Speaker 1: This is the Patriots Catch twenty two podcasts with Evan
Speaker 1: Lazar and Alex bar from Lazarre.
Speaker 2: Hello, everybody nailed it, Joined as always by our Bark.
Speaker 2: Here is Evan Lazar and Alex Bars. I'm doing edge defenders.
Speaker 2: I know you don't like. You don't like edge a position.
Speaker 1: It's not a real position.
Speaker 2: It is a real posit.
Speaker 1: It's not it's a real No, it's a defensive end
Speaker 1: outside linebacker. We use edge because coming into the draft
Speaker 1: there are guys that in one system might play and
Speaker 1: in another system might play outside linebacker. So, right, but
Speaker 1: that's going into the draft, and we don't know what
Speaker 1: system they're in, so we can't classify them as one
Speaker 1: or the other. One. We're talking about the Patriots. We're
Speaker 1: talking about a system. We know where they're going to
Speaker 1: be playing. All right, you even just say, all right,
Speaker 1: you even alright, go ahead, paid just said you have
Speaker 1: Kean White is a defensive end?
Speaker 3: I do?
Speaker 2: It's not?
Speaker 1: Is that edge? No, So you're just saying outside linebackers,
Speaker 1: you're calling them.
Speaker 2: Egg Yeah, that's our show in a nutshell, Alex like
Speaker 2: that that right there is our show. If you want
Speaker 2: like a snippet of what you're gonna get when you
Speaker 2: turn on Patriots Catch twenty two that thirty second clip.
Speaker 2: Is it like that? That's it right there? Pretty much?
Speaker 2: Is it us arguing over what is and isn't an edge?
Speaker 2: And if that's a real position, is it's perfect? So
Speaker 2: Evan Lazar and Alex Bart with you for the next
Speaker 2: hour or so here on Patriots Catch twenty two. We
Speaker 2: got a lot of talk about I wish it was
Speaker 2: about other things, like we were supposed to be out
Speaker 2: at practice today and talking about real football on this show.
Speaker 2: But we're gonna be talking about what's going on here
Speaker 2: the news with the Patriots losing two ota practices. There's
Speaker 2: since been a little bit more information coming out about
Speaker 2: exactly why they were stripped to too practices, and we're
Speaker 2: gonna touch on it. We're not you know, it's interesting
Speaker 2: because when this when the when they canceled practice yesterday,
Speaker 2: there's been a little bit of a roller coaster as
Speaker 2: when they canceled practice yesterday, it felt like they were
Speaker 2: canceling practice to quite frankly stick it to us, like
Speaker 2: you're not invited anymore, guys. Sorry. Right then, we got
Speaker 2: over that this morning with Pro Football talk reporting that
Speaker 2: it was because of a special teams meeting, a fifteen
Speaker 2: minute special teams meeting, where the league felt like it
Speaker 2: came across as mandatory even though things this time of
Speaker 2: year are supposed to be voluntary. Right, That's that's basically
Speaker 2: the crux of it, which to which just an hour
Speaker 2: or so go on Patriots unfiltered. I was pissed about.
Speaker 2: I was, this is ridiculous, like either everything is voluntary
Speaker 2: or everything's mandatory, but nothing this time of year is mandatory.
Speaker 2: It's all voluntary. Whether you go out to practice, whether
Speaker 2: you go out in the way, you know, go work
Speaker 2: out in the weight room, whether you're here at the
Speaker 2: facility at all right now is voluntary. So how can
Speaker 2: we have gray areas? But what isn't It isn't perceived
Speaker 2: as voluntary when the whole off season program as an
Speaker 2: entirety is voluntary. So that piece of it bugged me.
Speaker 2: There's been a little bit more come out now from
Speaker 2: Greg Badard that it seemed like the what he had
Speaker 2: heard is that the Patriots were here for maybe a
Speaker 2: little bit longer than the allotted amount of time to
Speaker 2: hold this special teams meeting. So if that is the truth,
Speaker 2: and that is the case. And I'm not questioning Greg's supporting,
Speaker 2: but this is there's a lot of behind the scenes
Speaker 2: details with these types of things.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of interpretation.
Speaker 2: Yeah, if that's the case, then I think that you know,
Speaker 2: that's a violation. You know, there's you're only supposed to
Speaker 2: be here for four hours per day. If you're here
Speaker 2: for longer than that, then you're here for longer than
Speaker 2: that that and that's a violation. But I think where
Speaker 2: I come from ef this you.
Speaker 1: Can so the way I interpreted it is like you said,
Speaker 1: these sessions are not the sessions are optional, right, just
Speaker 1: being here at this time as optional. But I think
Speaker 1: there's something within, like for those who are here, you
Speaker 1: can't just come in and do what you want to do, right,
Speaker 1: If you're gonna be you're gonna get part of the problem.
Speaker 1: You're part of the program program. Yeah, So the problem
Speaker 1: is was it mandatory? Was the meeting meeting mandatory for
Speaker 1: those in attendance to get what I'm saying, yes, Like
Speaker 1: so I think that's where it comes up versus I
Speaker 1: think because I'm I tried reading through all this last night.
Speaker 1: It's very dense. I sent it to my brother who's
Speaker 1: a lawyer. He hasn't texted me back. But for basically,
Speaker 1: the way I look at it is like, if you
Speaker 1: can be here for longer than four hours, but the
Speaker 1: team can't give you more than four hours to if
Speaker 1: those four hours hit and you're like, I'm gonna go
Speaker 1: get a lift in, you can go get a lift in.
Speaker 1: So it kind of reads like, Hey, the end of
Speaker 1: the day, we're gonna all meet with Joe Judge and
Speaker 1: kind of talk about special team stuff. But the way
Speaker 1: in which it was listed on the schedule wasn't a
Speaker 1: kind of hey, if you're still around to come by.
Speaker 1: It was more of a this is part of the
Speaker 1: day today.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, And that I can sort of understand. I
Speaker 2: still think and look when when when his name, Joe
Speaker 2: Judge's name is included in this report from Bedard And
Speaker 2: it's a sticking point right now for Patriots fans. We
Speaker 2: we both realize that right that that just him in
Speaker 2: general right now is not He's not the most popular
Speaker 2: guy on the block. Let me let me put it
Speaker 2: to you that way. But that being said, I still
Speaker 2: think that the punishment's a little harsh, and I think
Speaker 2: the main thing is is that you can't have it
Speaker 2: both ways. If you're the NFL, you can't hold these
Speaker 2: off season programs. Insist that they're voluntary, but all thirty
Speaker 2: two teams approach it the same way. And I said
Speaker 2: this this earlier. If you're if you're Stefan Diggs in Buffalo,
Speaker 2: does Stefon Diggs need to come to ot As. No,
Speaker 2: Stefan Digs ain't getting cut. Stefan Diggs is not getting traded.
Speaker 2: Stefan Diggs is not in jepfer. Are you losing his job?
Speaker 2: He's not fighting for a roster spot. It's just like
Speaker 2: when Brady would wouldn't come and we'd go do his
Speaker 2: own thing in the off season and then come back
Speaker 2: from mandatory mini camp. Those guys, for better or worse,
Speaker 2: are are different for the ninetieth guy on the roster right,
Speaker 2: For for Anthony Firksker, they just signed like an hour ago.
Speaker 2: He's got to be here, right. If you want to
Speaker 2: make the team, you're gonna be here. And I just
Speaker 2: think that it's it's such a wonky thing of it's
Speaker 2: clearly wink wink, nod nod mandatory for guys that aren't
Speaker 2: Tom Brady's.
Speaker 1: In sorry, is well, okay, it's not option, it's not mandatory,
Speaker 1: but it's also not mandatory we keep you on the
Speaker 1: roster right past camp. You want a little more details
Speaker 1: on this, Yeah, we're tricking in. So Mike Grd quote
Speaker 1: tweeted Greg's report said, can confirm this and also note
Speaker 1: that per sources, the players were aware they were being
Speaker 1: asked to stay longer than allowed. Did they help alert
Speaker 1: the NFLPA. I don't have the answer to that as
Speaker 1: of now, but basically, the players knew sitting in that meeting,
Speaker 1: Hey this is a violation, is what Mike is saying,
Speaker 1: and still went. So that's a really interesting dynamic. And
Speaker 1: I don't I'm kind of talking through this. I'm not
Speaker 1: blaming anybody, but did the players say, hey, this is
Speaker 1: not right, we're not supposed to be here.
Speaker 2: Did they go?
Speaker 1: Did they go and then say something like That's a
Speaker 1: really interesting dynamic that the players knew that it was
Speaker 1: a violation. So, and it goes back to your point
Speaker 1: with Joe Judge. And I thought it was interesting in
Speaker 1: Greg's report too that he has that, you know, the
Speaker 1: league in the league documents which he has that Joe
Speaker 1: Judge referred to as a special teams coach, and that
Speaker 1: kind of formalizes something a lot of us that expected.
Speaker 1: So it is interesting that this whole thing's kind of
Speaker 1: centering around him.
Speaker 2: Not great, not great, and it's not it's not even
Speaker 2: just a judge because I don't want to make him
Speaker 2: like a target for people, because there's already enough of
Speaker 2: a target for people.
Speaker 1: Well, that's why I'm saying, like the fact that he
Speaker 1: ends up in the middle of this is kind of like, yeah,
Speaker 1: not great.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think what the biggest thing that we
Speaker 2: were talking about off air, the most important thing, because
Speaker 2: when this originally happened, I full hand up on this.
Speaker 2: I was pissed because we couldn't go to practice today
Speaker 2: that I'm gonna admit that, like I wanted to go.
Speaker 2: I was excited. You know what, we we nerd out
Speaker 2: about this kind of stuff. We get to go watch
Speaker 2: them play some semblance of real football. We get to
Speaker 2: talk to you know, the listeners, everybody, and you get
Speaker 2: to talk to you guys about it, Like we like
Speaker 2: doing this. This is what we what we're in the
Speaker 2: job for, is what we're so I was mad about that,
Speaker 2: but that aside, I think what's more important is that
Speaker 2: they just lost four hours of practice. They just lost
Speaker 2: four hours of practice in the spring. It's clear. Look,
Speaker 2: I just said that Tom Brady and Stefon Diggs. Don't
Speaker 2: you know Sewan Diggs. That's not news breaks is retired.
Speaker 2: Diggs isn't that OTAs. The Bills aren't gonna lose the
Speaker 2: AFC Championship game because the fond Diggs didn't go to
Speaker 2: OTAs right like that, that's not going to be the case.
Speaker 2: But the bottom line is is that you have a
Speaker 2: new offensive coordinator, you're changing some things. It sounds like
Speaker 2: if Joe Judges is involved on special teams that he's
Speaker 2: calling meetings, it sounds like you're changing some things on
Speaker 2: special teams as well. And the bottom line is is
Speaker 2: that you just lost four hours of practice time and
Speaker 2: that in itself is something to be critical about because
Speaker 2: you you need every ounce of practice that you could
Speaker 2: possibly get. And at this time yesterday, when it just
Speaker 2: felt like they were just canceling, just to cancel, it
Speaker 2: was like, well, what they think they're ready? Like they
Speaker 2: think they're you know, they don't need these practices. Now
Speaker 2: that this comes out, it adds another layer to it.
Speaker 2: But certainly it's still in the same realm of let's
Speaker 2: button it up here, guys, right, Like, let's let's get
Speaker 2: a hold of these things a little bit more. Because
Speaker 2: this stuff for a team that's trying to rebuild or
Speaker 2: retool or reinvigorate, whatever word you want to use, this
Speaker 2: stuff can matter. It can matter. And I think that
Speaker 2: that as a Patriot fan, I would be a little
Speaker 2: bit disappointed in the team that they allowed this to happen,
Speaker 2: that they are losing two practices that now I think
Speaker 2: the biggest thing and with this Joe Judge report coming out,
Speaker 2: the biggest fear that I have is that this sounds
Speaker 2: a lot like last year. Yeah, this sounds a lot
Speaker 2: like last year with the situation, the setup on offense,
Speaker 2: and the players either not being on the same page
Speaker 2: as the coaches, the players not agreeing with the philosophies
Speaker 2: or the methods of the coaches. And this is same book,
Speaker 2: different chapter. And I think that in order for this
Speaker 2: team to get where we want this team to go,
Speaker 2: they need to be clean slate from last year. Just
Speaker 2: like Bill O'Brien said, right, you need to completely wipe
Speaker 2: the slate, cleaning of any of that type of thing
Speaker 2: going on. So it's that part of it I think
Speaker 2: is maybe even more important than the four hours of
Speaker 2: practice time, is that this is the type of stuff
Speaker 2: that was happening in last year. And now how do
Speaker 2: these players that were you know, I don't think you
Speaker 2: have to worry about like Matthew Slater, right, but what
Speaker 2: do you think Chris Board's thinking, Well, you know, what
Speaker 2: do you think you know a mere speed in Isaiah
Speaker 2: Bolden and you know the guys that they drafted at
Speaker 2: the end of the draft of special teams guys. It
Speaker 2: just you don't need this right now. You need to
Speaker 2: get everybody pulling the rope in the same direction. And
Speaker 2: this makes it feel a lot like last year that
Speaker 2: everybody's there's a chasm, right, there's a little bit of
Speaker 2: a sticking point there. So that that's your that's that's
Speaker 2: where we're at right now with the Patriots and and
Speaker 2: the OTAs well.
Speaker 1: I've just said the other thing too. You mentioned you know,
Speaker 1: guys on the same page and might you already had
Speaker 1: it there? The players knew that it was past the
Speaker 1: alloted time, and you know, did they or are they
Speaker 1: the ones who went to the NFLPA or No, we
Speaker 1: don't know two of the Patriots for NFLPA reps or
Speaker 1: Joe Cardon and Cody Davis special teamers. So that's an
Speaker 1: interesting wrinkle. And one more thing on the practice thing
Speaker 1: too that you were talking about. I don't I don't
Speaker 1: know how to sound this out sounding over le dramatic,
Speaker 1: So just no, I don't. There's not a better way
Speaker 1: to phrase this. But there are ota practices. I get it.
Speaker 1: They're non padded and air all that doesn't this like
Speaker 1: sort of put pressure on the players now for Wednesday,
Speaker 1: because if they come out and they don't look great,
Speaker 1: and I know it's ot. They'm not saying if like
Speaker 1: you know, oh, they're struggling, like if the defense is
Speaker 1: making plays, the defense is making place. But I'm saying
Speaker 1: if they come out and it looks like early training
Speaker 1: camp last year, where guys are running the wrong routes,
Speaker 1: or guys are running into each other, or they can't
Speaker 1: get the playoff in time and things like that, it's
Speaker 1: gonna be they're gonna get a lot of questions about
Speaker 1: do you guys feel like you could have used those
Speaker 1: extra practices? Do you feel like you guys missed that
Speaker 1: practic this time? When I say there's pressure on this
Speaker 1: as an OTAM talking relative compared to a normal attell,
Speaker 1: but it's which has zero stakes. But there is something
Speaker 1: there now.
Speaker 2: It just this is our first look in at the team.
Speaker 2: So there was already gonna be intrigue about how things
Speaker 2: were going. Intrigued pressure, But I just mean like there's
Speaker 2: always gonna be stories coming out of that of you know,
Speaker 2: what was Bill O'Brien, like, what was Joe Judge doing?
Speaker 2: But now that gets ramped up. Right now, now, well
Speaker 2: that's the coaches right now, there's pressure on where are
Speaker 2: they at?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 2: You know, what does it look like? Where are they at?
Speaker 2: What what's Joe Judge look like? And what sort of
Speaker 2: his dynamic like his interactions with players, Like if he's coaching,
Speaker 2: if he's a special teams coach, that means that he's
Speaker 2: hands on coaching, right, if he's leading meetings, he's hands on.
Speaker 2: So how do how are players responding to him? How
Speaker 2: how is this whole thing going? It's uh, it's another
Speaker 2: it's another sort of thing that they just don't need.
Speaker 2: I think that's what his bottom line is is. It's
Speaker 2: not you're you're right, It's not the biggest deal in
Speaker 2: the world. It's spring practices. There's no reason to blow
Speaker 2: it out of proportion. But at the same time, it's
Speaker 2: just one of those things that you just don't need.
Speaker 2: You don't need to lose practices, you don't need it
Speaker 2: to be go this way and have it be because
Speaker 2: of these types of things. And you, if you're trying
Speaker 2: to turn this football team around, this is just not
Speaker 2: something that you need right now. So it's just, uh,
Speaker 2: we'll see where it goes. Wednesday's gonna be interesting. That
Speaker 2: that's for sure. I mean it was already gonna be
Speaker 2: like somewhat interesting, but now forget about it. I mean,
Speaker 2: now it's really interesting now. And now we'll see what
Speaker 2: with all this, you know, all this kind of shakes
Speaker 2: out and special teams is still as much as they've
Speaker 2: turned over the personnel there. There was questions about Camra
Speaker 2: Cord from a lot of people. I get emails and
Speaker 2: texts and the d ms about that all the time, Like,
Speaker 2: you know, okay, well they brought in Chris Board, they
Speaker 2: brought in this guy, but how they still have the
Speaker 2: same coat. So now Joe Judge sounds like he's maybe
Speaker 2: even more involved than we even thought, almost like a
Speaker 2: de facto assistant Special Teams Coordinator or something like that
Speaker 2: if he's leading meetings and things like that. So it's
Speaker 2: gonna be fascinating. We're we are going to talk about
Speaker 2: what's going on or will be going on on the
Speaker 2: field at OTAs we both Alex and I both wrote
Speaker 2: OTA previews for the practice that was supposed to happen
Speaker 2: today that didn't. So we'll both have some thoughts on
Speaker 2: what we want to have our eye on and things
Speaker 2: like that. So we'll get to that as well. Get
Speaker 2: to your calls. Eight five to five PATS five hundred
Speaker 2: Web Radio at Patriots dot com is the email. Let's
Speaker 2: take a few calls and we'll get into some of
Speaker 2: our or what we're watching or what what what? How
Speaker 2: did you phrase yours storylines?
Speaker 1: To watch?
Speaker 2: Storylines? To watch? What caught my eye whatever. We'll get
Speaker 2: to that in a second, but let's start with Sean
Speaker 2: and Vancouver.
Speaker 4: What's up Sean, Hey, guys, how's going?
Speaker 3: OK?
Speaker 4: Well, I wanted to mention something that was on the
Speaker 4: previous show. We had a color who was a little
Speaker 4: discouraged about the Patriots upcoming season, and you know, saying
Speaker 4: that they're all there is is hopeful. We can't really
Speaker 4: rely on that. But you know, Evan, you mentioned that
Speaker 4: older fans like myself, I'm going to be fifty seven November,
Speaker 4: we had terrible teams and we had this rebuilding thing,
Speaker 4: but you know what, in reality, we didn't because all
Speaker 4: the success prior to two thousand and one was just limited,
Speaker 4: like it didn't continue. You'd have to be a fan
Speaker 4: of the Cowboys or the Steelers, so something like that
Speaker 4: who had some success and then rebuilt and then had
Speaker 4: more success later on. So for us, you know, we
Speaker 4: look back at the seventies with the team that was
Speaker 4: the first championship caliber team and got screwed by the
Speaker 4: rest in Oakland. And then in the eighties the great
Speaker 4: win in Miami finally won a game never won down
Speaker 4: there before. That team was was also a little bit
Speaker 4: of a surprise because it was a wildcard team that
Speaker 4: went to the Super Bowl got killed by the Bears,
Speaker 4: but you know, that was the end of that. And
Speaker 4: then in the nineties, Parcels team was was what six
Speaker 4: and ten in in ninety five and then ninety six
Speaker 4: again they went to Superbowl, but Parcels was on his
Speaker 4: way out and it wasn't wasn't quite rebuilt from from before,
Speaker 4: and then they went downhill. They they they had to
Speaker 4: rebuild something that wasn't even there, you know, it was
Speaker 4: it was a big surprise in two thousand and one,
Speaker 4: you know, because they were terrible in two thousand and
Speaker 4: Tom Brady had the magic from that Jets game and
Speaker 4: then the rest is history.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, it's a good point, Sean. You know, I
Speaker 2: just was to fill you in on what we were
Speaker 2: talking about things for the call. Sean just I think
Speaker 2: that sometimes a lot of the frustrat and sort of
Speaker 2: the impatience at times. And I hate to use that
Speaker 2: word because it has been a couple of years now, right,
Speaker 2: I don't think that's totally fair, but in general, I
Speaker 2: think we have never really been through this, right, Like,
Speaker 2: you know, you dropped off from the greatest run in
Speaker 2: NFL history and now you're a team that's back with
Speaker 2: the pack and just sort of another team in the NFL.
Speaker 2: And I do think that that's hard for fan bases.
Speaker 2: And my point was, you know, being honest about myself
Speaker 2: as a as a fan of the team and now
Speaker 2: somebody that reports on the team, I've never seen them
Speaker 2: lose like I've never seen them have anything really but success.
Speaker 2: I mean, even like what I remember of the nineties,
Speaker 2: those teams weren't you know, weren't always great, but they
Speaker 2: weren't they weren't terrible either, and they certainly had, you know,
Speaker 2: some some moments. And then really my first vivid football
Speaker 2: memories are of two thousand and one, and so all
Speaker 2: of a sudden, this team it just never loses, right,
Speaker 2: you know, you go twenty years like that, it gets
Speaker 2: to the point where it's hard to be down here.
Speaker 2: It's hard to just be another one of the crowd.
Speaker 2: And I think that that's sort of where the Patriots
Speaker 2: are at and their expectation that were set by the
Speaker 2: standard that they had with Brady. It's never gonna be
Speaker 2: like that again. Like did you welcome to the real NFL? Right?
Speaker 2: Like this is sort of what it's like for everybody else.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they didn't operate really the same way the other
Speaker 1: teams did.
Speaker 2: They're one of thirty.
Speaker 1: Two now, and that's just just just kind of what
Speaker 1: it looks like.
Speaker 2: Yeah, all right, what's up, Patty? How you doing.
Speaker 5: Up? Guys?
Speaker 1: So?
Speaker 5: Can I give you a quick brief history of my
Speaker 5: Patriots fandom and my thoughts on what happened with them
Speaker 5: losing practices? Sure, all right, So the year's nineteen ninety
Speaker 5: and I'm in eighth grade. I wasn't really that big
Speaker 5: of a football fan, so and I remember Monday night
Speaker 5: games leading up to a Monday night game between the
Speaker 5: Giants and the forty nine ers, who I believe were
Speaker 5: both eleven and one at the time, and I'd spoken
Speaker 5: something about the game, and I'll never forget this kid,
Speaker 5: Walter Garcia said, hey, pat, I never hear you talk
Speaker 5: about football. Who's your team? And I said, well, I'm
Speaker 5: from here, I'm a Patriots fan. And the whole class,
Speaker 5: like all the kid, even the girls dude back then,
Speaker 5: laughed at me. And it was that moment that I said,
Speaker 5: you know what I said in my head, I'm going
Speaker 5: to become the biggest Patriots fan. And really, who's laughing now?
Speaker 5: I mean, who cares about the last few years I
Speaker 5: was allowed to see six Super Bowl championships? You know,
Speaker 5: who cares if his Giants had a couple of a
Speaker 5: couple of them on mine? But what that's whatever, bro,
Speaker 5: But that's my my breef standem history. And if I'm
Speaker 5: Robert Krapf this. Indeed, if this, if this whole the
Speaker 5: Shenanigans were due to Joe Judge and his machismo or
Speaker 5: his ego or whatever hell he want to call it,
Speaker 5: I'm going to Byllain saying, listen, after what happened last
Speaker 5: year and that now we're getting now we can't practice
Speaker 5: for two days. This guy's got to go. I'm sorry.
Speaker 5: That's that's just how I feel as a fan. And
Speaker 5: you know, if I was in the owner shoes, but
Speaker 5: it's probably a good thing. I'm not the owner. That's
Speaker 5: all I.
Speaker 2: Gott Thanks, Patty. Look, I've I'm always wary out of
Speaker 2: calling for people's jobs. I don't like doing that. But
Speaker 2: Patty having those feelings about Joe Judges, I can't blame
Speaker 2: him for it, right, I just I can't blame you.
Speaker 2: If you're looking at this and saying that it's not
Speaker 2: it's it's to that point for you. I think that's
Speaker 2: a valid feeling to have. But I wonder it's funny
Speaker 2: because when we found out that Joe Judge was going
Speaker 2: to be involved on special teams, I think we all
Speaker 2: kind of, at least myself, I want to say we
Speaker 2: all speak for myself. We're kind of happy about that, right,
Speaker 2: like that's where he should be coaching. I mean, he's
Speaker 2: a special teams guy, like that's that's his roots. But
Speaker 2: I think what with him, the issues that come up
Speaker 2: are when he oversteps, right, when he thinks that he
Speaker 2: is more than just an assistant coach on the staff
Speaker 2: and he becomes a little bit bigger than that, and
Speaker 2: that this is sort of along those lines.
Speaker 1: Not gonna lie well, I mean it goes back to
Speaker 1: I remember this conversation we had when it was revealed
Speaker 1: that he was coming back. I guess if he's gonna
Speaker 1: be here special teams kind of helping out overseeing cam
Speaker 1: Accord in a more game planning role, that's the best
Speaker 1: spot for him if he has to be here. But
Speaker 1: that that was kind of my point is after everything
Speaker 1: that happened last year, does he still have to be here?
Speaker 1: And now here we are?
Speaker 2: It is an interesting dynamic and clearly clearly Bill thinks
Speaker 2: highly of Joe Judge. Yeah, because Joe Judge has gotten
Speaker 2: a lot of strikes with Bill and so.
Speaker 1: Look, I think he is a great special teams coach
Speaker 1: for everything here, like the special teams when he was
Speaker 1: the Special Teams cording his first thing here, Yeah, was
Speaker 1: probably as good as they've been as long as Brad Seeley. Yes,
Speaker 1: at least I'll admit I didn't follow special teams as
Speaker 1: closely back then.
Speaker 2: I don't think anybody follows special teams closely as you
Speaker 2: do now.
Speaker 1: Like he is really good at what he Joe Judge
Speaker 1: is really good at what that job is. Like, you
Speaker 1: can't deny that.
Speaker 2: It'll be interesting to see now that we move forward.
Speaker 2: Because even though Patty, I can understand your your sentiment
Speaker 2: about Jojo, he's gonna he's gonna be here right, Like,
Speaker 2: I can't imagine that after everything that went on last year,
Speaker 2: like this being the final. Yeah, I don't know. I
Speaker 2: just can't see that well the other here. But what's interesting,
Speaker 2: you know, just quickly, what would be interesting is how
Speaker 2: is it run on the sideline come September?
Speaker 5: Right?
Speaker 3: Like?
Speaker 2: Is he is he the coordinator? Like is he the
Speaker 2: one with the headset in the in the sheet and
Speaker 2: he's calling out, you know, calls to to the guys
Speaker 2: on the field. Is he the one in the middle
Speaker 2: of the huddle like you know, look, it's a special
Speaker 2: team's coordinator. We've I'll see what it looks like or
Speaker 2: is that still cam Accord and Joe Judge is just
Speaker 2: there to help from like like a lot of coaches
Speaker 2: say Monday through Saturday, right, and then on Sunday it's
Speaker 2: it's somebody else's gig. Like, is that the way it's
Speaker 2: gonna go. It's gonna be interesting to see how involved
Speaker 2: he is. I guess it is a short way of
Speaker 2: saying it, but based off of this, it sounds like
Speaker 2: he's gonna be heavily involved, So we'll see.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and the other question again we're getting into semantics here. Yeah,
Speaker 1: did they know the meeting was going like I'm saying
Speaker 1: the coaches whoever put on schedule?
Speaker 2: Yep?
Speaker 1: Did they know the meeting was going too long? It
Speaker 1: was like we're gonna try to get through it. Or
Speaker 1: was it just like a miscommunication they didn't realize? Right,
Speaker 1: Because that also sort of frames how how they react
Speaker 1: to it.
Speaker 2: I think, yeah, that's fair a man, just another thing
Speaker 2: that they just didn't need. That's all I'm gonna keep repeating,
Speaker 2: is this, These these things are things that they've got,
Speaker 2: They've got a button up. They've got to find a
Speaker 2: way to clean this type of stuff up. All right,
Speaker 2: let's talk a little bit about OTAs and about the
Speaker 2: next couple weeks with spring practices. We still get two,
Speaker 2: so we're still gonna be out there for two. Then
Speaker 2: we get the three mandatory mini camp days, so things
Speaker 2: are gonna heat up. There's a couple of things that
Speaker 2: I wrote it, but I wrote eight things, and I'll
Speaker 2: get to as many as we can, and you can
Speaker 2: get to yours. I think the biggest one, though, just
Speaker 2: starting off the top, is obviously seeing at least the
Speaker 2: basic or the foundation elements of Bill O'Brien's system, Right,
Speaker 2: what what is it gonna look like? I think there's
Speaker 2: been a lot of speculation on him, you know, certainly
Speaker 2: on this program, we've talked a ton about what it
Speaker 2: might look like. But I think the general gist of
Speaker 2: what I imagine we're gonna see is mainly seventy five
Speaker 2: percent Bill O'Brien. Right, We're gonna see, you know, Houston
Speaker 2: early Patriots, Bill O'Brien, you know, twenty twenty eleven Bill O'Brien,
Speaker 2: and obviously a little bit of Alabama Bill O'Brien too.
Speaker 2: But maybe we also see a little bit of doing
Speaker 2: what worked and for Mac Jones in the offense, in
Speaker 2: Max Rogie year. And now I know that that comes
Speaker 2: across as oh, well, you know what, bringing back a
Speaker 2: full back and under center, and and maybe that it's
Speaker 2: not that deep, right, maybe it doesn't go to formations
Speaker 2: and personnel groupings and go down in that path, But
Speaker 2: just in general, I think where they're aiming to attack
Speaker 2: the field, you know, I think what the big thing
Speaker 2: is with what happened last year, and they talked about it,
Speaker 2: you know, Matt Patrischa openly talked about how they wanted
Speaker 2: to be a little bit more vertical, and they wanted
Speaker 2: to be a little bit more bombs away. And I
Speaker 2: think that they looked at Mac Jones at Alabama and
Speaker 2: saw that he had the touch and the ability to
Speaker 2: throw not necessarily a twenty five yard dart, but throw
Speaker 2: a touch deep ball, you know, throw a true deep
Speaker 2: ball pass. And I think that they wanted to get
Speaker 2: a little bit more like that. But it certainly had
Speaker 2: more downs and ups, but it had it's up and downs,
Speaker 2: and I think the main thing was is that it
Speaker 2: was it was, it was inconsistent, it was it was
Speaker 2: just extremely volatile. So my question is more and less
Speaker 2: so about formations and personnel groupings because I think at
Speaker 2: the end of the day, Bill O'Brien's going to live
Speaker 2: in the groupings and the formations that he lives in. Right,
Speaker 2: it's gonna be eleven, it's gonna be twelve. I don't
Speaker 2: think it's gonna be any twenty one. But the question
Speaker 2: is is do they get back to really trying to
Speaker 2: win between the numbers and within that fifteen to you know,
Speaker 2: five to fifteen yard range versus trying to push the
Speaker 2: ball down the field more like they were doing the
Speaker 2: year before. And I think some of the personnel moves
Speaker 2: that they made in the offseason, mainly Juju but even
Speaker 2: Mi Kasiki to be a seam runner kind of point
Speaker 2: to the fact that they want to get back to
Speaker 2: that team that dices you up in the middle of
Speaker 2: the field.
Speaker 1: Well, just big picture here. When you talk about Lebrian,
Speaker 1: let's rewind for a second. What were the two biggest
Speaker 1: stories at least I honestly don't remember what we talked
Speaker 1: about with the defense last year. Coming out of OTS
Speaker 1: you don't talk a lot about defense. Yeah, during OT
Speaker 1: is unpadded practices, you don't see ton. But although there
Speaker 1: is one defensive storyline, I want to get to. We'll
Speaker 1: get into that in a second. The two biggest storylines
Speaker 1: last year were the new offensive system, right was look good,
Speaker 1: they're running zone They're running you know, zone block.
Speaker 2: Concepts and that really carried over.
Speaker 1: And the flat the fact they flipped the tackles that
Speaker 1: Isaiah When's on the right side, Trent Browns on the
Speaker 1: left side. Well you know here we are here later.
Speaker 1: Two of the biggest things I think we're looking for,
Speaker 1: and the third that we didn't have last year is
Speaker 1: how big of how much is this quarterback competition actually
Speaker 1: going to be a competition if at all?
Speaker 2: Oh I have I have a take on it. I
Speaker 2: do too.
Speaker 1: But besides that, what's the offensive system going to look like?
Speaker 1: And like you said, we might not know exactly, but
Speaker 1: we'll get an idea. Are they going back to power run,
Speaker 1: what kind of personality using and who's playing where at tackle?
Speaker 1: Because this isn't going to be your typical position battle.
Speaker 1: Trent Brown, Calvin Anderson, Riley Reef, all three of them
Speaker 1: can play both left and right. Now there's strengths for
Speaker 1: some more one than the other, but it's not as
Speaker 1: simple as hey, there's there's two guys competing for one spot,
Speaker 1: or there's three guys competing for you know, the starter
Speaker 1: and the backup job. It's gonna be start one bench,
Speaker 1: one cut, one right. This is three guys essentially competing
Speaker 1: for four jobs starting left tackles, starting right tackle, backup
Speaker 1: left tackle, backup, right tackle, right. And there might be
Speaker 1: overlap in there for sure, But it's this thing where
Speaker 1: it's not necessarily a direct you know, all right, well,
Speaker 1: this guy's gonna play here, this guy's gonna play here.
Speaker 1: There's different permutations of it. Yeah, you know, with Trent Brant,
Speaker 1: let's say it's Trent Brown on the left side rather
Speaker 1: the reef on the right side, or Trent Brown on
Speaker 1: the right side, Calvin Anderson on the left side.
Speaker 2: Well then who what? So those are kind of the two.
Speaker 1: Big things we're going into looking at this, and it's
Speaker 1: funny because it's kind of the big things we came
Speaker 1: away from last year's OTAs.
Speaker 2: The other big thing that I think that we came
Speaker 2: away from last year's OTIA is that one keeps in
Speaker 2: perspective that it's OTAs right and two points to what
Speaker 2: I was talking about before about the stylistic decisions of
Speaker 2: the offense. The big picture philosophies of the offense. Remember
Speaker 2: who the star was on offense last year? No ta
Speaker 2: is Alex Yeah, Tray Nixon yea. And why was he
Speaker 2: the star? Because they were bombing and away to trade
Speaker 2: Nixon down the field of No tas. So one, it's
Speaker 2: the Maurice Harris of it, all right, it's the fact
Speaker 2: that this actually means absolutely nothing. And in two, it's
Speaker 2: also just the fact that that was a philosophical shift
Speaker 2: right out of the gate. Right out of the gate,
Speaker 2: they wanted to be a bigger play offense, a more
Speaker 2: vertical offense, hunt chunk plays, things like that, And I
Speaker 2: really hope and wonder, but mostly hope that they're back
Speaker 2: to being more efficiency based this year. And I think
Speaker 2: that's better for the quarterback as well. Let's talk about
Speaker 2: the quarterbacks. This is my big thing other than Bill O'Brien,
Speaker 2: and this is my big take about the entire spring
Speaker 2: of the summer. I have no time and you can
Speaker 2: call in an email in and disagree, because plenty of
Speaker 2: people already have about this. I have absolutely no time
Speaker 2: at all for your quarterback competition. I do not I
Speaker 2: did not want to see a quarterback competition. I want
Speaker 2: to waste time with the quarterback competition. I don't want
Speaker 2: to hear it. I don't want to hear about how
Speaker 2: it pushes. Oh, it's gonna push Mac Jones. This is
Speaker 2: gonna get the best out it, you know, because they
Speaker 2: haven't tried pushing. You know what's gonna get the best
Speaker 2: out of Mac Jones? Getting him ready for the season.
Speaker 2: How about that? How about he's on his third coordinator
Speaker 2: in three years and the NFL is in another system. Again,
Speaker 2: it's certainly gonna have some overlap to his rookie year system.
Speaker 2: I'm not gonna deny that. But in general, another system,
Speaker 2: another voice, another guy leading the charge, a guy that
Speaker 2: we think is gonna be good at the job. I'll,
Speaker 2: you know, I'll put that aside. All that. I've seen
Speaker 2: two quarterback competitions in my time on the beat already
Speaker 2: because of the situation that we're in. One of them
Speaker 2: was a legitimate competition. That was twenty twenty COVID year
Speaker 2: Cam Newton versus Jaredson Mcbrian Hoyn, which.
Speaker 1: Cam Newton won by decidedly by default. He won that
Speaker 1: in a first round knockout.
Speaker 2: He won it by default. But but with that being
Speaker 2: said they wasted. I would say there was no spring
Speaker 2: that year, right because of COVID. They wasted like the
Speaker 2: first ten days of training camp on a competition on
Speaker 2: rotating every oh everybody gets a turn, right, everybody gets
Speaker 2: a turn, and we're gonna do this, and we're gonna
Speaker 2: do that. I don't think the Cam Newton Patriots that
Speaker 2: roster was was.
Speaker 1: In shambles, was beyond camp.
Speaker 2: That was not a good team. But I still wonder
Speaker 2: to an extent if they had just came into camp
Speaker 2: knowing that Cam Newton was going to be the starting
Speaker 2: quarterback and didn't try to try to convince themselves that
Speaker 2: Jared Stidham at that stage or ever was a starting
Speaker 2: quarterback in this league. How much more creative, how much
Speaker 2: more could they have put in right in terms of
Speaker 2: the running elements is what I'm talking about.
Speaker 1: How much even more than that, how much more comfortable
Speaker 1: would Cam have been with some of the receivers, because
Speaker 1: it was definitely a feeling out process early on, right, and.
Speaker 2: He was our already behind the eight ball because of
Speaker 2: how short the off season and the training camp were.
Speaker 1: I don't even think he didn't sign it until like July.
Speaker 2: Yeah, right, so yeah, he was already wasn't a full camp. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and then they wasted the time trying to figure out
Speaker 2: all who's the starter when it was pretty clear the
Speaker 2: only guy that had any chance to start in the
Speaker 2: NFL that season for the Patriots is Cam Newton. So
Speaker 2: that's one. The other one that I witnessed was obviously
Speaker 2: Cam versus Mac, right, which wasn't really a quarterback competition again,
Speaker 2: because Cam would get four reps and then Mac would
Speaker 2: get twenty five straight.
Speaker 1: Right, But yes, and no, Cam would get four reps,
Speaker 1: Mac would get twenty five straight. But Cam would get
Speaker 1: four reps with the starters and Mac would get twenty
Speaker 1: five with the backups. Yeah, it didn't shift till the
Speaker 1: end of the year. I don't mean to cut you
Speaker 1: off here, but.
Speaker 2: It's also a waste of time, that's my point.
Speaker 1: But here's the thing about that one. If you are
Speaker 1: somebody who thinks Mac's not the best option, right, they
Speaker 1: should go with Bailey's appy, they should go with Billie
Speaker 1: Cunningham and somebody somebody brought this up in the chat.
Speaker 1: It's you know, it's the best player plays No, but wait,
Speaker 1: I'm just kidding. That's sort of what that twenty twenty
Speaker 1: one battle was Yeah, Mac, I don't think it was
Speaker 1: about so you said before, Right, they wasted time because
Speaker 1: they didn't know who their starter was going to be
Speaker 1: early on.
Speaker 2: Yep.
Speaker 1: I think what happened in twenty twenty one was they
Speaker 1: did know. I think they went into camp fully ready
Speaker 1: for Cam Newton to start that season and Mac Jones
Speaker 1: to begin the year on the bench, and Mac played
Speaker 1: so well they had no choice, okay but to say,
Speaker 1: all right, we have to now start giving to this
Speaker 1: kid a chance with the starters. So could that be
Speaker 1: the thing that happens. So here's the thing.
Speaker 2: They're two different kinds. Yes, that, and that's sort of
Speaker 2: what I'm driving at too, right. I'm glad you kind
Speaker 2: of summed it up that way. Yeah, but I am
Speaker 2: leaving the door open for Vailey's appy. If Mac Jones
Speaker 2: has a rough camp, if Mac Jones has a rough
Speaker 2: start to the season, is where I'm really at with it.
Speaker 2: Like if the first month doesn't go well, yeah, and
Speaker 2: they're zero to four coming out of September, and it's
Speaker 2: just clear that this wasn't all just Matt Patricia being
Speaker 2: Matt Patricia. This is also just Mac is maybe just
Speaker 2: not not the guy. Right then, I'm leaving that door open.
Speaker 2: But going into the season, I don't want to hear
Speaker 2: that the best player will play. I don't want to
Speaker 2: hear that. Oh well, we gotta you know, Mac, you
Speaker 2: got to push him. We got to see what it's no, no,
Speaker 2: be it be good teams don't do stuff like but
Speaker 2: here's but here's what I'm in line.
Speaker 1: So again, the twenty twenty one was like a true
Speaker 1: when people think of quarterback competition, both guys going back
Speaker 1: and forth to the starters don't do that. Yeah, because,
Speaker 1: like you said, they need to get Mac ready. Yeah
Speaker 1: that Mac needs to be working with David Andrews and
Speaker 1: with Juju Smith Schuster and Hunter Henry and Mike Kasicki
Speaker 1: and that whole group. Yep, right, that's what he needs
Speaker 1: to be doing all the time. But at the same time,
Speaker 1: down at Brookline, whatever you said. You said you want
Speaker 1: to leave the door open for Bailey's apps.
Speaker 2: I want to leave the door open.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna rephrase that.
Speaker 2: I'm leaving the door open me too. I'm leaving the
Speaker 2: door open because from all the tea leaves, I have
Speaker 2: to write like I can't I can't ignore the fact
Speaker 2: that the head coach of the team didn't say his
Speaker 2: name for like six months in the offseason, right, So
Speaker 2: I can't leave it. I have to leave it open
Speaker 2: because it is a possibility.
Speaker 1: Well, no, but there's a difference here. There's a difference
Speaker 1: between what we think they should do and what they
Speaker 1: will do. Honestly, even what I think they should do.
Speaker 1: And this is me is a mac Jones guy. I'm
Speaker 1: not leaving the door open for Bailey's appy, but I'll
Speaker 1: leave it unlocked if he can open it.
Speaker 2: Like, this is the thing. Drill mac Jones with the starters.
Speaker 1: Give mac Jones all the high impact reps, all that,
Speaker 1: but if on that second field, Bailey's appy looks so
Speaker 1: damn good that you can't help. But wonder what happens
Speaker 1: if we plug this guy in with the starters, if
Speaker 1: it gets to that point. I'm not opposed, but I
Speaker 1: don't think it's a true quarterback competition. Everything should be
Speaker 1: set up for mac Jones to be getting ready for
Speaker 1: the season. The only reason Bailey should come. Bailey's appy
Speaker 1: should come into the conversations. If it becomes clear mac
Speaker 1: Jones maybe isn't the best option for the season because
Speaker 1: as of right now, everything we know, Mac Jones is
Speaker 1: the best option and it's not close, so just get
Speaker 1: him ready. I just that's what they should be focusing.
Speaker 2: I just think that a lot of the time, with
Speaker 2: these these competitions and with the best players should have
Speaker 2: played mentality and and the back and forth and all
Speaker 2: that kind of stuff, what you end up doing is
Speaker 2: you end up not fully preparing either guy exactly, right.
Speaker 1: But yeah, well it's that old saying when you have
Speaker 1: two quarterbacks, you know, on a quarterback right.
Speaker 2: So, and what it also reminds me of is, you know,
Speaker 2: we've covered a lot of training camp practices at this point,
Speaker 2: and some joint practices too, and sometimes they've had joint practices.
Speaker 2: And I go back to like Carolina last year, Yeah,
Speaker 2: right where it was it was Donald, right, Donald and
Speaker 2: Baker and they had a quarterback competition. It was it
Speaker 2: was two former failed top five picks going head to
Speaker 2: head and they had a quarterback competition. And they got
Speaker 2: into the season and it was Baker right off the top,
Speaker 2: I think, or I don't even remember, but either the
Speaker 2: bottom line is it didn't work out for either one
Speaker 2: of them. They both sucked, right, and maybe they just
Speaker 2: both suck, like maybe they're just both bad players. Like
Speaker 2: I you know, that's I'm leaving that out there, but
Speaker 2: I am of the school thought that I believe that
Speaker 2: if they had fully prepared Baker Mayfield, they're fully prepared
Speaker 2: Sam Darnold and not wasted their time going back and forth,
Speaker 2: it would have been better. And this is why a
Speaker 2: lot of teams only really have a competition for like
Speaker 2: a week, right, and then they and then they call it,
Speaker 2: you know, because somebody at some point in time, you
Speaker 2: have to start getting the guy ready. And at this point,
Speaker 2: I want Mac Jones to be the guy. I want
Speaker 2: everything this offseason to be pushing those chips in the
Speaker 2: middle of the table of Mac Jones being the guy.
Speaker 2: Where I will open the door for Bailey Zappy is
Speaker 2: if they start zero and four, they start one six,
Speaker 2: if they start terribly, yeah, and now they have decided
Speaker 2: that Mac is not our future. We are going to
Speaker 2: draft another quarterback. We're gonna be in the quarterback carousel
Speaker 2: again next offseason. And if they want to give the
Speaker 2: last seven eight games to Bailey Zappy to see, well,
Speaker 2: maybe it's Bailey.
Speaker 1: Just to see right, just to find out because fine
Speaker 1: might as well know.
Speaker 2: Fine, but this year is about deciding on Mac Jones
Speaker 2: and getting him into a quarterback competition in the summer
Speaker 2: does him no good.
Speaker 1: But I and I'm right there with you. It should
Speaker 1: be Mac Jones.
Speaker 2: It's his job.
Speaker 1: I wrote this last year after the Bears game. It's
Speaker 1: still Mac Jones' job because it was his job to
Speaker 1: lose and he didn't lose it.
Speaker 2: He didn't.
Speaker 1: He did not lose it last year. Right now, I
Speaker 1: don't know that they'll see it the same way. I
Speaker 1: would not be surprised if we get out there and
Speaker 1: it's him and Bailey ZAPPI splitting reps fifty fifty. I
Speaker 1: don't think it would be the right.
Speaker 2: Move, but I could see it. Will bug me, I know, no,
Speaker 2: it'll bug me too, But could you see it? I
Speaker 2: could one hundred percent see it. And that's exactly I
Speaker 2: wanted to get this take out because I could see
Speaker 2: it coming from a mile away. And what I think
Speaker 2: is gonna again, what I will repeat, I think is
Speaker 2: gonna end up happening if you do that to yourself,
Speaker 2: is that neither Mac Jones nor Bailey's Appy will play well.
Speaker 1: It's gonna look discombobulated again. Yeah, because there's not gonna
Speaker 1: be that chemistry.
Speaker 2: Right, So let's let's like you said, when you have
Speaker 2: when you have two quarterbacks, you don't have a quarterback.
Speaker 2: Even if this is this is really what it is
Speaker 2: to me, Even if mac Jones isn't the guy, I
Speaker 2: want them to act like he's the guy. I want
Speaker 2: them to play the part for now. And if you
Speaker 2: decide come October, come November like this just isn't working
Speaker 2: here and this isn't the path that we're gonna go
Speaker 2: down long term, then then maybe you get Bailey some
Speaker 2: games late in the year to see what he's got.
Speaker 2: So that way, there you have a full picture of
Speaker 2: how you're going into your off season to jump back
Speaker 2: on the carousel. But for right now, you act like
Speaker 2: he's the unquestioned QB one he acts, and I want
Speaker 2: to see that out of him too, Like I want
Speaker 2: to see him acting like he's the young question QB one,
Speaker 2: him him leading the offense, him playing with confidence, Like
Speaker 2: those are the types of things that I want to see.
Speaker 2: And look, I'll admit and I think you're in the
Speaker 2: same boat, Alex, but maybe I'm wrong. I'm more confident
Speaker 2: in mac Jones than other people are, I think, And
Speaker 2: I'm willing to live on that hill like I'm willing
Speaker 2: to die on it. I mean, I think he can
Speaker 2: play in this league. I think that he can be
Speaker 2: a starting quarterback in this league. Do I think that
Speaker 2: he's ever going to be Patrick Mahomes?
Speaker 3: No?
Speaker 2: But do I think that he could be at least
Speaker 2: Kirk Cousins in the NFL if things are how they
Speaker 2: should be. Yes, And I think there's a lot to
Speaker 2: be said for that level of quarterback, Like, yes, you
Speaker 2: could jump back in the carousel and go after the
Speaker 2: lottery ticket, right and try to chase a Patrick Mahomes
Speaker 2: or a Josh Allen.
Speaker 1: Means it goes back to something we said earlier. Patriots
Speaker 1: fans already fed up? Right, Yeah, do you want to
Speaker 1: spend two decades doing that? Because that's usually how long
Speaker 1: it takes. I'm with you on mac Jones. Look, I think,
Speaker 1: and I've given this speech before. If you're sitting here
Speaker 1: on May twenty fifth, twenty twenty three, and you're comfortable
Speaker 1: definitively saying mac Jones is the answer, or comfortable saying
Speaker 1: mac Jones is not the answer, You're kidding yourself. Yeah,
Speaker 1: because we don't know. We haven't seen enough to know
Speaker 1: something as an anomaly. Either twenty twenty one is the
Speaker 1: anomaly or twenty twenty two is the anomaly.
Speaker 2: Yep.
Speaker 1: If I had a guess, and I'd like to think
Speaker 1: I've watched a little bit of football in my life.
Speaker 1: I have a decent understanding how these things work. Yeah,
Speaker 1: nobody's right every time. But I again, I've seen the
Speaker 1: game once or twice. I think twenty twenty two is
Speaker 1: the anomaly. Yeah, I think he's closer to the player
Speaker 1: he was as a rookie than he was last year.
Speaker 1: I go back to a comp evan. Both of us
Speaker 1: made a lot coming out of the draft. That's as
Speaker 1: the ceiling, and that's Matt Ryan.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, we did. That was our ceiling.
Speaker 1: I still think that's on the table if they put
Speaker 1: the right pieces around him.
Speaker 2: Ceiling feels like I still think.
Speaker 1: That's on the table if they put the right if
Speaker 1: they put the right pieces around him.
Speaker 2: Does he get Sark and Julio Jones too, or is
Speaker 2: it just Matt ran Well.
Speaker 1: I wanted to ask you Shanahan, or I wanted to
Speaker 1: ask you that that actually reminds me a question I
Speaker 1: meant to ask earlier, we didn't get to it is
Speaker 1: Bill O'Brien. He's had three offensive coordinators now or will
Speaker 1: have three? Bill o brian the best offensive coordinator Mac
Speaker 1: Jones has had.
Speaker 2: Well, somebody actually asked us in that email, Josh McDaniels
Speaker 2: or Bill O'Brien. I think that Bill O'Brien. It's a
Speaker 2: good question. I think Bill O'Brien's maybe a little bit
Speaker 2: more creative, like a little bit more innovative. Yes, I
Speaker 2: say more than a little. I think that he's somebody
Speaker 2: that truly enjoys the evolution of the game, and like
Speaker 2: I think he has a lot of fun. Like I
Speaker 2: think I talked to him last time he had assistants.
Speaker 2: I talked to Will Longing, the new tight ends coach
Speaker 2: who came with Bill O'Brien, was in Houston with Bill O'Brien.
Speaker 2: Then he was with Alabama with Bill O'Brien. So he was, yeah,
Speaker 2: so he's followed him everywhere. And the one thing, you know,
Speaker 2: we were talking a little bit about Alabama and everything
Speaker 2: they did there, and a couple of things that he
Speaker 2: said was, you know, Bill's really good at We've had
Speaker 2: some very very different personnel pretty much everywhere we've gone,
Speaker 2: you know, like it really hasn't been you know, at
Speaker 2: Penn State it was like Christian Hackenberg, right, it was
Speaker 2: then it was DeShawn obviously in Hopkins, very different quarterbacks
Speaker 2: Houston and then and now it's Price Young, right, and
Speaker 2: and what they've had at Alabama and he said, you
Speaker 2: know that they they really ran things through the strengths
Speaker 2: of the personnel, and some of that was drastically different, right.
Speaker 2: And I think the other thing that he mentioned, you know,
Speaker 2: we were talking a little bit about the RPO package
Speaker 2: at Alabama, and I was just like, you know what
Speaker 2: makes it. It's this, It's it's held to a very
Speaker 2: high standard in terms of RPO.
Speaker 1: The Alabama RPO package, for people who don't know, is
Speaker 1: like the gold stand That is when when when people
Speaker 1: want to show what an RPO is, how an RPO
Speaker 1: is supposed to work the show element.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so it's one of the gold standards of it
Speaker 2: for sure. And he said that that was is.
Speaker 1: Like the titleist pro Yeah of r PO package.
Speaker 2: I don't know what that means. That's like the golf.
Speaker 2: I have no idea what he's talking about.
Speaker 1: It's like three dollars a ball.
Speaker 2: Is that expensive?
Speaker 3: Yes?
Speaker 2: Okay, so uh expensive? No idea, uh RPO the RPO package.
Speaker 2: And he said, well that was already there, you know
Speaker 2: that we kind of adopted that and and kind of
Speaker 2: learned about it and and all those types of things.
Speaker 2: So I think that Bill O'Brien's a little bit more
Speaker 2: open to new ideas, I guess, you know, and a
Speaker 2: little bit more innovative and a little bit more cutting edge,
Speaker 2: if you will, than Josh McDaniels. I do think that
Speaker 2: there's something to be said for the foundational elements for McDaniels.
Speaker 2: Like I think that his his core set of plays
Speaker 2: and like his core playbook is gonna be sound in
Speaker 2: football one hundred years ago and one hundred years so right,
Speaker 2: Like it just it's always gonna work. That's something to
Speaker 2: be said for that.
Speaker 1: To go back to the original question, is Bill O'Brien
Speaker 1: the best offensive coordinator Max's ever had?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: That, And I know you're a guy that really likes
Speaker 1: and really respects Josh McDaniels, are not knocking you for that,
Speaker 1: But that sounded like a really long way of saying, yes,
Speaker 1: Bill O'Brien is better without actually saying it because you
Speaker 1: didn't want to say that about Josh McDaniels. Am I
Speaker 1: translating correctly.
Speaker 2: They're just different cats. I don't know, they're just different
Speaker 2: like Josh. Josh is a traditionalist, right, like Josh is
Speaker 2: under center full back.
Speaker 1: Who is better for mac Jones? I'm not saying who's
Speaker 1: a better offense corner.
Speaker 2: I would say probably Bill O'Brien because you know what,
Speaker 2: I think another big difference between the two of them
Speaker 2: two is Bill O'Brien's a little bit more of a
Speaker 2: gun slinger, Like Bill O'Brien shoots from.
Speaker 1: The hippottle a little more just effet.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you know, And I don't mean that as like,
Speaker 2: you know, last year, like they're chucking the ball fifty
Speaker 2: yards down the field and throwing picks. I don't mean
Speaker 2: it like that. I just mean like he's a little
Speaker 2: bit more willing to try stuff.
Speaker 1: He'll put his cards on the table. Yeah yeah, So yeah,
Speaker 1: to go back to the original original question.
Speaker 2: Now that's the PG wave of putting that.
Speaker 1: To go back to yeah, I know, to go back
Speaker 1: to the original way, the original question of or the
Speaker 1: original point of I still think the truth ceiling that
Speaker 1: Matt Ryan Kopp is still there, and you had said,
Speaker 1: does he get Steve Sarkisian, does he get Julio Jones?
Speaker 2: So he doesn't have Julio Jones yet?
Speaker 1: Well what have we spent this entire offseason yelling about
Speaker 1: more than anything else?
Speaker 2: Right, So that's my point.
Speaker 1: I'm not saying he's going to be Matt Ryan this year,
Speaker 1: but I'm saying if they get him everything they need
Speaker 1: to get him, I think they can. And that is
Speaker 1: part of the reason I've been so blue in the
Speaker 1: face about go get Jerry Judy, go get one of
Speaker 1: these guys. And I'm still gonna be that. Well, we'll
Speaker 1: see how it goes this year, but like assuming he
Speaker 1: comes back, and we'll be saying that next year, right,
Speaker 1: let's trade up in the draft. They're not gonna be
Speaker 1: able to get Marvin Harrison junior, but go get save
Speaker 1: you're worthy, Go get a guy like that.
Speaker 2: It's gonna be really interesting to see what if mac
Speaker 2: thrives more in Bill O'Brien's system than McDaniel's system. But
Speaker 2: let's say he does, because mcdaniels's system is very much
Speaker 2: like you play my system, right, like you like Cam
Speaker 2: Newton was like running the same drought back concept as
Speaker 2: Tom bract Like. It's like just like you have to
Speaker 2: figure this out, whereas I think Bill O'Brien is a
Speaker 2: little bit more Yeah, like I said, a little bit
Speaker 2: more cutting out, a little bit more willing to evolve.
Speaker 1: So to go back to the point Bill O'Brien's here,
Speaker 1: let's say they click this, yere works that next year
Speaker 1: they go out and they get add the any wide
Speaker 1: receiver number one you want, right, a real wide receiver one.
Speaker 1: What are we going to be sitting here saying the
Speaker 1: expectations are for mac Jones, Hi exactly. That's good point.
Speaker 2: All right, let's move on from this. And I'm sorry
Speaker 2: we got some people a little bit angry. So if
Speaker 2: you want to call in and yell at us about
Speaker 2: the quarterback competition, which I still can't figure out for
Speaker 2: the life I.
Speaker 1: Think people are just annoyed that we talked about it,
Speaker 1: which I'm kind of glad.
Speaker 2: I just can't figure out for the life of me
Speaker 2: why people want a quarterback competition Like that doesn't mean
Speaker 2: that's not a good thing, folks. It's not a good
Speaker 2: thing if you if you have a quarterback competition means
Speaker 2: both of your guys think, all right, like.
Speaker 1: They weren't having quarterback competitions when they were winning six Super.
Speaker 2: Bowl Yeah, no, exactly. Maybe backup, you don't go to
Speaker 2: Kansas City OTAs and they're like, oh, what about that
Speaker 2: quarterback competition today? Guys, No, they don't talk about those
Speaker 2: types of things anyways. What else so with with OTAs,
Speaker 2: I think the other big thing, Look, the rookies is
Speaker 2: always a popular one. I think we're all looking forward
Speaker 2: to seeing Christian Gonzales, even seeing you know, tomorrow Douglas
Speaker 2: and Kaishan Bhute, right like that, that's always out there,
Speaker 2: and the rookies are up there. How they replaced Devin
Speaker 2: mccordy in that back on defense and that I think
Speaker 2: we can really start to glean some things from OTAs
Speaker 2: just because of who is playing what position, right, Like,
Speaker 2: it's not necessarily you know, game planned, it's not we're
Speaker 2: not getting even close to anything like that, but we
Speaker 2: can see who's lining up where right, and that's gonna
Speaker 2: be a big tell. And I'm I'm I'm fascinated by
Speaker 2: it because there is a couple, there's more than a couple,
Speaker 2: there's a probably half a dozen ways that I can
Speaker 2: think of that they could do this, and then there's
Speaker 2: probably another half a dozen that they that I I'm
Speaker 2: not thinking about that they are, right Like, so we're
Speaker 2: we're talking about a lot of different variables in a
Speaker 2: lot of different ways about going about things. I think
Speaker 2: the the really really like off the beaten path things
Speaker 2: that people have come up with, for example, like Jonathan
Speaker 2: Jones moving to free safety. I don't think that that's
Speaker 2: something that you do right away. I don't think that
Speaker 2: that's a that that's something that you jump to immediately.
Speaker 2: I think that's something that you might go to if
Speaker 2: you are giving up big plays all over the place
Speaker 2: in September and you just you have to figure out
Speaker 2: something else, right, you have to come up with a
Speaker 2: different idea. I think for right now, what I think
Speaker 2: they're going to try to do is really not put
Speaker 2: too much on one guy's plate to play the single
Speaker 2: high role all by himself and kind of be a
Speaker 2: little bit more unpredictable, Like less predictable, I guess is
Speaker 2: a better way to put that, right. Because I remember
Speaker 2: Devin mccordy, shortly after he announced that he was retiring,
Speaker 2: he actually tweeted this out that one of the biggest
Speaker 2: things for him looking at their defense was opposing offenses
Speaker 2: knew where he was going to be, Like he was
Speaker 2: going to be in the deep part of the field,
Speaker 2: right Like everybody knew that that's where Devin mccordy was
Speaker 2: going to be. Now with Kyle Duggart, with Adrian Phillips
Speaker 2: and Jabriel Peppers, and I do believe that we're gonna
Speaker 2: get out there and Jalen Mills is going to be
Speaker 2: a safety. I think he's going to be working with
Speaker 2: the safeties. Jalen Mills with the safeties. They they are
Speaker 2: a little bit more interchangeable, Like they have that potential
Speaker 2: to be a little bit more versatile, a little bit
Speaker 2: more mixed and match and interchangeable. And my guess is
Speaker 2: is that that's what you're going to see a ton of.
Speaker 2: It's gonna be a lot of post snap rotations, not
Speaker 2: a whole lot of static structure. It's going to be
Speaker 2: too high into one high. It's gonna be one high
Speaker 2: into too high, and they're really just gonna spin the dial,
Speaker 2: which they do a lot anyways. But I think at
Speaker 2: the end of the day, what was always had, you know,
Speaker 2: most of the time is Devon was spinning the dial
Speaker 2: into the same spot right right, So they might start
Speaker 2: it too high. But when they rotated into single high,
Speaker 2: they know that the buzz player is going to be
Speaker 2: Kyle Duggar and the single high guy is gonna be
Speaker 2: Devin mccordy. Now it could be either one of those safeties,
Speaker 2: which maybe does present a little bit more of unpredictability.
Speaker 2: But that's where I think that we're gonna see most
Speaker 2: of it. So I think we're gonna get out there
Speaker 2: at ota Is next week and everybody's gonna be playing
Speaker 2: free safety. It's not, you know, and I think that
Speaker 2: will be a big storyline. Yeah, I agree with you there.
Speaker 1: You know, you named a bunch of different possibilities. Is
Speaker 1: it Kyle Duggar, Is it Jonathan Jones? Is it Jalen Mills?
Speaker 1: Is Miles Bryant back there? Are they going one high?
Speaker 1: Are they going too high? I think the reality is
Speaker 1: all the above. I think it's gonna be a little
Speaker 1: bit of everything. You know. The real question is when
Speaker 1: they get down into goal line, what does it look like?
Speaker 2: Right?
Speaker 1: You know, if they do a two minute drill when
Speaker 1: it's third and ten, fourth and ten, right, does it
Speaker 1: look like that's really the question. But I think it's
Speaker 1: gonna be a whole bunch of different looks. I don't
Speaker 1: think they're gonna stick with one thing, and that's gonna
Speaker 1: be how they replace Devin mccordy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't think you replaced a player of that
Speaker 2: caliber just by saying you got it, Kyle Duggar right, like,
Speaker 2: like you're Devin mccordy now. Like, I don't think you
Speaker 2: can do that because there's just so much downloaded into
Speaker 2: the computer from Devin McCarty's perspective for all the years
Speaker 2: that he was back there that I think it's so
Speaker 2: hard to just ask one guy to replace a player
Speaker 2: like that. I mean, you're asking one guy to basically
Speaker 2: replace a borderline Hall of Fame player guy I would
Speaker 2: put it in Canton. But you know, maybe that's an
Speaker 2: argument for people that aren't as biased as me on
Speaker 2: that one, but in general, I think that's that's not
Speaker 2: how you do it. I am really interested to see
Speaker 2: when we get into the season, and obviously, you know,
Speaker 2: keep track of this type of stuff, like do they
Speaker 2: get more into the too high family, Like are they
Speaker 2: more of a cover two quarters based defense instead of
Speaker 2: what they've been so heavily a post safety cover three,
Speaker 2: cover one defense for Devin McCarty's career. Are do they
Speaker 2: go on that trend a little bit more, because that's
Speaker 2: the trend right now, right it's the Fangio tree, it's
Speaker 2: college style stuff, it's type fronts, it's you know, so
Speaker 2: much of what the league is doing now is to
Speaker 2: try to slow down. Obviously these quarterbacks and these passing
Speaker 2: offenses and too high is getting extremely popular. And even
Speaker 2: the Patriots have been a little bit more too high heavy,
Speaker 2: certainly in certain situations in particular, than they have been
Speaker 2: in the past, and that that's actually not you know
Speaker 2: that Bill's played some too high in his career, like
Speaker 2: he's been a base too high guy. Early two thousands
Speaker 2: they did a little bit more than they do now. Yeah,
Speaker 2: eighties with the Giants, they were, I mean, because it's
Speaker 2: so long ago, Cover twos, cover two doesn't change.
Speaker 1: S got distracted because the Falcons ran a surprise on
Speaker 1: sidekick on the TV behind you.
Speaker 2: It's okay, I was watching Michael Vick highlights when callers
Speaker 2: were calling in and complaining about how bad the team was. Like, yeah,
Speaker 2: so anyways, I'm interested to see that I'm trying to
Speaker 2: think of this is our first look and just kind
Speaker 2: of moving away from the defense for a second, because,
Speaker 2: to be honest with you, as much as I wish
Speaker 2: that we could talk about like storylines on the defensive
Speaker 2: line and stuff like that, there's no pads, there's no contact,
Speaker 2: So I'm not gonna get too caught up in like
Speaker 2: what Keon White looks like in this these spring practices,
Speaker 2: you know, I think we'll talk about like what he
Speaker 2: looks like physically, like you know that that sometimes pops
Speaker 2: out at you, like even though he's not the same player.
Speaker 2: But Sam Roberts last year, I remember being like, Okay,
Speaker 2: that guy's gigantic. Yeah, like that's an NFL defensive lineman.
Speaker 2: So maybe we'll see some of that. But the other
Speaker 2: thing that I think will be really interesting about what
Speaker 2: happens is we've really we've not seen Juju or Mike
Speaker 2: Kasiki like in the Patriot uniform yet, right, Like, this
Speaker 2: is sort of our first look at that and really
Speaker 2: our first semblance of what their roles are gonna sort
Speaker 2: of be. And I think, in particularly with Juju, what
Speaker 2: how are they gonna make him the high volume guy?
Speaker 2: Because he's clearly here to be the high volume guy, right.
Speaker 2: You know, he's gonna be a guy that, in theory
Speaker 2: should have one hundred plus targets seventy five plus catches
Speaker 2: like he had ninety last year catches wise with the
Speaker 2: with Kansas City, So he should be a high volume guy.
Speaker 2: First time really kind of seeing what that's gonna look like.
Speaker 2: What do you expect I guess out of this those
Speaker 2: Juju things. I think a lot of it is we
Speaker 2: almost like have forgotten, not forgotten, but I think we
Speaker 2: talked so much about some of the other guys that
Speaker 2: that juju, and in particular, we haven't really talked about
Speaker 2: him a lot lately. You know, it's kind of with
Speaker 2: the draft and everything.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I mean exactly what you said. I think
Speaker 1: he's going to be in the slot. I think he's
Speaker 1: gonna be that guy. I think he should be on
Speaker 1: pace to catch one hundred footballs. So yeah, we'll see
Speaker 1: if there's confirmation of that to one other and I
Speaker 1: so I don't know if we'll see him. You kind
Speaker 1: of reminded me of this with Keon White.
Speaker 2: Don't want to bring this up.
Speaker 1: I talked about how this is really more so ot
Speaker 1: is more about learning usage than seeing like who's beating
Speaker 1: out who for what position? Yeah, I don't it doesn't
Speaker 1: is Martain Mapu gonna be on the field, Like, I'm
Speaker 1: not sure think so right, because it's coming back from
Speaker 1: that shoulder surgery. I really would have liked to see
Speaker 1: how they were using him.
Speaker 2: Yeah, hopefully, like maybe there he's healthy enough to like
Speaker 2: go through like positional drills and stuff like that. He's
Speaker 2: definitely I would be absolutely shocked if he's participating in
Speaker 2: anything team related, but maybe he's in. When I see
Speaker 2: team related, I mean like seven on seven, eleven on eleven,
Speaker 2: if maybe we get to see him go through a
Speaker 2: positional drill which helps us dictate where what position he's thrilling,
Speaker 2: So maybe we get to see that that that those
Speaker 2: are always interesting, you know who's who's changing positions, who's
Speaker 2: working out with what, especially with those types of guys
Speaker 2: like Mapu kind of like blare the lines between a
Speaker 2: couple positions of where he could potentially be one last
Speaker 2: thing that I had on my list, And uh, you know,
Speaker 2: just a general take on this as well, I might
Speaker 2: be right about it at some point because I think
Speaker 2: this is such a big They were just talking about
Speaker 2: Julio Jones. Can Mac that guy Taekwon Thornton Like this
Speaker 2: is this is a low key big deal for this offense.
Speaker 2: Is type is making Taekwon Thornton work, like making him
Speaker 2: a thing? It's Mac Joe. Making Mac Jones work is
Speaker 2: number one by a long shot, but making Taekwon Thornton
Speaker 2: work might be number two. Don't they kind of go
Speaker 2: hand in hand? Yeah? Jones are what I mean?
Speaker 1: Don't you have to get Taekwon Thornton going?
Speaker 2: Yeah? And I think that that's sort of where I'm
Speaker 2: coming from. So I think that when you look at
Speaker 2: Bill O'Brien, he's actually had two receivers that have similar
Speaker 2: body types to Taekwon Thory. Now one of them's Will Fuller.
Speaker 5: Uh.
Speaker 2: With with the the Texans, will Fuller was like six
Speaker 2: feet one eighty five.
Speaker 1: I was surprised. I will Fuller to me always seemed
Speaker 1: like a much bigger guy.
Speaker 2: Than me too. Yeah, but he's not. I looked this
Speaker 2: up and what he waited at the combine. He seemed
Speaker 2: to play bigger, and I think that the difference, you know,
Speaker 2: watched I went back and watched will Fuller's big season.
Speaker 2: I think it was twenty nineteen with Bill O'Brien made, Yeah,
Speaker 2: eighteen nineteen something like that, and uh, the one thing
Speaker 2: that definitely stood out was, you know, they would give
Speaker 2: him these opportunities on twenty twenty on the outside to
Speaker 2: just go one on one and uh and he well,
Speaker 2: twenty twenty. I think it wasn't that was his big year,
Speaker 2: but that was no Brian, Brian, Brian, that was well
Speaker 2: Brian for the first four weeks of the season. Oh,
Speaker 2: you're right. So I looked at twenty nineteen.
Speaker 1: He had a pretty good year in twenty nineteen two
Speaker 1: as pretty good did There were a lot of times
Speaker 1: and this is sort of what I've said about Taekwon
Speaker 1: in the past, where he's just going one on one
Speaker 1: against press on the outside and wins, right, you know,
Speaker 1: And I think the big thing.
Speaker 2: Not only getting off the line of scrimmage, but being
Speaker 2: able to finish through some contact at the catch point
Speaker 2: was something that stood out with Bill Fuller. If Taekwon
Speaker 2: is going to be an eight hundred yard plus like
Speaker 2: a really good receiver, not just a field stretcher, not
Speaker 2: just like this gimmicky thing. If he's gonna be like
Speaker 2: a high volume, really really good receiver. He's going to
Speaker 2: have to add that to his bag. And I think
Speaker 2: that's where putting on weight, developing his routes, you know,
Speaker 2: developing his strength down the field, like, that's where those
Speaker 2: things come into play from him on an individual basis.
Speaker 2: But there was a lot of other things that that
Speaker 2: O'Brien did with Will Fuller. The other guy that as
Speaker 2: a similar body type is Jameson Williams, right, And I
Speaker 2: think you look at those two guys and some of
Speaker 2: the alignments and some of the ways that Bill o'pro
Speaker 2: and a either created foot races for them in space
Speaker 2: or b just simply got them off the line of
Speaker 2: scrimmage without them having to make a move off the
Speaker 2: line of scrimmage and press right like that just a stack,
Speaker 2: you know, where it's one guy in front of him
Speaker 2: and him off the line of scrimmage. So it just
Speaker 2: kind of creates that natural separation, that natural bubble of
Speaker 2: space like a pick or a bunch formation, which is
Speaker 2: similar motion certainly like bringing him in motion before the
Speaker 2: snap are at the snab to avoid contact. Those are
Speaker 2: the types of things that I think that Bill O'Brien
Speaker 2: can do that will get Taekwon to be a threat, right,
Speaker 2: the stats are gonna come from Taekwon, Like, Taekwon's going
Speaker 2: to have to do that individually. But for Taiwan to
Speaker 2: be a threat, I think Bill O'Brien can do that
Speaker 2: with alignment, with play calling, with that type of stuff.
Speaker 2: And the other thing he did with Fuller was obviously play
Speaker 2: action shots right, deep post routs, deep overs, things like
Speaker 2: that off play action where the intermediate is sucking up
Speaker 2: the safety and then it becomes a one on one
Speaker 2: for the receiver over the top. Like those are the
Speaker 2: types of things that the coach can do. What I
Speaker 2: want to see out of Taekwon is certainly, look where's
Speaker 2: he at physically, Like in terms of his frame. You know,
Speaker 2: if he comes in and no one wants him to
Speaker 2: be two hundred and ten pounds and lose the four
Speaker 2: to two eight like, no one wants that pose. Yeah,
Speaker 2: but if he's one ninety instead of one to eighty,
Speaker 2: like that could be a big difference. And just his
Speaker 2: physicality and his willingness to kind of fight through some
Speaker 2: contact and finish plays and finish routes not just catches
Speaker 2: right like, not just fighting for it at the catch
Speaker 2: point but when he breaks the route off is it
Speaker 2: is he able to kind of stave off a defender.
Speaker 2: Is he able to kind of run through the frame
Speaker 2: a little bit and through that contact to get himself separation.
Speaker 2: He is a big time X factor for this team
Speaker 2: and it feels like, like you said, it goes hand
Speaker 2: in hand with mac Jones, And if this offense is
Speaker 2: to hit its ceiling, then both those guys have to
Speaker 2: hit their ceilings, so they both have to individually perform.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, absolutely, And you know, I think it's that
Speaker 1: Z position And that's probably where I know a lot
Speaker 1: of people think of Thornton as an X because he's
Speaker 1: six three.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's that Z And I know.
Speaker 1: You just talked a lot about Taekwon Thornton, but to me,
Speaker 1: it's between Thornton and Born. They need somebody in that
Speaker 1: position like truly producing.
Speaker 2: You know that.
Speaker 1: I don't want to say, pull these numbers out of nowhere.
Speaker 1: I kept running that that pff FLA season simulators just
Speaker 1: because I was curious earlier. Good good that they well, no,
Speaker 1: make fun of the simulator, not me.
Speaker 2: Well, you know, it's a little bit of I.
Speaker 1: Like Kendrick Bourne kept getting like fifty catches, eight hundred yards,
Speaker 1: like five touchdowns. Well no, but here's my point, Like,
Speaker 1: if they can get that stat line from the Z position,
Speaker 1: whether that's Born or Thornton, like that, they're in great shape. Right,
Speaker 1: that's kind of the season you're looking for from that role.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think you know, when we talked about the
Speaker 2: Z position, it's Wes Welker and Julian Edelman are one
Speaker 2: type Z, and obviously Taekwon is a different type of Z. Right,
Speaker 2: He's not going to be a jitterbug. He's not going
Speaker 2: to be you know, five yard ends and whip routs
Speaker 2: and like that's not gonna be his game necessarily, But
Speaker 2: that doesn't mean that he's not a Z. And when
Speaker 2: you say a Z, you mean a guy that is
Speaker 2: playing off the line of scrimmage, right, So that allows
Speaker 2: him to move around, that allows him to come in motion,
Speaker 2: that allows him to play in the slot a lot,
Speaker 2: and to basically play off of the line so that
Speaker 2: he's not pressed up against a second X. And this
Speaker 2: team really, I think is still gravitating to Devonte Parker
Speaker 2: probably being the primary X guy. I mean they should
Speaker 2: just simply because he's the best body type and best
Speaker 2: player for it right now, that leads Taekwon as probably
Speaker 2: the natural Z in a different type of mold certainly
Speaker 2: than what they've had historically there and then Juju, it's
Speaker 2: kind of it kind of becomes like a different he's
Speaker 2: kind of an F right, like he's.
Speaker 1: He's a slot.
Speaker 2: So the F is the F is the other off
Speaker 2: the line receiver, right, So X is your X, you
Speaker 2: backside on the line receiver. Z is your flankers. He
Speaker 2: is your move around guy's the guy that plays off
Speaker 2: the line too. And in three receiver sets, O'Brien calls
Speaker 2: it an F like it's the F receiver, which is
Speaker 2: your other off the line guy that's not playing on
Speaker 2: the on the weak side of the formation, so he's
Speaker 2: playing on the same side as the tight end primarily.
Speaker 2: That that feels like Juju, And you know that that position.
Speaker 2: You know O'Brien's offense plays a ton in the slot.
Speaker 2: You know that that that's a guy that's probably going
Speaker 2: to play sixty five percent at least out of the slot.
Speaker 2: And you start to get into that's right, and you
Speaker 2: start to get in some different things. So the question
Speaker 2: really is is with this receiver group other than the rookies,
Speaker 2: which we can get to here in a second and
Speaker 2: kind of end it with that is when they are
Speaker 2: playing twelve personnel, Kaziki kind of becomes the f right
Speaker 2: like he's the move tight end, you know, Hunter Henry
Speaker 2: is still the why? Like how who comes off the field? Right?
Speaker 2: Like is Taekwon then become an X? Or does Taekwon
Speaker 2: come off the field and Devonte Parker stays on the
Speaker 2: field as the X? Like how does that situation sort
Speaker 2: itself out? But in three receiver sets? Like you know
Speaker 2: that should? I think that Taekwon is a natural Z,
Speaker 2: Like that's the guy that is your fastest, most dynamic
Speaker 2: player and I think right now that's probably him.
Speaker 1: Well, I think the beauty of it and if they're
Speaker 1: gonna go back to true Earhart Perkins, right is you
Speaker 1: do both because if you're running the same play like
Speaker 1: the same x's and o's and draw lines forever, right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: But you run it once with Parker at the X,
Speaker 1: Thornton at the z juju in the slot Hunter Henry
Speaker 1: is your tight end, and then you run it again
Speaker 1: with Thornton at the X juju as the z Kasiki
Speaker 1: is the slot and Henry is the tight end. Even
Speaker 1: though it's the same rep combination, it's a very different
Speaker 1: play that has to be defended. That personnel grouping has
Speaker 1: to be defended completely differently with a different package. So ideally,
Speaker 1: the answer to your question is sometimes this sometimes that
Speaker 1: I've been saying this for two years, the strength of
Speaker 1: this team's receiver group. I know they don't have a
Speaker 1: true number one, but I think there's legitimate strength and
Speaker 1: legitimate upside in the fact that there's really no overlap
Speaker 1: outside of maybe Borden and Thornton, but not even really everybody.
Speaker 1: Everybody wins differently, and you can throw Gasiki and Henry
Speaker 1: into that as well. So when you can, and when
Speaker 1: they were at their best in the first O'Brien stint
Speaker 1: and early on with Josh McDaniels, this is what they did.
Speaker 1: They don't run a lot of different plays. They just
Speaker 1: run the plays they run with different personnel and the
Speaker 1: execute him at a very high level. Yeah, it's they
Speaker 1: kind of have the perfect offense.
Speaker 2: To get back to that. It's window dressing, you know.
Speaker 2: They dress them up differently and it looks a little
Speaker 2: bit different, but it's really the same. Yeah. Look, I
Speaker 2: think there's a lot to be said for all that,
Speaker 2: and it's gonna be interesting to see how they use
Speaker 2: all these guys that are I will we will both
Speaker 2: fully admit I think that none of these guys. They
Speaker 2: don't have a Tyreek Hill. They don't have a Stefon Diggs.
Speaker 2: They don't have a DeVante Adams, they don't have an
Speaker 2: aj Brown, they don't have one of those guys as
Speaker 2: just you know, the most talented guy on the field.
Speaker 2: They don't. But they do have guys that they can
Speaker 2: mix and match with a little bit, and it can
Speaker 2: place in do some different things. And if you can
Speaker 2: get Taekwon's speed to be a factor, and you can
Speaker 2: get Juju's catch and run ability to be a factor,
Speaker 2: and if you can get Kasiki's seam running ability to
Speaker 2: be a factor, then those things can put stresses on
Speaker 2: defenses individually. Even if it's not like one guy that
Speaker 2: on Tesday, you know, the Tuesday meeting guy like that,
Speaker 2: they don't. They still don't have that guy. We can
Speaker 2: fully admit that.
Speaker 1: I just hope, you know, is disappointing last year to
Speaker 1: see them come out in like my And this isn't
Speaker 1: anything against any of these players specifically but you know, Myers,
Speaker 1: Agalore and Parker all had like over an eighty five
Speaker 1: percent usage eight week one, and they didn't play Kendrick Bourne.
Speaker 1: And I'm not necessarily necessarily saying they should have played
Speaker 1: George Humphrey, but it was those three that was And
Speaker 1: then too, when Thornton came back, they kind of pushed well,
Speaker 1: first Jakoby Myers has hurt, and then they kind of
Speaker 1: pushed Nelson Agiler out of a lineup and they still
Speaker 1: just it was just the same three receivers and they
Speaker 1: didn't rotate or mix and match at all, and that's
Speaker 1: always been a strength of what they do offensively. I
Speaker 1: really hope they get back to that because this group,
Speaker 1: to me, is built to play offense like that, where yeah,
Speaker 1: Juju is probably gonna be a ninety something percent usage guy.
Speaker 1: He should, He's not gonna come off the field after him.
Speaker 1: Everybody else, Parker Born, Shton, Henry Kasiki.
Speaker 2: It's situational.
Speaker 1: They need to be rotating all those and I'm not
Speaker 1: saying it's fifty to fifty for everybody, but they need
Speaker 1: to be rotating all those guys in and out a
Speaker 1: healthy amount.
Speaker 2: All right, let's take a phone call and then we'll
Speaker 2: wrap it here, Jerry, what's up?
Speaker 3: What's going on for Let's tell y'all doing it well?
Speaker 3: All right? So I got a quick question, is there
Speaker 3: any way possible this season where we see what's his name? Gonzales,
Speaker 3: Jack Jones, and Isaiah Boulden on the field at the
Speaker 3: same time. And the reason why I ask is because
Speaker 3: based off them through the loan, that's a lot of
Speaker 3: speed in one section, so I feel like we'll be
Speaker 3: able to play a lot of man and man press.
Speaker 3: But just wanted to get your.
Speaker 1: Thoughts on that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, no problem, Jerry, And that kind of segues us
Speaker 2: perfectly because I was gonna wrap it with the rookies,
Speaker 2: which is always whenever we get a chance to first
Speaker 2: see the rookies, it's always a good thing to watch.
Speaker 2: Isaiah Bolden. I'm not sure I think Isaiah Bolden projecting
Speaker 2: Isaiah Bolden. I don't know how you feel about this.
Speaker 2: Alex says anything more than a special team or at
Speaker 2: this stage I think is a little bit lofty, like, yes,
Speaker 2: he's fast. I yes, I've some of the film I
Speaker 2: have seen on him. His physicality at the line of
Speaker 2: scrimmage is decent. You know he can do some of
Speaker 2: those types of things. I just wouldn't get to I
Speaker 2: don't know. I can't. I can't get myself too excited
Speaker 2: about him on defense. I not yet. At least let's
Speaker 2: see what it looks like.
Speaker 1: So if we are going to have that conversation. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I've said this before, I said this when they
Speaker 1: drafted him. I wonder if he's a safety in the NFL.
Speaker 1: I just look at the way he processes the game. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and his straight I think he is better straight line
Speaker 1: speed than you know, change of direction ability. I think
Speaker 1: if they're gonna play him on defense, and I'm with you,
Speaker 1: like see him on special teams first and build up
Speaker 1: to that. But I if he's gonna play on defense,
Speaker 1: I want to see him at like true if they
Speaker 1: want to go single high, I'm not saying he put
Speaker 1: him out there against the Chiefs out of nowhere, but
Speaker 1: I'm curious to look start out with second team. What
Speaker 1: does he look like as a single high safety or
Speaker 1: even in too high. What does he look like playing
Speaker 1: free safety? Because if he is gonna play defense in
Speaker 1: the NFL, I think that's probably a better role for
Speaker 1: him than corner.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I don't disagree with you there.
Speaker 1: And I think he played some safety at Jackson State.
Speaker 2: They played a lot of zone, so you know, I
Speaker 2: think that some of his interceptions, like you could see
Speaker 2: some of that translating to safety, right, you know, like
Speaker 2: where he's kind of ball howking things like that. Wrapping
Speaker 2: it up here on the rookies. Look, I think everybody
Speaker 2: knows that I'm excited to see Christian Gonzales. Maybe just
Speaker 2: a little bit, but I think the biggest thing with
Speaker 2: Christian Gonzalez is I do feel like and we not
Speaker 2: gonna lie. We haven't had the best the best track
Speaker 2: record of this in our time covering the team because
Speaker 2: of the way that they've drafted, unfortunately, but I fully
Speaker 2: believe in the fact that you can see it almost
Speaker 2: right away when a guy is just different, like when
Speaker 2: we're we're not talking about you know, you're talking about
Speaker 2: movement skills. Yeah, and I'm not talking about like when
Speaker 2: when I say different, I don't mean like Taekwon, who
Speaker 2: we know on a track and burn anybody out there
Speaker 2: right Like you know, I'm talking about just is a freak,
Speaker 2: like just looks different, looks like looks the part looks
Speaker 2: The first round pick Worthy and I I'm hoping and
Speaker 2: I'm thinking that that's exactly what we're going to see
Speaker 2: out of Christian Zalez, where he just looks like somebody
Speaker 2: that is different than the vast majority of the rest
Speaker 2: of the players out there. The other two guys, look,
Speaker 2: this is a passing camp. And even though we just
Speaker 2: talked about it earlier Trey Nixon being the star of
Speaker 2: the summer last year, Frankly, if Kishan Butte or do
Speaker 2: Mario Douglas has any chance of hitting the ceiling that
Speaker 2: I think both of us think that they have the
Speaker 2: potential to hit, we gotta start seeing it now like
Speaker 2: this is there's no contact, there's no there's no reason
Speaker 2: if you're a good receiver you should show out in
Speaker 2: these types of practices. So we're gonna I'm not trying
Speaker 2: to put too much pressure on them. I'm just saying,
Speaker 2: you know, if we're gonna see flashes from either one
Speaker 2: of those guys, it's gonna come in the spring. So oh,
Speaker 2: we'll see what those two guys look like as well.
Speaker 2: And I looked it up.
Speaker 1: Isaiah Bolden only played thirty six snaps at free safety
Speaker 1: last year, compared to five hundred and ninety two is
Speaker 1: the slot corner, so would be new for him. But
Speaker 1: again I try. Yeah, I'm with you on the receivers.
Speaker 1: I think Kaishawn Butte is going to get as much
Speaker 1: attention as maybe any player really outside of the quarterbacks
Speaker 1: in this in this spring session here really excited to
Speaker 1: see what he can do. I'm like back and forth,
Speaker 1: like tomorrow, Douglas is the kind of player that should
Speaker 1: tear up the spring But I feel like the role
Speaker 1: for him is going to be that gadget basically Marcus
Speaker 1: Jones role. Right, They're not gonna tip their hand on
Speaker 1: that till they have to. We're not gonna see that
Speaker 1: that's being done in the close practices. That's not being
Speaker 1: done when we're they're so yeah, I know how much
Speaker 1: we'll see him in like team drills, but one on
Speaker 1: ones I expect him to be electric.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that that's that's a fair assessment. I
Speaker 2: just think that either one of those guys, like I
Speaker 2: just said, it's a passing camp. This is not a
Speaker 2: full padded practice. If you can't get open in ot as,
Speaker 2: you are not going to get open in the real thing, right, Like,
Speaker 2: that's just the bottom line. You're just it's it's got
Speaker 2: to start somewhere, and for receivers it often starts in
Speaker 2: the spring. All right, anything else that I missed, I
Speaker 2: don't think so. I think that that about covers it.
Speaker 2: Like I said earlier, the trenches, the trail, like we'll
Speaker 2: see who's out there, we'll see who's at left tackle,
Speaker 2: who's at right tackle. Those will be notes, certainly, but
Speaker 2: you're not really going to grade them or like evaluate them.
Speaker 5: Right.
Speaker 1: I am excited to get the stopwatch out for Bryce.
Speaker 2: That was That was what I was gonna ask you about.
Speaker 2: How so it's all seriousness. Do you put any stock
Speaker 2: on whatsoever about what happens in the spring with the specialists?
Speaker 2: So this is I think the one because there's some
Speaker 2: pressure on these specialists. Now, yeah, this is actually Land.
Speaker 2: I mean seriously, fourth round pick, Like that guy needs
Speaker 2: to pan out.
Speaker 1: Well, actually, there's less pressure on him than Barringer because
Speaker 1: Ryland's making the team. He's a fourth ron pick.
Speaker 2: Well, I don't mean it like that, but like if
Speaker 2: this is another Justin rohor Wasser situation, then that that's fair.
Speaker 2: It's not about the pressure on Ryland. It's more about
Speaker 2: the pressure for the scouting department that Ryland is. Yeah,
Speaker 2: that's fair, that's fair.
Speaker 1: I think that's This is the one position where you
Speaker 1: can start to evaluate, especially like hopefully, well, I don't
Speaker 1: want to stand out and watch in the rain. But
Speaker 1: I remember twenty twenty one, we got that one day
Speaker 1: where it was like pouring rain at Otac, Remember that,
Speaker 1: and they kicked the ball the entire day.
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is the one spot where it is fever
Speaker 2: dream right there. You know you got a new holder,
Speaker 2: new kicker. Hours of kicking.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, new holder, new kicker. How are they working together? Yeah,
Speaker 1: you can you can start to evaluate this a little bit.
Speaker 1: I think Ryland's gonna beat out Folk. That's just he's
Speaker 1: a fourth round pick. Folk didn't finish the season well
Speaker 1: last year. Barrenger should beat out Weightman. But maybe there's
Speaker 1: more of a competition there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, just because it's your But if you've cut a
Speaker 2: six round pick, it's not like unheard of to do
Speaker 2: something like that.
Speaker 1: He's also a guy that just I think you can
Speaker 1: get Corless weightman, or you can get Price Baron on
Speaker 1: the practice squad, and if Weightman's not the guy, you
Speaker 1: make the switch. However, many weeks in the season, whereas
Speaker 1: if you cut Chad Ryland, somebody's gonna pick him up.
Speaker 2: So I don't know how much like snap holds kick
Speaker 2: we're gonna get in spring practices because sometimes they don't
Speaker 2: kick as much field goals like that, Well we'll see it.
Speaker 1: It'll just be off to the side, right, That's that.
Speaker 2: Like, look, I the Patriots need to have all their
Speaker 2: eyes dotted and all their tea's crossed this year, right
Speaker 2: like we can't have any botched holes. We can't have
Speaker 2: any snaps Canna that you know, Joe Kurdona is snapping
Speaker 2: has really ever been a huge issue. But you know
Speaker 2: what I'm trying to say, they got to be good
Speaker 2: on the margins. And that's a new battery, right like
Speaker 2: that that operation is new and this is getting into
Speaker 2: the barth of it all. But let's be honest, like
Speaker 2: it's a snapper holder kicker has been for the last
Speaker 2: couple of years. The majority of it has been Joe Cardona,
Speaker 2: Jake Bailey, Nick Folk. Right now it's changed.
Speaker 1: So a really interesting thing will be and I normally
Speaker 1: do this, I might need to stop watch this year
Speaker 1: because what I want to do this year, I might enlist.
Speaker 2: You to help me with this X. I don't know
Speaker 2: if I had it, honestly.
Speaker 1: So the really interesting thing because they had too many
Speaker 1: blocked kicks last year. Yeah, I think what I probably
Speaker 1: should be timing, or I'll get you to time while
Speaker 1: I do the hangtimes is the operation time?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: What is the time from snap to kick, both on
Speaker 1: the punt in the field goal. Yeah, that's what I'm
Speaker 1: really gonna be watching because their operation times last year
Speaker 1: we're not good. And I never really went back and
Speaker 1: looked at it to the extent of like, who is
Speaker 1: this on? I mean, on the punts, it's usually pretty
Speaker 1: much on the punter, but field goals, it can be
Speaker 1: on the snapper, can be on the whole, or can
Speaker 1: even be on the kicker sometimes the combination. I'm gonna
Speaker 1: be interested to see what the operation times are because
Speaker 1: they need to be quicker this year so that weren't
Speaker 1: quick enough that year.
Speaker 2: That's why you listen to this show. If you if
Speaker 2: you listen to this show, and we thank all everybody
Speaker 2: that listens, but we I want to really think the
Speaker 2: die hards, because the diehards are listening an hour and
Speaker 2: twenty minutes in to hear Alex talk about operation.
Speaker 1: Let's be honest, Evan, had you and you've covered this
Speaker 1: game a long time, have you ever heard the term
Speaker 1: operation time before before?
Speaker 2: And just now yeah, yeah from you like three years ago. Okay,
Speaker 2: now I know what it is. Uh yeah, So they're
Speaker 2: all big.
Speaker 1: So when I was in college and I covered the
Speaker 1: team in college, I was really good friends with the
Speaker 1: kicker on the team and three college football, yeah d
Speaker 1: three college. But but we were watching the national championship
Speaker 1: and I remember we sit down and watch the game.
Speaker 1: The team scores, and he pulls out his phone, like
Speaker 1: what are you doing? He goes, I want to see
Speaker 1: what their operation time is? That like natch this team
Speaker 1: that's like everybody knows Mount Union's like the d through Powerhouse, right, yeah,
Speaker 1: people know what that is. So he's like, you know
Speaker 1: they're Mount Union. I want to see what they are
Speaker 1: compared to us. And it was off by like they
Speaker 1: were slower than what his was by like two hundreds
Speaker 1: of a second. You would have thought he won the
Speaker 1: Heisman with how proud he was like, yeah, we got
Speaker 1: a better operation. This is huge, huge to those specialties, guys,
Speaker 1: big big.
Speaker 2: So I'm curious what it'll be all right, so, uh
Speaker 2: humor me for two more minutes. You're going to cover
Speaker 2: the Celtics tonight.
Speaker 1: I am going to cover the Celtic so that's where Alex.
Speaker 2: Is headed, so you can check out his Celtics. We
Speaker 2: don't do Celtics coverage here, so I can I can
Speaker 2: plug your Celtics coverage and not you know, be stepping
Speaker 2: out on ninety five the sports sub dot com.
Speaker 1: It's also funny like I was ready assuming there was
Speaker 1: going to be an Ota practice today for people to
Speaker 1: be like really mad at us for not doing your show.
Speaker 1: I know if there had been both show would have
Speaker 1: been tomorrow.
Speaker 2: Marie Matt was a was a trooper about uh no
Speaker 2: pun intended about all the different time changes and trying
Speaker 2: to lock down a time But we didn't have to
Speaker 2: run into that issue my one minute on the Celtics
Speaker 2: because I you know me, I gotta talk some Celtics
Speaker 2: in the middle of May. My one minute on the
Speaker 2: Celtics is I am not allowing myself to be excited
Speaker 2: or hyped up or anything for this game tonight. It
Speaker 2: is not a series until they win tonight. If they
Speaker 2: win tonight, then evan Celtics footy pajamas is coming out right, Like, yeah,
Speaker 2: Green team or Evan is is out in full swing
Speaker 2: if they win tonight and then because then you start
Speaker 2: to believe, right, Like then then the believe creeps in.
Speaker 2: Then they'll crush me in Game six. But like that's
Speaker 2: when the belief kicks in. The one thing I really
Speaker 2: believe from a basketball standpoint now, not a Green Team
Speaker 2: or Evan Pom Pom standpoint, the Miami Heat. We've talked
Speaker 2: about this off the year. The Miami Heat, all playoff long,
Speaker 2: playoffs long have shot the three out of their minds
Speaker 2: like they were, Like I think they've been like forty
Speaker 2: six percent from three right in the playoffs. If they
Speaker 2: are finally and uh not having gave Vincent helps also
Speaker 2: because he's been one of the better knockdown shooters that
Speaker 2: they've had. Yeah, if they are finally regressing back to
Speaker 2: the mean, then the Celtics have hope. I am not
Speaker 2: giving the Celtics hope strictly off the fact that the
Speaker 2: Celtics are good enough to just blow doors in four
Speaker 2: straight games against Miami, right, They're gonna need some luck
Speaker 2: and the luck comes in with uh Strauss Duncan Robinson,
Speaker 2: Kyle Lowry, Kevin Love obviously, Caleb Martin starting to miss
Speaker 2: right like that, that's light.
Speaker 1: Well, so here's the big thing. Kyle Lowry has not
Speaker 1: been good in this series.
Speaker 2: Right, But that scares me for tonight because does Kyle
Speaker 2: Lowry have because he's starting, does he have a throwback
Speaker 2: like in the in his vault game to know that's.
Speaker 1: Gonna be more than thirty two minutes twice in the
Speaker 1: last three years in any game. So that's interesting.
Speaker 2: So because that's their whole run right now, is Jimmy
Speaker 2: and Bam like in the middle of the court does
Speaker 2: drawing four eyeballs and then then they either scoring or
Speaker 2: kicking it out to open shoes.
Speaker 1: Which, by the way, is what the Celtics offense should be.
Speaker 2: But that but that's been their offense, right especially around Jimmy.
Speaker 2: If all of a sudden, Jimmy's kicking it out to
Speaker 2: Duncan Robinson and he's air balling threes, then they're there.
Speaker 2: There goes their offense, right, So that's the that's what
Speaker 2: the Celtics need to happen. The Celtics need Miami's role
Speaker 2: players to get cold.
Speaker 4: Are we going here?
Speaker 2: That's it? That's the sign all you told me, you
Speaker 2: told me, I told you I had two minutes on
Speaker 2: the Celtics. Two minutes, all right, but go cover the Celtics.
Speaker 2: Go HAPPI with that, Alex and I will be back
Speaker 2: next week. Ot a's are on Wednesday. We might do
Speaker 2: show Wednesday, might do it Thursday, but we'll definitely do
Speaker 2: a OTA recap show. So don't you worry. You have
Speaker 2: that right here on Patriots dot com Patriots Catch twenty two.
Speaker 2: Leave us a review, and we'll see you guys next week.
Speaker 2: Thank you for downloading this podcast, Subscribe on Apple, Google Play,
Speaker 2: and everywhere else you listen. Like the show, please rate
Speaker 2: and review us. Listener comments and ratings help keep us
Speaker 2: high in the podcast rankings so new listeners can find us.
Speaker 2: Be sure to check Patriots dot com for more used
Speaker 2: and more podcasts.