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Speaker 1: Hey, welcome in Doug Gottlieb here and you are listening

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Speaker 1: to All Ball, All Basketball all the time. Um. I

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Speaker 1: want to do one on some of the n c

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Speaker 1: A tournament stuff, but right now I just this is

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Speaker 1: this pot is so good and so timely. I have

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Speaker 1: a couple other ones. John Gallagher is gonna join me

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Speaker 1: on a different pod. John, of course, the head coach

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Speaker 1: of Hartford. He's Irish. John is hysterical. He's hysterical, but

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Speaker 1: he's also insightful. So we'll drop that one maybe a

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Speaker 1: little bit tomorrow. This one, I wanted to make sure

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Speaker 1: we got it out to you because I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I think this is a pretty darn good UH basketball

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Speaker 1: team and story, and I thought we could just start here.

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Speaker 1: Paul Mills is the head coach at Oral Roberts. By

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Speaker 1: now you've come around to liking or Roberts, watching or Roberts,

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Speaker 1: but he comes from incredible, the humble beginnings in Houston,

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Speaker 1: Texas for out of Humbolt, Texas, right, and I think

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Speaker 1: you'll enjoy hearing his journey, his energy, his thoughts on

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Speaker 1: what this is all like. And of course he'll preview

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Speaker 1: a little bit of their rematch with Arkansas team that

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Speaker 1: they played led by twelve and the second half of

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Speaker 1: earlier this year in Fayetteville and and ultimately lost to

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Speaker 1: so without further ado. He's the head coach of Oral

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Speaker 1: Roberts University, got the job in two thousand seventeen, and

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Speaker 1: slowly but surely they have started from the bottom. Now

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Speaker 1: they're here. Let's catch up with Paul Mills of Earl

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Speaker 1: Roberts and living breathing form Cinderella himself, Cinderella himself, How

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Speaker 1: are you. I'm great, I'm great. You just live in

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Speaker 1: life inside the controlled environment. We were off yesterday. Yesterday

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Speaker 1: was Monday, and so um, so you don't panic because

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Speaker 1: you don't play again until Saturday night. But so far,

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Speaker 1: so good. Um, all right, don't I want to I

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Speaker 1: want you to help me tell your story. Okay? Um, Well,

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Speaker 1: you're know in su for a long time and obviously

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Speaker 1: an incredible weekend for your guys bailor basketball family, right uh,

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Speaker 1: and for or Robertson that university. But you personally, um,

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Speaker 1: growing up, what was your first memories of basketball and

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Speaker 1: your first attachment to the sport. Yeah, you know, in America,

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Speaker 1: basketball is kind of the sport of the poor. Uh

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Speaker 1: in in European African countries at soccer. But I mean

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Speaker 1: we couldn't afford a baseball glove or a bat. My

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Speaker 1: father was a preacher and so we we didn't have

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Speaker 1: much money, couldn't afford helmets and cleats and shoulder pads.

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Speaker 1: But you could go down to the end of the

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Speaker 1: street with a ball with twenty other kids and you

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Speaker 1: could play and uh, and that was always fun. I

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Speaker 1: mean five six seven, this is in Houston, yeah, and

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Speaker 1: so I can remember six seven eight my dad put

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Speaker 1: up a basket ketball goal in the in the backyard.

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Speaker 1: And so right around the age ten eleven twelve, I mean, um,

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Speaker 1: Houston was like on fire. We had five Slam of

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Speaker 1: jama Um, so those teams were going to the final four.

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Speaker 1: My birthday is on April the fourth, so my birthday

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Speaker 1: parties were five Slam of Jamma playing NC State and

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Speaker 1: uh Wittenberg, Oh it's a long way. Oh he got

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Speaker 1: it at the buzzer. And I can remember going in

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Speaker 1: my backyard and just crying and shooting until one o'clock

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Speaker 1: in the morning. Because and then you had the Michael

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Speaker 1: Jordan's era, right, and then I had friends who love

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Speaker 1: magic I had friends who liked Larry, uh and but

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Speaker 1: I like Mike and so it was just an awesome

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Speaker 1: time for me basketball wise, where I grew up, you

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Speaker 1: fell in love with the final four in college. Uh

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Speaker 1: And I mean and Keith Smart making big shots and

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Speaker 1: never nervous Purvis and and you just saw this emergence

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Speaker 1: on this national stage. And it's fit because the environment

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Speaker 1: where we lived, people were obsessed with basketball. On occasion,

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Speaker 1: you'd play football in the streets, um, because that only

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Speaker 1: required one ball. But for the most part we all

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Speaker 1: played basketball. And then you began to get competitive. Uh,

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Speaker 1: you got you would have all the arguments for why

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Speaker 1: Michael was better in Larry or why Michael was better

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Speaker 1: than Magic and uh, but you wanted to be a

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Speaker 1: all right whatever, let's go out and hoop ourselves. You

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Speaker 1: wanted to be good when these people called you out.

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Speaker 1: So it was it was it was a seven experience

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Speaker 1: for me. So so your dad, what was what was

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Speaker 1: the church that he preached that when you were in

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Speaker 1: North Belt Christian Where is that? Well, all Alden area

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Speaker 1: is a little north of Houston, So my dad's church

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Speaker 1: was about five miles north of that. You know what's

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Speaker 1: referred to as humble Texas. Okay, so it's a humble

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Speaker 1: sou which I can just like yeah yeah yeah. So um,

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Speaker 1: you mentioned like you didn't grow up wealthy. I do

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Speaker 1: think that some people think, well, Southern, that's pretty sure.

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Speaker 1: You know, he's living high in the hog. He's he's

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Speaker 1: got he's got a mega church. Yeah, he's got a

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Speaker 1: major church. That was not how it was for you.

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Speaker 1: I think most pastors probably preaching churches that are under

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Speaker 1: a hundred um the vast majority, especially in the South.

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Speaker 1: As you know, there's there's a church as more churches,

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Speaker 1: and there are gas stations and I mean there's one

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Speaker 1: on every corner and so so. So I mean you

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Speaker 1: were mad for me. I mean I had to be

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Speaker 1: there three times a week Wednesday night, Sunday morning, Sunday night,

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Speaker 1: God forbid, there was some prayer service or youth service.

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Speaker 1: H then you're there four times, but you're definitely there

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Speaker 1: three and you're mad because you realize other kids are

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Speaker 1: actually practicing on Wednesday night and you're not. You're mad

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Speaker 1: because other kids are watching their playing Saturday Sunday night

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Speaker 1: and you're not. And so church. I love my my

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Speaker 1: parents obviously, and I'm so grateful for how my my

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Speaker 1: parents invested in me. But when you're young, you don't

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Speaker 1: really have that sense. All you want to do is play.

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Speaker 1: And so to sit in two our church services three

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Speaker 1: different times each was he was? Was he good? Um?

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Speaker 1: He had good moments? Uh, you know where when you

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Speaker 1: preach as long as you not, they're not all gonna

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Speaker 1: be good. Uh. It's like it's like it's like it's

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Speaker 1: like it's gonna be like radio ships. Yeah. Yeah, like

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Speaker 1: like a radio shows you do two hundred thirty a year. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you gotta be really really, you gotta be great like

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Speaker 1: hundred times a year. You gotta be good about a

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Speaker 1: hundred fifty more times and then you just gotta like, hey,

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Speaker 1: figure out how to fill time because just it's not

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Speaker 1: possible that it's a great analogy? Was was he was

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Speaker 1: he okay with feedback? Did he ever go like I No?

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Speaker 1: I mean the reality is that so you'd sit on

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Speaker 1: the back row with all of your friends, right, um,

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Speaker 1: and so if I if I did something wrong, he

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Speaker 1: would stop during the sermon, say excuse me up, Paul,

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Speaker 1: would you come up here to the front row and

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Speaker 1: sit by your mother? And Uh, so I would have

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Speaker 1: to get up in the middle of the church with

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Speaker 1: your head down like a little puppy dog. And uh.

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Speaker 1: And he had warned me, Hey, son, I'm just telling

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Speaker 1: you you continue to sit back there because you're you know,

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Speaker 1: you're you're I'm throwing that. I had a friend who's

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Speaker 1: sitting next to me at church who was the biggest

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Speaker 1: l a Lakers Magic Johnson. Uh. His name was Jeremy

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Speaker 1: Gill and uh. And we would sit there and argue

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Speaker 1: like and we would want to fight by by the

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Speaker 1: time they said amen at the in we would want

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Speaker 1: to fight over the fact that you thought the Lakers

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Speaker 1: and Magic were better than Michael and the Bulls. And

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Speaker 1: so it would and then you then we would run.

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Speaker 1: The church had a gym, and we would go straight

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Speaker 1: to the gym and you would play until my dad

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Speaker 1: would stay for two or three hours after the service.

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Speaker 1: And so sit there and play. You're so but you

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Speaker 1: did your dad play? No, not at all? Did he does?

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Speaker 1: Did he understand your your love for the sport? Yes?

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Speaker 1: I mean uh. When I was a sophomore in high school, um,

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Speaker 1: I was that you may remember this name, Doug. There

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Speaker 1: was a guy who led the city of Houston and

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Speaker 1: scoring named le Bradford Smith. Le Bradford went to Wow,

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Speaker 1: did you really so? Le Bradford was out of base city.

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Speaker 1: You know who had the second most points in the

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Speaker 1: city of Houston, Me and uh le Bradford was a

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Speaker 1: miss small school? And how small school? I s, I see,

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Speaker 1: why does everybody have to ask that? Uh, I'm not

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Speaker 1: telling you we played at the same level. I'm just

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Speaker 1: telling you that when you're getting you're getting buckets. And

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Speaker 1: so when the stats get published, it says le Bradford

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Speaker 1: Smith and Paul Mills. I'm not telling you that we're

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Speaker 1: going against the same people. Um. But you know what,

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Speaker 1: I'll tell you this. I shot at every single time

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Speaker 1: I had the ball, and uh, and I made less

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Speaker 1: than half so uh. This was at Greenwood Village, um,

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Speaker 1: and and so at Greenwood Village, literally there's a hundred

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Speaker 1: kids in the high school. So fifty boys, fifty girls,

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Speaker 1: maybe twelve of them tried to play basketball, and ten

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Speaker 1: of them couldn't walk in chew gum. So it was

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Speaker 1: literally me and one other person. And since I was

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Speaker 1: the point guard, I got to decide everything, you know, so,

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Speaker 1: uh and so and then and then what I thought

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Speaker 1: is your special And I transferred to A five eight,

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Speaker 1: which is the high ist division in Texas, A five

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Speaker 1: A public school. Um and and so and then, needless

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Speaker 1: to say, my stats were not the same everage what

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Speaker 1: school you transferred to? McAuthur High School, Al Dean McArthur.

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Speaker 1: So what when you're when you tell your dad like, hey, Dad,

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Speaker 1: I want to I want to go to a bigger

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Speaker 1: high school for basketball. What what do you say? Uh?

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Speaker 1: You know why? And so i just pulled out the

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Speaker 1: Houston Chronicle and I'm like, look, I mean you can

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Speaker 1: read you see there's le Bradford Smith. And then the

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Speaker 1: next year it was Elmer Bennett who went to Notre

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Speaker 1: Dame from from from bel Air High School. And It's like, Dad, look,

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Speaker 1: I mean as clear as day that I belong on

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Speaker 1: a bigger stage. Uh. And and I didn't. Uh. I

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Speaker 1: loved it. I'm telling you I would not be uh

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Speaker 1: as passionate and love basketball had I not done it,

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Speaker 1: because I walked into a situation where I was the

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Speaker 1: only white kid who played there. I believe in the

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Speaker 1: twenty seven year history and so the entire i Are school,

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Speaker 1: especially on the basketball side, is it was black and

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Speaker 1: so for me to walk into that environment and and

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Speaker 1: and that was the neighborhood I grew up in anyway,

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Speaker 1: and so it wasn't any different, but it was such

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Speaker 1: a I can't I can't imagine not having the experience

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Speaker 1: of doing that I had. I've had those several of

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Speaker 1: my high school teammates reach out to me, and I

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Speaker 1: can't ever imagine myself being able to go down the

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Speaker 1: path that I've gone without that experience. No question of

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Speaker 1: socioeconomic different diversity, Listening to all these stories, hanging out

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Speaker 1: at their houses, them coming to yours, those things just

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Speaker 1: made all the difference in the world. And it fueled

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Speaker 1: something in me because it you just realized how good

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Speaker 1: you had to get. I it's interesting. So, um, we

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Speaker 1: we always had an AU team from kids from kind

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Speaker 1: of all over and we had some always had kids

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Speaker 1: from out central and my dad would we we'd have

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Speaker 1: practice and get done. He'd drive kids home because their

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Speaker 1: parents working, and then come back and I'd have to

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Speaker 1: ride with him. Like that was most of my childhood

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Speaker 1: outside of playing sports, was driving to and from sports

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Speaker 1: with my dad, right, But I remember so he used

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Speaker 1: to tell me he grew up in New York he'd

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Speaker 1: always teld me, like, Hey, my favorite moments in basketball is,

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Speaker 1: you know, you walk into a gym and you're the

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Speaker 1: only white guy, and people if you just you know,

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Speaker 1: are respectful people and play hard and just come into

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Speaker 1: hoop like you will be amazed at how kind people

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Speaker 1: are to you. Because there's still this kind of divide,

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Speaker 1: right and it's it's hard. I will say it's a

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Speaker 1: little bit harder in southern California because things are more homogeneous.

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Speaker 1: But um to two things jump out of my mind

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Speaker 1: when you tell the story about you in high school.

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Speaker 1: So when I was in eighth grade, I stayed back

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Speaker 1: in eighth grade. I was a little as a late bloomer.

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Speaker 1: And but my team, all my teammates from a you

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Speaker 1: went on to high school, right, So they're all playing

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Speaker 1: Most of them played varsities, some played JV whatever, and

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Speaker 1: so I didn't have a team to play with. So

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Speaker 1: there was a guy named Sam Minor who ran I

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Speaker 1: think what's called Team l A at the time. And

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Speaker 1: there's another guy named Tiny who ran Caney Bowls. And

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Speaker 1: so for that year I spent most of my afternoons

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Speaker 1: like at Mr Miner's house or practicing with his teams.

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Speaker 1: It was the exact same thing where and it was

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Speaker 1: awesome because it's it's like cultural immersion. And then you

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Speaker 1: you figure out, you know, it's it's actually one of

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Speaker 1: the things because I mean, obviously you see somebody's race

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Speaker 1: being different, and I don't know if you've experienced this,

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Speaker 1: but because you don't have a there's no racial bone

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Speaker 1: and anti like racial bone in your body. I just

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Speaker 1: I've always had a tough time understanding any of this

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Speaker 1: idea that you don't like somebody because they're black or

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Speaker 1: you're not. I I just it's like it's like a

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Speaker 1: gap in my brain where I don't understand, because I mean,

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Speaker 1: that's a great word, cultural immersion, right, I've never understood, Um,

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Speaker 1: the Jewish side, I've never understood anti Semitism. Right. Um,

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Speaker 1: It's like they look the same as everybody else. We

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Speaker 1: all look alike, you know. And then obviously when you

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Speaker 1: deal with different skin colors and you're dealing with Hispanic

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Speaker 1: and you're dealing with African American, Um, they just want

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Speaker 1: to accept you for who you are and know that

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Speaker 1: you're about the right things. And that was what and

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Speaker 1: I wanted to so earn their respect, um, and so

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Speaker 1: you would. I was the guy who was diving all

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Speaker 1: over the floor for loose balls. I was a guy

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Speaker 1: that was I'm gonna guard that guy. And so you

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Speaker 1: just the the cultural immersion is such a great it's

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Speaker 1: such a great word, because you wanted to immerse yourself,

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Speaker 1: uh to gain credibility, and uh that was what you did.

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Speaker 1: Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in

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Speaker 1: the nation. Catch all of our shows at Fox sports

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Speaker 1: Radio dot com and within the I Heart Radio app

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Speaker 1: search f s R to listen live. The other part

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Speaker 1: that you point out, which is but just is really smart,

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Speaker 1: which is like, at the end of day, people, most

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Speaker 1: people you are gonna judge you as a person, and

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Speaker 1: and they figure out that there's there's good white people,

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Speaker 1: there's bad white people, there's good black people, is bad

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Speaker 1: black people. Right, there's people are about the right things

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Speaker 1: and people that are not. And and people can spot

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Speaker 1: a phoney eventually, especially I've always said, especially you were

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Speaker 1: recruited obviously at a really high level when you've been

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Speaker 1: around it, and you you can spot this stuff. I

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Speaker 1: mean quick. I tell people all the time, I don't

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Speaker 1: bat a thousand, but I'm bat um because you know

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Speaker 1: what when I was fourteen, fifteen, sixteen, seventeen eighteen, you

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Speaker 1: were around it, and you tell the people that they

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Speaker 1: just want to be around us, but they're they're not

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Speaker 1: serious about hooping, or they just want to be around

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Speaker 1: us because because they want to be in the group,

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Speaker 1: but they're not really sincere people. I think guys like

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Speaker 1: you even have even a better Ententa because y'all went

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Speaker 1: through the experience of the recruiting and then you see

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Speaker 1: it for what it is, and so you see it.

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Speaker 1: On the other hand, you see it. I think I

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Speaker 1: think kids can spot phony in terms of guys that

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Speaker 1: are recruiting them as well. Yes, so why did you

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Speaker 1: Why did you go on to a and m uh,

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Speaker 1: so I went to a Division two school. UM had

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Speaker 1: the opportunity and obviously wanted to play um diving for

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Speaker 1: a loose ball. One day I cracked the bottom vertebrae

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Speaker 1: on my spine and um, uh Southern Nazarene University in

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Speaker 1: uh in Oklahoma City, and uh we actually there were

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Speaker 1: in that conference. The Sooner Athletic. Oh are you was

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Speaker 1: in that conference at the time, and um there there

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Speaker 1: was actually two and the eight picks out of there.

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Speaker 1: Greg Sutton from Oor, you went to the Spurs, and

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Speaker 1: then a transfer from Georgetown named Turner from Phillips University

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Speaker 1: was seventeen picked to the Rockets. So you saw good basketball.

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Speaker 1: And what happened was was I got injured. Um one

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Speaker 1: day at practice, cracked the bottom burde brae in my spine. UM. Saw.

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Speaker 1: You know, all these specialists do all these things long

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Speaker 1: story short, instead of your basketball careers over. And I

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Speaker 1: can remember being in the doctor's office and the tears

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Speaker 1: just flowing and um. And so now you know this, Doug,

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Speaker 1: there's nothing worse than being a manager. When you've been

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Speaker 1: a player. The whole idea that you're gonna rebound and

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Speaker 1: get guys water, and that's what people did for me.

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Speaker 1: I'm not gonna do it for them because you thought

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Speaker 1: of your that where you put people was based on

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Speaker 1: how well they hooped. Well, managers can't hoop. So I

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Speaker 1: was like, I'm just gonna travel with the team, gonna

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Speaker 1: go around, but I'm not gonna be a manager. And uh.

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Speaker 1: And so I realized, like listen, um, I when you're young,

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Speaker 1: you're arrogant. I said, if I can't play basketball, as

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Speaker 1: these doctors have said, Um, I'm gonna transfer closer to home,

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Speaker 1: So I went closer to home. Uh, and and I

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Speaker 1: would hang out. At that time, it was g Raleigh

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Speaker 1: White Collison UH and Tony Browne was a head coach.

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Speaker 1: Porter Moser was an assistant, And I kind of walk

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Speaker 1: through the concourse and you'd breathe it in and you'd

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Speaker 1: watch some practices here and there. It was hard. Uh,

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Speaker 1: But I, um, Joe Wilbert, do you know that name

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Speaker 1: at all? From Texas A and M. But but Joe

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Speaker 1: was an All conference Southwest Conference player and he's a friend.

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Speaker 1: But but you began to get close to, you know,

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Speaker 1: knowledgeable and close to some of the basketball players. But

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Speaker 1: you're just so eat up that you can't participate because

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Speaker 1: nobody ever gets into this thing to coach. You get

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Speaker 1: into it to play. Uh. Playing is what's fun. Coaching

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Speaker 1: is rewarding. But then it was like, man, you know,

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Speaker 1: what can I help people? Um, I'm this little bitty

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Speaker 1: white kid, and I wonder if I could just help

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Speaker 1: people with the game of basketball. And so that kind

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Speaker 1: of started a path for me because I just wanted

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Speaker 1: to be around the game so much. So how do

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Speaker 1: you show? How did you how did you get in

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Speaker 1: you start the high school job first. No. Yeah, So

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Speaker 1: my dad had a church and so in the summers,

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Speaker 1: UM I would say, hey, who wants to play basketball?

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Speaker 1: So what you get? Wast neighborhood kids show up and

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Speaker 1: you're playing for three or four hours. Well, then you

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Speaker 1: start to hear their stories, right, and these are kids,

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Speaker 1: and then you recognize the ones who are good, and

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Speaker 1: you want to help those guys, and so you'd schedule

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Speaker 1: individual sessions. Uh. And then the kids who didn't have

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Speaker 1: school clothes or shoes. You know, you had a soft

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Speaker 1: heart for those guys and you were helping them. And

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Speaker 1: I just realized that basketball was a carrot that attracted

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Speaker 1: these young men, even though we're in different demographic, socio

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Speaker 1: economic situations, that would allow me to help you. And

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Speaker 1: I just became enamored with it of trying to help

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Speaker 1: guys and so UM there at the church, Uh, we

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Speaker 1: had some high school kids and at Northfelt Christian and

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Speaker 1: we would run around and play other high schools. UM

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Speaker 1: played various schools throughout the city of Houston. So after

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Speaker 1: three years of doing that, I said, Man, I don't

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Speaker 1: want to do this kind of on a part time basis.

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Speaker 1: I want to do this all the time, like one

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Speaker 1: hundred percent of the time all year. And took another

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Speaker 1: high school job across town at a Fort Ben Baptist,

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Speaker 1: and I taught calculus and pre calculus and and got

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Speaker 1: to coach. And you know this one was official, right

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Speaker 1: because this one has a state championship associated with it

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Speaker 1: rather than just running around and playing games, more like

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Speaker 1: an A A U event. So did that for three years,

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Speaker 1: loved it. Um. I would tell you that they ran

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Speaker 1: me out of there after a final four experience. Um.

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Speaker 1: They just thought that basketball, in my mind, was becoming

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Speaker 1: too big. They were starting football and you never overrun

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Speaker 1: football in the state of Texas. And uh. And so

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Speaker 1: I was like, you know what, I'm four time co

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Speaker 1: district coach of the year, right, big deal? Huh and

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Speaker 1: uh we just went off the final four. I'm like

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Speaker 1: the Phil Jackson of high school coaches and uh, people

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Speaker 1: will hire me? And so here it is, so this

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Speaker 1: I just resigned. How did that man? How old am I? Um?

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Speaker 1: And so uh resign and you know there goes June, July, August, September,

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Speaker 1: and nobody's hired me. I did have a job offer

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Speaker 1: it in northern Arizona. My Cadris was great, and I

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Speaker 1: didn't want to move. I wanted to stay in Houston.

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Speaker 1: Um Bob Hoffman at ut pay and Am had brought

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Speaker 1: me in and I thought I was gonna go there.

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Speaker 1: Then I thought I was gonna go with Ray McCallum

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Speaker 1: to Houston. But long story short, here it is October

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Speaker 1: and I have nothing, and I'm just I'm just depressed,

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Speaker 1: right because you really think that you know something, and

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Speaker 1: what you don't realize is you really don't know much.

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Speaker 1: Um and Willis Wilson at Rice University heard about it

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Speaker 1: and he called me and he said, Paul, I'll give

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Speaker 1: you two thousand dollars for the year, uh to come

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Speaker 1: over here and help us. And I said, um, let

390
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Speaker 1: me ask you something. Can I sit on the bench?

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Speaker 1: He said, you'll go with us all the games and

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Speaker 1: you'll sit on the bench. I said, done deal. Uh.

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Speaker 1: So I remember the first game, like road game, being

394
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Speaker 1: at Stanford, and that's fine. And I thought it was

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Speaker 1: the most incredible thing in the world that all this

396
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Speaker 1: stuff you ever watched on TV, you were sitting there

397
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Speaker 1: watching it up close, and uh, what was the what

398
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Speaker 1: was the big kid's name? He has short arms? He

399
00:22:41,600 --> 00:22:45,040
Speaker 1: played a little in the NBA for the Rockets brought Gillespie.

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Speaker 1: Mike Harress played for Houston, Mike Carress, Michael Harris. He

401
00:22:51,560 --> 00:22:54,359
Speaker 1: was a six six undersized dunking for play for the

402
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Speaker 1: Utah Jazz. So you're with Michael every day, right, and

403
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Speaker 1: you're with we had another player, Jason mc brief, who

404
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Speaker 1: who got some NBA looks. Um So we had several guys.

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Speaker 1: We were good. And you're traveling and you're in you

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Speaker 1: you had the gym where they played badminton. Yes, right

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Speaker 1: behind it. People don't Rice. Before they redid the arena, Okay,

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Speaker 1: they used to have at one end, there was a

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Speaker 1: big curtain, a curtain we did. Dave Revson I did

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Speaker 1: again there and he's like, and we're coming of dext

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Speaker 1: Will say, what's behind that curtain? Right? They're and and

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Speaker 1: but you know Hawaii is in the conference, so you're

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Speaker 1: traveling to Hawaii. Boise State was good. Um Tulsa was

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Speaker 1: really good at that time, and so I just became

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Speaker 1: enamored with it. Um man, how do we get Rice?

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Speaker 1: So so Willis Wilson, who um uh he was. He

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Speaker 1: was like the first guy he Willis Wilson was the

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Speaker 1: first guy too that we we did a game and

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Speaker 1: he lost the game, but he came over to shake

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Speaker 1: everybody's hands. But he wasn't feeling that well. He's like,

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Speaker 1: you know, I'm not feeling that well, let me give

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Speaker 1: be an elbow. This is like two thousand four whatever.

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Speaker 1: And I was just and and revs and I remember

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Speaker 1: we we sat there and we said like that that's

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Speaker 1: the classiest thing. And he no college basketball coach does that? Right?

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Speaker 1: Everybody else? Anyway, what did you learn from him? What

427
00:24:26,080 --> 00:24:29,320
Speaker 1: was what was he like to to coach, to watch coach?

428
00:24:29,359 --> 00:24:32,359
Speaker 1: What did he do? One? He was phenomenal in his

429
00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:37,760
Speaker 1: player relationships. And I think so many coaches will talk

430
00:24:37,880 --> 00:24:41,080
Speaker 1: to a team, right, Um, they'll get everybody down, they'll

431
00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:43,960
Speaker 1: talk to the team, But how many coaches actually kind

432
00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:46,840
Speaker 1: of put their arm around guys and say I need

433
00:24:46,880 --> 00:24:50,200
Speaker 1: you to hang out with me twenty minutes after practice? Uh?

434
00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:54,919
Speaker 1: Is life good? Everything? All right? I thought he was brilliant.

435
00:24:55,880 --> 00:25:02,120
Speaker 1: I mean, what what I realized is just one how lucky, um,

436
00:25:02,240 --> 00:25:05,240
Speaker 1: you are just to be in this profession, especially when

437
00:25:05,240 --> 00:25:08,920
Speaker 1: you're like a little man syndrome guy like me and

438
00:25:09,160 --> 00:25:14,359
Speaker 1: and and so you're just so fortunate and and when

439
00:25:14,359 --> 00:25:17,000
Speaker 1: you look at at Willis's teams in the years that

440
00:25:17,080 --> 00:25:21,280
Speaker 1: he's been healthy, Um, they win and and when they

441
00:25:21,320 --> 00:25:24,240
Speaker 1: do a phenomenal job. But I feel bad that coach

442
00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:27,800
Speaker 1: w hasn't had an opportunity to experience an NC double

443
00:25:27,800 --> 00:25:31,320
Speaker 1: A tournament. And so when you get this opportunity, you

444
00:25:31,359 --> 00:25:33,240
Speaker 1: want to honor it because of the people that have

445
00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:36,440
Speaker 1: invested in you. And Willis was as good as it

446
00:25:36,480 --> 00:25:41,040
Speaker 1: gets in regards to helping guys and their personal relationships

447
00:25:41,320 --> 00:25:44,440
Speaker 1: of phenomenal and just a class act. And he would

448
00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:48,840
Speaker 1: want he has somebody. You want your you're to be invested.

449
00:25:48,880 --> 00:25:51,480
Speaker 1: You want him investing in you because he's pouring into

450
00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:54,240
Speaker 1: you the right things. Okay, so you do that for

451
00:25:54,280 --> 00:25:58,440
Speaker 1: a year. Uh where were you when the bailor thing

452
00:25:58,520 --> 00:26:02,440
Speaker 1: went down? Was? I was in Houston? Thought is the

453
00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:06,240
Speaker 1: craziest thing you had ever heard of? Um? Man, one

454
00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:11,280
Speaker 1: player killing another player? This is nuts and um And

455
00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:14,280
Speaker 1: so I when I was a high school coach, I

456
00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:17,200
Speaker 1: had brought in I would hold a clinic every year

457
00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:20,840
Speaker 1: and um brought in you know, coach Mjaris I would

458
00:26:21,000 --> 00:26:23,399
Speaker 1: hang out with. In the summer. I would go to

459
00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:27,720
Speaker 1: Utah and and learned Michael White Knight from Florida. Uh,

460
00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:30,720
Speaker 1: my room was here, Michael's was across. I remember one

461
00:26:30,760 --> 00:26:33,400
Speaker 1: summer as we spent time because I just thought coach

462
00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:36,080
Speaker 1: Mjaris was the best teacher in the world. But when

463
00:26:36,080 --> 00:26:37,919
Speaker 1: I was a high school coach, I travel around. I

464
00:26:37,960 --> 00:26:40,119
Speaker 1: go to Duke, I go to North Carolina, I go

465
00:26:40,240 --> 00:26:43,040
Speaker 1: to Utah. I'd spend every penny I had trying to

466
00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:46,120
Speaker 1: get around who I thought were really good coaches and

467
00:26:46,119 --> 00:26:49,960
Speaker 1: and those guys are obviously and so um and so

468
00:26:50,160 --> 00:26:52,840
Speaker 1: going through it, I thought it was just crazy. When

469
00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:55,840
Speaker 1: the whole Baylor thing went down and there was news

470
00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:58,000
Speaker 1: because we had had a good year at Rice that

471
00:26:58,160 --> 00:27:01,439
Speaker 1: Willis was gonna take the take the job at Baylor,

472
00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:04,960
Speaker 1: and and I remember him talking about would Joel want

473
00:27:05,040 --> 00:27:08,399
Speaker 1: to go into an environment like that? I remember thinking like,

474
00:27:08,560 --> 00:27:13,160
Speaker 1: no way, Like I'm not going to Waco, Texas. I'm

475
00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:17,239
Speaker 1: a Houstonian. I am staying here. I will beg my

476
00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:19,800
Speaker 1: way onto the next guy who takes over for you,

477
00:27:19,840 --> 00:27:22,440
Speaker 1: Coach w But why in the world would you walk

478
00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:28,120
Speaker 1: yourself into that situation? Okay, so Scott, that's the job,

479
00:27:29,119 --> 00:27:32,119
Speaker 1: the job. Uh huh, how did you how did you

480
00:27:32,160 --> 00:27:34,399
Speaker 1: have a relationship with Scott, Like, how did that happened? No,

481
00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:38,720
Speaker 1: so John Lucas, Uh, and John Lucas the third obviously

482
00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:42,119
Speaker 1: his son is a point guard at UM at Baylor,

483
00:27:42,640 --> 00:27:46,040
Speaker 1: and and so John Lucas worked out at six am

484
00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:49,080
Speaker 1: every morning in the rice gym in our auxiliary gym,

485
00:27:49,320 --> 00:27:52,800
Speaker 1: hit NBA players in there. And I can remember Josh Howard,

486
00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:59,240
Speaker 1: I can remember a Dwight Howard. I can remember multiple

487
00:27:59,480 --> 00:28:02,120
Speaker 1: high school kids who are elite you being in there

488
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:05,159
Speaker 1: yell ming. So I was always hanging around John Lucas

489
00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:08,119
Speaker 1: in the mornings at five thirty and then go do

490
00:28:08,280 --> 00:28:11,040
Speaker 1: my job at nine. And John was like, would you

491
00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:13,840
Speaker 1: like to go to Baylor? I was like no, and

492
00:28:13,920 --> 00:28:16,640
Speaker 1: he and I'm like, John, your son isn't even gonna

493
00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:18,520
Speaker 1: stay there, and he said that's right, He's gonna go

494
00:28:18,560 --> 00:28:22,320
Speaker 1: to somewhere else, you know, eventually Oklahoma State. And and

495
00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:25,040
Speaker 1: so I think people had told him, if you want

496
00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:26,840
Speaker 1: to be familiar with Texas, you need to talk to

497
00:28:26,880 --> 00:28:29,520
Speaker 1: this guy, Paul Mills. A long story short, Scott calls

498
00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:32,840
Speaker 1: me and UM end up visiting with him for about

499
00:28:32,840 --> 00:28:35,359
Speaker 1: an hour and uh, and I just said, man, this

500
00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:38,200
Speaker 1: guy is a scatter brain he has no chance in

501
00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:41,480
Speaker 1: the world at Baylor University, like he is weighing over

502
00:28:41,560 --> 00:28:44,680
Speaker 1: his head. And he said, would you uh consider coming

503
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:47,080
Speaker 1: up here? I remember here's a question. He said, how

504
00:28:47,160 --> 00:28:51,200
Speaker 1: much do you make? And I said around twenty thousand? Uh.

505
00:28:51,240 --> 00:28:53,800
Speaker 1: You know, my definition is like Bill Clinton, depends what

506
00:28:53,840 --> 00:28:58,280
Speaker 1: your definition of is is. So my definition of around

507
00:28:58,400 --> 00:29:01,840
Speaker 1: is like plus or mindus eighteen d uh and so

508
00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:03,320
Speaker 1: I said around twenty. He said I can pay you

509
00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:06,560
Speaker 1: a little bit more and I said, okay, um. He said,

510
00:29:06,560 --> 00:29:08,280
Speaker 1: what you consider coming up here? And I said, no,

511
00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:10,800
Speaker 1: I won't. Uh. I said, I've already been promised an

512
00:29:10,840 --> 00:29:13,880
Speaker 1: assistant spot if anybody leaves here. I'm from Houston. I'm

513
00:29:13,920 --> 00:29:16,360
Speaker 1: not walking into that situation. He said, well, let me

514
00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:18,640
Speaker 1: tell you something I heard. Faith was important to you.

515
00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:20,880
Speaker 1: Wouldn't you at least pray about it? And I said,

516
00:29:20,920 --> 00:29:23,000
Speaker 1: you know what, I'll pray about it, but I'm about

517
00:29:23,680 --> 00:29:26,560
Speaker 1: certain God will say no to and uh. So, long

518
00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:29,160
Speaker 1: story short, he and I just continue to talk and

519
00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:31,880
Speaker 1: he can we beat Texas? Can we beating? And him,

520
00:29:32,080 --> 00:29:34,320
Speaker 1: how do you get recruits in the state of Texas?

521
00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:36,120
Speaker 1: Who are the people you need to know? Dot dot?

522
00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:38,680
Speaker 1: I so we do this Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday for

523
00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:41,240
Speaker 1: an hour every night. And I said, listen, man, you've

524
00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:44,360
Speaker 1: been so kind. I said, I'll come to you on Saturday. Uh.

525
00:29:44,400 --> 00:29:46,040
Speaker 1: He was just come up here and visit and just

526
00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:47,720
Speaker 1: hang out. Let me get to know you. So I

527
00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:51,480
Speaker 1: go up there, my wife and I and Willis tries

528
00:29:51,520 --> 00:29:53,040
Speaker 1: to talk me out of it. He's like, I don't

529
00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:55,240
Speaker 1: think that's smart, but you you do what you want.

530
00:29:55,680 --> 00:29:57,840
Speaker 1: And they have a guy named c J. Miles on

531
00:29:57,960 --> 00:30:00,480
Speaker 1: campus and now he's now he's on You had the

532
00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:03,640
Speaker 1: job for a week, and I'm like, he just he's

533
00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:05,680
Speaker 1: got c J Miles. C J Miles is the best

534
00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:07,840
Speaker 1: player in the state of Texas. Like, how did you

535
00:30:07,840 --> 00:30:10,880
Speaker 1: get c J Miles on campus? And c J eventually

536
00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:14,080
Speaker 1: goes high school the NBA, and uh, I don't even

537
00:30:14,080 --> 00:30:16,720
Speaker 1: know if he's still playing, but he's been playing for

538
00:30:16,760 --> 00:30:20,120
Speaker 1: a long time and uh. And I was like, that's incredible.

539
00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:22,800
Speaker 1: And then at the same time, you just realized, like, man,

540
00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:26,120
Speaker 1: this is different level of basketball, this is this is

541
00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:30,600
Speaker 1: the Big twelve, and this is a different caliber. And

542
00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:35,200
Speaker 1: so I just became enamored with that. And uh eventually said,

543
00:30:35,240 --> 00:30:37,880
Speaker 1: you know what, I'll come up here and helps. I

544
00:30:37,920 --> 00:30:41,320
Speaker 1: was in an operations role, and and the people that

545
00:30:41,360 --> 00:30:44,240
Speaker 1: were there, and we were just I was in my twenties,

546
00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:47,200
Speaker 1: Scott was thirty two when he took the job. Um,

547
00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:50,280
Speaker 1: you couldn't tell us anything, right like, we were winning

548
00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:54,080
Speaker 1: the conference. And I think if if somebody older had

549
00:30:54,080 --> 00:30:57,280
Speaker 1: taken that job, sixty, who had been around the block,

550
00:30:57,560 --> 00:31:00,360
Speaker 1: they would have understood how hard that was. We didn't

551
00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:02,840
Speaker 1: know anything. So we worked till three in the morning

552
00:31:03,160 --> 00:31:05,840
Speaker 1: and we were all back in there by eight. And

553
00:31:06,040 --> 00:31:08,440
Speaker 1: it was that way seven days a week for three

554
00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:12,280
Speaker 1: straight years. And we were burning that candle and uh

555
00:31:12,360 --> 00:31:15,560
Speaker 1: and and I remember our second year, we were running

556
00:31:15,560 --> 00:31:19,000
Speaker 1: around going we're conference champs. Oklahoma State had just gone

557
00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:21,800
Speaker 1: to the Final four with John Lucas and you gotta

558
00:31:21,840 --> 00:31:28,080
Speaker 1: remember Lawrence Roberts, Kenny Taylor went to Texas started John Lucas,

559
00:31:28,120 --> 00:31:30,680
Speaker 1: Oklahoma State Big twelve player of the Year, and you

560
00:31:30,800 --> 00:31:33,520
Speaker 1: just was like, man, if you can keep kids in

561
00:31:33,600 --> 00:31:38,200
Speaker 1: Texas and and there's really good players here and um,

562
00:31:38,280 --> 00:31:41,040
Speaker 1: and so that year we're running around second year and

563
00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:43,880
Speaker 1: said we're gonna win conference. We won one game. We

564
00:31:43,920 --> 00:31:48,160
Speaker 1: went one in sixteen in conference and uh and then

565
00:31:48,200 --> 00:31:53,160
Speaker 1: you that was with it? Who who I was? If

566
00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:55,880
Speaker 1: you lost to us in our first year we won

567
00:31:55,920 --> 00:31:59,200
Speaker 1: four games, you were fired. Uh. All those guys lost

568
00:31:59,240 --> 00:32:02,520
Speaker 1: their jobs. Um the year the second year when we

569
00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:07,840
Speaker 1: beat a Colorado I think, um, unfortunately coach Patton wasn't

570
00:32:07,880 --> 00:32:10,560
Speaker 1: able to keep his job. So we were like, you

571
00:32:10,640 --> 00:32:14,600
Speaker 1: don't lose the Baylor like and and so, what you

572
00:32:14,720 --> 00:32:18,560
Speaker 1: realize after that second year, like reality hit. You're going

573
00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:21,680
Speaker 1: up against Hall of famer Ready Sutton, You're going up

574
00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:24,520
Speaker 1: against Hall of Famer Bob Knight. You're going up against

575
00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:27,440
Speaker 1: hall of famer Bill self in my mind, hall of

576
00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:33,160
Speaker 1: famer Rick Barnes. Uh. You had um NBA coaches at

577
00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:36,680
Speaker 1: Iowa State, Lon Krueger. Let me tell you something is

578
00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:40,960
Speaker 1: really really good. Uh. And and so you realize Bob

579
00:32:41,040 --> 00:32:43,440
Speaker 1: Huggins was at k State, and you just like, oh

580
00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:47,720
Speaker 1: my goodness. And we realized like this one, you better

581
00:32:47,760 --> 00:32:50,200
Speaker 1: go get players, but two we better figure out what

582
00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:53,160
Speaker 1: the heck we're doing. So so let's let's start with

583
00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:57,080
Speaker 1: the getting players. What how do you get? How do

584
00:32:57,080 --> 00:33:00,240
Speaker 1: you get guys? I just uh so the first big

585
00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:03,400
Speaker 1: class for us, you'll remember is is we got him

586
00:33:03,400 --> 00:33:08,400
Speaker 1: all our first year now, UM Curtis geralds Um was

587
00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:10,760
Speaker 1: out of Bustin. He committed at the end of our

588
00:33:10,800 --> 00:33:16,520
Speaker 1: first year. UM Henry Dugott Um was was from coach

589
00:33:16,600 --> 00:33:20,440
Speaker 1: Tang Jerome Tang's city where he grew up and his

590
00:33:20,560 --> 00:33:24,280
Speaker 1: in laws actually lived across the street. So Jerome was

591
00:33:24,360 --> 00:33:25,920
Speaker 1: never in the office. He was always at his in

592
00:33:26,040 --> 00:33:29,920
Speaker 1: law's house, uh waiving every time, like Henry picked up

593
00:33:29,920 --> 00:33:33,000
Speaker 1: the mail. Henry dugott was really good. We got a

594
00:33:33,080 --> 00:33:35,760
Speaker 1: player from Senegal named Mama do Den, and then we

595
00:33:35,760 --> 00:33:39,280
Speaker 1: got a player out of Dallas name Kevin Rogers. And

596
00:33:39,360 --> 00:33:43,760
Speaker 1: so those four came in for our year three and

597
00:33:43,960 --> 00:33:47,400
Speaker 1: we based that was a little point guard from New Orleans.

598
00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:51,040
Speaker 1: Uh Tweetie Carter, Yeah, he came in. He came in

599
00:33:51,120 --> 00:33:54,960
Speaker 1: that next year, and so we added those four. Then

600
00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:57,640
Speaker 1: we added a guy Tweetie Carter, Josh Lomer's and then

601
00:33:57,680 --> 00:34:00,800
Speaker 1: we added lace Darius Done. Then he had a quincy

602
00:34:00,880 --> 00:34:04,800
Speaker 1: a c Sterius Done like he was really He and

603
00:34:04,880 --> 00:34:09,360
Speaker 1: Tweete were the two highest biggest name recruits. Right, yeah,

604
00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:12,960
Speaker 1: what's what's the How do you just give me the

605
00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:15,080
Speaker 1: give me the late Sterius done? How that? How is

606
00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:17,200
Speaker 1: that relationship? How did you go through it. How did

607
00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:22,239
Speaker 1: you get so so late? Sdarius done is um from Monroe, Louisiana. Um,

608
00:34:22,280 --> 00:34:27,239
Speaker 1: if you have ever been to Monroe, Louisiana where he lived, Um,

609
00:34:27,920 --> 00:34:30,640
Speaker 1: it was it was a tougher place that I had

610
00:34:30,640 --> 00:34:33,799
Speaker 1: ever been to. I mean, the the shoes are over,

611
00:34:33,880 --> 00:34:37,879
Speaker 1: the telephone lines, electricity lines. I mean it's the same.

612
00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:41,640
Speaker 1: So you you first saw him, what, Yeah, I saw

613
00:34:41,719 --> 00:34:46,719
Speaker 1: him Mark Moorefield, Mark Moorefield saw him, loved him at

614
00:34:46,719 --> 00:34:49,759
Speaker 1: an AU event. Now he's a very much a homebody.

615
00:34:50,280 --> 00:34:53,239
Speaker 1: And he played in one more AU event against the

616
00:34:53,320 --> 00:34:56,040
Speaker 1: who's the player for the Houston Rockets who went to Indiana?

617
00:34:56,480 --> 00:35:00,880
Speaker 1: Um plays for the Rockets right now? Um the uh

618
00:35:02,120 --> 00:35:06,960
Speaker 1: Eric Gordon. He played against Eric Gordon and killed all right,

619
00:35:07,200 --> 00:35:09,439
Speaker 1: and all of a sudden he's top twenty in the country. Well,

620
00:35:09,600 --> 00:35:11,360
Speaker 1: you know what, he says, I don't want to do

621
00:35:11,440 --> 00:35:14,400
Speaker 1: anymore these AU tournaments. I'm sick of him. So his

622
00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:18,640
Speaker 1: AU coaches like Elden Pipes, the phenomenal man, says you

623
00:35:18,680 --> 00:35:21,680
Speaker 1: need to like visit some places. So he takes into

624
00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:25,040
Speaker 1: Old miss because that's close to Louisiana, and he doesn't

625
00:35:25,080 --> 00:35:27,799
Speaker 1: like it because the locker room is dirty. He's like,

626
00:35:27,880 --> 00:35:30,279
Speaker 1: I can't believe these people just leave their clothes out

627
00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:33,600
Speaker 1: like this. And so he goes played, only plays in

628
00:35:33,640 --> 00:35:37,239
Speaker 1: local events, doesn't travel anymore. He just he doesn't like it.

629
00:35:37,640 --> 00:35:40,600
Speaker 1: And so one day Coach Pipes is driving him home

630
00:35:40,880 --> 00:35:43,840
Speaker 1: and we had been begging for a visit, and um,

631
00:35:43,880 --> 00:35:46,200
Speaker 1: he says, look, Baylor is only four and a half

632
00:35:46,239 --> 00:35:49,400
Speaker 1: hours away. I'm just he's asleep. I'm just we're just

633
00:35:49,520 --> 00:35:54,919
Speaker 1: driving to Baylor. Got honest to goodness and so so apparently,

634
00:35:55,280 --> 00:35:57,720
Speaker 1: But when you listen to Lace Darius tell the story,

635
00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:00,640
Speaker 1: Lace hit me the other day. Uh, he he's my

636
00:36:00,760 --> 00:36:03,600
Speaker 1: most He's the most talented kid I ever coached in

637
00:36:03,640 --> 00:36:06,720
Speaker 1: my life. Um, and I've been fortunate to coach thirteen

638
00:36:06,800 --> 00:36:09,680
Speaker 1: NBA guys, but that guy was the most talented. He

639
00:36:09,520 --> 00:36:11,440
Speaker 1: u he said. He says, I woke up in Dallas

640
00:36:11,480 --> 00:36:13,640
Speaker 1: and I was like, what the heck? Like, where are we?

641
00:36:13,680 --> 00:36:15,680
Speaker 1: I thought I was going home. I didn't realize I

642
00:36:15,719 --> 00:36:18,120
Speaker 1: fell asleep. So he says, listen, we're just gonna go

643
00:36:18,120 --> 00:36:19,799
Speaker 1: by here at Baylor. He didn't, he said, he didn't

644
00:36:19,840 --> 00:36:21,920
Speaker 1: even realize how long he had been asleep. And so

645
00:36:22,040 --> 00:36:24,040
Speaker 1: he comes in and he sees our locker room and

646
00:36:24,080 --> 00:36:27,399
Speaker 1: it's clean, and he says, I'm going here. That's how

647
00:36:27,440 --> 00:36:31,360
Speaker 1: it happened. He committed. He was done. He never played

648
00:36:31,360 --> 00:36:34,719
Speaker 1: in another A A U event. Uh, he was finished.

649
00:36:35,120 --> 00:36:38,880
Speaker 1: And that is honestly how he committed to Baylor is

650
00:36:38,920 --> 00:36:42,520
Speaker 1: we had a cleaner locker room and old miss well,

651
00:36:42,560 --> 00:36:45,719
Speaker 1: old mrs. Old places are dumb. But I think this

652
00:36:45,760 --> 00:36:47,880
Speaker 1: is before you got the basketball facility though, right, this

653
00:36:47,920 --> 00:36:50,600
Speaker 1: is before they added on with the yeah, this was yeah,

654
00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:53,400
Speaker 1: this was. This was before the cleaner locker room. She cleaning.

655
00:36:53,440 --> 00:36:55,799
Speaker 1: This is next to guy man. And let me tell

656
00:36:55,840 --> 00:36:59,640
Speaker 1: you something at Rice, apparently Drew Brees was gonna go

657
00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:02,560
Speaker 1: to before he went to Purdue, and they said they

658
00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:04,719
Speaker 1: showed up one day and they took him through an

659
00:37:04,800 --> 00:37:07,719
Speaker 1: entrance that was normally clean and said he walked through

660
00:37:07,719 --> 00:37:10,480
Speaker 1: there and said he saw something and it was just like, man,

661
00:37:10,520 --> 00:37:14,400
Speaker 1: that's not the same presentation that I got originally. So

662
00:37:14,480 --> 00:37:18,880
Speaker 1: apparently that was why he went from Austin, Texas to Purdue.

663
00:37:19,160 --> 00:37:21,480
Speaker 1: And I've learned from the lace areas done and the

664
00:37:21,560 --> 00:37:25,160
Speaker 1: Drew Brees when I hear the Rice football staff tell it, uh,

665
00:37:25,320 --> 00:37:30,200
Speaker 1: we we clean like crazy before recruits show up. So

666
00:37:30,440 --> 00:37:33,880
Speaker 1: now you got guys going. And if we remember back then,

667
00:37:34,960 --> 00:37:39,000
Speaker 1: Scott became like he was a big zone guy. Right, Yeah,

668
00:37:39,280 --> 00:37:41,480
Speaker 1: it was we were We're gonna be the zone team.

669
00:37:41,520 --> 00:37:43,319
Speaker 1: Nobody else plays zone to sleep. We're gonna be the

670
00:37:43,360 --> 00:37:46,680
Speaker 1: zone team. Yeah, Who's whose idea was? That? Was? That? Yours? That?

671
00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:51,080
Speaker 1: When he was at Valpo, he was always impressed with

672
00:37:51,120 --> 00:37:54,880
Speaker 1: Stu Moral at Utah State and he loved Stu Moral

673
00:37:55,360 --> 00:37:59,160
Speaker 1: and and what they did defensively, and obviously Stu morals

674
00:37:59,160 --> 00:38:03,799
Speaker 1: an offensive genius um, but what they did defensively, he said,

675
00:38:03,840 --> 00:38:07,560
Speaker 1: really gave him problems. So what a one three one

676
00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:10,600
Speaker 1: on one side out? It's more of a one one

677
00:38:10,760 --> 00:38:14,520
Speaker 1: three and and the and and basically you're moving up

678
00:38:14,560 --> 00:38:17,520
Speaker 1: the wings based on are you a shooter are you not.

679
00:38:17,640 --> 00:38:20,600
Speaker 1: If you're a shooter, you're higher. If you're not, you're lower.

680
00:38:20,960 --> 00:38:23,919
Speaker 1: And so I mean it looks like a one three

681
00:38:23,920 --> 00:38:26,040
Speaker 1: one at times depending upon who you have out on

682
00:38:26,080 --> 00:38:29,759
Speaker 1: the court. And so what happened with us was we

683
00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:34,440
Speaker 1: had six ft nine three men uh Anthony Jones, Quincy

684
00:38:34,520 --> 00:38:38,719
Speaker 1: miller Um had these guys and other teams three men

685
00:38:38,840 --> 00:38:41,759
Speaker 1: were six four or six five six, six and they

686
00:38:41,760 --> 00:38:44,439
Speaker 1: couldn't keep up. And so we just said, man, let's

687
00:38:44,440 --> 00:38:47,000
Speaker 1: just utilize our length and at the end of the day,

688
00:38:47,080 --> 00:38:49,640
Speaker 1: let's push up and let's push guys to f a

689
00:38:49,760 --> 00:38:53,280
Speaker 1: Ut he can block shots better than anybody. Let's push

690
00:38:53,400 --> 00:38:56,520
Speaker 1: up and invite them to go to Isaiah Austin. Let's

691
00:38:56,520 --> 00:38:59,360
Speaker 1: push up and make guys go to Corey Jefferson. And

692
00:38:59,440 --> 00:39:02,120
Speaker 1: so all it was was we had six ft nine

693
00:39:02,200 --> 00:39:05,880
Speaker 1: three men who they struggled to stay in front of

694
00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:09,319
Speaker 1: the ball on smaller guys. So let's utilize something that

695
00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:12,279
Speaker 1: kind of pushes the three point line and makes them

696
00:39:12,320 --> 00:39:14,840
Speaker 1: go meet people at the rim where we think we

697
00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:18,880
Speaker 1: have really good rim protectors. And so that was really

698
00:39:18,920 --> 00:39:24,040
Speaker 1: the logic behind all of it. Um, what was it

699
00:39:24,080 --> 00:39:27,879
Speaker 1: like to go from when you first got there and

700
00:39:27,960 --> 00:39:31,320
Speaker 1: you had to get kids to just come play on campus.

701
00:39:31,320 --> 00:39:34,480
Speaker 1: I guess walk ons too. Then you're in the Elite

702
00:39:34,560 --> 00:39:40,839
Speaker 1: eight and you're basically one A charge call, A charge call, Yeah,

703
00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:42,880
Speaker 1: I mean like it was a bad call, a charge

704
00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:45,359
Speaker 1: call from beating Duke to go to the final four,

705
00:39:45,400 --> 00:39:49,000
Speaker 1: But like it is, how is how is Scott with

706
00:39:49,160 --> 00:39:52,640
Speaker 1: perspective with the because I know it still burns in

707
00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:55,680
Speaker 1: him in his mind this whole week, he's gonna be

708
00:39:55,680 --> 00:39:59,320
Speaker 1: thinking about the Duke Games, right, the Elite eights, because

709
00:39:59,320 --> 00:40:03,319
Speaker 1: he's that kind of petitor. But in your experience with them,

710
00:40:03,320 --> 00:40:05,399
Speaker 1: how is he with the perspective of where they where

711
00:40:05,400 --> 00:40:08,319
Speaker 1: you guys were too, how close you're getting to win

712
00:40:08,360 --> 00:40:10,880
Speaker 1: the whole thing? Yeah? One, I tell you, Scott is

713
00:40:11,000 --> 00:40:14,480
Speaker 1: very impatient. And what I think maybe would have happened

714
00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:18,319
Speaker 1: in seven years eight years, Um, he was just no,

715
00:40:18,680 --> 00:40:20,719
Speaker 1: is not an answer. I can just tell you that

716
00:40:20,800 --> 00:40:24,279
Speaker 1: right now. You better figure it out. Um, if you're

717
00:40:24,280 --> 00:40:28,960
Speaker 1: gassed to do something I can't know, it's not you.

718
00:40:29,360 --> 00:40:32,359
Speaker 1: That's not a don't even go there. I I learned

719
00:40:32,400 --> 00:40:35,680
Speaker 1: that one quick. But he was. He's impatient, and it

720
00:40:35,719 --> 00:40:38,799
Speaker 1: was a good thing. And everybody's like, oh, Scott Drew

721
00:40:38,840 --> 00:40:41,319
Speaker 1: is such an optimist, and I'm like, y'all should be

722
00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:45,560
Speaker 1: behind closed doors. And he never he never once said

723
00:40:45,600 --> 00:40:49,600
Speaker 1: a bad thing. I've never heard him utter a curse word. Uh,

724
00:40:49,680 --> 00:40:52,840
Speaker 1: And behind closed doors he would always be like, guys,

725
00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:56,400
Speaker 1: we better get better. As coaches, we better get better,

726
00:40:56,719 --> 00:40:59,239
Speaker 1: and as we better go get better players, and he

727
00:40:59,239 --> 00:41:01,719
Speaker 1: says we're not very good. So he would always come

728
00:41:01,719 --> 00:41:03,640
Speaker 1: in after every loss, and there were a bunch of

729
00:41:03,719 --> 00:41:08,000
Speaker 1: them those first three years, and he's just constantly challenging you, like,

730
00:41:08,040 --> 00:41:10,560
Speaker 1: we're just not very good and you know I and

731
00:41:10,800 --> 00:41:13,400
Speaker 1: his first response was I need to do better. And

732
00:41:13,440 --> 00:41:15,520
Speaker 1: so you're over there like, oh yeah, okay, you're gonna

733
00:41:15,560 --> 00:41:17,920
Speaker 1: call me out. I can't believe. And then he'd go

734
00:41:17,960 --> 00:41:20,040
Speaker 1: in front of the media and be like, you know,

735
00:41:20,080 --> 00:41:23,279
Speaker 1: we're headed in the right direction, guys, And I'm like,

736
00:41:23,719 --> 00:41:26,480
Speaker 1: you just told us how awful we were as a

737
00:41:26,600 --> 00:41:30,120
Speaker 1: stat what what what did he get? You watched him though,

738
00:41:30,520 --> 00:41:33,240
Speaker 1: How did he get better? Because he's a better coach,

739
00:41:33,360 --> 00:41:38,640
Speaker 1: You're a better coach. He uh, he became attracted to

740
00:41:38,840 --> 00:41:42,160
Speaker 1: I tell you guys who invested in him. One his

741
00:41:42,239 --> 00:41:47,440
Speaker 1: dad obviously, um Thad Mada. I can't tell you how

742
00:41:47,440 --> 00:41:50,080
Speaker 1: many times we come in and say, well that Mada

743
00:41:50,200 --> 00:41:53,960
Speaker 1: does this, and I'd be like that Mada is not

744
00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:57,600
Speaker 1: in Waco, Texas, coach, uh, and you know, or my

745
00:41:57,680 --> 00:42:00,759
Speaker 1: dad suggested this, and then you'd be upset that You're like, well,

746
00:42:01,080 --> 00:42:04,600
Speaker 1: coach Drew isn't around here every day. And and so

747
00:42:04,760 --> 00:42:08,560
Speaker 1: I think what he did was he became super interested

748
00:42:09,080 --> 00:42:12,319
Speaker 1: and hey, we struggle not taking care of taking care

749
00:42:12,320 --> 00:42:14,640
Speaker 1: of the ball. Who does a great job taking care

750
00:42:14,640 --> 00:42:16,719
Speaker 1: of the ball. And you know, Scott, he's gonna ask

751
00:42:16,840 --> 00:42:21,960
Speaker 1: nine million questions and and he's going through all these

752
00:42:22,080 --> 00:42:25,280
Speaker 1: questions and you know, and he's just gonna pick your brain,

753
00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:28,239
Speaker 1: pick your brain, and he's gonna be very deliberate about

754
00:42:28,280 --> 00:42:30,920
Speaker 1: it and think through it. And what you don't realize

755
00:42:31,640 --> 00:42:34,799
Speaker 1: is that he is over there taking and and you're

756
00:42:34,840 --> 00:42:39,680
Speaker 1: giving and and and that's he was such a learner

757
00:42:40,040 --> 00:42:44,000
Speaker 1: and he realized he's really is really from my experience,

758
00:42:44,120 --> 00:42:47,920
Speaker 1: an interesting you know. I mean he I don't remember

759
00:42:47,960 --> 00:42:49,480
Speaker 1: one time he pay him to come down and speak,

760
00:42:50,280 --> 00:42:52,840
Speaker 1: but he But but it was we played logals. You

761
00:42:52,880 --> 00:42:55,719
Speaker 1: were really good on on dunk ball, so you got

762
00:42:55,800 --> 00:42:59,080
Speaker 1: you called logals. We just we called it. We called

763
00:42:59,080 --> 00:43:01,520
Speaker 1: it logals. And because we moved the goal of nine

764
00:43:01,520 --> 00:43:04,720
Speaker 1: ft right. It was great, it was it was awesome.

765
00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:07,080
Speaker 1: You were killing, you were killing. I'm one of the

766
00:43:07,120 --> 00:43:09,479
Speaker 1: great dunk one of the great. I'm the greatest Jewish,

767
00:43:09,520 --> 00:43:12,000
Speaker 1: don't you are. I'll tell you you're obviously the best

768
00:43:12,160 --> 00:43:14,840
Speaker 1: nine ft goal hooper we ever had come through. That

769
00:43:14,920 --> 00:43:17,800
Speaker 1: was the problem was the problem, was the hoop was

770
00:43:17,800 --> 00:43:21,000
Speaker 1: the right hype anything else, But no, he's that fascinating

771
00:43:21,040 --> 00:43:24,239
Speaker 1: guy because you know he would he would text me.

772
00:43:24,880 --> 00:43:26,680
Speaker 1: Doesn't do it as much anymore. Do you text me

773
00:43:26,760 --> 00:43:28,839
Speaker 1: all the time? Like you watch our game? Yeah, give

774
00:43:29,160 --> 00:43:32,839
Speaker 1: me three things you saw? Tell me how I can

775
00:43:32,920 --> 00:43:35,200
Speaker 1: be better. I was like on your team every day.

776
00:43:35,200 --> 00:43:37,960
Speaker 1: He's like, yeah, you know, I respect you. Tell which

777
00:43:38,040 --> 00:43:39,960
Speaker 1: tem what you think. And so I had said him

778
00:43:39,960 --> 00:43:42,760
Speaker 1: stuff and sometimes I was like, you know, like listen,

779
00:43:42,840 --> 00:43:44,279
Speaker 1: you may not like this. I don't know, give me

780
00:43:44,320 --> 00:43:48,120
Speaker 1: give me more. Like well, like you didn't run anything

781
00:43:48,160 --> 00:43:49,799
Speaker 1: at this point in time, you didn't know they were

782
00:43:49,800 --> 00:43:54,440
Speaker 1: going to switch down. Um, okay, So how did the

783
00:43:54,480 --> 00:43:58,480
Speaker 1: O r U thing happen? Yeah? And so after you know,

784
00:43:59,040 --> 00:44:01,080
Speaker 1: seen was a good year for us at Baylor. We

785
00:44:01,080 --> 00:44:03,920
Speaker 1: were number one in the country. Um ended up going

786
00:44:03,920 --> 00:44:06,680
Speaker 1: to the Sweet six team lost to a final fourth

787
00:44:06,719 --> 00:44:09,799
Speaker 1: South Carolina team, And um, you know when when the

788
00:44:09,800 --> 00:44:13,600
Speaker 1: O r U thing happened. Um, it was late. It

789
00:44:13,719 --> 00:44:18,880
Speaker 1: was two weeks after I mean the national championship had

790
00:44:18,920 --> 00:44:22,359
Speaker 1: been played. And so I mean we were I mean

791
00:44:22,400 --> 00:44:24,640
Speaker 1: well down the road. I mean, you know, as an

792
00:44:24,480 --> 00:44:28,320
Speaker 1: as an assistant. I mean there may be some opportunities

793
00:44:28,320 --> 00:44:30,920
Speaker 1: out there, but you kind of know once once a

794
00:44:31,280 --> 00:44:34,040
Speaker 1: week or two after the national championship that stuffs over.

795
00:44:34,600 --> 00:44:38,160
Speaker 1: Those dominoes have quit falling. And uh. And so when

796
00:44:38,160 --> 00:44:40,839
Speaker 1: when the o Ruth thing happened, it was a little surprising.

797
00:44:41,160 --> 00:44:43,680
Speaker 1: And I had a number of people reach out and say, listen, Paul,

798
00:44:44,120 --> 00:44:46,719
Speaker 1: it's a Christian school in the South, that's what you're

799
00:44:46,760 --> 00:44:50,279
Speaker 1: currently at. You would do a great job there, and

800
00:44:50,480 --> 00:44:54,279
Speaker 1: and and and so. Um. But you know, you know

801
00:44:54,320 --> 00:44:58,319
Speaker 1: what also knew Jerome tang uh would do a great

802
00:44:58,400 --> 00:45:02,040
Speaker 1: job there. Uh that there was another guy who, hey,

803
00:45:02,120 --> 00:45:04,120
Speaker 1: there's a Christian school in the South, he would do

804
00:45:04,239 --> 00:45:08,000
Speaker 1: another and he had just interviewed um I believe in

805
00:45:08,040 --> 00:45:12,520
Speaker 1: New Mexico State. Uh when when they had when that

806
00:45:12,560 --> 00:45:14,440
Speaker 1: guy when when the coach went to you and l

807
00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:19,920
Speaker 1: V and so Marvin Menzies know who is the other

808
00:45:19,920 --> 00:45:22,120
Speaker 1: guy who interviewed it? At are you that put interviewed

809
00:45:22,120 --> 00:45:27,600
Speaker 1: in Mexico State? Um? I honestly forget okay and so

810
00:45:28,280 --> 00:45:31,160
Speaker 1: and so we didn't want to like hurt each other,

811
00:45:31,239 --> 00:45:34,759
Speaker 1: and I said, Jeroma, pull out if you this is something.

812
00:45:34,800 --> 00:45:37,879
Speaker 1: And we called their administration said y'all don't need two

813
00:45:37,960 --> 00:45:40,440
Speaker 1: people who kind of come from the same tree, because

814
00:45:40,480 --> 00:45:43,160
Speaker 1: we're both been there for fourteen years, we're both going

815
00:45:43,200 --> 00:45:47,719
Speaker 1: to recruit Texas, we're both from Houston. Were very similar

816
00:45:48,320 --> 00:45:51,000
Speaker 1: and uh, but Jerome went in and and he had

817
00:45:51,160 --> 00:45:55,160
Speaker 1: a certain dollar number and personnel requirements. Well, I'm wait,

818
00:45:55,480 --> 00:46:01,080
Speaker 1: I'm a much cheaper date. Uh, and so I just

819
00:46:01,360 --> 00:46:04,120
Speaker 1: I mean, they they said, hey, this is what we pay,

820
00:46:04,200 --> 00:46:08,000
Speaker 1: and it's we were all gonna gonna take a pay

821
00:46:08,040 --> 00:46:12,919
Speaker 1: cut regardless of who took the job. And uh, I said,

822
00:46:12,960 --> 00:46:17,560
Speaker 1: you know what, Uh, I'm I'm I'm interested. Uh And

823
00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:22,600
Speaker 1: and fortunately things went well, and um, you take the job.

824
00:46:22,680 --> 00:46:25,440
Speaker 1: I think it was May one, You're two weeks after

825
00:46:25,480 --> 00:46:30,799
Speaker 1: the signing period. Um, obviously, and I you know you

826
00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:35,640
Speaker 1: had to. Nobody helped me more on that than Scott Sutton. Um.

827
00:46:35,680 --> 00:46:39,560
Speaker 1: He was phenomenal. Um, he said, Paul, I've invested so

828
00:46:39,640 --> 00:46:43,000
Speaker 1: much of my life there, and however I can help you.

829
00:46:43,120 --> 00:46:46,600
Speaker 1: And uh, some people there and we didn't see eye

830
00:46:46,640 --> 00:46:48,919
Speaker 1: to eye. And because we didn't see eye to eye,

831
00:46:49,400 --> 00:46:51,840
Speaker 1: it is what it is. This happens in this profession.

832
00:46:52,160 --> 00:46:54,280
Speaker 1: But I want you to know I'm invested in however

833
00:46:54,360 --> 00:46:57,279
Speaker 1: I can help and I can't thank Scott enough for

834
00:46:57,320 --> 00:47:02,000
Speaker 1: the class. It's amazing. It's amazing how he handled that situation. Um,

835
00:47:02,040 --> 00:47:05,839
Speaker 1: there was no bitterness and UM and and he he

836
00:47:05,960 --> 00:47:10,880
Speaker 1: and Sean UM really from the ground up said listen,

837
00:47:11,160 --> 00:47:14,480
Speaker 1: here's our take. UM, do what you want, but but

838
00:47:14,560 --> 00:47:16,520
Speaker 1: let me give you advice as you kind of walk

839
00:47:16,600 --> 00:47:19,680
Speaker 1: through it. So my first year, I didn't you take

840
00:47:19,719 --> 00:47:22,359
Speaker 1: the job two weeks after the signing period. So I'm

841
00:47:22,400 --> 00:47:24,439
Speaker 1: not at the end of year one. No, no no matter

842
00:47:24,480 --> 00:47:27,240
Speaker 1: how good or bad I am. UM, they're not gonna

843
00:47:27,320 --> 00:47:30,879
Speaker 1: fire me. Um, I don't give me more than one year.

844
00:47:30,920 --> 00:47:33,640
Speaker 1: And we weren't very good. But I made a decision

845
00:47:33,719 --> 00:47:37,000
Speaker 1: that I'm saving nine scholarships. I'm not adding anybody. It's

846
00:47:37,040 --> 00:47:40,480
Speaker 1: May first, it's well past the signing period. And so

847
00:47:40,520 --> 00:47:42,880
Speaker 1: I just said, this first year is a wash, uh,

848
00:47:42,920 --> 00:47:46,400
Speaker 1: and enjoy it. What did not? What? What did? What

849
00:47:46,520 --> 00:47:49,719
Speaker 1: did you learn? Like? Look, you you've been ahead coach before,

850
00:47:49,760 --> 00:47:51,799
Speaker 1: but at the high school level. Now you know much

851
00:47:51,880 --> 00:47:54,560
Speaker 1: higher level, but you hadn't moved at eight That's that's

852
00:47:54,560 --> 00:47:57,080
Speaker 1: a big eighteen inch move, right, So you what did

853
00:47:57,080 --> 00:47:59,399
Speaker 1: you learn about yourself in terms of how you wanted

854
00:47:59,400 --> 00:48:01,920
Speaker 1: to play? You want to coach because you're different now

855
00:48:01,960 --> 00:48:04,439
Speaker 1: than the last time you're had coach. Yeah. Well, I'll

856
00:48:04,440 --> 00:48:06,560
Speaker 1: tell you this. We were one in seven and uh,

857
00:48:06,800 --> 00:48:09,840
Speaker 1: I thought to myself, like, I don't know, like I

858
00:48:09,920 --> 00:48:14,880
Speaker 1: may have made a bad decision here. I mean, I

859
00:48:14,960 --> 00:48:19,600
Speaker 1: had a way easier situation, uh than than what I

860
00:48:19,640 --> 00:48:22,799
Speaker 1: had at Baylor. And and then what you realize is,

861
00:48:22,960 --> 00:48:25,279
Speaker 1: you know, you get those thoughts like, man, maybe I'm

862
00:48:25,320 --> 00:48:28,160
Speaker 1: not cut out for this. This is way different than

863
00:48:28,239 --> 00:48:31,839
Speaker 1: what I anticipated. Um. And now at the end, you're

864
00:48:31,960 --> 00:48:33,719
Speaker 1: used to be in the Power of five playing to

865
00:48:33,800 --> 00:48:35,799
Speaker 1: these schools. Now you're on the other end. Like we

866
00:48:35,840 --> 00:48:38,680
Speaker 1: play Oklahoma State and we lose by forty two, and

867
00:48:38,760 --> 00:48:41,200
Speaker 1: Bill self text me after the game and he says,

868
00:48:41,239 --> 00:48:43,480
Speaker 1: Paul only lost by forty one the first time I

869
00:48:43,520 --> 00:48:47,919
Speaker 1: played him. Uh, I remember, I remember he got the job.

870
00:48:48,000 --> 00:48:51,000
Speaker 1: He got the job of Kansas and and you know,

871
00:48:51,040 --> 00:48:53,359
Speaker 1: Bill me, he's the best. He goes. Uh, he tells

872
00:48:53,400 --> 00:48:55,719
Speaker 1: the me, He's like, y'all know, I lost one in

873
00:48:55,760 --> 00:48:59,160
Speaker 1: one row Rogers my first year. You guys didn't know

874
00:48:59,239 --> 00:49:02,719
Speaker 1: what that was in the press release, yeah and so

875
00:49:03,040 --> 00:49:06,440
Speaker 1: and so it was little things like that because I remember,

876
00:49:06,520 --> 00:49:10,160
Speaker 1: like forty two guys. We just got beat for I

877
00:49:10,280 --> 00:49:13,400
Speaker 1: may not know. I don't know what I'm doing, and

878
00:49:13,400 --> 00:49:17,680
Speaker 1: and and he's texting, you only lost by forty one.

879
00:49:18,120 --> 00:49:21,600
Speaker 1: And then we go to Penn State, Um, wait, get

880
00:49:21,680 --> 00:49:25,120
Speaker 1: drilled by those guys, and and coach Chambers, Pat Chambers,

881
00:49:25,400 --> 00:49:27,759
Speaker 1: he could have beat us by a hundred. He called

882
00:49:27,800 --> 00:49:31,120
Speaker 1: the dogs off. We go to UH Arkansas, they beat us.

883
00:49:31,160 --> 00:49:33,279
Speaker 1: They could have beat us by a hundred. And what

884
00:49:33,360 --> 00:49:38,560
Speaker 1: I realized was one as we got into conference, I

885
00:49:38,600 --> 00:49:41,719
Speaker 1: don't need to prepare a team to beat Power fives.

886
00:49:42,280 --> 00:49:45,520
Speaker 1: I need to prepare a team to win our league.

887
00:49:46,239 --> 00:49:49,840
Speaker 1: And and what you need is guard play. And so

888
00:49:50,680 --> 00:49:53,480
Speaker 1: that next year we bring in nine new players. Uh

889
00:49:53,560 --> 00:49:57,240
Speaker 1: we brought in Kevin o'banner at semester. UM. He showed

890
00:49:57,320 --> 00:49:59,600
Speaker 1: up and I wanted him to kind of go through

891
00:49:59,640 --> 00:50:02,239
Speaker 1: it to see what it was. And so that was

892
00:50:02,320 --> 00:50:04,279
Speaker 1: his red shirt here. So that next year we bring

893
00:50:04,280 --> 00:50:06,719
Speaker 1: in nine new players. Three of those guys start for

894
00:50:07,280 --> 00:50:10,200
Speaker 1: UH Forest right now. Um one of them is our

895
00:50:10,239 --> 00:50:13,080
Speaker 1: six man who did start as a freshman, but he

896
00:50:13,080 --> 00:50:15,440
Speaker 1: had some injuries. And so four or four of the

897
00:50:15,520 --> 00:50:18,600
Speaker 1: top six guys were with us or part of that

898
00:50:18,719 --> 00:50:24,120
Speaker 1: nine and uh. So from that perspective, very similar to

899
00:50:24,160 --> 00:50:27,719
Speaker 1: the Baylor Right, we bring in Curtis, Henry, Kevin and

900
00:50:27,800 --> 00:50:30,840
Speaker 1: Mama do and we ride with those. I was riding

901
00:50:30,880 --> 00:50:34,160
Speaker 1: with these guys and and the good and the bad, right,

902
00:50:34,239 --> 00:50:37,040
Speaker 1: the highs and the lows. So that's when they're freshman,

903
00:50:37,120 --> 00:50:39,520
Speaker 1: you're not any good and we weren't any good. We're

904
00:50:39,520 --> 00:50:44,000
Speaker 1: actually worse. UM. And then that third year, we've played

905
00:50:44,000 --> 00:50:47,319
Speaker 1: Oklahoma State, I think the second game of the year. UM,

906
00:50:47,320 --> 00:50:50,520
Speaker 1: we had played a nine D one and then played

907
00:50:50,680 --> 00:50:52,520
Speaker 1: no you know what. We played in the first game

908
00:50:52,520 --> 00:50:56,319
Speaker 1: of the year and we lose by three, and I

909
00:50:56,400 --> 00:50:59,560
Speaker 1: was like, oh man, we may be all right. And

910
00:50:59,680 --> 00:51:02,000
Speaker 1: uh in that next game play Division when school Houston

911
00:51:02,040 --> 00:51:06,040
Speaker 1: Baptist and went by fifteen eighteen plus and uh. And

912
00:51:06,080 --> 00:51:09,840
Speaker 1: then you're like, okay, uh, we're gonna be okay. And

913
00:51:09,880 --> 00:51:13,239
Speaker 1: then you just then you just begin this process of

914
00:51:13,800 --> 00:51:21,399
Speaker 1: instilling belief into your Kevin O'Bannon. Where did you first

915
00:51:21,400 --> 00:51:23,160
Speaker 1: see him? How did you get him? Uh? I saw

916
00:51:23,239 --> 00:51:26,400
Speaker 1: him at UH at an au event in South Carolina

917
00:51:26,480 --> 00:51:29,600
Speaker 1: where his zion was that and UM zion was over

918
00:51:29,640 --> 00:51:32,480
Speaker 1: on that on one court, and so everybody was over there,

919
00:51:32,480 --> 00:51:35,000
Speaker 1: and I went over here to watch Texas Pro and

920
00:51:36,239 --> 00:51:38,040
Speaker 1: I remember he got a rebound and he went up

921
00:51:38,040 --> 00:51:41,880
Speaker 1: and dunked it, and I looked around. I'm like, all right,

922
00:51:41,960 --> 00:51:46,200
Speaker 1: nobody else saw that. Uh. And and and then I

923
00:51:46,200 --> 00:51:48,600
Speaker 1: found out. I said where is he from? He's from Houston.

924
00:51:49,000 --> 00:51:51,880
Speaker 1: And I said, all right, Uh, what does his parents

925
00:51:51,920 --> 00:51:54,840
Speaker 1: to said their preachers. I was like, his mom and

926
00:51:54,880 --> 00:51:57,400
Speaker 1: his dad, they're like both of them. And I was like,

927
00:51:57,480 --> 00:51:59,680
Speaker 1: so they're like co pastors of a church. And I

928
00:51:59,719 --> 00:52:05,839
Speaker 1: was like, okay, uh, here we go. Oh. And I'm

929
00:52:05,920 --> 00:52:10,399
Speaker 1: telling you it was Laser. I wore that poor kid out. Uh.

930
00:52:10,480 --> 00:52:13,759
Speaker 1: Now he was getting attention from wake Forest and and

931
00:52:13,920 --> 00:52:16,840
Speaker 1: really it was US or Nevada at the time. But

932
00:52:16,920 --> 00:52:20,760
Speaker 1: I wore that poor kid out. And uh and and

933
00:52:20,760 --> 00:52:23,200
Speaker 1: and so how do you how do you go and

934
00:52:23,239 --> 00:52:26,239
Speaker 1: you sit with the parents, and and how do you

935
00:52:26,680 --> 00:52:30,160
Speaker 1: I mean, obviously then being preachers, they understood or Roberts,

936
00:52:30,160 --> 00:52:32,640
Speaker 1: but when they're sitting there and there trying to judge. Okay,

937
00:52:32,880 --> 00:52:35,719
Speaker 1: my kid could go to Nevada, a program that has

938
00:52:35,719 --> 00:52:39,680
Speaker 1: put guys in the NBA recently, you know, And and

939
00:52:40,160 --> 00:52:41,799
Speaker 1: or I could go to or rob Its like how

940
00:52:41,840 --> 00:52:45,840
Speaker 1: do you convince some somebody to buy in when there's

941
00:52:46,320 --> 00:52:49,320
Speaker 1: there's outside of your association with Baylor, there's no substance.

942
00:52:49,320 --> 00:52:52,080
Speaker 1: How do you make somebody believe in your vision? Yeah?

943
00:52:52,120 --> 00:52:55,640
Speaker 1: Well one, I think one of the neat things about

944
00:52:55,800 --> 00:52:58,879
Speaker 1: the thirteen NBA guys that I've had the privilege of coach,

945
00:52:58,920 --> 00:53:01,359
Speaker 1: Antenna of them were never ranked right. They were never

946
00:53:01,560 --> 00:53:05,160
Speaker 1: ranked top one D high school players um quincy A,

947
00:53:05,280 --> 00:53:10,720
Speaker 1: c Perry Jones, and Isaiah Austin. Were those other guys, Royce, O'Neil,

948
00:53:10,840 --> 00:53:15,839
Speaker 1: Taurean Prince, um quincy A, c at a Ut None

949
00:53:15,840 --> 00:53:18,560
Speaker 1: of those guys were. And so what you were telling

950
00:53:18,920 --> 00:53:23,239
Speaker 1: those guys is, listen, I know everybody has coaches, they

951
00:53:23,320 --> 00:53:25,919
Speaker 1: have all these plays. I'm not a big believer in that.

952
00:53:26,200 --> 00:53:29,520
Speaker 1: I don't think in January there are two magic plays.

953
00:53:29,960 --> 00:53:33,640
Speaker 1: I would rather have two better players. And So, here

954
00:53:33,960 --> 00:53:37,120
Speaker 1: is what we're gonna do individual development. Wife, And I'm

955
00:53:37,160 --> 00:53:40,120
Speaker 1: not telling you, We're just showing you a schedule. Here's

956
00:53:40,120 --> 00:53:44,279
Speaker 1: how committed we're gonna be to you. Here's your morning workouts,

957
00:53:44,680 --> 00:53:48,960
Speaker 1: here's your afternoon workouts. Here's what we're doing. And and

958
00:53:49,040 --> 00:53:51,880
Speaker 1: so it was listen for me, developments the name of

959
00:53:51,920 --> 00:53:55,600
Speaker 1: the game. I've been fortunate to be around guys that

960
00:53:55,600 --> 00:53:59,480
Speaker 1: that's translated. And I'm telling you that I would rather

961
00:53:59,560 --> 00:54:02,520
Speaker 1: have two better players than two more plays. And I'm

962
00:54:02,560 --> 00:54:05,239
Speaker 1: you're gonna get invested in and I want you to

963
00:54:05,280 --> 00:54:08,360
Speaker 1: know that. And you know what they do. They have

964
00:54:08,480 --> 00:54:10,680
Speaker 1: to take a calculated risk, whether or not you know

965
00:54:10,760 --> 00:54:12,680
Speaker 1: what you're doing. And I said, you're gonna be in

966
00:54:12,680 --> 00:54:16,919
Speaker 1: a great environment where the temptations are not gonna be heavy,

967
00:54:17,000 --> 00:54:20,080
Speaker 1: and so you are gonna have an opportunity. The best

968
00:54:20,120 --> 00:54:21,680
Speaker 1: thing you can do is be in the gym. And

969
00:54:21,719 --> 00:54:24,520
Speaker 1: I want you to know that I live in there. Uh.

970
00:54:24,760 --> 00:54:29,520
Speaker 1: And so he decides to come and uh, and you

971
00:54:29,520 --> 00:54:32,560
Speaker 1: know what, he's a freshman All American. Uh. He was

972
00:54:32,600 --> 00:54:35,239
Speaker 1: a freshman Conference Player of the Year. He was a

973
00:54:35,320 --> 00:54:39,920
Speaker 1: six Man of the Year. And then all of a sudden, um, hey,

974
00:54:40,120 --> 00:54:43,440
Speaker 1: you know what, guess what what they actually told us

975
00:54:43,480 --> 00:54:46,160
Speaker 1: has come to fruition. So when you tell Max A

976
00:54:46,280 --> 00:54:50,359
Speaker 1: Smith this, he's like, well, Kevin, I don't know. Now

977
00:54:50,520 --> 00:54:52,840
Speaker 1: I wanted to I wanted to match. Yeah, now you

978
00:54:52,880 --> 00:54:56,680
Speaker 1: have kep Uh when when in the timeline did you

979
00:54:56,719 --> 00:55:01,319
Speaker 1: first see match four thirty afternoon tune on a Saturday

980
00:55:01,360 --> 00:55:08,240
Speaker 1: at an AU event on court number one at Drive Nation. HM, okay,

981
00:55:08,360 --> 00:55:12,600
Speaker 1: and he runs. I knew he could shoot, so coming in,

982
00:55:12,719 --> 00:55:15,280
Speaker 1: I was like, all right, he weighs a twenty pounds,

983
00:55:15,640 --> 00:55:21,760
Speaker 1: it's not very big. Um uh that's okay, six ft

984
00:55:21,840 --> 00:55:25,440
Speaker 1: now one twenties exaggerating, but I literally he's one forty.

985
00:55:26,000 --> 00:55:30,239
Speaker 1: Um he's six ft five eleven, one forty. But he's

986
00:55:30,239 --> 00:55:33,799
Speaker 1: off the ball and he can shoot that thing. And

987
00:55:33,840 --> 00:55:35,960
Speaker 1: it's like, man, this little dude, if he gets his

988
00:55:36,000 --> 00:55:39,200
Speaker 1: hands on it, like he can make these shots. And

989
00:55:39,239 --> 00:55:41,680
Speaker 1: then he runs a pick and roll with a player

990
00:55:41,719 --> 00:55:44,279
Speaker 1: who ended up going to a Big ten school. Um.

991
00:55:44,320 --> 00:55:46,480
Speaker 1: I think they were the only two Division one players

992
00:55:46,480 --> 00:55:49,759
Speaker 1: on that on on on that AU team. And when

993
00:55:49,760 --> 00:55:53,399
Speaker 1: I say it was too perfection, I was sitting there

994
00:55:53,480 --> 00:55:56,640
Speaker 1: like that is a dime and that's a heck of

995
00:55:56,640 --> 00:55:59,799
Speaker 1: a read and and the kid just goes up. He's

996
00:55:59,800 --> 00:56:01,920
Speaker 1: a X eleven guy, goes up and dumps it. And

997
00:56:01,960 --> 00:56:04,600
Speaker 1: I just said, holy cow. I said, if this kid

998
00:56:04,680 --> 00:56:08,000
Speaker 1: can really handle and see like that, um, we just

999
00:56:08,040 --> 00:56:11,240
Speaker 1: need to put weight on him. Because what I realized

1000
00:56:11,280 --> 00:56:13,840
Speaker 1: over the years is is we would pass up on

1001
00:56:14,000 --> 00:56:16,759
Speaker 1: kids at Baylor if you were chubby, and and they

1002
00:56:16,760 --> 00:56:18,960
Speaker 1: would go on and become conference player of the year

1003
00:56:19,120 --> 00:56:22,120
Speaker 1: somewhere else. And and I said, you know what, people

1004
00:56:22,160 --> 00:56:26,040
Speaker 1: can lose weight, uh, and you know what people can

1005
00:56:26,120 --> 00:56:30,000
Speaker 1: gain weight. And so you just began to concentrate. You

1006
00:56:30,120 --> 00:56:33,120
Speaker 1: got less concerned with do they have a big twelve

1007
00:56:33,160 --> 00:56:36,120
Speaker 1: body or do they have a college ready body? It's

1008
00:56:36,200 --> 00:56:38,680
Speaker 1: do they have a college ready skill? Already knew he

1009
00:56:38,719 --> 00:56:42,719
Speaker 1: could shoot, but when I saw that pass, I was

1010
00:56:43,520 --> 00:56:45,480
Speaker 1: that was it for me. I was locked. So was

1011
00:56:45,480 --> 00:56:49,520
Speaker 1: he was he a junior? Was he gonna? Yeah? He

1012
00:56:49,560 --> 00:56:52,279
Speaker 1: would he was, he was going into a senior year. Uh,

1013
00:56:52,320 --> 00:56:55,640
Speaker 1: he had offers from all the military academies. He's really smart.

1014
00:56:56,280 --> 00:57:01,480
Speaker 1: Um and uh and maarrassed. And so no other Texas schools.

1015
00:57:01,640 --> 00:57:03,360
Speaker 1: You're in Texas. You're in Texas, and you got a

1016
00:57:03,360 --> 00:57:05,959
Speaker 1: guarden in school and you got I mean you got

1017
00:57:06,200 --> 00:57:10,399
Speaker 1: s m U and TCU and there were coaching where

1018
00:57:10,480 --> 00:57:12,520
Speaker 1: you got Texas. You had to be Texas State for him.

1019
00:57:13,040 --> 00:57:17,880
Speaker 1: You had to be for him. Yeah. And and so

1020
00:57:18,200 --> 00:57:21,240
Speaker 1: I will say this I thought is better than grand size.

1021
00:57:21,280 --> 00:57:23,640
Speaker 1: That what you're telling me? No, no, no, no, no,

1022
00:57:23,840 --> 00:57:27,920
Speaker 1: I'm not saying they were chasing other people. And so

1023
00:57:28,000 --> 00:57:30,840
Speaker 1: everybody gets to chase other people. But I'll tell you

1024
00:57:30,920 --> 00:57:34,120
Speaker 1: Coach Springman Um, who is a Texas for seventeen years

1025
00:57:34,200 --> 00:57:38,040
Speaker 1: with coach Ball Russell sawing and he's like, you gotta

1026
00:57:38,080 --> 00:57:40,520
Speaker 1: get here. I'm just telling you, And I was like

1027
00:57:40,560 --> 00:57:44,439
Speaker 1: all right, and and literally we're like the only people there. Um,

1028
00:57:44,640 --> 00:57:47,520
Speaker 1: there's like, Noah, there's Division two schools. There were like

1029
00:57:47,520 --> 00:57:49,880
Speaker 1: the only Division one schools there. Everybody else is all

1030
00:57:49,880 --> 00:57:53,280
Speaker 1: of these other bigger events. UM. And I think I

1031
00:57:53,320 --> 00:57:56,800
Speaker 1: flew back from South Carolina at that event where I

1032
00:57:56,800 --> 00:57:59,560
Speaker 1: had seen Kevin and Um, I flew in to watch

1033
00:57:59,680 --> 00:58:02,680
Speaker 1: Matt and Um and Russell had been there, and just

1034
00:58:02,800 --> 00:58:06,360
Speaker 1: like I'm just I said, Russell had had had been

1035
00:58:06,400 --> 00:58:09,000
Speaker 1: at San Diego and then he was with Oklahoma City Thunder.

1036
00:58:09,040 --> 00:58:12,360
Speaker 1: I said, would you take him at San Diego? He said,

1037
00:58:12,680 --> 00:58:14,520
Speaker 1: And I said, that's all I need to know. And

1038
00:58:14,560 --> 00:58:18,080
Speaker 1: he was such a wonderful young man and and so

1039
00:58:18,880 --> 00:58:22,200
Speaker 1: it was how do we get him? And um and

1040
00:58:22,240 --> 00:58:26,160
Speaker 1: again we were fortunate. Okay, So fast forward that to

1041
00:58:26,240 --> 00:58:29,120
Speaker 1: the conference tournament this year, because well, you've had a

1042
00:58:29,120 --> 00:58:32,520
Speaker 1: wild year. Point they lost UMKC on the other hand,

1043
00:58:33,560 --> 00:58:36,840
Speaker 1: they're good by the way. Uh they're good by the way.

1044
00:58:36,960 --> 00:58:38,680
Speaker 1: I know they are. But when you tell people like

1045
00:58:38,840 --> 00:58:40,800
Speaker 1: they're in the street sixtein the same year they lost

1046
00:58:40,800 --> 00:58:43,560
Speaker 1: the NDCs, like really, like we we don't even I

1047
00:58:43,640 --> 00:58:45,280
Speaker 1: don't even knows who finished ahead of you in the

1048
00:58:45,280 --> 00:58:48,080
Speaker 1: Summit League, right, they just don't. It's it's that's it.

1049
00:58:48,440 --> 00:58:50,960
Speaker 1: That's kind of the magic of this thing. How did

1050
00:58:50,960 --> 00:58:54,320
Speaker 1: it all come together in the conference tournament? Yeah, I

1051
00:58:54,360 --> 00:58:56,640
Speaker 1: mean we could have finished. I mean we had some

1052
00:58:56,720 --> 00:59:01,040
Speaker 1: COVID cancelations cancelation you know, and had we been able

1053
00:59:01,080 --> 00:59:04,440
Speaker 1: to win that game, we would have been as finished second.

1054
00:59:05,000 --> 00:59:07,480
Speaker 1: And so I felt like in the problem is as

1055
00:59:07,520 --> 00:59:10,640
Speaker 1: the first two seeds get buys. And so we knew

1056
00:59:10,680 --> 00:59:12,640
Speaker 1: going into this that we had to win three games

1057
00:59:12,640 --> 00:59:15,040
Speaker 1: in three days. Well in our conference. Of the thirty

1058
00:59:15,040 --> 00:59:18,120
Speaker 1: one conferences that played this year, IVY League being the

1059
00:59:18,120 --> 00:59:20,680
Speaker 1: only one who didn't, seventeen of the thirty one played

1060
00:59:20,680 --> 00:59:25,360
Speaker 1: back to back games, So we knew, hey, back to back,

1061
00:59:25,480 --> 00:59:29,080
Speaker 1: we're gonna be okay. So the four five matchup, um,

1062
00:59:29,160 --> 00:59:31,320
Speaker 1: we had lost a one point game and then we

1063
00:59:31,360 --> 00:59:34,120
Speaker 1: had won the other one by seventeen. So we felt

1064
00:59:34,120 --> 00:59:37,840
Speaker 1: good about that. Uh, the number one seed. We had

1065
00:59:37,880 --> 00:59:41,000
Speaker 1: won by seventeen and then we lost by fifteen, and

1066
00:59:41,120 --> 00:59:44,680
Speaker 1: we really uh the South Dakota State and so you

1067
00:59:44,720 --> 00:59:48,040
Speaker 1: know that they've had Nate Walters and Mike don through

1068
00:59:48,040 --> 00:59:50,920
Speaker 1: the years, really good players, and we they had the

1069
00:59:50,920 --> 00:59:54,120
Speaker 1: returning Conference player of the year. But I'm after our

1070
00:59:54,160 --> 00:59:56,520
Speaker 1: first conference game, I remember telling the staff, I said,

1071
00:59:56,960 --> 00:59:58,680
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure we got the best point guard in

1072
00:59:58,680 --> 01:00:00,120
Speaker 1: the league. And if we have the best point in

1073
01:00:00,120 --> 01:00:02,800
Speaker 1: the league, but the best team in the league, and

1074
01:00:02,800 --> 01:00:05,560
Speaker 1: and I said, this needs to show itself. So we

1075
01:00:05,600 --> 01:00:09,160
Speaker 1: needed to pick up some areas in defensive intensity, and

1076
01:00:09,200 --> 01:00:12,880
Speaker 1: we needed to better understand shots selection, and if you

1077
01:00:12,960 --> 01:00:15,320
Speaker 1: look down the stretch, I think all of that just

1078
01:00:15,400 --> 01:00:17,760
Speaker 1: begins to come together. You know. It's kind of like

1079
01:00:17,960 --> 01:00:21,000
Speaker 1: when do your children finally understand, Hey, I've been saying

1080
01:00:21,040 --> 01:00:23,640
Speaker 1: that same message. I've been telling you that for two years,

1081
01:00:23,760 --> 01:00:26,680
Speaker 1: and they come in and like, Dad, did you know, Well,

1082
01:00:26,720 --> 01:00:29,640
Speaker 1: I've been telling you that for two years, and it

1083
01:00:29,720 --> 01:00:33,840
Speaker 1: just sometimes it just clicks, right. Well, it clicked, and

1084
01:00:34,200 --> 01:00:36,640
Speaker 1: so we end up winning a buzzer beater against the

1085
01:00:36,720 --> 01:00:39,800
Speaker 1: number one seed and have a great first half of

1086
01:00:40,120 --> 01:00:44,040
Speaker 1: up forty five to twenty on on North Dakota State

1087
01:00:44,440 --> 01:00:48,280
Speaker 1: who had won it two years and your your your

1088
01:00:48,400 --> 01:00:52,040
Speaker 1: your buzzer beater. Yeah, okay, take me through what Take

1089
01:00:52,080 --> 01:00:55,400
Speaker 1: me through what happened? I want you down to. We're

1090
01:00:55,400 --> 01:01:00,360
Speaker 1: tie game UM and so I Max, wait, how much

1091
01:01:00,400 --> 01:01:02,919
Speaker 1: time you got? Um? I think we get the ball

1092
01:01:02,960 --> 01:01:08,960
Speaker 1: with fourteen seconds? Okay, No, I gotta Traditionally, uh no,

1093
01:01:09,760 --> 01:01:12,960
Speaker 1: only if it's under four UM. Under four we call

1094
01:01:13,080 --> 01:01:15,880
Speaker 1: time out. Anything over for your going? Okay, do they

1095
01:01:15,880 --> 01:01:17,600
Speaker 1: have an automatic? You have an automatic or you just

1096
01:01:17,640 --> 01:01:21,120
Speaker 1: calling calling in front of your bench. We have an automatic? Alright?

1097
01:01:21,120 --> 01:01:24,240
Speaker 1: So um we get the ballot the hell? Yeah, there

1098
01:01:24,240 --> 01:01:28,760
Speaker 1: you go. There's the automatic. So there's fourteen seconds. You're

1099
01:01:28,760 --> 01:01:34,520
Speaker 1: going to the play at eight UM and and Max drives. Um,

1100
01:01:34,640 --> 01:01:38,000
Speaker 1: it starts right, crosses it over, goes back left, and

1101
01:01:38,120 --> 01:01:41,280
Speaker 1: Kevin's on the left block and Sneake cuts underneath the

1102
01:01:41,400 --> 01:01:44,080
Speaker 1: rim and now you're on the right cut. So Max

1103
01:01:44,120 --> 01:01:47,000
Speaker 1: puts up a shot right around the left hash mark

1104
01:01:47,560 --> 01:01:50,920
Speaker 1: and it's bouncing around and I'm like, it may fall,

1105
01:01:51,040 --> 01:01:53,439
Speaker 1: it may not. I'm not sure. You know what it's

1106
01:01:53,440 --> 01:01:56,080
Speaker 1: like when you've seen so many games, you know the

1107
01:01:56,080 --> 01:01:59,120
Speaker 1: ones that are going in, but I wasn't sure. So

1108
01:01:59,280 --> 01:02:03,280
Speaker 1: this one rims out and Ko had sneak cut under

1109
01:02:03,400 --> 01:02:06,680
Speaker 1: so he was on the inside of that defender over there,

1110
01:02:06,920 --> 01:02:09,280
Speaker 1: and he reaches his hand up and tips it in

1111
01:02:09,720 --> 01:02:13,320
Speaker 1: and uh, and I was I was ninety nine point

1112
01:02:13,400 --> 01:02:16,640
Speaker 1: nine per cent certain. And when the uh, when when

1113
01:02:16,640 --> 01:02:18,640
Speaker 1: the rest go over the monitor and then they get

1114
01:02:18,720 --> 01:02:21,840
Speaker 1: look over at you and they do this, and it's

1115
01:02:21,920 --> 01:02:26,080
Speaker 1: just it's elation, right, It's like thank goodness because the

1116
01:02:26,160 --> 01:02:29,440
Speaker 1: reality is as you thought that the momentum would carry

1117
01:02:29,440 --> 01:02:33,400
Speaker 1: you through day three, like I've always game ones the most,

1118
01:02:33,840 --> 01:02:38,320
Speaker 1: but Game two is so pivotal you can't start thinking ahead. Uh.

1119
01:02:38,360 --> 01:02:40,840
Speaker 1: And you start thinking ahead, we're gonna be in trouble

1120
01:02:40,840 --> 01:02:42,880
Speaker 1: because you're like, oh, a game away from the n

1121
01:02:42,920 --> 01:02:45,800
Speaker 1: C Double A tournament and and so I thought momentum

1122
01:02:45,840 --> 01:02:49,040
Speaker 1: would carry us. Game three, we were up forty a

1123
01:02:49,240 --> 01:02:51,920
Speaker 1: half on North Dakota State, played really well, and then

1124
01:02:51,960 --> 01:02:54,520
Speaker 1: they come back and uh, we have to end up

1125
01:02:54,520 --> 01:02:58,080
Speaker 1: getting a stop uh in order to winning it. Um.

1126
01:02:58,120 --> 01:03:00,880
Speaker 1: But the only two teams that have won this league

1127
01:03:01,160 --> 01:03:04,400
Speaker 1: since the tournament has moved to South Dakota, they have

1128
01:03:05,280 --> 01:03:09,439
Speaker 1: last NAG Yeah and so we understood. I mean they

1129
01:03:09,480 --> 01:03:12,520
Speaker 1: hear it constantly, like do you understand how good you

1130
01:03:12,520 --> 01:03:14,439
Speaker 1: have to be in order to win a conference? There's

1131
01:03:14,480 --> 01:03:16,400
Speaker 1: only two teams that have done it, and they just

1132
01:03:16,520 --> 01:03:19,479
Speaker 1: have a mentality that we don't yet. So I felt

1133
01:03:19,480 --> 01:03:23,000
Speaker 1: when we overcame that because they had been preached this

1134
01:03:23,200 --> 01:03:26,040
Speaker 1: all year. I mean, you know how to win in March.

1135
01:03:26,120 --> 01:03:28,160
Speaker 1: I mean we tell them that, we talk about that

1136
01:03:28,320 --> 01:03:30,760
Speaker 1: way back in August, and we got a graphic that

1137
01:03:30,800 --> 01:03:33,080
Speaker 1: we show once a week, this is how you went

1138
01:03:33,120 --> 01:03:36,360
Speaker 1: in March and and and so I thought when we

1139
01:03:36,440 --> 01:03:39,160
Speaker 1: overcame that because all you I mean, you're when you're

1140
01:03:39,160 --> 01:03:42,360
Speaker 1: in a one big league, it's the conference tournament. And

1141
01:03:42,400 --> 01:03:46,760
Speaker 1: I felt like that was such a weight uh off

1142
01:03:46,840 --> 01:03:49,800
Speaker 1: of the players are like, we're sick of hearing you

1143
01:03:49,840 --> 01:03:52,760
Speaker 1: talk about it so much, and uh and it's such

1144
01:03:52,760 --> 01:03:55,680
Speaker 1: a joy for those guys to you know. I was

1145
01:03:55,720 --> 01:03:58,480
Speaker 1: so happy for our players. I mean, our staff has

1146
01:03:58,480 --> 01:04:00,600
Speaker 1: been involved in eighty one of these and c double

1147
01:04:00,640 --> 01:04:03,600
Speaker 1: A tournament games. But you're just happy for your players

1148
01:04:03,600 --> 01:04:06,800
Speaker 1: that they get the March madness experience. All right, so

1149
01:04:07,000 --> 01:04:09,160
Speaker 1: you show you get done? Did you guys go back

1150
01:04:09,160 --> 01:04:13,640
Speaker 1: to Tulsa you go neatly from the Dakotas to Oh yeah,

1151
01:04:13,680 --> 01:04:16,520
Speaker 1: we we we we tried like crazy to get a

1152
01:04:16,520 --> 01:04:19,600
Speaker 1: plane ticket home. So we took a ten hour bus

1153
01:04:19,760 --> 01:04:23,160
Speaker 1: ride back. Um, they couldn't find any flights to get

1154
01:04:23,160 --> 01:04:26,360
Speaker 1: back to Tulsa within a reasonable time period. Take a

1155
01:04:26,400 --> 01:04:29,440
Speaker 1: ten hour of bus ride back and there are a

1156
01:04:29,560 --> 01:04:33,840
Speaker 1: police escort is meeting four miles from campus. Uh, these

1157
01:04:33,880 --> 01:04:37,480
Speaker 1: guys have never seen a police escort. You pull into

1158
01:04:37,640 --> 01:04:42,080
Speaker 1: O or U and hundreds of people are there, cameras everywhere,

1159
01:04:42,480 --> 01:04:46,240
Speaker 1: guys are walking off the bus, and you just realize like, oh,

1160
01:04:46,320 --> 01:04:49,440
Speaker 1: this is a different experience, and you're just so happy

1161
01:04:49,520 --> 01:04:53,160
Speaker 1: for your guys. And then immediately, so that's a Wednesday,

1162
01:04:53,200 --> 01:04:55,320
Speaker 1: and they tell us you have to be in the

1163
01:04:55,360 --> 01:04:58,720
Speaker 1: bubble on Saturday. Well, we had already had these plans

1164
01:04:58,760 --> 01:05:01,560
Speaker 1: for the watch show on Sunday. You know that you're

1165
01:05:01,600 --> 01:05:03,720
Speaker 1: already playing, and you're like, man, you have to get

1166
01:05:03,760 --> 01:05:06,360
Speaker 1: here Saturday before the You don't even get to see

1167
01:05:06,360 --> 01:05:09,600
Speaker 1: the selection show with your own family, Like you gotta

1168
01:05:09,640 --> 01:05:13,960
Speaker 1: be that protected. And uh, sure enough, Um, that Saturday

1169
01:05:14,000 --> 01:05:16,880
Speaker 1: morning at noon, you're on a plane and we were

1170
01:05:17,080 --> 01:05:22,000
Speaker 1: checked in hotel rooms, quarantining at three o'clock. So you're

1171
01:05:22,000 --> 01:05:25,800
Speaker 1: getting ready for Ohio State. And Uh, they're good. They're

1172
01:05:25,840 --> 01:05:28,080
Speaker 1: impressive team. I saw him in the Big Ten tournament.

1173
01:05:28,600 --> 01:05:30,440
Speaker 1: I call the thing. You know where you are the

1174
01:05:30,440 --> 01:05:33,360
Speaker 1: week before. Um, what do you think it would take

1175
01:05:33,360 --> 01:05:38,680
Speaker 1: for you guys to beat him one? UM? I honestly

1176
01:05:38,760 --> 01:05:40,880
Speaker 1: believe you know. Max Ay Smiths is a leading score

1177
01:05:40,920 --> 01:05:43,200
Speaker 1: in the country. Uh. He and Kevin are the best

1178
01:05:43,280 --> 01:05:46,480
Speaker 1: duo in the country in regards to points production. Um,

1179
01:05:46,480 --> 01:05:48,520
Speaker 1: we're number one in the country at making threes. We

1180
01:05:48,560 --> 01:05:50,760
Speaker 1: make a little bit more than eleven a game. Um.

1181
01:05:50,760 --> 01:05:53,600
Speaker 1: We're top fifteen at taking care of the ball and

1182
01:05:53,720 --> 01:05:56,600
Speaker 1: uh and we're top twelve at shooting it right. Uh

1183
01:05:56,680 --> 01:06:01,520
Speaker 1: make about thirty of our threes. Um. And so I thought, hey,

1184
01:06:01,760 --> 01:06:04,200
Speaker 1: we need to put Kevin and Max in a whole

1185
01:06:04,240 --> 01:06:06,600
Speaker 1: bunch of middle pick and roll. I think they're the

1186
01:06:06,600 --> 01:06:11,840
Speaker 1: best tandeman in the country. UM. And and we've seen everything.

1187
01:06:11,960 --> 01:06:14,760
Speaker 1: If you switch, if you hard hedge, um, if you

1188
01:06:14,840 --> 01:06:18,080
Speaker 1: jam um and we we we've seen it all. And

1189
01:06:18,120 --> 01:06:21,000
Speaker 1: so those guys kind of understand, uh, and the off

1190
01:06:21,000 --> 01:06:24,080
Speaker 1: ball movement, guys understand what it is we're actually trying

1191
01:06:24,120 --> 01:06:26,640
Speaker 1: to look for. And I just thought, like, if we'll

1192
01:06:26,680 --> 01:06:29,320
Speaker 1: put these two in middle, pick and roll and we'll

1193
01:06:29,360 --> 01:06:32,040
Speaker 1: take care of the ball and guys will play with

1194
01:06:32,120 --> 01:06:36,200
Speaker 1: the level of confidence and belief. Um, I just I

1195
01:06:36,240 --> 01:06:38,680
Speaker 1: just said, we'll get it done. So when it went

1196
01:06:38,720 --> 01:06:43,920
Speaker 1: to overtime, when I say I looked in those guys eyes,

1197
01:06:44,240 --> 01:06:47,320
Speaker 1: you could tell they were really confident. But you know,

1198
01:06:47,360 --> 01:06:50,360
Speaker 1: it's what's interesting about though, is you talked about overtime.

1199
01:06:50,720 --> 01:06:53,960
Speaker 1: You had to get one stop to get to overtime, right, Yeah,

1200
01:06:54,040 --> 01:06:56,400
Speaker 1: I mean all all these games like everybody's killing the

1201
01:06:56,400 --> 01:06:59,480
Speaker 1: Big ten, Like, look, they had their best perimeter player

1202
01:07:00,040 --> 01:07:02,240
Speaker 1: at the ball, a chance to win the game, and

1203
01:07:02,280 --> 01:07:04,880
Speaker 1: you guys gotta you held him to a really hard,

1204
01:07:04,920 --> 01:07:10,240
Speaker 1: contested deep shot. And so what happened was was on

1205
01:07:10,360 --> 01:07:15,800
Speaker 1: that shot you said, man, because you think they're gonna

1206
01:07:15,880 --> 01:07:17,840
Speaker 1: drive it, right, you think they're gonna go get a

1207
01:07:17,840 --> 01:07:21,680
Speaker 1: paint touch, and you're just really cautioning your guys not

1208
01:07:21,800 --> 01:07:25,080
Speaker 1: to foul, and and you see that shot and you're

1209
01:07:25,120 --> 01:07:29,800
Speaker 1: just like, oh, that's a tough one. Um, all right, Um,

1210
01:07:30,000 --> 01:07:33,840
Speaker 1: let's let's be serious about getting the ball where it

1211
01:07:33,920 --> 01:07:37,840
Speaker 1: needs to be and and make we take advantage of

1212
01:07:37,840 --> 01:07:41,120
Speaker 1: these next five minutes given that we just got the

1213
01:07:41,160 --> 01:07:43,480
Speaker 1: stop that we needed, and so it was almost like

1214
01:07:43,520 --> 01:07:47,800
Speaker 1: you were resuscitated a little bit. Um, and it was like,

1215
01:07:48,200 --> 01:07:51,959
Speaker 1: all right, we we've got to finish this opportunity here

1216
01:07:52,520 --> 01:07:55,400
Speaker 1: and uh and we were fortunate that we did. Alright,

1217
01:07:55,440 --> 01:08:00,800
Speaker 1: So then you're down eleven. Were less than tending against

1218
01:08:00,800 --> 01:08:06,040
Speaker 1: Florida against Mike White. We travel around and and go

1219
01:08:06,120 --> 01:08:10,760
Speaker 1: to camps and clinics with or whatever. Yeah, um, would

1220
01:08:10,800 --> 01:08:12,840
Speaker 1: you what was the what was the adjustment you made

1221
01:08:13,440 --> 01:08:15,840
Speaker 1: that help helped you come back on that thing? Yeah?

1222
01:08:15,880 --> 01:08:18,000
Speaker 1: I mean down to eleven. I'm sitting over there, going

1223
01:08:18,040 --> 01:08:20,720
Speaker 1: to I call a time out. I mean, is this

1224
01:08:20,920 --> 01:08:24,200
Speaker 1: just like because the reality is is if I called

1225
01:08:24,200 --> 01:08:27,400
Speaker 1: the time out, they're gonna switch defenses. I don't have

1226
01:08:27,439 --> 01:08:32,560
Speaker 1: a magic play here. Um, I need our guys to

1227
01:08:32,720 --> 01:08:35,840
Speaker 1: just stay fluid. You know, you're down five at the half.

1228
01:08:35,920 --> 01:08:39,600
Speaker 1: So so so now it's it's turned into eleven, a

1229
01:08:39,720 --> 01:08:45,280
Speaker 1: four possession game, and you're just thinking to yourself, like, Okay,

1230
01:08:45,400 --> 01:08:49,400
Speaker 1: our guys, they have to understand one, we have to

1231
01:08:49,439 --> 01:08:51,960
Speaker 1: do a better job on trade. Man. He he had

1232
01:08:52,000 --> 01:08:55,120
Speaker 1: two threes to open up that lead, and so we

1233
01:08:55,200 --> 01:08:57,519
Speaker 1: had to do some different things with our ball screen

1234
01:08:57,640 --> 01:09:00,840
Speaker 1: coverage up top. So what do you do? Uh, put

1235
01:09:00,880 --> 01:09:03,800
Speaker 1: two on him? Um. Before we were just going under

1236
01:09:04,040 --> 01:09:06,519
Speaker 1: and he made us pay. And they were deep too,

1237
01:09:06,760 --> 01:09:09,200
Speaker 1: I mean their NBA threes. And if you look at

1238
01:09:09,240 --> 01:09:11,439
Speaker 1: the opening shot that he makes, it's a drag and

1239
01:09:11,479 --> 01:09:14,920
Speaker 1: we go wonder he makes it? Um. And then to

1240
01:09:14,960 --> 01:09:17,599
Speaker 1: start the second half, there's two of them and they're

1241
01:09:17,640 --> 01:09:21,000
Speaker 1: back to back, and we said, we can't do that anymore. Okay,

1242
01:09:21,040 --> 01:09:23,320
Speaker 1: So so when you put you on the ball on

1243
01:09:23,360 --> 01:09:27,360
Speaker 1: the screen, now you gotta change rotations behind a little.

1244
01:09:27,720 --> 01:09:32,679
Speaker 1: I mean they they had a guy um who couldn't

1245
01:09:32,680 --> 01:09:36,720
Speaker 1: shoot threes um, or wouldn't shoot threes, and so we

1246
01:09:36,920 --> 01:09:39,800
Speaker 1: just said, you have to stay in the paint and

1247
01:09:39,840 --> 01:09:41,960
Speaker 1: we're gonna go put two on the ball, and you

1248
01:09:42,080 --> 01:09:45,320
Speaker 1: got to get it out of tree Man's hands. Um.

1249
01:09:45,360 --> 01:09:47,400
Speaker 1: And I mean, I don't know that we made it more.

1250
01:09:47,760 --> 01:09:50,720
Speaker 1: We didn't make it more complicated than that. And then offensively,

1251
01:09:50,760 --> 01:09:55,280
Speaker 1: did you make any any adjustments there? Um? Offensively, they

1252
01:09:55,280 --> 01:09:58,599
Speaker 1: were switching defenses so much. Uh so they would go

1253
01:09:58,640 --> 01:10:01,200
Speaker 1: back between the man and the three one. The only

1254
01:10:01,240 --> 01:10:04,040
Speaker 1: thing that the DJ Weaver kid who hit the three

1255
01:10:04,200 --> 01:10:06,599
Speaker 1: to to put us up eight to seventy eight, were

1256
01:10:06,640 --> 01:10:10,679
Speaker 1: down one seventy seven with two minutes to play. Um,

1257
01:10:10,880 --> 01:10:13,439
Speaker 1: we were getting good looks in the left corner and

1258
01:10:13,560 --> 01:10:16,120
Speaker 1: DJ hadn't made a shot. He was over five, but

1259
01:10:16,400 --> 01:10:19,759
Speaker 1: DJ Wever is a six ft eight really good shooter.

1260
01:10:20,439 --> 01:10:22,400
Speaker 1: And I just looked at him and I said, DJ,

1261
01:10:22,640 --> 01:10:24,519
Speaker 1: you're about to get a corner three here in the

1262
01:10:24,600 --> 01:10:27,280
Speaker 1: left wing on this one three one, I need you

1263
01:10:27,320 --> 01:10:29,920
Speaker 1: to make it. And he said, I got you. So

1264
01:10:30,160 --> 01:10:32,280
Speaker 1: if you look at the film, you can see me

1265
01:10:32,520 --> 01:10:35,439
Speaker 1: motioning one kid to get to the others. And I'm

1266
01:10:35,479 --> 01:10:38,280
Speaker 1: telling DJ, we just come from the huddle. DJ, you're

1267
01:10:38,320 --> 01:10:41,840
Speaker 1: supposed to be and I'm get there and you're sure enough.

1268
01:10:41,920 --> 01:10:44,479
Speaker 1: Max gets in there, draws too, throws it to DJ

1269
01:10:45,040 --> 01:10:48,800
Speaker 1: and you know what, he knocked that down. Uh. Can

1270
01:10:48,800 --> 01:10:53,120
Speaker 1: I say a quick story, real quick? So I tell

1271
01:10:53,160 --> 01:10:58,439
Speaker 1: this to what I've done, Uh the Oklahoma Coach Association clinic. Yeah,

1272
01:10:58,600 --> 01:11:00,679
Speaker 1: munch different times and I and I've told this story

1273
01:11:00,720 --> 01:11:02,719
Speaker 1: a couple of times. I go around the room message

1274
01:11:02,720 --> 01:11:05,679
Speaker 1: and what's the what's the best thing about coaching? Right?

1275
01:11:06,080 --> 01:11:07,360
Speaker 1: And I know if you gotta run and tell me

1276
01:11:08,080 --> 01:11:11,320
Speaker 1: what's just like paper? Miss so I said, uh, you know,

1277
01:11:11,360 --> 01:11:13,040
Speaker 1: what's what's the best thing about coaching? And they're all

1278
01:11:13,080 --> 01:11:16,479
Speaker 1: you know, like the relationships and watching a kid grow.

1279
01:11:16,479 --> 01:11:19,439
Speaker 1: It's like, that's all great. I'm not diminishing that. You want.

1280
01:11:19,640 --> 01:11:23,240
Speaker 1: The best thing is when you practice something and you

1281
01:11:23,520 --> 01:11:25,760
Speaker 1: showed the kids something, and you show them what and

1282
01:11:25,800 --> 01:11:28,160
Speaker 1: then in the game the exact work you tell them

1283
01:11:28,160 --> 01:11:30,200
Speaker 1: in the huddle and then you run it and not

1284
01:11:30,320 --> 01:11:32,320
Speaker 1: only do they catch it where you told me to

1285
01:11:32,360 --> 01:11:34,960
Speaker 1: catch it, they're open like you told them. They're open,

1286
01:11:35,280 --> 01:11:36,640
Speaker 1: they shoot it like you told them, and then it

1287
01:11:36,640 --> 01:11:38,880
Speaker 1: goes in the basket and everybody looks at you like

1288
01:11:38,920 --> 01:11:43,160
Speaker 1: you're the smartest human being, iron right. That's that to me, honestly,

1289
01:11:43,960 --> 01:11:46,920
Speaker 1: Like is the best is the I helped you and

1290
01:11:46,960 --> 01:11:49,360
Speaker 1: then your skill took over, right, So that that had

1291
01:11:49,400 --> 01:11:51,519
Speaker 1: to be a great rewarding moment. What's it like for

1292
01:11:51,560 --> 01:11:53,160
Speaker 1: you though, when that ball goes to the basket and

1293
01:11:53,200 --> 01:11:54,880
Speaker 1: all of a sudden you go from down to leven too,

1294
01:11:54,920 --> 01:11:58,320
Speaker 1: You've gotta lead under two to go. Yeah, we better

1295
01:11:58,360 --> 01:12:01,599
Speaker 1: get a stop, but we better not mess up this

1296
01:12:01,680 --> 01:12:05,639
Speaker 1: trade man coverage um at all. And I mean, because

1297
01:12:05,680 --> 01:12:07,840
Speaker 1: that's what you're worried about. I mean, guards win this

1298
01:12:07,920 --> 01:12:10,960
Speaker 1: time of year, and I'm fortunate that that I basically

1299
01:12:11,080 --> 01:12:13,600
Speaker 1: put five of them out there, um, because all of

1300
01:12:13,600 --> 01:12:16,760
Speaker 1: them can shoot and so and so from that perspective,

1301
01:12:16,800 --> 01:12:19,840
Speaker 1: it was, don't mess up this trade man coverage. If

1302
01:12:19,840 --> 01:12:23,040
Speaker 1: we're gonna get beat get, let's get beat on it too.

1303
01:12:23,160 --> 01:12:25,559
Speaker 1: Don't let him come off and go wonder and let

1304
01:12:25,640 --> 01:12:28,800
Speaker 1: him kill us off of three. So like, let's be

1305
01:12:28,880 --> 01:12:31,880
Speaker 1: really aggressive on the ball and let's make somebody else

1306
01:12:31,920 --> 01:12:34,360
Speaker 1: make a play. And we ended up getting a turnover.

1307
01:12:35,360 --> 01:12:37,400
Speaker 1: What's that feeling like when you see double zeros and

1308
01:12:37,439 --> 01:12:40,760
Speaker 1: you're going to sweet sixteen? Yeah, I mean one, I'd

1309
01:12:40,840 --> 01:12:44,080
Speaker 1: apologize that Chris Holtman and to Michael White, and both

1310
01:12:44,080 --> 01:12:47,519
Speaker 1: of them were class acts. But you get so caught

1311
01:12:47,600 --> 01:12:50,400
Speaker 1: up in the moment, right, Uh, player comes over and

1312
01:12:50,400 --> 01:12:55,280
Speaker 1: immediately hugs you, and you forget like you have some responsibility, sportsmanship,

1313
01:12:55,320 --> 01:12:59,400
Speaker 1: responsibilities to go acknowledge the other coach, and you just

1314
01:13:00,080 --> 01:13:03,519
Speaker 1: is lose it, right, I Mean, there's a Mike was great.

1315
01:13:03,560 --> 01:13:05,639
Speaker 1: He just come over and grabbed me and I said, Mike,

1316
01:13:05,680 --> 01:13:07,600
Speaker 1: I'm so sorry. He said, I want you to know

1317
01:13:07,640 --> 01:13:10,240
Speaker 1: I'm really happy for you. And Uh, I don't know

1318
01:13:10,320 --> 01:13:13,080
Speaker 1: that I could do that, uh in that moment, and

1319
01:13:13,640 --> 01:13:16,720
Speaker 1: it speaks volumes about Mike. But UM, I think I

1320
01:13:16,720 --> 01:13:19,880
Speaker 1: think you're just again you're happy for your players, like

1321
01:13:19,960 --> 01:13:23,160
Speaker 1: I mean when that, it's almost like you want your

1322
01:13:23,200 --> 01:13:26,840
Speaker 1: guys to experience, just like you want your children to

1323
01:13:26,880 --> 01:13:31,160
Speaker 1: have certain experiences. Um. I've had the experience of sweet sixteens.

1324
01:13:31,439 --> 01:13:34,720
Speaker 1: You want your guys to have that experience. And so

1325
01:13:34,840 --> 01:13:38,599
Speaker 1: from that perspective, UM, it's great. But I can tell

1326
01:13:38,640 --> 01:13:43,759
Speaker 1: you if you lose as it's awful. It's brutal. Uh.

1327
01:13:43,800 --> 01:13:47,479
Speaker 1: And so you're just you're really just I think for me,

1328
01:13:47,680 --> 01:13:50,360
Speaker 1: I hate losing more than I like winning. I expect

1329
01:13:50,400 --> 01:13:53,280
Speaker 1: to win. You pre prepared to win. I think we're

1330
01:13:53,280 --> 01:13:56,760
Speaker 1: gonna do all the things. The losing I did not anticipate.

1331
01:13:56,920 --> 01:14:00,920
Speaker 1: I didn't expect it. Um. And and I go to

1332
01:14:01,040 --> 01:14:06,000
Speaker 1: depths uh that people shouldn't go to. Uh nothing, I

1333
01:14:06,080 --> 01:14:10,200
Speaker 1: just meant, I stay up all night. It's brutal, it's agonizing.

1334
01:14:10,720 --> 01:14:12,920
Speaker 1: And the problem with this is you don't like when

1335
01:14:12,920 --> 01:14:15,800
Speaker 1: you do it during the season. It's all right, let's

1336
01:14:15,800 --> 01:14:18,400
Speaker 1: figure this out so we can help our guys. This

1337
01:14:18,840 --> 01:14:22,479
Speaker 1: it's over and Uh. And you don't want it to

1338
01:14:22,520 --> 01:14:27,000
Speaker 1: be over with your players. UM. Okay, so you got Arkansas,

1339
01:14:27,560 --> 01:14:31,400
Speaker 1: you played Arkansas, you let Arkansas at the half. What

1340
01:14:31,479 --> 01:14:35,120
Speaker 1: do you have this time that you didn't do earlier

1341
01:14:35,200 --> 01:14:39,320
Speaker 1: the season. Yeah. One, they're a different team. Um. I

1342
01:14:39,360 --> 01:14:42,640
Speaker 1: mean they played certain guys that game that that they

1343
01:14:42,640 --> 01:14:44,559
Speaker 1: don't play at all now. I mean there were multiple

1344
01:14:44,560 --> 01:14:47,479
Speaker 1: guys who played thirty thirty plus in that game who

1345
01:14:47,920 --> 01:14:50,599
Speaker 1: who get very little time now. So they're they're way different.

1346
01:14:50,600 --> 01:14:53,360
Speaker 1: I tell you that we're way different to our third

1347
01:14:53,439 --> 01:14:57,599
Speaker 1: leading score went down UM ten games ago. And and

1348
01:14:57,640 --> 01:15:00,240
Speaker 1: so what it's happened is is Max has to be

1349
01:15:00,360 --> 01:15:04,479
Speaker 1: more assertive. And we were playing Max about seventy thirty

1350
01:15:04,520 --> 01:15:06,880
Speaker 1: on ball off the ball at that time. Well now

1351
01:15:06,920 --> 01:15:12,519
Speaker 1: it's one on ball. Uh. And so where where we're different? Uh?

1352
01:15:12,800 --> 01:15:16,519
Speaker 1: And I also think we understand how people approach us,

1353
01:15:16,600 --> 01:15:20,200
Speaker 1: how people attack us, like we've seen it. Um. You know,

1354
01:15:20,240 --> 01:15:23,160
Speaker 1: we we played the third toughest nonconference schedule in the country.

1355
01:15:23,479 --> 01:15:26,080
Speaker 1: All five nonconference opponents went to the n C Double

1356
01:15:26,120 --> 01:15:30,360
Speaker 1: A tournament. You know, down five lose by five, Oklahoma

1357
01:15:30,360 --> 01:15:32,640
Speaker 1: State lose by five to which saw State UM at

1358
01:15:32,640 --> 01:15:35,040
Speaker 1: a twelve point leading the second half against Arkansas and

1359
01:15:35,080 --> 01:15:37,080
Speaker 1: you lose that game. And so I can tell you

1360
01:15:37,120 --> 01:15:40,840
Speaker 1: that that, Um, there was nobody who was happy about that,

1361
01:15:40,920 --> 01:15:43,280
Speaker 1: because we realized these are the areas we needed to

1362
01:15:43,320 --> 01:15:45,200
Speaker 1: tighten up. And it came at a really good time

1363
01:15:45,200 --> 01:15:47,559
Speaker 1: for us because it was right before Christmas. So when

1364
01:15:47,560 --> 01:15:50,840
Speaker 1: our guys got back, um, that was fresh, but they

1365
01:15:50,880 --> 01:15:53,680
Speaker 1: had days off, so they were mentally fresh, and so

1366
01:15:53,880 --> 01:15:56,760
Speaker 1: we knew the areas we needed to clean up in

1367
01:15:56,880 --> 01:16:00,760
Speaker 1: order to win games like that. And and I think

1368
01:16:00,840 --> 01:16:05,439
Speaker 1: those things are what's going to really help us. Um. Okay,

1369
01:16:06,360 --> 01:16:08,320
Speaker 1: there's there's a there's a bunch of that's really good

1370
01:16:10,280 --> 01:16:13,400
Speaker 1: on the court at the Baby Center. I believe it

1371
01:16:13,479 --> 01:16:18,080
Speaker 1: still says expect a miracle, right, it does on the baseline. Yeah, okay, uh,

1372
01:16:19,520 --> 01:16:21,479
Speaker 1: I don't. It wasn't miracle those two games that you won.

1373
01:16:21,520 --> 01:16:26,240
Speaker 1: They weren't miraculous, right, Those aren't miracles. No, But I'd

1374
01:16:26,240 --> 01:16:30,200
Speaker 1: still say to an outsider looking in considering what you

1375
01:16:30,240 --> 01:16:33,080
Speaker 1: took over the league you're in, what you're up against

1376
01:16:33,080 --> 01:16:36,880
Speaker 1: in terms of financial resources, you know, comparison to your competition,

1377
01:16:37,200 --> 01:16:40,920
Speaker 1: it would be fairly miraculous to get oral Roberts to

1378
01:16:41,040 --> 01:16:45,400
Speaker 1: a final four. Have you have you allowed yourself? You said,

1379
01:16:45,479 --> 01:16:47,559
Speaker 1: you just told me that. Like, hey, the hard part

1380
01:16:47,600 --> 01:16:49,920
Speaker 1: of the three games is the second game, right where

1381
01:16:49,960 --> 01:16:53,759
Speaker 1: you start thinking, how have you have you allowed yourself?

1382
01:16:53,760 --> 01:16:57,000
Speaker 1: At least the possibility that two games away from taking

1383
01:16:57,120 --> 01:16:59,320
Speaker 1: Oral Roberts to a final four, you know what? Honest

1384
01:16:59,360 --> 01:17:02,599
Speaker 1: to goodness. Um, after Ohio State, I had no idea

1385
01:17:02,640 --> 01:17:04,640
Speaker 1: who we were playing. I was like, who's on the

1386
01:17:04,680 --> 01:17:07,080
Speaker 1: other side of the bracket, Like who is it? And

1387
01:17:07,120 --> 01:17:09,600
Speaker 1: they was like Virginia Tech Florida And I was like,

1388
01:17:09,640 --> 01:17:12,080
Speaker 1: well who one. Uh. I was like are they any

1389
01:17:12,160 --> 01:17:15,679
Speaker 1: good because you're not the same like yeah, yeah, so yeah,

1390
01:17:15,760 --> 01:17:19,200
Speaker 1: so I I didn't I didn't even know. Um. After

1391
01:17:19,280 --> 01:17:22,160
Speaker 1: the Florida game, I'm like, well, who do we play now?

1392
01:17:22,439 --> 01:17:25,679
Speaker 1: And they were like, well, Texas Tech Arkansas. Like, honest

1393
01:17:25,720 --> 01:17:29,599
Speaker 1: to goodness, I just realized because Scott and I were

1394
01:17:29,600 --> 01:17:32,720
Speaker 1: together yesterday. Um, I didn't even know they were in

1395
01:17:32,760 --> 01:17:34,880
Speaker 1: the South. I didn't even know we were in the

1396
01:17:34,960 --> 01:17:39,160
Speaker 1: same region. Uh. And so I didn't know because I

1397
01:17:39,200 --> 01:17:41,840
Speaker 1: was following Grant. I didn't know that if they won,

1398
01:17:41,920 --> 01:17:45,160
Speaker 1: they played Baylor. But it never clicked that, oh, they're

1399
01:17:45,160 --> 01:17:49,759
Speaker 1: on the same side as us. Uh, because you honestly

1400
01:17:49,840 --> 01:17:53,920
Speaker 1: I am. I'm not a multitasker. I'm a focus guy,

1401
01:17:54,360 --> 01:17:56,840
Speaker 1: and I get locked in on something and I can

1402
01:17:56,880 --> 01:17:59,760
Speaker 1: tell you the whole world can just disappear. I don't

1403
01:17:59,800 --> 01:18:02,759
Speaker 1: pay attention to much else. And but now I'm aware

1404
01:18:02,840 --> 01:18:06,360
Speaker 1: that it's Baylor Villa Nova. But it's not as quick

1405
01:18:06,360 --> 01:18:09,760
Speaker 1: a turnaround. Right when you get the seating announcement on

1406
01:18:09,800 --> 01:18:13,160
Speaker 1: Sunday and you're like when you play Friday night and

1407
01:18:13,240 --> 01:18:15,000
Speaker 1: you know you got to present a scout to your

1408
01:18:15,000 --> 01:18:19,000
Speaker 1: guys on Tuesday, you go through every single game O,

1409
01:18:19,080 --> 01:18:21,960
Speaker 1: how State played, and you're clipping it, You're staying up,

1410
01:18:22,080 --> 01:18:24,120
Speaker 1: so you're not even aware of anything else. And then

1411
01:18:24,160 --> 01:18:26,639
Speaker 1: you're just here's the game playing guys, here's the game plan.

1412
01:18:26,800 --> 01:18:29,240
Speaker 1: So when that one's over, then you stand up all

1413
01:18:29,320 --> 01:18:32,559
Speaker 1: night getting ready for Florida and you're just going, going, going, going,

1414
01:18:32,880 --> 01:18:36,320
Speaker 1: And so you're not even aware. So now yesterday we

1415
01:18:36,320 --> 01:18:39,920
Speaker 1: were off, um and now so now you've got a

1416
01:18:39,960 --> 01:18:42,080
Speaker 1: little bit of time to kind of have an idea.

1417
01:18:42,240 --> 01:18:47,840
Speaker 1: So so how do you manage conditioning? Um, well, we

1418
01:18:47,960 --> 01:18:50,760
Speaker 1: played back to back game, so our guys are great. Um,

1419
01:18:51,360 --> 01:18:54,920
Speaker 1: they just played Obviously, Saturday night Kevin and Max played

1420
01:18:54,960 --> 01:18:58,639
Speaker 1: eighty five minutes, so they never came out, played forty

1421
01:18:58,640 --> 01:19:01,400
Speaker 1: five minutes ut Ohio State four minutes against both of

1422
01:19:01,439 --> 01:19:04,599
Speaker 1: them against Florida. So yesterday we're off. We will do

1423
01:19:05,160 --> 01:19:08,280
Speaker 1: here in about an hour. Uh, we'll do a really

1424
01:19:08,360 --> 01:19:11,960
Speaker 1: light workout. They'll lift, Um, we'll do about forty five minutes. Uh,

1425
01:19:12,000 --> 01:19:15,360
Speaker 1: they'll get up and down a little, but like five on. Oh,

1426
01:19:15,360 --> 01:19:18,639
Speaker 1: and then you got to guard the scout team and transition. Um,

1427
01:19:19,040 --> 01:19:21,840
Speaker 1: like we'll probably do about twelve minutes of that and

1428
01:19:21,880 --> 01:19:24,960
Speaker 1: then about thirty five forty minutes of shooting and then

1429
01:19:25,160 --> 01:19:28,000
Speaker 1: so today won't be much. So in essence, they get

1430
01:19:28,000 --> 01:19:32,760
Speaker 1: two days and then um get Wednesday and Thursday. Uh,

1431
01:19:32,760 --> 01:19:35,400
Speaker 1: those will be hard, Friday will be light, and then

1432
01:19:35,439 --> 01:19:39,880
Speaker 1: you play Saturday night. Pretty pretty great. Well listen, um,

1433
01:19:40,600 --> 01:19:43,280
Speaker 1: pretty humble beginnings. Obviously you're still a pretty humble guy.

1434
01:19:43,320 --> 01:19:45,720
Speaker 1: Did you get the clothes wash that you needed? Maybe

1435
01:19:46,000 --> 01:19:48,960
Speaker 1: later when when you and I started this, they hadn't

1436
01:19:49,000 --> 01:19:52,479
Speaker 1: been here, and so and that no socks, no wonder

1437
01:19:52,520 --> 01:19:55,120
Speaker 1: Shirt's not gonna tell you what else I don't have. Um,

1438
01:19:55,200 --> 01:19:58,040
Speaker 1: so this is the same thing I wore yesterday. Good

1439
01:19:58,080 --> 01:20:00,120
Speaker 1: thing that we were off yesterday and I didn't have

1440
01:20:00,200 --> 01:20:03,360
Speaker 1: to leave the hotel room. Uh, that's that was a plus,

1441
01:20:04,280 --> 01:20:07,759
Speaker 1: that's like. And so the clothes have shown up, so

1442
01:20:07,760 --> 01:20:09,680
Speaker 1: so I'm I'm looking forward to put it in on

1443
01:20:09,760 --> 01:20:14,320
Speaker 1: fresh clothes. They arrived about thirty minutes into this. Well. Uh,

1444
01:20:14,479 --> 01:20:16,920
Speaker 1: it's been an amazing story. I can't wait to see

1445
01:20:17,040 --> 01:20:20,400
Speaker 1: what you got in store force for Saturday. And it's you.

1446
01:20:20,400 --> 01:20:22,240
Speaker 1: You've dedicated a lot of your time to join me.

1447
01:20:22,320 --> 01:20:25,360
Speaker 1: And I really appreciate Doug. You're the best man best

1448
01:20:25,479 --> 01:20:27,920
Speaker 1: honestly goodness, if there was a Logal Hall of Fame,

1449
01:20:27,960 --> 01:20:35,320
Speaker 1: you'd be in it. We're ending on that all. I

1450
01:20:35,360 --> 01:20:37,639
Speaker 1: thought you, I thought you didn't appreciate that one, enjoyed

1451
01:20:37,680 --> 01:20:38,800
Speaker 1: that one. It was a long when it was a

1452
01:20:38,800 --> 01:20:42,320
Speaker 1: good one. And I love that recruiting pitch. I'd rather

1453
01:20:42,360 --> 01:20:44,719
Speaker 1: have two more guys and two more plays. It's pretty

1454
01:20:44,720 --> 01:20:49,280
Speaker 1: good solid. I know they're both right. Rather both rather

1455
01:20:49,280 --> 01:20:53,040
Speaker 1: have a couple of Go twos automatics gadgets that both.

1456
01:20:53,120 --> 01:20:55,720
Speaker 1: But it's pretty interesting what's happened with Scott Drew now

1457
01:20:55,800 --> 01:20:58,840
Speaker 1: producing Grant mccaslan. They won a game and Paul Mills

1458
01:20:58,840 --> 01:21:02,559
Speaker 1: was won two games, and they're starting to that that

1459
01:21:02,680 --> 01:21:06,960
Speaker 1: little crew, which is very tight and but very enjoyable

1460
01:21:07,000 --> 01:21:11,240
Speaker 1: to be around, is doing an incredible job in Texas,

1461
01:21:11,320 --> 01:21:14,160
Speaker 1: in Oklahoma. And I'll be interested to see if if

1462
01:21:14,240 --> 01:21:17,240
Speaker 1: Jerome Tang ends up taking a job. You know, Paul

1463
01:21:17,360 --> 01:21:19,760
Speaker 1: just said he priced himself out of all Roberts. That's fine,

1464
01:21:19,800 --> 01:21:23,160
Speaker 1: Paul got himself a job. It's pretty cool stuff. Meanwhile,

1465
01:21:23,160 --> 01:21:24,880
Speaker 1: you can listen to The Doug Otlip Show daily three

1466
01:21:24,920 --> 01:21:27,240
Speaker 1: or six Eastern twelve three Pacific on Fox Sports traded

1467
01:21:27,320 --> 01:21:29,120
Speaker 1: the I Heart Radio app. You can also download it

1468
01:21:29,160 --> 01:21:30,960
Speaker 1: as a podcast. Let's do it wherever you want. If

1469
01:21:30,960 --> 01:21:33,320
Speaker 1: you like this podcast, we'll make sure you subscribe. You

1470
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Speaker 1: download your rate, write a review, write a review, Come on,

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01:21:36,439 --> 01:21:39,120
Speaker 1: you canet how long's it take? And tweeted out send

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Speaker 1: it to a friend, Say, man, you might want to

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Speaker 1: listen to some really really good stuff. Thanks for so

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Speaker 1: much the positive feedback. Love it, Thank my thanks to

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Speaker 1: Paul Mills. I'm Doug Gottliebin. This is all ball Upper