WEBVTT - Hackin' on a Star: Matthew Bevan 0:00:00.520 --> 0:00:05.280 Ridiculous Crime is a production of My Heart Radio Elizabeth Dot. 0:00:05.840 --> 0:00:10.240 Uh you know it's ridiculous, Yes, I do. Okay, it's 0:00:10.240 --> 0:00:13.720 almost Thanksgiving and I was thinking back about the Macy's 0:00:13.800 --> 0:00:17.040 Day Thanksgiving Day parade, which is a big family favorite. 0:00:17.040 --> 0:00:19.040 Do you guys watch it now? Okay? Well, my family 0:00:19.079 --> 0:00:20.560 used to always watch it, and I was thinking back. 0:00:20.840 --> 0:00:23.080 It's like, well, I remember there being some crazy things. 0:00:23.160 --> 0:00:27.840 I looked it up in there was an absolutely hectic 0:00:28.160 --> 0:00:32.080 Macy's Day Thanksgiving Day parade. So what happens is there's 0:00:32.159 --> 0:00:34.760 winds whipping around. The winds are like at forty three 0:00:34.800 --> 0:00:37.080 miles an hour that day, they decide we're gonna do 0:00:37.120 --> 0:00:41.000 it anyway. Now, these are huge, exactly, and it takes 0:00:41.000 --> 0:00:43.159 like teams of people to hold them down. So I 0:00:43.159 --> 0:00:46.440 watched the footage right, and this was like amazing because 0:00:46.479 --> 0:00:50.479 they lost multiple floats in the parade. The Pink Panther 0:00:50.720 --> 0:00:54.040 goes out like a street the Quick Bunny, the cat 0:00:54.080 --> 0:00:56.240 and the hat they both go down at thirty six Street. 0:00:56.440 --> 0:00:58.840 But the one that I loved the most happened to 0:00:58.880 --> 0:01:03.160 be Barney the Big Purple Dinosaur. So after the Pink 0:01:03.200 --> 0:01:06.279 Panther had been you know, taken out with a knife 0:01:06.280 --> 0:01:10.360 by the NYPD. Barney comes down the path and Barney 0:01:10.400 --> 0:01:13.200 is like getting whipped around and the handlers have to 0:01:13.200 --> 0:01:16.640 lose control of him, right, and it comes this menace 0:01:16.640 --> 0:01:18.640 where the wind is going so fast the handlers are 0:01:18.680 --> 0:01:21.679 literally lying down on the street. Another handler is lying 0:01:21.680 --> 0:01:23.600 on top of them trying to hold them down because 0:01:23.600 --> 0:01:26.639 the wind is lifting them. Wondering if anyone got flung 0:01:26.760 --> 0:01:31.920 over on the roape completely not that good, but there 0:01:31.920 --> 0:01:34.400 were some people like things fell and stuff people got 0:01:34.560 --> 0:01:37.600 actually hurt. But aside from that, there was when Barney 0:01:37.640 --> 0:01:41.720 goes down and I quote one lady said, everything turned purple. Right, 0:01:41.800 --> 0:01:44.880 So what happens is like as the balloon handles are 0:01:44.920 --> 0:01:47.520 trying to fight to hold Barney, he hits this like 0:01:47.720 --> 0:01:49.720 light post and then all of a sudden rips open 0:01:49.760 --> 0:01:53.560 his side. So now Barney the kind of story's eviscerated 0:01:53.560 --> 0:01:56.000 in the air, flailing away and the wind is going 0:01:56.080 --> 0:01:59.280 right into his torn open side, and so people are screaming. 0:01:59.360 --> 0:02:02.960 Children's yeah, the families are screaming, And so what did 0:02:02.960 --> 0:02:05.440 people do? Because now also the wind is starting to 0:02:05.440 --> 0:02:07.640 whip this thing around like a kite. Handlers are trying 0:02:07.640 --> 0:02:10.240 to hold it down, so they're able to cut the 0:02:10.320 --> 0:02:13.079 ropes that are tied around one lamp post. Now Barney's 0:02:13.080 --> 0:02:15.960 flapping around and he's down at like street level, so 0:02:16.000 --> 0:02:18.480 he's getting close to like hitting people. Then White Pet 0:02:18.639 --> 0:02:21.160 once again rushes in. Someone's like, give me a knife, 0:02:21.200 --> 0:02:22.880 and then so they get a knife and they go 0:02:23.000 --> 0:02:25.680 at Barney with knives and they cut a heart. Stop it. 0:02:25.960 --> 0:02:27.640 They cut a heart Barney in front of all the 0:02:27.720 --> 0:02:29.880 children who were there, and then all the children watching 0:02:29.880 --> 0:02:31.880 the millions at home. And it is one of the 0:02:31.880 --> 0:02:35.400 funniest things I've ever seen. Is there a documentary about this? No, 0:02:35.520 --> 0:02:36.880 you can find it on YouTube. Oh I don't really. 0:02:36.919 --> 0:02:38.720 I don't know that. I think there should be. And 0:02:38.760 --> 0:02:41.080 I wanted to be very solemn the day that Barney 0:02:41.080 --> 0:02:43.800 went down. Oh it's insane. Yeah, I would watch that 0:02:44.120 --> 0:02:45.919 if you want to see it, it's on YouTube. Okay, 0:02:45.919 --> 0:02:49.000 Well that's ridiculous. Do you know what else is ridiculous? 0:02:49.480 --> 0:02:53.359 Hit me with it. Two kids hacking major military installations 0:02:53.400 --> 0:02:56.440 in search of UFO intel. Oh, I love these kids. 0:03:16.520 --> 0:03:20.560 This is ridiculous. Crime A podcast about absurd and outrageous capers, 0:03:20.600 --> 0:03:27.440 heists and cons It's always murder free and one ridiculous. 0:03:28.600 --> 0:03:34.320 I am not particularly computer literate. I mean, I'm proficient 0:03:34.440 --> 0:03:38.680 in Microsoft Office Suite applications, says right there on my resume. 0:03:40.320 --> 0:03:43.960 But I'm kind of I'm in awe of hackers. Well, 0:03:44.400 --> 0:03:47.080 I'm in all of the nineties version of them, you know, 0:03:47.160 --> 0:03:50.800 like they were more adventurous than now. It's like malicious 0:03:50.840 --> 0:03:53.600 and financial, right, but like to know the back door 0:03:53.760 --> 0:03:56.400 operations of things like that, and back in the day 0:03:56.440 --> 0:03:58.280 with people would be cracking in just because they wanted to. 0:03:58.480 --> 0:04:00.480 I could get in if they wanted to see what 0:04:00.560 --> 0:04:03.200 was being held in there, and that stayed these UFO 0:04:04.600 --> 0:04:06.960 to know how to do that rather than only know 0:04:07.040 --> 0:04:10.280 the front facing things. Um, I'm going to focus on 0:04:10.320 --> 0:04:13.880 the golden age of hacking, late eighties early nineties. Do 0:04:13.920 --> 0:04:17.880 you remember that Angelina Jolie film Hackers, Yes, the one 0:04:17.920 --> 0:04:20.360 you mentioned often. It had a really good theme song, 0:04:20.480 --> 0:04:24.760 hacking on a Star Really yeah, Randy Newman sang. It 0:04:26.320 --> 0:04:29.400 had other classics on the soundtrack, Nights of hackst Asia 0:04:30.000 --> 0:04:33.839 Are you serious? And then Computer Pooper You're not kidding? 0:04:34.320 --> 0:04:37.640 Disc is how we do it? I t are you kidding? 0:04:37.640 --> 0:04:43.080 I'm completely kidding. I had I could have believed you. Yeah, 0:04:43.200 --> 0:04:45.840 you know what, Well, okay, I shouldn't joke. But in 0:04:45.920 --> 0:04:49.120 all honesty, there were three soundtracks for that movie. Did 0:04:49.120 --> 0:04:52.400 you know that? So? And that's a hundred percent true. 0:04:52.400 --> 0:04:55.320 They just couldn't stop. Do you know what was songs 0:04:55.360 --> 0:04:58.039 written the movie? Well, I don't know what. There's track one, 0:04:58.080 --> 0:05:03.960 Disc one is called Original Bedroom Rockers by Cruder and Dorfmeister. Okay, 0:05:04.000 --> 0:05:05.800 so now I have to assume you're telling the truth. 0:05:06.040 --> 0:05:08.760 I hadn't heard of it, but I listened to that 0:05:08.800 --> 0:05:11.560 song for the sake of research. It's the music that 0:05:11.600 --> 0:05:13.560 you play when you're like in the nineties and it's 0:05:13.680 --> 0:05:16.360 dark and it's wet, and you're in the city scape 0:05:16.680 --> 0:05:20.920 and you're sneaking. That's what that it's for. You're like 0:05:21.000 --> 0:05:24.680 wearing a choker and thick sold Doc Martins and you're 0:05:24.680 --> 0:05:28.040 just hacking it at That's what that's for, Just poking 0:05:28.080 --> 0:05:31.839 around and you have tiny bangs of course male female, 0:05:31.880 --> 0:05:35.160 none of the above, tiny banks. Do you know? It 0:05:35.200 --> 0:05:38.800 was track one on disc two? Um, this is how 0:05:38.960 --> 0:05:44.680 we do it? Firestarter by the Prodigy. Like, if that 0:05:44.720 --> 0:05:48.600 doesn't take you back, I don't know that. So in 0:05:48.640 --> 0:05:52.320 the movie, they talk about the essay Hacker Manifesto, which 0:05:52.320 --> 0:05:55.479 is also known as the Conscience of a Hack. It 0:05:55.600 --> 0:05:59.599 defined the whole hacker business that you know, the biz 0:06:00.200 --> 0:06:02.800 as we like to call it. Yeah, it was written 0:06:02.839 --> 0:06:06.800 by a hacker, a hacker named the Mentor. Yes, he 0:06:07.000 --> 0:06:10.680 was a hacker. His MoMA named him Lloyd Blankenship. He 0:06:10.800 --> 0:06:13.520 called himself the Mentor. Can I read you the very 0:06:13.640 --> 0:06:16.080 end of it? Um? Should I do it? In my 0:06:16.160 --> 0:06:19.320 junior high drama kid voice, I was going to ask, 0:06:21.080 --> 0:06:24.440 this is our world now, the world of the electron 0:06:24.520 --> 0:06:27.920 and the switch, the beauty of the bad. We make 0:06:28.040 --> 0:06:31.160 use of a service already existing without paying for what 0:06:31.240 --> 0:06:35.679 could be dirt cheap if it wasn't run by profiteering gluttons, 0:06:35.720 --> 0:06:40.240 and you call us criminals. We explore, and you call 0:06:40.440 --> 0:06:45.360 us criminals. We seek after knowledge, and you call us criminals. 0:06:45.839 --> 0:06:50.880 We exist without skin color, without nationality, without religious bias, 0:06:51.160 --> 0:06:55.280 and you call us criminals. You build atomic bombs, you 0:06:55.360 --> 0:06:58.800 wage wars, you murder, cheat and lie to us and 0:06:58.839 --> 0:07:01.159 try to make us believe if it's for our own good. 0:07:01.600 --> 0:07:07.039 Yet we're the criminals. Yes, I am a criminal. My 0:07:07.240 --> 0:07:10.600 crime is that of curiosity. My crime is out of 0:07:10.720 --> 0:07:13.760 judging people by what they say and think, not what 0:07:13.800 --> 0:07:17.120 they look like. My crime is that about smarting you 0:07:17.360 --> 0:07:20.240 something that you will never forgive me for. I'm a 0:07:20.280 --> 0:07:24.760 hacker and this is my manifesto. You may stop this individual, 0:07:24.800 --> 0:07:28.640 but you cannot stop us all. After all, we're all alike. 0:07:30.400 --> 0:07:33.680 Reminds me of the Simpsons. Joker Ed Bakley drives a 0:07:33.760 --> 0:07:38.080 car that's powered off of his sense of self satisfaction. Yes, 0:07:38.640 --> 0:07:43.200 there's like serious Jean Valjean and doesn't make you want 0:07:43.200 --> 0:07:45.400 to go to coding class and just pop off once 0:07:45.400 --> 0:07:48.480 I get done. Waiving this flag over my head makes 0:07:48.520 --> 0:07:50.160 me want to go back to seventh grade and do 0:07:50.200 --> 0:07:56.600 a play. So Hackers, that was a real star turn 0:07:56.680 --> 0:07:59.760 for all. Angelina Jolie, Oh yeah, I think guess how 0:07:59.760 --> 0:08:02.400 she met and married Johnny Lee Miller sick boy. I 0:08:02.440 --> 0:08:08.880 think you're actually right about that. I'm right about hackers. 0:08:08.880 --> 0:08:12.720 It came out. It was in the public consciousness. Hacken. Yeah, 0:08:14.160 --> 0:08:15.560 it'd been there for a while. You know. He had 0:08:15.600 --> 0:08:21.600 Matthew Broderick in wargames the Net, that's right. Yeah, that 0:08:21.720 --> 0:08:25.200 was like the sanitized version. That was like the Kelly 0:08:26.000 --> 0:08:31.880 her out or visit her outlook, Hello Microsoft Excel and 0:08:32.000 --> 0:08:36.920 proficient Microsoft Office Suite. Um, yeah, no, that was the 0:08:37.040 --> 0:08:41.720 net is like the panera version of hackers and hackers 0:08:41.800 --> 0:08:50.679 is like the hot topic everything. So hackers. In six June, 0:08:51.080 --> 0:08:55.319 there was a U. S. Senate Permanent Subcommittee on Investigations 0:08:55.559 --> 0:08:59.880 that held a hearing on security in cyberspace. So you know, 0:09:00.040 --> 0:09:03.640 let's protecting as internet we got to. UM. Hearing was 0:09:03.679 --> 0:09:07.960 really all about the National Information Infrastructure as well as 0:09:07.960 --> 0:09:13.120 America's dependency on said infrastructure, the NII. It's basically, according 0:09:13.120 --> 0:09:17.800 to Senate staffers, quote, the advanced computer systems, databases, and 0:09:17.880 --> 0:09:22.520 telecommunications networks throughout the United States that make electronic information 0:09:22.600 --> 0:09:30.199 widely available and accessible. Start talking about like the Internet, cable, wire, satellite. 0:09:30.360 --> 0:09:33.360 So this was the telecommunications follow up act. I guess 0:09:33.440 --> 0:09:38.479 cell phones. Um, it's just a part of the global infrastructure, 0:09:38.520 --> 0:09:42.280 just the US. And so this this subcommittee, they put 0:09:42.280 --> 0:09:44.520 together a report and they figured out like what the 0:09:44.600 --> 0:09:50.040 vulnerabilities were for this infrastructure weakness in hardware and software. 0:09:50.440 --> 0:09:56.960 This week weeksauce human factor and then a lack of 0:09:57.080 --> 0:10:02.199 security culture. Ah, that's like the whole my passwords passwords. Yeah, 0:10:02.240 --> 0:10:04.400 it's like the I have the people who put a 0:10:04.440 --> 0:10:07.920 post it note with their password under their keyboard or 0:10:08.520 --> 0:10:11.760 people do that. You you don't work in office. Yeah, 0:10:11.840 --> 0:10:14.240 I don't know anything about office. That's like if you, yeah, 0:10:14.480 --> 0:10:17.000 you just lift a keyboard, you're probably on a on 0:10:17.120 --> 0:10:20.160 some people's Yeah, you're probably going to find there. But 0:10:20.200 --> 0:10:22.240 I don't even tape it underneath their desk draw They 0:10:22.320 --> 0:10:24.280 might do that too. I mean, if I were really 0:10:24.320 --> 0:10:26.160 trying to look for someone, that's what I would do, 0:10:27.240 --> 0:10:31.280 not that I would. Um So. In an example, the 0:10:31.280 --> 0:10:35.880 congressional staffers, they said, quote, the staff requested from various 0:10:35.960 --> 0:10:38.800 agencies the name of the individual or office in charge 0:10:38.800 --> 0:10:42.200 of computer safety. Most agencies responded that they did not 0:10:42.320 --> 0:10:44.800 know who that individual was, or that they did not 0:10:44.920 --> 0:10:47.960 know if such a position existed, or that the position 0:10:48.000 --> 0:10:51.000 was spread over numerous departments. Like who's in charge of 0:10:51.040 --> 0:10:55.840 security at the State Department? They're like department like like 0:10:55.960 --> 0:10:59.800 security security and the front door diversity. He plays a 0:10:59.840 --> 0:11:03.959 lot of games. Um so, but this is lot's changed 0:11:04.000 --> 0:11:07.959 since then. But still, um so, this subcommittee, were they 0:11:08.000 --> 0:11:14.080 just reacting to the smash hit movies hackers? Likely? No, 0:11:14.440 --> 0:11:17.719 there was a specific hack that was detailed in Appendix 0:11:17.720 --> 0:11:22.160 B to the report, and this is a cautionary tale, um, 0:11:22.200 --> 0:11:24.880 they said, quote the following case study is a good 0:11:24.880 --> 0:11:27.520 illustration of the type of threat facing our Department of 0:11:27.559 --> 0:11:32.319 Defense information infrastructure. Although the incident has been fully investigated 0:11:32.320 --> 0:11:36.000 by the Air Force Office of Special Investigations, numerous questions 0:11:36.000 --> 0:11:41.119 remain unanswered. So now we're not just talking like random 0:11:41.160 --> 0:11:44.079 business at at the at the government level. We're talking 0:11:44.080 --> 0:11:46.679 about Air Force. So it's like some war games kind 0:11:46.720 --> 0:11:48.480 of stuff, like the attacked into the d D and 0:11:48.520 --> 0:11:51.679 they're like getting nuclear. Do you want to play a game? 0:11:52.360 --> 0:11:57.240 So let's talk hackers. My story today. What's important is 0:11:57.240 --> 0:12:00.160 what I'm going to talk about. It's a grouse him 0:12:00.200 --> 0:12:03.360 to some a buddy story. Two young hackers taken on 0:12:03.440 --> 0:12:06.360 the world. The first guy someone you've already heard of, 0:12:07.000 --> 0:12:12.600 Angelina Jolie, Yes, her, No, it's Matthew Bevan. He was 0:12:13.200 --> 0:12:15.240 the name sounds familiar. He was, Yeah, he was on 0:12:15.240 --> 0:12:20.560 that British TV show The Heist, starring our Personal Savior. Um. 0:12:20.559 --> 0:12:23.600 He was a Welshman, or is a Welshman internationally known. 0:12:23.720 --> 0:12:29.680 He's still he's permanently internationally known. Hacker started young, he 0:12:29.760 --> 0:12:32.880 eventually became a white hat security expert who knows what 0:12:32.920 --> 0:12:35.960 he's doing today, we're hoping for his best life. But 0:12:36.040 --> 0:12:40.960 let's go back to the start. Born four Whales, Europe. 0:12:43.679 --> 0:12:47.360 His dad was a cop. So he gets his first computer, 0:12:47.720 --> 0:12:51.360 first real six during when he's twelve, and when he's 0:12:51.400 --> 0:12:56.240 fifteen he gets his first real mode M from my 0:12:56.320 --> 0:13:00.319 fellow math deficients. Right, okay, so it seems kind early 0:13:00.360 --> 0:13:03.080 for modems in such eight nine, at least for like 0:13:03.080 --> 0:13:05.480 the average person. Yeah. I had a friend whose father 0:13:05.559 --> 0:13:07.720 was a journalist and he used a modem to send 0:13:07.760 --> 0:13:09.880 his newspaper column in and we thought that was why 0:13:10.200 --> 0:13:12.520 had put a phone on this thing? Yeah, the little 0:13:12.520 --> 0:13:15.880 cradle thing. Well there there's little Matthew scouting and computing. 0:13:16.440 --> 0:13:20.800 You know. I mentioned it in the heist episode that 0:13:20.880 --> 0:13:25.120 he got his modem and he started freaking freaking out 0:13:25.240 --> 0:13:29.320 with the girl, free phone calls, hacking the phone, mainframe 0:13:29.400 --> 0:13:32.920 and the so on the week. So that then got 0:13:33.000 --> 0:13:35.760 him internet access. And since it's the early days, not 0:13:35.880 --> 0:13:40.160 everything is online, everything college networks. Yeah, but the stuff 0:13:40.200 --> 0:13:44.560 that is connected, he's just tuting right on in now. Um, 0:13:44.679 --> 0:13:50.200 he picked his hacker name Cougie. Yeah, comes from cougi kiri. 0:13:50.400 --> 0:13:53.400 Are you familiar with that? Hell? No, that's I'm ashamed 0:13:53.400 --> 0:13:56.120 for you. Um as we as the rest of us 0:13:56.120 --> 0:13:59.480 all know it's ninja sign language. Is it really that is? 0:14:00.360 --> 0:14:02.640 I'm not making that one up. It's hand signs that 0:14:02.760 --> 0:14:07.160 ninja's used to call upon their powers when they're in danger. So, 0:14:07.720 --> 0:14:10.840 according to my new favorite website, Way of the Ninja 0:14:10.920 --> 0:14:16.040 dot Com, kuji means nine symbols, and kirie refers to 0:14:16.080 --> 0:14:22.920 the cutting motion, and the nine symbols are written pyo, toe, shah, kai, jin, retzu, zai, 0:14:23.120 --> 0:14:25.320 and zen. I know I'm saying things wrong and I 0:14:25.520 --> 0:14:29.880 deep apologies for that. Each symbol, according to this website quote, 0:14:29.920 --> 0:14:32.560 each symbol has a specific meaning, so to invoke a 0:14:32.640 --> 0:14:36.760 specific ability, you have to perform the correct symbol. For example, 0:14:37.040 --> 0:14:40.200 if a ninja gets injured, he'd performed the kujie symbol 0:14:40.240 --> 0:14:43.480 for healing while in a meditative state. In other words, 0:14:43.560 --> 0:14:46.800 kuji kiri is like a meditative prayer. The combination of 0:14:46.840 --> 0:14:51.080 hand signs, breath and visualization induces a powerful mental state. 0:14:51.640 --> 0:14:55.240 There's no proof of people gaining extraordinary senses or healing powers. 0:14:55.480 --> 0:14:58.720 What cougie does is to trigger a specific mental state. 0:14:58.760 --> 0:15:02.120 For a shinobi, this optimal state of mine helps him 0:15:02.120 --> 0:15:04.600 function well under stress. It may also create the ideal 0:15:04.600 --> 0:15:08.120 conditions for his body to recover tad faster. I'm kind 0:15:08.120 --> 0:15:10.600 of embarrassed to admit, but at one time I did 0:15:10.680 --> 0:15:12.160 know this when I was a twelve year old boy, 0:15:12.200 --> 0:15:16.240 and I was like, oh, I know, you can't. You 0:15:16.280 --> 0:15:18.720 know you can't be a twelve year old boy and 0:15:18.720 --> 0:15:20.800 I have a little bit of ninja. Oh my god, 0:15:20.800 --> 0:15:22.640 I had a lot of ninja and like folding up 0:15:22.680 --> 0:15:25.360 throwing stars. Yeah, we used to go down to Chinatown 0:15:25.360 --> 0:15:27.200 and buy them. In fact, one of my favorite memories 0:15:27.240 --> 0:15:29.240 is coming back from Chinatown throwing them up in the 0:15:29.240 --> 0:15:31.560 air and we were wearing, you know, flip flops, and 0:15:31.600 --> 0:15:33.560 the ninja star fell and hit my friend in the 0:15:33.560 --> 0:15:35.560 foot and blood spread it up higher than his head. 0:15:35.720 --> 0:15:37.600 Can we talk about how that's here one of your 0:15:37.640 --> 0:15:40.200 favorite memories, you said, because we were so happy to 0:15:40.200 --> 0:15:42.400 get the ninja stars, And it's about the ninja stars, 0:15:42.440 --> 0:15:44.720 not about the blood, not about the guys are of blood. 0:15:44.880 --> 0:15:47.560 But he was impressive. He was impressed. It sounds it well. 0:15:47.560 --> 0:15:52.720 So Matthew called himself, Guji go on um, I need 0:15:52.720 --> 0:15:56.400 to take a break right now and practice my cog kitty. Um, 0:15:56.480 --> 0:15:58.560 let's listen to some ads. When we come back, I'm 0:15:58.600 --> 0:16:00.800 going to tell you about Cougie served from the Web 0:16:00.840 --> 0:16:25.520 in search of alien life. All right, Saron. When we 0:16:25.640 --> 0:16:30.040 left off, Matthew Bevan a k a. Cougi was crafting 0:16:30.120 --> 0:16:33.160 a mission, my favorite hacking in Ninja. Yes, he's doing 0:16:33.160 --> 0:16:37.160 a hacking mission. He started small colleges businesses because not 0:16:37.200 --> 0:16:40.640 a lot of stuff was online like the Prodigy network 0:16:40.680 --> 0:16:43.280 back then. Yeah, he and his hacker pals, they'd race 0:16:43.320 --> 0:16:45.360 each other to see who could hack the most systems 0:16:45.360 --> 0:16:50.480 in two hours. So that's fun. In an interview at 0:16:50.480 --> 0:16:54.160 the BBC, he said that hacking was quote perhaps the 0:16:54.240 --> 0:16:56.360 feeling that a parent might get if they find their 0:16:56.440 --> 0:16:59.400 child's diary. They know they should not read it, they 0:16:59.400 --> 0:17:03.080 know it's wrong, but they just can't help themselves. Wow. Right, 0:17:03.400 --> 0:17:06.000 kind of an apt analogy, I think. Yeah. But also 0:17:06.119 --> 0:17:09.000 it's like, so he has a cop for a dad, 0:17:09.119 --> 0:17:11.840 he probably doesn't have a whole lot of like privacy 0:17:11.920 --> 0:17:13.760 and homes. He's like, I know my parents are going 0:17:13.800 --> 0:17:16.560 to get off reading this. Um, they know they shouldn't, 0:17:16.760 --> 0:17:20.200 but they can help themselves. So he and his pals 0:17:20.560 --> 0:17:25.440 hacking it up hack in the USA, well, uk, okay. 0:17:25.760 --> 0:17:28.240 One of his pals is a teenage boy and he's like, 0:17:28.440 --> 0:17:30.440 you know, Matthews and his early twenties at this point, 0:17:30.520 --> 0:17:34.760 teenage boy named Richard Price who called himself data stream cowboy, 0:17:35.320 --> 0:17:38.960 data stream cowboy. Huh. Now what I love is that 0:17:39.040 --> 0:17:41.360 the government kind of insults him and only calls him 0:17:41.400 --> 0:17:45.320 data stream. How can you drop the cowboy, dude? I mean, 0:17:45.359 --> 0:17:47.320 it reminds me of drug Store Cowboy, one of my 0:17:47.440 --> 0:17:50.160 favorite nineties movies. I can never hear the words drug 0:17:50.200 --> 0:17:53.120 store that. Secretly my head, I think they're just dropping 0:17:53.119 --> 0:17:55.760 it so that first of all, it makes him feel 0:17:55.760 --> 0:17:57.840 a little familiar and he's a kid, and then they're 0:17:57.880 --> 0:18:01.840 like insulting him. But I'll so maybe because in those 0:18:01.920 --> 0:18:04.280 days you had to print things up in hard copy, 0:18:04.400 --> 0:18:06.479 if you took the word cowboy out, it would reduce 0:18:06.600 --> 0:18:09.399 over time the page count and you could save money. 0:18:09.720 --> 0:18:15.000 Really No, we're going to talk about all data stream 0:18:15.080 --> 0:18:18.960 seed later, but um, it was the nineties. Matthew was 0:18:19.000 --> 0:18:21.280 a young man, not a whole lot of real life friends. 0:18:21.280 --> 0:18:23.040 So of course he's a big fan of the X 0:18:23.080 --> 0:18:27.119 Files and he's fascinated with the Roswell incident. I'm not 0:18:27.240 --> 0:18:31.320 capping on him for that at all. Fascinated right, and 0:18:31.359 --> 0:18:36.040 I loved the x He'd hear about hackers breaking into 0:18:36.119 --> 0:18:39.080 army and navy bases to find information about UFOs. He's like, 0:18:39.119 --> 0:18:41.120 you know what, I'm gonna give it a try. Why 0:18:41.119 --> 0:18:46.560 not me? So so I want in. So there were 0:18:46.680 --> 0:18:51.840 rumors of forty previous hackers who tried this to get 0:18:51.880 --> 0:18:56.080 into all these military things, and then they disappeared. They disappeared, 0:18:56.560 --> 0:18:59.359 get out. But you know what, Matthew, how did they 0:18:59.359 --> 0:19:01.840 know the hackers disappear? Like did hacker community say like 0:19:01.840 --> 0:19:03.719 they stopped all of a sudden, they're not logging on. 0:19:03.800 --> 0:19:06.040 They're like, well, yeah, but is that okay? I don't know. 0:19:06.240 --> 0:19:09.520 They weren't like disappeared, disappeared like black helicopters. It's a rumor. 0:19:09.640 --> 0:19:11.680 So I'm sure that some people heard that, yeah, black 0:19:11.720 --> 0:19:13.960 helicopters came or they were thrown in vans. Other people 0:19:14.000 --> 0:19:15.560 are like, I haven't seen them online in a while, 0:19:16.160 --> 0:19:21.199 so you know yeah. Um, Matthew took my informal motto 0:19:21.240 --> 0:19:23.080 who knows who cares? And he just went with it. 0:19:23.240 --> 0:19:25.960 Who knows who cares, I'm going to try it. So 0:19:26.080 --> 0:19:29.359 he summons data stream Cowboy, and I just like to 0:19:29.400 --> 0:19:32.120 imagine they're both wearing like crushed velvet capes. I don't 0:19:32.119 --> 0:19:34.880 know why. And then they get their freak on. Okay, 0:19:34.960 --> 0:19:37.040 so there's just a couple of freaks off the leash. 0:19:37.080 --> 0:19:40.320 Am I right? People, is this thing on? Um? They 0:19:40.400 --> 0:19:42.560 wanted to know what the FEDS had on the UFOs, 0:19:42.600 --> 0:19:45.639 the UFOs, as we say in the biz. It was 0:19:45.680 --> 0:19:49.240 the nineties X files, the rage Internet spreading out like 0:19:49.280 --> 0:19:54.919 a cancer across the globe. And there's kan data stream here, 0:19:55.600 --> 0:19:59.880 cancer totally righting the cancer. He ha, Okay, so Matthew, 0:20:00.000 --> 0:20:03.119 a web of cancer, a couple of freaks off the leash. 0:20:03.359 --> 0:20:06.680 Matthew hacks into the computer network at Air Forces Rome 0:20:06.800 --> 0:20:10.280 Laboratory at what was then Griffith's Air Force Base in Rome, 0:20:10.320 --> 0:20:12.760 New York. Did you know I've been to that Air 0:20:12.760 --> 0:20:14.720 Force base? I did, and I wanted to talk to 0:20:14.720 --> 0:20:16.520 you about that. No, I had no idea. How would 0:20:16.560 --> 0:20:19.280 I know about? Because, my good dude, that's where they 0:20:19.320 --> 0:20:25.440 held with stock yours truly right there. The whole time 0:20:25.600 --> 0:20:29.400 I forgot you suffered through I was working for Mother 0:20:29.480 --> 0:20:32.400 Jones magazine at the time, and we're doing like marketing 0:20:32.440 --> 0:20:35.480 stuff there but also very loosely covering it for the 0:20:35.560 --> 0:20:39.119 Mojo website and as a whole other story for a 0:20:39.119 --> 0:20:45.200 whole other time. You've written about this medium, ye, so 0:20:45.320 --> 0:20:47.960 that Yeah, I've been to this Air Force base. I 0:20:47.960 --> 0:20:51.199 haven't been in like the brain center of it, the 0:20:51.240 --> 0:20:54.280 computer because it was decommissioned when I was there. You 0:20:54.400 --> 0:20:59.040 just suffered anyway, Oh yeah, smelled terrible anyway. Time in 0:20:59.080 --> 0:21:02.680 the hack Row Lab was quote the Air Forces Premier 0:21:02.720 --> 0:21:08.159 Command and Control research facility. Its projects included artificial intelligence system, 0:21:08.280 --> 0:21:12.360 radar guidance system, and target detection and tracking system. Why 0:21:12.480 --> 0:21:14.480 is this description side? It comes with a slow gin 0:21:14.600 --> 0:21:20.119 fizz like it happens when you when you go into 0:21:20.160 --> 0:21:22.560 the Internet now and you type it in. That's what 0:21:22.680 --> 0:21:26.120 comes out of your computer. That sound the voice anytime 0:21:26.119 --> 0:21:28.359 you want a description of anything important. Did you ever 0:21:28.400 --> 0:21:29.920 notice now if you go to look at anything for 0:21:29.960 --> 0:21:31.600 the Internet when you research it's like, oh, did you 0:21:31.600 --> 0:21:34.640 want to buy that? I'll go and research anything. It's like, oh, hey, 0:21:34.640 --> 0:21:36.520 did you want to buy that Air Force base? I'm like, Oh, 0:21:36.640 --> 0:21:38.680 I just wanted would you like to buy a black 0:21:38.720 --> 0:21:44.440 hole hook me up, So Maddie bevans uh, he said. 0:21:44.520 --> 0:21:48.040 His quote soul tool was a Commodore Amiga loaded with 0:21:48.119 --> 0:21:51.760 blue boxing program called rocks Box Hell. Yes, shout out 0:21:51.800 --> 0:21:54.280 to the Amiga I had. My brother and I had 0:21:54.280 --> 0:21:56.840 an Amiga when we were growing up. Yeah, my neighbor 0:21:56.920 --> 0:21:59.560 Ja had when we loved it are it was so 0:22:00.119 --> 0:22:04.159 way too sophisticated for our use, Like we played kids 0:22:04.320 --> 0:22:06.959 educational games like he had to solve math problems and 0:22:07.000 --> 0:22:10.600 collect carmins to like navigate a castle. That was what 0:22:10.760 --> 0:22:13.600 I did on there. My grandma got us that computer 0:22:13.720 --> 0:22:17.600 at this craziest store in Berkeley that was half computer 0:22:17.680 --> 0:22:22.600 store half tennis store. It was called it was called 0:22:22.640 --> 0:22:28.640 Winner's Circle. It legitimately sold computers and tennis gear interests. 0:22:28.800 --> 0:22:31.399 I think, Yeah, I thought I was misremembering it and 0:22:31.440 --> 0:22:34.280 like confusing two stores, and I was like, hold on 0:22:34.320 --> 0:22:36.520 a second. I had to look it up their old 0:22:36.600 --> 0:22:39.720 YELP reviews at this place that it doesn't exist anywhere, 0:22:39.760 --> 0:22:42.960 but it existed. Then I got my rackets restrung there. 0:22:43.200 --> 0:22:44.879 But then we'd also be like can I get a 0:22:44.920 --> 0:22:50.280 cool educational game like popular kids would do? Like I 0:22:50.320 --> 0:22:53.400 may have been wearing orthoped or like orthodontic net gear 0:22:54.640 --> 0:22:56.040 when I went in there. I don't know who's to 0:22:56.080 --> 0:22:59.600 say whatever. So Matthew, he had an Amiga shout out 0:22:59.640 --> 0:23:02.800 to him. He goes um he hacked the Rome Lab. 0:23:03.400 --> 0:23:05.480 He said he was doing it because he wanted to 0:23:05.600 --> 0:23:09.320 like prove UFO conspiracy stuff. He said, I was not 0:23:09.480 --> 0:23:15.120 interested in weapons codes, just the UFOs um. He thought 0:23:15.200 --> 0:23:17.760 that they were totally hiding UFO information. He wanted to 0:23:17.760 --> 0:23:20.040 find out what it was. He said, quote. There were 0:23:20.080 --> 0:23:22.879 a lot of weird coincidences which add up to the 0:23:22.920 --> 0:23:26.280 possibility of it most likely being true. I like to 0:23:26.320 --> 0:23:30.479 think what I saw was not misinformation. He saw some stuff. 0:23:31.600 --> 0:23:33.320 Did he tell the blink when a D two guy? 0:23:33.520 --> 0:23:37.199 That's my question. So the Air Force figured out pretty 0:23:37.200 --> 0:23:39.480 soon that there were two people they didn't know who 0:23:39.800 --> 0:23:42.280 who had hacked into seven of the computer systems at 0:23:42.359 --> 0:23:46.720 Rome Labs and gained complete access to all the information 0:23:46.720 --> 0:23:51.000 in their systems. Just waltzed right in. They downloaded data files. 0:23:51.480 --> 0:23:55.440 They installed sniffer software programs on each of the seven systems, 0:23:55.720 --> 0:23:59.000 which meant they were able to read, copy and delete emails, 0:23:59.720 --> 0:24:05.600