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Speaker 1: Welcome to Haunted Road, a production of iHeartRadio and Grimm

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Speaker 1: and Mild from Aaron Manky listener. Discretion is advised sitting

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Speaker 1: at the end of a long, tree lined driveway. The

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Speaker 1: White Hill Mansion in Fieldsborough, New Jersey has always held secrets.

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Speaker 1: During the American Revolution, the home concealed colonial troops from

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Speaker 1: British and German forces. Later, political leaders use tucked away

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Speaker 1: upstairs spaces for clandestine rendezvous. The attic once held a bordello,

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Speaker 1: and when one of the owners was arrested for bootlegging

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Speaker 1: during Prohibition, officials found more than one thousand gallons of

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Speaker 1: liquor hidden on the property. Today, the secrets of the

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Speaker 1: White Hill Mansion are different. They come from darkened corners

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Speaker 1: where voices call out when no one is there. They

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Speaker 1: shuffle up the stairs at night, in visible footsteps on

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Speaker 1: empty staircases. They even come from above the studding sounds

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Speaker 1: from higher floors that some have described as reminiscent of

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Speaker 1: a body being dragged across a floor. I'm Amy Bruney,

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Speaker 1: and this is Haunted Road. In seventeen twenty two, Robert

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Speaker 1: Field purchased three hundred acres of land in Whitehill, a Borough,

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Speaker 1: near Trenton, New Jersey. Almost twenty years later, he built

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Speaker 1: a Georgian style home on the property, the beginnings of

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Speaker 1: the White Hill Mansion that sits there today. Field's son,

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Speaker 1: Robert Field the second, inherited the property in seventeen fifty seven.

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Speaker 1: A prominent lawyer, Robert the second expanded the home and

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Speaker 1: established more businesses on the property, not only a farm

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Speaker 1: and orchard, but also a fishery and distillery. Robert and

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Speaker 1: his wife Mary Peel Field had seven children, although only

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Speaker 1: three Lydia, Mary and Robert lived to see adulthood. As

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Speaker 1: the businesses prospered, Robert's profile grew in the community. In

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Speaker 1: seventeen seventy four, he was appointed to the Committee of

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Speaker 1: Correspondence of New Jersey, which was attempting to get American

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Speaker 1: representation in the British Parliament. Field even wrote some of

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Speaker 1: their material himself. On the night of January twenty ninth,

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Speaker 1: seventeen seventy five, Robert Field the second drowned in the

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Speaker 1: nearby Delaware River under very mysterious circumstances. It's believed that

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Speaker 1: the boat was being rowed by a British sympathizer, either

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Speaker 1: a spy for King George or a loyalist. The boat'smen

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Speaker 1: allegedly hit Robert in the head with an oar, knocking

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Speaker 1: him unconscious, and threw him in the river. Some have

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Speaker 1: speculated that Field had discovered that the man was a

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Speaker 1: spy and was planning to turn him in. According to

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Speaker 1: a contemporary newspaper report in Dunlap and Claypool's American Daily Advertiser,

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Speaker 1: Robert was going in a canoe on board his shallop

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Speaker 1: when he unfortunately fell over and was drowned. He had

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Speaker 1: only his companion with him, whose threw over the paddle

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Speaker 1: to him, but mister Field sunk immediately. By this untimely accident,

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Speaker 1: his relations, friends and neighbors have lost a worthy and

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Speaker 1: agreeable companion. The Fields were slave owners, so it's likely

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Speaker 1: that the man in the boat was enslaved by him.

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Speaker 1: According to a family genealogy reported through the National Register

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Speaker 1: of Historic Places, his death has always been involved in mystery.

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Speaker 1: He was going down to Philadelphia from his home at

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Speaker 1: Whitehill on a sloop. He left the sloop for a

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Speaker 1: few hours during a calm and went on shore to

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Speaker 1: call on a pioneer. When the wind arose at twelve

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Speaker 1: o'clock at night, the captain sent a rowboat for him,

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Speaker 1: attended by one man. When the boat reached the sloop,

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Speaker 1: he was missing and was never heard from again, although

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Speaker 1: every effort was made to recover his body. Mary peel

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Speaker 1: Field was five months pregnant with their seventh child at

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Speaker 1: the time of Robert's death. The following year, in seventeen

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Speaker 1: seventy six, Mary had a notable dinner guest, the American

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Speaker 1: Navy's Captain Tom Houston. This led to her neighbors reporting

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Speaker 1: her as a colonial sympathizer. Shortly after, the British Army

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Speaker 1: searched the home for colonial soldiers. Some historians believe that

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Speaker 1: she was hiding them, likely in the house's attic or basement,

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Speaker 1: but none were ever discovered. To aid in his efforts

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Speaker 1: to maintain control of the American colonies, King George enlisted

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Speaker 1: military support from principalities around what would later become the

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Speaker 1: unified country of Germany. About half the soldiers for hire

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Speaker 1: came from the hess Castle regions, so in America the

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Speaker 1: troops became known as the Hessian Army. On December twelfth,

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Speaker 1: seventeen seventy six, the Hessian Armies Captain Rendon made Whitehill

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Speaker 1: Mansion his temporary headquarters, but despite her likely alignment with

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Speaker 1: the other side, Mary maintained a level of civility with

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Speaker 1: the Hessians during this time. She was visited several times

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Speaker 1: by Hessian Colonel Carl von Donlop, who wrote an ensuring

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Speaker 1: the protection of the field property during the war. Von

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Speaker 1: Dunlop's safeguards meant that, according to the National Registry of

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Speaker 1: Historic Places, although many houses in the area surrounding Whitehill

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Speaker 1: were ravaged, the farms stripped of their crops and their

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Speaker 1: outbuildings disassembled and carried off as firewood, Whitehill was spared.

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Speaker 1: According to Loretta Kelly, a long time preservationist at the mansion,

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Speaker 1: a lot of the houses along the river were burned down,

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Speaker 1: but whoever showed up at Mary's door was her best friend.

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Speaker 1: She knew how to play both ends against the middle.

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Speaker 1: After American troops defeated the Hessian forces during the holiday season,

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Speaker 1: most notably the victory at Tritton when Washington crossed the Delaware,

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Speaker 1: Captain Rendon left the mansion. In seventeen seventy eight, British

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Speaker 1: troops occupied the mansion while they searched for commodore John

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Speaker 1: Berry of the US Navy, who had been staying there

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Speaker 1: at the time. In seventeen seventy nine, Mary peel Field

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Speaker 1: married Commodore Thomas Reid of the Pennsylvania Navy, who made

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Speaker 1: Whitehill his head county seat. The same year, she helped

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Speaker 1: Commodore John Berry evade capture by British forces. In the

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Speaker 1: following decade, Mary's mother and husband died in the mansion,

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Speaker 1: and she signed ownership over to her son, Robert Field

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Speaker 1: the third and his wife, Abigail. Abigail two had a

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Speaker 1: strong connection to American independence. Her father, Richard Stockton, was

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Speaker 1: a signer of the Declaration of Independence from what was

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Speaker 1: then the New Jersey Colony, and he also helped to

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Speaker 1: establish Princeton University. Robert third and Abigail had six children.

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Speaker 1: It was this Field Hare who created Whitehill Mansion as

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Speaker 1: it is today, connecting the buildings on the property to

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Speaker 1: create a single two story structure. The home is brick

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Speaker 1: with white trim, with three chimneys rising from the roof.

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Speaker 1: If you visit today you can see the precise places

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Speaker 1: this happened inside the home. Abigail's mother, Annis died in

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Speaker 1: the home in eighteen oh one. Robert lost the home

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Speaker 1: in eighteen o four when up for sale due to

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Speaker 1: his squandering of the family's money on entertainment and expensive possessions,

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Speaker 1: according to the mansion's history. Two years later, Abigail's brother

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Speaker 1: Richard bought Whitehill to help the Field save face. He

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Speaker 1: allowed Robert and Abigail to stay in the house, where

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Speaker 1: they would live until his death in eighteen fifty. The

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Speaker 1: borough of Whitehill was officially renamed Fieldsborough after the Field family.

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Speaker 1: After Robert and Abigail died, the home went through many

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Speaker 1: owners and many different uses. David Bruce Senior bought Whitehill

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Speaker 1: Mansion in eighteen twenty one. His son, David Bruce Junior,

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Speaker 1: invented a new type casting machine in the attic of

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Speaker 1: the house and new typefaces, including a version of Today's

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Speaker 1: Times Roman. In the late eighteen hundreds, potter and saramacist

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Speaker 1: Joseph Mayer lived in the home and built a kill

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Speaker 1: in the basement. He invented several new pottery techniques while

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Speaker 1: living at Whitehill Mansion. In eighteen ninety five, industrialist Joseph

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Speaker 1: Crossley purchased the mansion. His son, Archibald, born in eighteen

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Speaker 1: ninety seven, would be the last baby to be born

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Speaker 1: in the home. Archibald Crossley would go on to be

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Speaker 1: one of the developers of the political Opinion poll. This

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Speaker 1: is when the history of White Hill Mansion starts to

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Speaker 1: get really mysterious. When the Crossleys moved out in nineteen eleven,

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Speaker 1: they sold the house to a woman named Susannah Graham

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Speaker 1: for the sum of one dollar, but there are no

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Speaker 1: historical records of who Graham was. The house was subsequently

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Speaker 1: abandoned and squatters moved in. During this time, the mansion

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Speaker 1: became a bordello, with sliding doors built to conceal secret

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Speaker 1: stairways and the attics sectioned off into several rooms. In

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Speaker 1: nineteen twenty three, Heinrich and Katrina glenk purchased the property,

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Speaker 1: turning the space into an upscale German restaurant, which became

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Speaker 1: a favorite among political and distinguished guests. As the mansion's

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Speaker 1: history describes it, over the years, the establishment went by

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Speaker 1: several names, including the Mansion, Glank's Mansion House, and the

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Speaker 1: White Hill Mansion Restaurant. In the tradition of Mary peel

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Speaker 1: Field's neutrality, the Glanks hosted both Republican and Democratic politicians.

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Speaker 1: Although it was a favorite hangout of the gop. According

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Speaker 1: to their grandson, John, my grandmother was a Republican and

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Speaker 1: a Democrat, depending on who was in the restaurant. Even

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Speaker 1: after the wars were over, the mansion continued to be

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Speaker 1: the site of important moments in American history. The building

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Speaker 1: of the New Jersey Turnpike and Interstate two ninety five

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Speaker 1: was supposedly negotiated by politicians while at the Mansion House.

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Speaker 1: During Prohibition, the restaurant continued to serve alcohol, with the

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Speaker 1: Glanks adding a bar to the basement of the home

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Speaker 1: by digging out an additional two feet of depth in

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Speaker 1: the cellar floor. Heinrich was allegedly a bootlegger. He was

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Speaker 1: arrested for this in nineteen twenty four, but it's unclear

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Speaker 1: whether he served jail time. According to the National Register

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Speaker 1: of Historic Places, the charges read seized one thousand gallons

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Speaker 1: of liquor. Large quantities of beer, wine, and whiskey were

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Speaker 1: found at various places along the Delaware. Heinrich likely used

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Speaker 1: a tunnel in the basement of the home, which leads

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Speaker 1: down to the river, to smuggle his contraband in and out.

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Speaker 1: It's unproven but suspected that the restaurant had mob tied

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Speaker 1: during this period. It's also said that local politicians would

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Speaker 1: use upstairs rooms to meet their mistresses. By this point,

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Speaker 1: Meryfield's former bedroom had been converted into a private dining

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Speaker 1: room where guests could ring a buzzer when they wanted service.

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Speaker 1: Heinrich died in nineteen fifty two, but the restaurants stayed

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Speaker 1: in the family until nineteen seventy two, when Katrina sold it. Eventually,

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Speaker 1: White Hill Mansion found its way into the hands of

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Speaker 1: the Steppin Chemical Company, which has a plant adjacent to

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Speaker 1: the property. It bought the mansion and its surrounding seven

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Speaker 1: acres with the aim of turning it into corporate offices,

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Speaker 1: but abandoned the project due to cost. For almost a decade,

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Speaker 1: the home sat abandoned and neglected until the Borough of

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Speaker 1: Fieldsboro bought the mansion in nineteen ninety nine. Preservation efforts

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Speaker 1: began in two thousand and four, and the home is

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Speaker 1: listed as a state registered Historic Place in twenty twelve.

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Speaker 1: It's now run by the Friends of Whitehill Mansion, which

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Speaker 1: offer historic tours and is renovating the rundown property. Although

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Speaker 1: Whitehill Mansion has seen better days in some ways, it's

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Speaker 1: still as grand as it was in its heyday. It

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Speaker 1: sits on a bluff high above the Delaware River, surrounded

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Speaker 1: by trees. Walking through the mansion, it's easy to see

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Speaker 1: all the phases of its history. There's the speakeasy basement

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Speaker 1: and the bordello attic, but there is more than that,

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Speaker 1: especially in its blend of architectural styles. The original mid

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Speaker 1: seventeen hundreds building was erected in the Georgian style, and

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Speaker 1: that brickwork is still very evident today, But late eighteen

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Speaker 1: hundreds editions were made in the Greek Revival and Queen

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Speaker 1: Anne Shingle styles, adding dormers to the roof, ironwork, and

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Speaker 1: other Gothic details. The most modern portion of the building

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Speaker 1: is a single story dining room with a flat roof

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Speaker 1: added around nineteen sixty. Once you make your way down

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Speaker 1: the long driveway and through the trees, you'll first encounter

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Speaker 1: a covered porch built in the early twentieth century, which

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Speaker 1: protects the nineteenth century main entry to the house. Walk inside,

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Speaker 1: and you'll be greeted by a central hall with an

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Speaker 1: ornate circa eighteen ninety six staircase. The first floor features

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Speaker 1: the circa seventeen sixty parlor, two other sitting rooms, the

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Speaker 1: nineteen sixties dining room with a wall of windows overlooking

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Speaker 1: the delaware, and the kitchen rooms. The second floor features

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Speaker 1: multiple bedrooms, the nursery, several bathrooms, and another kitchen. The

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Speaker 1: original primary bedroom was cut up during the restaurant era

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Speaker 1: to additionally accommodate a lady's room and a coat room.

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Speaker 1: In addition to the main access to the attic, a

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Speaker 1: hidden staircase from one of the bathrooms provides access to

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Speaker 1: the bordello rooms Upstairs. The attic is divided into a

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Speaker 1: number of rooms, including a living room and a bedroom

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Speaker 1: used by members of the glenk family, and two small

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Speaker 1: rooms probably used by the bordello. The basement of the

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Speaker 1: mansion was constructed in several stages in the seventeen hundreds

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Speaker 1: and eighteen hundreds. It still features the Prohibition era bar,

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Speaker 1: with green carpeting and wood paneling over the original stone walls.

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Speaker 1: Archaeological excavations in twenty eleven and twenty thirteen revealed the

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Speaker 1: remains of the original seventeen twenty two home and evidence

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Speaker 1: of a collapsed tunnel leading from the house to the river.

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Speaker 1: The tunnels would have been used to get supplies from

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Speaker 1: the river and to access the ferry there, as the

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Speaker 1: home is on a forty foot bluff above the water.

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Speaker 1: They were also likely where Mary Peel Fields directed Colonial

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Speaker 1: soldiers to hide during the Revolutionary War. That the tunnels

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Speaker 1: may have also been used as part of the underground railroad.

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Speaker 1: The digs also revealed Native American artifacts from Illnape Winter

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Speaker 1: settlement in pre colonial days and eighteenth century items used

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Speaker 1: by the Field family. There are remnants of the past

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Speaker 1: that are easy to find, and then there are the

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Speaker 1: ghosts of the mansion's past lives that people report experiencing

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Speaker 1: in different, decidedly more spooky ways. Reports of hauntings at

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Speaker 1: White Hill Mansion date to when the building operated as

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Speaker 1: a restaurant. In Passport to the Paranormal, Rich Newman writes

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Speaker 1: that patrons began to hear ghostly footsteps, see objects moving

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Speaker 1: around in the dining room, and even see shadowy figures

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Speaker 1: scooting around the restaurant. Lights in the mansion are said

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Speaker 1: to turn on and off without cause, and tour guides

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Speaker 1: in the mansion have described the feeling of being watched

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Speaker 1: when no one is around. They also report unexplained noises

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Speaker 1: of what some say are invisible footsteps on the stairs

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Speaker 1: at night, and of heavy objects, perhaps even a body

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Speaker 1: being dragged across the floor in the attic. Some believe

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Speaker 1: that the spirit of a woman who was involved in

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Speaker 1: sex work, possibly against her will, is present in the

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Speaker 1: attic as well. Disembodied voices and sounds have been reported

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Speaker 1: throughout the house, including the claim of one investigator who

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Speaker 1: says he heard the voice of a woman asking him

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Speaker 1: to introduce himself. The apparition of an unknown man has

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Speaker 1: also been reported on one of the house's staircases. The

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Speaker 1: sounds of children playing have been heard in what was

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Speaker 1: once the nursery. On one paranormal television show, investigators claim

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Speaker 1: to have seen a quickly moving childlike apparition flying around

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Speaker 1: corners and between floors. This is said by some to

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Speaker 1: be the ghosts of Samuel Field, Mary's son who died

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Speaker 1: in childhood. Those who lived and worked in the home

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Speaker 1: make frequent appearances in paranormal investigations, some saying they've heard

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Speaker 1: the voice of Heinrich Glank coming from the attic. Others

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Speaker 1: claim to have made contact with a talkative ghost believed

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Speaker 1: to be a former servant on the property. Thomas Reid,

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Speaker 1: Mary Peelfield's second husband, has been heard on EVPs. Mary

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Speaker 1: herself seated at a desk and writing a letter has

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Speaker 1: been reported in the parlor on the first floor of

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Speaker 1: the mansion, and women and children sometimes report the sensation

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Speaker 1: of having their hands touched or grabbed in that room.

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Speaker 1: Garden State ghost hunters report that the ghost of a

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Speaker 1: woman named Dolly, who was married at the mansion and

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Speaker 1: still wears her wedding dress, is present on the property.

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Speaker 1: This may be the Glenk's daughter, Magdalena Dolly Billingham, who

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Speaker 1: lived and worked at the establishment for many years and

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Speaker 1: was photographed in the mansion in her wedding dress in

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Speaker 1: nineteen thirty six. Dolly lived in some of the attic

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Speaker 1: rooms believed to have been a bordello. A tub in

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Speaker 1: the second floor bathroom, which some call the Bloody Bathroom

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Speaker 1: or the Bloody Bathtub, is said to be haunted. People

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Speaker 1: who climb into the bathtub blind it hard to climb out,

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Speaker 1: saying that it feels as if a weight is holding

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Speaker 1: them down. It's alleged that a man either committed suicide

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Speaker 1: or had his throat slit in it, but there's no

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00:17:10,560 --> 00:17:13,960
Speaker 1: evidence of a murder or suicide on the property. According

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Speaker 1: to a Princeton Info article written by Suzanne van Dongen,

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Speaker 1: people who are really sensitive and or psychic have come

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Speaker 1: in this room and said that bathtub is full of blood.

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Speaker 1: It's possible the bloody Bathroom moniker stems from the red

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Speaker 1: trim on the walls of the room and the story

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Speaker 1: was created from there. The basement bar is said to

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Speaker 1: be home to poltergeist activity. Items will suddenly move on

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Speaker 1: their own, either sliding across the bar or being thrown.

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Speaker 1: Don Reicherd of the Friends of the White Hill Mansion

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Speaker 1: claims to have had a plastic vase thrown at her,

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Speaker 1: nearly hitting her in the head. In the basement, one

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Speaker 1: tour guide had the experience of her necklace suddenly snapping,

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Speaker 1: sending beads flying while she was behind the bar. The

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Speaker 1: spirit there is said to dislike it when anyone comes

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Speaker 1: behind the bar. Another antidy he's said to be present

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Speaker 1: in the basement is, as Dana Nwkirk described it for

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Speaker 1: Week and Weird, a featureless shadow man, as one paranormal

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Speaker 1: group describes it. Supposedly, if you stay near the basement

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Speaker 1: long enough, a dark figure may creep into your personal

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Speaker 1: space before slinking back down to the depths of the basement.

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Speaker 1: Sounds like a very pleasant space, right, Well, don't take

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Speaker 1: my word for it, because up next we do have

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Speaker 1: Don Reikerd of Friends of the White Hill Mansion joining us,

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Speaker 1: and she's ready to share what she knows of the

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Speaker 1: paranormal activity in the mansion. And there's a lot to

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Speaker 1: go over that is coming up after the break. All right.

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Speaker 1: I am currently joined by Don Reikerd, who is the

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Speaker 1: president of the Friends of the White Hill Mansion. And correct, Don,

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Speaker 1: that is correct, So thank you so much for joining me.

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Speaker 1: I have been to the mansion in one time. I

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Speaker 1: was there for a couple of nights, though, so I

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Speaker 1: have seen it in person. It looks like it should

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Speaker 1: be very very haunted, you know, as soon as you

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Speaker 1: kind of pull up. It is a very ominous looking building.

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Speaker 1: But the history is just fascinating. So I can see

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Speaker 1: why you guys are working so tirelessly to make sure

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Speaker 1: that it is saved in some form.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you. It's a lot of work, but it's

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Speaker 2: a liberal of love.

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Speaker 1: I can imagine. It's the history. To me, it's probably

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Speaker 1: one of the more historic historically diverse mansions I have

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Speaker 1: investigated because so much has gone on there and also

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Speaker 1: obviously a lot of paranormal activity as well. So for you,

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Speaker 1: how long have you been involved with the mansion.

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Speaker 2: I first came across the mansion in two thousand and ten.

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Speaker 2: I became a volunteer not long afterwards. But the first

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Speaker 2: time I was there, I actually experienced paranormi life activity.

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Speaker 2: So between that and the history and just the challenge

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Speaker 2: of historical renovations, that was that I was hooked between

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Speaker 2: those three things.

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Speaker 1: So I like that. You know, many times someone would

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Speaker 1: experience something paranormal and say, you know, peace out, you know,

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Speaker 1: but in your case, that was one of the things

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Speaker 1: that got you more interested. What was that first experience?

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Speaker 2: My very first one was on the main stairway. I

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Speaker 2: was walking up there and I heard a female voice.

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Speaker 2: It sounded like French to me, And when I asked

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Speaker 2: the historian at the time, she told me that mary

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Speaker 2: Field spoke English and French, and when the Hessians occupied

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00:20:40,320 --> 00:20:43,760
Speaker 2: her house, they spoke German and French. So the only

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Speaker 2: form of communication during that time period was of course French.

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Speaker 2: So I found that very interesting.

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Speaker 1: That is really interesting. Have you brought in people who

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Speaker 1: speak French to see if that gets a reaction from

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Speaker 1: the spirits.

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Speaker 2: We actually have not. I started studying French about six

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Speaker 2: months ago, so I am hoping to try my new

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Speaker 2: skills at the house at some point.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's time to time to get into that Rosetta

346
00:21:06,440 --> 00:21:10,760
Speaker 1: Stone program or whatever. You uh, you know, I've found

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00:21:10,800 --> 00:21:14,119
Speaker 1: a few times over the years that, uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: people ask us all the time why you go into

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Speaker 1: a place speaking English when you know that the spirits

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Speaker 1: potentially spoke another language. You know, some people theorize that

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Speaker 1: there is this idea of universal consciousness where spirits can

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Speaker 1: somehow communicate in different languages when they pass on. But

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Speaker 1: other times it seems like we need to bring in

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Speaker 1: an interpreter. So I know we've done that a few

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Speaker 1: times over the years. We've brought in Spanish interpreters, We've

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00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:44,439
Speaker 1: brought in We've brought it a Polish speaking person a

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Speaker 1: few times on cases, and it does work. So I'd

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Speaker 1: be curious to know what happens. So, yeah, you had

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Speaker 1: that first experience, and what what else do people encounter there? Like,

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Speaker 1: what would you say are the more kind of regular

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00:22:00,600 --> 00:22:01,760
Speaker 1: occurrences that happen.

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Speaker 2: Oh my goodness. I think with any place it tends

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00:22:06,440 --> 00:22:11,120
Speaker 2: to fluctuate. But the most common art experiences in the basement.

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Speaker 2: You know, we don't have any actual historic proof that

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Speaker 2: there was mob activity in the house, but anytime you

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Speaker 2: have an illegal undertaking, say like running illegal liquor, there's

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Speaker 2: a good chance that you might have mob activity around it.

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Speaker 2: And it definitely seems like if you've ever communicated with

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Speaker 2: the spirit's done in the basement, it does seem like

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Speaker 2: there's a connection there. And that's one of the more

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Speaker 2: common interactions is down there. And of course there's a

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Speaker 2: little child on the second floor that many people have

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Speaker 2: heard running up and down the hallway. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: No, that basement, now that's the area. It's like it's

375
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Speaker 1: a bar right downstairs. Yeah, so I do remember that.

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Speaker 1: And if there was ever a prohibition area looking or

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Speaker 1: era looking bar, that is it. Yes, you go down

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00:23:01,720 --> 00:23:05,920
Speaker 1: there and you can almost see, you know, mobsters like

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00:23:06,040 --> 00:23:09,639
Speaker 1: gathering around tables down there and playing cards. It just

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Speaker 1: it looks so like the stereotypical kind of hideout, and

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Speaker 1: it does feel that way too. It feels kind of

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Speaker 1: oppressive down there, a little bit like it doesn't feel completely.

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Speaker 1: You don't feel completely at ease in that area. And

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Speaker 1: you know, I went down there by myself a few times,

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Speaker 1: just helping to set up equipment, and every time I

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00:23:28,960 --> 00:23:31,640
Speaker 1: found myself kind of rushing to get out of there.

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Speaker 1: Is that common?

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Speaker 2: Absolutely? Do you feel like you're being launched? Oh?

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00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:39,159
Speaker 1: Totally, absolutely, And especially when I was alone, And you know,

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Speaker 1: I'm when I'm investigating, I'm one of those people where

391
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Speaker 1: I try to really pay attention to the feelings I'm having.

392
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Speaker 1: I don't necessarily think that I'm psychic, but I do

393
00:23:48,720 --> 00:23:51,399
Speaker 1: think I'm pretty empathetic or you know, I think I

394
00:23:51,400 --> 00:23:54,399
Speaker 1: can feel other people's emotions, just like someone standing in

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Speaker 1: front of me. And every time I went down there

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Speaker 1: by myself, I was very quick to vacate the area.

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Speaker 2: Yes, ma'am, it's very common. He's threatened me a few times,

398
00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:08,800
Speaker 2: so I've gotten into the habit of not going down

399
00:24:08,840 --> 00:24:15,160
Speaker 2: there by myself. But if the most dominant spirit down there,

400
00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:17,639
Speaker 2: if he's in the mood to do something, it doesn't

401
00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:20,080
Speaker 2: matter if there's ten people down there or one, He's

402
00:24:20,119 --> 00:24:21,040
Speaker 2: going to do what he does.

403
00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:24,040
Speaker 1: So did what do you say he threatened you? What

404
00:24:24,080 --> 00:24:24,920
Speaker 1: does he do.

405
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Speaker 2: The first experience I had was when I had run

406
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Speaker 2: downstairs to get a screwdriver behind the bar, and when

407
00:24:33,840 --> 00:24:36,440
Speaker 2: I had run down there, I leaned over to open

408
00:24:36,560 --> 00:24:39,159
Speaker 2: up the drawer and a vase that was on the

409
00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:42,120
Speaker 2: counter hit the wall next to me. So I didn't

410
00:24:42,119 --> 00:24:43,719
Speaker 2: actually see it fly in the air, but I did

411
00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:46,879
Speaker 2: see it just mess my head and we tried to

412
00:24:46,880 --> 00:24:48,600
Speaker 2: debunk it as many ways as we can. And I

413
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Speaker 2: don't know if you remember that bar, but there's lips

414
00:24:50,520 --> 00:24:54,200
Speaker 2: on both sides of the bar, yes, so it's kind

415
00:24:54,200 --> 00:24:57,360
Speaker 2: of hard even if jump up and down to get

416
00:24:57,359 --> 00:25:00,880
Speaker 2: it to fall over. So how it flew across the room,

417
00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:04,720
Speaker 2: I'm not sure. But I was given a tour in

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00:25:04,760 --> 00:25:08,520
Speaker 2: front of fifteen people were in a necklace and I

419
00:25:08,560 --> 00:25:10,560
Speaker 2: could feel pressure on the back of my neck while

420
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Speaker 2: I was talking, and I just ignore it. If I'm

421
00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:16,000
Speaker 2: having paranormal activity, well, given a tour, I ignore it

422
00:25:16,040 --> 00:25:18,560
Speaker 2: because I don't want people to think I'm making it

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00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:22,240
Speaker 2: up as for a better experience. And then all of

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00:25:22,280 --> 00:25:26,320
Speaker 2: a sudden, the necklace broke and the beads went flying everywhere,

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Speaker 2: and I'm trying to stay calm and just keep talking.

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00:25:30,359 --> 00:25:33,160
Speaker 2: And of course the tour was like, excuse me, lady,

427
00:25:33,160 --> 00:25:37,640
Speaker 2: what just happened there? So it doesn't matter who I'm with.

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Speaker 2: If it happens, it just happens. And very recently, I

429
00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:42,720
Speaker 2: was down there for a meeting. So I was with

430
00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:44,639
Speaker 2: other people and I was sitting in one of the

431
00:25:44,680 --> 00:25:47,560
Speaker 2: chairs at the table and I got hit on the

432
00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:49,959
Speaker 2: top of the head so hard I thought the ceiling

433
00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:50,760
Speaker 2: fell on my head.

434
00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:55,200
Speaker 1: Oh no, See, that's disturbing type of act, Like there's

435
00:25:55,240 --> 00:26:00,719
Speaker 1: clearly something or someone down there who does not appreciate

436
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:04,199
Speaker 1: your presence. I don't know if this is, you know,

437
00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:09,120
Speaker 1: someone who who doesn't like women in particular, or does

438
00:26:09,119 --> 00:26:12,240
Speaker 1: this person pick on anyone of any gender.

439
00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:15,959
Speaker 2: Well, I have a guest, I have a friend with channels.

440
00:26:16,119 --> 00:26:19,320
Speaker 2: So I was so curious about this, we'll say gentleman.

441
00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:23,320
Speaker 2: And I was actually lucky enough to interview him twice,

442
00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:28,120
Speaker 2: believe it or not. And yeah, it's basically me. He

443
00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:31,000
Speaker 2: doesn't like me, and the reason was he said that

444
00:26:31,080 --> 00:26:36,119
Speaker 2: I have come closest to his secret, which is really intriguing.

445
00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:39,800
Speaker 1: Okay, and so we're not quite sure who this gentleman is.

446
00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:41,480
Speaker 1: Do you have any ideas as you ever said a

447
00:26:41,560 --> 00:26:45,200
Speaker 1: name or anything he has it was.

448
00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:48,040
Speaker 2: Kind of like I promised I wouldn't tell anyone. It's

449
00:26:48,119 --> 00:26:49,639
Speaker 2: up to him if he wants to tell people. But

450
00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:52,840
Speaker 2: it was like like a Jimmy the Nose kind of name.

451
00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:56,239
Speaker 1: Okay, and now have you been? I mean, obviously this

452
00:26:56,280 --> 00:26:58,639
Speaker 1: is what's always interesting in these kind of locations, like

453
00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:00,840
Speaker 1: there's not records of a lot of folks.

454
00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:02,600
Speaker 2: Right, and especially out of that era.

455
00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:05,399
Speaker 1: Correct. Yeah, I'm assuming you haven't found any records of

456
00:27:05,680 --> 00:27:07,119
Speaker 1: this name matching someone.

457
00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:10,800
Speaker 2: No, not, we haven't had any success. He did tell

458
00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:16,479
Speaker 2: us that he was from Wichita, and he doesn't like

459
00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:21,720
Speaker 2: being there, and he's very angry about being there. So

460
00:27:21,800 --> 00:27:24,600
Speaker 2: I don't know why he stays. He just kind of grumbles.

461
00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:27,200
Speaker 2: And I said, one time I asked him a question,

462
00:27:27,400 --> 00:27:29,000
Speaker 2: he told me to shut up or he'd smash a

463
00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:30,000
Speaker 2: bottle over my head.

464
00:27:30,280 --> 00:27:33,120
Speaker 1: Oh wow, he sounds like a very pleasant fellow.

465
00:27:33,880 --> 00:27:36,520
Speaker 2: Yes. And what's very interesting is I was given a

466
00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:39,679
Speaker 2: tour at one time, and I had a gentleman who

467
00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:43,440
Speaker 2: was about eighty years old, seventy eighty, and he said, well,

468
00:27:43,480 --> 00:27:45,560
Speaker 2: he was a kid, his grandfather used to take him

469
00:27:45,600 --> 00:27:48,680
Speaker 2: fishing on the Delaware River. And his grandfather pointing it

470
00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:50,840
Speaker 2: up to the house and said, see that house, they

471
00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:53,080
Speaker 2: used to shine high people there in the nineteen thirties.

472
00:27:53,440 --> 00:27:53,960
Speaker 1: Oh.

473
00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:58,400
Speaker 2: Now, I don't know if that's true, but that's really

474
00:27:58,480 --> 00:27:59,679
Speaker 2: disturbing if it is.

475
00:28:00,600 --> 00:28:03,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean that kind of activity. Like I mean,

476
00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:07,880
Speaker 1: we always theorize that spirits like that are staying behind

477
00:28:08,040 --> 00:28:11,680
Speaker 1: for some sort of reason. You know, it's usually some

478
00:28:11,720 --> 00:28:13,960
Speaker 1: sort of unfinished business. I talk about this a lot,

479
00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:15,480
Speaker 1: but you know, people always like, why don't you cross

480
00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:18,560
Speaker 1: them over? And a lot of times these folks don't

481
00:28:18,720 --> 00:28:20,680
Speaker 1: want to move on, or they can't move on until

482
00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:25,560
Speaker 1: they figure out their own kind of issues. He doesn't

483
00:28:25,600 --> 00:28:29,040
Speaker 1: sound like someone anyone would really want to help per se,

484
00:28:29,200 --> 00:28:32,359
Speaker 1: you know, and so he's probably not going to be

485
00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:36,480
Speaker 1: able to figure this out anytime soon, in my opinion.

486
00:28:36,600 --> 00:28:39,440
Speaker 1: But it's so interesting that those are the experiences you

487
00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:41,920
Speaker 1: have done there, because I felt that so strongly in

488
00:28:41,960 --> 00:28:45,120
Speaker 1: that area. And I'm assuming these happened day or night.

489
00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:48,840
Speaker 2: Correct, Oh, correct, Yeah, doesn't matter what time you're there.

490
00:28:48,920 --> 00:28:50,120
Speaker 2: When it happens, it happens.

491
00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:53,719
Speaker 1: Yeah. And now have you ever had any people that

492
00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:56,240
Speaker 1: come in for like a tour or anything who go

493
00:28:56,320 --> 00:28:59,120
Speaker 1: in that area and decide they are done, like they've

494
00:28:59,120 --> 00:29:01,040
Speaker 1: had to leave or anything like that.

495
00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:05,600
Speaker 2: Not usually done a tour because if you've been down there,

496
00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:08,920
Speaker 2: it's kind of a cool area. So if it is

497
00:29:09,160 --> 00:29:12,280
Speaker 2: light hearted, especially if he's not there, it's actually a

498
00:29:12,400 --> 00:29:16,280
Speaker 2: light hearted kind of space. But I have had people

499
00:29:16,320 --> 00:29:19,040
Speaker 2: on the second floor not even finish the tour and leave.

500
00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:22,760
Speaker 1: Oh okay, And now why do you think that is?

501
00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:25,880
Speaker 1: Is that? Did they see something? Is it a feeling?

502
00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:30,400
Speaker 2: Well, a couple times it was a voice. So at

503
00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:33,040
Speaker 2: one point we were in the area. Do you remember

504
00:29:33,040 --> 00:29:36,680
Speaker 2: where Adam heard the music? Yes on the episode in

505
00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:40,160
Speaker 2: that area, and I was talking and I just said,

506
00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:42,040
Speaker 2: you know, we suspect that there was a servant in

507
00:29:42,080 --> 00:29:46,280
Speaker 2: this area. And apparently the servant answered and said, yes,

508
00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:50,960
Speaker 2: he was there, And when the tour heard it, they said, yeah,

509
00:29:51,000 --> 00:29:51,440
Speaker 2: we're done.

510
00:29:52,080 --> 00:29:56,640
Speaker 1: That was enough. Disembodied voices are very strange because they

511
00:29:56,720 --> 00:30:01,000
Speaker 1: come out of literally they come out thin air. They

512
00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:05,320
Speaker 1: you can hear and detect them from where a mouth

513
00:30:05,360 --> 00:30:07,920
Speaker 1: would be if someone were to be standing right in

514
00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:11,840
Speaker 1: front of you talking, and it just makes the hair

515
00:30:11,960 --> 00:30:15,160
Speaker 1: on the back of your neck stand up because your body,

516
00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:19,680
Speaker 1: your being knows there's something very unnatural about that. So

517
00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:22,440
Speaker 1: I could see an entire tour group just being like,

518
00:30:22,600 --> 00:30:24,440
Speaker 1: we're done here, thank you. I was lovely.

519
00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:28,160
Speaker 2: Yeah. I think you never forget your first disembodied voice.

520
00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:33,000
Speaker 1: No, no, I'd still to this day, Disembodied voices and

521
00:30:33,040 --> 00:30:37,280
Speaker 1: being touched are to types of paranormal activity that I

522
00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:42,040
Speaker 1: really just they're not my favorite. You know, sometimes people

523
00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:46,480
Speaker 1: get very excited when these things happen, but for some reason,

524
00:30:46,560 --> 00:30:49,360
Speaker 1: disembodied voices just really creep me out, Like I am

525
00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:52,920
Speaker 1: thankful when they happen, and I do you know, I

526
00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:57,080
Speaker 1: take stock in them during the investigation, but if they're

527
00:30:57,120 --> 00:30:59,080
Speaker 1: like right in front of me, it's a lot. I

528
00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:01,600
Speaker 1: get a little shake And still to this day.

529
00:31:02,680 --> 00:31:04,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, you don't want to hang out there a lot

530
00:31:04,560 --> 00:31:07,480
Speaker 2: because it's it's extremely common. I don't know why, but

531
00:31:07,520 --> 00:31:11,000
Speaker 2: it's very common just to hear voices. Right. My husband

532
00:31:11,040 --> 00:31:13,720
Speaker 2: was My husband was there last week and he was

533
00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:15,840
Speaker 2: doing some work down in the basement. He said he

534
00:31:15,840 --> 00:31:18,920
Speaker 2: heard so much talking he actually stopped and walked up

535
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:20,920
Speaker 2: the stairs to look around to see who was there.

536
00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:24,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I've heard that's kind of an experience people

537
00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:28,200
Speaker 1: have there where they'll hear just people kind of going

538
00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:31,160
Speaker 1: about their business on other floors or in other rooms,

539
00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:34,080
Speaker 1: and they might think that it's an actual living person,

540
00:31:34,120 --> 00:31:37,840
Speaker 1: but they go to investigate and the space is empty.

541
00:31:37,960 --> 00:31:39,040
Speaker 1: So is that common.

542
00:31:39,560 --> 00:31:41,800
Speaker 2: I've heard it a few times where I don't know

543
00:31:41,840 --> 00:31:44,479
Speaker 2: if it was dinner conversation, because of course it was

544
00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:48,160
Speaker 2: a restaurant for over fifty years, but it just sounds

545
00:31:48,200 --> 00:31:50,960
Speaker 2: like murmuring. You can't really make out what's being said.

546
00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:54,600
Speaker 2: It's like a conversation a couple of rooms over. I've

547
00:31:54,640 --> 00:31:56,840
Speaker 2: even talked to the police department who have been there

548
00:31:56,880 --> 00:32:00,760
Speaker 2: on occasions, who have investigated, you know, sounds coming from

549
00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:02,840
Speaker 2: another room and haven't been able to find them.

550
00:32:03,240 --> 00:32:07,240
Speaker 1: Now, do I am I remembering correctly that the police

551
00:32:08,440 --> 00:32:11,440
Speaker 1: have been called there because of activity a few times

552
00:32:11,560 --> 00:32:15,840
Speaker 1: or something like that. Yes, as a matter.

553
00:32:15,680 --> 00:32:17,560
Speaker 2: Of fact, I think it was last year. I was

554
00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:21,440
Speaker 2: talking to the police, the chief of police, and they

555
00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:24,520
Speaker 2: were doing a surveillance and he said that he saw

556
00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:26,480
Speaker 2: a light on in one of the windows. He said,

557
00:32:26,480 --> 00:32:29,160
Speaker 2: we were going to go in and investigate, but we figured

558
00:32:29,200 --> 00:32:31,840
Speaker 2: you just up the lamp on and I don't have

559
00:32:31,960 --> 00:32:34,160
Speaker 2: a lamp near any of the windows, So I said

560
00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:39,760
Speaker 2: which window? He pointed up to the third floor, and

561
00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:42,800
Speaker 2: I said, there's no electricity on the third floor, and

562
00:32:42,840 --> 00:32:44,920
Speaker 2: he said to me, because I'm never going to that house.

563
00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:48,400
Speaker 2: But we've been called there, you know. Sometimes we have

564
00:32:48,480 --> 00:32:52,960
Speaker 2: break ins and a lot of times the police will

565
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:54,280
Speaker 2: just hang out. I'm like, do you want me to

566
00:32:54,280 --> 00:32:55,800
Speaker 2: go first? You have the guns, you want me to

567
00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:59,320
Speaker 2: go first. And that's kind of common because I think

568
00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:02,240
Speaker 2: they have been called there before in the past, and

569
00:33:02,360 --> 00:33:05,320
Speaker 2: I don't think anybody's too comfortable going in there by themselves.

570
00:33:05,880 --> 00:33:10,120
Speaker 1: No. I mean, I always find stories from law enforcement

571
00:33:10,160 --> 00:33:14,480
Speaker 1: to be fascinating because they they always have some they

572
00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:17,160
Speaker 1: have some pretty wild experiences that they're not always really

573
00:33:17,160 --> 00:33:20,480
Speaker 1: comfortable sharing with the public, but they'll tell me, you know,

574
00:33:20,520 --> 00:33:23,480
Speaker 1: they'll come to events and things, and I feel like

575
00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:25,360
Speaker 1: I do remember that. I think even when we were

576
00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:29,040
Speaker 1: there filming, the police stopped by a few times.

577
00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:32,480
Speaker 2: They do. They're very wonderful and keep an our eye

578
00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:33,400
Speaker 2: in the house for us.

579
00:33:33,760 --> 00:33:36,360
Speaker 1: That's great. I mean, I think you need that too.

580
00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:40,400
Speaker 1: I mean that community aspect to protect that place, because

581
00:33:40,440 --> 00:33:42,719
Speaker 1: like I said, when you roll up on it, it

582
00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:46,920
Speaker 1: does look abandoned, and so if you didn't know better,

583
00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:49,040
Speaker 1: you'd think you could just kind of you know, Jimmy

584
00:33:49,040 --> 00:33:50,680
Speaker 1: open that back door or something.

585
00:33:50,960 --> 00:33:53,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's been done before. I think there's been break

586
00:33:54,000 --> 00:33:58,680
Speaker 2: ins in every side of that house. Unfortunately, sometimes they

587
00:33:58,760 --> 00:34:02,280
Speaker 2: destroy stuff. And now that we have cameras, alarm system

588
00:34:02,360 --> 00:34:05,520
Speaker 2: and lights, it's helped a lot. That's all times. Yeah,

589
00:34:05,520 --> 00:34:07,400
Speaker 2: we'll see kids hanging out and we'll just set the

590
00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:09,759
Speaker 2: alarm off just to keep on moving on their way.

591
00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:12,520
Speaker 1: Right, I mean that's a big thing too, once you

592
00:34:12,680 --> 00:34:15,480
Speaker 1: find out if place is haunted, or it kind of

593
00:34:15,480 --> 00:34:19,200
Speaker 1: gets out there that it's haunted. And not that I

594
00:34:19,239 --> 00:34:22,880
Speaker 1: did this, I actually I absolutely did. But as a teenager,

595
00:34:23,200 --> 00:34:26,040
Speaker 1: you know, there's a lot of daring involved, and kids

596
00:34:26,040 --> 00:34:27,839
Speaker 1: get ideas in their heads and they want to get

597
00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:31,160
Speaker 1: into these places. They don't really think it through. Thankfully,

598
00:34:31,200 --> 00:34:33,279
Speaker 1: there weren't as many cameras and things as when I

599
00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:33,839
Speaker 1: was a kid.

600
00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:38,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I'm sure, I'm sure most of the break

601
00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:41,680
Speaker 2: ins were just kids just trying to have an experience.

602
00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:44,799
Speaker 2: And right, you know, I've even seen kids hanging out

603
00:34:44,840 --> 00:34:46,560
Speaker 2: and said listen, I'll give you a tour if you

604
00:34:46,560 --> 00:34:47,520
Speaker 2: want to see what it's like.

605
00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:51,759
Speaker 1: That's a really good tactic, honestly, you know, just kind

606
00:34:51,800 --> 00:34:54,000
Speaker 1: of let them in to see it and kind of,

607
00:34:54,640 --> 00:34:58,719
Speaker 1: you know, get their curiosity fulfilled so they don't try

608
00:34:58,719 --> 00:35:03,799
Speaker 1: to break into it later. Now, okay, so we've talked

609
00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:09,000
Speaker 1: about tours and talked about your husband's recent experience. What

610
00:35:09,040 --> 00:35:11,680
Speaker 1: would you say is maybe kind of the more I mean,

611
00:35:11,680 --> 00:35:14,640
Speaker 1: you've obviously had some pretty extreme things happen, but what

612
00:35:14,719 --> 00:35:16,840
Speaker 1: are some of the more kind of extreme stories that

613
00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:18,920
Speaker 1: have come out of the mansion that you've heard over

614
00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:20,880
Speaker 1: the years as far as paranormal activity.

615
00:35:22,640 --> 00:35:27,160
Speaker 2: Well, the newest thing is sightings of the Crawley thing

616
00:35:27,239 --> 00:35:27,920
Speaker 2: up in the attic.

617
00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:29,120
Speaker 1: Oh, one of those.

618
00:35:29,760 --> 00:35:32,520
Speaker 2: Yes, I I've never had the pleasure think that, yess.

619
00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:35,719
Speaker 2: But there have been a couple of people that have

620
00:35:35,800 --> 00:35:39,560
Speaker 2: seen like a shadow crawling across the floor in the

621
00:35:39,560 --> 00:35:42,040
Speaker 2: one road. Luckily never while they're in the room. Usually

622
00:35:42,040 --> 00:35:45,000
Speaker 2: when they're in across the hall looking into the room,

623
00:35:45,040 --> 00:35:48,160
Speaker 2: they'll see something moving in there. So, yes, I've never

624
00:35:48,200 --> 00:35:49,040
Speaker 2: had the pleasure.

625
00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:51,960
Speaker 1: You know. I will say, and I've said this before

626
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:57,000
Speaker 1: on the show, that some of these places, for some reason,

627
00:35:57,400 --> 00:36:02,000
Speaker 1: when they start to be investigated more, these crawlers start appearing.

628
00:36:02,080 --> 00:36:04,960
Speaker 1: That's what they call them as crawlers. They're not usually

629
00:36:05,000 --> 00:36:09,560
Speaker 1: a phenomenon that you see in locations that are not

630
00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:15,799
Speaker 1: investigated on the regular And yeah, and we kind of

631
00:36:15,880 --> 00:36:20,520
Speaker 1: theorize that they are this almost embodiment of the energy

632
00:36:21,560 --> 00:36:27,560
Speaker 1: that investigators and people coming in to ghost hunt create

633
00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:30,560
Speaker 1: because they come into a location over and over again,

634
00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:36,080
Speaker 1: you know, and they walk in there. Sometimes they're nervous,

635
00:36:36,120 --> 00:36:40,840
Speaker 1: sometimes they're excited. They talk about the kind of deaths

636
00:36:40,880 --> 00:36:44,919
Speaker 1: that have happened there over and over again, and there's

637
00:36:44,960 --> 00:36:48,240
Speaker 1: just something about that energy. And just as these years

638
00:36:48,239 --> 00:36:51,560
Speaker 1: have gone by, more and more of these are appearing.

639
00:36:51,600 --> 00:36:53,920
Speaker 1: And like, I could be completely off base here as

640
00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:56,920
Speaker 1: to where they're coming from, but they're not something that

641
00:36:56,960 --> 00:36:59,799
Speaker 1: people report when they first start investigating a place. They

642
00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:04,759
Speaker 1: kind of come like form over time. And so it's

643
00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:07,520
Speaker 1: definitely something I want to kind of study a little

644
00:37:07,520 --> 00:37:10,840
Speaker 1: bit more because we've been able to get rid of

645
00:37:10,880 --> 00:37:13,480
Speaker 1: them in a couple places by kind of counteracting that

646
00:37:13,719 --> 00:37:18,680
Speaker 1: energy and bringing like a more positive energy into a place,

647
00:37:18,760 --> 00:37:23,680
Speaker 1: because they can sometimes become stronger and bigger and more powerful.

648
00:37:23,719 --> 00:37:28,320
Speaker 1: They don't really touch people, but they're creepy, I can imagine.

649
00:37:28,719 --> 00:37:31,680
Speaker 2: And your story makes sense because I haven't had the

650
00:37:31,800 --> 00:37:36,719
Speaker 2: claims until recently within last two years.

651
00:37:37,400 --> 00:37:43,879
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I know you guys do pretty regular investigations there, right, correct. Yeah,

652
00:37:43,920 --> 00:37:47,960
Speaker 1: And I think it's really important to note that investigations

653
00:37:47,960 --> 00:37:50,920
Speaker 1: in some of these locations are really a great form

654
00:37:50,960 --> 00:37:57,440
Speaker 1: of revenue to help save these places. Yes, so I'm thinking, like,

655
00:37:58,040 --> 00:37:59,840
Speaker 1: I think it's great that you guys are able to

656
00:37:59,840 --> 00:38:01,719
Speaker 1: do that and open to that, because I think a

657
00:38:01,800 --> 00:38:04,960
Speaker 1: lot of historical locations, not a lot, but if you

658
00:38:05,840 --> 00:38:09,239
Speaker 1: are kind of closed off to the idea of investigating

659
00:38:09,280 --> 00:38:12,800
Speaker 1: in ghosts, and you know, obviously it gives the ghosts

660
00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:16,239
Speaker 1: a chance to interact, but it also can you know,

661
00:38:16,920 --> 00:38:20,560
Speaker 1: bring in much needed revenue and exposure and history to

662
00:38:20,680 --> 00:38:23,000
Speaker 1: the general public. So kudos to you guys for that.

663
00:38:23,440 --> 00:38:27,279
Speaker 2: Ah, thank you. I know that would I go to

664
00:38:27,480 --> 00:38:32,360
Speaker 2: these history projects or I'm also taking class in historic preservation.

665
00:38:33,280 --> 00:38:35,600
Speaker 2: When I first started doing that, you know, they would

666
00:38:35,719 --> 00:38:39,680
Speaker 2: clutch their pearls, you know, get the vapors over having

667
00:38:39,719 --> 00:38:42,399
Speaker 2: ghost haunts, But when you explain them, that's the only

668
00:38:42,480 --> 00:38:45,759
Speaker 2: way that we can make money for matching grants, and

669
00:38:45,800 --> 00:38:48,719
Speaker 2: that's our main revenue, and the public likes it, and

670
00:38:48,800 --> 00:38:52,040
Speaker 2: it's also a good way to introduce the history. They

671
00:38:52,040 --> 00:38:55,600
Speaker 2: they're interested in ghosts. Well, you can't really investigate ghosts

672
00:38:55,640 --> 00:38:57,800
Speaker 2: if you don't know what happened to bring the ghosts there.

673
00:38:58,200 --> 00:39:00,640
Speaker 2: So it's a great way to to use it as

674
00:39:00,640 --> 00:39:04,200
Speaker 2: a teaching tool. But I think in the historic area

675
00:39:05,080 --> 00:39:08,000
Speaker 2: it wasn't accepted for a really long time. You weren't

676
00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:10,799
Speaker 2: considered like a proper place if you did the ghost homes.

677
00:39:10,840 --> 00:39:13,799
Speaker 2: And I think that's starting to change as they understand

678
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:17,120
Speaker 2: that it's also part of a cultural heritage to have

679
00:39:17,200 --> 00:39:20,160
Speaker 2: people to come in there and experience these kind of things.

680
00:39:20,440 --> 00:39:22,399
Speaker 2: So I think it's a lot more acceptable now than

681
00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:23,439
Speaker 2: it was ten years ago.

682
00:39:23,880 --> 00:39:28,480
Speaker 1: Absolutely. It's funny. Years ago, the Mark Twain House invited

683
00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:32,120
Speaker 1: Adam and I to do kind of a round table

684
00:39:32,160 --> 00:39:37,080
Speaker 1: discussion with a number of historical societies and locations to

685
00:39:37,160 --> 00:39:40,279
Speaker 1: kind of talk about the benefits of including the paranormal

686
00:39:40,560 --> 00:39:46,239
Speaker 1: in their in their schedules or what have you, or

687
00:39:46,280 --> 00:39:49,880
Speaker 1: their programs, and it was nice. It was nice to

688
00:39:49,880 --> 00:39:53,080
Speaker 1: be able to kind of explain that you're reaching a

689
00:39:53,160 --> 00:39:57,600
Speaker 1: different generation. Really, you know, it's unfortunately not a lot

690
00:39:57,600 --> 00:40:01,479
Speaker 1: of teenagers are walking into His Oracle societies these days

691
00:40:01,760 --> 00:40:05,200
Speaker 1: summing through these things. But you introduce the idea of

692
00:40:05,239 --> 00:40:08,320
Speaker 1: the paranormal and ghost hunting, and suddenly they are taking

693
00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:10,960
Speaker 1: an interest. And you know, that's how I got into

694
00:40:11,360 --> 00:40:14,800
Speaker 1: the whole paranormal research thing. My dad tricked me and

695
00:40:15,000 --> 00:40:17,640
Speaker 1: took me to hunted places and then taught me the history.

696
00:40:17,680 --> 00:40:21,080
Speaker 1: You know, So that is so cool. Yeah, I think that.

697
00:40:21,200 --> 00:40:24,160
Speaker 1: I think that's really great. But this history at this

698
00:40:24,480 --> 00:40:29,040
Speaker 1: place in particular, it ranges from very dark and mysterious

699
00:40:29,080 --> 00:40:32,600
Speaker 1: to very positive and light, and so I imagine that

700
00:40:33,040 --> 00:40:35,719
Speaker 1: the spirits that you interact with kind of cover that

701
00:40:35,760 --> 00:40:36,520
Speaker 1: gamut as well.

702
00:40:36,600 --> 00:40:39,680
Speaker 2: Right, That's one of the things that find so fascinating.

703
00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:41,600
Speaker 2: A lot of houses if you go to they'll have

704
00:40:42,160 --> 00:40:46,759
Speaker 2: one erow word important person live there. But I mean

705
00:40:46,760 --> 00:40:49,279
Speaker 2: that land goes back. Some of the hauntings go back

706
00:40:49,280 --> 00:40:51,960
Speaker 2: to the sixteen hundreds, and then of course we're known

707
00:40:52,000 --> 00:40:56,440
Speaker 2: as a Revolutionary War house, but innovators, and there's so

708
00:40:56,600 --> 00:41:00,239
Speaker 2: much stuff going on through the Victorian times and then

709
00:41:00,280 --> 00:41:02,400
Speaker 2: of course everybody wants to talk about the speakeasy and

710
00:41:02,440 --> 00:41:06,520
Speaker 2: the Prohibition era, but I find the Victorian times really

711
00:41:06,520 --> 00:41:09,640
Speaker 2: fascinating because that time period at the house, there was

712
00:41:09,680 --> 00:41:13,520
Speaker 2: a different family there every decade, right, so people have

713
00:41:13,640 --> 00:41:17,160
Speaker 2: seen a Victorian lady in the whole way, whom I

714
00:41:17,160 --> 00:41:19,520
Speaker 2: think is different from the other Victorian lady that we've

715
00:41:19,520 --> 00:41:21,840
Speaker 2: spoken to in other parts of the house. One is older,

716
00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:25,120
Speaker 2: one is younger, so that's always interesting to try to

717
00:41:25,160 --> 00:41:27,840
Speaker 2: figure out. And then of course there's been a gentleman

718
00:41:27,880 --> 00:41:30,799
Speaker 2: who's been seen in the window waiting to people, which

719
00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:34,520
Speaker 2: is curious. I haven't had the pleasure of having him

720
00:41:34,560 --> 00:41:38,080
Speaker 2: wave to me, but from the description he seems to

721
00:41:38,080 --> 00:41:40,800
Speaker 2: be of that area too, with a long white beard

722
00:41:40,840 --> 00:41:44,600
Speaker 2: and kind of mutton chop sideburns on the side.

723
00:41:44,400 --> 00:41:46,640
Speaker 1: So I think I feel like I remember us setting

724
00:41:46,719 --> 00:41:50,040
Speaker 1: up a camera trying to capture that goes from outside.

725
00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:56,399
Speaker 1: So now do you know offhand if before like when

726
00:41:56,440 --> 00:41:59,719
Speaker 1: this was operating as the restaurant and everything years ago,

727
00:41:59,800 --> 00:42:02,560
Speaker 1: to do they have any hauntings? Do people remember it

728
00:42:02,600 --> 00:42:04,719
Speaker 1: having a haunted reputation even back then.

729
00:42:05,600 --> 00:42:09,320
Speaker 2: Well that was the challenge when I first started, because

730
00:42:09,360 --> 00:42:11,759
Speaker 2: I had so many experiences there and I kept thinking

731
00:42:11,840 --> 00:42:14,920
Speaker 2: I can't be the only one. The last owner of

732
00:42:15,000 --> 00:42:17,319
Speaker 2: the house, who left in nineteen ninety two would send

733
00:42:17,360 --> 00:42:19,920
Speaker 2: me messages saying stop telling people the house is haunted.

734
00:42:19,960 --> 00:42:25,040
Speaker 2: It's not. But I have since had people that worked

735
00:42:25,040 --> 00:42:29,799
Speaker 2: for her on my tours, waiters, dishwashers, bartenders who used

736
00:42:29,840 --> 00:42:32,680
Speaker 2: to work there that did have experiences that told me

737
00:42:32,719 --> 00:42:36,879
Speaker 2: about it. And when I talked to mister Glink, who

738
00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:40,040
Speaker 2: opened the restaurant in the nineteen twenties, his grandson lives

739
00:42:40,080 --> 00:42:42,840
Speaker 2: next door in the carriage house, and one of the

740
00:42:42,840 --> 00:42:45,160
Speaker 2: conversations I had with him was, Oh, yeah, they tell

741
00:42:45,200 --> 00:42:48,520
Speaker 2: me that my grandfather haunts the attic. So there had

742
00:42:48,520 --> 00:42:52,880
Speaker 2: to been stories before the two thousands.

743
00:42:52,760 --> 00:42:55,720
Speaker 1: Right see. I find that and I love hearing about

744
00:42:55,800 --> 00:42:58,879
Speaker 1: kind of how hauntings have progressed or how they've been

745
00:42:58,960 --> 00:43:03,840
Speaker 1: perceived over the years. Now I do remember when I

746
00:43:03,880 --> 00:43:06,600
Speaker 1: was there. I have to ask about this. Do you

747
00:43:06,719 --> 00:43:09,680
Speaker 1: think there's a tunnel? I heard there was a tunnel

748
00:43:09,800 --> 00:43:12,799
Speaker 1: potentially from the house to the down to the water.

749
00:43:12,960 --> 00:43:14,160
Speaker 1: Do you think that exists?

750
00:43:14,840 --> 00:43:17,600
Speaker 2: We believe that there was two, so we do know

751
00:43:17,840 --> 00:43:23,000
Speaker 2: of one that's definitely was there. The archaeologists during one

752
00:43:23,000 --> 00:43:26,279
Speaker 2: of our digs in twenty thirteen, discovered the path of

753
00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:29,279
Speaker 2: one of the tunnels, and we do believe that there's

754
00:43:29,320 --> 00:43:31,439
Speaker 2: one on the other side of the house that would

755
00:43:31,440 --> 00:43:34,920
Speaker 2: have gone down to the wharf. Which is on the

756
00:43:34,920 --> 00:43:37,000
Speaker 2: other side of the train tracks, so it's kind of

757
00:43:37,080 --> 00:43:39,200
Speaker 2: dangerous to get to now, but we do think we

758
00:43:39,600 --> 00:43:43,840
Speaker 2: figured it probably collapsed somewhere between nineteen sixties nineteen seventies,

759
00:43:44,160 --> 00:43:47,239
Speaker 2: and that timeframe in the area was brioked over for

760
00:43:47,280 --> 00:43:48,200
Speaker 2: safety reasons.

761
00:43:48,560 --> 00:43:51,399
Speaker 1: Ah, got it. Yeah, you can see it. Like I'm

762
00:43:51,480 --> 00:43:55,480
Speaker 1: just I find old tunnels to be so interesting and mysterious.

763
00:43:56,160 --> 00:43:59,360
Speaker 2: Yes, well, this is very interesting. We have been awarded

764
00:44:00,080 --> 00:44:03,239
Speaker 2: another grant to do an archaeology dig, so we work

765
00:44:03,280 --> 00:44:07,640
Speaker 2: in conjunction with Mammath University and this time around they're

766
00:44:07,640 --> 00:44:12,080
Speaker 2: going to use ground penetrating radar. One reason is we

767
00:44:12,080 --> 00:44:17,040
Speaker 2: don't know where the family's buried. And also Annis Bludenet

768
00:44:17,040 --> 00:44:20,440
Speaker 2: Stockton died in the house in eighteen oh one and

769
00:44:20,520 --> 00:44:23,480
Speaker 2: for some reason she is not buried with her husband,

770
00:44:23,640 --> 00:44:27,239
Speaker 2: Richard Stockton and Princeton, So that's strange. So I've got

771
00:44:27,239 --> 00:44:29,759
Speaker 2: people writing me all over the country at times. You know,

772
00:44:29,920 --> 00:44:33,919
Speaker 2: do you know where she's buried? Nope, So it would

773
00:44:33,960 --> 00:44:37,759
Speaker 2: be really interesting to find that out. And there were

774
00:44:37,800 --> 00:44:39,640
Speaker 2: also trying to track the second tunnel.

775
00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:43,600
Speaker 1: That's exciting. I mean I think that the more information

776
00:44:43,719 --> 00:44:46,400
Speaker 1: you can find, I think that's going to be, you know,

777
00:44:46,719 --> 00:44:49,520
Speaker 1: very helpful for you, but also very helpful for your ghosts,

778
00:44:49,600 --> 00:44:52,600
Speaker 1: you know. And as you're investigating, I'm so curious to know,

779
00:44:52,680 --> 00:44:55,320
Speaker 1: like what will happen with the activity when you start

780
00:44:55,400 --> 00:44:59,120
Speaker 1: doing that work there? Yeah, oh boy, you'll have to

781
00:44:59,200 --> 00:45:01,319
Speaker 1: keep me posted. Yeah.

782
00:45:01,360 --> 00:45:04,160
Speaker 2: Absolutely. And my little friend in the basement, he seems

783
00:45:04,200 --> 00:45:10,600
Speaker 2: to be guarding something near the tunnel entrance. Maybe it's him, Yeah, right,

784
00:45:10,760 --> 00:45:13,920
Speaker 2: I don't know, but it would be fascinating if they

785
00:45:13,960 --> 00:45:17,200
Speaker 2: found something in that era. And if they did, what

786
00:45:17,280 --> 00:45:20,200
Speaker 2: would his reaction be? Yeah, that'll be very interesting.

787
00:45:20,440 --> 00:45:22,560
Speaker 1: That is wild. Okay, So tell us, like, if people

788
00:45:22,600 --> 00:45:24,560
Speaker 1: want to support the mansion, if they want to visit

789
00:45:24,600 --> 00:45:26,000
Speaker 1: the mansion, what do they need to do?

790
00:45:26,680 --> 00:45:30,560
Speaker 2: You can go to White House Mansion dot org. Donation

791
00:45:30,800 --> 00:45:33,640
Speaker 2: help us very much. If you see the house, you

792
00:45:33,640 --> 00:45:35,719
Speaker 2: can see that there's a lot of work to be done.

793
00:45:36,719 --> 00:45:39,560
Speaker 2: But we feel that this house is very important to

794
00:45:39,640 --> 00:45:42,120
Speaker 2: American history, not just the history of New Jersey and

795
00:45:42,160 --> 00:45:46,520
Speaker 2: the Revolutionary War, but there's very few stories about women

796
00:45:46,600 --> 00:45:48,960
Speaker 2: from the Revolutionary War, and we feel that her story

797
00:45:49,040 --> 00:45:52,240
Speaker 2: is really important and in order to tell her story,

798
00:45:52,280 --> 00:45:55,279
Speaker 2: we really need to save her house. Yeah, so if

799
00:45:55,320 --> 00:45:58,840
Speaker 2: anybody's willing to donate, that's wonderful. We do have tours

800
00:45:58,960 --> 00:46:01,839
Speaker 2: monthly to teach the hit history, and of course there

801
00:46:01,840 --> 00:46:03,960
Speaker 2: are some ghost hunting opportunities out there too.

802
00:46:04,320 --> 00:46:07,040
Speaker 1: That is awesome. Well, thank you so much for taking

803
00:46:07,080 --> 00:46:09,279
Speaker 1: the time to chat with me today. I do you

804
00:46:09,320 --> 00:46:11,360
Speaker 1: find the mansion to be so fascinating. I hope to

805
00:46:11,360 --> 00:46:13,040
Speaker 1: be able to visit it very soon. I'm going to

806
00:46:13,080 --> 00:46:15,920
Speaker 1: be in the area in the fall doing some talks,

807
00:46:15,920 --> 00:46:17,120
Speaker 1: so I might have to stop by.

808
00:46:17,560 --> 00:46:18,800
Speaker 2: Yes, please, that'd be wonderful.

809
00:46:18,880 --> 00:46:21,080
Speaker 1: Awesome, Well, thank you so much, don I appreciate it.

810
00:46:21,880 --> 00:46:22,239
Speaker 2: Thank you.

811
00:46:31,520 --> 00:46:35,200
Speaker 1: The White Hill Mansion has had so many identities and

812
00:46:35,280 --> 00:46:39,239
Speaker 1: an incredibly rich history. It's no wonder it's haunted. I

813
00:46:39,320 --> 00:46:42,000
Speaker 1: love watching the friends of the White Hill Mansion breathe

814
00:46:42,080 --> 00:46:45,120
Speaker 1: new life into the location, and they could very much

815
00:46:45,239 --> 00:46:48,200
Speaker 1: use your help if you've taken an interest, because with

816
00:46:48,320 --> 00:46:50,880
Speaker 1: everything that's happened there in the last three hundred years,

817
00:46:51,400 --> 00:46:54,319
Speaker 1: imagine what the next three hundred years holds for that

818
00:46:54,400 --> 00:47:01,800
Speaker 1: majestic old mansion. I'm Amy Brunney and this was haunted road. Hey, friends,

819
00:47:02,000 --> 00:47:05,000
Speaker 1: believe it or not, My life with the afterlife true

820
00:47:05,040 --> 00:47:08,719
Speaker 1: Tales of the Paranormal Fall speaking tour is already very

821
00:47:08,840 --> 00:47:11,800
Speaker 1: much filling up, and dates are posted on my website

822
00:47:11,840 --> 00:47:15,160
Speaker 1: at Amybrune dot com. If you're interested in seeing me

823
00:47:15,239 --> 00:47:18,200
Speaker 1: in person and in some venues or at any conventions

824
00:47:18,280 --> 00:47:20,920
Speaker 1: or strange escapes that may be near you, please visit

825
00:47:20,920 --> 00:47:23,279
Speaker 1: that event's calendar to see if I'll be anywhere in

826
00:47:23,320 --> 00:47:25,640
Speaker 1: your neck of the woods. I would love to get

827
00:47:25,680 --> 00:47:32,640
Speaker 1: spooky with you again. That is Amybrooney dot com. Haunted

828
00:47:32,760 --> 00:47:36,040
Speaker 1: Road is hosted and written by me Amy Brune, with

829
00:47:36,120 --> 00:47:40,560
Speaker 1: additional research by Taylor Haggerdorn and Cassandra de Alba. This

830
00:47:40,640 --> 00:47:44,040
Speaker 1: show is edited and produced by Rema El Kali, with

831
00:47:44,120 --> 00:47:49,400
Speaker 1: supervising producer Josh Thain and executive producers Aaron Menke, Alex Williams,

832
00:47:49,440 --> 00:47:53,400
Speaker 1: and Matt Frederick. Haunted Road is a production of iHeartRadio

833
00:47:53,640 --> 00:47:56,759
Speaker 1: and Grim and Mild from Aaronmanky. Learn more about this

834
00:47:56,880 --> 00:48:01,160
Speaker 1: show over at Grimanmild dot com, and for more podcasts

835
00:48:01,160 --> 00:48:05,880
Speaker 1: from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever

836
00:48:05,960 --> 00:48:07,560
Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite shows.