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Speaker 1: He's the Drive with Dale Lolly and Matt Williamson on

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Speaker 1: Home of the Black and Gold Steelers Nation Radio. Welcome back.

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Speaker 1: I am Dale Lolly here with Matt Williamson and Matt

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Speaker 1: we were talking about that ESPN article and we talked

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Speaker 1: a lot about making Fitzpatrick in in in Yante Johnson

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Speaker 1: with their contract situation. But there's a number of other

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Speaker 1: key players around the league who are looking for new deals,

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Speaker 1: including some that will involve some AFC North teams. We

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Speaker 1: mentioned that, yeah, we mentioned this that Jesse Bates. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: Jesse Bates is going to be an interesting one to

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Speaker 1: watch for the Bengals because you know, everybody talks about,

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Speaker 1: well the Bengals are, you know, they're loaded, they get

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Speaker 1: everybody back. If Jesse Bates decides to hold out and

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Speaker 1: starts skipping games and things of that nature, that's a

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Speaker 1: big for that Bengals, even their best defensive player, clearly

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Speaker 1: their best defensive player, and I wonder if they see

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Speaker 1: the writing on the wall that you know, we're not

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Speaker 1: going to give him the money he he thinks. So

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Speaker 1: we're gonna draft a bunch of safeties and defensive backs.

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Speaker 1: Usually they draft corners really high, not safeties. Every team

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Speaker 1: is going to value well that this is true for

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Speaker 1: every position, but every team is going to value the

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Speaker 1: value of the safety position different. You know, maybe they

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Speaker 1: look at safeties and think there's somewhat interchange. I'd rather

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Speaker 1: spend the money on corners and edge pass rushers and

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Speaker 1: stuff around Burrow. So sorry, Jesse, but as good as

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Speaker 1: you were, we're not gonna pay. Yeah. One of the

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Speaker 1: other key ones to watch this year and this in

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Speaker 1: the next couple of months. Here is what happens with

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Speaker 1: Lamar Jackson. This one's strange. Yeah, I mean, uh, there

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Speaker 1: were people I know, I know for a fact that

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Speaker 1: the Ravens were not happy with the Browns for the

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Speaker 1: Shawn Walking happy about that. Yeah, yeah, they were the

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Speaker 1: team that probably the most affected by it because they

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Speaker 1: have to pay Lamar Jackson. If you look at DeShawn

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Speaker 1: Watson and Lamar Jackson's career paths, they're very similar. Lamar

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Speaker 1: has an m v P Award, but you could I mean,

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Speaker 1: Watson has been in that kind of conversation every year.

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Speaker 1: The team just been sin Yeah, the team just wasn't

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Speaker 1: quite as successful around him. You know, Jackson is thirty

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Speaker 1: seven and twelve as a starter in his career, and

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Speaker 1: he should. You know, any contract negotiations for him should

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Speaker 1: start at around that five year, two and thirty million

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Speaker 1: dollar contract that the Browns gave Watson. A lot of

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Speaker 1: angles here is first of all, I think it's probably

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Speaker 1: starting with Baltimore, but this might be true in Denver

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Speaker 1: for Russell Wilson or whatever. Kyler Murray's contract is looming

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Speaker 1: as well. I'm sure all those agents are gonna say, well,

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Speaker 1: the new standard is DeShawn Watson. That's what we want.

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Speaker 1: We were fully guaranteed. We want five percent more or

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Speaker 1: right in that neighborhood. That's what. That's what. And when

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Speaker 1: we sit down to the table, that's where we're starting.

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Speaker 1: Their owners and I wonder not that this is collusion,

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Speaker 1: but our thirty one other owner is going to say,

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Speaker 1: and ain't cool. You know that this is the Jamal

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Speaker 1: Adams outlier contract. Sorry, just just because they did that

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Speaker 1: doesn't mean we're going to do that. It's not the

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Speaker 1: new standard in the league. Just because one team went

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Speaker 1: rogue and bought an asset, you know, kind of like

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Speaker 1: college football does now, you know, like, but do you

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Speaker 1: then have to instead of being a five year, two

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Speaker 1: thirty million dollar deal that's fully guaranteed. Do you have

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Speaker 1: to go five years fifty million dollars, say half of

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Speaker 1: them with half of a guaranteed or whatever? You know,

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Speaker 1: I think yes, that's I think that's the ripple effect. Then,

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Speaker 1: you know, no matter what it hurts the Ravens, Broncos, Cardinals,

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Speaker 1: whoever become, it's it's a good problem to have because

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Speaker 1: you presumably have a franchise quarterback. Of course, if Lamar's

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Speaker 1: viewed that way. See, that's what's different about him to

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Speaker 1: me when you compare him to Watson Alan Mahomes, something

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Speaker 1: about similar age guys that have made big money and

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Speaker 1: who are all better passers than him. Because there's two

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Speaker 1: things working against Lamar, And to your point is one

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Speaker 1: he represents himself, which can't make I mean, we're talking

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Speaker 1: about hundreds of millions of dollars and you're saving an

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Speaker 1: extra one percent or something, you know, Like, I'm sure

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Speaker 1: that makes him very hard to deal with. And he's

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Speaker 1: such a unique player to your point that I would

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Speaker 1: much rather give him big money on a three year deal,

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Speaker 1: you know, like if he's running a four six five

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Speaker 1: to three years from now, he ain't the same you know,

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Speaker 1: and I think he's a better pastor than giving credit for.

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Speaker 1: But when Josh Allen's feet fail him, he's not gonna

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Speaker 1: crumble like Cam Newton did in my opinion, you know

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Speaker 1: what I mean? Yeah, No, I hear you. One of

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Speaker 1: the problems with representing yourself. Not only is it a

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Speaker 1: time factor because you don't have the time to do

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Speaker 1: that and also be the quarterback, you know, franchise quarterback.

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Speaker 1: But the other factor is to what you just said,

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Speaker 1: how do the Ravens say, hey, hey, lamar Um, you know,

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Speaker 1: we think we think you might be slowing down, or

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Speaker 1: we think there's a possibility that you can slow down

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Speaker 1: and you're not as good as this guy. Is that

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Speaker 1: what the player wants to hear? Because that stuff is

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Speaker 1: said to agents, they're not kind and they don't share

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Speaker 1: that with the player necessarily. Yeah, because you don't want

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Speaker 1: to have to sit there. I did a thing with

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Speaker 1: with Sean Yeah. I did a thing with Sean Casey

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Speaker 1: uh the Great Pittsburgh Sports Debate a couple of weeks ago,

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Speaker 1: and he talked about that, you know, going into a

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Speaker 1: contract negotiation, they have you know, arbitration in baseball, and

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Speaker 1: the team sits here and talks about all the things

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Speaker 1: that you can't do well well. The your agent sitser

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Speaker 1: and says all the things that you do do well

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Speaker 1: the court room and he said, you know, at the

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Speaker 1: end of it all and we got done, and you know,

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Speaker 1: the the GM comes out and says, hey, Sean, none

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Speaker 1: of this was was personal. And he's like, it felt

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Speaker 1: pretty personal to me when you're telling me, you know,

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Speaker 1: I don't run the base as well, I don't do this,

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Speaker 1: you know. Yeah, that's the problem with representing yourself or

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Speaker 1: having to be in a room in situations like that,

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Speaker 1: because negotiation, right, what's that lawyer saying something about, you know,

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Speaker 1: anyone that represents themselves as an idiot for a client,

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Speaker 1: as a full for a client, you know, like, come

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Speaker 1: on them are detacher solf you know. So those two

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Speaker 1: aspects make that stickier than the average one. You know,

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Speaker 1: like when Alan came up or Mahomes or whatever, whether

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Speaker 1: you think there's good a players or not. His style

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Speaker 1: of play and no, uh, you know, agent is going

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Speaker 1: to make this strange where it could go south. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I agree, now they could. His fifth year option is

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Speaker 1: twenty three million dollars, which is a nice race for him,

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Speaker 1: but still hit him with the franchise tag two years

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Speaker 1: in a row, which means that's any guy I might

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Speaker 1: do that with. But you know, at what point does

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Speaker 1: that become basically what you're telling him then? Is it

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Speaker 1: three years from now? You're not going to be our quarterback? Right?

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Speaker 1: You know, because then you start doing that, then then

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Speaker 1: you're using the first round pick on a quarterback a

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Speaker 1: year from now, you know. Yeah, then you're in the

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Speaker 1: Kirk Cousins situation with Washington. M He then becomes too

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Speaker 1: expensive because again that that franchise tag sets the bar

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Speaker 1: it's been. Washington was dumb about the Cousins stuff because

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Speaker 1: they could have got him cheaper than thirty million a

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Speaker 1: year year to year. You know, they end up overpaying

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Speaker 1: him really not for any benefit of their own where

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Speaker 1: in this case, I think franchising him is going to

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Speaker 1: get expensive. But your opinion of the player, unlike Cousins,

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Speaker 1: could change drastically year to year. Yeah, oh, there's no

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Speaker 1: doubt what he is. You know, the franchise tag for

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Speaker 1: the quarterback for this year is twenty nine point seven

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Speaker 1: million dollars, but next year, but next year that's gonna

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Speaker 1: go up over thirty. Then he gets a ten percent

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Speaker 1: raised from at least a ten percent race from that,

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Speaker 1: which makes it thirty five ish, and then you probably

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Speaker 1: can't sign him. Then you'd let him go, trade him,

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Speaker 1: let him go. What is that the you know, if

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Speaker 1: you're the Ravens, is that the path you want to

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Speaker 1: go down? I leaned towards yes, But much like the Steelers,

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Speaker 1: what if you make a what if you make a run.

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Speaker 1: Let's let's say go to the FC Championship game this year.

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Speaker 1: What if he's VP right now? Now? You know now

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Speaker 1: it's now Now he's gonna get fifty million dollars. And

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Speaker 1: you know what I was gonna say is the Calais

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Speaker 1: Campbell's and Mark Andrews starting at you, like, why aren't

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Speaker 1: you paying our quarterback? Dude? You know, like it's not

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Speaker 1: great for the locker room either. Well that's the other

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Speaker 1: part of the equation. Yeah, because he's your leader. That's important. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you're not gonna pay him. You're not gonna pay me

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Speaker 1: to keep that guy happy. Uh, some other guys who

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Speaker 1: are going to be who are pending free agents Quentin Nelson,

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Speaker 1: Well he's gonna make money. Yeah, could you can you

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Speaker 1: justify paying a guard twenty million dollars a year a guard,

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Speaker 1: maybe I understand he's the best. You know, he's he's

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Speaker 1: the one. If he's not the best guard in the

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Speaker 1: in the league, he's He's in the top three every year.

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Speaker 1: I mean, if I'm paying any interior offensive lineman more

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Speaker 1: than the highest guy, now, now that's him. You know, Like,

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Speaker 1: I don't think the Steelers need a guard. But back

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Speaker 1: to our last segment, if something happen, you know, if

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Speaker 1: he's if Nelson is a free agent from that right

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Speaker 1: year from now and the Steelers signed him to a

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Speaker 1: three year, sixty million dollar deal, I'd understand. You know

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Speaker 1: what I mean. Right now, Brandon Schuff is the highest

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Speaker 1: paid guard at six team point five million. Who's years. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: Nelson's gonna Nelson's gonna get twenty. He's gonna get twenty.

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Speaker 1: Dreff has Sureff has injury issues and he's not the

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Speaker 1: quality of player. Yeah. Um, Roquan Smith is going to

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Speaker 1: be free agent. Um. As I mentioned, they have the

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Speaker 1: most caps based in the league a year from now

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Speaker 1: because they let everybody go this year. This is gonna

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Speaker 1: be the worst year ever for the Bears fans. But

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Speaker 1: I mean that's again by design, getting out from all

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Speaker 1: the bad contracts of the last regime. They're gonna take

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Speaker 1: it on the chin, left and right this year, all

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Speaker 1: for a year from now to spend and you know,

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Speaker 1: reap the rewards of you know, having a tough year.

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Speaker 1: I would think ro Kuwan's right at the top of a

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Speaker 1: a list of guys we can't let go, you know,

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Speaker 1: kind of like our make a conversation. Yeah, here's another

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Speaker 1: interesting one. You kind of mentioned it in the last segment.

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Speaker 1: Dirtwin James is going to be up. And if you're

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Speaker 1: making like our Derwin James and micka Fitzpatrick right now,

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Speaker 1: kind of playing a game of chicken waiting time in

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Speaker 1: this world? Yeah, waiting, okay, Okay, Derwin. I want to

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Speaker 1: see you signed first, or make I want to see

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Speaker 1: you signed first, and then I'm gonna sign. That sets

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Speaker 1: the market, you know, for the for the other guy.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, you do all the work and then his

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Speaker 1: agent just cheeps off your paper. You know, it just

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Speaker 1: leans over in the test and say what do you

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Speaker 1: have for the answer to to me, make us should

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Speaker 1: be slightly higher paid because James has been hurt a lot. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I was gonna say if Jane plays seventeen plus playoffs

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Speaker 1: awesome games, I'll give me any more ones. Yeah, but

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Speaker 1: you know, yeah, but he hasn't done that yet in

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Speaker 1: his career, right, So if I'm the Chargers, I want

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Speaker 1: to sign him now. Absolutely. Yeah. The later it goes,

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Speaker 1: the more value I think he got it got. You know,

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Speaker 1: it goes up and they need yeah, they do. But

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Speaker 1: at some point they're gonna have to pay the quarterback

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Speaker 1: and you're already paying Joey Bosa. You know, Herbert. They're

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Speaker 1: very they're they're kind of a step ahead of where

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Speaker 1: the Steelers are hoping to be at Chargers for me,

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Speaker 1: They've got the edge rusher signed, They're gonna sign the

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Speaker 1: safety and then you know, another year from now, you're

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Speaker 1: gonna have to start looking at signing the quarterback to

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Speaker 1: an extension. It's funny said that because I'm not predicting

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Speaker 1: Herbert's gonna be or pick it's gonna be as good

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Speaker 1: as Herbert. But if he's on that career path of

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Speaker 1: a Borough or Herbert again, that's the best thing in

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Speaker 1: the world. Then you can trade for Khalil Mack and

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Speaker 1: signed J. C. Jackson and extend or when pickever you

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Speaker 1: want draft because you don't have needs like argers are

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Speaker 1: living example how to do it right now. Yeah, no doubt.

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Speaker 1: The the wide receivers and and this comes and it

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Speaker 1: goes into the Deante Johnson situation, Deebo, Samuel DK, Metcalf,

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Speaker 1: Terry McLaurin, they're all kind of the same. They're all

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Speaker 1: in that same boat. And you could add Deonte Johnson

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Speaker 1: to that um all the same draft class, all non

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Speaker 1: first round picks, so they haven't made a ton of money,

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Speaker 1: super productive and really number one receivers that are ascending,

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Speaker 1: you know. And A J. Brown used to be in

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Speaker 1: that conversation. Yeah, and he got his new deal deal

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Speaker 1: and I bet the others due too. Yeah. I mean

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Speaker 1: the going rate is twenty million dollars. It's just is

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Speaker 1: per year. If not more receivers don't fall off clips,

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Speaker 1: you know, like the chances that my But what's the

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Speaker 1: chances McLaurin or Deonte Johnson or A J. Brown is

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Speaker 1: a poor player two years about? I'd be shocked. It's very, very,

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Speaker 1: very low. The franchise tag player we did talk about,

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Speaker 1: Jesse Bates or Lando Brown. I forgot they franchised him. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I assume they're going to pay him, but he's just

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Speaker 1: not an ideal fit. No, Like, I think they franchise

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Speaker 1: to justify the trade. I think they kinda put the

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Speaker 1: franchise tag on him this year because they couldn't let

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Speaker 1: him walk right. See, I think they're gonna view their

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Speaker 1: team a little different. I think it was, let's give

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Speaker 1: Andy Reid Homes, Tyreek and Kelsey, and what a tremendous

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Speaker 1: ste he's gonna make with those ingredients. And he did,

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Speaker 1: And now I think they say, well, that's kind of run.

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Speaker 1: Its course. I don't know how much longer we're gonna

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Speaker 1: have Kelsey. Let's give Andy Patty Mahomes one of the

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Speaker 1: best offensive lines in the league and see what kind

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Speaker 1: of stew he can make with that, which I bet

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Speaker 1: it will be pretty tasty too. Yeah. You know, to me,

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Speaker 1: Orlando Brown as a left tackle is extremely overrated. Agreed.

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Speaker 1: I agree with all that he made the Pro Bowl

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Speaker 1: last year on name brand only and because he played

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Speaker 1: for the Chiefs, he should be a right tackle. As

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Speaker 1: a left tackle, he's he is average at best, yes,

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Speaker 1: and he's not even the maller you would think he

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Speaker 1: is in the run game. He's fine, but he's not

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Speaker 1: quittin Nelson who just right, Oh, we gotta run behind

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Speaker 1: that guy, know fourth and one where to get it

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Speaker 1: every time? Yeah, he's tough. Yeah, that that's it. That's

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Speaker 1: gonna be an interesting one. The Cowboys franchise tag Dalton Schultz.

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Speaker 1: And I know you're not a Dalton Schultz fan, but

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Speaker 1: the guy I didn't have seventy he did have seventy

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Speaker 1: eight catches for eight d eight yards and and eight

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Speaker 1: touched eight touchdowns last season. Yeah, and tight end franchising

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Speaker 1: is it's cheap with you, right, franchise you know you

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Speaker 1: don't have to be awesome. Dalton Schultz was more it

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Speaker 1: was was a better player last year than David and

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Speaker 1: Joeku more valuable player, I should say, maybe not necessarily,

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Speaker 1: but they but they both got franchise tag because that

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Speaker 1: franchise tag value, Uh, you know you're looking at ten

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Speaker 1: point nine three million. Only running back at nine point

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Speaker 1: five seven and then kickers at five point two million

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Speaker 1: dollars are are cheaper. And but you know, to me

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Speaker 1: that that kind of cheats the whole franchise tag a

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Speaker 1: little bit thing because when the franchise tag was I

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Speaker 1: think Max Stark's talked about this with us at the combine.

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Speaker 1: H And obviously he had the franchise tag placed on him,

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Speaker 1: you know during his career. Like when the franchise tag

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Speaker 1: was developed, it was like for quarterbacks or a star

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Speaker 1: a star player. When we now see guys, was they

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Speaker 1: stole it from the NBA with the Larry Bird rule,

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Speaker 1: you know, heard to change teams. Well, we don't want

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Speaker 1: Brett Farve the change teams either, not even the Joku

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Speaker 1: Dalton Schultz. Yeah, we've seen Yeah, we've seen kickers get

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Speaker 1: franchise tag. That's ridiculous bargain. Right, it's a loophole. There's

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Speaker 1: a major loophole. I could see both of those teams though,

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Speaker 1: giving those two guys new deal. Yeah, I think the

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Speaker 1: Joke who still has upside. I think he's a good

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Speaker 1: example of the gets better with age starting to reach

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Speaker 1: his prime, slow developing tight end. And they like Schultz,

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Speaker 1: you know, I think that like Scholtz, so they probably

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Speaker 1: both get better deals and maybe like Hunter Henry Johnny

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Speaker 1: Smith Deel's Yeah, I mean, you know you're talking about

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Speaker 1: the Browns who gave Austin Hooper eleven million dollars a year. Well,

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Speaker 1: a franchise tag for a tight end is ten point

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Speaker 1: nine three, like you might have. They cut Austin Hooper

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Speaker 1: and they gave that money to in Joku instead. Exactly

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Speaker 1: do you think the next guy in the list here, Gaseki,

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Speaker 1: is the same. I'm not sure. I don't think he is,

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Speaker 1: because he's really just a big wide receiver. He's a

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Speaker 1: big wide receiver. In fact, if I were his agent,

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Speaker 1: I'd be like, my guy doesn't block anybody. He's a

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Speaker 1: big wide receiver. He doesn't even put his shoulder next

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Speaker 1: to a tackle like I mean, he doesn't even line

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Speaker 1: up on the line of scrimmage. I would I would

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Speaker 1: go into the into that and say, hey, um, here

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Speaker 1: are here are the amount of times that that he

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Speaker 1: lined up in line Uh it was eight percent or

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Speaker 1: whatever whatever it actually is line up outside the numbers

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Speaker 1: at a time, Like he should be a wide receiver, yes,

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Speaker 1: but then the team's gonna say that's nice, but he's not.

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Speaker 1: Just like you know what I mean, yeah, right, the

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Speaker 1: way it goes, I mean, they're not gonna say, oh,

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Speaker 1: good point, and we'll pay you like a wide receiver.

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Speaker 1: He's gonna be paid like a tight end. But tyree

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Speaker 1: guaddle like Kasecki is not like those guys. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I don't know if he's part of the long term

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Speaker 1: plan or is he just here on the franchise tag

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Speaker 1: to make to his life easier and then we'll move

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Speaker 1: on and probably you know what I mean. I mean,

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Speaker 1: they keep bringing in wide receivers. I can't imagine if

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Speaker 1: you know, they needed a big and they've added some

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Speaker 1: tight ends, yes, like guys who are just guys like

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Speaker 1: you got you've got to spend, you know, go get

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Speaker 1: Tyreek Hill and you're not the Chiefs. And Gasecki is

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Speaker 1: not you know, he's not going to turn into Kelsey

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Speaker 1: anytime soon. No. And if you think about who the

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Speaker 1: new staff is, ideally they want George Kittle, you know,

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Speaker 1: I mean, you're not that level of player. But they

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Speaker 1: might just look at Hunter Long and be like, well,

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Speaker 1: he blocks and he's catches well enough, he's not just

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Speaker 1: you know, he's not a Gasecki type tight end. He's

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Speaker 1: but he's gonna give us fifty catches a year and

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Speaker 1: that's all we need. Yeah, and catch five touchdowns and

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Speaker 1: block for this running game that we're going to run

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Speaker 1: like crazy. Yeah, to me, I mean that that's that

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Speaker 1: tight end position is we we talked about that on

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Speaker 1: on on Wednesday. I mean we were in down that

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Speaker 1: list of tight ends that are still available. Yeah, and

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of good guys still out there, Like

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Speaker 1: there are a lot of NFL players that you can

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Speaker 1: find guys at that position. It seems like a million

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Speaker 1: years away and the league changes very quickly. But you know,

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Speaker 1: when Friar Mouse contract comes up, assuming he's everything you

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Speaker 1: want franchising end but costs nothing, you know what I mean? Right, right,

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Speaker 1: you can do that easily. Right, it's very cost control.

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Speaker 1: But you also have Nagy Harris situation. Yeah, well I

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Speaker 1: guess it would be the following year, yeah, because Friar

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Speaker 1: muth is uh is a year ahead. So but yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean those are things that you have to think

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Speaker 1: about when you when you do those kind of things.

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Speaker 1: We're gonna take another break. He is Matt Williamson. I

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Speaker 1: am Dale Lali. You're listening to the right here on

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Speaker 1: Steelers Nation Radio. When we come back, we're gonna do

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Speaker 1: a little fantasy stuff here. We trying to sprinkle some

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Speaker 1: of this stuff in here every once in a while,

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Speaker 1: so we do a little fantasy football focus when we

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Speaker 1: return radio for this year. Listening to the Drive on

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Speaker 1: Steelers Nation Radio