Speaker 1: Hey, and welcome to the short Stuff. There's Chuck, and
Speaker 1: I'm Josh, and Jerry's here too, sitting in for Dave.
Speaker 1: So this is short stuff.
Speaker 2: That's right. Call it Old wives Tale edition because this
Speaker 2: is about feeding a cold and starving a fever, which
Speaker 2: is the old wives tale that when you have a cold,
Speaker 2: you should, and originally started out as stuff a cold like,
Speaker 2: eat as much as you can, and then if you
Speaker 2: have a fever you should try and not eat very
Speaker 2: much at all.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think most people have heard that, right, that's
Speaker 1: a pretty widespread adage. Yeah. Our friends at the Cleveland Clinic,
Speaker 1: not normally known for their etymology resources, but they trace
Speaker 1: this back at least half of it to fifteen seventy four.
Speaker 1: There's a dictionary that was compiled by a guy named
Speaker 1: John Wile's and withal said that fasting is a great
Speaker 1: remedy of fever. So you got the second part right there,
Speaker 1: starve a fever, right, And it's as far back as
Speaker 1: anyone's trace it, although if you kind of want to
Speaker 1: expand your definition of what's being discussed here, you can
Speaker 1: trace it all the way back to Hippocrates. Right.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm not sure about this one, he said, the
Speaker 2: most most exquisitely slender diet you should have when the
Speaker 2: disease is very sharp. So I'm not quite sure what
Speaker 2: disease he's talking about there, So I'm not sure if
Speaker 2: that counts.
Speaker 1: No, But I mean just the phrase most exquisitely slender
Speaker 1: diet sounds awesome, so I thought it was worth putting
Speaker 1: in there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure. If you look at the current use
Speaker 2: of the term as we know and love it, it
Speaker 2: came about in the eighteenth century, pretty late in eighteenth well,
Speaker 2: I guess kind of mid in eighteen fifty three. That's
Speaker 2: when they were talking about feed and starve. As far
Speaker 2: as cold and fever go.
Speaker 1: What's weird, Chuck is I saw that it was this
Speaker 1: whole adage that we is, like basically, encouragement is taken
Speaker 1: as an encouragement or advice today was originally taken as
Speaker 1: like a warning that if you feed a cold, that
Speaker 1: cold will turn into a fever and then you'll have
Speaker 1: to starve the fever, like and that the reason that
Speaker 1: it was ambiguous is because of that comma in the middle.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, that has proved to me that people
Speaker 2: back then were dumb a little bit I don't get
Speaker 2: that one, but sure, okay.
Speaker 1: But well, what was the whole point? I mean, like,
Speaker 1: if the what was the idea that was based on
Speaker 1: I guess then.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I guess they were basing it on if you
Speaker 2: have a fever, then you don't want to eat hot food.
Speaker 2: I guess it didn't need.
Speaker 1: A lot of cold foods back then, I guess not.
Speaker 1: And if you're.
Speaker 2: Cold, you want to warm yourself up because there was
Speaker 2: only hot food available.
Speaker 1: Sure, that was I think what they think the whole
Speaker 1: thing was based on. And regardless of how you slice
Speaker 1: it though, how you take it as a warning or
Speaker 1: anything like that, it's it's pretty much generally viewed as
Speaker 1: not good advice by the medical community today. I say,
Speaker 1: we take a break and come back and talk about
Speaker 1: how this is not really good advice. How about how
Speaker 1: about that?
Speaker 3: All right, let's do it.
Speaker 1: As s K as good you should know.
Speaker 2: Okay, So people have basically always said that this was
Speaker 2: a bad idea. There was a writer and Gentlemen's Magazine
Speaker 2: in seventeen eighty five that said it was perhaps more
Speaker 2: destructive demandkind than the plague itself. This advice, which is
Speaker 2: definitely overstating things but people these days say, no, that's
Speaker 2: not good advice. First of all, if you have a cold,
Speaker 2: you may not want to eat very much. You may
Speaker 2: not be very hungry, So like, for God's sake, don't
Speaker 2: just make someone stuff themselves full just because they're sick
Speaker 2: with a cold. It's not going to do anything for you.
Speaker 1: Now, And that's bad enough. But the actual harm is
Speaker 1: in the second part starving a fever, because pretty much
Speaker 1: everybody in the medical community agrees that if you feel
Speaker 1: hungry while you're sick, you should go ahead and eat,
Speaker 1: because your appetite can come and go, and it can
Speaker 1: be so thin you want to take advantage of it
Speaker 1: when it does show up. And even more to the point,
Speaker 1: if you starve yourself on purpose while you have a fever,
Speaker 1: you're robbing yourself of some really much needed nutrients and
Speaker 1: calories that your body really needs, specifically when you have
Speaker 1: a fever.
Speaker 2: Yeah, if your metabolism is kicking in in a substantial way,
Speaker 2: it's gonna you know, if you're just laying around in bed,
Speaker 2: that'll make you eat up more of your calories and
Speaker 2: nutrients than you that you have in your body, So
Speaker 2: you're going to want as much as you can. So
Speaker 2: if you're hungry, cold fever or whatever, by god, eat
Speaker 2: something or drink something. Definitely need to stay hydrated. Even
Speaker 2: if you're not hungry. There are plenty of ways to
Speaker 2: get you know, nutrients and liquid.
Speaker 1: Into you, right. And the reason that your metabolism would
Speaker 1: jack up when you have a fever is because your
Speaker 1: body's literally raising your core temperature to try to cook
Speaker 1: out the virus that's got you in its grips. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't even need.
Speaker 2: Fevers are no fun, but I love when I when
Speaker 2: I'm sick and I get a fever and the fever happens,
Speaker 2: I'm like, okay, Like this is my body doing its thing,
Speaker 2: so I feel good about it.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, it is kind of weird. It's like almost
Speaker 1: giving it like a grudging salute, like way to go body, exactly.
Speaker 2: It didn't feel great, but oh there's no better feeling
Speaker 2: than like breaking that fever, you know.
Speaker 1: Oh for sure the worst is when the fever comes
Speaker 1: on in the morning and you've got fever all through
Speaker 1: the night. Fever is that? Okay?
Speaker 2: So make sure that was an accident.
Speaker 1: You said, can you imagine the coincidence? Like what would
Speaker 1: the odds be of.
Speaker 2: That don't know a natural songwriter.
Speaker 1: I guess so you said that you want to drink,
Speaker 1: especially if like you can't eat solid foods. At least
Speaker 1: try to drink things that have calories, like a sports
Speaker 1: drink with electrolytes like they had in Idiocrisy, and or
Speaker 1: like thin broths like a chicken broth can have a
Speaker 1: bunch of calories in it. Even vegetable broths have some calories,
Speaker 1: so you want to get it wherever you can. The
Speaker 1: key here is this, even if you don't want to
Speaker 1: eat at all, that's okay. Like most people, especially in
Speaker 1: the developed world, aren't on the edge of nutrition. We
Speaker 1: all have some reserves that can last us the few
Speaker 1: days we're not hungry while we're sick. What we don't
Speaker 1: have is a reserve enough of fluids to keep us
Speaker 1: going for very long. So you have to It's not
Speaker 1: a choice. You have to stay hydrated one way or another.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that same article from Gentlemen's Magazine from way back
Speaker 2: when suggested some other things of the time. Barley water,
Speaker 2: which sounds not too bad, small beer, mm, one of those.
Speaker 2: You ever seen those little little little baby beers, they're
Speaker 2: like eightouncers or whatever.
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, I looked that up. That was so they
Speaker 1: called that for low alcohol beer. Like I guess session
Speaker 1: beers basically would be a small beer.
Speaker 2: Right, Well, I don't know, but that makes sense.
Speaker 1: Small beer, yeah, small beer.
Speaker 2: We called me and my friends Eddie and Allison called
Speaker 2: those tiny beers tweets. I don't know what. I think
Speaker 2: Alice had made up the word and it just kind
Speaker 2: of stuck. And the fun thing about drinking those is
Speaker 2: you look like Andre the Giant.
Speaker 1: Yes, I know exactly what you mean. I loved doing
Speaker 1: that too.
Speaker 2: What else, apple water, linseed, t toast and water that
Speaker 2: maybe the toast in water, remember that.
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure that's what it is. I bet it
Speaker 1: is water gruel sweetened with honey. Yeah. So I looked
Speaker 1: all over to see if anybody had conducted a study
Speaker 1: on whether this was true or not, and thank god
Speaker 1: our friends over in the Netherlands in two thousand and two,
Speaker 1: a group of Dutch researchers conducted a study and they
Speaker 1: wanted to see whether feeding or calorie restriction has any
Speaker 1: effect on whether you have a cold or fever or
Speaker 1: anything like that. And what's astounding is that they found
Speaker 1: that it actually does have an effect like your on
Speaker 1: the level of your immune system with the types of
Speaker 1: cells that are produced.
Speaker 2: That's right, they starved well, I guess fasted same thing
Speaker 2: sure for both groups for twenty four hours. And then
Speaker 2: the cold feeders they gave a meal replacement drink, so
Speaker 2: not hot food in this case. And so after they
Speaker 2: had this you know, sustenance, I guess, their blood levels
Speaker 2: of an immune protein called interferin gamma went really really
Speaker 2: sky high average increase of four hundred and fifty percent.
Speaker 2: And interferon plays a role in regulating our response to
Speaker 2: infections in our immune system, so you would think like, hey,
Speaker 2: eating is like exactly what you want to do.
Speaker 1: Right, And then kind of as expected the other group,
Speaker 1: the group that had to fast, their interfere on gamma
Speaker 1: levels actually went down by about eighty three percent, so
Speaker 1: they lost some robustness to their immune response because they
Speaker 1: weren't eating. So so far you're kind of like, all right,
Speaker 1: this makes sense for sure. The surprise came with a
Speaker 1: different kind of immune cell called inter luken four, which
Speaker 1: they found actually rows in the group that was fasting.
Speaker 2: Yeah, by an average of almost four hundred percent compared
Speaker 2: the four fifty for the other and I think there
Speaker 2: was one patient who's fasting levels rose more than eleven
Speaker 2: hundred percent.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 2: And this is also an important part of our immune response,
Speaker 2: but it's different kinds of immune responses. So if you're
Speaker 2: thinking like, well, hey, if I starve myself, then this
Speaker 2: one's going to go up, Like you don't know which
Speaker 2: cells you need, So it's not sort of a a
Speaker 2: roulette game you should try and play by starving yourself.
Speaker 1: No, for sure, that interfere on that helps produce antibodies
Speaker 1: like for specifically targeted to an infection, and the inter
Speaker 1: luken uses our bodies like innate response like sicking cytokines
Speaker 1: that you normally have laying around in your body on it.
Speaker 1: So yeah, you can't game the whole thing. So that's
Speaker 1: why doctors across pretty much the board say, if you're
Speaker 1: sick and you feel like you can eat, like you're hungry,
Speaker 1: eat something for sure.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because what you want is a little bit of
Speaker 2: both and ideally more of both, but not a whole
Speaker 2: lot of one and a lot less of the other.
Speaker 1: Well put, especially when people rewind and listen to a
Speaker 1: couple of foods I hope so well, Chuck, said you
Speaker 1: hope so, which means everybody short stuff is out.
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