WEBVTT - Jamie Dimon Talks Growth of AI, Jobs, Government Shutdown 0:00:02.520 --> 0:00:07.040 Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. 0:00:07.800 --> 0:00:09.840 Jamie, we're talking about the fact that you have lent 0:00:09.960 --> 0:00:12.479 into technology over the last decade, billions of dollars invested 0:00:12.520 --> 0:00:15.760 across the business. When it comes to AI, which parts 0:00:15.800 --> 0:00:18.760 of the JP Morgan business are they'll be most transformed 0:00:18.840 --> 0:00:19.400 by AI. 0:00:20.040 --> 0:00:22.200 So we already we've been doing AI since twenty twelve. 0:00:22.440 --> 0:00:24.880 So people think it's a new thing. Jen AI is 0:00:24.960 --> 0:00:26.400 kind of new, but not all of it. We have 0:00:26.440 --> 0:00:29.200 two thousand people doing it, spend two billion dollars a. 0:00:29.200 --> 0:00:29.840 Year on it. 0:00:29.840 --> 0:00:35.479 It affects everything risk, fraud, marketing, idea generation, customer service, 0:00:35.800 --> 0:00:37.760 and it's kind of the tip of the iceberg. And 0:00:37.840 --> 0:00:39.720 so we know we're deploying it. Every time we meet 0:00:39.800 --> 0:00:41.640 us a business, we ask what are you doing? What 0:00:41.640 --> 0:00:43.159 are you doing to serve your people? Why can you 0:00:43.159 --> 0:00:46.080 do better? What are somebody else doing? So we're freely 0:00:46.120 --> 0:00:48.640 deploying it and safely. We have a lot of rules 0:00:48.640 --> 0:00:50.800 and regulations in place in our own data and how 0:00:50.800 --> 0:00:51.640 we use it, et cetera. 0:00:51.840 --> 0:00:54.120 Is it having a material impacts on revenues for JP Morgan? 0:00:54.160 --> 0:00:55.680 If not now, then when so we have. 0:00:55.720 --> 0:00:58.120 Shown that for that for two billion of expense. We 0:00:58.160 --> 0:01:00.960 have got two billion of benefit. We actually can do 0:01:01.040 --> 0:01:01.640 real detail. 0:01:01.680 --> 0:01:02.120 We did this. 0:01:02.200 --> 0:01:05.920 We wereduced headcount, we saved this time and money. We'duced areas. 0:01:05.959 --> 0:01:08.440 Some of you can't. It's just improved service something like that. 0:01:08.440 --> 0:01:11.520 It's like almost worthwhile worthless to say what's the MPV. 0:01:11.640 --> 0:01:14.760 But we know about two billion dollars of actual cost saves. 0:01:14.880 --> 0:01:17.000 And I think it's the tip of the iceberg. You 0:01:17.080 --> 0:01:19.760 were getting better and better at it. We know how 0:01:19.760 --> 0:01:21.600 to do it. As the managers learn how to do it, 0:01:21.640 --> 0:01:23.920 they're asking more questions why can't it do X? And 0:01:23.920 --> 0:01:25.759 why can't do yx? And then were on on my phone. 0:01:25.760 --> 0:01:28.360 Here we have a suite and all I'm sweet on 0:01:28.480 --> 0:01:32.720 internal data to do research and summarize reports and you know, 0:01:33.160 --> 0:01:35.640 scan contracts and do things like that. 0:01:35.800 --> 0:01:37.400 One hundred and fifty thousand. 0:01:37.080 --> 0:01:40.080 People a week use it, so it's it's quite productive. 0:01:40.200 --> 0:01:42.240 More and more of your employees are using the agentic 0:01:42.280 --> 0:01:43.240 AI our. 0:01:43.120 --> 0:01:47.400 Own our own LLM, and Igentic is just starting, you know, 0:01:47.480 --> 0:01:49.960 but that will be deploying over time too. But it's 0:01:50.000 --> 0:01:52.400 also been used for coding. I mean, it's it's being 0:01:52.520 --> 0:01:55.160 used quite broadly now. And like I said, part of 0:01:55.280 --> 0:01:57.680 is getting your mind working around how you're going to 0:01:57.840 --> 0:02:00.320 use this thing, and so our managers and leaders. 0:02:00.080 --> 0:02:00.640 Have to do it. 0:02:01.120 --> 0:02:04.680 If you look out five years, are there more jobs 0:02:04.760 --> 0:02:07.200 in banking as a result of AI or fewer? 0:02:08.680 --> 0:02:10.519 Look I think is I think people shouldn't put the 0:02:10.560 --> 0:02:12.840 head in the sand. It is going to affect jobs. 0:02:13.000 --> 0:02:16.960 So think of every application, every every service you do, 0:02:17.160 --> 0:02:19.320 will you'll be using AI, some to enhance it, some 0:02:19.360 --> 0:02:21.440 of it will be you doing the same job, You're 0:02:21.440 --> 0:02:23.840 doing a better job at it. There will be jobs 0:02:23.840 --> 0:02:26.600 that it eliminates, but you're better. Have been way ahead 0:02:26.600 --> 0:02:29.800 of the curve and retraining people, so we train and 0:02:29.800 --> 0:02:32.320 redeploy a lot of people. So for JP Moore, if 0:02:32.320 --> 0:02:36.239 we're successful, we'll have more jobs, but there'll probably be 0:02:36.320 --> 0:02:37.520 less jobs and certain functions. 0:02:38.520 --> 0:02:43.200 When you look at the spend on AI infrastructure, chips open, AI, 0:02:44.280 --> 0:02:47.519 not lost, not making a profit, loss making. Dales have 0:02:47.560 --> 0:02:49.880 about of trillion dollars this year. The hyper scale is 0:02:49.880 --> 0:02:52.160 to spend there. What is your reaction when you see 0:02:52.160 --> 0:02:54.480 those numbers crossing? Are you comfortable with that kind of 0:02:54.480 --> 0:02:56.160 spend on the infrastructure around AI. 0:02:56.400 --> 0:02:56.960 It's a lot. 0:02:57.120 --> 0:02:59.160 I'm not sure it's all ever going to be totally spent. 0:03:00.120 --> 0:03:02.320 When you look at big tech, like tech that happens 0:03:02.360 --> 0:03:04.480 like this and you're go look at cars, you click 0:03:04.480 --> 0:03:08.040 at television, you click at internet. Big money's got spent. 0:03:08.520 --> 0:03:10.760 There were a lot of losers, a lot of winners. 0:03:10.800 --> 0:03:13.360 In total, it was productive. So take even take the 0:03:13.360 --> 0:03:15.640 Internet bubble and remember that blew up and amount of 0:03:15.639 --> 0:03:17.840 p I can united by the name one hundred companies 0:03:17.880 --> 0:03:21.200 that you know were worth fifty billion dollars and disappeared. 0:03:21.440 --> 0:03:25.200 But out of it came Facebook, YouTube, Google, you know. 0:03:25.320 --> 0:03:28.160 So there will be real big companies with real big success. 0:03:28.400 --> 0:03:30.400 It will work inspite of the fact that not everyone 0:03:30.440 --> 0:03:32.119 who invested in it is going to have a great 0:03:32.120 --> 0:03:32.919 investment return. 0:03:33.080 --> 0:03:35.160 And of course those investments are part of what is 0:03:35.200 --> 0:03:37.560 powered this bull market in stocks. And on Sunday it 0:03:37.560 --> 0:03:39.640 will be three years of that ballmark. Where do you 0:03:39.640 --> 0:03:42.200 think we are in that ball market? Is this Is 0:03:42.200 --> 0:03:46.000 there any complacency there? Is it underpinned by rational factors? 0:03:46.120 --> 0:03:47.240 Is there more momentum? 0:03:47.400 --> 0:03:49.400 Yeah? You know, look, we're in a ball market. 0:03:49.600 --> 0:03:51.920 It has been clear as a price or high credits, 0:03:51.960 --> 0:03:55.400 breads a low consumers. Still okay, the consumer has jobs. 0:03:55.600 --> 0:03:58.840 Remember the jobs, jobs jobs. That usually starts to force 0:03:58.880 --> 0:04:00.960 people to cut back and change staying a consumers spend 0:04:01.040 --> 0:04:02.520 lesson companies cut back. 0:04:02.800 --> 0:04:06.080 So far, so good. There are a lot of issues. 0:04:05.720 --> 0:04:07.760 Out there that you know, the economy's got to deal 0:04:07.800 --> 0:04:11.000 with from all this geopolitical stuff, maybe they'll sort well. 0:04:11.160 --> 0:04:11.880 Which could happen. 0:04:11.920 --> 0:04:14.840 Inflation, I'm a little more nervous about inflation not coming 0:04:14.880 --> 0:04:18.080 down like people expect. That might be a surprise. And 0:04:18.080 --> 0:04:20.159 then in the hand there's a lot of spending. There's 0:04:20.160 --> 0:04:22.880 a lot of government spending which is inflationary too, by 0:04:22.920 --> 0:04:23.799 the way. 0:04:23.200 --> 0:04:26.000 And so look, I don't know. I hope for the best, 0:04:26.279 --> 0:04:27.120 plan for the worst. 0:04:27.880 --> 0:04:29.800 And you don't worried about a recession in twenty twenty six 0:04:29.839 --> 0:04:31.000 for the US you might not clear. 0:04:31.120 --> 0:04:33.640 Yes, I think it could happen in twenty twenty six. 0:04:33.720 --> 0:04:35.680 I just I'm not worried about it. As a different statement, 0:04:36.240 --> 0:04:38.719 we'll deal with it, We'll serve our clients will navigate 0:04:38.760 --> 0:04:40.479 through it. A lot of it has been through them before. 0:04:40.680 --> 0:04:43.000 You don't wish it because you know certain people get hurt. 0:04:43.040 --> 0:04:44.440 But it could happen in. 0:04:44.440 --> 0:04:46.119 Twenty twenty what's still a coose in the US government 0:04:46.160 --> 0:04:46.880 shot down, But I. 0:04:46.920 --> 0:04:50.400 Do think they're positives, like deregulations are real positive which 0:04:50.440 --> 0:04:52.919 also helps animal spirits that are positive. And you know 0:04:53.440 --> 0:04:56.000 in the one big beautiful build is also more stimulus 0:04:56.360 --> 0:04:59.799 that has positive for the economy, but maybe negatives for inflation. 0:05:00.040 --> 0:05:01.480 So how it all sorts. 0:05:01.240 --> 0:05:04.919 Out, We'll see markets are looking through the US government shutdown. 0:05:04.960 --> 0:05:07.400 Is there a period of time if this shutdown continues 0:05:07.440 --> 0:05:10.560 where markets start to wake up and become concerned? 0:05:11.279 --> 0:05:14.200 I don't think so. Look, I don't like shutdowns. 0:05:14.360 --> 0:05:16.080 I think it's just a bad idea, and I don't 0:05:16.120 --> 0:05:17.880 care what the Democrats republics say. 0:05:18.040 --> 0:05:19.760 It's a bad idea. It's not a way to run 0:05:19.760 --> 0:05:20.560 a railroad. 0:05:20.760 --> 0:05:22.760 I don't think it's critic We've had I forgot the 0:05:22.800 --> 0:05:24.960 number four or five or six. You know, one of 0:05:24.960 --> 0:05:27.600 them went for thirty five days. I'm not sure anyone 0:05:28.120 --> 0:05:30.719 really affected the economy the market in a real way. 0:05:31.960 --> 0:05:33.680 You mentioned inflation. You said you're a little bit more 0:05:33.680 --> 0:05:36.320 concerned about inflation than maybe some others. Markets pricing in 0:05:36.360 --> 0:05:39.000 about a hundred basis points of cuts between now and 0:05:39.040 --> 0:05:41.719 this time next year from the Fed. Does that therefore 0:05:41.760 --> 0:05:44.799 seem reasonable to you? Or markets are over their skis 0:05:44.800 --> 0:05:45.280 in pricing. 0:05:45.960 --> 0:05:48.720 I think, you know, markets have to make a forecast. 0:05:49.160 --> 0:05:51.679 I want to point out that forecasts have almost always 0:05:51.720 --> 0:05:54.560 been wrong, and the Fed's been wrong too, so it 0:05:54.600 --> 0:05:57.200 doesn't like their forecast is you know, going to be 0:05:57.240 --> 0:06:01.240 accurate if inflation does go up, starts ticking up for 0:06:01.240 --> 0:06:03.360 whatever reason, and it might you know, it's gonna be 0:06:03.400 --> 0:06:04.800 hard to do one hundred points. 0:06:05.000 --> 0:06:06.960 They might do some, you know, and then they. 0:06:06.800 --> 0:06:08.479 Have the battle, you know, the give and take of 0:06:08.800 --> 0:06:11.400 if employer starts going up, we obviously gonna do some. 0:06:11.680 --> 0:06:15.120 So we'll say you've long talked about geopolitics as being 0:06:15.120 --> 0:06:17.320 a risk factor. We're seeing gold at four thousand dollars. 0:06:17.360 --> 0:06:20.479 We're seeing bitcoin at record highs. The dollar, though yet 0:06:20.520 --> 0:06:22.920 to date, down about eight percent on the Bloomberg Dollar Index. 0:06:23.000 --> 0:06:25.799 Are you staying structural shifts out of the US dollar? 0:06:26.120 --> 0:06:27.600 And is that sustained theme. 0:06:28.000 --> 0:06:28.520 A little bit? 0:06:28.600 --> 0:06:31.200 But again I wouldn't have heart burned over it. The 0:06:31.320 --> 0:06:34.279 dollar did well for a long time if you own 0:06:34.480 --> 0:06:37.960 US stocks, So foreigners owned something like thirty five trillion 0:06:38.000 --> 0:06:40.400 dollars of US docks and bonds. And because this dock 0:06:40.480 --> 0:06:42.720 mark's gone up, your allocation the US has gone up. 0:06:42.960 --> 0:06:45.719 I think it's perfectly reasonable for investment committees in Europe 0:06:45.760 --> 0:06:47.560 and around the world to cut back a little bit 0:06:47.600 --> 0:06:50.840 of their equity ownership. We've also seen people changing their 0:06:50.839 --> 0:06:53.599 hedge ratios and stuff like that, so it may just 0:06:53.640 --> 0:06:56.239 be a rational adjustment to you know, I don't expect 0:06:56.279 --> 0:07:00.200 a stronger dollar the tariffs has this effect, but it's 0:07:00.200 --> 0:07:02.359 still if you look at America's still the greatest place. 0:07:02.160 --> 0:07:04.120 In the world to invest in long term and deal 0:07:04.160 --> 0:07:06.880 making seems to be picking up, and of course JP 0:07:06.960 --> 0:07:09.680 Morgan played a significant role in the takeover. The take 0:07:09.760 --> 0:07:13.120 private of EA twenty billion dollars in financing provided by 0:07:13.160 --> 0:07:15.400 JP Morgan. Is that a marker in the sand? 0:07:15.480 --> 0:07:15.680 Is that? 0:07:15.800 --> 0:07:17.840 Is that a one off as a deal of that 0:07:17.880 --> 0:07:20.720 type or is it a sign of a more competition 0:07:20.800 --> 0:07:22.640 between frankly, the banks and private credit. 0:07:22.840 --> 0:07:26.440 Well, we're agnostic about private credits, so there maybe competitions 0:07:26.520 --> 0:07:28.680 or not. We want our customers to do with their interests. 0:07:28.960 --> 0:07:30.800 We work for both, you know, and we did that 0:07:30.840 --> 0:07:33.320 whole deal in eleven days, and we didn't do it 0:07:33.360 --> 0:07:35.760 that way to make a point to private credit, you know, 0:07:35.920 --> 0:07:37.560 Dave said do it differently, and we could have done 0:07:37.560 --> 0:07:39.520 it differently too, and so. But there's a lot of 0:07:39.560 --> 0:07:43.040 merger talk, there's a lot of firepower, there's a lot 0:07:43.040 --> 0:07:44.920 of tech. You know, we had a bunch of IPOs 0:07:44.960 --> 0:07:47.480 in the US. I know they've only been a handful here. 0:07:48.240 --> 0:07:50.640 The tech world is still doing quite well. You know, 0:07:50.640 --> 0:07:52.920 the eight hundred companies here, I think it was four 0:07:52.960 --> 0:07:55.840 hundred last year. You know, we have five hundred bankers 0:07:55.840 --> 0:07:59.560 coming the innovation economy globally around the world, including edit 0:07:59.600 --> 0:08:03.480 like fifty your loan here. So you know, look, I'm 0:08:03.520 --> 0:08:06.320 the long term optimist. I do think acid prices are high, 0:08:06.360 --> 0:08:08.480 credits breds are low, and you know you should take 0:08:08.480 --> 0:08:10.640 that in consideration how you think about the future. 0:08:10.720 --> 0:08:12.640 When you talk about credit and you talk about debt. 0:08:12.680 --> 0:08:14.240 I'm thinking of some dates in fact that JP Morgan 0:08:14.280 --> 0:08:16.680 put out on auto loans biggest losses in the most 0:08:16.680 --> 0:08:19.280 recent months, I think since twenty twenty March of twenty twenty. 0:08:19.400 --> 0:08:21.800 Is that idiosyncratic to auto that means in the US 0:08:21.840 --> 0:08:23.800 or you seeing other weak links being stressed. 0:08:23.840 --> 0:08:25.880 I think you know, there were one or two frauds 0:08:26.000 --> 0:08:29.320 which I won't go through, but in general, consumer credit 0:08:29.760 --> 0:08:32.880 was so good. It's basically most of us just normalizing 0:08:33.440 --> 0:08:36.959 for both credit card but subprime order is a little 0:08:36.960 --> 0:08:39.880 bit worse than normalizing. It doesn't look like it's getting 0:08:39.920 --> 0:08:40.800 worse mirror, but it might. 0:08:40.880 --> 0:08:41.480 But a lot of that. 0:08:41.559 --> 0:08:43.839 If you look at the history of credit for consumers, 0:08:43.840 --> 0:08:47.960 it's employment is when employment or home prices go way down, 0:08:48.000 --> 0:08:50.520 which you know we don't maybe not expect that, that 0:08:50.720 --> 0:08:52.120 drives you know, credit. 0:08:53.000 --> 0:08:56.200 The administration is talking about possibly challenging the requirement around 0:08:56.320 --> 0:08:59.800 quarterly earnings, and you've talked about this, You've written about 0:08:59.800 --> 0:09:02.720 this bor and Buffett around the guidance part of earnings 0:09:02.720 --> 0:09:05.120 and quarterly guidance. Would you welcome a change like that 0:09:05.120 --> 0:09:07.040 and would it mean a change to JP Morgan in 0:09:07.120 --> 0:09:08.200 terms of how often. 0:09:08.040 --> 0:09:09.760 You Yeah, I would welcome in. 0:09:09.840 --> 0:09:12.720 We still play update investors quarterly with much less stuff, 0:09:12.760 --> 0:09:16.080 and we just very transparent. I think the bigger problem 0:09:16.160 --> 0:09:19.360 was just reporting quarterly. It was forecasting, where you know, 0:09:19.440 --> 0:09:21.280 CEOs get their backup against the wall. They have to 0:09:21.320 --> 0:09:23.959 meet these things earnings and they start doing dumb stuff 0:09:24.000 --> 0:09:26.559 to meet earnings, and that kind of public pressure. I 0:09:26.640 --> 0:09:29.360 think it's a smaller part of a much bigger problem. 0:09:29.640 --> 0:09:32.520 We've gone from eight thousand public companies in nineteen ninety 0:09:32.559 --> 0:09:36.720 six to like four thousand today, and you know that 0:09:36.840 --> 0:09:39.240 I'm not actually as good. We drive companies out of it. 0:09:39.280 --> 0:09:42.839 We have cookie cutter governance. There are some activists are good, 0:09:42.840 --> 0:09:46.720 but they're activists. There's litigation, there's cookie cutter compensation, there's 0:09:46.840 --> 0:09:50.320 very expensive listing. There's disclosure rules, which you've heard about 0:09:50.360 --> 0:09:53.080 them here, I mean endless rules, and that it makes 0:09:53.120 --> 0:09:53.640 it hard. 0:09:53.480 --> 0:09:54.680 For a small cut to go public. 0:09:55.000 --> 0:09:57.080 So I think, and they're trying to do that here, 0:09:57.280 --> 0:10:00.679 have an active small company going public. You all need 0:10:01.000 --> 0:10:03.640 and create an equity culture, which Rachel Reason is trying 0:10:03.640 --> 0:10:05.280 to do here. And I think they're doing a good 0:10:05.320 --> 0:10:08.360 job reducing regulations, you know, trying to make it easier 0:10:08.360 --> 0:10:10.680 to do business and you know, reducing regular banks, but 0:10:10.720 --> 0:10:13.920 also in business in general, you want an active market 0:10:14.200 --> 0:10:17.360 and we've kind of crushed it and could the research 0:10:17.480 --> 0:10:20.760 laws and miffit and disclosure requires it. So if I 0:10:20.840 --> 0:10:23.560 was a regulator, I would take a step back and 0:10:23.600 --> 0:10:25.840 look at the whole system and say, how can we 0:10:25.880 --> 0:10:28.320 improve it and make it safer, you know not and 0:10:28.400 --> 0:10:30.840 look at it holistically as opposed to know just everything's 0:10:30.960 --> 0:10:32.480 like a one off conversation. 0:10:33.080 --> 0:10:35.040 I need to talk to you about some other changes 0:10:35.080 --> 0:10:37.440 that the Trump administrations take. You are a champion of 0:10:37.440 --> 0:10:40.360 capitalism and free market capitalism. So when you see states 0:10:40.360 --> 0:10:42.520 taken by the administration or the US government's put it 0:10:42.559 --> 0:10:45.120 that way in terms of intel golden share for US 0:10:45.160 --> 0:10:49.439 steel investments in the lithium mind producer, how does that 0:10:49.720 --> 0:10:50.240 sit with you? 0:10:50.960 --> 0:10:55.000 So the first thing is there are legitimate complaints around trade. 0:10:55.120 --> 0:10:57.920 So just take that first somewhere around just unfair trade. 0:10:57.960 --> 0:11:01.839 It's unfair to use, you know, not just tariffs. It's surpluses, 0:11:01.840 --> 0:11:04.800 it's capital, it's quotas, it's just you know, it's the 0:11:04.920 --> 0:11:08.040 non tariff parers. And then there's national security related so 0:11:08.080 --> 0:11:10.480 I think a national security you have to take some 0:11:10.520 --> 0:11:12.120 special thing I called industrial policy. 0:11:12.280 --> 0:11:13.319 But it's not to be done right. 0:11:13.559 --> 0:11:17.960 It's got to come with permitting no virtual signaling. And 0:11:18.080 --> 0:11:19.920 so like the deal it was done for MP, I 0:11:19.920 --> 0:11:22.679 thought they did a very smart thing. They're giving MP 0:11:22.880 --> 0:11:24.959 which we were part of banking. You know, it does 0:11:25.080 --> 0:11:27.400 rare Earth's magnets a chip because they're gonna have a 0:11:27.400 --> 0:11:29.360 long term contract with the government. It gives them a 0:11:29.440 --> 0:11:31.880 chance to survive, to get through it. They call the 0:11:31.960 --> 0:11:34.480 Value of Death, and they bought a piece to go 0:11:34.559 --> 0:11:36.400 into it. So I thought that was really well done. 0:11:36.520 --> 0:11:38.440 I'm not going to comment all of them. I think 0:11:38.440 --> 0:11:40.199 it'd be very careful when you get involved in that 0:11:40.320 --> 0:11:40.800 kind of stuff. 0:11:40.800 --> 0:11:42.840 Why are you doing it? What's the long term benefit? 0:11:43.240 --> 0:11:43.400 You know? 0:11:43.480 --> 0:11:45.600 And then of course you know if Democrats get in powered, 0:11:45.600 --> 0:11:47.680 they're gonna do even more of it, So I would 0:11:47.720 --> 0:11:50.520 be very cautious about how you go about that. I 0:11:50.559 --> 0:11:53.360 do think they need to do more. You cannot do 0:11:53.440 --> 0:11:55.760 certain things in the United States. You think a company's 0:11:55.800 --> 0:11:58.280 gonna do it, they'll be They'll be bankrupt in seven months. 0:11:58.720 --> 0:12:02.760 They either need freelam and cheaper financing. And maybe the 0:12:02.760 --> 0:12:06.599 most important is long term purchase agreements with defense or 0:12:06.760 --> 0:12:08.520 company to something that gives me a real chance to. 0:12:08.520 --> 0:12:09.200 Build a business. 0:12:09.920 --> 0:12:11.440 You touch on the fact that we're here in the UK, 0:12:11.520 --> 0:12:13.640 the chance a little here. She addressed the summit, she 0:12:13.760 --> 0:12:16.560 dress the conference, she's making those changes. Is the UK 0:12:16.559 --> 0:12:18.360 doing enough? They're going to be potentially some changes when 0:12:18.400 --> 0:12:20.319 it comes to listings. They may be announced in the 0:12:20.360 --> 0:12:23.920 budget in November. Is enough being done to make the 0:12:24.000 --> 0:12:26.840 UK to make London an attractive listing destination again. 0:12:26.920 --> 0:12:28.360 Well, at first of all, it's come here. It's a 0:12:28.400 --> 0:12:32.400 wonderful city. It's a melting pot. The brain power is extraordinary, 0:12:32.440 --> 0:12:36.560 and I'm talking about not just financial but lawyers and technology, media. 0:12:36.920 --> 0:12:40.840 It's it's unbelievable. It's a huge benefit to your to UK, 0:12:40.920 --> 0:12:43.120 though I'm not sure the rest of the UK appreciates 0:12:43.160 --> 0:12:46.560 that much. And they are there's saying the right things. 0:12:46.640 --> 0:12:49.839 They're deregging. It's not just banks but business in general, 0:12:49.920 --> 0:12:52.880 reducing red tape. I call it blue tape. Now you 0:12:52.920 --> 0:12:54.760 know they're reducing red tape, blue tape. 0:12:54.760 --> 0:12:55.840 They're you know, they're. 0:12:55.640 --> 0:12:59.280 Trying to create a consolidate the pension and save these schemes. 0:12:59.280 --> 0:13:01.240 So I think it's very smart have a little more 0:13:01.280 --> 0:13:03.960 of an equity risk culture, you know, not to lose money, 0:13:03.960 --> 0:13:05.840 but to take a little more risk. And maybe some 0:13:05.880 --> 0:13:08.800 of these tech companies here. Yeah, I apployed everything they're doing. 0:13:09.080 --> 0:13:11.280 I know the you know, the public here doesn't applaud 0:13:11.280 --> 0:13:13.840 as much as I do. But they have to keep going. 0:13:14.960 --> 0:13:17.440 H one B visas in the US talking about attracting 0:13:17.480 --> 0:13:21.400 talent one hundred thousand dollars, is that a barrier to 0:13:21.720 --> 0:13:22.640 the US tech sector. 0:13:22.679 --> 0:13:26.760 You concerned about it, I'm not. Again. I've got Harpero. 0:13:26.920 --> 0:13:29.840 It's six hundred thousand employees. That's it. 0:13:29.880 --> 0:13:32.520 We have one hundred and sixty million people working. And 0:13:32.720 --> 0:13:34.800 I do think you know, these things happened. I didn't 0:13:34.840 --> 0:13:36.800 like when I first. I still don't particularly like it, 0:13:36.840 --> 0:13:39.640 but but you know what it was being abused. We 0:13:39.960 --> 0:13:41.920 did the analysis and the work. It was not supposed 0:13:41.960 --> 0:13:43.920 to be to bring cheaper workers here to make more 0:13:43.920 --> 0:13:46.480 money for your company. It was meant to bring very 0:13:46.559 --> 0:13:49.319 talented people and you don't necessarily have to for your company, 0:13:49.520 --> 0:13:51.520 and we do. We may have made some mistakes, but 0:13:51.800 --> 0:13:54.800 let's just fix the system. I was with the President 0:13:54.800 --> 0:13:57.240 once and he said, more merit based, more merit based. 0:13:57.400 --> 0:13:59.560 In fact, I heard him say it was just stamp 0:13:59.559 --> 0:14:03.080 of green card and every person in this country who 0:14:03.120 --> 0:14:06.280 went to university or advanced degrees and have him stay 0:14:06.280 --> 0:14:08.760 here and build their career here. That would be my belief. 0:14:09.160 --> 0:14:11.400 I want him to go back to that, not make 0:14:11.440 --> 0:14:13.160 it hard to be or make it easier for real 0:14:13.200 --> 0:14:13.800 merit based it. 0:14:14.640 --> 0:14:17.120 You speak to the President every week, No, okay, I've 0:14:17.160 --> 0:14:20.040 spoken him a couple of times. Jamie Donald, chairman CEO 0:14:20.160 --> 0:14:22.600 JP Morltman, thank you very much and dank I appreciate it.