1
00:00:00,360 --> 00:00:02,920
Speaker 1: Music Saved People. When we sit down with people in

2
00:00:02,960 --> 00:00:06,240
Speaker 1: this office, I'm constantly like, yeah, but what do you

3
00:00:06,240 --> 00:00:09,000
Speaker 1: want people to feel when they see this? Like that's

4
00:00:09,280 --> 00:00:10,800
Speaker 1: you know, what do you want them to do with

5
00:00:10,840 --> 00:00:13,239
Speaker 1: this information? You want them to take action? Do you

6
00:00:13,280 --> 00:00:16,320
Speaker 1: want them to absorb? Do you want them to cry?

7
00:00:16,560 --> 00:00:19,759
Speaker 1: Do you want them to laugh? Like? What does that

8
00:00:19,880 --> 00:00:23,440
Speaker 1: look like? And I think that when you can approach

9
00:00:23,520 --> 00:00:26,880
Speaker 1: it like that, it does provide a little bit more

10
00:00:26,920 --> 00:00:31,960
Speaker 1: of a human component to something that is very non human,

11
00:00:32,120 --> 00:00:34,200
Speaker 1: which is digital media.

12
00:00:34,280 --> 00:00:37,640
Speaker 2: I'm Len Hoffman, and welcome to the Music Saved Me Podcast,

13
00:00:37,720 --> 00:00:41,000
Speaker 2: the podcast where we discuss the healing power of music

14
00:00:41,640 --> 00:00:47,000
Speaker 2: and bring you the inside stories from musicians to insiders, inventors,

15
00:00:47,040 --> 00:00:49,839
Speaker 2: and even authors. And I think our guest today can

16
00:00:49,880 --> 00:00:52,879
Speaker 2: certainly speak from pretty much every aspect of all the

17
00:00:52,960 --> 00:00:56,520
Speaker 2: topics and so much more that I just listed. She

18
00:00:56,760 --> 00:01:00,400
Speaker 2: is an inspiring figure in the world of music, entered painment,

19
00:01:00,960 --> 00:01:05,600
Speaker 2: and leadership. Jenny Smythe is a renowned entrepreneur and the

20
00:01:05,600 --> 00:01:09,640
Speaker 2: founder and CEO of Gorilla Marketing in Nashville, spell gi

21
00:01:10,120 --> 00:01:14,720
Speaker 2: R Gorilla. Her career spans over two decades, starting in

22
00:01:14,760 --> 00:01:19,000
Speaker 2: the music industry at companies like Elektra, Disney's Hollywood Records,

23
00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:23,520
Speaker 2: Yahoo Music, Clear Channel. There's so many more. The whole

24
00:01:23,520 --> 00:01:27,440
Speaker 2: time would be over listing all your incredible accomplishments. Jenny

25
00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:29,600
Speaker 2: is also the author of a new book. It's a

26
00:01:29,640 --> 00:01:34,240
Speaker 2: beautiful and inspiring memoir called Becoming Gorilla, and I'm thrilled

27
00:01:34,319 --> 00:01:37,440
Speaker 2: to welcome her to Music Save Me. Jenny Smith, Welcome

28
00:01:37,480 --> 00:01:39,039
Speaker 2: to the show. It's so great to have you here

29
00:01:39,040 --> 00:01:39,560
Speaker 2: in person.

30
00:01:40,160 --> 00:01:41,560
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for having me.

31
00:01:41,959 --> 00:01:46,000
Speaker 2: All right, let's start off with your personal connection to music,

32
00:01:46,120 --> 00:01:48,200
Speaker 2: since it's sort of was sort of in the beginning,

33
00:01:48,200 --> 00:01:50,520
Speaker 2: in the foundation of your world. Can you share a

34
00:01:50,520 --> 00:01:54,800
Speaker 2: moment when music profoundly impacted your life or maybe helped

35
00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:56,160
Speaker 2: you through a challenging time.

36
00:01:57,040 --> 00:02:03,559
Speaker 1: I one hundred percent I MTV. MTV was a game

37
00:02:03,680 --> 00:02:11,120
Speaker 1: changer for me. I was a typical Gen X latchkey kid. I,

38
00:02:11,160 --> 00:02:16,320
Speaker 1: you know, had two working parents, two divorced parents, so

39
00:02:16,639 --> 00:02:21,400
Speaker 1: I for many hours after school I would go home

40
00:02:21,560 --> 00:02:23,480
Speaker 1: and be by myself, you know. And I had an

41
00:02:23,480 --> 00:02:26,160
Speaker 1: older sister, but she's six years older than me, and

42
00:02:26,240 --> 00:02:29,440
Speaker 1: so she and I often joked that my parents had

43
00:02:29,480 --> 00:02:34,000
Speaker 1: two only children, and we really didn't intersect until we

44
00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:35,880
Speaker 1: were like thirty years old, you know. I mean she

45
00:02:35,960 --> 00:02:38,040
Speaker 1: was an awesome big sister, but she was like too

46
00:02:38,120 --> 00:02:43,239
Speaker 1: cool to hang out with me, you know. But MTV

47
00:02:44,360 --> 00:02:49,160
Speaker 1: was the staple. And I don't a lot of people

48
00:02:49,200 --> 00:02:51,760
Speaker 1: tell their stories about MTV about when it came on air.

49
00:02:51,840 --> 00:02:56,079
Speaker 1: I don't actually remember when it came on air. I

50
00:02:56,320 --> 00:02:59,840
Speaker 1: just remember that after school, that is what went on

51
00:03:00,200 --> 00:03:03,120
Speaker 1: TV downstairs, and then you know, I would bring my

52
00:03:03,160 --> 00:03:05,760
Speaker 1: homework down there. I would bring my snacks down there.

53
00:03:06,440 --> 00:03:08,400
Speaker 1: We had a TV that you had to you know,

54
00:03:08,600 --> 00:03:13,000
Speaker 1: change the dial, and and then eventually VH one came

55
00:03:13,400 --> 00:03:17,880
Speaker 1: and so did be ET and so that became the

56
00:03:17,919 --> 00:03:24,000
Speaker 1: way that I consumed music, and not only consumed it

57
00:03:24,200 --> 00:03:27,000
Speaker 1: from you know, listening to the radio, but like watching

58
00:03:27,120 --> 00:03:30,919
Speaker 1: music videos and then seeing those chirons on the TV

59
00:03:31,320 --> 00:03:34,400
Speaker 1: of like what label it was, what the video director

60
00:03:34,680 --> 00:03:38,160
Speaker 1: was all of that. I was like, hey, like what

61
00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:40,440
Speaker 1: is this? You know, what's a record label, what's a

62
00:03:41,400 --> 00:03:43,880
Speaker 1: you know, what's a video director? Like what does all

63
00:03:43,920 --> 00:03:46,960
Speaker 1: of this mean? And I think generationally we were all

64
00:03:47,000 --> 00:03:50,920
Speaker 1: sort of blown away by seeing our music.

65
00:03:51,880 --> 00:03:54,520
Speaker 2: Absolutely I did the same thing. I mean, we couldn't

66
00:03:54,520 --> 00:03:57,240
Speaker 2: get home fast enough when there was a new you know,

67
00:03:57,360 --> 00:04:01,000
Speaker 2: Michael Jackson music video or you know, whatever it was

68
00:04:01,040 --> 00:04:04,080
Speaker 2: that they were playing on there. It's a very formative,

69
00:04:04,200 --> 00:04:07,560
Speaker 2: although I find it interesting that you were looking at

70
00:04:07,560 --> 00:04:11,520
Speaker 2: the labels and and that that information where I was like,

71
00:04:11,800 --> 00:04:14,360
Speaker 2: I want to be the host of the show.

72
00:04:14,480 --> 00:04:17,880
Speaker 1: You know. Well, I mean we ended up where we

73
00:04:17,880 --> 00:04:20,279
Speaker 1: were supposed to be, you know, like I know, right,

74
00:04:20,600 --> 00:04:23,120
Speaker 1: and we didn't have the internet, right, so I have

75
00:04:23,200 --> 00:04:26,599
Speaker 1: no I have no idea like why that was so

76
00:04:26,800 --> 00:04:30,320
Speaker 1: interesting to me, but it was. And then I kept

77
00:04:30,360 --> 00:04:34,120
Speaker 1: seeing repetitive names, you know, like what's Sony music, What's

78
00:04:34,160 --> 00:04:38,560
Speaker 1: Warner Music? I mean I think like I remember seeing

79
00:04:38,680 --> 00:04:45,320
Speaker 1: a Madonna video and figuring out Sire Records and then

80
00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:50,840
Speaker 1: going to the record store and asking, how do I

81
00:04:50,920 --> 00:04:57,400
Speaker 1: know what other records do Sire Records have? And the

82
00:04:57,400 --> 00:04:59,640
Speaker 1: the guy must have looked at you like what who

83
00:04:59,720 --> 00:05:04,360
Speaker 1: is this kid? You know? So I remember doing things

84
00:05:04,400 --> 00:05:07,440
Speaker 1: like that that were probably just like very odd ball behavior,

85
00:05:07,520 --> 00:05:11,040
Speaker 1: but you know, it was it was just in It

86
00:05:11,080 --> 00:05:12,960
Speaker 1: was it was interested me.

87
00:05:13,440 --> 00:05:15,960
Speaker 2: You were inquisitive and you and you wanted to ask questions,

88
00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:19,640
Speaker 2: and yeah, well that's how you had to be back then,

89
00:05:19,680 --> 00:05:21,800
Speaker 2: because you said there was there was no internet, So

90
00:05:22,000 --> 00:05:25,279
Speaker 2: how else do we know unless we asked right exactly

91
00:05:25,560 --> 00:05:27,840
Speaker 2: or went to the library, which I was really bad

92
00:05:27,839 --> 00:05:29,040
Speaker 2: at not doing.

93
00:05:29,560 --> 00:05:32,320
Speaker 1: I was not going to go library, Like, no, no.

94
00:05:32,480 --> 00:05:36,040
Speaker 2: How do you during that time where there's specific artists

95
00:05:36,120 --> 00:05:39,720
Speaker 2: or songs that really resonated with you, maybe say during

96
00:05:39,800 --> 00:05:41,480
Speaker 2: pivotal moments in your life.

97
00:05:41,960 --> 00:05:45,520
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, just entire movements of music, right, Like

98
00:05:46,440 --> 00:05:48,760
Speaker 1: it was kind of we were in that age where

99
00:05:49,120 --> 00:05:54,159
Speaker 1: people started to siphon themselves off into groups based on

100
00:05:54,200 --> 00:05:56,480
Speaker 1: the kind of music they listened to. So you were

101
00:05:56,560 --> 00:05:59,720
Speaker 1: like a rocker, like you were a stoner, you were

102
00:05:59,800 --> 00:06:04,400
Speaker 1: an kid. You know, you can't And I actually liked

103
00:06:04,640 --> 00:06:10,200
Speaker 1: everything and so yeah, and so like I didn't. I

104
00:06:10,279 --> 00:06:13,520
Speaker 1: didn't try to own that. I didn't try to you know.

105
00:06:13,800 --> 00:06:18,960
Speaker 1: I mean I certainly leaned more rock than anything else.

106
00:06:19,600 --> 00:06:22,560
Speaker 1: But man, I loved I mean the pop that was

107
00:06:22,600 --> 00:06:26,960
Speaker 1: coming out, you know, the Madonnas, the Cyndi Lauppers, the

108
00:06:27,600 --> 00:06:30,520
Speaker 1: you know, some of the Blondie videos, the you know,

109
00:06:30,760 --> 00:06:33,719
Speaker 1: I mean just they were they were rock too. They

110
00:06:33,800 --> 00:06:40,240
Speaker 1: just were massive global pop image icons, you know. I mean,

111
00:06:40,279 --> 00:06:43,520
Speaker 1: you just couldn't get it. You couldn't get off the

112
00:06:43,680 --> 00:06:48,520
Speaker 1: channel without seeing a strong individual woman.

113
00:06:49,400 --> 00:06:52,640
Speaker 2: How would you say your relationship with music has evolved

114
00:06:53,240 --> 00:06:54,120
Speaker 2: over the years.

115
00:06:54,520 --> 00:06:57,560
Speaker 1: I still get really excited, Like I mean, it's the

116
00:06:57,600 --> 00:07:00,400
Speaker 1: best part of my job, you know, Like I'll it

117
00:07:00,400 --> 00:07:04,080
Speaker 1: doesn't matter the types of clients I have. Like when

118
00:07:04,080 --> 00:07:08,520
Speaker 1: I hear a good song, it takes me right back

119
00:07:08,560 --> 00:07:12,600
Speaker 1: to that place in my heart where I get thrilled

120
00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:14,960
Speaker 1: to be excited to be part of a team that

121
00:07:15,040 --> 00:07:16,400
Speaker 1: can launch something like that.

122
00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:20,640
Speaker 2: Interesting that you say, being a part of a team.

123
00:07:21,280 --> 00:07:23,960
Speaker 2: I feel like that's my whole journey in life was

124
00:07:24,000 --> 00:07:27,360
Speaker 2: to just work with a really great team. But you

125
00:07:27,400 --> 00:07:29,400
Speaker 2: don't always get that right out of the gate, do you.

126
00:07:29,760 --> 00:07:32,600
Speaker 1: Oh, you don't. Sometimes you have to build it.

127
00:07:33,920 --> 00:07:36,160
Speaker 2: But when can you build the team if you're still

128
00:07:36,200 --> 00:07:39,160
Speaker 2: just starting out, you know, trying to make your way.

129
00:07:39,440 --> 00:07:41,720
Speaker 1: Like I mean, that's the thing, right is, like you

130
00:07:41,840 --> 00:07:48,400
Speaker 1: have to recognize, you what collaboration you need to be successful.

131
00:07:48,680 --> 00:07:52,400
Speaker 1: And you're right, like when you start thinking about it

132
00:07:52,440 --> 00:07:56,560
Speaker 1: in a linear fashion, like if it's a money hurdle,

133
00:07:56,800 --> 00:08:00,760
Speaker 1: or it's a time hurdle, or you know, all of

134
00:08:00,800 --> 00:08:05,600
Speaker 1: the things that we deal with of being entrepreneurs. But

135
00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:10,960
Speaker 1: at the heart of it. My job is so uniquely

136
00:08:11,080 --> 00:08:14,280
Speaker 1: collaborative that I just I have to find ways to

137
00:08:14,360 --> 00:08:18,800
Speaker 1: work with people and get it done. So even if

138
00:08:18,840 --> 00:08:22,640
Speaker 1: it's a trade you know, like and sometimes that just

139
00:08:22,680 --> 00:08:27,040
Speaker 1: comes in advice, Like I have competitors that I speak

140
00:08:27,080 --> 00:08:30,560
Speaker 1: to on the regular you know about what we're doing

141
00:08:30,640 --> 00:08:33,959
Speaker 1: and our area of the business. And over the years

142
00:08:33,960 --> 00:08:35,120
Speaker 1: that served me really well.

143
00:08:35,880 --> 00:08:39,040
Speaker 2: Not to be just for the for the for those listening,

144
00:08:40,679 --> 00:08:45,160
Speaker 2: you were very integral in terms of digital marketing or

145
00:08:45,520 --> 00:08:46,520
Speaker 2: musical artists.

146
00:08:46,760 --> 00:08:47,840
Speaker 3: Is that correct? Would that be?

147
00:08:48,240 --> 00:08:50,600
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know if I would say that

148
00:08:50,640 --> 00:08:56,680
Speaker 1: about myself, but I was at the I personally was

149
00:08:56,880 --> 00:09:02,280
Speaker 1: part of the generation that came online, and professionally, I

150
00:09:02,559 --> 00:09:05,600
Speaker 1: feel like I have been a good usher, a good

151
00:09:05,679 --> 00:09:10,480
Speaker 1: bridge between what has happened generationally.

152
00:09:10,679 --> 00:09:14,640
Speaker 2: Yes, it's big, I mean, especially the last twenty years.

153
00:09:14,760 --> 00:09:16,360
Speaker 1: Oh yeah.

154
00:09:16,400 --> 00:09:18,840
Speaker 2: When I moved to New York and got my first

155
00:09:18,920 --> 00:09:22,200
Speaker 2: job in television, it was VH one Classic, which was

156
00:09:22,240 --> 00:09:24,280
Speaker 2: a part of the very beginning of the launch of

157
00:09:24,600 --> 00:09:28,120
Speaker 2: digital television, which I had no idea what it was.

158
00:09:28,160 --> 00:09:30,440
Speaker 3: I was just thrilled to be there. It didn't matter.

159
00:09:31,240 --> 00:09:33,440
Speaker 1: Still, it's like one of the best things I've ever

160
00:09:33,440 --> 00:09:37,959
Speaker 1: seen on television, which a classic, the pop up videos

161
00:09:38,000 --> 00:09:42,040
Speaker 1: that VH one did. Oh yes, yes, best programming ever.

162
00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:43,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, and they should they should still have that on

163
00:09:43,960 --> 00:09:46,760
Speaker 2: the air today because there's still so much being done

164
00:09:46,760 --> 00:09:47,080
Speaker 2: about it.

165
00:09:47,120 --> 00:09:48,480
Speaker 3: But yeah, that really is.

166
00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:52,320
Speaker 2: It's an exciting time and interesting that it's taken so long.

167
00:09:52,960 --> 00:09:55,880
Speaker 2: It seems like it was yesterday, but now it's really

168
00:09:57,080 --> 00:10:01,560
Speaker 2: the thing that's driving everything. Yeah, is so adapting to

169
00:10:01,640 --> 00:10:05,320
Speaker 2: that must have been interesting and interesting time for you.

170
00:10:05,559 --> 00:10:08,960
Speaker 1: It was fun, right because we were in and we're

171
00:10:09,000 --> 00:10:12,840
Speaker 1: not in a dissimilar time right now because at the

172
00:10:12,920 --> 00:10:18,040
Speaker 1: time we still had TV, we had radio, we had touring,

173
00:10:18,240 --> 00:10:22,040
Speaker 1: you know, we had magazines, we had newspapers, we had critics,

174
00:10:22,160 --> 00:10:25,200
Speaker 1: we had all of that. But we didn't really have

175
00:10:25,320 --> 00:10:28,959
Speaker 1: a way to talk directly to our fans. So we

176
00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:32,840
Speaker 1: were speaking through third parties, which can be a benefit,

177
00:10:34,040 --> 00:10:34,760
Speaker 1: you know, it.

178
00:10:34,640 --> 00:10:37,360
Speaker 3: Can be You're right, we don't want to discount them.

179
00:10:37,360 --> 00:10:42,240
Speaker 1: They're very important, right, and it's we didn't have to

180
00:10:42,280 --> 00:10:46,120
Speaker 1: do nearly as much damage control, you know, as we

181
00:10:46,360 --> 00:10:51,960
Speaker 1: often find ourselves in positions of having to administer. But conversely,

182
00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:58,120
Speaker 1: as we grew and you know, digital and the fan

183
00:10:58,320 --> 00:11:03,479
Speaker 1: became the gate keeper instead of a lot of other sources.

184
00:11:05,120 --> 00:11:09,240
Speaker 1: It the volume of releases became a lot and some

185
00:11:09,320 --> 00:11:14,720
Speaker 1: of these other mediums, unfortunately have either dissipated or decreased.

186
00:11:16,120 --> 00:11:21,800
Speaker 1: So it's not it is a new opportunity. But every

187
00:11:21,840 --> 00:11:26,040
Speaker 1: sort of evolution comes, you know, there's a there's there's

188
00:11:26,200 --> 00:11:27,280
Speaker 1: death challenge.

189
00:11:27,559 --> 00:11:28,280
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yea.

190
00:11:28,440 --> 00:11:33,080
Speaker 1: So absolutely, it's not. It's not always like just growth

191
00:11:33,240 --> 00:11:37,800
Speaker 1: like sometimes it's a little bit of it's a flat line.

192
00:11:37,960 --> 00:11:41,760
Speaker 2: It's just a stagnating just Yeah, it's weird because you

193
00:11:41,760 --> 00:11:43,280
Speaker 2: would have thought we would have jumped to where we

194
00:11:43,320 --> 00:11:45,440
Speaker 2: are now a long time ago. But it's like you said,

195
00:11:45,440 --> 00:11:48,560
Speaker 2: it's taken almost two decades to get to the point.

196
00:11:49,040 --> 00:11:52,200
Speaker 1: I mean from your perspective being in TV, I mean,

197
00:11:52,520 --> 00:11:56,040
Speaker 1: we they're going, they're they're they're behind us. You know,

198
00:11:56,120 --> 00:11:59,240
Speaker 1: the music business has always kind of been the stepchild

199
00:11:59,360 --> 00:12:03,000
Speaker 1: to movies and the and the TV business. But we

200
00:12:03,040 --> 00:12:09,480
Speaker 1: went through this evolution, you know, painfully and publicly, you know,

201
00:12:09,559 --> 00:12:11,920
Speaker 1: with Napster and all of that.

202
00:12:12,000 --> 00:12:13,480
Speaker 3: Yes, and so.

203
00:12:13,480 --> 00:12:17,280
Speaker 1: I think everybody in the in the entertainment space had

204
00:12:17,440 --> 00:12:22,000
Speaker 1: the benefit of seeing some of our our profound mistakes

205
00:12:22,120 --> 00:12:25,520
Speaker 1: in that. So but that's for sure, there's still a lot.

206
00:12:25,559 --> 00:12:27,480
Speaker 1: I mean, how many times do you talk to people

207
00:12:27,559 --> 00:12:29,280
Speaker 1: a week where they're like, have you seen this show?

208
00:12:29,360 --> 00:12:32,600
Speaker 1: And you're like, what where? I don't need? What network

209
00:12:32,679 --> 00:12:34,520
Speaker 1: is that? And people are like, I don't you know

210
00:12:34,559 --> 00:12:38,400
Speaker 1: it's something something plus whatever, and you're just like, I

211
00:12:38,400 --> 00:12:40,800
Speaker 1: don't know, you know, like I'm old now I have

212
00:12:40,920 --> 00:12:42,920
Speaker 1: like the networks that I like to watch, and we

213
00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:44,880
Speaker 1: move on. You know, no, you're.

214
00:12:44,960 --> 00:12:47,440
Speaker 2: But but you're right. And what you just said though

215
00:12:47,480 --> 00:12:50,360
Speaker 2: about radio is the same thing. And radio was really

216
00:12:50,760 --> 00:12:52,920
Speaker 2: the place where you would go to hear that new

217
00:12:52,960 --> 00:12:56,520
Speaker 2: song that everyone was listening to yep, and now they

218
00:12:56,559 --> 00:12:59,319
Speaker 2: are starting to to play it, you.

219
00:12:59,280 --> 00:13:02,600
Speaker 3: Know, yeah, yes, yeah, and heavy rotation hopefully.

220
00:13:05,679 --> 00:13:05,880
Speaker 1: Now.

221
00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:09,600
Speaker 2: Regarding creative creativity and inspiration you were talking about, you

222
00:13:09,640 --> 00:13:14,240
Speaker 2: work a lot with with musicians and bands and groups

223
00:13:14,280 --> 00:13:17,480
Speaker 2: that we had mentioned earlier, creative groups. That's not always

224
00:13:17,559 --> 00:13:20,480
Speaker 2: easy in the music world to work as a team

225
00:13:20,559 --> 00:13:24,480
Speaker 2: because there's so many elements in the from the people

226
00:13:24,520 --> 00:13:28,880
Speaker 2: who wrote the music to you know, touring and decision

227
00:13:28,920 --> 00:13:31,400
Speaker 2: making and things like that. Have you ever had to

228
00:13:31,559 --> 00:13:35,400
Speaker 2: sort of deal in that world where you're helping the

229
00:13:35,440 --> 00:13:37,840
Speaker 2: bands to get along in their own groups.

230
00:13:38,000 --> 00:13:41,679
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean everybody has a different perception of what

231
00:13:41,760 --> 00:13:46,320
Speaker 1: success might look like to them, you know. And also

232
00:13:46,679 --> 00:13:52,679
Speaker 1: I mean being in a collaborative environment is I have

233
00:13:52,760 --> 00:13:55,680
Speaker 1: said this analogy a thousand times, but I'm like when

234
00:13:55,679 --> 00:13:59,439
Speaker 1: you grow up with divorced parents, you learn very quickly

235
00:13:59,559 --> 00:14:03,199
Speaker 1: which parent to go to to get the answer that

236
00:14:03,240 --> 00:14:08,480
Speaker 1: you want. You know, yes, or you learn that there

237
00:14:08,520 --> 00:14:13,000
Speaker 1: are certain things that you might run by somebody versus

238
00:14:13,120 --> 00:14:17,559
Speaker 1: somebody else, just based on how you think the the

239
00:14:18,480 --> 00:14:23,800
Speaker 1: news might fall on their heart, you know. But for

240
00:14:23,840 --> 00:14:28,520
Speaker 1: the most part, the way that we have chosen to operate,

241
00:14:28,640 --> 00:14:31,960
Speaker 1: even though it might be more painful, is to just

242
00:14:32,040 --> 00:14:36,160
Speaker 1: be fully transparent on you know. Our job isn't to

243
00:14:36,200 --> 00:14:39,960
Speaker 1: tell somebody what to do. Really, most artists that we

244
00:14:40,040 --> 00:14:43,320
Speaker 1: work with come to the table with a strong vision

245
00:14:44,480 --> 00:14:47,200
Speaker 1: of how they want the world to perceive their music,

246
00:14:47,320 --> 00:14:50,280
Speaker 1: and every artist knows that once it's out, you can't

247
00:14:50,320 --> 00:14:56,080
Speaker 1: actually control that at all. People hold on to things

248
00:14:56,120 --> 00:14:58,920
Speaker 1: that you weren't even thinking that they would think would

249
00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:03,560
Speaker 1: be a big deal, you know, favorite songs or singles

250
00:15:03,760 --> 00:15:08,680
Speaker 1: as it were. Is still a very opinion based, gut

251
00:15:08,800 --> 00:15:13,760
Speaker 1: instinct business. And even though digital marketing has slapped some

252
00:15:14,040 --> 00:15:17,800
Speaker 1: analytics on it that make it a little less risky

253
00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:24,000
Speaker 1: to you know, potentially choose one song over another. The really,

254
00:15:24,120 --> 00:15:28,200
Speaker 1: the heart of it is that some person, a human

255
00:15:28,240 --> 00:15:31,160
Speaker 1: being on a team, whether it's the artist or a

256
00:15:31,200 --> 00:15:35,880
Speaker 1: trusted confidant within the circle, somebody has made the decision

257
00:15:36,520 --> 00:15:39,760
Speaker 1: and at some point we all just have to get

258
00:15:39,760 --> 00:15:44,840
Speaker 1: behind that decision and do the best we can. But yes,

259
00:15:45,080 --> 00:15:50,440
Speaker 1: by making one person happy, ultimately, when you're dealing with teams,

260
00:15:50,640 --> 00:15:56,160
Speaker 1: you're making another person potentially unhappy, you know. So it's

261
00:15:56,200 --> 00:16:02,200
Speaker 1: a balance. You know, there's a starter, there's a sub

262
00:16:02,440 --> 00:16:04,479
Speaker 1: I mean, it's just it's the reality.

263
00:16:05,000 --> 00:16:07,600
Speaker 2: We'll be right back with more of the Music Saved

264
00:16:07,600 --> 00:16:10,760
Speaker 2: Me Podcast And by the way, if you like this podcast,

265
00:16:10,800 --> 00:16:13,800
Speaker 2: you are going to love our companion podcast called Taken

266
00:16:13,840 --> 00:16:16,800
Speaker 2: a Walk. It's hosted by my dear friend buzz Night

267
00:16:16,840 --> 00:16:19,400
Speaker 2: and you can find it wherever you get your podcasts.

268
00:16:23,560 --> 00:16:26,960
Speaker 2: Welcome back to the Music Saved Me Podcast, the podcast

269
00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:29,920
Speaker 2: where we discuss the healing powers of music with some

270
00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:32,800
Speaker 2: of the biggest names in music as well as up

271
00:16:32,800 --> 00:16:36,760
Speaker 2: and comers. Many artists talk about music coming to them

272
00:16:36,800 --> 00:16:40,880
Speaker 2: in moments of inspiration. As I'm sure you've discussed many times.

273
00:16:40,920 --> 00:16:44,320
Speaker 2: Have you personally experienced this in your creative work? Have

274
00:16:44,400 --> 00:16:47,240
Speaker 2: you ever been inspired by music or songs?

275
00:16:47,680 --> 00:16:53,160
Speaker 1: And I'm inspired by everybody. I mean I see the

276
00:16:53,200 --> 00:16:57,120
Speaker 1: world in words, and when people are speaking to me,

277
00:16:57,600 --> 00:17:02,960
Speaker 1: I will glob on to one saying or something. A

278
00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:06,560
Speaker 1: lot of times it's something in passing. So I am

279
00:17:06,760 --> 00:17:10,640
Speaker 1: the annoying person who could be at a dinner and

280
00:17:10,960 --> 00:17:14,359
Speaker 1: my friend could be just saying something and passing about

281
00:17:14,359 --> 00:17:18,120
Speaker 1: whatever her day is, and she'll say something and I'm like, oh,

282
00:17:18,200 --> 00:17:20,800
Speaker 1: I got to write that down, you know, Like I'll

283
00:17:20,800 --> 00:17:25,440
Speaker 1: text myself so I don't forget it. Or when I'm

284
00:17:25,520 --> 00:17:28,679
Speaker 1: listening to something and I try to really listen, like

285
00:17:28,720 --> 00:17:31,840
Speaker 1: I try to get the music, and before I make

286
00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:38,080
Speaker 1: any offers of ideas or you know, any suggestions on

287
00:17:38,160 --> 00:17:41,160
Speaker 1: what I would do in terms of strategy, I try

288
00:17:41,200 --> 00:17:46,200
Speaker 1: to listen. And I think that's pretty rare these days,

289
00:17:46,920 --> 00:17:49,240
Speaker 1: you know. I think I think a lot of people

290
00:17:49,280 --> 00:17:54,400
Speaker 1: will look at the numbers associated with a particular person

291
00:17:54,720 --> 00:17:58,840
Speaker 1: or a particular piece of media and then talk about

292
00:17:58,880 --> 00:18:02,200
Speaker 1: how they were going to, you know, deploy it as

293
00:18:02,200 --> 00:18:07,120
Speaker 1: opposed to what we are deploying, and the bigger point

294
00:18:07,320 --> 00:18:10,640
Speaker 1: is like when we sit down with people in this office,

295
00:18:11,400 --> 00:18:13,720
Speaker 1: I'm constantly like, yeah, but what do you want people

296
00:18:13,760 --> 00:18:17,560
Speaker 1: to feel when they see this? Yeah, Like that's you know,

297
00:18:17,840 --> 00:18:19,639
Speaker 1: what do you want them to do with this information?

298
00:18:19,720 --> 00:18:21,520
Speaker 1: Do you want them to take action? Do you want

299
00:18:21,520 --> 00:18:24,680
Speaker 1: them to absorb? Do you want them to fry? Do

300
00:18:24,760 --> 00:18:27,880
Speaker 1: you want them to laugh? Like? Like, what does that

301
00:18:27,920 --> 00:18:30,120
Speaker 1: look like? And I and I think that when you

302
00:18:30,160 --> 00:18:35,040
Speaker 1: can approach it like that, it does provide a little

303
00:18:35,040 --> 00:18:38,800
Speaker 1: bit more of a human component to something that is

304
00:18:38,960 --> 00:18:43,879
Speaker 1: very non human, which is digital media. You know. But

305
00:18:44,160 --> 00:18:47,360
Speaker 1: I mean that's just it's harder.

306
00:18:48,119 --> 00:18:51,840
Speaker 2: It is gone are the old fashioned rating systems too,

307
00:18:51,920 --> 00:18:53,679
Speaker 2: So you really are in the dark in terms of

308
00:18:53,960 --> 00:18:57,520
Speaker 2: that's right. Although the algorithms are a little scary these days,

309
00:18:57,560 --> 00:19:00,000
Speaker 2: scary souse, they can really you know, you can advertise

310
00:19:00,080 --> 00:19:05,359
Speaker 2: as one to one now, yep, which is amazing, especially

311
00:19:05,440 --> 00:19:08,040
Speaker 2: when you're putting out good stuff like music that helps

312
00:19:08,080 --> 00:19:13,280
Speaker 2: to deal with the massive i think mental health crisis

313
00:19:13,280 --> 00:19:16,439
Speaker 2: that we have going on in the world today and music.

314
00:19:18,160 --> 00:19:21,600
Speaker 2: I'm pretty certain that it's been scientifically proven now, especially

315
00:19:21,600 --> 00:19:24,680
Speaker 2: through some great interviews that I've had with some scientists,

316
00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:30,320
Speaker 2: that it does heal, which explains a lot about the

317
00:19:30,359 --> 00:19:32,560
Speaker 2: business as a whole and why it's still here today,

318
00:19:32,560 --> 00:19:36,480
Speaker 2: stronger than ever before, and even more of it more kinds.

319
00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:39,199
Speaker 2: Do you think music has the power to heal and

320
00:19:39,280 --> 00:19:43,159
Speaker 2: transform yourself? And if so, have you seen this in

321
00:19:43,200 --> 00:19:44,080
Speaker 2: your own life?

322
00:19:44,400 --> 00:19:50,760
Speaker 1: Oh? Not, even aside from the very obvious mental health

323
00:19:51,320 --> 00:19:56,120
Speaker 1: everything that you just referenced. The idea in my family,

324
00:19:57,200 --> 00:20:02,040
Speaker 1: we have my mom is suffering from dementia from Alzheimer's,

325
00:20:02,800 --> 00:20:06,239
Speaker 1: so we've seen the benefit on that. There's things that

326
00:20:06,280 --> 00:20:10,440
Speaker 1: she remembers deep deep in her and you know, certainly

327
00:20:10,440 --> 00:20:17,480
Speaker 1: people it's well documented in sources that have actual scientific reference,

328
00:20:17,560 --> 00:20:20,879
Speaker 1: not me. The idea that you can play somebody a

329
00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:24,680
Speaker 1: song from a really you know, prolific time in their

330
00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:28,040
Speaker 1: life and they can reconnect to those feelings that they

331
00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:31,240
Speaker 1: know where they were when they first heard that song,

332
00:20:31,440 --> 00:20:33,439
Speaker 1: or they think about the car that they used to

333
00:20:33,560 --> 00:20:36,320
Speaker 1: drive and what did that car smell? Like, you know,

334
00:20:36,560 --> 00:20:39,840
Speaker 1: like was it raining? Who was in the car? You know,

335
00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:43,480
Speaker 1: like you remember all of these things. And now I'm like, oh,

336
00:20:43,520 --> 00:20:45,760
Speaker 1: I sometimes I can't remember what I did on Tuesday,

337
00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:49,600
Speaker 1: but like I will listen to a song that I

338
00:20:49,720 --> 00:20:53,520
Speaker 1: loved in high school and I could tell you everything

339
00:20:53,680 --> 00:20:56,320
Speaker 1: that was happening at that time. You know so too,

340
00:20:56,640 --> 00:21:00,600
Speaker 1: Even even if there was no scientific reference to the

341
00:21:00,640 --> 00:21:06,480
Speaker 1: benefit of music, I know in my heart that and

342
00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:09,240
Speaker 1: every person that I talk to that also loves music,

343
00:21:09,280 --> 00:21:11,359
Speaker 1: which is really hard to find a person on the

344
00:21:11,400 --> 00:21:16,040
Speaker 1: planet who doesn't like music. Right, But the idea that

345
00:21:16,359 --> 00:21:23,359
Speaker 1: you can connect emotionally your memory, your smell, your site,

346
00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:26,639
Speaker 1: like all of those things just by listening to a song,

347
00:21:27,560 --> 00:21:29,800
Speaker 1: it's incredible. We are incredible.

348
00:21:30,600 --> 00:21:31,879
Speaker 3: You're right, You're absolutely right.

349
00:21:31,920 --> 00:21:34,280
Speaker 2: I think that we don't give ourselves as humans enough

350
00:21:34,320 --> 00:21:37,600
Speaker 2: credit for how powerful we are and the things that

351
00:21:37,640 --> 00:21:41,160
Speaker 2: we're able to do without plugging into a wall.

352
00:21:41,480 --> 00:21:41,960
Speaker 1: That's right.

353
00:21:42,280 --> 00:21:44,480
Speaker 2: For lack of a better way to explain it, I've

354
00:21:44,480 --> 00:21:46,800
Speaker 2: always wondered that, you know, if there's electricity in us,

355
00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:48,199
Speaker 2: how come we don't have to charge?

356
00:21:48,440 --> 00:21:51,479
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean even when you see, like you know,

357
00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:55,960
Speaker 1: my kids grow up with the apps you know, like yeah,

358
00:21:56,600 --> 00:21:59,199
Speaker 1: Abide or you know whatever, and they use those to

359
00:21:59,280 --> 00:22:03,040
Speaker 1: go to sleep and use sometimes they use the noise frequencies,

360
00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:08,520
Speaker 1: and just the idea that that is so calming to

361
00:22:08,600 --> 00:22:13,240
Speaker 1: our nervous system that we can bring ourselves down to

362
00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:16,040
Speaker 1: a place where we can out and RESTful sleep no

363
00:22:16,040 --> 00:22:19,840
Speaker 1: matter what is going on in our lives minus menopause,

364
00:22:19,920 --> 00:22:21,000
Speaker 1: by the way, and it's just.

365
00:22:20,920 --> 00:22:26,880
Speaker 3: Oh, nice to meet you. But I just broke out

366
00:22:26,920 --> 00:22:28,159
Speaker 3: into a sweat when you said that.

367
00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:28,840
Speaker 1: I'm sorry.

368
00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:32,080
Speaker 2: Sorry, guys, if you're listening, I know, guys hate.

369
00:22:31,880 --> 00:22:35,240
Speaker 1: That the idea that you know, my eight year old

370
00:22:35,600 --> 00:22:39,080
Speaker 1: knows if he's if he wants to listen to uh

371
00:22:39,920 --> 00:22:42,920
Speaker 1: meditation at night, that's incredible.

372
00:22:42,920 --> 00:22:46,040
Speaker 2: That's great, that really is. You know, it's funny when

373
00:22:46,080 --> 00:22:49,000
Speaker 2: we were kids, we didn't have that stuff. Obviously we

374
00:22:49,040 --> 00:22:50,879
Speaker 2: were kids. Now all of a sudden, I sound like

375
00:22:51,080 --> 00:22:51,600
Speaker 2: can we had.

376
00:22:51,480 --> 00:22:53,600
Speaker 1: To open the window and listen to crickets?

377
00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:55,800
Speaker 3: We ate rock? Should we liked it?

378
00:22:56,640 --> 00:22:56,720
Speaker 1: No?

379
00:22:57,760 --> 00:23:00,000
Speaker 2: We I used to listen to talk radio. I didn't

380
00:23:00,160 --> 00:23:02,160
Speaker 2: listen to talk radio. I would just put on talk

381
00:23:02,280 --> 00:23:04,800
Speaker 2: radio and I could fall asleep to the tone of

382
00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:08,160
Speaker 2: the voice just lulling me sleep.

383
00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:10,760
Speaker 1: So my dad used to joke that if we ever

384
00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:12,840
Speaker 1: he ever wanted me to go to sleep, that he

385
00:23:12,880 --> 00:23:17,040
Speaker 1: would just put golf on. Yes, I was just done, Yeah,

386
00:23:17,240 --> 00:23:19,320
Speaker 1: just out out out on the couch.

387
00:23:19,960 --> 00:23:20,840
Speaker 3: That quiet clap.

388
00:23:21,000 --> 00:23:27,119
Speaker 2: Well before I let you go you are an incredible person.

389
00:23:28,240 --> 00:23:32,639
Speaker 2: You've gone through so much in your short career, and

390
00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:37,280
Speaker 2: you've experienced things in life that most of us do.

391
00:23:37,320 --> 00:23:41,040
Speaker 2: You know, love and loss and growth, and but to

392
00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:43,320
Speaker 2: levels that most people don't really get to go to,

393
00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:47,959
Speaker 2: you know, like president of Country Music Association or you know,

394
00:23:48,040 --> 00:23:51,199
Speaker 2: things like that. So with that said, and also you

395
00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:54,840
Speaker 2: sit on the board of a special organization called Music

396
00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:59,320
Speaker 2: Health Alliance, what would you give for I guess just

397
00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:02,320
Speaker 2: something for inspiring words to a young person today who's

398
00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:04,920
Speaker 2: starting out into a completely different world than we came

399
00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:11,120
Speaker 2: through in terms of adapting and adopting and persevering.

400
00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:15,119
Speaker 1: I think the biggest piece of advice that I have

401
00:24:15,280 --> 00:24:19,719
Speaker 1: for somebody is when you feel yourself saying, but I

402
00:24:19,840 --> 00:24:23,479
Speaker 1: don't know what's going to happen in the future, and

403
00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:26,719
Speaker 1: you have a negative spin on that. I want to

404
00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:31,879
Speaker 1: remind people that when I was in college, this didn't exist.

405
00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:35,119
Speaker 1: So I look at it like, yeah, but we don't

406
00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:39,320
Speaker 1: know what's going to happen as not a yeah we

407
00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:41,800
Speaker 1: don't know what's going to happen. That's so scary. What

408
00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:43,880
Speaker 1: are you going to do? You got to have a plant.

409
00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:46,800
Speaker 1: I'm like, hey, yeah, you're right. I don't know what's

410
00:24:46,840 --> 00:24:51,520
Speaker 1: going to happen. Amazing opportunities may come your way with

411
00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:55,320
Speaker 1: just a little patience and hard work, and so you

412
00:24:55,520 --> 00:24:59,680
Speaker 1: can't even imagine what the world is going to look

413
00:24:59,760 --> 00:25:02,880
Speaker 1: like and the opportunities that are going to come your way.

414
00:25:03,359 --> 00:25:06,479
Speaker 1: So you've got to change your mindset on that. I

415
00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:11,200
Speaker 1: at this age, with this experience, still have no idea

416
00:25:11,840 --> 00:25:14,000
Speaker 1: some days when I walk into the office what I'm

417
00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:16,960
Speaker 1: going to have to deal with. And that is not

418
00:25:17,119 --> 00:25:20,720
Speaker 1: what stresses me out. What stresses me out is actually

419
00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:23,480
Speaker 1: thinking about living the kind of life that I do

420
00:25:23,560 --> 00:25:28,120
Speaker 1: something the same way every single day until it's time

421
00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:32,000
Speaker 1: to clock out. That's not interesting to me. So when

422
00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:35,800
Speaker 1: especially when kids are in college and they're asked that

423
00:25:36,280 --> 00:25:38,520
Speaker 1: awful question, what do you want to be when you

424
00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:43,480
Speaker 1: grow up? You know, like your job in your twenties

425
00:25:43,840 --> 00:25:47,639
Speaker 1: and even even past that is to try a bunch

426
00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:52,040
Speaker 1: of things and figure out what doesn't work for you,

427
00:25:52,040 --> 00:25:56,640
Speaker 1: you know, And I think that pressure that we put

428
00:25:56,680 --> 00:25:59,560
Speaker 1: on ourselves to have all the answers and to have

429
00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:04,760
Speaker 1: the plan is just a gigantic disservice because sometimes you

430
00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:06,520
Speaker 1: just got to get in there and figure it out.

431
00:26:07,359 --> 00:26:13,200
Speaker 1: And for me, historically speaking, when there's confusion and there's chaos,

432
00:26:13,800 --> 00:26:19,000
Speaker 1: that's been when I've been the most successful. So it's

433
00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:21,000
Speaker 1: it's you got to look for opportunities.

434
00:26:22,080 --> 00:26:24,320
Speaker 2: Great advice. Oh and one more thing I lied about

435
00:26:24,320 --> 00:26:30,640
Speaker 2: the last question. Becoming Gorilla, which is your new memoir out,

436
00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:34,800
Speaker 2: Can you explain why you named it Gorilla g I

437
00:26:35,119 --> 00:26:37,000
Speaker 2: R L I L LA.

438
00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:41,000
Speaker 1: So Gorilla Marketing is the name of my company and

439
00:26:41,320 --> 00:26:46,159
Speaker 1: it was originally at play off of gorilla warfare, you know,

440
00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:49,080
Speaker 1: meeting like underground sort of, you know.

441
00:26:49,160 --> 00:26:50,600
Speaker 3: On the on the down and dirty.

442
00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:54,760
Speaker 1: That's right. And why I name the book Becoming Gorilla

443
00:26:55,000 --> 00:26:59,879
Speaker 1: is because for fifteen years I've been hearing you know,

444
00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:03,040
Speaker 1: you can't you you can't. You got to have life

445
00:27:03,040 --> 00:27:05,280
Speaker 1: work balance. You got to you know, you got to

446
00:27:05,359 --> 00:27:08,919
Speaker 1: keep your work life separate from your home life, separate

447
00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:12,919
Speaker 1: from your whatevers. And about five years ago, I just

448
00:27:13,280 --> 00:27:17,080
Speaker 1: came to the realization that I am my job in

449
00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:20,480
Speaker 1: a way I am. I am what I do and

450
00:27:20,520 --> 00:27:24,119
Speaker 1: that's good because I'm super passionate about it. And I

451
00:27:24,160 --> 00:27:28,320
Speaker 1: don't put a face on or a uniform on for

452
00:27:28,440 --> 00:27:31,840
Speaker 1: eight hours to do this and then go be somebody else.

453
00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:34,800
Speaker 1: The rest of the day. So for me, it was

454
00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:38,560
Speaker 1: more of a reunion of just saying like, it's this

455
00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:41,680
Speaker 1: is who I am, and it happens to coincide with

456
00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:45,679
Speaker 1: what I do. But and I really wanted people to

457
00:27:46,960 --> 00:27:49,920
Speaker 1: see themselves in my story. And my hope was that

458
00:27:50,359 --> 00:27:54,600
Speaker 1: when they were reading it that they would have moments

459
00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:58,719
Speaker 1: where they would laugh or laugh at me, you know,

460
00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:02,480
Speaker 1: just I identifying with the story themselves.

461
00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:06,080
Speaker 2: Well, it's a beautiful book and I think everyone should

462
00:28:06,080 --> 00:28:07,760
Speaker 2: go out and grab a copy of it right now.

463
00:28:07,880 --> 00:28:10,360
Speaker 2: And I want to thank you so much for being

464
00:28:10,400 --> 00:28:13,080
Speaker 2: on Music Save Me, because I know you don't have

465
00:28:13,119 --> 00:28:15,160
Speaker 2: a lot of time, but I know you're a good

466
00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:20,040
Speaker 2: plate juggler after everything I've read, so Jenny Smith, thank

467
00:28:20,080 --> 00:28:22,199
Speaker 2: you so much for being on Music Save Me, and

468
00:28:22,480 --> 00:28:23,560
Speaker 2: good luck with everything.

469
00:28:24,040 --> 00:28:25,040
Speaker 1: Thank you so much.