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Speaker 1: Maggie, what did you take away from your recent visit

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Speaker 1: to death Rout? Was there something surprising or you know,

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Speaker 1: was it kind of what you expected?

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Speaker 2: I mean, I think I was surprised that the person

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Speaker 2: I was visiting is still in good spirits after having

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Speaker 2: multiple stays of execution, being within twenty minutes of being

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Speaker 2: killed by the state, having that last meal, the fact

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Speaker 2: that he can still smile, make jokes, be excited for life.

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Speaker 3: Still.

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Speaker 4: I don't even know how to put into words the

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Speaker 4: way that it.

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Speaker 2: Made me feel, but I think it made me feel

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Speaker 2: like so many of my problems in a daily basis

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Speaker 2: are so insignificant, and I think that was just so.

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Speaker 4: The willpower is amazing.

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Speaker 5: Well, tex is crazy and they've tried to kill me

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Speaker 5: five times, so I believe that they were very serious

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Speaker 5: about that. But I think with the evidence we have

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Speaker 5: now that there's no way they're going to have to

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Speaker 5: let me go, and they're going to have to acknowledge

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Speaker 5: that I'm innocent.

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Speaker 6: I don't see any other way.

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Speaker 4: From Lava for good. This is wrongful conviction with Maggie

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Speaker 4: Freeling today Hank Skinner on December thirty first, nineteen ninety three,

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Speaker 4: thirty one year old Hank Skinner was pregaming for a

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Speaker 4: New Year's Eve party. He was with his girlfriend of

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Speaker 4: seven months, forty one year old Twila Busby, and her

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Speaker 4: two adult children, Scooter and Randy. Hank passed out before

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Speaker 4: ten PM from a potent combination of vodka, codine, and xanax.

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Speaker 4: Despite his condition, Twila left for the party without him.

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Speaker 4: When she turned she was strangled and bludgeoned to death.

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Speaker 4: Her two sons were stabbed to death. Hank was the

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Speaker 4: sole survivor and was instantly the prime suspect, despite evidence

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Speaker 4: that Hank was incapable of committing these murders and that

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Speaker 4: another more probable person of interest exists. Hank has spent

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Speaker 4: nearly thirty years on Texas death row awaiting execution.

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Speaker 6: I'm sixty years old.

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Speaker 5: I've spent my whole, the best years of my life

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Speaker 5: in here, from thirty to sixty.

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Speaker 6: I want out of here. I shouldn't be here. I

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Speaker 6: never should have been here to start with.

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Speaker 4: Hank Skinner was born on April fourth, nineteen sixty two.

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Speaker 4: He's the oldest of four kids.

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Speaker 6: I'm from Virginia, Okay.

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Speaker 5: I was born in the foothills of the Blue Ridge

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Speaker 5: Mountains in Franklin County, Virginia, which is the moonshine capital

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Speaker 5: of the United States.

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Speaker 4: His dad was part of the local industry. He was

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Speaker 4: a foreign car mechanic as well as a moonshiner.

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Speaker 5: See had three eight hundred gallons steam steels and fired

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Speaker 5: on butane. He made the best sugar liquor you've ever drank,

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Speaker 5: and see moonshine. If it's made correctly, it's a lot

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Speaker 5: better than store bought liquor. And so my dad's stuff

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Speaker 5: burned clear, and I mean he was about one hundred

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Speaker 5: and forty proof. You can just get a four ounce

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Speaker 5: glass to do ice cubes.

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Speaker 6: And sip on it all.

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Speaker 7: So did you just grew up drinking moonshine?

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Speaker 6: Yeah? Sure.

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Speaker 7: When was the first time you drank it?

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Speaker 6: Six years old? And I stole it from my dad.

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Speaker 4: Growing up, Hank felt like he had the best parents

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Speaker 4: in the world. He takes pride that he was named

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Speaker 4: after his dad.

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Speaker 5: I'm actually a junior, but when my dad passed, I

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Speaker 5: took his name and so now I'm just Henry Skinner

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Speaker 5: Hank Skinner.

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Speaker 6: Hank is a nickname for Henry.

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Speaker 5: He loved Hank Williams sor and I love Hank Williams

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Speaker 5: Junior and Hank the Third.

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Speaker 7: I love them all.

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Speaker 6: Yeah. Out of the same.

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Speaker 4: Way, Hank learned a lot from his dad.

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Speaker 6: Like my dad, he taught me how to slaughter hogs

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Speaker 6: and slaughter.

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Speaker 4: Cow and he worked for his dad too young. Hank

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Speaker 4: was a skilled laborer and free spirit.

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Speaker 5: We were just a bunch of wild, rambunctious kids having

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Speaker 5: a good time. We had field keg parties and cow pastors.

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Speaker 5: There was bikers up there everywhere. That's who I grew

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Speaker 5: up with.

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Speaker 4: But Hank also had a soft spot for the female

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Speaker 4: role models in his life. Like his mom and grandma,

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Speaker 4: Hank grew up learning a lot from them, including how

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Speaker 4: to respect women.

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Speaker 5: If you want to find out anything in life that

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Speaker 5: really means.

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Speaker 6: Something, find out from a woman.

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Speaker 5: They know how to do everything, and so I can sew,

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Speaker 5: I can alter clothes. I used to make dresses for

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Speaker 5: my little sister on my mama's sewing machine. I make quilts.

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Speaker 5: I know how to do everything. I know how to

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Speaker 5: can vegetables, you know, out of the garden. We used

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Speaker 5: to do this every year. Where the women aren't the shit.

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Speaker 5: That's all there is to it.

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Speaker 6: You know what I mean.

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Speaker 4: Hank also learned a lot about women after he married

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Speaker 4: quite young.

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Speaker 5: I was nineteen, my wife was sixteen, and we had

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Speaker 5: just gotten married because she was already pregnant.

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Speaker 6: I had a daughter, Natalie Joe. I was so in

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Speaker 6: love with her when she was born.

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Speaker 4: Natalie Joe was the light of Hank's life, but Hank's

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Speaker 4: marriage to Natalie Joe's mother was another story. He and

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Speaker 4: his wife struggled to get along. According to Hank, she

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Speaker 4: had substance abuse issues.

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Speaker 6: She was strung out on cocaine. Well, we had a

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Speaker 6: big argument to fight going on all the time, and so.

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Speaker 5: She's my daughter. Stayed with her mother. That was the

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Speaker 5: only thing that was acceptable to her. My mama wanted her,

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Speaker 5: but she wouldn't let my mama have her. And so

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Speaker 5: my wife was doing crazy things when we divorce.

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Speaker 6: So I just said, fuck this, I'm done. I left

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Speaker 6: and I went first to Georgia.

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Speaker 4: They're in Georgia. Hank worked at a casino who's high

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Speaker 4: earning customers were catered to by women.

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Speaker 5: And these are gamblers and they're high rollers, and so

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Speaker 5: they want woman on their arm.

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Speaker 6: You know.

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Speaker 4: Hank took it upon himself to look out for these.

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Speaker 6: Women if they get two hands.

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Speaker 5: Yet'm like, you know, I'm the guy who steps in

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Speaker 5: and tells them, no, no, no, you know it.

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Speaker 6: Can't be doing that.

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Speaker 5: And so you ever seen that movie Roadhouse with Patrick Sways,

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Speaker 5: Because that's what I did. I was a cooler just

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Speaker 5: like he was in that movie, but not in a

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Speaker 5: bar in the gambling establishment. And so I lived in

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Speaker 5: an old, old ramshackle rooming house that had three stories

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Speaker 5: and had big stucco porch on the top. And so

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Speaker 5: I could sit up there and drink beer and smoke

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Speaker 5: weed and watch all the cars go by and holler

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Speaker 5: at the girls.

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Speaker 6: I was the rooster of the hymn house.

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Speaker 4: I had it all in his mind. Hank was living

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Speaker 4: the life.

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Speaker 7: So how'd you wind up in Texas?

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Speaker 6: So when I came out here, I came out here because.

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Speaker 5: I wanted to break out in the oil field, because

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Speaker 5: I heard about the oil field. It was a good

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Speaker 5: place to make money, and I did. I made a

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Speaker 5: lot of money out here. I ended up moving to Pampa.

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Speaker 5: It's an oldfield.

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Speaker 4: Town, and Pampa Hank found kindred spirits in the lifestyle

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Speaker 4: he enjoyed, but soon he was charged and convicted for

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Speaker 4: unauthorized use of a motor vehicle and was on parole.

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Speaker 4: He started going to AA as part of his parole,

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Speaker 4: and that's where he met Tila Busby.

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Speaker 5: These two guys were picking on her, and so I

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Speaker 5: dried up for tears and I talked to her and

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Speaker 5: got her all right.

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Speaker 6: She was just they were just drilling. I mean the

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Speaker 6: way they were, mister, what.

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Speaker 7: Were they picking on her for?

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Speaker 5: She's a whore or she's a sorry bitch? She drank

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Speaker 5: you know, she ain't never go sober up.

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Speaker 6: It was just horrible. So anyway, I ended up giving

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Speaker 6: her a ride home.

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Speaker 4: On the way, Hank asked if she wanted to stop

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Speaker 4: for a cup of coffee.

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Speaker 5: And we sit down and started talking and it was like,

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Speaker 5: just like instantly, we've been together for fifty years.

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Speaker 6: I mean, she was so easy to talk to.

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Speaker 5: And she told me, she said, I have never met

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Speaker 5: anybody like you in my life.

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Speaker 6: What are you some kind of magician? And I'm like,

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Speaker 6: why do you say that? She said, I don't know.

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Speaker 5: But since I sit down and just started talking to you,

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Speaker 5: I just started feeling some kind of way.

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Speaker 4: Twila and Hank started spending all their time together.

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Speaker 6: Twilight and I our soulmates.

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Speaker 5: We could just look at each other and know what

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Speaker 5: Kinether was thinking and what to say, you know.

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Speaker 6: And whenever we went to another people's house.

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Speaker 5: She always said, in my life, people said we were

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Speaker 5: like two high school kids and we were so in love.

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Speaker 7: Well, she was a lot older than you, right.

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Speaker 5: Ten years, that's not a lot.

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Speaker 4: Twila had two sons, Elwyn, who went by Scooter, was

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Speaker 4: twenty two and Randy was twenty, and Hank took on

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Speaker 4: the young men as his own. The three of them

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Speaker 4: had even worked together in a landscaping business. Hank had

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Speaker 4: a previous hand injury that left his right dominant hand

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Speaker 4: virtually useless, so the boys were a big help.

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Speaker 5: So I laid out the plans and showed them what

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Speaker 5: to do and how to do it, and they did

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Speaker 5: all the manual labor and we made good money.

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Speaker 4: Everything was going great for Twila and Hank until seven

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Speaker 4: months into their relationship New Year's Eve nineteen ninety three,

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Speaker 4: when it all came crashing down. This episode is underwritten

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Speaker 4: by AIG, a leading global insurance company. AIG is committed

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Speaker 4: to corporate social responsibility and to making a positive difference

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Speaker 4: in the lives of its employees and in the communities

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Speaker 4: where we work and live. In light of the compelling

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Speaker 4: need for pro bono legal assistance, and in recognition of

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Speaker 4: AIG's commitment to criminal and social justice reform, the AIG

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Speaker 4: pro Bono Program provides free legal services and other support

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Speaker 4: to underrepresented communities and individuals. On December thirty one, nineteen

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Speaker 4: ninety three, Hank, Twila, and Twila's sons were all at

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Speaker 4: home preparing for their evening celebration. Although it could be

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Speaker 4: a dangerous combination, Hank took some xanax and drank the

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Speaker 4: better part of a fifth of vodka, and then he

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Speaker 4: accidentally started sipping Twila's drink, not realizing that she had

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Speaker 4: spiked it with codine.

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Speaker 6: Back in class.

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Speaker 5: Looked the same as mine, and I grabbed it and

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Speaker 5: drank from it, and I had no.

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Speaker 6: Idea what was in it.

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Speaker 4: Hank wound up passing out that night from the combination

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Speaker 4: of substances. He also says he's allergic to codin.

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Speaker 6: It makes me sick, it gives me vertigo.

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Speaker 5: I can't stand up, it makes me very lethargic, I

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Speaker 5: lose my balance, I can't talk well. It feels like

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Speaker 5: my throat was constricting, like my lungs are full of cotton.

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Speaker 5: I can't get a deep breath.

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Speaker 7: Do you remember feeling any of that? Were you already

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Speaker 7: really drunk?

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Speaker 5: I remember feeling all of that before I passed out.

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Speaker 4: Around ten fifteen pm, Hank and Twila's friend Howard Mitchell

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Speaker 4: came to pick them up to drive them to attend

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Speaker 4: his New Yar's Eve party. When Howard arrived, he found

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Speaker 4: Hank in a practically comatose state. He tried to rouse

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Speaker 4: his friend but got no reaction. According to Howard, Hank

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Speaker 4: was out cold, so he and Twila left for the

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Speaker 4: party without Hank.

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Speaker 7: So but nobody called nine one one to make sure

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Speaker 7: you're okay.

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Speaker 5: We're all a bunch of partiers. Everybody passes out. How

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Speaker 5: many times a year have been no party?

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Speaker 6: And that's three or four?

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Speaker 5: Motherfucker's land on learn in the corners And I've been

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Speaker 5: passed out before.

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Speaker 6: But not like that.

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Speaker 4: At the party, Twyla encountered her uncle, Robert Dennell. He

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Speaker 4: was incredibly drunk, following Twyla around and making sexual advances.

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Speaker 4: They had previously had a sexual relationship. Although Twila's consent

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Speaker 4: to the relationship was questionable. She had allegedly told people

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Speaker 4: her uncle had raped her more than once. Twila got

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Speaker 4: uncomfortable and Howard took her home. They arrived back sometime

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Speaker 4: between eleven and eleven fifteen after the What happened is

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00:13:01,200 --> 00:13:06,880
Speaker 4: not totally clear, but here's how Hank remembers it. Sometime

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00:13:06,960 --> 00:13:10,040
Speaker 4: that night, Hank says he was shaken awake by Scooter

243
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Speaker 4: and when I.

244
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Speaker 6: First woke up, I couldn't. I couldn't. I couldn't see

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Speaker 6: where the fuck I was at. I couldn't. I don't

246
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Speaker 6: know it. I couldn't think in words, and I'm seeing

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Speaker 6: blood all over the walls, but I didn't recognize it

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Speaker 6: as well. I'm thinking what in the fuck? And people

249
00:13:30,800 --> 00:13:32,360
Speaker 6: slinging all over this living room.

250
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Speaker 5: And so he got me up and he give me

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Speaker 5: my pants and he told me put them on.

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Speaker 6: We got to get the fuck out of here. And yes,

253
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Speaker 6: and I didn't.

254
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Speaker 4: Know that Scooter had been stabbed in the chest and

255
00:13:44,880 --> 00:13:47,800
Speaker 4: stomach area, but he was still managing to move around

256
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Speaker 4: and was trying to save both of their lives.

257
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Speaker 6: He said, he said, we got to get out of here, Hank.

258
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Speaker 6: They're coming back, and I'm thinking who's coming back? What

259
00:13:56,800 --> 00:13:58,120
Speaker 6: the fuck are you talking about?

260
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Speaker 5: You remember him saying they were come, yes, yes, and

261
00:14:01,840 --> 00:14:04,480
Speaker 5: he was saying it in a high streamed voice.

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Speaker 6: That's one of the things I remember.

263
00:14:07,600 --> 00:14:10,720
Speaker 4: Scooter was a big guy, six foot six and about

264
00:14:10,720 --> 00:14:14,120
Speaker 4: two hundred and twenty five pounds, and despite his injuries,

265
00:14:14,440 --> 00:14:16,880
Speaker 4: he was able to lift Hank up and help him out.

266
00:14:18,040 --> 00:14:20,280
Speaker 7: Was anything registering at this point.

267
00:14:23,360 --> 00:14:28,080
Speaker 6: Now feeling whatever has happened is bad. This is bad.

268
00:14:28,120 --> 00:14:29,600
Speaker 6: We have got to get the fuck out here.

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00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:33,480
Speaker 5: But I wasn't thinking in words. I was just thinking

270
00:14:33,600 --> 00:14:34,560
Speaker 5: in emotions.

271
00:14:37,920 --> 00:14:40,840
Speaker 4: Still unsteady on his feet, Hank started looking around.

272
00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:43,560
Speaker 5: But when I did, I lost my balance and fell

273
00:14:43,640 --> 00:14:47,760
Speaker 5: face forward in the floor. And so I remember looking

274
00:14:47,800 --> 00:14:50,840
Speaker 5: across the floor, got up on my elbows trying to

275
00:14:50,880 --> 00:14:53,080
Speaker 5: get up, and I couldn't do it. And I remember

276
00:14:53,160 --> 00:14:56,160
Speaker 5: looking across the floor and I could see my girlfriend,

277
00:14:56,480 --> 00:14:59,000
Speaker 5: and all I could see was a mass of her hair,

278
00:15:00,280 --> 00:15:05,880
Speaker 5: blood of black tinting the edges of everything, and everything

279
00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:07,760
Speaker 5: was looking alternately red and green.

280
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Speaker 6: But her face was gone.

281
00:15:13,280 --> 00:15:16,440
Speaker 4: Twila had been strangled and bludging to death. Someone had

282
00:15:16,520 --> 00:15:19,280
Speaker 4: hit her fourteen times in the head with the handle

283
00:15:19,320 --> 00:15:21,880
Speaker 4: of a pickaxe, When she was found, her pants were

284
00:15:21,960 --> 00:15:27,480
Speaker 4: unzipped and her shirt was lifted up. As Hank was

285
00:15:27,520 --> 00:15:30,360
Speaker 4: still trying to absorb everything, Scooter was pulling him to

286
00:15:30,360 --> 00:15:33,920
Speaker 4: go check on his younger brother, Randy, And so we.

287
00:15:33,960 --> 00:15:36,040
Speaker 5: Get in the bedroom and he leans me against the

288
00:15:36,120 --> 00:15:39,000
Speaker 5: dresser so we can see about his brother. And I

289
00:15:39,000 --> 00:15:41,360
Speaker 5: couldn't even stand up, even holding on with the dresser,

290
00:15:41,400 --> 00:15:44,240
Speaker 5: and I fell in the floor. And this is something

291
00:15:44,280 --> 00:15:47,720
Speaker 5: I remember. I don't remember falling, I don't remember trying

292
00:15:47,720 --> 00:15:51,520
Speaker 5: to get up, but I remember looking up at him,

293
00:15:52,000 --> 00:15:53,920
Speaker 5: and he's looking at his brother, and he's got this

294
00:15:54,120 --> 00:15:58,000
Speaker 5: horribly sad expression on his face, and so I know

295
00:15:58,120 --> 00:15:58,640
Speaker 5: he's dead.

296
00:16:01,200 --> 00:16:03,480
Speaker 4: Randy had been stabbed in the heart through his back

297
00:16:03,520 --> 00:16:05,880
Speaker 4: while he was asleep. He had died on the top

298
00:16:05,960 --> 00:16:08,040
Speaker 4: level of the bunk bed he shared with Scooter.

299
00:16:09,080 --> 00:16:12,160
Speaker 5: That's when I realized my hand was cut, and I

300
00:16:12,160 --> 00:16:15,240
Speaker 5: didn't know how it had gotten cut, but I had

301
00:16:15,720 --> 00:16:19,200
Speaker 5: a vague memory of somebody standing over top of me

302
00:16:19,360 --> 00:16:22,960
Speaker 5: with a knife and I threw my hands up and

303
00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:24,880
Speaker 5: they cut my hand and it was burning.

304
00:16:26,320 --> 00:16:30,440
Speaker 6: And so I didn't know if that really happened to her,

305
00:16:30,440 --> 00:16:31,680
Speaker 6: if I was just dreaming it.

306
00:16:33,360 --> 00:16:36,080
Speaker 4: Hank wasn't dreaming that his hand was cut. That was real.

307
00:16:36,440 --> 00:16:38,760
Speaker 4: He and Scooter moved through the house trying to escape,

308
00:16:39,080 --> 00:16:41,760
Speaker 4: but they were bleeding everywhere, and.

309
00:16:41,680 --> 00:16:44,160
Speaker 5: So we got out in the backyard and we went

310
00:16:44,200 --> 00:16:46,880
Speaker 5: through the gate, and I didn't know where we were going,

311
00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:47,640
Speaker 5: but we had.

312
00:16:47,480 --> 00:16:49,360
Speaker 6: To get the fuck out of there, that's all I knew.

313
00:16:50,320 --> 00:16:55,000
Speaker 6: And so I fell in the alley and he told.

314
00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:57,320
Speaker 5: Me, Hank, I can't keep picking you up. And I said,

315
00:16:57,320 --> 00:16:59,520
Speaker 5: don't worry about me, just go go get help.

316
00:16:59,680 --> 00:17:01,600
Speaker 6: Got help, and.

317
00:17:01,520 --> 00:17:04,520
Speaker 5: So I remember seeing him walk off towards the street

318
00:17:04,600 --> 00:17:09,720
Speaker 5: light through the alley.

319
00:17:13,760 --> 00:17:16,600
Speaker 4: Hank passed out again, so he didn't know that Scooter

320
00:17:16,680 --> 00:17:19,160
Speaker 4: had made it to the neighbor's porch, where he finally

321
00:17:19,200 --> 00:17:22,960
Speaker 4: succumbed to his wounds and collapsed. A neighbor found Scooter

322
00:17:23,080 --> 00:17:26,040
Speaker 4: and called nine one one, and he was immediately brought

323
00:17:26,080 --> 00:17:30,359
Speaker 4: to the hospital. There at twelve forty five am, Scooter died.

324
00:17:33,840 --> 00:17:36,520
Speaker 4: When the police showed up and found out where Scooter lived,

325
00:17:36,720 --> 00:17:40,560
Speaker 4: they immediately went to the house. When they arrived, they

326
00:17:40,640 --> 00:17:45,600
Speaker 4: found a massacre. There was a trail of blood from

327
00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:48,280
Speaker 4: the fence to the front porch. The front storm door

328
00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:52,159
Speaker 4: was smeared with blood. Once inside, police found multiple bloody

329
00:17:52,200 --> 00:17:56,400
Speaker 4: handprints on doors and doorknobs in the bedroom, kitchen, utility room,

330
00:17:56,640 --> 00:18:00,480
Speaker 4: and on the door leading out to the backyard, along

331
00:18:00,560 --> 00:18:03,920
Speaker 4: with bloody handprints and blood smeared throughout the house. Police

332
00:18:03,960 --> 00:18:07,440
Speaker 4: also found a black plastic trash bag containing a wet,

333
00:18:07,520 --> 00:18:11,639
Speaker 4: brown stained towel and a knife. They found the bloody

334
00:18:11,640 --> 00:18:14,959
Speaker 4: pickaxe handle used to bludge in Twila, as well as

335
00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:17,800
Speaker 4: a knife that was on the porch. They also found

336
00:18:17,800 --> 00:18:21,600
Speaker 4: a man's windbreaker, and of course, the bodies of Twila

337
00:18:21,640 --> 00:18:31,040
Speaker 4: and Randy. Almost immediately the police started looking for Hank,

338
00:18:31,320 --> 00:18:34,879
Speaker 4: the living boyfriend. They found him at Andrea Joyce Reid's house,

339
00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:38,240
Speaker 4: where Hank had gone for help after he came to consciousness.

340
00:18:38,640 --> 00:18:41,399
Speaker 4: Andrea was a neighbor and she was also a Hank's

341
00:18:41,400 --> 00:18:44,440
Speaker 4: sex girlfriend. Hank became the prime suspect.

342
00:18:45,320 --> 00:18:47,920
Speaker 3: The reason he was accused of the crime, I think

343
00:18:48,040 --> 00:18:50,920
Speaker 3: is because in fact he was the only survivor from

344
00:18:51,000 --> 00:18:54,600
Speaker 3: the scene, which was both very lucky because the assailant

345
00:18:54,760 --> 00:18:57,919
Speaker 3: didn't kill Hank, but it's also very unlucky because it

346
00:18:57,960 --> 00:19:00,520
Speaker 3: meant all the fingers were immediately pointed at him.

347
00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:01,840
Speaker 4: This is Rob Owen.

348
00:19:02,440 --> 00:19:05,399
Speaker 3: I'm a lawyer. I live in Chicago. For many years

349
00:19:05,440 --> 00:19:08,840
Speaker 3: I practiced in Texas doing mostly death penalty cases, and

350
00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:11,199
Speaker 3: during that time was when I became one of the

351
00:19:11,240 --> 00:19:15,240
Speaker 3: members of Hank Skinner's defense team. The police assumed that

352
00:19:15,320 --> 00:19:17,639
Speaker 3: this was an open and shot case. They assumed that

353
00:19:17,760 --> 00:19:20,000
Speaker 3: he had to be the killer. He had some of

354
00:19:20,040 --> 00:19:23,359
Speaker 3: the blood of Twila Busby and the other victims on

355
00:19:23,480 --> 00:19:25,320
Speaker 3: his clothing, for example.

356
00:19:25,359 --> 00:19:28,280
Speaker 4: And Hank says the blood very likely came from touching

357
00:19:28,320 --> 00:19:30,199
Speaker 4: Twila to see if she was okay.

358
00:19:30,560 --> 00:19:33,439
Speaker 3: I think that was all. It was very easy for

359
00:19:33,480 --> 00:19:35,680
Speaker 3: the cops to assume that they had the right guy.

360
00:19:37,400 --> 00:19:40,080
Speaker 4: Hank was taken to the police station and booked, but

361
00:19:40,119 --> 00:19:42,399
Speaker 4: he was still so messed up from the alcohol and

362
00:19:42,480 --> 00:19:45,560
Speaker 4: codeine that he couldn't even stand on his own while

363
00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:48,440
Speaker 4: his photograph was taken. The police had to hold him up.

364
00:19:48,640 --> 00:19:51,480
Speaker 4: He was eventually taken to the hospital. Hank's cut hand

365
00:19:51,600 --> 00:19:55,000
Speaker 4: was treated and he voluntarily gave blood samples. Results of

366
00:19:55,000 --> 00:19:58,440
Speaker 4: those samples were used to calculate Hank's blood alcohol levels

367
00:19:58,480 --> 00:20:01,040
Speaker 4: at the approximate time of the murder. They showed that

368
00:20:01,080 --> 00:20:04,680
Speaker 4: at the time, Hank's blood alcohol content was almost three

369
00:20:04,920 --> 00:20:08,520
Speaker 4: times the drunk driving standard, and his codeine level was

370
00:20:08,600 --> 00:20:12,199
Speaker 4: two and a half times the recommended dose, and so

371
00:20:13,160 --> 00:20:15,000
Speaker 4: this is Hank's alibi.

372
00:20:15,640 --> 00:20:18,600
Speaker 3: Hank couldn't have committed this murder of these murders because

373
00:20:18,720 --> 00:20:22,400
Speaker 3: he was simply physically incapable at the time of carrying

374
00:20:22,440 --> 00:20:22,800
Speaker 3: them out.

375
00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:26,560
Speaker 4: Remember, Hank was virtually comatose when Howard came to pick

376
00:20:26,600 --> 00:20:29,000
Speaker 4: him up for the party, and Twyla came home from

377
00:20:29,000 --> 00:20:32,439
Speaker 4: that party only about an hour later. Hank couldn't have

378
00:20:32,520 --> 00:20:35,520
Speaker 4: possibly sobered up by the time the murders transpired.

379
00:20:36,400 --> 00:20:39,320
Speaker 3: Hank could only have been able to sort of at

380
00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:43,000
Speaker 3: most stand and stagger like That would have been about

381
00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:47,480
Speaker 3: the sum of his physical ability based on the volume

382
00:20:47,520 --> 00:20:53,480
Speaker 3: of alcohol and codeine in his bloodstream.

383
00:20:53,680 --> 00:20:56,719
Speaker 4: Police searched the house for ten days without a warrant,

384
00:20:57,080 --> 00:21:00,960
Speaker 4: but they failed to collect key evidence, including bloody finger

385
00:21:01,040 --> 00:21:04,840
Speaker 4: and handprints. Vaginal swabs were taken from Twila, and despite

386
00:21:04,880 --> 00:21:08,480
Speaker 4: one detective urging him to do so, Gary Stallings, the

387
00:21:08,480 --> 00:21:11,679
Speaker 4: criminalist who was leading the forensics team, did not believe

388
00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:15,400
Speaker 4: Twila was raped and did not have the swabs tested.

389
00:21:15,920 --> 00:21:19,000
Speaker 4: None of the evidence directly linked Hank to the crime.

390
00:21:19,440 --> 00:21:22,080
Speaker 4: Yes his bloody handprints were there, but he also lived

391
00:21:22,119 --> 00:21:24,600
Speaker 4: in the house and says he was attacked. There was

392
00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:28,959
Speaker 4: also DNA and at least one handprint that was not Hank's, Twila's,

393
00:21:29,040 --> 00:21:34,280
Speaker 4: scooters or Randy's, but despite all of that, Hank was

394
00:21:34,320 --> 00:21:37,360
Speaker 4: prosecuted for the murders. His trial began a little over

395
00:21:37,359 --> 00:21:41,080
Speaker 4: a year later, in March nineteen ninety five, he faced

396
00:21:41,200 --> 00:21:52,879
Speaker 4: the death penalty. District Attorney John Mann was the prosecutor

397
00:21:52,880 --> 00:21:56,359
Speaker 4: in the case. At trial, Man rested his argument on

398
00:21:56,440 --> 00:22:01,000
Speaker 4: two key testimonies, that of state witnesses Howard Mitchell and

399
00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:04,320
Speaker 4: Andrea Joyce read. No actual forensics linking Hank to the

400
00:22:04,320 --> 00:22:07,919
Speaker 4: crime were presented at trial. In fact, Stalling's the criminalist,

401
00:22:08,280 --> 00:22:11,440
Speaker 4: conceded that just because the evidence proved Hank was there

402
00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:14,880
Speaker 4: at the house does not identify him as the murderer.

403
00:22:15,359 --> 00:22:17,960
Speaker 4: Howard Mitchell testified for the state and said that Hank

404
00:22:18,119 --> 00:22:21,000
Speaker 4: was completely comatose when he arrived to take them to

405
00:22:21,040 --> 00:22:23,880
Speaker 4: his party, But he also said that when Twyla's uncle,

406
00:22:23,960 --> 00:22:26,920
Speaker 4: Robert Dennell, was harassing her at his house, Howard took

407
00:22:26,920 --> 00:22:29,639
Speaker 4: her home and that they shared a friendly kiss on

408
00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:33,960
Speaker 4: the porch. Man used Howard's testimony to argue that Hank

409
00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:39,200
Speaker 4: killed Twila, Scooter and Randy in a jealous rage. Andrea

410
00:22:39,280 --> 00:22:43,360
Speaker 4: Joyce Reid, Hank's sex girlfriend and neighbor, also testified.

411
00:22:42,920 --> 00:22:45,160
Speaker 3: Because she came in and said, well, when he got

412
00:22:45,200 --> 00:22:48,240
Speaker 3: to my house on the night of the crime, he

413
00:22:48,400 --> 00:22:51,840
Speaker 3: was behaving in ways that didn't seem that messed up.

414
00:22:51,880 --> 00:22:55,760
Speaker 3: He was obviously intoxicated, but he was able to walk

415
00:22:55,800 --> 00:22:58,000
Speaker 3: into the house under his own steam. He was able

416
00:22:58,040 --> 00:23:01,080
Speaker 3: to take off his shirt. He was able to stitch

417
00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:03,880
Speaker 3: up the severe cut that he had sustained on one

418
00:23:03,920 --> 00:23:08,000
Speaker 3: hand using thread and needles that Andrea Reid provided him.

419
00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:12,280
Speaker 4: Her testimony was a blow for the defense. Harold Comer,

420
00:23:12,440 --> 00:23:15,280
Speaker 4: who happened to be a former prosecutor, was Hank's court

421
00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:19,200
Speaker 4: appointed defense attorney. Comer argued that Hank survived the attacks

422
00:23:19,240 --> 00:23:22,000
Speaker 4: because the perpetrator didn't perceive him as a threat in

423
00:23:22,040 --> 00:23:25,760
Speaker 4: his condition. He also argued that Hank's pre existing injury

424
00:23:25,880 --> 00:23:28,919
Speaker 4: had left his right hand with nerve and tissue damage,

425
00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:31,240
Speaker 4: he did not have the strength to carry out these

426
00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:36,320
Speaker 4: brutal murders. William T. Lowry, a forensic toxicologist for the defense,

427
00:23:36,680 --> 00:23:40,160
Speaker 4: also said that it was quote highly improbable that Hank

428
00:23:40,240 --> 00:23:43,399
Speaker 4: could have committed the murders based on how intoxicated he was.

429
00:23:43,760 --> 00:23:46,439
Speaker 4: In a later afi David he added to his argument.

430
00:23:46,680 --> 00:23:49,960
Speaker 4: He said, quote, mister Skinner, at best would have been

431
00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:54,199
Speaker 4: in a stuporous state, barely able to stand without assistance,

432
00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:58,840
Speaker 4: and completely without the physical coordination or mental acuity required

433
00:23:59,040 --> 00:24:04,240
Speaker 4: to commit these murders by strangulation, beating, and stabbing end quote.

434
00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:08,320
Speaker 4: According to doctor Lowry, Hank was likely exerting whatever strength

435
00:24:08,359 --> 00:24:11,560
Speaker 4: and energy he had just to stand up and walk.

436
00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:14,280
Speaker 4: Based on Hank's bloody handprints around the walls of the

437
00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:16,840
Speaker 4: house and his inability to stand for a photo at

438
00:24:16,880 --> 00:24:21,520
Speaker 4: the police station, this was likely the case. Hank's defense

439
00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:25,760
Speaker 4: attorney also presented Twyla's uncle, Robert Dnell, as an alternate suspect,

440
00:24:26,080 --> 00:24:28,680
Speaker 4: but he failed to make a strong case of reasonable

441
00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:32,360
Speaker 4: doubt for Hank, and on March eighteenth, nineteen ninety five,

442
00:24:32,760 --> 00:24:35,600
Speaker 4: the jury deliberated for only two and a half hours

443
00:24:35,720 --> 00:24:39,400
Speaker 4: before finding Hank guilty. Five days later, they handed him

444
00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:40,400
Speaker 4: a death sentence.

445
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:44,320
Speaker 5: And I just can't believe they're done this to me

446
00:24:44,920 --> 00:24:47,639
Speaker 5: because I'm innocent, and they know they knew I was

447
00:24:47,680 --> 00:24:50,439
Speaker 5: innocent before they arrested me.

448
00:25:05,640 --> 00:25:08,480
Speaker 8: The fact that a country in the Western world still

449
00:25:08,600 --> 00:25:11,440
Speaker 8: executed citizens is beyond shocking.

450
00:25:12,080 --> 00:25:14,200
Speaker 4: This is Sandrine, a yourge skinner.

451
00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:18,359
Speaker 8: I am French, spending half my time in Texas and

452
00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:20,000
Speaker 8: half moss time in France.

453
00:25:20,400 --> 00:25:22,840
Speaker 4: Sandrine and Hank have been married since two thousand and eight,

454
00:25:23,280 --> 00:25:25,560
Speaker 4: and Hank is anxious to get out of prison so

455
00:25:25,600 --> 00:25:28,600
Speaker 4: they can be together. Because of the pandemic, they hadn't

456
00:25:28,720 --> 00:25:33,040
Speaker 4: seen or heard each other for almost three years until recently.

457
00:25:33,880 --> 00:25:37,160
Speaker 4: So for three years, you guys have just been writing letters.

458
00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:39,240
Speaker 8: Yeah, that's correct.

459
00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:44,800
Speaker 4: How did you hear about Hank? And you know you're

460
00:25:44,840 --> 00:25:45,520
Speaker 4: in France?

461
00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:48,840
Speaker 7: What interested you? And somebody in Houston, Texas?

462
00:25:49,200 --> 00:25:49,520
Speaker 6: Well?

463
00:25:50,280 --> 00:25:52,639
Speaker 8: I had a friend in France who was a young lawyer,

464
00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:56,000
Speaker 8: and he wrote his thesis on the death penalty in

465
00:25:56,080 --> 00:25:58,840
Speaker 8: Texas and he sent me a copy. I read it

466
00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:02,000
Speaker 8: and I just of my chair. I couldn't believe that

467
00:26:02,080 --> 00:26:05,800
Speaker 8: the legal system in the US was so poor and

468
00:26:05,880 --> 00:26:09,000
Speaker 8: so flawed. And he told me at the time about

469
00:26:09,040 --> 00:26:11,800
Speaker 8: an organization that was set up and run by the

470
00:26:11,880 --> 00:26:15,240
Speaker 8: death row prisoners in Texas, and they had a sort

471
00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:18,719
Speaker 8: of a trimesterral newsletter, and he said you know, if

472
00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:21,639
Speaker 8: you want to translate it in French, we could distribute

473
00:26:21,720 --> 00:26:23,760
Speaker 8: in France and get people, you know, a bit more

474
00:26:23,800 --> 00:26:26,480
Speaker 8: aware about what's going on there. And so I did

475
00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:28,840
Speaker 8: a couple of times, and he said, well, she want

476
00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:32,240
Speaker 8: to correspond with people there, I'm thinking of free guys.

477
00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:34,320
Speaker 8: I'm sure you'll get along with. And Hank was one

478
00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:37,240
Speaker 8: of those three guys. That's how we started writing in

479
00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:38,720
Speaker 8: nineteen ninety six.

480
00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:44,560
Speaker 4: Sandrine says they corresponded for about four years before she

481
00:26:44,600 --> 00:26:47,040
Speaker 4: went to visit Hank on death Row, a place where

482
00:26:47,080 --> 00:26:51,040
Speaker 4: prisoners are confined in cells alone and do everything alone.

483
00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:53,600
Speaker 4: When she met Hank on death Row, that when she

484
00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:55,840
Speaker 4: felt he was more than just a pen pal.

485
00:26:56,480 --> 00:27:00,919
Speaker 8: And you know, he's very smart, he's very funny, is

486
00:27:01,520 --> 00:27:04,800
Speaker 8: very strong, as you can imagine with what he's been through.

487
00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:10,439
Speaker 8: And we just clicked instantly, even at a distance and

488
00:27:10,520 --> 00:27:13,320
Speaker 8: in writing, and we clicked even more when we met.

489
00:27:13,680 --> 00:27:15,800
Speaker 4: In what ways I mean you might think, you know,

490
00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:18,520
Speaker 4: you see your world's apart. Literally, I mean, you're we

491
00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:19,800
Speaker 4: are bom.

492
00:27:19,840 --> 00:27:23,080
Speaker 7: In France and he's a man on death row.

493
00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:28,040
Speaker 8: Totally different culture, different background. Well, yeah, you know, kindred spirits.

494
00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:30,440
Speaker 8: I guess no, no borders.

495
00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:32,760
Speaker 4: So you guys have never been able to be intimate

496
00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:35,560
Speaker 4: in any kind of way. You've never even touched his hand.

497
00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:39,800
Speaker 8: No, never, What is that like? It's well, I'm not

498
00:27:39,840 --> 00:27:42,199
Speaker 8: a maso kiss. But honestly, it is a torture. It

499
00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:45,480
Speaker 8: is a torture. It really is a torture because you

500
00:27:45,560 --> 00:27:48,600
Speaker 8: look sometimes, you know, when you even with your friends.

501
00:27:48,640 --> 00:27:50,679
Speaker 8: I mean, I don't know here in the US, but

502
00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:53,919
Speaker 8: in France we are very filly, touchy. We need to

503
00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:58,640
Speaker 8: be close. We kiss, we hag, so you know someone's

504
00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:03,560
Speaker 8: sent the skill. You know a lot of things. So basically,

505
00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:06,919
Speaker 8: our sensorial memories of each other's are the sound of

506
00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:10,399
Speaker 8: our voices and our eyes and the look in our eyes.

507
00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:15,280
Speaker 8: And not knowing his skin, not being able to comfort

508
00:28:15,359 --> 00:28:16,480
Speaker 8: him is very.

509
00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:16,920
Speaker 3: Very hard.

510
00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:26,359
Speaker 4: Through the years, Sandrine has flown back and forth between

511
00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:29,280
Speaker 4: France and Houston to visit Hank on death row. Although

512
00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:32,800
Speaker 4: she was not originally involved in Hank's innocent claim, Sandrine

513
00:28:32,880 --> 00:28:35,040
Speaker 4: eventually became convinced of his innocence.

514
00:28:35,600 --> 00:28:40,560
Speaker 8: And I read tons and tons of paperwork, and to

515
00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:44,640
Speaker 8: me it was obvious, I mean physically scientifically, for a

516
00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:47,800
Speaker 8: number of reasons, it was very clear that he was innocent.

517
00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:51,480
Speaker 4: And indeed the one key witness that Hank's fate rested on.

518
00:28:51,840 --> 00:28:56,280
Speaker 4: Andrea Joyce Reid recanted her statement here's rabo and again.

519
00:28:56,600 --> 00:28:59,560
Speaker 3: After Hank was convicted and set to death row, and

520
00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:04,760
Speaker 3: contacted Hank's lawyers and said that testimony wasn't true. I

521
00:29:04,840 --> 00:29:07,600
Speaker 3: was really afraid because I thought I was likely to

522
00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:10,400
Speaker 3: be accused of being some sort of accomplice or having

523
00:29:10,480 --> 00:29:13,040
Speaker 3: assisted Hank in some way that would put me into

524
00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:15,840
Speaker 3: legal jeopardy. She was at the time trying to regain

525
00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:18,360
Speaker 3: custody of a child, and she thought that that would

526
00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:23,280
Speaker 3: certainly be unlikely if the authorities were angry at her

527
00:29:23,440 --> 00:29:26,160
Speaker 3: or believed she had some role in this crime. So

528
00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:31,040
Speaker 3: she essentially went to trial and exaggerated systemically and repeatedly

529
00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:33,960
Speaker 3: the things that Hank was able to do. What she

530
00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:38,320
Speaker 3: said in her recantation was in fact, Hank was not

531
00:29:38,440 --> 00:29:40,400
Speaker 3: able to get into the house on his own. She

532
00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:44,120
Speaker 3: had to go outside basically drag him up the steps

533
00:29:44,120 --> 00:29:45,000
Speaker 3: and into the house.

534
00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:49,400
Speaker 4: But when she recanted, Prosecutor Man was not pleased.

535
00:29:49,720 --> 00:29:54,000
Speaker 3: John Mann dragged Andrea Reid before a grand jury after

536
00:29:54,080 --> 00:29:58,200
Speaker 3: she gave her affidavit recanting her trial testimony and threatened

537
00:29:58,200 --> 00:30:02,040
Speaker 3: to prosecute her for perjury as she persisted, and to

538
00:30:02,120 --> 00:30:05,880
Speaker 3: her great credit, she did not back away from the recantation,

539
00:30:06,040 --> 00:30:09,840
Speaker 3: and she said, I don't want false testimony on my conscience,

540
00:30:09,880 --> 00:30:11,920
Speaker 3: and so I'm going to stick now telling the truth

541
00:30:11,960 --> 00:30:14,840
Speaker 3: now matter what the consequences for me personally are. But

542
00:30:15,080 --> 00:30:17,440
Speaker 3: I think that says a lot about mister Mann that

543
00:30:17,560 --> 00:30:20,520
Speaker 3: he was willing to threaten to prosecute her in order

544
00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:22,400
Speaker 3: to keep her truth from coming out.

545
00:30:23,560 --> 00:30:28,160
Speaker 4: Hank filed multiple appeals, one based on Andrew's recantation, but

546
00:30:28,360 --> 00:30:31,160
Speaker 4: clearly none were sufficient for the court to free him.

547
00:30:31,400 --> 00:30:35,160
Speaker 4: He was only met with execution dates. Sandrina and Hank

548
00:30:35,240 --> 00:30:39,320
Speaker 4: kept up their relationship for nearly fifteen years before Hank

549
00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:43,240
Speaker 4: got another execution date in March twenty ten. This time

550
00:30:43,440 --> 00:30:45,680
Speaker 4: it was serious. He was transferred to one of the

551
00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:51,160
Speaker 4: cells near the death chamber in Huntsville, Texas.

552
00:30:51,400 --> 00:30:53,960
Speaker 5: They kill my first brand March the second, they kill

553
00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:56,400
Speaker 5: my second brand March the eleventh. Then a were won't

554
00:30:56,480 --> 00:30:59,080
Speaker 5: kill me in March twenty four or thirteen days later?

555
00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:00,360
Speaker 6: What is that?

556
00:31:00,480 --> 00:31:02,480
Speaker 7: What is that like when you when you know you're

557
00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:03,360
Speaker 7: gonna die.

558
00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:10,720
Speaker 5: It's indescribable. The last seven days, you don't sleep at all.

559
00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:16,520
Speaker 5: You're hyper vigilance. Your mind starts unrolling all of the

560
00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:19,080
Speaker 5: things you've done in your life that you wish you

561
00:31:19,120 --> 00:31:24,600
Speaker 5: hadn't die, the things you could have done better. I'm

562
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:26,880
Speaker 5: sitting there looking at that gurney that they're fixing to

563
00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:27,320
Speaker 5: put me on.

564
00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:29,440
Speaker 6: I could see it through the door. They had the

565
00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:30,120
Speaker 6: door open.

566
00:31:31,000 --> 00:31:33,560
Speaker 5: I could see the microphone, I could see the straps,

567
00:31:33,800 --> 00:31:37,520
Speaker 5: arm boards, and I was absolutely convinced I was fixing

568
00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:38,280
Speaker 5: to die.

569
00:31:38,880 --> 00:31:40,880
Speaker 6: I just, I just knew that I was.

570
00:31:40,840 --> 00:31:43,560
Speaker 5: Gonna die, because the courtsy just give me the short

571
00:31:43,640 --> 00:31:46,480
Speaker 5: shrift every time we had filled something like fuck you,

572
00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:49,280
Speaker 5: fuck you die die, and so.

573
00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:53,040
Speaker 6: Uh, I felt like that was it.

574
00:31:54,120 --> 00:31:55,240
Speaker 7: Did you get a last meal?

575
00:31:55,560 --> 00:31:56,160
Speaker 6: Yes? I did?

576
00:31:56,520 --> 00:31:56,920
Speaker 3: What was it?

577
00:31:57,200 --> 00:31:57,320
Speaker 6: Uh?

578
00:31:57,480 --> 00:32:02,960
Speaker 5: Popeye's fried chicken, a cheese, a double cheeseburger with onions

579
00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:11,600
Speaker 5: and tomatoes, no lettuce, and chocolate pudding, chocolate cake, and

580
00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:12,840
Speaker 5: a chocolate milkshake.

581
00:32:14,600 --> 00:32:16,320
Speaker 6: And I ain't every bit of it.

582
00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:26,040
Speaker 4: Fortunately, Hank's execution was stayed by the US Supreme Court

583
00:32:26,320 --> 00:32:31,000
Speaker 4: less than an hour before he was set to be killed. Today,

584
00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:33,840
Speaker 4: Hank spends his time as a jail house attorney helping

585
00:32:33,840 --> 00:32:36,840
Speaker 4: other prisoners with the law and their cases, and although

586
00:32:36,840 --> 00:32:40,200
Speaker 4: he's in solitary on death row, incarcerated people do have

587
00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:43,040
Speaker 4: a right to provide legal help to one another, so

588
00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:50,560
Speaker 4: that's really his only social interactions. Hank has maintained his

589
00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:54,600
Speaker 4: innocence for nearly thirty years to this day. He believes

590
00:32:54,600 --> 00:32:58,160
Speaker 4: he was framed by Twyla's uncle, Bob Dennell, and at

591
00:32:58,200 --> 00:33:02,760
Speaker 4: one of Hank's later hearings, longtime neighbor Deborah Ellis testified

592
00:33:02,840 --> 00:33:05,160
Speaker 4: that she saw Denell in his yard a few days

593
00:33:05,240 --> 00:33:08,480
Speaker 4: after the murders took place. He was giving a frenzied

594
00:33:08,560 --> 00:33:11,520
Speaker 4: cleaning to his old beat up pickup truck, taking out

595
00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:14,920
Speaker 4: the seats, throwing away the carpet, and scrubbing the floorboards

596
00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:18,760
Speaker 4: with an astringent cleaner. Ellis found his behavior strange because

597
00:33:18,960 --> 00:33:26,440
Speaker 4: Robert reportedly rarely cleaned his truck. Hank's theory is that

598
00:33:26,520 --> 00:33:29,800
Speaker 4: after Twila left the party with Howard, Denell followed them home.

599
00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:32,800
Speaker 4: When Howard Mitchell testified at trial, he said that when

600
00:33:32,800 --> 00:33:35,800
Speaker 4: he returned to the party, Dinell was gone. Hank thinks

601
00:33:35,840 --> 00:33:38,080
Speaker 4: he left to confront Twila at home and when he

602
00:33:38,080 --> 00:33:41,280
Speaker 4: saw Hank passed out. He left him as the sole survivor,

603
00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:45,160
Speaker 4: knowing how that would look. And if you remember, there

604
00:33:45,240 --> 00:33:48,680
Speaker 4: was a men's windbreaker jacket that was taken as evidence.

605
00:33:49,120 --> 00:33:50,760
Speaker 4: However it was never tested.

606
00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:56,400
Speaker 3: Clearly has potential evidentiary value. It's got blood spatter on

607
00:33:56,480 --> 00:34:00,560
Speaker 3: the sleeves, it's got sweat stains on the collar, on

608
00:34:00,600 --> 00:34:01,800
Speaker 3: the interior lining.

609
00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:05,360
Speaker 4: Over the years, Rob and Hank's team have tried to

610
00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:07,720
Speaker 4: test all the evidence they could, but.

611
00:34:08,200 --> 00:34:10,360
Speaker 3: It was only once we got into court that the

612
00:34:10,360 --> 00:34:12,480
Speaker 3: state came in and said, oh, well, we don't know

613
00:34:12,520 --> 00:34:15,080
Speaker 3: what happened to the jacket. The jacket is lost. And

614
00:34:15,440 --> 00:34:18,319
Speaker 3: it's also a little weird that it's the only piece

615
00:34:18,360 --> 00:34:20,879
Speaker 3: of evidence that they say is lost. Right, they had

616
00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:22,400
Speaker 3: all the other evidences of the scene. They've got the

617
00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:25,360
Speaker 3: blood swabs, they got the knives, they've got fingernail clippings,

618
00:34:25,400 --> 00:34:28,799
Speaker 3: they've got hairs, but somehow they managed to lose an

619
00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:33,120
Speaker 3: object as large as a man's windbreaker jacket. So I'm

620
00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:36,040
Speaker 3: not going to vouch for their claim to have lost

621
00:34:36,120 --> 00:34:38,680
Speaker 3: this jacket. I think they should still be looking for

622
00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:39,200
Speaker 3: this jacket.

623
00:34:40,160 --> 00:34:42,080
Speaker 4: DNA testing that was able to be done on the

624
00:34:42,080 --> 00:34:44,840
Speaker 4: items from the crime scene has been completed, none of

625
00:34:44,840 --> 00:34:48,000
Speaker 4: the results have implicated Hank as the murderer. However, the

626
00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:50,920
Speaker 4: courts ruled that even if the DNA testing and results

627
00:34:50,920 --> 00:34:53,400
Speaker 4: had been available at the time of trial, it's not

628
00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:57,120
Speaker 4: reasonably probable that the jury would have found him not guilty,

629
00:34:57,480 --> 00:35:00,520
Speaker 4: meaning the judge who decided the verdict would have reached

630
00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:03,920
Speaker 4: the same conclusion. Hank has appealed this to the Texas

631
00:35:03,960 --> 00:35:15,719
Speaker 4: Highest Criminal Court. It's currently pending a decision. When I

632
00:35:15,760 --> 00:35:18,279
Speaker 4: met with Hank at the Polenski Death Row unit, I

633
00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:20,200
Speaker 4: asked him, do.

634
00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:22,840
Speaker 7: You wish you were killed that night instead of winding

635
00:35:22,920 --> 00:35:23,279
Speaker 7: up here?

636
00:35:25,200 --> 00:35:30,160
Speaker 5: There have been times when I wish that, because, especially

637
00:35:30,200 --> 00:35:33,319
Speaker 5: in the first days after this happened and I was

638
00:35:33,360 --> 00:35:34,120
Speaker 5: in jail.

639
00:35:33,880 --> 00:35:37,200
Speaker 6: Cell by myself, it would have been so much better,

640
00:35:37,880 --> 00:35:38,560
Speaker 6: you know what I mean.

641
00:35:40,880 --> 00:35:45,480
Speaker 5: I just could not believe that they were gone. I mean,

642
00:35:45,520 --> 00:35:47,640
Speaker 5: the three people I love most in this world.

643
00:35:47,719 --> 00:35:49,440
Speaker 6: Her sons were my best friends.

644
00:35:50,080 --> 00:35:57,200
Speaker 5: We spend all our time together, and so to wake

645
00:35:57,280 --> 00:35:57,760
Speaker 5: up one.

646
00:35:57,640 --> 00:36:01,960
Speaker 6: Morning and there it is all gone, And you know,

647
00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:06,440
Speaker 6: survivor's guilt. I didn't do this. There's nothing in the

648
00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:07,799
Speaker 6: world that could have made me do it.

649
00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:13,759
Speaker 5: But I felt so responsible because I was the king

650
00:36:13,800 --> 00:36:18,080
Speaker 5: of that castle, and instead of passed out drunk on

651
00:36:18,160 --> 00:36:20,560
Speaker 5: the fucking couch, I should have been awake and able

652
00:36:20,600 --> 00:36:21,360
Speaker 5: to do something.

653
00:36:39,200 --> 00:36:41,759
Speaker 7: Can you envisional life outside of here?

654
00:36:42,680 --> 00:36:43,000
Speaker 6: Sure?

655
00:36:43,800 --> 00:36:44,560
Speaker 7: What does that look like?

656
00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:46,280
Speaker 6: I'm gonna be with saying dream?

657
00:36:46,840 --> 00:36:48,080
Speaker 7: Do you think you'll go to France?

658
00:36:48,719 --> 00:36:49,359
Speaker 6: Absolutely?

659
00:36:49,719 --> 00:36:50,520
Speaker 7: You're gonna get out of here?

660
00:36:50,520 --> 00:36:53,360
Speaker 5: Oh way, I'm out of this country. They let me

661
00:36:53,400 --> 00:36:55,399
Speaker 5: out of here. I'm so out of here, it ain't

662
00:36:55,440 --> 00:36:55,840
Speaker 5: fund you.

663
00:36:56,239 --> 00:36:56,960
Speaker 7: Do you think you're going.

664
00:36:56,960 --> 00:36:57,359
Speaker 6: To get out?

665
00:37:00,520 --> 00:37:04,840
Speaker 5: Well? Takes us crazy, and they've tried to kill me

666
00:37:04,920 --> 00:37:09,880
Speaker 5: five times, so I believe that they're very serious about that.

667
00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:12,759
Speaker 6: But I think with the evidence we.

668
00:37:12,760 --> 00:37:17,360
Speaker 5: Have now that there's no way they're gonna have to

669
00:37:17,440 --> 00:37:19,759
Speaker 5: let me go, and they're gonna have to acknowledge that

670
00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:20,279
Speaker 5: I'm in this.

671
00:37:20,640 --> 00:37:23,360
Speaker 6: I don't see any other way, you know.

672
00:37:23,560 --> 00:37:29,200
Speaker 5: I think, after all I've suffered that I deserve a chance.

673
00:37:30,040 --> 00:37:32,560
Speaker 5: I deserve to be with my wife, I deserve to

674
00:37:32,600 --> 00:37:34,920
Speaker 5: have a life. I deserve to be released and get

675
00:37:34,960 --> 00:37:35,799
Speaker 5: the hell out of here.

676
00:37:35,920 --> 00:37:40,680
Speaker 6: And I won't out. I'm telling you something, you know.

677
00:37:40,920 --> 00:37:44,479
Speaker 5: It was just so amazing to find love a second time,

678
00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:47,200
Speaker 5: and I love her endlessly.

679
00:37:46,840 --> 00:37:51,280
Speaker 6: Man, and I mean, we are really truly so a maze.

680
00:37:56,680 --> 00:37:59,520
Speaker 4: Hank is still eligible for execution, but he will knock

681
00:37:59,560 --> 00:38:02,440
Speaker 4: it a new ta as long as litigation is pending.

682
00:38:06,200 --> 00:38:07,799
Speaker 4: If you want to help Hank, you can go to

683
00:38:08,120 --> 00:38:15,680
Speaker 4: Justice for Hank dot org, forward Slash Help Next Time.

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00:38:15,800 --> 00:38:21,040
Speaker 4: On Wrongful Conviction with Maggie Freeling Carla Bidet, they were.

685
00:38:20,920 --> 00:38:24,800
Speaker 9: Telling me that I abuse Kit. It was painful because

686
00:38:25,280 --> 00:38:28,880
Speaker 9: I love this Kit so much. She's thinking that you

687
00:38:29,120 --> 00:38:35,160
Speaker 9: abuse somebody so innocent, and then they were saying that.

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00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:41,840
Speaker 4: I did that. Thank you for listening to Wrongful Conviction

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00:38:41,960 --> 00:38:46,160
Speaker 4: with Maggie Freeling. Please support your local innocence organizations and

690
00:38:46,200 --> 00:38:48,040
Speaker 4: go to the links in our bio to see how

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00:38:48,080 --> 00:38:51,160
Speaker 4: you can help. I'd like to thank our executive producers

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00:38:51,280 --> 00:38:53,960
Speaker 4: Jason Flamm and Kevin Wortis, as well as our senior

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00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:59,160
Speaker 4: producer Annie Chelsea, researcher Lila Robinson, story editor Sonya Paul

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00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:02,759
Speaker 4: with a dish production by Jeff Cleiburn and Connor Hall.

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00:39:03,200 --> 00:39:06,240
Speaker 4: The music in this production is by three time OSCAR

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00:39:06,280 --> 00:39:09,600
Speaker 4: nominated composer Jay Ralph. Be sure to follow us on

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00:39:09,640 --> 00:39:14,080
Speaker 4: Instagram at Wrongful Conviction on Facebook at Wrongful Conviction podcast

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00:39:14,280 --> 00:39:17,000
Speaker 4: and on Twitter at Wrongful Conviction, as well as at

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00:39:17,080 --> 00:39:20,279
Speaker 4: Lava for Good. On all three platforms, you can also

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00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:23,640
Speaker 4: follow me on both Instagram and Twitter at Maggie Freeling.

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00:39:24,160 --> 00:39:27,440
Speaker 4: Wrongful Conviction with Maggie Freeling is a production of Lava

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00:39:27,480 --> 00:39:39,439
Speaker 4: for Good Podcasts in association with Signal Company Number one