> 00:08:05,400 Speaker 1: not a complicated case. Veteran defense attorney Steve Cooley explained. 131 00:08:05,880 --> 00:08:08,920 Speaker 1: Anyone who says it's nuanced because Cain's motive was to 132 00:08:08,960 --> 00:08:11,960 Speaker 1: get even for the molestation of someone he loved, that 133 00:08:11,960 --> 00:08:16,040 Speaker 1: that somehow mitigates what he did, well not really. There's 134 00:08:16,040 --> 00:08:18,960 Speaker 1: no defense of I got mad because he really hurts 135 00:08:18,960 --> 00:08:23,160 Speaker 1: someone I loved. Steve Cooley isn't wrong in his legal logic. 136 00:08:23,480 --> 00:08:27,080 Speaker 1: And Judge Selina Brown, however susceptible she may or may 137 00:08:27,120 --> 00:08:30,480 Speaker 1: not be to subconscious prejudice based on Caine's tough appearance, 138 00:08:30,880 --> 00:08:35,040 Speaker 1: isn't wrong in her legal logic. The law cannot condone 139 00:08:35,120 --> 00:08:38,760 Speaker 1: vigilanteism for any reason and continue to serve as an 140 00:08:38,760 --> 00:08:43,800 Speaker 1: effective policing tool for society, especially when the vigilanteism physically 141 00:08:43,920 --> 00:08:47,760 Speaker 1: endangers other members of the public. Think about it. What if, 142 00:08:47,800 --> 00:08:51,920 Speaker 1: instead of accidentally hitting Harry Gallard's stepfather, Paul Bender, Cain 143 00:08:52,040 --> 00:08:54,240 Speaker 1: had hit a child playing in a park as the 144 00:08:54,320 --> 00:08:58,000 Speaker 1: high speed chase whiz by. Would that child's death be 145 00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:00,719 Speaker 1: acceptable because Cain was trying to unish the man who 146 00:09:00,720 --> 00:09:04,160 Speaker 1: harmed his son due to two wrongs, even if one 147 00:09:04,200 --> 00:09:07,480 Speaker 1: of them is arguably well intentioned, ever really make a 148 00:09:07,600 --> 00:09:10,679 Speaker 1: right as far as the law is concerned, and as 149 00:09:10,679 --> 00:09:14,240 Speaker 1: far as seventy seven percent of the US population is concerned. 150 00:09:14,280 --> 00:09:18,280 Speaker 1: According to the fourteenth American Values Survey conducted as recently 151 00:09:18,320 --> 00:09:21,760 Speaker 1: as October twenty twenty three, the answer to that question 152 00:09:22,200 --> 00:09:30,600 Speaker 1: is emphatically no. So the scandal and the Kane Velasquez 153 00:09:30,600 --> 00:09:34,080 Speaker 1: and Harry Gallart legal proceedings was less about the DA's 154 00:09:34,160 --> 00:09:37,960 Speaker 1: hardline approach to prosecuting Kane Velasquez and more about the 155 00:09:38,000 --> 00:09:41,560 Speaker 1: course leniency towards Harry Gillard. The fact that it was 156 00:09:41,600 --> 00:09:46,200 Speaker 1: the same district attorney's office prosecuting both cases, and the 157 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:49,920 Speaker 1: same district attorney's office that later failed to even notify 158 00:09:50,040 --> 00:09:54,320 Speaker 1: Caine Velasquez family of Harry Gallart's release. That is the 159 00:09:54,400 --> 00:09:57,760 Speaker 1: crux of the problem and the match that ultimately ignited 160 00:09:57,800 --> 00:10:01,400 Speaker 1: this scandal. The discrepancy in the prosecution of the two 161 00:10:01,440 --> 00:10:05,440 Speaker 1: men felt prejudicial against Kane Velasquez and in favor of 162 00:10:05,480 --> 00:10:10,439 Speaker 1: Harry Gallard, and under the circumstances, that was what felt 163 00:10:10,480 --> 00:10:15,480 Speaker 1: deeply wrong. Kine needed someone to help reset his MMA 164 00:10:15,640 --> 00:10:19,600 Speaker 1: tough guy image and reframe his story. He couldn't contest 165 00:10:19,679 --> 00:10:23,480 Speaker 1: that he had behaved recklessly. Clearly, his temper and potentially 166 00:10:23,520 --> 00:10:27,640 Speaker 1: even the onset of CTE or chronic traumatic encephalopathy, a 167 00:10:27,640 --> 00:10:30,319 Speaker 1: brain condition thought to be linked to repeated head injuries 168 00:10:30,320 --> 00:10:33,880 Speaker 1: and blows to the head, had temporarily muted Kaine's ability 169 00:10:33,880 --> 00:10:37,240 Speaker 1: to reason clearly, and his very public attack on the 170 00:10:37,240 --> 00:10:41,480 Speaker 1: Gallart family had exceeded the law's limits. What he and 171 00:10:41,520 --> 00:10:45,319 Speaker 1: his defense attorney, Mark Geragos could do, though, was introduced 172 00:10:45,360 --> 00:10:48,080 Speaker 1: the softer side of Kane Velasquez to the court and 173 00:10:48,120 --> 00:10:52,000 Speaker 1: to the public. Maybe becoming a less threatening, more relatable 174 00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:55,000 Speaker 1: presence in the court would inspire the judge to grant 175 00:10:55,040 --> 00:10:58,120 Speaker 1: a lesser punishment for Kine, just as Harry Gallard had 176 00:10:58,120 --> 00:11:02,360 Speaker 1: been given a surprisingly lenient Surely, these two men, on 177 00:11:02,440 --> 00:11:05,920 Speaker 1: opposite sides of a dark tragedy, deserved fairness in the 178 00:11:05,960 --> 00:11:12,240 Speaker 1: form of comparable consideration under the law, and so Michelle Velasquez, 179 00:11:12,320 --> 00:11:16,240 Speaker 1: Kane's wife, got involved in his defense. Seeing the events 180 00:11:16,240 --> 00:11:19,480 Speaker 1: of what had transpired through her eyes, through a mother's eyes, 181 00:11:19,920 --> 00:11:23,560 Speaker 1: made clear that any bias in her husband's prosecution wasn't acceptable. 182 00:11:23,960 --> 00:11:27,800 Speaker 1: Her husband's appearance and profession were irrelevant. Caine was a 183 00:11:27,840 --> 00:11:30,839 Speaker 1: gentle giant and a loving father who, from her perspective, 184 00:11:31,280 --> 00:11:33,959 Speaker 1: hadn't caused a fraction of the damage that Harry Gillard 185 00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:38,280 Speaker 1: had to their northern California community. Yes, Kaine's misguided attack 186 00:11:38,520 --> 00:11:43,480 Speaker 1: might have injured an innocent citizen, but arguably it hadn't 187 00:11:43,520 --> 00:11:47,480 Speaker 1: Paul Bender, Harry Gallard's stepfather, had been injured by Kane Velasquez. 188 00:11:47,960 --> 00:11:50,920 Speaker 1: And while Paul Bender didn't molest Kine Junior, did he 189 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:54,280 Speaker 1: really bear no responsibility for what had allegedly happened at 190 00:11:54,280 --> 00:11:59,880 Speaker 1: Patty's childcare? Really, despite the beautiful location and seemingly tipped 191 00:12:00,280 --> 00:12:04,280 Speaker 1: shape of Patty's childcare, social service documents revealed that the 192 00:12:04,360 --> 00:12:07,600 Speaker 1: daycare run by Patti Gollart and Paul Bender had actually 193 00:12:07,600 --> 00:12:11,800 Speaker 1: amassed ten violations since twenty eighteen. Granted, none of the 194 00:12:11,840 --> 00:12:15,640 Speaker 1: sided incidents were specifically sexual in nature, but the daycare 195 00:12:15,720 --> 00:12:18,640 Speaker 1: run by Paul Bender's wife, Patty Gallart in their shared home, 196 00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:22,840 Speaker 1: certainly had a worrying record, and in the Velaska's lawsuit 197 00:12:22,840 --> 00:12:27,480 Speaker 1: against Patty Goalart's daycare, the thirteen page documents submitted claim 198 00:12:27,559 --> 00:12:32,240 Speaker 1: that Patricia Gallart, Paul Bender, and Patty's childcare staff clearly 199 00:12:32,600 --> 00:12:37,320 Speaker 1: allowed Harry's behavior and conduct to occur and continue to occur, 200 00:12:37,760 --> 00:12:41,800 Speaker 1: and fail to adequately monitor and supervise the victims and Harry. 201 00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:46,880 Speaker 1: Despite the warnings, observations, and signs of inappropriate behavior and conduct, 202 00:12:47,360 --> 00:12:50,560 Speaker 1: Harry at all times remained permitted to reside on the 203 00:12:50,559 --> 00:12:54,559 Speaker 1: property of Patty's Childcare. So this information begs the question, 204 00:12:55,160 --> 00:12:59,040 Speaker 1: how should the non fatal injury of alleged criminal associate 205 00:12:59,080 --> 00:13:02,640 Speaker 1: Paul Bender's staff up against all the innocent children who 206 00:13:02,640 --> 00:13:05,840 Speaker 1: had been allegedly put in harm's way at Patty's daycare 207 00:13:05,920 --> 00:13:09,880 Speaker 1: over the years. Surely, the Velasquez family argued this question 208 00:13:10,040 --> 00:13:14,120 Speaker 1: should be considered, so Kin's attorney, Mark Garrigos made sure 209 00:13:14,120 --> 00:13:17,840 Speaker 1: that it would be by having Michelle Caine's softer, more 210 00:13:17,880 --> 00:13:21,880 Speaker 1: presentable have share in press and with the court the unthinkable, 211 00:13:21,960 --> 00:13:26,680 Speaker 1: heartbreaking experience that she, her husband, and her son had endured. 212 00:13:28,600 --> 00:13:31,959 Speaker 1: Michelle Velasquez described the moment she learned about the abuse 213 00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:35,439 Speaker 1: of her son, Kane Velasquez Junior, whom she lovingly calls 214 00:13:35,559 --> 00:13:39,839 Speaker 1: Little Kine, as a mother's worst nightmare. My heart sank, 215 00:13:40,000 --> 00:13:43,160 Speaker 1: she said. She and Kane Velaskaz Senior are putting their 216 00:13:43,200 --> 00:13:46,319 Speaker 1: four year old son to bed when little Kine disclosed 217 00:13:46,360 --> 00:13:49,120 Speaker 1: what had happened to him. Little Kine said that Harry 218 00:13:49,120 --> 00:13:51,800 Speaker 1: Gollard had taken him into the bathroom at the daycare. 219 00:13:52,360 --> 00:13:55,080 Speaker 1: When Cain asked his son why Harry had gone into 220 00:13:55,080 --> 00:13:58,040 Speaker 1: the bathroom with him, given that he was fully potty trained, 221 00:13:58,520 --> 00:14:02,200 Speaker 1: Little Kaine said that Harry had touched his private parts. Later, 222 00:14:02,280 --> 00:14:05,200 Speaker 1: Michele relayed to the court that Little Kine had seemed 223 00:14:05,200 --> 00:14:08,360 Speaker 1: ashamed when he told them about Harry Gillart touching his 224 00:14:08,480 --> 00:14:11,400 Speaker 1: penis and scrotum, and when she asked if Harry Gallart 225 00:14:11,480 --> 00:14:14,520 Speaker 1: put Cain Junior's penis in his mouth, she said her 226 00:14:14,559 --> 00:14:19,640 Speaker 1: son answered yes. The revelation of their son's abuse at 227 00:14:19,680 --> 00:14:25,120 Speaker 1: Patty's childcare left both parents reeling with shock and outrage. Horrified, 228 00:14:25,600 --> 00:14:29,040 Speaker 1: Michelle called Child Protective Services within the hour to file 229 00:14:29,080 --> 00:14:33,240 Speaker 1: their report against the Gallard's daycare center. Meanwhile, Cain Senior 230 00:14:33,320 --> 00:14:36,120 Speaker 1: stayed with their son, trying to calm him down and 231 00:14:36,160 --> 00:14:39,920 Speaker 1: get him to sleep. Child Protective Services told Michelle to 232 00:14:39,920 --> 00:14:42,800 Speaker 1: file a police report and recommended that she'd get in 233 00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:47,200 Speaker 1: touch with State licensing about Patty's childcare too. Of course, 234 00:14:47,320 --> 00:14:52,040 Speaker 1: Michelle did everything she was instructed to do, Immediately shocked 235 00:14:52,080 --> 00:14:54,720 Speaker 1: and crushed by the weight of feeling powerless to protect 236 00:14:54,720 --> 00:14:57,960 Speaker 1: her child, Michelle could at least find some solace in 237 00:14:58,000 --> 00:15:01,280 Speaker 1: believing that steps were being taken to address the horror 238 00:15:01,280 --> 00:15:05,080 Speaker 1: that it happened to her precious toddler. After a sleepless night, 239 00:15:05,120 --> 00:15:08,040 Speaker 1: Michelle and Kin woke up to a new, darker reality. 240 00:15:08,760 --> 00:15:11,520 Speaker 1: Suddenly one hundred percent of their energy was focused on 241 00:15:11,640 --> 00:15:14,760 Speaker 1: taking care of their son, getting him help to cope 242 00:15:14,760 --> 00:15:17,840 Speaker 1: with the trauma he'd endured, and ensuring that Harry Gallart 243 00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:22,160 Speaker 1: was charged and removed from society to make absolutely sure 244 00:15:22,200 --> 00:15:25,000 Speaker 1: that he was unable to harm their children and any 245 00:15:25,040 --> 00:15:28,920 Speaker 1: other children for that matter ever again. Michelle and Kane 246 00:15:28,960 --> 00:15:31,800 Speaker 1: expected that child protective Services, the police, and the state 247 00:15:31,880 --> 00:15:35,800 Speaker 1: Licensing Department would all spring into action, giving their grave 248 00:15:35,920 --> 00:15:39,680 Speaker 1: situation the urgent attention it demanded. So when they hadn't 249 00:15:39,720 --> 00:15:42,440 Speaker 1: heard anything back from any of the agencies by late morning, 250 00:15:42,920 --> 00:15:47,080 Speaker 1: Michelle called the Sheriff's department directly. Three deputies were dispatched 251 00:15:47,080 --> 00:15:51,400 Speaker 1: to the Velasquez home immediately, and finally, after an interminable 252 00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:54,360 Speaker 1: night and morning, Michelle and Kin felt like they were 253 00:15:54,360 --> 00:15:58,440 Speaker 1: taking positive action to support their son. The deputy's visit 254 00:15:58,480 --> 00:16:01,920 Speaker 1: focused on gathering information from Cain and Michelle. They spoke 255 00:16:01,960 --> 00:16:05,200 Speaker 1: in tense whispers around their dining room table as Kane 256 00:16:05,240 --> 00:16:08,080 Speaker 1: Junior watched a movie in the next room. The deputies 257 00:16:08,080 --> 00:16:11,400 Speaker 1: had not come to speak directly with Little kin specialized 258 00:16:11,440 --> 00:16:14,320 Speaker 1: detectives must be sent out for interviews with children, but 259 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:17,600 Speaker 1: Little Kine left his movie anyway, wandered into the dining 260 00:16:17,680 --> 00:16:21,080 Speaker 1: room of his own volition, climbed onto the table, and 261 00:16:21,160 --> 00:16:23,520 Speaker 1: told the deputies what had happened to him at daycare. 262 00:16:24,120 --> 00:16:28,280 Speaker 1: It was remarkably brave and horribly sad behavior to witness 263 00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:31,880 Speaker 1: from a four year old. Less than twenty four hours earlier, 264 00:16:31,960 --> 00:16:34,200 Speaker 1: Cain and Michelle had been eating dinner at this table, 265 00:16:34,640 --> 00:16:38,960 Speaker 1: feeling totally and completely blessed. Now they found themselves sitting 266 00:16:38,960 --> 00:16:42,000 Speaker 1: in the very same seats, at the very same table, 267 00:16:42,720 --> 00:16:46,040 Speaker 1: but with pits of grief in their stomachs. Law enforcement 268 00:16:46,080 --> 00:16:50,280 Speaker 1: officers beside them and their beloved toddler in a sullied spotlight, 269 00:16:50,840 --> 00:16:54,680 Speaker 1: discussing how he'd been abused at daycare. What a surreal, 270 00:16:55,080 --> 00:17:00,000 Speaker 1: nightmarish moment. And these tense, painful conversations were far from 271 00:17:00,080 --> 00:17:03,760 Speaker 1: from over with Little Caine despite Cain's and Michelle's screaming 272 00:17:03,880 --> 00:17:06,440 Speaker 1: urge to protect him from anything further to do with 273 00:17:06,520 --> 00:17:11,000 Speaker 1: the unraveling tragedy. This is because the prosecutors needed Little 274 00:17:11,040 --> 00:17:15,159 Speaker 1: Cain to provide a forensic interview conducted by someone trained 275 00:17:15,160 --> 00:17:18,720 Speaker 1: to question children. The logic behind this is that kids 276 00:17:18,920 --> 00:17:22,840 Speaker 1: aren't just smaller adults. Their brains aren't fully developed, and 277 00:17:22,920 --> 00:17:25,880 Speaker 1: if they are really young, like Little Caine, then they 278 00:17:25,880 --> 00:17:29,320 Speaker 1: can be suggestible. That means that the people interviewing him 279 00:17:29,400 --> 00:17:33,400 Speaker 1: must be highly qualified to only gather information from them 280 00:17:33,880 --> 00:17:38,400 Speaker 1: and not give information to them. Professor Michael Lamb, who 281 00:17:38,400 --> 00:17:41,719 Speaker 1: formerly headed up the Department of Social and Developmental Psychology 282 00:17:41,720 --> 00:17:45,440 Speaker 1: at the University of Cambridge, explain that the quality of 283 00:17:45,480 --> 00:17:49,760 Speaker 1: forensic interviewing practices is of utmost importance if the right 284 00:17:49,800 --> 00:17:53,359 Speaker 1: of both child victims and innocent suspects are to be protected, 285 00:17:54,040 --> 00:17:57,600 Speaker 1: and that makes sense right so, however horrible it was 286 00:17:57,680 --> 00:18:01,159 Speaker 1: for the Velasquez family to keep having their time recount 287 00:18:01,200 --> 00:18:04,679 Speaker 1: his tale of sexual abuse, they recognized that it was 288 00:18:04,720 --> 00:18:08,960 Speaker 1: a necessary evil to support the system's prosecution of Harry Gallard, 289 00:18:09,840 --> 00:18:14,359 Speaker 1: but they must have absolutely hated it, and understandably, what 290 00:18:14,560 --> 00:18:17,760 Speaker 1: parent wouldn't Michelle and Kaine must have shouted at the 291 00:18:17,760 --> 00:18:20,840 Speaker 1: prospect of their young son being put through this process, 292 00:18:21,359 --> 00:18:25,720 Speaker 1: replaying his ordeal again and again. Plus they were told 293 00:18:25,720 --> 00:18:28,720 Speaker 1: that Little Kaine's forensic interview would need to be videotaped 294 00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:30,960 Speaker 1: so that it could be played back later in court. 295 00:18:31,720 --> 00:18:34,280 Speaker 1: The video interview would create a permanent account of their 296 00:18:34,320 --> 00:18:38,840 Speaker 1: son's abuse. How terribly painful and how difficult it must 297 00:18:38,840 --> 00:18:42,359 Speaker 1: have been for Cain to restrain himself throughout these dark, 298 00:18:42,440 --> 00:18:46,800 Speaker 1: endless days following Little Kaine's allegations against Harry Gallard. A 299 00:18:46,880 --> 00:18:49,960 Speaker 1: man so accustomed to fighting surely must have wanted to 300 00:18:49,960 --> 00:18:57,280 Speaker 1: defend the people he loved most immediately. But here's the thing. Cain, 301 00:18:57,680 --> 00:19:00,600 Speaker 1: as always in his marriage to Michelle, followed her lead. 302 00:19:01,240 --> 00:19:04,959 Speaker 1: He loved her, he respected her, and above all, he 303 00:19:05,000 --> 00:19:08,240 Speaker 1: trusted her. Cain has said in multiple interviews that it's 304 00:19:08,320 --> 00:19:11,280 Speaker 1: Michelle who looks out for him, not the other way around. 305 00:19:11,840 --> 00:19:15,000 Speaker 1: And because Michelle had faith in the legal system, Caine 306 00:19:15,000 --> 00:19:18,000 Speaker 1: did too. If the legal system needed their family to 307 00:19:18,040 --> 00:19:21,240 Speaker 1: go through hell recounting what had happened to Little Kane 308 00:19:21,280 --> 00:19:24,919 Speaker 1: again and again and again in order to realize justice 309 00:19:24,920 --> 00:19:28,240 Speaker 1: and put Harry Gillart behind bars. Then they were committed 310 00:19:28,280 --> 00:19:32,960 Speaker 1: to that path all together as a family, So the 311 00:19:33,040 --> 00:19:36,239 Speaker 1: Velasquez family drove down to the Children's Advocacy Center in 312 00:19:36,280 --> 00:19:40,800 Speaker 1: Santa Clarita. Children's advocacy centers provide a sensitive environment for 313 00:19:40,920 --> 00:19:43,919 Speaker 1: children who've experienced abuse to go for therapy and to 314 00:19:43,920 --> 00:19:47,879 Speaker 1: provide forensic interviews. The center is an inviting place, with 315 00:19:47,960 --> 00:19:51,320 Speaker 1: warm colors painted on the walls, toys stacked up in 316 00:19:51,359 --> 00:19:54,600 Speaker 1: the corners and spread out across tables, and plenty of snacks, 317 00:19:54,960 --> 00:19:57,520 Speaker 1: but it must have become a place of heightened distress 318 00:19:57,520 --> 00:19:59,960 Speaker 1: for Cain and Michelle when they were informed that they 319 00:20:00,240 --> 00:20:03,320 Speaker 1: couldn't be in the room during little Kaine's interview. The 320 00:20:03,480 --> 00:20:06,440 Speaker 1: last thing they wanted to do was leave their son unattended, 321 00:20:06,800 --> 00:20:09,639 Speaker 1: having found out so recently what had taken place in 322 00:20:09,680 --> 00:20:14,320 Speaker 1: their absence at daycare. But again, the system demanded this 323 00:20:14,480 --> 00:20:18,320 Speaker 1: trust of Cain and Michelle Velasquez. This is because parents 324 00:20:18,359 --> 00:20:22,160 Speaker 1: are naturally distressed as their child discloses the awful thing 325 00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:25,880 Speaker 1: someone did to them, and children take cues from parents. 326 00:20:26,400 --> 00:20:29,560 Speaker 1: If the parents act horrified, then often the child will 327 00:20:29,560 --> 00:20:33,760 Speaker 1: stop talking, and prosecutors need the child to talk to 328 00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:36,280 Speaker 1: tell them as much as possible in order to bring 329 00:20:36,320 --> 00:20:39,639 Speaker 1: the person who harmed them to justice. So they are 330 00:20:39,760 --> 00:20:42,679 Speaker 1: Kin and Michelle having just relinquished their precious son to 331 00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:46,400 Speaker 1: forensic interviewers, a child they are desperate to protect from 332 00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:50,240 Speaker 1: any further harm. Can't you just imagine them sitting hand 333 00:20:50,240 --> 00:20:52,639 Speaker 1: in hand in the waiting room at the Children's Advocacy 334 00:20:52,680 --> 00:20:56,920 Speaker 1: Center in loaded silence as their hearts break. Would Little 335 00:20:57,000 --> 00:21:00,920 Speaker 1: Caine ever fully recover from what had happened? Would they 336 00:21:01,040 --> 00:21:04,199 Speaker 1: ever be able to forgive themselves for not knowing, for 337 00:21:04,320 --> 00:21:07,400 Speaker 1: not being able to protect their child. They probably thought 338 00:21:07,400 --> 00:21:10,160 Speaker 1: the situation couldn't get any worse, But in the words 339 00:21:10,160 --> 00:21:13,320 Speaker 1: of esteemed actor Ving Raims, it can always get worse. 340 00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:16,680 Speaker 1: The interview at the Children's Advocacy Center managed to shake 341 00:21:16,720 --> 00:21:20,040 Speaker 1: loose even more serious abuse claims than the one Little 342 00:21:20,119 --> 00:21:24,200 Speaker 1: Kane had previously shared with his parents. Their nightmare felt endless, 343 00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:26,800 Speaker 1: and the only light at the end of their family's 344 00:21:26,840 --> 00:21:30,600 Speaker 1: tragic tunnel was that Harry Gallart would face justice for 345 00:21:30,680 --> 00:21:34,400 Speaker 1: his crimes. Michelle and Kan told little Kine that he 346 00:21:34,520 --> 00:21:37,240 Speaker 1: would be safe from now on. They were giving the 347 00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:40,560 Speaker 1: justice system everything that it needed to function, and Harry 348 00:21:40,560 --> 00:21:45,000 Speaker 1: Gallart would never again be free to hurt children. Michelle 349 00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:47,280 Speaker 1: and Kin had no reason not to believe that this 350 00:21:47,480 --> 00:21:51,120 Speaker 1: was the truth. It seemed cut and dry. Little Cain 351 00:21:51,160 --> 00:21:53,639 Speaker 1: had given enough information in the forensic interview at the 352 00:21:53,720 --> 00:21:57,159 Speaker 1: Children's Advocacy Center in Santa Clarita for the prosecutor to 353 00:21:57,200 --> 00:21:59,720 Speaker 1: give the green light to charge Harry Gallart with child 354 00:21:59,760 --> 00:22:05,560 Speaker 1: mother station check. Harry Gollart was then promptly arrested Check, so, 355 00:22:05,680 --> 00:22:08,040 Speaker 1: even though he was devastated by what had happened to 356 00:22:08,040 --> 00:22:11,119 Speaker 1: his son, at this point in the saga, Cain at 357 00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:13,679 Speaker 1: least had every reason to believe that their trust in 358 00:22:13,720 --> 00:22:17,280 Speaker 1: the system had been well placed. They'd done everything asked 359 00:22:17,320 --> 00:22:20,560 Speaker 1: of their family in the aftermath of Little Kaine's allegations, 360 00:22:20,600 --> 00:22:24,600 Speaker 1: and justice had been swiftly served. But as we know, 361 00:22:25,680 --> 00:22:29,560 Speaker 1: things didn't end there. The judge hearing Harry Golart's case 362 00:22:29,560 --> 00:22:32,000 Speaker 1: decided he should be let out of jail shortly after 363 00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:36,119 Speaker 1: his arrest, after just two days in jail. Unbelievably, to 364 00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:38,680 Speaker 1: be fair, even the Die's office was stunned by the 365 00:22:38,760 --> 00:22:42,680 Speaker 1: judge's decision. Prosecutors went on record with their opposition to 366 00:22:42,720 --> 00:22:46,520 Speaker 1: Harry Golart's release. The Collective sentiment was that Harry Gallard 367 00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:49,800 Speaker 1: was a probable sex offender who posed an active threat 368 00:22:49,880 --> 00:22:53,000 Speaker 1: to miners. But the judge let Harry out of jail anyway, 369 00:22:53,400 --> 00:22:56,080 Speaker 1: and with an o R bond to boot. O R 370 00:22:56,160 --> 00:22:59,639 Speaker 1: means own recognizance, So all Harry Gollard had to do 371 00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:02,199 Speaker 1: was some a piece of paper pledging he'd returned to 372 00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:04,280 Speaker 1: court when he was told to do so, and that 373 00:23:04,480 --> 00:23:08,400 Speaker 1: was it. He was a freeman, adding insult to injury, 374 00:23:08,520 --> 00:23:12,480 Speaker 1: and despite California law requiring it, nobody from the DIA's 375 00:23:12,520 --> 00:23:15,679 Speaker 1: office told the Velasquez family that Harry Gallart, the man 376 00:23:15,680 --> 00:23:18,000 Speaker 1: who would abuse their child, was back on the streets. 377 00:23:18,560 --> 00:23:21,600 Speaker 1: When Cain and Michelle did find out, they were shocked 378 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:25,840 Speaker 1: and gutted. Now Harry Gallart was back out in society 379 00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:29,480 Speaker 1: with the potential for daily contact with their family. This 380 00:23:29,600 --> 00:23:33,159 Speaker 1: did not seem fair or acceptable to many people, and 381 00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:36,360 Speaker 1: it certainly didn't seem fair or acceptable to Kane Velasquez, 382 00:23:36,800 --> 00:23:39,960 Speaker 1: a wounded father and highly capable fighter who was now 383 00:23:40,040 --> 00:23:47,840 Speaker 1: overcome with grief and rage. There is a lot of 384 00:23:47,920 --> 00:23:50,639 Speaker 1: gray in the world. Law is one of those things. 385 00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:54,720 Speaker 1: For me, terrifyingly gray. It's designed to be absolute to 386 00:23:54,800 --> 00:23:58,360 Speaker 1: keep everyone safe in principle, but the law is subject 387 00:23:58,359 --> 00:24:03,000 Speaker 1: to human interpretation, and humans are varied and opinionated. How 388 00:24:03,040 --> 00:24:05,760 Speaker 1: does the lost treatment of Kane Velasquez and Harry Gallard 389 00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:10,359 Speaker 1: sit with you so far, Fellows Scandal Scoopers. I've definitely 390 00:24:10,440 --> 00:24:13,520 Speaker 1: served up a lot of facts here today, So digest 391 00:24:13,600 --> 00:24:16,840 Speaker 1: them and decide what do you think? Is this how 392 00:24:16,880 --> 00:24:20,120 Speaker 1: our justice system is supposed to work? And in your opinion, 393 00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:24,960 Speaker 1: is Kane Velaskaz justified for playing dirty? Join me your host, 394 00:24:25,040 --> 00:24:28,199 Speaker 1: Jay Harris, as I add more layers to this messy blend, 395 00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:32,400 Speaker 1: delving even deeper into what happened to Kane Velasquez, his family, 396 00:24:32,760 --> 00:24:36,159 Speaker 1: Paul Bender, and the Gallarts in the next episode of 397 00:24:36,280 --> 00:24:51,439 Speaker 1: Playing Dirty Sports Scandals. Playing Dirty Sports Scandals is a 398 00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:55,920 Speaker 1: production of Dan Patrick Productions, Never Ever Productions and Workhouse 399 00:24:55,960 --> 00:25:01,640 Speaker 1: Media from executive producers Dan Patrick, Paul Anderson, Penela Maya Glickman, 400 00:25:01,720 --> 00:25:05,760 Speaker 1: and Jennifer Clary, Hosted by Jay Harris, Written and produced 401 00:25:05,760 --> 00:25:09,919 Speaker 1: by Jen Brown, Francie Haiks, Maya Glickman, and Jennifer Clay.