WEBVTT - Hour 3 - Cheating in Fishing & Chess 0:00:00.640 --> 0:00:03.480 You are listening to the Dan Patrick Show on Fox 0:00:03.520 --> 0:00:09.680 Sports Radio. Final hour on this Tuesday show's flown by. 0:00:10.760 --> 0:00:13.920 We're gonna talk cheating. Coming up, this sour the fishing 0:00:14.080 --> 0:00:20.400 scandal that's rocked Lake Erie. They had a walleye tournament. Also, 0:00:20.720 --> 0:00:24.240 you have a cheating scandal in chess. We'll have an 0:00:24.320 --> 0:00:28.000 update on that, and a cheating expert in chess is 0:00:28.040 --> 0:00:30.600 going to join us. Coming up. I don't know if 0:00:30.640 --> 0:00:32.839 you give out business cards, Nick, what do you do 0:00:32.960 --> 0:00:36.839 for a living. I'm a cheating expert in chess. Yes, boy, 0:00:36.880 --> 0:00:39.080 is that like that? Leo Dicabrio will be catchbee if 0:00:39.080 --> 0:00:41.480 you can. He was a he was a scam artist 0:00:41.479 --> 0:00:43.040 for years. They went to work for the FBI catching 0:00:43.080 --> 0:00:45.800 scam artist. I'm not sure, but we'll talk to him. Yes, 0:00:45.800 --> 0:00:47.920 tones say, aren't you also a computer science professor at 0:00:47.920 --> 0:00:49.760 the University Buffalo and try to lead with that. No, no, no, 0:00:49.800 --> 0:00:54.000 it's the chess I'm a cheating expert. Here a couple 0:00:54.080 --> 0:00:56.320 of phone calls. We'll get to those as well. The 0:00:56.440 --> 0:00:59.040 poll question for the final hour of this award nominated 0:00:59.080 --> 0:01:02.800 program seat no counter is well, Dad, we threw up there, 0:01:03.400 --> 0:01:05.319 not threw up, but we put up. Yeah, I should 0:01:05.319 --> 0:01:08.280 say yeah, you always say threw up, threw up? Yeah, 0:01:08.520 --> 0:01:13.480 old habit ste hard yet radiant um better at press conferences? 0:01:13.720 --> 0:01:16.800 Nick Saban or Bill Belichick? Oh right now, Nick Saban 0:01:17.040 --> 0:01:18.920 is winning with us sixty percent of the vote. How 0:01:18.920 --> 0:01:22.000 about that? People like Nick Saban better than Bill. It 0:01:22.000 --> 0:01:26.080 feels like I am surprised occasionally with Nick Saban. I'm 0:01:26.200 --> 0:01:33.479 rarely surprised with Bill Belichick. Here's here's Nick Saban being 0:01:33.560 --> 0:01:37.880 asked a question that, yeah, maybe you want to ask it, 0:01:38.080 --> 0:01:40.679 but you know the answer is probably not going to 0:01:40.720 --> 0:01:45.000 be favorable. You've talked about Jaylen Merrow's unique skill set. 0:01:45.120 --> 0:01:47.960 Just given that, is there thought of maybe putting a 0:01:48.040 --> 0:01:51.680 package together for him regardless of Price's injury status. We 0:01:52.000 --> 0:01:56.000 already have one, So you want us to put a 0:01:56.040 --> 0:01:58.200 new one together now just because he might play or 0:01:58.320 --> 0:02:00.440 use the old one. Man, We're gonna do it either one. 0:02:00.480 --> 0:02:03.080 I mean, I'll go talk to the offensive coaches and 0:02:03.160 --> 0:02:07.920 see again. You know I don't talk to Jimbo on 0:02:07.920 --> 0:02:09.840 a regular basis, but I'll call him and tell him 0:02:09.880 --> 0:02:13.320 right now for the conferences you're only too I mean, 0:02:13.760 --> 0:02:15.840 you guys think I'm gonna tell you what we're going 0:02:15.960 --> 0:02:20.160 to do with our offense and our team, you might 0:02:20.160 --> 0:02:26.240 as well make it up. Oh, good stuff, good stuff. 0:02:27.440 --> 0:02:29.840 Alabama is now ready for Texas, say at am. It'd 0:02:29.840 --> 0:02:31.839 be awesome if the media right now did start making 0:02:31.919 --> 0:02:34.120 up stuff. They just start making up all kinds of 0:02:34.200 --> 0:02:36.520 random things that the offense was gonna you can expect. 0:02:38.360 --> 0:02:40.600 Yes time. What part of that question said, can you 0:02:40.600 --> 0:02:42.920 specifically tell us what players you're going to run? There 0:02:42.960 --> 0:02:45.000 was you know, even if I was into that, that 0:02:45.080 --> 0:02:47.600 was just a little much. I don't know. I had 0:02:47.639 --> 0:02:49.520 a problem with that. And I like Nick Saban, but 0:02:49.560 --> 0:02:52.120 that was he's like looking to start up with somebody there. Yeah, 0:02:52.160 --> 0:02:55.560 he just you know, probably goes in there, knows he's 0:02:55.600 --> 0:02:57.160 got to go in and talk to the media, and 0:02:57.200 --> 0:03:00.080 it's like, uh, what are they gonna ask me? Hey, 0:03:00.160 --> 0:03:03.840 you've got a special package strategy? What's your offensive game 0:03:03.880 --> 0:03:08.040 plan for Texas? A and M? And plus they hear 0:03:08.160 --> 0:03:10.480 things that they want to hear, or they answer it 0:03:10.520 --> 0:03:13.200 in a way that they want to answer it. Yeah. More, 0:03:13.960 --> 0:03:15.480 I just want to be in there when they're not 0:03:15.520 --> 0:03:17.800 playing an SEC opponent and they're playing you know, a 0:03:17.919 --> 0:03:21.600 lesser you know, FCS school. Yeah, and oh the competition 0:03:21.720 --> 0:03:25.000 and Saban's head will explode off of his shoulders. Yeah, 0:03:25.000 --> 0:03:28.280 he can't do that. Sunday Night, Joe Burrow in the 0:03:28.280 --> 0:03:31.280 Bengals battle Lamar Jackson and the Ravens Sunday seven Eastern 0:03:31.320 --> 0:03:36.080 on NBC and Peacock. All right, here's the story, and 0:03:36.160 --> 0:03:39.320 maybe you got a chance to follow this, But there 0:03:39.440 --> 0:03:44.840 was a fishing tournament that was in Upper Ohio here 0:03:45.320 --> 0:03:49.200 and it was the Lake Erie Walleye tournament called loot 0:03:49.360 --> 0:03:54.600 l e WT Lake Erie Walleye Trailer and the winners 0:03:55.160 --> 0:04:00.840 were disqualified because they found weights in the fifth that 0:04:00.960 --> 0:04:03.600 they caught. And there's a lot of money at stake here. 0:04:03.960 --> 0:04:06.920 The winning prize was close to twenty nine thousand dollars. 0:04:07.200 --> 0:04:10.600 But these guys have been winning. This is a season 0:04:10.720 --> 0:04:13.720 long event. They start in the summer and it wraps 0:04:13.840 --> 0:04:17.160 up this past Friday. And you may have seen the 0:04:17.279 --> 0:04:21.640 video and it went viral. As the kids like to say, 0:04:22.040 --> 0:04:25.320 they cut open the fish and you saw the weights 0:04:26.000 --> 0:04:31.960 fall out. So it became a big deal that they're 0:04:32.040 --> 0:04:35.640 cheating in fishing, and these guys have won close to 0:04:35.720 --> 0:04:40.640 three hundred thousand dollars. These guys are like the Lamb's 0:04:40.760 --> 0:04:48.360 Armstrong of fishing. Here they're Barry Bonds, McGuire and Sosa, 0:04:48.920 --> 0:04:53.159 but Matt Markey covers the event. Covered the event. He's 0:04:53.160 --> 0:04:57.679 the outdoors editor for the Toledo Blade and he joins 0:04:57.760 --> 0:05:01.200 us on the program. Matt, thanks for joining. Explain the 0:05:01.279 --> 0:05:07.480 tournament for our audience. This particular tournament was the championship 0:05:07.600 --> 0:05:11.200 for that Lake Erie Walleye Trail circuit and it involved 0:05:12.120 --> 0:05:16.440 probably thirty or forty two person teams and the top 0:05:16.480 --> 0:05:20.000 prize would have been with bonuses in all, maybe thirty 0:05:20.040 --> 0:05:24.560 to forty thousand dollars. But there's a lot of other tournaments, 0:05:24.560 --> 0:05:28.719 including two major tournaments that take place from the middle 0:05:28.760 --> 0:05:32.839 of October till the weekend after Thanksgiving, and in those 0:05:33.800 --> 0:05:36.840 both of those have more than four hundred thousand in 0:05:37.000 --> 0:05:40.400 total prize money, with one hundred and twenty five thousand, 0:05:40.440 --> 0:05:42.680 one hundred and fifty thousand going to the winner. So 0:05:42.720 --> 0:05:46.159 the stakes are a lot higher than most people would 0:05:46.160 --> 0:05:49.520 think when it comes to walleye fishing. When did we 0:05:49.600 --> 0:05:54.600 know that there was something up? We knew. I've been 0:05:54.640 --> 0:05:57.400 hearing it for about a year with this particular pair 0:05:58.040 --> 0:06:01.479 behind the scenes, guys whispering you know, complaining in all, 0:06:01.480 --> 0:06:05.359 but nobody willing to make a formal complaint or to 0:06:05.520 --> 0:06:08.760 charge them, you know, in the public square. But there 0:06:08.800 --> 0:06:11.279 have been a lot of rumors in it, most of 0:06:11.320 --> 0:06:15.640 them involved this particular pair. But once this tournament, the 0:06:15.680 --> 0:06:18.840 first day was held, you come in, there's a way in. 0:06:18.960 --> 0:06:21.719 There's some pomp and circumstance with it all up on 0:06:21.760 --> 0:06:24.840 a stage, and they kind of make it a you know, 0:06:24.880 --> 0:06:28.719 a pt barnum thing. And when these fish came up, 0:06:28.920 --> 0:06:31.599 any lake erie walleye fisherman will know if you hand 0:06:31.640 --> 0:06:35.279 them a twenty five inch fish, it should weigh between 0:06:35.360 --> 0:06:37.360 four and five pounds, And if you hand them a 0:06:37.440 --> 0:06:40.280 thirty inch fish, they will know within six to eight 0:06:40.320 --> 0:06:43.599 ounces is what it should weigh. These two guys brought 0:06:43.640 --> 0:06:46.440 their fish up and the tournament director, who's been doing 0:06:46.440 --> 0:06:50.080 this a long time, holds this fish up and to 0:06:50.240 --> 0:06:52.800 him it looks like a five pound fish. He puts 0:06:52.800 --> 0:06:55.640 it on the scale and it weighs seven pounds. And 0:06:55.760 --> 0:07:00.599 because of all the accusations behind the scenes associated with 0:07:00.640 --> 0:07:05.040 these two guys, he became suspicious and kind of, you know, 0:07:05.160 --> 0:07:08.080 inspected it a little bit more closely. Felt something unusual 0:07:08.080 --> 0:07:10.800 in the belly of this fish, and then when they 0:07:10.840 --> 0:07:12.960 he got a knife and opened it up, these two 0:07:13.360 --> 0:07:16.720 massive twelve ounce lead balls roll out of its bellies. 0:07:16.760 --> 0:07:21.800 So apparently, allegedly and all those qualifiers, you know, these 0:07:21.840 --> 0:07:24.920 guys had been using lead weights to enhance the weight 0:07:24.920 --> 0:07:30.560 of their catch. Is this a felony. It's a felony. 0:07:31.280 --> 0:07:34.760 Felony fraud, is what the prosecutor tells me, because, like 0:07:34.840 --> 0:07:36.920 I said, it would have been thirty or forty thousand 0:07:36.920 --> 0:07:39.560 dollars that they would have won under you know, these 0:07:39.800 --> 0:07:43.440 this pretext that they cheated and bumped up the weights. 0:07:43.520 --> 0:07:48.080 But the bigger controversy now is the fact that these 0:07:48.120 --> 0:07:53.600 guys supposedly won one of the major fall tournaments last year, 0:07:53.920 --> 0:07:56.760 and that was one hundred and fifty grand, and they've 0:07:56.800 --> 0:08:00.720 won several other tournaments, and we think it's the neighborhood 0:08:01.320 --> 0:08:06.840 with bonuses, prize money and sponsor money, probably four hundred 0:08:06.880 --> 0:08:10.800 grand that they've won. And the whole time with these people, 0:08:10.960 --> 0:08:12.960 you know, saying that they're cheating. You know, all this 0:08:13.120 --> 0:08:16.000 going on in the background. So there's a lot more 0:08:16.040 --> 0:08:19.440 money here involved than people think. And the nature of 0:08:19.440 --> 0:08:23.600 the tournament, Dan is what makes it so difficult to police. 0:08:24.080 --> 0:08:27.280 So imagine a pro golf tournament and the best golfers 0:08:27.280 --> 0:08:28.960 in the world go out and it's just them and 0:08:29.000 --> 0:08:31.840 their caddy and they play eighteen and they come in 0:08:31.880 --> 0:08:34.600 and they turn in their card, and there's nobody to say, 0:08:35.400 --> 0:08:37.080 you know, well, he didn't get a twenty six on 0:08:37.120 --> 0:08:39.079 the back. You know he didn't shoot a twenty nine 0:08:39.120 --> 0:08:42.360 on the front. And that's that's what happens. Is these 0:08:42.400 --> 0:08:44.560 guys go out on the lake at the at first 0:08:44.640 --> 0:08:48.440 light and they come back eight hours later, and you 0:08:48.520 --> 0:08:51.600 have to believe, unless you monitor it more closer or 0:08:51.640 --> 0:08:53.920 inspect it, you have to believe that they went out 0:08:53.960 --> 0:08:57.520 and caught those fish. Because there's a couple of things 0:08:57.520 --> 0:09:00.480 here that I think some of the competitors thought the 0:09:00.520 --> 0:09:03.200 fish looked a little too old, so maybe they brought 0:09:03.200 --> 0:09:06.760 the fish with him. Also, they weren't I think you 0:09:06.880 --> 0:09:10.680 donate the fish to the local markets, and they weren't 0:09:10.679 --> 0:09:14.120 donating their fish to the local markets. That sound right 0:09:14.120 --> 0:09:17.440 here meant yes, you're absolutely right. Those are the two 0:09:17.440 --> 0:09:19.720 other red flags that have popped up in the past. 0:09:19.880 --> 0:09:24.760 Because in a tournament that was held near Toledo in April, 0:09:25.320 --> 0:09:29.920 they won that tournament allegedly, and they went out and 0:09:30.000 --> 0:09:33.840 fish like four days before the tournament, intensely saying they 0:09:33.880 --> 0:09:36.920 were scouting for places. And then when they checked in 0:09:36.960 --> 0:09:40.640 their fish, several of the fishermen commented that their fish 0:09:40.720 --> 0:09:44.640 looked old. In other words, the tournament runs Friday and Saturday. 0:09:44.679 --> 0:09:47.320 They go out on a Tuesday and fish and catch 0:09:47.320 --> 0:09:49.880 a couple big ones, put them in alive well in 0:09:49.920 --> 0:09:52.280 the boat, turn the oxygen on and pump and hope 0:09:52.320 --> 0:09:54.719 to keep them alive. And then when they go out 0:09:54.720 --> 0:09:57.280 and fish during the tournament, they mixed those two big 0:09:57.320 --> 0:09:59.679 ones in with the fish they actually caught to try 0:09:59.679 --> 0:10:02.800 to bu up their catch. But if you were to 0:10:03.000 --> 0:10:07.520 donate your fish to the local food pantry, which every 0:10:07.520 --> 0:10:11.280 other fisherman did in that Toledo tournament except them, the 0:10:11.360 --> 0:10:13.320 people that are cleaning the fish would have said, hey, 0:10:13.360 --> 0:10:15.800 wait a minute, these are old. We're not giving this, 0:10:16.040 --> 0:10:18.600 you know, we're not feeding foul fish to the folks 0:10:18.640 --> 0:10:21.240 down at the soup kitchens. So those were the other 0:10:21.280 --> 0:10:24.920 red flags that they had caught fish earlier, put them 0:10:24.920 --> 0:10:27.280 in alive well and then tried to mix those in 0:10:27.360 --> 0:10:30.360 with their catch. And also the fact that they didn't 0:10:30.400 --> 0:10:34.200 donate their fish is a major red flag because these 0:10:34.240 --> 0:10:37.920 guys are all exceptional walleye fishermen. They have enough walleye 0:10:37.920 --> 0:10:41.000 and the freezer to feed them and their you know, 0:10:41.040 --> 0:10:44.400 their wife's next husband. But you know they for some 0:10:44.480 --> 0:10:47.760 reason they kept their fish and nobody else did. We're 0:10:47.800 --> 0:10:51.720 talking to Matt Markey, outdoors editor for the Toledo Blade, 0:10:51.760 --> 0:10:56.679 any reaction from these two Jacob Brunyan and Chase Kaminski. 0:10:58.040 --> 0:11:02.720 Jacob Brunyan said, I can't talk. Sorry, that's it, and 0:11:02.880 --> 0:11:06.679 nothing from Kaminsky. That's the extent of their reaction at 0:11:06.720 --> 0:11:09.480 this point, and I try to find out yesterday. Neither 0:11:09.559 --> 0:11:13.679 one of them has legal representation as of this point, 0:11:13.720 --> 0:11:17.000 but I imagine once they're formally charged in the Cuyahoga 0:11:17.080 --> 0:11:21.360 County Court they will have attorneys representing them at all. 0:11:21.400 --> 0:11:24.679 But still very early in that process, and there's a 0:11:24.720 --> 0:11:27.880 lot of questions about will they be sued by these 0:11:28.280 --> 0:11:32.200 earlier tournaments, by some of their sponsors who've given them 0:11:32.400 --> 0:11:37.280 tens of thousands of dollars for misrepresentation. There's a high 0:11:37.360 --> 0:11:40.640 division of wildlife investigation for violations that it might have 0:11:40.640 --> 0:11:43.679 occurred out on the lake because you can't take game 0:11:43.760 --> 0:11:47.040 fish and manipulate them in any fashion. There's just a 0:11:47.080 --> 0:11:53.120 whole string of issues other than the fact that the reputations. Obviously, 0:11:53.360 --> 0:11:56.680 you are ruined. If you cheating golf in a pro tournament, 0:11:56.679 --> 0:11:59.439 you're done, and these guys have cheated in a professional 0:11:59.440 --> 0:12:02.160 wallete turn so they're done. I thought it was going 0:12:02.200 --> 0:12:04.760 to get ugly when they started to weigh the fish, 0:12:04.800 --> 0:12:07.160 and then everybody started to gather, and then all of 0:12:07.240 --> 0:12:10.640 a sudden, the tournament director cut open a couple of 0:12:10.640 --> 0:12:13.560 those fish, and you saw those weights come out, and 0:12:13.640 --> 0:12:18.679 I thought these guys could get roughed up here. They 0:12:18.720 --> 0:12:23.080 would have dan, except for the tournament director is a 0:12:23.160 --> 0:12:26.520 full time police officer in Broadview Heights, which is a 0:12:26.520 --> 0:12:29.360 Cleveland suburb, so he knew how to at least try 0:12:29.400 --> 0:12:33.080 to maintain order. But there were a couple Cleveland police 0:12:33.120 --> 0:12:37.280 officers on hand, and he called them over to basically 0:12:37.640 --> 0:12:40.880 escort these guys away from the mob. But you're absolutely right. 0:12:41.280 --> 0:12:44.199 If the police had not been there, it would have 0:12:44.240 --> 0:12:46.800 been much more than what we saw in those videos. 0:12:46.800 --> 0:12:49.000 It would be there would have been physical because a 0:12:49.000 --> 0:12:52.320 lot of those guys in that crowd just realized that 0:12:52.360 --> 0:12:55.360 all their suspicions were true, and that they had been 0:12:55.440 --> 0:12:58.520 cheated out of tens of thousands of dollars in previous 0:12:58.559 --> 0:13:00.760 tournaments where they might have finished second or the third 0:13:00.760 --> 0:13:03.800 of these guys. And we see this with guys in 0:13:03.880 --> 0:13:07.760 sports and other sports where they cheat too well, you know, 0:13:07.840 --> 0:13:11.880 if you put one weight in there. Okay, maybe it's 0:13:11.960 --> 0:13:14.920 not as obvious, but as you said, this is what 0:13:15.000 --> 0:13:17.920 these guys do. They can feel a fish, they can 0:13:17.960 --> 0:13:21.080 see the size of the fish, they know exactly, and 0:13:21.160 --> 0:13:23.520 these guys got too greedy to make sure that they 0:13:23.559 --> 0:13:27.120 won this event or these other events. I think so. 0:13:27.240 --> 0:13:29.440 I think it worked in the past, and so they 0:13:30.280 --> 0:13:34.240 got brazen and they got sloppy. And what they did 0:13:34.400 --> 0:13:38.160 was actually very primitive, you know, using the lead weights 0:13:38.160 --> 0:13:42.320 as probably the most simple way to enhance the weight 0:13:42.360 --> 0:13:45.160 of a fish. But they went way over with these 0:13:45.240 --> 0:13:48.800 lead balls. And then they actually took other fish and 0:13:48.960 --> 0:13:51.400 stripped the flesh off of them and stuff that down 0:13:51.440 --> 0:13:54.200 there to try to keep the lead from banging together 0:13:54.320 --> 0:13:57.079 and making it even more obvious. But they got they 0:13:57.120 --> 0:13:59.520 got sloppy, and I think it's like a lot of criminals. 0:14:00.120 --> 0:14:02.959 After the first ten bank robberies go well, then maybe 0:14:02.960 --> 0:14:05.600 they get sloppy with their routine. These guys just got 0:14:05.640 --> 0:14:08.600 sloppy and brazen and you know, a little bit too 0:14:09.720 --> 0:14:13.079 aggressive in their approach. And they're lucky they got out 0:14:13.080 --> 0:14:16.000 of their alive. Matt, good to talk to you. Thanks 0:14:16.000 --> 0:14:19.480 for joining us. We'll be following this whatever happens next. 0:14:20.320 --> 0:14:24.960 All right, Thank you. Dan enjoyed it. Matt Markey, alt 0:14:25.000 --> 0:14:28.600 Door's editor for The Toledo Blade. All right, punishment for 0:14:28.640 --> 0:14:34.200 these two, Todd, you're the judge. What's the punishment for 0:14:34.240 --> 0:14:37.400 these two? Now, this is about three hundred thousand dollars 0:14:37.480 --> 0:14:41.720 in prize winnings here. I think they got to give 0:14:41.760 --> 0:14:43.800 back all their money. They need to investigate all the 0:14:43.800 --> 0:14:46.000 other money that they want, and maybe those go to 0:14:46.040 --> 0:14:48.040 the second and third place people that should have been 0:14:48.040 --> 0:14:49.920 in first and second place. I think they need to 0:14:49.960 --> 0:14:52.880 be submerged in water like a fish like I have 0:14:52.920 --> 0:14:54.960 like a little hook attach to them, and be submerged 0:14:55.000 --> 0:14:57.440 with like weights like those lead weights that they put 0:14:57.440 --> 0:15:00.400 in the fish's mouth and all. And that's just artist. 0:15:00.440 --> 0:15:08.280 Oh yeah, you get well, okay, judge, Judy dude, the 0:15:08.720 --> 0:15:13.880 video of it all happening is unbelievable. Of the people 0:15:13.920 --> 0:15:16.400 figuring out what's going on? And there's I don't know, 0:15:16.520 --> 0:15:20.840 fifty one hundred and fifty dudes, big dudes surrounding who 0:15:20.880 --> 0:15:24.840 are heated, yes, because they're going way the fish. And 0:15:24.880 --> 0:15:26.880 then all of a sudden, the guy who runs the 0:15:26.920 --> 0:15:30.760 tournament cuts open the fish and we've got weights, and 0:15:30.760 --> 0:15:33.560 then all of a sudden it is on. There's a 0:15:33.640 --> 0:15:36.640 fight here, there's another flight, and the one guy's going, 0:15:36.800 --> 0:15:41.920 where's your crown now? Yes, bleeper, bleeper, where's your crown now? Yes? 0:15:42.840 --> 0:15:47.880 All right, so what do you do? Setan holy smokes man, 0:15:47.920 --> 0:15:51.400 I'm shocked that there wasn't some type of like like that. 0:15:51.440 --> 0:15:54.000 They just didn't settle the punishment right there in the moment, 0:15:54.000 --> 0:15:55.760 because it felt like those dudes are about to get 0:15:55.760 --> 0:15:57.600 the crap feet out of them. Well, the guy who's 0:15:57.680 --> 0:16:00.560 running the tournament is a cop. It does a really 0:16:00.560 --> 0:16:03.720 great job actually of keeping everything. He says right away, 0:16:03.760 --> 0:16:06.760 he's like, I don't want anybody touched. Don't don't touch him, 0:16:06.760 --> 0:16:10.320 and there's going to jail. I know, all right, Marvel, 0:16:10.600 --> 0:16:15.320 what do you do? Three hundred thousand dollars fine, two 0:16:15.400 --> 0:16:19.880 year suspension? Oh okay, I think he went light taking 0:16:19.880 --> 0:16:22.760 that one up to the commissioner. Yeah, the fish commission Yeah, 0:16:23.480 --> 0:16:28.040 the fishioner, the coffishioner. Okay, yes, that's a major title. 0:16:28.120 --> 0:16:31.720 I'm the cofifishioner. Yes. They obviously got to give all 0:16:31.760 --> 0:16:33.520 the money back. I don't know if the second place 0:16:33.560 --> 0:16:35.840 gets the money. It's not like the Reggie Bush Bevinschung 0:16:35.920 --> 0:16:39.160 Heisman thing. I would go mountain landis on him. I 0:16:39.200 --> 0:16:42.240 go lifetime ban from fishing. They'd lose their personal fishing 0:16:42.280 --> 0:16:45.600 licenses and their competitive license and like community service they 0:16:45.600 --> 0:16:47.760 have to work work at like a fishing tackle place, 0:16:47.840 --> 0:16:52.080 just scaling fish for free for hours on it. I 0:16:52.240 --> 0:16:56.920 would I would make them lose their casting hand, like wow, yow. 0:16:57.080 --> 0:16:58.800 I'd have to take off one of their their hands. 0:16:58.800 --> 0:17:07.360 You're going biblical, yes, yes, fish eye for a fishy yes. 0:17:07.480 --> 0:17:12.280 Time you know the layers will be angling for lighter sky. Okay, alright, alright, 0:17:12.359 --> 0:17:15.080 there we go. Alright, let me take a break here, 0:17:15.600 --> 0:17:17.600 let me take a break. Somebody said, we really tackled 0:17:17.640 --> 0:17:23.399 the hardstall. Okay, okay, like that, everybody is trying to 0:17:23.480 --> 0:17:26.360 kind of run down the inventory of fishing words here. 0:17:26.400 --> 0:17:30.639 The hook I used to fish with a cane pole. 0:17:31.400 --> 0:17:33.440 I used to fish all the time, you and Mom 0:17:33.440 --> 0:17:35.240 and Paul used to go down to the down down 0:17:35.280 --> 0:17:39.040 the fishing hole at a cane pole and uh then 0:17:39.080 --> 0:17:42.960 I got an open face real Now, I fly fish. 0:17:43.000 --> 0:17:51.600 That's what real men do. That was that was supposed 0:17:51.600 --> 0:17:54.520 to be in my inner When we come back, we 0:17:54.600 --> 0:17:58.560 go from cheating and fishing to cheating and chess. We'll 0:17:58.600 --> 0:18:01.960 talk to an expert who will tell us about how 0:18:02.000 --> 0:18:04.120 to cheat and chess. Yes, Polly. Do you think either 0:18:04.200 --> 0:18:06.000 our last two guests thought when they woke up a 0:18:06.040 --> 0:18:07.280 couple of days ago, we're gonna be on the Dan 0:18:07.320 --> 0:18:10.440 Patrick Show this week Tuesday in October. I think our 0:18:10.520 --> 0:18:13.400 last guest thought there's a chance somebody's going to reach 0:18:13.440 --> 0:18:16.080 out to me. I don't think our next guest thought, 0:18:16.119 --> 0:18:18.120 you know when he woke up, you know, think Dan 0:18:18.200 --> 0:18:20.680 Patrick's gonna call me. We're gonna talk about chess. Yes, Polly, 0:18:20.760 --> 0:18:23.040 we were offered Devo Samuel for the next seconent. Know 0:18:23.320 --> 0:18:26.679 we want we want to University of Buffalo chess est. Yeahchel, 0:18:26.720 --> 0:18:29.719 nobody cares. All right, Well, come back back Dan Patrick's 0:18:29.720 --> 0:18:32.840 show back after this. If you own a business, it's 0:18:32.880 --> 0:18:34.960 been a bumpy ride. You could use a break. And 0:18:35.200 --> 0:18:37.560 maybe there's help on the way. If your business has 0:18:37.640 --> 0:18:40.920 five or more employees, manage to survive COVID, you could 0:18:40.920 --> 0:18:43.280 be eligible to receive a payroll tax rebate of up 0:18:43.280 --> 0:18:47.080 to twenty six thousand dollars. That's per employee, not alone. 0:18:47.440 --> 0:18:51.400 It's a refund of your taxes. Totally legal. The challenge 0:18:51.440 --> 0:18:54.560 is getting your hands on it, and that's where getrefunds 0:18:54.600 --> 0:18:58.680 dot Com comes in. Getrefunds dot Com has a team 0:18:58.680 --> 0:19:01.280 of tax attorneys they put together. They're highly trained in 0:19:01.280 --> 0:19:05.000 this little known payroll tax refund program. They've already returned 0:19:05.040 --> 0:19:07.960 over a billion dollars to businesses and maybe they can 0:19:08.000 --> 0:19:10.800 help you as well. They do all the work, no 0:19:10.920 --> 0:19:13.639 charge upfront. They simply share a percentage of the cash 0:19:13.640 --> 0:19:15.720 that they get back for you. So what do you 0:19:15.720 --> 0:19:19.000 have to lose? Businesses of all types can qualify, including 0:19:19.040 --> 0:19:23.200 those who took PPP, nonprofits, even those that had increases 0:19:23.280 --> 0:19:26.280 in sales. So find out if your business qualifies to 0:19:26.359 --> 0:19:28.919 go to get refunds dot Com. It's like on qualify me, 0:19:28.960 --> 0:19:32.240 answer a few questions. This payroll tax refund is only 0:19:32.280 --> 0:19:35.400 available for a limited amount of time. Don't miss out. 0:19:35.600 --> 0:19:38.520 Get Refunds dot com good luck. Thanks for listening to 0:19:38.560 --> 0:19:41.040 The Dan Patrick Show podcast. Be sure to catch us 0:19:41.119 --> 0:19:43.960 live every weekday morning nine until noon eastern six to 0:19:44.040 --> 0:19:46.840 nine Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, and you can find 0:19:46.920 --> 0:19:50.959 us on the iHeartRadio app at FSR or stream us 0:19:51.000 --> 0:19:55.119 live on the Peacock app. An investigation is said to 0:19:55.119 --> 0:19:58.520 be launched in the wake of cheating allegations made by 0:19:58.760 --> 0:20:05.119 world chess champ in Magnus Carlson. This was announced last Thursday, 0:20:05.640 --> 0:20:11.560 and Carlson has accused a fellow grandmaster, Hans Nieman, of cheating, 0:20:11.680 --> 0:20:15.520 saying that his rivals quote over the board progress has 0:20:15.560 --> 0:20:20.719 been unusual. So he's a nineteen year old American. Carlson, 0:20:20.920 --> 0:20:25.200 by most accounts, is the greatest chess player in the world, 0:20:25.600 --> 0:20:28.520 one of the greatest of all time. And he backed 0:20:28.560 --> 0:20:33.800 out of a competition that was last month. So I 0:20:33.840 --> 0:20:36.720 said to Fritzie, can you give me a chess cheating expert? 0:20:36.960 --> 0:20:41.440 He said, yep, he's Professor Kenneth Reagan, Professor of Computer 0:20:41.520 --> 0:20:44.280 Science and Engineering at the University of Buffalo School of 0:20:44.320 --> 0:20:49.639 Engineering and also a chess cheating expert. Professor, thanks for 0:20:49.800 --> 0:20:53.760 joining us. How do you become a chess cheating expert. Well, 0:20:53.800 --> 0:20:57.040 in my case, a statistical model that I developed since 0:20:57.080 --> 0:21:00.920 two thousand and six when there was a great fracas 0:21:01.080 --> 0:21:04.680 at the World Championship with the Bulgarian accusing the Russian 0:21:04.720 --> 0:21:11.000 of cheating by computer cable to his bathroom. Okay, so wait, 0:21:11.400 --> 0:21:16.040 explain that he had a computer cable. No, he did not. 0:21:16.200 --> 0:21:20.400 There was no such cable, because my model explained that 0:21:20.440 --> 0:21:24.359 the Bulgarian was overlooking a simple principle. If you have 0:21:24.480 --> 0:21:28.040 only one move to stay alive, chances are a good 0:21:28.119 --> 0:21:31.000 chess player and a computer will find the same move, 0:21:31.400 --> 0:21:35.480 depends on the kind of position involved. Okay, let's get 0:21:35.480 --> 0:21:39.920 to what's happening between these two. Carlson is the greatest 0:21:40.320 --> 0:21:45.480 chess player in the world, is high gradly high rated, Yes, okay. 0:21:46.000 --> 0:21:51.240 Hans Nieman is the newcomer and aspiring teenager who was 0:21:51.320 --> 0:21:54.840 suddenly broken into the ranks of the elite, gaining more 0:21:54.880 --> 0:21:59.000 than two hundred rating points in the past two years. Okay, 0:21:59.080 --> 0:22:02.360 how does that him that you gain all of that 0:22:03.520 --> 0:22:06.120 in a short amount of time. Well, in his case, 0:22:06.160 --> 0:22:09.959 you barnstorm around Europe in the US playing chess as 0:22:10.040 --> 0:22:14.080 much as you can, including online, so he has a 0:22:14.160 --> 0:22:17.640 learning curve sep similar to that of many young players 0:22:17.680 --> 0:22:21.159 whom I've had to track because their official ratings have 0:22:21.240 --> 0:22:25.760 been frozen during the pandemic. So Frederick Friedel on Chess 0:22:25.760 --> 0:22:29.520 Base posted a great comparison showing that Niemonth's growth is 0:22:29.600 --> 0:22:32.359 really not that much of an outlier compared to other 0:22:32.440 --> 0:22:37.080 hotshots of whom Magnus Carlson was one fifteen years ago. 0:22:38.119 --> 0:22:42.240 Nieman has a couple of blemishes on his record with 0:22:42.320 --> 0:22:46.560 cheating before correct. Yes, he did confess to cheating online 0:22:46.640 --> 0:22:50.840 on multiple occasions, once when he was twelve, and once 0:22:51.359 --> 0:22:54.080 don't know for how long during the early months of 0:22:54.080 --> 0:22:56.800 the pandemic. All right, what's he being accused of now 0:22:56.880 --> 0:23:00.560 by Magnus Carlson. He's being accused of cheating over the 0:23:00.640 --> 0:23:04.679 board in their game in Saint Louis and more recently 0:23:04.880 --> 0:23:09.439 than he has confessed were Mark Magnus's words, and of 0:23:09.560 --> 0:23:13.320 that I have no evidence. How would one cheat over 0:23:13.359 --> 0:23:16.560 the board? Well, there have been many ways. I've cases 0:23:16.640 --> 0:23:19.480 have had people who used hidden cameras, They've had computers 0:23:19.480 --> 0:23:23.160 in their shoes, They've gotten buzzes on their thighs, they've 0:23:23.160 --> 0:23:25.480 had a magic pen, they've had an ear piece of 0:23:25.560 --> 0:23:32.240 Fonito was used once, so yes, they have in many ways. Okay, 0:23:32.359 --> 0:23:36.159 but he's accused of having something on his body or 0:23:36.200 --> 0:23:40.600 in his body with vibrations helping him make moves. There's 0:23:40.880 --> 0:23:44.800