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Speaker 1: Ridiculous crime is a production of iHeartRadio, Elizabeth.

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Speaker 2: What are we doing here? We're supposed to be on vacation.

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Speaker 3: I never go on vacation. You never go on vacation.

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Speaker 3: I mean they closed the building down and we have

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Speaker 3: to do like we did this morning where we lock

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Speaker 3: pick break in.

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Speaker 2: You're welcome for that for Christmas, Thank you so much.

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Speaker 2: I think the lessons have been helping both of us.

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Speaker 3: But they keep us, they keep us out of here,

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Speaker 3: but not one hundred percent.

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Speaker 2: They can't keep us out, can't.

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Speaker 3: They really can't.

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Speaker 2: Well, the reason why I call it for this confab

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Speaker 2: and headquarters today. Yes, I don't tell producer Day were here. No,

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Speaker 2: I had a story update for you one I wanted

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Speaker 2: to share. You may remember the story about Rita Crunwell

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Speaker 2: ran back on July nineteenth, twenty twenty two.

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Speaker 3: Okay, you remember that name?

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Speaker 2: Yes, oh yeah, she was the comptroller for the small

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Speaker 2: town of Dixon in western Iloni. Right, she's the one

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Speaker 2: who embezzled millions of dollars from the coffers of her

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Speaker 2: little small town, innocent small town. And she's like a

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Speaker 2: hoover vacuum taking up cash right now, Why why would

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Speaker 2: she do this to her small town, well, Elizabeth, because

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Speaker 2: she could buy herself a mess, a mess of pretty

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Speaker 2: ponies and show horses.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and she was just rotten to the core, totally. No.

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Speaker 2: It took her two plus decades of doing this, and

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Speaker 2: she stole fifty three million dollars from her.

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Speaker 3: Small So crazy for such a small town.

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Speaker 2: Right now, I don't want to give away the whole story,

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Speaker 2: but I'll tell you this. Eventually she gets busted, she

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Speaker 2: gets sent to prison. But Elizabeth, the reason I called

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Speaker 2: you into headquarters today is because outgoing President Joe Biden

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Speaker 2: has been horsing around with pardons and commutations for federal prisoners.

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Speaker 2: And you know what those are, right Well, yeah, pardons

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Speaker 2: are different from computatation.

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Speaker 3: To this commutation, you change the sentence.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. So, Rita, she gets a commutation, they basically

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Speaker 2: void her sentence. She's now seventy one years old. She's

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Speaker 2: already seen some kindness when it comes to this justice

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Speaker 2: because thanks to reduction in the number of federal prisoners

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Speaker 2: during COVID, Rita, she got sent home to finish her

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Speaker 2: sentence on house arrest. Chief petition for this, she got

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Speaker 2: an early release. They gave a toy, right, they sent

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Speaker 2: her to her halfway house where she has been living,

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Speaker 2: and then like, well, you know, just send her all

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Speaker 2: the way home. So now she's all the way out.

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Speaker 2: And let me tell you, the folks in her hometown

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Speaker 2: at Dixon, they are picked. Dude, there's this one cat,

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Speaker 2: Danny Leglosa. He's the city manager of Dixon. He said,

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Speaker 2: and I quote, the city of Dixon is shocked and outraged. Now,

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Speaker 2: Leglosa added, and I once again quote, this is a

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Speaker 2: complete travesty of justice and a slap in the face

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Speaker 2: for our entire community. This dude, he was the police

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Speaker 2: chief when old Rita was bilking their hometown. Yeah, now

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Speaker 2: he's the city manager, so he's really protective of this place.

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Speaker 2: And it explains why he would say and I quote,

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Speaker 2: this definitely cuts the scar open. It's not a scab,

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Speaker 2: it's a scar. It's a deep one. At a time

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Speaker 2: when the federal government is the least trusted institution in

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Speaker 2: the country to do something like this.

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Speaker 3: Now, I also this.

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Speaker 2: Former cup he turned city manager. He described Rita. He

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Speaker 2: knows her obviously, so he called her a quote sociopath

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Speaker 2: who demonstrated no remorse, who destroyed the people that were

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Speaker 2: closest to her, not a feeling of guilt for what

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Speaker 2: she put our town through. He wasn't done, Elizabeth, because

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Speaker 2: you know, after eight years of being in jail, she

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Speaker 2: walks and he could. Well, he said, it's just not right.

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Speaker 2: Just the laziness to carte blanche commute, the sentence of

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Speaker 2: everyone or nearly everyone that was put on home detention

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Speaker 2: during COVID, not even giving consideration to the victims or

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Speaker 2: their crimes.

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Speaker 3: Man makes some points, right now.

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Speaker 2: You know, I'm not quite a prison abolitionist, but I'm

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Speaker 2: not looking to lock people up. So there's also the Okay,

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Speaker 2: the law enforcement community, they worked so hard to put

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Speaker 2: this homegirl away, right, they now describe what she is

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Speaker 2: doing as dancing in the streets of Dixon with their commutation.

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Speaker 2: That was the words of US Marshal Jason Wajdolo. Okay,

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Speaker 2: Now he said she quote conned the President of the

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Speaker 2: United States. Yeah, he was really pissed. Now I'll get

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Speaker 2: the last word. I'll give it to his current mayor,

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Speaker 2: Dixon Lee Ariano. Right, he called out the real world

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Speaker 2: costs of what Rita did. Her horse obsessed greed, right,

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Speaker 2: he said, and I quote, you can't steal fifty three

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Speaker 2: million dollars and it's non violent. It hurts your public safety.

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Speaker 2: We had an ambulance that smoked when it went down

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Speaker 2: the street, Elizabeth, this more Town ambulance Tupaca day has

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Speaker 2: it disgusting? All be goes of old Rita Crunwell and

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Speaker 2: heard my little ponies. Now let's sit back, relax, and

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Speaker 2: let's hear how Rita Crunwell did it all for the horse.

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Speaker 3: Let me just point out really quickly, this lady sucked

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Speaker 3: the public teat dry. She took the money. Why do

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Speaker 3: we still have to pay for her? If she's like

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Speaker 3: in her seventies and six, I don't want to I

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Speaker 3: don't want to give her four square you know, three squares? Yeah,

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Speaker 3: wherever you say it, you know what I mean. Like

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Speaker 3: I if she's just I don't know. I think she's

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Speaker 3: kind of been brought low. I can't imagine that she's

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Speaker 3: living high on the hogs. So I say I'm tired

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Speaker 3: of paying.

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Speaker 2: For Let's see her do some restitution on that fifty

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Speaker 2: three million.

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Speaker 3: Yeah exactly, just Michael.

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Speaker 2: Anyway, whatever, this one is still criminally ridiculous, So enjoy

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Speaker 2: read the Crunwell and her little ponies.

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Speaker 3: Elizabeth Dutton Zaren. Do you know what's ridiculous. Yeah, I'll

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Speaker 3: tell you what's ridiculous.

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Speaker 2: Oh, hit me with it.

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Speaker 3: Okay, when you don't want your car stolen, which is

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Speaker 3: not that's not ridiculous. No one wants her car stolen

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Speaker 3: unless you just need to get rid of it. Well, sure,

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Speaker 3: evidence wise, but let's say you don't trust the club,

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Speaker 3: you don't trust the locks or an alarm. Did you

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Speaker 3: know I think this is ridiculous. You can buy a

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Speaker 3: boot for your own car.

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Speaker 2: I think I know where you're going with.

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Speaker 3: This, Like it's not just a municipal thing. Did you

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Speaker 3: get some reason to one recently? Where did you see

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Speaker 3: in my neighbor's driveway?

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Speaker 2: What your neighbor boots his own car?

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Speaker 3: It boots his own car. And I have decided that's ridiculous, Yes,

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Speaker 3: I would agree and idiotic.

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Speaker 2: Why does he boot his own car because he had

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Speaker 2: a car stolen a couple of times? No, did he

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Speaker 2: have his like something else stolen. He's just kind of

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Speaker 2: like gunshy about this innocence I don't know, just snatched

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Speaker 2: from him and now he's like, not my truck.

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Speaker 3: I think maybe he shouldn't be living in the city.

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Speaker 2: Oh definite, Yeah, definitely. So wait, is he like somebody

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Speaker 2: from like rural small town America? Nope? Hmm what's his deal?

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Speaker 3: I don't know, but he's ridiculous.

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Speaker 2: I'll completely concur with that. Now I got one for you, Yes,

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Speaker 2: you're ready. This is a story. It's about a middle

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Speaker 2: aged woman. She's from rural, small town Illinois, and this

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Speaker 2: particular Midwestern woman she uh, she had a taste for

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Speaker 2: that sweet sweet horsey breeding life. Oh oh yeah. Now

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Speaker 2: to pay for her horse jones, she decided to dip

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Speaker 2: into the bank account not of her wealthy husband, not

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Speaker 2: of her family, but of her town, her hometown, and

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Speaker 2: she used the money that she could on the horses,

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Speaker 2: and she started diverting so much of the town's budget

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Speaker 2: that the town was almost going bankrupt. Oh he's a

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Speaker 2: perfect criminal. Since no one sees her coming. This is

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Speaker 2: the story of Rita Crundwell, the woman who got hooked

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Speaker 2: on horse. I'm sorry, the horses, woman who got hooked

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Speaker 2: on horses, those sweet, sweet ponies. This is Ridiculous Crime

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Speaker 2: a podcast about absurd and outrageous capers, heists, and cons.

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Speaker 2: It's always ninety nine percent murder free and ridiculous. Today's

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Speaker 2: bizarre tale of small town crime takes place in the

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Speaker 2: American heartland. One of your favorite places, Elizabeth, America's heartland

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Speaker 2: is now this story of Rita Crundwell. It takes place

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Speaker 2: in a very specific part of rural small town America,

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Speaker 2: the Illinois of Dixon. Now, this is also famous for

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Speaker 2: a couple of things. Before Rita Crundwell, it was famous

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Speaker 2: as the hometown of the star of the Bedtime for

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Speaker 2: Bonzo series of movies would later become I believe a

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Speaker 2: politician Ronald Reagan that yeah, uh huh. And then Dixon,

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Speaker 2: Illinois is also the petunia capital of well, not the world,

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Speaker 2: but of Illinois. It's the petunia capital of Illinois, which

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Speaker 2: is you know, high praise for Illinois.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah.

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Speaker 2: Also the catfish capital of Illinois once again of Illinois.

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Speaker 3: Very original fish. Not the practice of people not.

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Speaker 2: Like really good at like hooking up with like like foreigners,

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Speaker 2: getting them to come over here.

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Speaker 3: And be like, wait a minute, cat the bottom feeder.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, this is not like mante Teo's hometown. Now, our

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Speaker 2: second fun fact about Dixon is that Rita Crundwell lives there.

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Speaker 2: And she is the fifth most prolific embezzler of all.

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Speaker 3: Time, of all times, of all time.

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Speaker 2: Day, Elizabeth, has the FBI ever come to your home

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Speaker 2: or place of work and asked to speak with you?

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Speaker 3: Well, Elizabeth, no they haven't. They haven't asked to speak

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Speaker 3: with me. But one time when I worked at a

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Speaker 3: certain place, they came.

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Speaker 2: In, really, but not to talk to me. Did you

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Speaker 2: get to watch them operate?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? Well not really. They went into another office and

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Speaker 3: then everyone was terrified in our office and screaming around.

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Speaker 3: And I was like, well, we haven't done anything, wait

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Speaker 3: have we?

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Speaker 2: And then okay, well I've got a little fun visualization

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Speaker 2: for you. You're ready. This is the moment when the

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Speaker 2: FBI comes to your work and what that is?

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Speaker 1: Like?

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Speaker 2: You ready? I want you to close your eyes, yes,

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Speaker 2: I want you to picture it. It's a Tuesday morning

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Speaker 2: in April. It's early in the day, a little after

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Speaker 2: nine am. You're working at the Dixon City Hall. You're

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Speaker 2: a part time secretary, just typing away, doing your thing.

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Speaker 2: It's how Rita started at city Hall. And you spot

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Speaker 2: these three FBI agents. They push open the double doors,

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Speaker 2: streaming in sunlight behind them. The noises of the day

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Speaker 2: on Main Street Dixon. All come pouring in, these FBI agents.

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Speaker 2: They stride in with purpose and they're looking past you.

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Speaker 2: You're like, but no, oh, I greet people. They're like, no,

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Speaker 2: we know where we're going. They go marching up the stairs.

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Speaker 2: You go to follow to see if they need help,

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Speaker 2: trying to get to wherever it is that they're going.

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Speaker 2: And as you're going up the marble steps, you can

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Speaker 2: see them make the turn and start heading towards the

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Speaker 2: Mayor's office. You're like, okay, I know where they're going,

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Speaker 2: so you trail behind them. You follow them all the

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Speaker 2: way down the hallway. They get to the Mayor's office.

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Speaker 2: Mayor Jim Burke is in his office that morning. This

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Speaker 2: is a point of fact because he's a part time mayor.

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Speaker 2: He's not always in the office. This morning he is.

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Speaker 2: He's very common now, full time real estate agent, part

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Speaker 2: time mayor. Jim Burke is a good hearted guy and so,

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Speaker 2: you know, kind self effacing, kind of Midwestern guy, Big

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Speaker 2: Jim Burke, Big Jim Burke, and with the FBI agents

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Speaker 2: come in, he's really friendly, nice to them, and you're

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Speaker 2: right on the FBI's six right you're watching past them

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Speaker 2: into Mayor Jim Burke's office because you want to see

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Speaker 2: what all this hullabaloo is about.

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Speaker 3: Oh, hella, I figured you were in real life.

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Speaker 2: Yes, And so as Mayor Jim Burke is greeting the

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Speaker 2: FBI agents, you notice he doesn't look scared, fright and

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Speaker 2: intimidated nothing. He's cool as a cucumber and a bowl

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Speaker 2: of hot sucks because my man Sci would say, yeah.

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Speaker 2: And Big Jim is sitting there and he's like, you know,

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Speaker 2: I basically called you into the office. It seems he's

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Speaker 2: got that demeanor like he invited the FBI. And know

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Speaker 2: why would he invite the FBI? You're wondering, Well, the

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Speaker 2: FBI agents they don't say anything at first, they just

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Speaker 2: keep doing their business. And uh, you don't know this,

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Speaker 2: but you're about to find out that the FBI has

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Speaker 2: been working with Mayor Jim Burke to bust one of

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Speaker 2: the employees in city Hall and today is the day.

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Speaker 3: For the silver bracelets to be slapped on their wrist. Wow.

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Speaker 2: Mayor Jim Burke's face starts to lighten a little bit.

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Speaker 2: He looks at the FBI guys. You're like, what's going

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Speaker 2: on a moment? The excitement is just rippling through you.

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Speaker 2: And all of a sudden, Mayor Burke says to the

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Speaker 2: three FBI agents, are we ready? You're like, oh, it's

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Speaker 2: going down the one. The FBI guys replies, yes, let's

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Speaker 2: bring her in. Mayor Burke picks up his telephone. He

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Speaker 2: dials an extension in city Hall. People Bob bo bo bob,

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Speaker 2: and then he waits, puts the phone on speaker mode.

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Speaker 2: You can hear the down the hall ringing. You're like,

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Speaker 2: did you call someone in the office. You hear a

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Speaker 2: woman's voice at the other end. Hello, She's got a nice, sunny,

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Speaker 2: you know, springtimey voice. Mayor Burke, very serious, very solemn,

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Speaker 2: says Rita, would you mind stepping into my office for

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Speaker 2: a minute. Rita replies sure.

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Speaker 3: Now.

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Speaker 2: A moment later, her office door opens. You hear it,

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Speaker 2: and also then you hear footsteps clean She's going down

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Speaker 2: the hallway, the marble steps, her heels, they get louder,

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Speaker 2: she gets closer. You're so anticipatory, you just cannot wait

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Speaker 2: for the moment what is going to be happening. Rita

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Speaker 2: pokes her head in the doorway that you're standing there

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Speaker 2: in the doorway with her. Now she squeezes and she

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Speaker 2: says hi, and everyone turns a three. FBI engagent's turn.

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Speaker 2: Mayor Jim Burke turns. You just kind of just glance

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Speaker 2: over at her because she's standing there right next to you.

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Speaker 2: The FBI agents say, Rita, would you mind coming in?

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Speaker 2: Mayor Burke reiterates, Rita, would you please mind stepping into

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Speaker 2: my office? The lead FBI says, Hi, I'm with the FBI.

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Speaker 2: That moment has come.

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Speaker 3: You're like, oh, it's going down now.

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Speaker 2: He flashes his badge. Rita looks at it, and her

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Speaker 2: face starts to break a little. She knows it's over

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Speaker 2: her decades of lies, the fraud, the embezzlement, the scams,

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Speaker 2: the cons all of it are coming crashing down. But

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Speaker 2: yet her face doesn't fully show it. Just the hint

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Speaker 2: of it is in her eyes. The lead FBI guy continues, Rita,

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Speaker 2: we'd like to ask you some questions. Mayor Burke stares

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Speaker 2: at Rita. Meanwhile, Rita's face still hasn't changed. It's just placid,

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Speaker 2: and you're like, how is she doing this? She just

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Speaker 2: keeps smiling. It just the small pert smile breaks on

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Speaker 2: her face. It's almost midwestern and polite, super eerie, and

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Speaker 2: then the FBI agent slapped the cuffs on her and

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Speaker 2: they say she won't talk. They're taking into the office.

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Speaker 2: They leave city Hall, they purp walk her out. Everybody

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Speaker 2: is a gas They're all looking, Oh my goodness, it's Rita, Rita.

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Speaker 2: I can't believe it's Rita. That moment was the moment

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Speaker 2: when Mayor Jim Burke finally realize what we will call

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Speaker 2: the Tao of Rita Crundwell, now what is the tao

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Speaker 2: of Rita Crunwell? Well as it goes, he said, and

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Speaker 2: I quote, it showed me she didn't give a about

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Speaker 2: our town. Oh yeah, So how much did Rita exactly

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Speaker 2: not give about the town of Dixon, Illinois?

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Speaker 3: Tell me, can you guess? No, try the tune of

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Speaker 3: fifty three million dollars? Fifty three million dollars fifty three

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Speaker 3: million dollars. How did the town have that much money

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Speaker 3: to begin with?

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Speaker 2: Well, that was over multiple years. She was just basically

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Speaker 2: siphoning off cash to pay for her horses, year after

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Speaker 2: year after year after year from this small little town

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Speaker 2: until she'd taken fifty three million dollars in The FBI

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Speaker 2: showed up and said we'd like to talk to Rita.

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Speaker 3: Can I tell you how excited I am that they

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Speaker 3: didn't kick me out when they started doing this whole Rita,

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Speaker 3: we need to talk to you. They just let me

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Speaker 3: stand in the doorway. I like that.

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Speaker 2: I knew you'd like to kind of just watch that

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Speaker 2: same out. Yeah, the FBI is very generous, you know,

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Speaker 2: in small.

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Speaker 3: Town America, and they sent the FBI comes. It's not

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Speaker 3: like state police or anything. So this is big time.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they didn't bring the US marshals to grab her.

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Speaker 2: They wanted to talk with her and then to Couffer.

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Speaker 2: So coincidentally, that fifty three million I just told you,

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Speaker 2: that's the exact same amount that Kanye West was in

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Speaker 2: bankruptcy for in twenty sixteen. Oh, he's now almost a billionaire.

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Speaker 2: If he's not already a billionaire, I don't know who cares.

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Speaker 2: But the point is is that's a sizable chunk of money.

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Speaker 2: It's enough to turn you into a billionaire, and in

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Speaker 2: this case, it was enough to pretty much bankrupt her hometown. Wow.

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Speaker 2: Now let's say you stole fifty three million dollars, Elizabeth,

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Speaker 2: so we say it together.

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Speaker 3: You still fifty three million million dollars.

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Speaker 2: Elizabeth, Okay, oh good, Now you didn't donate any of it.

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Speaker 2: You just had to spend all of it on yourself

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Speaker 2: or stuff or whatever gifts. I don't care. What would

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Speaker 2: you spend fifty three million, No, I'll limit it. What

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Speaker 2: animal would you spend fifty three million dollars on?

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Speaker 3: Oh? Dogs? Hello?

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Speaker 2: Dog?

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Speaker 3: Really you wouldn't go like big like peacocks or bears,

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Speaker 3: or I would have a standing dog army that would

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Speaker 3: be completely pampered. Okay, yeah, it would be wild.

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Speaker 2: What would you do with your dog army? I mean,

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Speaker 2: you got enough money to pamper them, so, like, how

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Speaker 2: are you going to pamper.

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Speaker 3: Them various acts of vengeance? No? I would would you

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Speaker 3: have for them? Everyone gets their own bed so they

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Speaker 3: don't all try and sleep on my bed. Okay, They

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Speaker 3: get the finest of foods and table scraps. Okay, I

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Speaker 3: don't know, buy like a bunch of acres and build

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Speaker 3: my own dog parks.

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Speaker 2: Like would you travel with them? Would you get like

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Speaker 2: maybe like a very large trailer and a truck and

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Speaker 2: you take them on a road trip around the country.

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Speaker 3: With all their heads outside of exactly sunglasses on all

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Speaker 3: of them. Oh, my god, I would get the nicest

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Speaker 3: sunglasses for all the dogs. Everybody gets a pair of

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Speaker 3: custom ray bands.

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Speaker 2: Very nice, very nice.

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Speaker 3: Good.

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Speaker 2: You're starting to now get what Rita Crundwell was about.

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Speaker 3: Oh was she about that rude dude life.

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Speaker 2: No, unfortunately she was just about that rude life. Now,

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Speaker 2: after the short break, it's time to meet the star

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Speaker 2: of our story, the embezzler extraordinariy Rita Crundwell.

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Speaker 3: Elizabeth M.

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Speaker 2: You used to live in a small town, you told me. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: the small town that we don't have to name it.

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Speaker 2: But living in a small town, you know what it's like.

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Speaker 2: Were there any any liars in your town? Anybody who

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Speaker 2: got busted for a lie? Maybe it was like a

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Speaker 2: divorce that all of a sudden came to light, a

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Speaker 2: scandal with money.

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Speaker 3: Was anything like that? Of course, human beings live there. Well, yes,

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Speaker 3: I know, but.

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Speaker 2: I'm saying, but in small towns, it's it's less likely

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Speaker 2: that a secret emerges because people know the secret. It

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Speaker 2: kind of gets whispered about, you know what I mean, Like,

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Speaker 2: it doesn't just get broken in the news. It's more

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Speaker 2: like people knew about it and then it's like the

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Speaker 2: news confirmed. Yeah, but that's about accurate.

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Speaker 3: I think, yeah, there are secrets that that are sort

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Speaker 3: of known secrets. Everyone's in on it. But then sometimes

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Speaker 3: you gets surprised.

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Speaker 2: They're gonna be like the violent secrets, the marital secrets,

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Speaker 2: the money secrets. But oftentimes there's the whisper networks of

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Speaker 2: small towns that are totally very different than big cities, right, right,

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Speaker 2: can't be anonymous, right exactly. Keep that in mind as

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Speaker 2: I tell you how Rita Crundwell pulled off her fifty

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Speaker 2: three million dollars theft.

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Speaker 3: Of all of her How many people lived in this Dixon, Illinois.

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Speaker 3: Sixteen thousand people? All right, yeah, that's pretty small, Yeah,

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Speaker 3: pretty small. Well, that's big compared to where I was living.

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Speaker 3: Oh really yeah, thirteen hundred people, Oh my god, sixteen

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Speaker 3: thousand would be that's the big city.

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Speaker 2: I going into the big city to get your checks cash.

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Speaker 3: Oh, that's where like Starbucks is forty five minutes away. Yeah, anyway,

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Speaker 3: so I think that's yeah, in the grand scheme of things,

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Speaker 3: practic pretty small town.

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Speaker 2: Well getting to Dixon, Illinois, Rita Crunwell's hometown. Rita was

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Speaker 2: one of six Crundwell kids. She grew up on the

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Speaker 2: family farm. She was the type of teen who wore

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Speaker 2: cowboy boots. She drove a beat up pickup truck. She

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Speaker 2: was into four ah. She raised livestock, she competed in

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Speaker 2: livestock shows, and she showed up in the lyrics. I

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Speaker 2: think one or two John Cougar Mellencamp songs.

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Speaker 3: That's gonna say. She sounds like a character in a

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Speaker 3: New Country lyric.

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Speaker 2: Yes, she's like Trayce Adkins, ideal girl.

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Speaker 3: Drinking from a red solo cub, sitting in the pickup.

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Speaker 2: Saying how much hey means to her? That reminds me

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Speaker 2: of home. Now, Rita cronwells So, she was also a

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Speaker 2: smart girl. She was a National Honor Society member. She

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Speaker 2: was a popular girl, the kind of kid who gets

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Speaker 2: nominated or elected. I don't know how it goes, but

400
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Speaker 2: to her high school's homecoming court.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know how that works.

402
00:19:22,240 --> 00:19:24,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's elected. I don't know anyway. Rita

403
00:19:24,800 --> 00:19:28,239
Speaker 2: Cronwell all American upbringing. Just keep that in mind. Now,

404
00:19:28,520 --> 00:19:30,119
Speaker 2: one of the facts I just told you above is

405
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Speaker 2: not true. I'll let you guess which one. Oh, John Cougar,

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Speaker 2: mellencap Okay, So, Rita our former honor student. Girl with

407
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Speaker 2: the big glasses, brown hair. Four it's kid cowboy boots

408
00:19:39,960 --> 00:19:41,200
Speaker 2: got in your mind. Okay.

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Speaker 3: She goes to work at the city hall thanks to

410
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Speaker 3: her high school's work study program. So she's like a.

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Speaker 2: Junior at the time. This is nineteen seventy okay, Okay,

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Speaker 2: So in nineteen seventy one, she graduates and then she

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Speaker 2: takes a job, full time job at city hall. It's

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Speaker 2: like it's a good job all town. So she's like,

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Speaker 2: I'm keeping it around. That same time, Mayor he creates

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Speaker 2: this new position called the town's comptroller. And the comptrollers

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Speaker 2: you were familiar is, handles the money. They're a little

418
00:20:07,960 --> 00:20:09,960
Speaker 2: bit different than say the treasurer. They are in charge

419
00:20:09,960 --> 00:20:11,880
Speaker 2: of like writing the checks, making sure that the check

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Speaker 2: book is balanced.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So this person is important in the town to Dixon because,

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Speaker 2: as I said earlier, Mayor Jim Burke part time mayor,

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Speaker 2: city council, and city council members. Rather there's four of them.

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00:20:22,920 --> 00:20:26,200
Speaker 2: They're also all part time, so the city relies on

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Speaker 2: some full time employees to handle city business. So Rita

427
00:20:29,160 --> 00:20:32,640
Speaker 2: Cronwell joins this full time quatier of city hall employees

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00:20:33,160 --> 00:20:35,359
Speaker 2: and eventually she works her way up to treasurer and

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Speaker 2: then from treasurer to comptroller. So it takes her about

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Speaker 2: thirteen years. So now we're in nineteen eighty three, we're

431
00:20:42,480 --> 00:20:44,680
Speaker 2: into the Reagan years of America. There is a new

432
00:20:44,800 --> 00:20:47,840
Speaker 2: feeling about rural America. There's a new optimism coming out

433
00:20:47,840 --> 00:20:50,240
Speaker 2: of the seventies and inflation. So people are they're having

434
00:20:50,280 --> 00:20:52,920
Speaker 2: a little bit of a not a go go American moment,

435
00:20:53,000 --> 00:20:56,360
Speaker 2: but the rural America is feeling better about themselves.

436
00:20:56,480 --> 00:20:56,560
Speaker 3: Right.

437
00:20:56,720 --> 00:20:59,240
Speaker 2: Rita takes that moment says, I'm feeling better about myself

438
00:20:59,320 --> 00:21:03,560
Speaker 2: too now, Quicker than you can say Kevin Bacon and footloose.

439
00:21:03,720 --> 00:21:07,119
Speaker 2: Rita Crundwell starts angling for how she can make her

440
00:21:07,160 --> 00:21:09,280
Speaker 2: new appointment work for her. Takes her a little bit

441
00:21:09,320 --> 00:21:12,920
Speaker 2: of time, about seven years. About at that time, she's like,

442
00:21:13,400 --> 00:21:15,440
Speaker 2: I think I got to handle how I'm gonna scam

443
00:21:15,560 --> 00:21:18,480
Speaker 2: this town. Now. Rita, she's really good with numbers, Like

444
00:21:18,600 --> 00:21:21,560
Speaker 2: that's part of her bag is that she's exacting. She's

445
00:21:21,640 --> 00:21:24,719
Speaker 2: detail oriented, and everybody knows this about her. It's it's

446
00:21:24,800 --> 00:21:27,159
Speaker 2: her rep right. The mayor at the time of her

447
00:21:27,280 --> 00:21:30,680
Speaker 2: arrest said, quote, Rita was very efficient, very pleasant, she

448
00:21:30,760 --> 00:21:32,760
Speaker 2: got along with everyone, and she knew the job in

449
00:21:32,840 --> 00:21:36,240
Speaker 2: and out. She seemed like a perfect fit. Yeah. Right,

450
00:21:36,320 --> 00:21:38,600
Speaker 2: so that's her general mo o that everybody's reacting to.

451
00:21:38,920 --> 00:21:39,160
Speaker 3: Yeah.

452
00:21:39,560 --> 00:21:43,480
Speaker 2: Now, meanwhile, Rita is acting like a Banana Republic dictator.

453
00:21:43,600 --> 00:21:46,280
Speaker 2: She decides to take total control of city Hall, which

454
00:21:46,320 --> 00:21:49,080
Speaker 2: in this case means the flow of information. She has

455
00:21:49,400 --> 00:21:51,840
Speaker 2: all of the paperwork that she deals with routed to

456
00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:54,000
Speaker 2: a PO box so nobody can see the mail that

457
00:21:54,119 --> 00:21:57,880
Speaker 2: is coming to her. Nope, the address that you normally

458
00:21:57,880 --> 00:21:59,600
Speaker 2: would think of her where the mail would go city hall.

459
00:21:59,680 --> 00:22:01,639
Speaker 2: The whole reason why you have a city hall was

460
00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:03,640
Speaker 2: a building for business of city hall to We've be done,

461
00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:05,720
Speaker 2: She's like, no, send that to my PO box. I'll

462
00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:07,159
Speaker 2: do it at home. I'm a work from home kind

463
00:22:07,200 --> 00:22:09,919
Speaker 2: of gown. This is like way before I work at home.

464
00:22:10,119 --> 00:22:12,119
Speaker 3: Yeah. She's like, I'm a workaholic and this way I

465
00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:14,639
Speaker 3: can work on the weekends. And I see you read it.

466
00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:15,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, you say you're onto it.

467
00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:16,280
Speaker 3: Yeah.

468
00:22:16,359 --> 00:22:18,840
Speaker 2: Apparently in her small town everyone else was like, no,

469
00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:20,320
Speaker 2: she's just so good at her work.

470
00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:22,760
Speaker 3: Well, and one of the things that I noticed living

471
00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:25,320
Speaker 3: in a small town is that you are sort of

472
00:22:26,119 --> 00:22:30,359
Speaker 3: locked into your public persona when you're in high school,

473
00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:34,320
Speaker 3: and so whoever you are in high school tends to

474
00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:36,800
Speaker 3: follow you through. And so if you were like the

475
00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:39,280
Speaker 3: handsome quarterback and then you just kind of keep screwing

476
00:22:39,359 --> 00:22:41,240
Speaker 3: up later people are you know, but he was the

477
00:22:41,280 --> 00:22:44,920
Speaker 3: handsome quarterback or the state, you're the weird outsider. It's

478
00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:48,480
Speaker 3: hard to then change. And so she's like she it's

479
00:22:48,520 --> 00:22:51,560
Speaker 3: hard to reinvent yourself, whereas like where I'm you know,

480
00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:55,800
Speaker 3: born and raised California, that's like a pastime, right, mustant

481
00:22:55,840 --> 00:22:58,640
Speaker 3: reinvention completely, but you're not. Really it's hard. It's hard

482
00:22:58,680 --> 00:23:00,760
Speaker 3: in a small town. So I can see Rita if

483
00:23:00,840 --> 00:23:02,800
Speaker 3: she just locks herself in in high school is like

484
00:23:02,920 --> 00:23:06,879
Speaker 3: National Honor Society, doing work study, riding around in a

485
00:23:06,960 --> 00:23:09,960
Speaker 3: pickup truck whatever, like doing all the right things for

486
00:23:10,119 --> 00:23:12,240
Speaker 3: each everyone's gonna see her like that.

487
00:23:13,080 --> 00:23:15,320
Speaker 2: Never they never took a second glance. You're so right

488
00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:17,480
Speaker 2: about that. She apparently locked in and then she used that.

489
00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:19,280
Speaker 2: I think she was aware of it, like you are

490
00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:23,240
Speaker 2: that like this is all they see. So the meanwhile,

491
00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:26,119
Speaker 2: Rita is like basically doing exactly what you're saying, is

492
00:23:26,280 --> 00:23:31,080
Speaker 2: creating this persona that is impeccable and implacable in terms

493
00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:34,359
Speaker 2: of like everybody thinks they know Rita, they have no

494
00:23:34,520 --> 00:23:35,320
Speaker 2: idea who Rita is.

495
00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:39,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, right, So, like, for instance, to advance.

496
00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:42,280
Speaker 2: Her idea of her being really frugal and meticulous about money,

497
00:23:42,359 --> 00:23:45,040
Speaker 2: she always deducts money from her own salary for any

498
00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:47,560
Speaker 2: day of work that she misses. Right now, what this

499
00:23:47,720 --> 00:23:52,280
Speaker 2: means is if like she's out of office for like

500
00:23:52,720 --> 00:23:54,840
Speaker 2: a week for to go to a horse show, We'll

501
00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:57,960
Speaker 2: say she deducts that from her pay, and that balanced

502
00:23:58,000 --> 00:24:00,480
Speaker 2: out that one year. She makes about eighty three thousand

503
00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:03,560
Speaker 2: dollars a year, so she one year only made sixty

504
00:24:03,560 --> 00:24:05,920
Speaker 2: one thousand dollars because she took twenty two thousand dollars

505
00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:08,480
Speaker 2: off of her salary. So that way it would look like,

506
00:24:08,680 --> 00:24:09,399
Speaker 2: you know, well.

507
00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:12,880
Speaker 3: Did she not get vacation time or beyond? I think

508
00:24:12,920 --> 00:24:15,080
Speaker 3: she may have used up her page. Oh so she's

509
00:24:15,200 --> 00:24:18,760
Speaker 3: just above board, like yeah, look I'm taking leave without pay.

510
00:24:19,560 --> 00:24:21,000
Speaker 3: You wh she go do horse.

511
00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:23,399
Speaker 2: Stuff, horses shows and like travel. People don't know, they

512
00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:24,040
Speaker 2: just know that she leaves.

513
00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:26,360
Speaker 3: Wait a second, So she makes eighty g's a year

514
00:24:26,440 --> 00:24:29,760
Speaker 3: and she took off twenty that's like a quarter of

515
00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:31,200
Speaker 3: the time, she's not even there.

516
00:24:31,480 --> 00:24:32,000
Speaker 2: I do math.

517
00:24:32,119 --> 00:24:35,600
Speaker 3: Yes, they look at you a second semoke coming out

518
00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:36,080
Speaker 3: of my ears.

519
00:24:36,160 --> 00:24:38,440
Speaker 2: I was worried something caught fire. But yeah, nice work.

520
00:24:38,720 --> 00:24:41,640
Speaker 3: Like that's like half half of her time.

521
00:24:42,600 --> 00:24:45,960
Speaker 2: So they weren't doing this math. The local townspeople they're

522
00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:47,520
Speaker 2: just so happy and they figured Rito was so good

523
00:24:47,520 --> 00:24:50,920
Speaker 2: at a job. Meanwhile, that same time, when she's out sick,

524
00:24:51,080 --> 00:24:54,240
Speaker 2: she has like a family member go to her po

525
00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:56,159
Speaker 2: box and pick up her work to make sure that

526
00:24:56,200 --> 00:24:57,159
Speaker 2: nobody ever sees it.

527
00:24:57,320 --> 00:25:01,359
Speaker 3: Maybe they're using like the metric that I all jobs

528
00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:04,719
Speaker 3: would do is like forget the eight hours a day,

529
00:25:04,800 --> 00:25:07,680
Speaker 3: forty hour week. However, if you get your work done,

530
00:25:08,280 --> 00:25:09,680
Speaker 3: then fine, you get paid.

531
00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:11,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm with you. That should be the stand.

532
00:25:11,320 --> 00:25:14,120
Speaker 3: So let's be honest, like a quarter of our time

533
00:25:14,359 --> 00:25:18,760
Speaker 3: is you know, busy work, messing her doing I don't know,

534
00:25:19,040 --> 00:25:23,040
Speaker 3: crypto quip so yeah, for instance, for instance, I don't know,

535
00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:25,080
Speaker 3: just you know, spitball in here, but I think you

536
00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:29,160
Speaker 3: know she's she's laying out something now, she's doing nefarious things.

537
00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:32,000
Speaker 3: But if we're all honest with ourselves, yeah, we could

538
00:25:32,040 --> 00:25:33,760
Speaker 3: get all of our work done in three quarters of

539
00:25:33,800 --> 00:25:34,040
Speaker 3: the time.

540
00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:36,119
Speaker 2: She went way past I'm going to make the biggest

541
00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:39,000
Speaker 2: ball of rubber bands I can. But I see your point,

542
00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:41,480
Speaker 2: which is basically, you know, people should be able to

543
00:25:41,560 --> 00:25:43,640
Speaker 2: work as much as their work is required of right,

544
00:25:43,760 --> 00:25:45,760
Speaker 2: and not try to fill in some arbitrary oh you

545
00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:47,200
Speaker 2: got to be here on the clock kind of stuff

546
00:25:47,280 --> 00:25:49,320
Speaker 2: exactly completely, And Rita would agree with you.

547
00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:50,960
Speaker 3: No, I don't like that.

548
00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:53,560
Speaker 2: I know you don't want Tor on your side. In

549
00:25:53,720 --> 00:25:57,720
Speaker 2: nineteen ninety, Rita creates her fake dummy bank account and

550
00:25:57,840 --> 00:26:03,240
Speaker 2: goes into business of Rita. She starts sidelining money and

551
00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:07,280
Speaker 2: creating like well what will soon become a vast empire

552
00:26:07,320 --> 00:26:09,560
Speaker 2: in fortune in the horse world. And the way she

553
00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:12,480
Speaker 2: did it is she started a city account but in

554
00:26:12,600 --> 00:26:15,720
Speaker 2: her name, okay, So that way she's the only signatory

555
00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:18,040
Speaker 2: on the account. But as far as the bank is concerned,

556
00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:19,320
Speaker 2: it's doing city business.

557
00:26:19,560 --> 00:26:21,800
Speaker 3: So it's like City of Dixon.

558
00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:28,120
Speaker 2: Exactly, okay, and with signatory Rita, Rita crime. So that's

559
00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:30,280
Speaker 2: how she starts some in buzzle funds. And she likes it.

560
00:26:30,400 --> 00:26:32,800
Speaker 3: She's into it, right, she gets after it.

561
00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:35,399
Speaker 2: She's like a I don't know, a colonist in the

562
00:26:35,440 --> 00:26:37,560
Speaker 2: New World She's like, Oh, look at all this value

563
00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:41,880
Speaker 2: just lying around here. So her plan works because one

564
00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:45,119
Speaker 2: there is this constant influx of new city leaders. Right

565
00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:47,280
Speaker 2: the city council member and new mayor comes in. She

566
00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:49,400
Speaker 2: teaches them the books, this is how the city works,

567
00:26:49,440 --> 00:26:51,000
Speaker 2: this is what I do. So she teaches them her

568
00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:54,320
Speaker 2: cooked books method. When the city auditors come in, because

569
00:26:54,440 --> 00:26:57,000
Speaker 2: she was smart about this, starting about somewhere in the

570
00:26:57,000 --> 00:27:00,640
Speaker 2: mid eighties, she started basically faking the records. Nineteen ninety

571
00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:03,520
Speaker 2: when she creates her false account and starts diverting funds.

572
00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:06,440
Speaker 2: By that point she has all these records that are fake.

573
00:27:06,560 --> 00:27:09,680
Speaker 2: So the auditors looking back seven years they have a

574
00:27:09,800 --> 00:27:12,760
Speaker 2: false record. They don't yeah, so they can't see it either.

575
00:27:13,119 --> 00:27:15,920
Speaker 2: The local town is you know, they're the banks that

576
00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:17,680
Speaker 2: are supposed to be in charge of the accounts that

577
00:27:17,760 --> 00:27:19,920
Speaker 2: they keep getting bought up by national banks, so that

578
00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:22,520
Speaker 2: there no longer is that nosy bank manager who's paying

579
00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:24,840
Speaker 2: attention to how often Rita is coming in in diverting funds.

580
00:27:24,880 --> 00:27:28,119
Speaker 2: She's just sitting at home clicking buttons now and Dundale.

581
00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:32,000
Speaker 2: So there's no oversight either officially by the money cops.

582
00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:34,359
Speaker 2: There's no oversight by the bank managers, and there's no

583
00:27:34,440 --> 00:27:35,560
Speaker 2: oversight by her bosses.

584
00:27:35,960 --> 00:27:37,840
Speaker 3: Wow right, yes, exactly.

585
00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:40,840
Speaker 2: So at this point, the only thing that's holding it

586
00:27:40,920 --> 00:27:43,680
Speaker 2: together is that everybody, as I keep pointing out, is

587
00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:46,119
Speaker 2: so convinced that Rita is just so darn good at

588
00:27:46,160 --> 00:27:49,880
Speaker 2: her job rights. And I'll quote Mayor Jim Burke again,

589
00:27:50,840 --> 00:27:53,399
Speaker 2: he was just like enamored as mayor. He didn't have

590
00:27:53,440 --> 00:27:55,560
Speaker 2: to work very hard because if he needed anything done,

591
00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:57,639
Speaker 2: he just went to Rita. She knew right where it was,

592
00:27:57,960 --> 00:28:00,840
Speaker 2: so quote I could go unto her and say, Rita,

593
00:28:01,040 --> 00:28:03,600
Speaker 2: do you have a copy of the cable TV contract

594
00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:06,520
Speaker 2: from nineteen eighty six? And she'd go right to a

595
00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:09,440
Speaker 2: drawer and pull it out. How did you argue with that?

596
00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:12,560
Speaker 3: I trust her with the nuclear code exactly.

597
00:28:13,280 --> 00:28:16,200
Speaker 2: So, just you know, imagine poor Jim burk surprise when

598
00:28:16,200 --> 00:28:18,399
Speaker 2: the FBI showed up a city hall for Rita.

599
00:28:18,960 --> 00:28:20,800
Speaker 3: But of course he did know at that point. Well

600
00:28:20,840 --> 00:28:27,600
Speaker 3: wait a second, so what if everything is getting not everything,

601
00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:31,040
Speaker 3: but if she's diverting significant funds, is the town up

602
00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:34,879
Speaker 3: and running? Well, I mean, oh no, not at all.

603
00:28:35,600 --> 00:28:38,200
Speaker 2: Like that's the thing is so like they couldn't afford

604
00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:41,120
Speaker 2: to repair the cemetery like they had problems with their cemetery.

605
00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:43,960
Speaker 2: Their streets were going bad, the street lights weren't working.

606
00:28:44,040 --> 00:28:47,840
Speaker 2: They couldn't get uniforms and radar guns for the cops.

607
00:28:48,320 --> 00:28:50,520
Speaker 2: They had basketball courts at all broken ups. The kids

608
00:28:50,560 --> 00:28:52,840
Speaker 2: can't play on them. They had to go without city

609
00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:56,320
Speaker 2: jobs or pay increases for years. It was bad.

610
00:28:56,920 --> 00:28:59,680
Speaker 3: But Rita knows where the cable contract is exactly.

611
00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:02,400
Speaker 2: As long as you find that, What does mayor Jim

612
00:29:02,440 --> 00:29:04,000
Speaker 2: Burke's really care about the rest of day?

613
00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:04,840
Speaker 3: Goodness?

614
00:29:05,400 --> 00:29:07,320
Speaker 2: No, but I just like to focus on Rita for

615
00:29:07,440 --> 00:29:10,920
Speaker 2: a second. Can you imagine being her like lying to

616
00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:14,480
Speaker 2: everyone you know, everyone you grew up with, everyone you

617
00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:17,320
Speaker 2: work with every day of your life for decades, and

618
00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:20,520
Speaker 2: just creating this larger and larger divide between you and

619
00:29:20,840 --> 00:29:22,880
Speaker 2: who people think you are and who they're giving you

620
00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:24,760
Speaker 2: credit for you. You're not Rita Crundwell anymore.

621
00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:27,320
Speaker 3: No, And she must have the lowest opinion of every

622
00:29:27,400 --> 00:29:31,160
Speaker 3: other human being to r No, she's sociopathic or is

623
00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:32,840
Speaker 3: she just something else?

624
00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:34,480
Speaker 2: And I don't mean to do a diagnose her.

625
00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:36,880
Speaker 3: I'm I don't know, I don't know. I'm sure she's

626
00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:39,920
Speaker 3: got a whole host of issues. I'm wondering just about

627
00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:43,560
Speaker 3: what happened to her. Rita who hurts you, I know, right.

628
00:29:43,800 --> 00:29:45,920
Speaker 2: So the thing that we do know is that Rita

629
00:29:46,600 --> 00:29:49,520
Speaker 2: did it for one for the glamour. Oh we know

630
00:29:49,600 --> 00:29:52,080
Speaker 2: what her motivation was other than the horses. It wasn't

631
00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:54,680
Speaker 2: just the horses. It was also Rita elects, the diamonds,

632
00:29:54,800 --> 00:29:57,320
Speaker 2: the fur, the bright lights of the big city. And

633
00:29:57,360 --> 00:29:59,680
Speaker 2: in this case, the big city is Oklahoma City. Well

634
00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:02,720
Speaker 2: it's a big city, sure, Okay, yeah, I mean like, yeah,

635
00:30:02,760 --> 00:30:04,360
Speaker 2: it is a big city if you're from Dickson, Illinois.

636
00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:07,160
Speaker 2: I'm just saying it's not like, oh, she's out in Manhattan.

637
00:30:07,200 --> 00:30:08,520
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm not trying to say it. Every city

638
00:30:08,560 --> 00:30:10,080
Speaker 2: has to be measured against New York. But there are

639
00:30:10,080 --> 00:30:11,320
Speaker 2: a lot of big cities in this world. And I

640
00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:14,640
Speaker 2: will put Oklahoma City up. Oklahoma, I like that about you.

641
00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:16,720
Speaker 2: My apologies, Oklahoma.

642
00:30:16,320 --> 00:30:17,320
Speaker 3: City, well Arts District.

643
00:30:17,440 --> 00:30:20,440
Speaker 2: Oh No, I like the city. I'm not like saying

644
00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:23,320
Speaker 2: anything bad. I just wouldn't say that it's a big

645
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:26,520
Speaker 2: city in America, you know, like Houston. Houston's a big

646
00:30:26,560 --> 00:30:29,640
Speaker 2: city in America. The Oklahoma City, I mean a big heart. Yes,

647
00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:34,360
Speaker 2: it is a beautiful city with a big heart. The

648
00:30:34,760 --> 00:30:38,640
Speaker 2: American quarter Horse Association's World Championship Show. It happens to

649
00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:40,400
Speaker 2: be in Oklahoma City every year.

650
00:30:40,640 --> 00:30:42,880
Speaker 3: What do you know? Yeah, and uh, that place is.

651
00:30:43,440 --> 00:30:45,800
Speaker 2: I don't know if you've ever been to the American

652
00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:48,080
Speaker 2: quarter Horse Association World Championship Show.

653
00:30:48,440 --> 00:30:50,040
Speaker 3: But I missed it.

654
00:30:50,160 --> 00:30:52,240
Speaker 2: Oh then I don't need to tell you. But just

655
00:30:52,280 --> 00:30:55,320
Speaker 2: for my own edification, I'll remind you that it is

656
00:30:55,480 --> 00:30:59,000
Speaker 2: possibly one of the largest collections of humans you know

657
00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:01,480
Speaker 2: that takes place on the North American continent. Bigger than

658
00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:04,560
Speaker 2: Democratic national conventions, better than the Republican National Convention. It's

659
00:31:04,560 --> 00:31:06,800
Speaker 2: bigger than the Super Bowl. It's hundreds of thousands of

660
00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:10,200
Speaker 2: people coming into Oklahoma City just talking horses, walking horses,

661
00:31:10,240 --> 00:31:13,480
Speaker 2: looking at horses, just being all about horse life for days.

662
00:31:14,160 --> 00:31:19,040
Speaker 2: Yeah whatever, Yeah, that horsey life, horse horse life. So

663
00:31:19,240 --> 00:31:21,080
Speaker 2: like the type of people that you would see in town,

664
00:31:21,120 --> 00:31:25,280
Speaker 2: Oklahoma City during the quarter Horse Association World Championship Show.

665
00:31:25,480 --> 00:31:29,240
Speaker 2: People like Harrison Ford, Kevin Costner, Robert Redford, Lyle love it.

666
00:31:29,640 --> 00:31:31,520
Speaker 2: So all those celebrities that you can think of is

667
00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:34,560
Speaker 2: like I can imagine him with a horse. The horsey set,

668
00:31:34,680 --> 00:31:36,760
Speaker 2: the horsey set people are down for that horse life. Yeah,

669
00:31:37,040 --> 00:31:39,560
Speaker 2: so Rita crunwell, she would like to go and do

670
00:31:39,600 --> 00:31:42,240
Speaker 2: Oklahoma City. And whenever she would go, she would show

671
00:31:42,440 --> 00:31:48,360
Speaker 2: out for bikinis. Not that kind of show out, but

672
00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:50,120
Speaker 2: but she would put a show on a show. I'll

673
00:31:50,160 --> 00:31:52,960
Speaker 2: just leave it at that. So the floor of the arena,

674
00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:57,120
Speaker 2: because just imagine like a giant like basketball stadium or

675
00:31:57,160 --> 00:31:59,720
Speaker 2: football indorse, football stadium, right, So on the floor of

676
00:31:59,760 --> 00:32:03,760
Speaker 2: that stadium you would have convention stalls and booze, and

677
00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:06,200
Speaker 2: Rita would down be down there with everybody else. But

678
00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:08,160
Speaker 2: instead of having like a table on the stall, she

679
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:11,760
Speaker 2: would have, for instance, a log cabin recreated for the event. Wait,

680
00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:14,440
Speaker 2: an entire an entire log cabin.

681
00:32:14,640 --> 00:32:17,360
Speaker 3: It's like, hey, look, dude, was Abraham Lincoln born there?

682
00:32:17,440 --> 00:32:18,240
Speaker 3: What's going on here?

683
00:32:18,680 --> 00:32:21,480
Speaker 2: Now? That was just the entrance to her section. Once

684
00:32:21,520 --> 00:32:24,720
Speaker 2: you stepped inside the recreation log cabin, you'd be greeted

685
00:32:24,800 --> 00:32:26,920
Speaker 2: by the sight of the glitter and the shine of

686
00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:29,840
Speaker 2: her trophy room she had. You had to walk past

687
00:32:29,920 --> 00:32:31,280
Speaker 2: all of her trophies.

688
00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:31,920
Speaker 3: Like a pageant kid.

689
00:32:32,040 --> 00:32:34,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, like total pagan kid. And she had like

690
00:32:35,000 --> 00:32:37,760
Speaker 2: that love of like I don't know, ribbons, that whatever,

691
00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:40,600
Speaker 2: it is that motivates the passion for ribbons. She wanted

692
00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:43,640
Speaker 2: everyone to see her ribbon collection gold plastic. Yeah exactly.

693
00:32:43,800 --> 00:32:45,480
Speaker 2: She's like, look at this, this is etched, has my

694
00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:49,400
Speaker 2: name on it. It's magical. So after the gleam of

695
00:32:49,440 --> 00:32:52,040
Speaker 2: her trophy room wears off and you wander further into

696
00:32:52,120 --> 00:32:56,040
Speaker 2: the recreated log cabin, then you meet the full open

697
00:32:56,120 --> 00:32:58,600
Speaker 2: bar that she has arrayed for her guests, and there

698
00:32:58,680 --> 00:33:01,880
Speaker 2: you could grab a cocktail, all courtesy of Rita Crunwell.

699
00:33:02,240 --> 00:33:04,120
Speaker 2: And now I like to imagine, you know, one of

700
00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:07,239
Speaker 2: this Horsey set sitting in that recreated log cabin with her.

701
00:33:07,560 --> 00:33:10,000
Speaker 2: Let's say Harrison Ford, all right, and he's like raising

702
00:33:10,040 --> 00:33:12,880
Speaker 2: a glass talking horses to Rita, and Rita's telling him

703
00:33:12,920 --> 00:33:14,560
Speaker 2: how good it was this year, and he's telling her

704
00:33:14,600 --> 00:33:16,720
Speaker 2: how good the whiskey is. And she's like, oh, you

705
00:33:16,880 --> 00:33:19,040
Speaker 2: like the whiskey. And he's like, yep, oh what am

706
00:33:19,080 --> 00:33:22,640
Speaker 2: I doing it? You're the celebrity and profession you're the professional. Yeah, okay,

707
00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:24,880
Speaker 2: would you mind being Harrison Ford for a second. I'm

708
00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:28,000
Speaker 2: happy to okay, So I'm Rita. So she's like, imagine

709
00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:30,120
Speaker 2: the scene. She's like, oh, yeah, I sitting there surrounded

710
00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:33,840
Speaker 2: by log cabins, people elbow hobnobbin, talking horses and horse

711
00:33:33,880 --> 00:33:36,600
Speaker 2: trailers or whatever they talk about. She's like more Champagne

712
00:33:36,640 --> 00:33:37,440
Speaker 2: Harrison Ford.

713
00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:42,760
Speaker 3: M hm, hey, but that is me, Harrison Ford, a

714
00:33:42,880 --> 00:33:47,120
Speaker 3: flying airplane and I eat play though see flawless.

715
00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:49,240
Speaker 2: I mean, it's like you're in the log cabin with

716
00:33:49,400 --> 00:33:52,160
Speaker 2: Rita and Harrison or as I call him, Harry. Now,

717
00:33:53,040 --> 00:33:54,680
Speaker 2: oh my god, I'm sorry, I have to apologize with

718
00:33:54,840 --> 00:33:57,160
Speaker 2: I totally forgot to tell you how she's dressed at

719
00:33:57,200 --> 00:33:58,000
Speaker 2: these events.

720
00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:01,720
Speaker 3: Practically practically real close.

721
00:34:01,800 --> 00:34:03,760
Speaker 2: So just put a little bit more fur on it

722
00:34:03,960 --> 00:34:07,440
Speaker 2: and make it like a full white fur coat, like

723
00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:10,480
Speaker 2: you know, like white, I don't know, snow leopard fur

724
00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:15,120
Speaker 2: or something exotic, something endangered, and then diamonds and like,

725
00:34:15,239 --> 00:34:16,240
Speaker 2: I don't know, a tiara.

726
00:34:17,280 --> 00:34:20,319
Speaker 3: It's going hard. It's kind of more than I anticipated.

727
00:34:20,360 --> 00:34:22,640
Speaker 3: I thought she'd be like in TJ Max's Finest.

728
00:34:22,680 --> 00:34:25,400
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, no, she's got like the beaded tops or

729
00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:28,080
Speaker 2: whatever those things are, like the sequins and beads.

730
00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:29,960
Speaker 3: I don't know what the lame bryant of it all.

731
00:34:30,120 --> 00:34:33,120
Speaker 3: I'm just imagining with the beaded tops that instead it's

732
00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:35,720
Speaker 3: like those beaded seat covers for cab drivers.

733
00:34:36,719 --> 00:34:40,359
Speaker 2: Not quite those big like like a wooden.

734
00:34:40,120 --> 00:34:44,640
Speaker 3: Macro made top exactly. She's very experimental. She's very fashioned forward.

735
00:34:44,520 --> 00:34:46,319
Speaker 2: Like so fashion forward you can't even see her. She's

736
00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:49,319
Speaker 2: just down the line to hope that she's out there still.

737
00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:51,279
Speaker 3: She's just in like a milar suit.

738
00:34:51,640 --> 00:34:53,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was real. I thought you would appreciate her, like,

739
00:34:54,040 --> 00:34:55,360
Speaker 2: I see if I can find some pictures and we

740
00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:57,480
Speaker 2: put them on Instagram. She has a real best in

741
00:34:57,560 --> 00:34:59,759
Speaker 2: show vibe to her outfits. And I know how you

742
00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:03,360
Speaker 2: I love that movie go for that. Yeah, kimonos, we

743
00:35:03,560 --> 00:35:05,640
Speaker 2: just kind of imagine that, but less fun, more crime.

744
00:35:07,440 --> 00:35:09,880
Speaker 2: I don't know. Also, what is your favorite like middle

745
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:13,239
Speaker 2: aged woman's fashion tendency? Like I was trying to think of,

746
00:35:13,320 --> 00:35:15,719
Speaker 2: like what stores it is that she's probably shopping at.

747
00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:18,000
Speaker 3: Stated, That's what I was.

748
00:35:18,239 --> 00:35:19,640
Speaker 2: That's only when I could go with and I was like,

749
00:35:19,680 --> 00:35:21,439
Speaker 2: I don't mean to just pick on the Chico's woman.

750
00:35:21,560 --> 00:35:24,879
Speaker 2: Is there like another brand that is j Jill j Jill?

751
00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:27,319
Speaker 3: Okay, I don't know. I'd have to know her full

752
00:35:27,360 --> 00:35:29,960
Speaker 3: aesthetic to give it a good assessment. Is she like

753
00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:31,480
Speaker 3: a is she a department store?

754
00:35:31,560 --> 00:35:34,719
Speaker 2: Gal No, no, are you kidding me? No, she is

755
00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:38,640
Speaker 2: definitely boutique as much as possible. No. I mean occasionally,

756
00:35:38,719 --> 00:35:40,880
Speaker 2: if she can't get out of Dixon, she may have to, like,

757
00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:43,600
Speaker 2: you know, get her jeans at the local store. But

758
00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:44,200
Speaker 2: other than that.

759
00:35:44,520 --> 00:35:44,960
Speaker 3: Interesting.

760
00:35:45,080 --> 00:35:47,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, there was a woman in the horse scene

761
00:35:47,520 --> 00:35:49,840
Speaker 2: who knew her very well, and she was talking in

762
00:35:49,880 --> 00:35:52,160
Speaker 2: a newspaper article. And I found this and I thought,

763
00:35:52,680 --> 00:35:56,400
Speaker 2: thistle answer Elizabeth question. So she clalked Rita's style to

764
00:35:56,480 --> 00:36:01,640
Speaker 2: time and I quote, this is about her beaded gowns

765
00:36:01,840 --> 00:36:03,600
Speaker 2: that you would wear to these events, like at the

766
00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:06,719
Speaker 2: nighttime formal event at the American quarter Horse Association's World

767
00:36:06,800 --> 00:36:10,680
Speaker 2: Championship show, and I quote, they're beautiful. I went to

768
00:36:10,719 --> 00:36:12,680
Speaker 2: look at a couple of the blouses she wore. The

769
00:36:12,920 --> 00:36:16,760
Speaker 2: used ones were eighteen hundred dollars a pop, and Rita

770
00:36:17,000 --> 00:36:23,840
Speaker 2: didn't wear used I thought, gad zeukes the Midwestern jumped out, didn't.

771
00:36:23,680 --> 00:36:27,640
Speaker 3: It, dad zoos? So she's like wearing designer duds. Yeah, exactly.

772
00:36:27,719 --> 00:36:31,320
Speaker 3: Do you think she wore Carl Lagerfeld, Sure, because didn't

773
00:36:31,320 --> 00:36:32,719
Speaker 3: he eat horse meat?

774
00:36:32,840 --> 00:36:35,279
Speaker 2: Oh god, I don't know anything about that.

775
00:36:36,560 --> 00:36:38,680
Speaker 3: Making that up is that's true, I make up most

776
00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:41,319
Speaker 3: of what I say, but I do believe that it's

777
00:36:41,400 --> 00:36:44,120
Speaker 3: true that Carl Lagerfeld was on like a horse meat diet.

778
00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:47,040
Speaker 3: It's a lot of French people eat horse meat.

779
00:36:47,280 --> 00:36:49,719
Speaker 2: I'm aware of that. They do eat horse meat over there,

780
00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:51,960
Speaker 2: and I just tried to forget like.

781
00:36:52,000 --> 00:36:54,080
Speaker 3: The synergy of her wearing lager films and.

782
00:36:54,120 --> 00:36:55,400
Speaker 2: Eating horse meat, Carl.

783
00:36:56,840 --> 00:36:57,319
Speaker 3: Horse meat.

784
00:36:57,360 --> 00:36:58,600
Speaker 2: Well, I don't know about the horse meat part.

785
00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:02,279
Speaker 3: Well, I haven't had. Carl Lagerfeld lost ninety pounds on

786
00:37:02,360 --> 00:37:04,320
Speaker 3: a diet of tuna and BlackBerry moose.

787
00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:06,359
Speaker 2: I'm not hearing horse meat.

788
00:37:06,680 --> 00:37:09,640
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, No, it was rumored that Carl Lagerfeld's famous

789
00:37:09,719 --> 00:37:12,600
Speaker 3: diet involved eating horse meat, tomatoes, and diet.

790
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:16,600
Speaker 2: Coke altogether of Vogue, Thank you Vogue.

791
00:37:16,600 --> 00:37:20,400
Speaker 3: A slurry of horse meat, tomatoes and dyke.

792
00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:23,120
Speaker 2: Slurry of horse meat. Thank you Vogue for something I'll

793
00:37:23,160 --> 00:37:27,920
Speaker 2: never forget. And thank you Elizabeth for yet another gross dropping.

794
00:37:27,680 --> 00:37:31,959
Speaker 3: A gross up. Oh calf's liver too. In Wild Straw.

795
00:37:32,960 --> 00:37:36,160
Speaker 2: Well, I'm glad you asked about Rita and what people

796
00:37:36,239 --> 00:37:37,360
Speaker 2: thought about her and money.

797
00:37:37,560 --> 00:37:40,920
Speaker 3: So speaking of Rita, speaking of Rita.

798
00:37:40,800 --> 00:37:43,920
Speaker 2: Crundwell and whether or not she came from money or not.

799
00:37:44,680 --> 00:37:47,440
Speaker 2: People used to wonder if she'd inherited land from her family,

800
00:37:47,560 --> 00:37:50,840
Speaker 2: and uh, you know it's true. She actually had inherited

801
00:37:50,880 --> 00:37:53,839
Speaker 2: a horse farm from her mother. The details may have varied,

802
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:56,040
Speaker 2: but the general story was the same. Someone died, she

803
00:37:56,200 --> 00:37:59,120
Speaker 2: got wealthy, right, That's like the story around the horse world. Now,

804
00:37:59,400 --> 00:38:01,920
Speaker 2: that was pretty true. A whole ass town was literally

805
00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:05,080
Speaker 2: dying and she got welcome. So there was the death man,

806
00:38:05,160 --> 00:38:08,480
Speaker 2: well shark other everything else. The details a little wrong. Now,

807
00:38:08,600 --> 00:38:11,279
Speaker 2: when Rita would arrive at a horse show before she

808
00:38:11,440 --> 00:38:13,600
Speaker 2: would you know, set up her bass Pro shop Lincoln

809
00:38:13,640 --> 00:38:16,759
Speaker 2: log cabin, before any drinks got poured for any horse

810
00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:19,640
Speaker 2: loving stars like Lyle love It. Oh wait, I gotta

811
00:38:19,680 --> 00:38:22,560
Speaker 2: do one more. Would you like some more Champagne Lyle loving?

812
00:38:23,200 --> 00:38:26,359
Speaker 3: Hey everybody, it's me Lyle love It. I just stole

813
00:38:26,440 --> 00:38:27,600
Speaker 3: Temple grand and shirt.

814
00:38:28,760 --> 00:38:30,560
Speaker 2: It's amazing. It's like he's just here for a moment,

815
00:38:30,600 --> 00:38:31,320
Speaker 2: then he disappears.

816
00:38:31,480 --> 00:38:33,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, I get I transform.

817
00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:35,640
Speaker 2: No, thank you for gracing us with that one. I

818
00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:36,279
Speaker 2: always liked those.

819
00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:37,080
Speaker 3: That one's on the house.

820
00:38:37,480 --> 00:38:40,080
Speaker 2: Before Rita would pull on her white fur coat or

821
00:38:40,239 --> 00:38:42,759
Speaker 2: for you, her white fur bikini and some hot little

822
00:38:42,800 --> 00:38:45,719
Speaker 2: sequin number to dazzle the horsey crowd. Rita also like

823
00:38:45,800 --> 00:38:47,719
Speaker 2: to make a big splash in the parking lotch she

824
00:38:47,760 --> 00:38:50,960
Speaker 2: would like, I don't mean like jumping from a hike,

825
00:38:51,560 --> 00:38:54,160
Speaker 2: like jumping. She didn't do it that way, not like

826
00:38:54,200 --> 00:38:56,440
Speaker 2: pushing a watermelon off the top of a building splash.

827
00:38:56,560 --> 00:38:58,200
Speaker 2: I mean like she wanted people to be like, Oh,

828
00:38:58,239 --> 00:39:02,080
Speaker 2: it's Rita kind of walk on music pretty much. It

829
00:39:02,200 --> 00:39:04,600
Speaker 2: was just like the sound of pain and suffering in

830
00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:08,200
Speaker 2: her hometown. But drum beat was amazing. No, before she

831
00:39:08,239 --> 00:39:10,880
Speaker 2: would get there, she would like have like her fleet

832
00:39:11,040 --> 00:39:14,960
Speaker 2: arrive right. And her fleet consisted of a forty five

833
00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:17,840
Speaker 2: foot Liberty Coach RV. And in case you're not in

834
00:39:17,920 --> 00:39:20,080
Speaker 2: the market for RVs, that's one of the nicest ones

835
00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:22,719
Speaker 2: that you can get. Yeah, so that one is the

836
00:39:22,880 --> 00:39:27,640
Speaker 2: luxury liner of mobile forty five foot long Liberty Coach

837
00:39:27,800 --> 00:39:31,840
Speaker 2: RV forty five long, way bigger than like your normal

838
00:39:32,080 --> 00:39:36,200
Speaker 2: like a tour bus. Now, this boasted a king sized bed,

839
00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:42,680
Speaker 2: five satellite TVs, marble countertops, leather wrapped railings, multiple tile floors,

840
00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:47,200
Speaker 2: multiple tile floors, also a washer and dryer. I don't

841
00:39:47,239 --> 00:39:49,840
Speaker 2: even have one of those in my apartment. Now, this

842
00:39:50,040 --> 00:39:53,160
Speaker 2: whole thing costs two million dollars. Two million dollars for

843
00:39:53,239 --> 00:39:53,680
Speaker 2: an RV.

844
00:39:54,080 --> 00:39:55,000
Speaker 3: Great day in the morning.

845
00:39:55,040 --> 00:39:56,600
Speaker 2: Do you know how much of Dixon, Illinois you could

846
00:39:56,600 --> 00:39:59,719
Speaker 2: fix with that RV? No, of course, she didn't handle

847
00:39:59,800 --> 00:40:02,680
Speaker 2: her horses herself. Now, Rita had professional cowboys for all

848
00:40:02,680 --> 00:40:05,440
Speaker 2: that she didn't like brush down the maine and tail.

849
00:40:05,880 --> 00:40:07,120
Speaker 3: She just would do boys.

850
00:40:07,160 --> 00:40:09,360
Speaker 2: So there's the stall, set up the horses, right, So

851
00:40:09,520 --> 00:40:11,400
Speaker 2: she'd have them mucking out the trailers and all that

852
00:40:11,440 --> 00:40:13,320
Speaker 2: stuff that she didn't want to do. But those cowboys

853
00:40:13,400 --> 00:40:15,279
Speaker 2: they weren't cheap either, so she had to have a

854
00:40:15,320 --> 00:40:18,319
Speaker 2: trailer for them and then have you know, lodging.

855
00:40:18,080 --> 00:40:20,480
Speaker 3: For them and so forth. She had a mighty convoy.

856
00:40:20,840 --> 00:40:23,120
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, but she was really successful with this because

857
00:40:23,120 --> 00:40:25,280
Speaker 2: of how much money she was diverting into her horsey funds.

858
00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:28,480
Speaker 2: In twenty eleven, just before this is right before Rita

859
00:40:28,520 --> 00:40:31,120
Speaker 2: gets busted. She gets busted in twenty twelve, the year

860
00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:33,440
Speaker 2: before she gets busted, when she went to the American

861
00:40:33,560 --> 00:40:36,640
Speaker 2: quarter Horse Association World Championship Show in Oklahoma City.

862
00:40:36,840 --> 00:40:40,360
Speaker 3: That's a mouthful, quite She was the bell of the

863
00:40:40,400 --> 00:40:43,600
Speaker 3: ball that year. She won fifty four prizes at the

864
00:40:43,640 --> 00:40:46,080
Speaker 3: Oklahoma Any of those money or is it just all

865
00:40:46,239 --> 00:40:46,799
Speaker 3: a bunch of other.

866
00:40:46,760 --> 00:40:49,919
Speaker 2: Yeah, she's wanting some ribbons and some prize money. Yeah,

867
00:40:49,960 --> 00:40:51,680
Speaker 2: like quarter million dollars kind of prize money.

868
00:40:52,160 --> 00:40:53,520
Speaker 3: She was named the leading.

869
00:40:53,360 --> 00:40:57,080
Speaker 2: Owner of the American quarter Horse Association that year.

870
00:40:57,400 --> 00:40:59,279
Speaker 3: Yeah, she's pouring a bunch of money into the whole

871
00:40:59,360 --> 00:40:59,960
Speaker 3: thing completely.

872
00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:01,880
Speaker 2: Eighth year in a row, she was named Owner of

873
00:41:02,000 --> 00:41:05,479
Speaker 2: the Year. I'll tell you your hometown's harder, and money

874
00:41:05,560 --> 00:41:08,839
Speaker 2: goes far if you direct it in one tight funnel. Now,

875
00:41:08,920 --> 00:41:11,280
Speaker 2: the only thing that her friends and neighbors knew about

876
00:41:11,320 --> 00:41:13,600
Speaker 2: what Rita was doing down in Oklahoma City came to

877
00:41:13,680 --> 00:41:16,800
Speaker 2: them from the newspaper articles because they would, like, you know,

878
00:41:17,120 --> 00:41:19,440
Speaker 2: see like a headline, Oh Rita won again down to

879
00:41:19,480 --> 00:41:20,239
Speaker 2: Oklahoma City.

880
00:41:20,280 --> 00:41:21,239
Speaker 3: We're so proud of her.

881
00:41:21,719 --> 00:41:25,560
Speaker 2: So going back to my man Mayor, Big Jim Burke,

882
00:41:26,560 --> 00:41:30,359
Speaker 2: he was quoted talking about how all this prize money

883
00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:32,680
Speaker 2: Rita was winning shown by the newspapers. He said, and

884
00:41:32,800 --> 00:41:35,720
Speaker 2: I quote, we all knew that she had these horses,

885
00:41:35,800 --> 00:41:37,840
Speaker 2: but you know, there were big write ups about her

886
00:41:37,880 --> 00:41:40,879
Speaker 2: in the papers, and she's winning all these national championships,

887
00:41:40,920 --> 00:41:43,640
Speaker 2: and there were stories flying around town that she was

888
00:41:43,719 --> 00:41:46,480
Speaker 2: selling horses for two hundred and fifty thousand dollars three

889
00:41:46,560 --> 00:41:49,279
Speaker 2: hundred thousand dollars. So we thought this was what that was,

890
00:41:49,320 --> 00:41:53,359
Speaker 2: what was providing her this nice income, a successful horse business. Now,

891
00:41:53,400 --> 00:41:55,400
Speaker 2: when she was caught by the FBI, Rita, as I

892
00:41:55,480 --> 00:41:57,920
Speaker 2: told you, was the officially the fifth greatest embezzler of

893
00:41:57,960 --> 00:42:00,400
Speaker 2: all time. That's how successful her horse business this was.

894
00:42:01,120 --> 00:42:03,400
Speaker 2: Now she's like the Larry Bird of embezzlement, just this

895
00:42:03,520 --> 00:42:06,799
Speaker 2: hard worker from the heartland. You know. Now, personally, if

896
00:42:06,880 --> 00:42:08,239
Speaker 2: I was someone to ask me, like, what do you

897
00:42:08,320 --> 00:42:10,320
Speaker 2: do for a living, I'm not going to say anything

898
00:42:10,400 --> 00:42:12,160
Speaker 2: about my real life anymore. I'm going to use the

899
00:42:12,200 --> 00:42:14,960
Speaker 2: Rita Crundwell method. I'm gonna start telling people, Oh, all

900
00:42:15,040 --> 00:42:18,200
Speaker 2: my money it's in walruses. I'm in the walrus business.

901
00:42:18,480 --> 00:42:20,120
Speaker 2: See if people go for it. I really like this.

902
00:42:21,719 --> 00:42:24,279
Speaker 2: We'll take a quick break and after this I'll tell

903
00:42:24,320 --> 00:42:48,560
Speaker 2: you how Rita got busted. Elizabeth. Yes, our girl, Rita Crundwell.

904
00:42:48,640 --> 00:42:50,279
Speaker 2: I've been telling you about her. I've been telling you

905
00:42:50,320 --> 00:42:52,440
Speaker 2: about Harrison ford Lyle. Love it, all the fun stuff

906
00:42:52,480 --> 00:42:55,560
Speaker 2: she's been doing. But what else was she spending her

907
00:42:55,600 --> 00:42:59,440
Speaker 2: stolen loot on besides impressing Harrison Ford with expensive whiskeys

908
00:42:59,440 --> 00:43:03,120
Speaker 2: and champagne scented candles. Good call, good call. No, she

909
00:43:03,360 --> 00:43:04,359
Speaker 2: was actually buying land.

910
00:43:04,920 --> 00:43:06,400
Speaker 3: Well that's smart. Yeah, that's what you.

911
00:43:06,520 --> 00:43:08,239
Speaker 2: You know, they aren't making it anymore, as Mark Twain

912
00:43:08,280 --> 00:43:10,600
Speaker 2: would say, yep. Well, starting in two thousand and six,

913
00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:13,600
Speaker 2: Rita she made some real estate purchases and she bought

914
00:43:13,640 --> 00:43:16,080
Speaker 2: an eighty eight acre spread that cost her about half

915
00:43:16,160 --> 00:43:19,200
Speaker 2: million dollars of her hometown's money. She dubbed her new

916
00:43:19,239 --> 00:43:21,759
Speaker 2: spread Rita's Ranch. Now, personally, I would have gone with

917
00:43:21,840 --> 00:43:24,560
Speaker 2: Casa de Rita, but that's just me. I don't know.

918
00:43:25,000 --> 00:43:26,560
Speaker 2: You know, you had a name like Rita, you can.

919
00:43:26,480 --> 00:43:28,480
Speaker 3: Really rude Marta Ritaville.

920
00:43:28,719 --> 00:43:31,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. See already two better names right there. We're

921
00:43:31,719 --> 00:43:36,040
Speaker 2: not even trying. So it was a complete horse breeding complex,

922
00:43:36,160 --> 00:43:40,200
Speaker 2: training exercise compound. She even had a whole arena built

923
00:43:40,239 --> 00:43:42,479
Speaker 2: for her to practice in. Just imagine her riding around

924
00:43:42,520 --> 00:43:44,960
Speaker 2: the horses with an empty arena, her imagining the crowds

925
00:43:45,040 --> 00:43:45,480
Speaker 2: cheering her.

926
00:43:45,880 --> 00:43:47,920
Speaker 3: She had like a button she pushed in the sound

927
00:43:47,960 --> 00:43:55,560
Speaker 3: of crowds. Confetti cannons all shaped like butterflies.

928
00:43:55,960 --> 00:43:59,319
Speaker 2: Yes, Carrie, I know I threw that one in there

929
00:43:59,600 --> 00:44:02,759
Speaker 2: from r carries a tour rider. She requests that there

930
00:44:02,880 --> 00:44:05,080
Speaker 2: be confetti in her dressing room that must be the

931
00:44:05,160 --> 00:44:10,799
Speaker 2: shape of butterflies. No moth confetti for miss Mimi. Now,

932
00:44:11,000 --> 00:44:12,920
Speaker 2: as I told you, rita Cronwell salary from the City

933
00:44:12,920 --> 00:44:16,080
Speaker 2: of Dixon eighty three thousand dollars. So people are willing

934
00:44:16,160 --> 00:44:18,600
Speaker 2: to believe that this eighty three thousand dollars salary is

935
00:44:18,680 --> 00:44:21,840
Speaker 2: being very well invested apparently. Yeah, So while she was

936
00:44:21,920 --> 00:44:23,600
Speaker 2: a hob nubbing with the rich and famous in her

937
00:44:23,640 --> 00:44:26,279
Speaker 2: white fur and her diamonds and tr or whatever she

938
00:44:26,440 --> 00:44:28,680
Speaker 2: was doing, that was her one persona back home, She's

939
00:44:28,719 --> 00:44:31,320
Speaker 2: still like all of her neighbors. She's wearing the you know,

940
00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:35,440
Speaker 2: the boots a cow the cowboy, you know, flannels, like

941
00:44:35,880 --> 00:44:38,600
Speaker 2: she looks like everybody else. And that is pretty much

942
00:44:38,680 --> 00:44:41,640
Speaker 2: how she manages her whole criminal enterprise. Nobody looks past

943
00:44:41,719 --> 00:44:43,439
Speaker 2: the surface of what she looks like as a middle

944
00:44:43,480 --> 00:44:43,879
Speaker 2: aged woman.

945
00:44:44,360 --> 00:44:46,480
Speaker 3: That's at the time. And in a small town, it's

946
00:44:46,520 --> 00:44:48,640
Speaker 3: a lot of money. Today in a small town, making

947
00:44:48,680 --> 00:44:50,520
Speaker 3: eighty three thousand dollars is a lot of money.

948
00:44:50,600 --> 00:44:52,759
Speaker 2: It's not enough for a two million dollar RV.

949
00:44:53,520 --> 00:44:55,480
Speaker 3: No do they not? Does the town know about the

950
00:44:55,520 --> 00:44:56,880
Speaker 3: two million or ask to park it?

951
00:44:57,160 --> 00:44:59,680
Speaker 2: I mean, she comes back to town with this compleet

952
00:44:59,800 --> 00:45:03,239
Speaker 2: of cars under cover of darkness. She had like full

953
00:45:03,320 --> 00:45:07,760
Speaker 2: on eighteen wheelers pulling horse trailers. Multiple she had multiple

954
00:45:07,840 --> 00:45:09,680
Speaker 2: eighteen wheelers in her canoy convoy.

955
00:45:10,000 --> 00:45:11,759
Speaker 3: She's probably just telling you know what, I got a

956
00:45:11,840 --> 00:45:14,279
Speaker 3: great deal. If you go to the back of Tjmax,

957
00:45:14,920 --> 00:45:18,319
Speaker 3: they have all the cars and trucks, ask for Cheryl'll

958
00:45:18,520 --> 00:45:20,479
Speaker 3: people don't know. And then if you kind of bump

959
00:45:20,520 --> 00:45:22,759
Speaker 3: it a little scratch that, you get another twenty percent off.

960
00:45:22,800 --> 00:45:23,920
Speaker 2: Where do you think I got this bracelet?

961
00:45:24,120 --> 00:45:26,080
Speaker 3: Yeah? Everything is she got a deal.

962
00:45:26,960 --> 00:45:31,319
Speaker 2: The US district court that filed the indictment against her,

963
00:45:31,840 --> 00:45:34,280
Speaker 2: they would not agree that she got great deals because

964
00:45:34,400 --> 00:45:36,800
Speaker 2: they had actually the itemized list of all of her stuff.

965
00:45:36,840 --> 00:45:39,000
Speaker 2: And I'll just read you a couple of the highlights.

966
00:45:40,120 --> 00:45:44,160
Speaker 2: Between nineteen ninety and two thousand and six, she stole

967
00:45:44,200 --> 00:45:47,440
Speaker 2: about twenty three million dollars. Oh wow, So that's that's

968
00:45:47,480 --> 00:45:49,759
Speaker 2: when she got started in nineteen ninety two thousand and six.

969
00:45:49,840 --> 00:45:52,560
Speaker 2: Twenty three million dollars over that sixteen year period, that

970
00:45:52,719 --> 00:45:55,080
Speaker 2: gives you an average of about one point four million

971
00:45:55,120 --> 00:45:58,640
Speaker 2: dollars a year. Right after she got going in two

972
00:45:58,640 --> 00:46:00,600
Speaker 2: thousand and six, she starts ram printed up and she

973
00:46:00,640 --> 00:46:02,879
Speaker 2: starts trying to win some of them championships, and world

974
00:46:02,960 --> 00:46:06,040
Speaker 2: championships are not cheap. So she sat there and wrapped

975
00:46:06,040 --> 00:46:09,239
Speaker 2: it back up to taking it about five million dollars

976
00:46:09,239 --> 00:46:10,279
Speaker 2: a year and embezzled money.

977
00:46:10,520 --> 00:46:12,799
Speaker 3: What is the town's budget every year?

978
00:46:13,000 --> 00:46:15,480
Speaker 2: The town's budget, I'm glad you asked, is nine million

979
00:46:15,520 --> 00:46:19,239
Speaker 2: dollars roughly. Oh, so she's taking more than half of

980
00:46:19,320 --> 00:46:22,480
Speaker 2: the town's budget. When she got really going, and those

981
00:46:22,520 --> 00:46:25,919
Speaker 2: engines were running red hot goodness, and they still weren't

982
00:46:25,960 --> 00:46:27,560
Speaker 2: noticing it, and you know how she was getting away

983
00:46:27,600 --> 00:46:29,720
Speaker 2: with it, but she was blaming the state of Illinois.

984
00:46:29,800 --> 00:46:31,640
Speaker 2: She said that like, oh, they're supposed to pay for

985
00:46:31,760 --> 00:46:33,799
Speaker 2: this stuff that I charged and I put the money out,

986
00:46:33,840 --> 00:46:35,959
Speaker 2: but they haven't, so next year we should get the money.

987
00:46:36,000 --> 00:46:37,560
Speaker 2: And people believed it because they're like, oh, you know,

988
00:46:37,680 --> 00:46:39,799
Speaker 2: the state lawmakers are always stealing our money.

989
00:46:39,920 --> 00:46:43,319
Speaker 3: Yeah, no one really pays attention to local They'll pay

990
00:46:43,320 --> 00:46:46,160
Speaker 3: attention when the basketball courts are all checked up, but

991
00:46:46,400 --> 00:46:48,800
Speaker 3: then they don't know the minute show of no and

992
00:46:48,880 --> 00:46:49,840
Speaker 3: also he's counting on it.

993
00:46:50,320 --> 00:46:53,080
Speaker 2: They like big mayor, Big Jim Burke. Right, he's a

994
00:46:53,160 --> 00:46:54,839
Speaker 2: local guy. But they don't seem to like the state

995
00:46:54,920 --> 00:46:57,759
Speaker 2: lawmakers or the governor. Like those people are not trustworthy.

996
00:46:57,760 --> 00:47:00,919
Speaker 3: I don't like you read a Crundwell here understand small

997
00:47:00,960 --> 00:47:01,600
Speaker 3: town values.

998
00:47:01,760 --> 00:47:09,279
Speaker 2: Yes, like so, rita Crundwell. She meets fate One day when,

999
00:47:09,800 --> 00:47:11,840
Speaker 2: unbeknownst to her, while she is away on one of

1000
00:47:11,920 --> 00:47:14,640
Speaker 2: her vacations or in this case, attending a horse show,

1001
00:47:15,719 --> 00:47:18,600
Speaker 2: a piece of mail arrives and it's a bank statement,

1002
00:47:18,760 --> 00:47:21,279
Speaker 2: and it's been basically sent to the wrong place, and

1003
00:47:21,360 --> 00:47:25,040
Speaker 2: it's on her desk, and this replacement for her. This

1004
00:47:25,600 --> 00:47:27,759
Speaker 2: the city clerk who's in her office trying to go

1005
00:47:27,800 --> 00:47:29,919
Speaker 2: through all the paperwork. She sees this one thing, sees

1006
00:47:29,960 --> 00:47:31,719
Speaker 2: it looks like she's on a bank reads it. It's

1007
00:47:31,719 --> 00:47:34,040
Speaker 2: a bank statement. She doesn't recognize the account, so she

1008
00:47:34,120 --> 00:47:36,279
Speaker 2: takes the account to the mayor. Maryor Jim Burke's like,

1009
00:47:36,520 --> 00:47:39,400
Speaker 2: I don't recognize this. Ask Rita what it is. She's like, no,

1010
00:47:39,560 --> 00:47:40,520
Speaker 2: I think that's the problem.

1011
00:47:40,640 --> 00:47:42,280
Speaker 3: It looks like this is Rita's account.

1012
00:47:42,640 --> 00:47:44,880
Speaker 2: Mary's like, oh, I can't be. She's like, no, I

1013
00:47:44,960 --> 00:47:45,279
Speaker 2: think it is.

1014
00:47:45,320 --> 00:47:47,800
Speaker 3: They look. He's like, oh my goodness, I love this

1015
00:47:47,960 --> 00:47:48,520
Speaker 3: nosey hero.

1016
00:47:49,040 --> 00:47:51,040
Speaker 2: Yes, I thought you would like her. So her name

1017
00:47:51,120 --> 00:47:52,320
Speaker 2: is Kaitha Swanson.

1018
00:47:52,400 --> 00:47:55,200
Speaker 3: By the way, well miss Swanson. First of all, I

1019
00:47:55,760 --> 00:47:58,359
Speaker 3: believe there was a whisper network in town. Everybody knew

1020
00:47:58,360 --> 00:48:00,600
Speaker 3: about this. It wasn't a secret. And she didn't just

1021
00:48:00,719 --> 00:48:02,800
Speaker 3: see something on the desk. She went dig in.

1022
00:48:03,040 --> 00:48:04,759
Speaker 2: I think she took her moment when Rita was out

1023
00:48:04,760 --> 00:48:06,279
Speaker 2: of the office. He's like, what's this, what's that? And

1024
00:48:06,360 --> 00:48:07,040
Speaker 2: went through it all.

1025
00:48:07,000 --> 00:48:08,800
Speaker 3: Well done investigator.

1026
00:48:08,600 --> 00:48:13,040
Speaker 2: Special investigator Kata Swanson. So Kaitha and Mayor Jim Burke

1027
00:48:13,160 --> 00:48:15,719
Speaker 2: have their moment together in his office. He's convinced by

1028
00:48:15,760 --> 00:48:17,759
Speaker 2: her to go take this to the FBI. He takes

1029
00:48:17,800 --> 00:48:19,480
Speaker 2: to the FBI. FI is like, oh, yeah, this is

1030
00:48:19,520 --> 00:48:19,839
Speaker 2: not good.

1031
00:48:20,440 --> 00:48:21,279
Speaker 3: This is not good.

1032
00:48:21,400 --> 00:48:25,759
Speaker 2: Mayor, Hey, Mayor, we want you don't blow the investigation

1033
00:48:25,800 --> 00:48:28,040
Speaker 2: we're about to start. Don't let anybody know. We need

1034
00:48:28,120 --> 00:48:29,520
Speaker 2: you to keep this under your hat. And he's like,

1035
00:48:29,680 --> 00:48:31,360
Speaker 2: I think I can do that, Like, no, we're serious.

1036
00:48:31,680 --> 00:48:33,879
Speaker 2: This may take some time. It's a small town. Don't

1037
00:48:33,920 --> 00:48:36,719
Speaker 2: tell anybody, not even like your closest friends. He's like,

1038
00:48:36,840 --> 00:48:38,960
Speaker 2: I tell my wife. They're like, okay, if you tell

1039
00:48:39,000 --> 00:48:42,960
Speaker 2: your wife, mayor just nobody else, don't take club. Nobody

1040
00:48:42,960 --> 00:48:45,160
Speaker 2: in American legion needs to know this one. He's like, okay,

1041
00:48:45,560 --> 00:48:47,640
Speaker 2: Like when can I tell them? When we boss Diard

1042
00:48:47,680 --> 00:48:49,719
Speaker 2: He's like, okay, how long will that be? And then

1043
00:48:49,719 --> 00:48:52,279
Speaker 2: they're like, just let us do our work. Six months later,

1044
00:48:52,400 --> 00:48:54,560
Speaker 2: they come into his office. They're like, we're going to

1045
00:48:54,600 --> 00:48:56,160
Speaker 2: need to talk to Rita. And that's why he's like,

1046
00:48:56,239 --> 00:48:58,600
Speaker 2: oh man, he's all excited. And that was the day

1047
00:48:58,719 --> 00:48:59,920
Speaker 2: that you were standing in the doorway.

1048
00:49:00,160 --> 00:49:01,319
Speaker 3: I remember it well. Yes.

1049
00:49:01,520 --> 00:49:06,360
Speaker 2: So what the FBI found was that Rita had basically taken,

1050
00:49:06,560 --> 00:49:08,360
Speaker 2: as I told you, a dummy bank account, but not

1051
00:49:08,480 --> 00:49:11,439
Speaker 2: only that, she'd created multiple bank accounts for the city

1052
00:49:11,520 --> 00:49:13,719
Speaker 2: that were legitimate. She would bounce the money through those

1053
00:49:13,719 --> 00:49:16,439
Speaker 2: different accounts, then she would create a fake invoice, send

1054
00:49:16,480 --> 00:49:18,600
Speaker 2: the money into that fake invoice account, use the fake

1055
00:49:18,640 --> 00:49:21,760
Speaker 2: invoice account, then to dummy back out to her account,

1056
00:49:21,760 --> 00:49:25,120
Speaker 2: and then she was hiding both the writing of the checks,

1057
00:49:25,160 --> 00:49:26,920
Speaker 2: the bouncing of the books, and where the money was going.

1058
00:49:27,080 --> 00:49:29,960
Speaker 2: So people were thinking it all looks fine. The amounts

1059
00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:32,440
Speaker 2: seemed to balance out because they didn't notice that she

1060
00:49:32,640 --> 00:49:35,160
Speaker 2: was the one who was, you know, saying you owe

1061
00:49:35,200 --> 00:49:38,000
Speaker 2: me money. You owe me six million dollars or whatever

1062
00:49:38,160 --> 00:49:41,400
Speaker 2: she was saying. So that's how you get a payday

1063
00:49:41,440 --> 00:49:44,239
Speaker 2: for Rita is you know, classic money laundering. You know,

1064
00:49:44,440 --> 00:49:46,800
Speaker 2: jay Z would be proud to her, so after she

1065
00:49:46,840 --> 00:49:50,080
Speaker 2: would withdraw her laundered funds and she'd go and buy

1066
00:49:50,120 --> 00:49:54,239
Speaker 2: all verus expensive stuff. The thing that was kind of

1067
00:49:54,360 --> 00:49:56,279
Speaker 2: working to her benefit, as I've pointed out a couple

1068
00:49:56,320 --> 00:49:58,960
Speaker 2: of times, is people didn't look past her appearance.

1069
00:49:59,080 --> 00:50:00,600
Speaker 3: And yet she was very aware of this.

1070
00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:03,160
Speaker 2: She would put on an appearance for the Oklahoma people,

1071
00:50:03,400 --> 00:50:05,200
Speaker 2: she would come home and take off that and she

1072
00:50:05,320 --> 00:50:07,960
Speaker 2: knew that people wouldn't do anything except for your girl,

1073
00:50:08,080 --> 00:50:11,759
Speaker 2: Katha Swanson Keith, Yeah. Now that is the advantage that

1074
00:50:11,840 --> 00:50:15,279
Speaker 2: con artists have over average people is that they know

1075
00:50:15,400 --> 00:50:17,960
Speaker 2: that a person is usually persuaded more by a good

1076
00:50:18,080 --> 00:50:21,080
Speaker 2: story than by facts. You're KEITHA and you you guys

1077
00:50:21,120 --> 00:50:23,520
Speaker 2: are rare who actually want to see the numbers on paper,

1078
00:50:23,800 --> 00:50:26,080
Speaker 2: want to investigate, want to get confirmation. Most people are

1079
00:50:26,160 --> 00:50:29,560
Speaker 2: like I heard readA her mother died left or a farm.

1080
00:50:29,640 --> 00:50:30,600
Speaker 2: That's good enough for them.

1081
00:50:31,040 --> 00:50:31,600
Speaker 3: That's what they have.

1082
00:50:31,760 --> 00:50:34,000
Speaker 2: And so if you can tell a good story, you

1083
00:50:34,080 --> 00:50:36,400
Speaker 2: can be a good con artist. Do you think, as

1084
00:50:36,440 --> 00:50:39,359
Speaker 2: a former school teacher and a storyteller, that you could

1085
00:50:39,360 --> 00:50:40,200
Speaker 2: be a good con artist?

1086
00:50:40,440 --> 00:50:40,480
Speaker 3: No?

1087
00:50:40,880 --> 00:50:41,160
Speaker 2: Why not?

1088
00:50:41,880 --> 00:50:47,560
Speaker 3: I'd feel really bad at my mark. My victim would

1089
00:50:47,600 --> 00:50:49,879
Speaker 3: have to be a horrible person, and then I would

1090
00:50:50,080 --> 00:50:50,840
Speaker 3: feel bad about it.

1091
00:50:51,000 --> 00:50:52,759
Speaker 2: That's totally that's the way within the balance. You don't

1092
00:50:52,800 --> 00:50:54,920
Speaker 2: have to only go after the innocent gullible.

1093
00:50:54,960 --> 00:50:57,000
Speaker 3: But I also have too many tells. I'm not good

1094
00:50:57,040 --> 00:51:00,520
Speaker 3: at lying. Yeah, it becomes real obvious.

1095
00:51:00,719 --> 00:51:02,239
Speaker 2: Here's how you can get good at lying. This is

1096
00:51:02,280 --> 00:51:05,200
Speaker 2: true for anything. Don't think you're lying if you believe

1097
00:51:05,239 --> 00:51:06,920
Speaker 2: your story. No, I mean, I know this sounds ridiculous,

1098
00:51:06,920 --> 00:51:09,920
Speaker 2: but you'd have to believe that this momentarily is the truth.

1099
00:51:09,960 --> 00:51:12,120
Speaker 2: And if you do that, your body will behave as

1100
00:51:12,160 --> 00:51:13,880
Speaker 2: if it's the truth. If you can just tell yourself,

1101
00:51:14,080 --> 00:51:18,400
Speaker 2: I will momentarily live under these imaginary circumstances. That's how

1102
00:51:18,480 --> 00:51:20,200
Speaker 2: you become a good liar. That's also how you become

1103
00:51:20,239 --> 00:51:23,600
Speaker 2: a good actor. Same things, the exact same. You have

1104
00:51:23,640 --> 00:51:26,080
Speaker 2: to emotionally convince yourself. You convince yourself. You can convince

1105
00:51:26,120 --> 00:51:26,799
Speaker 2: anything that's true.

1106
00:51:26,920 --> 00:51:28,360
Speaker 3: I could see that, So I think you could be

1107
00:51:28,440 --> 00:51:30,319
Speaker 3: should I practice start cutting people?

1108
00:51:31,080 --> 00:51:32,760
Speaker 2: Let's be able to talk about this. You can develop

1109
00:51:32,800 --> 00:51:33,600
Speaker 2: a whole routine for you.

1110
00:51:33,760 --> 00:51:35,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'll sign up for your classes.

1111
00:51:36,040 --> 00:51:38,200
Speaker 2: But in all honesty, as a teacher, you would you

1112
00:51:38,239 --> 00:51:40,319
Speaker 2: agree that a story is more persuasive than facts.

1113
00:51:42,120 --> 00:51:44,080
Speaker 3: I think so, well. I don't know, not in my

1114
00:51:44,280 --> 00:51:47,439
Speaker 3: time as a as an instructor, but I would say

1115
00:51:47,480 --> 00:51:50,200
Speaker 3: that as a writer, you know you can. You can

1116
00:51:50,239 --> 00:51:52,719
Speaker 3: get people to believe all sorts of things. You can

1117
00:51:52,760 --> 00:51:55,600
Speaker 3: get them to change what's true to them. So not

1118
00:51:55,719 --> 00:51:58,520
Speaker 3: necessarily facts, but everyone has.

1119
00:51:58,440 --> 00:51:59,880
Speaker 2: Their own truth, their interpretation.

1120
00:52:00,040 --> 00:52:02,000
Speaker 3: But yeah, whatever is true to someone, and you can,

1121
00:52:02,120 --> 00:52:04,080
Speaker 3: if you tell a good enough story, you can.

1122
00:52:04,000 --> 00:52:07,560
Speaker 2: Rearrange the value of the facts totally. Well, that's exactly

1123
00:52:07,600 --> 00:52:09,840
Speaker 2: what Rita did. Now, getting to a couple of the

1124
00:52:09,880 --> 00:52:12,440
Speaker 2: facts that people overlooked that I think would have been

1125
00:52:12,600 --> 00:52:15,320
Speaker 2: somewhat suspicious to me if I were living in Dixon, Illinois.

1126
00:52:15,719 --> 00:52:18,439
Speaker 2: Here's an example of some of the horses that she named.

1127
00:52:19,040 --> 00:52:20,920
Speaker 2: People would see these names in print, like so and

1128
00:52:21,040 --> 00:52:23,759
Speaker 2: so one like Rita Cronwell one with and these are

1129
00:52:23,800 --> 00:52:26,799
Speaker 2: the horses names, right, Okay, we'll play a little game.

1130
00:52:27,160 --> 00:52:29,359
Speaker 2: Four horses. I'm going to name three are real?

1131
00:52:29,640 --> 00:52:29,920
Speaker 3: Okay.

1132
00:52:30,680 --> 00:52:35,480
Speaker 2: Number one I'm money too. Number two I found a penny.

1133
00:52:36,520 --> 00:52:41,240
Speaker 2: Number three good, I will be number four Dixon Illinois

1134
00:52:41,320 --> 00:52:41,840
Speaker 2: can suck it.

1135
00:52:43,800 --> 00:52:45,880
Speaker 3: Oh, I don't know. What do you think is not

1136
00:52:45,920 --> 00:52:49,879
Speaker 3: the real horse name the penny? No Dixon, No, it's good,

1137
00:52:49,920 --> 00:52:50,279
Speaker 3: I will be.

1138
00:52:50,880 --> 00:52:51,800
Speaker 2: No, I'm hitting him.

1139
00:52:53,360 --> 00:52:53,760
Speaker 3: Illinois.

1140
00:52:55,680 --> 00:52:57,520
Speaker 2: But all of her horse names are about money or

1141
00:52:57,600 --> 00:52:59,400
Speaker 2: be like trickery. And people are like, yeah, that's just

1142
00:52:59,520 --> 00:53:00,319
Speaker 2: let's your inch risks.

1143
00:53:00,360 --> 00:53:03,239
Speaker 3: No, good old Rita well right under their noses. Yeah.

1144
00:53:03,239 --> 00:53:05,160
Speaker 2: Well, when the US Marshalls showed up, they had to

1145
00:53:05,640 --> 00:53:07,640
Speaker 2: collect all the ill gotten gains Rita had gotten over

1146
00:53:07,719 --> 00:53:10,560
Speaker 2: the decades she'd been fleecing everyone in town. They showed

1147
00:53:10,640 --> 00:53:12,920
Speaker 2: up and they find four hundred horses that they now

1148
00:53:13,000 --> 00:53:13,520
Speaker 2: have to move.

1149
00:53:13,760 --> 00:53:15,279
Speaker 3: Four hundred, four hundred horse.

1150
00:53:15,320 --> 00:53:16,800
Speaker 2: Remember some of these horses are worth two hundred and

1151
00:53:16,800 --> 00:53:17,880
Speaker 2: fifty thousand dollars apiece.

1152
00:53:18,320 --> 00:53:20,800
Speaker 3: Wow, exactly. So the DJ is like, oh man, what

1153
00:53:20,880 --> 00:53:21,360
Speaker 3: are we gonna do?

1154
00:53:21,680 --> 00:53:24,200
Speaker 2: They called up, I don't know, the cowboy US Marshals

1155
00:53:24,239 --> 00:53:26,160
Speaker 2: and they started like putting them in trailers and wrangling

1156
00:53:26,200 --> 00:53:27,200
Speaker 2: them up and going off.

1157
00:53:27,239 --> 00:53:29,600
Speaker 3: She had them like a horse infestation. Dude.

1158
00:53:29,600 --> 00:53:31,160
Speaker 2: They had to have a whole auction for all of

1159
00:53:31,200 --> 00:53:33,800
Speaker 2: her stuff, and then a large part of the stuff

1160
00:53:33,920 --> 00:53:38,240
Speaker 2: was hers her family bought back for her with what money? Yeah, exactly.

1161
00:53:38,840 --> 00:53:40,400
Speaker 2: So here's the list of some of the stuff that

1162
00:53:40,719 --> 00:53:43,880
Speaker 2: the DOJ took from her. Two single family homes in Dixon.

1163
00:53:44,000 --> 00:53:47,359
Speaker 2: A single family home in Inglewood, Florida. A horse farm

1164
00:53:47,440 --> 00:53:50,839
Speaker 2: in Dixon. The custom Liberty Coach motor home. They worth

1165
00:53:50,880 --> 00:53:54,080
Speaker 2: two million dollars. The Featherlight trailer also worth about a

1166
00:53:54,200 --> 00:53:56,560
Speaker 2: quarter million dollars. That's for pulling horses and so forth.

1167
00:53:56,680 --> 00:53:59,320
Speaker 2: A bunch of Chevy Silverado trucks because at least she

1168
00:53:59,360 --> 00:54:02,720
Speaker 2: knew good value. Some GMC trucks, but really those should

1169
00:54:02,719 --> 00:54:04,440
Speaker 2: have been dodges because they were cowboys, because that's what

1170
00:54:04,520 --> 00:54:05,759
Speaker 2: cowboys and cowgirls drive.

1171
00:54:05,800 --> 00:54:06,200
Speaker 3: But whatever.

1172
00:54:06,360 --> 00:54:09,279
Speaker 2: A Kenworth tractor truck, which was worth about two hundred grand.

1173
00:54:09,360 --> 00:54:11,440
Speaker 2: A freight liner truck these are the eighteen wheelers that

1174
00:54:11,480 --> 00:54:13,840
Speaker 2: are pulling the trailers, also worth two hundred grand. A

1175
00:54:13,960 --> 00:54:17,680
Speaker 2: Ford Thunderbird, a classic sixty seven Chevy Corvette once again

1176
00:54:17,800 --> 00:54:21,240
Speaker 2: nose class. And lastly a bunch of John deer utility vehicles,

1177
00:54:21,280 --> 00:54:24,160
Speaker 2: tractors and riding moment nothing rides like a deer, nothing

1178
00:54:24,239 --> 00:54:27,279
Speaker 2: at all. Then that's just the homes in vehicles. So

1179
00:54:28,000 --> 00:54:30,200
Speaker 2: imagine everything else. You got all the horse stuff, and

1180
00:54:30,360 --> 00:54:34,760
Speaker 2: the machinis for bikinis, and the various sent in candles

1181
00:54:34,880 --> 00:54:39,800
Speaker 2: find Corinthian leather bound books exactly. So on April seventeenth,

1182
00:54:39,880 --> 00:54:42,000
Speaker 2: twenty twelve, at the time of her arrest, in her

1183
00:54:42,080 --> 00:54:44,320
Speaker 2: bank account, she had one hundred and ninety one thousand,

1184
00:54:44,360 --> 00:54:46,959
Speaker 2: three hundred and seventy five dollars and seventy five cents.

1185
00:54:47,040 --> 00:54:49,040
Speaker 2: Because you know, it's also good at math, the doj

1186
00:54:50,040 --> 00:54:51,520
Speaker 2: and they made sure to get every penny.

1187
00:54:51,640 --> 00:54:54,120
Speaker 3: So this was twenty twelve. When did she start eighty

1188
00:54:54,280 --> 00:54:55,120
Speaker 3: three eighty two.

1189
00:54:55,520 --> 00:54:58,400
Speaker 2: She starts scamming in nineteen ninety. Okay, she gets the

1190
00:54:58,480 --> 00:55:00,160
Speaker 2: job in eighty three. Ticks are about seven years to

1191
00:55:00,200 --> 00:55:02,279
Speaker 2: cook the books. In that nineteen ninety she gets going

1192
00:55:02,640 --> 00:55:06,320
Speaker 2: and then for six a long run exactly. So the

1193
00:55:06,560 --> 00:55:12,440
Speaker 2: city of Dixon meanwhile left holding an empty bag. Yes exactly,

1194
00:55:12,840 --> 00:55:14,440
Speaker 2: They're like, what are we gonna do? Now?

1195
00:55:14,480 --> 00:55:16,840
Speaker 3: I told you they had like basically lost all this stuff.

1196
00:55:16,920 --> 00:55:19,279
Speaker 2: The cops couldn't get radar guns, the kids couldn't have

1197
00:55:19,360 --> 00:55:20,240
Speaker 2: basketball uniforms.

1198
00:55:20,440 --> 00:55:21,560
Speaker 3: Were out there with hair dryers.

1199
00:55:21,719 --> 00:55:23,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, just pretending that they have, Like, don't look too

1200
00:55:23,920 --> 00:55:27,600
Speaker 2: close the year agoing forty eight thirty five. Now they

1201
00:55:27,680 --> 00:55:29,680
Speaker 2: did all that obviously, so Rita can have her little

1202
00:55:29,760 --> 00:55:33,200
Speaker 2: my little pony collectionist show horses and like, you gotta

1203
00:55:33,320 --> 00:55:36,000
Speaker 2: love at least I don't know. I don't love is

1204
00:55:36,040 --> 00:55:38,560
Speaker 2: the wrong word. But there was a Netflix documentary on

1205
00:55:38,640 --> 00:55:40,439
Speaker 2: her story that was made. If you'd like to see

1206
00:55:40,440 --> 00:55:42,719
Speaker 2: more about the Rita Cronwell story, check out the documentary.

1207
00:55:42,960 --> 00:55:46,000
Speaker 2: But the director, Kelly Richmond Pope, who is a DePaul

1208
00:55:46,320 --> 00:55:51,319
Speaker 2: University accounting professor by day and a documentary filmmaker by night, said,

1209
00:55:51,440 --> 00:55:54,359
Speaker 2: and I quote, I feel like she had the last laugh.

1210
00:55:54,560 --> 00:55:55,080
Speaker 3: She won.

1211
00:55:55,280 --> 00:55:57,360
Speaker 2: She lived like a queen for twenty plus years and

1212
00:55:57,440 --> 00:56:00,480
Speaker 2: only served eight years. You do the math of won.

1213
00:56:01,360 --> 00:56:03,000
Speaker 2: So what do you put in the quote? Is that

1214
00:56:03,120 --> 00:56:05,759
Speaker 2: she after she's convicted, she does eight years in prison,

1215
00:56:05,880 --> 00:56:08,360
Speaker 2: federal prison. Her family buys up most of the property

1216
00:56:08,360 --> 00:56:10,439
Speaker 2: when he goes to auction, so she spends eight years.

1217
00:56:10,520 --> 00:56:12,080
Speaker 2: That's her price for all that she got away with.

1218
00:56:12,160 --> 00:56:14,239
Speaker 2: So this guy is saying, oh, eight years would be

1219
00:56:14,280 --> 00:56:17,359
Speaker 2: worth all of that. She's the winner. What's your thought?

1220
00:56:17,600 --> 00:56:21,279
Speaker 3: No, she's not. Because of it the fact that even

1221
00:56:21,320 --> 00:56:24,320
Speaker 3: if she was never caught, she didn't win. Yes, because

1222
00:56:24,320 --> 00:56:28,600
Speaker 3: that's the grossest behavior to take from the people around

1223
00:56:28,680 --> 00:56:31,239
Speaker 3: you who've supported you. Gave her a job at a time,

1224
00:56:31,400 --> 00:56:33,680
Speaker 3: like you know, at that time to be in a

1225
00:56:33,760 --> 00:56:36,840
Speaker 3: small town, to be the treasurer at the city of

1226
00:56:36,920 --> 00:56:39,759
Speaker 3: the town or as a woman, yeah, that role. Yeah,

1227
00:56:39,960 --> 00:56:42,880
Speaker 3: and she obviously everyone supported her growing up. And then

1228
00:56:42,920 --> 00:56:45,000
Speaker 3: she turns around and gives them the big two fingers

1229
00:56:45,040 --> 00:56:48,200
Speaker 3: to the sky and it's like, I'm taking all your stuff. Yeah,

1230
00:56:48,520 --> 00:56:49,360
Speaker 3: is this not winning?

1231
00:56:50,280 --> 00:56:52,279
Speaker 2: I'm with you. I do the methold differently than old

1232
00:56:52,360 --> 00:56:55,000
Speaker 2: Kelly Richmond Pope. I just see her, as I said before,

1233
00:56:55,080 --> 00:56:57,319
Speaker 2: she's basically a one woman version of colonization.

1234
00:56:57,520 --> 00:56:59,320
Speaker 3: She's just like I can if I can lift it,

1235
00:56:59,400 --> 00:57:02,239
Speaker 3: I'm taking it. It's just it's so gross. It is

1236
00:57:02,360 --> 00:57:03,680
Speaker 3: absolutely gross. What she did.

1237
00:57:03,800 --> 00:57:06,359
Speaker 2: I mean, stealing half of more than half of your

1238
00:57:06,440 --> 00:57:10,759
Speaker 2: town's annual budget. Yeah, okay, let's just put this in perspective.

1239
00:57:11,280 --> 00:57:13,480
Speaker 2: Let's say I stole half of the money from your

1240
00:57:13,520 --> 00:57:16,600
Speaker 2: family's budget. And I did that every year, year after

1241
00:57:16,720 --> 00:57:19,080
Speaker 2: year for six years. And I did this to fund

1242
00:57:19,200 --> 00:57:22,320
Speaker 2: my seahorse habit all right, and eventually I get busted

1243
00:57:22,360 --> 00:57:24,560
Speaker 2: by the FBI. Do you think if someone came along

1244
00:57:24,600 --> 00:57:27,440
Speaker 2: and said, that man, he's winning, would you be like, yeah,

1245
00:57:27,520 --> 00:57:30,439
Speaker 2: that's right, brother, that brother's look at that old folk

1246
00:57:30,520 --> 00:57:33,160
Speaker 2: hero there. No, they wouldn't because I don't look like

1247
00:57:33,280 --> 00:57:37,800
Speaker 2: Rita Crondwell at my point, so the only reason a

1248
00:57:38,600 --> 00:57:41,000
Speaker 2: fur bikini right now? Well, yeah, and we had sequence,

1249
00:57:41,040 --> 00:57:44,160
Speaker 2: but that's not Rita's. That's that's where Rid and I overlap. Okay,

1250
00:57:45,400 --> 00:57:47,320
Speaker 2: But the basically the idea is that here you have

1251
00:57:47,360 --> 00:57:49,920
Speaker 2: this middle aged white woman in rural America, and everybody

1252
00:57:50,000 --> 00:57:51,840
Speaker 2: would assume that she could be a criminal on the

1253
00:57:51,920 --> 00:57:54,640
Speaker 2: level of like some Walter White breaking bad level of

1254
00:57:54,840 --> 00:57:55,240
Speaker 2: like you know.

1255
00:57:55,680 --> 00:57:58,000
Speaker 3: That's why we have to assume that everyone is a criminal.

1256
00:57:58,200 --> 00:58:02,880
Speaker 3: Exactly solves that problem. I mean, that's essentially My point is. Look, look,

1257
00:58:02,920 --> 00:58:05,000
Speaker 3: you need to be both skeptical and optimistic and do

1258
00:58:05,080 --> 00:58:07,520
Speaker 3: both yea at the same time, and that's hard, it's exhausting.

1259
00:58:07,880 --> 00:58:10,360
Speaker 2: The answer is always the same, don't believe the hype.

1260
00:58:11,600 --> 00:58:12,120
Speaker 3: That's true.

1261
00:58:12,520 --> 00:58:14,160
Speaker 2: So what's our ridiculous takeaway.

1262
00:58:13,840 --> 00:58:20,360
Speaker 3: Elizabeth, ridiculous takeaway is that I really wish that they

1263
00:58:20,400 --> 00:58:22,440
Speaker 3: would have caught onto her earlier, because now I'm just

1264
00:58:22,560 --> 00:58:25,040
Speaker 3: like dwelling on the fact that the roads were all

1265
00:58:25,080 --> 00:58:27,640
Speaker 3: messed up and kids didn't have like parks to play

1266
00:58:27,640 --> 00:58:29,400
Speaker 3: in because she wanted to go ride a horse somewhere.

1267
00:58:29,400 --> 00:58:30,960
Speaker 3: Now she wasn't even riding these horses.

1268
00:58:31,120 --> 00:58:32,400
Speaker 2: No, she's winning, She's.

1269
00:58:32,280 --> 00:58:36,360
Speaker 3: Just parading them around. Oh, she's disgusting.

1270
00:58:36,840 --> 00:58:39,800
Speaker 2: I also noticed she didn't need a weapon to rob anyone,

1271
00:58:39,880 --> 00:58:42,000
Speaker 2: She just needed a pat And we always had to

1272
00:58:42,080 --> 00:58:44,120
Speaker 2: forget that when these white collar crimes do far more

1273
00:58:44,240 --> 00:58:46,960
Speaker 2: damage to a community than someone's sticking up the corner store,

1274
00:58:47,040 --> 00:58:49,400
Speaker 2: but they don't get punished. And I'm not suggesting that

1275
00:58:49,440 --> 00:58:51,240
Speaker 2: we need to punish people, but we need to consider

1276
00:58:51,400 --> 00:58:53,960
Speaker 2: the actual effect and impact of crimes as opposed to

1277
00:58:54,240 --> 00:58:55,160
Speaker 2: how they make us feel.

1278
00:58:55,240 --> 00:58:58,680
Speaker 3: You know what the heroic quality was here, Nosiness. Yes,

1279
00:58:58,800 --> 00:58:59,480
Speaker 3: I thought you'd like that.

1280
00:58:59,600 --> 00:59:04,600
Speaker 2: I knew Kaithus wantson was like your people to a Yeah, well,

1281
00:59:04,680 --> 00:59:06,919
Speaker 2: you know, as you know about me, Elizabeth, I would

1282
00:59:06,960 --> 00:59:09,440
Speaker 2: love to own a horse ranch. I love horses. I

1283
00:59:09,480 --> 00:59:11,800
Speaker 2: would just pretty much do anything to have a horse

1284
00:59:11,880 --> 00:59:14,560
Speaker 2: ranch on my own, except for stealing all of the

1285
00:59:14,640 --> 00:59:17,520
Speaker 2: money I can from my hometown. That is the Zaron

1286
00:59:17,520 --> 00:59:20,680
Speaker 2: Burnett guarantee. I like that, so thanks for joining us.

1287
00:59:21,320 --> 00:59:23,200
Speaker 2: I'm Zaron Burnette. And over there in the white fur

1288
00:59:23,280 --> 00:59:26,760
Speaker 2: and diamonds is Elizabeth Dutty. You can find us online

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Speaker 2: at Ridiculous Crime, about, Twitter, and Instagram. Got a tip

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Speaker 2: for us about a ridiculous crime you like to hear about.

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Speaker 2: You want to confess to a ridiculous crime, email us

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Speaker 2: at Ridiculous Crime at gmail dot com. Ridiculous Crime is

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Speaker 2: hosted by Elizabeth Dutton and Zaren Burnett, produced and edited

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Speaker 2: by Harrison Ford's horse trainer, Dave Houston. Research is by

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Speaker 2: the President of the three quarter and seven Eighths Horse Association,

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Speaker 2: Briissa Brown. Our theme song is by part time mayor

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Speaker 2: Thomas Lee and our resident lyele Love It look Alike,

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Speaker 2: Travis Dutton, Executive Producer, a Ben the Horse Breeder to

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Speaker 2: the Stars Bowling and Noel Don't you dare Call me

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Speaker 2: a Comptroller Brown.

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Speaker 1: Ridiculous Crime is a production of iHeartRadio. Four more podcasts

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Speaker 1: from my Heart Radio visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts

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Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows,