WEBVTT - The Remarkable Beaver, Part 2

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, a production of iHeartRadio.

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<v Speaker 2>Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. My name

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<v Speaker 2>is Robert.

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<v Speaker 3>Lamb and I'm Joe McCormick. And today we are back

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<v Speaker 3>with part two of our series on the beaver. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>In the last episode, we hopefully gave you a newfound, improved,

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<v Speaker 2>and reinvigorated appreciation for the common beaver, the world's second

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<v Speaker 2>largest living rodent and a tireless ecosystem engineer.

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<v Speaker 3>That's right. Last time we focused mainly on the real

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<v Speaker 3>life biology, behavior, and ecological role of the beaver, So

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<v Speaker 3>if you haven't listened to part one, you should probably

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<v Speaker 3>go back and check that one out first. I think

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<v Speaker 3>that will give you a richer understanding of the stuff

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<v Speaker 3>we're going to be talking about today. But for a

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<v Speaker 3>very brief recap, Yeah, beavers are large. They're the second

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<v Speaker 3>largest extant rodent after the capybara. Beavers have iron in

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<v Speaker 3>their teeth, perfect fortureing through wood to cut down trees

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<v Speaker 3>and for gnawing off pieces of vegetation. Beavers, of course

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<v Speaker 3>eat vegetation their herbivores, and their diet includes foliage, but

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<v Speaker 3>also the bark and the outer layers of soft wood

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<v Speaker 3>from tree branches and trunks. Beavers, of course build amazing structures.

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<v Speaker 3>They dam waterways to change the characteristics of flowing waterways

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<v Speaker 3>to sort of like create ponds and redirect water flow

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<v Speaker 3>and so forth to deepen water channels. And they also

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<v Speaker 3>build these essentially impenetrable lodges with underwater entrances and exits

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<v Speaker 3>for their own housing and protection. And these constructions also

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<v Speaker 3>allow underwater storage of caches of vegetation to provide food

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<v Speaker 3>throughout the winter. And then finally, we discussed several studies

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<v Speaker 3>of what might or might not be considered tool use

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<v Speaker 3>in beavers. This was a lot of fun, including we

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<v Speaker 3>had a long digression on the so called stick displays

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<v Speaker 3>where some beavers in particular populations. Is not common to

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<v Speaker 3>all beavers of either of the extent species, but this

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<v Speaker 3>was documented among some Eurasian beavers in Norway. They would

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<v Speaker 3>pick up a stick and they would shake it, shake

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<v Speaker 3>it up and down while holding it in the mouth

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<v Speaker 3>and forepaws. The researchers believed this was to demonstrate strength

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<v Speaker 3>in order to drive away potential antagonists, maybe other beavers

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<v Speaker 3>encroaching onto their territory, And of course we ended up

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<v Speaker 3>highlighting the most impressive of the stick shaking beavers, a beautiful,

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<v Speaker 3>powerful warrior of the wasteland named Beergit.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes her name, I had to look this up. Her

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<v Speaker 2>name and apparently means power, strength, vigor, and virtue.

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<v Speaker 3>Wow.

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<v Speaker 2>The other beaver in that study that's not as.

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<v Speaker 3>As impressive the second place shake.

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<v Speaker 2>The second place was Froda. Frodo's name means clever, learned,

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<v Speaker 2>and wise. And this is also, like I said, this

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<v Speaker 2>is related to Frodo, Like Frodo is like a variation

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<v Speaker 2>of this name that Tolkien used in the Lord of

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<v Speaker 2>the Rings.

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<v Speaker 3>That makes sense. Yeah, While the real life biology of

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<v Speaker 3>the beaver is truly fascinating, what actually first got us

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<v Speaker 3>interested in this topic was something you came across, rob,

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<v Speaker 3>which was the pattern of deeply off the mark illustrations

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<v Speaker 3>of beavers in medieval and Renaissance manuscripts, just so far

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<v Speaker 3>off the mark in depicting this animal. You wonder how

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<v Speaker 3>it happened.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, we got into a little bit and discussed how,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, we have to take into account that while

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<v Speaker 2>we do have one variety of beavers in North America

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<v Speaker 2>and the other variety in Eurasia, you know, not everyone

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<v Speaker 2>would have had direct exposure to it. You have that

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<v Speaker 2>game of telephone taking place about these species depending on

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<v Speaker 2>illustrations and second and third hand accounts. Then there's the

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<v Speaker 2>added fact that beavers are largely nocturnal. They live out

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<v Speaker 2>often in very remote circumstances, so the average even observer

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<v Speaker 2>may not get to observe them that closely. And then,

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<v Speaker 2>as we'll discuss in this episode, even more there are

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<v Speaker 2>additional elements of their physiology that may mystify someone who

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<v Speaker 2>is observing them in the wild or trying to make

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<v Speaker 2>sense of their bodies as the carcass is processed.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Another thing though, is that the Eurasian beaver was

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<v Speaker 3>once hunted nearer to extinction. Its populations have bounced back

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<v Speaker 3>significantly since then since the twentieth century, but it came

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<v Speaker 3>kind of close for the Eurasian beaver, like the hunter

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<v Speaker 3>has really got over on them for a while. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>North American beavers were also in bad shape, and two

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<v Speaker 2>of the main drivers for this. One of them is

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<v Speaker 2>beaver hats in beaver fur. I'm to understand that the

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<v Speaker 2>beaver hat going out of style helped out a lot,

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<v Speaker 2>but there's another major beaver product, beaver derived product we're

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<v Speaker 2>going to discuss in this episode that also threatened these species.

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<v Speaker 2>So yeah, these are going to be important, especially when

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<v Speaker 2>we talk about a particular detail of various bestiaries and

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<v Speaker 2>illuminated manuscripts that show beavers or alleged beavers. Some of

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<v Speaker 2>these are very strange beavers. They look more like a

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<v Speaker 2>deer or a dog, or a lion or you name it.

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<v Speaker 2>But at any rate, the main perplexing detail is that

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<v Speaker 2>they are depicted chewing off their own testicles whilst being

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<v Speaker 2>pursued by a human hunter.

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<v Speaker 3>I thought we should mention and describe a few of

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<v Speaker 3>these actual illustrations and the manuscripts they come from, So

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<v Speaker 3>I came across a post about this on the British

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<v Speaker 3>Library's Medieval Manuscripts blog. I love the British Library's blogs,

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<v Speaker 3>by the way, they often are wonderful resource. But this

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<v Speaker 3>post is from November seventh, twenty twelve. It's called Beaver's

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<v Speaker 3>on the Run by Nicole Eddie and it includes a

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<v Speaker 3>number of illustrations, a couple that we alluded to at

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<v Speaker 3>the beginning of part one of this series and several

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<v Speaker 3>that I think we haven't talked about yet, but none

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<v Speaker 3>of which have we featured in detail. So the author

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<v Speaker 3>of this blog post says you can usually recognize a

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<v Speaker 3>beaver in a medieval bestiary, which seemed at first like

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<v Speaker 3>a very odd statement because most of these drawings look

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<v Speaker 3>absolutely nothing like the real animal, not even a little,

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<v Speaker 3>But she goes on to explain you can recognize them

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<v Speaker 3>because they are always depicted the same way in a

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<v Speaker 3>characteristic or stereotyped scene quote on the run, pursued by

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<v Speaker 3>a hunter who is frequently blowing a horn and accompanied

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<v Speaker 3>by hunting dogs. And just as you said, Rob, we

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<v Speaker 3>can add to that image the fact that they are

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<v Speaker 3>often depicted either discarding or in the middle of biting

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<v Speaker 3>off their own testicles while in hot pursuit. Several examples.

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<v Speaker 3>Let's start with one we briefly alluded to in part one.

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<v Speaker 3>So this is a miniature from a Latin bestiary originating

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<v Speaker 3>in England from the second or third quarter of the

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<v Speaker 3>thirteenth century. The manuscript is known as Sloane thirty five

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<v Speaker 3>forty four. So what we see in a miniature with

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<v Speaker 3>the Latin text all around is a sort of rectangle

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<v Speaker 3>of red background decorated with these three leaf clover shapes,

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<v Speaker 3>and then we have what appears to be some kind

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<v Speaker 3>of big cat, maybe a mountain lion. Compared to the

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<v Speaker 3>human and the dog in this drawing, it is about

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<v Speaker 3>the size of a horse. Also, it has a horse's tail.

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<v Speaker 3>Did you notice that has like a hairtail.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, this does not even look like a fish tail.

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<v Speaker 2>As we mentioned before some depictions of beavers, they often

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<v Speaker 2>have almost like a mermaid quality to them.

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<v Speaker 3>Huh. Of course, beavers do have interesting unusual tails. They

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<v Speaker 3>have the flat tail, which aids them in swimming, but

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<v Speaker 3>they also use for a type of signaling known as

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<v Speaker 3>water slapping, where they slap the surface of the water

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<v Speaker 3>to make loud sounds, and this is used for social

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<v Speaker 3>reasons to signal to the to the other beavers around

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<v Speaker 3>them that may be a predator or a rival beaver

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<v Speaker 3>from outside the family group is approaching their territory.

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<v Speaker 2>I will say this about this particular quote unquote beaver.

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<v Speaker 2>The posture here with feet back rear, feet on the ground, front,

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<v Speaker 2>feet elevated, and this tail as horsey as it looks,

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<v Speaker 2>it is kind of going down and out, which is

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<v Speaker 2>at least vaguely reminiscent of the way that beavers will

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<v Speaker 2>often walk if they're carrying something, you know, with that

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<v Speaker 2>tail helping them to balance, and their front legs are

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<v Speaker 2>up helping to carry something.

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<v Speaker 3>That would be fortunate if that was the artist's intention.

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<v Speaker 3>But I think what's being shown here is a horsehair

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<v Speaker 3>style tail like flapping in the wind as the beaver runs.

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<v Speaker 2>If it were not for the you know, vulgar error

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<v Speaker 2>as we'll discuss regarding the eating of the testicles or

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<v Speaker 2>the biting of the testicles here, this is otherwise, I

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<v Speaker 2>think a beautiful image. I like the use of the

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<v Speaker 2>like the red, the like the deep crimson behind it.

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<v Speaker 3>Oh but wait, we didn't get to the animal's head yet.

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<v Speaker 3>So it's got horse sized body, horse looking tail, but

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<v Speaker 3>with feline paws, and an approximately leonine head like a

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<v Speaker 3>mountain lion's head, but also with a snake neck. It's

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<v Speaker 3>kind of a dragon like. The neck is curving around

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<v Speaker 3>and it appears to be covered in maybe feathers or scales,

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<v Speaker 3>and the neck is curving all the way around for

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<v Speaker 3>the head to reach back and yes, bite its own testicles.

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<v Speaker 3>While the beast is in mid spring, it's leaping through

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<v Speaker 3>the air and biting while it's aloft. Its front paws

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<v Speaker 3>are off the ground.

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<v Speaker 2>It is a strange image, Jef. You had no background

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<v Speaker 2>on this, you would just think this is a fantastic creature.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Meanwhile, the hunting dog is after it is, of

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<v Speaker 3>course sort of barking, pulling. Maybe is that a leashure?

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<v Speaker 3>I can't quite tell. But there's a hunter. Also a

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<v Speaker 3>dude standing there looking kind of like a hungover George Washington,

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<v Speaker 3>and he is blowing an upturned hunter's horn.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah. All the eyes in this image look kind of bloodshot.

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<v Speaker 2>Adds an interesting effect to it.

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<v Speaker 3>Okay, next image for us to discuss. This is from

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<v Speaker 3>a work known as the Rochester Bestiary from England around

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<v Speaker 3>the year twelve, in a manuscript called Royal twelve f.

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<v Speaker 3>This one is a lot more colorful. Here, the hunt

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<v Speaker 3>takes place on a green hill with a golden sky

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<v Speaker 3>in the background and trees that look like asparagus. The

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<v Speaker 3>hunter has blonde surfer hair and wears a blue tunic.

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<v Speaker 3>He really does. It's kind of surfery, isn't it. It's

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<v Speaker 3>kind of Owen Wilson hair. Yeah, and he's blowing as

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<v Speaker 3>his horn. He's carrying either a sword or a club

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<v Speaker 3>of some kind in the other hand from the horn,

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<v Speaker 3>The dogs are howling in pursuit. The beaver is once

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<v Speaker 3>again sort of a serpentine lion with the long scaly

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<v Speaker 3>neck twisting all the way back around, biting off the genitalia,

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<v Speaker 3>but with a different face this time. The beaver's face

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<v Speaker 3>here is kind of sad and porky, like like a

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<v Speaker 3>lion pig muttering geez not again.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, this is another strange one where the beaver looks

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<v Speaker 2>more like a camel or perhaps you know, some variation

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<v Speaker 2>of prehistoric mammal.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, now I want to get into some ones that

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<v Speaker 3>have more differences. The next one has actually no testicle biting.

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<v Speaker 3>This is from an herbal medicine manual called Tractatus de

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<v Speaker 3>Herbis from Salerno, which is in Italy, produced between twelve

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<v Speaker 3>eighty and thirteen ten. The manuscript is called Egerton seven

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<v Speaker 3>forty seven. Here the hunter is a wizard. That interesting.

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<v Speaker 3>He's wearing a pointy wizard hat, and he has huge hands,

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<v Speaker 3>one of which is like up in front of his face,

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<v Speaker 3>almost as if he's marveling at the hand, like how

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<v Speaker 3>did my hand get this way? What has become of me?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah? This image has a kind of childlike wonder to it,

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<v Speaker 2>especially when we're describing the beaver.

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<v Speaker 3>That's right, right, So, yeah, the wizard hunter has gigantic

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<v Speaker 3>hands bigger than his head. He's got his horn slung

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<v Speaker 3>around his shoulder. He's about to heave a spear. Interesting,

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<v Speaker 3>I guess there was spear hunting of beavers maybe, But

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<v Speaker 3>he's got a spear like cocked back, ready to throw it.

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<v Speaker 3>And then the hunter, the dogs, and the beaver are

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<v Speaker 3>all standing in what looks like a field of spinach plants,

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<v Speaker 3>Like there are these green forking plants interspersed all around.

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<v Speaker 3>I don't know if that's supposed to be the kind

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<v Speaker 3>of vegetation growing in the landscape that has been altered

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<v Speaker 3>by the proximity of a beaver dam. And then one

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<v Speaker 3>of the dogs is gigantic and the other is not

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<v Speaker 3>that gigantic. And then the beaver is a horse, And

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<v Speaker 3>I mean, I mean that it's not like a horse.

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<v Speaker 3>The beaver is a horse. It's just a.

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<v Speaker 2>Horse, Yeah, a kind of shaggy looking horse with I

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<v Speaker 2>believe visible testicles.

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<v Speaker 3>Oh yeah, not just visible. They're sort of in bold

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<v Speaker 3>compared to the rest of the illustration, Do you know

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<v Speaker 3>what I'm saying? Yeah, Yeah, they're like filled in a

0:12:41.280 --> 0:12:44.800
<v Speaker 3>darker color than anything else. So the beaver horse is

0:12:44.840 --> 0:12:48.439
<v Speaker 3>not biting them off, but they're just like, they're very

0:12:48.440 --> 0:12:51.439
<v Speaker 3>prominent and they're almost perfectly centered in the illustration.

0:12:52.160 --> 0:12:54.640
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, maybe the dogs got to him before you get

0:12:55.360 --> 0:12:58.080
<v Speaker 2>in this narrative, get rid of them.

0:12:58.240 --> 0:13:00.440
<v Speaker 3>Okay, This next one I thought was really fun. This

0:13:00.480 --> 0:13:03.080
<v Speaker 3>is from another English best ear a twelfth century in

0:13:03.120 --> 0:13:07.000
<v Speaker 3>a manuscript called Stowe ten sixty seven. It's not fully colored,

0:13:07.000 --> 0:13:10.160
<v Speaker 3>in just a line drawing. The hunter looks like he's

0:13:10.360 --> 0:13:14.000
<v Speaker 3>dancing kind of. He looks, you know, jolly, like he's moving,

0:13:14.080 --> 0:13:17.360
<v Speaker 3>he's feeling the rhythm, and he's blowing his horn and

0:13:17.440 --> 0:13:20.560
<v Speaker 3>pointing a single finger at the beaver with his one hand.

0:13:20.559 --> 0:13:22.520
<v Speaker 3>You see the pointing hand. I don't know why. That

0:13:23.040 --> 0:13:26.880
<v Speaker 3>was really funny to me. But the beaver, meanwhile, is

0:13:26.920 --> 0:13:29.800
<v Speaker 3>a dog. It's just fully a dog, but with one

0:13:30.240 --> 0:13:35.760
<v Speaker 3>major variation with weird bulbous eye sockets bulging out of

0:13:35.800 --> 0:13:38.319
<v Speaker 3>his head over the snout. And we were trying to

0:13:38.320 --> 0:13:41.520
<v Speaker 3>figure out which Star Wars alien this dog looked like.

0:13:41.640 --> 0:13:44.679
<v Speaker 3>I eventually realized I was sort of thinking, it looks

0:13:44.720 --> 0:13:48.599
<v Speaker 3>like the dog version of the Zandozan assassin from the

0:13:48.679 --> 0:13:49.680
<v Speaker 3>Last Starfighter.

0:13:50.200 --> 0:13:53.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, I can see that, and I took a

0:13:53.960 --> 0:13:56.240
<v Speaker 2>I was like, something was about this was ringing Star

0:13:56.280 --> 0:13:58.600
<v Speaker 2>Wars for me as well. So I had the best

0:13:58.640 --> 0:14:00.920
<v Speaker 2>diaries some of a couple of Star Wars best areas

0:14:00.920 --> 0:14:04.560
<v Speaker 2>out anyway for the Monster fact I'm working on for

0:14:04.679 --> 0:14:07.280
<v Speaker 2>this week, So I was like, what is it reminding

0:14:07.320 --> 0:14:09.240
<v Speaker 2>me of? And I think it's reminding me of the

0:14:09.520 --> 0:14:13.840
<v Speaker 2>of issue tib. This is a strange kind of Avian

0:14:14.040 --> 0:14:17.520
<v Speaker 2>or beak looking creature that's in the background at Java's

0:14:17.559 --> 0:14:22.479
<v Speaker 2>Palace but has also subsequently been used in like comics

0:14:22.480 --> 0:14:24.160
<v Speaker 2>and on the Clone Wars and stuff like that.

0:14:24.600 --> 0:14:26.240
<v Speaker 3>This was one of those where you showed me an

0:14:26.240 --> 0:14:28.480
<v Speaker 3>image and I was like, oh, I have seen this before,

0:14:28.480 --> 0:14:30.880
<v Speaker 3>but I can't remember from where. It's really kind of

0:14:30.920 --> 0:14:33.400
<v Speaker 3>in the background, but yeah, Isshu Tube is like in

0:14:33.480 --> 0:14:35.920
<v Speaker 3>Return of the Jedi. There I found a shot of

0:14:36.000 --> 0:14:39.240
<v Speaker 3>him like back sort of behind Luke's head while Luke

0:14:39.320 --> 0:14:40.760
<v Speaker 3>is pointing a blaster at Java.

0:14:41.280 --> 0:14:44.520
<v Speaker 2>He's not, in my opinion, one of the more interesting

0:14:44.640 --> 0:14:48.960
<v Speaker 2>Java's Palace aliens. Like I didn't have him as a figure,

0:14:49.280 --> 0:14:52.480
<v Speaker 2>which you know, maybe that's because I didn't find him interesting,

0:14:52.560 --> 0:14:54.120
<v Speaker 2>or maybe I don't find him interesting because I don't

0:14:54.120 --> 0:14:55.040
<v Speaker 2>have the connection with the toy.

0:14:55.560 --> 0:14:57.800
<v Speaker 3>Well, anyway, do you get back to the beaver in

0:14:57.880 --> 0:15:01.520
<v Speaker 3>this drawing, which again is just a dull. It's interesting

0:15:01.560 --> 0:15:05.680
<v Speaker 3>because he's not biting his testicles here. They're floating in

0:15:05.760 --> 0:15:09.360
<v Speaker 3>the air behind him, as if the alien dog beaver

0:15:09.760 --> 0:15:13.560
<v Speaker 3>has sort of projectile defecated them in the hunter's direction.

0:15:13.760 --> 0:15:16.360
<v Speaker 3>You see, they're like a floating four leaf clover in

0:15:16.400 --> 0:15:16.800
<v Speaker 3>the air.

0:15:17.360 --> 0:15:21.080
<v Speaker 2>The four leafed aspect of the testicle is interesting, and

0:15:21.120 --> 0:15:23.240
<v Speaker 2>I think that will be of note when we get

0:15:23.240 --> 0:15:27.840
<v Speaker 2>into the actual anatomy of the lower regions of the beaver.

0:15:28.240 --> 0:15:30.240
<v Speaker 3>Now, the examples don't stop there. We could go on

0:15:30.360 --> 0:15:33.000
<v Speaker 3>naming many more, but I think you get the idea.

0:15:33.320 --> 0:15:35.280
<v Speaker 3>There was one thing I just wanted to mention further

0:15:35.360 --> 0:15:39.440
<v Speaker 3>because it's kind of interesting variation, and that's an illustration

0:15:39.600 --> 0:15:42.640
<v Speaker 3>of a beaver hunt from the Queen Mary Salter, an

0:15:42.680 --> 0:15:48.160
<v Speaker 3>early fourteenth century manuscript called Royal two B. And in

0:15:48.200 --> 0:15:51.080
<v Speaker 3>this one, the beaver again looks nothing like a beaver,

0:15:51.160 --> 0:15:53.640
<v Speaker 3>but in a different way. This time it's just a fox.

0:15:53.880 --> 0:15:56.840
<v Speaker 3>It's yeah, would you say it's like a gray fox?

0:15:57.280 --> 0:15:58.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it looks like a fox.

0:15:58.720 --> 0:16:01.600
<v Speaker 3>The hunter approaches with an axe propped up on his shoulder,

0:16:02.040 --> 0:16:06.560
<v Speaker 3>and the beaver lies on his back, exposing his belly. Interesting.

0:16:07.120 --> 0:16:12.560
<v Speaker 3>Apparently this was another common motif in these medieval illustrations

0:16:12.560 --> 0:16:15.479
<v Speaker 3>of beavers, in addition to beaver's biting off their own testicles.

0:16:15.920 --> 0:16:18.800
<v Speaker 3>Allegedly this would happen they would lie on their back

0:16:18.800 --> 0:16:23.160
<v Speaker 3>and expose their belly after they had previously bitten them off,

0:16:23.680 --> 0:16:26.240
<v Speaker 3>or after they had been harvested by a previous hunter

0:16:26.280 --> 0:16:29.280
<v Speaker 3>and the beaver had survived. So the beaver here is

0:16:29.360 --> 0:16:32.480
<v Speaker 3>revealing I haven't got what you're looking for. And then

0:16:32.520 --> 0:16:34.800
<v Speaker 3>the hunter in this image, the hunter does look kind

0:16:34.800 --> 0:16:37.480
<v Speaker 3>of annoyed, doesn't he. He's like, ah, what for real?

0:16:38.520 --> 0:16:38.920
<v Speaker 3>He does?

0:16:38.920 --> 0:16:42.600
<v Speaker 2>These guys hand up like ah, man chase this critter

0:16:42.760 --> 0:16:46.120
<v Speaker 2>down in the woods and it doesn't have the goods anymore.

0:16:46.440 --> 0:16:49.000
<v Speaker 3>But in the medieval lore of beaver hunts, the idea

0:16:49.120 --> 0:16:51.360
<v Speaker 3>was that the beaver is clever, It knows what the

0:16:51.400 --> 0:16:53.560
<v Speaker 3>hunter is looking for, and the beaver is thinking, oh,

0:16:53.600 --> 0:16:55.120
<v Speaker 3>if I can show off that I don't have what

0:16:55.120 --> 0:16:56.520
<v Speaker 3>the hunter needs, it won't kill me.

0:16:56.840 --> 0:16:59.080
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, now this is going to be interesting to reflect

0:16:59.120 --> 0:17:01.800
<v Speaker 2>on it in a bed when we talk about beaver aggression,

0:17:02.600 --> 0:17:07.160
<v Speaker 2>I can only imagine that this idea of the cornered

0:17:07.200 --> 0:17:14.800
<v Speaker 2>beaver being a docile creature is an extreme exaggeration and inaccuracy.

0:17:15.280 --> 0:17:17.960
<v Speaker 3>So this imagery is obviously a lot of fun. But

0:17:18.160 --> 0:17:20.840
<v Speaker 3>rob would you, I think it's safe to say, I

0:17:20.920 --> 0:17:25.120
<v Speaker 3>hope you'll agree that the chomping, off, dropping, shooting, projectile,

0:17:25.160 --> 0:17:29.960
<v Speaker 3>pooping of testicles, none of this reflects any biological reality.

0:17:30.040 --> 0:17:34.320
<v Speaker 3>This is not something beavers actually do, or ever actually did. Correct.

0:17:34.400 --> 0:17:37.560
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, this is, as we'll discuss in a bit, it's

0:17:37.600 --> 0:17:42.760
<v Speaker 2>referred to as the vulgar error. At times, the error

0:17:42.800 --> 0:17:47.639
<v Speaker 2>is based on some definite biological realities concerning the beaver.

0:17:48.359 --> 0:17:50.919
<v Speaker 2>But they did not do this. Yeah, this is not

0:17:51.040 --> 0:17:53.920
<v Speaker 2>something they did. This is not something I think any

0:17:53.960 --> 0:17:58.119
<v Speaker 2>animal does. So before we get into exactly why that,

0:17:58.240 --> 0:18:01.199
<v Speaker 2>we have to talk about what they were after with

0:18:01.240 --> 0:18:05.640
<v Speaker 2>all of this. They were after castorium, the hunters were Yes,

0:18:05.680 --> 0:18:10.000
<v Speaker 2>the hunters were after castorium, a product derived from beaver's

0:18:10.200 --> 0:18:12.480
<v Speaker 2>I believe we mentioned this briefly in the last episode.

0:18:12.840 --> 0:18:16.040
<v Speaker 2>But the basic reality here is beavers keep their hide

0:18:16.080 --> 0:18:20.960
<v Speaker 2>waterproof via oily secretions from their cast or glands. Each

0:18:21.040 --> 0:18:24.199
<v Speaker 2>beaver male or female has a pair of these along

0:18:24.240 --> 0:18:27.479
<v Speaker 2>with a pair of anal glands. So so far castor

0:18:27.520 --> 0:18:31.640
<v Speaker 2>glands anal glands one pair of each. This alone makes

0:18:31.680 --> 0:18:35.879
<v Speaker 2>me think back to that sort of four clothed testicle

0:18:36.000 --> 0:18:40.480
<v Speaker 2>that has dropped in one of those eliminated manuscript details

0:18:40.480 --> 0:18:41.160
<v Speaker 2>we were discussing.

0:18:41.440 --> 0:18:45.000
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, that's the four sacks that's being chucked at the hunter.

0:18:45.560 --> 0:18:49.040
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Now I found a great article of great short

0:18:49.080 --> 0:18:53.160
<v Speaker 2>but detailed article with illustrations about the glands of the beaver.

0:18:53.560 --> 0:18:57.280
<v Speaker 2>This is from nineteen seventy eight by Gerald E. Svenson,

0:18:58.600 --> 0:19:02.040
<v Speaker 2>and it's titled cast and anal Glands of the Beaver

0:19:02.119 --> 0:19:05.320
<v Speaker 2>and was published in the Journal of Mammalogy and it's

0:19:05.359 --> 0:19:08.160
<v Speaker 2>on jay Store. It's free to access. If you really

0:19:08.240 --> 0:19:09.879
<v Speaker 2>want to go in depth on this and see the

0:19:10.640 --> 0:19:15.480
<v Speaker 2>very helpful illustrations, I definitely recommend it. But the author

0:19:15.520 --> 0:19:20.160
<v Speaker 2>here says, quote, these glands liberate odoriferous products that may

0:19:20.160 --> 0:19:23.440
<v Speaker 2>be used in the construction of scent mounts and in

0:19:23.600 --> 0:19:24.760
<v Speaker 2>scent communication.

0:19:25.440 --> 0:19:27.920
<v Speaker 3>This will sort of connect to what we talked about

0:19:27.920 --> 0:19:31.439
<v Speaker 3>in the previous episode about the territoriality observed in the

0:19:31.440 --> 0:19:35.080
<v Speaker 3>Eurasian beavers, where a family group would build a lodge

0:19:35.080 --> 0:19:37.000
<v Speaker 3>in a dam, and it would sort of police the

0:19:37.000 --> 0:19:41.000
<v Speaker 3>borders of its area to keep rivals out. And one

0:19:41.040 --> 0:19:43.520
<v Speaker 3>of the things it would do in order to indicate

0:19:43.560 --> 0:19:47.199
<v Speaker 3>the borders of its area is do scent marking. And

0:19:47.400 --> 0:19:52.760
<v Speaker 3>often it was observed that along with the stick shaking behavior,

0:19:52.800 --> 0:19:55.960
<v Speaker 3>when a beaver felt its territory might be being encroached

0:19:56.000 --> 0:19:59.080
<v Speaker 3>on by another beaver from outside the group, it would

0:19:59.160 --> 0:20:02.000
<v Speaker 3>engage in a additional scent marking. It would start to

0:20:02.080 --> 0:20:06.280
<v Speaker 3>mark either with anal glands or castorium. Yeah.

0:20:06.480 --> 0:20:10.399
<v Speaker 2>So both anal uncastor glands are in a cavity that

0:20:10.480 --> 0:20:13.160
<v Speaker 2>the author here describes as being similar to a scrotum,

0:20:13.320 --> 0:20:16.840
<v Speaker 2>and that quote. Testes lie anterior to the glands in

0:20:16.880 --> 0:20:21.520
<v Speaker 2>the distal region of the Inguinol Canal. The testes protrude

0:20:21.600 --> 0:20:25.360
<v Speaker 2>into the gland cavity in sexually mature males, but are

0:20:25.400 --> 0:20:29.040
<v Speaker 2>separated from the glands by tissue of the terminal end

0:20:29.600 --> 0:20:34.800
<v Speaker 2>of the Inginol canal and the lining of the gland cavity. Okay,

0:20:34.960 --> 0:20:38.560
<v Speaker 2>I realize that's a lot and joe for you. Anyway,

0:20:38.960 --> 0:20:42.440
<v Speaker 2>I included an illustration from this paper that I think

0:20:42.560 --> 0:20:45.000
<v Speaker 2>makes a little more sense of this. This is one

0:20:45.040 --> 0:20:48.240
<v Speaker 2>of two illustrations that the author provides, and a reminder,

0:20:48.280 --> 0:20:50.320
<v Speaker 2>we're very much in the kloaca here.

0:20:50.680 --> 0:20:52.879
<v Speaker 3>Right, So in the back of the beaver, sort of

0:20:52.880 --> 0:20:56.480
<v Speaker 3>between the tail and the hind legs, we have the

0:20:56.520 --> 0:21:01.119
<v Speaker 3>gland cavity and it contains these different organs, the anal

0:21:01.119 --> 0:21:02.760
<v Speaker 3>gland and the castor gland.

0:21:03.359 --> 0:21:07.840
<v Speaker 2>Yes, now he points out that anal glands are posterior

0:21:07.920 --> 0:21:12.880
<v Speaker 2>to the castor glands, and each gland opens independently via ducts.

0:21:13.359 --> 0:21:18.440
<v Speaker 2>So the castor glands, however, don't open directly to the outside. Instead,

0:21:18.720 --> 0:21:21.679
<v Speaker 2>they hook up to the urethra and open into the

0:21:21.680 --> 0:21:25.520
<v Speaker 2>beaver's cloaca. However, I imagine this will be key to

0:21:25.520 --> 0:21:26.639
<v Speaker 2>what we're discussing here.

0:21:26.840 --> 0:21:27.119
<v Speaker 3>Quote.

0:21:27.560 --> 0:21:32.720
<v Speaker 2>Contraction of the muscle sheath also forces the papillary end

0:21:32.840 --> 0:21:37.800
<v Speaker 2>of the anal gland to protrude from the cloaca. I

0:21:37.840 --> 0:21:39.480
<v Speaker 2>do not think the same is true of the castor

0:21:39.520 --> 0:21:42.760
<v Speaker 2>glands proper, but again I'm thinking of some of that. Basically,

0:21:42.760 --> 0:21:47.240
<v Speaker 2>getting back to this idea of glands something like testicles,

0:21:48.000 --> 0:21:50.760
<v Speaker 2>or they could be seen as testicles emerging from the

0:21:50.800 --> 0:21:54.440
<v Speaker 2>cloaca of the beaver, and then it's not there again,

0:21:54.520 --> 0:21:59.800
<v Speaker 2>you know. Common feature of these illustrations interesting though, the

0:22:00.160 --> 0:22:02.719
<v Speaker 2>if I'm understanding everything correctly, these would be the anal glands,

0:22:02.760 --> 0:22:04.160
<v Speaker 2>not the castor glands.

0:22:04.560 --> 0:22:07.680
<v Speaker 3>But the illustrator doesn't understand it's either one. They think

0:22:07.680 --> 0:22:10.359
<v Speaker 3>they're seeing gonads and then like they're there again, and

0:22:10.359 --> 0:22:12.760
<v Speaker 3>then then they're gone right now.

0:22:13.119 --> 0:22:16.440
<v Speaker 2>As for the castorium itself, I've seen it described as

0:22:16.520 --> 0:22:21.239
<v Speaker 2>butter like. Svenson describes it as yellowish, but then it

0:22:21.320 --> 0:22:25.479
<v Speaker 2>turns brown when exposed to air and sunlight. He shares

0:22:25.560 --> 0:22:28.520
<v Speaker 2>that urine washes the cast or out in a quote

0:22:28.600 --> 0:22:32.879
<v Speaker 2>unquote composite mixture that has a pungent odor. He writes,

0:22:33.359 --> 0:22:36.800
<v Speaker 2>the secretions from both pairs of glands quote can be

0:22:36.880 --> 0:22:40.280
<v Speaker 2>involved in scent mound construction, but that the method of

0:22:40.280 --> 0:22:44.600
<v Speaker 2>producing these secretions differs based on what we've just discussed.

0:22:44.600 --> 0:22:48.879
<v Speaker 2>So anal gland secretions are rubbed on something, they're expressed,

0:22:48.920 --> 0:22:50.560
<v Speaker 2>and then the beaver you know, gets to rub it

0:22:50.600 --> 0:22:56.680
<v Speaker 2>on the rock or the tree trunk, whatever, while castorium

0:22:56.960 --> 0:23:01.720
<v Speaker 2>is essentially urinated out. So beaver's use castorum to mark

0:23:01.840 --> 0:23:05.480
<v Speaker 2>territory and to waterproof their fur. But since ancient times,

0:23:05.560 --> 0:23:10.520
<v Speaker 2>humans have found other uses for the substance to harvest it.

0:23:10.520 --> 0:23:13.760
<v Speaker 2>It can be milked from a live animal apparently. I've

0:23:13.800 --> 0:23:19.160
<v Speaker 2>read that they frequently expel it when handled, though again

0:23:19.320 --> 0:23:22.800
<v Speaker 2>huge caveat here. Don't go trying to handle beavers. I'm

0:23:22.800 --> 0:23:26.679
<v Speaker 2>not sure under what circumstances it is even recommended to

0:23:26.720 --> 0:23:31.040
<v Speaker 2>do this, but leave it to the professionals. Professional beaver handlers,

0:23:31.720 --> 0:23:33.199
<v Speaker 2>if they exist, are the ones that need to be

0:23:33.240 --> 0:23:35.919
<v Speaker 2>doing this. Most of what we're talking about here, especially

0:23:35.920 --> 0:23:40.240
<v Speaker 2>with these illustrations and historical collection of castorium, though, involves

0:23:40.280 --> 0:23:43.120
<v Speaker 2>of course killing the beaver, and this requires the glands

0:23:43.119 --> 0:23:48.400
<v Speaker 2>to be removed post mortem and then smoked for preservation. Joe,

0:23:48.440 --> 0:23:50.760
<v Speaker 2>I've included a photo. You can find lots of photos

0:23:51.000 --> 0:23:54.840
<v Speaker 2>of castorium that has been dried or smoked, and it

0:23:54.920 --> 0:23:57.439
<v Speaker 2>essentially looks like some sort like you might imagine some

0:23:57.480 --> 0:24:03.119
<v Speaker 2>sort of like dried up gland, some sort of like

0:24:05.359 --> 0:24:07.760
<v Speaker 2>you know, mummified scrotum sort of idea here.

0:24:08.359 --> 0:24:11.560
<v Speaker 3>You ever, like a drop a fingerling potato while you're

0:24:11.600 --> 0:24:14.480
<v Speaker 3>preparing food and it rolls under the cabinet and you

0:24:14.520 --> 0:24:16.600
<v Speaker 3>don't realize it's there, and then you find it a

0:24:16.600 --> 0:24:19.160
<v Speaker 3>few months later when you're cleaning and it's all shriveled

0:24:19.240 --> 0:24:21.879
<v Speaker 3>up into Yes, like a mummy of a potato. That's

0:24:21.920 --> 0:24:22.520
<v Speaker 3>what it looks like.

0:24:23.080 --> 0:24:36.920
<v Speaker 2>Yes. Now getting into this idea of the alleged testicle drop,

0:24:37.920 --> 0:24:40.320
<v Speaker 2>this has been around for quite a while, and you

0:24:41.200 --> 0:24:43.879
<v Speaker 2>find mention of it in the works of Plenty of

0:24:43.880 --> 0:24:47.560
<v Speaker 2>the Elder from the Natural History, where of course we're

0:24:47.560 --> 0:24:49.760
<v Speaker 2>always turning to Plenty to see what he had to say.

0:24:49.800 --> 0:24:51.840
<v Speaker 2>And this is what he had to say in the

0:24:51.920 --> 0:24:55.800
<v Speaker 2>Natural History. This is the Bostic translation quote the beavers

0:24:55.920 --> 0:24:59.960
<v Speaker 2>of Yuxin, when they are closely pressed by danger, themselves

0:25:00.119 --> 0:25:02.879
<v Speaker 2>cut off the same part, as they know that it

0:25:02.960 --> 0:25:06.760
<v Speaker 2>is for this they are pursued. This substance is called

0:25:06.800 --> 0:25:10.800
<v Speaker 2>castorian by the physicians. In addition to this, the bite

0:25:10.840 --> 0:25:13.919
<v Speaker 2>of this animal is terrible. With its teeth, it can

0:25:13.960 --> 0:25:16.760
<v Speaker 2>cut down trees on the banks of rivers, just as

0:25:16.880 --> 0:25:19.640
<v Speaker 2>though with a knife. If they seize a man by

0:25:19.680 --> 0:25:22.240
<v Speaker 2>any part of his body, they will never loose their

0:25:22.280 --> 0:25:26.760
<v Speaker 2>hold until his bones are broken and crackle under their teeth.

0:25:27.240 --> 0:25:29.760
<v Speaker 2>The tail is like that of a fish. In other

0:25:29.840 --> 0:25:32.400
<v Speaker 2>parts of the body they resemble the otter. They are

0:25:32.440 --> 0:25:36.280
<v Speaker 2>both of them aquatic animals, and both have hair softer

0:25:36.560 --> 0:25:37.119
<v Speaker 2>than down.

0:25:37.720 --> 0:25:40.720
<v Speaker 3>I love the description of the ferociousness here is sort

0:25:40.760 --> 0:25:45.280
<v Speaker 3>of describing like the snapping turtle reputation. You know, it

0:25:45.680 --> 0:25:49.560
<v Speaker 3>won't let go into lightning strikes. If you make a

0:25:49.560 --> 0:25:52.360
<v Speaker 3>beaver mad, it's gonna bite until your bones are broken,

0:25:52.520 --> 0:25:54.920
<v Speaker 3>and basically it's crunching on them like cereal.

0:25:55.560 --> 0:25:58.040
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and this is an idea that I think for

0:25:58.119 --> 0:26:00.720
<v Speaker 2>many of us might seem comical because we don't think

0:26:00.720 --> 0:26:03.679
<v Speaker 2>of the beaver as being aggressive. And you know, as

0:26:03.720 --> 0:26:06.920
<v Speaker 2>we discussed in the last episode, beavers, certainly when they're

0:26:06.920 --> 0:26:09.480
<v Speaker 2>dealing with other beavers, they have an number of safeguards

0:26:09.480 --> 0:26:15.480
<v Speaker 2>in place to prevent actual combat from occurring unless necessary.

0:26:16.480 --> 0:26:18.520
<v Speaker 2>So you might be wondering, well, is there anything too,

0:26:18.640 --> 0:26:22.040
<v Speaker 2>Is this just Plenty getting it wrong, or are beaver's

0:26:22.040 --> 0:26:25.160
<v Speaker 2>truly this ferocious? Well, beaver attacks on humans are rare,

0:26:25.600 --> 0:26:28.720
<v Speaker 2>but they are not unknown. Rabies can of course play

0:26:28.720 --> 0:26:31.760
<v Speaker 2>a role, but it's not always a factor in these

0:26:31.920 --> 0:26:35.920
<v Speaker 2>rare instances. We might laugh at Plenty's description, but beavers are,

0:26:36.000 --> 0:26:39.560
<v Speaker 2>of course wild animals. They should be respected, and they

0:26:39.600 --> 0:26:44.840
<v Speaker 2>can be put into situations where they then violently defend themselves.

0:26:45.119 --> 0:26:47.520
<v Speaker 2>There has been at least one account of a fatal

0:26:47.560 --> 0:26:50.439
<v Speaker 2>attack on a human in the last century, and I

0:26:50.520 --> 0:26:53.439
<v Speaker 2>believe in that case it was a situation where they

0:26:53.440 --> 0:26:55.480
<v Speaker 2>were bit by the beaver and then bled to death.

0:26:57.200 --> 0:27:00.920
<v Speaker 2>Now there is a wonderful CBC Radio interview out there

0:27:00.920 --> 0:27:03.800
<v Speaker 2>if you haven't heard it, from the early nineties and

0:27:03.800 --> 0:27:06.000
<v Speaker 2>then I'm not sure the date is known, but it

0:27:06.040 --> 0:27:09.000
<v Speaker 2>was rebroadcasting I think ninety seven, and that's the version

0:27:09.040 --> 0:27:12.560
<v Speaker 2>that is archived with CBC Radio. It's apparently one of

0:27:12.560 --> 0:27:18.160
<v Speaker 2>the most requested recordings from the CBC Radio archive. If

0:27:18.160 --> 0:27:20.000
<v Speaker 2>you look for it, you can find it out there.

0:27:20.640 --> 0:27:23.600
<v Speaker 2>It is action packed, it is a little bit funny.

0:27:24.280 --> 0:27:26.840
<v Speaker 2>It's but it's also not for the weak of heart.

0:27:26.960 --> 0:27:31.480
<v Speaker 3>This interview is riveting. A man describes I think he's

0:27:31.520 --> 0:27:34.280
<v Speaker 3>trying to drive across a bridge in his truck when

0:27:34.720 --> 0:27:38.159
<v Speaker 3>during a heavy downpour, or maybe right after one, and

0:27:38.200 --> 0:27:41.920
<v Speaker 3>the bridge is sort of flooded. There's some water standing

0:27:42.000 --> 0:27:44.600
<v Speaker 3>between the concrete barriers on the sides of the bridge,

0:27:44.840 --> 0:27:47.200
<v Speaker 3>and it appears that a beaver has taken up residence

0:27:47.280 --> 0:27:49.879
<v Speaker 3>on the bridge. It's sort of swimming back and forth

0:27:49.920 --> 0:27:52.200
<v Speaker 3>in the water. The man gets out of his truck

0:27:52.240 --> 0:27:54.639
<v Speaker 3>because he is afraid he has accidentally hit the beaver

0:27:54.760 --> 0:27:57.200
<v Speaker 3>with his truck, and when he gets out, the beaver

0:27:57.480 --> 0:28:00.720
<v Speaker 3>angrily latches onto his leg and proceeds to attack him

0:28:00.800 --> 0:28:06.679
<v Speaker 3>multiple times. He sustains. It seems not life threatening necessarily,

0:28:06.760 --> 0:28:09.919
<v Speaker 3>but pretty serious sounding injuries, like the beaver bites and

0:28:09.960 --> 0:28:10.800
<v Speaker 3>it bites hard.

0:28:11.359 --> 0:28:13.959
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, like bites him like eleven times, and he's just

0:28:14.240 --> 0:28:17.040
<v Speaker 2>fighting it off, trying to get back in his truck

0:28:17.080 --> 0:28:18.639
<v Speaker 2>and drive off. I think he has to hit it

0:28:18.680 --> 0:28:22.720
<v Speaker 2>with a propane tank at some point. And yeah, it's

0:28:22.760 --> 0:28:24.920
<v Speaker 2>a violent account, though I have to stress that the

0:28:25.280 --> 0:28:28.280
<v Speaker 2>man telling the tale, he has a lot of sympathy

0:28:28.320 --> 0:28:30.159
<v Speaker 2>for the beaver, and at the end of it, he's like,

0:28:30.520 --> 0:28:32.639
<v Speaker 2>you know, it's my fault. I'm the one who I

0:28:32.720 --> 0:28:34.200
<v Speaker 2>thought I hit it, and I should never have gotten

0:28:34.240 --> 0:28:36.199
<v Speaker 2>out of the car. It was just it was just

0:28:36.280 --> 0:28:38.520
<v Speaker 2>out of the truck. It was just defending itself. But

0:28:38.920 --> 0:28:41.640
<v Speaker 2>it really drives home that, yes, if the beaver is cornered,

0:28:41.840 --> 0:28:46.640
<v Speaker 2>the beaver can be ferocious. Those teeth can dig into you,

0:28:47.040 --> 0:28:49.840
<v Speaker 2>and you can easily see how in another situation, if

0:28:49.880 --> 0:28:52.320
<v Speaker 2>the beaver had got him in just a few different places,

0:28:52.760 --> 0:28:54.720
<v Speaker 2>he could have easily bled to death before he was

0:28:54.760 --> 0:28:57.760
<v Speaker 2>able to drive himself to the hospital. I also like

0:28:57.840 --> 0:29:00.160
<v Speaker 2>how the individual in this story he's quick to add like,

0:29:00.400 --> 0:29:03.200
<v Speaker 2>I've been bit by just about every animal out there,

0:29:03.400 --> 0:29:05.760
<v Speaker 2>but I'd never been bit or i'd been attacked by it.

0:29:05.840 --> 0:29:09.120
<v Speaker 2>Just about every animal out there been attacked by a wolverine.

0:29:10.520 --> 0:29:14.800
<v Speaker 3>One imagines a moose, but never a beaver. Yeah, but

0:29:14.920 --> 0:29:17.560
<v Speaker 3>I am, like you said, impressed by he holds no

0:29:17.640 --> 0:29:21.440
<v Speaker 3>malice for the beaver even after the attack. I think

0:29:21.440 --> 0:29:23.600
<v Speaker 3>he just keeps saying he was on defense.

0:29:24.160 --> 0:29:27.520
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. So so definitely sneep that out of you if

0:29:27.720 --> 0:29:30.960
<v Speaker 2>you're interested. But back to the Plenty document here. One

0:29:31.000 --> 0:29:33.520
<v Speaker 2>of the notes on this text points out that Plenty

0:29:33.600 --> 0:29:39.600
<v Speaker 2>derived this description from the physician Sextius, and the text

0:29:39.640 --> 0:29:43.560
<v Speaker 2>goes under remark on the vulgar error here and mentions

0:29:43.600 --> 0:29:46.440
<v Speaker 2>the work of the French naturalist Cuvier.

0:29:46.920 --> 0:29:47.240
<v Speaker 3>Quote.

0:29:47.360 --> 0:29:51.200
<v Speaker 2>Cuvier remarks that when the gland becomes distended with this secretion,

0:29:51.600 --> 0:29:54.680
<v Speaker 2>the animal may probably get rid of it by rubbing

0:29:54.680 --> 0:29:57.800
<v Speaker 2>the part against a stone or tree, and in this

0:29:57.880 --> 0:30:01.600
<v Speaker 2>way leave the cast door for the hunters, thus giving

0:30:01.760 --> 0:30:05.480
<v Speaker 2>rise to the vulgar error. Now, this is interesting because

0:30:05.520 --> 0:30:08.880
<v Speaker 2>going back to what we just discussed, it discussed disgusted. Sorry,

0:30:08.920 --> 0:30:10.960
<v Speaker 2>it's easy to get the too confused here. What we're

0:30:11.000 --> 0:30:14.120
<v Speaker 2>talking about here, what they're rubbing, would be the anal

0:30:14.200 --> 0:30:18.640
<v Speaker 2>gland secretions, not the cast door. But still, you can

0:30:18.680 --> 0:30:23.040
<v Speaker 2>imagine this situation where you'd have something distended from the

0:30:23.080 --> 0:30:25.960
<v Speaker 2>lower end of the beaver, something that may look from

0:30:26.000 --> 0:30:28.760
<v Speaker 2>a pair of glands, that may look like testicles. Here's

0:30:28.800 --> 0:30:33.000
<v Speaker 2>this beaver going up or rubbing itself against a stone

0:30:33.240 --> 0:30:36.680
<v Speaker 2>or a piece of a tree branch or something, and

0:30:36.720 --> 0:30:39.840
<v Speaker 2>then oh low and behold, whatever was protruding is gone.

0:30:40.440 --> 0:30:42.960
<v Speaker 2>This could be the thing that quote gives rise to

0:30:43.000 --> 0:30:43.840
<v Speaker 2>the vulgar error.

0:30:44.360 --> 0:30:46.440
<v Speaker 3>Yep, that does make sense, and it connects again to

0:30:46.520 --> 0:30:51.600
<v Speaker 3>the idea of the scent markings being territorial boundaries in nature,

0:30:51.640 --> 0:30:55.240
<v Speaker 3>you know, trying to ward off encroachments by other beavers

0:30:55.240 --> 0:30:58.440
<v Speaker 3>often so it makes a lot of sense that, say,

0:30:58.480 --> 0:31:01.520
<v Speaker 3>if a hunter is coming into a beaver's family group territory,

0:31:01.560 --> 0:31:02.840
<v Speaker 3>the hunter might see it marking.

0:31:03.120 --> 0:31:06.040
<v Speaker 2>Now Plenty also mentions the beaver again in the Natural

0:31:06.080 --> 0:31:08.880
<v Speaker 2>History when discussing the sea cow, which he says has

0:31:08.920 --> 0:31:13.440
<v Speaker 2>a similar level of intelligence and a similar alleged defense

0:31:13.480 --> 0:31:16.360
<v Speaker 2>capability quote. And this is talking about the sea cow.

0:31:16.840 --> 0:31:19.920
<v Speaker 2>It vomits forth its gall which is useful for many

0:31:19.960 --> 0:31:23.440
<v Speaker 2>purposes in medicine, also the rennet, which serves as a

0:31:23.480 --> 0:31:27.040
<v Speaker 2>remedy in epilepsy, for it is well aware that it

0:31:27.080 --> 0:31:32.000
<v Speaker 2>is hunted. For these substances. Theophrastus informs us that lizards

0:31:32.040 --> 0:31:35.880
<v Speaker 2>also cast their skins like the serpent, and instantly devour them,

0:31:36.360 --> 0:31:40.920
<v Speaker 2>thus depriving us of a powerful remedy for epilepsy. He

0:31:41.040 --> 0:31:44.200
<v Speaker 2>says too, that the bite of the lizard is fatal

0:31:44.240 --> 0:31:46.160
<v Speaker 2>in Greece but harmless in Italy.

0:31:48.120 --> 0:31:50.160
<v Speaker 3>Okay, now.

0:31:51.400 --> 0:31:53.560
<v Speaker 2>There is some merit to what Plenty is saying here,

0:31:54.600 --> 0:31:57.960
<v Speaker 2>generally because certain creatures are thought to leave behind parts

0:31:58.000 --> 0:32:01.720
<v Speaker 2>of their body or vomit something as a distractor for predators.

0:32:02.120 --> 0:32:05.200
<v Speaker 2>We also know very well that not just humans but

0:32:05.280 --> 0:32:09.160
<v Speaker 2>animal predators sometimes target specific organs of their prey. But

0:32:09.240 --> 0:32:13.560
<v Speaker 2>what he's reporting about the beaver here specifically is not true.

0:32:14.120 --> 0:32:16.760
<v Speaker 2>But I also find this interesting. This is a tangent

0:32:16.960 --> 0:32:20.320
<v Speaker 2>the idea that the lizard eats its skin after it

0:32:20.400 --> 0:32:23.880
<v Speaker 2>sheds it, despite us to be like, Nope, you're not

0:32:23.880 --> 0:32:27.120
<v Speaker 2>getting in your hands on my sweet skin when I mean,

0:32:27.120 --> 0:32:30.840
<v Speaker 2>in reality, we know that many lizards, including my son's gecko,

0:32:31.160 --> 0:32:33.600
<v Speaker 2>consumes its own sheddings because like, you're not going to

0:32:33.680 --> 0:32:34.760
<v Speaker 2>waste that good stuff.

0:32:35.200 --> 0:32:39.600
<v Speaker 3>Of course not, nature is full of disgusting efficiencies. But

0:32:39.720 --> 0:32:41.080
<v Speaker 3>to add a little bit to what you said a

0:32:41.160 --> 0:32:43.560
<v Speaker 3>minute ago, it is absolutely true that, yeah, there are

0:32:43.560 --> 0:32:47.120
<v Speaker 3>many animals that will self amputate when threatened to buy

0:32:47.160 --> 0:32:50.960
<v Speaker 3>a predator or under various stressful situations. This is a

0:32:51.440 --> 0:32:55.640
<v Speaker 3>strategy known as autotomy. A a u t o t

0:32:55.800 --> 0:33:00.320
<v Speaker 3>o m y comes from the Greek for self cutting

0:33:00.400 --> 0:33:05.120
<v Speaker 3>or self severing. And yeah, you can often see it

0:33:05.160 --> 0:33:07.880
<v Speaker 3>like in lizards, where yes, if a predator, say, grabs

0:33:07.920 --> 0:33:10.400
<v Speaker 3>hold of their tail, the lizard will just release the

0:33:10.440 --> 0:33:13.800
<v Speaker 3>tail from their body. The predator can have it, which

0:33:13.800 --> 0:33:17.600
<v Speaker 3>has a double effect that's helpful for the lizard's survival.

0:33:17.640 --> 0:33:19.280
<v Speaker 3>For one thing, if it is grabbed by the tail

0:33:19.320 --> 0:33:22.360
<v Speaker 3>and then releases the tail, it has now escaped the

0:33:22.400 --> 0:33:24.760
<v Speaker 3>grasp of the predator. But the other thing is by

0:33:24.960 --> 0:33:28.720
<v Speaker 3>giving the predator a sort of consolation prize, it's almost

0:33:28.760 --> 0:33:30.680
<v Speaker 3>like compromising with them. It's like, well, you can have

0:33:30.800 --> 0:33:32.960
<v Speaker 3>this much, but you can't have my whole life.

0:33:34.560 --> 0:33:37.040
<v Speaker 2>It's also worth noting that I think, I mean, all

0:33:37.080 --> 0:33:41.800
<v Speaker 2>the examples of this that come to mind are essentially

0:33:41.880 --> 0:33:46.320
<v Speaker 2>ejections releases. They do not involve like active severing of

0:33:46.800 --> 0:33:49.880
<v Speaker 2>a creature's own body with its teeth or its claws

0:33:49.960 --> 0:33:50.280
<v Speaker 2>or that.

0:33:50.200 --> 0:33:53.240
<v Speaker 3>Sort of thing. Well, yeah, that's a good question. All

0:33:53.280 --> 0:33:55.440
<v Speaker 3>of the ones I can think of, having read of

0:33:56.080 --> 0:33:59.960
<v Speaker 3>read about before, yeah, just seem to be reject severe

0:34:00.280 --> 0:34:02.680
<v Speaker 3>often of like a tail or a leg or something,

0:34:02.760 --> 0:34:06.719
<v Speaker 3>or a claw. But that is a good question. There

0:34:06.760 --> 0:34:10.759
<v Speaker 3>are there cases where the animal has to work on

0:34:10.880 --> 0:34:14.360
<v Speaker 3>its own autonomy, where it essentially must do the severing

0:34:14.400 --> 0:34:18.040
<v Speaker 3>itself with its teeth or claws or other or something

0:34:18.680 --> 0:34:19.399
<v Speaker 3>something like that.

0:34:19.880 --> 0:34:23.160
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so if the beaver were to sever its own testicles,

0:34:23.200 --> 0:34:28.560
<v Speaker 2>it would be a really un alarming behavioral development. I

0:34:28.600 --> 0:34:32.600
<v Speaker 2>can't imagine a situation where this where a creature would

0:34:32.640 --> 0:34:36.080
<v Speaker 2>develop it like evolved to have this as an actual

0:34:36.960 --> 0:34:40.480
<v Speaker 2>feature of like dropping their testicles, like ejecting them, because

0:34:40.719 --> 0:34:43.480
<v Speaker 2>you know, even examples like certain scorpions that eject part

0:34:43.520 --> 0:34:46.200
<v Speaker 2>of their own tail and in doing so eject their

0:34:46.239 --> 0:34:48.920
<v Speaker 2>anus and then can no longer poop. As we've discussed

0:34:48.960 --> 0:34:50.320
<v Speaker 2>and then just kind of swell up with poop for

0:34:50.360 --> 0:34:53.200
<v Speaker 2>the rest of their lives. If memory serves, they can

0:34:53.239 --> 0:34:57.760
<v Speaker 2>still reproduce. They're not giving up reproduction, that vital act

0:34:57.880 --> 0:35:01.560
<v Speaker 2>of any species in order to protect itself.

0:35:02.040 --> 0:35:05.160
<v Speaker 3>I did think of a possible counter example. I wish

0:35:05.239 --> 0:35:07.960
<v Speaker 3>I had read up on this deeply before we started recording,

0:35:08.040 --> 0:35:12.799
<v Speaker 3>But I believe there are cases where crabs will practice autonomy,

0:35:12.880 --> 0:35:16.839
<v Speaker 3>and that will involve the like cutting or pulling of

0:35:16.880 --> 0:35:21.520
<v Speaker 3>the autonomized claw with the other claw, so that is active,

0:35:21.719 --> 0:35:24.000
<v Speaker 3>like the alleged beaver testicle biting.

0:35:24.560 --> 0:35:27.279
<v Speaker 2>Ah, we'll leave it to crabs to do it that way.

0:35:27.360 --> 0:35:29.400
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, maybe we'll have to come back to that in

0:35:29.680 --> 0:35:30.760
<v Speaker 3>listener mail or something.

0:35:40.239 --> 0:35:43.440
<v Speaker 2>All right, now, coming back to kastorium. The origins of

0:35:43.520 --> 0:35:47.239
<v Speaker 2>human uses for this substance are, of course lost to time.

0:35:47.320 --> 0:35:49.480
<v Speaker 2>They emerge from somewhere in the vast period of time

0:35:49.600 --> 0:35:53.440
<v Speaker 2>during which our ancestors determined how best to process and

0:35:53.600 --> 0:35:56.880
<v Speaker 2>use an animal's body for resources that range from like

0:35:56.920 --> 0:36:00.480
<v Speaker 2>the really practical like meat and materials, things that are

0:36:00.600 --> 0:36:04.600
<v Speaker 2>more cultural like decorations and adornments, and also that often

0:36:04.719 --> 0:36:09.480
<v Speaker 2>mercy area of medicinal and magical properties. In a given substance,

0:36:10.040 --> 0:36:13.680
<v Speaker 2>but still we have some early sources to consider. Now,

0:36:13.680 --> 0:36:17.720
<v Speaker 2>apparently the ancient archaeological evidence of castorium usage by humans

0:36:17.719 --> 0:36:20.120
<v Speaker 2>takes us back a good six thousand years. I was

0:36:20.120 --> 0:36:23.239
<v Speaker 2>looking at a paper titled Ancient Throwing Dart reveals first

0:36:23.360 --> 0:36:27.239
<v Speaker 2>archaeological evidence of Castorium published in the Journal of Archaeological

0:36:27.320 --> 0:36:30.960
<v Speaker 2>Science Reports. This was in June of twenty twenty one

0:36:31.400 --> 0:36:35.520
<v Speaker 2>by Hellwig at All and basically this throwing dart in

0:36:35.560 --> 0:36:39.040
<v Speaker 2>particular was found in the Yukon territory and it featured

0:36:39.080 --> 0:36:45.360
<v Speaker 2>a red orange residue that, upon analysis contained the various

0:36:45.440 --> 0:36:50.120
<v Speaker 2>organic ingredients and materials that matched up with beaver castorium.

0:36:50.680 --> 0:36:54.240
<v Speaker 2>The authors point out that the substance was seemingly used

0:36:54.480 --> 0:36:58.880
<v Speaker 2>to toughen wood by ancient hunters, though baiting and medicinal

0:36:59.000 --> 0:37:03.160
<v Speaker 2>uses among later First Nations people were also recorded. The

0:37:03.239 --> 0:37:06.480
<v Speaker 2>Taltan people in particular were said to use it on

0:37:06.719 --> 0:37:09.799
<v Speaker 2>the heated wood of their bows and kept some on

0:37:09.880 --> 0:37:13.080
<v Speaker 2>their person in a small container of like wood or

0:37:13.080 --> 0:37:16.800
<v Speaker 2>horn or bone. So it sounds like it was something

0:37:16.800 --> 0:37:20.440
<v Speaker 2>that was probably used to like to maintain your weapons,

0:37:20.480 --> 0:37:22.400
<v Speaker 2>to maintain your hunting implements.

0:37:23.400 --> 0:37:25.520
<v Speaker 3>That's a kind of oily treatment for the wood.

0:37:26.160 --> 0:37:28.959
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, which, you know, this to a certain extent,

0:37:28.960 --> 0:37:31.480
<v Speaker 2>I guess kind of reminds one of how the beavers

0:37:31.560 --> 0:37:35.400
<v Speaker 2>use it to help and use that special claw comb

0:37:35.400 --> 0:37:38.280
<v Speaker 2>of theirs to comb it into their fur, in addition

0:37:38.320 --> 0:37:40.479
<v Speaker 2>to using it to mark their scent.

0:37:41.480 --> 0:37:43.719
<v Speaker 3>But in the fur it's I believe it's supposed to

0:37:43.719 --> 0:37:45.120
<v Speaker 3>have some waterproofing purposes.

0:37:45.680 --> 0:37:49.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah yeah, Now, Sarah Lohman in a twenty seventeen article

0:37:49.440 --> 0:37:52.720
<v Speaker 2>for Mental Flows, points it's a nice overview that points

0:37:52.719 --> 0:37:58.480
<v Speaker 2>to a number of different additional alleged uses for a gastorium.

0:37:59.040 --> 0:38:02.360
<v Speaker 2>For instance, I believe even in Roman times, it was

0:38:02.400 --> 0:38:05.920
<v Speaker 2>thought that you could use like a smoke inhalation based

0:38:06.760 --> 0:38:10.760
<v Speaker 2>version of it for as an abortive medicine. Twelfth century

0:38:10.800 --> 0:38:14.719
<v Speaker 2>mystic Hildegarde von Bingen wrote that it could be powdered

0:38:14.800 --> 0:38:17.600
<v Speaker 2>and put into a wine to reduce fever, and then

0:38:17.640 --> 0:38:20.080
<v Speaker 2>in colonial America it was used for all sorts of stuff.

0:38:20.120 --> 0:38:23.400
<v Speaker 2>It was used as both the means of staving off sleep,

0:38:23.520 --> 0:38:26.280
<v Speaker 2>you know, sort of like your trucker speed, I guess,

0:38:26.440 --> 0:38:29.040
<v Speaker 2>but it was also used to encourage sleep, you know,

0:38:29.239 --> 0:38:33.120
<v Speaker 2>having a little insomnia, well her own castorium. It was

0:38:33.239 --> 0:38:35.399
<v Speaker 2>used as a kind of brain booster. You know, you're

0:38:35.400 --> 0:38:37.480
<v Speaker 2>feeling like you need to up your game. Well, you

0:38:37.520 --> 0:38:41.080
<v Speaker 2>can't just grab some pills, some brain booster pills at

0:38:41.120 --> 0:38:43.359
<v Speaker 2>the grocery store. You need to go get yourself some

0:38:43.400 --> 0:38:45.399
<v Speaker 2>castorium from the local apothecary.

0:38:46.400 --> 0:38:47.760
<v Speaker 3>They must have gotten really smart.

0:38:48.239 --> 0:38:51.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, it was used to treat colic, to treat gout,

0:38:52.280 --> 0:38:54.719
<v Speaker 2>and to treat toothaches and earaches.

0:38:55.200 --> 0:38:58.200
<v Speaker 3>Now I got interested in the idea of the use

0:38:58.200 --> 0:39:04.239
<v Speaker 3>of castorium allegedly to treat pain because of something I read. Unfortunately,

0:39:04.280 --> 0:39:07.880
<v Speaker 3>I was not able to find a very clear answer

0:39:07.920 --> 0:39:11.920
<v Speaker 3>on this. But what I read was that I was

0:39:11.960 --> 0:39:16.160
<v Speaker 3>looking at a book called Aspirin and the Salicylates by

0:39:16.280 --> 0:39:21.440
<v Speaker 3>KDE Rainsford, published in twenty thirteen. Quote. Salicylates have also

0:39:21.480 --> 0:39:26.520
<v Speaker 3>been identified in beaver castor ie of scent glands from

0:39:26.520 --> 0:39:29.440
<v Speaker 3>where it is secreted instead of the via the usual

0:39:29.560 --> 0:39:34.799
<v Speaker 3>urinary route. The salicilits are probably metabolic transformation products from

0:39:34.920 --> 0:39:39.920
<v Speaker 3>vegetable sources in the diet of the beaver. So that

0:39:40.040 --> 0:39:44.520
<v Speaker 3>kind of interested me because salacillates are related to the

0:39:44.640 --> 0:39:50.200
<v Speaker 3>active ingredient in aspirin. Aspirin is, of course, it's a

0:39:50.239 --> 0:39:55.960
<v Speaker 3>nonsteroidal anti inflammatory drug often used to reduce fever and

0:39:56.000 --> 0:40:02.040
<v Speaker 3>treat pain inflammation, and this active ingredient, aspirin acetyl salicilic acid,

0:40:02.800 --> 0:40:05.839
<v Speaker 3>is derived from a precursor found in the bark of

0:40:05.880 --> 0:40:08.840
<v Speaker 3>the willow tree, which of course is something that beavers

0:40:08.880 --> 0:40:12.239
<v Speaker 3>tend to chew and eat a lot of. So this

0:40:12.360 --> 0:40:18.440
<v Speaker 3>chemical relationship with the active ingredient in a common nonsteroidal

0:40:18.480 --> 0:40:23.439
<v Speaker 3>anti inflammatory and pain reliever made me wonder if there

0:40:23.520 --> 0:40:27.440
<v Speaker 3>could be some kind of connection there, like maybe this

0:40:27.640 --> 0:40:32.320
<v Speaker 3>downstream animal product that's derived from this original plant molecule.

0:40:33.840 --> 0:40:36.440
<v Speaker 3>I wondered if that could be playing a role in

0:40:36.520 --> 0:40:40.880
<v Speaker 3>castorium actually having an anti inflammatory effect or treating pain.

0:40:41.280 --> 0:40:44.000
<v Speaker 3>But I could not find anything solid to back up

0:40:44.120 --> 0:40:47.600
<v Speaker 3>that connection. So I don't know if there's actually anything

0:40:47.640 --> 0:40:50.359
<v Speaker 3>to that, but my curiosity is raised here.

0:40:51.040 --> 0:40:58.319
<v Speaker 2>M Yeah, that's interesting. Now, outside of alleged medicinal properties,

0:40:58.760 --> 0:41:02.520
<v Speaker 2>it also has a long history of being used as

0:41:02.560 --> 0:41:05.040
<v Speaker 2>a like a just for its scent and as a

0:41:05.040 --> 0:41:08.799
<v Speaker 2>flavor enhancer. Loman notes, as others have noted in these

0:41:08.800 --> 0:41:14.120
<v Speaker 2>other sources, we've looked at that castorium, once processed you know, smoked,

0:41:14.520 --> 0:41:17.960
<v Speaker 2>were derived into a tincture. It can be used to

0:41:18.080 --> 0:41:22.320
<v Speaker 2>enhance flavors, particularly to enhance flavors of raspberry and strawberry

0:41:23.000 --> 0:41:26.120
<v Speaker 2>to replicate a kind of vanilla flavor, and it's also

0:41:26.160 --> 0:41:29.240
<v Speaker 2>been used to give perfumes a sort of leathery odor.

0:41:29.600 --> 0:41:31.800
<v Speaker 2>And I guess all this shouldn't be too surprising, again

0:41:32.200 --> 0:41:36.279
<v Speaker 2>realizing that the compounds in castorium are ultimately derived from

0:41:36.360 --> 0:41:39.600
<v Speaker 2>leaves and tree bark, so it shouldn't be completely shocking.

0:41:41.360 --> 0:41:44.600
<v Speaker 2>Now it's still technically an FDA approved natural flavoring in

0:41:44.640 --> 0:41:49.319
<v Speaker 2>the United States, but it's rarely used and was far

0:41:49.400 --> 0:41:53.760
<v Speaker 2>more commonly used as a flavor enhancer in the early

0:41:53.800 --> 0:41:57.560
<v Speaker 2>twentieth century. Now you've probably if you've looked around at

0:41:57.560 --> 0:41:59.520
<v Speaker 2>anything about this, you may have come across this. There

0:41:59.560 --> 0:42:04.960
<v Speaker 2>is a curarently a Swedish spirit called Beaverhoot that uses

0:42:05.360 --> 0:42:12.640
<v Speaker 2>castorium translated as beaver shout. Some adventurous imbibers have sought

0:42:12.680 --> 0:42:16.399
<v Speaker 2>it out. You'll find a number of essentially I guess

0:42:16.400 --> 0:42:19.480
<v Speaker 2>spirit and alcohol bloggers out there talking about their experiences

0:42:19.480 --> 0:42:21.719
<v Speaker 2>with it or doing videos, some of these with kind

0:42:21.760 --> 0:42:25.000
<v Speaker 2>of crude titles, but I found a really nice one

0:42:25.600 --> 0:42:30.600
<v Speaker 2>on a blog from an individual named Dolly Jorgensen at

0:42:30.680 --> 0:42:35.800
<v Speaker 2>Dolly dot jorgensenweb dot net, who has like a very nice,

0:42:35.960 --> 0:42:39.480
<v Speaker 2>historically driven post on the subject that is again far

0:42:39.520 --> 0:42:41.880
<v Speaker 2>classier than what I was seeing in other places online.

0:42:42.080 --> 0:42:44.880
<v Speaker 2>I just want to read a quick quote from Dolly

0:42:44.960 --> 0:42:50.200
<v Speaker 2>Jorgenson about trying out beaver shout quote. The first flavor

0:42:50.280 --> 0:42:53.960
<v Speaker 2>was similar to oak cured whiskey, but then the musk

0:42:54.120 --> 0:42:57.040
<v Speaker 2>comes out. It's a hard to describe taste, but I

0:42:57.040 --> 0:43:01.319
<v Speaker 2>imagine that it's what traditional male musky colan would taste like.

0:43:02.120 --> 0:43:05.520
<v Speaker 2>It was not particularly strong, however, so it seemed pleasant

0:43:05.600 --> 0:43:09.600
<v Speaker 2>enough to consume most of the shot. An hour later, however,

0:43:09.640 --> 0:43:12.960
<v Speaker 2>I had a different opinion. Is the castorium sense started

0:43:13.160 --> 0:43:16.960
<v Speaker 2>to seep out through my skin. Literally, my pores started

0:43:17.000 --> 0:43:19.040
<v Speaker 2>to extrude the musky smell.

0:43:19.719 --> 0:43:22.200
<v Speaker 3>Okay, I mean that's a commercial basically.

0:43:23.360 --> 0:43:27.440
<v Speaker 2>So I thought that was telling because the way the

0:43:27.480 --> 0:43:31.319
<v Speaker 2>author describes it here, it's probably or at least in

0:43:31.320 --> 0:43:34.120
<v Speaker 2>this case, and I guess it depends on who's making

0:43:34.760 --> 0:43:37.520
<v Speaker 2>the liquor and so forth, but it sounds like it's

0:43:37.680 --> 0:43:40.400
<v Speaker 2>more tolerable than you might imagine, but there being this

0:43:40.520 --> 0:43:43.839
<v Speaker 2>kind of like after effect to consuming it. If any

0:43:43.880 --> 0:43:47.040
<v Speaker 2>adventurous sorts out there listening to this episode have experience

0:43:47.160 --> 0:43:50.080
<v Speaker 2>with beaver shout, do write in. We would love to

0:43:50.120 --> 0:43:53.359
<v Speaker 2>hear from you. We'd love to hear your impression of this.

0:43:53.960 --> 0:43:55.600
<v Speaker 3>You know, this reminds me of the time we talked

0:43:55.640 --> 0:43:57.960
<v Speaker 3>about the liquor that had a human toe in it

0:43:58.040 --> 0:44:00.920
<v Speaker 3>and then we heard from multiple listeners said they drank it.

0:44:01.600 --> 0:44:04.319
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Yeah. There was another blog post that I was

0:44:04.400 --> 0:44:06.799
<v Speaker 2>looking at where the individual was like, Hey, it's kind

0:44:06.800 --> 0:44:10.480
<v Speaker 2>of a hobby of mine to find various alcohols that

0:44:10.600 --> 0:44:15.040
<v Speaker 2>have something organic in them, something some like part and

0:44:15.080 --> 0:44:17.600
<v Speaker 2>then try it out. And you see this in different cultures,

0:44:17.600 --> 0:44:19.120
<v Speaker 2>like the idea is like some sort of alcohol and

0:44:19.120 --> 0:44:20.480
<v Speaker 2>it has like, I don't know, a snake and it

0:44:20.560 --> 0:44:23.239
<v Speaker 2>a scorpion in it, that sort of thing. But in

0:44:23.280 --> 0:44:28.120
<v Speaker 2>this case, the castor glands of a beaver are used

0:44:28.160 --> 0:44:31.759
<v Speaker 2>to create a unique spirit. I also looked around. I

0:44:31.800 --> 0:44:34.279
<v Speaker 2>was like, maybe somebody's making a cocktail with this. Maybe

0:44:34.320 --> 0:44:38.239
<v Speaker 2>there's a beaver shout cocktail out there. I could not

0:44:38.360 --> 0:44:41.879
<v Speaker 2>find one. So if mixologists out there are figuring out

0:44:41.880 --> 0:44:44.280
<v Speaker 2>a way to sort of tame the flavor of beaver

0:44:44.400 --> 0:44:47.399
<v Speaker 2>shout and like sort of manipulate it into a more

0:44:47.400 --> 0:44:50.520
<v Speaker 2>refined concoction. I have not found evidence of it of it.

0:44:50.560 --> 0:44:54.520
<v Speaker 2>I went to imbub magazine and looked around for castorium

0:44:54.960 --> 0:44:57.640
<v Speaker 2>and that nothing was coming up. And that's the one

0:44:57.640 --> 0:45:02.040
<v Speaker 2>place I would expect, like some profettional mixologist out there

0:45:02.280 --> 0:45:04.640
<v Speaker 2>has has whipped this up, you know, just on just

0:45:04.800 --> 0:45:07.440
<v Speaker 2>as a challenge. But I saw no evidence of it.

0:45:08.040 --> 0:45:10.880
<v Speaker 2>Maybe in Sweden, maybe it's like a special thing. You

0:45:10.880 --> 0:45:13.520
<v Speaker 2>need to like look to Swedish high end bars to

0:45:13.560 --> 0:45:13.880
<v Speaker 2>find this.

0:45:14.560 --> 0:45:17.040
<v Speaker 3>Maybe maybe you got to ask beer get where to

0:45:17.040 --> 0:45:17.440
<v Speaker 3>find it.

0:45:17.880 --> 0:45:21.080
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, all right, well, I believe we're going to close

0:45:21.080 --> 0:45:24.719
<v Speaker 2>out our two parter on the beaver here. But this

0:45:24.800 --> 0:45:27.480
<v Speaker 2>was a fun one. This is one that initially I

0:45:27.560 --> 0:45:30.440
<v Speaker 2>was thinking we would discuss these some of these images

0:45:30.480 --> 0:45:32.879
<v Speaker 2>of the beaver in an episode that looked at other

0:45:33.400 --> 0:45:37.160
<v Speaker 2>inaccurate depictions of animals from various bestiaries. And then it

0:45:37.239 --> 0:45:39.960
<v Speaker 2>quickly became obvious that this was an entire episode, and

0:45:40.000 --> 0:45:42.440
<v Speaker 2>then that it was actually a part one and a

0:45:42.480 --> 0:45:46.600
<v Speaker 2>part two. I have so much more respect and admiration

0:45:47.160 --> 0:45:49.120
<v Speaker 2>for the weird and wonderful beaver.

0:45:49.239 --> 0:45:51.479
<v Speaker 3>Now, how can you not? I mean, if you don't,

0:45:51.480 --> 0:45:52.640
<v Speaker 3>they'll shake a stick at you.

0:45:53.280 --> 0:45:56.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, all right, We're going to go and close

0:45:56.280 --> 0:45:57.920
<v Speaker 2>it out here, but we'd love to hear from everyone

0:45:57.920 --> 0:46:01.480
<v Speaker 2>out there if you have thoughts, experiences is concerning the

0:46:01.520 --> 0:46:05.359
<v Speaker 2>beaver right in. If you want to check out other

0:46:05.400 --> 0:46:07.040
<v Speaker 2>episodes we've done in the past, We've covered a lot

0:46:07.080 --> 0:46:10.360
<v Speaker 2>of curious animals over the years, kind of composing our

0:46:10.400 --> 0:46:13.239
<v Speaker 2>own festi area in many respects. On the Stuff to

0:46:13.280 --> 0:46:16.440
<v Speaker 2>Blow Your Mind podcast, you can find core episodes of

0:46:16.440 --> 0:46:19.160
<v Speaker 2>that on Tuesdays and Thursdays in the Stuff to Blow

0:46:19.200 --> 0:46:22.959
<v Speaker 2>Your Mind podcast feed. On Mondays we do listener mail.

0:46:23.120 --> 0:46:25.520
<v Speaker 2>On Wednesday's we do a short form artifact or monster fact,

0:46:25.640 --> 0:46:27.880
<v Speaker 2>and on Fridays we set aside most series concerns to

0:46:27.960 --> 0:46:31.600
<v Speaker 2>just talk about a weird movie on Weird House Cinema.

0:46:31.840 --> 0:46:35.080
<v Speaker 3>Huge thanks to our audio producer JJ Pousway. If you

0:46:35.080 --> 0:46:37.120
<v Speaker 3>would like to get in touch with us with feedback

0:46:37.160 --> 0:46:40.080
<v Speaker 3>on this episode or any other, to suggest a topic

0:46:40.120 --> 0:46:42.200
<v Speaker 3>for the future, or just to say hello, you can

0:46:42.239 --> 0:46:45.120
<v Speaker 3>email us at contact at stuff to Blow your Mind

0:46:45.239 --> 0:46:53.600
<v Speaker 3>dot com.

0:46:53.640 --> 0:46:56.600
<v Speaker 1>Stuff to Blow Your Mind is production of iHeartRadio. For

0:46:56.680 --> 0:47:00.520
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