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Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is

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Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or

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Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A

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Speaker 1: production of I Heart Radio. Hello, welcome back to the show.

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Speaker 1: My name is Matt, my name is Noel. They call

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Speaker 1: me Ben. We're joined as always with our super producer Paul,

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Speaker 1: Mission control decand most importantly, you are you. You are

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Speaker 1: here and that makes this stuff they don't want you

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Speaker 1: to know. Hold your loved ones close for this one, folks.

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Speaker 1: This is a very dark, uh and disturbing episode that

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Speaker 1: we're diving into today. Because today's show contains, at times

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Speaker 1: graphic descriptions of violence, it may not be suitable for

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Speaker 1: all audience members, so listen or discretion is advised. Like

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Speaker 1: many of our most compelling show suggestions, this one comes

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Speaker 1: to us from a listener John in Long Beach. John says,

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Speaker 1: what's up, guys, big fan of your podcast. Been listening

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Speaker 1: for a year now, only realized that the album logo

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Speaker 1: has six fingers like a week ago. Hey, finally and

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Speaker 1: you would pay off. I know we were waiting for

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Speaker 1: John to get it. Uh, good on you, John, He continues, Anyway,

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Speaker 1: I was wondering if you guys will do a podcast

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Speaker 1: on the disappearance of Madeleine McCann. I only just heard

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Speaker 1: about it when a friend told me he just saw

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Speaker 1: a documentary on it. Thanks guys, have a great week.

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Speaker 1: Thanks for writing John. Yeah, this is referring to a case.

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Speaker 1: In two thousand seven, a British born three year old

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Speaker 1: named Madeleine McCann disappeared while on vacation, whereas they would

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Speaker 1: say in the UK, on holiday with her family in Portugal.

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Speaker 1: The case made national headlines. Authorities in three different countries

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Speaker 1: conducted multiple investigations and for more than a decade they

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Speaker 1: found no solid leads. So what happened? Here are the facts.

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Speaker 1: Madeline McCann was born on May twelve, two thousand three,

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Speaker 1: in Leicester, England. Her parents were Jerry and Kate McCann.

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Speaker 1: They were married in Both of them worked in the

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Speaker 1: medical profession. Kate became a general practitioner after studying at

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Speaker 1: the University of Dundee and was working part time while

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Speaker 1: also taking care of uh she and her husband's children.

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Speaker 1: Jerry was working as a consultant cardiologists. In addition to

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Speaker 1: Madaline um who was their oldest The couple also has

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Speaker 1: twins um born in two thousand five and in two

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Speaker 1: thousand seven. The family, you know, they're working hard, they're

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Speaker 1: supporting their kids. They decided to go on holiday, as

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Speaker 1: you do. They went to a place called the San

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Speaker 1: Club Resort in Praya de Luze in Portugal, and there

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Speaker 1: they rented an apartment at the Ocean Club Resort. And

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Speaker 1: I'm guessing this is like, you know, a kind of

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Speaker 1: a sweet kind of situation. I mean, um fancier hotel. Right, Well,

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Speaker 1: I pulled, I pulled some you know, I'm going to

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Speaker 1: give a reluctant shout out to the Sun. I know

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Speaker 1: I've given it a hard time, rightly so in past episodes.

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Speaker 1: But they have a graphic layout of the apartment that

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Speaker 1: the mccns were residing in during this vacation, and it's

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Speaker 1: very helpful as you listen along today to have that

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Speaker 1: up so you can see the positions of where the rooms,

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Speaker 1: the windows, and the entrances and exits of this place where.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, think of like an almost like an extended

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Speaker 1: stay apartment. Yeah, and if you you can go to

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Speaker 1: the BBC and find an overview picture of this whole area.

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Speaker 1: So if you have those two picks years up where

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Speaker 1: you can see where all the places we're going to

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Speaker 1: talk about are, and then actually into the thing. I

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Speaker 1: think you're in a good spot. So let's go to

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Speaker 1: the night of the disappearance. On the third of May

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Speaker 1: two thousand seven, the McCanns the parents met a group

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Speaker 1: of seven friends at a tapas restaurant in the resort complex.

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Speaker 1: This was not very far from their apartment at all.

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Speaker 1: It was about a hundred and eighty feet or fifty

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Speaker 1: five meters. So the reason that's important is it means

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Speaker 1: you could easily walk back to that apartment and back

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Speaker 1: to the restaurant without you know, it would take hardly

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Speaker 1: any time at all. It's basically just walking across where

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Speaker 1: the pool area is and then you're at the tapas bar.

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Speaker 1: It's literally that close. So Madeleine and her younger brother

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Speaker 1: and sister where those are the fraternal twins, They were

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Speaker 1: staying in the apartment. They were sleeping, and they were

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Speaker 1: supposed to be sleeping. Keep in mind, these are very

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Speaker 1: young kids. They're probab pbly pooped from a day of vacation.

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Speaker 1: In fact, the parents had noted earlier that the children

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Speaker 1: seemed very tired, So around eight thirty pm, those kids

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Speaker 1: are sent to bed. The mccns and their friends are responsible,

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Speaker 1: good parents. They created a rotational system that they used

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Speaker 1: to check in on the kids. So every twenty or

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Speaker 1: thirty minutes, it's someone's turned to go. Just look in

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Speaker 1: on the kids, not wake um up or anything like that,

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Speaker 1: just make sure they're okay. Kate McCann's turn comes up

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Speaker 1: around ten pm. She walks over to the apartment, supporting

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Speaker 1: to note they had locked the front door of the apartment,

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Speaker 1: but it had a back patio door like sliding patio door,

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Speaker 1: and that they had left unlocked so they could easily

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Speaker 1: slide the door open or closed without waking up the kids.

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Speaker 1: So Kate McCann looks in on the room where Madeleine

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Speaker 1: and the two twins are supposed to be sleeping. She

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Speaker 1: notices that the window to this room is open, the

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Speaker 1: shutters have been pulled up. Madeline McCann has disappeared. The

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Speaker 1: authorities are immediately alerted and the resort staff, the local police,

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Speaker 1: other guests of the resort search all night for Madeline

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Speaker 1: until daybreak and they find nothing. Yeah, I can't even

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Speaker 1: imagine that sinking feeling of you know, and just the

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Speaker 1: how do we even accept that? And just the way

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Speaker 1: your mind must spin. You know, when we were looking

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Speaker 1: into this story, I just kept putting myself in that position,

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Speaker 1: you know, being a dad and mad I'm sure you

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Speaker 1: could understand that feeling as well, only not really just

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Speaker 1: even the hint of it is almost more than you

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Speaker 1: can even kind of comprehend. But yeah, they alerted the

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Speaker 1: authorities right away, UM police, the resort staff and other

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Speaker 1: guests essentially formed a search party UM looking for Madeline

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Speaker 1: until dawn, but they they found nothing. Uh, In less

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Speaker 1: than twenty four hours. The McCann only held a press

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Speaker 1: conference UM and I believe there's a sixty minutes Australia

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Speaker 1: piece on this that has some of the footage from

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Speaker 1: at least one of the multiple public appeals for help

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Speaker 1: that the McCann family eventually did. Over the course of

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Speaker 1: the following few days, hundreds of volunteers joined the search party.

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Speaker 1: Authorities at the border were put on high alert, staff

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Speaker 1: at the nearby airport was told to watch for the child,

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Speaker 1: and then on May twelve, the authorities in Portugal UM

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Speaker 1: publicly stated they believe that Madeline had been abducted, but uh,

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Speaker 1: silver Lining was alive and somewhere still in the country. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: or at least they believed right, because there was no

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Speaker 1: way to verify it. Then, twenty three days after the

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Speaker 1: initial abduction or the disappearance, on the authorities, they're released

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Speaker 1: a description of a man was at that point unidentified,

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Speaker 1: and he had a couple of descriptors. He was blonde

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Speaker 1: in hair, he appeared to have acne, and he was

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Speaker 1: seen that night on May three, two thousand seven, around

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Speaker 1: the area, and it was believed that he was possibly

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Speaker 1: carrying a child or at least caring something that could

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Speaker 1: be confused for a child. And this description was based

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Speaker 1: on a friend of the Meccans who gave it to

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Speaker 1: the authorities. This person's name was Jane Tanner. She was

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Speaker 1: one of the people who was attending that Tapas restaurant

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Speaker 1: with them on the night that Madeline disappeared. And let's

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Speaker 1: let's exist in the present tense here. As the search continues,

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Speaker 1: speculation abounds taking multiple forms. There are ongoing official investigations.

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Speaker 1: But remember this disappearance occurs in the age of the Internet.

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Speaker 1: That means there are increasingly amateur sleuths getting involved. Theories,

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Speaker 1: some more plausible than others, spread across the media and

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Speaker 1: across the web. So our question today again, what happened

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Speaker 1: to Madeleine McCann. Here's where it gets crazy. First, things

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Speaker 1: are going wrong with the investigation. From the jump, there

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Speaker 1: are fundamental problems with the crime scene. In June, the

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Speaker 1: Portuguese police note that the scene was not properly protected,

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Speaker 1: so they may have lost vital forensic clues. There. You'll

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Speaker 1: also see contemporaneous reports of blood being discovered in small amounts,

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Speaker 1: or of sniffer dogs reacting to Kate McCann in particular,

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Speaker 1: and this is something that the red meat chasing tabloids

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Speaker 1: latch onto immediately. And July British police have canine squad

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Speaker 1: inspect the vacation apartment there at the resort, as well

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Speaker 1: as the rental car the mccahan's used. Then they get buppets,

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Speaker 1: no leads. Fast forward to August. It's now been a

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Speaker 1: hundred days since the disappearance, and for the first time

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Speaker 1: the officials heading these investigations acknowledged that Madeleine McCann may

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Speaker 1: not be found alive, and over the years since this disappearance,

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Speaker 1: in two thousand seven, numerous individuals and groups have proposed

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Speaker 1: multiple possible explanations. We've categorized the most prevalent, the most prominent,

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Speaker 1: but we do have to say again they run the

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Speaker 1: gamut of plausibility and some of these theories are I'm

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Speaker 1: careful not to inject my opinion often, but some of

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Speaker 1: these theories are to my mind offensive because we have

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Speaker 1: to remember these are real people and this is a

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Speaker 1: real three year old child. UM, So I guess we

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Speaker 1: should start at the beginning. UM the first one that

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Speaker 1: has definitely he made the rounds and his reference pretty

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Speaker 1: extensively in this twenty nineteen Netflix documentary, which you know,

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Speaker 1: in my mind is a little on the exploitative side. UM.

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Speaker 1: There was a lot of discussion of sex trafficking. Initially,

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Speaker 1: it was believed by some UM authorities, in particular in Portugal,

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Speaker 1: that Madeline McCann had been abducted to be sold into

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Speaker 1: a sex trafficking ring. A private investigator named Julian Peribanez

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Speaker 1: noted that, UM, these kinds of abductions for this exact

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Speaker 1: purpose have happened in the past. UM. Also, he noted

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Speaker 1: the profit motive. UH. He was quoted and saying the

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Speaker 1: value that Madeline had was really high. If they took her,

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Speaker 1: it's because they were going to get a lot of money. Wow. Okay,

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Speaker 1: that's a very straightforward way of saying something quite horrible. Uh.

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Speaker 1: Unfortunately this theory is plausible. Um. It certainly is a

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Speaker 1: thing abduction for sex trafficking purposes to basically sell people

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Speaker 1: into human beings, children into sexual bondage. Uh. Slavery um

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Speaker 1: is a very very real thing. Um. There have also

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Speaker 1: been some other theories along these lines. According to the Telegraph, UH,

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Speaker 1: an unusually high number of assaults on young girls had

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Speaker 1: taken place in the area specifically. The report found quote

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Speaker 1: police identified nine sexual assaults and three near misses on

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Speaker 1: British girls aged between six to twelve in the three

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Speaker 1: years before Madeline went missing. In one case from two

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Speaker 1: thousand five, a ten year old girl was assaulted in

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Speaker 1: an apartment there close to the spot where Madeline vanished.

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Speaker 1: And you know, that's a that's a troubling thing to know,

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Speaker 1: and it's probably one of those things that wouldn't be

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Speaker 1: broadcast out to people who were thinking about going on

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Speaker 1: holiday there, specifically in that resort and or in that area,

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Speaker 1: And it's pretty disturbing. Just to know that that kind

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Speaker 1: of thing was happening. But that's not the only theory.

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Speaker 1: Another concept was brought forward that perhaps this was just

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Speaker 1: some form of burglary that had gone wrong, because remember

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Speaker 1: this is a place for vacationing people who are there

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Speaker 1: probably carrying cash. A lot of people carry paper money

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Speaker 1: of one sort or another, even if you're in a

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Speaker 1: different country. You're going to take some cash and get

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Speaker 1: it transferred over to the correct currency when you're there.

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Speaker 1: It's just easier to to go that way rather than

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Speaker 1: trying to use a credit card or something like that.

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Speaker 1: So what if somebody was just attempting to break into

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Speaker 1: the apartment two uh, you know, take that money or

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Speaker 1: take some valuables in there, but then came across Madeline.

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Speaker 1: And if this were true, one would assume that at

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Speaker 1: least some valuables you know, there within the apartment would

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Speaker 1: have been taken. However, there didn't seem to be anything

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Speaker 1: miss seeing from the apartment besides Magdaline mm hmm. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so that's an argument against the burglar. I want to

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Speaker 1: go back to the idea that you mentioned about the

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Speaker 1: about how to how the public is or is not

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Speaker 1: informed about these higher rates of disappearances and attacks. That's

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Speaker 1: going to be important later in the story. But to

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Speaker 1: the point of burglary had gone wrong, Yeah, it seems

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Speaker 1: odd that they if they were doing a snatch and

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Speaker 1: grab for valuables, it seems odd that they left some

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Speaker 1: stuff in the apartment. Well. And also, why would you

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Speaker 1: just why would you just walk out with of young

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Speaker 1: girl if you were there to steal valuables, right, unless

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Speaker 1: it was linked back to what Noel was talking about,

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Speaker 1: you would then sell that girl. Yeah, it makes no sense.

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Speaker 1: And so the other kids were just fast asleep and untouched, right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so that's that's why. Again, that's why I'm saying that

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Speaker 1: one does not seem to add up. Uh. This leads

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Speaker 1: us to something else, the wander away theory, which was

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Speaker 1: popular for a while, or you know, pretty it was

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Speaker 1: propagated for a while. It's the idea that the child

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Speaker 1: could have wandered out on her own while she was unsupervised,

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Speaker 1: maybe to explore the vacation area, maybe to check out

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Speaker 1: the nearby water, and then after leaving the apartment, she

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Speaker 1: could have drowned perhaps, or she could have been tragically

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Speaker 1: struck by a vehicle when the nearby roads in a

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Speaker 1: hit and run. This sort of stuff has occurred in

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Speaker 1: the past, but it raises multiple important questions. The patio

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Speaker 1: door was closed. Remember that's how Kate McCann found, you know,

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Speaker 1: found that her child was missing. So how would a

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Speaker 1: three year old manage to close those pretty heavy sliding

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Speaker 1: patio doors behind her that are also pretty tall for

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Speaker 1: her to reach? And then wouldn't a body or evidence

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Speaker 1: of an accident have been found if the uh, especially

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Speaker 1: if there were a hit and run. This this is

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Speaker 1: why people went through those three theories pretty quickly, And

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Speaker 1: we're getting to We're getting to the part I wanted

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Speaker 1: to warn everybody about earlier, which is the possibly offensive theories.

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Speaker 1: One of the most emotionally harrowing aspects of a case

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Speaker 1: like this is something that a lot of true crime,

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Speaker 1: you know, docuseries never bother investigating. It's that the parents

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Speaker 1: have to also be investigated by the police. Imagine how difficult.

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Speaker 1: Difficult doesn't even cover it. Imagine how horrific, uh it is,

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Speaker 1: how indescribably painful to be searching desperately for your child

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Speaker 1: while at the same time being interrogated about their disappearance

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Speaker 1: as a suspect and There were numerous theories here about this.

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Speaker 1: It started like a most immediately after police got involved

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Speaker 1: in Portugal. I mean, it's it's it's just it's procedure,

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Speaker 1: it's standard operating procedure to eliminate all suspects, and that

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Speaker 1: starts with the people that were the closest. But it's

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Speaker 1: just I can't even imagine you're going through all of

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Speaker 1: this stuff in your head and asking all these questions

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Speaker 1: and then you're even the intimation of being, you know,

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Speaker 1: a suspect would just be so shattering. Um. But that's

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Speaker 1: what happened. In September two seven, the Portuguese police interviewed

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Speaker 1: Kate McCann as a witness in the case. The next

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Speaker 1: day they labeled the couple suspects. Um. I think the

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Speaker 1: Portuguese word for that is arguido spend. Is that how

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Speaker 1: you pronounce them? Well, I don't speak Portuguese, but you're correct, Noel,

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Speaker 1: that's just the that's just the specific term in that

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Speaker 1: language that they use for suspects. Uh. But to your point,

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Speaker 1: they didn't, you know, they didn't lock the mccan's up,

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Speaker 1: nor did they detain them. Eventually they allowed the couple

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Speaker 1: and their twins to return to the UK just a

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Speaker 1: few days later. A few days after that, prosecutors said

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Speaker 1: there was no new evidence to justify requestioning the mccans,

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Speaker 1: which I think is a good move because imagine how

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Speaker 1: traumatic that would be to fly back to have to

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Speaker 1: talk about that again, you know, in this setting. I mean,

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Speaker 1: it's certainly not a good pr look, I can say

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Speaker 1: that to be sure. Yeah, I would just jump back

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Speaker 1: to the arguido thing really quickly. That that is, under

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Speaker 1: Portuguese law, a very specific thing that gets labeled on

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Speaker 1: people almost always right before they are taken in as

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Speaker 1: like the primary suspect, basically to prepare it to be

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Speaker 1: charged for something. Would that be the equivalent of like

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Speaker 1: person of interest? It's not necessarily they're not being accused yet,

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Speaker 1: but there, you know, I mean, I guess person of

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Speaker 1: interest in suspect of the same thing. For some reason.

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Speaker 1: You hear them used, not always interchangeably. According to an

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Speaker 1: expert from the already in UM a lot of expert there,

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Speaker 1: the quote is, if you are in a arguido, they

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Speaker 1: have to have suspicion that a crime has been committed

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Speaker 1: by that person. So the authorities treating believe that you

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Speaker 1: had something to do with it. Yeah, because there is

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Speaker 1: a difference a person of interest to someone that they

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Speaker 1: just want to talk to a suspect, to someone they

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Speaker 1: believe might actually have been involved in the crime. That's

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Speaker 1: how I would understand it. So you can see why

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Speaker 1: this group of theories may sound offensive, but it is

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Speaker 1: important to mention them here as we flesh out the

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Speaker 1: full scope of thought on the events. So back to

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Speaker 1: the trafficking ring. People began to say, what if the

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Speaker 1: parents somehow sold their own child to a trafficking ring

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Speaker 1: and then just faked the disappearance. There are two big

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Speaker 1: problems with that. First off, this would require an extraordinary,

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Speaker 1: almost impossible level of dedication and acting on the part

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Speaker 1: of the parents for years and years and years. Also,

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Speaker 1: more immediately wore brass tacks. Subsequent investigations to to prove

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Speaker 1: something like this would have a very high likelihood of

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Speaker 1: discovering any anomalous financial transactions. And it's also one of

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Speaker 1: the most monstrous things you can imagine someone doing. And um, yeah,

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Speaker 1: just that alone feels it just feels so wrong. And

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Speaker 1: to make an accusation like that, you would need some

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Speaker 1: pretty damning proof. Yeah, it's it's that's a rough idea.

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Speaker 1: But but that's not all right, right, Yeah, there's the

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Speaker 1: idea that they were responsible for their daughter's death, not

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Speaker 1: through design, but through accident and subsequent panic. Yes, there

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Speaker 1: are two authors, Anthony Summers and Robin Swan, who I've

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Speaker 1: argued that the authorities believed or suspected the McCanns possibly

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Speaker 1: gave some kind of drug to Madeline in an attempt

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Speaker 1: to get her to go to sleep, essentially so they

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Speaker 1: could go across the street and hang out with their friends. Um,

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Speaker 1: this would certainly not be the only time that's ever

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Speaker 1: happened in the history of the world. It's been a

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Speaker 1: pretty common practice to give children a tiny amount of

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Speaker 1: alcohol or you know, maybe a tiny amount of cough

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Speaker 1: syrup or something that has sleepy effects, essentially to help

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Speaker 1: their children go to sleep if they're having trouble sleeping. Um,

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Speaker 1: that is by no means an out there, I don't know,

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Speaker 1: even an accusation of something entirely wrong really, But the

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Speaker 1: idea here is that the McCanns gave Madeline way too much,

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Speaker 1: essentially despite their medical expertise. Yeah, right, doesn't seem to

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Speaker 1: add up. There's a Portuguese police officer who supported this theory.

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Speaker 1: He went so are as to release a book and

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Speaker 1: a TV doc on the subject um that so the

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Speaker 1: concept there. I have not actually watched that doc or

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Speaker 1: read his specific book. What is it? Goncrlo Marl sounds

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Speaker 1: like a real stand up guy. He is a disgraced

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Speaker 1: police officer, by the way, so this is one of

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Speaker 1: his his large lines of business. This actually, this went

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Speaker 1: to court in two thousand nine. The mccahans started taking

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Speaker 1: legal action against his you know, his work, because it's

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Speaker 1: incredibly insulting. It's defamatory, right if it can't be proven,

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Speaker 1: and Portuguese court agreed, and then later he appealed the

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Speaker 1: decision because the court had awarded them four hundred fifty

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Speaker 1: thousand the equivalent of four and fifty thousand British pounds

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Speaker 1: in damages. But I think that's still ongoing. This is

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Speaker 1: interesting because at first I thought, you know, all are

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Speaker 1: these people vultures who are trying to make a quick

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Speaker 1: buck off of an unspeakable disaster, And then you do see,

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Speaker 1: you do see things that at least proponents of these

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Speaker 1: kind of theories consider to be strong circumstantial proof. Unfortunately,

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Speaker 1: it's something that pops up in a lot of cases

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Speaker 1: with parents and disappeared children. They would say, oh, this

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Speaker 1: mom or this dad in this situation. They focused on

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Speaker 1: Kate McCann and said, you know, she doesn't seem as fraught,

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Speaker 1: as upset, as emotionally damaged as she should be. These

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Speaker 1: people say, you know in my mind. Uh. And that's

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Speaker 1: where this kind of armchair sleuthing can get dangerous. But

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Speaker 1: there was one interesting quantitative thing that I found that

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Speaker 1: is a fact. Uh. In the initial interviews, she was

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Speaker 1: asked forty nine questions over a long course of time, uh,

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Speaker 1: and she answered only one. Got also a full list

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Speaker 1: of the forty eight questions. You can find that online

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Speaker 1: at the tab dot com. Just look for McCann forty

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Speaker 1: eight questions the tab. And they don't seem like UM.

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Speaker 1: A lot of them seem like maybe relatively innocuous questions.

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Speaker 1: I would want you guys take on these. They didn't

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Speaker 1: seem particularly loaded. They were asking about process, order of operations,

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Speaker 1: and maybe it's just difficult to answer those questions. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean it's stuff like did you search inside the

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Speaker 1: master bedroom wardrobe? UM? Questions about things being out of place,

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Speaker 1: like why was the curtain by the sofa near the

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Speaker 1: side window tampered with? Does someone go behind the sofa?

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Speaker 1: So Ben when you say she didn't answer them like

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Speaker 1: she like said, I I reserve my right to not

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Speaker 1: answer this question, like she exercised her right to not.

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Speaker 1: I mean like what order she she said, I don't recall,

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Speaker 1: or something like I don't under And well, you've got

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Speaker 1: to remember she is at this point, no matter what happened,

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Speaker 1: she is under a tremendous amount of stress, and she

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Speaker 1: is being looked at as a suspect, essentially by these

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Speaker 1: authorities that are asking her these questions. It's a pickle

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Speaker 1: of a situation to be in because like every attorney

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Speaker 1: you would tell you, I'm not giving you legal advice

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Speaker 1: here as Matt Frederick, but most attorneys would tell you,

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Speaker 1: reserve your right to not say anything everything. You're being

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Speaker 1: asked questions by police. That makes sense. The counterpoint to

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Speaker 1: that is your daughter's missing, and these authorities are trying

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Speaker 1: to help you find your daughter. Well, she said at

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Speaker 1: some point that she didn't answer the questions because she

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Speaker 1: thought that them questioning her was distracting them from actually

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Speaker 1: looking for the real culprit, which is a little bit

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Speaker 1: of an odd way of looking at it. You know,

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Speaker 1: you think she would be as cooperative as possible so

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Speaker 1: they could move on. But again, I'm sure there's some

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Speaker 1: resentment there of like, you know, why are you even

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Speaker 1: bothering with me but against all procedural well, and how

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Speaker 1: could my daughter get abducted, you know, under your watch essentially,

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Speaker 1: And why do you guys care about the sofa in

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Speaker 1: my vacation apartment when there's a missing kid out there?

401
00:26:15,880 --> 00:26:19,080
Speaker 1: Also again, how tremendously unfair and stressful it is to

402
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Speaker 1: be tried in the court of public opinion, which trends misogynistic. Right,

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Speaker 1: let's just be honest about that. You can't look at

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Speaker 1: someone and say that the way they appear to be

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Speaker 1: experiencing grief is not satisfactory to you, some stranger who's

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Speaker 1: never met the person. And also it came out later that, uh,

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Speaker 1: they have been advised by various parties not to uh,

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Speaker 1: not to show a ton of emotion, like try not

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Speaker 1: to weep in public interviews and so on, because again

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Speaker 1: the tabloids will grab it. There are there are more

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Speaker 1: out their theories, and these theories I tried pretty I

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Speaker 1: feel like I can't say assiduously anymore. I tried really

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Speaker 1: hard to uh to find any kind of possible proof

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Speaker 1: or logic for some of these very out there ones,

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Speaker 1: and I I only found a little bit for one,

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Speaker 1: But they're there are three really out there ones, and

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Speaker 1: we'll get to those theories afterward. From our sponsor and

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Speaker 1: we're back. The first is get this. I don't know

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Speaker 1: if you guys heard about this one, the Secret Discovery.

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Speaker 1: The idea here is that Madeline McCann was found, was

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Speaker 1: found safe and alive, but the discovery was kept secret

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Speaker 1: because the argument goes, by the time she had been found,

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Speaker 1: there have been so much media scrutiny and her picture

424
00:27:56,000 --> 00:28:00,000
Speaker 1: was plastered, plastered everywhere in public that she would never

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Speaker 1: her be able to live a normal life under her

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Speaker 1: previous identity. Therefore, Madeline McCann is not found, but another

427
00:28:06,119 --> 00:28:10,000
Speaker 1: girl is. That just doesn't seem very likely. Yeah, I

428
00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:12,600
Speaker 1: mean off, Mike Ben, you were talking about how these

429
00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:16,879
Speaker 1: are just so out there and also borderline offensive, that

430
00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:18,920
Speaker 1: we're not going to spend two too too much time

431
00:28:18,960 --> 00:28:21,880
Speaker 1: on them, But here they are. They definitely are things

432
00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:24,880
Speaker 1: that have been discussed, um be it on the internet,

433
00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:28,760
Speaker 1: and some of the reporting and potentially even in certain

434
00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:32,760
Speaker 1: circles of law enforcement. Uh. The notion that there never

435
00:28:33,040 --> 00:28:40,000
Speaker 1: was a Madaline mccam. UH, that Madeline McCann was some

436
00:28:40,080 --> 00:28:44,880
Speaker 1: sort of abstraction made up by the British government to

437
00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:48,760
Speaker 1: distract from other news stories. Um to be some kind

438
00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:53,760
Speaker 1: of red herring. Uh during I don't know, potentially a

439
00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:58,680
Speaker 1: a bad news cycle um or designed to help raise

440
00:28:58,840 --> 00:29:04,920
Speaker 1: funds that ultimately would be diverted to the government. Um. Okay,

441
00:29:05,040 --> 00:29:08,440
Speaker 1: I retract my previous assessment that this could have been

442
00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:11,440
Speaker 1: discussed within law enforcement circles. I think this is largely

443
00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:15,760
Speaker 1: a fringe E. You know, when there's a vacuum of information,

444
00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:20,040
Speaker 1: weird stuff tends to fill it. Um. So this is

445
00:29:20,040 --> 00:29:22,720
Speaker 1: not something that's being taken seriously by the vast majority

446
00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:25,960
Speaker 1: of people even a little bit familiar with this case.

447
00:29:26,360 --> 00:29:29,320
Speaker 1: And we'll just go ahead and caveat it and saying

448
00:29:29,400 --> 00:29:34,480
Speaker 1: that the existence of Malan mccam is absurdly well documented.

449
00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:39,320
Speaker 1: There are numerous pictures of the child with with her family,

450
00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:42,560
Speaker 1: with her siblings, numerous accounts of people who knew her

451
00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:45,000
Speaker 1: and met her spent time with her. For this theory

452
00:29:45,040 --> 00:29:48,120
Speaker 1: to be true. The McCanns themselves had to have been

453
00:29:48,760 --> 00:29:52,800
Speaker 1: so complicit in the deepest uh and and most well

454
00:29:52,880 --> 00:29:58,040
Speaker 1: executed cover ups that we've ever been privy to. UH

455
00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:01,040
Speaker 1: and that would have taken probably decade that have been planned,

456
00:30:01,160 --> 00:30:03,959
Speaker 1: you know, the all of the pieces would have had

457
00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:06,880
Speaker 1: to be laid out meticulously, and this is does not

458
00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:10,760
Speaker 1: make any sense whatsoever. So I mean my question is

459
00:30:10,800 --> 00:30:13,800
Speaker 1: where is this being circulated like uh I did just

460
00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:18,040
Speaker 1: it's this is wild, yeah, yeah, this is this is

461
00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:21,400
Speaker 1: part of the online echo chambers. So we're talking about

462
00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:28,160
Speaker 1: armchair investigators maybe on Twitter, true crime forums or paid

463
00:30:28,360 --> 00:30:33,400
Speaker 1: subreddits things like that. Uh. It's It's strange though, because

464
00:30:33,520 --> 00:30:37,160
Speaker 1: one of the out there theories that I think you're right.

465
00:30:37,200 --> 00:30:40,720
Speaker 1: We can dismiss the idea that there was somehow never Madeline,

466
00:30:41,240 --> 00:30:45,080
Speaker 1: but I think there's a little more sands to the

467
00:30:45,080 --> 00:30:49,640
Speaker 1: theory that there was corruption in Portugal at the time,

468
00:30:49,720 --> 00:30:54,280
Speaker 1: that Portuguese authorities had some sort of ulterior motive in

469
00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:59,720
Speaker 1: treating the parents as suspects or pushing that narrative. UH.

470
00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:05,000
Speaker 1: People were arguing that there treatment of the Meccans went

471
00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:08,480
Speaker 1: beyond standard operating procedure and that they were in fact

472
00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:11,400
Speaker 1: trying to frame them to your point, Matt, in an

473
00:31:11,400 --> 00:31:16,520
Speaker 1: effort to save that tourism industry. Uh. This, I don't know.

474
00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:18,640
Speaker 1: This is an interesting went out of the three. This

475
00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:21,680
Speaker 1: has more proof. Yes, Ben, this is a theory that

476
00:31:23,720 --> 00:31:27,280
Speaker 1: can have sand to it at sometimes just because of

477
00:31:27,400 --> 00:31:33,560
Speaker 1: the basic facts that exist about certain locations and the

478
00:31:33,600 --> 00:31:36,800
Speaker 1: economy there that's based on tourism. It comes. This one

479
00:31:36,840 --> 00:31:39,720
Speaker 1: in particular, comes from a man named Brian Kennedy, who

480
00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:45,040
Speaker 1: was a businessman from Edinburgh. He says, you can understand

481
00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:47,320
Speaker 1: how the mood of public opinion would go from sympathy

482
00:31:47,360 --> 00:31:52,640
Speaker 1: to vilification. Uh. And essentially that the Portugal authorities decided,

483
00:31:53,120 --> 00:31:55,840
Speaker 1: let's find somebody to blame for this that doesn't make

484
00:31:55,960 --> 00:31:58,960
Speaker 1: us look bad. He says. I think it's all tied

485
00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:01,840
Speaker 1: into tourism, into street and tourism being down in the

486
00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:07,800
Speaker 1: country's gdp. Um. It is true that, like we said,

487
00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:10,200
Speaker 1: in a lot of places, tourism is so vital that

488
00:32:10,280 --> 00:32:12,840
Speaker 1: the money coming in from out of country, out of state,

489
00:32:12,880 --> 00:32:15,840
Speaker 1: out of town is the only thing that makes the

490
00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:20,760
Speaker 1: wheels spin there. Um. I don't see that being a

491
00:32:20,800 --> 00:32:25,400
Speaker 1: reason to want to frame a family for hurting their

492
00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:31,600
Speaker 1: child though, Yeah, that's that's its whole order. That's you know,

493
00:32:31,800 --> 00:32:36,680
Speaker 1: that's even that's less of a theory or conspiracy about

494
00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:40,320
Speaker 1: the actual events than it is a theory or conspiracy

495
00:32:40,360 --> 00:32:46,040
Speaker 1: about the behavior of the authorities afterwards. Right, Yeah, But

496
00:32:46,120 --> 00:32:49,440
Speaker 1: it is a conspiracy about not wanting to have a

497
00:32:49,560 --> 00:32:53,280
Speaker 1: dangerous person or not wanting to admit that there is

498
00:32:53,360 --> 00:32:58,120
Speaker 1: some dangerous person that exists around this high dollar tourism area,

499
00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:01,160
Speaker 1: because then you who in their right mind is going

500
00:33:01,200 --> 00:33:05,000
Speaker 1: to take their child and themselves on vacation there. Yeah,

501
00:33:05,000 --> 00:33:07,520
Speaker 1: I mean it's and I guess it's maybe the equivalent

502
00:33:07,560 --> 00:33:09,840
Speaker 1: of like if a murder took place in a house,

503
00:33:10,360 --> 00:33:12,720
Speaker 1: you know, the real estate agents lying about it, are

504
00:33:12,720 --> 00:33:16,040
Speaker 1: covering it up because it's not necessarily something people would

505
00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:18,680
Speaker 1: jump at the chance to live in a murder house.

506
00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:23,400
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, I mean not everybody, at least some people.

507
00:33:23,400 --> 00:33:25,239
Speaker 1: For some people that might be a feature, you know,

508
00:33:26,440 --> 00:33:30,959
Speaker 1: some people pay extra I mean meeky Yeah. But the uh,

509
00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:34,800
Speaker 1: the the interesting part about that point too, is that

510
00:33:34,840 --> 00:33:37,800
Speaker 1: this is a wealthy area there. You can look now

511
00:33:37,840 --> 00:33:43,200
Speaker 1: and see enormous holmes being constructed, So it does there,

512
00:33:43,200 --> 00:33:46,440
Speaker 1: you know, you can see the internal logic there, but

513
00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:49,880
Speaker 1: none of these theories, the three we just explored, have

514
00:33:49,960 --> 00:33:56,240
Speaker 1: garnered much support, primarily because none of them have generated

515
00:33:56,360 --> 00:34:00,840
Speaker 1: much evidence in support of what they're proposing. However, this

516
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:06,320
Speaker 1: is where we get to the idea of predators. In Wait,

517
00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:13,400
Speaker 1: we mentioned reports of some mysterious figures, but in the

518
00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:18,879
Speaker 1: Telegraph gave an official stance to these long standing rumors

519
00:34:18,920 --> 00:34:22,400
Speaker 1: that Madeleine McCann may have been abducted on the order

520
00:34:22,440 --> 00:34:28,040
Speaker 1: of an unknown, wealthy, childless couple. So not some crazed killer,

521
00:34:28,360 --> 00:34:31,080
Speaker 1: not some cover up of an accident, but someone hunting

522
00:34:31,080 --> 00:34:34,200
Speaker 1: a child on the orders of someone else. And that's

523
00:34:34,239 --> 00:34:39,640
Speaker 1: because after the disappearance, witnesses were coming forward saying, now

524
00:34:39,680 --> 00:34:43,200
Speaker 1: that I think about it, now that I recall I

525
00:34:43,320 --> 00:34:46,920
Speaker 1: may have seen suspicious individuals hanging out at the resort

526
00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:50,960
Speaker 1: in the days leading up to the event. It's got

527
00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:56,279
Speaker 1: some pros and cons pro any lead is helpful at

528
00:34:56,280 --> 00:34:59,440
Speaker 1: this point when these folks are coming forward con they

529
00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:02,360
Speaker 1: don't have uh, you know, in a lot of cases,

530
00:35:02,360 --> 00:35:05,040
Speaker 1: they don't have camera footage of this or something. They

531
00:35:05,080 --> 00:35:07,840
Speaker 1: just have their memory. And memory is one of the

532
00:35:07,840 --> 00:35:12,240
Speaker 1: worst witnesses in human experience. Uh. But but the idea

533
00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:15,320
Speaker 1: here is that there may have been an operation involving

534
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:19,560
Speaker 1: multiple people, some acting as spotters. And to put a

535
00:35:19,680 --> 00:35:23,319
Speaker 1: brutal fine point on it. In this theory, the the

536
00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:29,000
Speaker 1: idea is that people were waiting for a child of

537
00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:33,239
Speaker 1: maybe a certain ethnicity, maybe a certain hair color or appearance,

538
00:35:33,400 --> 00:35:37,240
Speaker 1: a certain age, and then they waited until they found

539
00:35:37,239 --> 00:35:41,880
Speaker 1: someone who fit those specifications. That's chilling if that happens.

540
00:35:41,960 --> 00:35:44,880
Speaker 1: And there was one report that was followed up on,

541
00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:48,239
Speaker 1: which was the report of a of a couple, right,

542
00:35:48,360 --> 00:35:52,439
Speaker 1: an unidentified couple, that's right. This report of an unidentified

543
00:35:52,480 --> 00:35:57,080
Speaker 1: couple UH seems to have been substantiated. The idea that

544
00:35:57,160 --> 00:36:02,759
Speaker 1: these were something known as spotters UM, which would be

545
00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:08,080
Speaker 1: UH people complicit in the child sex trafficking ring or

546
00:36:08,160 --> 00:36:10,160
Speaker 1: in trade. I don't know what the hell you want

547
00:36:10,160 --> 00:36:12,520
Speaker 1: to call it, UM, but this is a job people

548
00:36:12,560 --> 00:36:17,080
Speaker 1: searching for a child who met the particular requirements of

549
00:36:17,080 --> 00:36:20,239
Speaker 1: of what was being sought UM. Whether that be race

550
00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:24,800
Speaker 1: or age or hair color, God only knows UM. And

551
00:36:25,280 --> 00:36:28,879
Speaker 1: this report of this unidentified couple, like I said, does

552
00:36:28,920 --> 00:36:32,280
Speaker 1: seems to have been substantiated. A couple later came forward

553
00:36:32,320 --> 00:36:36,759
Speaker 1: and thought one sighting may have been them UM as

554
00:36:36,800 --> 00:36:40,640
Speaker 1: they were walking in the area, but upon further investigation,

555
00:36:41,280 --> 00:36:43,879
Speaker 1: they had nothing to do with the case. So, um,

556
00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:47,520
Speaker 1: we should get back on track to that Tanner report.

557
00:36:47,920 --> 00:36:53,520
Speaker 1: A single unidentified man I believe, blonde with acne, with

558
00:36:53,760 --> 00:36:58,600
Speaker 1: the descriptions early carrying a child. But as we know,

559
00:36:58,680 --> 00:37:02,160
Speaker 1: at the end of the day, editors are opportunists. Um,

560
00:37:02,160 --> 00:37:04,480
Speaker 1: So this notion of a predator kind of lying in

561
00:37:04,560 --> 00:37:10,640
Speaker 1: wait looking for that perfect moment uh to spring into action. Um,

562
00:37:10,719 --> 00:37:16,360
Speaker 1: that seems to be pretty plausible considering that there appears

563
00:37:16,440 --> 00:37:18,680
Speaker 1: to have been a high number of sexual predators in

564
00:37:18,680 --> 00:37:22,000
Speaker 1: the area at that time. And sure, you know, like

565
00:37:22,040 --> 00:37:26,120
Speaker 1: in any resort area, which often you know, are in

566
00:37:26,280 --> 00:37:29,440
Speaker 1: poorer parts of the world, you know, where there are

567
00:37:29,480 --> 00:37:32,719
Speaker 1: the people that actually live there aren't particularly wealthy, would

568
00:37:32,760 --> 00:37:35,160
Speaker 1: never actually stay in the resort. So there certainly is

569
00:37:35,239 --> 00:37:38,000
Speaker 1: kind of a have and have not mentality, And uh,

570
00:37:38,040 --> 00:37:40,520
Speaker 1: it makes sense to break ends and thefts would be

571
00:37:40,719 --> 00:37:45,319
Speaker 1: relatively common. But this idea of a loan predator really

572
00:37:45,360 --> 00:37:49,520
Speaker 1: didn't seem to go anywhere until very recently this year.

573
00:37:49,560 --> 00:37:52,879
Speaker 1: In fact, yes, one last time, going back to that

574
00:37:52,960 --> 00:37:56,800
Speaker 1: report that Jane Tanner, friend of the McCanns, made about

575
00:37:56,880 --> 00:38:01,040
Speaker 1: one person carrying a child. Did I actually have any

576
00:38:01,040 --> 00:38:04,400
Speaker 1: weight to it. Maybe she saw something and maybe the

577
00:38:04,400 --> 00:38:07,120
Speaker 1: authorities should have paid more attention to it at the time.

578
00:38:08,200 --> 00:38:10,040
Speaker 1: We'll tell you all about it right after a word

579
00:38:10,040 --> 00:38:20,120
Speaker 1: from our sponsor, and we're back. As we said at

580
00:38:20,120 --> 00:38:25,120
Speaker 1: the top, this is an ongoing mystery and there is

581
00:38:25,160 --> 00:38:29,600
Speaker 1: a new turn of events in the case of Madeline McCann.

582
00:38:29,960 --> 00:38:35,160
Speaker 1: Recent revelations which unfortunately didn't have to be as recent

583
00:38:35,360 --> 00:38:39,120
Speaker 1: as they are. After years and years, again, a decade

584
00:38:39,120 --> 00:38:44,480
Speaker 1: plus of fruitless investigation, authorities believe that they have discovered

585
00:38:44,960 --> 00:38:49,640
Speaker 1: the abductor of Madeline McCann. The suspect is a German

586
00:38:49,840 --> 00:38:52,719
Speaker 1: Man who is originally being referred to as Christian be

587
00:38:53,400 --> 00:38:56,719
Speaker 1: we know now his full name is Christian Bruckner. He

588
00:38:56,920 --> 00:39:00,640
Speaker 1: is I must note not to be confused with another

589
00:39:00,719 --> 00:39:04,480
Speaker 1: Christian Bruckner, who is apparently a famous voice actor in Germany,

590
00:39:05,200 --> 00:39:08,880
Speaker 1: which I was not aware of. But this Christian Bruckner

591
00:39:09,920 --> 00:39:17,399
Speaker 1: he spent his entire adult life being um being the

592
00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:24,440
Speaker 1: worst person, a small time criminal, uh, an absolute sleeves bag.

593
00:39:24,600 --> 00:39:28,600
Speaker 1: He would travel back and forth between Portugal and Germany,

594
00:39:28,640 --> 00:39:31,719
Speaker 1: often in an attempt to escape the consequences of one

595
00:39:31,719 --> 00:39:34,840
Speaker 1: of his many crimes, which began in his teenage years

596
00:39:35,600 --> 00:39:40,239
Speaker 1: when he uh, when he sexually assaulted someone. Uh. He

597
00:39:40,320 --> 00:39:43,440
Speaker 1: was on the run for his sexual abuse of children,

598
00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:46,880
Speaker 1: for forgery, for driving without a license, for petty theft,

599
00:39:46,960 --> 00:39:52,160
Speaker 1: for drug dealing. His former associates, who are one of

600
00:39:52,200 --> 00:39:55,960
Speaker 1: the main reasons that authorities caught onto him. His former

601
00:39:55,960 --> 00:40:01,120
Speaker 1: associates described him as one of those kind of resort burglars.

602
00:40:01,160 --> 00:40:04,360
Speaker 1: He was known for breaking in through the windows of

603
00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:09,640
Speaker 1: first floor apartments. And he did not directly get caught

604
00:40:10,520 --> 00:40:13,400
Speaker 1: or you know, he did not directly get implicated in

605
00:40:13,440 --> 00:40:17,280
Speaker 1: the mccan case for a long long time, which is chilling.

606
00:40:17,800 --> 00:40:22,440
Speaker 1: It is chilling. And um, his most serious crime, uh

607
00:40:22,560 --> 00:40:25,600
Speaker 1: is a real doozy. Um. She's hard to even say

608
00:40:25,640 --> 00:40:30,040
Speaker 1: out loud. He uh is known to have raped a

609
00:40:30,200 --> 00:40:36,200
Speaker 1: seventy two year old American woman on September two five. Um,

610
00:40:36,239 --> 00:40:39,719
Speaker 1: the victim, he tortured her. Yeah, he beat her with

611
00:40:39,840 --> 00:40:45,239
Speaker 1: a metal rod after binding her, uh, presumably raping her.

612
00:40:45,719 --> 00:40:48,520
Speaker 1: And and he you know, the police reports indicated that

613
00:40:48,560 --> 00:40:53,200
Speaker 1: she had been beaten around the chest and legs and buttocks,

614
00:40:53,960 --> 00:40:57,239
Speaker 1: was horribly bruised. I mean, thankfully she she left with

615
00:40:57,239 --> 00:41:00,200
Speaker 1: her life. But um, yeah, she'd been staying in an

616
00:41:00,200 --> 00:41:03,560
Speaker 1: apartment that was along the daily route between Bruckner's house

617
00:41:03,600 --> 00:41:06,680
Speaker 1: and the beach that he visited every day. Um and yeah,

618
00:41:06,760 --> 00:41:09,719
Speaker 1: I mean these these uh, there's there's more details that

619
00:41:09,760 --> 00:41:13,600
Speaker 1: we have here. Really steal yourselves, folks. These are quite disturbing.

620
00:41:14,360 --> 00:41:18,160
Speaker 1: So we know that this this person was you know,

621
00:41:18,760 --> 00:41:22,560
Speaker 1: their apartment was along that daily route between Bruckner's house

622
00:41:22,640 --> 00:41:28,080
Speaker 1: and a beach he visited every day. One night, the

623
00:41:28,200 --> 00:41:32,080
Speaker 1: night of September two, around ten thirty pm, he enters

624
00:41:32,120 --> 00:41:35,960
Speaker 1: through this person's front door, which is unlocked because this

625
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:40,280
Speaker 1: is supposed to be a relatively safe neighborhood. He dragged

626
00:41:40,280 --> 00:41:43,480
Speaker 1: her through the building. As you said, nol, he bound her,

627
00:41:43,480 --> 00:41:46,440
Speaker 1: he tied her down. Uh, he beat her, which has

628
00:41:46,480 --> 00:41:49,080
Speaker 1: been with what has been described as a metal rod,

629
00:41:49,080 --> 00:41:54,600
Speaker 1: but also a scimitar, which might be a translation error there. Uh.

630
00:41:54,600 --> 00:41:59,759
Speaker 1: He did assaulter uh and torture her, after which he

631
00:42:01,040 --> 00:42:05,520
Speaker 1: dragged her forcibly into the kitchen of the apartment and

632
00:42:05,640 --> 00:42:09,200
Speaker 1: he forced her to give him cash that she had

633
00:42:09,239 --> 00:42:13,480
Speaker 1: on her person and he made off with her computer.

634
00:42:14,239 --> 00:42:20,120
Speaker 1: She survived, thankfully, and Portuguese authorities investigated this case, but

635
00:42:20,239 --> 00:42:25,040
Speaker 1: they closed their investigation a year later in two thousand

636
00:42:25,239 --> 00:42:31,160
Speaker 1: and six, and Bruckner was not Bruckner almost got away

637
00:42:31,200 --> 00:42:34,680
Speaker 1: with this. He pretty much did no one. No one

638
00:42:34,760 --> 00:42:38,640
Speaker 1: knew about his association, and then he started bragging to

639
00:42:38,960 --> 00:42:42,560
Speaker 1: his criminal friends about it, and the UM, I don't

640
00:42:42,560 --> 00:42:44,520
Speaker 1: know what you would call it, the world of thievery,

641
00:42:45,800 --> 00:42:50,560
Speaker 1: his his fellow thieves, his um, the people who would

642
00:42:50,800 --> 00:42:54,120
Speaker 1: who would squat on properties with him and then helped

643
00:42:54,239 --> 00:42:56,880
Speaker 1: the like in their mind, Bruckner was a sleeves bag

644
00:42:57,280 --> 00:43:00,839
Speaker 1: with a big mouth, but he would help them come

645
00:43:00,920 --> 00:43:05,000
Speaker 1: up with schemes to steal stuff, like really small time

646
00:43:05,080 --> 00:43:09,759
Speaker 1: stuff like stealing gasoline, stealing diesel. I didn't know that

647
00:43:09,880 --> 00:43:13,200
Speaker 1: was a thing that anybody other than like large oil

648
00:43:13,239 --> 00:43:16,320
Speaker 1: companies did. I didn't know it was like a micro

649
00:43:16,480 --> 00:43:21,399
Speaker 1: economic crime as well. So Bruckner is talking with these

650
00:43:21,440 --> 00:43:29,000
Speaker 1: associates of his and he discloses that while he was

651
00:43:29,080 --> 00:43:33,160
Speaker 1: conducting this horrific assault, he filmed it so that he

652
00:43:33,200 --> 00:43:37,280
Speaker 1: could view it recreationally later. And this is a step

653
00:43:37,320 --> 00:43:41,520
Speaker 1: too far. Imagine you're one of those other probably not

654
00:43:41,640 --> 00:43:44,520
Speaker 1: to profile, but you're probably kind of a sleez bag too.

655
00:43:45,560 --> 00:43:48,480
Speaker 1: And you say, hey, I thought we were just stealing

656
00:43:48,560 --> 00:43:51,759
Speaker 1: stuff to get you know, drug money or something. It's

657
00:43:51,800 --> 00:43:54,440
Speaker 1: a step too far for me to be part of

658
00:43:54,480 --> 00:44:01,040
Speaker 1: your violent sex crimes that are on film. And that

659
00:44:01,120 --> 00:44:06,719
Speaker 1: compels these people, uh, and that compels them to go

660
00:44:06,880 --> 00:44:10,440
Speaker 1: to the authorities, which we have to say, you know, uh,

661
00:44:10,520 --> 00:44:13,200
Speaker 1: if they had not done so, we have no idea

662
00:44:13,280 --> 00:44:16,920
Speaker 1: how the next series of events would have played out. Right,

663
00:44:17,440 --> 00:44:22,200
Speaker 1: and Ben didn't. Weren't there internet posts that he had

664
00:44:22,280 --> 00:44:25,680
Speaker 1: made or some kind of journaling that he had done

665
00:44:25,840 --> 00:44:30,560
Speaker 1: talking about his kind of escalating fantasies about abducting and

666
00:44:30,680 --> 00:44:37,359
Speaker 1: using someone a child, even for sex. Those were alleged

667
00:44:37,400 --> 00:44:40,719
Speaker 1: Iman and actually seen the files themselves where they were

668
00:44:40,760 --> 00:44:44,520
Speaker 1: alleged chat room logs right that he had done, where

669
00:44:44,520 --> 00:44:48,080
Speaker 1: he talked about capturing something little and keeping it for

670
00:44:48,120 --> 00:44:51,399
Speaker 1: a while. And and there was an interesting point made

671
00:44:51,400 --> 00:44:55,880
Speaker 1: in that sixty minutes piece on the Australian sixty Minutes

672
00:44:56,280 --> 00:44:59,840
Speaker 1: where one of the investigators said that it could be

673
00:45:00,120 --> 00:45:02,600
Speaker 1: argue that, well, the m O for this guy was

674
00:45:02,719 --> 00:45:05,600
Speaker 1: old women, But honestly, the m O for this guy

675
00:45:05,719 --> 00:45:10,680
Speaker 1: was just helpless helplessness and being able to take someone

676
00:45:10,840 --> 00:45:13,239
Speaker 1: and and have them bend to his will, and so

677
00:45:13,280 --> 00:45:16,479
Speaker 1: it's really honestly the same having a child or having

678
00:45:16,520 --> 00:45:21,000
Speaker 1: an helpless elderly woman. As as awful as that sounds,

679
00:45:21,239 --> 00:45:24,520
Speaker 1: it really does fit the same m O. So the

680
00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:30,680
Speaker 1: purported UH statements made by Bruckner online were found in

681
00:45:31,239 --> 00:45:37,640
Speaker 1: UH dedicated pro child abuse forums on on the dark Web,

682
00:45:38,040 --> 00:45:40,400
Speaker 1: and again to your point, Matt, I don't think they

683
00:45:40,400 --> 00:45:43,279
Speaker 1: have a hundred percent proof that he did that, but

684
00:45:43,520 --> 00:45:46,640
Speaker 1: they're strong it's strongly suspected that he was the author.

685
00:45:47,360 --> 00:45:52,400
Speaker 1: You can hear the recreations of that on UH sixty

686
00:45:52,440 --> 00:45:56,600
Speaker 1: minutes on the Australian sixty minutes, which is a bit exploitative,

687
00:45:56,680 --> 00:45:59,880
Speaker 1: but it is important information because if it is a

688
00:46:00,600 --> 00:46:03,680
Speaker 1: confirmed to be this guy, than we see also UH

689
00:46:03,920 --> 00:46:08,440
Speaker 1: evidence of premeditation, right of a plan and an escalation,

690
00:46:09,000 --> 00:46:13,439
Speaker 1: and it is it is pretty sickening. It's also not

691
00:46:13,600 --> 00:46:17,760
Speaker 1: the first time again that this guy has been implicated

692
00:46:18,280 --> 00:46:22,880
Speaker 1: in these sorts of villainous, unclean behaviors. There was a

693
00:46:22,960 --> 00:46:25,640
Speaker 1: documentary like I know a lot of us are familiar

694
00:46:25,680 --> 00:46:29,239
Speaker 1: with the recent Netflix documentary, but there was another documentary

695
00:46:29,320 --> 00:46:32,640
Speaker 1: about a missing very young girl, a five year old

696
00:46:32,680 --> 00:46:37,680
Speaker 1: named Inga Garrick from Germany. She vanished from a German

697
00:46:37,719 --> 00:46:42,960
Speaker 1: campsite eight years after McCann disappeared, and the documentary appears

698
00:46:43,000 --> 00:46:47,279
Speaker 1: to implicate Bruckner. He was investigated for the disappearance of

699
00:46:47,320 --> 00:46:53,480
Speaker 1: this child, I think around twenty sixteen, and they ultimately

700
00:46:53,520 --> 00:46:56,719
Speaker 1: did not charge him with kidnapping or with homicide or

701
00:46:56,719 --> 00:47:01,200
Speaker 1: anything like that. But they they found things that were

702
00:47:01,280 --> 00:47:05,319
Speaker 1: much much worse, the kind of things that if I

703
00:47:05,400 --> 00:47:08,120
Speaker 1: were an investigator, I think if anyone was an investigator,

704
00:47:08,160 --> 00:47:10,240
Speaker 1: they would be the kind of things that that haunt

705
00:47:10,320 --> 00:47:17,680
Speaker 1: you for years afterwards. Yeah, and then if it was

706
00:47:17,719 --> 00:47:22,160
Speaker 1: a movie, one of those officers who just couldn't handle

707
00:47:22,200 --> 00:47:27,440
Speaker 1: it would just end up putting that guy in a

708
00:47:27,440 --> 00:47:31,520
Speaker 1: shallow grave somewhere. That's just no, dude. That's where that's

709
00:47:31,520 --> 00:47:33,160
Speaker 1: where my mind started to go. Like I was saying,

710
00:47:33,200 --> 00:47:36,239
Speaker 1: when I was spiraling out thinking about this, you know,

711
00:47:36,320 --> 00:47:38,239
Speaker 1: and obviously, I mean, the parents are following all this

712
00:47:38,320 --> 00:47:41,200
Speaker 1: in the news, they know this guy's a suspect, they

713
00:47:41,200 --> 00:47:44,640
Speaker 1: know roughly what the public knows, what we have access to.

714
00:47:45,840 --> 00:47:48,320
Speaker 1: I would just go I would lose my mind. I

715
00:47:48,360 --> 00:47:51,440
Speaker 1: would I would fly into a murderous rage. I just

716
00:47:51,480 --> 00:47:54,759
Speaker 1: don't know. And just to note here this documentary we're

717
00:47:54,760 --> 00:47:59,799
Speaker 1: discussing right now, within it, there apparently are friends of

718
00:48:00,000 --> 00:48:04,439
Speaker 1: Bruckner who were speaking with the documentary filmmakers. They said

719
00:48:04,480 --> 00:48:08,080
Speaker 1: that he would often brag about this very specific vehicle,

720
00:48:08,200 --> 00:48:13,080
Speaker 1: a large camper van, and how it was ideal for quote,

721
00:48:13,360 --> 00:48:18,080
Speaker 1: hiding kids and drugs. And within this camper authorities found

722
00:48:18,280 --> 00:48:25,400
Speaker 1: stashes of little girl swimsuits and thousands of images of

723
00:48:25,520 --> 00:48:32,279
Speaker 1: children in sexual situations. Um. And this was when they

724
00:48:32,280 --> 00:48:36,560
Speaker 1: were investigating Bruckner specifically for Inga's disappearance that we were

725
00:48:36,600 --> 00:48:42,120
Speaker 1: speaking about before in completely separate child m and you also,

726
00:48:42,200 --> 00:48:45,520
Speaker 1: we should I hate to say it, but we have

727
00:48:45,680 --> 00:48:50,839
Speaker 1: to be accurate and explicit here. Uh, this is this

728
00:48:50,920 --> 00:48:55,200
Speaker 1: is child pornography. Yes, I didn't didn't mean to skirt

729
00:48:55,280 --> 00:48:59,400
Speaker 1: around that. It's just I wanted to say it without

730
00:48:59,400 --> 00:49:03,279
Speaker 1: saying it. And is there a sense, I mean, maybe

731
00:49:03,320 --> 00:49:07,520
Speaker 1: we'll get there. I know there's another big termed twist

732
00:49:07,560 --> 00:49:09,759
Speaker 1: coming soon, I guess. But was there a sense that

733
00:49:09,800 --> 00:49:13,000
Speaker 1: any of these were images that he himself had created

734
00:49:14,440 --> 00:49:19,320
Speaker 1: or okay, okay, yeah, we don't know what this done.

735
00:49:19,840 --> 00:49:24,160
Speaker 1: This leads to, thankfully legal consequences as of twenty nineteen,

736
00:49:24,760 --> 00:49:28,680
Speaker 1: well as of right now, Bruckner is held in a

737
00:49:28,840 --> 00:49:35,200
Speaker 1: German prison, is held on charges unrelated to the McCann case.

738
00:49:36,320 --> 00:49:40,640
Speaker 1: So let's start putting some of the sinister pieces of

739
00:49:40,680 --> 00:49:46,040
Speaker 1: this puzzle together. He traveled often between Germany, Spain, and

740
00:49:46,160 --> 00:49:51,239
Speaker 1: Portugal during two thousand seven, the time of the McCann disappearance.

741
00:49:51,440 --> 00:49:55,080
Speaker 1: He had been living in this area prior delis as

742
00:49:55,080 --> 00:49:58,040
Speaker 1: a waiter or a barman, which I assume as a

743
00:49:58,040 --> 00:50:02,920
Speaker 1: bartender in various lubs, right. And he was also constantly,

744
00:50:03,280 --> 00:50:07,400
Speaker 1: by his own admission, on the watch for opportunities to

745
00:50:07,600 --> 00:50:13,440
Speaker 1: steal from tourists, bragging to his associates about how great

746
00:50:13,480 --> 00:50:16,040
Speaker 1: his van was, how it was a safe spot. He

747
00:50:16,080 --> 00:50:18,640
Speaker 1: would talk when he was in his cups about the

748
00:50:18,680 --> 00:50:22,200
Speaker 1: idea of selling children in Morocco. You know how much

749
00:50:22,200 --> 00:50:25,880
Speaker 1: of that is just like self aggrandizing braggado show of

750
00:50:25,880 --> 00:50:29,240
Speaker 1: an evil man. How much of this is a plan

751
00:50:29,400 --> 00:50:34,759
Speaker 1: or a process in investigators start looking at Bruckner. I mean,

752
00:50:34,800 --> 00:50:39,920
Speaker 1: being a bartender would be a pretty pretty choice opportunity

753
00:50:40,680 --> 00:50:44,040
Speaker 1: to to find out information about folks that are there

754
00:50:44,040 --> 00:50:46,760
Speaker 1: on vacation, people that are you know, having some drinks

755
00:50:46,800 --> 00:50:49,479
Speaker 1: get loose lip, talk about where they're staying, talk about

756
00:50:49,480 --> 00:50:52,640
Speaker 1: who they're with, you know, I mean we obviously know

757
00:50:52,760 --> 00:50:56,760
Speaker 1: that the uh, the parents like to have a good time,

758
00:50:57,280 --> 00:50:59,239
Speaker 1: like to have their top us. You know, maybe they

759
00:50:59,320 --> 00:51:02,279
Speaker 1: ended up at this gentleman's bar at some place where

760
00:51:02,280 --> 00:51:05,239
Speaker 1: he worked. And I don't know. I'm just saying, you know,

761
00:51:05,280 --> 00:51:10,120
Speaker 1: there's certainly possible, um, but you're right. Uh. The now

762
00:51:10,400 --> 00:51:15,040
Speaker 1: notorious camper authorities worked off reports from neighbors that Bruckner

763
00:51:15,120 --> 00:51:19,000
Speaker 1: spent long hours in a shed on the property UM

764
00:51:19,320 --> 00:51:24,520
Speaker 1: and began digging. The shed uh is described in an

765
00:51:24,600 --> 00:51:28,120
Speaker 1: article I read as a something like a depraved shed,

766
00:51:28,640 --> 00:51:33,000
Speaker 1: which is pretty accurate. Um, more than accurate. Actually, Uh,

767
00:51:33,040 --> 00:51:38,440
Speaker 1: they started to dig, they found a hidden seller. Um.

768
00:51:38,560 --> 00:51:43,319
Speaker 1: They were seen carrying forensic bags out, as well as

769
00:51:43,360 --> 00:51:50,520
Speaker 1: a child's toy bucket. Apparently uncovered thousands of videos on

770
00:51:50,760 --> 00:51:55,799
Speaker 1: hard drives and USB sticks uh, supposedly buried along with

771
00:51:56,040 --> 00:51:59,839
Speaker 1: his dog. This is what I read. Yeah, I think

772
00:51:59,840 --> 00:52:05,120
Speaker 1: it underneath that stuff was underneath yeah, right, exactly exactly.

773
00:52:05,480 --> 00:52:08,560
Speaker 1: To clarify, this was a search that was conducted in

774
00:52:08,600 --> 00:52:12,160
Speaker 1: a field in northern Germany where the guy was squatting

775
00:52:12,680 --> 00:52:16,040
Speaker 1: for a long time. It's about four miles from where

776
00:52:16,840 --> 00:52:20,720
Speaker 1: Bruckner once lived. But his neighbors all you can tell,

777
00:52:20,760 --> 00:52:24,120
Speaker 1: his neighbors all distrusted and hated him like he would.

778
00:52:24,160 --> 00:52:26,680
Speaker 1: He would tell people who was a car mechanic if

779
00:52:26,680 --> 00:52:29,719
Speaker 1: they asked what he did. But his own car was

780
00:52:29,800 --> 00:52:33,319
Speaker 1: continually his own van was continually leaking fuel and in

781
00:52:33,360 --> 00:52:39,400
Speaker 1: a state of disrepair. The Hidden Seller is true detective

782
00:52:39,480 --> 00:52:42,919
Speaker 1: level stuff. Oh yeah, it really is. Did we talk

783
00:52:43,000 --> 00:52:48,600
Speaker 1: about where he was staying in Portugal? Right there by

784
00:52:48,600 --> 00:52:51,400
Speaker 1: the resort? Did we talk about that already? We indicated

785
00:52:51,440 --> 00:52:54,200
Speaker 1: that he was very close. Yeah. There there are a

786
00:52:54,239 --> 00:52:56,800
Speaker 1: couple of places online where you can find the actual

787
00:52:57,719 --> 00:53:01,600
Speaker 1: area the place where he where Brutner was staying at

788
00:53:01,680 --> 00:53:04,600
Speaker 1: the time when Madeline disappeared, and it was not far

789
00:53:04,719 --> 00:53:07,040
Speaker 1: from the resort where she was abducted for him. And

790
00:53:07,040 --> 00:53:09,520
Speaker 1: it was also if he was the author of those

791
00:53:09,560 --> 00:53:14,880
Speaker 1: things on the Dark Web, it's his and if he

792
00:53:14,960 --> 00:53:18,680
Speaker 1: did this, then it follows the outline the order of

793
00:53:18,719 --> 00:53:21,920
Speaker 1: operations that this author on the Dark Web was talking about.

794
00:53:21,920 --> 00:53:26,640
Speaker 1: So that's another puzzle piece. And you know, as of now, uh,

795
00:53:27,600 --> 00:53:30,520
Speaker 1: none of these recordings or tear or whatever tapes and

796
00:53:30,560 --> 00:53:32,080
Speaker 1: again this is why I asked the stuff they found

797
00:53:32,080 --> 00:53:35,080
Speaker 1: in his van? Is there any indication that he created

798
00:53:35,120 --> 00:53:38,680
Speaker 1: this himself? This stuff seems like he may have. Uh.

799
00:53:38,719 --> 00:53:40,600
Speaker 1: Some of the authorities that are interviewed in that sixty

800
00:53:40,600 --> 00:53:44,920
Speaker 1: minutes piece absolutely or characterizing him as a serial killer type,

801
00:53:45,080 --> 00:53:47,880
Speaker 1: as a psychopath, you know, at the very least a

802
00:53:47,920 --> 00:53:53,440
Speaker 1: serial killer in the making. Um. And they're keeping a

803
00:53:53,480 --> 00:53:56,600
Speaker 1: tight lid on whatever they found in that cellar. And honestly,

804
00:53:56,680 --> 00:53:58,520
Speaker 1: I would look at it as an act of mercy,

805
00:53:58,760 --> 00:54:01,400
Speaker 1: you know, to the parents at stuff isn't available for

806
00:54:01,440 --> 00:54:04,480
Speaker 1: them to see. Who knows there's somebody Again in the

807
00:54:04,760 --> 00:54:09,240
Speaker 1: sixty minutes piece, one of the investigators indicated that maybe

808
00:54:09,360 --> 00:54:12,680
Speaker 1: she could have been on one of those tapes. German authorities,

809
00:54:13,400 --> 00:54:19,960
Speaker 1: British authorities, Portuguese authorities all seemed to indicate, without sharing

810
00:54:20,080 --> 00:54:23,319
Speaker 1: the totality of their information, they all seemed to indicate

811
00:54:23,719 --> 00:54:30,799
Speaker 1: that Bruckner is the person behind the disappearance. The one

812
00:54:30,840 --> 00:54:34,160
Speaker 1: of the most disturbing parts here is that German authorities

813
00:54:34,280 --> 00:54:42,160
Speaker 1: right now are convinced that Madeline McCann is no longer

814
00:54:42,239 --> 00:54:45,480
Speaker 1: with us, that she is dead. They believe she died

815
00:54:45,520 --> 00:54:49,040
Speaker 1: shortly after the abduction. They believe she was abducted by Bruckner.

816
00:54:49,200 --> 00:54:53,200
Speaker 1: They believe Bruckner murdered her, but they also believe that

817
00:54:53,280 --> 00:54:57,960
Speaker 1: they have at this point insufficient evidence to officially charge him,

818
00:54:58,000 --> 00:55:01,120
Speaker 1: which puts them in a weird position because the German

819
00:55:01,200 --> 00:55:05,080
Speaker 1: prosecutors are saying, this is the guy. I told the family,

820
00:55:05,160 --> 00:55:07,759
Speaker 1: why we know this is the guy, we just need

821
00:55:07,840 --> 00:55:11,279
Speaker 1: more evidence, and then members of German law enforcement in

822
00:55:11,360 --> 00:55:15,680
Speaker 1: other regards are saying the same thing. Uh to your point, no,

823
00:55:16,360 --> 00:55:20,440
Speaker 1: you know, I think it is it is noble to

824
00:55:20,640 --> 00:55:23,560
Speaker 1: say that there with maybe withholding that as an active

825
00:55:23,560 --> 00:55:27,280
Speaker 1: mercy for the parents, but I believe there there's also

826
00:55:27,400 --> 00:55:31,240
Speaker 1: the very compelling motive that they don't want to fumble

827
00:55:31,280 --> 00:55:35,359
Speaker 1: a technicality that would invalidate the case. They want to

828
00:55:35,440 --> 00:55:39,839
Speaker 1: get the monster right. All of this aside, you know

829
00:55:39,880 --> 00:55:42,960
Speaker 1: what kind of charges he is facing. I mean, obviously

830
00:55:43,280 --> 00:55:46,279
Speaker 1: he must have gotten out for that rape of the

831
00:55:46,320 --> 00:55:49,240
Speaker 1: seventy two year old woman, and I mean they found

832
00:55:49,280 --> 00:55:51,680
Speaker 1: the child porn in his in his van. I mean,

833
00:55:51,719 --> 00:55:55,560
Speaker 1: surely he's already facing some pretty serious charges and isn't

834
00:55:55,560 --> 00:55:59,720
Speaker 1: going to be like out anytime soon. Yeah, So he uh,

835
00:55:59,760 --> 00:56:02,359
Speaker 1: he it's it's odd that you mentioned that because he

836
00:56:02,560 --> 00:56:07,920
Speaker 1: recently dropped his bid for early release from prison. He

837
00:56:08,000 --> 00:56:11,800
Speaker 1: has served, he's been serving. Uh, he's been serving prison

838
00:56:11,840 --> 00:56:16,640
Speaker 1: time on unrelated drug charges. So it's it's a pattern

839
00:56:16,680 --> 00:56:21,680
Speaker 1: that we see happen often with you know, we've been

840
00:56:21,800 --> 00:56:25,120
Speaker 1: very careful to avoid the word, but to avoid the

841
00:56:25,160 --> 00:56:27,920
Speaker 1: phrase serial killers. But it's it's a pattern that we

842
00:56:27,960 --> 00:56:31,719
Speaker 1: have seen often, uh, in these sorts of arrestaurant, these

843
00:56:31,719 --> 00:56:36,600
Speaker 1: breaks in a case, it's not uncommon for the person

844
00:56:36,640 --> 00:56:38,600
Speaker 1: who turns out to be a culprit of one crime

845
00:56:38,840 --> 00:56:43,080
Speaker 1: to already be incarcerated for a different crime. And that

846
00:56:43,080 --> 00:56:46,880
Speaker 1: that's we've seen it in numerous episodes of this show. Uh,

847
00:56:47,080 --> 00:56:53,880
Speaker 1: he is I think as of July, he's about two

848
00:56:54,120 --> 00:57:00,280
Speaker 1: thirds through his his prison sentence on those drug offense, says.

849
00:57:00,840 --> 00:57:04,320
Speaker 1: And then after he does that, he has to start

850
00:57:04,760 --> 00:57:08,120
Speaker 1: his seven year prison sentence for the two thousand and

851
00:57:08,200 --> 00:57:11,880
Speaker 1: five assault. So they wouldn't the court wouldn't allow it

852
00:57:12,000 --> 00:57:15,520
Speaker 1: to be served concurrently, if that makes sense. They wanted

853
00:57:15,560 --> 00:57:17,600
Speaker 1: to keep him in jail for as long as possible,

854
00:57:18,320 --> 00:57:20,520
Speaker 1: or in prison, I should say. And just a reminder,

855
00:57:20,720 --> 00:57:24,480
Speaker 1: they did not catch him for that assault. Initially, it

856
00:57:24,560 --> 00:57:26,360
Speaker 1: took a long time for them to figure out they

857
00:57:26,400 --> 00:57:28,920
Speaker 1: do was Bruckner um When the I believe it was,

858
00:57:29,000 --> 00:57:33,360
Speaker 1: the people who are around him started talking absolutely. And

859
00:57:33,440 --> 00:57:38,400
Speaker 1: this also Portuguese police have currently confirmed they are re

860
00:57:38,560 --> 00:57:41,720
Speaker 1: examining evidence now that they have a bit better idea

861
00:57:41,760 --> 00:57:45,360
Speaker 1: of what to look for. They have saliva samples from

862
00:57:45,440 --> 00:57:47,920
Speaker 1: the crime scene, and they say they're sending those to

863
00:57:48,040 --> 00:57:53,600
Speaker 1: Germany to be tested against Bruckner's DNA. His lawyer, one

864
00:57:53,680 --> 00:57:59,720
Speaker 1: Friedrich Fulscher, said that his client Bruckner, denies any involvement

865
00:58:00,040 --> 00:58:05,480
Speaker 1: in not just the McCann case, but in two other

866
00:58:05,600 --> 00:58:10,920
Speaker 1: cases of missing children that he's currently under investigation at

867
00:58:11,000 --> 00:58:14,560
Speaker 1: some level four. And that's that's where we are. So

868
00:58:14,720 --> 00:58:18,720
Speaker 1: much of this stuff happened just a few weeks ago.

869
00:58:20,080 --> 00:58:22,840
Speaker 1: We we can't recommend that you, if you are interested

870
00:58:22,880 --> 00:58:26,720
Speaker 1: in this, check out some of the timelines that are

871
00:58:26,760 --> 00:58:30,560
Speaker 1: available out there. Look at some of the images that

872
00:58:30,600 --> 00:58:34,520
Speaker 1: we mentioned earlier, take a look at it. Maybe you

873
00:58:34,520 --> 00:58:38,040
Speaker 1: know you can see something that the authorities don't. We don't.

874
00:58:38,080 --> 00:58:40,000
Speaker 1: You never know, we may have one of those unsolved

875
00:58:40,000 --> 00:58:44,760
Speaker 1: mysteries moments where something just comes to light that maybe

876
00:58:44,840 --> 00:58:47,680
Speaker 1: you were aware of, or you saw something one night

877
00:58:47,720 --> 00:58:49,840
Speaker 1: that you didn't realize if you were in that area

878
00:58:50,040 --> 00:58:53,680
Speaker 1: and you're listening to this now, um, you know it.

879
00:58:53,680 --> 00:58:57,280
Speaker 1: It is one of those cases that I certainly hope

880
00:58:57,400 --> 00:59:00,840
Speaker 1: has a conclusion at some point, very soon they can

881
00:59:00,880 --> 00:59:03,840
Speaker 1: give this family a little closure. And now at this

882
00:59:03,920 --> 00:59:09,760
Speaker 1: point we know that there may be some sort of closure,

883
00:59:09,880 --> 00:59:14,720
Speaker 1: and that is that is something that can finally answer

884
00:59:14,760 --> 00:59:19,360
Speaker 1: a question that has haunted all the survivors of of

885
00:59:19,400 --> 00:59:24,920
Speaker 1: Madeline McCann for again more than a decade. Our thoughts

886
00:59:24,920 --> 00:59:27,280
Speaker 1: go out to the McCann family. Our thoughts also go

887
00:59:27,360 --> 00:59:31,560
Speaker 1: out to all of the parents and relatives of other

888
00:59:31,680 --> 00:59:38,200
Speaker 1: people who have disappeared or have somehow gone missing. We

889
00:59:38,280 --> 00:59:40,520
Speaker 1: know that in this case it seems the wheels of

890
00:59:40,600 --> 00:59:46,280
Speaker 1: justice grind slow but hopefully exceedingly fine. We don't have

891
00:59:46,320 --> 00:59:49,080
Speaker 1: the answers. We cannot predict the future. We do not

892
00:59:49,240 --> 00:59:52,440
Speaker 1: know how this will proceed, this case with Christian Bruckner,

893
00:59:53,000 --> 00:59:58,960
Speaker 1: but we can say it feels it feels extraordinary that

894
00:59:59,080 --> 01:00:04,720
Speaker 1: German authority EASE are saying that they found the murderer

895
01:00:05,000 --> 01:00:09,880
Speaker 1: with such certitude. There's no hemming and hawing. The only

896
01:00:09,920 --> 01:00:12,080
Speaker 1: thing they're saying is that they can of fish. They

897
01:00:12,160 --> 01:00:16,800
Speaker 1: don't have the evidence they need yet to officially charge

898
01:00:17,400 --> 01:00:21,120
Speaker 1: charge this person. But I would expect more updates soon,

899
01:00:21,280 --> 01:00:23,960
Speaker 1: maybe even before this podcast comes out. And one more

900
01:00:24,000 --> 01:00:27,040
Speaker 1: note here on just the the updates and new information.

901
01:00:27,080 --> 01:00:30,240
Speaker 1: According to the BBC, the UK's Metropolitan Police says it

902
01:00:30,320 --> 01:00:33,640
Speaker 1: received more than two hundred and seventy calls and emails

903
01:00:33,680 --> 01:00:36,520
Speaker 1: since there was a brand new appeal for new information.

904
01:00:37,240 --> 01:00:40,959
Speaker 1: Um that happened in June. So there are people who

905
01:00:41,080 --> 01:00:43,920
Speaker 1: are trying their best to give any and all info

906
01:00:44,000 --> 01:00:47,080
Speaker 1: they can that may be relevant. UM. So who knows

907
01:00:47,160 --> 01:00:50,800
Speaker 1: what we're what We're gonna find very soon and let

908
01:00:50,840 --> 01:00:53,680
Speaker 1: us know what you think. As always, we want to

909
01:00:53,720 --> 01:00:56,840
Speaker 1: hear from you. You can find us anywhere online. We're

910
01:00:56,920 --> 01:01:00,560
Speaker 1: on Instagram or on Twitter, We're on Facebook. We highly

911
01:01:00,560 --> 01:01:04,240
Speaker 1: recommend our Facebook community page. Here's where it gets crazy.

912
01:01:04,640 --> 01:01:07,040
Speaker 1: It's right you can join your fellow conspiracy realists on

913
01:01:07,120 --> 01:01:11,240
Speaker 1: there with just uh, the drop of a name or

914
01:01:11,360 --> 01:01:13,200
Speaker 1: or a joke of some kind, or just anything to

915
01:01:13,240 --> 01:01:15,440
Speaker 1: let us know that you're a person, uh that's interested

916
01:01:15,480 --> 01:01:17,960
Speaker 1: in this show and wants to get in. UM. If

917
01:01:18,000 --> 01:01:20,000
Speaker 1: you don't want to do that, You can find us

918
01:01:20,040 --> 01:01:24,120
Speaker 1: on the usual social channels on Twitter, on Instagram, or

919
01:01:24,240 --> 01:01:28,000
Speaker 1: Conspiracy Stuff or Conspiracy Stuff Show Um. You can also

920
01:01:28,000 --> 01:01:31,120
Speaker 1: find us as individual human people on social media. I

921
01:01:31,160 --> 01:01:34,240
Speaker 1: am on Instagram at how Now Noel Brown. If you

922
01:01:34,280 --> 01:01:38,959
Speaker 1: have input about this case, related cases, or any other

923
01:01:39,080 --> 01:01:40,840
Speaker 1: topics we've covered on the show and you want to

924
01:01:40,880 --> 01:01:42,720
Speaker 1: talk to me directly, you can find me at Ben

925
01:01:42,760 --> 01:01:46,560
Speaker 1: bull in HSW on Twitter or at Ben Bolling on Instagram.

926
01:01:47,040 --> 01:01:49,400
Speaker 1: But what if you hate social media and prefer to

927
01:01:49,480 --> 01:01:52,840
Speaker 1: use a phone. We have a solution for you. What

928
01:01:53,080 --> 01:01:56,880
Speaker 1: you prefer to use phones in me to give us

929
01:01:56,880 --> 01:01:59,840
Speaker 1: a call. Our number is one eight three three S

930
01:02:00,040 --> 01:02:03,040
Speaker 1: E D W y T K. Leave us a message,

931
01:02:03,360 --> 01:02:07,600
Speaker 1: your thoughts, your ideas for new episodes, your jokes about

932
01:02:07,600 --> 01:02:10,680
Speaker 1: the Illuminati. We accept all. Please give us a call.

933
01:02:12,760 --> 01:02:15,080
Speaker 1: If you don't want to do that, you can always

934
01:02:15,080 --> 01:02:18,560
Speaker 1: reach us the kud old fashioned way, send us an email.

935
01:02:18,760 --> 01:02:40,560
Speaker 1: We are conspiracy at iHeart radio dot com. Stuff they

936
01:02:40,600 --> 01:02:42,480
Speaker 1: Don't want you to Know is a production of I

937
01:02:42,640 --> 01:02:45,720
Speaker 1: heart Radio. For more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit

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Speaker 1: the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen

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Speaker 1: to your favorite shows.