1
00:00:04,200 --> 00:00:07,760
Speaker 1: Welcome, Welcome, Welcome to the Bob Left Sets podcast. My

2
00:00:07,880 --> 00:00:11,639
Speaker 1: guest this week is Chris Zeru, the manager of Logic

3
00:00:11,800 --> 00:00:14,240
Speaker 1: and so much more so. I was at a meeting

4
00:00:14,280 --> 00:00:17,760
Speaker 1: at the Soho House last August and I got up

5
00:00:17,800 --> 00:00:19,800
Speaker 1: to go to the bathroom and these guys Shanghai mean

6
00:00:19,840 --> 00:00:21,960
Speaker 1: they knew who I was. It's always great to be recognized,

7
00:00:22,200 --> 00:00:23,400
Speaker 1: and they said, oh, we want to talk to you,

8
00:00:23,400 --> 00:00:24,520
Speaker 1: want to talk to you. So I was done with

9
00:00:24,600 --> 00:00:27,360
Speaker 1: my meeting. I sat down with these guys, Chris and

10
00:00:27,800 --> 00:00:29,520
Speaker 1: one of the guys who worked with him, and they

11
00:00:29,600 --> 00:00:32,760
Speaker 1: told me the story of managing Logic and they all said,

12
00:00:32,800 --> 00:00:34,880
Speaker 1: you gotta watch the vm A. Something's really gonna happen

13
00:00:34,880 --> 00:00:37,080
Speaker 1: on the vm A s And they were right, Chris,

14
00:00:37,120 --> 00:00:40,760
Speaker 1: how old are you? And you really had quite a career.

15
00:00:40,800 --> 00:00:43,720
Speaker 1: But let's go from the beginning. So you're from Long Island,

16
00:00:43,840 --> 00:00:47,080
Speaker 1: Long Island, New York guests. Okay, what town exactly? Garden City,

17
00:00:47,200 --> 00:00:52,120
Speaker 1: Garden City, Garden you grow up? Are you interested in music? Very?

18
00:00:52,320 --> 00:00:55,279
Speaker 1: I guess when I started figuring out my identity right

19
00:00:55,280 --> 00:00:57,880
Speaker 1: as an Adams became very interested in music. I think

20
00:00:57,880 --> 00:01:00,480
Speaker 1: before that I don't have much much memory of of

21
00:01:00,560 --> 00:01:02,920
Speaker 1: being more of a music fan than the average person.

22
00:01:03,320 --> 00:01:06,399
Speaker 1: But definitely as I got older, right, I think I would.

23
00:01:06,440 --> 00:01:08,000
Speaker 1: I would just dive in a little bit more. If

24
00:01:08,040 --> 00:01:10,520
Speaker 1: I liked an artists or a band, I would use

25
00:01:10,520 --> 00:01:12,280
Speaker 1: the Internet and try and find out as much as

26
00:01:12,319 --> 00:01:15,760
Speaker 1: I possibly could about that particular artist. Well, that's interesting

27
00:01:15,840 --> 00:01:19,319
Speaker 1: because being twenty eight, you grew up in the napster era. Yes,

28
00:01:19,440 --> 00:01:22,800
Speaker 1: you remember using Napster. We're not with the police, are

29
00:01:22,840 --> 00:01:25,039
Speaker 1: not here? I use naps I I do remember using

30
00:01:25,120 --> 00:01:29,080
Speaker 1: Napster heavily, heavilyly, okay. And did you ever buy CDs

31
00:01:29,240 --> 00:01:31,240
Speaker 1: all the time? Yeah? I used to go to the

32
00:01:31,280 --> 00:01:33,680
Speaker 1: city store. There's a you know, Pete, I don't even

33
00:01:33,680 --> 00:01:35,600
Speaker 1: remember the name of the city store. There's a pizza

34
00:01:35,600 --> 00:01:38,360
Speaker 1: place that I would go to Friday nights with my

35
00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:41,480
Speaker 1: parents and brothers and sisters and record store right next door,

36
00:01:41,520 --> 00:01:43,920
Speaker 1: and I would spend hours there. So okay. And there

37
00:01:43,920 --> 00:01:45,919
Speaker 1: are how many kids in your family? I'm one of six?

38
00:01:46,040 --> 00:01:47,760
Speaker 1: One of six? And where are you in the hierarchy?

39
00:01:47,840 --> 00:01:50,280
Speaker 1: Second oldest, second oldest? And your father did what for

40
00:01:50,320 --> 00:01:52,560
Speaker 1: a living? He worked in I t his whole life,

41
00:01:52,600 --> 00:01:55,440
Speaker 1: still does Okay? And how far from New York City.

42
00:01:55,480 --> 00:01:58,040
Speaker 1: Were you about a thirty five minute trip on the

43
00:01:58,080 --> 00:02:00,760
Speaker 1: Long Island Railroad and did you go all time? And

44
00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:03,440
Speaker 1: what would you do in the city. I mean, I'd

45
00:02:03,440 --> 00:02:05,320
Speaker 1: go when when I was old enough to go with friends. Right,

46
00:02:05,360 --> 00:02:09,040
Speaker 1: you just go to go school, go to the pinball place.

47
00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:11,320
Speaker 1: That's a good look at the musical instrument at mann

48
00:02:11,320 --> 00:02:13,280
Speaker 1: He's the greatest city in the world. We'd go as

49
00:02:13,280 --> 00:02:15,960
Speaker 1: a family around Christmas time. It's tradition. We still do it.

50
00:02:16,120 --> 00:02:17,600
Speaker 1: And then and then as I and I am again,

51
00:02:17,600 --> 00:02:19,400
Speaker 1: I'm skipping around. As I got into the business, it

52
00:02:19,440 --> 00:02:22,240
Speaker 1: was super helpful for me. I think a lot of

53
00:02:22,840 --> 00:02:26,400
Speaker 1: it was serendipity and luck right being being born in

54
00:02:26,639 --> 00:02:28,880
Speaker 1: New York in Long Island, right when I decide, okays

55
00:02:28,919 --> 00:02:30,400
Speaker 1: what I'm gonna do. Them get in the music business.

56
00:02:31,000 --> 00:02:33,360
Speaker 1: Half of the major labels, if not more, their headquarters

57
00:02:33,360 --> 00:02:35,200
Speaker 1: are based in Manhattan, So I'd constantly going in for

58
00:02:35,280 --> 00:02:37,560
Speaker 1: meetings and and things like that. Yeah, people say, you know,

59
00:02:37,680 --> 00:02:40,079
Speaker 1: you can do it from anywhere now, but face to

60
00:02:40,160 --> 00:02:42,680
Speaker 1: face does make a difference, big difference, I do believe.

61
00:02:42,680 --> 00:02:44,720
Speaker 1: Because of the Internet, right, you can do it from anywhere,

62
00:02:44,760 --> 00:02:47,760
Speaker 1: but face to face that that that personal connection when

63
00:02:47,760 --> 00:02:50,440
Speaker 1: somebody goes along way. Okay, so you're in the high school,

64
00:02:50,760 --> 00:02:53,600
Speaker 1: when do you decide, hey, this is something I might

65
00:02:53,639 --> 00:02:55,560
Speaker 1: want to make a career aut them. Not not in

66
00:02:55,600 --> 00:02:57,720
Speaker 1: high school, it was. It was definitely later, I think

67
00:02:58,320 --> 00:03:00,799
Speaker 1: my again, at a less since, when you start trying

68
00:03:00,800 --> 00:03:03,280
Speaker 1: to figure out your identity or what you're passionate about.

69
00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:06,200
Speaker 1: For me, it was it was sports, specifically soccer. That

70
00:03:06,280 --> 00:03:09,880
Speaker 1: was my main focus majority of of my teenage years.

71
00:03:09,880 --> 00:03:12,440
Speaker 1: And um, I guess I've always been a little bit

72
00:03:12,600 --> 00:03:16,400
Speaker 1: ambitious and and um very set some audacious goals. I

73
00:03:16,720 --> 00:03:19,640
Speaker 1: wanted to be a professional soccer player. Um that was

74
00:03:19,960 --> 00:03:22,239
Speaker 1: and I took it very seriously. I kind of dedicated

75
00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:24,840
Speaker 1: my life to it. And for me, it was okay,

76
00:03:24,840 --> 00:03:26,760
Speaker 1: if I played Division one, that's the first step of

77
00:03:26,760 --> 00:03:31,919
Speaker 1: getting there. And so so from probably sophomore year in

78
00:03:32,280 --> 00:03:35,680
Speaker 1: high school, I really dedicated my life and time to

79
00:03:35,680 --> 00:03:39,640
Speaker 1: to trying to become a professional soccer player and getting

80
00:03:39,680 --> 00:03:42,880
Speaker 1: a Division one scholarship as my first step, and and um,

81
00:03:42,920 --> 00:03:47,600
Speaker 1: that was my focus. I did that. I jumped around

82
00:03:47,600 --> 00:03:49,200
Speaker 1: a little bit, I played my freshman year, I went

83
00:03:49,240 --> 00:03:52,680
Speaker 1: to Kinnisius College in Buffalo, didn't love Buffalo, didn't have

84
00:03:52,760 --> 00:03:55,280
Speaker 1: the greatest experience with with the coach there, and I

85
00:03:55,320 --> 00:03:59,440
Speaker 1: think that was a theme throughout my short college career.

86
00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:03,560
Speaker 1: Um it kind of started to to take my passion

87
00:04:03,600 --> 00:04:05,720
Speaker 1: away for the sporting I think it ruined it for

88
00:04:05,760 --> 00:04:08,480
Speaker 1: me a little bit. So, So at this late date,

89
00:04:08,880 --> 00:04:11,640
Speaker 1: do you think you have the ability to go all

90
00:04:11,720 --> 00:04:15,840
Speaker 1: the way? No? And and that's also something that I realized, right,

91
00:04:15,840 --> 00:04:18,240
Speaker 1: I think I'm very fortunate to be very self aware.

92
00:04:18,800 --> 00:04:22,080
Speaker 1: And you know, shortly after playing, you know, you start

93
00:04:22,120 --> 00:04:23,359
Speaker 1: with what I would do is I would look at

94
00:04:23,440 --> 00:04:26,120
Speaker 1: seniors who who are definitely better than me. They would graduate,

95
00:04:26,160 --> 00:04:28,960
Speaker 1: and I'd watch them, right, and and that social media

96
00:04:29,040 --> 00:04:30,360
Speaker 1: is a beautiful thing, and I'd keep in touch with

97
00:04:30,400 --> 00:04:32,080
Speaker 1: these guys a lot of them, and they would go

98
00:04:32,160 --> 00:04:34,040
Speaker 1: and kind of jump around and try to play a

99
00:04:34,120 --> 00:04:38,479
Speaker 1: much lower level professional teams and not really have much luck.

100
00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:41,080
Speaker 1: And I'm like, holy shit, right, and I got okay,

101
00:04:41,120 --> 00:04:42,960
Speaker 1: I got two more years or three more years to

102
00:04:43,279 --> 00:04:45,640
Speaker 1: get as good as he was, and he's not even

103
00:04:45,680 --> 00:04:48,039
Speaker 1: So it was it was that played a big role

104
00:04:48,040 --> 00:04:50,880
Speaker 1: in me deciding to not play anymore. Was you know what,

105
00:04:50,960 --> 00:04:53,000
Speaker 1: I don't think I'm good enough. Okay, so you're one

106
00:04:53,080 --> 00:04:55,120
Speaker 1: year in Knician. Then where'd you go from? I did

107
00:04:55,200 --> 00:04:57,440
Speaker 1: one semester there. I played the first semester I transferred.

108
00:04:57,520 --> 00:05:00,360
Speaker 1: There was a college at Delphi University on Long Island.

109
00:05:00,640 --> 00:05:02,919
Speaker 1: The coach is very interested. That's where Gary de Labatte

110
00:05:03,040 --> 00:05:04,800
Speaker 1: went from this Howard Church show. That's why I hear

111
00:05:04,839 --> 00:05:07,400
Speaker 1: about it all the time. And and uh, there was

112
00:05:07,400 --> 00:05:09,120
Speaker 1: a coach there that was very interested in me. But

113
00:05:09,160 --> 00:05:11,400
Speaker 1: I chose to go to Kinnisius. So I rang them

114
00:05:11,440 --> 00:05:13,080
Speaker 1: over over the holiday. I was like, listen, you know,

115
00:05:13,120 --> 00:05:15,400
Speaker 1: I'm thinking about transferring. I didn't want to take time off.

116
00:05:15,400 --> 00:05:17,800
Speaker 1: I wanted to find a team in place, because at

117
00:05:17,839 --> 00:05:19,680
Speaker 1: Division one level in the in the off season, right

118
00:05:19,720 --> 00:05:23,039
Speaker 1: and I guess was spring semester. Um, you play, you

119
00:05:23,080 --> 00:05:24,840
Speaker 1: play five days a week, and then that's how it goes.

120
00:05:24,839 --> 00:05:26,800
Speaker 1: So I rang him. He was like, listen, you could

121
00:05:26,800 --> 00:05:28,240
Speaker 1: walk on the team right now. So I did that.

122
00:05:28,279 --> 00:05:31,400
Speaker 1: I transferred there. I played there in my sophomore year. Um,

123
00:05:31,520 --> 00:05:34,440
Speaker 1: and that's when I kind of decided, you know what,

124
00:05:34,440 --> 00:05:36,320
Speaker 1: I'm just not going to do this anymore. And did

125
00:05:36,320 --> 00:05:38,840
Speaker 1: you literally stop playing? Literally stop playing? And you play

126
00:05:38,960 --> 00:05:41,640
Speaker 1: it all in pick up games. Now I wish I did.

127
00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:44,320
Speaker 1: I I don't have the time. Um, I use as

128
00:05:44,320 --> 00:05:46,400
Speaker 1: an excuse probably, but there's a lot of leagues you

129
00:05:46,440 --> 00:05:49,159
Speaker 1: can play him, but I'm in the office until until Okay,

130
00:05:49,160 --> 00:05:54,120
Speaker 1: so you drop out of uh playing American football, I

131
00:05:54,160 --> 00:05:58,880
Speaker 1: mean European football soccer. And if you only drop out

132
00:05:58,920 --> 00:06:01,160
Speaker 1: because you don't think you're gonna goodenough, not because you've

133
00:06:01,160 --> 00:06:03,600
Speaker 1: been motivated by the music thing or anything. No, no, no,

134
00:06:03,680 --> 00:06:05,560
Speaker 1: it was it was a combination of of that, right,

135
00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:08,560
Speaker 1: I think, you know, recognizing that and saying, you know what,

136
00:06:08,880 --> 00:06:10,520
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna, I'm just gonna kind of stop, and

137
00:06:10,560 --> 00:06:13,760
Speaker 1: then having some some bad experiences with coaches who really

138
00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:17,920
Speaker 1: really ruined my love of the game a little bit

139
00:06:18,040 --> 00:06:23,640
Speaker 1: at um, you know, not not just not being great people,

140
00:06:23,839 --> 00:06:27,279
Speaker 1: I think ultimately is what did it for me, and um,

141
00:06:27,320 --> 00:06:29,680
Speaker 1: you know, not making it fun anymore. I I really

142
00:06:29,720 --> 00:06:33,600
Speaker 1: love that sport. Um, it was amazing, smad love competing.

143
00:06:33,920 --> 00:06:37,080
Speaker 1: I'm very competitive and it was now lit for me

144
00:06:37,360 --> 00:06:39,480
Speaker 1: right to be competitive and do that, and especially I

145
00:06:39,560 --> 00:06:41,839
Speaker 1: was trying to do it at the highest level. But yeah,

146
00:06:41,880 --> 00:06:44,800
Speaker 1: I don't think I truly do think my experiences with

147
00:06:45,240 --> 00:06:48,000
Speaker 1: some bad coaches at that level really ruined it for me,

148
00:06:48,080 --> 00:06:50,360
Speaker 1: and and being a little bit you know what, I

149
00:06:50,640 --> 00:06:52,800
Speaker 1: just don't think I'm quite good enough. Um, it was

150
00:06:52,839 --> 00:06:54,800
Speaker 1: a combination of all of that. Well, I have to ask,

151
00:06:54,839 --> 00:06:57,880
Speaker 1: because you're of the demo, what do you see going

152
00:06:58,000 --> 00:07:01,279
Speaker 1: forward visa the European foot well in American football in

153
00:07:01,279 --> 00:07:04,159
Speaker 1: the United States? I think, and again very opinionated, but

154
00:07:04,200 --> 00:07:08,160
Speaker 1: I think this is your chance. Don't hold back. Now,

155
00:07:08,360 --> 00:07:12,440
Speaker 1: that's a good question. I think in thirty years it's

156
00:07:12,440 --> 00:07:14,960
Speaker 1: gonna be the biggest sport in America. Right, and you

157
00:07:14,960 --> 00:07:19,360
Speaker 1: think American football survives, I do not. I'm with you,

158
00:07:19,720 --> 00:07:23,000
Speaker 1: I do not. I just think because of of the

159
00:07:23,000 --> 00:07:27,160
Speaker 1: the now is, people are recognizing the dangers of playing

160
00:07:27,200 --> 00:07:30,000
Speaker 1: that sport. I think, and again, it takes time. It

161
00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:32,960
Speaker 1: takes you years, right, I think people are gonna start.

162
00:07:33,000 --> 00:07:35,120
Speaker 1: I think you're gonna see an up swing back into baseball.

163
00:07:35,400 --> 00:07:38,040
Speaker 1: It's where the best athletes go. I think that those

164
00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:42,520
Speaker 1: sports succeed, right. And I think because maybe soccer in

165
00:07:42,520 --> 00:07:45,520
Speaker 1: this country isn't as sexy. I think when when very

166
00:07:45,520 --> 00:07:47,800
Speaker 1: good athletes get to a certain age, you generally drop

167
00:07:47,960 --> 00:07:52,160
Speaker 1: soccer and you focus on probably American football and and

168
00:07:52,160 --> 00:07:55,520
Speaker 1: and maybe basketball, right, um, just because I think that's

169
00:07:55,640 --> 00:07:58,320
Speaker 1: it's not a sexy to play soccer. Everyone everyone plays

170
00:07:58,320 --> 00:08:02,520
Speaker 1: it super young, right, every but then you just drop it. Now,

171
00:08:02,560 --> 00:08:06,320
Speaker 1: if you're having the best athletes literally in the country

172
00:08:06,400 --> 00:08:09,000
Speaker 1: deciding to play soccer, you're going to see that change.

173
00:08:09,000 --> 00:08:11,280
Speaker 1: I think it needs the perfect storm, in my opinion,

174
00:08:11,320 --> 00:08:13,840
Speaker 1: what it's going to take to really because it happens

175
00:08:13,840 --> 00:08:16,760
Speaker 1: every every four years, right, everybody gets World Cup fever, right,

176
00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:19,480
Speaker 1: And for me, I think in order for the stick

177
00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:23,960
Speaker 1: beyond just that summer, you need a superstar athlete, an

178
00:08:23,960 --> 00:08:27,679
Speaker 1: American kid, an American player who is a is a

179
00:08:27,720 --> 00:08:30,640
Speaker 1: true world class player, not just in the US but

180
00:08:30,760 --> 00:08:34,360
Speaker 1: in the world, and combining with a a big US

181
00:08:34,400 --> 00:08:37,040
Speaker 1: soccer run in the World Cup, I think at that moment,

182
00:08:37,080 --> 00:08:39,640
Speaker 1: the perfect storm, it'll it'll it'll stay. Okay, so you're

183
00:08:39,640 --> 00:08:43,320
Speaker 1: in the Delphi, you stop playing soccer, and then what

184
00:08:44,120 --> 00:08:49,359
Speaker 1: and then I it wasn't initially stopped dead. I debated,

185
00:08:49,760 --> 00:08:51,720
Speaker 1: I said, you know what, maybe I'll play Division two.

186
00:08:52,080 --> 00:08:55,480
Speaker 1: So I immediately transferred to another. I went to four,

187
00:08:55,559 --> 00:08:58,000
Speaker 1: I went to four different colleges, and you did graduate?

188
00:08:58,160 --> 00:09:00,960
Speaker 1: I did I graduate from a Delphi. I went back. Um,

189
00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:05,800
Speaker 1: but just you know, generally speaking, going from community community,

190
00:09:06,240 --> 00:09:07,640
Speaker 1: you can start off with a whole new set of

191
00:09:07,640 --> 00:09:09,640
Speaker 1: people have already been there for a while. Are you

192
00:09:09,679 --> 00:09:12,040
Speaker 1: the type of person who can fit in anywhere? Yeah,

193
00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:13,720
Speaker 1: that's never been too much of an issue for me.

194
00:09:13,760 --> 00:09:16,000
Speaker 1: I was also at that point when I transferred and

195
00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:17,640
Speaker 1: went back to Long On it was all local, so

196
00:09:17,679 --> 00:09:19,760
Speaker 1: it's a little different. I had a bunch of really

197
00:09:19,800 --> 00:09:21,520
Speaker 1: really good friends that I grew up with for at

198
00:09:21,559 --> 00:09:25,040
Speaker 1: that point, what fifteen years, seventeen years, so I wasn't

199
00:09:25,080 --> 00:09:29,280
Speaker 1: as um needing a community at at whatever school I

200
00:09:29,320 --> 00:09:31,520
Speaker 1: was at. I had my You went from all Aware

201
00:09:31,760 --> 00:09:35,320
Speaker 1: CW Post, which is another school Long On division school program.

202
00:09:35,320 --> 00:09:37,560
Speaker 1: They're very good, and I transferred there on me because

203
00:09:37,559 --> 00:09:38,800
Speaker 1: I was like, you know, what if I decided to

204
00:09:38,840 --> 00:09:42,000
Speaker 1: play and then I ultimately decided not to. I think

205
00:09:42,040 --> 00:09:45,000
Speaker 1: I jumped at that point back to community college because

206
00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:46,600
Speaker 1: I'm like, all right, am I going to transfer out

207
00:09:46,600 --> 00:09:49,240
Speaker 1: of Long Island and then just you know, forget playing

208
00:09:49,280 --> 00:09:52,520
Speaker 1: and go somewhere else, maybe to a bigger school. Um.

209
00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:55,200
Speaker 1: And then again at that time, I think I started

210
00:09:55,520 --> 00:09:59,160
Speaker 1: to uh debate the idea of of of dabbling as

211
00:09:59,200 --> 00:10:02,120
Speaker 1: a career in music. Okay, so tell us about your inkling,

212
00:10:02,360 --> 00:10:06,080
Speaker 1: how you decide you might do that. It was, you know,

213
00:10:06,120 --> 00:10:08,280
Speaker 1: that was a weird time in my life. I think

214
00:10:08,280 --> 00:10:11,360
Speaker 1: it was nineteen where you know, I devoted how many

215
00:10:11,360 --> 00:10:12,840
Speaker 1: of her years it was to the sport, and it

216
00:10:12,880 --> 00:10:15,120
Speaker 1: was just I'm not doing it anymore. So I kind

217
00:10:15,120 --> 00:10:16,480
Speaker 1: of had to figure out what I wanted to do.

218
00:10:17,080 --> 00:10:19,880
Speaker 1: And I remember just asking myself kind of kind of

219
00:10:20,000 --> 00:10:22,880
Speaker 1: self talk a little bit, you know what, what do

220
00:10:22,960 --> 00:10:24,559
Speaker 1: I love as much as the sport of soccers? I

221
00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:26,439
Speaker 1: wanted to fill that void with something that was truly

222
00:10:26,440 --> 00:10:28,880
Speaker 1: passionate about. And the only thing I could answer that

223
00:10:28,920 --> 00:10:32,440
Speaker 1: with was music, right, And that sounds silly because everybody

224
00:10:32,480 --> 00:10:35,640
Speaker 1: loves music, but I think I again, looking back, I

225
00:10:36,480 --> 00:10:39,600
Speaker 1: was definitely more passionate, I think than the average person.

226
00:10:40,160 --> 00:10:42,680
Speaker 1: So I was just like, okay, cool, I'm gonna try.

227
00:10:42,679 --> 00:10:44,839
Speaker 1: I'm gonna figure it out. I don't think I was

228
00:10:44,880 --> 00:10:47,200
Speaker 1: somebody who wanted to just be a normal college kid.

229
00:10:47,320 --> 00:10:51,240
Speaker 1: I needed something to work on or work towards at least,

230
00:10:51,600 --> 00:10:54,960
Speaker 1: So for me, that's how kind of I stumbled into music. Okay,

231
00:10:55,000 --> 00:10:57,360
Speaker 1: And did you know what role you wanted to play

232
00:10:57,360 --> 00:10:59,840
Speaker 1: in music. I didn't. I didn't I started. So then

233
00:10:59,840 --> 00:11:02,040
Speaker 1: I when I kind of figured that out, I would

234
00:11:02,040 --> 00:11:03,760
Speaker 1: literally just go to Barnes and Noble, right, and I

235
00:11:03,760 --> 00:11:05,199
Speaker 1: would go to the music section and just try and

236
00:11:05,280 --> 00:11:09,040
Speaker 1: read music business books and just I knew nothing nothing.

237
00:11:09,160 --> 00:11:13,559
Speaker 1: So to me, I think I stumbled upon artist management

238
00:11:13,880 --> 00:11:15,480
Speaker 1: because I was like, all right, this has the lowest

239
00:11:15,480 --> 00:11:17,160
Speaker 1: barrier to entry. I think, if you can do it

240
00:11:17,200 --> 00:11:21,720
Speaker 1: yourself and license to starve. But that's why the buried

241
00:11:21,840 --> 00:11:24,280
Speaker 1: entry is so low, absolutely because I didn't know. I

242
00:11:24,320 --> 00:11:26,719
Speaker 1: had no relationships in the business. I had no connections,

243
00:11:26,760 --> 00:11:28,560
Speaker 1: So that was me. I was like, listen, Okay, if

244
00:11:28,600 --> 00:11:30,319
Speaker 1: I do this myself, if I find an artist and

245
00:11:30,320 --> 00:11:33,079
Speaker 1: I kind of build something, that's that's my my my

246
00:11:33,200 --> 00:11:35,439
Speaker 1: entry into the business. So I think that's how I

247
00:11:35,440 --> 00:11:38,080
Speaker 1: truly stumbled upon arts management. Okay, what was the next step?

248
00:11:38,120 --> 00:11:40,880
Speaker 1: The next step is finding talent, which is the hardest

249
00:11:40,880 --> 00:11:43,200
Speaker 1: thing to do with the greatest manager, but without hit

250
00:11:43,240 --> 00:11:45,320
Speaker 1: act forget it correct, you know. And this goes back

251
00:11:45,320 --> 00:11:48,760
Speaker 1: to my passion I think throughout and what I realized

252
00:11:48,800 --> 00:11:51,840
Speaker 1: looking back now, there was a lot of parallels between

253
00:11:52,080 --> 00:11:54,800
Speaker 1: my my love of soccer and my love of music.

254
00:11:55,000 --> 00:11:57,480
Speaker 1: I would train a lot, and often by myself when

255
00:11:57,520 --> 00:11:59,880
Speaker 1: I'm not at practice, right, and I would always have

256
00:12:00,080 --> 00:12:01,679
Speaker 1: music with me and when I that's just they went

257
00:12:01,760 --> 00:12:04,079
Speaker 1: hand in hand. Um. So with that said, I would

258
00:12:04,280 --> 00:12:07,280
Speaker 1: find myself on the internet on different music blogs and

259
00:12:07,280 --> 00:12:10,040
Speaker 1: and just looking at up and coming artists. So I

260
00:12:10,080 --> 00:12:12,680
Speaker 1: already knew that world a little bit just from being

261
00:12:12,679 --> 00:12:15,040
Speaker 1: a fan, right, and and then so I said, okay,

262
00:12:15,080 --> 00:12:16,280
Speaker 1: I need to find artists. I would just go to

263
00:12:16,280 --> 00:12:19,280
Speaker 1: those same websites and blogs and look for talent. Okay,

264
00:12:19,320 --> 00:12:21,600
Speaker 1: how much time did you spend doing that? Probably a

265
00:12:21,679 --> 00:12:24,720
Speaker 1: ridiculous amount of time, like hours a day. Yeah, I

266
00:12:24,760 --> 00:12:27,240
Speaker 1: think so all my free time, basically, that's what And

267
00:12:27,240 --> 00:12:29,880
Speaker 1: your parents said, what about this? You know they were

268
00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:31,840
Speaker 1: My parents are greatest people in the world. They they

269
00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:33,760
Speaker 1: I truly believe. If I was at this time, I

270
00:12:33,760 --> 00:12:36,319
Speaker 1: was again nineteen, probably almost twenty years old, I think

271
00:12:36,360 --> 00:12:38,520
Speaker 1: if I, you know, transition my life the way I did,

272
00:12:38,559 --> 00:12:40,680
Speaker 1: I you know, stop playing soccer and I said, hey,

273
00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:42,640
Speaker 1: I want to be an astronaut. They were like great

274
00:12:43,000 --> 00:12:46,280
Speaker 1: rock out so they financially helpful, not no, not at all,

275
00:12:46,640 --> 00:12:49,000
Speaker 1: you know they they I don't think they could have

276
00:12:49,080 --> 00:12:51,920
Speaker 1: been and um, you know they want to and still

277
00:12:51,960 --> 00:12:53,559
Speaker 1: work ethic in me and I think they did that.

278
00:12:53,840 --> 00:12:55,800
Speaker 1: I was probably the only kid at Division one soccer

279
00:12:55,840 --> 00:12:58,200
Speaker 1: team who had to have a job. My dad. My

280
00:12:58,320 --> 00:13:00,600
Speaker 1: dad was very adamant about me working, said, what were

281
00:13:00,600 --> 00:13:03,600
Speaker 1: you doing, Kenisius? I worked at the gym. I signed

282
00:13:03,600 --> 00:13:05,400
Speaker 1: people in right, it was a work study. What do

283
00:13:05,440 --> 00:13:06,880
Speaker 1: you want to call it? But yeah, he was like, listen,

284
00:13:06,880 --> 00:13:09,000
Speaker 1: you need to, you know, fund your life, and you

285
00:13:09,040 --> 00:13:10,319
Speaker 1: have to have a job. I was like, Dad, you know,

286
00:13:10,360 --> 00:13:12,720
Speaker 1: I'm Division one soccer is a full time job and

287
00:13:12,760 --> 00:13:14,600
Speaker 1: being a full time student. He's like, I don't give

288
00:13:14,600 --> 00:13:19,000
Speaker 1: a ship. So okay, So now you have this epiphany

289
00:13:19,040 --> 00:13:21,600
Speaker 1: when you're in community college. I think, I think that's

290
00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:24,720
Speaker 1: what it was. Are you still working at the time. Yes.

291
00:13:24,760 --> 00:13:26,880
Speaker 1: I worked in retail, worked in the mall. There was

292
00:13:26,920 --> 00:13:31,160
Speaker 1: a store called Rule, which was I guess a a

293
00:13:31,360 --> 00:13:34,880
Speaker 1: more adult version of Ambercrombie and Fitch is where I worked. Okay,

294
00:13:35,040 --> 00:13:36,920
Speaker 1: and you're living at home. I'm living at home and

295
00:13:37,040 --> 00:13:39,880
Speaker 1: you're surfing the next do you start contacting these acts?

296
00:13:39,880 --> 00:13:42,360
Speaker 1: I did? And how did that turn out? I mean good?

297
00:13:42,400 --> 00:13:44,880
Speaker 1: I would try and start a dialogue in a relationship

298
00:13:44,920 --> 00:13:46,680
Speaker 1: with them a little bit. You would say, what, I'm

299
00:13:46,720 --> 00:13:50,559
Speaker 1: nobody from nowhere, come work with me exactly literally, and

300
00:13:50,559 --> 00:13:52,240
Speaker 1: and a lot of it was Hey, let me show

301
00:13:52,320 --> 00:13:53,839
Speaker 1: you what I think I can do for you, and

302
00:13:53,880 --> 00:13:56,080
Speaker 1: I'll prove myself to you. Right. I had no I

303
00:13:56,120 --> 00:13:58,960
Speaker 1: had no experience, I had no resume, and that all

304
00:13:58,960 --> 00:14:01,040
Speaker 1: it was as just trying to say, hey, listen, you know,

305
00:14:01,280 --> 00:14:05,360
Speaker 1: so what happened? Um? I started working with an artist

306
00:14:05,600 --> 00:14:08,640
Speaker 1: and everything was going well. I've learned the artist was weird.

307
00:14:08,679 --> 00:14:10,360
Speaker 1: You were on the island. The artist was weird. The

308
00:14:10,400 --> 00:14:12,880
Speaker 1: first artist I ever worked with was was an artist

309
00:14:12,880 --> 00:14:15,320
Speaker 1: by the name of Jazz Cardier. He was from Toronto.

310
00:14:16,120 --> 00:14:19,600
Speaker 1: Came across amount a website, reached out to him. Um, Yes,

311
00:14:19,680 --> 00:14:22,560
Speaker 1: started a relationship, started working together. UM. And it was

312
00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:25,000
Speaker 1: cool for me because you learned as you go, right, Um,

313
00:14:25,160 --> 00:14:29,640
Speaker 1: started working with him. Everything went well. I think shortly

314
00:14:29,680 --> 00:14:32,320
Speaker 1: after that we we decided to to part way is

315
00:14:32,320 --> 00:14:35,200
Speaker 1: probably a couple of months in Um. But what did

316
00:14:35,240 --> 00:14:38,240
Speaker 1: you do for him? Uh? Kind of everything, right, I

317
00:14:38,240 --> 00:14:41,960
Speaker 1: mean what did you achieve? Uh? My big thing was

318
00:14:41,960 --> 00:14:45,880
Speaker 1: was finding attention wherever eyeballs and ears were That's where

319
00:14:45,880 --> 00:14:48,120
Speaker 1: I wanted my artists obey. To this day that that

320
00:14:48,160 --> 00:14:51,320
Speaker 1: hasn't changed. Um And I think I understood the internet

321
00:14:51,400 --> 00:14:55,040
Speaker 1: really well, probably just from being a fan of it

322
00:14:55,080 --> 00:14:58,920
Speaker 1: and watching what was happening. I'd watched different artists have

323
00:14:59,120 --> 00:15:03,560
Speaker 1: moments and uh create buzz or blowing up. But if

324
00:15:03,560 --> 00:15:06,200
Speaker 1: you want to call it right and I reverse engineer that.

325
00:15:06,200 --> 00:15:08,600
Speaker 1: That was my big thing. Okay, that artist got to

326
00:15:08,640 --> 00:15:10,680
Speaker 1: hear how he'd do it, and I would just dive

327
00:15:10,720 --> 00:15:12,840
Speaker 1: in and try and figure it out. I still do

328
00:15:12,920 --> 00:15:14,720
Speaker 1: that to this to this day. What did you do

329
00:15:14,760 --> 00:15:17,840
Speaker 1: for this artist? I developed a lot of relationships with

330
00:15:17,880 --> 00:15:20,400
Speaker 1: these blogs And that sounds funny right today in two

331
00:15:20,400 --> 00:15:22,720
Speaker 1: thousand eighteen these blogs, but at the time this is

332
00:15:22,720 --> 00:15:28,280
Speaker 1: probably two thousand ten, no oh nine, probably, and uh yeah,

333
00:15:28,280 --> 00:15:30,160
Speaker 1: they were they were everything at the time. I think

334
00:15:30,160 --> 00:15:31,600
Speaker 1: there was a lot of attention there and there was

335
00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:34,800
Speaker 1: a lot of um eyeballs and ears. Okay, so if

336
00:15:34,840 --> 00:15:37,920
Speaker 1: you had a relationship, would they promote this guy's song? Correct?

337
00:15:38,280 --> 00:15:41,080
Speaker 1: And did you see any reaction? Absolutely? And that's a

338
00:15:41,080 --> 00:15:43,560
Speaker 1: beautiful part about the internet. Data right, and it's much

339
00:15:43,640 --> 00:15:45,640
Speaker 1: there's much more data now, but at the time you know,

340
00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:48,680
Speaker 1: whether we put something up on YouTube. I think, you know,

341
00:15:49,040 --> 00:15:51,640
Speaker 1: music streaming wasn't a conversation. The word at the time

342
00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:55,640
Speaker 1: didn't exist really. Um, I think YouTube was the only

343
00:15:55,760 --> 00:15:58,560
Speaker 1: music streaming service in the world probably at the time.

344
00:15:58,560 --> 00:16:00,560
Speaker 1: I don't know, maybe Spot of five, but it was

345
00:16:00,680 --> 00:16:04,400
Speaker 1: Spotified was in eleven, right, so in Europe only, and

346
00:16:04,400 --> 00:16:07,560
Speaker 1: and um a YouTube was was huge at the time.

347
00:16:07,600 --> 00:16:09,040
Speaker 1: So you get to see the views, you get to

348
00:16:09,040 --> 00:16:10,880
Speaker 1: see you know, the listons. And also why did it

349
00:16:11,000 --> 00:16:13,720
Speaker 1: end with this person in Toronto? Um, I think we

350
00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:17,000
Speaker 1: mutually agreed to to to part ways, right, And at

351
00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:19,720
Speaker 1: the time I found another artist, um that I started

352
00:16:19,720 --> 00:16:23,960
Speaker 1: working with Philadelphia, a young rapper, amazing kid. So I

353
00:16:24,000 --> 00:16:26,120
Speaker 1: was kind of balancing them both and then I think

354
00:16:26,320 --> 00:16:28,040
Speaker 1: the other one took more of my attention. Okay, So

355
00:16:28,080 --> 00:16:30,520
Speaker 1: the person in Toronto, whatever happened to him, Um, he's

356
00:16:30,560 --> 00:16:33,680
Speaker 1: doing well now. Okay, So he's the one in Philadelphia.

357
00:16:33,760 --> 00:16:37,360
Speaker 1: The name of this rapper is Okay, And what happened

358
00:16:37,400 --> 00:16:40,520
Speaker 1: there a little bit of the same scenario where where

359
00:16:40,560 --> 00:16:42,720
Speaker 1: I think, you know, and at that point when I

360
00:16:42,760 --> 00:16:45,840
Speaker 1: was working with him, I had came across logic stuff

361
00:16:45,840 --> 00:16:48,800
Speaker 1: and started building relationship with logic a little bit okay,

362
00:16:48,800 --> 00:16:51,000
Speaker 1: but before you get there, the guy in Toronto, the

363
00:16:51,000 --> 00:16:53,520
Speaker 1: guy in Philadelphia. You have actions, you're interacting with the blogs.

364
00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:56,520
Speaker 1: You're not making any money, no, no, no, no. Management

365
00:16:56,520 --> 00:16:58,360
Speaker 1: is a business where the money comes later. If you

366
00:16:58,440 --> 00:16:59,880
Speaker 1: do it right, the money comes out. If you do

367
00:16:59,920 --> 00:17:02,400
Speaker 1: it wrong, it doesn't come at all. Right, So a

368
00:17:02,400 --> 00:17:05,640
Speaker 1: little slower, how do you end up interacting with logic?

369
00:17:06,080 --> 00:17:08,840
Speaker 1: So that's that's a that's a funny story. Actually it's

370
00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:11,040
Speaker 1: you know, and again a lot of and and now,

371
00:17:11,160 --> 00:17:13,000
Speaker 1: especially being a little bit older, I look back and

372
00:17:13,040 --> 00:17:15,040
Speaker 1: how much of it was serendipity and how much of

373
00:17:15,080 --> 00:17:18,399
Speaker 1: it was luck and how literally. So I was working

374
00:17:18,400 --> 00:17:21,000
Speaker 1: with this artist out of out of Philly, and this

375
00:17:21,040 --> 00:17:24,840
Speaker 1: is early days of Twitter again, this is late oh nine,

376
00:17:25,000 --> 00:17:30,199
Speaker 1: very early, right, and I'm on Twitter. That's just what

377
00:17:30,280 --> 00:17:32,399
Speaker 1: I did, right, I'd follow things that I was interested

378
00:17:32,400 --> 00:17:35,680
Speaker 1: in passion about all music ship basically. And at the time,

379
00:17:35,760 --> 00:17:39,840
Speaker 1: this artist DJ, I followed him right, and he tweeted

380
00:17:39,840 --> 00:17:43,520
Speaker 1: out a YouTube link right, just U R L, no description,

381
00:17:43,600 --> 00:17:46,000
Speaker 1: no nothing, And I was probably bored. I was on

382
00:17:46,160 --> 00:17:47,919
Speaker 1: my I was at home on my computer, and I

383
00:17:47,960 --> 00:17:51,080
Speaker 1: clicked the video, and it was an acapella video of

384
00:17:51,200 --> 00:17:55,919
Speaker 1: logic rapping. He was walking down the University of Maryland somewhere.

385
00:17:56,320 --> 00:17:58,920
Speaker 1: It was poorly done at the time, and I ended

386
00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:00,440
Speaker 1: up speaking a lot of about it after and I

387
00:18:00,520 --> 00:18:02,919
Speaker 1: figured out why it was such poor quality. He ended

388
00:18:02,960 --> 00:18:04,960
Speaker 1: up having the microphone. He put it in his hoodie.

389
00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:06,480
Speaker 1: He was wearing a hoodie and he put it in

390
00:18:06,520 --> 00:18:08,520
Speaker 1: the hoodie so it could pick up his his voice.

391
00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:10,840
Speaker 1: And it was probably a minute and a half video,

392
00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:14,240
Speaker 1: right and something destruct me and I was like, I

393
00:18:14,240 --> 00:18:16,120
Speaker 1: think he was very as a rapper. You could tell

394
00:18:16,160 --> 00:18:20,480
Speaker 1: his his technical ability and how skilled he was. Something

395
00:18:20,520 --> 00:18:21,679
Speaker 1: just him and I was like, this kid is a

396
00:18:21,720 --> 00:18:24,160
Speaker 1: student in the game. I need I need more um.

397
00:18:24,240 --> 00:18:26,840
Speaker 1: And it was very difficult to find him before you

398
00:18:26,880 --> 00:18:28,920
Speaker 1: get there. How many views did the video have when

399
00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:34,080
Speaker 1: you saw it, Yeah, it was difficult to find. Difficult

400
00:18:34,080 --> 00:18:36,320
Speaker 1: to find him. I don't know what social media he

401
00:18:36,359 --> 00:18:38,480
Speaker 1: had at the time, if any, wasn't really much there.

402
00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:40,800
Speaker 1: He didn't really have a fan page or anything like that.

403
00:18:41,080 --> 00:18:44,160
Speaker 1: I found his personal Facebook and I literally just Facebook

404
00:18:44,200 --> 00:18:46,919
Speaker 1: chat at him. Now this is two two thousand ten,

405
00:18:47,040 --> 00:18:50,359
Speaker 1: very early Facebook chat at him very much, say why

406
00:18:50,359 --> 00:18:52,000
Speaker 1: I reached out to everybody else I wanted to work with.

407
00:18:52,320 --> 00:18:54,800
Speaker 1: I was just blindly ambitious. I didn't think ship right,

408
00:18:55,040 --> 00:18:57,600
Speaker 1: and I reached out to him and started conversating. I

409
00:18:57,640 --> 00:18:59,280
Speaker 1: think at the time he had thought I was a fan,

410
00:19:00,160 --> 00:19:02,600
Speaker 1: so he was super He was really sweet kid, I mean,

411
00:19:02,720 --> 00:19:05,920
Speaker 1: and and we start a dialogue. Shortly after, I think

412
00:19:06,000 --> 00:19:07,879
Speaker 1: I got his phone number and I call him and

413
00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:10,159
Speaker 1: I want to work with you. And I jumped on

414
00:19:10,200 --> 00:19:13,080
Speaker 1: a megabus um, which is a beautiful, beautiful thing. I

415
00:19:13,119 --> 00:19:15,479
Speaker 1: think it's what was I getting to to Maryland four?

416
00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:18,600
Speaker 1: I think thirty dollars round trip, very very explained to people,

417
00:19:18,600 --> 00:19:20,520
Speaker 1: because not everybody knows what the mega bus. It's probably

418
00:19:20,520 --> 00:19:22,600
Speaker 1: just an East coast thing, right, certainly New York, New

419
00:19:22,640 --> 00:19:24,880
Speaker 1: York to Boston, etcetera. But for the people listening who

420
00:19:24,880 --> 00:19:27,639
Speaker 1: are certainly not from that are explained the megabus. It's amazing.

421
00:19:27,640 --> 00:19:29,600
Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's a it's a big bus, right,

422
00:19:29,640 --> 00:19:32,000
Speaker 1: you pay little to no money and they'll take you

423
00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:34,199
Speaker 1: basically anywhere up and down the East Coast. It's very

424
00:19:34,240 --> 00:19:36,560
Speaker 1: beautiful things. Okay, but you wait, you wait in line

425
00:19:36,560 --> 00:19:38,200
Speaker 1: in the cold, you wait for the bus to come.

426
00:19:38,200 --> 00:19:41,520
Speaker 1: They're generally very late. And you walk on the bus.

427
00:19:41,560 --> 00:19:43,560
Speaker 1: You have your E ticket I'd printed out at my

428
00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:46,000
Speaker 1: parents house and jump on the long Land are getting

429
00:19:46,000 --> 00:19:48,360
Speaker 1: the city and go um and yeah, I go down

430
00:19:48,359 --> 00:19:50,120
Speaker 1: to see him and the megabus that some of these

431
00:19:50,119 --> 00:19:53,200
Speaker 1: buses depending when you booked, the prices different, like but

432
00:19:53,320 --> 00:19:55,480
Speaker 1: girly could be very cheap, correct, and some of them

433
00:19:55,520 --> 00:19:58,240
Speaker 1: have WiFi. Dadn't at the time, no one nobody have

434
00:19:58,280 --> 00:20:01,680
Speaker 1: waf right, Okay, So you go Maryland. Your parents are

435
00:20:01,720 --> 00:20:05,320
Speaker 1: like this is fine, the most supportive parents in the

436
00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:10,200
Speaker 1: entire world. Okay, And okay, you're going. You plan you

437
00:20:10,200 --> 00:20:12,440
Speaker 1: you know you're going to Maryland. You think you're gonna

438
00:20:12,440 --> 00:20:14,879
Speaker 1: stay at his house were You're gonna take the megabus

439
00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:17,000
Speaker 1: back the same day. So so I think how it

440
00:20:17,119 --> 00:20:20,439
Speaker 1: happened first before I visited. So at the time, he

441
00:20:20,520 --> 00:20:22,280
Speaker 1: was again he had a little team together. You didn't

442
00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:25,280
Speaker 1: have management, okay, the team was what his friends. Yes,

443
00:20:25,520 --> 00:20:28,240
Speaker 1: literally um, and he was like, hey, we wanna you know,

444
00:20:28,280 --> 00:20:29,600
Speaker 1: we want to shoot a video. I think he was

445
00:20:29,600 --> 00:20:32,760
Speaker 1: putting together his first project ever at the time, and

446
00:20:32,800 --> 00:20:34,240
Speaker 1: he was like, hey, we want to shoot a video.

447
00:20:34,840 --> 00:20:37,320
Speaker 1: I want to meet you. You know, maybe we'll come

448
00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:39,440
Speaker 1: up to New York and you can kind of show

449
00:20:39,520 --> 00:20:41,680
Speaker 1: us around Manhattan and we could we could, you know,

450
00:20:41,760 --> 00:20:44,840
Speaker 1: meet each other at the time point and shoot, I

451
00:20:44,840 --> 00:20:47,400
Speaker 1: guess is what you'd call it. We shoot very low budget.

452
00:20:47,480 --> 00:20:50,200
Speaker 1: I mean no budget, right, is how we do it. UM.

453
00:20:50,240 --> 00:20:51,760
Speaker 1: So he I was like, cool, come up right, I'll

454
00:20:51,800 --> 00:20:53,720
Speaker 1: meet you and I'll take you guys around. I don't

455
00:20:54,000 --> 00:20:56,239
Speaker 1: I mean man Hatt's Manhattan, I don't know. I was like,

456
00:20:56,280 --> 00:20:58,320
Speaker 1: I was like, ship where I even? I don't know. Um,

457
00:20:58,359 --> 00:20:59,760
Speaker 1: I had a buddy who lived there and he had

458
00:20:59,800 --> 00:21:01,639
Speaker 1: a top, so you guys want to use that as

459
00:21:01,680 --> 00:21:04,200
Speaker 1: a location. UM. And he came up. I met him.

460
00:21:04,480 --> 00:21:06,800
Speaker 1: We kind of hung the entire So this was before

461
00:21:06,880 --> 00:21:10,119
Speaker 1: you took the megabus. Correct, he came up, We hang out.

462
00:21:10,160 --> 00:21:13,160
Speaker 1: There's a big issue with managers. You always need an

463
00:21:13,240 --> 00:21:17,720
Speaker 1: act that wants it as much as the manager wants.

464
00:21:17,840 --> 00:21:20,600
Speaker 1: And so how did you pick up? And where was

465
00:21:20,680 --> 00:21:23,920
Speaker 1: he at in terms of his desire? U? The kid

466
00:21:24,040 --> 00:21:26,800
Speaker 1: is is the most ambitious kid I've ever met in

467
00:21:26,840 --> 00:21:28,960
Speaker 1: my life. To this day, he still is. And and

468
00:21:29,160 --> 00:21:33,080
Speaker 1: I think that's that's common from any successful artist. Um.

469
00:21:33,200 --> 00:21:37,560
Speaker 1: You you have to really because it's it's hard as hell. Right,

470
00:21:37,600 --> 00:21:40,720
Speaker 1: looking back at my very short eight years, it is

471
00:21:40,840 --> 00:21:43,680
Speaker 1: hard as hell. Okay, so he comes to New York.

472
00:21:44,000 --> 00:21:46,000
Speaker 1: How do you close them? Listen. I wasn't trying to,

473
00:21:46,160 --> 00:21:48,719
Speaker 1: you know, be be forced for the aggress I was like, man,

474
00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:50,840
Speaker 1: let's just let's let's work together and if I if

475
00:21:50,840 --> 00:21:52,919
Speaker 1: you like me. I was literally that simple. If you

476
00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:55,520
Speaker 1: like me and you know you you like what I'm

477
00:21:55,520 --> 00:21:58,119
Speaker 1: doing for you, let's work together. And if not, all good.

478
00:21:58,359 --> 00:22:00,840
Speaker 1: It was that simple, right, um. And we spent a

479
00:22:00,840 --> 00:22:02,840
Speaker 1: lot of time before he had met on the phone together.

480
00:22:02,880 --> 00:22:05,399
Speaker 1: We speak pretty often. I tell him kind of some

481
00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:07,760
Speaker 1: of the ideas I had. We talked about his music

482
00:22:07,800 --> 00:22:11,119
Speaker 1: a lot. Um. I was he was fortunate enough to

483
00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:12,800
Speaker 1: kind of I guess once I gained his trust to

484
00:22:12,880 --> 00:22:16,040
Speaker 1: let me in his his creative world, I guess, um.

485
00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:17,560
Speaker 1: And he came up. I kind of took him around

486
00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:19,000
Speaker 1: for the day and they went back they I think

487
00:22:19,040 --> 00:22:21,240
Speaker 1: they did the megabus or they did. One of his

488
00:22:21,280 --> 00:22:22,919
Speaker 1: friends drove up and they all packed in a car

489
00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:25,080
Speaker 1: and came up very shortly after. I was a qual

490
00:22:25,240 --> 00:22:27,720
Speaker 1: come down and see you. At the time, he was

491
00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:30,159
Speaker 1: living in his best friend's basement, to this day. His

492
00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:32,960
Speaker 1: best friend is Lenny. His name is called Big Lembo.

493
00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:36,800
Speaker 1: Um he met him, I guess he logic was at

494
00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:38,639
Speaker 1: a I believe this is I don't want to get

495
00:22:38,640 --> 00:22:41,360
Speaker 1: the story wrong. He had opened up for somebody at

496
00:22:41,359 --> 00:22:43,040
Speaker 1: some up and coming show and Lenny saw him and

497
00:22:43,080 --> 00:22:45,719
Speaker 1: they started talking after the show, and Lodge just kind

498
00:22:45,720 --> 00:22:47,560
Speaker 1: of working the dead in jobs. At the time. He

499
00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:51,520
Speaker 1: was living with his I guess his stepmother, godmother Mary Joe,

500
00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:54,600
Speaker 1: whatever you wanna call her. Um. His relationship with with

501
00:22:54,800 --> 00:22:56,520
Speaker 1: both his parents at the time weren't great, so he

502
00:22:56,560 --> 00:22:59,959
Speaker 1: wasn't really living with either one of them, and was logic,

503
00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:02,080
Speaker 1: at this point, we're the same age or he's probably

504
00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:06,400
Speaker 1: nineteen or twenty. I was nine, probably twenty, and he

505
00:23:06,480 --> 00:23:08,800
Speaker 1: was working, Yeah, he was. He was just working dead

506
00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:11,399
Speaker 1: in jobs and developed a relationship with Lenny, and I

507
00:23:11,440 --> 00:23:13,679
Speaker 1: guess he was like, Lenny, could if you let me

508
00:23:13,760 --> 00:23:17,359
Speaker 1: live there, give me one year. Give me one year

509
00:23:17,720 --> 00:23:19,879
Speaker 1: to see if this thing works out. I want to

510
00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:21,680
Speaker 1: go all in. I don't want to go to work

511
00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:23,560
Speaker 1: and take having anything to take my time away. I

512
00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:26,200
Speaker 1: want to work on music every day all day. Lenny

513
00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:28,560
Speaker 1: was kind enough, He's like dude come living my basement,

514
00:23:28,640 --> 00:23:30,200
Speaker 1: so at the time he was living in Lenny's basement.

515
00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:32,840
Speaker 1: I went down there and it was probably a little

516
00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:35,480
Speaker 1: bit less than a twenty four hour trip. We didn't

517
00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:37,639
Speaker 1: we didn't really sleep. We kind of just hung the

518
00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:40,159
Speaker 1: whole night and talked UM and I left early the

519
00:23:40,200 --> 00:23:42,960
Speaker 1: next morning. Were they going to shoot video in New York?

520
00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:45,240
Speaker 1: In New York and they ran around New York video.

521
00:23:45,280 --> 00:23:46,879
Speaker 1: I thought the video was in Maryland. No, no no, no,

522
00:23:47,040 --> 00:23:48,480
Speaker 1: they ran around a shot. I just went down to

523
00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:50,880
Speaker 1: Maryland after I met him in New York to continue

524
00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:53,040
Speaker 1: building a relationship, and I wanted to see, you know,

525
00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:55,240
Speaker 1: where he comes from. So I went down there. Was

526
00:23:55,240 --> 00:23:56,679
Speaker 1: the first time I went to ended up going down

527
00:23:56,720 --> 00:23:58,480
Speaker 1: there many times, but that was the first time I

528
00:23:58,520 --> 00:23:59,960
Speaker 1: jumped on a mega bus and we kind of hung

529
00:24:00,240 --> 00:24:03,640
Speaker 1: you know, all night and got to know each other better. UM,

530
00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:08,000
Speaker 1: and yeah, that was okay. So what's the next step? UM,

531
00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:10,280
Speaker 1: I think we were working together. I don't know if

532
00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:12,240
Speaker 1: we ever even had a real conversation at the point

533
00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:14,080
Speaker 1: of things, you know, it started just going well, right.

534
00:24:14,119 --> 00:24:17,359
Speaker 1: I think we we um were like minded. We we

535
00:24:17,359 --> 00:24:20,600
Speaker 1: we love working hard and and UM, I think we

536
00:24:20,640 --> 00:24:23,280
Speaker 1: just started working together. So we're putting together his first

537
00:24:23,320 --> 00:24:26,040
Speaker 1: mixtape at the time. Um it was called Young Sinatra,

538
00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:28,800
Speaker 1: which is like his alter ego as as a rapper,

539
00:24:28,920 --> 00:24:31,400
Speaker 1: and um, we put that together, we put it out,

540
00:24:31,600 --> 00:24:33,480
Speaker 1: and I would do my thing, right. I think I

541
00:24:33,480 --> 00:24:36,199
Speaker 1: had my little niche of understanding the internet at the

542
00:24:36,240 --> 00:24:42,240
Speaker 1: time and the music business again, uh, probably going towards now,

543
00:24:42,600 --> 00:24:48,000
Speaker 1: very the recorded music business was in a very weird spot, right, Um,

544
00:24:48,119 --> 00:24:50,440
Speaker 1: and I didn't. I guess my ignorance at the time

545
00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:54,760
Speaker 1: was beneficial because I didn't understand really the that side

546
00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:58,320
Speaker 1: of the business. Um, I understood how to try and

547
00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:01,720
Speaker 1: break through. And and my I guess philosophy or thesis

548
00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:04,440
Speaker 1: was building a fan base. It was always long term

549
00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:07,040
Speaker 1: thinking at the time, and so was his right. And

550
00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:08,640
Speaker 1: you have to be willing to make that. I think

551
00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:13,000
Speaker 1: if you constantly try to do things for force small

552
00:25:13,119 --> 00:25:15,720
Speaker 1: gains or short term wins, you ended up not really

553
00:25:15,720 --> 00:25:18,560
Speaker 1: gonna win long term. So it was always about building

554
00:25:18,560 --> 00:25:20,639
Speaker 1: a fan base, building a base, building a base. That

555
00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:23,240
Speaker 1: was our thing. Now with the previous actually worked, the blogs,

556
00:25:23,280 --> 00:25:26,080
Speaker 1: How did you do it with logic? Same thing, same thing.

557
00:25:26,080 --> 00:25:28,200
Speaker 1: And I think with those acts I I ended up

558
00:25:28,680 --> 00:25:31,840
Speaker 1: just developing great relationships with a lot of these blogs

559
00:25:31,840 --> 00:25:35,240
Speaker 1: and websites and even understanding that world even better and

560
00:25:35,280 --> 00:25:38,959
Speaker 1: doing certain things to cut through and different you know,

561
00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:41,760
Speaker 1: social media outlets at the time, understanding their algorithms and

562
00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:43,880
Speaker 1: where I could post things, at what time of the day,

563
00:25:44,200 --> 00:25:46,680
Speaker 1: when I reached the most people. You know, I think

564
00:25:47,200 --> 00:25:50,000
Speaker 1: I can be a big nerd with that kind of stuff. Um.

565
00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:52,480
Speaker 1: And it just helped me understand how to reach more people,

566
00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:54,720
Speaker 1: and I would focus on that, and that's what we

567
00:25:54,880 --> 00:25:57,080
Speaker 1: really do. So at the time, our our our thing

568
00:25:57,200 --> 00:26:00,200
Speaker 1: was free music, right and even to this day you

569
00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:02,879
Speaker 1: set at to people, it's kind of it's kind of crazy, um.

570
00:26:03,040 --> 00:26:04,879
Speaker 1: And I think we did that because we were thinking

571
00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:08,160
Speaker 1: long term. Right, if we put out quality music and

572
00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:12,359
Speaker 1: and great content to reach people, and you do it consistently,

573
00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:15,560
Speaker 1: you're probably gonna win in the end, right and and

574
00:26:15,560 --> 00:26:17,440
Speaker 1: and it was always a long term mentality. We didn't

575
00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:21,000
Speaker 1: want anything tomorrow, um. And I think that looking back

576
00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:24,639
Speaker 1: was was huge that we both had the same mindset. Okay,

577
00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:28,200
Speaker 1: at the time, you're trying to build awareness, but how

578
00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:32,320
Speaker 1: do you ultimately know who your fans are at that point?

579
00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:35,520
Speaker 1: That's a good question. Because that's difficult and a lot

580
00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:39,439
Speaker 1: of that we didn't have that detailed data, right, I

581
00:26:39,440 --> 00:26:43,080
Speaker 1: think that you can get today. Um it was so

582
00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:45,439
Speaker 1: I use what was huge at the time was YouTube, right,

583
00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:47,159
Speaker 1: Like I said, I think that was the only music

584
00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:49,800
Speaker 1: streaming service in in in in the world at the time.

585
00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:52,560
Speaker 1: We're at least in in the US. And so what

586
00:26:52,600 --> 00:26:54,439
Speaker 1: we would do we'd go through the project, him and

587
00:26:54,440 --> 00:26:57,200
Speaker 1: I would have conversations and we'd want to shoot four

588
00:26:57,320 --> 00:27:00,199
Speaker 1: or five music videos for just one project. And the

589
00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:03,120
Speaker 1: project may have fifteen songs on it, right at least

590
00:27:03,160 --> 00:27:06,040
Speaker 1: even be edited or just one take him walking in

591
00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:08,399
Speaker 1: his so to speak, point and shoot is what we

592
00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:11,359
Speaker 1: called it, him walking in his hoodie, no budget. What

593
00:27:11,400 --> 00:27:13,560
Speaker 1: we would do we we found a young director and

594
00:27:13,600 --> 00:27:16,000
Speaker 1: we kind of bargain with them where we were building

595
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:18,680
Speaker 1: out right the YouTube channel and we're getting a certain

596
00:27:18,680 --> 00:27:20,600
Speaker 1: amount of views at the time. I was like, hey,

597
00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:23,240
Speaker 1: if you because we didn't have money, if you work

598
00:27:23,280 --> 00:27:25,240
Speaker 1: with us, I'll put your logo at the front of

599
00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:27,280
Speaker 1: the video. So that's how I kind of we we

600
00:27:27,320 --> 00:27:29,280
Speaker 1: kind of did it that way. Embartered a little bit

601
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:32,200
Speaker 1: um and we traded attention for a lot of stuff right,

602
00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:35,040
Speaker 1: So we did that. We'd work with a young director

603
00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:38,360
Speaker 1: at the time who was super talented, ambitious, hustler. Um

604
00:27:38,520 --> 00:27:40,400
Speaker 1: and we point shooting. The whole thing of doing four

605
00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:43,919
Speaker 1: to five music videos a project was because identified, well,

606
00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:45,919
Speaker 1: YouTube is how you reach people. So let's pick the

607
00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:49,280
Speaker 1: strongest singles, right is what we were doing really, um,

608
00:27:49,320 --> 00:27:51,960
Speaker 1: and let's highlight those still the same thing to this day.

609
00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:54,040
Speaker 1: And a single as a gateway drug to dive in

610
00:27:54,080 --> 00:27:56,680
Speaker 1: deeper and and and fall in love with the artist hopefully.

611
00:27:56,840 --> 00:27:59,200
Speaker 1: How do you know that you're getting traction or are

612
00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:01,919
Speaker 1: you getting views? Right at the time was how we know.

613
00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:03,679
Speaker 1: And then then what we try to do is convert

614
00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:06,399
Speaker 1: that into social media follows. Whether we're building his Twitter

615
00:28:06,440 --> 00:28:08,560
Speaker 1: at the time, it's probably on the Twitter and Facebook.

616
00:28:08,560 --> 00:28:11,080
Speaker 1: At the Instagram didn't exist. There wasn't much else, so

617
00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:15,160
Speaker 1: Snapchat certainly didn't exist. Um and yeah, try and convert

618
00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:17,119
Speaker 1: it into a real fans who would stay. Okay, so

619
00:28:17,160 --> 00:28:21,480
Speaker 1: he does his first mixtape and what's the step after that?

620
00:28:21,760 --> 00:28:26,200
Speaker 1: Do another one? It was consistency. Okay, how many mixtapes

621
00:28:26,240 --> 00:28:27,960
Speaker 1: we did four together before we put on an album?

622
00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:31,800
Speaker 1: Four free projects right, which which and I remember then

623
00:28:31,880 --> 00:28:34,159
Speaker 1: and I'm probably jumping around a bit, starting to have

624
00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:38,360
Speaker 1: meetings at at labels and record companies, and the conversation

625
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:41,720
Speaker 1: around few free music was was odd. I think my

626
00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:44,400
Speaker 1: perspective at the time differed from a lot of other

627
00:28:44,400 --> 00:28:47,600
Speaker 1: people because I would always say I would it was contradiction.

628
00:28:47,840 --> 00:28:50,920
Speaker 1: I would say, you absolutely can monetize free music, right,

629
00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:53,240
Speaker 1: And what that was is you just have to think

630
00:28:53,280 --> 00:28:54,720
Speaker 1: long term, and if you do it the right way

631
00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:57,040
Speaker 1: and build a base, you're gonna tour, You're gonna sell merch.

632
00:28:57,120 --> 00:29:00,239
Speaker 1: We become a brand. That was our goal, um, and

633
00:29:00,440 --> 00:29:01,960
Speaker 1: I think I think we did a pretty good job

634
00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:05,760
Speaker 1: at that. But what came first touring or label meeting.

635
00:29:06,560 --> 00:29:09,320
Speaker 1: Probably at the same time, I think, okay, so when

636
00:29:09,320 --> 00:29:12,160
Speaker 1: do you decide let's literally put the act on. We

637
00:29:12,160 --> 00:29:16,440
Speaker 1: we probably put out two projects maybe yeah, again it's

638
00:29:16,440 --> 00:29:18,640
Speaker 1: going back to a little blurb two projects. At the time,

639
00:29:19,080 --> 00:29:21,320
Speaker 1: it was all intuition. It was all gut, right, you

640
00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:23,880
Speaker 1: start building the following you can and and a lot

641
00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:25,880
Speaker 1: of things we would do is all about the fans.

642
00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:29,600
Speaker 1: We would have conversations about hey, you stream, remember you

643
00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:31,880
Speaker 1: stream at the time, Yeah, that was you know on Twitter,

644
00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:34,240
Speaker 1: constantly go on you streams, just do Q and as

645
00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:36,320
Speaker 1: with the fans for two three hours a day, right

646
00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:39,000
Speaker 1: when he wasn't working on music show the process. Hey,

647
00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:41,480
Speaker 1: you stream you recording a song? How many people would

648
00:29:41,520 --> 00:29:46,480
Speaker 1: tune in? I don't know. Eight hundreds? Yeah, it was

649
00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:49,280
Speaker 1: a lot, um because I just understood that attention was

650
00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:52,160
Speaker 1: very valuable and even if it's a five people, it

651
00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:54,440
Speaker 1: goes a long way. So we do that. And so

652
00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:55,920
Speaker 1: to answer your question, how do we know when guatur

653
00:29:56,400 --> 00:29:59,480
Speaker 1: straight intuition, straight gut. At the time we're doing labels,

654
00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:01,880
Speaker 1: he would jump on a megabus, come up to me,

655
00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:04,800
Speaker 1: sleep at my parents house. He crashed on the floor

656
00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:07,280
Speaker 1: in my room. Um. And then we jump on the

657
00:30:07,280 --> 00:30:09,760
Speaker 1: Long Island railroad and going to Penn Station and have

658
00:30:09,840 --> 00:30:12,600
Speaker 1: label meetings. And okay, just to be very clear, this

659
00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:15,640
Speaker 1: is before or after you've gone on the road. Before okay,

660
00:30:15,760 --> 00:30:17,600
Speaker 1: you would set up a meeting or you would knock

661
00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:19,200
Speaker 1: on the door and sit in the waiting. So just

662
00:30:19,280 --> 00:30:22,440
Speaker 1: as we're creating, you know, and building this fan base

663
00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:24,800
Speaker 1: online it you know, there's an r S out there

664
00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:27,000
Speaker 1: and there's people who pay attention. Just like I was

665
00:30:27,040 --> 00:30:28,880
Speaker 1: in the blog world, they were as well, and they

666
00:30:28,920 --> 00:30:30,560
Speaker 1: reach out and say, hey, we're interested. We love to

667
00:30:30,560 --> 00:30:33,920
Speaker 1: have a conversation, UM, and we would take meetings and

668
00:30:33,960 --> 00:30:36,800
Speaker 1: get to know people and UM try to learn how

669
00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:38,760
Speaker 1: that world worked a little bit. So how would the

670
00:30:38,840 --> 00:30:41,880
Speaker 1: meetings end? Good to meet you, We'll we'll we'll get

671
00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:44,200
Speaker 1: back to you. We'll think on it. And did you

672
00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:46,720
Speaker 1: then pester them or did they disappear they come back?

673
00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:49,239
Speaker 1: I didn't pester anybody. I think logic and I were

674
00:30:49,280 --> 00:30:51,680
Speaker 1: having conversations at the time. I said, we'll do it

675
00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:53,640
Speaker 1: when it feels right. If it feels right, if it doesn't,

676
00:30:53,680 --> 00:30:56,960
Speaker 1: we don't do it. And you know, having that trust

677
00:30:57,040 --> 00:30:59,680
Speaker 1: in what you're doing, I think is important. We would

678
00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:02,560
Speaker 1: turn down deals at the time and you know, okay,

679
00:31:02,800 --> 00:31:04,520
Speaker 1: so a little slower you're going for all these A

680
00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:06,680
Speaker 1: and R meetings. How many do you think you took

681
00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:09,320
Speaker 1: before you went on the road? A lot. I think

682
00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:12,920
Speaker 1: we probably took definitely met with every major at some point,

683
00:31:12,920 --> 00:31:16,880
Speaker 1: whether some were pre touring somewhere, and all of those acts,

684
00:31:16,920 --> 00:31:19,200
Speaker 1: all those companies reached out to you. You didn't reach

685
00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:21,360
Speaker 1: out to them. Correct. Did you have a lawyer at

686
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:24,920
Speaker 1: the time, I did, which again was very still working

687
00:31:24,960 --> 00:31:27,280
Speaker 1: with him to this day. He represents Logics to this day.

688
00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:30,600
Speaker 1: Was very serendipitous as well. Again, as I had no

689
00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:33,160
Speaker 1: right relationship in the business, right I needed a management

690
00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:36,000
Speaker 1: contract and I didn't know any entertainment lawyers. I didn't

691
00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:39,120
Speaker 1: know anybody. So my my closest connection to the music

692
00:31:39,160 --> 00:31:41,320
Speaker 1: business was at one of my one of my best

693
00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:45,320
Speaker 1: friends dads worked in Manhattan. That was my connection. I

694
00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:47,320
Speaker 1: literally called my buddy. I said, hey, dude, cause you

695
00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:50,120
Speaker 1: ask your dad if he knows any entertainment lawyers. He said, sure,

696
00:31:50,640 --> 00:31:55,000
Speaker 1: call his dad. Again serendipity. Look, he's like, oh, I

697
00:31:55,040 --> 00:31:57,240
Speaker 1: think in he had an office down in Soho And

698
00:31:57,240 --> 00:31:59,640
Speaker 1: he's like, oh, I think and he's an accountant. I

699
00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:01,880
Speaker 1: think an entertainment attorney moved into the building this week.

700
00:32:01,960 --> 00:32:03,920
Speaker 1: Let me grab the super and get his card for you.

701
00:32:04,760 --> 00:32:06,720
Speaker 1: That night, I drove to my buddy's house grab his card.

702
00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:09,880
Speaker 1: I called the lawyer that was eight years ago, and

703
00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:12,320
Speaker 1: it's the same lawyer, same one. So I was like, hey,

704
00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:13,960
Speaker 1: I'm you know, I'm working with this artist. I kind

705
00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:16,480
Speaker 1: of need management contract and I had to pay for

706
00:32:16,560 --> 00:32:19,160
Speaker 1: the management and that same kid, my buddy actually lent

707
00:32:19,240 --> 00:32:25,240
Speaker 1: me the money too, probably and how old. Is the

708
00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:29,200
Speaker 1: lawyer is your contemporary or older? He's older now, he's

709
00:32:29,600 --> 00:32:31,920
Speaker 1: probably closer. I didn't even want to say his age,

710
00:32:31,920 --> 00:32:35,200
Speaker 1: but yeah, he's he's older than me. He's much almost

711
00:32:35,200 --> 00:32:38,320
Speaker 1: double my age. So did your lawyer help get you

712
00:32:38,400 --> 00:32:41,720
Speaker 1: meetings or you're just fielding emails? Just fielding emails? That

713
00:32:41,800 --> 00:32:44,720
Speaker 1: was my that was my you know thesis at the time,

714
00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:46,400
Speaker 1: it'll come to us if we're doing if we're doing

715
00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:49,160
Speaker 1: it right, and we're building an audience, and it's going

716
00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:50,800
Speaker 1: to come to us. And that's exactly what happened. And

717
00:32:50,800 --> 00:32:53,800
Speaker 1: at this point you're all in on logic. You don't

718
00:32:53,800 --> 00:32:56,440
Speaker 1: have any other acts. Correct, It was all in on

719
00:32:56,480 --> 00:32:59,720
Speaker 1: logic at this time. And then shortly after I met

720
00:32:59,800 --> 00:33:02,760
Speaker 1: John Billion, who's my second client that that I'm working with.

721
00:33:06,920 --> 00:33:08,920
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to this week's edition of the Bob

722
00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:11,480
Speaker 1: Left Sets podcast. If you want to see photos and

723
00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:13,800
Speaker 1: videos of my guests and the tune In studios here

724
00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:18,200
Speaker 1: in Venice, California, check out at tune In on Twitter, Facebook,

725
00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:22,480
Speaker 1: and Instagram, and now more with president of Visionary Music

726
00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:28,800
Speaker 1: Group Chris Rue. So you're with logic, how do you

727
00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:31,920
Speaker 1: decide to put it on the road? So we it

728
00:33:32,000 --> 00:33:34,480
Speaker 1: was it was intuition, it was goud. Obviously, we're feeling

729
00:33:34,520 --> 00:33:36,600
Speaker 1: things out, and I think I felt I was like, listen,

730
00:33:36,640 --> 00:33:38,400
Speaker 1: I think at this point, as I do, we could

731
00:33:38,440 --> 00:33:41,760
Speaker 1: probably tour. I think there's thirty markets at a minimum

732
00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:45,080
Speaker 1: in this country where we can do three tickets, right,

733
00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:47,520
Speaker 1: three three or four hundred tickets. And again you're going

734
00:33:47,520 --> 00:33:49,960
Speaker 1: straight off intuition. I didn't have a lot of What

735
00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:51,640
Speaker 1: it was was kind of feeling things out with your

736
00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:54,760
Speaker 1: gut and the same way we take meetings, right, if

737
00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:57,120
Speaker 1: something feels right, we'll entertain. If it doesn't, we won't.

738
00:33:57,680 --> 00:34:00,400
Speaker 1: And you know, so I think we decided said, let's

739
00:34:00,400 --> 00:34:01,800
Speaker 1: we're gonna do it. We're gonna put up a tour.

740
00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:06,080
Speaker 1: And you need capital, you need money to do that.

741
00:34:06,600 --> 00:34:09,359
Speaker 1: So I think I was like, listen, what if we

742
00:34:09,400 --> 00:34:12,120
Speaker 1: signed a deal, because at this point, there was you know,

743
00:34:12,120 --> 00:34:13,799
Speaker 1: a lot of interests, a lot of offers. So what

744
00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:16,080
Speaker 1: if we signed a deal and used that advanced money

745
00:34:16,120 --> 00:34:18,120
Speaker 1: to fund our tour? And I think that's what we

746
00:34:18,160 --> 00:34:20,759
Speaker 1: agreed to do. We signed with def JAM at the time,

747
00:34:21,520 --> 00:34:25,200
Speaker 1: this is how long after your initial meeting with Logic

748
00:34:26,280 --> 00:34:28,719
Speaker 1: less than a year, a little bit less than a year.

749
00:34:28,920 --> 00:34:33,720
Speaker 1: So this is this is very very early, UM, and

750
00:34:33,960 --> 00:34:37,040
Speaker 1: we decided on def JAM. It felt right. We again,

751
00:34:37,040 --> 00:34:39,239
Speaker 1: after all the meetings everything, it just just in our

752
00:34:39,280 --> 00:34:43,040
Speaker 1: guts felt the best. Um. We did the deal. I remember,

753
00:34:43,040 --> 00:34:45,759
Speaker 1: I was, I was still in college. I was. I

754
00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:49,839
Speaker 1: remember the weird juxtaposition. I was studying for finals on

755
00:34:49,840 --> 00:34:52,040
Speaker 1: on my desk in my room. And then I also

756
00:34:52,080 --> 00:34:55,360
Speaker 1: had a record contract with notes from his lawyer that

757
00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:57,000
Speaker 1: I was trying to go through and decipher at the

758
00:34:57,000 --> 00:35:01,040
Speaker 1: same time. Um, we signed and and use the money,

759
00:35:01,120 --> 00:35:02,200
Speaker 1: and we toured it and I told you have to

760
00:35:02,239 --> 00:35:03,640
Speaker 1: I said, please, we don't want to. We don't want

761
00:35:03,640 --> 00:35:06,879
Speaker 1: to announce anything. We wanted hands off. UM. And that's

762
00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:08,440
Speaker 1: what we did. We didn't. I don't think we announced

763
00:35:08,480 --> 00:35:10,960
Speaker 1: the deal for another year and a half after that.

764
00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:14,760
Speaker 1: Do you remember how much money they gave you? Yeah?

765
00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:16,799
Speaker 1: I do. Okay, you're not gonna tell me. But was

766
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:19,040
Speaker 1: there any money to put in your pocket after the tour?

767
00:35:19,520 --> 00:35:22,839
Speaker 1: Very little? Very little? Okay. So how do you get

768
00:35:22,840 --> 00:35:24,880
Speaker 1: an agent? Yeah? We had an agent at the time.

769
00:35:24,880 --> 00:35:28,520
Speaker 1: There's a little boutique agency, UM called New Agency that

770
00:35:28,520 --> 00:35:32,960
Speaker 1: would they specialized. They were really smart and yes, and

771
00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:34,960
Speaker 1: then Matt Adler is who we were working with, still

772
00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:36,560
Speaker 1: a good friend of mine today. I was actually with

773
00:35:36,640 --> 00:35:40,359
Speaker 1: him the other day. Um we. They specialized in kind

774
00:35:40,360 --> 00:35:42,560
Speaker 1: of working with up and coming artists, right and they

775
00:35:42,800 --> 00:35:44,759
Speaker 1: scour the blog world the same thing I was doing.

776
00:35:44,800 --> 00:35:47,279
Speaker 1: They reach out and find built a relationship with them.

777
00:35:47,280 --> 00:35:50,160
Speaker 1: Started working with Matt Adler, and we went through and

778
00:35:50,440 --> 00:35:52,400
Speaker 1: we put a tour together and we funded it with

779
00:35:52,440 --> 00:35:55,399
Speaker 1: the advanced money. And it was a lot of it. Man, Like,

780
00:35:55,520 --> 00:35:57,040
Speaker 1: I had no clue what I was doing. It was

781
00:35:57,080 --> 00:36:01,120
Speaker 1: figuring it out as we went. Um we we. We

782
00:36:01,239 --> 00:36:04,560
Speaker 1: rented a minivan and a Nissan Ultima from Enterprise rent

783
00:36:04,560 --> 00:36:06,920
Speaker 1: a Car. I was doing the paperwork on that and

784
00:36:06,960 --> 00:36:09,120
Speaker 1: it was specifically said, you cannot leave the state of

785
00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:12,000
Speaker 1: New York. And I was like, listen, if you know

786
00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:14,160
Speaker 1: we're going to California and we're coming back, they'll never

787
00:36:14,200 --> 00:36:16,960
Speaker 1: know we left. And you know, I'm sure at the time,

788
00:36:17,080 --> 00:36:19,080
Speaker 1: you know, going through easy passes all through and tolls

789
00:36:19,080 --> 00:36:21,920
Speaker 1: throughout the country, we had our license plate snapped many times.

790
00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:24,480
Speaker 1: But uh, yes, we did that. We rented a minivan

791
00:36:24,600 --> 00:36:28,040
Speaker 1: and and and uh Nissan Altima. We there was a

792
00:36:28,080 --> 00:36:31,040
Speaker 1: company in Rochester that I reached out to. I was

793
00:36:31,080 --> 00:36:34,239
Speaker 1: looking for independent merch companies because they were the cheapest. Again,

794
00:36:34,239 --> 00:36:36,719
Speaker 1: we paid for own merch. We didn't have a um

795
00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:39,320
Speaker 1: E merch they all the time. Reached out to them.

796
00:36:39,600 --> 00:36:41,560
Speaker 1: Uh you know, and these are numbers that I'm probably

797
00:36:41,600 --> 00:36:43,120
Speaker 1: making up in my head. How okay, how many T

798
00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:45,399
Speaker 1: shirts do we have? Do we need? And um would

799
00:36:45,400 --> 00:36:47,560
Speaker 1: carry them around and garbage bags and we didn't really

800
00:36:47,560 --> 00:36:50,719
Speaker 1: have that great of a system. It was after the

801
00:36:50,719 --> 00:36:52,960
Speaker 1: show run over the merch table, because all kids would

802
00:36:52,960 --> 00:36:55,400
Speaker 1: come by. I'd be I'd be selling merch and shoving

803
00:36:55,400 --> 00:36:57,359
Speaker 1: the money in our pocket, then sitting down and going

804
00:36:57,400 --> 00:37:00,319
Speaker 1: through and counting it, putting in Manila and of so

805
00:37:00,360 --> 00:37:03,960
Speaker 1: that's that was my accounting system was Manila envelopes. I

806
00:37:04,000 --> 00:37:06,640
Speaker 1: went through before the tour and I wrote, Okay, we're

807
00:37:06,640 --> 00:37:08,279
Speaker 1: doing thirty cities. I think it was at the time.

808
00:37:08,480 --> 00:37:10,200
Speaker 1: I'd write the city, right, and I have an open

809
00:37:10,239 --> 00:37:12,440
Speaker 1: it would be an empty envelope. We'd settle and it

810
00:37:12,480 --> 00:37:14,080
Speaker 1: was all cash at the time because we've got zero

811
00:37:14,120 --> 00:37:17,080
Speaker 1: guarantees right, Logic had no tour history. Nobody wanted to

812
00:37:17,080 --> 00:37:19,920
Speaker 1: pay us, so we did door deals and uh, you know,

813
00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:21,440
Speaker 1: if you do well, you can make good money. And

814
00:37:21,760 --> 00:37:24,320
Speaker 1: we did. And I take the I'd settle with the promoter,

815
00:37:24,640 --> 00:37:26,000
Speaker 1: and I take the cash, and I put in the

816
00:37:26,120 --> 00:37:28,759
Speaker 1: envelope and I, you know, close it and lick it

817
00:37:28,840 --> 00:37:31,600
Speaker 1: closed like it and I'd write, Okay, Denver, Colorado, two

818
00:37:31,680 --> 00:37:35,399
Speaker 1: thousand four dollars right. And if somebody needed twenty bucks

819
00:37:35,480 --> 00:37:37,799
Speaker 1: for food, weed, whatever it was, you have to open

820
00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:39,799
Speaker 1: it minus twenty and all on a sharp you had

821
00:37:39,800 --> 00:37:42,040
Speaker 1: to write it. That was. That was the accounting system.

822
00:37:42,200 --> 00:37:45,800
Speaker 1: And you know, again did a lot of stupid things,

823
00:37:45,840 --> 00:37:49,040
Speaker 1: but you've learned as you go. We carry the backpack around.

824
00:37:49,080 --> 00:37:52,480
Speaker 1: We carry all the Manila envelopes with cash in one backpack,

825
00:37:53,280 --> 00:37:55,560
Speaker 1: leave it unattended in in the in the green room,

826
00:37:55,640 --> 00:37:57,799
Speaker 1: and walk around the venue just the backpacks in there.

827
00:37:57,800 --> 00:38:00,440
Speaker 1: Probably at one point probably had forty or five thousand

828
00:38:00,440 --> 00:38:03,959
Speaker 1: dollars cash in it. Um. Yeah, it's very silly. So

829
00:38:04,400 --> 00:38:05,839
Speaker 1: how did you get people to come to the show?

830
00:38:06,560 --> 00:38:08,960
Speaker 1: That was it? Using his socials? Hey, we announced the tour,

831
00:38:10,760 --> 00:38:12,440
Speaker 1: oh man, I mean we promoted the ship out of

832
00:38:12,440 --> 00:38:15,080
Speaker 1: it because you had to. Um, we announced the tour.

833
00:38:15,760 --> 00:38:17,799
Speaker 1: We did a tour poster with the city's We're coming

834
00:38:17,840 --> 00:38:21,279
Speaker 1: here and constantly promoted it on his social media. Um,

835
00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:24,120
Speaker 1: the twitted really well. I think we probably sold out.

836
00:38:24,920 --> 00:38:26,480
Speaker 1: And how many people did you? We did v I

837
00:38:26,520 --> 00:38:28,279
Speaker 1: P as well? People were paying for v I P,

838
00:38:28,400 --> 00:38:31,080
Speaker 1: which is like, this is crazy just to meet him,

839
00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:33,200
Speaker 1: take a photo and snake his hand. How much was

840
00:38:33,320 --> 00:38:36,319
Speaker 1: v I P? Man, I don't know. Everything was cheap.

841
00:38:36,400 --> 00:38:38,480
Speaker 1: We were selling tickets with twelve dollars to the show

842
00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:41,480
Speaker 1: general mission, so I'm sure VP was probably twenty five bucks.

843
00:38:41,920 --> 00:38:44,920
Speaker 1: And and again we didn't care about the money. It

844
00:38:45,080 --> 00:38:46,879
Speaker 1: was listen, I want to make a statement. We want

845
00:38:46,880 --> 00:38:48,680
Speaker 1: to sell it. Build a story. That was part of it.

846
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:50,799
Speaker 1: We didn't like. It was literally, yeah, we don't care

847
00:38:50,800 --> 00:38:53,040
Speaker 1: if we make money. I remember having conversations with the

848
00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:55,120
Speaker 1: agent saying, what's the cheapest we could sell tickets for

849
00:38:55,200 --> 00:38:57,480
Speaker 1: Let's do that. That was it? Okay? How many people

850
00:38:57,480 --> 00:38:59,520
Speaker 1: were part of your entourage? Very small at the time,

851
00:38:59,560 --> 00:39:03,000
Speaker 1: probably five for six, right, we had me. I did

852
00:39:03,040 --> 00:39:04,440
Speaker 1: a little bit of it, and I was like this,

853
00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:06,640
Speaker 1: I'm not I can't do this whole thing. I gotta

854
00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:08,120
Speaker 1: you know, it's a little It was a lot for

855
00:39:08,160 --> 00:39:10,680
Speaker 1: me because I had to work and I get stressed

856
00:39:10,680 --> 00:39:12,480
Speaker 1: out that you know, we're driving the middle and I

857
00:39:12,520 --> 00:39:15,560
Speaker 1: were all over the place. Um, probably five or six people. Right.

858
00:39:15,600 --> 00:39:18,960
Speaker 1: A video guy that the director were working with came

859
00:39:19,000 --> 00:39:21,839
Speaker 1: on the road film content that was wall was about right.

860
00:39:21,840 --> 00:39:23,480
Speaker 1: We we put out things at the time they were

861
00:39:23,480 --> 00:39:27,000
Speaker 1: called just Another Days, um episodes, and what they were

862
00:39:27,080 --> 00:39:28,960
Speaker 1: was just behind the scenes of him on the road

863
00:39:29,000 --> 00:39:31,520
Speaker 1: and what his life was like and what and the

864
00:39:31,520 --> 00:39:35,319
Speaker 1: performance was what he would wrap the background track. Yeah, yes,

865
00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:38,760
Speaker 1: I was, yes, UM for one of my early clients,

866
00:39:38,760 --> 00:39:40,640
Speaker 1: I was a DJ because I did I just what

867
00:39:40,719 --> 00:39:42,759
Speaker 1: I did, right, So I when I say DJ, I

868
00:39:42,800 --> 00:39:44,680
Speaker 1: had my laptop and I had iTunes and it was

869
00:39:44,680 --> 00:39:46,839
Speaker 1: the instrumental and I used the space bar to play

870
00:39:46,840 --> 00:39:49,000
Speaker 1: and stop. Um. So it was it was a lot

871
00:39:49,040 --> 00:39:52,319
Speaker 1: of that. Uh. And yeah it was simple as as

872
00:39:52,440 --> 00:39:54,200
Speaker 1: as simple as we can make it. And so you

873
00:39:54,280 --> 00:39:57,200
Speaker 1: come back from the tour, it was success. Everybody's worn

874
00:39:57,239 --> 00:40:00,000
Speaker 1: out and where do you go from there? Another mixtape?

875
00:40:00,200 --> 00:40:05,239
Speaker 1: Keep going, def jam hands off please? Okay? Then after

876
00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:08,000
Speaker 1: the mixtape, I think we did too. I think we did.

877
00:40:08,440 --> 00:40:11,560
Speaker 1: We did one more after we signed, which the concept

878
00:40:11,600 --> 00:40:16,040
Speaker 1: of that to def jam was was ludicrous, right, hands off,

879
00:40:16,239 --> 00:40:19,279
Speaker 1: you just gave us a nice advanced check. We're we're

880
00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:21,960
Speaker 1: doing another mixtape that we're gonna put out for free.

881
00:40:22,680 --> 00:40:24,680
Speaker 1: Um and we did that. We built it even bigger

882
00:40:24,680 --> 00:40:25,640
Speaker 1: because I was like, you know what, when we do

883
00:40:25,719 --> 00:40:28,520
Speaker 1: his debut album, I wanted to be a big thing,

884
00:40:28,840 --> 00:40:31,920
Speaker 1: and I wanted to sell a hundred thousand albums first week,

885
00:40:31,960 --> 00:40:33,520
Speaker 1: and I knew we could do it. So that was

886
00:40:33,560 --> 00:40:35,839
Speaker 1: the goal. Okay, So when did the first album come

887
00:40:35,840 --> 00:40:41,480
Speaker 1: out two thousand four or how many tours had there

888
00:40:41,480 --> 00:40:44,520
Speaker 1: been at that point? Uh? We had sold and I

889
00:40:44,560 --> 00:40:46,880
Speaker 1: remember because there was things that we'd use to write

890
00:40:46,880 --> 00:40:49,920
Speaker 1: to grab people's attention as part of the story. We

891
00:40:49,960 --> 00:40:52,799
Speaker 1: had sold a hundred and fifty thousand tickets worldwide at

892
00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:56,040
Speaker 1: that point without without selling a single song. Yes, so

893
00:40:56,080 --> 00:41:01,760
Speaker 1: you also toured toward Europe. Wow. Okay, so you finally

894
00:41:01,800 --> 00:41:03,600
Speaker 1: put out the first album. You want to sell a

895
00:41:03,640 --> 00:41:06,640
Speaker 1: hundred thousand comblems? Correct? You told me that the label

896
00:41:06,680 --> 00:41:11,359
Speaker 1: didn't agree or believe you. Correct? And let me let

897
00:41:11,400 --> 00:41:13,680
Speaker 1: me preface this with I love Deaf Jam to death.

898
00:41:13,760 --> 00:41:16,080
Speaker 1: They are we would not be here without them. There

899
00:41:16,120 --> 00:41:19,319
Speaker 1: phenomenal partner and and a lot of looking back was

900
00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:22,160
Speaker 1: a lot was my fault. Um. I felt, I can say, hey,

901
00:41:22,200 --> 00:41:25,360
Speaker 1: hands off, we'll call you in a year when we're ready. Um,

902
00:41:25,400 --> 00:41:28,040
Speaker 1: that's a mistake. You want to keep them engaged, you

903
00:41:28,080 --> 00:41:30,800
Speaker 1: want to keep them motivated, you want them to follow

904
00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:33,480
Speaker 1: the story. I didn't do any of that. UM. I

905
00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:35,560
Speaker 1: was very much like, listen, we're doing this ourselves. We

906
00:41:35,640 --> 00:41:38,840
Speaker 1: got it, this independent mentality. Um. And then all of

907
00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:40,520
Speaker 1: a sudden, I felt, okay, it's time to hand in

908
00:41:40,560 --> 00:41:45,319
Speaker 1: our debut album. Let's go. Mistake. UM. They we had

909
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:48,600
Speaker 1: no in their mind, no data or analytics to show

910
00:41:48,640 --> 00:41:52,239
Speaker 1: that we could sell hundred thousand albums. My thing was,

911
00:41:52,320 --> 00:41:54,480
Speaker 1: and I remember talking to the head of sales at

912
00:41:54,480 --> 00:41:56,600
Speaker 1: the time, My thing was, Dude, we sold a hundred

913
00:41:56,640 --> 00:42:00,640
Speaker 1: and fifty thousand tickets worldwide, and tickets are more expensive

914
00:42:00,680 --> 00:42:03,320
Speaker 1: than what we're selling this album for. We did probably

915
00:42:03,320 --> 00:42:06,319
Speaker 1: at that point a couple of hundred thousand dollars in

916
00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:09,960
Speaker 1: merch sales. UM, like, listen, if they're spending money like

917
00:42:10,040 --> 00:42:12,600
Speaker 1: that on him and his brand is to me, seeing

918
00:42:12,600 --> 00:42:15,680
Speaker 1: an artist live is the ultimate test to a base.

919
00:42:15,719 --> 00:42:17,920
Speaker 1: I think it is the It is the most important

920
00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:20,239
Speaker 1: barometer of where an artist is at. Can you sell

921
00:42:20,280 --> 00:42:22,160
Speaker 1: tickets and if so, how many can you sell? It

922
00:42:22,280 --> 00:42:25,080
Speaker 1: is the ultimate thing, right, We're all living in our

923
00:42:25,120 --> 00:42:28,120
Speaker 1: lives with all distractions and to go to a show,

924
00:42:28,200 --> 00:42:30,759
Speaker 1: to go to a live show, that what what it

925
00:42:30,800 --> 00:42:33,080
Speaker 1: takes behind that if you really break down a ticket sale,

926
00:42:33,280 --> 00:42:36,480
Speaker 1: whether you know you're an older demo fan base, those parents,

927
00:42:36,520 --> 00:42:39,399
Speaker 1: the parents are getting babysitters, they might be taking off work,

928
00:42:39,440 --> 00:42:41,080
Speaker 1: they may be tired at work the next day because

929
00:42:41,080 --> 00:42:43,359
Speaker 1: they were out later the trains, they have to take

930
00:42:43,400 --> 00:42:47,000
Speaker 1: their the transportation, whatever, and spending their hard earned dollars

931
00:42:47,040 --> 00:42:50,359
Speaker 1: on it. Um so so so that to me was

932
00:42:50,400 --> 00:42:51,880
Speaker 1: the most it still is the most important thing. Can

933
00:42:51,920 --> 00:42:54,840
Speaker 1: you sell tickets? Okay? So you disappear for you you

934
00:42:54,960 --> 00:42:56,520
Speaker 1: come back so that you can sell a hundred thousand

935
00:42:56,600 --> 00:43:01,120
Speaker 1: albums and they say, no, you can't. There's nothing that

936
00:43:01,160 --> 00:43:03,120
Speaker 1: we have that data that we look at to show

937
00:43:03,200 --> 00:43:05,239
Speaker 1: us that you can sell a hundred thousand albums. And

938
00:43:05,280 --> 00:43:08,360
Speaker 1: at the time physical physical album sales were still very important,

939
00:43:08,760 --> 00:43:13,719
Speaker 1: not very important and important. Um and that game is expensive, right.

940
00:43:13,800 --> 00:43:15,799
Speaker 1: Whatever you don't sell in physical retail, you have to

941
00:43:15,800 --> 00:43:18,799
Speaker 1: buy back. So they try to be as exact as

942
00:43:18,840 --> 00:43:21,960
Speaker 1: they possibly can. At the time, I'm in there. I'm

943
00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:27,040
Speaker 1: twenty years old, kicking and screaming that we're gonna saw

944
00:43:27,040 --> 00:43:29,160
Speaker 1: a hundred thousand records the first week, which is an

945
00:43:29,160 --> 00:43:33,160
Speaker 1: incredibly audacious number. We didn't have any sales history. We

946
00:43:33,200 --> 00:43:35,440
Speaker 1: hadn't sold a song, so they're looking at me like

947
00:43:35,480 --> 00:43:38,880
Speaker 1: I had two heads, um and it was a battle.

948
00:43:39,080 --> 00:43:41,200
Speaker 1: It was it was It was comedy that they ultimately

949
00:43:41,239 --> 00:43:44,040
Speaker 1: make and what happened not a lot. They that if

950
00:43:44,080 --> 00:43:46,640
Speaker 1: we if in again, and they might disagree. I don't

951
00:43:46,640 --> 00:43:48,799
Speaker 1: know if if we had been shipped properly, he would

952
00:43:48,800 --> 00:43:50,560
Speaker 1: have sold well over a hundred thousand allums. We sold

953
00:43:50,560 --> 00:43:53,960
Speaker 1: seventy five thousand albums. I think they only had printed

954
00:43:54,680 --> 00:43:58,800
Speaker 1: thirteen or fourteen thousand physical copies in the United States. Okay,

955
00:43:58,840 --> 00:44:01,719
Speaker 1: so that's the first week you did. And then what

956
00:44:01,760 --> 00:44:04,880
Speaker 1: did they say? You know, what was great about it

957
00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:07,640
Speaker 1: is and where our relationship really grew. I think they

958
00:44:07,640 --> 00:44:10,479
Speaker 1: were they were not afraid to say, listen, we didn't

959
00:44:10,560 --> 00:44:14,279
Speaker 1: understand this right. And again, looking back, it was a

960
00:44:14,400 --> 00:44:18,040
Speaker 1: very disruptive time in the business. Right you had people

961
00:44:18,480 --> 00:44:20,799
Speaker 1: like Logic and artists like Logic that we're building this

962
00:44:20,880 --> 00:44:23,360
Speaker 1: thing on the internet didn't exist in the history of

963
00:44:23,680 --> 00:44:27,319
Speaker 1: music there nothing like that existed, and you know, I don't.

964
00:44:27,360 --> 00:44:29,279
Speaker 1: I don't blame them, I don't. It was a very

965
00:44:29,440 --> 00:44:32,160
Speaker 1: weird thing to look back at and what we were doing,

966
00:44:32,520 --> 00:44:35,000
Speaker 1: what a handful of artists were doing. So you sell

967
00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:38,839
Speaker 1: seventy thousand albums, and what's the march forward from there?

968
00:44:39,640 --> 00:44:43,200
Speaker 1: Keep buildings, let's move let's move to uh, let's move

969
00:44:43,280 --> 00:44:46,399
Speaker 1: to album number two. It was consistency. Let's tour off

970
00:44:46,400 --> 00:44:48,239
Speaker 1: it first of all, right, so first your tour and

971
00:44:48,280 --> 00:44:50,799
Speaker 1: what kind of buildings are you doing? Then we were

972
00:44:50,880 --> 00:44:54,640
Speaker 1: doing Man, it gets a little blurry at this point,

973
00:44:54,640 --> 00:44:56,960
Speaker 1: I think we had probably sold in New York. I

974
00:44:56,960 --> 00:45:00,320
Speaker 1: think we're doing twelve tickets probably like an Irving Plaza

975
00:45:00,400 --> 00:45:03,440
Speaker 1: before before the album came out. Um, maybe even more

976
00:45:03,480 --> 00:45:05,480
Speaker 1: than that, almost two thousand tickets before them came out.

977
00:45:05,480 --> 00:45:08,120
Speaker 1: So at that point, I'm probably doing three thousand cap

978
00:45:08,200 --> 00:45:10,640
Speaker 1: rooms majority of the major cities. Um, that's a lot

979
00:45:10,640 --> 00:45:13,080
Speaker 1: of tickets. Yeah, because we had built it early, we started.

980
00:45:13,400 --> 00:45:16,200
Speaker 1: You know what's crazy is you know where logics at from.

981
00:45:16,239 --> 00:45:18,920
Speaker 1: He's gonna be doing arenas this summer sum arenas. We

982
00:45:19,000 --> 00:45:21,120
Speaker 1: started at three d cap rooms, So it's it's kind

983
00:45:21,160 --> 00:45:22,920
Speaker 1: of crazy and we didn't skip a step. I think

984
00:45:22,960 --> 00:45:26,279
Speaker 1: that was very important. Um, it was it was we

985
00:45:26,280 --> 00:45:29,040
Speaker 1: we sell a room or tour and we'd scale what's

986
00:45:29,040 --> 00:45:31,640
Speaker 1: the next what's the next jump after that? Okay, what's

987
00:45:31,640 --> 00:45:33,200
Speaker 1: the next jump after that? And we did it, you know,

988
00:45:33,239 --> 00:45:36,200
Speaker 1: step by step. So how long until the second album?

989
00:45:36,280 --> 00:45:38,240
Speaker 1: A year? I think we we try to stay consistent

990
00:45:38,239 --> 00:45:40,239
Speaker 1: almost a year in between, right, and in between your

991
00:45:40,239 --> 00:45:42,880
Speaker 1: working the first record, your tours? What are the goals

992
00:45:42,920 --> 00:45:48,320
Speaker 1: for the second record? Well over a hundred thousand? Um,

993
00:45:48,800 --> 00:45:52,360
Speaker 1: what do we do? I don't even know we did? Okay?

994
00:45:52,360 --> 00:45:54,360
Speaker 1: In this story? Is it just keep going up? We

995
00:45:54,360 --> 00:45:58,120
Speaker 1: Are there any disappointments? Um, there's always disappointments. I mean,

996
00:45:58,440 --> 00:46:01,080
Speaker 1: you know, when you're building something thing and you're in it,

997
00:46:01,080 --> 00:46:03,120
Speaker 1: it takes a while to to build, right. I think

998
00:46:03,120 --> 00:46:06,799
Speaker 1: you have to be focused and you know, really stay

999
00:46:06,800 --> 00:46:09,080
Speaker 1: focused on what the end goal is. And if you

1000
00:46:09,160 --> 00:46:11,000
Speaker 1: do that, I think you can get through a lot

1001
00:46:11,000 --> 00:46:14,120
Speaker 1: of the bumps in the road. I'll call it. Now

1002
00:46:14,160 --> 00:46:17,000
Speaker 1: as you're gaining traction, he's selling these number of records,

1003
00:46:17,200 --> 00:46:19,719
Speaker 1: you're wet behind the years. Anybody come along and try

1004
00:46:19,760 --> 00:46:22,960
Speaker 1: to steal your act? I'm sure, not that I know of,

1005
00:46:23,160 --> 00:46:25,839
Speaker 1: but I'm sure, I'm sure, and I think that's where

1006
00:46:25,840 --> 00:46:30,239
Speaker 1: it's important finding you know, clients are artists that that

1007
00:46:30,520 --> 00:46:33,280
Speaker 1: you can trust and work with, I think, and again

1008
00:46:33,280 --> 00:46:35,879
Speaker 1: that's all intuition for me, right, you know, my two

1009
00:46:35,920 --> 00:46:38,360
Speaker 1: guys are their family to me at this point, Logic

1010
00:46:38,400 --> 00:46:40,600
Speaker 1: and John Belling their family. Just I mean, I mean

1011
00:46:40,680 --> 00:46:42,680
Speaker 1: at Logic's wedding, I was the best man. It's a family.

1012
00:46:42,800 --> 00:46:46,760
Speaker 1: So the second album comes out in two thousand fourteen,

1013
00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:49,200
Speaker 1: you say, yeah, I think it was okay, and what

1014
00:46:49,239 --> 00:46:53,080
Speaker 1: happens after I'm sorry, yeah, I was fifteen was incredible

1015
00:46:53,120 --> 00:46:55,680
Speaker 1: to story was the name of the OA comes out

1016
00:46:56,200 --> 00:46:58,840
Speaker 1: and it's continuing to build. It's continuing to build. We

1017
00:46:58,960 --> 00:47:01,800
Speaker 1: grow everything. We our sales goals at the time whatever

1018
00:47:01,840 --> 00:47:05,320
Speaker 1: they were. Um, we sold a lot of albums. I

1019
00:47:05,360 --> 00:47:08,440
Speaker 1: think we ended up having it was top five debut,

1020
00:47:09,080 --> 00:47:11,799
Speaker 1: uh maybe the number one hip hop and we ended

1021
00:47:11,840 --> 00:47:14,080
Speaker 1: up getting a number two or three on top two.

1022
00:47:15,000 --> 00:47:19,920
Speaker 1: Um scale touring, go bigger. We did that. My only

1023
00:47:19,920 --> 00:47:21,560
Speaker 1: goal going to an album, right, and it was from

1024
00:47:21,640 --> 00:47:25,640
Speaker 1: day one, was was double the fan base, double the touring.

1025
00:47:25,640 --> 00:47:27,120
Speaker 1: It's all I cared about to this day. That's all

1026
00:47:27,160 --> 00:47:29,319
Speaker 1: I care about because if you do that, everything that's

1027
00:47:29,320 --> 00:47:31,439
Speaker 1: gonna take care of yourself. And at this point in time,

1028
00:47:31,480 --> 00:47:33,480
Speaker 1: after the second album comes out and he's going on

1029
00:47:33,600 --> 00:47:35,320
Speaker 1: the road, are you putting any money in your pocket?

1030
00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:37,680
Speaker 1: I'm sure at that point, yeah, right. I think as

1031
00:47:37,680 --> 00:47:40,360
Speaker 1: it got bigger, I think we all were. That was

1032
00:47:40,520 --> 00:47:42,640
Speaker 1: you know, that was the biggest revenue for us. Was

1033
00:47:42,640 --> 00:47:47,279
Speaker 1: was live, live shows, touring, Okay, and so it still is.

1034
00:47:47,560 --> 00:47:50,759
Speaker 1: Go through the second second album cycle, which leaves us

1035
00:47:50,760 --> 00:47:54,040
Speaker 1: where yeah, maybe maybe four thousand cab rooms at that

1036
00:47:54,080 --> 00:47:56,279
Speaker 1: point we did again, double the fan base, double the touring.

1037
00:47:56,280 --> 00:47:58,879
Speaker 1: We did it um. And then going into going into

1038
00:47:58,920 --> 00:48:02,759
Speaker 1: his his third album, same goal, same thing. It was

1039
00:48:02,840 --> 00:48:05,400
Speaker 1: consistency and momentum. We didn't want to take a lot

1040
00:48:05,480 --> 00:48:09,640
Speaker 1: of time off. I think that was also looking and

1041
00:48:09,640 --> 00:48:11,680
Speaker 1: and and that's all I do. I just try to

1042
00:48:11,719 --> 00:48:13,959
Speaker 1: understand the current state of the music business and where

1043
00:48:13,960 --> 00:48:17,279
Speaker 1: things are at, where people's attentions are. And again, you know,

1044
00:48:17,360 --> 00:48:19,360
Speaker 1: we don't have six hours, but you go in the

1045
00:48:19,440 --> 00:48:22,440
Speaker 1: details of it, um, all the different things that happened

1046
00:48:22,480 --> 00:48:26,000
Speaker 1: throughout this that journey so far, going into two albums,

1047
00:48:26,080 --> 00:48:28,680
Speaker 1: right from four mix tapes of two albums. You know,

1048
00:48:28,840 --> 00:48:31,799
Speaker 1: you have different forms of social media coming out. Instagram

1049
00:48:31,840 --> 00:48:35,960
Speaker 1: popped out, Snapchat popped out, and it was identifying those things, okay,

1050
00:48:36,280 --> 00:48:39,120
Speaker 1: like logics in my in my humble opinion, and I

1051
00:48:39,120 --> 00:48:40,920
Speaker 1: think Snapchat had told usus he's one of the first

1052
00:48:41,000 --> 00:48:44,000
Speaker 1: artists ever on on Snapchat and was building a Snapchat

1053
00:48:44,000 --> 00:48:48,200
Speaker 1: following was because I was watching what young kids were using.

1054
00:48:48,280 --> 00:48:50,680
Speaker 1: I'd watched my little sister, what are you what are

1055
00:48:50,719 --> 00:48:52,920
Speaker 1: you using? What is that right? And try and understand

1056
00:48:52,920 --> 00:48:55,400
Speaker 1: and figure it out. And Okay, if that's where attention is,

1057
00:48:55,400 --> 00:48:58,680
Speaker 1: that's where I want my artist to be. And now

1058
00:48:58,680 --> 00:49:03,960
Speaker 1: you're at the third album, correct, So how does that

1059
00:49:04,040 --> 00:49:07,600
Speaker 1: album come together? Um? Really? Well? Uh, you know, I

1060
00:49:07,640 --> 00:49:12,840
Speaker 1: think he was more confident and and um, he wanted

1061
00:49:12,840 --> 00:49:14,719
Speaker 1: to make an album that was personal to him. I

1062
00:49:14,760 --> 00:49:16,799
Speaker 1: think he's always done that. I think it's been at

1063
00:49:16,800 --> 00:49:20,160
Speaker 1: the foundation of how he writes music. UM, and talk

1064
00:49:20,200 --> 00:49:22,239
Speaker 1: about some of the struggles and personal stuff that he

1065
00:49:22,280 --> 00:49:25,000
Speaker 1: was dealing with, whether that's you know, anxiety at the time.

1066
00:49:25,040 --> 00:49:28,400
Speaker 1: I think was was was um problematic in his life,

1067
00:49:28,520 --> 00:49:30,719
Speaker 1: So he made an album about that. It was about

1068
00:49:30,760 --> 00:49:33,359
Speaker 1: being human. I think was was the core of it, okay,

1069
00:49:33,360 --> 00:49:36,520
Speaker 1: and these albums are made where this one last one.

1070
00:49:36,600 --> 00:49:38,239
Speaker 1: At this point he had built a studio in his

1071
00:49:38,320 --> 00:49:40,680
Speaker 1: in his house, he had a guesthouse, UM and he

1072
00:49:40,719 --> 00:49:43,440
Speaker 1: wanted to convert the basement of the guesthouse into a studio,

1073
00:49:43,520 --> 00:49:45,959
Speaker 1: which he did that. He made almost this entire last

1074
00:49:46,080 --> 00:49:49,160
Speaker 1: album and in that and that's that's the producer. He

1075
00:49:49,239 --> 00:49:51,600
Speaker 1: has an in house guy that he's been using since

1076
00:49:51,600 --> 00:49:54,000
Speaker 1: the mixtape days. He met at the University of Maryland

1077
00:49:54,280 --> 00:49:58,480
Speaker 1: at a beat battle. The kid's name is six, incredibly talented.

1078
00:49:58,880 --> 00:50:00,480
Speaker 1: We were working with him from Mixed Hip one so

1079
00:50:00,560 --> 00:50:03,880
Speaker 1: two thousands, so there's no outside forces, No big names

1080
00:50:03,920 --> 00:50:06,239
Speaker 1: come in, very little, I think throughout the time we

1081
00:50:06,239 --> 00:50:08,799
Speaker 1: were doing sessions and figuring it out, and it's who

1082
00:50:08,800 --> 00:50:10,839
Speaker 1: you really vibe with, and you have to understand each

1083
00:50:10,840 --> 00:50:13,000
Speaker 1: other's brains creatively, and that's a difficult thing to do

1084
00:50:13,480 --> 00:50:16,399
Speaker 1: with a lot of people. UM and Logic has been

1085
00:50:16,440 --> 00:50:19,880
Speaker 1: with Six. I think he executive produced this last album.

1086
00:50:20,000 --> 00:50:22,000
Speaker 1: Um And does a lot with him. We'd bring in

1087
00:50:22,040 --> 00:50:25,400
Speaker 1: different musicians and instrument players and things like that that

1088
00:50:25,440 --> 00:50:28,080
Speaker 1: Logic met throughout the time. I think No Idea was

1089
00:50:28,160 --> 00:50:30,719
Speaker 1: very kind. Um he signed us when he was at

1090
00:50:30,760 --> 00:50:34,319
Speaker 1: def Jam to to open his world to us. So

1091
00:50:34,400 --> 00:50:36,799
Speaker 1: Logic met a lot of people throughout that process too

1092
00:50:36,800 --> 00:50:40,600
Speaker 1: that he still works with. So how does one come together? Um,

1093
00:50:40,680 --> 00:50:44,560
Speaker 1: one eight hundred comes together in a very natural way.

1094
00:50:44,719 --> 00:50:49,439
Speaker 1: He just he made the song. He sent it to me. Yeah,

1095
00:50:49,440 --> 00:50:52,960
Speaker 1: and and I was like, ship, this is special right. Um.

1096
00:50:53,080 --> 00:50:55,600
Speaker 1: At the time, he didn't think anything of it. He

1097
00:50:55,719 --> 00:50:57,239
Speaker 1: just made the song, sent it to me. And it

1098
00:50:57,320 --> 00:50:59,879
Speaker 1: was as as the processs how he works, he'll if

1099
00:51:00,120 --> 00:51:02,040
Speaker 1: not there in the studio and he'll just send me

1100
00:51:02,120 --> 00:51:03,879
Speaker 1: music as it comes to go. Hey made this last night,

1101
00:51:04,120 --> 00:51:06,640
Speaker 1: call me right that simple and that was one of

1102
00:51:06,680 --> 00:51:08,839
Speaker 1: the tracks that he made. And he said call me,

1103
00:51:09,200 --> 00:51:11,640
Speaker 1: but did you know I did? He'll tell you I did.

1104
00:51:11,680 --> 00:51:13,680
Speaker 1: I did. Okay, I'm gonna this is really gonna date me.

1105
00:51:13,719 --> 00:51:15,800
Speaker 1: But I was talking to Al Cooper had a record

1106
00:51:15,800 --> 00:51:18,000
Speaker 1: come to gold Sounds of the South, and he signed

1107
00:51:18,080 --> 00:51:21,360
Speaker 1: Leonard Skinner the first album just come out with Freebird,

1108
00:51:21,640 --> 00:51:23,239
Speaker 1: and he got a call from I think it was

1109
00:51:23,360 --> 00:51:27,080
Speaker 1: Ronnie van ziand Jacksonville. Al was living in a leant

1110
00:51:27,160 --> 00:51:28,560
Speaker 1: at the time and he says, we have a new song.

1111
00:51:28,600 --> 00:51:31,040
Speaker 1: We gotta record and they came up and they recorded

1112
00:51:31,080 --> 00:51:34,359
Speaker 1: sweet Home Alabama. Okay, And the record didn't come out

1113
00:51:34,400 --> 00:51:37,279
Speaker 1: for a year. And I asked cal I go, did

1114
00:51:37,320 --> 00:51:39,319
Speaker 1: you know it was a hand? He goes it was

1115
00:51:39,360 --> 00:51:43,799
Speaker 1: sweet Home Alabama. So the question is, did you have

1116
00:51:43,880 --> 00:51:46,200
Speaker 1: that same feeling? Okay, this is the breakthrough track. This

1117
00:51:46,239 --> 00:51:48,279
Speaker 1: is gonna make the difference. I don't know if I

1118
00:51:48,280 --> 00:51:49,600
Speaker 1: looked at a breakthrough, I said, this is a big

1119
00:51:49,600 --> 00:51:52,400
Speaker 1: there's a big record. Um I did, and and it

1120
00:51:52,480 --> 00:51:54,239
Speaker 1: was a lot of It was kind of having conversations

1121
00:51:54,239 --> 00:51:57,440
Speaker 1: with him that to get him to agree with me, right,

1122
00:51:57,520 --> 00:51:59,800
Speaker 1: I don't think he he keme on it's this third album.

1123
00:51:59,840 --> 00:52:03,200
Speaker 1: He never had a hit record at that point. Um

1124
00:52:03,400 --> 00:52:05,839
Speaker 1: And you know, I was having conversations, but I think

1125
00:52:05,840 --> 00:52:07,760
Speaker 1: this could be this could be big. But it wasn't

1126
00:52:09,480 --> 00:52:11,759
Speaker 1: because of the song and and and there was there's

1127
00:52:11,800 --> 00:52:15,279
Speaker 1: no no brainer, right, um and and I think we

1128
00:52:15,320 --> 00:52:19,600
Speaker 1: wanted to be incredibly genuine about it, which was probably

1129
00:52:19,680 --> 00:52:22,480
Speaker 1: stacking the odds against us. The title of the song

1130
00:52:22,560 --> 00:52:25,719
Speaker 1: is is the Suicide Prevention Lifeline Phone Number? Which is

1131
00:52:25,840 --> 00:52:28,800
Speaker 1: very which is not typical. Right. You don't see songs

1132
00:52:28,800 --> 00:52:30,919
Speaker 1: that are um and and doing certain things like that

1133
00:52:31,280 --> 00:52:34,280
Speaker 1: one of the first standout lyrics in the first thirty

1134
00:52:34,280 --> 00:52:36,160
Speaker 1: seconds of the songs I Want to Die Today. I

1135
00:52:36,160 --> 00:52:39,759
Speaker 1: don't think Top forty radio particularly likes that, um. But

1136
00:52:39,840 --> 00:52:42,399
Speaker 1: it was one of the situations where you know, real

1137
00:52:42,600 --> 00:52:46,319
Speaker 1: genuine music, just one is what happened? Okay, So you

1138
00:52:46,400 --> 00:52:49,279
Speaker 1: go to the label and you do they immediately pick

1139
00:52:49,360 --> 00:52:51,480
Speaker 1: up on the track. Yeah. I think I identified it

1140
00:52:51,520 --> 00:52:54,000
Speaker 1: to them way later, right after we sent them all

1141
00:52:54,000 --> 00:52:56,480
Speaker 1: the music, because he probably made it in the middle

1142
00:52:56,600 --> 00:52:59,160
Speaker 1: of the album process, maybe towards the end of it,

1143
00:52:59,440 --> 00:53:00,840
Speaker 1: and then when we and all the music, it was

1144
00:53:00,880 --> 00:53:02,680
Speaker 1: just having conversations, Hey, this song. I think the song

1145
00:53:02,719 --> 00:53:05,000
Speaker 1: is special. I think the song is big um, and

1146
00:53:05,000 --> 00:53:07,319
Speaker 1: they believe as well. They they bought in and how

1147
00:53:07,320 --> 00:53:10,800
Speaker 1: did you get the guest vocal um from Alesia? And yeah,

1148
00:53:10,880 --> 00:53:13,759
Speaker 1: I think I think the song is a story, right,

1149
00:53:13,800 --> 00:53:17,120
Speaker 1: it's and we're talking about having a female vocalist and

1150
00:53:17,160 --> 00:53:18,719
Speaker 1: I love Leslie. I try to get him to work

1151
00:53:18,760 --> 00:53:20,879
Speaker 1: with Leslie in the past. So I threw that out

1152
00:53:20,920 --> 00:53:22,279
Speaker 1: there and he was like, yo, I love that. I

1153
00:53:22,280 --> 00:53:23,880
Speaker 1: think I reached out to put them in touch and

1154
00:53:23,960 --> 00:53:26,000
Speaker 1: they got in touch. And then at the time I

1155
00:53:26,000 --> 00:53:28,480
Speaker 1: think one of his friends had put him on to Khalid,

1156
00:53:29,000 --> 00:53:30,919
Speaker 1: and I think he reached out to Kaled and and

1157
00:53:31,360 --> 00:53:33,640
Speaker 1: that came together. I think they Kalid went to his

1158
00:53:33,680 --> 00:53:35,759
Speaker 1: house and cut it at his studio. Okay, so let's

1159
00:53:35,800 --> 00:53:39,800
Speaker 1: go a little slower. The album comes out exactly when

1160
00:53:40,800 --> 00:53:45,600
Speaker 1: May fifth, And what is the first track they're working? Uh?

1161
00:53:45,800 --> 00:53:49,560
Speaker 1: Was one eight hundred that came out in April. It

1162
00:53:49,640 --> 00:53:52,080
Speaker 1: was the last song we dropped before the album came

1163
00:53:52,080 --> 00:53:54,000
Speaker 1: out a week prior. Okay, So what happens with the

1164
00:53:54,280 --> 00:53:57,520
Speaker 1: because it seems to me the track doesn't really blow

1165
00:53:57,600 --> 00:54:00,720
Speaker 1: up until the v M as correct, So what happened

1166
00:54:01,200 --> 00:54:04,279
Speaker 1: between the end of April and August? Um, we didn't

1167
00:54:04,320 --> 00:54:06,480
Speaker 1: impact immediately, right. We wanted the story. You wanted the

1168
00:54:06,560 --> 00:54:08,279
Speaker 1: number one album. That was a big goal for us.

1169
00:54:08,719 --> 00:54:11,000
Speaker 1: We wanted to sell over two hundred thousand albums. That

1170
00:54:11,040 --> 00:54:14,040
Speaker 1: was another big goal for US, UM, which isn't easy

1171
00:54:14,120 --> 00:54:18,680
Speaker 1: to do. UM and we we I think we two

1172
00:54:18,719 --> 00:54:21,879
Speaker 1: hundred and fifty thousand we sold the first week. UM.

1173
00:54:21,960 --> 00:54:24,560
Speaker 1: We're very happy about that he has number one album.

1174
00:54:24,680 --> 00:54:26,800
Speaker 1: UM is part of a story and it's telling that

1175
00:54:26,800 --> 00:54:29,719
Speaker 1: that story and make well the reason I asked irrelevant

1176
00:54:29,760 --> 00:54:33,080
Speaker 1: of your specific track. We live in an era where

1177
00:54:33,080 --> 00:54:36,239
Speaker 1: there's so much product that term that it's hard to

1178
00:54:36,239 --> 00:54:38,719
Speaker 1: get noticed. And it used to be if something you know,

1179
00:54:38,800 --> 00:54:41,120
Speaker 1: I used this track by Rag and bow Man Human

1180
00:54:41,320 --> 00:54:44,720
Speaker 1: it was number one all over the world except in America. Okay,

1181
00:54:44,840 --> 00:54:46,960
Speaker 1: the track didn't change, but it didn't make it in America.

1182
00:54:47,040 --> 00:54:50,200
Speaker 1: So prior to one could say in the Internet, if

1183
00:54:50,239 --> 00:54:53,080
Speaker 1: something was phenomenal, creed would rise to the top. I

1184
00:54:53,120 --> 00:54:55,760
Speaker 1: don't believe that anymore. There's just too many things out there.

1185
00:54:55,840 --> 00:54:58,320
Speaker 1: So you have a track that is a stone cold smash,

1186
00:54:59,520 --> 00:55:02,200
Speaker 1: what is the process of trying to have it get noticed?

1187
00:55:03,040 --> 00:55:05,759
Speaker 1: Hacking culture, I think you have to do things to

1188
00:55:05,800 --> 00:55:08,440
Speaker 1: cut through and to stand out. Um, I agree, I

1189
00:55:08,440 --> 00:55:12,440
Speaker 1: think there is there is a lot of uh, you know,

1190
00:55:13,560 --> 00:55:17,000
Speaker 1: over saturation today. I think there's a somebody said this

1191
00:55:17,040 --> 00:55:18,399
Speaker 1: so I can't I don't. I don't know if it's

1192
00:55:18,760 --> 00:55:21,799
Speaker 1: completely accurate. There's a hundred and fifty thousand songs being

1193
00:55:21,840 --> 00:55:25,040
Speaker 1: uploaded Spotify in a seven day week, which is which

1194
00:55:25,120 --> 00:55:29,759
Speaker 1: is absurd absurd um. But again, it's how you look

1195
00:55:29,800 --> 00:55:32,279
Speaker 1: at things, right. I try to look at it from

1196
00:55:32,280 --> 00:55:38,480
Speaker 1: an optimistic perspective. There is what the consumption is at

1197
00:55:38,560 --> 00:55:41,279
Speaker 1: all time high, is how I look at things, um,

1198
00:55:42,000 --> 00:55:44,240
Speaker 1: And music consumption is at all time I think every

1199
00:55:44,320 --> 00:55:47,320
Speaker 1: day that goes by tomorrow will be the music consumption

1200
00:55:47,360 --> 00:55:49,400
Speaker 1: will probably be at the highest point in in the

1201
00:55:49,520 --> 00:55:52,040
Speaker 1: history of the world. UM. And I think as things

1202
00:55:52,080 --> 00:55:54,719
Speaker 1: continue to grow, that's going to continue to happen every

1203
00:55:54,800 --> 00:55:57,279
Speaker 1: day it's going to grow. UM. So it's looking at

1204
00:55:57,280 --> 00:55:59,120
Speaker 1: it from that perspective. And how do you cut through

1205
00:55:59,440 --> 00:56:03,600
Speaker 1: doing certain things like our VMA performance? Right? How do

1206
00:56:03,719 --> 00:56:07,040
Speaker 1: we let's go before that though, because the VMA was

1207
00:56:07,120 --> 00:56:09,520
Speaker 1: really a huge spike and turned it all, you know,

1208
00:56:09,640 --> 00:56:13,120
Speaker 1: or put poor gasoline on the fire. You have a track?

1209
00:56:13,560 --> 00:56:15,760
Speaker 1: Do you sit at deaf jam and say what playlists

1210
00:56:15,800 --> 00:56:18,399
Speaker 1: are we gonna get on? How we gonna work this? Yeah?

1211
00:56:18,440 --> 00:56:20,640
Speaker 1: I mean that's that's that's absolutely part of it. I

1212
00:56:20,640 --> 00:56:24,239
Speaker 1: think playlists is essential. Again, it's where the attention is.

1213
00:56:24,640 --> 00:56:28,840
Speaker 1: So having relationships with the digital the DSPs, Apple and

1214
00:56:28,880 --> 00:56:32,560
Speaker 1: Spotify and and you know, making sure they're engaged and

1215
00:56:32,600 --> 00:56:35,719
Speaker 1: they understand there's records coming. And now do you personally

1216
00:56:35,719 --> 00:56:37,680
Speaker 1: go to Spotify and Apple? I do. I have great

1217
00:56:37,719 --> 00:56:41,520
Speaker 1: relationship and you'll say, what we have new music and

1218
00:56:41,560 --> 00:56:44,399
Speaker 1: we have this particular song, is we're really excited about. Okay,

1219
00:56:44,520 --> 00:56:47,200
Speaker 1: since the song ended up being gigantic when you played

1220
00:56:47,200 --> 00:56:49,640
Speaker 1: it for them, did they understand it? Yeah? I think

1221
00:56:49,680 --> 00:56:51,800
Speaker 1: they did. And it was also making sure they understood

1222
00:56:51,800 --> 00:56:54,000
Speaker 1: in the narrative of the entire album and how things

1223
00:56:54,040 --> 00:56:56,520
Speaker 1: fit in and and you know, we weren't just focused

1224
00:56:56,520 --> 00:56:59,480
Speaker 1: on one song during the initial rollout, I think post

1225
00:56:59,520 --> 00:57:01,640
Speaker 1: album or least, Yeah, let's let's move forward and let's

1226
00:57:01,680 --> 00:57:04,160
Speaker 1: focus on this one track because we think it's special

1227
00:57:04,560 --> 00:57:07,000
Speaker 1: UM and has potential, but it was for us. He's

1228
00:57:07,120 --> 00:57:10,040
Speaker 1: logics and album artists. He's always been that. UM Again,

1229
00:57:10,080 --> 00:57:12,320
Speaker 1: not having a hit and selling you know, two hundred

1230
00:57:12,320 --> 00:57:15,000
Speaker 1: and fifty thousand albums first week, you're an album artist.

1231
00:57:15,640 --> 00:57:16,880
Speaker 1: So what did they say that we're going to do

1232
00:57:17,000 --> 00:57:19,919
Speaker 1: for you? Um? You know, you get playlists, but there's

1233
00:57:19,920 --> 00:57:21,760
Speaker 1: more to that's about building the story and there's there's

1234
00:57:21,840 --> 00:57:24,440
Speaker 1: little things that you can do. I think looking back

1235
00:57:24,480 --> 00:57:27,600
Speaker 1: at that, UM, there was probably two things that stand

1236
00:57:27,600 --> 00:57:29,640
Speaker 1: out to me. And timing is very important as well.

1237
00:57:29,760 --> 00:57:32,920
Speaker 1: Right was the music video when we held onto it

1238
00:57:33,000 --> 00:57:36,680
Speaker 1: for a long time, UM, because we're looking, we're waiting

1239
00:57:36,680 --> 00:57:39,000
Speaker 1: for when we needed something to spike it, and that

1240
00:57:39,040 --> 00:57:42,240
Speaker 1: did absolutely phenomenal. I think the song had been working.

1241
00:57:42,280 --> 00:57:44,440
Speaker 1: And again you learn things as you go. I think

1242
00:57:44,920 --> 00:57:48,080
Speaker 1: music videos are more important, important for international markets than

1243
00:57:48,120 --> 00:57:51,080
Speaker 1: they are in new in the US. UM and we

1244
00:57:51,160 --> 00:57:56,040
Speaker 1: knew that. And why do you think, well, especially I don't.

1245
00:57:56,040 --> 00:57:57,160
Speaker 1: I don't know if I can answer it. I think

1246
00:57:57,200 --> 00:57:59,560
Speaker 1: in Latin America, YouTube is everything. I think that's how

1247
00:57:59,560 --> 00:58:01,960
Speaker 1: they can see music. That's why videos do do really well.

1248
00:58:02,000 --> 00:58:04,480
Speaker 1: I mean, look at Desposito right very quickly became the

1249
00:58:04,520 --> 00:58:08,320
Speaker 1: most viewed music video in YouTube history. UM. I would

1250
00:58:08,320 --> 00:58:10,720
Speaker 1: attribute out a lot to the Latin American audience, you know,

1251
00:58:10,960 --> 00:58:13,120
Speaker 1: So we held onto that when we decided to release it.

1252
00:58:13,120 --> 00:58:14,959
Speaker 1: We had already been charting, right if you even focus

1253
00:58:15,040 --> 00:58:17,200
Speaker 1: on the Spotify chart, because that's something I look at

1254
00:58:17,200 --> 00:58:19,520
Speaker 1: every day. We had been charting on the Spotify chart

1255
00:58:19,560 --> 00:58:22,360
Speaker 1: in the US. This is the Spotify top correct, and

1256
00:58:22,400 --> 00:58:25,840
Speaker 1: had not globally. The twenty four hours after releasing a

1257
00:58:26,000 --> 00:58:28,000
Speaker 1: video we jumped onto the global charts. Yeah, and then

1258
00:58:28,000 --> 00:58:31,320
Speaker 1: it's twenty four hours so and then to right now, Well, no,

1259
00:58:31,960 --> 00:58:34,680
Speaker 1: I was gonna ask a number of views, but really, Stratos,

1260
00:58:34,720 --> 00:58:37,320
Speaker 1: I'm church triple digit millions, but we don't remember what

1261
00:58:37,400 --> 00:58:40,200
Speaker 1: it was then, Okay, so how do you cook up

1262
00:58:40,400 --> 00:58:44,360
Speaker 1: the v M A performance conversation with logic? What's his inspiration?

1263
00:58:44,360 --> 00:58:47,120
Speaker 1: Where's your head at? Um? Let's go back one step.

1264
00:58:47,200 --> 00:58:49,040
Speaker 1: How do you actually get on the show? To begin with?

1265
00:58:49,320 --> 00:58:52,560
Speaker 1: I I credit um Steve Bartle's and gave to Sorio.

1266
00:58:52,720 --> 00:58:55,880
Speaker 1: So Steve was at the time the CEO of def

1267
00:58:55,960 --> 00:58:58,560
Speaker 1: Jam and gave still is he runs pr over there.

1268
00:58:58,840 --> 00:59:03,280
Speaker 1: They had great relationship with MTV and and hounded hounded

1269
00:59:03,440 --> 00:59:06,360
Speaker 1: them about it. Hounded them because the track wasn't a

1270
00:59:06,400 --> 00:59:08,440
Speaker 1: hit at the time, and at the time it was building.

1271
00:59:08,440 --> 00:59:10,280
Speaker 1: It was building, but they were just saying put them on.

1272
00:59:10,360 --> 00:59:12,920
Speaker 1: They weren't saying we're going to do this whole production number. Correct,

1273
00:59:12,960 --> 00:59:14,360
Speaker 1: we didn't even We just wanted to get an offer,

1274
00:59:14,560 --> 00:59:16,520
Speaker 1: perform and then we'll get into the details of that

1275
00:59:17,120 --> 00:59:19,680
Speaker 1: UM at the time. So then they did that, and

1276
00:59:19,720 --> 00:59:22,440
Speaker 1: they did an amazing job at getting us on the show,

1277
00:59:22,840 --> 00:59:24,960
Speaker 1: and then I I built a relationship with with them

1278
00:59:24,960 --> 00:59:26,480
Speaker 1: now that I have right and that's a beautiful part

1279
00:59:26,520 --> 00:59:29,960
Speaker 1: about management. UM. But yeah, I credit I credit Stephen

1280
00:59:30,000 --> 00:59:32,840
Speaker 1: Gabe with that. Okay, then how did you decide to

1281
00:59:32,920 --> 00:59:36,360
Speaker 1: have the ultimate performance you did. Logic was in Nashville

1282
00:59:36,360 --> 00:59:40,280
Speaker 1: rehearsing for tour. We had just got the offer, and I,

1283
00:59:40,360 --> 00:59:42,160
Speaker 1: you know, I I certainly wanted to make it special.

1284
00:59:42,240 --> 00:59:45,040
Speaker 1: I know Logic was going to too. I jumped on

1285
00:59:45,080 --> 00:59:46,800
Speaker 1: a plane, I went to Nashville to have dinner with

1286
00:59:46,840 --> 00:59:49,400
Speaker 1: him so we could talk out what what his inspiration

1287
00:59:49,480 --> 00:59:52,160
Speaker 1: was and put a performance together. And we did it

1288
00:59:52,200 --> 00:59:57,160
Speaker 1: at that dinner, I think, okay, and MTV immediately said five. Yeah,

1289
00:59:57,240 --> 00:59:59,800
Speaker 1: I mean we were fingers crossed going to remember and

1290
01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:01,840
Speaker 1: reason with the Nashville because like twenty four or forty

1291
01:00:01,840 --> 01:00:04,840
Speaker 1: eight hours later, I had a production call with them

1292
01:00:04,960 --> 01:00:07,920
Speaker 1: and we had to pitch what our idea was, um,

1293
01:00:07,960 --> 01:00:10,280
Speaker 1: you know, and and it was very ambitious. We wanted

1294
01:00:11,040 --> 01:00:13,240
Speaker 1: we just wanted to be genuine as possible with this song.

1295
01:00:13,400 --> 01:00:15,880
Speaker 1: And and for those people, I can't believe that anybody

1296
01:00:15,920 --> 01:00:17,960
Speaker 1: wouldn't have seen it at this point in time, but

1297
01:00:18,000 --> 01:00:21,280
Speaker 1: assuming they haven't walked through what the performance was, it was,

1298
01:00:21,720 --> 01:00:26,680
Speaker 1: you know, we incorporated what what we're calling and we've

1299
01:00:26,760 --> 01:00:29,439
Speaker 1: learned as their cult survivors, right, either people who were

1300
01:00:29,520 --> 01:00:33,160
Speaker 1: were were have attempted suicide and and and survived or

1301
01:00:33,640 --> 01:00:37,440
Speaker 1: unfortunately lost loved ones to to to suicide. Um. We

1302
01:00:37,520 --> 01:00:39,760
Speaker 1: had them as extras. I guess you could say in

1303
01:00:39,800 --> 01:00:42,000
Speaker 1: the performance that we were being revealed at certain moments

1304
01:00:42,000 --> 01:00:45,480
Speaker 1: of the song. UM. And they had T shirts on

1305
01:00:45,720 --> 01:00:47,560
Speaker 1: right where where the messaging on them was you are

1306
01:00:47,560 --> 01:00:50,920
Speaker 1: not alone and letting them know, UM that that you know,

1307
01:00:51,560 --> 01:00:53,919
Speaker 1: if you're struggling with that and you're in a really

1308
01:00:54,040 --> 01:00:55,960
Speaker 1: low pleasure, not alone, and there's people you can talk to,

1309
01:00:56,040 --> 01:00:58,160
Speaker 1: and there's people, um that are here to help. And

1310
01:00:58,160 --> 01:01:00,320
Speaker 1: that's what the song is about. So we wanted them

1311
01:01:00,320 --> 01:01:03,040
Speaker 1: incorporated and to make sure they were real people, right, um,

1312
01:01:03,080 --> 01:01:06,320
Speaker 1: and not actors or anything is silly like that. Um.

1313
01:01:06,360 --> 01:01:08,240
Speaker 1: And I think one of the also the special things

1314
01:01:08,240 --> 01:01:11,440
Speaker 1: about it was so at the time the speech that

1315
01:01:11,520 --> 01:01:14,479
Speaker 1: Logic gave at the at the end of the song

1316
01:01:14,600 --> 01:01:16,520
Speaker 1: was never part of It wasn't part of the conversation.

1317
01:01:17,720 --> 01:01:19,880
Speaker 1: I was in l A at the time because I

1318
01:01:19,920 --> 01:01:21,800
Speaker 1: had flown out here for the performance, and it was

1319
01:01:21,800 --> 01:01:24,840
Speaker 1: probably forty eight hours before Logic was on tour, so

1320
01:01:24,920 --> 01:01:28,720
Speaker 1: he basically we basically ended the tour. He flew in

1321
01:01:28,880 --> 01:01:31,480
Speaker 1: to do the performance. He got here three in the

1322
01:01:31,480 --> 01:01:35,120
Speaker 1: morning the night before and he called me probably four

1323
01:01:35,120 --> 01:01:36,840
Speaker 1: hours before. I was in a dinner out here, I

1324
01:01:36,840 --> 01:01:38,640
Speaker 1: remember it. I stepped out. I was like, what's going on?

1325
01:01:39,200 --> 01:01:41,000
Speaker 1: He goes, dude, I wrote something and I need to

1326
01:01:41,040 --> 01:01:44,720
Speaker 1: say it. And I said, okay, how long is it?

1327
01:01:45,160 --> 01:01:47,320
Speaker 1: I said a minute? You need to get me another minute.

1328
01:01:47,840 --> 01:01:51,120
Speaker 1: Now in television that's like an hour, it's like a day.

1329
01:01:51,320 --> 01:01:56,320
Speaker 1: And we're forty eight hours before the show and I

1330
01:01:56,480 --> 01:01:59,520
Speaker 1: call I called Bruce who who was putting on the show,

1331
01:02:00,280 --> 01:02:02,439
Speaker 1: and was like, I gotta make this happen, and and

1332
01:02:02,440 --> 01:02:05,560
Speaker 1: and and and pitched him on it, and I think

1333
01:02:06,200 --> 01:02:08,640
Speaker 1: pushed him into it and we we got an extra

1334
01:02:08,720 --> 01:02:10,960
Speaker 1: minute out of it. So before it happens, I know

1335
01:02:11,000 --> 01:02:13,120
Speaker 1: from talking to you before it happens, you knew this

1336
01:02:13,200 --> 01:02:16,120
Speaker 1: was gonna be a transformative moment. You hope, because what

1337
01:02:16,240 --> 01:02:19,000
Speaker 1: I see you to three days before, I probably saw

1338
01:02:19,000 --> 01:02:22,160
Speaker 1: you the same day or day after Logic called me. Um,

1339
01:02:22,320 --> 01:02:24,160
Speaker 1: I would hope. I would hope, right, And that's all

1340
01:02:24,160 --> 01:02:26,280
Speaker 1: you can do. You can you can you can bet

1341
01:02:26,320 --> 01:02:28,480
Speaker 1: on things and and think, but you know, I think

1342
01:02:28,520 --> 01:02:30,400
Speaker 1: the stars have to align and they did for for that.

1343
01:02:30,560 --> 01:02:33,040
Speaker 1: What was it like being at the actual performance? It

1344
01:02:33,120 --> 01:02:36,520
Speaker 1: was special. I was backstage, UM watching on a little

1345
01:02:36,520 --> 01:02:40,200
Speaker 1: TV UM, and I obviously heard the live audio and

1346
01:02:40,320 --> 01:02:43,880
Speaker 1: the way I the way I knew right was I

1347
01:02:43,920 --> 01:02:46,320
Speaker 1: heard the we're at the forum. I think I heard

1348
01:02:46,320 --> 01:02:48,840
Speaker 1: the arena erupt And that's when you know, right. So,

1349
01:02:48,960 --> 01:02:51,920
Speaker 1: especially at a show like that, when when people stand up,

1350
01:02:51,960 --> 01:02:54,080
Speaker 1: same thing happened to him at the Grammys is when I,

1351
01:02:54,280 --> 01:02:56,720
Speaker 1: let's say, I want to get to that eventually. So

1352
01:02:57,080 --> 01:03:00,400
Speaker 1: is the reaction is the gasoline on the fire media?

1353
01:03:00,680 --> 01:03:03,800
Speaker 1: Because yes, we shot to number one in the Spotify

1354
01:03:03,880 --> 01:03:06,840
Speaker 1: US chart UM and iTunes probably top five by the

1355
01:03:06,880 --> 01:03:09,960
Speaker 1: next morning, and it seemed like sustained for months, correct

1356
01:03:10,560 --> 01:03:13,600
Speaker 1: And and that gave that gave I think the promo

1357
01:03:13,680 --> 01:03:16,040
Speaker 1: people at def Jam, who did such an amazing job

1358
01:03:16,440 --> 01:03:19,040
Speaker 1: breaking this record at at Rhythm and Top forty Radio,

1359
01:03:19,080 --> 01:03:21,080
Speaker 1: I think it gave them all the ammunition they needed

1360
01:03:21,400 --> 01:03:23,840
Speaker 1: to take it to the next level at at radio.

1361
01:03:24,240 --> 01:03:27,280
Speaker 1: And then how do you end up on the Grammys? UM?

1362
01:03:27,320 --> 01:03:31,760
Speaker 1: You know something we wanted? It started with the denominations, UM,

1363
01:03:32,120 --> 01:03:35,680
Speaker 1: and then pushing and hoping that we get a call

1364
01:03:35,800 --> 01:03:38,440
Speaker 1: for for a performance. Did you get any bounce from

1365
01:03:38,480 --> 01:03:41,280
Speaker 1: that that's quantifiable? UM? I did, and and like I said,

1366
01:03:41,320 --> 01:03:43,440
Speaker 1: I'm a I'm a I'm a dad, a nerd right

1367
01:03:43,480 --> 01:03:46,520
Speaker 1: in a weirdo. So so I don't know if it's

1368
01:03:46,560 --> 01:03:48,919
Speaker 1: the next Monday morning or it was a Tuesday morning

1369
01:03:48,960 --> 01:03:51,280
Speaker 1: after the Grammys when you like, I think Spotify tchart

1370
01:03:51,360 --> 01:03:53,360
Speaker 1: might be twenty five hours delayed or whatever. The first

1371
01:03:53,400 --> 01:03:55,280
Speaker 1: thing I did, right, I woke up and I need

1372
01:03:55,280 --> 01:03:57,280
Speaker 1: to look literally first, it was probably in the morning.

1373
01:03:57,840 --> 01:04:02,760
Speaker 1: And iTunes we had a three jump. That's big. It's

1374
01:04:02,760 --> 01:04:04,320
Speaker 1: really big, right, I think a lot of the songs

1375
01:04:04,320 --> 01:04:06,000
Speaker 1: that had performances at night had that big of a

1376
01:04:06,080 --> 01:04:13,680
Speaker 1: jump um on Spotify and Apple zero change. It's A'm like,

1377
01:04:13,720 --> 01:04:15,959
Speaker 1: all right, how do how do I? What does that mean?

1378
01:04:16,120 --> 01:04:18,120
Speaker 1: That's all I try and do, right, figure it out

1379
01:04:18,240 --> 01:04:21,600
Speaker 1: and and learn from it. What does that mean? And

1380
01:04:21,600 --> 01:04:23,920
Speaker 1: this is my and it's funny. I had, you know,

1381
01:04:24,800 --> 01:04:27,960
Speaker 1: a group chat text message with everybody who works for

1382
01:04:28,040 --> 01:04:30,200
Speaker 1: VISI name music group and works with me. And I

1383
01:04:30,200 --> 01:04:33,240
Speaker 1: started a conversation, uh eight thirty in the morning. I said, Hey, guys,

1384
01:04:33,240 --> 01:04:35,840
Speaker 1: I'm looking at something. It's really interesting. Let's talk it out. Le'

1385
01:04:35,880 --> 01:04:38,480
Speaker 1: figure it out. When I get into the office. And

1386
01:04:38,760 --> 01:04:41,320
Speaker 1: what I attributed to is I said, there's a three

1387
01:04:42,120 --> 01:04:44,320
Speaker 1: increase in the song, and I got that number from

1388
01:04:44,360 --> 01:04:47,920
Speaker 1: def jam, I think, and you know, zero from what

1389
01:04:47,960 --> 01:04:50,360
Speaker 1: it seems like on the streaming services. So what I'm

1390
01:04:50,360 --> 01:04:53,160
Speaker 1: attribute is the demographic, right, this is and again this

1391
01:04:53,240 --> 01:04:56,440
Speaker 1: is me just making my best judgment on it. And

1392
01:04:56,440 --> 01:04:58,560
Speaker 1: this is how it's interesting to me because I learned

1393
01:04:58,600 --> 01:05:00,960
Speaker 1: and again I'm a weirdo like they ship is legitimately

1394
01:05:01,000 --> 01:05:06,880
Speaker 1: interesting to me. I think the probably older demo who

1395
01:05:06,920 --> 01:05:10,120
Speaker 1: who who watches the Grammys tends to use iTunes a

1396
01:05:10,160 --> 01:05:13,000
Speaker 1: little bit more right and purchase song and that song,

1397
01:05:13,320 --> 01:05:15,720
Speaker 1: that performance, that song may have been brand new to

1398
01:05:15,800 --> 01:05:19,439
Speaker 1: that viewer. They may have not heard that song ever, right,

1399
01:05:19,960 --> 01:05:22,240
Speaker 1: And I think the younger demo who tends to lean

1400
01:05:22,280 --> 01:05:26,160
Speaker 1: more on streaming services, was already uber familiar, probably like

1401
01:05:26,600 --> 01:05:28,640
Speaker 1: sick of this song at this point and didn't need

1402
01:05:28,680 --> 01:05:30,760
Speaker 1: to react because they knew the song already, so they

1403
01:05:30,800 --> 01:05:33,160
Speaker 1: didn't go and rush and stream it. That's my that's

1404
01:05:33,200 --> 01:05:36,120
Speaker 1: my best guests on on why you saw such a

1405
01:05:36,160 --> 01:05:39,080
Speaker 1: difference between the streaming services and that sustain There never

1406
01:05:39,160 --> 01:05:41,880
Speaker 1: was a bump on streaming, and there wasn't a bump

1407
01:05:41,880 --> 01:05:44,440
Speaker 1: on YouTube either, I didn't look at YouTube. That's a

1408
01:05:44,440 --> 01:05:48,280
Speaker 1: good question. Okay, So what's next for Logic? What's next

1409
01:05:48,280 --> 01:05:51,680
Speaker 1: for Logic? Another project and and and a tour? Okay,

1410
01:05:52,240 --> 01:05:54,760
Speaker 1: how do you feel having had this incredible success? Is

1411
01:05:54,760 --> 01:05:57,760
Speaker 1: that pressure to come up with the track to follow up?

1412
01:05:58,640 --> 01:06:01,680
Speaker 1: Not at all? Not at all, double double the fan base,

1413
01:06:01,720 --> 01:06:03,440
Speaker 1: double a touring, everything else, to take care of yourself.

1414
01:06:03,520 --> 01:06:07,280
Speaker 1: And you don't think he feels the pressure, not at all. Okay,

1415
01:06:07,320 --> 01:06:09,760
Speaker 1: So let's let's go down some of the landscape here.

1416
01:06:10,920 --> 01:06:14,919
Speaker 1: You mentioned streaming versus I tunes. Let's start with something

1417
01:06:14,960 --> 01:06:17,560
Speaker 1: a little bit different at this point in time, with

1418
01:06:17,600 --> 01:06:20,360
Speaker 1: someone like Logic and with the demo that you appeal to.

1419
01:06:20,760 --> 01:06:24,840
Speaker 1: How important is terrestrial radio? In my opinion again this

1420
01:06:25,000 --> 01:06:29,200
Speaker 1: is I think it's very important. Okay, So do you

1421
01:06:29,280 --> 01:06:32,920
Speaker 1: think again? I again, coming from a perspective, I only

1422
01:06:32,960 --> 01:06:36,320
Speaker 1: care about attention. Where's the attention? Well, I'm talking, I'm

1423
01:06:36,360 --> 01:06:38,840
Speaker 1: weighing things out, okay, because what do we know. We

1424
01:06:38,880 --> 01:06:41,360
Speaker 1: know that Best Boy said they're gonna stop selling CDs,

1425
01:06:41,680 --> 01:06:43,480
Speaker 1: so it's gonna be hard to even find a CD

1426
01:06:43,640 --> 01:06:46,680
Speaker 1: have to order Amazon. We know that iTunes sales of

1427
01:06:46,800 --> 01:06:50,160
Speaker 1: tracks is down, and streaming is up. We know that

1428
01:06:50,200 --> 01:06:52,360
Speaker 1: if we look at the Spotify Top fifty in America,

1429
01:06:52,360 --> 01:06:56,520
Speaker 1: it's mostly hip hop, so we're seeing trends. So I'm

1430
01:06:56,600 --> 01:06:59,720
Speaker 1: asking you where do you believe, especially since you're the

1431
01:07:00,040 --> 01:07:03,840
Speaker 1: act represent is speaking to a younger demo, certainly under

1432
01:07:03,840 --> 01:07:06,600
Speaker 1: the age of where do you think it's all going?

1433
01:07:07,080 --> 01:07:12,120
Speaker 1: Likely likely towards a streaming world. Is where it's going? Um,

1434
01:07:12,160 --> 01:07:16,000
Speaker 1: you know, and and I to me, it's it's I

1435
01:07:16,040 --> 01:07:19,960
Speaker 1: think it's easier for people like I think streaming killed music.

1436
01:07:20,000 --> 01:07:23,000
Speaker 1: Pirating You don't really don't pirate music, And I agree,

1437
01:07:23,240 --> 01:07:25,760
Speaker 1: it's too much time and I can't imagine doing it

1438
01:07:25,920 --> 01:07:28,840
Speaker 1: because if you if if you create less of because

1439
01:07:29,320 --> 01:07:31,840
Speaker 1: obviously we've all pired of music. Whether you want to

1440
01:07:31,840 --> 01:07:33,760
Speaker 1: write or not, you have time. You don't know what

1441
01:07:33,800 --> 01:07:35,600
Speaker 1: you're getting when you click that download link, right, Am

1442
01:07:35,600 --> 01:07:37,680
Speaker 1: I downloading some some bullshit virus that is going to

1443
01:07:37,720 --> 01:07:41,439
Speaker 1: screw up my my computer or whatever? Um, I think

1444
01:07:41,680 --> 01:07:43,840
Speaker 1: streaming made it easier for the consumer, so it won't

1445
01:07:44,360 --> 01:07:47,200
Speaker 1: that simple. I guess what I'm saying because you brought

1446
01:07:47,280 --> 01:07:49,840
Speaker 1: up the issue of the bounce on iTunes is opposed

1447
01:07:50,200 --> 01:07:53,880
Speaker 1: to Spotify. What we know is if someone who's Drake

1448
01:07:54,080 --> 01:07:56,840
Speaker 1: or The Weekend puts out new music and immediately goes

1449
01:07:56,840 --> 01:08:01,240
Speaker 1: to the top of the Spotify chart, whereas radio. I mean,

1450
01:08:01,240 --> 01:08:03,880
Speaker 1: this is a big controversy in the UK edge they're

1451
01:08:03,920 --> 01:08:06,280
Speaker 1: changing the Shark charts because Ed Shearon put out a

1452
01:08:06,280 --> 01:08:09,080
Speaker 1: record and like all of his wrecked tracks were at

1453
01:08:09,120 --> 01:08:11,040
Speaker 1: the top of the chick I think I think radio

1454
01:08:11,120 --> 01:08:14,760
Speaker 1: happens a little bit, there's lag there. I think streaming

1455
01:08:14,800 --> 01:08:18,160
Speaker 1: is immediate and and then when things react there then

1456
01:08:18,240 --> 01:08:20,920
Speaker 1: it it'll happen at radio. It doesn't make that audience

1457
01:08:20,920 --> 01:08:25,760
Speaker 1: any less important. But do you think that audience is stable, increasing,

1458
01:08:25,920 --> 01:08:31,800
Speaker 1: decreasing or what at at radio? Probably stable? You really think? So?

1459
01:08:32,400 --> 01:08:36,120
Speaker 1: You think that your audience, which certainly lives on the Internet,

1460
01:08:36,160 --> 01:08:38,320
Speaker 1: whether it be on a handtel, the desktop or whatever,

1461
01:08:38,840 --> 01:08:42,920
Speaker 1: you believe that they're still listening to terrestrial radio. I don't.

1462
01:08:42,960 --> 01:08:47,200
Speaker 1: I think the younger demographic tends to lean more towards streaming, um,

1463
01:08:47,240 --> 01:08:49,960
Speaker 1: you know, and and and the older demo is on

1464
01:08:50,080 --> 01:08:52,479
Speaker 1: terresto radio. Okay, So if I were to pull up

1465
01:08:52,520 --> 01:08:56,519
Speaker 1: your album Logics album, obviously one eight suicide prevention song

1466
01:08:56,560 --> 01:09:01,040
Speaker 1: has got you know, a gazillion streams the to the album.

1467
01:09:01,080 --> 01:09:03,840
Speaker 1: Are the tracks consistent in the number of streams they

1468
01:09:03,880 --> 01:09:06,800
Speaker 1: have or do they vary? The tracks are consistent, I

1469
01:09:06,800 --> 01:09:09,200
Speaker 1: think one hundred outlier, but there's a handful of tracks

1470
01:09:09,200 --> 01:09:11,320
Speaker 1: and there I think on Spotify Loan that over a

1471
01:09:11,400 --> 01:09:14,840
Speaker 1: hundred million streams. So you believe people are listening to

1472
01:09:14,880 --> 01:09:17,679
Speaker 1: the album as an album, absolutely, I mean the numbers

1473
01:09:17,680 --> 01:09:20,479
Speaker 1: show that, right. I think I think all this the

1474
01:09:20,520 --> 01:09:22,400
Speaker 1: way I look at it at a single, right, I

1475
01:09:22,400 --> 01:09:24,519
Speaker 1: think it's just a gateway drug to that artist and

1476
01:09:25,040 --> 01:09:27,200
Speaker 1: to pull them into to that world and and and

1477
01:09:27,200 --> 01:09:29,160
Speaker 1: dive in. And I think that's well, there's a story

1478
01:09:29,320 --> 01:09:30,439
Speaker 1: as we sit here in the story in the Well

1479
01:09:30,479 --> 01:09:33,679
Speaker 1: Street Journal, I believe today talking about Cardi B. Who

1480
01:09:33,800 --> 01:09:35,559
Speaker 1: is you know, maybe the biggest act of the last

1481
01:09:35,560 --> 01:09:39,439
Speaker 1: six months doesn't even have an album, right, So then

1482
01:09:39,479 --> 01:09:42,320
Speaker 1: you say, well, you is it that you're you're um?

1483
01:09:43,120 --> 01:09:45,840
Speaker 1: Is it that logic has got an extended message that

1484
01:09:45,960 --> 01:09:49,680
Speaker 1: his audience wants. Yeah, because I think they're they're bought in.

1485
01:09:49,760 --> 01:09:52,240
Speaker 1: I think there's a really big base there and I

1486
01:09:52,280 --> 01:09:56,320
Speaker 1: think they they follow his narrative right and and to

1487
01:09:56,400 --> 01:09:59,360
Speaker 1: the Cardi point there, there's more than one way to win.

1488
01:09:59,600 --> 01:10:01,840
Speaker 1: That's one thing I learned more than anything. Um, I

1489
01:10:01,840 --> 01:10:04,960
Speaker 1: think you have to adapt and pivot based on the artist, right.

1490
01:10:05,320 --> 01:10:08,599
Speaker 1: I think I've been very fortunate to work with Lodging

1491
01:10:08,680 --> 01:10:14,000
Speaker 1: John who who are very, very, very talented songwriters, and

1492
01:10:14,640 --> 01:10:18,280
Speaker 1: they write from from their narrative, in their perspective on

1493
01:10:18,320 --> 01:10:20,320
Speaker 1: how they view the world and things they went through.

1494
01:10:20,840 --> 01:10:22,960
Speaker 1: I think that's what's helped us for both of them

1495
01:10:23,360 --> 01:10:26,840
Speaker 1: build two really strong bases, is that there's something there

1496
01:10:26,840 --> 01:10:29,879
Speaker 1: that a fan can attach onto that story, that narrative,

1497
01:10:29,920 --> 01:10:33,040
Speaker 1: and they can relate. I think relatability is the most

1498
01:10:33,080 --> 01:10:36,280
Speaker 1: important thing. I think that's that's really what a die

1499
01:10:36,320 --> 01:10:39,719
Speaker 1: hard fan is, feeling like there's some sort of personal

1500
01:10:39,720 --> 01:10:42,439
Speaker 1: connection between you and that artist. That's the zeitgeist. I

1501
01:10:42,479 --> 01:10:44,360
Speaker 1: couldn't agree more. And that's why one of the reasons

1502
01:10:44,400 --> 01:10:46,120
Speaker 1: so much of today's pop music in the last twelve

1503
01:10:46,200 --> 01:10:48,880
Speaker 1: months has failed. It's failed to achieve that. Okay, you

1504
01:10:48,920 --> 01:10:51,880
Speaker 1: own a house, do I know where? Do you live

1505
01:10:52,200 --> 01:10:55,600
Speaker 1: in Manhattan? So you rented apartment? I do? Okay, do

1506
01:10:55,640 --> 01:10:59,640
Speaker 1: you in a relationship currently? Now? Okay, theoretically if you

1507
01:10:59,720 --> 01:11:02,200
Speaker 1: found uh the right person, do you have enough time

1508
01:11:02,240 --> 01:11:05,360
Speaker 1: for that? Absolutely? You make time for it's important. Okay, Well,

1509
01:11:05,400 --> 01:11:07,559
Speaker 1: some people are dedicated to their work. So how many

1510
01:11:07,600 --> 01:11:13,000
Speaker 1: people are working for your organization now? Currently? Total? Three? Okay,

1511
01:11:13,000 --> 01:11:16,280
Speaker 1: what do you want? I want to keep it this size?

1512
01:11:16,600 --> 01:11:19,400
Speaker 1: You want to grow, We're gonna scale. I think it's inevitable.

1513
01:11:19,880 --> 01:11:23,320
Speaker 1: It's a goal mine. Um, absolutely, And you have not

1514
01:11:23,479 --> 01:11:25,760
Speaker 1: You have such success with logic. Do people come to

1515
01:11:25,840 --> 01:11:30,040
Speaker 1: you to manage as Yeah? I think so. Um. You know,

1516
01:11:30,080 --> 01:11:32,639
Speaker 1: whether whether I have the time to kind of look

1517
01:11:32,640 --> 01:11:35,479
Speaker 1: at everything or not it you know, I think that's

1518
01:11:35,520 --> 01:11:37,680
Speaker 1: the That's what matters. I think, you know. For me,

1519
01:11:37,720 --> 01:11:40,360
Speaker 1: it's all gut still right. I just need something. I

1520
01:11:40,360 --> 01:11:42,000
Speaker 1: need to feel that thing and be like, Okay, you've

1521
01:11:42,000 --> 01:11:45,280
Speaker 1: had a lot of experience since two thousand nine, but

1522
01:11:45,360 --> 01:11:47,559
Speaker 1: in this business there are people who have much more

1523
01:11:47,600 --> 01:11:51,200
Speaker 1: experience than you. And it's also a business. I don't

1524
01:11:51,240 --> 01:11:56,200
Speaker 1: care despite any kind of college program, Uh, you really

1525
01:11:56,240 --> 01:11:59,000
Speaker 1: can only learn by doing. I couldn't agree with that more.

1526
01:11:59,040 --> 01:12:01,439
Speaker 1: I think if you want to work in the music business,

1527
01:12:02,200 --> 01:12:04,000
Speaker 1: and this is very I'm gonna make it, don't go

1528
01:12:04,040 --> 01:12:06,320
Speaker 1: to college. Don't go to college at all. Don't go

1529
01:12:06,360 --> 01:12:08,640
Speaker 1: to college at all. You cannot learn this business in

1530
01:12:08,640 --> 01:12:11,559
Speaker 1: a textbook period. Okay, I agree with that. Do you

1531
01:12:11,600 --> 01:12:15,360
Speaker 1: believe your college experience paid any dividends in your life

1532
01:12:15,520 --> 01:12:18,719
Speaker 1: forgetting the music business? Or maybe intersecting with that, would

1533
01:12:18,720 --> 01:12:21,320
Speaker 1: you say college itself was no of no benefit to

1534
01:12:21,360 --> 01:12:24,519
Speaker 1: you from zero. I have a major issue with with

1535
01:12:25,320 --> 01:12:30,920
Speaker 1: the higher education in this contract. Well, I'm fascinated. What

1536
01:12:31,080 --> 01:12:35,559
Speaker 1: is it? Um, it's a business, is what is the

1537
01:12:35,560 --> 01:12:38,799
Speaker 1: problem with it? You're charging you cannot put a price

1538
01:12:38,840 --> 01:12:40,720
Speaker 1: on education. I don't know how you do that. I

1539
01:12:40,760 --> 01:12:43,320
Speaker 1: don't I don't understand the concept of it. And I was.

1540
01:12:43,520 --> 01:12:48,200
Speaker 1: I was the squeaky wheel and likely pain in the

1541
01:12:48,240 --> 01:12:50,880
Speaker 1: ass every college I went to, all four of them,

1542
01:12:50,920 --> 01:12:53,160
Speaker 1: where I had major issues with the way things were

1543
01:12:53,479 --> 01:12:55,600
Speaker 1: and couldn't really get real answers on a lot of

1544
01:12:55,600 --> 01:12:58,920
Speaker 1: this stuff. Um. Even even you know, at at at

1545
01:12:58,920 --> 01:13:01,040
Speaker 1: a Delphi, I remember I had there was banners on

1546
01:13:01,040 --> 01:13:03,360
Speaker 1: the campus about like I think it was some sort

1547
01:13:03,360 --> 01:13:06,280
Speaker 1: of entrepreneurship kind of having kids go out and do

1548
01:13:06,320 --> 01:13:09,639
Speaker 1: it themselves, which is exactly what I was doing. Um.

1549
01:13:09,880 --> 01:13:11,800
Speaker 1: And they're saying, you know, they're here to help you.

1550
01:13:11,880 --> 01:13:15,240
Speaker 1: And remember having all conversations with with professors at the

1551
01:13:15,280 --> 01:13:17,800
Speaker 1: time Hey, I'm doing I'm the manager. I'm doing this

1552
01:13:17,840 --> 01:13:19,519
Speaker 1: at the time because again at the time when I

1553
01:13:19,560 --> 01:13:22,200
Speaker 1: was starting, I borrow my dad's car, pick up my artists,

1554
01:13:22,200 --> 01:13:23,760
Speaker 1: and we drive to a show. That's how we did

1555
01:13:23,760 --> 01:13:25,479
Speaker 1: it right in My commission would be a hundred and

1556
01:13:25,520 --> 01:13:28,479
Speaker 1: fifty dollars probably, And I said, listen, you know, is

1557
01:13:28,479 --> 01:13:31,400
Speaker 1: there anywhere I could take the exam earlier figure it

1558
01:13:31,439 --> 01:13:34,040
Speaker 1: out a way around it. No, And it was I

1559
01:13:34,120 --> 01:13:35,960
Speaker 1: ran into that over and over and over again. And

1560
01:13:36,000 --> 01:13:40,439
Speaker 1: even you know, I was a business major, having to

1561
01:13:41,960 --> 01:13:45,160
Speaker 1: take art classes my senior year in order to graduate,

1562
01:13:45,320 --> 01:13:48,960
Speaker 1: I took. I had to had no choice. Handbuilding with Clay.

1563
01:13:49,000 --> 01:13:52,760
Speaker 1: I would literally go to and and do pottery and

1564
01:13:52,760 --> 01:13:55,680
Speaker 1: and I would fight my advisor and and ask her

1565
01:13:56,080 --> 01:13:59,360
Speaker 1: how is this benefiting me as a businessman? Um? And

1566
01:13:59,400 --> 01:14:01,160
Speaker 1: she couldn't really answer it. It was it was simply

1567
01:14:01,200 --> 01:14:03,840
Speaker 1: because they wanted money from the credits. Those credits cast

1568
01:14:03,840 --> 01:14:08,280
Speaker 1: the same as managerial finance Sam Price. Okay, I can

1569
01:14:08,280 --> 01:14:11,800
Speaker 1: play with Clay for free. Okay, the uh the management

1570
01:14:11,840 --> 01:14:15,880
Speaker 1: courses you took help you at all? No, I don't

1571
01:14:15,880 --> 01:14:19,559
Speaker 1: think so, okay. So I was half checked in, half

1572
01:14:19,640 --> 01:14:22,559
Speaker 1: checked out. I understand. I mean, you know, it's like

1573
01:14:22,760 --> 01:14:26,479
Speaker 1: they have these college courses in entrepreneurship, entrepreneurs are born.

1574
01:14:26,800 --> 01:14:28,479
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't think you can teach somebody to

1575
01:14:28,520 --> 01:14:30,720
Speaker 1: be an entrepreneur. I think I agree with that. I

1576
01:14:30,800 --> 01:14:32,479
Speaker 1: think it's a lot of it is d NA, right.

1577
01:14:32,520 --> 01:14:35,240
Speaker 1: I think as I've gotten older and become more self aware,

1578
01:14:35,880 --> 01:14:38,759
Speaker 1: I recognized that that it was just it was partially

1579
01:14:38,760 --> 01:14:40,479
Speaker 1: who I was, and it just took me a long

1580
01:14:40,560 --> 01:14:42,200
Speaker 1: time to figure it out, I think. But it is

1581
01:14:42,280 --> 01:14:45,439
Speaker 1: fascinating because you know, when you're first on your first

1582
01:14:45,479 --> 01:14:47,720
Speaker 1: club tour, most people are not interested. But as you

1583
01:14:47,800 --> 01:14:50,960
Speaker 1: have success, it's like when you make a deal for

1584
01:14:51,040 --> 01:14:53,360
Speaker 1: a tour, there are people who've been doing this for

1585
01:14:53,360 --> 01:14:57,920
Speaker 1: forty years who obviously no more than you and they

1586
01:14:58,040 --> 01:15:00,840
Speaker 1: and there's nowhere to learn that other than the school

1587
01:15:00,880 --> 01:15:03,960
Speaker 1: of hard knocks. And then many people are worried that

1588
01:15:04,080 --> 01:15:06,600
Speaker 1: you know, their act is gonna go with someone more experienced.

1589
01:15:06,920 --> 01:15:09,559
Speaker 1: You haven't had that. But it's you ever, I mean

1590
01:15:09,560 --> 01:15:11,280
Speaker 1: you mentioned a couple of times during the podcast you

1591
01:15:11,280 --> 01:15:13,559
Speaker 1: ever say you know, God it if I knew then

1592
01:15:13,600 --> 01:15:17,160
Speaker 1: what I know now, absolutely, But you you can't. You

1593
01:15:17,200 --> 01:15:19,360
Speaker 1: can't know back then what you know now, it's not

1594
01:15:19,400 --> 01:15:23,120
Speaker 1: how life works. And I think i'm I'm a much

1595
01:15:23,160 --> 01:15:25,160
Speaker 1: better manager today for all of the things that I

1596
01:15:25,240 --> 01:15:28,479
Speaker 1: learned by trial and error and and and learning as

1597
01:15:28,479 --> 01:15:31,120
Speaker 1: I went right. You you you can look back and go, shit,

1598
01:15:31,160 --> 01:15:32,599
Speaker 1: I made the right decision, or oh shit, I made

1599
01:15:32,600 --> 01:15:35,479
Speaker 1: the wrong decision. I'm I'm grateful and unfortunate. I didn't

1600
01:15:35,479 --> 01:15:39,080
Speaker 1: make any wrong decisions that were career threatening or ruining

1601
01:15:39,120 --> 01:15:41,960
Speaker 1: to to to my artists. So so before we started

1602
01:15:42,000 --> 01:15:45,120
Speaker 1: the podcast, you were saying you're very bullish on music,

1603
01:15:45,280 --> 01:15:47,400
Speaker 1: very bullish on the scene. Could you go on a

1604
01:15:47,400 --> 01:15:49,160
Speaker 1: little bit about that. I think it's I think it's

1605
01:15:49,200 --> 01:15:51,360
Speaker 1: the most exciting time to be in the business literally right,

1606
01:15:51,400 --> 01:15:54,800
Speaker 1: because if, if, if you can pivot and and and

1607
01:15:54,880 --> 01:15:58,280
Speaker 1: adapt right, I think a lot of people spend time

1608
01:15:58,320 --> 01:16:02,240
Speaker 1: and energy complaining about the current state of the music business. Um,

1609
01:16:02,240 --> 01:16:03,920
Speaker 1: it's funny. I was in the studio back in New

1610
01:16:03,960 --> 01:16:05,360
Speaker 1: York with John the other day and we're having this

1611
01:16:05,479 --> 01:16:08,240
Speaker 1: We just talked about the business conversation. A lot of

1612
01:16:08,280 --> 01:16:11,920
Speaker 1: people get frustrated. All we're living in a singles culture,

1613
01:16:12,479 --> 01:16:16,639
Speaker 1: so what so what like then adapt and and and

1614
01:16:16,720 --> 01:16:20,240
Speaker 1: do that right? Rather than then I wish the business

1615
01:16:20,280 --> 01:16:22,360
Speaker 1: was like but it's not right. And I think if

1616
01:16:22,360 --> 01:16:26,320
Speaker 1: you can do that and you can adapt quickly, and

1617
01:16:26,360 --> 01:16:28,040
Speaker 1: you have an artist who can do that as well,

1618
01:16:28,120 --> 01:16:30,000
Speaker 1: you're you're really gonna win. And that's what that's what's

1619
01:16:30,000 --> 01:16:32,160
Speaker 1: exciting about it to me, because I think I'm learning

1620
01:16:32,160 --> 01:16:36,120
Speaker 1: every day. Um again, having an artist performed at the

1621
01:16:36,120 --> 01:16:39,000
Speaker 1: Grammys and then the next morning looking at dad, I

1622
01:16:39,080 --> 01:16:41,400
Speaker 1: trying to figure out, Okay, what did that do and

1623
01:16:41,479 --> 01:16:44,679
Speaker 1: let's learn from it? And and um, you know, having

1624
01:16:44,920 --> 01:16:47,640
Speaker 1: a group conversation with you know, everyone who works with

1625
01:16:47,680 --> 01:16:50,240
Speaker 1: me and trying to figure it out. Um, that to

1626
01:16:50,280 --> 01:16:52,320
Speaker 1: me is what's exciting. And do you have a lot

1627
01:16:52,320 --> 01:16:56,519
Speaker 1: of people who you're contemporaries who you communicate with? Oh? Yeah, yeah,

1628
01:16:56,600 --> 01:16:59,519
Speaker 1: I've as I've been very lucky to make some amazing,

1629
01:17:00,280 --> 01:17:03,320
Speaker 1: hopefully lifelong friends in the business. I mean, that's just okay.

1630
01:17:03,400 --> 01:17:05,040
Speaker 1: And the other thing is you're you live in New York,

1631
01:17:05,080 --> 01:17:06,800
Speaker 1: but you're out here in l A. You see it

1632
01:17:06,880 --> 01:17:09,400
Speaker 1: come on a regular basis, take meetings. Who you what

1633
01:17:09,479 --> 01:17:11,920
Speaker 1: kind of people are you meeting with? Label people I've

1634
01:17:11,960 --> 01:17:14,439
Speaker 1: I've you know, it's just part of networking in the business,

1635
01:17:14,520 --> 01:17:17,320
Speaker 1: whether it's you know, Live Nation or a g because

1636
01:17:17,320 --> 01:17:21,360
Speaker 1: we're touring. Um, different agents are agents. Logic agents are

1637
01:17:21,360 --> 01:17:24,120
Speaker 1: based out here, John's are as well. I think last

1638
01:17:24,160 --> 01:17:27,559
Speaker 1: year I spent close to sixty days out here. Okay,

1639
01:17:27,600 --> 01:17:30,080
Speaker 1: So for those people who literally know nothing and don't

1640
01:17:30,080 --> 01:17:32,479
Speaker 1: have your personality, you just say I'm gonna go to

1641
01:17:32,560 --> 01:17:34,639
Speaker 1: l A. You make meetings in advance, you say let's

1642
01:17:34,640 --> 01:17:36,720
Speaker 1: go to lunch. What do you do? Right? We we

1643
01:17:36,720 --> 01:17:38,920
Speaker 1: were on email about a week and a half ago. Right,

1644
01:17:38,920 --> 01:17:43,360
Speaker 1: So I'm figuring my schedule out and and um schedule lunches, dinners, breakfast.

1645
01:17:43,520 --> 01:17:45,840
Speaker 1: Wherever I can get in front of people, I'll do it.

1646
01:17:45,880 --> 01:17:47,920
Speaker 1: I like to be busy. I think downtime is I

1647
01:17:48,000 --> 01:17:49,960
Speaker 1: hate it, especially when I'm traveling, right, because then you

1648
01:17:49,960 --> 01:17:52,080
Speaker 1: feel like you're wasting your time. I hung with I

1649
01:17:52,120 --> 01:17:53,560
Speaker 1: hung with Logic. He lives out here. I was with

1650
01:17:53,640 --> 01:17:55,559
Speaker 1: him in the past two nights, was at his house.

1651
01:17:55,640 --> 01:17:58,360
Speaker 1: So what's he up to these days? Working on music?

1652
01:17:58,920 --> 01:18:03,240
Speaker 1: He's never not working. So and he's now married. Yeah,

1653
01:18:03,560 --> 01:18:06,200
Speaker 1: he's been married two years. Um, he's a challenge when

1654
01:18:06,240 --> 01:18:09,599
Speaker 1: you're an artist, but everybody tries and he's uh, he's

1655
01:18:09,640 --> 01:18:13,680
Speaker 1: working on music. We're getting ready for something and a

1656
01:18:13,760 --> 01:18:16,479
Speaker 1: tour hopefully. Okay, So at the end of the day,

1657
01:18:17,200 --> 01:18:21,160
Speaker 1: forty years from now, any big goals, anything you've really

1658
01:18:21,160 --> 01:18:24,160
Speaker 1: wanted to accomplish, No, I said, I said small goals.

1659
01:18:24,200 --> 01:18:27,160
Speaker 1: I said, year goals. Um with with the company, will

1660
01:18:27,160 --> 01:18:29,040
Speaker 1: sit down and we'll we'll set goals. What do we

1661
01:18:29,040 --> 01:18:30,800
Speaker 1: want to accomplish this year? And again it's one of

1662
01:18:30,800 --> 01:18:32,280
Speaker 1: the it's part of my thesis. If you do that

1663
01:18:32,320 --> 01:18:35,160
Speaker 1: every year, you're you're you're gonna win in the end, right,

1664
01:18:35,280 --> 01:18:37,120
Speaker 1: double the bass, double the touring, and if you focus

1665
01:18:37,160 --> 01:18:39,400
Speaker 1: on that, things are gonna happen. Okay, just want to

1666
01:18:39,400 --> 01:18:40,760
Speaker 1: go back to chapter because he said, you know they're

1667
01:18:40,760 --> 01:18:44,120
Speaker 1: bumps in the road. The goal is to double. Let's

1668
01:18:44,120 --> 01:18:46,599
Speaker 1: assume you start going down the path and it's not

1669
01:18:46,640 --> 01:18:50,160
Speaker 1: going in the right direction. What do you do? Pivot?

1670
01:18:50,360 --> 01:18:53,240
Speaker 1: That's all you can do. Right, Well, I see this

1671
01:18:53,280 --> 01:18:55,559
Speaker 1: is an audio podcast. You can't see the big smile

1672
01:18:55,600 --> 01:18:57,759
Speaker 1: on his face. But it's very different from the baby

1673
01:18:57,760 --> 01:19:01,479
Speaker 1: Blue mentality, which they'll double down on what they're already doing.

1674
01:19:01,479 --> 01:19:04,160
Speaker 1: The concept of pivot, which really the term comes as

1675
01:19:04,160 --> 01:19:07,240
Speaker 1: a result of pivoting in the tech business too many people.

1676
01:19:07,360 --> 01:19:09,439
Speaker 1: If it's not working, It's like you know, I tell

1677
01:19:09,479 --> 01:19:11,400
Speaker 1: people all the time, if you're putting up on music,

1678
01:19:11,439 --> 01:19:14,840
Speaker 1: you're not getting a reaction. Correct and assuming you're you're not,

1679
01:19:14,880 --> 01:19:17,080
Speaker 1: you're unhappy with that. You gotta pivot. But that's a

1680
01:19:17,080 --> 01:19:19,919
Speaker 1: beautiful thing. I think, because I was having this conversation

1681
01:19:19,960 --> 01:19:22,920
Speaker 1: recently with somebody, I think we're living through There's no

1682
01:19:23,200 --> 01:19:27,559
Speaker 1: such thing anymore in my mind as a bad album

1683
01:19:27,640 --> 01:19:31,000
Speaker 1: or bad record ruining your career like it used to write.

1684
01:19:31,280 --> 01:19:32,920
Speaker 1: I think if you look at the nineties and if

1685
01:19:32,960 --> 01:19:35,360
Speaker 1: you let's say, the sophomore slump was a thing, I

1686
01:19:35,400 --> 01:19:37,439
Speaker 1: don't know if that exists anymore. You're always as good

1687
01:19:37,479 --> 01:19:40,000
Speaker 1: as your last at bat right. And I'm not here

1688
01:19:40,040 --> 01:19:42,559
Speaker 1: to name artists, but there's some some major artists I

1689
01:19:42,560 --> 01:19:45,400
Speaker 1: think in the past year, um male and female pop

1690
01:19:45,479 --> 01:19:49,200
Speaker 1: artists right that can can or have been selling out

1691
01:19:49,200 --> 01:19:52,679
Speaker 1: arenas in some stadiums, that came out with an album

1692
01:19:52,760 --> 01:19:55,799
Speaker 1: that didn't do well well. Lady Gaga, right, Lady Gaga's

1693
01:19:55,840 --> 01:19:58,200
Speaker 1: last album is basically as Stiff. She was out with

1694
01:19:58,920 --> 01:20:01,800
Speaker 1: Tony Bennett and then she not alone. It's kind of amazing,

1695
01:20:02,200 --> 01:20:05,000
Speaker 1: but you look so you're good at your last a

1696
01:20:05,040 --> 01:20:07,479
Speaker 1: bat so so if if if that artist were to

1697
01:20:07,520 --> 01:20:10,880
Speaker 1: come with a hit record tomorrow, everybody forgets about about

1698
01:20:10,880 --> 01:20:13,160
Speaker 1: the flow. It's that that's what's cool about what we're

1699
01:20:13,160 --> 01:20:15,599
Speaker 1: living through. I think, okay, But let's the other thing

1700
01:20:15,760 --> 01:20:19,120
Speaker 1: is when you've got a choice in this matter. There

1701
01:20:19,240 --> 01:20:22,599
Speaker 1: used to be, you know, when the business became institutionalized

1702
01:20:22,600 --> 01:20:25,439
Speaker 1: in the seventies and eighties, there'll be you know, a

1703
01:20:25,439 --> 01:20:27,920
Speaker 1: three to five single process and the album would come

1704
01:20:27,920 --> 01:20:30,080
Speaker 1: out every three years. You look at Drake, He's putting

1705
01:20:30,080 --> 01:20:33,840
Speaker 1: out multiple projects per year. So I think you also

1706
01:20:33,920 --> 01:20:36,760
Speaker 1: have the ability he had Biber. Biber experimented for all

1707
01:20:36,760 --> 01:20:39,120
Speaker 1: of a sudden he had his huge comeback. So I

1708
01:20:39,160 --> 01:20:41,200
Speaker 1: think you also have to say I have the tools

1709
01:20:41,240 --> 01:20:43,679
Speaker 1: that if something is not working, I could come back

1710
01:20:43,760 --> 01:20:46,120
Speaker 1: up to back correct, whereas if you wait three to

1711
01:20:46,200 --> 01:20:48,759
Speaker 1: five years. If you look at the Justin Timberlake situation,

1712
01:20:48,760 --> 01:20:51,760
Speaker 1: which is fascinating because everyone seems to agree that the

1713
01:20:51,800 --> 01:20:55,080
Speaker 1: album is a disappointment, which is also a difference because

1714
01:20:55,080 --> 01:20:58,040
Speaker 1: a lot of times, you know, the spin goes otherwise. Um,

1715
01:20:58,240 --> 01:21:01,519
Speaker 1: he waited so long, I believe that he he were

1716
01:21:01,560 --> 01:21:05,479
Speaker 1: to put out new music within a year, this project

1717
01:21:05,479 --> 01:21:08,600
Speaker 1: would be forgotten. Certainly live business phenomenal. But if he

1718
01:21:08,640 --> 01:21:13,000
Speaker 1: waits three to five years, you know, let's let's go

1719
01:21:13,080 --> 01:21:16,320
Speaker 1: one step. You know, Kesha was off the market for

1720
01:21:16,360 --> 01:21:19,600
Speaker 1: a long time and she came back. It was very successful.

1721
01:21:19,880 --> 01:21:22,680
Speaker 1: What's your analysis of that? It was genuine She had

1722
01:21:22,680 --> 01:21:25,080
Speaker 1: gone through some some from what I understand, some horrible

1723
01:21:25,120 --> 01:21:28,080
Speaker 1: things and she wrote about it. That's I mean, that's

1724
01:21:28,080 --> 01:21:32,200
Speaker 1: that's you literally believe it's the music and the message

1725
01:21:32,200 --> 01:21:34,639
Speaker 1: she was sending. Absolutely. I think it's always that if

1726
01:21:34,680 --> 01:21:36,920
Speaker 1: you can make something that connects or resonates with people,

1727
01:21:37,200 --> 01:21:39,760
Speaker 1: you're gonna win. And that's again, that's what's exciting. So

1728
01:21:39,840 --> 01:21:42,400
Speaker 1: you can you know, you say, oh, we're in a

1729
01:21:42,520 --> 01:21:46,120
Speaker 1: we're in a it's too much consumption and it's oversaturated.

1730
01:21:46,560 --> 01:21:48,680
Speaker 1: Well yeah, until you cut through and then you're you're

1731
01:21:48,720 --> 01:21:52,719
Speaker 1: loving it, right, So it's it's about perspective. And again

1732
01:21:52,880 --> 01:21:55,400
Speaker 1: you can flop, but keep it moving. Don't don't wait

1733
01:21:55,439 --> 01:21:57,880
Speaker 1: three years and cry about it. Keep it moving. Okay,

1734
01:21:58,000 --> 01:22:01,599
Speaker 1: And certainly on street being services, both the two biggest

1735
01:22:01,640 --> 01:22:05,760
Speaker 1: in America, Apple and Spotify hip hop dominates. Do you

1736
01:22:05,840 --> 01:22:09,439
Speaker 1: anticipate that will continue to be the case, because I

1737
01:22:09,479 --> 01:22:12,960
Speaker 1: think it's clearly connecting in culture. I think, you know,

1738
01:22:13,000 --> 01:22:15,600
Speaker 1: and it dominates on those services because that's where the

1739
01:22:15,600 --> 01:22:17,800
Speaker 1: audience is. I think it's the younger demo that use

1740
01:22:17,880 --> 01:22:20,639
Speaker 1: those that use those services, and and that's what they're

1741
01:22:20,640 --> 01:22:24,840
Speaker 1: listening to, right, I think country might be they those

1742
01:22:24,880 --> 01:22:27,240
Speaker 1: listeners may consume music a little bit differently, the same

1743
01:22:27,240 --> 01:22:30,600
Speaker 1: with rock and and and and even even pop. I

1744
01:22:30,840 --> 01:22:33,920
Speaker 1: think the consumer the same pop consumer. What's funny hip

1745
01:22:33,960 --> 01:22:36,240
Speaker 1: hop is pop now that's all it is. It's of course,

1746
01:22:36,800 --> 01:22:39,519
Speaker 1: but it's so dominant. I mean, on some level, we

1747
01:22:39,560 --> 01:22:42,759
Speaker 1: have a landscape with no coherence. Everything is its own vertical.

1748
01:22:43,160 --> 01:22:45,960
Speaker 1: But if you look at hip hop is pop. But

1749
01:22:46,360 --> 01:22:49,200
Speaker 1: there's never been a sound that's been this dominant. But

1750
01:22:49,320 --> 01:22:51,439
Speaker 1: look at what Look what's common in hip hop. The

1751
01:22:51,439 --> 01:22:54,519
Speaker 1: consistency at which these artists drop music. That's why they're

1752
01:22:54,560 --> 01:22:57,479
Speaker 1: winning because they just let's put out two projects a year,

1753
01:22:57,520 --> 01:23:00,000
Speaker 1: three projects a year. He talked about Drake. He's done

1754
01:23:00,040 --> 01:23:01,519
Speaker 1: that now for three or four years in a row.

1755
01:23:01,840 --> 01:23:05,480
Speaker 1: There is no coincidence. Kendrick Lamar, right, it's no coincidence

1756
01:23:05,520 --> 01:23:09,000
Speaker 1: to me. He drops his album two weeks before Logics

1757
01:23:09,439 --> 01:23:11,360
Speaker 1: seen he just put out another album, right, the Black

1758
01:23:11,360 --> 01:23:14,280
Speaker 1: Panther sound, Right. I mean it's consistency, it's it's it's

1759
01:23:14,360 --> 01:23:19,559
Speaker 1: how how important the socials as opposed to the music itself.

1760
01:23:19,600 --> 01:23:21,680
Speaker 1: To me, that situational depending on the artist. Right, If

1761
01:23:21,680 --> 01:23:24,479
Speaker 1: you want to be public facing and you want to

1762
01:23:24,520 --> 01:23:26,759
Speaker 1: have a narrative with your fan base or with the public,

1763
01:23:26,960 --> 01:23:29,240
Speaker 1: then it's important. And if you don't, it's not. Well

1764
01:23:29,360 --> 01:23:34,200
Speaker 1: let's just assume, I mean forgetting phenomena like if you

1765
01:23:34,439 --> 01:23:37,759
Speaker 1: do not have socials and the songs are very good,

1766
01:23:38,800 --> 01:23:41,920
Speaker 1: can you make it there? There's there's a there's a

1767
01:23:41,960 --> 01:23:45,599
Speaker 1: million examples of that, and they call Kendrick Lamar, Frank Ocean.

1768
01:23:45,840 --> 01:23:48,719
Speaker 1: How much of being part of the scene important? Again,

1769
01:23:48,760 --> 01:23:50,200
Speaker 1: I think it depends on the artist. I think you

1770
01:23:50,240 --> 01:23:51,800
Speaker 1: can be a part of the scene if you want

1771
01:23:51,840 --> 01:23:54,439
Speaker 1: to and you want to be you know, out in it,

1772
01:23:54,600 --> 01:23:57,160
Speaker 1: and some don't. We I mean like other people guessing

1773
01:23:57,200 --> 01:24:00,200
Speaker 1: on your your track, you guesting on their tracks such

1774
01:24:00,240 --> 01:24:02,280
Speaker 1: that people would serve the net and become aware of

1775
01:24:02,280 --> 01:24:04,160
Speaker 1: what you're doing. I think hip hop's winning because they

1776
01:24:04,240 --> 01:24:07,080
Speaker 1: get it right. What what guest features are? It's cross promotion,

1777
01:24:07,280 --> 01:24:08,519
Speaker 1: all right? Let me let me get in front of

1778
01:24:08,560 --> 01:24:10,879
Speaker 1: your base, you get in front of mine. That's cross promotion,

1779
01:24:10,960 --> 01:24:13,760
Speaker 1: that's business, one on one, right, Um, not saying that

1780
01:24:13,760 --> 01:24:15,400
Speaker 1: they're looking at it like that. I just think that's

1781
01:24:15,400 --> 01:24:17,719
Speaker 1: what's happening. Well, we could go out for hours here.

1782
01:24:18,040 --> 01:24:20,559
Speaker 1: Is there anything you specifically want to say before we go? No,

1783
01:24:20,720 --> 01:24:22,680
Speaker 1: I appreciate you having me on. Okay. You know, we

1784
01:24:22,760 --> 01:24:24,920
Speaker 1: get a perspective from someone who's not only the younger

1785
01:24:24,960 --> 01:24:29,120
Speaker 1: generation but very successful with a hit act Logic and

1786
01:24:29,200 --> 01:24:32,160
Speaker 1: another one on the way. And the other thing about

1787
01:24:32,120 --> 01:24:34,639
Speaker 1: it is very optimistic as opposed to the old forts

1788
01:24:34,760 --> 01:24:37,880
Speaker 1: who believe music and the music business has been ruined. Chris, So,

1789
01:24:38,000 --> 01:24:46,120
Speaker 1: thanks so much for coming on the PUD. That wraps

1790
01:24:46,200 --> 01:24:49,040
Speaker 1: up this episode of the Bob Lefts Podcast with my guest,

1791
01:24:49,240 --> 01:24:52,719
Speaker 1: Visionary Music Group President Chris ru I hope you enjoyed

1792
01:24:52,800 --> 01:24:54,920
Speaker 1: just like I did hearing the story of getting from

1793
01:24:54,920 --> 01:24:57,760
Speaker 1: a Delphi University all the way to the v M

1794
01:24:57,760 --> 01:25:01,280
Speaker 1: a S and the Grammys, managing Jack's like Logic and

1795
01:25:01,360 --> 01:25:04,679
Speaker 1: John Belliam. Don't forget to subscribe to the podcast. I'm

1796
01:25:04,680 --> 01:25:08,400
Speaker 1: tune in Apple or your Apple choice. Until next time,

1797
01:25:08,720 --> 01:25:18,880
Speaker 1: I'm Bob left Sets can think of me reas and

1798
01:25:19,720 --> 01:25:27,200
Speaker 1: don't know exactly one must be its out down EA