WEBVTT - Black Republicans feat. Garrison Hayes

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<v Speaker 1>The media.

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<v Speaker 2>There's been a thing that has like boggled my mind

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<v Speaker 2>for a long time, and I've been trying to figure

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<v Speaker 2>out how to approach this conversation.

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<v Speaker 3>And it's.

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<v Speaker 2>Black people voting for trump hood politics. Y'all, Okay, listen,

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<v Speaker 2>But first, it's like this.

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<v Speaker 3>Bull look.

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<v Speaker 1>It is like this.

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<v Speaker 3>Bull look is like this so look, it's like this.

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<v Speaker 2>Uh, like I wouldn't saw Conclave. It's actually it's clearly

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<v Speaker 2>a great movie. It's not what I thought it was

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<v Speaker 2>gonna be. Like I thought it was gonna be some

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<v Speaker 2>sort of souper defense of the Catholic Church and all

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<v Speaker 2>of it's inglorious glory and no, it was raw and gritty,

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<v Speaker 2>had a great turn at the end. It's pretty dope anyway. Uh,

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<v Speaker 2>starting with the fun stuff is TikTok, because I just

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<v Speaker 2>think this is hilarious. They had all kinds of a

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<v Speaker 2>emails and personal or intered company interactions turned into the courts,

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<v Speaker 2>but it was redacted, right, So a lot of the

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<v Speaker 2>things that are really damning about who they are was

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<v Speaker 2>supposed to be redacted. So your normal run of the

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<v Speaker 2>mill reporter who was just essentially looking at the redacted

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<v Speaker 2>document and then copy and pasting into their notes so

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<v Speaker 2>that they can, you know, do the reporting normal acceptable stuff.

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<v Speaker 3>The problem was.

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<v Speaker 2>The Redaction didn't keep redacting when it got copied over,

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<v Speaker 2>so it was all all the blacked out stuff was

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<v Speaker 2>not blacked out no more, and they could read all

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<v Speaker 2>the stuff that they ain't want nobody to know, and

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<v Speaker 2>which was we're absolutely trying to get y'all kids addicted.

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<v Speaker 2>We are doing things purposefully to get teenagers addicted. And

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<v Speaker 2>these little like time warnings about how long you've been

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<v Speaker 2>on the app is just cosmetic. This stuff don't work.

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<v Speaker 2>We're doing this because we're trying to give y'all kids crack.

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<v Speaker 2>And here's what's crazy. It's not like every other social

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<v Speaker 2>media ain't doing this. They just doing it better. They

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<v Speaker 2>just took it and made it Asian. They're just like,

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<v Speaker 2>we're just gonna do it better than y'all.

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<v Speaker 3>Oh boy.

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<v Speaker 2>They was like, y'all wasn't supposed to see that. They

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<v Speaker 2>was like, well, we wasn't trying to see it.

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<v Speaker 4>It just showed.

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<v Speaker 2>But since we looking at it, you are absolutely guilty

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<v Speaker 2>as charged. It is so funny to me that the

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<v Speaker 2>Redaction didn't keep redacting snitched on themselves.

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<v Speaker 3>Another News.

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<v Speaker 2>Final stretch of this wonderfully well balanced and not absolutely

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<v Speaker 2>psychotic presidential cycle final stretch, And one thing that does

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<v Speaker 2>bother me is Kamala trying to convince them that she

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<v Speaker 2>a safe negro. I'm like, stop trying to be safe.

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<v Speaker 2>But then again, I get it, because how you're gonna

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<v Speaker 2>get the job if you ain't a safe negro. That's

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<v Speaker 2>one of the Cash twenty two is about being black

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<v Speaker 2>in this country. You gotta show these people you safe.

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<v Speaker 2>But you know, we be trying to stay dangerous over here.

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<v Speaker 2>But that's because we're not running for office. If I

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<v Speaker 2>was running for office, I'd have to be sick. So

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<v Speaker 2>and what I mean by that is telling potential Republican

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<v Speaker 2>voters that you can possibly swipe off who just find

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<v Speaker 2>Trump untenable, that hey, look, look no, I'm one of

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<v Speaker 2>the good ones, you know, And I mean.

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<v Speaker 4>Listen, understandable. The calculation is.

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<v Speaker 2>The rest of us can't stand Trump so bad that

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<v Speaker 2>the idea of not voting and the idea of voting

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<v Speaker 2>for him is just impossible, you know. But they forgetting

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<v Speaker 2>about the people that's just gonna sit out. So anyway,

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<v Speaker 2>what do I know, I don't really run a campaign

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<v Speaker 2>never had. The Trump strategy is we gonna kill him.

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<v Speaker 2>There's thirteen thousand murderers living freely in America.

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<v Speaker 3>We gotta get get him out.

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<v Speaker 2>If the election doesn't go the way I think it is,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm sending the National Guard, the military because we have

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<v Speaker 2>enemies within, and we're gonna send the mill.

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<v Speaker 4>He like we gonna kill.

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<v Speaker 2>Him, I'll bring in the militariat if y'all don't do

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<v Speaker 2>what I.

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<v Speaker 4>Think y'all supposed to do. My man is just he

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<v Speaker 4>just y'all, that man is unhinged.

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<v Speaker 2>I just don't I don't see what you see in him,

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<v Speaker 2>which is gonna be a part of the rest of

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<v Speaker 2>us episode. Finally, blood on the streets and brains on

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<v Speaker 2>the sidewalk and body parts are Toddlers are just raining

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<v Speaker 2>from the ground as we speak. In northern Gaza. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>another school in a hospital exploded and somehow, I don't know.

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<v Speaker 2>I want to believe it's AI generated. I want to

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<v Speaker 2>believe it's so bad. But you see the hand of

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<v Speaker 2>a man who still has the IVY in his arm

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<v Speaker 2>being engulfed in flames as this hospital gets bombed by

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<v Speaker 2>the Israeli military. And here's what's crazy. Is that program

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<v Speaker 2>is the side quest. Now the main quest is Lebanon. Now,

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<v Speaker 2>Israel had just taken a bomb on one of their

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<v Speaker 2>military bases. Hear me, Lebanon struck one of the military bases,

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<v Speaker 2>and in return, America has sent a hundred troops to

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<v Speaker 2>Israel and has also added more of the sort of

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<v Speaker 2>iron dome thing the anti missile joints that they have

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<v Speaker 2>to help aid in the retaliation for the retaliation. All

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<v Speaker 2>the while, the UN peacekeepers are like, guys, help us,

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<v Speaker 2>help you.

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<v Speaker 3>Like it?

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<v Speaker 4>You? You keep trying to say, this isn't a genocide.

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<v Speaker 4>It'saying an ethnic cleansing, except it kind of is it

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<v Speaker 4>kind of high key is guys?

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<v Speaker 3>You I.

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<v Speaker 4>I don't know how else to say this.

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<v Speaker 3>He's what the.

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<v Speaker 2>UN is saying right now. Anyway, let's listen to Garrison

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<v Speaker 2>like this, all.

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<v Speaker 3>Right, we're back.

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<v Speaker 2>It's not hard to note that, like, obviously black people

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<v Speaker 2>can be conservative, and there's a lot of them, a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of us as church folk, and some would argue that,

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<v Speaker 2>like when you look back at even just the attitude

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<v Speaker 2>of my father's generation and black panthers in them, their

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<v Speaker 2>attitude was like the generation before them civil rights movement people.

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<v Speaker 2>They was like, change the system, make the system equitable,

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<v Speaker 2>and thank God for them my daddy and them was like,

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<v Speaker 2>this system will never be for us.

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<v Speaker 4>It will never ever ever work in our favor.

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<v Speaker 2>And if that's your attitude, then you need to take

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<v Speaker 2>care of yourself. So a lot of the things about

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<v Speaker 2>you know, the black nationalists that I grew up under,

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<v Speaker 2>in a lot of ways dovetails to a lot of

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<v Speaker 2>those conservative views. Thee I don't want none of you.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't want the government's money because the government don't

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<v Speaker 2>love me. Government will never take care of me. They

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<v Speaker 2>will never have my best interest in mind. So we

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<v Speaker 2>need to make our own money. We need to build

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<v Speaker 2>our own schools, we need to build our own communities,

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<v Speaker 2>we need to do.

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<v Speaker 4>All those things.

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<v Speaker 2>So and again, church folk a lot of times be

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<v Speaker 2>hella anti gay, church folk be hella anti abortion to

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<v Speaker 2>a dovetail. So I understand the concept of a black conservative.

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<v Speaker 2>And what we find is a lot of them who

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<v Speaker 2>are conservative have rejected the Republican Party because they're like, well,

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<v Speaker 2>you're anti black, but still feel like they got to

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<v Speaker 2>play ball because that's the only way to get their

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<v Speaker 2>things done. We got the hommie Garrison Hayes, who turns

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<v Speaker 2>out like we kind of moved to a lot of

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<v Speaker 2>the same circles.

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<v Speaker 4>It just got a dope.

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<v Speaker 2>He did this video when he went to the RNC

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<v Speaker 2>and he reported on black Republicans and supporters of Trump,

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<v Speaker 2>and it was a no brainer. We had to bring

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<v Speaker 2>him down to other politics. So here it is me

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<v Speaker 2>and Garrison talking about.

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<v Speaker 4>Caw niggas really love Trump.

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<v Speaker 5>Here we go.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, so we'll just jump in.

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<v Speaker 2>First of all, Garrison, thank you so much for pulling

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<v Speaker 2>up on us prop.

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<v Speaker 3>It's a real honor, man. I appreciate you.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, this like we've been, you know, as the show

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<v Speaker 2>has kind of grown, you know, I think about like.

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<v Speaker 4>The like, all right, could we really pull this off?

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<v Speaker 4>Like there's the kid, we really pull this off?

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<v Speaker 2>Like episodes and then how's the like how do I

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<v Speaker 2>handle this topic in the most respectful way possible? Like

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<v Speaker 2>that's what we was kind of thinking about, because like,

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<v Speaker 2>and first I want to commend you on that.

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<v Speaker 4>Like, first of all, everybody, you've probably heard all.

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<v Speaker 2>The intros that we've done already, but I want to

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<v Speaker 2>say first, after watching the piece you did with with

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<v Speaker 2>Mother Jones, I like work in the you know, peacemaking

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<v Speaker 2>kind of world on the humanitarian side. But before that,

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<v Speaker 2>it was like, you know, gang intervention, and like what

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<v Speaker 2>you have to do in those situations is like I can't.

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<v Speaker 2>You can't mock the people you're trying to bring to

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<v Speaker 2>the table, you know what I'm saying, Like, I can't.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, you can't talk down to them, You can't,

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<v Speaker 2>can't eye roll. You can't do that, even when stuff

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<v Speaker 2>that's coming out of their mouth is preposterous, you know.

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<v Speaker 4>Like, but I can't. I have to keep you at

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<v Speaker 4>the table.

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<v Speaker 2>And and while at the same time I suffer no foolishness,

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<v Speaker 2>you know. Like, So I first I want to commend

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<v Speaker 2>you on the way you carried yourself. I don't know

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<v Speaker 2>if that was magical editing or if you just that

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<v Speaker 2>much of a g Either way, I need to commend

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<v Speaker 2>you on how you handle yourself.

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<v Speaker 3>No, I appreciate it. I appreciate it.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm I. I've been in conversation. So people may not

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<v Speaker 1>know this. I was a pastor for a number of years,

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<v Speaker 1>for about five years, and so between being a pastor

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<v Speaker 1>and a chaplain, and so I've talked to people in

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<v Speaker 1>some really intense moments where maybe I've preached about let's say,

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<v Speaker 1>justice from the pull from the you know, from the

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<v Speaker 1>pull picsion, and afterwards someone comes up to me and

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<v Speaker 1>they are upset because I said something or I didn't

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<v Speaker 1>say something, or whatever the case.

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<v Speaker 3>You. Yeah, and so.

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<v Speaker 1>You kind of learn one thing is I don't really

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<v Speaker 1>have the ability to stop my face from making certain expressions,

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<v Speaker 1>but you try to learn to be a little bit

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<v Speaker 1>more winsome and like give people space to say what

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<v Speaker 1>they want to say and ask clarifying questions where necessary.

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<v Speaker 3>And so some of that is definitely coming out in

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<v Speaker 3>that video.

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<v Speaker 4>From the pastoral side of it.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, yeah, yea, and nah, I.

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<v Speaker 2>Respect that because I think too, Like you know, I

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<v Speaker 2>spent spent a good amount of time in like Christian

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<v Speaker 2>spaces and evangelical spaces, and once you start talking, like

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<v Speaker 2>really start talking to talk, you know what I'm saying

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<v Speaker 2>like that, you do have those moments where it's like, I,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm not going to get into a particular like I'm

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<v Speaker 2>not gonna get into like a theological.

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<v Speaker 3>Debate with you.

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<v Speaker 2>You know what I'm saying over some something that is

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<v Speaker 2>quite clearly biblical.

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<v Speaker 3>You know what I'm saying.

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<v Speaker 2>So I'm not gonna you know what I mean, Like,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, I'm not like your your your issue is cultural.

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<v Speaker 2>It would take too it would take too long to

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<v Speaker 2>unpack this, you know, or like you said, like sometimes

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<v Speaker 2>it's like I'm I sometimes feel like especially because I

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<v Speaker 2>came from like a music and sort of entertaining side,

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<v Speaker 2>where it would be like you have a you have

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<v Speaker 2>a discipleship problem, you have an this is a this

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<v Speaker 2>is you have a local you have a home church problem.

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<v Speaker 2>Like I can't I can't help you with this, you

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<v Speaker 2>know what I mean. So yeah, so that's dope. It definitely,

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<v Speaker 2>it definitely shines through.

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<v Speaker 4>So I appreciate it. I appreciate that.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yes, So it's it's a different it's a it's

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<v Speaker 2>a real different like intersection for I think.

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<v Speaker 4>For specifically, like.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, it's my show, I could keep it a buck,

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<v Speaker 2>so specifically for like white evangelicals to understand the cross

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<v Speaker 2>section of like justice and progressivism that most of us

0:14:30.680 --> 0:14:35.320
<v Speaker 2>of color are like, I don't I don't see the problem.

0:14:36.000 --> 0:14:37.680
<v Speaker 2>I don't see what you don't see. I don't see

0:14:37.720 --> 0:14:39.000
<v Speaker 2>the discountcy So.

0:14:38.680 --> 0:14:40.640
<v Speaker 1>Anyway, yeah, I kind of want to talk to that

0:14:40.680 --> 0:14:42.400
<v Speaker 1>for a little bit because I do think that there

0:14:42.480 --> 0:14:45.040
<v Speaker 1>is something really interesting happening that I don't think we're

0:14:45.160 --> 0:14:51.000
<v Speaker 1>appropriately naming. It's this idea that being for racial justice,

0:14:51.040 --> 0:14:54.280
<v Speaker 1>like acknowledging that ever since the beginning of this country,

0:14:54.760 --> 0:14:57.360
<v Speaker 1>certain groups have been put down while certain groups have

0:14:57.440 --> 0:15:02.120
<v Speaker 1>been actively elevated, and and that often goes along the

0:15:02.160 --> 0:15:07.120
<v Speaker 1>lines of gender, sexuality, and race, and so like acknowledging

0:15:07.120 --> 0:15:09.800
<v Speaker 1>that is just kind of a fact of life in America,

0:15:09.960 --> 0:15:12.680
<v Speaker 1>fact of life perhaps in the world. Okay, fine, we

0:15:12.680 --> 0:15:14.720
<v Speaker 1>can kind of get on board with that. Now, the

0:15:14.800 --> 0:15:17.760
<v Speaker 1>second step is to say something must be done about this, right,

0:15:17.840 --> 0:15:19.720
<v Speaker 1>Like we have to kind of like fix some of

0:15:19.760 --> 0:15:23.440
<v Speaker 1>these things to make America the greatest place that it

0:15:23.640 --> 0:15:28.920
<v Speaker 1>can be. Now, yes, this is in many ways considered

0:15:29.440 --> 0:15:32.560
<v Speaker 1>being like progressive, like we want to move things forward.

0:15:32.640 --> 0:15:37.360
<v Speaker 1>But I challenge the assumption that pushing for racial justice

0:15:37.640 --> 0:15:41.960
<v Speaker 1>is like a progressive thing, right, Yeah, like believing that

0:15:42.080 --> 0:15:46.280
<v Speaker 1>black people should have the same kind of opportunities and access,

0:15:46.520 --> 0:15:49.960
<v Speaker 1>you know, like it shouldn't be segregated, it shouldn't be racialized,

0:15:50.000 --> 0:15:53.920
<v Speaker 1>Like communities that are poor should have opportunity to no

0:15:54.000 --> 0:15:56.640
<v Speaker 1>longer be poor, and the people who live there shouldn't

0:15:56.640 --> 0:15:59.640
<v Speaker 1>be blamed for the structures that keep them there, Like,

0:15:59.720 --> 0:16:02.600
<v Speaker 1>these are not actually like progressive ideals, right.

0:16:02.480 --> 0:16:03.880
<v Speaker 4>It's incredibly bare minimum.

0:16:04.040 --> 0:16:07.120
<v Speaker 3>It is quite literally the bare minimum.

0:16:07.520 --> 0:16:10.600
<v Speaker 2>And what I appreciate that man, because I've said often

0:16:10.600 --> 0:16:12.680
<v Speaker 2>in the show, like I'm like, I mean, we're not

0:16:13.440 --> 0:16:15.920
<v Speaker 2>We're not Karl Marx over here by saying I'm saying

0:16:16.000 --> 0:16:19.480
<v Speaker 2>like it's not this isn't like a proletariat revolution. I'm

0:16:19.520 --> 0:16:23.960
<v Speaker 2>just saying, you know, this shouldn't cost that much. Yeah,

0:16:24.000 --> 0:16:26.720
<v Speaker 2>that's right, And there is laws that made this possible

0:16:27.920 --> 0:16:30.200
<v Speaker 2>that maybe we shouldn't have him laws.

0:16:30.400 --> 0:16:32.560
<v Speaker 3>Right, exactly exactly.

0:16:32.760 --> 0:16:35.080
<v Speaker 1>And I think what I'm trying to kind of get

0:16:35.080 --> 0:16:40.520
<v Speaker 1>to is that I am seeing a kind of like

0:16:40.840 --> 0:16:46.640
<v Speaker 1>person rise up, specifically in the black community, who is like, hey,

0:16:47.040 --> 0:16:51.920
<v Speaker 1>I actually hold conservative ideals. I heard hold conservative values,

0:16:51.960 --> 0:16:56.080
<v Speaker 1>perhaps around abortion, or perhaps around game marriage or whatever

0:16:56.120 --> 0:16:58.280
<v Speaker 1>the case may be. Like that is a common thing.

0:16:58.320 --> 0:17:00.640
<v Speaker 1>You black, I'm black. We've grown up in black communities

0:17:00.640 --> 0:17:03.560
<v Speaker 1>where we pretty normal. Yeah, it's like not abnormal for

0:17:03.640 --> 0:17:07.520
<v Speaker 1>black people to be relatively conservative. The problem is that

0:17:07.840 --> 0:17:12.560
<v Speaker 1>American conservatives, the Republican Party specifically, has made racial progress

0:17:13.240 --> 0:17:18.080
<v Speaker 1>an issue upon which they stand against Now. Now, this

0:17:18.160 --> 0:17:20.320
<v Speaker 1>is just like, on a baseline level, if I were

0:17:20.359 --> 0:17:22.560
<v Speaker 1>to give a critique of the Republican Party, it's that

0:17:22.640 --> 0:17:26.760
<v Speaker 1>you are missing out on an incredibly diverse number of

0:17:26.920 --> 0:17:31.679
<v Speaker 1>potential voters. If you're so stupid on race, I'm sorry,

0:17:31.720 --> 0:17:33.600
<v Speaker 1>I just have to say the thing, right, Like, can

0:17:33.640 --> 0:17:34.119
<v Speaker 1>I just be you?

0:17:34.320 --> 0:17:34.480
<v Speaker 5>Right?

0:17:34.720 --> 0:17:38.000
<v Speaker 2>No, bro, you spending, you spending homie, Like I can't

0:17:38.000 --> 0:17:39.920
<v Speaker 2>even get to my points of adventures because like you

0:17:40.040 --> 0:17:45.040
<v Speaker 2>already spitting I Like, for example, on the episode coming

0:17:45.080 --> 0:17:47.360
<v Speaker 2>out this week, on the episode coming out this week,

0:17:47.400 --> 0:17:47.920
<v Speaker 2>it was like.

0:17:49.359 --> 0:17:49.920
<v Speaker 3>What we made.

0:17:49.960 --> 0:17:54.080
<v Speaker 2>I made the point to where I feel like I

0:17:54.200 --> 0:17:58.120
<v Speaker 2>have to do the Republicans homework for them in that

0:17:58.920 --> 0:18:04.960
<v Speaker 2>if if you weren't so racist, like like, rather than

0:18:05.520 --> 0:18:08.520
<v Speaker 2>demonizing Springfield, Ohio.

0:18:08.800 --> 0:18:12.920
<v Speaker 4>This could be your city on a hill.

0:18:13.119 --> 0:18:15.240
<v Speaker 2>This could be your shining light city on a hill.

0:18:15.440 --> 0:18:17.440
<v Speaker 2>Like let me It's like again, let me do your

0:18:17.440 --> 0:18:23.359
<v Speaker 2>homework for you. You could say, hey, liberal legislature and democratic

0:18:23.440 --> 0:18:25.879
<v Speaker 2>laws pushed industry.

0:18:25.400 --> 0:18:28.040
<v Speaker 4>Away, right, so the city was dying.

0:18:28.400 --> 0:18:31.280
<v Speaker 2>And then when the Republicans came in office, we brought

0:18:31.400 --> 0:18:33.639
<v Speaker 2>jobs back, so many jobs that there was such a

0:18:33.680 --> 0:18:36.400
<v Speaker 2>surplus and we got to fulfill the American dream by

0:18:36.400 --> 0:18:40.160
<v Speaker 2>bringing in legal immigration who also were willing to work.

0:18:40.200 --> 0:18:40.840
<v Speaker 3>And now this.

0:18:40.760 --> 0:18:43.360
<v Speaker 2>Community is going together. You could even argue your community

0:18:43.400 --> 0:18:45.679
<v Speaker 2>is post racial. You could say that because you have

0:18:45.760 --> 0:18:47.760
<v Speaker 2>all these Haitian people working next to these white people

0:18:47.760 --> 0:18:50.800
<v Speaker 2>would not And there's eight thousand new jobs and families

0:18:50.840 --> 0:18:54.359
<v Speaker 2>are learning French and businesses are opening and rest I'm like, bro,

0:18:54.600 --> 0:18:54.960
<v Speaker 2>but like.

0:18:55.000 --> 0:18:57.160
<v Speaker 4>I don't understand why you could have said that.

0:18:57.800 --> 0:19:01.320
<v Speaker 2>But but instead niggas is eating cats, you know, Like

0:19:02.320 --> 0:19:05.920
<v Speaker 2>you know, I'm like I if you were so, this

0:19:06.000 --> 0:19:08.600
<v Speaker 2>could be your win. You could have said, listen, if

0:19:08.600 --> 0:19:10.760
<v Speaker 2>you just let us cook, you know what I'm saying.

0:19:10.800 --> 0:19:12.040
<v Speaker 2>If that's you could have said, if you just let

0:19:12.040 --> 0:19:14.560
<v Speaker 2>the Republicans cook, we can make all cities like this.

0:19:14.720 --> 0:19:17.560
<v Speaker 2>Eight thousand jobs, families are learning French, you're all learning

0:19:17.560 --> 0:19:19.160
<v Speaker 2>how to there's restaurants.

0:19:19.160 --> 0:19:19.920
<v Speaker 3>It's great.

0:19:20.040 --> 0:19:21.520
<v Speaker 4>We brought the city back to life.

0:19:21.640 --> 0:19:21.880
<v Speaker 3>Yep.

0:19:21.960 --> 0:19:25.320
<v Speaker 1>But no, I think that's why I think you're exactly right.

0:19:25.320 --> 0:19:28.520
<v Speaker 1>It's why former R and C chairman Michael Steele doesn't

0:19:28.560 --> 0:19:31.400
<v Speaker 1>feel like he has a home in the Republican Party today. Right,

0:19:31.480 --> 0:19:36.879
<v Speaker 1>this is an American conservative who just sees the leaning

0:19:36.920 --> 0:19:39.840
<v Speaker 1>in the doubling down on a kind of bigotry that

0:19:39.920 --> 0:19:44.199
<v Speaker 1>is actually inexcusable, and it you know, beyond the politics

0:19:44.240 --> 0:19:46.240
<v Speaker 1>of it being inexcusable and that it is a poor

0:19:46.280 --> 0:19:50.159
<v Speaker 1>electoral strategy, it is inexcusable on a moral level as well.

0:19:50.240 --> 0:19:50.920
<v Speaker 3>The lives of.

0:19:50.920 --> 0:19:54.640
<v Speaker 1>The Haitian immigrants, the legal Haitian immigrants who live in Springfield, Ohio,

0:19:55.000 --> 0:20:00.159
<v Speaker 1>their lives are measurably worse because the party, because one

0:20:00.200 --> 0:20:02.919
<v Speaker 1>of the two major parties, has decided to make them

0:20:03.359 --> 0:20:06.280
<v Speaker 1>a target of a very specific kind of narrative, a

0:20:06.400 --> 0:20:09.160
<v Speaker 1>very specific kind of campaign. In many ways, what I'd

0:20:09.280 --> 0:20:12.760
<v Speaker 1>argue is that they don't even really care about the

0:20:12.800 --> 0:20:14.879
<v Speaker 1>Haitians per se, right, Like this.

0:20:14.760 --> 0:20:15.640
<v Speaker 3>Isn't at all.

0:20:16.000 --> 0:20:19.879
<v Speaker 1>They are a tool that they're using that they're so disposable,

0:20:19.920 --> 0:20:24.280
<v Speaker 1>These Haitian legal Haitian immigrants are so disposable, and I'd argue,

0:20:24.359 --> 0:20:26.160
<v Speaker 1>in large part because of the color of their skin

0:20:26.200 --> 0:20:29.280
<v Speaker 1>and the origin of their birth, they are so disposable

0:20:29.320 --> 0:20:32.080
<v Speaker 1>that they're willing to just kind of use them, leverage

0:20:32.160 --> 0:20:36.000
<v Speaker 1>them to distract from the abysmal debate performance that Donald

0:20:36.000 --> 0:20:38.679
<v Speaker 1>Trump had a couple of weeks ago. The kind of

0:20:38.920 --> 0:20:41.879
<v Speaker 1>tanking polling numbers that he's had since Vice President Kamala

0:20:41.880 --> 0:20:44.040
<v Speaker 1>Harris has entered the race, the fact that he has

0:20:44.119 --> 0:20:46.080
<v Speaker 1>concepts of a plan but not a real plan. The

0:20:46.080 --> 0:20:49.359
<v Speaker 1>fact that his economic plans when they went when expressed,

0:20:49.880 --> 0:20:52.679
<v Speaker 1>are incredibly inflationary and would cause a global kind of

0:20:52.800 --> 0:20:56.560
<v Speaker 1>kind of collapse. Like, these facts are very bad or

0:20:56.960 --> 0:20:59.679
<v Speaker 1>for the Republican's presidential candidate. And so they come up

0:20:59.720 --> 0:21:03.159
<v Speaker 1>with the So now we're talking about Haitians on props podcasts,

0:21:03.920 --> 0:21:06.360
<v Speaker 1>and that's kind of the point, right, And the thing

0:21:06.560 --> 0:21:08.520
<v Speaker 1>I think I want to tie it to for the

0:21:08.560 --> 0:21:12.680
<v Speaker 1>community specifically is that it's because they see and it's

0:21:12.720 --> 0:21:15.920
<v Speaker 1>because of four hundred plus years of in culturation and

0:21:16.080 --> 0:21:20.160
<v Speaker 1>narrative building, they see these people as as disposable, as

0:21:20.680 --> 0:21:21.400
<v Speaker 1>kind of cast.

0:21:21.200 --> 0:21:23.439
<v Speaker 3>Away, something that they can throw away and use in

0:21:23.560 --> 0:21:24.680
<v Speaker 3>that kind of larger plan.

0:21:25.640 --> 0:21:29.120
<v Speaker 2>I'd even push that point even further and say, and

0:21:29.480 --> 0:21:32.720
<v Speaker 2>they also see the rest of the citizens of Springfield

0:21:32.720 --> 0:21:33.480
<v Speaker 2>as disposable.

0:21:33.680 --> 0:21:34.960
<v Speaker 3>It's such a good point.

0:21:35.320 --> 0:21:38.120
<v Speaker 2>I can lie about your city and they the city

0:21:38.160 --> 0:21:40.719
<v Speaker 2>has become a veteran ram and in the wake of

0:21:40.760 --> 0:21:43.879
<v Speaker 2>that have seen what thirty eight bomb threats, you know,

0:21:44.160 --> 0:21:47.479
<v Speaker 2>and like, and it's almost like bro, like keep your

0:21:47.560 --> 0:21:48.359
<v Speaker 2>name out of my mouth.

0:21:48.440 --> 0:21:49.359
<v Speaker 4>Man out your mouth?

0:21:49.440 --> 0:21:52.199
<v Speaker 2>Man, Like y'all not helping like I was with you, right,

0:21:52.359 --> 0:21:54.480
<v Speaker 2>but you just gonna drag us like this in public,

0:21:54.680 --> 0:21:56.159
<v Speaker 2>you know what I'm saying. Like, and then try to

0:21:56.200 --> 0:21:59.040
<v Speaker 2>say you doing this, You're like, don't you know it?

0:21:59.040 --> 0:22:01.520
<v Speaker 2>Almost don'ts on my back? Tell me it's raining dog

0:22:01.600 --> 0:22:03.439
<v Speaker 2>like you're not my friend, you know what I mean.

0:22:03.560 --> 0:22:06.240
<v Speaker 2>So that's like the that's the other ugly part about

0:22:06.240 --> 0:22:09.639
<v Speaker 2>that type of supremacy, that type of fascism that they

0:22:09.720 --> 0:22:12.920
<v Speaker 2>waiting in is like, well they don't they don't love you.

0:22:12.960 --> 0:22:14.960
<v Speaker 3>Either, right, you know you know what I'm saying.

0:22:15.800 --> 0:22:18.359
<v Speaker 2>So so yeah, man, we're like we are already there, man,

0:22:18.400 --> 0:22:21.000
<v Speaker 2>I love Yeah, yeah, no.

0:22:21.040 --> 0:22:21.919
<v Speaker 3>That's perfect. No.

0:22:22.080 --> 0:22:23.760
<v Speaker 2>So that that leads me to one of the questions

0:22:23.800 --> 0:22:28.040
<v Speaker 2>I had a little later that like, could you, while present,

0:22:29.680 --> 0:22:32.199
<v Speaker 2>did you notice what you kind of already laid out already,

0:22:32.280 --> 0:22:37.280
<v Speaker 2>like a distinction between a black conservative and a Trump person,

0:22:38.359 --> 0:22:40.399
<v Speaker 2>Like was there a distinction that you could see like

0:22:40.600 --> 0:22:41.760
<v Speaker 2>even with your own eyes.

0:22:41.560 --> 0:22:42.480
<v Speaker 3>You know what I'm saying. Yeah.

0:22:42.520 --> 0:22:45.520
<v Speaker 1>So I actually had plenty of conversations. I've been reporting

0:22:45.560 --> 0:22:48.640
<v Speaker 1>on this for basically a year now and a lot

0:22:48.680 --> 0:22:51.640
<v Speaker 1>of the conversations I've been having with black people who

0:22:51.720 --> 0:22:56.199
<v Speaker 1>identify as conservative, they often reject the Republican Party. This

0:22:56.240 --> 0:22:58.200
<v Speaker 1>is kind of where I've come conclusion, and I think

0:22:58.200 --> 0:23:01.240
<v Speaker 1>we know intuitively, but my reporting has like really kind

0:23:01.240 --> 0:23:01.919
<v Speaker 1>of shown.

0:23:02.840 --> 0:23:05.520
<v Speaker 3>That there there's a great there's a large group of

0:23:05.520 --> 0:23:09.760
<v Speaker 3>people who Black people, black voters, who again hold these

0:23:09.800 --> 0:23:13.520
<v Speaker 3>conservative kind of values, but see the Republican Party as

0:23:13.600 --> 0:23:16.320
<v Speaker 3>kind of an untenable, kind of unacceptable kind of case

0:23:16.400 --> 0:23:20.560
<v Speaker 3>for their particular political lot, and so that distinction is

0:23:20.640 --> 0:23:23.080
<v Speaker 3>often kind of drawn out in many ways. I do

0:23:23.160 --> 0:23:29.920
<v Speaker 3>think that kind of a value of you know, rugged individualism,

0:23:30.160 --> 0:23:33.040
<v Speaker 3>right like this, like I'm going to do it myself.

0:23:33.280 --> 0:23:38.200
<v Speaker 1>I reject white handouts, I reject the quote welfare state.

0:23:38.280 --> 0:23:40.719
<v Speaker 1>I don't want any DEI like like that is a

0:23:40.880 --> 0:23:44.760
<v Speaker 1>value that I actually don't think is particularly foreign Again

0:23:45.680 --> 0:23:48.240
<v Speaker 1>within the black community, this idea that we've all been

0:23:48.359 --> 0:23:51.280
<v Speaker 1>raised with, this kind of saying this black axiom, which

0:23:51.320 --> 0:23:53.800
<v Speaker 1>is that sometimes most times, every time you got to

0:23:53.840 --> 0:23:56.919
<v Speaker 1>work twice as hard to get as much.

0:23:57.040 --> 0:23:59.000
<v Speaker 3>That's the thing that we all grew up with.

0:23:59.080 --> 0:24:02.880
<v Speaker 1>This is a kind of make sure you're doing your

0:24:03.000 --> 0:24:06.359
<v Speaker 1>part to push forward that I would see is in

0:24:06.480 --> 0:24:10.240
<v Speaker 1>large part kind of bas a particular kind of conservative idea.

0:24:10.320 --> 0:24:13.520
<v Speaker 1>I'd say this is small sea conservative, not Republican or

0:24:13.600 --> 0:24:16.679
<v Speaker 1>big you know, Heritage foundation foundation. But it is kind

0:24:16.720 --> 0:24:19.920
<v Speaker 1>of a kind of like individualistic value that we've all

0:24:19.960 --> 0:24:23.040
<v Speaker 1>been more or less raised with where I think it

0:24:23.200 --> 0:24:25.159
<v Speaker 1>goes off the rails if I were to kind of

0:24:25.160 --> 0:24:28.600
<v Speaker 1>do a little op ad here is there within that

0:24:28.800 --> 0:24:32.359
<v Speaker 1>saying there is a recognition that you do have to

0:24:32.400 --> 0:24:34.359
<v Speaker 1>work twice as hard. Now what is that twice as

0:24:34.400 --> 0:24:37.239
<v Speaker 1>heart referring to? It's referring to the structural barriers that

0:24:37.320 --> 0:24:40.560
<v Speaker 1>continue to keep black people and other people of colors

0:24:40.840 --> 0:24:43.200
<v Speaker 1>at the bottom of our American cast system. So there's

0:24:43.200 --> 0:24:46.160
<v Speaker 1>an acknowledgement. And what I found in conversations with many

0:24:46.160 --> 0:24:49.480
<v Speaker 1>of the black MAGA folks is that they just simply

0:24:49.520 --> 0:24:53.560
<v Speaker 1>do not want to acknowledge that there are these structural barriers.

0:24:53.560 --> 0:24:54.359
<v Speaker 3>In the first.

0:24:54.119 --> 0:24:57.600
<v Speaker 2>Logical jump, yeah, yeah, the logical jump is or what

0:24:57.800 --> 0:25:00.720
<v Speaker 2>that clearly the next logical step in the argument you're

0:25:00.760 --> 0:25:03.480
<v Speaker 2>making is what they said, why are you working twice

0:25:03.480 --> 0:25:06.479
<v Speaker 2>as hard? Like why you know what I'm saying, yea,

0:25:07.160 --> 0:25:09.440
<v Speaker 2>which brings me to yeah, man, brings me to two things.

0:25:09.480 --> 0:25:13.399
<v Speaker 2>One to echo your point, my father, My father was

0:25:13.440 --> 0:25:14.119
<v Speaker 2>a black panther.

0:25:14.520 --> 0:25:18.480
<v Speaker 4>So there was in a lot of ways.

0:25:19.720 --> 0:25:22.399
<v Speaker 2>The argument that you know, some make the same argument

0:25:22.560 --> 0:25:26.440
<v Speaker 2>that like before you would say like Clarence Thomas's brain

0:25:26.520 --> 0:25:30.000
<v Speaker 2>got completely cooked. It was like this was the attitude

0:25:30.119 --> 0:25:31.640
<v Speaker 2>to where it's like in my dad in a lot

0:25:31.680 --> 0:25:34.080
<v Speaker 2>of ways, even talking to him now, he's definitely not

0:25:34.119 --> 0:25:37.000
<v Speaker 2>as you know, he's much older now, but you know,

0:25:37.040 --> 0:25:39.879
<v Speaker 2>and he's definitely not as radical as he was. But

0:25:40.000 --> 0:25:43.560
<v Speaker 2>the idea was like this system is is designed to

0:25:43.640 --> 0:25:47.920
<v Speaker 2>destroy us. These people will never love us. So we

0:25:47.960 --> 0:25:50.840
<v Speaker 2>are all we got, you know. So even like he

0:25:50.920 --> 0:25:54.040
<v Speaker 2>we were out here in the La chapter the forty

0:25:54.080 --> 0:25:56.919
<v Speaker 2>fourth of Central like that was that was our area,

0:25:57.040 --> 0:26:00.760
<v Speaker 2>you know. And he was after school tutor, you know

0:26:00.800 --> 0:26:02.400
<v Speaker 2>what I'm saying. Like, so he was a part of

0:26:03.080 --> 0:26:04.720
<v Speaker 2>that pro and it was like and he goes, cause

0:26:04.800 --> 0:26:09.359
<v Speaker 2>I can't trust I can't trust the American education system

0:26:09.359 --> 0:26:12.080
<v Speaker 2>to teach my black son the things that he needs

0:26:12.119 --> 0:26:12.440
<v Speaker 2>to know.

0:26:12.600 --> 0:26:14.200
<v Speaker 3>So we are going to do it.

0:26:14.520 --> 0:26:17.600
<v Speaker 2>So and the same thing, it's like even though my grandmother,

0:26:17.800 --> 0:26:21.359
<v Speaker 2>you know, subsisted on assistant living. He was still was

0:26:21.520 --> 0:26:24.520
<v Speaker 2>very much like every dollar they give us is a

0:26:24.520 --> 0:26:26.480
<v Speaker 2>dollar we owe them, Like, you know what I'm saying, Like,

0:26:26.560 --> 0:26:27.400
<v Speaker 2>let's not you.

0:26:27.359 --> 0:26:27.800
<v Speaker 4>Know what I mean.

0:26:27.880 --> 0:26:30.640
<v Speaker 2>And I think that like a younger version of that,

0:26:31.960 --> 0:26:34.320
<v Speaker 2>which I definitely wanted to ask you about, is like

0:26:34.880 --> 0:26:38.240
<v Speaker 2>the black capitalists, like the jay Z, the Killer Mike

0:26:38.400 --> 0:26:40.520
<v Speaker 2>version of like, oh well, we just need black banks,

0:26:40.600 --> 0:26:42.280
<v Speaker 2>we just need you know what I'm saying, Well, if

0:26:42.320 --> 0:26:44.679
<v Speaker 2>we owned our land, if we own these businesses, if

0:26:44.680 --> 0:26:46.680
<v Speaker 2>we own these things. I think in a lot of ways,

0:26:47.119 --> 0:26:48.720
<v Speaker 2>you know, part of me is like, yeah, you know,

0:26:48.760 --> 0:26:50.240
<v Speaker 2>you're in the ocean, you might as well swim.

0:26:50.240 --> 0:26:51.600
<v Speaker 4>It's like it's a saltwater ocean.

0:26:51.640 --> 0:26:51.840
<v Speaker 3>I have.

0:26:52.119 --> 0:26:54.359
<v Speaker 2>The ocean is capitalism. I don't know what to tell you,

0:26:54.359 --> 0:26:56.160
<v Speaker 2>you know what I'm saying. But then there's the other

0:26:56.240 --> 0:26:59.600
<v Speaker 2>part of us that are like, no, the ocean is toxic,

0:27:00.200 --> 0:27:03.560
<v Speaker 2>and U's just like, is there an element of like

0:27:03.920 --> 0:27:07.320
<v Speaker 2>should we just burn the whole thing down? Or like

0:27:07.359 --> 0:27:12.120
<v Speaker 2>you said, like there's an understandable conclusion to say that,

0:27:12.240 --> 0:27:17.680
<v Speaker 2>like these radical views of the sixties dovetail into the

0:27:17.760 --> 0:27:19.800
<v Speaker 2>type of conservatism that you're talking about.

0:27:19.920 --> 0:27:23.120
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, Okay, so I do know what you're saying.

0:27:23.160 --> 0:27:24.879
<v Speaker 1>There's so many things that kind of trigger for me

0:27:24.920 --> 0:27:28.959
<v Speaker 1>throughout that whole thing. I'm working on something that's largely

0:27:29.000 --> 0:27:31.320
<v Speaker 1>built off of the book Locking Up Our Own by

0:27:31.440 --> 0:27:34.520
<v Speaker 1>James Forman Jr. It's a phenomenal book that I highly

0:27:34.560 --> 0:27:37.480
<v Speaker 1>recommend folks who are interested in this stuff get into.

0:27:37.520 --> 0:27:41.199
<v Speaker 1>It's really about black on black policing. It's about the

0:27:41.240 --> 0:27:43.840
<v Speaker 1>way that black people kind of govern at least their

0:27:43.880 --> 0:27:47.600
<v Speaker 1>own communities. I argue in this piece that's coming out

0:27:47.600 --> 0:27:49.040
<v Speaker 1>in a few weeks, so you guys are getting a

0:27:49.040 --> 0:27:53.240
<v Speaker 1>little early, I argue that black people love the police,

0:27:53.520 --> 0:27:58.200
<v Speaker 1>that black people are deeply invested in the police and

0:27:58.280 --> 0:28:02.280
<v Speaker 1>policing structures in a way that may feel a bit counterintuitive.

0:28:02.920 --> 0:28:05.439
<v Speaker 1>I give all of this kind of background, and I

0:28:05.480 --> 0:28:09.520
<v Speaker 1>promise I'm going somewhere with this in that, like what

0:28:09.560 --> 0:28:11.720
<v Speaker 1>you're talking about with your dad, my dad was also

0:28:11.920 --> 0:28:14.080
<v Speaker 1>a black panther, or at least in gay Black panther

0:28:14.119 --> 0:28:15.160
<v Speaker 1>party in Atlanta.

0:28:16.200 --> 0:28:17.600
<v Speaker 3>So this was, you know, many years ago.

0:28:17.680 --> 0:28:20.479
<v Speaker 1>But yeah, but one thing that comes out of this

0:28:20.480 --> 0:28:23.760
<v Speaker 1>this black this pro black black panther movement, is this

0:28:23.960 --> 0:28:28.680
<v Speaker 1>idea of being tough on crime so before Reagan gets

0:28:28.720 --> 0:28:32.119
<v Speaker 1>tough on crime, and and and beyond, before these folks

0:28:32.240 --> 0:28:35.320
<v Speaker 1>are mixed in, before they're engaged in tough on crime rhetoric,

0:28:35.760 --> 0:28:38.800
<v Speaker 1>the black community was actually deeply invested in back in

0:28:38.800 --> 0:28:42.840
<v Speaker 1>tough on crime rhetoric because they recognized that a crime

0:28:43.120 --> 0:28:46.400
<v Speaker 1>that the person who was pushing some drugs heroin for instance,

0:28:46.400 --> 0:28:49.200
<v Speaker 1>in their community, even if they know, even if we.

0:28:49.120 --> 0:28:51.520
<v Speaker 3>Know it was like a psyop, and the government.

0:28:51.200 --> 0:28:54.920
<v Speaker 1>Was engaged absolutely absolutely, the person who's actually doing the

0:28:55.000 --> 0:28:58.040
<v Speaker 1>distributing is a brother, right, And so they would put

0:28:58.080 --> 0:29:01.400
<v Speaker 1>up these signs. Black Panthers and other pro black movement people,

0:29:01.480 --> 0:29:03.520
<v Speaker 1>especially in DC, will put up these signs and say

0:29:03.600 --> 0:29:06.800
<v Speaker 1>want it brother for crimes against a brother, right. And

0:29:06.840 --> 0:29:09.240
<v Speaker 1>so there's this kind of like like whenever I hear

0:29:09.280 --> 0:29:11.400
<v Speaker 1>a conservative try to talk about black on black crime,

0:29:11.640 --> 0:29:14.800
<v Speaker 1>I'm like, you are sixty years too late. Like we've

0:29:14.880 --> 0:29:17.480
<v Speaker 1>been talking about black on black crime right for for

0:29:17.520 --> 0:29:20.160
<v Speaker 1>a very long time. I give all of that background

0:29:20.240 --> 0:29:25.880
<v Speaker 1>to say that the problem I find amongst many black

0:29:25.880 --> 0:29:28.880
<v Speaker 1>conservative thinkers, Thomas Soul comes to mind as a person

0:29:28.920 --> 0:29:32.200
<v Speaker 1>who kind of fits this description. They had an idea

0:29:32.520 --> 0:29:36.440
<v Speaker 1>in let's say the late sixties or the seventies about

0:29:36.560 --> 0:29:39.280
<v Speaker 1>how we move forward as a community, and they just

0:29:39.400 --> 0:29:43.920
<v Speaker 1>refused to take in the information and evolve. Let me

0:29:43.960 --> 0:29:49.160
<v Speaker 1>give a little example here, people, black people deeply, like,

0:29:49.560 --> 0:29:52.760
<v Speaker 1>really really deeply supported the nineteen ninety four crime bill.

0:29:52.800 --> 0:29:56.440
<v Speaker 1>We just passed the thirty year anniversary of the nineteen

0:29:56.520 --> 0:30:00.480
<v Speaker 1>ninety four crime bill, which accelerated mass and cars at

0:30:00.520 --> 0:30:05.480
<v Speaker 1>a rate that is actually unfathomable, did unfathomable damage to

0:30:05.520 --> 0:30:09.000
<v Speaker 1>the black community. Was architected by Joe Biden and signed

0:30:09.040 --> 0:30:14.240
<v Speaker 1>into law by Bill Clinton. Right, but over one hundred

0:30:14.320 --> 0:30:17.560
<v Speaker 1>black pastors across the country took out a full page

0:30:17.600 --> 0:30:21.120
<v Speaker 1>ad in the New York Times asking for Congress to

0:30:21.200 --> 0:30:24.840
<v Speaker 1>pass this bill. The Congressional Black Caucus supported the tough

0:30:24.880 --> 0:30:26.280
<v Speaker 1>on crime nineteen ninety.

0:30:26.000 --> 0:30:26.800
<v Speaker 3>Four crime bill.

0:30:27.360 --> 0:30:32.040
<v Speaker 1>They pushed for this country to do the thing that's

0:30:32.120 --> 0:30:35.520
<v Speaker 1>hurt us the most. Now, this is a this is

0:30:35.560 --> 0:30:38.760
<v Speaker 1>a tough pill to swallow, right, But but what we

0:30:38.800 --> 0:30:41.880
<v Speaker 1>can do here, What the Black Lives Matter movement, for example,

0:30:41.880 --> 0:30:44.720
<v Speaker 1>does is actually looks back over time and says, wait, wait, wait,

0:30:45.280 --> 0:30:47.280
<v Speaker 1>they may have intended this to be good. They may

0:30:47.280 --> 0:30:49.760
<v Speaker 1>have intended for this to save Grandma who was putting

0:30:49.840 --> 0:30:52.480
<v Speaker 1>up burglar bars her on her house, or to save

0:30:52.760 --> 0:30:55.600
<v Speaker 1>cousin who was getting engaged with like gang violence and

0:30:55.640 --> 0:30:57.800
<v Speaker 1>all this stuff. Right, Like, they may have intended it

0:30:57.840 --> 0:30:59.560
<v Speaker 1>to be a positive thing in our community, but what

0:30:59.600 --> 0:31:01.960
<v Speaker 1>we've loved learned is that it is a negative thing.

0:31:02.360 --> 0:31:05.600
<v Speaker 1>And what I often find is that the folks who

0:31:05.640 --> 0:31:08.480
<v Speaker 1>have been conservative for a long time or becoming conservative,

0:31:08.640 --> 0:31:12.240
<v Speaker 1>they refuse to look back at the way We've tried

0:31:12.480 --> 0:31:16.600
<v Speaker 1>so many things and those things have failed. So when

0:31:16.640 --> 0:31:19.320
<v Speaker 1>I hear you talking about and I'm finally landing, man,

0:31:19.520 --> 0:31:22.200
<v Speaker 1>finally landing. When I hear you talking, when I hear

0:31:22.240 --> 0:31:27.200
<v Speaker 1>you talking about black capitalism, I can recognize that black

0:31:27.240 --> 0:31:30.880
<v Speaker 1>capitalism has helped Jay Z become a billionaire, It's helped

0:31:31.680 --> 0:31:34.600
<v Speaker 1>many many others make a bunch of money. It has

0:31:34.640 --> 0:31:38.520
<v Speaker 1>not helped our community. It's helped individuals, but it's not

0:31:38.600 --> 0:31:42.480
<v Speaker 1>helped our community. And that is the value of capitalism.

0:31:42.560 --> 0:31:48.400
<v Speaker 1>Capitalism is inherently valued on the individual success, the individual

0:31:48.640 --> 0:31:51.959
<v Speaker 1>kind of you know, like ownership, right, And so I

0:31:52.000 --> 0:31:54.400
<v Speaker 1>don't want to getting you know, I don't have to

0:31:54.440 --> 0:31:56.320
<v Speaker 1>get bogged down. And whether or not we burn down

0:31:56.360 --> 0:31:57.920
<v Speaker 1>the system, I know, that's just kind of a saying.

0:31:58.280 --> 0:32:01.360
<v Speaker 1>I think many people have tried and have failed. What

0:32:01.440 --> 0:32:04.959
<v Speaker 1>I can recognize is that there are policy prescriptions, there

0:32:04.960 --> 0:32:08.360
<v Speaker 1>are ways to move forward that benefit the community. I

0:32:08.400 --> 0:32:12.600
<v Speaker 1>think about Barack Obama's Affordable Care Act, which wasn't explicitly

0:32:12.960 --> 0:32:15.640
<v Speaker 1>about black people. It wasn't on the it wasn't the

0:32:15.760 --> 0:32:20.719
<v Speaker 1>Black Care Act, and yet it lowered black uninsured rates

0:32:21.080 --> 0:32:23.200
<v Speaker 1>from I believe twenty five percent to like ten or

0:32:23.200 --> 0:32:24.360
<v Speaker 1>fifteen percent something like that.

0:32:24.600 --> 0:32:26.160
<v Speaker 3>It lowered it, you know, significantly.

0:32:26.200 --> 0:32:29.480
<v Speaker 1>That means more people who are now on health insurance,

0:32:29.480 --> 0:32:31.480
<v Speaker 1>who can now go to the doctor, who can now

0:32:31.560 --> 0:32:35.240
<v Speaker 1>get preventive care. I think about Joe Biden and Kamala

0:32:35.280 --> 0:32:39.640
<v Speaker 1>Harris's Prescription you know plan, where they lowered the cost

0:32:39.720 --> 0:32:43.560
<v Speaker 1>of prescription drugs, particularly around diabetes insulin, to like thirty

0:32:43.600 --> 0:32:46.480
<v Speaker 1>five dollars for seniors. That means that someone's grandmother or

0:32:46.560 --> 0:32:51.920
<v Speaker 1>aunt or uncle can now afford to get life saving medication.

0:32:52.480 --> 0:32:55.320
<v Speaker 3>And while that may go against.

0:32:54.760 --> 0:32:56.960
<v Speaker 1>The values of capitalism, which is like, if there's a

0:32:57.040 --> 0:32:59.960
<v Speaker 1>high demand, run the price up so that you get

0:33:00.400 --> 0:33:02.680
<v Speaker 1>as much as possible off of it, Right, that might

0:33:02.720 --> 0:33:06.200
<v Speaker 1>go against capitalism, I still think that those things are

0:33:06.280 --> 0:33:10.880
<v Speaker 1>valuable without ever having to necessarily destroy the foundations of

0:33:10.880 --> 0:33:12.800
<v Speaker 1>capitalism in this country. So that's how I tell you

0:33:12.880 --> 0:33:14.720
<v Speaker 1>about it, and I hope it's kind of a helpful

0:33:14.800 --> 0:33:16.120
<v Speaker 1>frame for the conversation.

0:33:16.200 --> 0:33:17.040
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, no, it's perfect.

0:33:17.280 --> 0:33:19.760
<v Speaker 2>It's perfect because you know, one of my mentors used

0:33:19.800 --> 0:33:23.280
<v Speaker 2>to say about like a couple of things you talked about,

0:33:23.280 --> 0:33:28.880
<v Speaker 2>like the there's like vertical equality and then there's horizontal equality.

0:33:28.960 --> 0:33:31.520
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, yeah, we've had a black president, you know. Yeah,

0:33:31.640 --> 0:33:35.360
<v Speaker 2>you were able to as an individual black person a

0:33:35.400 --> 0:33:39.040
<v Speaker 2>mass millions of dollars. Okay, yeah, vertical, you know, but

0:33:39.440 --> 0:33:43.560
<v Speaker 2>that does not mean horizontally there's this equality. And again

0:33:43.600 --> 0:33:48.000
<v Speaker 2>to your point, like you know, to amass the type

0:33:48.000 --> 0:33:54.680
<v Speaker 2>of wealth that these brothers are talking about requires a working.

0:33:54.360 --> 0:33:55.800
<v Speaker 3>Class, you know.

0:33:55.920 --> 0:33:58.880
<v Speaker 2>So it's like it's it's it's important. You can't get

0:33:58.880 --> 0:34:02.040
<v Speaker 2>there without exploiting the very brothers and sisters that you're

0:34:02.200 --> 0:34:05.160
<v Speaker 2>arguing or you're trying to undergirden support.

0:34:05.240 --> 0:34:06.360
<v Speaker 3>No, I totally agree.

0:34:07.160 --> 0:34:40.759
<v Speaker 5>I love it, man.

0:34:40.840 --> 0:34:42.839
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, which actually leads me to the next thing

0:34:42.920 --> 0:34:46.120
<v Speaker 2>that like there were moments specifically in the video which

0:34:46.120 --> 0:34:48.640
<v Speaker 2>you kind of like in a in a in a

0:34:48.760 --> 0:34:53.279
<v Speaker 2>in a broader way I've already addressed when someone says something.

0:34:52.960 --> 0:34:53.360
<v Speaker 3>That's like.

0:34:55.520 --> 0:34:58.680
<v Speaker 2>It's just this is just not true, you know, where

0:34:58.719 --> 0:35:02.200
<v Speaker 2>like you know it, and there are certain things like okay,

0:35:02.400 --> 0:35:07.719
<v Speaker 2>you know, did was the assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand

0:35:07.840 --> 0:35:09.680
<v Speaker 2>the start of World War One?

0:35:10.040 --> 0:35:11.760
<v Speaker 4>Maybe or maybe.

0:35:11.760 --> 0:35:18.400
<v Speaker 2>It was the situations that led you know, Priss to

0:35:18.480 --> 0:35:21.040
<v Speaker 2>feel like he needs to assassinate. Maybe it started twenty

0:35:21.120 --> 0:35:24.279
<v Speaker 2>years before, and then that's a matter of interpretation. Who

0:35:24.320 --> 0:35:28.440
<v Speaker 2>knows a white mob burnt down Tulsa, like that is

0:35:28.600 --> 0:35:32.520
<v Speaker 2>just what happened, you know herself saying like like I

0:35:32.640 --> 0:35:34.759
<v Speaker 2>just don't, I don't.

0:35:34.800 --> 0:35:37.719
<v Speaker 4>There's this is not up for interpretation. This is just

0:35:37.760 --> 0:35:38.440
<v Speaker 4>what happened.

0:35:38.800 --> 0:35:43.560
<v Speaker 2>And I find there's two questions I'm getting to here

0:35:44.080 --> 0:35:48.160
<v Speaker 2>is when discussing things like this that are just.

0:35:49.960 --> 0:35:50.400
<v Speaker 3>False.

0:35:50.719 --> 0:35:53.880
<v Speaker 2>I appreciated the way that you're like, no, we have

0:35:53.920 --> 0:35:57.000
<v Speaker 2>to stop this conversation because whatever point you're about to

0:35:57.040 --> 0:36:01.680
<v Speaker 2>make after this is invalid because it's built on an

0:36:01.680 --> 0:36:04.719
<v Speaker 2>axiom that is just false. You know, like where there

0:36:04.760 --> 0:36:06.640
<v Speaker 2>are certain things like I said that you can interpret.

0:36:06.719 --> 0:36:09.880
<v Speaker 2>You could say, what again, let me do your homework

0:36:09.920 --> 0:36:15.200
<v Speaker 2>for you. You could have said there were laws and

0:36:17.120 --> 0:36:20.440
<v Speaker 2>regulations that might have been removed that allowed for the

0:36:20.440 --> 0:36:22.839
<v Speaker 2>growth of Black Wall Street. You could have argued that,

0:36:23.160 --> 0:36:24.840
<v Speaker 2>you know what I'm saying, but to say the destruction

0:36:24.960 --> 0:36:26.719
<v Speaker 2>of it was this It's not a for interpretation, bro.

0:36:26.800 --> 0:36:29.279
<v Speaker 2>It was burnt down by a racist mob, right, so

0:36:29.719 --> 0:36:30.840
<v Speaker 2>you know what I'm saying, Like, I don't know what

0:36:30.880 --> 0:36:33.400
<v Speaker 2>to tell you, hoy, Like that's what happened. So I

0:36:34.560 --> 0:36:36.840
<v Speaker 2>think oftentimes when it comes to like you said, like

0:36:36.880 --> 0:36:40.800
<v Speaker 2>the maga folks that like just refuse to acknowledge the obvious,

0:36:41.280 --> 0:36:45.960
<v Speaker 2>like is there, I oftentimes feel like I'm waiting for

0:36:46.040 --> 0:36:49.320
<v Speaker 2>you to wink at me that like you don't really

0:36:50.200 --> 0:36:53.120
<v Speaker 2>you don't really believe this, like this this is a hustle, right,

0:36:53.160 --> 0:36:56.480
<v Speaker 2>like because again what you just said is categorically false,

0:36:56.600 --> 0:36:59.440
<v Speaker 2>like that's even in the white books, even in the

0:36:59.480 --> 0:37:00.400
<v Speaker 2>white school books.

0:37:00.480 --> 0:37:02.279
<v Speaker 4>This is what happened, you know what I'm saying, So

0:37:02.480 --> 0:37:05.359
<v Speaker 4>like this, where did you get this?

0:37:05.600 --> 0:37:05.799
<v Speaker 3>You know?

0:37:07.200 --> 0:37:11.520
<v Speaker 2>But then there's like wait, maybe you do really you

0:37:11.640 --> 0:37:14.279
<v Speaker 2>really think this is and then so like what's your

0:37:14.280 --> 0:37:18.200
<v Speaker 2>read on the like? And obviously this is all like

0:37:18.280 --> 0:37:21.319
<v Speaker 2>anecdotal and speculation, but like, what is your read on

0:37:21.440 --> 0:37:21.799
<v Speaker 2>the like?

0:37:22.000 --> 0:37:23.760
<v Speaker 3>The part of your soul you got.

0:37:23.520 --> 0:37:27.640
<v Speaker 2>To turn into a pretzel and to deny reality to

0:37:27.680 --> 0:37:29.239
<v Speaker 2>where it's like you said, to lead up to the

0:37:29.239 --> 0:37:31.120
<v Speaker 2>point to be like like another moment in the thing

0:37:31.160 --> 0:37:35.120
<v Speaker 2>when you was like, wellhommie was like we believe the strong,

0:37:35.280 --> 0:37:38.200
<v Speaker 2>like the almost like a conservative doctor, Umar, you know

0:37:38.200 --> 0:37:40.160
<v Speaker 2>what I'm saying, where it's like, you know, the family,

0:37:40.360 --> 0:37:43.839
<v Speaker 2>the black family unit is the core of our civilization.

0:37:43.920 --> 0:37:46.239
<v Speaker 2>And we were better before the Civil rights movement, cause

0:37:46.280 --> 0:37:49.719
<v Speaker 2>at least we was together, my brother in Christ, like you,

0:37:50.200 --> 0:37:53.040
<v Speaker 2>there's nowhere in the world that you just said that

0:37:53.120 --> 0:37:55.359
<v Speaker 2>right now, you know what I'm saying. So, but about

0:37:55.400 --> 0:37:57.400
<v Speaker 2>the same time, I understand the logic that led to that.

0:37:57.520 --> 0:38:00.160
<v Speaker 2>Like my dad went to a segregated all black high school,

0:38:00.200 --> 0:38:05.359
<v Speaker 2>like and he saw black people at every point of

0:38:05.400 --> 0:38:06.280
<v Speaker 2>the social strata.

0:38:06.400 --> 0:38:06.759
<v Speaker 4>I did not.

0:38:07.080 --> 0:38:08.759
<v Speaker 2>I did not see that, you know what I'm saying. So,

0:38:08.840 --> 0:38:11.000
<v Speaker 2>like I would say, yeah, I never saw a black principle.

0:38:11.040 --> 0:38:13.160
<v Speaker 2>I didn't have I didn't know any black lawyers. I

0:38:13.200 --> 0:38:14.680
<v Speaker 2>didn't know any of that stuff because I just didn't

0:38:14.680 --> 0:38:17.000
<v Speaker 2>live in a segregated area. You feel me, so to

0:38:17.080 --> 0:38:22.239
<v Speaker 2>your point, yes, however, that was us making treasure out

0:38:22.280 --> 0:38:25.080
<v Speaker 2>of trash bro Like, no, that was in spite of

0:38:25.120 --> 0:38:27.680
<v Speaker 2>the laws, you know what I'm saying. So, like, I

0:38:28.440 --> 0:38:32.760
<v Speaker 2>just my question is like two questions. One, were there

0:38:32.800 --> 0:38:35.799
<v Speaker 2>moments during that time to where you were like, all right,

0:38:35.880 --> 0:38:39.279
<v Speaker 2>fam like this a hustle, right, And then so with

0:38:39.400 --> 0:38:41.160
<v Speaker 2>that when it's like no, maybe it's not a hustle,

0:38:42.160 --> 0:38:43.279
<v Speaker 2>what's your take on Like.

0:38:45.120 --> 0:38:48.000
<v Speaker 3>How how you just ignore.

0:38:49.320 --> 0:38:50.200
<v Speaker 4>History?

0:38:50.480 --> 0:38:52.080
<v Speaker 2>I got to use to explain it, like you're just

0:38:52.960 --> 0:38:54.720
<v Speaker 2>just acting like what happened didn't happen.

0:38:55.200 --> 0:38:57.719
<v Speaker 1>I think one of the things I learned going to

0:38:57.800 --> 0:38:59.879
<v Speaker 1>the RNC, I don't think it's a it's a sea

0:39:00.280 --> 0:39:03.600
<v Speaker 1>that I don't identify with the politics of the Republican

0:39:03.640 --> 0:39:05.680
<v Speaker 1>Party of course, but going.

0:39:05.400 --> 0:39:07.640
<v Speaker 3>There I learned a lot.

0:39:07.800 --> 0:39:09.560
<v Speaker 1>Man, I learned a lot and I got a lot

0:39:09.560 --> 0:39:12.080
<v Speaker 1>of empathy in the process. I gained a lot of

0:39:12.080 --> 0:39:14.680
<v Speaker 1>empathy being at the r and C this summer, and

0:39:15.239 --> 0:39:20.880
<v Speaker 1>for for starters, their media ecosystem is just totally different

0:39:20.920 --> 0:39:25.080
<v Speaker 1>from mine, right, Like I curate, So I tell people this,

0:39:25.440 --> 0:39:27.840
<v Speaker 1>I have a YouTube I have a YouTube like account

0:39:28.040 --> 0:39:28.600
<v Speaker 1>that's mine.

0:39:28.640 --> 0:39:29.120
<v Speaker 3>That's just me.

0:39:29.200 --> 0:39:31.000
<v Speaker 1>It's what I'm most interested in, and what I click

0:39:31.200 --> 0:39:33.160
<v Speaker 1>just makes sense for me, and then I have one

0:39:33.200 --> 0:39:35.920
<v Speaker 1>that I've specifically curated for right wing content so that

0:39:35.960 --> 0:39:38.400
<v Speaker 1>I can consume some of them, understand what they're what

0:39:38.440 --> 0:39:41.840
<v Speaker 1>they're thinking on that side. And what I learned being

0:39:41.960 --> 0:39:45.840
<v Speaker 1>there is that man like they they have a totally

0:39:45.920 --> 0:39:48.600
<v Speaker 1>different kind of set of facts instead of kind of

0:39:48.600 --> 0:39:50.920
<v Speaker 1>a different reality than that than the one I'm living in.

0:39:51.080 --> 0:39:53.319
<v Speaker 1>Right like, the news cycle is different, and the way

0:39:53.320 --> 0:39:55.920
<v Speaker 1>they're interpreting the news that might overlap is totally different.

0:39:56.400 --> 0:39:58.640
<v Speaker 1>And I think some of that seeps in in a

0:39:58.719 --> 0:40:04.879
<v Speaker 1>very genuine way into their understanding of history and economics

0:40:04.920 --> 0:40:07.799
<v Speaker 1>and policy and what's best for the community. I think

0:40:07.840 --> 0:40:10.080
<v Speaker 1>some of that stuff is really actually a part of

0:40:10.120 --> 0:40:13.279
<v Speaker 1>the whole thing. I made a video about Prager University.

0:40:13.520 --> 0:40:17.520
<v Speaker 1>Prager You has a series of videos on YouTube, and

0:40:18.880 --> 0:40:22.920
<v Speaker 1>they honestly misrepresent history Black history, specifically in ways that

0:40:22.960 --> 0:40:25.640
<v Speaker 1>I think is dangerous, and I call that out. But

0:40:25.680 --> 0:40:28.880
<v Speaker 1>I also have to recognize that someone's watching that and

0:40:29.000 --> 0:40:32.520
<v Speaker 1>they are getting the kids ready, or they're cooking dinner,

0:40:33.000 --> 0:40:35.080
<v Speaker 1>or they're just getting ready for their day, and they're

0:40:35.239 --> 0:40:38.319
<v Speaker 1>kind of uncritically absorbing this stuff, and it really is

0:40:38.360 --> 0:40:40.600
<v Speaker 1>shaping the way they view when they look back in

0:40:40.640 --> 0:40:43.080
<v Speaker 1>the past at history and so. On the one hand,

0:40:43.120 --> 0:40:45.680
<v Speaker 1>I want to give a bit of grace to say that, like,

0:40:46.600 --> 0:40:48.680
<v Speaker 1>people are busy and they got a lot stuff going

0:40:48.680 --> 0:40:51.000
<v Speaker 1>on in their lives, and so when someone tells you

0:40:51.480 --> 0:40:56.120
<v Speaker 1>that black people were better off before the Civil Rights

0:40:56.160 --> 0:40:59.640
<v Speaker 1>Act of nineteen sixty four, you may uncritically believe it.

0:41:00.040 --> 0:41:02.240
<v Speaker 1>Here to tell you that that's not true, right, Like,

0:41:02.239 --> 0:41:05.080
<v Speaker 1>like I'm here to say that black poverty has been

0:41:05.160 --> 0:41:09.320
<v Speaker 1>falling ever since black people started receiving civil rights protections.

0:41:09.360 --> 0:41:13.279
<v Speaker 1>This is a fact, right, Like, we've closed racial wealth

0:41:13.320 --> 0:41:17.120
<v Speaker 1>gap very very little, but it has been closed a

0:41:17.160 --> 0:41:20.400
<v Speaker 1>little bit post civil rights, and so that's important to

0:41:20.480 --> 0:41:21.800
<v Speaker 1>kind of like get out of the way. On the

0:41:21.840 --> 0:41:24.560
<v Speaker 1>other hand, there's an author. His name is Clay Caine.

0:41:24.600 --> 0:41:26.520
<v Speaker 1>I've been calling his name a lot because he wrote

0:41:26.520 --> 0:41:29.320
<v Speaker 1>a book called The Grift and it's about the downward

0:41:29.320 --> 0:41:32.080
<v Speaker 1>spiral of the Black Republican Party from the Party of

0:41:32.360 --> 0:41:34.440
<v Speaker 1>Party of Abraham Lincoln to the Party of Trump. And

0:41:34.840 --> 0:41:37.799
<v Speaker 1>in the he argues, and I don't fully agree with

0:41:37.800 --> 0:41:40.520
<v Speaker 1>his total argument, but I think the history elements of

0:41:40.560 --> 0:41:43.360
<v Speaker 1>what he's talking about is really strong. But he argues

0:41:43.440 --> 0:41:46.279
<v Speaker 1>that the modern black Republican is a grifter. They know

0:41:46.400 --> 0:41:49.799
<v Speaker 1>that if they say the right thing, they kind of

0:41:49.840 --> 0:41:53.160
<v Speaker 1>miss they represent themselves. They protect the white man as

0:41:53.200 --> 0:41:55.080
<v Speaker 1>best as possible from any criticism.

0:41:55.880 --> 0:41:57.360
<v Speaker 3>Then there's a both.

0:41:57.120 --> 0:41:59.040
<v Speaker 1>A pat on the head, a pat on the back,

0:41:59.440 --> 0:42:01.480
<v Speaker 1>and maybe a check on the other side of it.

0:42:01.719 --> 0:42:04.160
<v Speaker 1>I don't think that's true of your everyday voter. I

0:42:04.200 --> 0:42:07.399
<v Speaker 1>would never cast that kind of like aspersion on your

0:42:07.400 --> 0:42:08.040
<v Speaker 1>everyday voter.

0:42:08.080 --> 0:42:09.680
<v Speaker 3>I don't think they have much to gain. They're just

0:42:09.719 --> 0:42:10.880
<v Speaker 3>saying what they really believe.

0:42:11.200 --> 0:42:13.040
<v Speaker 1>But I do think that some of the media people

0:42:13.640 --> 0:42:17.200
<v Speaker 1>understand that if you say that America is in a

0:42:17.280 --> 0:42:20.720
<v Speaker 1>racist country, or if you you know, if you call out,

0:42:20.920 --> 0:42:23.960
<v Speaker 1>you know, black people, or say that the say that

0:42:24.000 --> 0:42:26.480
<v Speaker 1>Kamala Harris isn't black, or whatever the case, maybe if

0:42:26.520 --> 0:42:29.480
<v Speaker 1>you do that, if you go along with the Haitians

0:42:29.480 --> 0:42:32.560
<v Speaker 1>are eating cats and dogs thing, there is a reward

0:42:32.960 --> 0:42:36.759
<v Speaker 1>for you playing kind of you know, cover or for

0:42:36.840 --> 0:42:37.440
<v Speaker 1>this game.

0:42:37.719 --> 0:42:39.440
<v Speaker 3>And and I and I don't.

0:42:39.200 --> 0:42:41.520
<v Speaker 1>Have a lot of patience for it, but I have

0:42:41.600 --> 0:42:44.000
<v Speaker 1>been watching it very closely because I think it's a

0:42:44.040 --> 0:42:47.480
<v Speaker 1>it's a dangerous element within within our media ecosystem.

0:42:47.680 --> 0:42:51.640
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, yeah, perfect that's the like, that's the wink.

0:42:51.840 --> 0:42:54.719
<v Speaker 2>You know what I mean that I feel like, you know,

0:42:55.280 --> 0:42:59.200
<v Speaker 2>like black men and black men. I'm like, I'm like,

0:42:59.280 --> 0:43:01.759
<v Speaker 2>if anything, I'm like, just let me know that's what

0:43:01.760 --> 0:43:04.279
<v Speaker 2>you're doing, you know, because you don't feel me like

0:43:04.320 --> 0:43:07.359
<v Speaker 2>where I'm like, there's anyway you're That's that's a great point.

0:43:07.400 --> 0:43:10.000
<v Speaker 2>You also brought up earlier Thomas Swoll, which I'll be like, man,

0:43:10.040 --> 0:43:12.680
<v Speaker 2>that's day one, you know, that's that's.

0:43:12.920 --> 0:43:15.120
<v Speaker 3>That's day one, you know. And and and.

0:43:15.239 --> 0:43:18.200
<v Speaker 2>Honestly, it's like like you said, like any of us

0:43:18.239 --> 0:43:20.560
<v Speaker 2>could drive a truck through the logic that you know.

0:43:20.640 --> 0:43:22.520
<v Speaker 2>And I try to speak with the level of humility

0:43:22.520 --> 0:43:25.040
<v Speaker 2>in the sense that like this this person comes from

0:43:25.400 --> 0:43:28.359
<v Speaker 2>a different generation than either he's way more he's way

0:43:28.360 --> 0:43:30.560
<v Speaker 2>more educated than I am. Like let me just let

0:43:30.600 --> 0:43:31.920
<v Speaker 2>me just be real. You know what I'm saying, he's

0:43:31.920 --> 0:43:35.359
<v Speaker 2>objectively more educated than I am. I'm just saying, you

0:43:35.400 --> 0:43:39.960
<v Speaker 2>know that, like the world you're painting is not the

0:43:40.000 --> 0:43:43.040
<v Speaker 2>world we existent. It's just it's just not you know.

0:43:44.360 --> 0:43:47.120
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, yeah, I think too to your point about

0:43:47.160 --> 0:43:52.400
<v Speaker 2>like I have the same I have my like, Okay,

0:43:52.440 --> 0:43:54.880
<v Speaker 2>this is what I consume and this is what I

0:43:54.880 --> 0:43:57.400
<v Speaker 2>am consuming so that I can understand my neighbor, you

0:43:57.440 --> 0:43:58.200
<v Speaker 2>know what I'm saying, like.

0:43:58.200 --> 0:43:59.760
<v Speaker 3>So, and but.

0:44:01.560 --> 0:44:03.440
<v Speaker 2>Without coming off like which is again one of the

0:44:03.440 --> 0:44:05.600
<v Speaker 2>problems of like the left is like without coming off

0:44:05.640 --> 0:44:07.799
<v Speaker 2>as an elitist, like I'm trying not to be, but

0:44:08.000 --> 0:44:11.440
<v Speaker 2>just like There's been many times in either of these

0:44:11.480 --> 0:44:13.880
<v Speaker 2>spaces where I've been like, wait, hold up, what'd you

0:44:13.960 --> 0:44:16.719
<v Speaker 2>just say, Like I don't know about that chief, Like

0:44:16.760 --> 0:44:19.000
<v Speaker 2>I don't know if that's I don't know if that's what's.

0:44:18.840 --> 0:44:19.560
<v Speaker 4>Happening right here.

0:44:19.600 --> 0:44:22.040
<v Speaker 2>You you feel me like, you know, even to the

0:44:22.200 --> 0:44:26.919
<v Speaker 2>like to your point about policing and my my read

0:44:27.040 --> 0:44:32.479
<v Speaker 2>on on you know, black community capital C is we're

0:44:32.560 --> 0:44:37.120
<v Speaker 2>rather transactional and pragmatic, like you know, like we're like

0:44:37.160 --> 0:44:40.560
<v Speaker 2>you said, we're not We're not a progressive community. You

0:44:40.600 --> 0:44:45.080
<v Speaker 2>feel me like, we're not necessarily centrist as a political infrastructure,

0:44:45.160 --> 0:44:47.239
<v Speaker 2>you know what I'm saying, but just very transactional, like

0:44:47.280 --> 0:44:49.440
<v Speaker 2>who's gonna who's gonna help us?

0:44:49.760 --> 0:44:49.960
<v Speaker 3>You know?

0:44:51.160 --> 0:44:54.640
<v Speaker 2>And and this idea, like you said, of of the

0:44:54.719 --> 0:44:59.800
<v Speaker 2>grift being a part of like in some senses, feel

0:45:01.920 --> 0:45:04.240
<v Speaker 2>I'm be careful when I say this, but like feels

0:45:04.400 --> 0:45:09.360
<v Speaker 2>almost like within the tradition of being black in America

0:45:09.800 --> 0:45:13.719
<v Speaker 2>is like you have to find a hustle because like

0:45:13.960 --> 0:45:16.799
<v Speaker 2>we you and I have both acknowledged we are the

0:45:16.840 --> 0:45:19.640
<v Speaker 2>bottom of the cast system. They're like, you can't you

0:45:19.680 --> 0:45:22.640
<v Speaker 2>can't just play fair here, you know, because this is

0:45:22.719 --> 0:45:26.000
<v Speaker 2>just what it is. Now, do I agree with that

0:45:26.160 --> 0:45:28.960
<v Speaker 2>or not? Is that in the best interest not only

0:45:29.000 --> 0:45:31.520
<v Speaker 2>of yourself, like I would argue also, which is probably

0:45:31.520 --> 0:45:34.399
<v Speaker 2>the same argument you're making, which is like, not only

0:45:34.480 --> 0:45:36.800
<v Speaker 2>is this a detriment to your community, it's a detriment

0:45:36.840 --> 0:45:40.200
<v Speaker 2>to yourself because like you said, these white people don't

0:45:40.200 --> 0:45:42.120
<v Speaker 2>love you, you know what I'm saying, And they're gonna

0:45:42.200 --> 0:45:44.719
<v Speaker 2>keep pushing you further and further and further away, to

0:45:44.800 --> 0:45:47.120
<v Speaker 2>the point to where again you just become one of

0:45:47.200 --> 0:45:48.680
<v Speaker 2>the one of the Haitians eating cats.

0:45:48.840 --> 0:45:52.040
<v Speaker 4>You will always be that until you are no use

0:45:52.080 --> 0:45:52.960
<v Speaker 4>for us, you know.

0:45:53.400 --> 0:45:56.400
<v Speaker 2>So, so like not only not only you might be

0:45:56.400 --> 0:45:59.839
<v Speaker 2>going for that quick check, but like this is not good.

0:46:00.280 --> 0:46:03.200
<v Speaker 2>I'm telling you that right now, you know, so yeah, so,

0:46:03.320 --> 0:46:05.759
<v Speaker 2>like I agree, the average voter.

0:46:07.200 --> 0:46:08.680
<v Speaker 3>Is like the.

0:46:08.640 --> 0:46:11.319
<v Speaker 2>Interview that you said is listening today, pastor like and

0:46:11.600 --> 0:46:14.759
<v Speaker 2>you know, at our churches, you know. Unfortunately, like you know,

0:46:14.840 --> 0:46:18.800
<v Speaker 2>we've been very historically very anti queer, you know what

0:46:18.840 --> 0:46:22.080
<v Speaker 2>I'm saying, We've been very anti abortion, and and so

0:46:22.120 --> 0:46:24.960
<v Speaker 2>that's what I mean, like to your point, like you know,

0:46:25.040 --> 0:46:28.839
<v Speaker 2>it's it's it's it's a very smaller group of us

0:46:28.840 --> 0:46:32.000
<v Speaker 2>that have like kind of pushed past these like sort

0:46:32.040 --> 0:46:36.600
<v Speaker 2>of convolution of like our faith stances and have like

0:46:36.680 --> 0:46:39.399
<v Speaker 2>pulled pulled the camera back a little bit and been like, oh,

0:46:39.520 --> 0:46:43.920
<v Speaker 2>this is a phyllish slaply project that like you're using

0:46:43.960 --> 0:46:46.960
<v Speaker 2>our views, you know what I'm saying, and speaking about us.

0:46:46.960 --> 0:46:48.680
<v Speaker 2>And I think one of the things that like really

0:46:49.440 --> 0:46:54.839
<v Speaker 2>evolved in my mind was when I realize, like, man,

0:46:54.920 --> 0:47:00.439
<v Speaker 2>y'all talking about this trans community the way you used

0:47:00.440 --> 0:47:03.640
<v Speaker 2>to talk about us, And that made me be like,

0:47:03.760 --> 0:47:07.680
<v Speaker 2>well hold up now, Like I don't again, my antenta

0:47:07.760 --> 0:47:11.360
<v Speaker 2>is like, well, I don't want to sound like y'all

0:47:11.760 --> 0:47:15.319
<v Speaker 2>the way you sound to me when I talk about damn.

0:47:15.440 --> 0:47:19.080
<v Speaker 2>That can't be the way we need to move right,

0:47:19.239 --> 0:47:24.200
<v Speaker 2>Like yeah, So my last thing, yeah, anyway, let me

0:47:24.280 --> 0:47:24.520
<v Speaker 2>let me.

0:47:24.520 --> 0:47:26.000
<v Speaker 3>Get to this last point here was.

0:47:27.960 --> 0:47:31.359
<v Speaker 2>When specifically in this in this in this video, when

0:47:31.400 --> 0:47:36.600
<v Speaker 2>you interviewed, you know, the pastor from Detroit, which I

0:47:36.640 --> 0:47:40.160
<v Speaker 2>think is the example of like the person that's like, bro,

0:47:40.280 --> 0:47:44.160
<v Speaker 2>these are just my values, and I feel like, transactionally speaking,

0:47:44.760 --> 0:47:47.200
<v Speaker 2>this is gonna get our values pushed forward, like I can.

0:47:47.280 --> 0:47:49.759
<v Speaker 4>I could see him truly believing that.

0:47:50.320 --> 0:47:52.799
<v Speaker 2>The thing that gave me pause was when he was like,

0:47:53.160 --> 0:47:55.200
<v Speaker 2>if a friend of mine called and said, I'm a

0:47:55.200 --> 0:47:58.319
<v Speaker 2>man coming in that has thirty six felonies, why would

0:47:58.320 --> 0:48:00.239
<v Speaker 2>I not let him come to my church? My first

0:48:00.239 --> 0:48:03.319
<v Speaker 2>thought was like, you're gonna let him preach, right right?

0:48:03.520 --> 0:48:06.560
<v Speaker 2>Like you know, I'm not asking you, like if you

0:48:06.640 --> 0:48:09.400
<v Speaker 2>let him come, you let him preach, like to me,

0:48:09.640 --> 0:48:18.160
<v Speaker 2>like you can't possibly not understand how that's different, Like

0:48:18.239 --> 0:48:21.160
<v Speaker 2>you no, you didn't just no, no, no, no, no, you

0:48:21.239 --> 0:48:22.359
<v Speaker 2>let him preach.

0:48:23.000 --> 0:48:26.120
<v Speaker 3>To this point. Like I actually asked him that question.

0:48:26.160 --> 0:48:28.239
<v Speaker 1>It didn't make it into the video because we had

0:48:28.239 --> 0:48:30.239
<v Speaker 1>to cut so much out of the video, but I

0:48:30.280 --> 0:48:35.879
<v Speaker 1>asked him that question, and I said exactly that, as

0:48:35.920 --> 0:48:38.080
<v Speaker 1>like you know, I would as a former pastor, I

0:48:38.160 --> 0:48:40.120
<v Speaker 1>of course come through, like come through.

0:48:40.200 --> 0:48:42.439
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, you need to hear this, this life saving word.

0:48:42.960 --> 0:48:46.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah yeah, yeah, But I wouldn't give him the platform,

0:48:47.120 --> 0:48:49.640
<v Speaker 1>and he made the argument that you know, it wasn't

0:48:49.640 --> 0:48:54.280
<v Speaker 1>on a Sunday and that he didn't stand behind the pulpit,

0:48:55.440 --> 0:48:58.560
<v Speaker 1>but he did stand on stage, and the conversation was

0:48:58.680 --> 0:49:02.279
<v Speaker 1>before his congregation, right, And like, I think there's some

0:49:02.400 --> 0:49:03.960
<v Speaker 1>kind of you know, a little bit of like a

0:49:04.080 --> 0:49:07.560
<v Speaker 1>split in hairs kind of thing happening here that I

0:49:07.560 --> 0:49:09.759
<v Speaker 1>I feel like it's worth, you know, making sure his

0:49:09.960 --> 0:49:12.239
<v Speaker 1>perspective is out there, that he didn't feel like he

0:49:12.560 --> 0:49:15.120
<v Speaker 1>gave them the pulpit or let him stand before, you know.

0:49:15.200 --> 0:49:17.520
<v Speaker 1>But but looking at the video, he is on stage, right,

0:49:17.560 --> 0:49:19.760
<v Speaker 1>and like, so so there, I think it's a legitimate question.

0:49:20.440 --> 0:49:22.759
<v Speaker 1>And I would stand by kind of the framing that

0:49:22.800 --> 0:49:25.520
<v Speaker 1>you have that he kind of like basically let him

0:49:25.560 --> 0:49:27.759
<v Speaker 1>stand up there, you know, but he didn't give a

0:49:27.800 --> 0:49:28.600
<v Speaker 1>sermon per se.

0:49:28.680 --> 0:49:30.520
<v Speaker 3>So I want to make sure we're being fair here.

0:49:30.719 --> 0:49:34.279
<v Speaker 1>That said, I I am right there with you, man,

0:49:34.400 --> 0:49:39.000
<v Speaker 1>Like I think that that pastor has some value system

0:49:39.719 --> 0:49:42.839
<v Speaker 1>that has led him to the place where he's at, right,

0:49:44.360 --> 0:49:48.200
<v Speaker 1>But I do wonder about effectiveness, you know, Like there's

0:49:48.239 --> 0:49:51.960
<v Speaker 1>a there's a real question that I think many pastors

0:49:52.000 --> 0:49:55.200
<v Speaker 1>have to ask and answer, which is, like what is

0:49:55.239 --> 0:50:00.279
<v Speaker 1>my role in this moment, And I'm not totally sure

0:50:00.400 --> 0:50:06.440
<v Speaker 1>if like inviting someone so uniquely divisive and with the

0:50:06.600 --> 0:50:10.120
<v Speaker 1>history that that person has, and and then yeah, and

0:50:10.160 --> 0:50:12.040
<v Speaker 1>then if I can come back to this idea of

0:50:12.040 --> 0:50:16.279
<v Speaker 1>the thirty four convictions, I probably as Again I've said

0:50:16.280 --> 0:50:18.719
<v Speaker 1>this a few times as a former pastor, if the

0:50:18.800 --> 0:50:21.520
<v Speaker 1>person who is coming into my church or has been

0:50:21.520 --> 0:50:26.440
<v Speaker 1>invited to my church has sexual assault or has been

0:50:26.480 --> 0:50:31.440
<v Speaker 1>criminally liable for rate, if that person's being invited, I

0:50:31.480 --> 0:50:33.640
<v Speaker 1>actually have a few more questions before I say yes.

0:50:34.160 --> 0:50:36.839
<v Speaker 1>I actually have a few more questions. We need to

0:50:36.880 --> 0:50:40.160
<v Speaker 1>figure some out, figure out some boundaries. Who's who is

0:50:40.239 --> 0:50:43.000
<v Speaker 1>at risk in this moment? Am I putting someone who's

0:50:43.040 --> 0:50:46.160
<v Speaker 1>maybe sexually assaulted and this is a hypothetical sexually assault

0:50:46.160 --> 0:50:48.400
<v Speaker 1>to a child? Am I putting that person in a

0:50:48.400 --> 0:50:51.319
<v Speaker 1>position to have access to more children? I'd you know, like,

0:50:51.360 --> 0:50:53.560
<v Speaker 1>if is this a person who does not have control

0:50:53.600 --> 0:50:56.440
<v Speaker 1>over themselves and says that they'll grab people by it?

0:50:56.560 --> 0:50:57.759
<v Speaker 3>I don't want to have to go down that road.

0:50:57.840 --> 0:51:00.520
<v Speaker 1>But my point is like, there is a response ability

0:51:00.560 --> 0:51:03.440
<v Speaker 1>beyond the inviting everyone in, and not to make this

0:51:03.480 --> 0:51:06.560
<v Speaker 1>all about that particular pastor I had some questions though

0:51:06.719 --> 0:51:11.440
<v Speaker 1>about about the framing of that issue and whether or

0:51:11.520 --> 0:51:14.319
<v Speaker 1>not even values in mind, if this was the right

0:51:14.360 --> 0:51:17.720
<v Speaker 1>person to to to serve as a vehicle for those values.

0:51:18.080 --> 0:51:18.600
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

0:51:18.840 --> 0:51:21.960
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I'm like I have I have cousins. I

0:51:21.960 --> 0:51:23.640
<v Speaker 2>don't bring around my children, you.

0:51:23.560 --> 0:51:26.640
<v Speaker 4>Know, like it or like blood related you know that.

0:51:26.760 --> 0:51:29.319
<v Speaker 2>I'm like, I don't know, gee, like this is not

0:51:30.040 --> 0:51:33.120
<v Speaker 2>it's not wise. I love you, I'll meet with you,

0:51:33.120 --> 0:51:34.640
<v Speaker 2>you know what I'm saying, But like, am I going

0:51:34.719 --> 0:51:35.840
<v Speaker 2>to bring you around my family?

0:51:35.880 --> 0:51:41.680
<v Speaker 3>Probably not? Probably not, probably not. You know what I'm saying.

0:51:41.719 --> 0:51:43.759
<v Speaker 2>Sometimes you got to like this is just one of

0:51:43.760 --> 0:51:46.600
<v Speaker 2>those like realities of you know, living in the broken

0:51:46.640 --> 0:51:49.920
<v Speaker 2>system we live in. I think you you you you

0:51:50.000 --> 0:51:52.719
<v Speaker 2>hit the knit head on the nail to nail on

0:51:52.760 --> 0:51:57.040
<v Speaker 2>the head. That's what I'm saying about kind of actually

0:51:57.040 --> 0:51:59.719
<v Speaker 2>going back to like what do we mean by what

0:51:59.760 --> 0:52:01.000
<v Speaker 2>do you mean by felony?

0:52:01.200 --> 0:52:02.720
<v Speaker 4>Like what do you mean by crime?

0:52:02.920 --> 0:52:03.080
<v Speaker 3>You know?

0:52:03.160 --> 0:52:07.040
<v Speaker 2>And I think that like this is where having a

0:52:07.920 --> 0:52:12.280
<v Speaker 2>real understanding of what policing and law and criminal justice

0:52:12.280 --> 0:52:15.960
<v Speaker 2>means in America could have because you know, crime is

0:52:16.080 --> 0:52:19.080
<v Speaker 2>crime is also racialized. Crime is also cultural, Like you know.

0:52:19.560 --> 0:52:23.440
<v Speaker 2>Is like if when it's a you know, when it's

0:52:23.480 --> 0:52:28.319
<v Speaker 2>a natural disaster in a white community, you're scavenging. If

0:52:28.320 --> 0:52:30.680
<v Speaker 2>it's in a black community, you're looting. You know, it's

0:52:30.760 --> 0:52:32.799
<v Speaker 2>the same thing. You know what I'm saying, We're doing

0:52:32.840 --> 0:52:35.200
<v Speaker 2>the same thing. I'm just surviving. So you said, I'm

0:52:35.239 --> 0:52:37.879
<v Speaker 2>this is the crime of looting. I'm like, I don't know, bro.

0:52:38.040 --> 0:52:41.240
<v Speaker 2>Like so he got convicted of looting during the Hurricane Katrina.

0:52:41.400 --> 0:52:43.680
<v Speaker 4>Like, I don't know, bro, that was I don't know.

0:52:43.600 --> 0:52:44.959
<v Speaker 3>If that was looting. You know what I'm saying.

0:52:44.960 --> 0:52:48.759
<v Speaker 2>So, like, like you said, having those extra questions and

0:52:49.000 --> 0:52:51.520
<v Speaker 2>but again I GA think back to your to your

0:52:51.520 --> 0:52:55.200
<v Speaker 2>original point. It's it is because we have accepted the

0:52:55.239 --> 0:52:59.800
<v Speaker 2>reality that systemic racism exists.

0:53:00.160 --> 0:53:00.399
<v Speaker 3>Yep.

0:53:00.719 --> 0:53:03.600
<v Speaker 2>So since this is the reality when you walk in

0:53:03.640 --> 0:53:05.640
<v Speaker 2>with with the amount of felonies. I have a friend that

0:53:05.840 --> 0:53:09.920
<v Speaker 2>like was in the back of a car like that

0:53:09.960 --> 0:53:11.480
<v Speaker 2>one to high school with. He's sleep in the back

0:53:11.520 --> 0:53:14.239
<v Speaker 2>after basketball practice while his two friends pulled over and

0:53:14.800 --> 0:53:16.799
<v Speaker 2>broke this breaking and enery robbed a house.

0:53:17.239 --> 0:53:18.440
<v Speaker 3>Wow, he's a felon.

0:53:19.200 --> 0:53:21.480
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I'm saying, but in the back of the car,

0:53:21.760 --> 0:53:23.920
<v Speaker 2>you just see what I'm saying, so I'm like those things,

0:53:24.320 --> 0:53:27.560
<v Speaker 2>those things require a little more interrogation.

0:53:28.120 --> 0:53:28.359
<v Speaker 3>I think.

0:53:28.520 --> 0:53:32.240
<v Speaker 2>I think I'll end with this one, which specifically speaks

0:53:32.239 --> 0:53:34.400
<v Speaker 2>to the black community and the black community that I

0:53:34.480 --> 0:53:36.760
<v Speaker 2>hope to talk to, I think in a lot of ways,

0:53:37.719 --> 0:53:38.759
<v Speaker 2>and and.

0:53:38.400 --> 0:53:39.600
<v Speaker 4>And Latino community.

0:53:39.640 --> 0:53:39.920
<v Speaker 3>I'm from.

0:53:39.960 --> 0:53:41.920
<v Speaker 2>I'm from the East side of Los Angeles, you know. So,

0:53:42.040 --> 0:53:44.719
<v Speaker 2>like we do a lot of interaction with black and

0:53:44.760 --> 0:53:47.520
<v Speaker 2>brown issues out here, and that's been really a passion

0:53:47.880 --> 0:53:49.080
<v Speaker 2>not only for my life.

0:53:48.800 --> 0:53:50.719
<v Speaker 4>But specifically for this podcast.

0:53:51.040 --> 0:53:55.600
<v Speaker 2>And what I found was the the Trump thing for

0:53:55.920 --> 0:54:00.600
<v Speaker 2>at like the street level, they understand it, you know,

0:54:00.760 --> 0:54:03.000
<v Speaker 2>they understand him. It's like I can never be wrong.

0:54:03.280 --> 0:54:05.080
<v Speaker 2>I'm the boss. He get to the he get to

0:54:05.120 --> 0:54:07.799
<v Speaker 2>the money. You feel me, you know, you know, so

0:54:08.000 --> 0:54:12.880
<v Speaker 2>there's there's an understanding of how he moves, which to

0:54:12.960 --> 0:54:14.920
<v Speaker 2>which most of us should respond.

0:54:14.960 --> 0:54:16.399
<v Speaker 4>Would then maybe he shouldn't be the.

0:54:16.320 --> 0:54:19.960
<v Speaker 2>President if like, if he moved like Pooky in them,

0:54:20.000 --> 0:54:23.360
<v Speaker 2>then like maybe maybe this ain't our guy. You feel me,

0:54:24.280 --> 0:54:29.880
<v Speaker 2>but you have that being said, that sort of understanding

0:54:29.960 --> 0:54:36.040
<v Speaker 2>of like, well, this is something I'm familiar with and

0:54:36.560 --> 0:54:39.400
<v Speaker 2>makes sense to me. Then you fast forward to somebody

0:54:39.440 --> 0:54:42.719
<v Speaker 2>like a sexy Red that was like, well, I like

0:54:42.760 --> 0:54:44.880
<v Speaker 2>Trump because he got me the stemmis.

0:54:44.640 --> 0:54:44.880
<v Speaker 3>You know.

0:54:46.000 --> 0:54:50.640
<v Speaker 2>And again, I don't want to participate in the same

0:54:50.760 --> 0:54:54.440
<v Speaker 2>anti blackness that was happening with the generation before, with

0:54:54.520 --> 0:54:56.520
<v Speaker 2>the crime bills and such like that, and you know

0:54:56.520 --> 0:54:58.080
<v Speaker 2>what I'm saying, and just kind of sort of like

0:54:58.440 --> 0:55:02.319
<v Speaker 2>play the respectability politics, you know, and just these young

0:55:02.400 --> 0:55:04.000
<v Speaker 2>niggas is weird, you know what I'm saying, Like I

0:55:04.040 --> 0:55:04.600
<v Speaker 2>don't want to.

0:55:05.160 --> 0:55:06.879
<v Speaker 4>Participate into in that.

0:55:08.520 --> 0:55:12.600
<v Speaker 2>However, that way of thinking is so in a lot

0:55:12.600 --> 0:55:14.520
<v Speaker 2>of times for me, it's like it's a little heartbreaking

0:55:15.040 --> 0:55:17.040
<v Speaker 2>in the sense that I'm like, Okay, so he got

0:55:17.080 --> 0:55:19.760
<v Speaker 2>you fourteen hundred dollars for four years. That's not even

0:55:20.360 --> 0:55:23.840
<v Speaker 2>a that's not even one month's rent, right right, right?

0:55:24.000 --> 0:55:28.600
<v Speaker 2>Four years? Like is this really? That's really? That's really

0:55:28.680 --> 0:55:33.360
<v Speaker 2>all it took was just fourteen I don't even know

0:55:33.400 --> 0:55:36.880
<v Speaker 2>where my question is in this, but just uh, I

0:55:36.920 --> 0:55:40.160
<v Speaker 2>hear the question though, Yeah, Like how how do we engage?

0:55:40.200 --> 0:55:42.319
<v Speaker 2>Like I said at the beginning, it's like I need to,

0:55:42.520 --> 0:55:44.719
<v Speaker 2>I need to I need you at the table, like

0:55:44.880 --> 0:55:48.200
<v Speaker 2>so like I'm not going to speak in a way

0:55:48.280 --> 0:55:51.520
<v Speaker 2>that's like down to you and come up as a leaders.

0:55:51.640 --> 0:55:55.080
<v Speaker 2>That being said, I am we are clearly more informed,

0:55:55.560 --> 0:55:58.120
<v Speaker 2>you know what I'm saying, So like what are your

0:55:58.200 --> 0:56:00.400
<v Speaker 2>what are your thoughts on, like how do we keep

0:56:00.800 --> 0:56:03.719
<v Speaker 2>the young homies at the table, you know, and being

0:56:03.760 --> 0:56:05.279
<v Speaker 2>able to say, like one of the things that we've

0:56:05.320 --> 0:56:08.880
<v Speaker 2>talked about on our show was like real political power

0:56:09.000 --> 0:56:11.560
<v Speaker 2>versus like astroturfing, you know what I'm saying, where it's like,

0:56:11.920 --> 0:56:16.080
<v Speaker 2>I know, you know lo Homie Trey, Little City James,

0:56:16.120 --> 0:56:19.439
<v Speaker 2>Like if he shoots a text out like hey, we're

0:56:19.440 --> 0:56:21.239
<v Speaker 2>gonna meet on you know what I'm saying, We're gonna

0:56:21.280 --> 0:56:25.279
<v Speaker 2>be on on on Crenshawn'slaws, and you know I need

0:56:25.360 --> 0:56:26.760
<v Speaker 2>I need one hundred and fifty people.

0:56:27.160 --> 0:56:28.520
<v Speaker 4>Three hundred people are coming.

0:56:28.600 --> 0:56:29.280
<v Speaker 3>Off a text.

0:56:29.560 --> 0:56:32.240
<v Speaker 4>I'm like, that's that's real political power.

0:56:32.719 --> 0:56:34.600
<v Speaker 3>You can organize, you know what I'm saying.

0:56:35.040 --> 0:56:37.520
<v Speaker 2>So because they're actually coming, you know what I'm saying,

0:56:37.600 --> 0:56:40.080
<v Speaker 2>So like the to me, it's like these are the

0:56:40.120 --> 0:56:43.319
<v Speaker 2>people that if I'm gonna if we're gonna onboard them

0:56:43.360 --> 0:56:47.600
<v Speaker 2>into like really imagining a black future, I need somebody

0:56:47.680 --> 0:56:49.960
<v Speaker 2>like this at the table. So my question is like, yeah,

0:56:50.000 --> 0:56:51.680
<v Speaker 2>if you could figure out the question and They're like,

0:56:51.680 --> 0:56:53.000
<v Speaker 2>how do we keep them engaged?

0:56:53.200 --> 0:56:54.600
<v Speaker 3>No, I think that's in a conversation.

0:56:54.760 --> 0:56:57.360
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I think it's the right the right question, and

0:56:57.400 --> 0:56:59.000
<v Speaker 1>this is the right conversation for us to be having

0:56:59.120 --> 0:57:02.600
<v Speaker 1>right now because people are interested. It's more, it's so

0:57:02.640 --> 0:57:05.279
<v Speaker 1>important to have this conversation now because people are tuned in.

0:57:05.560 --> 0:57:07.959
<v Speaker 3>It's even more important to have it in a year.

0:57:08.040 --> 0:57:11.000
<v Speaker 1>It's even more important than two years, right, And so

0:57:11.280 --> 0:57:16.280
<v Speaker 1>I think for me, it starts with understanding that people

0:57:16.360 --> 0:57:20.560
<v Speaker 1>are rightfully cynical about what's happening right now. Right there's

0:57:20.680 --> 0:57:23.000
<v Speaker 1>a new study that came out about the Black vote,

0:57:23.080 --> 0:57:25.880
<v Speaker 1>National Black Voter Values, and it talks about this group

0:57:25.880 --> 0:57:28.680
<v Speaker 1>of people, this significant group of people about twenty percent

0:57:29.120 --> 0:57:33.480
<v Speaker 1>who are black voters potential Black voters, but are cynical.

0:57:33.760 --> 0:57:36.000
<v Speaker 1>And many of the folks in that kind of cohort

0:57:36.080 --> 0:57:38.840
<v Speaker 1>are black men. And I think it's actually really appropriate

0:57:38.880 --> 0:57:40.960
<v Speaker 1>for us to kind of like land here because we

0:57:41.000 --> 0:57:44.560
<v Speaker 1>talked earlier about the nineteen ninety four crime bill that

0:57:44.680 --> 0:57:48.880
<v Speaker 1>disproportionately criminalized black men us black men.

0:57:49.200 --> 0:57:49.680
<v Speaker 3>You come to.

0:57:49.600 --> 0:57:52.600
<v Speaker 1>Twenty twenty four, thirty years later, and black men. I've

0:57:52.600 --> 0:57:55.960
<v Speaker 1>talked to dozens, dozens of black men who are voting

0:57:56.000 --> 0:57:58.040
<v Speaker 1>age who are like, I'm not dealing with that, I'm

0:57:58.080 --> 0:57:59.959
<v Speaker 1>not engaged with Yes, I'm trying to get my money

0:58:00.160 --> 0:58:01.960
<v Speaker 1>and I'm gonna take care of my family and I'm

0:58:01.960 --> 0:58:03.560
<v Speaker 1>gonna be fine, and they gonna do what they're gonna

0:58:03.560 --> 0:58:09.919
<v Speaker 1>do anyway, Right, that cynical kind of that cynicism is warranted.

0:58:10.400 --> 0:58:14.000
<v Speaker 1>It is fat like it is so like like it

0:58:14.120 --> 0:58:17.880
<v Speaker 1>makes sense. I get it. You say it, I get it.

0:58:17.920 --> 0:58:20.919
<v Speaker 1>As a black man, I get it. You see it.

0:58:21.040 --> 0:58:24.560
<v Speaker 1>Sometimes it feels like you see everybody else moving forward,

0:58:25.000 --> 0:58:28.800
<v Speaker 1>rising up, getting it, going to college, getting opportunities, working

0:58:28.840 --> 0:58:31.120
<v Speaker 1>like these culdhy like work from home jobs. It feels

0:58:31.120 --> 0:58:33.120
<v Speaker 1>like everybody's doing that. But the black men in my

0:58:33.160 --> 0:58:38.000
<v Speaker 1>life are stuck working nine to five doing manual lookers

0:58:38.560 --> 0:58:42.000
<v Speaker 1>on the floor, throwing bags under planes, feel like they

0:58:42.000 --> 0:58:45.160
<v Speaker 1>can't get ahead. And so I feel like, to keep

0:58:45.200 --> 0:58:47.720
<v Speaker 1>folks engaged, you got to start there. I mean, this

0:58:47.880 --> 0:58:51.120
<v Speaker 1>is like the most basic kind of gospel principle. I

0:58:51.200 --> 0:58:52.960
<v Speaker 1>know this isn't a Christian thing, but like you know

0:58:53.000 --> 0:58:55.640
<v Speaker 1>what I'm saying, Yeah, it really feels that way, right.

0:58:55.680 --> 0:58:59.080
<v Speaker 1>It feels like, Yo, look at the way that folks

0:58:59.360 --> 0:59:02.520
<v Speaker 1>who are are really trying to push forward a positive message.

0:59:02.760 --> 0:59:05.200
<v Speaker 1>You have to meet people where they are, and you

0:59:05.280 --> 0:59:08.040
<v Speaker 1>have to engage with folks on their basic need level

0:59:08.400 --> 0:59:11.000
<v Speaker 1>before you get started talking all this stuff. I really

0:59:11.040 --> 0:59:12.720
<v Speaker 1>have a lot to say here, So please forgive me

0:59:12.720 --> 0:59:14.480
<v Speaker 1>if I go on, no, like, go off, go of,

0:59:15.080 --> 0:59:17.400
<v Speaker 1>I'm gonna say this, man. I was in Atlanta a

0:59:17.480 --> 0:59:20.440
<v Speaker 1>few weeks ago reporting for this thing I'm doing for NPR,

0:59:20.840 --> 0:59:24.080
<v Speaker 1>and one of the interesting things that kept coming up

0:59:24.120 --> 0:59:26.400
<v Speaker 1>against is that when I'm in southwest Atlanta, I'm talking

0:59:26.440 --> 0:59:28.440
<v Speaker 1>like Cascade Beach or Hills, Sylvan Hills.

0:59:28.640 --> 0:59:31.720
<v Speaker 3>Yeah yeah, yeah, like the commune and you know, the hood.

0:59:31.800 --> 0:59:34.000
<v Speaker 4>Yeah yeah, yeah, no, no, I know where we're at.

0:59:34.040 --> 0:59:34.800
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, like that.

0:59:34.880 --> 0:59:36.760
<v Speaker 1>That's where I'm at, and I grew up not far

0:59:36.800 --> 0:59:38.640
<v Speaker 1>from there. My mom went to Sylvia High School in

0:59:38.680 --> 0:59:40.400
<v Speaker 1>the eighties. And so my point is, like, when I'm

0:59:40.440 --> 0:59:43.200
<v Speaker 1>down there, this is a community that has been the

0:59:43.200 --> 0:59:46.560
<v Speaker 1>hood for as long as I've been living, my mom's

0:59:46.560 --> 0:59:50.080
<v Speaker 1>whole life, and it is that way today, boarded up homes,

0:59:50.240 --> 0:59:52.200
<v Speaker 1>very transient, mostly renters.

0:59:52.240 --> 0:59:53.720
<v Speaker 3>Like, it's that kind of community.

0:59:53.760 --> 0:59:56.720
<v Speaker 1>And when I'm talking to people and their material conditions

0:59:57.120 --> 1:00:00.680
<v Speaker 1>did not change under Clinton. Whenever body was talking about

1:00:00.720 --> 1:00:03.120
<v Speaker 1>we're in economic boom. They did not change under Bush.

1:00:03.200 --> 1:00:05.439
<v Speaker 1>They're in bad shape under Bush, they were in bad

1:00:05.480 --> 1:00:08.280
<v Speaker 1>shape under Obama, they were in bad shape under Trump,

1:00:08.360 --> 1:00:11.480
<v Speaker 1>they were in bad shape under Biden. And now folks

1:00:11.520 --> 1:00:13.959
<v Speaker 1>are knocking on their door to tell you, tell them, hey, man,

1:00:14.520 --> 1:00:18.040
<v Speaker 1>you really gotta vote for Kamala Harris otherwise your life

1:00:18.080 --> 1:00:19.040
<v Speaker 1>is going to be really hard.

1:00:19.040 --> 1:00:22.360
<v Speaker 3>And they're like, my life has been hard. Yeah, help

1:00:22.560 --> 1:00:25.240
<v Speaker 3>helped me understand the difference. What's the difference?

1:00:25.640 --> 1:00:29.360
<v Speaker 1>That's the good. You have to acknowledge that this is

1:00:29.400 --> 1:00:31.320
<v Speaker 1>the reality. Now, where do we go from here? Now

1:00:31.320 --> 1:00:33.600
<v Speaker 1>we've acknowledged that this is the reality for many Americas,

1:00:33.600 --> 1:00:34.600
<v Speaker 1>many black Americans.

1:00:34.640 --> 1:00:35.600
<v Speaker 3>Where do we go from here?

1:00:36.320 --> 1:00:39.240
<v Speaker 1>I like to look at the number of votes in

1:00:39.360 --> 1:00:44.440
<v Speaker 1>each precinct, in each district, and oftentimes, man, it's a

1:00:44.480 --> 1:00:49.520
<v Speaker 1>couple hundred votes. Like oftentimes you're electing whole city council

1:00:49.560 --> 1:00:53.320
<v Speaker 1>members off of three thousand votes. So if you got

1:00:53.320 --> 1:00:56.960
<v Speaker 1>a guy who can mobilize one hundred and fifty three

1:00:57.080 --> 1:01:01.600
<v Speaker 1>hundred people, yeah, next tell you that your your point

1:01:01.680 --> 1:01:04.560
<v Speaker 1>is well to, is well made. That is political power.

1:01:04.920 --> 1:01:08.720
<v Speaker 1>If you can get that person to mobilize three hundred

1:01:08.760 --> 1:01:10.720
<v Speaker 1>people for four or five days straight.

1:01:11.200 --> 1:01:12.920
<v Speaker 3>You own it strong.

1:01:13.040 --> 1:01:17.080
<v Speaker 1>But you basically have chosen that's the person who will

1:01:17.160 --> 1:01:18.000
<v Speaker 1>represent your district.

1:01:18.120 --> 1:01:19.160
<v Speaker 3>You've chosen that person.

1:01:19.200 --> 1:01:21.880
<v Speaker 1>Now you are now the power broker for your district

1:01:21.960 --> 1:01:25.680
<v Speaker 1>because you know you can always mobilize enough folks to

1:01:25.720 --> 1:01:28.280
<v Speaker 1>get a person elected or to get a person removed.

1:01:28.560 --> 1:01:30.960
<v Speaker 1>And that's real power. That's real power that I don't

1:01:31.000 --> 1:01:34.200
<v Speaker 1>think that we've been told that we can actually affect.

1:01:34.360 --> 1:01:36.560
<v Speaker 1>I'll give a quick example. I live on a road

1:01:36.600 --> 1:01:39.760
<v Speaker 1>that's mad fast. I've been lobbying my city council member

1:01:40.280 --> 1:01:43.120
<v Speaker 1>for the last few months to slow this road down.

1:01:43.600 --> 1:01:47.280
<v Speaker 1>We just got a little speed sign thing that just

1:01:47.320 --> 1:01:50.560
<v Speaker 1>flashes how fast you're going. It's a step, right, it's

1:01:50.560 --> 1:01:53.479
<v Speaker 1>a step. And the thing is, when I called her

1:01:53.840 --> 1:01:56.440
<v Speaker 1>and said, hey, my role is kind of fast like it.

1:01:57.080 --> 1:01:57.720
<v Speaker 3>It bothers me.

1:01:57.760 --> 1:02:00.360
<v Speaker 1>I'm sitting at home on a Sunday watching people drive

1:02:00.400 --> 1:02:01.560
<v Speaker 1>way too fast down my road.

1:02:02.320 --> 1:02:02.520
<v Speaker 3>Yep.

1:02:02.800 --> 1:02:04.760
<v Speaker 1>She's like, well, you're the first person to call about this.

1:02:05.520 --> 1:02:07.800
<v Speaker 1>I'm the first person. It's like hundreds of people that

1:02:07.800 --> 1:02:08.439
<v Speaker 1>live on this road.

1:02:08.480 --> 1:02:08.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

1:02:08.920 --> 1:02:12.160
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and I'm the first person to call. Your voice

1:02:12.400 --> 1:02:14.960
<v Speaker 1>is actually so much. When you call your council member,

1:02:15.000 --> 1:02:16.840
<v Speaker 1>when you call your center, when you call your representative,

1:02:16.840 --> 1:02:18.840
<v Speaker 1>when you go to the mayor's office and you show up,

1:02:19.080 --> 1:02:21.360
<v Speaker 1>you are probably one of twenty five people who've shown up,

1:02:21.360 --> 1:02:23.400
<v Speaker 1>and all twenty four of the other people are like

1:02:23.440 --> 1:02:25.720
<v Speaker 1>all white women, all white say because they know how

1:02:25.760 --> 1:02:27.480
<v Speaker 1>to work it. They go get where they will how

1:02:27.480 --> 1:02:30.480
<v Speaker 1>to and so like you can have. What I'm trying

1:02:30.520 --> 1:02:33.160
<v Speaker 1>to say is like the government is not complicated. They

1:02:33.200 --> 1:02:35.680
<v Speaker 1>want you to think it's complicated, because then you kind

1:02:35.680 --> 1:02:37.640
<v Speaker 1>of get a little like brain fog and you feel like.

1:02:37.560 --> 1:02:39.000
<v Speaker 3>It's not really worth it. I'm just go do what

1:02:39.040 --> 1:02:40.720
<v Speaker 3>I gotta do. It's not complicated.

1:02:40.800 --> 1:02:43.919
<v Speaker 1>Show up, pull your homies together to show up, pull

1:02:43.960 --> 1:02:47.080
<v Speaker 1>your community together to show up, talk to people, and.

1:02:48.680 --> 1:02:51.040
<v Speaker 3>It'll work. And so that's that's what I say.

1:02:51.240 --> 1:02:54.080
<v Speaker 1>First of all, acknowledge what's going on, acknowledge the factor

1:02:54.040 --> 1:02:57.520
<v Speaker 1>that folks are rightfully cynical. And then second, let's create

1:02:57.600 --> 1:03:00.440
<v Speaker 1>some pathways. Let's give some actual next step for how

1:03:00.480 --> 1:03:01.200
<v Speaker 1>to engage.

1:03:01.560 --> 1:03:07.120
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, bro, this couldn't have been better. It's like you

1:03:07.200 --> 1:03:10.760
<v Speaker 2>even like I mean, the cornerstone premise of this show

1:03:10.840 --> 1:03:13.240
<v Speaker 2>is what you just said, is that government's not that complicated.

1:03:13.240 --> 1:03:15.320
<v Speaker 2>You understand this more than you think you do. Oh yeah,

1:03:15.400 --> 1:03:18.920
<v Speaker 2>you know, and in a lot of ways. Again, one

1:03:18.960 --> 1:03:21.840
<v Speaker 2>of our cornerstone premises is like you've actually been doing

1:03:22.760 --> 1:03:26.680
<v Speaker 2>politics your whole life, like you've already been doing it,

1:03:26.680 --> 1:03:30.400
<v Speaker 2>it's just by a different name. Garson, Thank you so

1:03:30.480 --> 1:03:33.440
<v Speaker 2>much for doing this with us. Man, Can you please

1:03:33.520 --> 1:03:36.440
<v Speaker 2>plug all your plugs of like where they could follow you,

1:03:36.480 --> 1:03:37.640
<v Speaker 2>where they could see your videos?

1:03:37.720 --> 1:03:39.320
<v Speaker 3>All that for sure? For sure.

1:03:40.320 --> 1:03:42.560
<v Speaker 1>First of all, probably is a real honor. I don't

1:03:42.680 --> 1:03:45.560
<v Speaker 1>say that lightly. It's amazing to be here. Long time

1:03:45.560 --> 1:03:46.920
<v Speaker 1>admirer of your work.

1:03:47.280 --> 1:03:49.560
<v Speaker 3>Man, don't tell me that, bro, Thank you man, serious,

1:03:49.640 --> 1:03:50.240
<v Speaker 3>I'm serious.

1:03:51.120 --> 1:03:53.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And so I'll say you can follow me on

1:03:53.920 --> 1:03:57.480
<v Speaker 1>social media's I'm Garrison Hayes on everything, at Garrison h

1:03:57.640 --> 1:04:01.680
<v Speaker 1>on Instagram, at Garrison hat on TikTok, at Harrison Haes

1:04:01.720 --> 1:04:03.680
<v Speaker 1>on YouTube, and you can find the link to the

1:04:03.680 --> 1:04:05.960
<v Speaker 1>rest of my stuff from any of those places in

1:04:05.960 --> 1:04:07.480
<v Speaker 1>my podiot that's.

1:04:07.280 --> 1:04:07.840
<v Speaker 4>What it is.

1:04:09.120 --> 1:04:12.840
<v Speaker 2>Once again, thank you so much, and please lock in

1:04:12.880 --> 1:04:15.680
<v Speaker 2>with this brilliant brain right here doing amazing stuff down

1:04:15.680 --> 1:04:16.720
<v Speaker 2>there in the A.

1:04:16.720 --> 1:04:20.520
<v Speaker 4>Appreciate you, all right, y'all appreciate you. I get stop

1:04:20.760 --> 1:04:22.080
<v Speaker 4>and we're good. Zoe though.

1:04:34.800 --> 1:04:36.880
<v Speaker 2>All right, now, don't you hit stop on this pod.

1:04:37.360 --> 1:04:39.280
<v Speaker 2>You better listen to these credits. I need you to

1:04:39.360 --> 1:04:43.120
<v Speaker 2>finish this thing so I can get the download numbers. Okay,

1:04:43.600 --> 1:04:47.720
<v Speaker 2>so don't stop it yet, but listen. This was recorded

1:04:47.840 --> 1:04:52.400
<v Speaker 2>in East Lost boil Heights by your boy Propaganda. Tap

1:04:52.480 --> 1:04:55.160
<v Speaker 2>in with me at prop hip hop dot com. If

1:04:55.160 --> 1:04:58.520
<v Speaker 2>you're in the Coldbrew coffee we got Terraform Coldbrew. You

1:04:58.520 --> 1:05:02.120
<v Speaker 2>can go there dot com and use promo code hood

1:05:02.120 --> 1:05:06.320
<v Speaker 2>get twenty percent off get yourself some coffee. This was mixed, edited,

1:05:06.440 --> 1:05:10.200
<v Speaker 2>and mastered by your boy Matt Alsowski Killing the Beat Softly.

1:05:10.280 --> 1:05:13.160
<v Speaker 2>Check out his website Mattowsowski dot com.

1:05:13.280 --> 1:05:15.080
<v Speaker 4>I'm a speller for you because I.

1:05:15.080 --> 1:05:20.480
<v Speaker 2>Know M A T T O S O W s

1:05:20.920 --> 1:05:24.919
<v Speaker 2>ki dot com Matthowsowski dot com. He got more music

1:05:24.920 --> 1:05:27.440
<v Speaker 2>and stuff like that on there, so gonna check out

1:05:27.480 --> 1:05:30.560
<v Speaker 2>The heat Politics is a member of Cool Zone Media,

1:05:31.120 --> 1:05:36.280
<v Speaker 2>executive produced by Sophie Lichterman, part of the iHeartMedia podcast network.

1:05:36.960 --> 1:05:39.440
<v Speaker 2>Your theme music and scoring is also by the one

1:05:39.440 --> 1:05:43.440
<v Speaker 2>and nobly Matt Awsowski. Still killing the Beat Softly, so listen.

1:05:43.960 --> 1:05:46.760
<v Speaker 2>Don't let nobody lie to you. If you understand urban living,

1:05:46.800 --> 1:05:49.920
<v Speaker 2>you understand politics. These people is not smarter than you.

1:05:50.240 --> 1:05:51.280
<v Speaker 2>We'll see y'all next week.

1:06:00.880 --> 1:06:02.800
<v Speaker 3>Addition one