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Speaker 1: Taking a Walk in order for me to get the

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Speaker 1: Journey seal. This is real stuff. I want people to know,

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Speaker 1: this is not bullshit.

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Speaker 2: In order for me to get the next Journey single out,

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Speaker 2: I have to get go, find the Yiddish book, learn

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Speaker 2: two lines of Yiddish, call him back, read the Yiddish,

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Speaker 2: and then he'll talk to me and we'll get the

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Speaker 2: Journey single out. You can't make this shit up.

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Speaker 3: Today on the Taking a Walk podcast, Buzz Night is

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Speaker 3: joined by a true legend of the music industry, Paul

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Speaker 3: Rappaport As a longtime Columbia Records executive and author of

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Speaker 3: Gliders Over Hollywood, Airships, Airplay, and the Art of Rock Promotion.

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Speaker 3: Paul has spent decades behind the scenes with some of

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Speaker 3: the most iconic names in rock history, from Pink Floyd

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Speaker 3: and Bruce Springsteen to Bob Dylan and the Rolling Stones. Today,

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Speaker 3: Paul shares unforgettable stories from the golden age of rock,

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Speaker 3: like flying the Pink Floyd Airship across America, trading Tarlk's

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Speaker 3: with David Gilmour on stage, and navigating the wild, creative

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Speaker 3: chaos of life on the road with music's biggest stars.

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Speaker 3: Joined Buzznight for an audio journey through music history as

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Speaker 3: we take a walk with Paul Rappaport on the Taking

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Speaker 3: a Walk podcast.

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Speaker 4: So, Paul Rappaport, thanks for being on Taking a Walk.

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Speaker 4: It's so great to see you in person, my friend.

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Speaker 2: Thanks for having me on. I'm amazed that I'm on

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Speaker 2: the side of the microphone.

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Speaker 4: It's a beautiful, beautiful thing. So, since the podcast is

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Speaker 4: called Taking a Walk, before we get to your fabulous

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Speaker 4: book and the seemy underbelly of its creation, if you

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Speaker 4: could take a walk with somebody living or dead, doesn't

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Speaker 4: have to be a musician, but since you've lived a

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Speaker 4: life around music, maybe that would be great. Who would

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Speaker 4: it be and where would you take a walk with them?

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Speaker 2: I think it would be Michael Bloomfield because as a

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Speaker 2: guitar player, I've been playing guitar since I was a kid.

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Speaker 2: He really spoke to me when I got turned onto

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Speaker 2: the Paul Butterfield Blues Band and I listened to what

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Speaker 2: this guy was doing. He's not as well known as

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Speaker 2: he should be, you know, for being the great guitar

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Speaker 2: player that he was. I mean, Bob Dylan considers him

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Speaker 2: to be the best guitar player he ever played. With

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Speaker 2: just to give you an idea of you know, how

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Speaker 2: great Michael Bloomfield is. And I met him once briefly

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Speaker 2: what you read in the book. But he's a big

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Speaker 2: hero of mine. And I think it would be him

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Speaker 2: because he's not living anymore. And if I could go

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Speaker 2: back and just talk to him about the blues and

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Speaker 2: you know, his style and how he learned to talk

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Speaker 2: with the instrument and everything, and I probably would be

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Speaker 2: in Chicago with him where he, you know, played in

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Speaker 2: all those clubs and learned his craft, you know, hanging

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Speaker 2: out with guys like Muddy Waters and these people. That

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Speaker 2: would be a thrill for me. I remember actually being

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Speaker 2: in a student you know, working on a record and

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Speaker 2: I had to play a part in time in beat

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Speaker 2: and and it was you had to get in a

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Speaker 2: groove and I and it's going to sound hippie dippy,

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Speaker 2: but I was like channeling him, like like I was like, hey, Michael,

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Speaker 2: you know, like he just said on my shoulder, just

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Speaker 2: so I can get this done, yeah, you know, and

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Speaker 2: I felt like he was there and it was like, oh, no,

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Speaker 2: you got this, and I just I don't know, you know,

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Speaker 2: I just felt special.

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Speaker 5: So it would be him. In in in Chicago.

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Speaker 4: And knowing you, I think you would get some unique,

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Speaker 4: uh takes out of him. You would get down to

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Speaker 4: the core of what drove him as an artist, and

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Speaker 4: you would you would get something out of him. I

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Speaker 4: think that would be different than most folks would get

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Speaker 4: out of a person like that.

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Speaker 5: I believe you.

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Speaker 2: Knowing you, I think you know, having grown up and

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Speaker 2: being involved, you know, with guitars from an early age,

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Speaker 2: It's something that's.

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Speaker 5: Been a part of me my whole life.

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Speaker 2: And of course, you know, all the artists that I

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Speaker 2: worked with in my career, it was a sort of

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Speaker 2: an instant bond with them because aside from talking about

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Speaker 2: you know, you know, the promotion of them and selling

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Speaker 2: you know, you know, albums and eventually CDs, et cetera,

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Speaker 2: et cetera, they knew that their music was inside me,

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Speaker 2: that I loved their music, and you know, it was

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Speaker 2: easy for me to talk to them and I could talk.

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Speaker 2: I have deep conversations because I could talk about you know,

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Speaker 2: albums in certain parts and how did this happen? And

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Speaker 2: you know, because I was such a fan, and it

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Speaker 2: gave me a wonderful entree, you know, in the music

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Speaker 2: business because I wasn't.

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Speaker 5: Viewed as a suit right.

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Speaker 2: I was like, Oh, this guy's cool, he's going to

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Speaker 2: help us, but he knows our stuff, like he knows

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Speaker 2: what he's talking about. So I think I probably would,

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Speaker 2: you know. I mean, I write in my book about

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Speaker 2: meeting Michael Bloomfield briefly, and I'm trying to learn how

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Speaker 2: to play the blues. I'm a kid in college and

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Speaker 2: an electric flag comes and I'm watching what he's doing,

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Speaker 2: and the guy's playing a less Paul, which I didn't

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Speaker 2: know how meaningful that was at the time. I just

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Speaker 2: know that these notes are screaming out of this guitar,

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Speaker 2: and he's talking to me with this guitar like he's

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Speaker 2: it can be sad, it can be happy, it can

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Speaker 2: be exhilarating. All these emotions are flying out of this guitar.

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Speaker 2: He's plugged into five different amps, which is a whole

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Speaker 2: nother story was he was working and crafting his sound,

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Speaker 2: you know. But I think that because he felt so

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Speaker 2: much in his music, that we would have a different

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Speaker 2: kind of a discussion. You know, where does this come from?

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Speaker 5: How do you do this?

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Speaker 2: And I remember going backstage afterwards introducing myself saying, hey,

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Speaker 2: I'm the college.

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Speaker 5: You're up for UCLA.

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Speaker 2: I'm a big fan, you know, blah blah, and I'm

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Speaker 2: learning how to play the blues. I'm trying to get

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Speaker 2: the sustain. How do you do this? And he looks

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Speaker 2: at me and he goes, oh, it's in the fingers.

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Speaker 2: It's all in the fingers. And as I write in

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Speaker 2: the book, I thought he was egoing out on me, like, oh, hey,

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Speaker 2: it's all in the fingers, right, And he leaves and

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Speaker 2: I go back to my fraternity house and I just

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Speaker 2: emulate what he did. I go, it's all in the fingers.

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Speaker 5: You know.

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Speaker 2: I have a guitar at the time as a Rickenbacker.

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Speaker 2: It's not the greatest guitar for blues.

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Speaker 5: But I do what he did.

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Speaker 2: I turn the app all the way up, I turn

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Speaker 2: the volume all the way up, and I wiggle my finger.

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Speaker 2: As most guitar players know, that's how you get a vibrato.

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Speaker 2: You hit a note and you wiggle your finger makes

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Speaker 2: a vibrato. That's how you get the sustain. The light

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Speaker 2: bulb of the century goes off in my head and

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Speaker 2: I'm like, oh my god, he wasn't egoing. He's trying

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Speaker 2: to teach me something, and I'm running back across camp screaming.

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Speaker 5: My guts out. People think I'm crazy.

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Speaker 1: It's in the fingers. It's in the fingers, you know.

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Speaker 2: And I wanted to tell him, but he was long gone, right,

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Speaker 2: you know, by the time I got back to you know,

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Speaker 2: the hall where he played.

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Speaker 5: But I would just love to have.

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Speaker 2: Another conversation with that guy about so many things, but

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Speaker 2: he would be the one.

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Speaker 4: I love the story, and I think what I'll pile

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Speaker 4: on the accolades at the beginning about you, and in

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Speaker 4: the middle of the interview and at the end, so

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Speaker 4: I'll equally distribute the accolades. But I think one of

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Speaker 4: the keys to your success as a promotion leader for

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Speaker 4: your company was the fact that you weren't bullshit and

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Speaker 4: you were genuine in your love for the music and

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Speaker 4: for what the artists were doing. And people instantly picked

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Speaker 4: up on that. They knew if Paul Rappaport was coming

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Speaker 4: with a project, that it was going to be something

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Speaker 4: that had some meat to it rather than some fly

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Speaker 4: by night operation.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Well, you know, I had no other agenda other than

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Speaker 2: I love this music so much that we grew up

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Speaker 2: with this music late sixties early seventies. I mean this

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Speaker 2: shapes our lives. Bob Dylan shaped the way I think,

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Speaker 2: so did Pink Floyd, so did the Rolling Stones, the Beatles.

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Speaker 2: So I come to the business just with a love

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Speaker 2: of music and no other agenda other than to help

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Speaker 2: these people along because they had given so much to me.

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Speaker 2: It was like, Hey, I get to give back to

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Speaker 2: these people and new artists. When when I joined Columbia,

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Speaker 2: you know, Aerosmith is a brand new band. There's a

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Speaker 2: new guy named Bruce Springsteen. There's a new guy named

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Speaker 2: Billy Joel. There's a new guy named Elvis Costelli. There's

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Speaker 2: all new people. There's a brand new it's starting out.

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Speaker 2: So we're starting out together where I'm the same age

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Speaker 2: as all those guys. So I think because I'd come

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Speaker 2: from the sixties thing, which was a more authentic, genuine place,

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Speaker 2: I'm not the pre you know, the fifties, you know

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Speaker 2: promo guys like the Hey babe guys. You know, I'm

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Speaker 2: not that slick person. And my only agenda is I

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Speaker 2: love this music and I get to shout about it. Right,

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Speaker 2: I'm going to go try to get this on radio

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Speaker 2: to tell people, Hey, I love this music and guess

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Speaker 2: what you know, so will you if you can hear this,

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Speaker 2: et cetera. I think also because of my work ethic,

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Speaker 2: people knew if I would bring a promotion to them.

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Speaker 5: One of the greatest.

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Speaker 2: Compliments I ever got was from somebody when I brought

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Speaker 2: them something that was you know, I have a big imagination.

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Speaker 2: I'd bring them something pretty big, and they said, that's okay, Rap,

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Speaker 2: because my last name's Rapaports and my nicknames Rap's that's okay, Rap.

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Speaker 5: Your shit works. And it was the.

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Speaker 2: Biggest compiment I ever had, Like, oh, they trust me. Like, no,

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Speaker 2: your shit works. Whatever you have, even if it's outlandish,

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Speaker 2: you know, which could be shooting a laser beam off

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Speaker 2: a mountainside or a giant airship for Bake Floyd. At

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Speaker 2: least they knew I'd done my homework and yes, you

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Speaker 2: know it would work. So I think those two things.

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Speaker 2: Having the work ethic too, and just make sure everything

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Speaker 2: did work, you know, by perfection. Having a list I

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Speaker 2: always I would always make myself a checklist. I don't

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Speaker 2: care if it's the smallest promotion or the biggest television show.

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Speaker 2: You make yourself a checklist of you anticipate every little

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Speaker 2: thing every big thing and every little thing. All you

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Speaker 2: have to do is go down the list. Will never fail.

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Speaker 2: You'll be perfect because you just keep looking at the list.

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Speaker 2: I didn't do that. I didn't do that yet, So

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Speaker 2: that was something that I adopted early on. You know

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Speaker 2: what you read about in the book which really helped.

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Speaker 4: It was an early lesson for you.

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Speaker 2: It was an early lesson, yeah, because it was like, oh,

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Speaker 2: this is how you do it, and you learn along

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Speaker 2: the way. You know, you know, you know how to

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Speaker 2: do these you know different things, how to approach problems

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Speaker 2: and challenges. So I think those two things are work

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Speaker 2: ethic and.

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Speaker 5: You know not.

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Speaker 2: You know, look, it's an entertainment business. A lot of

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Speaker 2: people have agendas. They're trying to be this, or they

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Speaker 2: want to be that, or they're trying to get close

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Speaker 2: to somebody because they want to favor.

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Speaker 5: It just wasn't me. I was just pretty much what

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Speaker 5: you see is what you get. You know.

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Speaker 4: That's yeah, Well, it certainly proved its point time and

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Speaker 4: time again. We'll get to the book more, but I

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Speaker 4: want to ask you, do you recall though, the first

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Speaker 4: moment in your life where you were touched by music

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Speaker 4: and you absolutely knew with some certainty you were going

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Speaker 4: to have something to do with music in your life.

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Speaker 5: That's an interesting question.

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Speaker 2: My first memory of music really moving me is it's

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Speaker 2: a very old song. It's a Big Rock Candy Mountain,

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Speaker 2: you know, by a guy named Harry McClintock. And in

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Speaker 2: this song, it's about a hobo and it talks about

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Speaker 2: living the hobo life. And in the big Rock Candy

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Speaker 2: Mountain there's cigarette trees, there's lemonade springs, and there's a

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Speaker 2: jail that only made out of ten so you can

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Speaker 2: walk right out again as soon as you are in.

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Speaker 2: I'm like, what five or six? I hear this, and

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Speaker 2: I love this song because I could see it in

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Speaker 2: my head. You know, I have a big imagination. I

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Speaker 2: could see this world in my head and I went, Wow,

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Speaker 2: what a great world. So I listened to this over

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Speaker 2: and over again as a kid, because I went, this

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Speaker 2: is a wonderful world. I'm only a kid, right, And

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Speaker 2: just even the whole idea of a jail where you

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Speaker 2: can walk out again, it speaks to my inner rebel.

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Speaker 5: Right.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So that's the first time, I think.

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Speaker 4: And you must have loved when it then became a

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Speaker 4: central part of Oh brother World.

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Speaker 5: I blew my mind right.

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Speaker 1: I was like, oh, that's my song.

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Speaker 2: So, but the first time where I really have a

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Speaker 2: wake up call is again. I'm seven years old and

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Speaker 2: I'm you know, It's Sunday morning in Los Angeles. My

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Speaker 2: parents are sleeping in I turn on the TV. There's

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Speaker 2: not a lot on in the fifties on Sunday morning,

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Speaker 2: but there was a lie show from a very famous

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Speaker 2: car salesman, cal Worthington cal Worthington Dodge, who had a

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Speaker 2: giant car lot and in order to get people interested,

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Speaker 2: he had live music playing on the lot and it

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Speaker 2: was mostly country.

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Speaker 5: So as a.

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Speaker 2: Kid, first of all, it's great because it's live. I'm

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Speaker 2: transported to this place and I'm seeing all these players

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Speaker 2: and singers and I'm like, this is amazing, and I

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Speaker 2: don't know, buzz I guess for whatever reason, the guitars

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Speaker 2: spoke to me. I'm looking at these guitars. I knew

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Speaker 2: what a guitar was, of course, but this is the

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Speaker 2: first time I'm seeing them in action. I'm like, look

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Speaker 2: at these guitars. They're all different. Some of them are bit,

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Speaker 2: some of them are small, some of them have a

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Speaker 2: widen neck, some of them are a nylon string, some

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Speaker 2: are metal strings, but they're all have their own soul.

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Speaker 5: Right.

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Speaker 2: Every time somebody hits the guitar, a different sound comes out.

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Speaker 2: And all these people have songs and they have something

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Speaker 2: to say. They have these songs have messages, and I'd

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Speaker 2: always anticipate, Jez, I wonder what this person is going

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Speaker 2: to sing about it, and wonder what that person is

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Speaker 2: to sing about. But the guitar, I don't know if

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Speaker 2: it was the curves or the wood. It just seemed important.

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Speaker 2: I went, wait, you know, somebody with a guitar on

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Speaker 2: their shoulders got a message for me. And this is

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Speaker 2: a big deal to me. And I remember after watching

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Speaker 2: the show, I told my parents, I not I want

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Speaker 2: to learn how to play the guitar.

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Speaker 5: I need to.

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Speaker 2: I need to do that. I need to learn how

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Speaker 2: to play the guitar. And as you read, I mean

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Speaker 2: the woman who came to our house told my parents,

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Speaker 2: oh what she called the Spanish guitar. She said, oh,

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Speaker 2: this will be difficult for him. He's got to push

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Speaker 2: the strings down. Why don't we start them on lap steel,

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Speaker 2: which is like if you look at country band's pedal steel,

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Speaker 2: there's pedals that bend in the strings. But there's lap

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Speaker 2: steel which without the pedals, and you can play slide

292
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Speaker 2: guitar music, but you could play country, you could play

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Speaker 2: you know, Hawaiian music was big. It wasn't really my

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Speaker 2: thing at all, but it was electric. So I plugged

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Speaker 2: into an amp and that was wow, this is electuses like,

296
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Speaker 2: this is a cool thing. And so I start doing

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Speaker 2: this as seven years old, and I think at that

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Speaker 2: time it wasn't what I wanted, right, So I'm doing

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Speaker 2: this for a little while, and I'm like, I don't

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Speaker 2: like this, you know, except for the one time I

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Speaker 2: did the you know, the recital where an eight year

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Speaker 2: old girl came was doing a hula in front of me.

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Speaker 2: I'm playing Hawaiian music, this girl shows up. All I

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Speaker 2: know is I'm seeing more skin than I've ever seen

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Speaker 2: in my life as a kid. You know, hula skirts,

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Speaker 2: you know, below her navel, her legs are moving in

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Speaker 2: and out. I'm only eight.

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Speaker 1: I know I like this. I don't know why. I

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Speaker 1: have no idea why. I like, you knew why, you know,

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Speaker 1: I don't know at eight?

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Speaker 5: What do you know at eight? Yeah?

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Speaker 2: But you know, but Hawaiian music started to sound better

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Speaker 2: and better. I was like, oh, and I'll stick with

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Speaker 2: this royal. But at fourteen when I heard Bob Dylan,

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Speaker 2: that changed my life and I went, okay, I forget

316
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Speaker 2: I'm doing this. So at fourteen years old and I

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Speaker 2: heard Peter, Paul and Mary, but Dylan was really the one.

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Speaker 2: I don't think twice right. And I see the guitars

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Speaker 2: they're playing, and I just went out, saved up my money,

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Speaker 2: went and bought a guitar, strung it up in a

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Speaker 2: way that I needed. I like the nylon and look,

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00:16:01,400 --> 00:16:03,480
Speaker 2: i'd a bought a guitar that happened to have steel strings.

323
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Speaker 2: I actually took those steel strings off. I filed down

324
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Speaker 2: the nut of the guitar so the nylon strings would fit.

325
00:16:08,440 --> 00:16:12,040
Speaker 2: Made my own guitar, you know, lowered the action so

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Speaker 2: that my fingers could play, got a guitar chord book

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Speaker 2: and just sat down and taught myself how to play

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Speaker 2: the guitar. And I couldn't get it off out of

329
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Speaker 2: my fingers. I just couldn't get enough of it. We'd

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Speaker 2: be watching TV and I just I just you know,

331
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Speaker 2: I wouldn't play it loud, but I'd be cording to

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Speaker 2: make sure my fingers could remember how to go because

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00:16:32,400 --> 00:16:34,200
Speaker 2: you know, in the beginning, your fingers don't know what

334
00:16:34,200 --> 00:16:36,160
Speaker 2: to do. You're taking your right hand and you're pushing

335
00:16:36,160 --> 00:16:39,160
Speaker 2: your left fingers down to No, this string is getting

336
00:16:39,160 --> 00:16:40,440
Speaker 2: in the way of this. You have to make sure

337
00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:43,840
Speaker 2: that the chords are clear. And ever since fourteen year

338
00:16:43,840 --> 00:16:47,200
Speaker 2: olds old, I just couldn't get the guitar out of

339
00:16:47,840 --> 00:16:49,840
Speaker 2: my hands. It just became a friend of mine. It

340
00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:53,320
Speaker 2: became like a companion. And you know, if you were sad,

341
00:16:53,480 --> 00:16:55,160
Speaker 2: it could be a friend. If you were happy, you

342
00:16:55,200 --> 00:16:57,880
Speaker 2: could play joyous stuff on it. It's just always there.

343
00:16:59,000 --> 00:17:02,160
Speaker 2: At fifteen and sixteen, I go where electric I grew

344
00:17:02,240 --> 00:17:05,480
Speaker 2: up in southern California, saw surf music, Dick Dale, all right,

345
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Speaker 2: you want to talk about You want know where heavy

346
00:17:07,200 --> 00:17:09,800
Speaker 2: metal came from. Even Jimmy Hendrix tells you that he

347
00:17:09,840 --> 00:17:12,880
Speaker 2: listened to Dick Dale. Go listen to surf beat right

348
00:17:13,880 --> 00:17:18,119
Speaker 2: with a Fender reverb from Hell, you know, the echo

349
00:17:18,200 --> 00:17:21,600
Speaker 2: of that thing and Miserly and all these songs, and

350
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Speaker 2: so you know, early on I learned how to play

351
00:17:24,640 --> 00:17:27,960
Speaker 2: surf music. Was interestingly enough, the same thing was happening

352
00:17:28,000 --> 00:17:31,560
Speaker 2: in England. All right, So I'm listening to the Ventures

353
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Speaker 2: right and surf instrumentals. At the same time, a guy

354
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Speaker 2: named David Gilmour is in England. He's listening to Hank

355
00:17:39,359 --> 00:17:41,280
Speaker 2: Marvin and the Shadows and they.

356
00:17:41,200 --> 00:17:43,639
Speaker 5: Had the big hit Apache. But it's the.

357
00:17:43,520 --> 00:17:46,840
Speaker 2: Same Fender Twain right, the same thing's going on. This

358
00:17:46,920 --> 00:17:50,440
Speaker 2: is how electric guitar is building, you know, until Jimmy

359
00:17:50,440 --> 00:17:53,119
Speaker 2: Hendrix comes along and then changes the face of the

360
00:17:53,160 --> 00:17:53,840
Speaker 2: electric guitar.

361
00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:55,080
Speaker 5: Yeah, but.

362
00:17:56,560 --> 00:17:59,320
Speaker 2: So we started doing that, and then of course when

363
00:17:59,320 --> 00:18:02,840
Speaker 2: the British invade hit with the Beatles and the Stones,

364
00:18:02,960 --> 00:18:06,560
Speaker 2: I was immediately attracted to the Rolling Stones because they

365
00:18:06,600 --> 00:18:11,479
Speaker 2: were dangerous and I wanted to be dangerous. So I

366
00:18:11,560 --> 00:18:16,320
Speaker 2: learned how to play electric guitar blues listening to early

367
00:18:16,440 --> 00:18:19,200
Speaker 2: Rolling Stones records. This is Keith Richards was how I

368
00:18:19,240 --> 00:18:21,639
Speaker 2: learned how to play electric guitar with an you know,

369
00:18:21,680 --> 00:18:23,480
Speaker 2: with a record album at a tone arm which I

370
00:18:23,560 --> 00:18:24,440
Speaker 2: ruined my records, like.

371
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Speaker 5: What going back dropped the newly? What's he?

372
00:18:26,800 --> 00:18:28,160
Speaker 1: How does he do that? What is he doing?

373
00:18:28,280 --> 00:18:30,159
Speaker 2: And as a kid, there's no we don't have YouTube,

374
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Speaker 2: we don't have any of that. So that's the only

375
00:18:32,119 --> 00:18:33,600
Speaker 2: way you're going to learn or a friend's gonna come

376
00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:35,240
Speaker 2: over and say, oh, here's a lick, or here's how

377
00:18:35,240 --> 00:18:38,040
Speaker 2: he's doing this or whatever. You know, years later I

378
00:18:38,440 --> 00:18:40,560
Speaker 2: met him. He gave me a guitar list, you know,

379
00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:42,760
Speaker 2: which was amazing because I learned how all the Rolling

380
00:18:42,760 --> 00:18:45,719
Speaker 2: Stones hits are made with young tuning. But but at

381
00:18:45,760 --> 00:18:48,480
Speaker 2: any rate, so I think from the age of fourteen,

382
00:18:49,400 --> 00:18:53,120
Speaker 2: I know something's up for me with the guitar. By

383
00:18:53,160 --> 00:18:55,399
Speaker 2: the time I go electric and I'm playing in bands

384
00:18:55,440 --> 00:18:58,719
Speaker 2: in high school, I know something's really now. I have

385
00:18:58,800 --> 00:19:00,320
Speaker 2: no idea I'm going to be in the music business,

386
00:19:00,320 --> 00:19:01,679
Speaker 2: and I have no idea if I'm going to make

387
00:19:01,720 --> 00:19:06,479
Speaker 2: it as in music, you know, we had experiences. I

388
00:19:06,480 --> 00:19:08,680
Speaker 2: was in a punk band in la in nineteen seventy three,

389
00:19:08,720 --> 00:19:12,720
Speaker 2: which you know may have gone farther than we thought.

390
00:19:12,840 --> 00:19:15,280
Speaker 2: I thought it was a lark. So you know, I

391
00:19:15,320 --> 00:19:16,800
Speaker 2: was going to get a real job at Columbia, and

392
00:19:16,840 --> 00:19:19,359
Speaker 2: I was went, well, this is a steady job. I

393
00:19:19,359 --> 00:19:22,399
Speaker 2: think I'll take this. I'll still play guitar. The leader

394
00:19:22,440 --> 00:19:26,240
Speaker 2: of the band band it's called Mogen David and his Whinos,

395
00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:30,119
Speaker 2: I believe it or not, it's it's a legendary band

396
00:19:30,359 --> 00:19:32,920
Speaker 2: in La if you go on to eBay and you

397
00:19:32,960 --> 00:19:36,000
Speaker 2: look up our album like it's called Savage Young Winos,

398
00:19:36,000 --> 00:19:38,720
Speaker 2: which is a takeoff on the Savage Young Beatles album

399
00:19:38,760 --> 00:19:41,240
Speaker 2: with Pete Best. If you go on eBay, our album

400
00:19:41,280 --> 00:19:45,000
Speaker 2: ogain Mogen David and his Winos Savage Young Whinos is

401
00:19:45,000 --> 00:19:47,240
Speaker 2: like a bidding war. The last one sold for one

402
00:19:47,280 --> 00:19:50,679
Speaker 2: hundred and thirty three records. If you go get the

403
00:19:50,720 --> 00:19:54,399
Speaker 2: original Beatles album called Savage Young Beatles with Pete Best

404
00:19:54,400 --> 00:19:57,119
Speaker 2: as the drummer, it sells for fifty bucks.

405
00:19:58,320 --> 00:19:58,960
Speaker 5: So go figure.

406
00:19:59,160 --> 00:20:01,280
Speaker 2: I don't know how this worked, but so we were

407
00:20:01,280 --> 00:20:03,439
Speaker 2: in this band and you know, we we were like

408
00:20:03,480 --> 00:20:05,760
Speaker 2: we're known in Hollywood. We're like the hip you know whatever,

409
00:20:05,800 --> 00:20:10,440
Speaker 2: punk band. But when the Columbia, you know, real job

410
00:20:10,480 --> 00:20:12,879
Speaker 2: came up. Harold Bronson, who by the way, went on

411
00:20:12,920 --> 00:20:15,200
Speaker 2: to be Rhino Records. He's the he is the co

412
00:20:15,240 --> 00:20:19,120
Speaker 2: founder of Rhino Records, right, very talented guy. He wanted

413
00:20:19,119 --> 00:20:20,600
Speaker 2: to take the band on the road. And I said, Harold,

414
00:20:20,600 --> 00:20:22,560
Speaker 2: I just don't think we're that good now we buzz.

415
00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:24,800
Speaker 2: We didn't know that at that time, nobody was that good.

416
00:20:24,800 --> 00:20:26,320
Speaker 2: There was a band, there was a group called the

417
00:20:26,320 --> 00:20:30,359
Speaker 2: Wrecking Crew. These people are helping bands, even the biggest

418
00:20:30,400 --> 00:20:32,280
Speaker 2: bands in the road, like the Beach Boys. Like I'd

419
00:20:32,280 --> 00:20:33,840
Speaker 2: hear the Beach Boys and go, Harold, which is not

420
00:20:33,880 --> 00:20:36,400
Speaker 2: that good. Listen to these guys. It wasn't them. It's

421
00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:39,199
Speaker 2: the Wrecking Crew, like you know, session guys helping them.

422
00:20:39,240 --> 00:20:40,760
Speaker 2: And of course, but we didn't know that.

423
00:20:40,840 --> 00:20:41,320
Speaker 1: We didn't know that.

424
00:20:41,359 --> 00:20:43,120
Speaker 2: So they're getting better as they play on the road.

425
00:20:43,119 --> 00:20:44,880
Speaker 2: Guess what, if you practice, you get better. You play

426
00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:47,280
Speaker 2: night after night, you get better. We didn't know that,

427
00:20:47,359 --> 00:20:49,400
Speaker 2: so we didn't know anything. We'd snuck in the middle

428
00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:51,880
Speaker 2: of a recording studio night make our record. We didn't buzz.

429
00:20:51,880 --> 00:20:54,800
Speaker 2: We didn't know anything. E Q, what does that do?

430
00:20:54,640 --> 00:20:57,480
Speaker 2: We don't know anything, right, So but we made a record.

431
00:20:57,520 --> 00:20:59,560
Speaker 2: We made a thousand, We sold a thousand. We sold

432
00:20:59,560 --> 00:21:02,840
Speaker 2: them all over the world. I have reviews from France

433
00:21:02,880 --> 00:21:05,120
Speaker 2: and Japan, don't I don't know if they like the record.

434
00:21:05,160 --> 00:21:07,639
Speaker 2: I don't know what they say it because they're different languages.

435
00:21:08,040 --> 00:21:11,280
Speaker 2: But but you know, so we go on our merry way.

436
00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:13,280
Speaker 2: I work for Columbia Records. I have, you know, wonderful

437
00:21:13,280 --> 00:21:17,560
Speaker 2: career there. Harold does Rhino Records. Those guys go it's huge.

438
00:21:17,760 --> 00:21:20,199
Speaker 2: But when the Ramones came out, Harold called me and

439
00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:23,080
Speaker 2: he said, you see, this would have been us. And

440
00:21:23,119 --> 00:21:25,200
Speaker 2: we don't know that it wouldn't have not been us

441
00:21:25,480 --> 00:21:27,600
Speaker 2: because we didn't go down the road of hey can

442
00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:29,400
Speaker 2: we get some help in the studio. We just thought

443
00:21:29,440 --> 00:21:31,959
Speaker 2: it's all on us. I mean, neither one of us

444
00:21:31,960 --> 00:21:34,520
Speaker 2: are complaining. We both had wonderful careers and we you know,

445
00:21:35,240 --> 00:21:37,640
Speaker 2: you know, I had successful marriages and kids and all

446
00:21:37,640 --> 00:21:39,480
Speaker 2: that kind of stuff, you know, and I don't know

447
00:21:39,520 --> 00:21:41,720
Speaker 2: that I would have, you know, actually even been able

448
00:21:41,760 --> 00:21:43,840
Speaker 2: to survive on the road. I think I might have

449
00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:46,159
Speaker 2: been one of those road casualties. That's a that's a

450
00:21:46,240 --> 00:21:48,119
Speaker 2: rough life. I don't know if that's for me, but

451
00:21:48,119 --> 00:21:50,560
Speaker 2: at any rate, but I guess the you know, in

452
00:21:50,600 --> 00:21:53,080
Speaker 2: those times, I know music's playing a part in my life.

453
00:21:53,119 --> 00:21:54,439
Speaker 2: I know it's always going to play a part in

454
00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:56,720
Speaker 2: my life. Even when I got the job for Columbia,

455
00:21:56,720 --> 00:21:58,120
Speaker 2: we will this is be the best of both worlds.

456
00:21:58,160 --> 00:22:00,680
Speaker 2: I can still play, and I can play in sessions

457
00:22:01,040 --> 00:22:02,879
Speaker 2: and then and behold, I'm meeting all these people and

458
00:22:02,920 --> 00:22:08,199
Speaker 2: I'm winding up playing. You know, you know, I run

459
00:22:08,280 --> 00:22:11,800
Speaker 2: the book Todje Mahall came one day to the office.

460
00:22:11,840 --> 00:22:14,360
Speaker 2: He usually would go to the recording studio. He came

461
00:22:14,400 --> 00:22:16,880
Speaker 2: to the business office. I don't know why. Cool guy

462
00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:18,760
Speaker 2: goes into the mailroom. He's got a big, flat back

463
00:22:18,800 --> 00:22:21,720
Speaker 2: Austrian bass. He just starts playing the bass, right, because

464
00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:23,119
Speaker 2: in those days, that's how it was. We were like

465
00:22:23,160 --> 00:22:23,960
Speaker 2: one happy family.

466
00:22:24,040 --> 00:22:24,240
Speaker 5: Right.

467
00:22:25,400 --> 00:22:27,040
Speaker 2: Okay, I don't know where I got the balls to

468
00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:28,560
Speaker 2: do this, but I have a guitar in my office.

469
00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:30,240
Speaker 2: I went in there and just started jamming with them

470
00:22:30,680 --> 00:22:32,600
Speaker 2: right now. Every once in a while I look up.

471
00:22:32,600 --> 00:22:34,320
Speaker 2: I just stop because I realized it's Todje Mahall. I

472
00:22:34,320 --> 00:22:36,639
Speaker 2: freak out, right, So we get done. So half an

473
00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:38,600
Speaker 2: hour later or forty minutes, he looks at me. He goes,

474
00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:41,040
Speaker 2: what's wrong with you? I said, what do you mean?

475
00:22:41,600 --> 00:22:43,240
Speaker 2: He goes, well, you seem like you know where you're going.

476
00:22:43,280 --> 00:22:44,240
Speaker 2: You're doing really good, and then.

477
00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:44,920
Speaker 1: You just stop.

478
00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:47,040
Speaker 2: I go, yeah, I stop because I look up and

479
00:22:47,080 --> 00:22:50,399
Speaker 2: I realize it's you, and I freak out and he goes, well, ah,

480
00:22:50,520 --> 00:22:54,720
Speaker 2: that's your problem, right, And I came to realize these

481
00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:58,760
Speaker 2: guys are all players. First people from that generation. Eric

482
00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:01,280
Speaker 2: Clapton did not get into business to be a rock star.

483
00:23:01,359 --> 00:23:05,800
Speaker 2: Rockstar wasn't even invented, right, he invents that with other people.

484
00:23:05,800 --> 00:23:08,000
Speaker 2: There is no such thing at the time. There are

485
00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:10,840
Speaker 2: pop stars, but there's no rock stars. Eric Clappan just

486
00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:12,520
Speaker 2: wanted to be the best player he could be. If

487
00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:14,480
Speaker 2: you read his autobiography, I just wanted to be a

488
00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:18,360
Speaker 2: guitar virtuoso and all of these blues things that I heard.

489
00:23:18,359 --> 00:23:20,120
Speaker 2: I went, oh my god, it's already been done. Well,

490
00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:21,919
Speaker 2: maybe I'll listen to Freddy kme to me. If I

491
00:23:21,960 --> 00:23:24,000
Speaker 2: do it my way, maybe I can make quote unquote

492
00:23:24,040 --> 00:23:26,639
Speaker 2: a living. You know, you read Ronnie Wood's book. We

493
00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:28,760
Speaker 2: just wanted to play. We didn't think about business. Just

494
00:23:28,800 --> 00:23:30,399
Speaker 2: me and Rod. We just got into vanage. We just

495
00:23:30,400 --> 00:23:32,600
Speaker 2: want to play. But they wanted to be the best

496
00:23:32,640 --> 00:23:35,679
Speaker 2: players they could be. David Gilmore same thing. They just

497
00:23:35,720 --> 00:23:38,159
Speaker 2: wanted to be the best players they could be. And

498
00:23:38,200 --> 00:23:42,000
Speaker 2: then all the business stuff came after. So they're musicians, right.

499
00:23:43,119 --> 00:23:46,960
Speaker 2: I found myself. You know, when Steve Perry was making

500
00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:51,120
Speaker 2: a solo record, you know, in a rehearsal, he goes, oh, hey, rap, oh,

501
00:23:51,160 --> 00:23:52,879
Speaker 2: I know you can blow just grab one of my

502
00:23:52,920 --> 00:23:56,520
Speaker 2: guitars and come up here. I'm like, Okay, what do

503
00:23:56,520 --> 00:23:58,199
Speaker 2: you want to do? I don't know, Like I'm a

504
00:23:58,200 --> 00:24:01,560
Speaker 2: blues guy. Okay, Perry blues an a minor. Oh no,

505
00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:03,000
Speaker 2: he asked me the key? What key do you want?

506
00:24:03,160 --> 00:24:03,400
Speaker 5: Perry?

507
00:24:03,400 --> 00:24:04,359
Speaker 1: You're the singer, you know.

508
00:24:04,359 --> 00:24:07,680
Speaker 2: It's like, but awesome, I'm playing guitar with Steve Perry's journey, right,

509
00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:11,399
Speaker 2: I want to play with the little feet guys. This

510
00:24:11,440 --> 00:24:14,439
Speaker 2: would happen to me just because I'm a player, you know.

511
00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:15,880
Speaker 2: And then you read in the book, eventually I wind

512
00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:18,200
Speaker 2: up playing with Pink Floyd, which is all that's a

513
00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:19,679
Speaker 2: whole another planet, you know.

514
00:24:19,760 --> 00:24:25,960
Speaker 4: But I think one of the underlying storylines lessons inside

515
00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:30,960
Speaker 4: the book is the aspect of your confidence in just

516
00:24:31,359 --> 00:24:34,720
Speaker 4: freaking going for it, whether it be as a player,

517
00:24:35,119 --> 00:24:37,959
Speaker 4: whether it be and the way that you approached, you know,

518
00:24:38,040 --> 00:24:41,840
Speaker 4: your promotion work, the ability to think big and just

519
00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:45,320
Speaker 4: say let's let it rip, baby, let's let it wrap baby.

520
00:24:45,840 --> 00:24:50,760
Speaker 4: And I think, as I reflect on the book, I

521
00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:54,520
Speaker 4: think that's one of the things that everyone can take from.

522
00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:57,720
Speaker 5: It, besides all the great stories. Would you agree with that? Oh?

523
00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:00,560
Speaker 2: I think so there's a you know, there's a lot

524
00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:04,000
Speaker 2: in this book, beyond the stories. And you know, I

525
00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:05,640
Speaker 2: tried to write it like you are there, like you're

526
00:25:05,640 --> 00:25:08,159
Speaker 2: having conversations, you know, with with with with some of

527
00:25:08,200 --> 00:25:11,000
Speaker 2: your favorite artists, because I, you know, I'm blessed with

528
00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:14,240
Speaker 2: like a photographic memory. I can read these conversations. I

529
00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:16,520
Speaker 2: remember the conversation buzz. I can remember the room. I

530
00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:18,560
Speaker 2: remember having dinner with Mick Jagger. I can tell you

531
00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:20,879
Speaker 2: what he had to eat. I mean, I can visualize

532
00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:22,879
Speaker 2: this plate. I mean, that's it's kind of wacky stuff.

533
00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:23,920
Speaker 5: Well, you are a bit of a.

534
00:25:25,840 --> 00:25:31,080
Speaker 2: I'm whatever it is, I'm something, so these things, you know,

535
00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:34,320
Speaker 2: come to me and so but I wanted to make

536
00:25:34,359 --> 00:25:37,800
Speaker 2: sure that more than stories, you know, I hope people

537
00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:40,760
Speaker 2: could could get you know, here's an inside look of

538
00:25:40,800 --> 00:25:43,080
Speaker 2: how this works, or here's how.

539
00:25:43,320 --> 00:25:45,960
Speaker 5: You know my mind worked, you know.

540
00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:48,119
Speaker 2: And I had a big imagination and I had a

541
00:25:48,119 --> 00:25:50,960
Speaker 2: big work ethic, and I had you know, I wanted

542
00:25:50,960 --> 00:25:54,080
Speaker 2: to be the best. You know, I guess that's an

543
00:25:54,119 --> 00:25:56,720
Speaker 2: ego thing, but I I you know, I wanted to

544
00:25:56,760 --> 00:25:59,359
Speaker 2: be the best. I just and I wanted to sound

545
00:25:59,400 --> 00:26:01,520
Speaker 2: like some like I'm egoing up. But I had to

546
00:26:01,560 --> 00:26:03,160
Speaker 2: be the best at what I did, which is something

547
00:26:03,160 --> 00:26:06,560
Speaker 2: inside like I'm going to be the best at this

548
00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:09,639
Speaker 2: and I'm going to do bigger than life things, you know,

549
00:26:09,640 --> 00:26:12,120
Speaker 2: and that Yeah, that does take a belief in yourself

550
00:26:12,119 --> 00:26:15,600
Speaker 2: and and it does take a bit of attitude. But

551
00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:20,719
Speaker 2: I would, I would, I would visualize things and then

552
00:26:20,760 --> 00:26:22,439
Speaker 2: I would make them happen. So like I have a

553
00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:27,040
Speaker 2: bigger imagination, so I could visualize an airship for Pink

554
00:26:27,080 --> 00:26:29,760
Speaker 2: Floyd or shooting a you know, a giant laser cannon

555
00:26:29,800 --> 00:26:32,960
Speaker 2: off a mountain side, or you know, you know, even

556
00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:35,280
Speaker 2: if I did a TV show, you know once at

557
00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:37,080
Speaker 2: a TV series and which just I could see it.

558
00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:39,480
Speaker 2: And once I saw it, it was like, Okay, I

559
00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:42,639
Speaker 2: see it. How do we do that? Okay, get the

560
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:45,600
Speaker 2: checklist out? What does it take? Everything takes something different.

561
00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:48,600
Speaker 2: What does it take to make these things happen? And

562
00:26:48,640 --> 00:26:50,720
Speaker 2: it's like building blocks, you just you know, it's like

563
00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:53,160
Speaker 2: building a company. You know, look, you build a company.

564
00:26:53,640 --> 00:26:54,560
Speaker 2: It's like building a company.

565
00:26:54,560 --> 00:26:55,080
Speaker 5: It's the same thing.

566
00:26:55,160 --> 00:26:57,520
Speaker 2: So here are the things that need that you need

567
00:26:57,560 --> 00:26:59,439
Speaker 2: if you're going to shoot an argon laser cannon off

568
00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:01,879
Speaker 2: a mountainside. These are the things you need. These are

569
00:27:01,880 --> 00:27:05,280
Speaker 2: the things you need for a giant psychedelic airship. You know,

570
00:27:05,840 --> 00:27:09,359
Speaker 2: there's a television show live by request. Okay, I didn't

571
00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:10,840
Speaker 2: know about television. I had to learn how to make

572
00:27:10,840 --> 00:27:12,720
Speaker 2: a television show. Okay, it's okay. There are people that

573
00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:14,800
Speaker 2: teach you how to make a television show from the

574
00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:16,600
Speaker 2: get What do you need? How does this work? How

575
00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:18,200
Speaker 2: do the lights work? How do the camera people work?

576
00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:20,320
Speaker 2: How do the producers work? Who do I hire? You

577
00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:21,400
Speaker 2: can learn it, but I.

578
00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:23,320
Speaker 5: Would see it. I have it like i'd see it.

579
00:27:23,359 --> 00:27:26,600
Speaker 2: I guess the best way to to, you know, to

580
00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:30,760
Speaker 2: to have you understand it like I envision these things

581
00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:32,520
Speaker 2: and then I build them well.

582
00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:36,399
Speaker 4: And that's probably what eventually led you down the path

583
00:27:36,520 --> 00:27:39,960
Speaker 4: of uh and where your your mind and your your

584
00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:44,280
Speaker 4: memory went with all this with you know, being a magician,

585
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:49,560
Speaker 4: a card trick micetro, I mean you have to have

586
00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:53,119
Speaker 4: a memory and a mind that works uniquely to be

587
00:27:53,160 --> 00:27:55,800
Speaker 4: able to pull some of the stuff off that you

588
00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:57,520
Speaker 4: were able to pull right.

589
00:27:57,760 --> 00:28:00,479
Speaker 2: But there's a secret to it, yeah, you know, especially

590
00:28:00,720 --> 00:28:04,280
Speaker 2: in magic. You know I write about, you know, my

591
00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:06,760
Speaker 2: four Ways into Magic. Got an uncle who was a

592
00:28:06,760 --> 00:28:09,479
Speaker 2: big time magician in Florida, and I started learning as

593
00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:12,439
Speaker 2: a kid. Later in life, you know, I wind up

594
00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:15,240
Speaker 2: getting lessons from one of the great masters that invented

595
00:28:15,840 --> 00:28:18,399
Speaker 2: a lot of the slights that people still use today.

596
00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:21,680
Speaker 2: There was two major league magicians. When was a guy

597
00:28:21,720 --> 00:28:24,399
Speaker 2: named Tony Slidini who took his name from Houdini because

598
00:28:24,440 --> 00:28:27,399
Speaker 2: he's from the forties. There was a guy Divernon was

599
00:28:27,400 --> 00:28:29,160
Speaker 2: on the west coast and Tony was on the East coast.

600
00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:33,520
Speaker 2: I saw Tony perform. I took lessons with him. Magic

601
00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:39,480
Speaker 2: will teach you a lot. There's a lot about it

602
00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:43,600
Speaker 2: that's not just the slights, right, It's it's it's a

603
00:28:43,600 --> 00:28:47,600
Speaker 2: lot of mind. You know, when am I going to

604
00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:52,200
Speaker 2: tell people what journey do I want to take them down?

605
00:28:52,920 --> 00:28:57,400
Speaker 2: It's a performance art. You know, it's getting people to

606
00:28:57,480 --> 00:29:01,120
Speaker 2: think a certain way so that something else happens, and

607
00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:04,880
Speaker 2: something else happens. And there's a lot that I learned,

608
00:29:05,440 --> 00:29:11,880
Speaker 2: and there's a lot that you can divine from how

609
00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:15,920
Speaker 2: magic works in the in the human mind. And I,

610
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:17,680
Speaker 2: as you read, I brought some of this stuff to

611
00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:20,600
Speaker 2: light in the book. How he actually even took some

612
00:29:20,680 --> 00:29:23,920
Speaker 2: of those premises and and you know, made it a

613
00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:27,240
Speaker 2: part of my promotion efforts. Because there were things that

614
00:29:27,280 --> 00:29:30,600
Speaker 2: I learned that I could quote unquote make magic happen

615
00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:35,000
Speaker 2: in certain ways that helped records along that maybe needed

616
00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:37,840
Speaker 2: some help. They weren't going to get there on its own, right,

617
00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:40,400
Speaker 2: So you know, so that was it was, it was,

618
00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:45,280
Speaker 2: It was helpful. So I think the way your mind

619
00:29:45,400 --> 00:29:49,640
Speaker 2: has to work for that stuff is a lot of

620
00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:51,400
Speaker 2: people don't realize. They think it's always just slight of

621
00:29:51,400 --> 00:29:54,520
Speaker 2: hand or something. Oh no, no, that's that's that's just the basics.

622
00:29:55,120 --> 00:29:58,760
Speaker 2: Just the magic is bigger. I mean, if if you

623
00:29:58,800 --> 00:30:00,880
Speaker 2: want to you know, I I hate it when people

624
00:30:00,920 --> 00:30:03,440
Speaker 2: say tricks. I don't like that. We're not doing tricks.

625
00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:06,440
Speaker 2: I didn't, you know, I want to do magic. Magic's different. Okay,

626
00:30:06,880 --> 00:30:10,880
Speaker 2: you do magic and people are like, whoa, that was

627
00:30:10,880 --> 00:30:14,440
Speaker 2: that real? Like wait a minute. You know, if you

628
00:30:14,480 --> 00:30:17,080
Speaker 2: want people to get to that place, you get people

629
00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:20,720
Speaker 2: to get to that place, and then you've accomplished you

630
00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:21,760
Speaker 2: know something.

631
00:30:22,360 --> 00:30:26,520
Speaker 5: So yes, yes, yeah, it applied.

632
00:30:26,600 --> 00:30:28,680
Speaker 2: It was part of what you ultimately became a part

633
00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:31,000
Speaker 2: of my life, and uh, you know, it was.

634
00:30:30,920 --> 00:30:35,360
Speaker 4: Great witnessing it. I remember the first time absolutely blew

635
00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:37,600
Speaker 4: my mind. I was already a fan of yours, and

636
00:30:37,600 --> 00:30:42,120
Speaker 4: then I'm like, this guy's a freaking superhero, you know,

637
00:30:42,600 --> 00:30:47,680
Speaker 4: and there and there he's he's we're leaving. Uh, we'll

638
00:30:47,720 --> 00:30:50,200
Speaker 4: get to Bob Dylan Moore in a bit, but we're

639
00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:54,400
Speaker 4: leaving the Bob Dylan moment that you were gracious enough

640
00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:58,600
Speaker 4: to include me in. And and I remember that Bob

641
00:30:58,640 --> 00:31:01,880
Speaker 4: wanted you to stay behind because he wanted you to

642
00:31:01,920 --> 00:31:05,520
Speaker 4: do that that trick where he was a big he

643
00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:08,480
Speaker 4: was a big manage left he left the Jack of

644
00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:09,240
Speaker 4: Hearts right right.

645
00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:09,480
Speaker 5: Yeah.

646
00:31:09,520 --> 00:31:13,480
Speaker 2: No, he was a big magic fan, Bob, so he

647
00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:16,280
Speaker 2: liked for me to come backstage and do you know,

648
00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:18,960
Speaker 2: card magic or whatever. And he was just a big fan,

649
00:31:20,400 --> 00:31:22,640
Speaker 2: you know. But the Jack of Heart story is funny

650
00:31:22,640 --> 00:31:28,480
Speaker 2: because I did this effect where I wanted him to

651
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:30,840
Speaker 2: wind up with the Jack of Hearts, right, and there's

652
00:31:30,880 --> 00:31:33,320
Speaker 2: ways that you can do that, because I thought, well,

653
00:31:33,680 --> 00:31:35,280
Speaker 2: this will be you know, Bob will love this.

654
00:31:35,240 --> 00:31:37,560
Speaker 5: Because it's you know, Lily Rosemary and the Jack of Hearts. Right.

655
00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:40,840
Speaker 2: So I do this whole thing, this concoction and everything,

656
00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:44,240
Speaker 2: Jack of Hearts comes up. Bob's like, eh, pretty cool.

657
00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:48,400
Speaker 2: I go, well, Bob, you know Jack of Hearts. He goes, well,

658
00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:51,080
Speaker 2: so what I go. I go, you know, Lily Rosemary

659
00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:53,480
Speaker 2: and the Jack of Hearts and he looks at me like,

660
00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:56,400
Speaker 2: you know, who cares?

661
00:31:55,680 --> 00:31:58,560
Speaker 1: Like that's the fartherest thing from you know.

662
00:31:58,600 --> 00:32:01,040
Speaker 2: This guy's written so many songs in my mind, it's like, oh,

663
00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:02,760
Speaker 2: that's one of the biggest Bob Billing songs. He doesn't

664
00:32:02,760 --> 00:32:04,240
Speaker 2: even put two and two together that the Jack of

665
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:07,320
Speaker 2: Hearts comes up. It doesn't matter to him. Maybe he did.

666
00:32:07,600 --> 00:32:09,000
Speaker 2: He was just playing with you.

667
00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:11,240
Speaker 5: Well, Bob can do that, right, Maybe.

668
00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:11,760
Speaker 1: We'll get back to point.

669
00:32:11,760 --> 00:32:14,400
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, well yeah, maybe you know, maybe maybe you know,

670
00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:16,080
Speaker 2: you don't know. He could have been, but I don't

671
00:32:16,080 --> 00:32:20,520
Speaker 2: think so. I think it was just my view on him.

672
00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:23,320
Speaker 2: But he you know, And look, I would have fun

673
00:32:23,360 --> 00:32:27,040
Speaker 2: with all you guys. It's a fun It's a people thing.

674
00:32:27,360 --> 00:32:29,000
Speaker 2: So you like, if you and I go out to

675
00:32:29,040 --> 00:32:31,280
Speaker 2: dinner and then afterwards, and I don't force it on people.

676
00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:33,000
Speaker 2: I'm not one of these guys. Oh you know, pick

677
00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:33,440
Speaker 2: a card guy.

678
00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:35,360
Speaker 5: I'm not. You have to ask.

679
00:32:35,440 --> 00:32:38,680
Speaker 2: If you're really interested, I'll do something. I'm not that guy, right,

680
00:32:38,760 --> 00:32:41,400
Speaker 2: But for people who love it, it's fun. How much

681
00:32:41,400 --> 00:32:43,320
Speaker 2: fun is this? Okay, let's have dessert. Oh you want

682
00:32:43,360 --> 00:32:45,440
Speaker 2: to see like half an hour magic? Sure, great, Okay,

683
00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:47,800
Speaker 2: here's corn's going through a tabletop. But you know it's like,

684
00:32:48,320 --> 00:32:50,000
Speaker 2: why not. You know, it's just it's a it's a

685
00:32:50,440 --> 00:32:52,560
Speaker 2: I love it because it's also a people things. It's

686
00:32:52,560 --> 00:32:55,440
Speaker 2: a it's something I do with people. It's not my

687
00:32:56,080 --> 00:32:57,880
Speaker 2: The way that I do it isn't like I'm the

688
00:32:57,920 --> 00:33:01,560
Speaker 2: magician and you're not. I'm much the opposite. I'm want

689
00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:03,360
Speaker 2: to be as amazed as you. So when things happen

690
00:33:03,440 --> 00:33:05,040
Speaker 2: that are amazing and you're getting to kick out of it,

691
00:33:05,040 --> 00:33:07,800
Speaker 2: I'm getting to kick out of like, man, that was amazing.

692
00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:09,960
Speaker 5: You know, I want to be a part of it.

693
00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:12,640
Speaker 2: I don't want to be the you know, sort of

694
00:33:12,680 --> 00:33:16,320
Speaker 2: overlord of it. It's better to be, you know, just

695
00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:19,080
Speaker 2: with everybody else hanging out and freaking out, you know,

696
00:33:19,280 --> 00:33:20,880
Speaker 2: over watching this stuff happens.

697
00:33:21,040 --> 00:33:24,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, we'll be right back with more of the Taking

698
00:33:24,120 --> 00:33:32,440
Speaker 3: a Walk podcast. Welcome back to the Taking a Walk Podcast.

699
00:33:33,760 --> 00:33:36,880
Speaker 4: So there's so many people I want to talk about here,

700
00:33:36,960 --> 00:33:39,040
Speaker 4: so I kind of have to. I don't want to

701
00:33:39,040 --> 00:33:42,200
Speaker 4: do the lightning round effect at all, but I do

702
00:33:42,320 --> 00:33:46,200
Speaker 4: want to run through some of the mount rushmore of

703
00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:50,840
Speaker 4: music that you have been exposed to and you were

704
00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:54,240
Speaker 4: part of that is so well chronicled in the book,

705
00:33:54,280 --> 00:33:56,800
Speaker 4: and you do take us into it and it does

706
00:33:57,560 --> 00:34:00,480
Speaker 4: make you feel like you're you're there. So you did

707
00:34:00,480 --> 00:34:03,959
Speaker 4: an amazing job of crafting it. The book is beautiful,

708
00:34:04,440 --> 00:34:09,360
Speaker 4: the layout of it, the feel of it, the pictures.

709
00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:11,640
Speaker 5: And I got lucky. I had some publishers who are

710
00:34:11,640 --> 00:34:12,359
Speaker 5: really into art.

711
00:34:13,120 --> 00:34:16,160
Speaker 4: Yeah, but you cared back to your work. It's so

712
00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:19,440
Speaker 4: obvious too, So the publishers care, you care. Yeah, it's

713
00:34:19,440 --> 00:34:22,640
Speaker 4: a great product. So it's a beautiful book. The pictures

714
00:34:22,960 --> 00:34:27,160
Speaker 4: are rich. I remember talking to you early on when

715
00:34:27,200 --> 00:34:30,799
Speaker 4: you were still working on it, and you hadn't even

716
00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:35,480
Speaker 4: completed it, and you were already beautifully obsessed and proud

717
00:34:35,600 --> 00:34:38,839
Speaker 4: of the work. Even at that point, I remember, yeah, well,

718
00:34:38,880 --> 00:34:40,040
Speaker 4: I know now you really are.

719
00:34:40,160 --> 00:34:41,080
Speaker 5: Well. It took six years.

720
00:34:41,120 --> 00:34:43,680
Speaker 2: I mean, this is six years of writing, rewriting, putting

721
00:34:43,719 --> 00:34:46,040
Speaker 2: stuff in, throwing stuff out. I wanted it to be

722
00:34:47,120 --> 00:34:50,920
Speaker 2: great and that takes time, and so and I slaved

723
00:34:50,920 --> 00:34:53,799
Speaker 2: over every paragraph, every sentence, words. I mean, just you know.

724
00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:57,399
Speaker 2: I had four editors that helped, you know, like they're

725
00:34:57,440 --> 00:35:01,440
Speaker 2: like record producers. You know, the the fellow from job

726
00:35:01,480 --> 00:35:04,760
Speaker 2: Bone Press the books on Jobbone. He's like a record producer.

727
00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:06,759
Speaker 2: It's like, okay, you've got fifteen tracks, let's cut it

728
00:35:06,800 --> 00:35:09,520
Speaker 2: down to twelve. I'm going to resequence your album and

729
00:35:09,560 --> 00:35:12,399
Speaker 2: here's a better baseline for this song. That's what record

730
00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:15,640
Speaker 2: producers do. That's what people that you know that are

731
00:35:15,640 --> 00:35:16,160
Speaker 2: in charge.

732
00:35:15,960 --> 00:35:16,400
Speaker 5: Of books do.

733
00:35:16,440 --> 00:35:18,279
Speaker 2: And he said, look, it's your book, he said, but

734
00:35:18,680 --> 00:35:20,040
Speaker 2: he's the way you've written it. I think it's a

735
00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:21,920
Speaker 2: bit top heavy. I'd like to slide the Bob Dylan

736
00:35:22,200 --> 00:35:25,279
Speaker 2: section a little closer here. I think your chapter one

737
00:35:25,320 --> 00:35:27,840
Speaker 2: could be a prologue. I'm smart enough to know this

738
00:35:27,920 --> 00:35:29,960
Speaker 2: is what these people do for a living. It took

739
00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:31,960
Speaker 2: me a second. Took me about a week because when

740
00:35:31,960 --> 00:35:34,279
Speaker 2: he sent it back it was different, same stories, but

741
00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:35,880
Speaker 2: kind of you know, laid out different.

742
00:35:36,520 --> 00:35:38,120
Speaker 5: And I took a big breath and I went, oh, no,

743
00:35:38,280 --> 00:35:39,799
Speaker 5: this is like, this flows better.

744
00:35:39,880 --> 00:35:40,000
Speaker 3: This.

745
00:35:40,360 --> 00:35:42,480
Speaker 5: He knows what he's this. You know, he knows.

746
00:35:43,120 --> 00:35:44,799
Speaker 2: It was kind of like I wish that some young

747
00:35:44,840 --> 00:35:47,239
Speaker 2: bands would have listened to me more right away.

748
00:35:47,280 --> 00:35:48,080
Speaker 5: I'm not going to be them.

749
00:35:48,280 --> 00:35:50,160
Speaker 2: I'm going to be the one who listens like I

750
00:35:50,200 --> 00:35:52,879
Speaker 2: think this is like really amazing. So just I said,

751
00:35:52,880 --> 00:35:56,200
Speaker 2: thank you, thank you, thank you. So you know the

752
00:35:56,239 --> 00:35:59,719
Speaker 2: writing is mine, but the way that it's laid out

753
00:35:59,800 --> 00:36:03,560
Speaker 2: is was it's having a great record producer. I lucked

754
00:36:03,600 --> 00:36:04,839
Speaker 2: out and got this guy, you know.

755
00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:09,200
Speaker 4: So okay, Mount Rushmore, I'm going to start with the Stones,

756
00:36:09,280 --> 00:36:11,640
Speaker 4: because I know you were more of a Stones person

757
00:36:11,680 --> 00:36:15,200
Speaker 4: than a Beatles person, even though Paul McCartney represents the

758
00:36:15,280 --> 00:36:20,240
Speaker 4: significant part, so he'll be next. But what can folks

759
00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:25,640
Speaker 4: take on the Rolling Stones experience that you experiences that

760
00:36:25,719 --> 00:36:29,480
Speaker 4: you but overall experience that you write about so well.

761
00:36:29,280 --> 00:36:32,800
Speaker 2: Well, I think, first of all, I'm not writing from

762
00:36:33,239 --> 00:36:37,400
Speaker 2: a too cool first school place. I want people to

763
00:36:37,480 --> 00:36:41,120
Speaker 2: understand exactly how it was for me meeting them in

764
00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:43,160
Speaker 2: the first place. Again, I'm a seventeen year old kid

765
00:36:43,239 --> 00:36:46,920
Speaker 2: falling over the Rolling Stones. I take my wife, my

766
00:36:46,960 --> 00:36:49,480
Speaker 2: girlfriend at the time who wound up becoming my wife,

767
00:36:50,000 --> 00:36:53,560
Speaker 2: and we're the him. I'm seventeen, she's sixteen, or however

768
00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:55,400
Speaker 2: old we are in nineteen sixty six. I take her

769
00:36:55,400 --> 00:36:59,399
Speaker 2: to the Hollywood Bowl see my favorite band, and our

770
00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:02,279
Speaker 2: favorite song was Everybody Needs Somebody to Love, which is

771
00:37:02,320 --> 00:37:04,800
Speaker 2: a song they did on two different albums.

772
00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:06,080
Speaker 5: And.

773
00:37:07,520 --> 00:37:09,280
Speaker 2: You know, we're just like you see in the newsreels.

774
00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:11,200
Speaker 2: We're jumping up and down, we're singing the songs. I mean,

775
00:37:11,600 --> 00:37:13,879
Speaker 2: you know, Meck Jagger comes out, jumps high in the air.

776
00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:16,560
Speaker 2: He's got this great leather jacket with conchos. He's, you know,

777
00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:19,840
Speaker 2: playing the tambourinae. This is so long ago. Brian Jones

778
00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:22,960
Speaker 2: is still in the band. Okay, so this is music

779
00:37:23,000 --> 00:37:26,400
Speaker 2: that is my life. It's shaping my life. Mother's little helper,

780
00:37:26,480 --> 00:37:30,440
Speaker 2: all the messages whatever. Now you fast forward twenty years

781
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:33,880
Speaker 2: and I'm sitting on a couch right across the street,

782
00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:37,520
Speaker 2: you know, over here in Black Rock, which is Columbia Records,

783
00:37:37,520 --> 00:37:41,880
Speaker 2: you know famous, you know, the CBS building. I'm telling

784
00:37:42,239 --> 00:37:46,600
Speaker 2: Mick Jagger his marketing plan for his first solo album,

785
00:37:46,640 --> 00:37:49,040
Speaker 2: She's the Boss, because I've now come to New York

786
00:37:49,080 --> 00:37:51,000
Speaker 2: and I'm the head of rock promotion for Columbia. Now

787
00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:53,680
Speaker 2: I'm sitting next to this guy telling him his marketing plan.

788
00:37:54,239 --> 00:37:57,080
Speaker 2: The two most amazing things are I know what I'm

789
00:37:57,080 --> 00:38:00,360
Speaker 2: talking about because I'm Steep. Now, I'm a professional record

790
00:38:00,360 --> 00:38:03,920
Speaker 2: you know promotion man. He's listening to me. Now, I

791
00:38:03,960 --> 00:38:06,120
Speaker 2: got to shake my head like I'm just because I'm

792
00:38:06,120 --> 00:38:08,520
Speaker 2: flashing back. I'm like, I'm just the kid that saw

793
00:38:08,560 --> 00:38:12,480
Speaker 2: you not that many years ago. This guy's listening to

794
00:38:12,520 --> 00:38:16,600
Speaker 2: me and I'm having trouble wrapping my head around this. Right, So,

795
00:38:17,480 --> 00:38:20,080
Speaker 2: first of all, to meet I want people to know

796
00:38:20,160 --> 00:38:23,200
Speaker 2: what it was like, even though I'm professional to have

797
00:38:23,280 --> 00:38:26,400
Speaker 2: to just take a breath and get it together to

798
00:38:26,480 --> 00:38:29,040
Speaker 2: talk to these people. Because when you sit across from

799
00:38:29,120 --> 00:38:31,120
Speaker 2: a Mick Jagger or a Keith or Bob are any of

800
00:38:31,160 --> 00:38:34,160
Speaker 2: these people that were a part of my life before

801
00:38:34,239 --> 00:38:37,640
Speaker 2: him in the music business. So, like I mentioned before,

802
00:38:38,160 --> 00:38:41,160
Speaker 2: when I start, it's Bruce, and it's Billy Joel and

803
00:38:41,200 --> 00:38:44,560
Speaker 2: it's Arrowsmith. We're all the same age, we grow up together.

804
00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:47,640
Speaker 2: I'm not in any less awe of their talent, but

805
00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:50,360
Speaker 2: it's not the same feeling. It's not I'm not in

806
00:38:50,440 --> 00:38:53,240
Speaker 2: awe of them because we're just trying to make their kids,

807
00:38:53,280 --> 00:38:54,640
Speaker 2: trying to make their careers happen.

808
00:38:54,719 --> 00:38:54,839
Speaker 3: Right.

809
00:38:55,600 --> 00:38:57,799
Speaker 2: So, but when you see these people, like you know

810
00:38:58,120 --> 00:39:00,200
Speaker 2: when you I grew up watching the Eds all of

811
00:39:00,239 --> 00:39:02,400
Speaker 2: It show, and I know every Rolling Stone and I

812
00:39:02,440 --> 00:39:05,600
Speaker 2: love Bill Wyman playing bass, being the famous bass and

813
00:39:05,680 --> 00:39:08,040
Speaker 2: just chewing gum and looking into the camera like you know,

814
00:39:08,120 --> 00:39:10,760
Speaker 2: all these visions I have, that's what you see.

815
00:39:11,200 --> 00:39:12,160
Speaker 5: You don't see.

816
00:39:12,560 --> 00:39:14,799
Speaker 2: Oh, here's a guy that's you know, you know done,

817
00:39:15,239 --> 00:39:16,760
Speaker 2: haven't made a great career for himself.

818
00:39:17,360 --> 00:39:18,600
Speaker 5: You can't help it.

819
00:39:18,680 --> 00:39:20,880
Speaker 2: All the movies and all the songs and all the

820
00:39:20,920 --> 00:39:23,160
Speaker 2: concerts you saw, that's what you're looking at. So it

821
00:39:23,719 --> 00:39:27,520
Speaker 2: takes a second, right, And I wanted people to just

822
00:39:27,680 --> 00:39:30,040
Speaker 2: travel with this is how it was, and then eventually

823
00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:32,680
Speaker 2: you get to know them. Then I wanted people to

824
00:39:32,680 --> 00:39:36,800
Speaker 2: see a different side of them. These guys are really

825
00:39:36,840 --> 00:39:41,120
Speaker 2: cool people. I mean they're because they've been there and back, right,

826
00:39:41,960 --> 00:39:44,920
Speaker 2: These are seasoned people. It's a hard life. People just

827
00:39:44,960 --> 00:39:47,040
Speaker 2: only see the fun stuff. They don't know the rough

828
00:39:47,120 --> 00:39:49,960
Speaker 2: part about this business and what it can take out

829
00:39:49,960 --> 00:39:54,200
Speaker 2: of you. So again, I wanted people to see to

830
00:39:54,320 --> 00:39:56,720
Speaker 2: meet me when I'm seventeen learning how to play guitar

831
00:39:56,960 --> 00:40:00,960
Speaker 2: right in my little you know, blue collar town southern California,

832
00:40:01,480 --> 00:40:05,520
Speaker 2: and b flashed forward working with Mick Jagger, and finally

833
00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:10,160
Speaker 2: Keith Richards, my all time favorite rock hero, which you

834
00:40:10,200 --> 00:40:11,520
Speaker 2: know you read in the book the first time I

835
00:40:11,560 --> 00:40:14,160
Speaker 2: read him, is pretty drugy so that's a whole other

836
00:40:14,600 --> 00:40:17,439
Speaker 2: fun story for another thing. But you know, but later

837
00:40:17,480 --> 00:40:19,560
Speaker 2: I remeet him when we signed the whole Rolling Stones,

838
00:40:19,800 --> 00:40:22,240
Speaker 2: and the guy gives me a guitar lesson. Now again,

839
00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:25,719
Speaker 2: I'm flashed back to the kid at seventeen years old, going,

840
00:40:26,600 --> 00:40:30,120
Speaker 2: I don't understand why I can't get this. And I

841
00:40:30,200 --> 00:40:32,719
Speaker 2: meet him, and because he's a guitar player first and

842
00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:36,960
Speaker 2: a rock star second, it's the guitar club, right, I

843
00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:39,200
Speaker 2: meet him. Okay, look, I'm going to gush on you

844
00:40:39,280 --> 00:40:41,399
Speaker 2: for about thirty seconds and then I'll be professional again.

845
00:40:41,440 --> 00:40:42,919
Speaker 2: I said, but you got to understand what you mean

846
00:40:42,920 --> 00:40:44,120
Speaker 2: to me as a kid growing up.

847
00:40:44,920 --> 00:40:45,880
Speaker 5: He took it on in.

848
00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:49,160
Speaker 2: He actually loved the fact that a kid listened to him.

849
00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:51,680
Speaker 2: He said to me, No, this means a lot to me.

850
00:40:51,719 --> 00:40:54,000
Speaker 2: Because I'm a musician. I'm supposed to pass it on.

851
00:40:54,440 --> 00:40:55,280
Speaker 2: That's my job.

852
00:40:55,360 --> 00:40:55,680
Speaker 5: He said.

853
00:40:55,680 --> 00:40:57,280
Speaker 2: Look, I'm proud of the Stones, I'm proud of everything

854
00:40:57,280 --> 00:41:00,920
Speaker 2: we done, but I'm supposed to pass this on to

855
00:41:01,040 --> 00:41:03,800
Speaker 2: players like you and Dave Edmonds. How I got in

856
00:41:03,880 --> 00:41:06,040
Speaker 2: the same you know list of Dave Edmonds. I don't know,

857
00:41:06,080 --> 00:41:08,279
Speaker 2: but I'll take it. So then the guy gives me

858
00:41:08,320 --> 00:41:10,960
Speaker 2: a guitar lesson. Now it turns out that the reason

859
00:41:11,000 --> 00:41:14,120
Speaker 2: my high school band couldn't get the songs exactly right,

860
00:41:14,200 --> 00:41:16,120
Speaker 2: it is because most of the Rolling Stone hits are

861
00:41:16,200 --> 00:41:18,520
Speaker 2: in G tuning. It's an open G tuning. It's a

862
00:41:18,560 --> 00:41:19,280
Speaker 2: blues tuning.

863
00:41:19,920 --> 00:41:20,239
Speaker 5: You know that.

864
00:41:20,280 --> 00:41:21,960
Speaker 2: I explained in the book that he explained to me.

865
00:41:22,440 --> 00:41:24,520
Speaker 2: He said, this is fun. You're gonna see this goes home.

866
00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:26,319
Speaker 2: It's only five strings. You're going to take the top

867
00:41:26,360 --> 00:41:29,440
Speaker 2: string off. You gotta bar these chords. There's only two fingers.

868
00:41:31,520 --> 00:41:34,160
Speaker 2: He was so excited to show me this, and I

869
00:41:34,200 --> 00:41:37,640
Speaker 2: wanted people to see that side of Keith Richards, you know,

870
00:41:37,719 --> 00:41:39,600
Speaker 2: you get the rock star stuff. I want them to

871
00:41:39,640 --> 00:41:42,040
Speaker 2: meet a guy who loves the guitar so much he

872
00:41:42,120 --> 00:41:46,040
Speaker 2: just wants to turn another guitar player onto this. I

873
00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:50,600
Speaker 2: want them to meet a David Gilmour who has a

874
00:41:50,800 --> 00:41:54,800
Speaker 2: thank you you know him and Nick you know invited

875
00:41:54,840 --> 00:41:57,239
Speaker 2: me to play live with them on stage and in

876
00:41:57,320 --> 00:42:00,520
Speaker 2: the London Arena in front of fifteen thousand kids. Buzz

877
00:42:00,560 --> 00:42:03,239
Speaker 2: Who does that? Think about this? Who does that? We

878
00:42:03,280 --> 00:42:04,960
Speaker 2: want to thank you so much for everything you've done

879
00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:07,600
Speaker 2: for us. Come and play in our band. One song live,

880
00:42:08,120 --> 00:42:10,840
Speaker 2: You're gonna play lead, You're gonna have a blast. I

881
00:42:10,880 --> 00:42:14,239
Speaker 2: want people to know that side of these people. You know,

882
00:42:14,280 --> 00:42:17,240
Speaker 2: Mick Jaggers all about the business, but there's a story

883
00:42:17,239 --> 00:42:19,520
Speaker 2: in here where you see his heart. I want people

884
00:42:19,560 --> 00:42:23,600
Speaker 2: to know Mick Jagger's heart. I want them to see

885
00:42:23,640 --> 00:42:29,560
Speaker 2: what I saw beyond you know, you know what you

886
00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:35,680
Speaker 2: normally see, because for me, that's those were the greatest moments.

887
00:42:36,160 --> 00:42:38,480
Speaker 2: You know that that glitz is the glitz. Yeah, they're

888
00:42:38,560 --> 00:42:42,160
Speaker 2: rock stars. Yeah I'm go'm hanging out with the Rolling Stones.

889
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:45,000
Speaker 2: But you know, when you're really working with somebody and

890
00:42:45,040 --> 00:42:46,680
Speaker 2: you're trying to take the hill and you're trying to

891
00:42:46,719 --> 00:42:50,160
Speaker 2: do something special for people, and you're working with them

892
00:42:50,200 --> 00:42:52,880
Speaker 2: shoulders shoulder to try to make stuff happen. At the

893
00:42:52,960 --> 00:42:54,600
Speaker 2: end of the day, it's just guys, you know, looking

894
00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:57,320
Speaker 2: at each other. Are guys and gals look at each other, Hey,

895
00:42:57,600 --> 00:42:59,840
Speaker 2: we together, we made this happen.

896
00:43:00,560 --> 00:43:00,960
Speaker 5: It's real.

897
00:43:01,320 --> 00:43:04,960
Speaker 2: It's very fulfilling, you know, because it's beyond the glitz,

898
00:43:05,000 --> 00:43:06,560
Speaker 2: because it's just this real stuff, the.

899
00:43:06,480 --> 00:43:09,920
Speaker 4: Spirit of what yeah is music is all about. Right,

900
00:43:10,680 --> 00:43:14,920
Speaker 4: He's just so incredibly special and it's the essence and

901
00:43:15,080 --> 00:43:16,600
Speaker 4: core of that.

902
00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:20,280
Speaker 2: That's right, So I hope people would would would take

903
00:43:20,520 --> 00:43:23,200
Speaker 2: that away and you learn, you know, a lot of

904
00:43:23,239 --> 00:43:27,080
Speaker 2: the inside stuff about how how the business worked, and

905
00:43:27,440 --> 00:43:30,160
Speaker 2: probably in the in this day and age, it still

906
00:43:30,680 --> 00:43:33,640
Speaker 2: has remniances of the same kind of people help each

907
00:43:33,680 --> 00:43:35,840
Speaker 2: other out, kind of a kind of a you know, business,

908
00:43:35,880 --> 00:43:38,239
Speaker 2: and it's still the business of music, so not as

909
00:43:38,280 --> 00:43:41,759
Speaker 2: magical as it was seventies, eighties and nineties, which is

910
00:43:42,000 --> 00:43:44,920
Speaker 2: why I really I had to capture it because as

911
00:43:44,960 --> 00:43:49,760
Speaker 2: you read, forget the artist, the managers, they're more eccentric

912
00:43:49,840 --> 00:43:51,840
Speaker 2: than the artists. And you're talking about banana brains. I

913
00:43:51,840 --> 00:43:55,960
Speaker 2: mean this, you know herby Herbert making everybody learn Yiddish

914
00:43:56,000 --> 00:43:58,360
Speaker 2: if you want to talk to him, he's not even Jewish.

915
00:43:58,920 --> 00:44:01,399
Speaker 2: I mean, this is real. This is rock and roll

916
00:44:01,440 --> 00:44:05,120
Speaker 2: business in nineteen eighty five. If you you don't want

917
00:44:05,120 --> 00:44:08,440
Speaker 2: to talk to us, you know, they said Yiddish for dummies,

918
00:44:08,480 --> 00:44:10,440
Speaker 2: books to the whole industry. If you want to talk

919
00:44:10,480 --> 00:44:13,360
Speaker 2: to me and their famous road manager Pat Morrow, Bubba. Right,

920
00:44:13,400 --> 00:44:14,880
Speaker 2: if you want to talk to me or Bubba, you

921
00:44:14,960 --> 00:44:18,280
Speaker 2: need to learn a couple of lines of Yiddish, all right,

922
00:44:17,880 --> 00:44:20,960
Speaker 2: So I will never forget this it's a Thursday. I

923
00:44:20,960 --> 00:44:24,279
Speaker 2: can't remember what Journeys Herby Herbert, Yeah, Journey, Herbie Herberts.

924
00:44:24,040 --> 00:44:24,680
Speaker 5: Journey's manager.

925
00:44:24,680 --> 00:44:27,840
Speaker 2: Okay, Journey's huge, but the biggest bands in the world.

926
00:44:28,160 --> 00:44:29,879
Speaker 2: I can't remember which one it was. We're selling fifty

927
00:44:29,960 --> 00:44:32,760
Speaker 2: thousand albums a week. Right, we have to pick a single.

928
00:44:32,800 --> 00:44:35,480
Speaker 2: It's timely. I remember it was a Thursday. We had

929
00:44:35,520 --> 00:44:37,359
Speaker 2: to get it out. I had some ideas. He had

930
00:44:37,360 --> 00:44:39,200
Speaker 2: some ideas. We have to pick the next single, life

931
00:44:39,239 --> 00:44:41,120
Speaker 2: to tell the rock stations. We have to put it

932
00:44:41,120 --> 00:44:44,239
Speaker 2: in production for top forty stations. And I'd got this book,

933
00:44:44,239 --> 00:44:45,960
Speaker 2: which I thought was cute, right, I got the Yiddish

934
00:44:45,960 --> 00:44:48,600
Speaker 2: for Dummy's book. It is great, you know, Herbie Herbert

935
00:44:48,640 --> 00:44:51,040
Speaker 2: line one, Hey, Herbie, how you doing Volschmas?

936
00:44:51,080 --> 00:44:51,279
Speaker 1: Two?

937
00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:54,399
Speaker 2: What he's how are you and Yiddish? You start something

938
00:44:54,440 --> 00:44:56,759
Speaker 2: in Yiddish. I'm like, Herbie, I got the book. It's great,

939
00:44:56,960 --> 00:44:58,279
Speaker 2: you know, but you and I are about to have

940
00:44:58,440 --> 00:45:00,760
Speaker 2: like a really important conversation history clock in the afternoon

941
00:45:00,760 --> 00:45:02,160
Speaker 2: here in New York. We got to decide now the

942
00:45:02,239 --> 00:45:05,440
Speaker 2: new Journey single Buzz. He doesn't stop talking Yiddish for

943
00:45:05,480 --> 00:45:08,960
Speaker 2: two minutes. Finally he stops. He goes, rap, what the

944
00:45:08,960 --> 00:45:10,840
Speaker 2: fuck a nice Jewish boy like you can't learn a

945
00:45:10,840 --> 00:45:14,319
Speaker 2: little Yiddish. I'm like Herbie, Yeah, I get it, but

946
00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:18,800
Speaker 2: this is a timely conversation. I know, learn your Yiddish

947
00:45:18,840 --> 00:45:22,000
Speaker 2: and call me back. Click buzz.

948
00:45:22,360 --> 00:45:23,040
Speaker 1: This is rock.

949
00:45:23,160 --> 00:45:25,399
Speaker 2: This is in order for me to get the Journey single.

950
00:45:25,480 --> 00:45:27,120
Speaker 1: This is real stuff. I want people to know. This

951
00:45:27,160 --> 00:45:28,879
Speaker 1: is not bullshit. In order for me to.

952
00:45:28,800 --> 00:45:31,839
Speaker 2: Get the next Journey single out, I have to get go,

953
00:45:31,920 --> 00:45:34,759
Speaker 2: find the Yiddish book, learn two lines of Yiddish, call

954
00:45:34,840 --> 00:45:37,680
Speaker 2: him back, read the Yiddish, and then he'll talk to

955
00:45:37,719 --> 00:45:40,279
Speaker 2: me and we'll get the Journey single out. You can't

956
00:45:40,280 --> 00:45:42,239
Speaker 2: make this shit up, right, that's the tip of the

957
00:45:42,239 --> 00:45:45,200
Speaker 2: iceberg of the stuff that's in this book. It's it's nuts,

958
00:45:45,600 --> 00:45:48,240
Speaker 2: it's you know, it's this is the it's a business

959
00:45:48,280 --> 00:45:51,719
Speaker 2: where there's bowling in the hallways, water, gun fights, a

960
00:45:51,760 --> 00:45:56,160
Speaker 2: business meeting to discuss why you know, the LA branch

961
00:45:56,160 --> 00:45:59,000
Speaker 2: wouldn't be allowed to set their table on fire anymore

962
00:45:59,360 --> 00:46:02,960
Speaker 2: at former CBS Records conventions, right because that was our

963
00:46:02,960 --> 00:46:05,320
Speaker 2: big thing. You know, we threw roles in the knives

964
00:46:05,320 --> 00:46:08,080
Speaker 2: and forts escalated into setting our table on fire in

965
00:46:08,160 --> 00:46:12,960
Speaker 2: a ballroom in these hotel you know shows that we'd

966
00:46:12,960 --> 00:46:15,000
Speaker 2: have dinner shows at night and the bands would play

967
00:46:15,280 --> 00:46:17,279
Speaker 2: and we were the rowdy table. So we ended every

968
00:46:17,400 --> 00:46:19,600
Speaker 2: night by setting our table on fire. We did this

969
00:46:19,600 --> 00:46:21,279
Speaker 2: two years in a row. Somebody in New York finally

970
00:46:21,280 --> 00:46:24,000
Speaker 2: figured out this is not a good idea, right these

971
00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:25,880
Speaker 2: people are setting a table on fire in a ballroom,

972
00:46:25,960 --> 00:46:27,120
Speaker 2: in a hotel room.

973
00:46:27,160 --> 00:46:27,919
Speaker 1: There's a past.

974
00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:30,279
Speaker 2: It's a business meeting, which going with a business meaning

975
00:46:30,440 --> 00:46:32,640
Speaker 2: to discuss this fact why we can no longer set

976
00:46:32,680 --> 00:46:36,560
Speaker 2: our table on fire at former CBS you know, you know,

977
00:46:36,680 --> 00:46:41,120
Speaker 2: at the next CBS record conventions, and fascinatingly, half the

978
00:46:41,160 --> 00:46:43,160
Speaker 2: staff rebelled and wanted to know why.

979
00:46:43,000 --> 00:46:46,560
Speaker 1: Not this is? This is? This is what this is?

980
00:46:46,800 --> 00:46:48,719
Speaker 2: So I wanted to capture all of this because no

981
00:46:48,760 --> 00:46:51,279
Speaker 2: one was going to believe it, you know, And one

982
00:46:51,320 --> 00:46:54,480
Speaker 2: day when I'm not here anymore, hopefully this is the

983
00:46:54,520 --> 00:46:57,120
Speaker 2: bucket's still around and you can read all about it

984
00:46:57,360 --> 00:46:59,200
Speaker 2: because you can't believe it, you know.

985
00:47:00,200 --> 00:47:06,160
Speaker 4: I want to in the time we have get people

986
00:47:06,200 --> 00:47:09,759
Speaker 4: to go nuts over what we alluded to. It's the

987
00:47:09,840 --> 00:47:14,520
Speaker 4: Bob Dylan aspect, which I learned a lot more than

988
00:47:14,520 --> 00:47:18,439
Speaker 4: I even knew in terms of your connection with him

989
00:47:18,640 --> 00:47:21,160
Speaker 4: over the years. I mean I knew obviously you worked

990
00:47:21,360 --> 00:47:23,680
Speaker 4: with him, but I kind of always felt like.

991
00:47:24,080 --> 00:47:25,840
Speaker 1: Well, you know, he's Bob.

992
00:47:25,880 --> 00:47:29,439
Speaker 4: He doesn't really work with anybody on anything, but talk

993
00:47:29,480 --> 00:47:31,080
Speaker 4: about that relationship and.

994
00:47:31,560 --> 00:47:35,879
Speaker 2: He he does and he doesn't. I mean Bob first

995
00:47:35,880 --> 00:47:38,680
Speaker 2: of all. For me, the two biggest artists that mean

996
00:47:39,120 --> 00:47:41,600
Speaker 2: more to me than anything growing up are Bob Dylan

997
00:47:41,840 --> 00:47:45,280
Speaker 2: and Keith Richards, Right, So it's Keith and the Stones,

998
00:47:45,280 --> 00:47:47,480
Speaker 2: and Bob Dylan changed my life as he did a

999
00:47:47,480 --> 00:47:49,880
Speaker 2: lot of our lives in the sixties. I mean, he

1000
00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:53,279
Speaker 2: changed the culture. His music is allowing me as a

1001
00:47:53,280 --> 00:47:55,440
Speaker 2: young man, going, wait a minute, you don't have to

1002
00:47:55,520 --> 00:47:57,480
Speaker 2: live in this square world anymore. Things are going to

1003
00:47:57,600 --> 00:47:59,160
Speaker 2: change and you can be a part of this change

1004
00:47:59,160 --> 00:48:01,480
Speaker 2: and you can think different and have new ideas on

1005
00:48:01,520 --> 00:48:03,520
Speaker 2: how to live life and et cetera.

1006
00:48:03,360 --> 00:48:03,760
Speaker 5: Et cetera.

1007
00:48:03,960 --> 00:48:07,880
Speaker 2: So for me, helping him and having a relationship with

1008
00:48:08,000 --> 00:48:11,400
Speaker 2: him was huge, and it took me a few meetings

1009
00:48:11,400 --> 00:48:13,719
Speaker 2: to get used to it, cause again, you could talk

1010
00:48:13,760 --> 00:48:15,680
Speaker 2: to Bob for thirty seconds and then you realize who

1011
00:48:15,680 --> 00:48:18,520
Speaker 2: you're talking to, and you know and each can't help,

1012
00:48:18,560 --> 00:48:20,200
Speaker 2: but you shake your head, you go just Bob Dylan.

1013
00:48:21,719 --> 00:48:26,600
Speaker 2: But he's very much the artist artist. He's like Picasto.

1014
00:48:26,640 --> 00:48:29,560
Speaker 2: He just paints. He doesn't think about promotion, he doesn't

1015
00:48:29,560 --> 00:48:33,439
Speaker 2: think about marketing. His mind isn't there. So he would

1016
00:48:33,440 --> 00:48:35,279
Speaker 2: come up with some ideas that are funny to me,

1017
00:48:35,480 --> 00:48:38,080
Speaker 2: but to him there you know, he doesn't know because

1018
00:48:38,120 --> 00:48:42,920
Speaker 2: he doesn't know, right. It's like, imagine the universe. Okay,

1019
00:48:42,920 --> 00:48:45,960
Speaker 2: there's the Sun and we're the planets, and we fly

1020
00:48:46,040 --> 00:48:49,120
Speaker 2: around the Sun, so we have a perspective of the universe.

1021
00:48:49,160 --> 00:48:51,440
Speaker 2: We're like, oh, there's planets behind us, there's planets in

1022
00:48:51,440 --> 00:48:54,279
Speaker 2: front of us, and there's the sun. Okay, But Bob

1023
00:48:54,320 --> 00:48:58,120
Speaker 2: Dylan's the sun, right. He has no perspective. He's the sun, right,

1024
00:48:58,160 --> 00:49:01,960
Speaker 2: So he doesn't know about all this stuff. So I

1025
00:49:02,000 --> 00:49:05,120
Speaker 2: would every time you have an album out, I'd call

1026
00:49:05,200 --> 00:49:07,439
Speaker 2: him and say, look, you know, I know you don't

1027
00:49:07,440 --> 00:49:10,200
Speaker 2: like to promote yourtuff. Somebody, here's twenty ideas, right, And

1028
00:49:10,640 --> 00:49:14,440
Speaker 2: I remember, you know Shot of Love. I'd heard the

1029
00:49:14,440 --> 00:49:16,040
Speaker 2: album it was great, and I called him in New

1030
00:49:16,120 --> 00:49:18,040
Speaker 2: York and I said, Okay, Bob, this this is gonna

1031
00:49:18,040 --> 00:49:19,919
Speaker 2: be great. We're going to do great with this album.

1032
00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:24,719
Speaker 2: Here's twenty ideas. You know, I'm listening to ideas. Nah

1033
00:49:25,160 --> 00:49:28,080
Speaker 2: nah nah, Now I'm not going to do that.

1034
00:49:28,160 --> 00:49:28,319
Speaker 3: Man.

1035
00:49:28,680 --> 00:49:32,520
Speaker 2: You know it's because he told me. I said, okay, look,

1036
00:49:32,960 --> 00:49:35,799
Speaker 2: how's this. We don't promote you at all. You just

1037
00:49:35,920 --> 00:49:38,600
Speaker 2: show up on Scott Muni's shows. You know, Scott was

1038
00:49:38,640 --> 00:49:41,160
Speaker 2: a major league legend in you know, New York on

1039
00:49:41,239 --> 00:49:43,000
Speaker 2: w onew You're just gonna show up a Scott's show.

1040
00:49:43,160 --> 00:49:45,440
Speaker 2: John Lennon did it. He just showed up. It was brilliant.

1041
00:49:45,760 --> 00:49:46,640
Speaker 1: You'll just show up.

1042
00:49:47,880 --> 00:49:50,759
Speaker 2: Oh man, I don't like to push my music that way,

1043
00:49:52,120 --> 00:49:55,600
Speaker 2: which I respected, like he didn't. He wants the music

1044
00:49:55,600 --> 00:49:57,920
Speaker 2: to do the talking. He doesn't want to quote unquote

1045
00:49:58,040 --> 00:50:01,640
Speaker 2: promote it. Just it's just not him, man. It says

1046
00:50:01,480 --> 00:50:03,719
Speaker 2: he just wants to paint, right, It's like, I just

1047
00:50:03,760 --> 00:50:04,680
Speaker 2: want to make this music.

1048
00:50:05,120 --> 00:50:07,160
Speaker 5: And eventually got him to do you read about the book.

1049
00:50:07,160 --> 00:50:09,719
Speaker 2: I eventually you know, got him to do you know,

1050
00:50:09,760 --> 00:50:13,480
Speaker 2: an interview, which was a whole, you know, unworldly experience.

1051
00:50:14,520 --> 00:50:15,320
Speaker 5: But he's.

1052
00:50:17,120 --> 00:50:23,080
Speaker 2: Very mercurial and but he'll listen. But it would be

1053
00:50:23,200 --> 00:50:24,840
Speaker 2: like we go out to dinner and it's like, okay,

1054
00:50:25,160 --> 00:50:27,640
Speaker 2: we have to talk about this video. No, man, I

1055
00:50:27,680 --> 00:50:30,440
Speaker 2: just got back from Russia. They gave me an award,

1056
00:50:30,800 --> 00:50:33,719
Speaker 2: which Russian poets like you know, you know Pushkins. This

1057
00:50:33,719 --> 00:50:35,600
Speaker 2: is a big deal with poetry in Russia's a big deal.

1058
00:50:36,200 --> 00:50:37,800
Speaker 2: He goes, they just they just gave me an award.

1059
00:50:37,800 --> 00:50:40,400
Speaker 2: I was thrilled that they gave me an award in

1060
00:50:40,440 --> 00:50:43,000
Speaker 2: Russia for my poetry. He goes, Rap, you gotta start

1061
00:50:43,000 --> 00:50:45,520
Speaker 2: reading these Russian Poets's got a list, right, I said, Bob,

1062
00:50:45,560 --> 00:50:48,080
Speaker 2: you and I have to talk about the video. No, no, no, man,

1063
00:50:48,080 --> 00:50:49,960
Speaker 2: I'll talk about the video later. You need to get

1064
00:50:50,000 --> 00:50:52,560
Speaker 2: into these Russian poets. So these are the kind of

1065
00:50:52,560 --> 00:50:55,319
Speaker 2: conversations you could have with him. And one day he

1066
00:50:55,320 --> 00:50:57,640
Speaker 2: came in. We were just talking about being dads, right.

1067
00:50:57,719 --> 00:50:58,919
Speaker 2: I was like, yeah, I wrote in the book.

1068
00:50:58,960 --> 00:50:59,239
Speaker 5: I was like.

1069
00:50:59,400 --> 00:51:01,719
Speaker 2: It was the most fan conversation because I was like, Bob,

1070
00:51:01,760 --> 00:51:03,839
Speaker 2: you know, I've got this one son, I got another

1071
00:51:03,880 --> 00:51:05,560
Speaker 2: on the way. What am I going to tell him?

1072
00:51:05,560 --> 00:51:08,160
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, the sixties are kind of wild

1073
00:51:08,280 --> 00:51:11,359
Speaker 2: in the seventies and you know, And he looked at

1074
00:51:11,360 --> 00:51:13,840
Speaker 2: me and he said, well, he goes, you know what

1075
00:51:14,160 --> 00:51:16,040
Speaker 2: you know it's Bob del Ways. Well you have a choice,

1076
00:51:16,160 --> 00:51:20,120
Speaker 2: you know, he said, My life is with drugs, the women.

1077
00:51:20,520 --> 00:51:23,959
Speaker 2: It's all in the press. I'm busted, you know, he said.

1078
00:51:23,960 --> 00:51:25,160
Speaker 2: But you you know.

1079
00:51:25,239 --> 00:51:27,920
Speaker 1: He's like rap. You have a choice.

1080
00:51:27,960 --> 00:51:30,000
Speaker 2: Tell him some things. You don't have to tell him

1081
00:51:30,120 --> 00:51:34,480
Speaker 2: everything but me, you know, I'm I'm busted right up

1082
00:51:34,520 --> 00:51:38,279
Speaker 2: by a whole lives in the press. And he was

1083
00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:40,040
Speaker 2: just talking to me as a guy. Hey, look, this

1084
00:51:40,239 --> 00:51:43,360
Speaker 2: was my life. I didn't have a choice. You have

1085
00:51:43,440 --> 00:51:46,319
Speaker 2: a choice. So now we're talking. You know, he's given

1086
00:51:46,360 --> 00:51:48,120
Speaker 2: me advice, right, I mean, so we're just guys, and

1087
00:51:48,239 --> 00:51:49,560
Speaker 2: now we're not He's not Bob Dylan.

1088
00:51:50,040 --> 00:51:50,239
Speaker 3: You know.

1089
00:51:50,360 --> 00:51:52,120
Speaker 2: He told me the most amazing thing. He said, you

1090
00:51:52,120 --> 00:51:54,520
Speaker 2: know the problem with me is when people meet me,

1091
00:51:54,520 --> 00:51:57,200
Speaker 2: they think they're meeting the lyrics. And that's exactly what

1092
00:51:57,239 --> 00:51:59,080
Speaker 2: happened to me when I first met him, because that's

1093
00:51:59,080 --> 00:52:02,600
Speaker 2: all we know. You know, the lyrics, right, you look

1094
00:52:02,600 --> 00:52:05,080
Speaker 2: at this guy and you think about all these lyrics.

1095
00:52:05,400 --> 00:52:07,239
Speaker 2: He said, Look, I know how heavy the songs are.

1096
00:52:07,320 --> 00:52:10,800
Speaker 2: I wrote them, but those are songs. I'm a songwriter.

1097
00:52:10,960 --> 00:52:13,960
Speaker 2: But there's me, the human being me, I'm me. Those

1098
00:52:14,000 --> 00:52:17,480
Speaker 2: are the songs. There's a difference, and people can't making

1099
00:52:17,520 --> 00:52:22,920
Speaker 2: the difference, separating, separating. When Jerry Garcia passed away and

1100
00:52:22,960 --> 00:52:25,600
Speaker 2: there was a funeral and Bob went, and the very

1101
00:52:25,640 --> 00:52:29,080
Speaker 2: famous promoter, John sure in Town went, they're walking away

1102
00:52:29,080 --> 00:52:31,000
Speaker 2: from the funeral and Garcia went through the whole thing,

1103
00:52:31,040 --> 00:52:33,120
Speaker 2: not as bad as Bob, but you know, Garcia's God,

1104
00:52:33,160 --> 00:52:35,359
Speaker 2: and you know he was revered. And the fans would

1105
00:52:35,400 --> 00:52:40,319
Speaker 2: just think they're walking out of the funeral, and Bob

1106
00:52:40,360 --> 00:52:42,120
Speaker 2: looks at John Sharon says, you want to know something,

1107
00:52:42,680 --> 00:52:46,120
Speaker 2: the guy that's lying in that coffin is the only

1108
00:52:46,200 --> 00:52:47,560
Speaker 2: person that knows.

1109
00:52:47,640 --> 00:52:53,280
Speaker 5: What it feels like to be me. WHOA right? WHOA right?

1110
00:52:53,360 --> 00:52:55,360
Speaker 2: Because Bob has to deal with that every day of

1111
00:52:55,400 --> 00:52:57,720
Speaker 2: his life because he gets approached in odd ways.

1112
00:52:58,680 --> 00:53:02,600
Speaker 5: He can't help it. He's Bob Dylan. You know.

1113
00:53:02,640 --> 00:53:03,120
Speaker 1: Good luck?

1114
00:53:03,239 --> 00:53:04,319
Speaker 5: All right? That's how it is.

1115
00:53:04,760 --> 00:53:08,920
Speaker 4: Man. Well, the book is fabulous. It takes you inside

1116
00:53:09,400 --> 00:53:15,560
Speaker 4: your life but also inside the insecurities of artists, the

1117
00:53:15,719 --> 00:53:20,160
Speaker 4: creative processes. You did a brilliant job with it, and

1118
00:53:21,000 --> 00:53:25,000
Speaker 4: I just love talking to you about stuff that I

1119
00:53:25,080 --> 00:53:27,719
Speaker 4: knew and stuff that I didn't know, which is so

1120
00:53:27,880 --> 00:53:30,520
Speaker 4: captured in your book. Congratulations on it.

1121
00:53:31,120 --> 00:53:33,359
Speaker 2: I really appreciate it. First of all, it's easy talking

1122
00:53:33,400 --> 00:53:35,879
Speaker 2: to you. Were old friends, so you know. But I'm

1123
00:53:35,880 --> 00:53:37,360
Speaker 2: a promotion man, so I'm going to mention the.

1124
00:53:37,400 --> 00:53:37,919
Speaker 5: Name of them.

1125
00:53:39,440 --> 00:53:43,279
Speaker 2: I better Okay, it's called Gliders Over Hollywood, which if

1126
00:53:43,280 --> 00:53:44,920
Speaker 2: you read the book you'll find out why it's called

1127
00:53:44,920 --> 00:53:49,080
Speaker 2: Glider's Over Hollywood. Just think of Boston Wood Gliders Glider's

1128
00:53:49,080 --> 00:53:52,280
Speaker 2: Over Hollywood. It's easy, peasy you and go on Amazon,

1129
00:53:52,320 --> 00:53:55,360
Speaker 2: Barnes and Noble. Just punch it in Glider's Over Hollywood.

1130
00:53:55,400 --> 00:53:57,279
Speaker 2: It'll show up if you have a local bookstore and

1131
00:53:57,280 --> 00:53:59,560
Speaker 2: you want to support them. If they don't have it,

1132
00:53:58,960 --> 00:54:00,879
Speaker 2: they it You've gotten for you.

1133
00:54:00,680 --> 00:54:01,759
Speaker 5: You'll love it.

1134
00:54:02,000 --> 00:54:05,160
Speaker 4: And I love talking to your rap I will leave

1135
00:54:05,200 --> 00:54:06,200
Speaker 4: you on one thought.

1136
00:54:06,239 --> 00:54:07,160
Speaker 5: I have one.

1137
00:54:07,000 --> 00:54:11,480
Speaker 4: Regret in my music radio career, and it was the

1138
00:54:11,560 --> 00:54:15,480
Speaker 4: fact that when Bob Dylan said anybody want to do

1139
00:54:15,520 --> 00:54:20,800
Speaker 4: a shadow whiskey, and I and others backed off because

1140
00:54:20,840 --> 00:54:22,560
Speaker 4: we were like, we can't do this. This is the

1141
00:54:22,640 --> 00:54:25,440
Speaker 4: voice of a generation and I'll know I'll never have

1142
00:54:25,480 --> 00:54:26,240
Speaker 4: that chance again.

1143
00:54:26,280 --> 00:54:29,080
Speaker 5: But anyway, and he meant it, by the way, this

1144
00:54:29,160 --> 00:54:32,120
Speaker 5: is Bob just being Bob. Right, were petrified.

1145
00:54:32,200 --> 00:54:35,640
Speaker 4: Yeah, I understood, but Rapper, so great to see you.

1146
00:54:35,800 --> 00:54:38,360
Speaker 4: Thanks for being on Taking a Walk, Thanks for having me,

1147
00:54:38,400 --> 00:54:39,440
Speaker 4: and congratulations.

1148
00:54:39,520 --> 00:54:40,040
Speaker 5: Thanks again.

1149
00:54:41,560 --> 00:54:44,040
Speaker 3: Thanks for listening to this episode of the Taking a

1150
00:54:44,080 --> 00:54:47,960
Speaker 3: Walk podcast. Share this and other episodes with your friends

1151
00:54:48,040 --> 00:54:51,560
Speaker 3: and follow us so you never miss an episode. Taking

1152
00:54:51,560 --> 00:54:55,480
Speaker 3: a Walk is available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

1153
00:54:55,680 --> 00:55:00,160
Speaker 3: and wherever you get your podcasts.