WEBVTT - Dave Weigel & Jocelyn Benson 0:00:00.680 --> 0:00:04.200 Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics, 0:00:04.400 --> 0:00:07.160 where we discussed the top political headlines with some of 0:00:07.200 --> 0:00:12.080 today's best minds, and Governor JB. Pritzker says, you come 0:00:12.119 --> 0:00:15.120 for my people, you come through me. We have such 0:00:15.160 --> 0:00:19.000 a great show for you today. Semaphore's Dave Weigel tells 0:00:19.079 --> 0:00:22.239 us what he's found in his examination of the twenty 0:00:22.320 --> 0:00:25.880 twenty four election. Then we'll talk to Michigan Secretary of 0:00:25.920 --> 0:00:29.600 State Jocelyn Benson how about how her state will fight 0:00:29.720 --> 0:00:33.280 back against Trump's next term. But first the news. 0:00:33.280 --> 0:00:35.239 By why don't you tell us where the House is 0:00:35.240 --> 0:00:36.640 at in the election? Right now? 0:00:36.920 --> 0:00:40.120 Right now, Democrats have two hundred and one seats and 0:00:40.200 --> 0:00:44.159 Republicans have two hundred and twelve seats. They flipped six seats, 0:00:44.159 --> 0:00:48.360 Democrats flip five seats, so there's at this point Republicans 0:00:48.360 --> 0:00:51.680 have a one seat net gain. There are still thirteen 0:00:51.760 --> 0:00:56.200 uncalled races to watch that are just not finished being counted. 0:00:56.320 --> 0:01:00.440 Some will go to recount, and so if Democrats can 0:01:00.720 --> 0:01:04.640 net seventeen of those thirteen seats, they will have the majority. 0:01:04.920 --> 0:01:08.280 That seems unlikely since that math is not mathing, but 0:01:08.560 --> 0:01:11.840 it will be a very slim majority. That Republicans will 0:01:11.880 --> 0:01:15.000 have in the House. So we'll see what happens, but 0:01:15.000 --> 0:01:17.960 it certainly Democrats will pick up a few seats, probably 0:01:18.080 --> 0:01:23.040 main second district, Washington's third district, a couple of seats 0:01:23.040 --> 0:01:24.840 will be picked up, so it will end up being 0:01:24.959 --> 0:01:27.360 very close. There's still a bunch of Senate seats that 0:01:27.480 --> 0:01:32.160 aren't caught, so there's one seat Nevada. Rosen is going 0:01:32.240 --> 0:01:36.960 to win Arizona. Ruben seems like he has it. In Pennsylvania. 0:01:37.400 --> 0:01:42.399 There's a chance because it's point because the Republicans leading 0:01:42.440 --> 0:01:45.319 by point five, that there might be a recount, and 0:01:45.440 --> 0:01:50.320 there's a possibility that McCormick might end up. If they 0:01:50.360 --> 0:01:54.280 recount and they find enough ballots, it's possible that the 0:01:54.400 --> 0:01:55.960 case will keep his seat. 0:01:56.280 --> 0:01:59.000 Smile. This is what I'm coing the mask off section. 0:01:59.120 --> 0:02:01.880 It seems the Republican were so giddy about Trump's when 0:02:02.120 --> 0:02:05.000 that they're already showing exactly what many of us knew. 0:02:05.040 --> 0:02:08.440 They were already. But these attacks on women are really 0:02:08.639 --> 0:02:10.160 something else. What are you seeing here? 0:02:10.440 --> 0:02:15.760 White supremacist Nick Flint has said your body, my choice forever. 0:02:16.240 --> 0:02:19.400 He posted that before the race. We saw a text 0:02:19.520 --> 0:02:23.360 campaign of obvious hate crimes, issuing a threat to students 0:02:23.360 --> 0:02:26.040 of color across the nation, claiming they had been selected 0:02:26.080 --> 0:02:32.280 to be slaves and appear at plantations. Pretty horrendous, misogynistic 0:02:32.680 --> 0:02:37.200 claims of you know, wanting to do horrible things to women. 0:02:37.720 --> 0:02:41.160 It's really not surprising, but it's this is what trump 0:02:41.240 --> 0:02:41.800 Ism does. 0:02:42.120 --> 0:02:45.000 And then of course we have all the right wing 0:02:45.080 --> 0:02:48.120 influencers who are taking their mask off about Project twenty 0:02:48.160 --> 0:02:49.880 twenty five and other things. What are you seeing here? 0:02:50.200 --> 0:02:52.959 So you'll remember that Trump said he had knew nothing 0:02:53.000 --> 0:02:56.040 about Project twenty twenty five and that Project twenty twenty 0:02:56.080 --> 0:02:59.240 five was not at all connected to him. So basically, 0:03:00.040 --> 0:03:02.960 mediately after Trump onon, Matt Walsh She's a right wing 0:03:03.040 --> 0:03:07.160 podcast host wrote on X now that the election is over, 0:03:07.200 --> 0:03:09.560 I think we can finally say that, yeah, actually Project 0:03:09.600 --> 0:03:12.119 twenty twenty five is the agenda. L ol. 0:03:12.480 --> 0:03:14.760 Matt waalsherre. You will all be know from making a 0:03:14.840 --> 0:03:18.120 documentary reason called Am I Racist? Where he shows how 0:03:18.240 --> 0:03:18.920 racist he is. 0:03:19.440 --> 0:03:24.200 Ex Trump White has advisor Steve Bannon praised Walsh and 0:03:24.240 --> 0:03:27.880 amplified his post during his war Room podcast Wednesday, telling 0:03:27.919 --> 0:03:31.600 his staff to promote Walsh's comments on social media. Right 0:03:31.639 --> 0:03:35.880 wing influencer Bennie Johnson also posted an on X it 0:03:35.920 --> 0:03:38.840 is my honor to inform you that Project twenty twenty 0:03:38.880 --> 0:03:40.440 five was real the whole time. 0:03:40.480 --> 0:03:44.200 He wrote, you may know Betty Johnson from the Justice Department, 0:03:44.320 --> 0:03:47.080 saying he was a recipient of Russian disinformation money. 0:03:47.160 --> 0:03:49.760 That's right, he got a lot of money from Russia 0:03:49.880 --> 0:03:54.520 to spread disinformation. Bo French, a Texas GOP official who 0:03:54.520 --> 0:03:58.720 came under fire recently for using slurs to describe gay 0:03:58.800 --> 0:04:03.040 people and people at this abilities, wrote on X Wednesday, 0:04:03.120 --> 0:04:05.160 so we can admit now that we're going to implement 0:04:05.200 --> 0:04:08.119 Project twenty twenty five. So there you go. They'll say 0:04:08.120 --> 0:04:10.320 they were kidding, but they always say they were kidding. 0:04:10.440 --> 0:04:13.000 But we know the truth. And you can see the 0:04:13.040 --> 0:04:16.440 documentary we did on Project twenty twenty five. It's on YouTube. 0:04:16.560 --> 0:04:20.520 Just google it. It's I think a very worthwhile use 0:04:20.520 --> 0:04:21.720 of your time, MILLI. 0:04:21.920 --> 0:04:24.640 So we have the first hint of at least what 0:04:24.720 --> 0:04:27.279 we'll start as a romance. Elon Musk was on a 0:04:27.320 --> 0:04:30.360 call with mister Trump and Zelenski today. What do you 0:04:30.400 --> 0:04:30.840 see here? 0:04:31.200 --> 0:04:36.480 Donald Trump won the presidency on Tuesday, and almost immediately 0:04:37.080 --> 0:04:41.080 the richest people sixty four billion dollar gain for the 0:04:41.080 --> 0:04:45.840 world's ten richest people, so Elon Musk, Jeff Bezos, Larry 0:04:45.880 --> 0:04:49.960 Allison all among the top gainers. US stock surge dollar 0:04:50.040 --> 0:04:53.960 gained on US election result. The net worth, led by 0:04:54.320 --> 0:04:58.240 Tesla's CEO, the world's wealthiest person, surged to sixty three 0:04:58.320 --> 0:05:02.240 point five billion dollars on Wednday Day. Musk added twenty 0:05:02.279 --> 0:05:06.760 six point five billion to his pot. Amazon's Jeff Bezos 0:05:06.839 --> 0:05:10.560 Oracles Larry Ellison were all among the top gainers. It's 0:05:10.600 --> 0:05:16.680 the biggest increase since Bloomberg's Wealth Index began in twenty twelve. Look, 0:05:16.920 --> 0:05:18.960 Trump is going to pick the winners and losers in 0:05:19.040 --> 0:05:23.200 this economy, and he's going to make big tax cuts 0:05:23.200 --> 0:05:27.480 for very wealthy people. And I think that these people 0:05:27.520 --> 0:05:32.000 who decided to support Trump made a bet that he 0:05:33.040 --> 0:05:36.960 would deliver for them, and he already has. So it's 0:05:37.000 --> 0:05:40.280 pretty grim. Sometimes I want to just talk for a 0:05:40.360 --> 0:05:43.480 minute to our listeners about sort of where I am 0:05:43.600 --> 0:05:46.920 right now and just be honest. This was not the 0:05:46.960 --> 0:05:49.520 result I've talked about a little bit, and I really 0:05:49.520 --> 0:05:51.640 did think Harris was going to win, and I really 0:05:51.920 --> 0:05:56.560 was quite devastated and sad for what happened, but I 0:05:56.640 --> 0:05:59.520 want to just point out that it was really, you know, 0:05:59.640 --> 0:06:02.760 a couple one hundred thousand votes in a few swing 0:06:02.800 --> 0:06:05.960 states that did this for him, and a lot of 0:06:06.040 --> 0:06:09.520 us in this country don't agree with Trump or trump Ism, 0:06:09.920 --> 0:06:13.159 and at this moment, really the goal has to be 0:06:13.360 --> 0:06:16.599 to protect institutions, to protect the rule of law, to 0:06:16.760 --> 0:06:20.600 make sure that we continue to bring sunlight to the 0:06:20.640 --> 0:06:25.600 stuff that people aren't covering. Trump has a bold and 0:06:26.320 --> 0:06:30.080 deeply unpopular agenda he's going to try to implement, and 0:06:30.760 --> 0:06:34.640 the only way that it can be gummed up is 0:06:34.760 --> 0:06:39.040 by sunlight, is by talking about it, is by covering it. 0:06:39.160 --> 0:06:41.480 So as much as there's a feeling like we all 0:06:41.480 --> 0:06:43.800 want to just turn off the news, and maybe we 0:06:43.839 --> 0:06:46.240 should take a week or two to do that, but 0:06:47.040 --> 0:06:49.840 this is going to require vigilance on all of our 0:06:49.920 --> 0:06:53.000 parts in order to make sure that we do have 0:06:53.040 --> 0:06:55.960 elections in two years and we do have a functioning 0:06:56.000 --> 0:06:58.960 democracy and we do protect the rule of law. So 0:06:59.320 --> 0:07:02.800 I think every one of us, including myself, needs to 0:07:03.000 --> 0:07:06.400 watch some Netflix and eat some cookies. I'm planning on 0:07:06.440 --> 0:07:09.760 that later, But I feel very heartbroken for like a 0:07:09.800 --> 0:07:12.760 lot of young women in this country, But I feel 0:07:12.800 --> 0:07:16.960 more than ever that the importance is that we continue 0:07:17.080 --> 0:07:20.800 to not engage in false equivalencies, really give you the 0:07:20.840 --> 0:07:24.320 news as you needed, and try to do our best 0:07:24.360 --> 0:07:28.040 and be transparent with you as listeners. I'm so grateful 0:07:28.240 --> 0:07:31.000 that you guys come to us four times a week 0:07:31.120 --> 0:07:33.920 or three times a week or no. I know, but 0:07:33.960 --> 0:07:37.240 you might not listen to every episode. But I'm really grateful, 0:07:37.320 --> 0:07:39.679 and I really feel that it's a responsibility of mine 0:07:39.720 --> 0:07:42.120 to try to do the best we can, including to 0:07:42.120 --> 0:07:45.960 be transparent, and to just continue to bring you things 0:07:45.960 --> 0:07:49.480 so you can really stay completely up to date with 0:07:49.560 --> 0:07:53.440 the news and to know what's happening. So we're really grateful. 0:07:53.680 --> 0:07:56.680 And I know you're hurting, and we're hurting too. I'm 0:07:56.760 --> 0:07:59.120 hurting too, and I know Jesse's hurting too, and it's 0:07:59.200 --> 0:08:01.480 really dark, but I do want you to know that 0:08:02.040 --> 0:08:06.600 there is hope here and that there are federal governors 0:08:06.680 --> 0:08:10.080 who are committed to taking care of their people and 0:08:10.440 --> 0:08:20.400 do not give up. Dave Wigel is a reporter at Semaphore. 0:08:20.840 --> 0:08:23.600 Welcome back to Fast Politics, Dave. 0:08:24.000 --> 0:08:27.000 It's going to be back. Thank you, under great circumstances. 0:08:28.000 --> 0:08:33.320 So I want you to talk to us about what 0:08:34.240 --> 0:08:37.760 went wrong. First of all, my whole place is that 0:08:37.800 --> 0:08:40.199 I want I'm going to this is we're going to 0:08:40.280 --> 0:08:41.360 just do therapy for me. 0:08:41.640 --> 0:08:42.000 I see. 0:08:42.240 --> 0:08:45.280 Now. My whole place is I want to know what 0:08:46.040 --> 0:08:51.400 happened in this election and how I got it so 0:08:51.440 --> 0:08:54.439 wrong in my mind, like, I just want as much 0:08:54.559 --> 0:08:58.800 information as possible. So I have seen that you have 0:08:58.840 --> 0:09:03.480 been sort of parson through what happened. So can we 0:09:03.559 --> 0:09:06.680 start at the macro and then go to the micro? 0:09:07.160 --> 0:09:09.240 So what happened in this election? Broadly? 0:09:09.679 --> 0:09:11.920 So I'll start by saying a lot of people are 0:09:11.960 --> 0:09:15.240 looking at the numbers on their screen and assuming, oh, 0:09:15.520 --> 0:09:18.959 Kamala Harris turned out fewer voters than Joe Biden. Therefore 0:09:19.240 --> 0:09:22.720 she didn't excite Democrats. It looks in the swing states, 0:09:22.720 --> 0:09:26.319 we already know she basically hit the Biden numbers. In 0:09:26.559 --> 0:09:30.960 the swing states, they executed their strategy, which was knowing 0:09:31.000 --> 0:09:34.440 that some voters were moving toward Trump, replacing them with 0:09:34.480 --> 0:09:37.840 other voters turning out as many persuadable people as possible. 0:09:37.920 --> 0:09:40.320 It was Consin's one example of this. Harris got more 0:09:40.400 --> 0:09:42.960 votes than Biden did in Wisconsin. She got almost as 0:09:43.000 --> 0:09:45.160 many votes as Barack Obama did in two thousand and eight, 0:09:45.200 --> 0:09:48.960 which was the biggest Democratic landslide in Wisconsin since the sixties, 0:09:49.080 --> 0:09:51.280 and the state's population's been pretty static. That's why I 0:09:51.280 --> 0:09:53.320 focus on that one. But she didn't win it. So 0:09:53.760 --> 0:09:57.479 what happened it was that Donald Trump was not discredited 0:09:57.600 --> 0:10:01.199 for ninety five percent of Republican votvoters, some had already 0:10:01.240 --> 0:10:03.040 left the party. He saw this at the convention, Right, 0:10:03.040 --> 0:10:05.000 They're just people who weren't for toront like Mike Bends, 0:10:05.000 --> 0:10:06.480 who were never a lot back in the tent. They 0:10:06.559 --> 0:10:10.200 left and he was replacing them with voters who he 0:10:10.360 --> 0:10:13.440 promised everything to. And I had This part is important 0:10:13.679 --> 0:10:17.280 because what Donald Trump does differently than other candidates, and 0:10:17.320 --> 0:10:19.640 he does it because of a very friendly mediate environment 0:10:19.640 --> 0:10:21.800 that he helped create but that he also lucked into, 0:10:22.120 --> 0:10:25.720 is just promising everything to everybody. So if he did, 0:10:25.840 --> 0:10:28.000 he's not hide bound by saying, well, if I get 0:10:28.040 --> 0:10:29.400 in there, I might have a deficit to deal with. 0:10:29.480 --> 0:10:29.960 Well he will. 0:10:30.000 --> 0:10:31.720 He's just not going to. He just will pretend that 0:10:31.760 --> 0:10:34.360 he's going to fix it all with terrors he appointed, 0:10:34.400 --> 0:10:36.320 the justices that were turned to row. He just says 0:10:36.360 --> 0:10:38.200 that he's actually not going to do anything else. On abortion, 0:10:38.440 --> 0:10:41.760 he proposed a suite of new tax cuts that are 0:10:41.760 --> 0:10:43.719 not paid for and that would shrink the lifespan of 0:10:43.760 --> 0:10:46.400 Social Security. But this came up with Democrats. I was 0:10:46.400 --> 0:10:48.800 talked to this week, just a narrow focus on this point. 0:10:48.920 --> 0:10:51.560 Trump proposed tax cuts that would make the Social Security 0:10:51.559 --> 0:10:53.719 Trust Fund run out faster. But because he said I 0:10:53.760 --> 0:10:56.679 want to cut taxes on social Security, lower information voters. 0:10:56.720 --> 0:10:58.400 I'm not trying to be too negative or insulting, but 0:10:58.400 --> 0:11:01.440 lot lower information voters back and said it sounds like 0:11:01.559 --> 0:11:04.160 I heard the word social security and I heard tax cut, 0:11:04.400 --> 0:11:06.680 and they just and I didn't really say, that's a risk. 0:11:06.880 --> 0:11:09.640 He is hard to run against. And Democrats went from 0:11:09.640 --> 0:11:11.800 in twenty sixteen thinking this is a fluke, we never 0:11:11.800 --> 0:11:14.720 should have lost it to thinking a candidate this brazen, 0:11:14.880 --> 0:11:19.240 who doesn't care about being called out for criminal convictions 0:11:19.280 --> 0:11:22.839 or offensive things or not being honest. A candidate who's 0:11:22.880 --> 0:11:25.760 just that that brazen is very hard to run against. 0:11:25.840 --> 0:11:28.439 And they've now seen in two midterms. I would be 0:11:28.480 --> 0:11:31.080 surprised as the next midterm their coalition will turn out 0:11:31.160 --> 0:11:33.120 better than the Trump coalition. But when he is there, 0:11:33.200 --> 0:11:34.880 five hundred thousand worket pople come out of the woods 0:11:34.920 --> 0:11:35.840 and vote for Republicans. 0:11:36.040 --> 0:11:38.599 Explain this to me again, because this is so interesting. 0:11:38.840 --> 0:11:43.040 So let's just go back to Wisconsin. This is super interesting. 0:11:43.160 --> 0:11:47.400 So she actually did grow her coalition, but it wasn't enough. 0:11:47.960 --> 0:11:49.959 Yes, So the difference here is nate. If you look 0:11:49.960 --> 0:11:52.040 at swing states where all the money was spent, Harris 0:11:52.200 --> 0:11:55.520 is at above or right below the Biden numbers from 0:11:55.559 --> 0:11:57.199 twenty twenty. We haven't do We don't have this from 0:11:57.240 --> 0:11:59.679 Arizona and of Etiot and I think that like those 0:11:59.800 --> 0:12:02.319 might be outliers. Because of the shift in the Latino 0:12:02.440 --> 0:12:05.120 vote in states where the campaigns did not spend money, 0:12:05.280 --> 0:12:07.160 and New Jersey's one of these, New York is one 0:12:07.200 --> 0:12:09.320 of these, Florida is one of these. There were a 0:12:09.400 --> 0:12:12.280 huge shift towards Republicans of every vote, every group of 0:12:12.320 --> 0:12:14.440 voters except white women with college degrees, and even then 0:12:14.480 --> 0:12:16.640 that wasn't much of a shift. That is where the 0:12:16.640 --> 0:12:20.000 simple story of the election is. People were still angry 0:12:20.040 --> 0:12:22.600 that prices were up after twenty twenty, no matter what 0:12:22.640 --> 0:12:24.800 Democrats did on the economy, the fact that the economy 0:12:24.800 --> 0:12:26.439 had proved a lot, the fact it's very easy to 0:12:26.480 --> 0:12:29.080 imagine Donald Trump, if he had been president this week, 0:12:29.200 --> 0:12:30.960 would have said, no one thought I could do it, 0:12:31.000 --> 0:12:33.920 but we've beaten inflation, and strong men come up to 0:12:33.960 --> 0:12:35.280 me with tears in their eyes and say, it's the 0:12:35.280 --> 0:12:37.160 best economy we've ever seen. They know that he would 0:12:37.200 --> 0:12:40.000 have been able to sell that economy, but they couldn't. 0:12:40.160 --> 0:12:43.080 Those are the model causal things happening here. There's a 0:12:43.080 --> 0:12:46.400 lot of discourse which I'm listening and skimming, some stuff 0:12:46.480 --> 0:12:49.440 about how the party lost its lost its connection to 0:12:49.600 --> 0:12:52.760 working class voters culturally, and that's complicated. The one part 0:12:52.760 --> 0:12:55.600 I think the Democrats are actually moving towards agreement on 0:12:56.000 --> 0:12:59.400 is that for years they thought they had an emerging 0:12:59.400 --> 0:13:04.400 majority and they didn't need far right media or alternative 0:13:04.440 --> 0:13:07.440 media or offensive media. I'd say that they could take 0:13:07.480 --> 0:13:09.719 the high road. Well, then they didn't need to talk 0:13:09.720 --> 0:13:12.319 to those people. The Harris campaign, if they did some 0:13:12.360 --> 0:13:16.920 subtraction from the coalition, not totally intentional, but for example, 0:13:16.960 --> 0:13:19.880 the RFK thing, their bet was we are not going 0:13:19.920 --> 0:13:21.760 to be the party. We're going to lose people if 0:13:21.800 --> 0:13:23.680 we are the party that just will say, oh sure, 0:13:23.760 --> 0:13:27.120 we'll totally blow up public health because of conspiracy theories, 0:13:27.120 --> 0:13:28.880 so they let him out of the coalition. The thing 0:13:28.920 --> 0:13:32.200 that is more fixable is they hadn't prioritize going on 0:13:32.559 --> 0:13:34.959 new media that people who don't trust the mainstream media 0:13:35.080 --> 0:13:37.720 listen to. Some Democrats did, and every diperary did, like 0:13:37.720 --> 0:13:40.640 Andrew Yang, Bernie Sanders, John Federando, I talk to you 0:13:40.679 --> 0:13:42.280 this week. All of them say you just need to 0:13:42.280 --> 0:13:43.640 do that, like you're not going to go in there 0:13:43.640 --> 0:13:45.280 and get eaten alive. If you're getting eaten a live, 0:13:45.320 --> 0:13:47.160 you shouldn't run for office because you should be better 0:13:47.200 --> 0:13:49.440 at talking. You can't live in the bubble anymore where 0:13:49.520 --> 0:13:51.800 some people are just beneath you. Maybe none of them 0:13:51.880 --> 0:13:53.640 vowed for you, but you need to try. Maybe they 0:13:53.640 --> 0:13:55.360 don't vote for you, but they don't hate you once 0:13:55.400 --> 0:13:55.880 you get. 0:13:55.679 --> 0:13:57.559 On there, right or they know you exist. 0:13:57.880 --> 0:14:01.040 Sure, because when they talk about messaging, the messaging means 0:14:01.240 --> 0:14:04.000 earned media, which is you doing interviews and speeches. It 0:14:04.040 --> 0:14:07.200 means paid media, which is you buying ads. And that's 0:14:07.240 --> 0:14:08.959 the thing where they're running ad That's why I talked 0:14:08.960 --> 0:14:10.800 about swinges stays where they're runing ads and people saw 0:14:10.800 --> 0:14:13.080 the ads they held a lot of ground and where 0:14:13.120 --> 0:14:16.040 people were just watching the news on their phones and 0:14:16.080 --> 0:14:18.120 tuning out. They lost a lot of ground, and that. 0:14:18.160 --> 0:14:22.760 Seems so important because there's so much blame going around, 0:14:23.000 --> 0:14:25.680 which is I think normal winn a party loses, But 0:14:25.840 --> 0:14:29.280 that is so important because it sounds like in a 0:14:29.440 --> 0:14:35.600 weird way, because Democrats probably held those Senate seats, almost 0:14:35.640 --> 0:14:38.160 all the Senate seats in swing states that were up, 0:14:38.360 --> 0:14:42.680 and it almost sounds like the campaign helped those down 0:14:42.840 --> 0:14:43.840 ballot races. 0:14:44.400 --> 0:14:47.480 Yeah, that's the thing in the Senate seats, the almost 0:14:47.520 --> 0:14:50.480 irony of this, just like I get I can see 0:14:50.520 --> 0:14:54.000 if the key like Montana is a testa ran ahead, 0:14:54.240 --> 0:14:56.120 bear around, right ahead. Well, I don't want to get 0:14:56.120 --> 0:14:58.320 it too over complicated about what happened, but it was 0:14:58.480 --> 0:15:01.920 Democrats were able to win and outperform Harris in a 0:15:02.000 --> 0:15:05.600 number of places, which suggests to me that Republicans less 0:15:05.600 --> 0:15:07.600 well owned than Trump, but running on the same stuff 0:15:07.760 --> 0:15:10.240 as in twenty twenty two, just do not have the 0:15:10.240 --> 0:15:11.920 same appeal. It's very clear. 0:15:11.880 --> 0:15:14.320 Trump Ism does not scale right. 0:15:14.400 --> 0:15:16.400 Not right now, And even JD. Vance is less popular 0:15:16.440 --> 0:15:18.120 than Donald Trump. He doesn't get the same crowd, he 0:15:18.160 --> 0:15:20.400 doesn't have the same peal. There are not people having JD. 0:15:20.520 --> 0:15:21.680 Vance voat grades, et cetera. 0:15:21.840 --> 0:15:24.920 Now, can you imagine Not. 0:15:25.000 --> 0:15:26.480 Really, I can imagine a lot of things, but that 0:15:26.520 --> 0:15:28.640 it's kind of hard to imagine, but very a. Goosy 0:15:28.840 --> 0:15:32.000 is a unique candidate because he's a Latino veteran in 0:15:32.040 --> 0:15:35.880 Arizona and he spent three years moving to the right. 0:15:36.000 --> 0:15:38.320 He'd been much more progressive and he moved to the right. 0:15:38.600 --> 0:15:40.000 You can do that in three years. You can't do 0:15:40.040 --> 0:15:41.840 it in one hundred days. That's a harder test of 0:15:41.880 --> 0:15:44.720 this because Kerry Lake is pretty well lothed and known 0:15:44.760 --> 0:15:46.880 for trying to overturn elections and nothing else. But that 0:15:46.960 --> 0:15:49.440 was a good example where where Democrats kind of filled 0:15:49.440 --> 0:15:51.480 the soil for a long time, and by the time 0:15:51.560 --> 0:15:54.080 voters are paying attention, they had seen Ruben Gegel on 0:15:54.120 --> 0:15:56.680 Bill Maher and they'd seen him say that Democrats should 0:15:56.680 --> 0:15:59.000 stop saying LATINX, which he did three years ago. I mean, 0:15:59.040 --> 0:16:00.600 I did, like there, go I not been saying that, 0:16:00.640 --> 0:16:02.280 but he said three years ago, stop doing it. 0:16:02.520 --> 0:16:02.880 Yeah. 0:16:03.080 --> 0:16:07.200 That example of a Democratic campaign that made some compromises 0:16:07.560 --> 0:16:10.120 and said hey, if you're a moderate voter, I'm not 0:16:10.160 --> 0:16:12.200 going to do anything super crazy that you hate. That 0:16:12.360 --> 0:16:14.160 was pretty successful and Harris did a lot of that, 0:16:14.240 --> 0:16:17.280 and again, we're voters saw her saying, here's my economic plan, 0:16:17.400 --> 0:16:20.160 and I'm supported by some Republicans, so I'm not actually 0:16:20.160 --> 0:16:22.320 at left winger. That was in competition with the ads 0:16:22.360 --> 0:16:24.960 about her being a crazy left winger and her letting 0:16:25.200 --> 0:16:27.520 the border explode, et cetera, et cetera. But that actually 0:16:27.520 --> 0:16:29.880 did move some people. Just they're missing the people who 0:16:30.200 --> 0:16:32.560 don't watch TV except for when they're seeing sports, they 0:16:32.560 --> 0:16:35.120 didn't hear that. And the messaging because there's so much 0:16:35.200 --> 0:16:38.040 of a post to discuss on messaging. That's where I've 0:16:38.040 --> 0:16:40.080 come down on this was seeing what they were actually 0:16:40.080 --> 0:16:41.840 spending money on in the States. 0:16:42.120 --> 0:16:45.480 So explain this to me. The messaging it sort of worked. 0:16:45.880 --> 0:16:48.880 Yeah, that's why this gulf between On average, it hired 0:16:48.880 --> 0:16:51.760 you on average. But for example, Democratic support collapsed to 0:16:51.760 --> 0:16:54.240 New Jersey, it just didn't matter because they won their 0:16:54.280 --> 0:16:55.840 house seats. They could. They were's one they want to 0:16:55.840 --> 0:16:58.400 flip and they did. If that collapsed up around the country, 0:16:58.640 --> 0:17:02.360 Democrats would have lost New Mexico and Minnesota and Virginia, 0:17:02.480 --> 0:17:05.160 and it didn't. It was where they had targeted messaging 0:17:05.240 --> 0:17:09.560 to burnish Harris's image. It was pretty successful. Harris's favorability 0:17:09.600 --> 0:17:12.679 improved throughout the campaign. I think the issue here is 0:17:12.720 --> 0:17:16.280 that Democrats did not correct quickly enough, because these things 0:17:16.320 --> 0:17:19.240 move very slowly. I see news stories as a second 0:17:19.280 --> 0:17:21.520 hand on a clock, and campaigns as the as the 0:17:22.119 --> 0:17:24.560 hour hand. It's really what because they had done differently 0:17:24.960 --> 0:17:27.239 well given that they were running on we're going to 0:17:27.520 --> 0:17:30.879 kick out asylum seekers more than we were two years ago. 0:17:31.160 --> 0:17:35.440 They were running on expanding medicare in pretty incremental ways. 0:17:35.440 --> 0:17:38.760 They're running on fighting price gouging. Had Joe Biden said 0:17:39.320 --> 0:17:42.560 in June twenty twenty three, not twenty four, I have 0:17:42.640 --> 0:17:44.640 to pull the cord on this, and I think even 0:17:44.680 --> 0:17:46.879 Kamala Harris been the nominee, they would have had the 0:17:46.920 --> 0:17:49.480 time to do that. Inflation would have continued to be 0:17:49.840 --> 0:17:53.040 an issue for them. But every Democrat owned part of 0:17:53.040 --> 0:17:55.840 the inflation situation because they owned it. They didn't own 0:17:55.840 --> 0:17:59.199 all the immigration situation because that's controlled by DHS and 0:17:59.320 --> 0:18:02.440 the executive, so some of them took some damage over it, 0:18:02.480 --> 0:18:04.960 and the damage is usually you didn't stop Biden from 0:18:04.960 --> 0:18:09.240 making things worse. But I think inflation would have been survivable, 0:18:09.280 --> 0:18:12.159 and by survival I mean Democrats running one and a 0:18:12.200 --> 0:18:15.159 half points better in a few states, they would have 0:18:15.280 --> 0:18:17.520 narrowly won the election. They would sto would have lost 0:18:17.520 --> 0:18:19.919 the Ohio Senate race, in the Montana Senate race, like 0:18:19.960 --> 0:18:22.840 they were fighting for a very, very, very tough race. 0:18:22.880 --> 0:18:24.640 But I think could they have gotten over the line 0:18:24.840 --> 0:18:28.240 with a similar strategy that started a year earlier. I 0:18:28.680 --> 0:18:29.359 think they could have. 0:18:30.000 --> 0:18:34.080 Yeah. What's so interesting to me about all of this 0:18:34.720 --> 0:18:39.040 is that it seems to me like New York State 0:18:39.760 --> 0:18:43.639 Democrats won seeds, right, I mean, they flipped two seeds. 0:18:44.040 --> 0:18:47.440 Yeah, So there are the green shoots for Democrats in 0:18:47.480 --> 0:18:49.360 a lot of places that we're going to figure out 0:18:49.359 --> 0:18:52.879 more after the election. And this happens. For example, two 0:18:52.920 --> 0:18:56.440 thousand and four, Georgie Wish wins and Republicans win most 0:18:56.480 --> 0:18:59.679 of their closed races. And the exception is Colorado, where 0:19:00.080 --> 0:19:03.840 Democrats win a Senate seat they flipped it from Republicans. 0:19:04.320 --> 0:19:07.520 They do much better in local elections. They were hopeful 0:19:07.560 --> 0:19:09.639 maybe the whole country is like that. It turns out 0:19:09.680 --> 0:19:12.119 it's not. There's parts of the country that are like Colorado. 0:19:12.280 --> 0:19:15.200 The key it turns out in the long term is 0:19:15.400 --> 0:19:18.159 do people there have college degrees that is definitive. But 0:19:18.240 --> 0:19:20.160 there were going to be places where Democrats did. North 0:19:20.200 --> 0:19:23.520 Carolina is one where they lost the presidential election state wipe, 0:19:23.520 --> 0:19:26.160 but they actually picked up some lower offices and broke 0:19:26.200 --> 0:19:29.320 their replicans oup majority. Even in this electorate, they were 0:19:29.359 --> 0:19:31.679 able to make some gains. When I talked about this electorate, 0:19:31.720 --> 0:19:34.719 I mean just Trump persuading people and adding votes from 0:19:34.720 --> 0:19:37.040 twenty twenty. Had Trump gotten exactly as many votes as 0:19:37.040 --> 0:19:39.000 he got in twenty twenty, if you listen to him, 0:19:39.040 --> 0:19:40.600 he says he wonted because no one had ever won 0:19:40.600 --> 0:19:43.000 that many votes. He wouldn't have won. Harris got more 0:19:43.080 --> 0:19:45.119 votes in a couple key states, and she would have 0:19:45.200 --> 0:19:47.880 edged past him. He did more persuasion, And so that's 0:19:47.880 --> 0:19:49.720 part of it. Two Democrats are not the only actors 0:19:49.760 --> 0:19:52.720 of history. Trump made decisions, and I think I talked 0:19:52.760 --> 0:19:56.360 about lying, et cetera, but he made even other policy decisions. 0:19:56.359 --> 0:19:59.200 To this say, unlike every other Republican, and hey, maybe 0:19:59.320 --> 0:20:01.760 unlike what I'll actually do and I take the power. 0:20:02.160 --> 0:20:04.560 I'm never going to touch Obamacare, I'm never going to 0:20:04.560 --> 0:20:07.119 touch Medicare, I'm never going to touch Social Security. I'm 0:20:07.119 --> 0:20:09.440 going to defend them. All that does matter. I don't 0:20:09.480 --> 0:20:12.720 think even the exact same alignment. If Trump had said, 0:20:12.880 --> 0:20:14.640 you know what, I'm bored about running and they had 0:20:14.680 --> 0:20:17.480 nominated run to Santus, I'm not convinced a Santus would 0:20:17.480 --> 0:20:20.000 have won because I think the rest of the Republican 0:20:20.040 --> 0:20:22.639 instinct is pretty tied to and we're going to get 0:20:22.680 --> 0:20:26.399 in there and shrink the deficit. Trump's decisions are very potent. Also, 0:20:26.640 --> 0:20:28.919 what was the story he's able to tell? Again, it 0:20:28.960 --> 0:20:32.520 involves some bs, which is when I was president, which 0:20:32.760 --> 0:20:35.200 a presidency that ended in February twenty twenty, and nothing 0:20:35.240 --> 0:20:37.320 else was my fault. The economy is really good. Well, 0:20:37.320 --> 0:20:39.879 another Republican couldn't have run on that. He ran a 0:20:40.000 --> 0:20:43.280 very good campaign with a combination of a record he 0:20:43.280 --> 0:20:46.640 could defend and some stuff he made up and could 0:20:46.720 --> 0:20:47.520 very easily defend. 0:20:47.920 --> 0:20:49.840 Right, I want you to put this together for me. 0:20:50.200 --> 0:20:55.560 In the states where they didn't have the campaign apparatus 0:20:56.040 --> 0:20:59.919 working as hard right, the non swing states like New Jersey. 0:21:00.080 --> 0:21:02.440 Let's talk about New Jersey. How much do you think 0:21:02.680 --> 0:21:04.880 disinformation played a role. 0:21:05.040 --> 0:21:08.000 Well, depending on what type of disinformation. There are elections 0:21:08.000 --> 0:21:11.600 that happen in fairly tough circumstances, and one of them 0:21:11.720 --> 0:21:14.119 is which we all live through you and me, And 0:21:14.359 --> 0:21:16.560 I assume I was listening as twenty twelve and it 0:21:16.880 --> 0:21:20.720 objectively voters in October twenty twelve were paying more for 0:21:20.800 --> 0:21:23.360 gas than they had been four years earlier, based on time. 0:21:23.480 --> 0:21:25.560 Uneployment was not what it was four and a half 0:21:25.640 --> 0:21:28.320 years earlier. There wasn't a good You just have to 0:21:28.359 --> 0:21:30.560 stick through it. We are the party that's going to 0:21:30.600 --> 0:21:32.959 get you through it. Things are improving, keep trusting us 0:21:33.280 --> 0:21:36.120 message that was successful for Barack Obama. And I think 0:21:36.119 --> 0:21:38.520 you can disaggregate form that from even his own talent 0:21:38.560 --> 0:21:42.160 because Democrats across the klairemccaskill was winning and John Tester 0:21:42.280 --> 0:21:44.080 is winning, and for a lot of Democrats it's like, Yep, 0:21:44.119 --> 0:21:46.320 we didn't turn things around yet, but we're turning them 0:21:46.320 --> 0:21:49.080 around and those other guys are terrible. That's the part 0:21:49.119 --> 0:21:51.760 that I think Trump makes more complicated because he wasn't 0:21:51.840 --> 0:21:54.320 running on Paul Ryan saying we're going to shrink the 0:21:54.359 --> 0:21:56.880 deficit and black Art Medican and he might, he just wasn't. 0:21:57.320 --> 0:22:00.000 This was running on it. This is the success he had. 0:22:00.160 --> 0:22:02.159 This is why I not overwripe it but just really like, 0:22:02.200 --> 0:22:04.840 if this was Jdevan's running on the same campaign without 0:22:04.840 --> 0:22:06.200 that record, I don't think it would have worked. I 0:22:06.200 --> 0:22:07.680 don't think you would have the same people come out 0:22:07.680 --> 0:22:09.639 of the would work because the overall democratic message of 0:22:09.800 --> 0:22:12.760 returning the corner that has been successful before it was 0:22:12.800 --> 0:22:15.840 actually round Reagan in nineteen eighty four, things were in 0:22:15.920 --> 0:22:20.080 some metrics, including inflation, unemployment, things were worse in morning 0:22:20.320 --> 0:22:23.000 morning in America than they were right now. The final thing, though, 0:22:23.520 --> 0:22:25.800 the final thing, I'm adding like twenty to twenty things, 0:22:25.840 --> 0:22:28.479 this daisy chain of takes, but this media environment, when 0:22:28.520 --> 0:22:31.320 you have to be talking about disinformation, I'm cautious say 0:22:31.320 --> 0:22:33.760 what's different information? What it is? And I think what's 0:22:33.800 --> 0:22:36.480 important is not just people not quite getting what's happening 0:22:36.480 --> 0:22:39.560 in the economy. It's that there's no objective source that 0:22:39.600 --> 0:22:42.040 a lot of people trust that's telling what's actually happening. 0:22:42.200 --> 0:22:44.680 Some of that is people who'll say, oh, the TV 0:22:44.800 --> 0:22:46.720 told me to wear a mask outside, and I don't 0:22:46.720 --> 0:22:48.879 trust that anymore. Some it's that, but it's also just 0:22:48.880 --> 0:22:51.119 people have moved on other media sources and they just 0:22:51.400 --> 0:22:54.000 not only do they not hear positive democratic messaging, but 0:22:54.080 --> 0:22:56.680 when they hear Trum's messaging. No one's really pushing back 0:22:57.200 --> 0:22:59.080 some way. Am I the hardest interviewer in a world? 0:22:59.080 --> 0:23:02.200 Probably not, But I would notice when kamal Aris goes 0:23:02.200 --> 0:23:05.280 on MSNBC, the first question is why are you struggling 0:23:05.480 --> 0:23:07.800 on the economy? Why don't people trust you on the economy? 0:23:08.119 --> 0:23:10.600 When Trump goes on like Joe Rogan and the note Boys, 0:23:10.840 --> 0:23:13.080 that's not the question that it's a lot of let's 0:23:13.080 --> 0:23:14.720 talk about how cool and fun you are. 0:23:14.960 --> 0:23:16.360 Yeah, yeah, yeah, you've really been. 0:23:16.400 --> 0:23:19.760 I don't think even the media environment of twenty sixteen 0:23:20.160 --> 0:23:22.520 hard to recreate all that stuff, but that one where 0:23:22.560 --> 0:23:24.760 just people who are still getting most of their news 0:23:24.800 --> 0:23:29.520 from newspapers and TV, local TV, cable. The political discourse 0:23:29.600 --> 0:23:31.000 is more shape by what's on the a one of 0:23:31.000 --> 0:23:32.879 the New York Times. That was tougher for him, and 0:23:32.880 --> 0:23:33.760 this is much easier. 0:23:34.000 --> 0:23:37.840 So interesting, I mean, that's a really important point that 0:23:37.920 --> 0:23:42.680 he has a sort of propaganda network that Democrats don't have, right, 0:23:42.920 --> 0:23:46.600 I mean, basically that's what you're saying, and that propaganda 0:23:46.680 --> 0:23:49.439 network pumps him up and makes him seem But I 0:23:49.480 --> 0:23:52.600 also think the secret sauce about Trump has always been 0:23:53.200 --> 0:23:57.480 that he is just a uniquely talented I mean, like 0:23:57.600 --> 0:24:00.240 him or loathe him, certainly, I am not a fan, 0:24:00.440 --> 0:24:04.640 but he is uniquely good at connecting with his people. 0:24:05.240 --> 0:24:08.600 One of the things that Trump did, which I thought 0:24:08.600 --> 0:24:11.800 would doom him but actually has really delivered for him, 0:24:11.920 --> 0:24:15.119 is that he was so laser focused on his base 0:24:15.680 --> 0:24:20.639 and Harris was more interested. Obviously, again it's not a 0:24:20.680 --> 0:24:23.880 fair comparison because she had three months and he had, 0:24:24.040 --> 0:24:27.159 you know, our whole lifetimes. But he was committed to 0:24:27.320 --> 0:24:29.960 just turning out his base and thinking and making the 0:24:29.960 --> 0:24:33.080 gamble that that would be enough, and she was trying 0:24:33.119 --> 0:24:38.439 to practice conversion and ultimately the bass play one out. 0:24:38.680 --> 0:24:40.280 I mean, can you talk about that? 0:24:40.760 --> 0:24:42.560 Well, I do not know if he was trying to 0:24:42.680 --> 0:24:45.720 reach his base. It's a very complicated question because I 0:24:45.720 --> 0:24:48.320 don't mind you in the word wrappaganda. But one thing 0:24:48.920 --> 0:24:52.399 I'll positive here is that whenever a democratic president, Fox 0:24:52.480 --> 0:24:54.960 News drives the truck down to Del Rio and Eagle 0:24:55.000 --> 0:24:57.640 Pass and covers people crossing the border. And when Donald 0:24:57.640 --> 0:25:01.800 Trump's president, they talked remov is present. So because there 0:25:01.840 --> 0:25:04.320 were illegal border crossings under Trump, and I'm not being 0:25:04.359 --> 0:25:06.640 good because there were policy changes, bind did that led 0:25:06.640 --> 0:25:09.040 to more people across the border. There also were just 0:25:09.280 --> 0:25:12.360 worse conditions in places like Venezuela and Haiti that led 0:25:12.400 --> 0:25:14.800 to more migration out of there and people trying to 0:25:14.800 --> 0:25:17.520 get into the country. But it was not false that 0:25:17.760 --> 0:25:22.119 the Trump policy was a very unsympathetic were full go 0:25:22.240 --> 0:25:25.840 away approach, including saying you're in a campaign that yes, 0:25:25.880 --> 0:25:29.040 there are people who have legal temporary status from Haiti 0:25:29.080 --> 0:25:30.840 that live in Ohio and we should take your status 0:25:30.880 --> 0:25:33.320 away and kick them out. The Trump approaches just kick 0:25:33.400 --> 0:25:35.440 them out. That is a policy difference. And the promise 0:25:35.480 --> 0:25:37.800 of instead of you coming across the country and getting 0:25:37.800 --> 0:25:40.160 a court date, We're going to immediately deport you, We're 0:25:40.160 --> 0:25:42.400 going to process you in Mexico, just get out of here. 0:25:42.560 --> 0:25:46.400 That is significant change. It just helps that even when 0:25:46.600 --> 0:25:50.200 border crossings are falling under a Democrat, the stories are 0:25:50.240 --> 0:25:53.480 still about who's coming across the border illegally. One thing 0:25:53.520 --> 0:25:55.840 that stuck with me it wasn't my reporting, it was politico. 0:25:56.160 --> 0:26:01.280 But one reason the Teamsters didn't endure in the presidential 0:26:01.400 --> 0:26:03.760 race and just stayed neutral, which actually was kind of 0:26:03.800 --> 0:26:06.080 victory for Harris not norsing Trump, was that there were 0:26:06.119 --> 0:26:10.400 some heads of locals who sorry, not the teasers, the firefighters, firefighters. 0:26:10.440 --> 0:26:13.439 There are some heads in their locals who blamed the 0:26:13.480 --> 0:26:16.560 border for fentanyl and said, fentanyl's coming over and it's 0:26:16.560 --> 0:26:19.159 putting our firefighters at risk. And there is an example 0:26:19.200 --> 0:26:20.480 of something because if you if you know about how 0:26:20.560 --> 0:26:23.480 drugs smuggling works, as everyone listen to this podcast does, 0:26:23.640 --> 0:26:25.760 that's not like somebody that comes from Haiti with a 0:26:25.760 --> 0:26:28.159 bag of fentanyl and crosses the border. Drug smuggling is 0:26:28.240 --> 0:26:31.600 very sophisticated. Happened everywhere. It happens on planes, like we're 0:26:31.600 --> 0:26:34.320 not stopping all flights through Mexico. This is this catch 0:26:34.320 --> 0:26:36.840 twenty two that Democrats are in. You would see Republicans 0:26:36.920 --> 0:26:40.200 every time law enforcement announced a fentanyl seizure and say, 0:26:40.240 --> 0:26:42.359 look at how much fentanyl they seized. This is not working. 0:26:42.440 --> 0:26:45.360 Whenever Republican is president, he goes down and says, look 0:26:45.400 --> 0:26:47.240 at this, we seized a bunch of fentanyl. The policy 0:26:47.400 --> 0:26:50.199 is working. I'm not convinced that Democrats wouldn't do that. 0:26:50.280 --> 0:26:53.000 I do think Democrats are going to start revisiting not 0:26:53.080 --> 0:26:56.320 just Bill Clinton's politics, with Barack Obama's politics and how 0:26:56.480 --> 0:27:00.800 you just need to actually one be tough on rule 0:27:00.840 --> 0:27:05.000 breaking and things that are disruptive to normal people's lives. 0:27:05.200 --> 0:27:06.720 And you need to say that you are all the 0:27:06.760 --> 0:27:08.720 time and show up all the time. Like the people 0:27:08.720 --> 0:27:11.840 that I think are most out of the conversation that 0:27:11.920 --> 0:27:14.600 Democrats want to have right now in every way are 0:27:14.640 --> 0:27:16.800 the people who in it. And I was there covering 0:27:16.800 --> 0:27:20.080 this for twenty four thirteen, fourteen fifteen, the Black Lives 0:27:20.119 --> 0:27:23.800 Matter movement and also crim adjuster performers on the libertarian 0:27:24.040 --> 0:27:26.560 left and right who were saying, we actually can start 0:27:26.600 --> 0:27:29.600 removing some people from prison and being more tolerant about 0:27:29.680 --> 0:27:33.440 getting people rehabilitated, maybe not doing as many homelessness sweeps. 0:27:33.440 --> 0:27:35.600 We can be less cruel because crime is down. And 0:27:35.640 --> 0:27:38.399 one thing to happen this election below blow the claridential level. 0:27:38.440 --> 0:27:40.520 Well at the presidential level. Kamala Harris is running as 0:27:40.560 --> 0:27:42.719 to talk about being a tough prosecutor and for one example, 0:27:42.720 --> 0:27:45.320 and how just they've a party abandoned the that approach. 0:27:45.359 --> 0:27:46.840 I keep want to say, soft on crime, just try 0:27:46.960 --> 0:27:49.680 not talk to cliches. But also just in her state 0:27:50.280 --> 0:27:52.600 where she lives in Los Angeles County, voters got rid 0:27:52.640 --> 0:27:55.560 of the Progressive DA where she was born in Alameda County. 0:27:55.600 --> 0:27:58.440 Voters got rid of the progressive DA Oakland, where she 0:27:58.520 --> 0:28:00.359 spent some of her life. Voters kicked out the mayor 0:28:00.480 --> 0:28:02.760 San Francisco, where she was DA. Voters kicked out from 0:28:02.760 --> 0:28:05.280 there and statewide, and she never said how she voted 0:28:05.320 --> 0:28:07.400 on this. There was a ballot measure to get rid 0:28:07.480 --> 0:28:09.680 of some of these primo dust reform. They're the ones 0:28:09.720 --> 0:28:13.119 that had passed and passed life, and the original one 0:28:13.200 --> 0:28:16.120 passed with Republican support. I remember I talked to Gingrich, 0:28:16.320 --> 0:28:19.520 who dedorsed it, for a story recently. Grige ten years 0:28:19.520 --> 0:28:21.640 ago was saying, Hey, Californians, we need to get people 0:28:21.640 --> 0:28:24.040 out of prison. Let's pass this bill, and people who 0:28:24.040 --> 0:28:26.679 are just doing teddy chocolate lifting will be clogging up 0:28:26.680 --> 0:28:29.639 the jails. And then ten years later people say, I 0:28:29.640 --> 0:28:32.879 am tired of watching videos on TV of guys walking 0:28:32.880 --> 0:28:35.600 out of stores with bags of goods. I'm tired of 0:28:35.680 --> 0:28:39.560 going to Walgreens and there is shampoo behind the lock gate. 0:28:39.720 --> 0:28:41.360 You might stop and say, like, is that really the 0:28:41.360 --> 0:28:44.080 most important thing happening? Look, quality of life matters. 0:28:44.280 --> 0:28:46.920 Thank you, thank you, thank you so interesting. I really 0:28:47.000 --> 0:28:52.880 appreciate you. Jocelyn Benson is the Secretary of State of Michigan. 0:28:53.400 --> 0:28:56.440 Welcome to FoST Politics, Jocelyn Benson. 0:28:56.880 --> 0:28:58.120 Hi, thanks for having me. 0:28:58.480 --> 0:29:01.840 I wanted to have you on the podcast because a 0:29:01.880 --> 0:29:04.640 lot of the listeners of this podcast, and by a 0:29:04.640 --> 0:29:07.600 lot of listeners this podcast, I mean myself, are full 0:29:07.640 --> 0:29:10.680 on freaking out about what this is going to look 0:29:10.760 --> 0:29:15.560 like another Trump presidency, and so I figure because you 0:29:15.920 --> 0:29:19.520 are part of the trifactor of fabulous women who lead 0:29:19.520 --> 0:29:22.160 the state of Michigan, you could talk to us a 0:29:22.240 --> 0:29:24.760 little bit about First of all, I want you to 0:29:24.800 --> 0:29:26.880 first talk to us about the election and what you 0:29:26.960 --> 0:29:30.520 saw on the ground and how that was, and then 0:29:30.560 --> 0:29:33.240 I have many, many, many other questions for you. 0:29:33.720 --> 0:29:35.200 Well, thanks for having me. 0:29:35.480 --> 0:29:38.360 I think what I saw on the ground in the 0:29:38.440 --> 0:29:42.440 lead up to the election and throughout was a lot 0:29:42.480 --> 0:29:48.720 of enthusiasm across the board. And basically the enthusiasm ended 0:29:48.800 --> 0:29:50.800 up truly being across the board because we had the 0:29:50.840 --> 0:29:54.240 highest turnout election in our state's history. Five point six 0:29:54.360 --> 0:29:57.600 seven million people voted, which blew through our past record 0:29:57.640 --> 0:30:00.280 of five point five from twenty twenty which and that 0:30:00.320 --> 0:30:02.720 one blew through our previous record of five million in 0:30:02.760 --> 0:30:05.240 two thousand and eight. And so we at the time 0:30:05.240 --> 0:30:08.400 when our state population has been decreasing, we've seen voter 0:30:08.800 --> 0:30:12.680 turnout increase and really just go through the roof. 0:30:12.680 --> 0:30:15.560 This past Tuesday. That's not a terrible thing, and that's 0:30:15.600 --> 0:30:18.760 sort of that's a good thing for our for our democracy. 0:30:19.000 --> 0:30:23.840 It really illuminates also the reality that the two party 0:30:23.880 --> 0:30:27.720 system or is perhaps not fully equipped to reflect the 0:30:27.760 --> 0:30:31.480 diverse perspectives in the electorate, in the electorate that large. 0:30:31.680 --> 0:30:34.040 What we also saw on Michigan were two things. 0:30:34.080 --> 0:30:38.280 One extraordinary celebration at the polls, more energy than I've seen. 0:30:38.320 --> 0:30:40.320 And this was in you know, I went to ham Tranmek, 0:30:40.360 --> 0:30:43.200 I went down river places where our Democrats lost. I 0:30:43.240 --> 0:30:48.360 still saw extraordinary turnout, extraordinary enthusiasm. People were really determined 0:30:48.400 --> 0:30:50.400 to vote. The second thing I saw in Michigan was, 0:30:50.680 --> 0:30:52.120 you know, other than that, the at the top of 0:30:52.160 --> 0:30:55.560 the ticket women Wan. Our entire congressional delegation on the 0:30:55.560 --> 0:30:59.920 Democratic side is almost entirely women. Now, we elected Alyssa Slack, 0:31:00.320 --> 0:31:03.480 We elected two women to the Michigan Supreme Court who 0:31:03.560 --> 0:31:07.320 ran as Democrats. So there's I wouldn't call it silver linings, 0:31:07.320 --> 0:31:09.080 but I would add that to the lessons that we 0:31:09.120 --> 0:31:11.800 need to take from this election to recognize that still 0:31:12.000 --> 0:31:15.120 it's clear that women voters have something to stay. They're 0:31:15.120 --> 0:31:18.280 supporting female candidates in our state. The women of Michigan 0:31:18.400 --> 0:31:21.840 continue to expand. But at the same time, we also 0:31:21.920 --> 0:31:24.120 have to listen to the economic message that voters who 0:31:24.240 --> 0:31:28.120 supported Trump in Michigan and throughout the country are sending 0:31:28.160 --> 0:31:30.959 to everyone. They are hurting and they are looking for 0:31:31.000 --> 0:31:33.760 someone to listen and hear them at least make them 0:31:33.760 --> 0:31:36.800 feel hard, and who can convince them rightly or wrongly, 0:31:36.960 --> 0:31:39.520 accurately or not that they have the plan to heal 0:31:39.800 --> 0:31:40.280 their pain. 0:31:40.800 --> 0:31:44.479 But Alissa's Slatkin is going to the Senate. She is 0:31:45.000 --> 0:31:49.800 that is particularly exciting. And there are other Democrats in 0:31:50.200 --> 0:31:55.040 you know, Jackie Rosen and rub and Diego and who 0:31:55.080 --> 0:31:58.640 did in fact overperform the top of the ticket and 0:31:58.720 --> 0:32:02.440 maybe also benefitted from the top of the tickets campaign. 0:32:03.520 --> 0:32:06.240 Yeah, I think so. You can make that argument. Certainly, 0:32:06.760 --> 0:32:10.440 all throughout various local districts where we saw a high 0:32:10.440 --> 0:32:13.080 turnout that we otherwise wouldn't see. The West Side of 0:32:13.160 --> 0:32:15.960 Michigan is an example of that too. But you know, 0:32:16.000 --> 0:32:18.640 we're still picking a part all of those all of 0:32:18.680 --> 0:32:22.760 those things. The other piece we know protecting democracy was 0:32:23.040 --> 0:32:25.880 a critical factor for a lot of people who did 0:32:25.880 --> 0:32:28.360 show up, and I think it's important to know that 0:32:28.360 --> 0:32:31.200 that work is going to continue and the fact that 0:32:31.520 --> 0:32:34.040 democracy thrives when we demand that it does. 0:32:34.440 --> 0:32:36.720 And so for us to give up. 0:32:36.640 --> 0:32:38.640 In this moment, at a time where we do have 0:32:38.800 --> 0:32:42.880 someone who's an avowed authoritarian, you know, about to ascend 0:32:42.920 --> 0:32:45.080 to the highest office in the land, we're needed now 0:32:45.120 --> 0:32:47.920 more than ever to stand firm and speak out against 0:32:48.000 --> 0:32:50.600 anyone who tries to take away our voices and our freedoms. 0:32:50.880 --> 0:32:55.880 Yeah. So, I mean we're already hearing, thankfully from Newsome 0:32:56.200 --> 0:33:01.040 and also from Governor Pritzker, these statements of like how 0:33:01.200 --> 0:33:05.560 federalism can in fact protect American citizens and blue states. 0:33:05.720 --> 0:33:08.560 Talk to me about what that looks like in Michigan. 0:33:08.920 --> 0:33:13.760 The power of people to stay engaged and stay involved 0:33:13.880 --> 0:33:17.440 and to hold people accountable, no matter how powerful, is 0:33:17.560 --> 0:33:21.160 a critical component of what democracy is. And especially in 0:33:21.200 --> 0:33:24.480 this moment, we have to still wave that flag and 0:33:24.560 --> 0:33:26.840 march into battle with that as our charge. And so 0:33:27.000 --> 0:33:29.800 I think you'll see young people, women in Michigan, people 0:33:29.800 --> 0:33:32.280 of color, continue to lead that if we allow our 0:33:32.320 --> 0:33:36.240 grief and despondents in this moment to turn into an energy, 0:33:36.640 --> 0:33:40.000 just like it did after twenty sixteen, to push for freedom, 0:33:40.040 --> 0:33:44.120 to push for an expansion of freedom, and really again 0:33:44.160 --> 0:33:48.040 also take on that economic opportunity message as well that 0:33:48.120 --> 0:33:52.200 the vice president attempted to. But for various different reasons 0:33:52.200 --> 0:33:55.640 that we can unpack, I didn't resonate as strongly as 0:33:56.400 --> 0:33:59.960 the one her opponent and the ones in future president 0:34:00.080 --> 0:34:01.520 and was able to sell. 0:34:01.800 --> 0:34:06.440 Yeah, I actually think this election was hardest on younger 0:34:06.680 --> 0:34:10.480 women because for some of these younger women, I don't 0:34:10.800 --> 0:34:17.959 know if they understood just how much America could reject them, right. 0:34:17.840 --> 0:34:21.200 Yeah, I think that was really certainly a message you 0:34:21.920 --> 0:34:25.040 could see. And yet, you know, we only lose when 0:34:25.080 --> 0:34:28.080 we allow others to make us believe that our voices 0:34:28.120 --> 0:34:30.880 don't matter, you know, and so to young women, to 0:34:30.960 --> 0:34:32.520 all women, our voices matter. 0:34:32.960 --> 0:34:34.799 And it's up to us. 0:34:34.600 --> 0:34:38.000 To continue to stand with these young women as well, 0:34:38.040 --> 0:34:41.480 who will inherit what we leave behind and ensure that 0:34:41.560 --> 0:34:44.960 they remain in a country that protects them and protects 0:34:45.000 --> 0:34:48.320 their freedom and protects their voices, protects their bodies, protects 0:34:48.320 --> 0:34:50.840 their safety. That work is still on us to do, 0:34:51.280 --> 0:34:54.600 and the loss of that work on Tuesday that we 0:34:54.800 --> 0:34:58.759 endured doesn't change that. It just in my view, makes 0:34:58.800 --> 0:35:01.440 it all the more urgent. And history teaches us every 0:35:01.440 --> 0:35:04.200 time we as a people have reacted to setbacks with 0:35:04.320 --> 0:35:08.680 a stronger organization, with a stronger determination to push forward. 0:35:08.800 --> 0:35:13.200 We have one and every advancement throughout our history has 0:35:13.280 --> 0:35:16.160 involved setbacks. So we have to see this as that, 0:35:16.400 --> 0:35:17.719 and not a lot not to see it as a 0:35:17.719 --> 0:35:19.239 reason to give up. I know a lot of people 0:35:19.280 --> 0:35:20.759 want to walk away. It's a lot easier to just 0:35:20.840 --> 0:35:22.880 least say I want to leave the country. You know, 0:35:22.920 --> 0:35:25.600 I'm done. It's okay to feel that in this moment. 0:35:25.640 --> 0:35:28.280 We all felt that in twenty sixteen. But we also 0:35:28.360 --> 0:35:30.480 have to at least and a lot of people I'm 0:35:30.520 --> 0:35:32.840 CaCu in Michigan are seeing this as an opportunity to 0:35:32.880 --> 0:35:34.280 say not on our watch. 0:35:34.520 --> 0:35:36.680 And this story is not over, you know, the story of. 0:35:36.640 --> 0:35:37.520 The Women of Michigan. 0:35:37.520 --> 0:35:38.080 It's not over. 0:35:38.320 --> 0:35:40.520 This maybe the sequel to twenty twenty, but it's not 0:35:40.520 --> 0:35:42.480 the end of the trilogy. And we're coming back. 0:35:42.760 --> 0:35:46.040 Yeah. I think that's really important, and I think it's 0:35:46.080 --> 0:35:48.399 important to be clear that it was the setback, but 0:35:48.440 --> 0:35:52.040 that also it is an opportunity to learn a lot 0:35:52.080 --> 0:35:53.840 of stuff and then to keep. 0:35:53.640 --> 0:35:57.640 Going right, Yeah, and to learn from everything. And we 0:35:57.680 --> 0:35:59.400 do this and on my team, whether it was the 0:35:59.640 --> 0:36:02.719 after math of the twenty twenty election, whether it's you know, 0:36:02.760 --> 0:36:05.560 twenty twenty four and the aftermath we're about to experience. 0:36:05.840 --> 0:36:08.800 Use everything to get stronger, use everything to get wiser, 0:36:09.000 --> 0:36:11.840 use everything to get to get better, because that's what 0:36:11.920 --> 0:36:14.520 the issues and the people that we fight for deserve 0:36:14.640 --> 0:36:17.799 and require. And so for me, it's really hard in 0:36:17.880 --> 0:36:20.080 moments like this. You want to give up, who want 0:36:20.080 --> 0:36:21.520 to walk away, You want to say this is too hard, 0:36:21.520 --> 0:36:22.920 and they ever go to win. I'm up against too 0:36:22.920 --> 0:36:25.759 many powerful forces. The richest guy in the world and 0:36:25.840 --> 0:36:27.600 soon to be, you know, one of the most powerful 0:36:27.640 --> 0:36:28.840 elected people in the world. 0:36:28.920 --> 0:36:29.919 How do we fight that? 0:36:30.040 --> 0:36:33.160 It's easy to feel small, But those forces that want 0:36:33.239 --> 0:36:36.200 us to feel small will win if we allow them. 0:36:36.080 --> 0:36:37.080 To make us feel that way. 0:36:37.120 --> 0:36:38.879 If we don't give up on the ideals that brought 0:36:38.920 --> 0:36:41.120 us to the fight to begin with, we can keep going. 0:36:41.239 --> 0:36:43.520 And I would argue that if we do give up 0:36:43.560 --> 0:36:47.080 on the ideals and the values of inclusion and equality 0:36:47.320 --> 0:36:50.720 and freedom and protecting the vulnerable, everything that that brings 0:36:50.800 --> 0:36:52.719 us to the arena. If we give up on that, 0:36:52.880 --> 0:36:56.040 then it's a guarantee that those ideals fail to define 0:36:56.040 --> 0:36:58.000 who we are as a nation. But if we stand 0:36:58.000 --> 0:37:00.360 in the arena and we keep fighting, that's our best 0:37:00.360 --> 0:37:02.799 shot and our only shot to ensure that we have 0:37:02.880 --> 0:37:06.560 a chance to ensure our nation and our republic reflects 0:37:06.600 --> 0:37:10.160 the best of what we've always been since our founding. Yeah, 0:37:10.480 --> 0:37:12.200 I have a book coming out in May. I'm not 0:37:12.360 --> 0:37:14.160 like saying this to promote it. I'm just saying that 0:37:14.239 --> 0:37:16.640 this is like for me. This is why I wrote 0:37:16.680 --> 0:37:18.920 that book after twenty twenty, is to say we all 0:37:18.960 --> 0:37:21.759 have to be warriors, and we can't allow setbacks or 0:37:21.760 --> 0:37:25.040 things out of our control or losses to do anything 0:37:25.040 --> 0:37:27.120 other than make us better warriors for who we are 0:37:27.200 --> 0:37:30.000 and the communities we fight for. So in this moment, 0:37:30.040 --> 0:37:31.680 we have to ask ourselves, how are we going to 0:37:31.680 --> 0:37:34.680 pick ourselves back up, dust ourselves off, keep going, and 0:37:34.800 --> 0:37:37.280 use this as a moment to build our stronger muscles 0:37:37.320 --> 0:37:39.960 to you know, just like athletes. I'm a marathon and 0:37:40.000 --> 0:37:42.440 we run long distances, our muscles break down and then 0:37:42.440 --> 0:37:44.480 they come back stronger. So this is a time in 0:37:44.520 --> 0:37:48.520 which we is a community, can feel that weakness, and 0:37:48.640 --> 0:37:51.160 let's use that weakness to come back stronger. And if 0:37:51.160 --> 0:37:53.279 we can focus our energy on that, then we can 0:37:53.360 --> 0:37:57.200 and will succeed. History teaches us that unequivocally. 0:37:57.560 --> 0:38:00.480 Yeah, no, it's true. I mean, the other or bright 0:38:00.480 --> 0:38:05.320 spot if we're gonna feel better about this rushing electoral 0:38:05.840 --> 0:38:09.399 shit show, is that the Republicans have controlled the House 0:38:09.440 --> 0:38:13.440 for two years and they have been absolutely awful at it, 0:38:13.640 --> 0:38:16.759 and every piece of legislation they've managed to pass has 0:38:16.840 --> 0:38:20.000 been they've had to have democratic help. So you know, 0:38:20.040 --> 0:38:23.640 they'll have an equally small margin if they don't lose 0:38:23.680 --> 0:38:27.360 the House of Representatives. So there is some bit of 0:38:28.160 --> 0:38:28.959 good news there. 0:38:29.520 --> 0:38:32.720 Yeah, there is always reason to help, and there's always 0:38:32.719 --> 0:38:35.920 a reminder that the reason why these issues, whether it 0:38:35.960 --> 0:38:38.440 be reproductive freedom, or whether it be just sort of 0:38:38.560 --> 0:38:41.440 keeping our kids safe in schools, or you know, everything 0:38:41.480 --> 0:38:44.000 that making sure we can have clean water, drink, clean air, 0:38:44.040 --> 0:38:46.120 and a breathe, everything that we fight for, there's a 0:38:46.160 --> 0:38:47.359 reason we have to fight for it. 0:38:47.360 --> 0:38:49.919 It's because the infrastructure. 0:38:49.320 --> 0:38:50.759 Of the world is not set up to make those 0:38:50.760 --> 0:38:53.840 things automatic guarantees They're only given to us when we 0:38:53.920 --> 0:38:56.319 demand them. And just like democracy only survives when we 0:38:56.360 --> 0:38:58.640 fight for it. So this is an opportunity for us 0:38:58.640 --> 0:39:00.719 to all ask ourselves, you know, what are we going 0:39:00.760 --> 0:39:02.359 to fight for? What are we going to stand for? 0:39:02.480 --> 0:39:05.040 And the power of the people will always be more 0:39:05.080 --> 0:39:08.520 powerful and greater than the people in power, And we 0:39:08.560 --> 0:39:11.399 can't forget that in moments like this, Even though there's 0:39:11.440 --> 0:39:13.719 so many different reasons to forget it, there's many more 0:39:13.719 --> 0:39:16.080 reasons to remember the strength that we come when we 0:39:16.120 --> 0:39:18.239 come together and don't give up. And I think we 0:39:18.280 --> 0:39:22.320 can push forward with courage, with dignity and with grace 0:39:22.719 --> 0:39:25.160 and you know, living all of our values and fighting 0:39:25.160 --> 0:39:28.000 for what we believe in. If we continue to build solidarity, 0:39:28.000 --> 0:39:30.080 to build unity, and to be there for each other, 0:39:30.160 --> 0:39:32.239 to stand up for each other, that's when we as 0:39:32.280 --> 0:39:34.880 a country are at our best and no one leader 0:39:35.080 --> 0:39:37.600 gets to define us in a way that doesn't reflect 0:39:37.640 --> 0:39:40.440 those best ideals. We can still maintain the ability to 0:39:40.440 --> 0:39:42.319 show the world who we are. It's only if we 0:39:42.360 --> 0:39:44.280 give up on that then truly we have lost. 0:39:44.480 --> 0:39:46.359 So are you going to be able to push back 0:39:46.400 --> 0:39:48.360 on Project twenty twenty? And what does that look like. 0:39:48.680 --> 0:39:51.600 Yeah, I mean, we have to see how things play out, 0:39:51.600 --> 0:39:53.800 and I think there are a lot of entities and 0:39:53.920 --> 0:39:57.560 organizations planning out. We still need to yet see what 0:39:57.640 --> 0:39:59.960 Congress looks like. Here in Michigan, we still have the 0:40:00.040 --> 0:40:02.360 executive branch, we have the state Senate. So there's a 0:40:02.360 --> 0:40:05.040 lot we can do to define what that pushback should 0:40:05.080 --> 0:40:07.160 look like, you know, whether it's in the environment, whether 0:40:07.200 --> 0:40:10.000 it's in education. And then there's also, you know, a 0:40:10.040 --> 0:40:13.360 parallel track of just keeping notes and planning for the 0:40:13.400 --> 0:40:16.080 next opportunity to lead the country and what that's going 0:40:16.160 --> 0:40:17.560 to look like. And I'm sure there's again a lot, 0:40:17.600 --> 0:40:19.960 there's a whole cohort of people doing that. It's about 0:40:20.120 --> 0:40:24.160 staying vigilant, staying engaged, people who have scoured through Project 0:40:24.160 --> 0:40:26.680 twenty twenty five, scouring through it now on coming up 0:40:26.680 --> 0:40:29.960 with a plan in response for every action it telegraphs. 0:40:30.640 --> 0:40:32.520 That's the type of work we all need to be doing, 0:40:32.520 --> 0:40:34.359 and doing it together. You know, this is not the 0:40:34.400 --> 0:40:39.440 time to descend into our own disunity. I guess, for 0:40:39.520 --> 0:40:41.479 lack of a better word, this is not the time 0:40:41.520 --> 0:40:43.360 to point arrows at each other. This is not the 0:40:43.400 --> 0:40:45.120 time to say you did this wrong, or you did 0:40:45.160 --> 0:40:47.120 that bad and use that as a way to kind 0:40:47.120 --> 0:40:49.600 of demoralize us even more. This is the time for 0:40:49.680 --> 0:40:51.680 us to say, yeah, we all messed up, we miss 0:40:51.760 --> 0:40:53.560 the mark. These are the reasons why. This is what 0:40:53.560 --> 0:40:54.840 we're going to learn from it, and this is what 0:40:54.880 --> 0:40:57.200 we're going to come back stronger. That's what the winning 0:40:57.239 --> 0:40:59.880 team does, right every I've thought about this a lot 0:41:00.000 --> 0:41:03.080 over the last few days. Everyone who's ever accomplished anything 0:41:03.120 --> 0:41:07.000 has face setbacks. That's that's reality. The question is always 0:41:07.040 --> 0:41:08.880 what do you do next? And that's what we as 0:41:08.920 --> 0:41:12.719 a like as women, need to ask ourselves. What do 0:41:12.719 --> 0:41:14.799 we do next? That's really the question, And what do 0:41:14.840 --> 0:41:17.360 we do next? Given Project twenty five? What alliances we 0:41:17.640 --> 0:41:20.319 do we build, what solidarity do we build? And if 0:41:20.360 --> 0:41:22.600 we can stay in that space as opposed to space 0:41:22.640 --> 0:41:25.440 about tearing each other down or picking things apart, Like 0:41:25.480 --> 0:41:27.680 I'm not interested in that. Let's not waste understand that, 0:41:28.040 --> 0:41:32.279 let's learn together from our mishaps, show grace to those 0:41:32.320 --> 0:41:35.000 who perhaps fell short. But everyone still has to stay 0:41:35.000 --> 0:41:37.120 in the arena because if we leave, we lose. But 0:41:37.160 --> 0:41:38.719 if we stay in it and we fight, we can 0:41:38.719 --> 0:41:39.120 still win. 0:41:39.280 --> 0:41:41.520 Yeah, yeah, I think that's a really good point. 0:41:41.400 --> 0:41:44.719 As the Vice President so beautifully articulated right in her 0:41:44.840 --> 0:41:47.800 concession speech, which was as much as a concessiant speech 0:41:47.840 --> 0:41:49.879 as it was a call to action for the nation 0:41:50.320 --> 0:41:52.879 to stay vigilant and stay engaged and stay in the fight. 0:41:53.120 --> 0:41:56.920 Maybe that's also just how I respond to things, like 0:41:57.000 --> 0:41:58.920 I take the hit, but then I say, Okay, how 0:41:58.920 --> 0:42:00.000 do I punch back stronger? 0:42:00.200 --> 0:42:00.399 Right? 0:42:00.480 --> 0:42:03.040 Like, That's that's what being a warrior is than a fighter. 0:42:03.080 --> 0:42:05.919 But at the same time, I think, you know, there's 0:42:06.160 --> 0:42:08.919 a clear message that was sent in this election, which 0:42:08.960 --> 0:42:10.920 is that people are hurting and they're looking for people 0:42:10.920 --> 0:42:13.880 who will fight for them. And in this case, Trump 0:42:14.000 --> 0:42:17.080 made the case, even if it was disingenuous, even if 0:42:17.080 --> 0:42:19.359 we could pick it apart, they felt he would fight 0:42:19.400 --> 0:42:21.200 for them, and they showed up for him. And so 0:42:21.320 --> 0:42:23.640 how do we what lessons do we learn from that? 0:42:23.640 --> 0:42:26.719 That's the type of conversation we need to have right now. Yeah, 0:42:26.840 --> 0:42:27.839 are you feeling. 0:42:27.800 --> 0:42:30.000 I feel like shit? I don't know. I had the 0:42:30.080 --> 0:42:33.440 last episode. I apologize to everyone from getting the election 0:42:33.640 --> 0:42:38.040 so wrong. I personally just really like Vice President Harrison 0:42:38.160 --> 0:42:41.640 thinks she's smart and they did. Actually, I mean I 0:42:41.719 --> 0:42:44.879 was just talking to a straight reporter on this who 0:42:44.960 --> 0:42:48.160 was talking about how in many ways the campaign did 0:42:48.200 --> 0:42:51.040 a lot of very smart stuff which helped the Senate 0:42:51.120 --> 0:42:55.400 candidates in some of these swing states, which is really interesting. 0:42:55.840 --> 0:42:59.640 I'm very disappointed. I also think black women they did 0:42:59.680 --> 0:43:03.239 so much much for us, so it is very I 0:43:03.280 --> 0:43:06.680 feel like it's just a very bleak. It just feels 0:43:06.840 --> 0:43:10.360 very painful to watch the group that you put together 0:43:10.480 --> 0:43:14.360 who really did come out have to watch that disappointment 0:43:14.600 --> 0:43:18.200 is I hate. And then also it's just hard. I 0:43:18.239 --> 0:43:21.640 also am really scared because I've asked, like between feeling 0:43:22.160 --> 0:43:24.880 a little better because I know how bad Republicans are 0:43:24.920 --> 0:43:28.799 at governing, and also I know how wildly unpopular a 0:43:28.840 --> 0:43:31.120 lot of the ideas in Project twenty twenty five are, 0:43:31.600 --> 0:43:34.920 right like, you know, it's all fun and games until 0:43:34.960 --> 0:43:38.440 a concentration camp ends up on your block, right Like, 0:43:38.600 --> 0:43:41.399 So a lot of that stuff is not popular. And 0:43:41.680 --> 0:43:45.879 I know how ambitious a lot of this agenda is 0:43:46.080 --> 0:43:48.400 and how hard it is to implement. It's hard to 0:43:48.440 --> 0:43:52.960 implement good stuff, it's equally hard to implement bad stuff. 0:43:53.400 --> 0:43:56.279 So that makes me feel a little better, but you know, 0:43:56.480 --> 0:43:57.600 it does not feel good. 0:43:58.719 --> 0:44:02.160 I know, you know, I would say, yeah, I think 0:44:02.360 --> 0:44:05.319 it's and it's important. I think to give space to 0:44:05.360 --> 0:44:07.120 all that in this moment. 0:44:07.840 --> 0:44:11.719 I really appreciate you coming on yeah, onward, I think 0:44:11.840 --> 0:44:15.680 is the most important thing to feel to just, you know, 0:44:16.200 --> 0:44:19.080 make sure we don't give up and make sure we 0:44:19.560 --> 0:44:20.640 continue to fight. 0:44:23.440 --> 0:44:24.920 A moment. 0:44:27.680 --> 0:44:32.600 Jesse Cannon Somali, this is a sad story. What are 0:44:32.640 --> 0:44:33.279 you seeing here? 0:44:33.400 --> 0:44:36.640 So Trump received forty six percent of the Latino vote 0:44:36.640 --> 0:44:39.759 compared to thirty five percent four years ago, and Associated 0:44:39.760 --> 0:44:43.040 Press poll shows, and that's the most support Latinos have 0:44:43.080 --> 0:44:47.360 ever shown a Republican presidential candidate. And this is Donald Trump, 0:44:47.400 --> 0:44:51.279 who is calling for mass deportation, who is saying that 0:44:51.719 --> 0:44:56.200 Mexicans in many cases are quote criminals, drug dealers, rapists, 0:44:56.200 --> 0:44:59.279 et cetera. So he's also said that immigrants poison the 0:44:59.280 --> 0:45:02.239 blood of our kind. A lot of these Latinos will 0:45:02.280 --> 0:45:09.160 be targeted for deportation. So it's a pretty bleak thing 0:45:09.400 --> 0:45:14.320 to see people vote against their own interests so profoundly. 0:45:14.640 --> 0:45:17.200 And I wanted to bring it up, not because it's 0:45:17.440 --> 0:45:20.440 fuckery in the fact that it's funny, but fuckery in 0:45:20.480 --> 0:45:24.400 the fact that it's so dark and profoundly and disheartening. 0:45:25.080 --> 0:45:29.520 That's it for this episode of Fast Politics. Tune in 0:45:29.760 --> 0:45:35.200 every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday, and Saturday to hear the best 0:45:35.280 --> 0:45:39.560 minds and politics make sense of all this chaos. If 0:45:39.560 --> 0:45:42.640 you enjoy this podcast, please send it to a friend 0:45:43.080 --> 0:45:46.320 and keep the conversation going. Thanks for listening.