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Speaker 1: Now here's a highlight from Coast to Coast AM on iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Man, Welcome back to Coast to Coast George Nori with you.

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Speaker 2: Joshua P. Warren back with us. Paranormal investigator and host

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Speaker 2: of The Strange Things on the Coast to Coast Day

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Speaker 2: and Paranormal podcast Network. His work explores the universal relationship

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Speaker 2: between matter and matter and energy. He's in demand as

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Speaker 2: an expert on ghosts, UFOs, cryptids, psychic phenomena, time warps,

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Speaker 2: and everything that presses forth the boundaries of normal reality.

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Speaker 2: Josh Welcome, Happy holidays, Merry Christmas to you.

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Speaker 3: Well, thank you, Georgia, Happy holidays and Merry Christmas to

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Speaker 3: you as well. It's great to be able to share

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Speaker 3: some time during this magical point in the year.

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Speaker 2: I'm looking forward to this chat with you tonight. But

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Speaker 2: give me your thoughts on these drones that have been

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Speaker 2: flying over New York and New Jersey. What do you

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Speaker 2: think is going on?

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Speaker 3: Well, I don't think we are seeing Fanta Claus doing

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Speaker 3: any test fights so honestly, because so many people claim

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Speaker 3: that they look like a drone, and some of them

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Speaker 3: do look kind of like some exotic, morphous weird technology

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Speaker 3: that's sort of sprinkled out there as all that most

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Speaker 3: of the fightings say they look like a big zone.

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Speaker 3: And you know, there are some authorities. For example, I

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Speaker 3: believe there was a colonel with the New Jersey State

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Speaker 3: Police who said one of their helicopters flew right over

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Speaker 3: top of one of these drones and it was a

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Speaker 3: very mechanical, tangible thing that was about six feet across.

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Speaker 3: And when you take all those into account, if we

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Speaker 3: believe what our government is telling us, and they don't

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Speaker 3: know what they are, and that may not be true.

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Speaker 3: Obviously dald Trump hasn't situated that that may not be

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Speaker 3: the case that they're conceiving us. But if what they

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Speaker 3: are saying is true and they don't know what they are,

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Speaker 3: that I would say that you consider that most of

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Speaker 3: the drones we have are made in China. And also,

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Speaker 3: well you see that the Chinese were willing to fly

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Speaker 3: and the balloon across our con street to gather information

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Speaker 3: that and they basically got away through that. It would

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Speaker 3: make sense to me that they're the likely But this

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Speaker 3: is some kind of Tinese technology and they're trying to

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Speaker 3: gather some sensitive innovation take advantage of transitionive Pepper that's

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Speaker 3: going on right now before Trump takes off the next month.

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Speaker 2: Well, it's pretty dramatic stuff that you've been doing. Joshua

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Speaker 2: pe Warren has been doing this for a long time

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Speaker 2: for us. I don't know if you haven't heard his

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Speaker 2: podcast yet of Strange Things, as Tom has been mentioning

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Speaker 2: over the past couple of weeks. It's on the Paranormal

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Speaker 2: Podcast Network and it is truly remarkable. It's a show

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Speaker 2: that he does. Now we've got Sandra Champlain doing it

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Speaker 2: as well. Plus we also have Captain Ron doing his

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Speaker 2: on UFOs. But the Josh has got some great scary things.

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Speaker 2: And what we did is we asked him. We said, Josh,

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Speaker 2: tell me tell me this all right back now, what

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Speaker 2: happened the magic of Santa Claus?

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Speaker 3: Do we touch on a sensitive subject?

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Speaker 2: Perhaps you never know? You never know, Josh, But we

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Speaker 2: were talking about your podcast. How long you been doing

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Speaker 2: that for us?

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Speaker 3: Now? You know, I've been doing these Strange Things podcast

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Speaker 3: on the Coast to Coast they have Paranormal Podcast Network

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Speaker 3: for about I guess we're going on maybe four and

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Speaker 3: a half years now. It's very hard to believe. It

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Speaker 3: still kind of feels like a new project, and yet

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Speaker 3: I just recently recorded the two hundred and twentieth episode,

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Speaker 3: and that's quite impressive if you consider that. You know,

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Speaker 3: each episode is an hour, including some commercials, not very many,

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Speaker 3: and so there is plenty of content there for people

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Speaker 3: who haven't heard the podcast that want to go back

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Speaker 3: and start from the scratch and listen to the whole

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Speaker 3: saga if you will.

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Speaker 2: Well, let's have some paranormal fun talking about Christmas and

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Speaker 2: Santa Claus. You've getting in a lot of calls from

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Speaker 2: people who claim to be seen Santa Claus popping up

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Speaker 2: all over the place. What's going on?

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Speaker 3: You know, this goes back to a research project that

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Speaker 3: I really started in two thousand and eight. You know,

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Speaker 3: we're talking about going back about almost seventeen years ago.

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Speaker 3: And I've always been interested in this concept of the

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Speaker 3: so called pulpa. And what I mean is, for thousands

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Speaker 3: of years, there has been a belief in certain cultures

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Speaker 3: that reality is a flexible thing. And if someone with

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Speaker 3: a very powerful mind focuses over and over on visualizing

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Speaker 3: something like a particular being or a character that that

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Speaker 3: might actually be externalized, the person could project that from

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Speaker 3: his or her brain and create this being, and it's

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Speaker 3: even more powerful a group of people do this collectively.

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Speaker 3: It's the projection of a fault form. And the thought

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Speaker 3: form is not just some kind of a mindless hologram,

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Speaker 3: but we're also talking about it taking on some consciousness

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Speaker 3: and interactivity of its own, literally giving birth to it

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Speaker 3: directly from one's thoughts. And now I know that sounds

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Speaker 3: pretty extraordinary, But a lot of people have believed that

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Speaker 3: maybe some of these sightings we've had over the years,

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Speaker 3: of these very famous powerful religious figures, like Mother Mary

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Speaker 3: being seen at Fatima or in Portugal, or Lords or

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Speaker 3: in France, or some of these areas where we have,

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Speaker 3: of course massive sightings of angels or demons, maybe these

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Speaker 3: are the products of Tulpa's well. One of the most

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Speaker 3: powerful images that we all have had of a character

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Speaker 3: for hundreds of years has been that of Santa Claus.

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Speaker 3: And of course Santa.

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Speaker 4: Claus is He's so real that in our minds that

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Speaker 4: at a certain point in our lives often our parents

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Speaker 4: tell us, they tell us he's real. And so I

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Speaker 4: thought I would test out this Tulpa thing, and back

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Speaker 4: in two thousand and eight, I started asking people if

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Speaker 4: they'd ever.

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Speaker 3: Seen Santa Claus. I sent out a newsletter. I have

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Speaker 3: a free e newsletter that's on my website that goes

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Speaker 3: out to thousands of people all over the world, free

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Speaker 3: and spam free. So I hope everybody will sign up

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Speaker 3: for that. And I said, look, this is not a joke.

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Speaker 3: I'm wondering if you've ever seen Santa Claus. I'll keep

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Speaker 3: your story private, but please just be honest with me

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Speaker 3: and I'll take it seriously. And would you like to

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Speaker 3: hear some of the feedback I got.

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Speaker 2: I'd love to so.

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Speaker 3: Here I have. For example, one of the first that

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Speaker 3: came in was a woman from Miami who said nineteen

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Speaker 3: eighty she not only saw Santa in her living room,

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Speaker 3: but asked him where the toys came from, and he answered, quote,

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Speaker 3: they are not made on Earth. I inspire the toymakers

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Speaker 3: end quote, and then he disappeared. Then a woman from

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Speaker 3: a Spencer, North Carolina said, in nineteen seventy two she

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Speaker 3: clearly saw Santa and his sleigh pulled by a complete

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Speaker 3: team of rain across the across the Christmas Eve sky

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Speaker 3: at night there. And then in nineteen sixty three, a

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Speaker 3: man from Dayton Tennessee swore to me that he and

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Speaker 3: his brother saw sleigh tracks and possibly even some rainbeer

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Speaker 3: tracks around their house after a visit from Santa. I mean,

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Speaker 3: the list goes on and on. In fact, you know,

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Speaker 3: I even wrote a TV proposal about this phenomenon one time,

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Speaker 3: called I Saw Fanta Clause. So if any big TV

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Speaker 3: producers want to call deact me, I think that would

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Speaker 3: be a great special. But when these kinds of stories

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Speaker 3: come in from adults and they're being serious and they're

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Speaker 3: talking about having these types of encounters, it makes me

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Speaker 3: wonder if this is indeed evidence that the Topa phenomenon

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Speaker 3: is real.

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Speaker 2: What do you think about Santa Claus personally.

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Speaker 3: Well, you know, I actually had to experiment with this myself,

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Speaker 3: because you know, when I was a kid, I had

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Speaker 3: some of those occasions where maybe I heard some jingle

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Speaker 3: bells here and there in the night, and I wasn't

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Speaker 3: sure what I was hearing. But I had a really

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Speaker 3: bizarre experience that was very influential for me. Let's see,

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Speaker 3: this was, well, my wife's family is from Texas, and

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Speaker 3: so years ago, I think it was around twenty fifteen,

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Speaker 3: my wife and I decided to go spend the Christmas

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Speaker 3: season with her mother named Linda and her mother's husband

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Speaker 3: named Dale, and they lived on this big ranch outside

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Speaker 3: of San Antonio, Texas. And so because the ranch was

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Speaker 3: so big, there were several buildings on the property, and

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Speaker 3: we were there for over a month around Christmas time. Well,

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Speaker 3: as you know, a lot of times I'm doing work

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Speaker 3: late at night, and so there were times when I

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Speaker 3: would go out. Maybe I'd get in the truck and

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Speaker 3: drive across the property back of it into the woods

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Speaker 3: where they had this sort of office and workshop that

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Speaker 3: was off to the side, and then I could do

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Speaker 3: interviews at night or whatever when normal people were sleeping.

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Speaker 3: So I would spend time out there pretty regularly in

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Speaker 3: the evening. So it was kind of creepy altogether. And

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Speaker 3: during that stay, one point, Lauren and I we were

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Speaker 3: walking through this shopping mall in San Antonio and we

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Speaker 3: went through some department story and saw this very detailed,

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Speaker 3: elaborate little Santa Claus doll, and I started thinking about

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Speaker 3: this topa phenomenon and talk let me do an experiment.

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Speaker 3: So I bought this doll. And then I brought that

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Speaker 3: doll back when I was staying by myself in that

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Speaker 3: little building on the back of the property at the ranch,

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Speaker 3: and I would just put him at a prominent place,

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Speaker 3: and every once in a while I would sit there

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Speaker 3: for about maybe at least one or two minutes, and

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Speaker 3: I would look at that doll and I would think

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Speaker 3: of it as actually being Santa Claus, and I would

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Speaker 3: talk to it as if it were Santa Claus, and

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Speaker 3: I would tell it what I wanted for Christmas and

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Speaker 3: all this kind of stuff.

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Speaker 1: You would have.

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Speaker 3: Thought I was Balker's probably if you did no otherwise,

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Speaker 3: and you might have been right. But after about three

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Speaker 3: occasions of me doing this, one evening, this was probably

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Speaker 3: about eleven o'clock at night, my wife Lauren and I

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Speaker 3: were standing in the kitchen with her mother, Linda, and

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Speaker 3: obviously it was kind of late, so Dale had already

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Speaker 3: gone to bed, and we were just sort of, you know,

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Speaker 3: making small talk in the kitchen, and all of a

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Speaker 3: sudden Dale comes walking out of his back bedroom and

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Speaker 3: he said, is everybody okay? And we said yeah, why

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Speaker 3: and he said, well, I just got a call from

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Speaker 3: nine to one to one, and dispatch says that they

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Speaker 3: received a call from the building out back on the

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Speaker 3: property now of course, as far as we know, nobody

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Speaker 3: had been in this building, and so he was just

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Speaker 3: satisfied with the fact that we were okay. There was

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Speaker 3: nobody else was supposed to be on the property. So

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Speaker 3: he just told nine one one, I don't know, I

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Speaker 3: can't explain it, and he went back to bed. So,

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Speaker 3: of course, at this point I started thinking, oh my gosh,

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Speaker 3: how could this happen. Did I succeed in creating some

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Speaker 3: kind of a presence out there. Well, I couldn't help myself,

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Speaker 3: even though it was dangerous. I didn't even arm myself.

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Speaker 3: I got in that truck here about eleven thirty twelve

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Speaker 3: o'clock at night by myself, and I drove up this

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Speaker 3: long dirt road to that backside of the property. And

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Speaker 3: when I got there, I didn't see anything that was disturbed.

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Speaker 3: And I walked up and I crept in and I

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Speaker 3: opened the door, and I didn't see anything out of place.

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Speaker 3: I said, Santa, I know it's you. I know you're here,

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Speaker 3: go ahead, do something else. I heard some kind of

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Speaker 3: annoise in one of the rooms that actually I couldn't

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Speaker 3: tell what it was. It almost sounded like an object falling.

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Speaker 3: So at that point I got a little bit of

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Speaker 3: frightened because I thought maybe there was actually somebody who'd

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Speaker 3: broken into that building. So I waited a little bit

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Speaker 3: until I didn't hear anything else that I crept back

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Speaker 3: there and I shined my light and all I saw

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Speaker 3: was couple of books that had fallen over, and they

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Speaker 3: were very close to the doll. So after that, I

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Speaker 3: went back and I said, this is kind of crazy,

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Speaker 3: because I've been doing these experiments to create this tulpa

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Speaker 3: and we get this call from the room with a

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Speaker 3: building that nobody can explain. Well, the rest of the

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Speaker 3: time we were there, nothing happened. But since then, every

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Speaker 3: year around Christmas time, the light on that building blinks

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Speaker 3: on and off at various weird times only around Christmas,

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Speaker 3: and sometimes they actually hear what sounds like the voice

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Speaker 3: of a man, deep voice, often laughing and shattering. And

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Speaker 3: of course when they go there, no one is around.

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Speaker 3: So I think, George, that may have been the closest

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Speaker 3: I've ever come to creating a real Santa Claus tulpa.

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Speaker 2: Do you think Santa Claus is mystical and has the

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Speaker 2: ability to transform or is something physical?

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Speaker 3: Well, you know that's the thing about these tulpas they

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Speaker 3: may be. They it might be tempting to think of

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Speaker 3: them as a non physical thing, because we think of

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Speaker 3: thoughts as often being these non physical, amorphous and transient

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Speaker 3: types of things. But actually there's no real distinctive difference

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Speaker 3: between matter and energy, between physical matter and energy, it's

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Speaker 3: only a matter of the rate at which it's vibrating.

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Speaker 3: So in other words, I think that some of these

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Speaker 3: things that we might consider fantasmal actually do have a

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Speaker 3: physical component as well, And therefore you can't just say, again,

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Speaker 3: these are like some kind of a holographic projection that

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Speaker 3: they don't have a mind. When they manifest, they're very,

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Speaker 3: very real, And you know what. The thing that's kind

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Speaker 3: of spooky is that it's one thing to talk about

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Speaker 3: Santa Claus, but there is also a flip side of this,

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Speaker 3: and I'm talking about the fact that when I was

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Speaker 3: asking people if they had ever seen some some kind

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Speaker 3: of a stand or a reindeer oriented vision like that,

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Speaker 3: sometimes they would say, well, no, But on Christmas Eve

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Speaker 3: I saw something that was very scary and dark. For example,

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Speaker 3: there was a man in New York who said in

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Speaker 3: nineteen seventy that he got up in the middle of

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Speaker 3: the night, he heard something in the living room. He

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Speaker 3: thought that he was going to catch mom and dad

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Speaker 3: leaving some presents. Instead, he walked down and was horrified

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Speaker 3: to find being standing there that looked, he said, very

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Speaker 3: much like the ghost of Christmas Yet to come, you know,

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Speaker 3: the creepy one from Charles Dickens to Christmas Carol. Except

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Speaker 3: this thing had horns, and that instantly reminded me of

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Speaker 3: the anti Santa Claus, which, of course is the Crumpuss,

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Speaker 3: one of the scariest things out there.

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Speaker 2: Why would they develop the crumpus to scare the living

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Speaker 2: daylights out of those kids in those days?

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Speaker 3: Well, you know, crumpus has become quite popular. A few

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Speaker 3: decades ago, most people in our country didn't even really

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Speaker 3: know much about crumpus. The crumpus has been around almost

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Speaker 3: as long as Santa Claus, some say even longer, and

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Speaker 3: in German crumpus means claw, and in Central and Eastern

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Speaker 3: Europe and these sort of alpine regions and their folklore,

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Speaker 3: the crumpus is this tall, shaggy horned, bipedal sort of beasts,

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Speaker 3: anthropomorphic with long gripping fangs and wild, fiery, frightening eyes,

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Speaker 3: and the idea is that you know, when your kids

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Speaker 3: are good, Santa Claus comes in and he gives them

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Speaker 3: gifts and treats, but if they're bad, well then the

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Speaker 3: Crumpus will visit instead. He comes in dragging chains and

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Speaker 3: he will work his way into the town and essentially

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Speaker 3: he will find the children. In some cases he'll beat

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Speaker 3: up the parents and then drag the children off to

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Speaker 3: his cave where he may even eat them. So it's

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Speaker 3: a pretty dramatic punishment. And he runs around often with

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Speaker 3: different types of whips and rods. And in fact, I

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Speaker 3: have not been in certain areas of Europe, especially around Germany,

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Speaker 3: during Christmas time, but I have heard it be very

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Speaker 3: intimidating in some of these little towns because they have

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Speaker 3: some of these traditional parades that they call the Crumpus

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Speaker 3: Loss or Crumpus Run, and there are young men who'll

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Speaker 3: just dress up as Crumpus and they will storm these

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Speaker 3: little towns and villages, and I'm sure they've had quite

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Speaker 3: a bit of ale to drink, and they will just

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Speaker 3: go through sort of terrorizing the town, and a lot

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Speaker 3: of the residents will will leave town as a matter

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Speaker 3: of fact, on these nights when when the Crumpus run

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Speaker 3: as popular, and so I suppose you can't have one

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Speaker 3: without the other. It's one of those things that you know,

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Speaker 3: if you've got the good guy who's going to give

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Speaker 3: you the carrot, well the Crumpus is there to give

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Speaker 3: you the stick. And I must say that you know

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Speaker 3: whether or not we can consider these real spiritual entities

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Speaker 3: that are coming here from some other dimension, at very least,

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Speaker 3: you know, they're both certainly popular enough. They've been around

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Speaker 3: long enough that I think it's easy to understand why

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Speaker 3: these could be externalized as some kinds of holiday tulpus.

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Speaker 2: Have you ever heard stories of Crumpus hurting people?

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Speaker 3: You know, nothing that I've verified now. Of course, if

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Speaker 3: you look back historically, there are all kinds of legends

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Speaker 3: about Crumpus literally kidnapping children, children disappearing around Christmas time.

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Speaker 3: But you know, as far as anything that has been

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Speaker 3: reported directly to me, only they've been very frightened. Now.

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Speaker 3: Of course, the exception of that would be there was

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Speaker 3: one man who also said that he hadn't experienced It

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Speaker 3: wasn't on Christmas Eve, but it was close to Christmas,

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Speaker 3: and this was somewhere in Oregon, and he said that

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Speaker 3: he woke up at night and that there was a dark,

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Speaker 3: beastly form that was clawing him and he was screaming.

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Speaker 3: Of course he at this time he was a teenager,

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Speaker 3: but he hit him to the sheet and then finally

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Speaker 3: he ran away and the whole household woke up and

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Speaker 3: they said, you know, you're just having a bad dream.

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Speaker 3: And then of course he looks down and he has

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Speaker 3: claw marks all over him. So we do have these

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Speaker 3: kinds of stories about these encounters with dark entities around

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Speaker 3: Christmas time. And you know, it makes me wonder if

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Speaker 3: you know, you hate to bring this up, but you know,

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Speaker 3: as much joy as there is around Christmas time, there

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Speaker 3: are a lot of people who claim that it makes

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Speaker 3: them very depressed. You know, we hear story it's about

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Speaker 3: people feeling uh, you know, more suicidal, and I don't

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Speaker 3: I don't have the statistics about that, but uh, there

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Speaker 3: is unfortunately a dark component that comes with this, and

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Speaker 3: maybe that you know, the cruppers has something to do

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Speaker 3: with it.

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