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Speaker 1: This is what happens when the fourth Turning meets fifth

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Speaker 1: generation warfare.

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Speaker 2: A commentator, international social media sensation and form a Navy

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Speaker 2: intelligence veteran.

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Speaker 3: This is Human Events with your host Jack Posovic christ

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Speaker 3: Is King this morning.

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Speaker 2: Arizona Senator Mark Kelly defiant after the Pentagon announced it's

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Speaker 2: investigating him for serious allegations of misconduct after he and

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Speaker 2: five other Democratic lawmakers posted a video urging US service

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Speaker 2: members not to follow illegal orders.

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Speaker 4: I was a captain in the United States Navy.

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Speaker 2: Former CIA officer, former Navy Kelly who flew thirty nine

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Speaker 2: combat missions in a rock before going on to become

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Speaker 2: an astronaut, now threatened with a court martial for saying this.

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Speaker 5: Our laws are clear.

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Speaker 6: You can refuse illegal orders.

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Speaker 5: You can refuse illegal orders. You must refuse illegal orders.

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Speaker 1: No one has to carry out orders that violate the

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Speaker 1: law or our constitution.

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Speaker 2: The President furious at the lawmakers, labeling them traders and

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Speaker 2: accusing them of quote seditious behavior punishable by death.

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Speaker 7: The White House is supportive of the Department of Wars

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Speaker 7: investigation into Senator Mark Kelly, and I think what Senator

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Speaker 7: Mark Kelly was actually trying to do was intimidate the

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Speaker 7: one point three million active duty service members who are

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Speaker 7: currently serving in our United States Armedforces with that video

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Speaker 7: that he and his Democratic colleagues put out. Senator Mark

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Speaker 7: Kelly Well knows the rules of the military and the

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Speaker 7: respect that one must have for the chain of command,

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Speaker 7: and that all lawful, all orders, lawful orders are presumed

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Speaker 7: to be legal by our service members. You can't have

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Speaker 7: a functioning military if there is disorder in chaos.

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Speaker 3: Within the ranks.

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Speaker 4: And Trump administration now vowing to appeal after a federal

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Speaker 4: judge throughout the criminal case against former FBI Director James

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Speaker 4: Comey and New York ATTNY General Letitia James. In twin rulings,

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Speaker 4: the judge found prosecutor Lindsay Halligan was unlawfully appointed, writing quote,

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Speaker 4: all actions flowing from Miss Halligan's defective appointment constitute unlawful

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Speaker 4: exercise of executive power and must be set aside.

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Speaker 8: Overnights, an intense barrage of Russian missiles and drones raining

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Speaker 8: down on the Ukrainian capital for more than six hours

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Speaker 8: as negotiations intensified between the US, Russia, and Ukraine officials,

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Speaker 8: saying Russia targeted power stations two residential buildings also hit.

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Speaker 3: I don't know if you heard that.

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Speaker 8: We're now getting intense Russian bombardments of the capital. At

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Speaker 8: least seven people killed, according to officials, the mayor saying

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Speaker 8: seven out of ten of the capital's districts now suffering

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Speaker 8: power disruptions.

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Speaker 1: Ladies and John welcome aboard today's edition of Human Events

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Speaker 1: Daily were here live Phoenix, Arizona. Today is November twenty fifth,

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty five.

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Speaker 3: Anno Domini.

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Speaker 1: I wanted to just to tick a quick moment before

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Speaker 1: we get into today's top story. I want to get

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Speaker 1: into this Ukraine peace deal. Will the Russians agree? Will

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Speaker 1: Ukraine agree? But I'm out here in Phoenix, and.

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Speaker 3: This is.

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Speaker 1: This is Charlie's an old studio that I'm sitting in

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Speaker 1: right now. This desk right here, Charlie's original desk where

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Speaker 1: he launched the Charlie Kirk Show and been here many

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Speaker 1: times done. He's was gracious enough to allow me to

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Speaker 1: use it to launch Human Events Daily. And I've had

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Speaker 1: my family here, I've had obviously his family's been here.

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Speaker 1: He and I have been here for debates and laughter

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Speaker 1: and so many stories and so many things. And yeah,

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Speaker 1: it just really really takes you back sometimes to realize

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Speaker 1: that there's so much important in this world and there's

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Speaker 1: so much going on that you do need to take

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Speaker 1: a step back sometimes and realize that everything could change

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Speaker 1: in the blink of an eye. And don't never forget that.

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Speaker 1: Just don't ever forget that we live in a real world,

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Speaker 1: an actual world, and when we talk about cases of violence.

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Speaker 1: That's why that's why ending the Ukraine War is so important,

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Speaker 1: and that's why this peace deal is so important at

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Speaker 1: President Trump and Secretary Driscoll, who's now been taking the

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Speaker 1: lead on these negotiations, if they can get this done,

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Speaker 1: it's so important because the Ukrainians and the Russians they're

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Speaker 1: going to their Christmas time as well. And for every

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Speaker 1: single soldier lost on the battlefield, that's a family that's

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Speaker 1: got a son that doesn't come home. That's a family

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Speaker 1: that's got a dad that they're never going to see again.

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Speaker 1: It was like Charlie's kids are never going to see

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Speaker 1: their dad again. This is real stuff. And for people

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Speaker 1: who want to play games with acts of violence, with

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Speaker 1: acts of war and say, oh, it's not really that

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Speaker 1: big of a deal and we'll just keep fighting and

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Speaker 1: Russia will keep, you know, having to throw more men

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Speaker 1: into it. It's disgusting actually when I see people who

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Speaker 1: want to continue this thing, and it's actually horrific because

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Speaker 1: why don't you go over there, and so many of

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Speaker 1: them refuse to why don't you go over there and

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Speaker 1: actually meet with the people who've got to live with

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Speaker 1: missiles flying over their heads every day, who've got to

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Speaker 1: dodge bullets just so they can get to the grocery store,

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Speaker 1: who've got to deal with drone warfare all over the place,

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Speaker 1: and who have to see their sons getting dragged to

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Speaker 1: the front. You wouldn't that would you want that for

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Speaker 1: your children, because that's the reality of warfare. It's not

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Speaker 1: some grandiose, romantic scheme. It's people dying in disgusting and

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Speaker 1: disfiguring ways. It's bodies that are blown apart so much

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Speaker 1: that you can't actually put them back together to bring

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Speaker 1: them home closed caskets every time. So that's what you want,

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Speaker 1: that's what you're supporting. If you support more war, that's

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Speaker 1: what you're getting. That's what we see. That's certainly what

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Speaker 1: we see. And I'm not going to sit here and

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Speaker 1: play some games like oh who started who's started. Look,

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Speaker 1: look there's a war and people are dying now.

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Speaker 3: This deal.

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Speaker 1: The Russians said they like the twenty eight point plan,

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Speaker 1: the nineteen point plan that came.

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Speaker 3: Out as well, that the Ukrainian said they agreed to.

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Speaker 3: I don't.

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Speaker 1: I'm just gonna say right now, I don't think the

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Speaker 1: Russians are going to agree to this. I said that

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Speaker 1: on War Room this morning. I'm going to continue. I

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Speaker 1: do not think the Russians will go on board with

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Speaker 1: this because they do not want Ukraine in NATO at all,

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Speaker 1: not even an option, not even a possibility. N They

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Speaker 1: want full neutralization, neutral status for Ukraine, and they view

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Speaker 1: it as an existential threat to Russia. Now you can disagree,

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Speaker 1: and you can say I don't think you're right. All

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Speaker 1: you want, but you've got to convince them of that.

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Speaker 1: Ladies and gentlemen, the enemy always gets a vote. We

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Speaker 1: write back human events daily.

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Speaker 3: And in our way, and our golden age has just begun.

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Speaker 4: This is human events with Jack Posovic.

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Speaker 1: Now it's time for everyone to understand what America First

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Speaker 1: truly means. Welcome to the Second American Revolution, all right, folks.

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Speaker 1: Jack Zobic back Live, Phoenix, Arizona, ladies and gentlemen. Anyone

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Speaker 1: that knows me and knows the work that human Events

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Speaker 1: more on this Ukraine deal?

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Speaker 3: Will it last? Will it be agreed to?

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Speaker 1: I want to bring Mike Bens on now from the

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Speaker 1: Foundation for Freedom Online. Bens, You've done the yeomen's work

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Speaker 1: on explaining why Ukraine really became this vocal point so much,

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Speaker 1: going all the way back to President Trump's first impeachment

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Speaker 1: hunter by in the Barisma dealings. And I guess I

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Speaker 1: wanted to say, Ben's is that if this thing is

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Speaker 1: actually to wind down, this is going to be a

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Speaker 1: huge problem for a lot of people in power, both

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Speaker 1: in the United States and across Europe, isn't it.

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Speaker 6: Yeah. It's a little complicated though, because I do think

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Speaker 6: that they do want the kinetic military activity that Russia

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Speaker 6: is conducting to wind down, in the sense that I

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Speaker 6: think that some of the well not some, but almost

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Speaker 6: all of the exuberance in the early initial twenty twenty

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Speaker 6: two forays, when there was a thought that actually Russia

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Speaker 6: had misstepped and that they were actually much weaker than

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Speaker 6: NATO feared they might be, and it looked like Ukraine

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Speaker 6: was having some early victories, there was I think, a

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Speaker 6: hope that Ukraine could militarily take this all the way

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Speaker 6: and then end up with a regime change inside of

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Speaker 6: mass In another boris Yeltsen resurrected in put In Putin's place,

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Speaker 6: and instead Ukraine is now reporting loss after loss. Every

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Speaker 6: update I seem to see on it seems to be

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Speaker 6: another territory, another town, another very one sided victory for

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Speaker 6: Russia on the military battlefield. And I do think that

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Speaker 6: the goal of the piece, there's kind of a Trump

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Speaker 6: goal and there's a Blob goal for peace. I think

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Speaker 6: the Trump goal is to have a lasting piece. I

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Speaker 6: think the Blob goal is to have a temporary piece

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Speaker 6: and then to use that piece to build up a

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Speaker 6: larger military presence to eventually either win a paramilitary covert

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Speaker 6: war or a full on war. The next time something

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Speaker 6: like this can be provoked through another twenty fourteen style

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Speaker 6: my Don style coup in another kind of Russian satellite area.

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Speaker 6: But basically, the whole play here is about Eurasia, and

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Speaker 6: that's what this is all about. It's about the seventy

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Speaker 6: five trillion dollars worth of natural resources inside of Russia.

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Speaker 6: It's about control over the entire Eurasian landscape, and ultimately

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Speaker 6: it'll be about regime change inside of Russia to make

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Speaker 6: that happen. And so as the pacification of all the

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Speaker 6: Russian military support for countering many NATO commercial and political

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Speaker 6: activities in Africa, in Central Asia, and to a lesser extent,

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Speaker 6: I wouldn't even count really Latin America anymore at this point.

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Speaker 3: But so we are hearing.

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Speaker 1: By the way, I wanted to just throw out just

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Speaker 1: before we went live today, and this is what I've.

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Speaker 3: Been saying all morning.

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Speaker 1: The White Houses come out and said, well, additional discussions

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Speaker 1: are now going to be required among Ukraine, the United States,

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Speaker 1: and Russia as the country's work to hammer out this deal.

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Speaker 1: So Dan Driscoll, of course, we know, is meeting with

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Speaker 1: Russian officials and Abu Dhabi right now.

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Speaker 3: Lavrov what had Lavrov said it.

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Speaker 1: Could be rejected if the terms are fundamentally different to

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Speaker 1: the understanding that was reached during the Trump Putin summit

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Speaker 1: in Alaska a few months ago. I was actually had

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Speaker 1: the opportunity to attend that summit. It was really incredible

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Speaker 1: to just be there and be in the room at

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Speaker 1: least when the meeting got started with Lavrov et cetera.

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Speaker 3: And what are we also hearing?

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Speaker 1: Zelenski wants to bring the Europeans in And I think

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Speaker 1: that's kind of what went on here because Ben's you know,

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Speaker 1: I think there's a lot of story here that that

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Speaker 1: the you know it, we're told that Vice President Jade

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Speaker 1: Vance came in and he's the one that really got

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Speaker 1: Driscoll into the new position as this point man for

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Speaker 1: these discussions, for these negotiations. They knew that the previous

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Speaker 1: discussions had really been at loggerheads, so he said, you know,

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Speaker 1: why not send this guy over and let's just sit

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Speaker 1: down with the Russians and hammer something out. But it

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Speaker 1: seems though that when the Ukrainians get involved, they always

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Speaker 1: want to bring in Europe, and when they bring in Europe,

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Speaker 1: that always seems to bring in the Blob as well.

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Speaker 1: Oh completely, I mean, I remember that's NATO, because that's

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Speaker 1: where all of NATO is exactly right.

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Speaker 6: Trump is not negotiating with Ukraine on this piece, deeal.

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Speaker 6: He's negotiating with Great Britain and the captured you know,

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Speaker 6: parts of France and Germany who sort of work themselves

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Speaker 6: into Zelenski's body to negotiate for him, because that is

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Speaker 6: who is picking up the slack. I mean, Europe is

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Speaker 6: now trying to create its own army. We just had

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Speaker 6: androwsplowgrass muse in the head of NATO during Obama. I'm

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Speaker 6: going to read what he tweeted this morning. I'm now

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Speaker 6: calling for Europe to deploy up to twenty thousand troops

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Speaker 6: behind Ukraine's front lines, establish an airshield with one hundred

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Speaker 6: and fifty combat aircraft and unlocked frozen Russian assets meaning

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Speaker 6: sees Russian assets, which would cause an absolute firestorm in

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Speaker 6: the international markets and make it unlikely that any sane invests,

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Speaker 6: any sane sovereign country would ever invest in Europe again,

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Speaker 6: if not directly under the barrel of a gun. But

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Speaker 6: that is that is the animating spirit of France, Germany,

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Speaker 6: the UK to some extent, Norway, the Dutch. It's the

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Speaker 6: EU and you know, that's that's Soros town. This is

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Speaker 6: this is where all this reconstruction money is coming, apart

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Speaker 6: from the US, which you know, so you basically have Democrats,

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Speaker 6: the remaining never Trump Republicans and Europe working into Zelenski's

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Speaker 6: body to tell him what to do and not to do.

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Speaker 6: And you know, the way they've changed the terms from

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Speaker 6: this deal are just hilarious.

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Speaker 3: I mean they right.

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Speaker 6: Now Ukraine has just completely subsumed in this multi billion

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Speaker 6: dollar corruption scandal where they're finding one hundred million dollars

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Speaker 6: and you know, embezzled one hundred million dollars, embezzled cash,

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Speaker 6: golden toilets. The highest levels of the Ukrainian government that

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Speaker 6: you know, from the folks in their energy ministry to

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Speaker 6: I mean, would appear to be the second and third

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Speaker 6: in command of Zelenski himself. Meanwhile, Ukraine is still not

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Speaker 6: held a vote in over five years. They've canceled elections indefinitely,

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Speaker 6: that remains.

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Speaker 3: Meanwhile, it just.

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Speaker 6: I think Libernet just posted a giant tapestry of the

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Speaker 6: German censorship industrial complex and I was I found it

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Speaker 6: humorous that they one of the three hundred and thirty

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Speaker 6: German government funded censorship organizations. In the report is an

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Speaker 6: institution called Radar, which is part of the USA Censorship network,

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Speaker 6: and Radar was taking German taxpayer dollars to monitor social

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Speaker 6: media discourse in Ukraine to stop what it called false

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Speaker 6: narratives that delegitimized the Kiev government. So all stops are

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Speaker 6: being pulled to that shore up this kind of seemingly

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Speaker 6: coke addle, dysfunctional corrupt government as its corpse is propped

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Speaker 6: up and marionetted by a bunch of EU blobsters.

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Speaker 1: And and one of the big, one of the big

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Speaker 1: pressure points on this is something that you've been talking

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Speaker 1: about here for years, and this came out publicly, and

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Speaker 1: you don't hear any coverage of this really in the West.

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Speaker 1: That Zelenski's Justice minister and the Minister of Energy, Minister

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Speaker 1: of Justice, Miniter Energy both resigned just days ago, like

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Speaker 1: two weeks ago in Kiev on the backs of a

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Speaker 1: one hundred million dollar kickback scheme involve a you guessed it,

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Speaker 1: the state owned energy company and Entergo Adam, which is

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Speaker 1: actually their nuclear company. And the ring leader of the

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Speaker 1: scheme was, of course one of Zelenski's close business partners,

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Speaker 1: I mean You just can't make it up, can you.

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Speaker 3: Now?

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Speaker 6: You certainly can't. But what I thought was so interesting,

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Speaker 6: and I'm just trying to pull up the exact language here.

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Speaker 6: But the part of the original Trump proposal I believed

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Speaker 6: to Ukraine was that there would be a full audit.

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Speaker 6: Part of the conditions of the deal would be a

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Speaker 6: full audit of aid money to Ukraine. And then as

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Speaker 6: the scandal unfolded, the language was changed to instead offer

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Speaker 6: an amnesty that essentially all crimes committed by the Kiev

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Speaker 6: government if they agreed to this peace deal, would be

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Speaker 6: effectively absolved or pardoned, so that there would need to

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Speaker 6: be no Truth and Reconciliation committee or transitional justice in

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Speaker 6: a post Zelenski. So they try to set the stage

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Speaker 6: for terms in which the Zelenski mafia will feel inclined

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Speaker 6: to H as part of the peace terms, you know,

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Speaker 6: go back to being something even nominally pretending to be

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Speaker 6: a democracy, i e. Some path the holding of vote

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Speaker 6: on an election again. But everyone knows Zelenski would lose,

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Speaker 6: and H undoubtedly the successor Justice Department or Justice ministry

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Speaker 6: would be saddled with all of these.

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Speaker 1: And they have to figure out exactly what to do

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Speaker 1: right back, Jack PISOBC Mike Ben's.

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Speaker 5: How you talk.

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Speaker 2: About influencers, These are influences.

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Speaker 9: And they're friends of mine, Jack.

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Speaker 4: Jack.

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Speaker 1: Break down, all right, Jack re Selvick back live with

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Speaker 1: Mike Ben's. We're talking the latest on this Ukraine potential

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Speaker 1: peace deal. We have also heard some Macrone just came out,

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Speaker 1: we're confirming that now and said after they just held.

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Speaker 3: A call with the quote unquote Coalition of the Willing.

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Speaker 1: Now you remember that was who came to the White

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Speaker 1: House to meet with President Trump and Zolensky the day

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Speaker 1: after u Zolensky, excuse me, Trump and Putin met in Anchorage, Alaska.

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Speaker 1: Now they're saying now Macrone is saying that European led

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Speaker 1: security guarantees for Kiev could involve the United States. So

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Speaker 1: Ben's what we're looking at here is this is pushing

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Speaker 1: everything into the reconstruction and this new potential military situation.

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Speaker 6: Hearing well, you know, as we were just talking about

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Speaker 6: the found the Wall Street Journal reporting that in the

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Speaker 6: apparent move to expose corruption, the initial US draft called

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Speaker 6: for an audit of all international aid Ukraine had received.

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Speaker 6: The Wall Street Journal reports the language was changed to

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Speaker 6: say all parties will receive full amnesty for their actions

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Speaker 6: during the war. So instead of agreeing to have all

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Speaker 6: the international aid Ukraine has received be audited, instead the

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Speaker 6: apparently the provision was changed to say no audit and

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Speaker 6: no matter what crimes we committed in embezzling funds, we're

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Speaker 6: not going to be criminally liable anyway.

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Speaker 3: So that's fine.

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Speaker 1: Ukraine changed one of the twenty twenty eight provisions that

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Speaker 1: was talking for an international audit of the of all

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Speaker 1: the funds that came in that it's not going to

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Speaker 1: be an audit. It's in fact going to be amnesty

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Speaker 1: for any which which you know, and by the way,

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Speaker 1: amnesty is something that you you receive for crime. It's

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Speaker 1: not something that you receive for you know, benevolent acts

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Speaker 1: or acts of charity. No, it's it's amnesty is something

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Speaker 1: or a pardon is something you received for for committing

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Speaker 1: a crime.

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Speaker 6: Right, Well, this is I mean, this is just so thematic, right,

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Speaker 6: I mean, this is like remember when they tried to

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Speaker 6: sell the Ukraine Aid as being, oh, it's longer just

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Speaker 6: giving unconditional, no strings attached grants to Ukraine. We're going

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Speaker 6: to make them loans. We were going to make money

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Speaker 6: forgivable at any time and have no interest and no

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Speaker 6: maturity date and are forgivable on demand, like it's it's.

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Speaker 3: Here's here's something we should actually think about.

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Speaker 1: Is and just in a true sense, is the government

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Speaker 1: of Ukraine and the economy, whatever economy is left of Ukraine,

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Speaker 1: does it actually resemble a real government and a real

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Speaker 1: country's you know, administration or does this this seems to

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Speaker 1: me like they're like one of these subcontractors that USAID

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Speaker 1: would be working with and one of these like shady groups.

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Speaker 3: They don't seem like a real government at all.

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Speaker 6: Right, And remember one of the leading figures within Ukrainian

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Speaker 6: state media said after USA shutdown or the shutdown was initiated,

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Speaker 6: that this would devastate Ukraine's media because over ninety percent

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Speaker 6: of Ukraine's media institutions and outlets were funded directly by USAID,

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Speaker 6: So ninety percent of Ukraine's media was funded by USAID,

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Speaker 6: including the Kiev Independent, very independent. But that's there's now

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Speaker 6: this mad I mean, it's important to remember the stakes

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Speaker 6: Ukraine sits on fourteen trillion dollars worth of natural resources

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Speaker 6: between the shale, the petroleum, the rare earth minerals, and

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Speaker 6: so there is what's three hundred billion dollars in taxpayer

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Speaker 6: money for a fourteen trillion dollar potential reward. That's kind

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Speaker 6: of the thought process. Of course, we're not going to

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Speaker 6: get our three hundred billion dollars back. That is basically subsidized,

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Speaker 6: subsidized R and D capital for you might say, for

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Speaker 6: military industrial complex contractors, big mining companies, big gas giants,

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Speaker 6: you know, and big agriculture companies. And that is that's

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Speaker 6: what's happening. Ukraine is being is being put through shock

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Speaker 6: therapy while it is firing off the machine guns like

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Speaker 6: a madman, and it is convulsing at the biological and

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Speaker 6: cellular level as it is being sold off nucleus by nucleus,

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Speaker 6: every cell to another Wall Street and London trading firm.

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Speaker 6: This is what's been happening now.

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Speaker 1: And that's by the way, and just just in our

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Speaker 1: final minute, that is why there's so much language in

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Speaker 1: here about the reconstruction, who's paying for it or using

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Speaker 1: these frozen Russian assets, But then also who benefits from

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Speaker 1: the reconstruction as well, isn't.

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Speaker 3: It Yeah, well it is.

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Speaker 6: And this is where I come back to how this

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Speaker 6: impacts things at home. That the special envoy for Ukraine

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Speaker 6: reconstruction under the Biden administration was none other than Penny Pritzker.

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Speaker 6: Penny Prisker, who was the sponsor of Barack Obama's Senate

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Speaker 6: career before he became president, then became Barack Obama's Commerce Secretary,

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Speaker 6: and now manages the entire Harvard Endowment, the fifty six

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Speaker 6: billion dollar Harvard Endowment Fund, while simultaneously running Ukraine reconstruction.

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Speaker 6: Harvard very famously invested in in Pilford, Russian state assets

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Speaker 6: when it was paid by USAID. I think three hundred

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Speaker 6: and fifty million dollars it got from USAID the Harvard

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Speaker 6: Institute for International Development under Jeffrey Saxson Larry Summers, and

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Speaker 6: then they did it again in Ukraine in the nineteen nineties,

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Speaker 6: and I'm sure they're doing it here, which is why

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Speaker 6: I have been calling repeatedly for this administration to condition

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Speaker 6: all federal grants to all universities on total transparency about

436
00:26:39,800 --> 00:26:43,679
Speaker 6: the investment activities of private endowments. If you're going to

437
00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:47,200
Speaker 6: qualify for one dollar of federal government grants, we need

438
00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:51,600
Speaker 6: to see every investment that endowment is making, so we

439
00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:54,200
Speaker 6: know whether or not what people are being taught.

440
00:26:54,040 --> 00:26:58,440
Speaker 1: At Harvard'll give them a follow folks. Mike Benz, Mike Benz, cyber,

441
00:26:58,760 --> 00:26:59,360
Speaker 1: take care of Mike.

442
00:26:59,440 --> 00:27:00,920
Speaker 5: Can Where's Jack?

443
00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:03,280
Speaker 3: Where's Jack?

444
00:27:04,760 --> 00:27:05,640
Speaker 2: Where is it?

445
00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:06,240
Speaker 3: Jack?

446
00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:07,160
Speaker 5: I want to see you.

447
00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:11,359
Speaker 6: Great job, Jack, Thank you?

448
00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:12,600
Speaker 4: What a job you do.

449
00:27:13,080 --> 00:27:14,280
Speaker 6: You know, we have an incredible thing.

450
00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:15,920
Speaker 3: We're always talking about the fake.

451
00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:18,800
Speaker 6: News and demand, but we have guys and these are

452
00:27:18,840 --> 00:27:21,080
Speaker 6: the guys shore be getting Policieshki.

453
00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:27,200
Speaker 1: All right, Jack with celbaquer back Live Human Events Daily, Phoenix, Arizona. Folks,

454
00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:30,520
Speaker 1: did you know Utah and Florida recently banned fluoride in

455
00:27:30,560 --> 00:27:33,879
Speaker 1: their drinking water. Why are they doing a massive u

456
00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:35,879
Speaker 1: turn on something that's been pumped in our water for

457
00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:40,479
Speaker 1: eighty years? The government claims fluoride is for healthy teeth,

458
00:27:40,600 --> 00:27:43,160
Speaker 1: but is that just nandy state nonsense. You don't need

459
00:27:43,200 --> 00:27:46,399
Speaker 1: bureaucrats medicating your water. You need the freedom to choose

460
00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:49,879
Speaker 1: pure water. That's why my family, the Posso family, uses

461
00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:53,320
Speaker 1: Cove Pure. This is a countertop water purifier certified to

462
00:27:53,320 --> 00:27:56,639
Speaker 1: remove up the nine point nine percent of impurities that

463
00:27:56,720 --> 00:28:01,119
Speaker 1: includes fluoride and other garbage like PFA's fertilizer runoff, you

464
00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:03,600
Speaker 1: name it. The first thing I noticed is the taste.

465
00:28:03,800 --> 00:28:06,520
Speaker 1: Coke Pure helps water become what it's supposed to taste like,

466
00:28:06,760 --> 00:28:11,040
Speaker 1: pure clean, no aftertaste. The best part is you can

467
00:28:11,119 --> 00:28:13,920
Speaker 1: choose any temperature hot or cold with just one tap.

468
00:28:13,960 --> 00:28:15,280
Speaker 1: It's so easy, you know, drilling.

469
00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:17,480
Speaker 3: No plumbers. Just fill it in and plug it in.

470
00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:19,800
Speaker 1: Head over to Coke Pure dot com slash poso and

471
00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:23,159
Speaker 1: for a limited time get two hundred dollars off. The

472
00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:26,880
Speaker 1: government has no business forcing things in your water. Don't

473
00:28:26,920 --> 00:28:28,679
Speaker 1: wait for them to sort out pure water. You have

474
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:31,680
Speaker 1: to do it yourself. That's Covepure dot com slash poso,

475
00:28:32,000 --> 00:28:36,280
Speaker 1: Covepure dot com slash poso for two hundred dollars off. Right, folks,

476
00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:39,400
Speaker 1: We got Will Chamberlain coming up next Article three.

477
00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:44,920
Speaker 3: Project Will. This story broke right as the show was.

478
00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:48,840
Speaker 1: Going live yesterday and I was I was thinking, we

479
00:28:48,840 --> 00:28:49,400
Speaker 1: need a lawyer.

480
00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:51,440
Speaker 3: When you know, as I had like two minutes.

481
00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:53,760
Speaker 1: I was going to try to book you, but you know,

482
00:28:53,800 --> 00:28:56,000
Speaker 1: you're a little busy for us yesterday, But apparently you

483
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:57,680
Speaker 1: weren't too busy to go on the War Room with

484
00:28:57,720 --> 00:28:58,920
Speaker 1: Steve Bannon where you will.

485
00:29:00,240 --> 00:29:01,680
Speaker 9: No, I was very happy to go on the War

486
00:29:01,720 --> 00:29:03,160
Speaker 9: Room with Steve Banner, but I really should have gone

487
00:29:03,160 --> 00:29:06,160
Speaker 9: on with you because Steve decided to play ten minutes

488
00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:10,520
Speaker 9: of MSNBC clips, which really was just necessary for the

489
00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:10,880
Speaker 9: first time.

490
00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:14,640
Speaker 1: He tortures, He tortures his audience through this every day,

491
00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:16,440
Speaker 1: and he says, I'm just trying to toughen you.

492
00:29:16,440 --> 00:29:18,800
Speaker 3: Up, just trying to toughen you up. You gotta get

493
00:29:18,880 --> 00:29:20,520
Speaker 3: used to it, you gotta get stronger.

494
00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:23,840
Speaker 1: So he's he's he's working over his forces. But yes,

495
00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:26,400
Speaker 1: I've I've had to endure those many many times, and

496
00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:27,400
Speaker 1: you had.

497
00:29:27,240 --> 00:29:29,960
Speaker 3: To endure the co cure cursal read which.

498
00:29:29,800 --> 00:29:31,520
Speaker 1: Really wasn't really all that bad at all. It's it's

499
00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:32,520
Speaker 1: really nice with Tony.

500
00:29:32,400 --> 00:29:35,520
Speaker 5: Loves nicer than James Comy's visage, Are you kidding? I'd

501
00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:35,880
Speaker 5: listen to.

502
00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:40,680
Speaker 1: So walk us through though, and by the way, makes

503
00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:44,200
Speaker 1: a great Christmas gift. Walk us through though this whole

504
00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:46,840
Speaker 1: contention about because it really seems to me and I

505
00:29:46,840 --> 00:29:50,080
Speaker 1: haven't gone through obviously the law, like you have the

506
00:29:50,160 --> 00:29:54,719
Speaker 1: appointment of Lindsey Halligan, that seems to be what uh

507
00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:58,360
Speaker 1: with this judge in Virginia is hanging all of this on.

508
00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:02,240
Speaker 1: That's something where of course, now I remember a number

509
00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:05,280
Speaker 1: of people made this a similar argument regarding Jack Smith,

510
00:30:05,520 --> 00:30:08,080
Speaker 1: but that was because he was a special counsel. She's

511
00:30:08,120 --> 00:30:10,760
Speaker 1: not a special counsel. She's a US attorney, which is

512
00:30:10,760 --> 00:30:13,400
Speaker 1: a routine position. So will the Flora's yours.

513
00:30:14,520 --> 00:30:18,280
Speaker 9: Yeah, so you've highlighted an interesting distinction, which is special

514
00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:22,280
Speaker 9: councils also have to our inferior officers, most likely just

515
00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:25,960
Speaker 9: like US attorneys. And for inferior officers, there's a number

516
00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:29,120
Speaker 9: of ways to confirm them or appoint them. You can

517
00:30:29,880 --> 00:30:33,080
Speaker 9: go through the normal presidential advice and consent process with

518
00:30:33,080 --> 00:30:38,120
Speaker 9: the Senate or the Congress can buy statute create a

519
00:30:38,240 --> 00:30:41,360
Speaker 9: method for you to be appointed to a particular position.

520
00:30:41,360 --> 00:30:45,000
Speaker 9: And that's what's happens with these interim US attorneys. There's

521
00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:48,440
Speaker 9: a statute. I believe it's twenty eight USC or it's

522
00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:50,320
Speaker 9: either eighteen or twenty eight. I forget off the top

523
00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:53,760
Speaker 9: of my head four fifty six that deals with how

524
00:30:53,800 --> 00:30:57,200
Speaker 9: these vacancies work, and so it's a kind of poorly worded,

525
00:30:57,640 --> 00:31:01,640
Speaker 9: little bit ambiguous statute, honestly, But the best reading of

526
00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:05,200
Speaker 9: it is that it basically gives the Attorney General the

527
00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:08,000
Speaker 9: ability to appoint entering US attorneys for one hundred and

528
00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:11,840
Speaker 9: twenty day periods whenever there's a vacancy, and it also

529
00:31:11,880 --> 00:31:15,160
Speaker 9: gives concurrent authority to the local district court to do

530
00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:18,040
Speaker 9: so in the event that the political branches for whatever reason,

531
00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:18,760
Speaker 9: can't get their act.

532
00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:19,800
Speaker 5: Together and make an appointment.

533
00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:26,480
Speaker 9: But that authority should be understood as concurrent, it's not exclusive.

534
00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:28,720
Speaker 9: And there's a couple of reasons why. I mean, first off,

535
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:31,600
Speaker 9: the language of the statute is pretty clear. By its terms,

536
00:31:31,640 --> 00:31:34,160
Speaker 9: there's only one exception to the Attorney General's authority, and

537
00:31:34,200 --> 00:31:36,800
Speaker 9: that is that they're not allowed to appoint people who

538
00:31:36,800 --> 00:31:40,000
Speaker 9: have been affirmatively rejected by the Senate. And then the

539
00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:42,800
Speaker 9: second reason that's the appropriate reading is because there's a

540
00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:46,920
Speaker 9: major constitutional problem with saying that the only way to

541
00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:50,520
Speaker 9: appoint an executive branch official, or the only people that

542
00:31:50,520 --> 00:31:52,760
Speaker 9: can appoint an executive branch official are.

543
00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:53,680
Speaker 5: District court judges.

544
00:31:53,760 --> 00:31:56,920
Speaker 9: That gives Article three judges the power to appoint Article

545
00:31:57,000 --> 00:32:01,680
Speaker 9: two officials and not just any but the exclusive power.

546
00:32:02,080 --> 00:32:04,720
Speaker 9: So that's every time we've been seeing over the last

547
00:32:04,800 --> 00:32:07,840
Speaker 9: year where there have been attempts to defend independent agencies

548
00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:12,600
Speaker 9: from presidentials who revision. Those attempts have failed, and Congress

549
00:32:12,760 --> 00:32:16,560
Speaker 9: just can't pass statutes that vest Article to appointment authority

550
00:32:16,840 --> 00:32:20,800
Speaker 9: exclusively in entities that aren't the presidency.

551
00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:25,240
Speaker 1: So when this comes down to it, there was an interim,

552
00:32:25,680 --> 00:32:29,240
Speaker 1: there was an interim vacancy and they went and appointed

553
00:32:29,280 --> 00:32:30,040
Speaker 1: Lindsay Halligan.

554
00:32:30,400 --> 00:32:33,480
Speaker 3: Was this done? So? Will in your reading was this lawful?

555
00:32:34,040 --> 00:32:35,920
Speaker 5: Yeah? In my reading, this was absolutely lawful.

556
00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:38,920
Speaker 9: And the government put out a very very good brief

557
00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:41,080
Speaker 9: on this subject. I thought that was very very clear

558
00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:46,640
Speaker 9: in terms of explaining what the language was. The alternative

559
00:32:46,640 --> 00:32:49,520
Speaker 9: you requires a very very aggressive reading of the statute

560
00:32:49,520 --> 00:32:54,080
Speaker 9: that effectively requires reading exclusivity were exclusive. Words like only

561
00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:57,440
Speaker 9: or you know, the only way to apply those words

562
00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:00,560
Speaker 9: just don't appear in the statute. And by its term,

563
00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:04,120
Speaker 9: Subsection A of that statute is just it's really clear

564
00:33:04,120 --> 00:33:06,920
Speaker 9: on its terms. If there's a vacancy, the Attorney General

565
00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:09,760
Speaker 9: can make an interim appointment period.

566
00:33:09,360 --> 00:33:11,840
Speaker 1: Would you kind of refer to that as maybe, oh,

567
00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:15,040
Speaker 1: I don't know, a Weisman reading of the statute.

568
00:33:15,120 --> 00:33:16,400
Speaker 5: A Weisman reading of the statute.

569
00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:18,920
Speaker 9: Yes, And it's weird because, to be fair, there's a

570
00:33:18,920 --> 00:33:20,920
Speaker 9: lot of district judges who have made this mistake. But

571
00:33:21,080 --> 00:33:23,040
Speaker 9: if we've learned anything from the last year or so,

572
00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:25,800
Speaker 9: is that the district judge is ruling against the Trump administration.

573
00:33:25,880 --> 00:33:29,800
Speaker 9: It's not something that tends to stick when the administration

574
00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:32,360
Speaker 9: decides to appeal. There's something like a ninety two percent

575
00:33:32,640 --> 00:33:36,200
Speaker 9: success rating of the Supreme Court, which is unprecedented. Unprecedented

576
00:33:36,200 --> 00:33:38,280
Speaker 9: for administration to be doing this well. And that's because

577
00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:42,080
Speaker 9: district judges are aggressively trying to find ways to thwart

578
00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:44,600
Speaker 9: the actions of the Trump administration. And this is the

579
00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:47,160
Speaker 9: most classic example. You know, James Comy has a lot

580
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:49,920
Speaker 9: of relationships in the Eastern District of Virginia and elsewhere.

581
00:33:50,080 --> 00:33:52,720
Speaker 9: He's a lot of relationships among Democratic politicians. They're very

582
00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:55,320
Speaker 9: upset that he's being indicted for perjuring himself in front

583
00:33:55,320 --> 00:33:57,560
Speaker 9: of Congress, and they're going to pull out all the

584
00:33:57,560 --> 00:33:59,840
Speaker 9: stops to try and stop the indictment. It's one of

585
00:33:59,840 --> 00:34:02,880
Speaker 9: the reasons that you know, people often can be frustrated

586
00:34:02,920 --> 00:34:05,000
Speaker 9: that things don't happen more quickly. But this is a

587
00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:08,880
Speaker 9: classic example of even when the administration does things.

588
00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:10,799
Speaker 5: Properly, there are a whole bunch of roadblocks put in

589
00:34:10,840 --> 00:34:11,280
Speaker 5: their way.

590
00:34:11,719 --> 00:34:14,399
Speaker 9: So it's really important that to the extent they can

591
00:34:14,600 --> 00:34:16,880
Speaker 9: they cross the rise and doctor tea, or cross their

592
00:34:16,920 --> 00:34:17,759
Speaker 9: t's and dot their eyes.

593
00:34:19,360 --> 00:34:21,680
Speaker 3: Well, and this is what they're going to do.

594
00:34:21,960 --> 00:34:24,280
Speaker 1: And the reason I refer to Weisman readings is because

595
00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:27,240
Speaker 1: we know that this is and I remember you conducting

596
00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:31,640
Speaker 1: this incredible analysis of the obstruction statute when Weissman was

597
00:34:31,680 --> 00:34:34,080
Speaker 1: trying to urge and when he ran the Muller investigation,

598
00:34:34,120 --> 00:34:37,040
Speaker 1: and he's now on MSNBC all the time. He's constantly

599
00:34:37,080 --> 00:34:40,160
Speaker 1: trying to find ways This is like his one trick

600
00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:42,880
Speaker 1: in a sense. He's constantly trying to find ways to

601
00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:49,080
Speaker 1: twist statutes into readings that don't actually fit the plain

602
00:34:49,160 --> 00:34:52,920
Speaker 1: text reading or the common sense reading of the words,

603
00:34:53,280 --> 00:34:56,840
Speaker 1: and use them then in effect to block whatever Trump

604
00:34:56,880 --> 00:35:00,000
Speaker 1: is doing, or in the previous case of Mueller, actually

605
00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:03,960
Speaker 1: launch an indictment of a sitting president of the United States,

606
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:06,839
Speaker 1: or at least urgent indictment that would you know, turn

607
00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:08,319
Speaker 1: into an impeachment.

608
00:35:08,360 --> 00:35:10,719
Speaker 3: But it's always sort of this one trick, isn't it.

609
00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:16,680
Speaker 9: Yeah, it's a very aggressive liberal lawyering, is the one trick, right,

610
00:35:16,719 --> 00:35:21,600
Speaker 9: And it's aggressive statutory interpretation, novel statutory interpretation, the novel

611
00:35:21,719 --> 00:35:22,640
Speaker 9: use of statutes.

612
00:35:22,680 --> 00:35:22,840
Speaker 5: You know.

613
00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:25,279
Speaker 9: One of the really interesting thing things here is that,

614
00:35:25,920 --> 00:35:28,439
Speaker 9: you know, we talked about this endlessly during the Biden

615
00:35:28,440 --> 00:35:31,799
Speaker 9: administration when they were going after Trump, how aggressively they

616
00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:36,200
Speaker 9: were interpreting fifteen twelve subsection C two to try and

617
00:35:36,360 --> 00:35:39,640
Speaker 9: expand this catch all obstruction statute into something that encompassed

618
00:35:39,640 --> 00:35:42,360
Speaker 9: what the president did on January sixth, And it's an

619
00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:44,720
Speaker 9: obstruction of justice statute. So this is about the destruction

620
00:35:44,760 --> 00:35:48,920
Speaker 9: of evidence. It's not about stopping the count in the

621
00:35:49,840 --> 00:35:51,080
Speaker 9: electoral College count.

622
00:35:51,400 --> 00:35:52,760
Speaker 5: So this is yet.

623
00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:55,279
Speaker 9: Another example of that where but now it's going the

624
00:35:55,320 --> 00:35:57,600
Speaker 9: other direction in the sense that before they were trying

625
00:35:57,640 --> 00:36:01,040
Speaker 9: to interpret statutes in a novel way in order to

626
00:36:01,080 --> 00:36:04,880
Speaker 9: expand prosecutorial authority. Now that the Republicans are controlled it,

627
00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:08,600
Speaker 9: they're coming up with these novel and eccentric interpretations.

628
00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:09,920
Speaker 5: Of serially to restrain prostutoral authority.

629
00:36:09,960 --> 00:36:14,760
Speaker 1: Constrained prosecutorial authority, which is amazing. So so the Weissman

630
00:36:14,880 --> 00:36:18,000
Speaker 1: standard is depends on what side of the football he's on.

631
00:36:18,400 --> 00:36:20,560
Speaker 1: In one case, oh, the prosecutor should be able to

632
00:36:20,560 --> 00:36:22,920
Speaker 1: do whatever he wants. But now now that Lindsay Halligan

633
00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:26,560
Speaker 1: is the prosecutor, oh no, we have to constrain prosecutillary authority.

634
00:36:26,719 --> 00:36:28,600
Speaker 1: Think of our standing as a you know, as a

635
00:36:28,600 --> 00:36:31,160
Speaker 1: free republic, and I mean, my gosh, if it's allowed

636
00:36:31,160 --> 00:36:33,520
Speaker 1: these prosecutors to do whatever they want, it's really amazing

637
00:36:33,520 --> 00:36:34,279
Speaker 1: when you think about it.

638
00:36:34,560 --> 00:36:36,840
Speaker 9: You'd be forgiven for thinking that the entire game of

639
00:36:36,840 --> 00:36:39,600
Speaker 9: progressive lawyering is Calvin Ball. You would be forgiven for

640
00:36:39,640 --> 00:36:41,200
Speaker 9: thinking about that's basically.

641
00:36:40,800 --> 00:36:41,319
Speaker 5: What we're dealing.

642
00:36:41,600 --> 00:36:43,880
Speaker 3: Well, for those who don't know what is Calvin ball.

643
00:36:44,080 --> 00:36:46,120
Speaker 5: Oh, Calvin ball is a cartoon.

644
00:36:46,160 --> 00:36:48,040
Speaker 9: I mean, I guess I'm showing my age right because

645
00:36:48,080 --> 00:36:49,960
Speaker 9: we had Calvin and Hobbs when we were kids. But

646
00:36:50,040 --> 00:36:52,279
Speaker 9: Calvin Hobbs is a great cartoon, and Calvin Ball is

647
00:36:52,280 --> 00:36:54,520
Speaker 9: the famous game that has come up with by Calvin,

648
00:36:54,560 --> 00:36:56,680
Speaker 9: which is just basically whatever rule he can make up,

649
00:36:56,719 --> 00:36:58,560
Speaker 9: any rules he wants to at any time, and it

650
00:36:58,719 --> 00:37:00,279
Speaker 9: always ensures that he wins the game, no.

651
00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:02,040
Speaker 3: Matter what that being said.

652
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:06,279
Speaker 1: Anyone who's got small children knows Calvin ball because that's

653
00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:09,439
Speaker 1: exactly how my kids play pretty much every single game

654
00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:11,759
Speaker 1: that I come up with with or they come up with.

655
00:37:11,800 --> 00:37:13,640
Speaker 1: They say, Daddy, let's let's play this game, and then

656
00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:15,479
Speaker 1: we're playing in and say, well, that's against the rules.

657
00:37:15,520 --> 00:37:17,520
Speaker 3: Oh no, there's actually a rule that you don't know about.

658
00:37:17,600 --> 00:37:20,680
Speaker 1: Oh really, right, So that's you know, that's as crazy

659
00:37:20,680 --> 00:37:22,799
Speaker 1: as this is, folks, and you know we're laughing, but

660
00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:26,680
Speaker 1: it's it's ridiculous what they're doing to our system because

661
00:37:26,680 --> 00:37:29,960
Speaker 1: you have actual judges will sit there and play these

662
00:37:30,000 --> 00:37:34,440
Speaker 1: mental gymnastic games while presiding over the destruction of our

663
00:37:34,480 --> 00:37:38,520
Speaker 1: country and running rapshod over the actual.

664
00:37:38,239 --> 00:37:39,439
Speaker 3: System of justice.

665
00:37:39,520 --> 00:37:41,719
Speaker 1: Zech Pisobak. Wil Chamberlain'll be right back here at hum

666
00:37:41,719 --> 00:37:42,279
Speaker 1: Events Daily.

667
00:38:02,800 --> 00:38:04,839
Speaker 2: Jack is a great guy. He's written at.

668
00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:07,600
Speaker 1: Fantastic look and everybody's talking about it. Go get it

669
00:38:08,200 --> 00:38:10,319
Speaker 1: that he spent my friend right from the beginning of

670
00:38:10,360 --> 00:38:11,680
Speaker 1: this whole beautiful event.

671
00:38:12,239 --> 00:38:14,719
Speaker 4: Kat We're going to turn it around and many way

672
00:38:14,760 --> 00:38:15,840
Speaker 4: to get him payment.

673
00:38:19,040 --> 00:38:19,960
Speaker 3: All right, Jack with Selwick.

674
00:38:19,960 --> 00:38:24,720
Speaker 1: We're back with Will Chamberlain, Lawyer for the art Senior

675
00:38:24,719 --> 00:38:27,640
Speaker 1: Attorney for the Article three project. Will The other piece

676
00:38:27,680 --> 00:38:30,120
Speaker 1: that I wanted to get in with you is this

677
00:38:30,360 --> 00:38:34,000
Speaker 1: situation regarding the Uniform Code a Military Justice and the

678
00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:37,359
Speaker 1: fact that Senator Mark Kelly, himself, a retired United States

679
00:38:37,480 --> 00:38:41,080
Speaker 1: Navy captain in six equivalent to a colonel in the

680
00:38:41,400 --> 00:38:45,839
Speaker 1: Army or Marine Corps, is supposedly now under investigation by

681
00:38:45,880 --> 00:38:48,399
Speaker 1: the Pentagon. Now this is something where and I'll just say,

682
00:38:48,440 --> 00:38:52,239
Speaker 1: as having been a military both enlisted and an officer,

683
00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:56,839
Speaker 1: that the UCMJAY is something that's explained to you day one.

684
00:38:56,960 --> 00:38:59,080
Speaker 3: This isn't some gotcha, This isn't Calvin Ball.

685
00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:02,200
Speaker 1: And you also know that if you retire and you

686
00:39:02,239 --> 00:39:04,920
Speaker 1: take that pension, if you're getting those checks, then you

687
00:39:05,320 --> 00:39:10,440
Speaker 1: are still subject to the Uniform Code of Military Justice.

688
00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:13,320
Speaker 1: So we'll looking at it from that perspective. This idea

689
00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:18,360
Speaker 1: of whether or not his comments and actions do actually

690
00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:22,520
Speaker 1: form the basis for a sedition charge in a court martial,

691
00:39:22,560 --> 00:39:25,480
Speaker 1: which is different from a civilian court. Do you think

692
00:39:25,600 --> 00:39:27,759
Speaker 1: that potentially the government would have a case here?

693
00:39:28,800 --> 00:39:31,480
Speaker 9: Yeah, I mean, you know my understanding, and you might

694
00:39:31,480 --> 00:39:33,319
Speaker 9: actually know a little bit more about military law than

695
00:39:33,360 --> 00:39:35,600
Speaker 9: I do, because you were so deeply ingrained in it,

696
00:39:35,640 --> 00:39:39,640
Speaker 9: but under things that you're not allowed to do things

697
00:39:39,680 --> 00:39:42,400
Speaker 9: that knowingly undermind good order and discipline is my understanding,

698
00:39:42,440 --> 00:39:45,000
Speaker 9: and it's hard to imagine something that could undermine good

699
00:39:45,040 --> 00:39:46,480
Speaker 9: order and discipline more than to.

700
00:39:47,280 --> 00:39:50,319
Speaker 3: Those believe it or not believe it or not.

701
00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:54,239
Speaker 1: Actually, just to give you the lanes here, those are,

702
00:39:54,440 --> 00:39:56,280
Speaker 1: that's an entirely separate statute.

703
00:39:56,560 --> 00:39:56,719
Speaker 3: Right.

704
00:39:56,719 --> 00:39:58,680
Speaker 1: So there's an article for a good order and Discipline

705
00:39:58,719 --> 00:40:00,600
Speaker 1: one thirty four. This is like your general catch all.

706
00:40:00,680 --> 00:40:04,200
Speaker 1: There's article ninety two, which is involved in subordination. And

707
00:40:04,239 --> 00:40:08,680
Speaker 1: then there is of course the Sedition.

708
00:40:08,719 --> 00:40:10,160
Speaker 3: I had this pulled up a minute.

709
00:40:09,920 --> 00:40:13,239
Speaker 1: Ago, the actual Sedition article itself. So I mean there's

710
00:40:13,360 --> 00:40:16,480
Speaker 1: quite a few articles that cover this. And then for

711
00:40:16,480 --> 00:40:20,080
Speaker 1: a lot of people not understanding, if you take the pension,

712
00:40:20,480 --> 00:40:24,880
Speaker 1: you are still considered subject to the Uniform Code of Military.

713
00:40:24,480 --> 00:40:28,720
Speaker 9: Justice, right, And it's like we shouldn't have retired senior

714
00:40:28,719 --> 00:40:31,800
Speaker 9: military officers who hold this the esteem of being retired

715
00:40:31,800 --> 00:40:35,560
Speaker 9: senior military officers saying things that undermine the good order

716
00:40:35,600 --> 00:40:38,879
Speaker 9: and discipline of the army. I mean the fact that

717
00:40:39,080 --> 00:40:42,759
Speaker 9: military service members can't obey unlawful orders or shouldn't obey

718
00:40:42,960 --> 00:40:45,480
Speaker 9: is drilled into them from the beginning, but it's drilled

719
00:40:45,480 --> 00:40:47,399
Speaker 9: into them in the context of the fact that they

720
00:40:47,440 --> 00:40:50,359
Speaker 9: need to presume that orders are lawful and that they

721
00:40:50,400 --> 00:40:53,960
Speaker 9: need to obey their superiors, and that insubordination is punished

722
00:40:54,040 --> 00:40:56,600
Speaker 9: as well. So when you have six senators getting up

723
00:40:56,600 --> 00:40:59,600
Speaker 9: there drilling in the sort of opposite message you must

724
00:40:59,800 --> 00:41:02,360
Speaker 9: not follow on lawful orders while not being able to

725
00:41:02,360 --> 00:41:04,600
Speaker 9: identify a single and lawful order that's been issued.

726
00:41:05,560 --> 00:41:07,520
Speaker 5: Well, what everybody understands what you're doing.

727
00:41:07,600 --> 00:41:12,840
Speaker 9: Everybody understands that you're trying to foment discontent and insubordination

728
00:41:12,960 --> 00:41:16,000
Speaker 9: in the military, which is something that you're prohibited from doing,

729
00:41:16,160 --> 00:41:18,239
Speaker 9: something that Captain mar Kelley is prohibited from doing and

730
00:41:18,239 --> 00:41:19,080
Speaker 9: should know better.

731
00:41:21,280 --> 00:41:23,280
Speaker 1: No, and it's something by the way, when you mentioned

732
00:41:23,360 --> 00:41:26,880
Speaker 1: he should know better, this is something that Look if

733
00:41:27,280 --> 00:41:30,120
Speaker 1: if a member of the military did this while they

734
00:41:30,120 --> 00:41:32,239
Speaker 1: were serving, you know, I should say, you know, a

735
00:41:32,280 --> 00:41:34,960
Speaker 1: regular member of the military, someone who's not you know,

736
00:41:35,080 --> 00:41:39,279
Speaker 1: a famous democrat who takes selfies with Alex Soros and

737
00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:42,600
Speaker 1: who's invested in Chinese spy balloon companies.

738
00:41:42,880 --> 00:41:46,919
Speaker 3: Right, if you did something like this, then you would.

739
00:41:46,640 --> 00:41:49,360
Speaker 1: Absolutely be, and you would either be brought to the

740
00:41:49,360 --> 00:41:51,279
Speaker 1: captain's mast in the Navy, which is something we have

741
00:41:51,320 --> 00:41:55,320
Speaker 1: for extraditional punishment, and as an officer in high standing

742
00:41:55,480 --> 00:41:59,239
Speaker 1: like an six, as he is and continues to be

743
00:41:59,360 --> 00:42:02,880
Speaker 1: by the way, because as he's receiving your retirement retirement pension,

744
00:42:02,880 --> 00:42:06,600
Speaker 1: com measure it with his rank, then yes, he absolutely

745
00:42:06,640 --> 00:42:09,759
Speaker 1: should face something like this. And it's not about necessarily

746
00:42:10,160 --> 00:42:15,360
Speaker 1: punishing Mark Kelly. It's about upholding a broad standard for

747
00:42:15,400 --> 00:42:18,360
Speaker 1: the entire military as an armed forces discipline.

748
00:42:19,840 --> 00:42:23,520
Speaker 9: Yeah, like you don't play games within subordination in any military.

749
00:42:23,680 --> 00:42:26,759
Speaker 9: It's the most basic idea that I mean, my whole

750
00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:28,640
Speaker 9: understanding of you know, I didn't go through boot camp,

751
00:42:28,680 --> 00:42:30,480
Speaker 9: but you did. But the whole minor whole understanding of

752
00:42:30,480 --> 00:42:31,879
Speaker 9: the point of boot camp is to sort of drill

753
00:42:31,920 --> 00:42:33,719
Speaker 9: into you that your job is to say yes sir

754
00:42:33,719 --> 00:42:37,279
Speaker 9: when you're given an order, among many other things. So

755
00:42:37,360 --> 00:42:40,480
Speaker 9: the last thing we should be doing is like aggressively

756
00:42:40,680 --> 00:42:44,840
Speaker 9: making subordinates question whether they're they're being given lawful or

757
00:42:44,880 --> 00:42:48,479
Speaker 9: unlawful orders constantly, Like that's you know, unlawful order should

758
00:42:48,520 --> 00:42:51,200
Speaker 9: be a giant, bright, glaring red light that is almost

759
00:42:51,239 --> 00:42:54,279
Speaker 9: almost never happens, is not going to happen to the

760
00:42:54,360 --> 00:42:57,680
Speaker 9: vast majority of service members ever, if not any you

761
00:42:57,719 --> 00:43:02,600
Speaker 9: know that the complete passage. And so for the you know,

762
00:43:02,640 --> 00:43:04,440
Speaker 9: for these six centers to just be coming up with

763
00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:07,279
Speaker 9: this out of nowhere and randomly like and this this

764
00:43:07,400 --> 00:43:11,080
Speaker 9: strong insinuation, you know, those grave phases, like they're really

765
00:43:11,080 --> 00:43:13,720
Speaker 9: deeply insinuating that there are unlawful orders coming from President

766
00:43:13,760 --> 00:43:16,000
Speaker 9: Trump right now. But it's irresponsible for them to do

767
00:43:16,040 --> 00:43:17,520
Speaker 9: that if they can't point to anything that they think

768
00:43:17,560 --> 00:43:18,640
Speaker 9: is unlawful.

769
00:43:19,800 --> 00:43:22,440
Speaker 3: Right, And so that's exactly what it's supposed to be.

770
00:43:22,480 --> 00:43:25,160
Speaker 1: And this whole idea of you know, oh, you must

771
00:43:25,200 --> 00:43:27,480
Speaker 1: disobey unlawful orders. No, you know what, we know what

772
00:43:27,520 --> 00:43:30,120
Speaker 1: you're doing, and we know exactly what you're doing. You're

773
00:43:30,120 --> 00:43:32,680
Speaker 1: not You're not you know, you're not being coy, you're

774
00:43:32,719 --> 00:43:36,040
Speaker 1: not being clever. It's very obvious. And for me, I

775
00:43:36,080 --> 00:43:38,719
Speaker 1: think that when I saw this come out in the

776
00:43:38,719 --> 00:43:42,560
Speaker 1: first place, I recognized the Democrat plan from all the

777
00:43:42,560 --> 00:43:45,879
Speaker 1: way back in twenty nineteen, the original impeachment of President Trump,

778
00:43:45,920 --> 00:43:49,120
Speaker 1: which started with a member of the military working with

779
00:43:49,160 --> 00:43:52,280
Speaker 1: a member of the intelligence community to leak a phone

780
00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:55,520
Speaker 1: call with Zelensky. Yes, the same President Zelensky and the

781
00:43:55,560 --> 00:43:59,920
Speaker 1: same President Trump that led to this, this impeachment inquiry,

782
00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:02,200
Speaker 1: which it was all predicated on a quid pro quo

783
00:44:02,280 --> 00:44:05,520
Speaker 1: that never actually took place in the transcript, But what

784
00:44:05,560 --> 00:44:07,680
Speaker 1: did it start with? It started with members of the

785
00:44:07,680 --> 00:44:10,560
Speaker 1: military and members of the intelligence community leaguing on the

786
00:44:10,560 --> 00:44:11,319
Speaker 1: commander in chief.

787
00:44:12,120 --> 00:44:12,560
Speaker 5: That's right.

788
00:44:12,640 --> 00:44:15,120
Speaker 9: Yeah, And of course mister Vinman's brother is now serving

789
00:44:15,160 --> 00:44:18,239
Speaker 9: in Congress and apparently his his playbook is about one

790
00:44:18,280 --> 00:44:20,640
Speaker 9: page long because he's doing making the same sort of

791
00:44:20,640 --> 00:44:23,959
Speaker 9: stunt where he's you know, talking about how he saw

792
00:44:24,000 --> 00:44:26,000
Speaker 9: the contents of a phone call when he worked for

793
00:44:26,040 --> 00:44:29,160
Speaker 9: the Trump NSA, and he's demanding that Trump release the

794
00:44:29,160 --> 00:44:31,759
Speaker 9: contents of that phone call. Again, query whether or not

795
00:44:31,840 --> 00:44:36,400
Speaker 9: that's yet again another violation of the classified materials rules

796
00:44:36,480 --> 00:44:39,600
Speaker 9: like whenever you know, are you allowed you actually again,

797
00:44:39,640 --> 00:44:42,160
Speaker 9: you're you're an expert in classified information because you yourself,

798
00:44:42,200 --> 00:44:44,839
Speaker 9: can you can you just talk about how the what

799
00:44:44,920 --> 00:44:48,399
Speaker 9: information you saw and how derogatory it is and how

800
00:44:48,480 --> 00:44:51,000
Speaker 9: people should really release it so they can see derogatory

801
00:44:51,000 --> 00:44:51,239
Speaker 9: it is?

802
00:44:51,320 --> 00:44:55,560
Speaker 1: No, no, no, you cannot and right, even.

803
00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:58,080
Speaker 9: If you don't say exactly what the information is, you say,

804
00:44:58,239 --> 00:45:00,880
Speaker 9: But it's super derogatory, I promise, and he should be

805
00:45:00,880 --> 00:45:01,680
Speaker 9: forced to release it.

806
00:45:02,080 --> 00:45:04,920
Speaker 3: No, no, you really can't. You really can't.

807
00:45:04,960 --> 00:45:07,960
Speaker 1: You can't make references to it, and I would I

808
00:45:07,960 --> 00:45:12,040
Speaker 1: would urge, by the way, anyone to go through every

809
00:45:12,080 --> 00:45:15,239
Speaker 1: single one of the tweets that I've ever written, or

810
00:45:15,440 --> 00:45:18,800
Speaker 1: statements that I've ever made on this show or any others,

811
00:45:19,360 --> 00:45:22,279
Speaker 1: to see if I've ever committed exactly what you're saying

812
00:45:22,360 --> 00:45:26,680
Speaker 1: right now. Because now I'm not under UCMJ because I

813
00:45:26,680 --> 00:45:30,440
Speaker 1: didn't do twenty years to qualify for a retirement pension. However,

814
00:45:30,600 --> 00:45:32,719
Speaker 1: as a member of the intelligence community, I do have

815
00:45:32,760 --> 00:45:35,600
Speaker 1: a lifetime NDA. And so if I were to come

816
00:45:35,640 --> 00:45:39,080
Speaker 1: on here and say, hey, Will and everybody gather around,

817
00:45:39,120 --> 00:45:41,160
Speaker 1: I'm going to tell you about everything that took place

818
00:45:41,200 --> 00:45:44,440
Speaker 1: down at Guantanamo Bay when I was there, that would

819
00:45:44,520 --> 00:45:46,160
Speaker 1: probably be my last episode.

820
00:45:46,880 --> 00:45:48,440
Speaker 5: Yeah, probably, and rightfully so.

821
00:45:48,760 --> 00:45:51,200
Speaker 9: And so I feel like this, maybe this has gone

822
00:45:51,239 --> 00:45:54,040
Speaker 9: under the radar because nobody's talking about investigating Eugene Vinman

823
00:45:54,040 --> 00:45:56,880
Speaker 9: from his handling classified information. But there's no doubt that

824
00:45:56,960 --> 00:45:59,440
Speaker 9: the contents of that phone call between President Trump and

825
00:45:59,520 --> 00:46:01,960
Speaker 9: MBS or like in if they haven't been released, they

826
00:46:01,960 --> 00:46:05,000
Speaker 9: are classified. That is foreign diplomacy. So the fact that

827
00:46:05,040 --> 00:46:07,560
Speaker 9: he's insinuating he knows what's in those phone calls and

828
00:46:07,600 --> 00:46:11,320
Speaker 9: demanding transcript releases on that basis what this is a

829
00:46:11,320 --> 00:46:13,200
Speaker 9: six year old farm kleo phone call too, Like, what's

830
00:46:13,239 --> 00:46:16,360
Speaker 9: the there's no there's a whistleblower protection for him. Now

831
00:46:16,800 --> 00:46:19,719
Speaker 9: you know that he falls, you know, flatly and frivolously

832
00:46:19,760 --> 00:46:22,160
Speaker 9: asserted back in twenty eighteen, or I guess his brother.

833
00:46:22,200 --> 00:46:23,880
Speaker 9: It's easy to confuse the two of them, right, they

834
00:46:23,880 --> 00:46:26,640
Speaker 9: both you know, they both are named Vinment, Yeah, right,

835
00:46:26,680 --> 00:46:27,960
Speaker 9: are applauded by the Ukrainians.

836
00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:29,360
Speaker 5: They both lead classifife.

837
00:46:28,920 --> 00:46:32,000
Speaker 1: Phone And speaking of which, by the way, will we

838
00:46:32,040 --> 00:46:34,479
Speaker 1: do have breaking news on Ukraine President Trump.

839
00:46:34,560 --> 00:46:35,960
Speaker 3: We talked about this at the beginning of the show.

840
00:46:35,960 --> 00:46:38,200
Speaker 1: I know we'll have about a minute left, but President

841
00:46:38,200 --> 00:46:41,520
Speaker 1: Trump has just released a truth social saying that over

842
00:46:41,560 --> 00:46:43,960
Speaker 1: the past week, my team has made tremendous progress with

843
00:46:44,000 --> 00:46:48,080
Speaker 1: respect to ending the war between Russia and Ukraine. Last month,

844
00:46:48,200 --> 00:46:50,200
Speaker 1: twenty five thousand soldiers died.

845
00:46:50,239 --> 00:46:51,240
Speaker 3: The original twenty.

846
00:46:51,040 --> 00:46:53,560
Speaker 1: Eight point piece plan, which is drafted by the United States,

847
00:46:53,800 --> 00:46:56,520
Speaker 1: has been fine tuned additional input from both sides.

848
00:46:56,640 --> 00:46:58,759
Speaker 3: There are only a few remaining points of disagreement.

849
00:46:58,880 --> 00:47:01,120
Speaker 1: This is this is significant and in the hopes of

850
00:47:01,200 --> 00:47:04,480
Speaker 1: finalizing this peace plan, President Trump has directed his Special

851
00:47:04,640 --> 00:47:08,440
Speaker 1: Envoice Steve Whitkoff, to meet with President Putin in Moscow,

852
00:47:08,719 --> 00:47:10,839
Speaker 1: and at the same time Secretary of the Army Dan

853
00:47:10,920 --> 00:47:15,800
Speaker 1: Driscoll will be meeting with the Ukrainians and so really

854
00:47:15,840 --> 00:47:19,520
Speaker 1: working forward to the final stages potentially of a peace plan.

855
00:47:19,640 --> 00:47:23,040
Speaker 1: That's breaking news from President the United States himself, will

856
00:47:23,120 --> 00:47:24,680
Speaker 1: I wish we had more time. We'll get you back

857
00:47:24,719 --> 00:47:27,520
Speaker 1: on when we have more on these legal developments. Where

858
00:47:27,520 --> 00:47:30,320
Speaker 1: can people go to follow you in the interim.

859
00:47:29,880 --> 00:47:32,320
Speaker 9: At Well Chamberlain on x and you can always follow

860
00:47:32,360 --> 00:47:34,400
Speaker 9: what the Article three project is doing and join our

861
00:47:34,440 --> 00:47:37,000
Speaker 9: campaigns at a three P action dot com.

862
00:47:37,040 --> 00:47:39,160
Speaker 1: God bless well and hope that you, Jordan and the

863
00:47:39,160 --> 00:47:40,240
Speaker 1: family have a great.

864
00:47:40,200 --> 00:47:43,040
Speaker 5: And happy thank you, absolutely happy thanksgiving.

865
00:47:43,920 --> 00:47:45,920
Speaker 3: God bless ladies and gentlemen. As always, you have my

866
00:47:45,960 --> 00:47:46,400
Speaker 3: permission

867
00:47:46,480 --> 00:47:47,000
Speaker 4: To layer for