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Speaker 1: Hi everyone, It's me Josh and for this week's Select

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Speaker 1: I chose our two thousand eighteen episode on the Mystery

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Speaker 1: of the Yuba County Five. I was actually inspired to

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Speaker 1: choose this one because I was recently a guest on

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Speaker 1: another podcast called The Yuba County Five hosted by Shanon McGarvey.

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Speaker 1: And it's actually a really fascinating deep dive into this

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Speaker 1: long standing mystery, and it expands on and actually does

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Speaker 1: a lot of updating on what we talked about in

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Speaker 1: this episode. So if this one strikes your fancy, go

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Speaker 1: check out the Yuba County Five podcast from Mopac Audio.

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Speaker 1: And in the meantime, I hope you enjoy our episode

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Speaker 1: on it. Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a production

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Speaker 1: of I Heart Radio. Hey, and welcome to the podcast.

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Speaker 1: I'm Josh Clark, and there's Charles W Chuck Bryant, and

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Speaker 1: there's Jerry over there. So this is stuff you should no. Yes,

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Speaker 1: how you doing, Chuck? Do I look tired? Do you

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Speaker 1: seem a little a little LOGI tired? Man? What's going

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Speaker 1: on with you? I've just been waking up like too

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Speaker 1: early for no reason, going to bed too late though,

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Speaker 1: because if you go to bed early and wake up early.

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Speaker 1: You're fine, well, going to bed late, sometimes not getting

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Speaker 1: enough sleep, then going trying to go to bed super

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Speaker 1: early to make up for it. But I don't know

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Speaker 1: about this making up for a sleep depisode. I don't

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Speaker 1: buy all that. I feel like we talked about it

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Speaker 1: before that there's that that that doesn't actually work. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm just tired, that's all I can say. Sorry, man, Sorry,

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Speaker 1: I'll live all right. I'm glad we killed some time

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Speaker 1: before we got into this very mysterious sad story. It's

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Speaker 1: a good one, though, isn't it. It is extraordinarily sad,

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Speaker 1: probably the saddest true well, I don't know it's up

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Speaker 1: there as far as true life true crime. Disappeared his

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Speaker 1: go um, and it's the one about Gary Matthias. That's

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Speaker 1: what they call it. They call it the Gary Matthias disappearance.

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Speaker 1: But that really doesn't do it much justice, or it

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Speaker 1: doesn't serve it well, because it was a lot more

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Speaker 1: than Gary Matthias involved. Yeah, I've seen it more so

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Speaker 1: called the Uba County five. But you know, I guess

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Speaker 1: it just depends on where you're looking. I had not

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Speaker 1: run across that. Oh yeah, Oh god, that makes me,

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Speaker 1: wonder what all stuff I missed? Well, you know there

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Speaker 1: were five guys, what so, No, there actually were five guys.

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Speaker 1: There were five friends. Um, Gary Matthias was one of them,

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Speaker 1: and there were four others. There was Ted Weir who

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Speaker 1: was the oldest, he was thirty two. There was Jackie

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Speaker 1: Hewitt he was the youngest, he was twenty four. There

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Speaker 1: was Jack Madruga. I'm not sure what Ah was, but

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Speaker 1: he was definitely between twenty four and thirty two. I'll

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Speaker 1: tell you Bill Sterling. And then again Gary are Matthias

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Speaker 1: And those five guys were a set of friends and

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Speaker 1: they met at the Yuba City UH Vocational Rehabilitation Center

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Speaker 1: for the what you would call today UM cognitively impaired

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Speaker 1: or cognitively challenged. Yeah, because three of these guys, UM.

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Speaker 1: Of course, this one article you have from nine seventy

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Speaker 1: eight doesn't use appropriate terms anymore. But three of these

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Speaker 1: guys were intellectually disabled UM or developmentally disabled. Not an

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Speaker 1: exact like it's kind of hard to get an exact

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Speaker 1: DIA diagnosis from these terms, really, but h. Madruga was undiagnosed.

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Speaker 1: But according to his mom, uh, he was generally thought

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Speaker 1: of as she said, as quote slow end quote. And

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Speaker 1: then Matthias was the only one not diagnosed with a

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Speaker 1: developmental disability, but he was under drug treatment for schizophrenia. Right,

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Speaker 1: So all five of these guys had some sort of

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Speaker 1: challenge going on in their life, right, exactly. So, so

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of details you can kind of glean

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Speaker 1: because you're absolutely right, Like reading the really great Washington

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Speaker 1: Post article, which is basically the comprehensive document on the

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Speaker 1: case from UM, you can kind of glean uh an

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Speaker 1: idea picture of these guys. So they're just five friends,

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Speaker 1: thickest thieves. Even within this this tight little group of friends,

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Speaker 1: there's subgroups of even tighter friends like um Ted Weir

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Speaker 1: and Jackie Hewitt were particularly close, and Bill Sterling and

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Speaker 1: Jack Madrugo were particularly close. Um. They had like they

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Speaker 1: were just these these five guys known as the Boys, right.

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Speaker 1: They all lived at home with their parents. They were

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Speaker 1: always going to live at home with their parents. It

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Speaker 1: was just what what the plan was, um, Like I

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Speaker 1: think Ted ted Weir had a had a job, um

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Speaker 1: as a janitor and then later on as a snack

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Speaker 1: bar clerk. Um. Basketball, Yeah, that was another one, and

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Speaker 1: they actually all played together on the basketball team for

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Speaker 1: the Vocational Rehab Center, basically like their hang out, the

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Speaker 1: place where they hung out. They played basketball on that team.

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Speaker 1: But um Jack madrew God's worth saying head a driver's license,

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Speaker 1: whereas three of the other ones didn't, although Gary Mathias

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Speaker 1: did as well. So these guys, they just they were friends.

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Speaker 1: They like had a tight kinship together. They had very normal,

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Speaker 1: reliable lives that were basically home centric, and when they

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Speaker 1: were out doing stuff, you could expect them home for

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Speaker 1: dinner kind of thing, like it was just a given. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I think that's that's super worth pointing out here. Early on,

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Speaker 1: as they saw them more than one place, they said

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Speaker 1: they referred to their lives as very predictable and scheduled,

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Speaker 1: which is why this interesting. The events that occurred on

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Speaker 1: February nineteen seventy eight were very very unusual. Right, So

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Speaker 1: on February eight, the boys that's what their families all

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Speaker 1: call them, because apparently all their families were at least

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Speaker 1: in touch, if not friendly, with another. Yeah, I think

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Speaker 1: they kind of supported one another. It sounds like as

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Speaker 1: much as anyone did in ninety eight. Uh So, on

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Speaker 1: this night, February twenty four, there was a Friday night. Um,

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Speaker 1: the boys left their homes around Maryville and Ubis City

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Speaker 1: in California, and they traveled I think about fifty miles

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Speaker 1: north to cal State Chico which is now called Chico

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Speaker 1: State University, and they went to go see their team.

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Speaker 1: The cal State l A team beat up on cal

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Speaker 1: State Chico and cal State l A actually eighty four,

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Speaker 1: which would have pleased the boys tremendously. So they went

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Speaker 1: to the game. That much is known, and then they

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Speaker 1: left the game. That much is known too, because around

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Speaker 1: ten o'clock when they left the game, they went to

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Speaker 1: a convenience store called Bear's Market and they bought some stuff. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: apparently that they were trying to kind of close up,

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Speaker 1: and so the clerk was a little bit annoyed that

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Speaker 1: they showed up. And these are the kind of details

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Speaker 1: that aren't so important, but it just shows that, you know,

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Speaker 1: they really did their investigating pretty thoroughly, including well, we'll

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Speaker 1: we'll get to sort of the the lead investigator in

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Speaker 1: a minute. But yeah, they bought just a few things.

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Speaker 1: They bought a Hostess cherry pie, um, a Langendorf lemon pie,

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Speaker 1: snickers bar, a Marathon bar, a couple of pepsis, and

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Speaker 1: a court and a half of milk, which is to say,

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Speaker 1: it's not like they were stocking up on food. They

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Speaker 1: just got some uh some some snacks, right exactly for

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Speaker 1: the drive back home fifty fifty miles about an hour. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: The thing is is they they would have been fully

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Speaker 1: expected back home, not just because there was you know,

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Speaker 1: this was it wasn't like any of them to spend

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Speaker 1: the night away, right except Matthias. He he had friends

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Speaker 1: and he would stay out with friends sometimes. But um,

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Speaker 1: the other four like they slipped in their bed at

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Speaker 1: home every night. That's just what they did. So their

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Speaker 1: families fully expected them to come back. Um. And another

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Speaker 1: reason why they expected them to come back was because

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Speaker 1: the next day, Saturday, they had a basketball game for

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Speaker 1: their vocational rehab team, the Gateway Gators, and they they

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Speaker 1: apparently were all extraordinarily excited about this game. Yeah, which

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Speaker 1: again is just another point being made that there was

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Speaker 1: these guys had every intention on coming home super excited

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Speaker 1: about the game. I think Matthias even was kind of

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Speaker 1: driving his mom a little batty, saying, you know, don't

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Speaker 1: let me oversleep. Got this big game. Apparently the guys

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Speaker 1: had their clothes laid out. Uh, and they were all

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Speaker 1: super excited about this basketball game. Uh. And then they

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Speaker 1: don't come home, and you know, these parents and grandparents

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Speaker 1: start waking up at various points in the middle of

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Speaker 1: the night or in the morning and start getting in

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Speaker 1: touch with one another, you know, all verifying like your

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Speaker 1: kids not there, your your kids not there. And they

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Speaker 1: started to freak out. And by eight o'clock that evening,

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Speaker 1: I believe the mother of Madruga actually finally called the cops. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and the cops, um, we're kind of I don't have

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Speaker 1: the impression that they were like, well this is I'm sure,

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Speaker 1: this is fine. I think they got involved pretty early on.

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Speaker 1: But things really picked up when I think on a Tuesday,

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Speaker 1: that was that was Saturday night that they finally called

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Speaker 1: the cops. And on Tuesday, Uh, Jack Madruga's car was discovered,

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Speaker 1: and it was discovered in a very very unusual place, right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: what was this thing in old Mercury, Montego Yeah, sixty

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Speaker 1: nine Montego a land yacht is what it was. And

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Speaker 1: they found it. Um. And this was, by the way,

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Speaker 1: this is Jack Madruga's prized possession. Like no one else

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Speaker 1: drove the thing. He took pristine care of it. It

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Speaker 1: was like his baby. His car was right, So to

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Speaker 1: find it abandoned with the window one of the windows

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Speaker 1: rolled down up a mountain road, which was, um, I think,

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Speaker 1: seventy miles away from the basketball game, in a different

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Speaker 1: direction away from their house. Right, so the basketball game

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Speaker 1: was north of their homes. This was east of southeast

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Speaker 1: of the basketball game and up a mountain road. It

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Speaker 1: was extremely bizarre and also I'm sure quite worrying. When

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Speaker 1: the families were already worried, I think finding this car

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Speaker 1: like this probably really set them into panic mode. Well yeah,

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Speaker 1: and here's where, uh in this article is very clear

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Speaker 1: to say from that point on, nothing made any kind

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Speaker 1: of sense. So here's a few things about the car

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Speaker 1: that definitely don't add up. You might think, all right, there,

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Speaker 1: you know, there was a snowstorm, so they drove up

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Speaker 1: here and they got stuck. Apparently that is not true.

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Speaker 1: The car stopped at about the snow line, and they

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Speaker 1: said they did confirm that the wheels had spun some,

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Speaker 1: but the car wasn't stuck, and these five dudes could

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Speaker 1: have pushed it free pretty easily. Apparently, right, this thing

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Speaker 1: number one, thing number two is that it had a

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Speaker 1: quarter tank of gas still, so they didn't run out

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Speaker 1: of gas. Right then when the cops hot wired the car,

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Speaker 1: the keys were gone. Uh. And when the cops heartwired

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Speaker 1: the cars started up immediately. There wasn't any engine trouble

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Speaker 1: or anything like that. Yeah. The last thing they found

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Speaker 1: were all these maps of California and um, so it's

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Speaker 1: not like they had no way of knowing where they were.

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Speaker 1: And then they found all the you know, all the

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Speaker 1: rappers from the food items. Uh. The only thing, ironically

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Speaker 1: that wasn't fully eaten was the marathon bar um, living

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Speaker 1: up to his reputation. Right. See, I guess the toughest

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Speaker 1: candy bar to get through. Yeah, that's that's how they

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Speaker 1: build it, some weird cartoon cowboy. Yeah, so you know,

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Speaker 1: that's the deal. The underside of the car wasn't damaged,

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Speaker 1: which they say was pretty interesting because on this road,

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Speaker 1: apparently there were a lot of deep, deep ruts. This

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Speaker 1: thing kind of hangs low anyway, has a low hanging muffler,

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Speaker 1: has these five dudes inside, these grown men. Uh. And

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Speaker 1: there was no damage under the underside of this car,

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Speaker 1: which means, you know a couple of things. If you

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Speaker 1: kind of are surmising, which is the either the driver

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Speaker 1: kind of knew where they were going and drove through

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Speaker 1: the darkness with a lot of precision, or they just

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Speaker 1: maybe drew drove really slow. Yeah, I think it was

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Speaker 1: the ladder because I think Madruga did was probably would

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Speaker 1: have been very unhappy that his car was on this

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Speaker 1: road now. So I just took it slow and took

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Speaker 1: it super slow. I saw somewhere that there wasn't even

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Speaker 1: a large mud spot on it. It was they had

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Speaker 1: taken it that easy. Yeah, And apparently Madruga uh didn't

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Speaker 1: like the cold, he didn't like camping, so he wouldn't

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Speaker 1: have known that road. It's not like there's a lot

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Speaker 1: else to do up there but that, right, And evidently, uh,

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Speaker 1: none of the boys were big into outdoorsy type stuff.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that's a really good point, Chuck. So like

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Speaker 1: that none of them had any connection to that, to

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Speaker 1: that area, and certainly not to that mountain. One of them,

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Speaker 1: I think Sterling, Bill Sterling had been had gone camping

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Speaker 1: with his family there eight years before. Yeah, and he

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Speaker 1: didn't even like I think they went back again and

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Speaker 1: he was like, no, I don't want to go right,

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Speaker 1: So he didn't like the outdoors, he didn't like the cold.

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Speaker 1: And then I think ted uh Ted Weir had gone

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Speaker 1: deer hunting or something once with friends way west of

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Speaker 1: the area. Um but still, I mean enough that you

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Speaker 1: could that was it was a lead that the cops

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Speaker 1: were to chase down. Um. But but then too, he

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Speaker 1: didn't enjoy himself and he didn't like the woods either,

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Speaker 1: So there was no let's go hang out in the

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Speaker 1: woods kind of thing going on here. Just everything about

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Speaker 1: the fact that they found this car and where they

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Speaker 1: found it, in the state they found it in was

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Speaker 1: really bizarre and really worrying. Should we take a break?

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Speaker 1: I think we should. Man, all right, you and I

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Speaker 1: are going to go hang out in the woods and

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Speaker 1: we'll be back right up to this. So I've never

241
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Speaker 1: swept the woods before. That was really interesting, right, It's

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Speaker 1: not spick and span out here. So um, So they

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Speaker 1: find the car, and when they find the car, Chuck.

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Speaker 1: I think it was the next night after they had

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Speaker 1: gone missing, a storm blew into the area and it

246
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Speaker 1: dumped like almost a foot of snow on the mountain.

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Speaker 1: This is February in the mountains in California. UM, I

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Speaker 1: would guess the Sierras, is what it sounds like, right, So, yeah,

249
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Speaker 1: Cheek is in the Chicos, in the Sierra Nevadas. I

250
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Speaker 1: think it's north of Sacramento. So it would be very

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Speaker 1: very cold and the snow would be pretty tough to

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Speaker 1: get through. Um So, but they still tried. They got

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Speaker 1: guys on horseback, they got helicopters out, they looked for him,

254
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Speaker 1: but they found nothing. They found not one bit of

255
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Speaker 1: of um and not a single trace of these guys

256
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Speaker 1: after just the car and that was it. Yeah, the

257
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Speaker 1: snow certainly didn't help anything because it would not be

258
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Speaker 1: until June. On June four, after this thing, you know,

259
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Speaker 1: the mountain faws out somewhat when these uh Sunday you

260
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Speaker 1: know motorcycle bikers, they'll go right around the mountains. They

261
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Speaker 1: went into an old Forest service trailer camp at the

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Speaker 1: end of a road and said, do you smell something

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Speaker 1: that smells like perhaps a dead body, And sadly it

264
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Speaker 1: was Ted Weir. And this is where things get even stranger. Yeah,

265
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Speaker 1: so the I think the trailer caught their attention, but

266
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Speaker 1: what caught their attention even further was that a window

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Speaker 1: had been broken to get into the trailer and then yeah,

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Speaker 1: like you said, what really called their attention was the

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Speaker 1: smell in the sight of of ted weirds decomposing body.

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Speaker 1: But what got what made it very, very weird is

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Speaker 1: one he's wrapped in sheets tucked under his head in

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Speaker 1: a way that like he couldn't have possibly tucked himself.

273
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Speaker 1: So somebody had tucked him in like that and he

274
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Speaker 1: ted weird been a portly fellow. Um. Cynthia Gorney, who

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Speaker 1: wrote the Washington Post article on this this case in

276
00:16:28,920 --> 00:16:33,000
Speaker 1: calls him, um, beer belly handsome, which I've never heard

277
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Speaker 1: those words put together in my entire life. I think

278
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Speaker 1: that's what I am. Sure, sure i'd call you beer

279
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Speaker 1: belly foxy. Okay, okay, so um, but he was beer

280
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Speaker 1: belly hands he was. He was a thick guy. He's

281
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Speaker 1: like five ten, two hundred pounds. He had a few

282
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Speaker 1: extra pounds on him right when they found him, though,

283
00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:54,560
Speaker 1: he weighed about a hundred and twenty a hundred to

284
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Speaker 1: a hundred and twenty pounds, which means that between the

285
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Speaker 1: time that they went missing and the time that he died,

286
00:17:01,800 --> 00:17:05,720
Speaker 1: he'd lost anywhere between eighty and a hundred pounds. Yeah.

287
00:17:05,760 --> 00:17:10,560
Speaker 1: A couple of more interesting tidbits. He his leather shoes

288
00:17:10,600 --> 00:17:14,639
Speaker 1: were gone and missing completely. Um. On the little night

289
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Speaker 1: stand by his bed was his his own ring because

290
00:17:17,920 --> 00:17:20,560
Speaker 1: it had his name engraved on it, his gold yeah,

291
00:17:20,600 --> 00:17:24,879
Speaker 1: ted his gold necklace, his wallet with money uh. And

292
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Speaker 1: then weirdly a watch that was not his. It was

293
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Speaker 1: a gold Waltham watch that had a missing crystal. Uh.

294
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Speaker 1: And all of the families said that this No, none

295
00:17:35,359 --> 00:17:40,360
Speaker 1: of our kids had this watch. So that's one interesting tidbit.

296
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Speaker 1: And the other is that he had a big, full

297
00:17:44,080 --> 00:17:48,040
Speaker 1: beard that indicated that he lived in that cabin for

298
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Speaker 1: anywhere from eight to thirteen weeks. And what's really really

299
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Speaker 1: underving about the thirteen week one thirteen week number is

300
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Speaker 1: that if he survived thirteen weeks, that means that he

301
00:17:58,080 --> 00:18:01,679
Speaker 1: would have died just days before for his body was found.

302
00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:04,920
Speaker 1: Is that right? Yes? Did you did you do the math?

303
00:18:05,040 --> 00:18:07,160
Speaker 1: I did the math because think about so they disappeared

304
00:18:07,160 --> 00:18:10,640
Speaker 1: on February and he was found June four, So you've

305
00:18:10,680 --> 00:18:17,919
Speaker 1: got a I really really hope I call on the

306
00:18:17,960 --> 00:18:21,320
Speaker 1: Saints that that not to have been the case, like

307
00:18:21,440 --> 00:18:24,280
Speaker 1: that he perhaps died a couple of days before. Yeah,

308
00:18:24,320 --> 00:18:26,960
Speaker 1: that that he he would have expired like like weeks

309
00:18:27,000 --> 00:18:29,119
Speaker 1: before that. There was just no chance for him, like

310
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Speaker 1: if he was destined and doomed to die. I really

311
00:18:32,280 --> 00:18:34,679
Speaker 1: hope it wasn't a couple of days before they found

312
00:18:34,680 --> 00:18:38,119
Speaker 1: his body after starving for thirteen weeks. Yeah. And to

313
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Speaker 1: cap it off, I don't think we we've mentioned yet,

314
00:18:41,160 --> 00:18:45,760
Speaker 1: this cabin was almost twenty miles from their car. Oh yeah,

315
00:18:45,960 --> 00:18:49,240
Speaker 1: so in the middle of the night. Uh. And at

316
00:18:49,280 --> 00:18:50,840
Speaker 1: this point, this is this is all we know is

317
00:18:50,880 --> 00:18:55,840
Speaker 1: about Ted in our story, he walked or ran almost

318
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Speaker 1: twenty miles in four to six ft snow drifts to

319
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Speaker 1: go to this trailer, where he spent the next two

320
00:19:02,720 --> 00:19:07,399
Speaker 1: to three months slowly dying. Yeah. So okay, that's pretty

321
00:19:07,440 --> 00:19:09,639
Speaker 1: weird in and of itself. And they found that his

322
00:19:09,680 --> 00:19:12,720
Speaker 1: feet were terribly frost bitten, right, which is why his

323
00:19:12,760 --> 00:19:15,440
Speaker 1: shoes were off. But again his shoes were missing. Um,

324
00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:19,000
Speaker 1: what gets even weirder. And this is just where the

325
00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:22,720
Speaker 1: case truly turns. Bizarres, one of the Yuba County Sheriff's

326
00:19:22,760 --> 00:19:25,840
Speaker 1: deputies are under sheriff, called it Bizaar's Hell is like

327
00:19:25,880 --> 00:19:30,400
Speaker 1: the quote of this story, Um, this this the trailer,

328
00:19:30,440 --> 00:19:33,480
Speaker 1: the cabin was actually like a forest Service trailer and

329
00:19:33,520 --> 00:19:37,520
Speaker 1: it was an emergency trailer from what I understand, and

330
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Speaker 1: it was fully stocked with a year's worth of food

331
00:19:41,400 --> 00:19:44,080
Speaker 1: that would have kept all five of those boys alive

332
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Speaker 1: for a year. It was built to keep you alive,

333
00:19:48,040 --> 00:19:50,840
Speaker 1: yes exactly. And they found it, but they didn't put

334
00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:52,479
Speaker 1: it to use. Now, let's not to say that they

335
00:19:52,520 --> 00:19:57,000
Speaker 1: didn't find the food. There was. There were twelve rations

336
00:19:57,119 --> 00:20:01,520
Speaker 1: like um sea rations like army meals opened and eaten,

337
00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:05,199
Speaker 1: but that was it. The other stuff wasn't touched. There

338
00:20:05,240 --> 00:20:08,280
Speaker 1: was a whole locker of other dehydrated food and like

339
00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:12,359
Speaker 1: fruit cups and stuff that hadn't been touched at all. Okay,

340
00:20:12,480 --> 00:20:15,440
Speaker 1: and bear in mind, this is all right here while

341
00:20:15,520 --> 00:20:20,080
Speaker 1: Ted ted Weir is starving to death. Yeah, so all

342
00:20:20,119 --> 00:20:24,040
Speaker 1: this food is there. Uh, they found out The investigators

343
00:20:24,040 --> 00:20:27,520
Speaker 1: determined that there had not been a fire built, even

344
00:20:27,520 --> 00:20:30,879
Speaker 1: though there were paperback novels, there was wood, furniture, there

345
00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:34,359
Speaker 1: were matches, like everything was there to build a fire.

346
00:20:34,760 --> 00:20:38,320
Speaker 1: And not only that, but there was a propane tank

347
00:20:39,040 --> 00:20:41,159
Speaker 1: that all they had to do, Uh, it was in

348
00:20:41,200 --> 00:20:43,760
Speaker 1: another shed outside. All they had to do was open

349
00:20:43,800 --> 00:20:49,560
Speaker 1: this thing on and they would have actually had gas heat, yes, Het, right,

350
00:20:49,800 --> 00:20:52,560
Speaker 1: they didn't. They also didn't even um cover up the

351
00:20:52,680 --> 00:20:55,720
Speaker 1: broken window that they used to get into the trailer.

352
00:20:56,520 --> 00:21:01,440
Speaker 1: It's just weird, just bizarre decision after bizarre decision, right. Yeah.

353
00:21:01,640 --> 00:21:05,040
Speaker 1: So there's one other thing in the trailer that that is,

354
00:21:05,119 --> 00:21:10,880
Speaker 1: um pretty interesting. They find Gary Matthias's tennis shoes. So

355
00:21:11,080 --> 00:21:15,119
Speaker 1: Gary mathias Is tennis shoes are there, and um, Ted

356
00:21:15,160 --> 00:21:19,760
Speaker 1: Weir's shoes leather shoes are missing. Uh. And what they

357
00:21:19,800 --> 00:21:23,800
Speaker 1: think possibly is that Gary Matthias was in the trailer

358
00:21:23,840 --> 00:21:27,399
Speaker 1: with Ted. Ted had terrible frostbite. Ted would have had

359
00:21:27,440 --> 00:21:31,200
Speaker 1: bigger feet than Gary. Gary probably had frostbite too, so

360
00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:34,399
Speaker 1: he used Ted's shoes to put them on and go

361
00:21:34,480 --> 00:21:38,600
Speaker 1: back out into the wilderness. Yeah. I mean they pretty

362
00:21:38,680 --> 00:21:43,000
Speaker 1: much determined that probably all five of those guys were

363
00:21:43,400 --> 00:21:46,080
Speaker 1: in here at one point. Okay, so I have to

364
00:21:46,080 --> 00:21:49,560
Speaker 1: say that's that's I don't think that's true really because

365
00:21:49,560 --> 00:21:53,959
Speaker 1: that's what I saw. So I think so what I

366
00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:56,720
Speaker 1: saw was that they so, okay, we should probably tell

367
00:21:56,720 --> 00:22:00,919
Speaker 1: everybody that the we should continue on, Chuck. But the like,

368
00:22:00,960 --> 00:22:03,239
Speaker 1: I think a day after they found Ted Weir, they

369
00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:05,960
Speaker 1: started looking around the area and they started finding the

370
00:22:05,960 --> 00:22:10,240
Speaker 1: other boys remains. Yeah, and you know this is thanks

371
00:22:10,280 --> 00:22:13,479
Speaker 1: to what I said would be sort of the lead investigator, uh,

372
00:22:13,640 --> 00:22:17,159
Speaker 1: Uba County Lieutenant Lance Ayers, who actually had gone to

373
00:22:17,240 --> 00:22:20,080
Speaker 1: high school with We're uh didn't know him that well,

374
00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:23,760
Speaker 1: but he was really consumed by this case UM and

375
00:22:23,840 --> 00:22:26,600
Speaker 1: seems sort of obsessed with trying to solve it to

376
00:22:26,680 --> 00:22:30,560
Speaker 1: the point where he was chasing down leads from psychics.

377
00:22:30,600 --> 00:22:33,360
Speaker 1: At one point, Yeah, apparently he met with a psychic

378
00:22:33,400 --> 00:22:37,560
Speaker 1: who um I told him that the boys were in

379
00:22:37,960 --> 00:22:41,359
Speaker 1: Araville or had been murdered in a red house either

380
00:22:41,440 --> 00:22:45,720
Speaker 1: brick or stained in Oraville with the house number UM

381
00:22:45,760 --> 00:22:49,480
Speaker 1: either four four seven to three or four seven five three.

382
00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:52,320
Speaker 1: And Lance Ayers was so consumed with this that he

383
00:22:52,400 --> 00:22:55,640
Speaker 1: actually drove every street of Oraville over a two day

384
00:22:55,640 --> 00:22:58,280
Speaker 1: period trying to find that house based on the tip

385
00:22:58,320 --> 00:23:02,720
Speaker 1: of a psychic. That's how Upset TV came with this case. Yeah,

386
00:23:02,880 --> 00:23:05,800
Speaker 1: so we've put a pen in our were they all

387
00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:09,160
Speaker 1: in the cabin debate? We're coming back to that right right,

388
00:23:09,560 --> 00:23:11,720
Speaker 1: All right, So now we pick up a story of

389
00:23:11,760 --> 00:23:15,160
Speaker 1: a man named Joseph Shoens, and this is where things

390
00:23:15,200 --> 00:23:18,320
Speaker 1: get even more odd. So this guy was fifty five

391
00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:22,000
Speaker 1: years old. He got in touch with the cops because,

392
00:23:22,160 --> 00:23:24,160
Speaker 1: you know, some strange things that had happened that night

393
00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:27,760
Speaker 1: of the disappearance. He was gonna go camping with his family,

394
00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:30,760
Speaker 1: um on you know, up that road, and so he

395
00:23:30,800 --> 00:23:34,840
Speaker 1: decided to take his little Volkswagen Beetle um around five

396
00:23:34,880 --> 00:23:37,040
Speaker 1: thirty that evening just to check out the snow line

397
00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:39,560
Speaker 1: to see if it was passable and if it was

398
00:23:39,560 --> 00:23:42,000
Speaker 1: going to be safe to take his family camping that weekend.

399
00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:44,879
Speaker 1: He found out it was not. Yeah, he got his

400
00:23:44,880 --> 00:23:47,840
Speaker 1: his car stuck right right above the snow line. And

401
00:23:47,920 --> 00:23:51,160
Speaker 1: this was to be about fifty yards further than where

402
00:23:51,200 --> 00:23:56,280
Speaker 1: that mercury would eventually be found. Right, so he has

403
00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:59,159
Speaker 1: um he gets out to push a push his Beetle

404
00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:01,480
Speaker 1: right and has a heart attack. He's he's fifty five

405
00:24:01,520 --> 00:24:04,880
Speaker 1: in this nine, which means he he lived on nothing

406
00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:07,280
Speaker 1: but scotch and steak. So you can imagine that that

407
00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:09,159
Speaker 1: was the outcome, right when you have to push your

408
00:24:09,240 --> 00:24:13,560
Speaker 1: Volkswagen Beetle and um, he's like in a bad spot

409
00:24:13,760 --> 00:24:16,439
Speaker 1: right there. He's a phone in the wilderness at the

410
00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:19,480
Speaker 1: snow line of a mountain eight miles away from help.

411
00:24:19,560 --> 00:24:22,160
Speaker 1: That the place that he had stopped to actually get

412
00:24:22,200 --> 00:24:25,159
Speaker 1: a drink probably of scotch on the way up the

413
00:24:25,160 --> 00:24:27,520
Speaker 1: mountain to check out the snow line had been eight

414
00:24:27,600 --> 00:24:30,880
Speaker 1: miles back in the other direction. So he very wisely

415
00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:33,639
Speaker 1: like leaves his car running with the heater on and

416
00:24:33,720 --> 00:24:36,680
Speaker 1: just lays there and tries to collect himself and gather himself.

417
00:24:37,040 --> 00:24:39,320
Speaker 1: And that is a mild heart attack, we should point out,

418
00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:42,160
Speaker 1: but enough that if you, Joseph shown, you are probably

419
00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:46,320
Speaker 1: freaking out on not trying to u diminish like his

420
00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:50,440
Speaker 1: danger level. But it wasn't like, uh, he was like

421
00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:53,320
Speaker 1: laying there near death like he would eventually hike eight

422
00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:57,400
Speaker 1: miles out right after this heart attack. Yes, so he

423
00:24:57,480 --> 00:24:59,760
Speaker 1: but but while he was laying there trying to like

424
00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:04,120
Speaker 1: gather his strength again. So this happened about five thirty

425
00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:08,240
Speaker 1: And he said a couple hours after that, some um

426
00:25:08,800 --> 00:25:11,199
Speaker 1: a car at least one but probably two cars, and

427
00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:13,520
Speaker 1: one of them would have been a pickup truck, came

428
00:25:13,600 --> 00:25:15,800
Speaker 1: up and had their lights on, and he saw the

429
00:25:15,800 --> 00:25:18,439
Speaker 1: silhouettes of some men and a woman with a baby,

430
00:25:18,960 --> 00:25:22,400
Speaker 1: and he said he called out to them, and they

431
00:25:22,440 --> 00:25:25,400
Speaker 1: ignored it and turned off the lights, and he got

432
00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:28,040
Speaker 1: back in his car, and he said he laid there

433
00:25:28,080 --> 00:25:32,600
Speaker 1: for another few hours before he heard some whistling sounds

434
00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:36,719
Speaker 1: and some flashlight beams a little further down the mountain,

435
00:25:36,960 --> 00:25:40,080
Speaker 1: probably about fifty yards. Uh. And that would have been

436
00:25:40,119 --> 00:25:42,320
Speaker 1: a couple of hours, probably about five or six hours

437
00:25:42,359 --> 00:25:47,000
Speaker 1: after his um his heart attack. And they think that

438
00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:51,600
Speaker 1: the second group at least was the the five boys

439
00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:55,199
Speaker 1: with Gary Matthias. Yeah, and well I think at this

440
00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:58,000
Speaker 1: point they were right outside his car window. Yeah. So

441
00:25:58,119 --> 00:26:02,000
Speaker 1: again he gets out, calls for help, and the whistling

442
00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:05,240
Speaker 1: sounds stopped, and the flashlights get turned off, and so

443
00:26:05,280 --> 00:26:07,399
Speaker 1: he goes back in his car and lays back down,

444
00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:10,680
Speaker 1: and he's like to two groups of people have come

445
00:26:10,760 --> 00:26:13,320
Speaker 1: up this mountain. I'm having a heart attack here, and

446
00:26:13,359 --> 00:26:15,679
Speaker 1: somehow calling for help has chased both of both of

447
00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:19,760
Speaker 1: them off, both groups off. Yeah. So that that Volkswagen Beetle,

448
00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:21,920
Speaker 1: like I can tell you from experience, had of like

449
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:25,760
Speaker 1: an eight gallon gas tank, so it eventually runs out

450
00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:30,119
Speaker 1: of gas. Um it Also now they think about it

451
00:26:30,119 --> 00:26:34,040
Speaker 1: doesn't have a very efficient heating system, like, uh, my

452
00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:37,280
Speaker 1: first Beetle didn't even have a fan. We just called

453
00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:39,680
Speaker 1: it the ankle burner, Like if you when you turned

454
00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:43,000
Speaker 1: on the heat, it literally just opened vents on the

455
00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:47,400
Speaker 1: floorboard that like came straight off the engine. Wow, that's

456
00:26:47,640 --> 00:26:50,639
Speaker 1: that's sharp design. So you wouldn't even like you had

457
00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:52,720
Speaker 1: to be moving for there to be actually a hot

458
00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:56,320
Speaker 1: air running through it. Man. But I do know that

459
00:26:56,560 --> 00:26:59,560
Speaker 1: I had another Beetle that had that did have a

460
00:26:59,560 --> 00:27:02,600
Speaker 1: little fan end. So let's just presume that Shans had

461
00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:05,200
Speaker 1: the fan. I'm not going to I'm going to presume

462
00:27:05,240 --> 00:27:07,879
Speaker 1: the opposite, Okay, I'm going to presume that this was

463
00:27:07,920 --> 00:27:10,760
Speaker 1: a hellish experience for him in every way, all right.

464
00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:14,280
Speaker 1: So eventually the car runs out of gas. Uh, it's

465
00:27:14,320 --> 00:27:17,080
Speaker 1: still dark, and he manages after this heart attack, like

466
00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:20,399
Speaker 1: I said earlier, to walk eight miles to a lodge

467
00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:22,359
Speaker 1: called the Mountain House. Is that where he had gotten

468
00:27:22,359 --> 00:27:24,960
Speaker 1: the drink? Yeah? All right. So he comes back and

469
00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:29,840
Speaker 1: they're like Showans, and he's like, don't shows me. You

470
00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:32,600
Speaker 1: have no idea what I've been through. Uh. It turns

471
00:27:32,600 --> 00:27:35,800
Speaker 1: out it's pretty serious. And on the way out he

472
00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:39,240
Speaker 1: passes this Montego sitting empty in the middle of the

473
00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:42,440
Speaker 1: road about fifty yards further down the mountain behind his car,

474
00:27:42,480 --> 00:27:45,240
Speaker 1: where he stopped at the snow line. That's right. So

475
00:27:45,520 --> 00:27:48,280
Speaker 1: Showance doesn't think much of this. He just is like, Okay,

476
00:27:48,280 --> 00:27:49,840
Speaker 1: well there's a car in the middle of the road

477
00:27:49,880 --> 00:27:51,920
Speaker 1: the snow lines here. I'm not the only one who

478
00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:54,280
Speaker 1: got stuck last night. Those guys are jerks for not

479
00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:57,119
Speaker 1: coming to my aid when I shouted for help. And

480
00:27:57,160 --> 00:27:59,639
Speaker 1: he he doesn't think much of it until all of

481
00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:02,880
Speaker 1: a sudd on the news he starts seeing these reports

482
00:28:02,880 --> 00:28:04,959
Speaker 1: of these five guys who went missing the same night

483
00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:06,840
Speaker 1: that he had his heart attack on the same road,

484
00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:10,359
Speaker 1: in the same mountain, and he came forward and the

485
00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:14,840
Speaker 1: cops figured out like that, Joseph Shohnes was probably the

486
00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:20,240
Speaker 1: last person to see those five guys alive. Uh. Well, yeah,

487
00:28:20,359 --> 00:28:23,920
Speaker 1: they're silhouettes at least. Yeah. Uh should we take a break?

488
00:28:24,359 --> 00:28:26,320
Speaker 1: I think so. Man, all right, we're gonna take a

489
00:28:26,320 --> 00:28:29,600
Speaker 1: break and get to some more uh sad discoveries right

490
00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:59,560
Speaker 1: after this. Okay, we're back, Chuck, we are you promised,

491
00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:02,760
Speaker 1: more said discoveries laid on him. All right. So the

492
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:06,160
Speaker 1: next day, after Weird's body had been found, you know,

493
00:29:06,240 --> 00:29:09,000
Speaker 1: the search is really on at this point. Uh, they

494
00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:13,240
Speaker 1: found a few things. They found the remains of Sterling

495
00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:16,880
Speaker 1: and Madruga there on different sides of the road. Uh,

496
00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:19,440
Speaker 1: that same road that led to the trailer, but about

497
00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:23,239
Speaker 1: eleven and a half miles from the car, right, so

498
00:29:23,280 --> 00:29:27,440
Speaker 1: presumably another what nine miles from the trailer, Yes, which

499
00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:29,440
Speaker 1: is why I think that they never made it to

500
00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:35,240
Speaker 1: the trailer. Put a pin in that. Uh. Madruga had

501
00:29:35,360 --> 00:29:39,239
Speaker 1: very gruesomely been partially eaten by animals, of course up

502
00:29:39,240 --> 00:29:43,040
Speaker 1: there on the mountains, probably after he had died though, Yeah, yeah, yeah,

503
00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:45,720
Speaker 1: I think it sounds like all of this was they

504
00:29:45,920 --> 00:29:48,840
Speaker 1: succumbed to nature and then the animals kind of took

505
00:29:48,840 --> 00:29:52,120
Speaker 1: it from there, right. Uh, So they dragged his body

506
00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:55,520
Speaker 1: to a stream. Uh, he's laying their face up, they said,

507
00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:58,560
Speaker 1: with his hand curled around his watch. And then Sterling

508
00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:02,320
Speaker 1: was in the woods and very gruesomely they said that

509
00:30:02,400 --> 00:30:05,160
Speaker 1: his remains were, or his bones I guess, were scattered

510
00:30:05,160 --> 00:30:09,040
Speaker 1: over about fifty ft yes. And then I think a

511
00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:11,600
Speaker 1: day or so after that, there was another search party

512
00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:15,040
Speaker 1: that was launched, and Jackie Hewitt's father insisted on being

513
00:30:15,280 --> 00:30:18,120
Speaker 1: a part of it, and Jackie Hewitt was still missing,

514
00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:20,760
Speaker 1: and very sadly his dad was the one who discovered

515
00:30:20,800 --> 00:30:25,240
Speaker 1: his remains. He found um, his son's I think spine

516
00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:28,080
Speaker 1: is what he came upon. Yeah, in the same road,

517
00:30:28,200 --> 00:30:31,080
Speaker 1: a lot closer to the trailer though, but he right,

518
00:30:31,480 --> 00:30:34,960
Speaker 1: like just a quarter mile or something, right, Uh yeah,

519
00:30:34,960 --> 00:30:37,640
Speaker 1: I think that's about right, something very very close to it.

520
00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:41,800
Speaker 1: And they also found, um, his his clothes. They knew

521
00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:44,000
Speaker 1: it was him because he was His levies and his

522
00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:47,320
Speaker 1: shirt were also found nearby, and so were um. He

523
00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:51,960
Speaker 1: was wearing very stylish platform shoes called get Their's, which

524
00:30:52,000 --> 00:30:54,800
Speaker 1: I had to look up and they were actually pretty fresh. Yeah,

525
00:30:54,960 --> 00:30:56,400
Speaker 1: not nothing the kind of shoes that you want to

526
00:30:56,400 --> 00:30:59,240
Speaker 1: be hiking around the snowy woods in. No, definitely not.

527
00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:02,840
Speaker 1: I mean again, platform shoes. They're like, um, you know

528
00:31:02,920 --> 00:31:06,560
Speaker 1: that that uh that rubbery sold thing that like you

529
00:31:06,600 --> 00:31:10,080
Speaker 1: find in like Clark's, like Clark Wallabyes, like the thick

530
00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:12,920
Speaker 1: rubbery so I think it's called crepe sold They were

531
00:31:12,960 --> 00:31:17,320
Speaker 1: like those, but platform shoes and like a rippley bottom. Yeah,

532
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:21,040
Speaker 1: probably look at these things. Yeah, they're probably the worst,

533
00:31:21,640 --> 00:31:24,640
Speaker 1: the worst hiking shoes you could ever imagine what these

534
00:31:24,680 --> 00:31:28,880
Speaker 1: would be good for actually catching ladies? Probably, right, I guess.

535
00:31:29,240 --> 00:31:32,280
Speaker 1: I mean they're pretty they're pretty cool that that wavy

536
00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:35,160
Speaker 1: soul though looks so strange. Well I look that up.

537
00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:37,400
Speaker 1: It's it's to keep your center of balance when you're

538
00:31:37,440 --> 00:31:41,240
Speaker 1: way up there. Okay, yeah, well that makes more sense. Then. Yeah,

539
00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:42,880
Speaker 1: there were there was a lot of thought put into

540
00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:48,360
Speaker 1: those shoes. Uh. And then finally the next day there

541
00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:52,160
Speaker 1: was a skull discovered about a hundred yards downhill, and

542
00:31:52,240 --> 00:31:57,760
Speaker 1: that was the final remains from Jackie Hewitt. So they

543
00:31:57,800 --> 00:32:02,440
Speaker 1: found everybody, every dy that is, except for Gary Matthias.

544
00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:05,440
Speaker 1: He was still missing and he's he still is. Actually,

545
00:32:05,440 --> 00:32:08,640
Speaker 1: if you go on the Yuba County Sheriff's website on

546
00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:11,680
Speaker 1: their missing person's page, he's still listed there. Yeah, his

547
00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:16,760
Speaker 1: shoes were inside again and that trailer um, which you

548
00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:19,120
Speaker 1: know that They can't say anything for sure, though, but

549
00:32:19,440 --> 00:32:21,280
Speaker 1: it suggests that he was in there at one point,

550
00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:23,880
Speaker 1: and they surmised that he may have, like you said,

551
00:32:23,920 --> 00:32:26,960
Speaker 1: taken them off to where the leather shoes guests, presumably

552
00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:30,720
Speaker 1: because they were warmer, or his feet were frost bitten

553
00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:34,560
Speaker 1: and had swollen, so he needed the bigger shoes um

554
00:32:34,600 --> 00:32:38,080
Speaker 1: to strike out back outside like he was. He was like,

555
00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:40,400
Speaker 1: I can't go out there barefoot, and I can't get

556
00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:43,360
Speaker 1: my tennis shoes on any longer. Yeah, And so to

557
00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:45,640
Speaker 1: deal with Matthias, like we said, he was under treatment

558
00:32:45,680 --> 00:32:49,560
Speaker 1: for schizophrenia. UM. He was in the army in Germany,

559
00:32:49,640 --> 00:32:53,840
Speaker 1: and apparently UM had occasions post war where he had

560
00:32:53,880 --> 00:32:56,600
Speaker 1: become violent. He was charged with the salt a couple

561
00:32:56,640 --> 00:33:01,080
Speaker 1: of times. But UM all accounts say that for the

562
00:33:01,160 --> 00:33:04,000
Speaker 1: at least the last two years he had really been

563
00:33:04,040 --> 00:33:07,240
Speaker 1: on his meds. He had been working in his stepdad's business.

564
00:33:07,880 --> 00:33:10,360
Speaker 1: He was They called him one of the our sterling

565
00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:13,560
Speaker 1: success cases, as doctor did. Yeah, and they were really,

566
00:33:13,720 --> 00:33:16,440
Speaker 1: you know, he was really coming around and hadn't had

567
00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:18,840
Speaker 1: any what is his dad he said, he called them

568
00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:21,840
Speaker 1: haywire episodes. Yeah, I hadn't had one of those in

569
00:33:22,400 --> 00:33:25,680
Speaker 1: in a in a couple of years. And the stepfather

570
00:33:25,760 --> 00:33:28,080
Speaker 1: said that he had. He had been taking his meds

571
00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:30,680
Speaker 1: the week he disappeared, right, and his stepfather would know

572
00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:33,840
Speaker 1: because his stepfather owned a gardening business, and um Gary

573
00:33:33,880 --> 00:33:36,440
Speaker 1: Mathias had been working with him side by side for

574
00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:39,160
Speaker 1: a couple of years by that time. So he he

575
00:33:39,200 --> 00:33:42,560
Speaker 1: also didn't seem like one to really mince words or bs.

576
00:33:42,640 --> 00:33:45,040
Speaker 1: So I take him for his word that his his

577
00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:49,080
Speaker 1: son was fully medicated and his schizophrenia was under control.

578
00:33:49,080 --> 00:33:53,840
Speaker 1: It sounds like so. Um, the problem is is he

579
00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:58,920
Speaker 1: hadn't taken his pills with him, so if he did survive, Um,

580
00:33:59,000 --> 00:34:02,480
Speaker 1: he he had, he had gone without him. He left

581
00:34:02,560 --> 00:34:04,120
Speaker 1: him at home, and the reason why he left him

582
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:06,320
Speaker 1: at home is because he fully expected to be back

583
00:34:06,320 --> 00:34:10,960
Speaker 1: home a couple hours after he left for the basketball game. Yeah,

584
00:34:11,320 --> 00:34:15,000
Speaker 1: no more evidence that, Like, it's just really bizarre that

585
00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:17,759
Speaker 1: they went anywhere but home, and that raised a lot

586
00:34:17,840 --> 00:34:22,839
Speaker 1: of questions for the families. Um. Back in the day,

587
00:34:22,640 --> 00:34:29,120
Speaker 1: the I think Madruga's mom, Mabel, was very vocal about

588
00:34:29,120 --> 00:34:34,640
Speaker 1: her belief that, um, somebody had either tricked or threatened

589
00:34:35,239 --> 00:34:38,279
Speaker 1: her son and the other boys into going up that

590
00:34:38,320 --> 00:34:43,920
Speaker 1: mountain or um it was somebody else was was responsible

591
00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:48,960
Speaker 1: for for this series of decisions. Yeah. So they learned

592
00:34:49,000 --> 00:34:53,360
Speaker 1: a few things afterwards that are sort of clues but

593
00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:57,080
Speaker 1: never ended up solving anything. Um. One is that a

594
00:34:57,480 --> 00:35:00,560
Speaker 1: snow cat for a service snow cat had been up

595
00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:03,320
Speaker 1: that road. I think what the just the day before

596
00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:07,000
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, I think and packed in a path of

597
00:35:07,040 --> 00:35:10,719
Speaker 1: snow so it was walkable. So they you know, it

598
00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:14,160
Speaker 1: led up to that trailer, and they surmised that the

599
00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:16,320
Speaker 1: boys may have this might have been the only walkable

600
00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:19,040
Speaker 1: path forward, so they might have followed that path to

601
00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:22,239
Speaker 1: the trailer. Uh. They hired a water witcher at one

602
00:35:22,239 --> 00:35:27,319
Speaker 1: point and uh he was in Paradise, California, and he

603
00:35:27,360 --> 00:35:30,760
Speaker 1: said that he fixed his little uh is it dibbening

604
00:35:30,840 --> 00:35:35,120
Speaker 1: or divining divining rod to pick up human minerals and

605
00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:38,799
Speaker 1: traces of humans. That led them to another cabin where

606
00:35:38,840 --> 00:35:43,080
Speaker 1: they found a disposable lighter and this was about three

607
00:35:43,160 --> 00:35:47,200
Speaker 1: quarters a mile from the trailer where they found the body.

608
00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:50,160
Speaker 1: And all the parents said, no, like, they didn't have

609
00:35:50,239 --> 00:35:52,920
Speaker 1: a lighter like this. The guys didn't carry a lighter, right,

610
00:35:53,600 --> 00:35:55,600
Speaker 1: So there were a lot of dead ends like that.

611
00:35:55,920 --> 00:35:58,120
Speaker 1: And then like that, for example, that watch that had

612
00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:00,359
Speaker 1: been found with Ted weird that it was sing it's

613
00:36:00,360 --> 00:36:03,120
Speaker 1: crystal and you know, all the families said, that wasn't

614
00:36:03,120 --> 00:36:06,319
Speaker 1: any of our boys watch. I mean, it could be

615
00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:09,600
Speaker 1: totally meaningless. It could have been a forest ranger who

616
00:36:09,680 --> 00:36:11,759
Speaker 1: had left the watch behind because it had broken or

617
00:36:11,800 --> 00:36:15,520
Speaker 1: something like that. But that's most of the evidence in

618
00:36:15,560 --> 00:36:18,520
Speaker 1: this case, or just those just little dead ends. Yeah,

619
00:36:18,520 --> 00:36:21,960
Speaker 1: that Gary Mathias apparently knew some people, and they're really

620
00:36:22,040 --> 00:36:25,480
Speaker 1: just sort of reaching at this point new people in Forbestown,

621
00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:29,400
Speaker 1: which is about halfway between Chico and Uba City, And

622
00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:33,120
Speaker 1: apparently the turn is easy to miss, and there was

623
00:36:33,239 --> 00:36:36,400
Speaker 1: some speculation like maybe he was taking his buddies to

624
00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:40,160
Speaker 1: go see these people he knew got lost, but apparently

625
00:36:40,200 --> 00:36:42,200
Speaker 1: those friends were like, we hadn't seen him in years,

626
00:36:42,239 --> 00:36:44,160
Speaker 1: and it would be really like unlikely that he just

627
00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:46,839
Speaker 1: would have randomly come to visit. Yeah. I could also

628
00:36:46,880 --> 00:36:49,239
Speaker 1: see the other boys not wanting to go along with

629
00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:52,120
Speaker 1: that too, because they had that basketball game in the

630
00:36:52,160 --> 00:36:54,799
Speaker 1: morning that they all wanted to be um fresh as

631
00:36:54,840 --> 00:36:57,720
Speaker 1: a daisy for it too. Yeah. And and like Gary

632
00:36:57,719 --> 00:37:00,239
Speaker 1: Mathias had been badgering his mom, I think, like you said,

633
00:37:00,239 --> 00:37:02,600
Speaker 1: to make sure he didn't oversleep the next morning because

634
00:37:02,600 --> 00:37:06,120
Speaker 1: he was excited about that basketball game too. Yeah. So

635
00:37:06,200 --> 00:37:08,719
Speaker 1: the thing is, though, Chuck, is even if let's say

636
00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:10,520
Speaker 1: that is the case, Let's say that they all got

637
00:37:10,560 --> 00:37:12,399
Speaker 1: a wild hair and they decided to go see Gary

638
00:37:12,440 --> 00:37:16,920
Speaker 1: Mathias's friend and they started up this mountain because they

639
00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:19,239
Speaker 1: got lost. They missed the turn off and ended up

640
00:37:19,320 --> 00:37:21,959
Speaker 1: on a mountain road at the snow line. I thought

641
00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:26,839
Speaker 1: the car was stuck. What why why would all of them,

642
00:37:26,880 --> 00:37:30,160
Speaker 1: all of them collectively and individually, say well, let's go

643
00:37:30,320 --> 00:37:34,000
Speaker 1: up rather than back down. Let's go up into the snow.

644
00:37:34,280 --> 00:37:37,759
Speaker 1: Supposedly the snow driss for six eight ft um and

645
00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:39,480
Speaker 1: even if it was packed down with the snow cat,

646
00:37:39,480 --> 00:37:44,160
Speaker 1: it doesn't make sense to go forward unless they thought, well,

647
00:37:44,320 --> 00:37:47,680
Speaker 1: the last side of civilization behind us was too far right,

648
00:37:47,840 --> 00:37:50,560
Speaker 1: Maybe there's something up here which is a thing that's

649
00:37:50,600 --> 00:37:53,879
Speaker 1: a that's an economic theory called sunk cost, where you're

650
00:37:53,920 --> 00:37:56,560
Speaker 1: so invested in something, you're so far along that you

651
00:37:56,600 --> 00:37:59,360
Speaker 1: don't want to just stop and turn back or or quit.

652
00:37:59,719 --> 00:38:02,440
Speaker 1: So it's possible that that was that aided in their

653
00:38:02,440 --> 00:38:05,279
Speaker 1: decision making. But again, okay, so then let's say that

654
00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:08,000
Speaker 1: they're like, okay, the snow cat track is gonna lead

655
00:38:08,080 --> 00:38:10,640
Speaker 1: us to safety or something. When they get to the trailer,

656
00:38:10,719 --> 00:38:13,040
Speaker 1: like why not eat the food? Why not make a fire?

657
00:38:13,120 --> 00:38:15,520
Speaker 1: I can I can even see missing the propane tank,

658
00:38:15,840 --> 00:38:19,359
Speaker 1: just not being you know, um, just with it enough

659
00:38:19,560 --> 00:38:22,640
Speaker 1: from the harrowing experience that you could just totally miss

660
00:38:22,680 --> 00:38:25,000
Speaker 1: the propane tank. And I even think that your trailer

661
00:38:25,040 --> 00:38:26,640
Speaker 1: is going to have that kind of thing. But the

662
00:38:26,680 --> 00:38:29,640
Speaker 1: food that you've already started to eat, that you already

663
00:38:29,640 --> 00:38:31,719
Speaker 1: show you have a can opener and know how to

664
00:38:31,840 --> 00:38:34,120
Speaker 1: use it. Like, how do you just starve to death

665
00:38:34,160 --> 00:38:37,320
Speaker 1: after that? Well, I mean the food. The other food

666
00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:40,359
Speaker 1: was in a locker they never opened apparently. But like,

667
00:38:40,480 --> 00:38:44,360
Speaker 1: if you're there, especially for two to three months, like

668
00:38:44,400 --> 00:38:48,720
Speaker 1: you're turning over everything, You're lighting a fire with whatever

669
00:38:48,760 --> 00:38:50,560
Speaker 1: you can get your hands on. Those plenty of stuff

670
00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:54,360
Speaker 1: to make a fire. Uh. What's up with the supposed

671
00:38:54,360 --> 00:38:57,880
Speaker 1: woman and the baby? That could be chalked up maybe

672
00:38:57,880 --> 00:39:02,160
Speaker 1: pretty easily to uh what was his name? Snopes, shoots shows,

673
00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:07,319
Speaker 1: Shans Snopes snoop talk that could be chalked up to

674
00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:09,400
Speaker 1: him in the state of a heart attack in the

675
00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:11,879
Speaker 1: middle of the night, just sort of seeing things could

676
00:39:11,880 --> 00:39:14,160
Speaker 1: have been or could have just been an entirely different

677
00:39:14,200 --> 00:39:17,080
Speaker 1: party of people who had nothing to do with it

678
00:39:17,200 --> 00:39:20,359
Speaker 1: or everything to do with it, But it could have

679
00:39:20,440 --> 00:39:22,200
Speaker 1: They could have been there too. I mean it was

680
00:39:22,680 --> 00:39:25,080
Speaker 1: you know, it was a mountain. Some people lived on it.

681
00:39:25,360 --> 00:39:28,880
Speaker 1: Some people apparently like camp there, which is what Shones

682
00:39:28,960 --> 00:39:31,839
Speaker 1: was scouting for. You know, how did Matthias never get

683
00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:35,280
Speaker 1: found at all? I don't know I saw him. I think, Uh,

684
00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:40,399
Speaker 1: I think. At the end of the WAPO article, um

685
00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:45,440
Speaker 1: Cynthia Gorney, the journalist, says that, um, probably, you know,

686
00:39:45,560 --> 00:39:48,719
Speaker 1: he laid there on the snow somewhere that they just

687
00:39:48,760 --> 00:39:52,000
Speaker 1: didn't find or overlooked, or he got buried in the snow,

688
00:39:52,040 --> 00:39:53,920
Speaker 1: and then when the thaw came, he sunk down to

689
00:39:53,960 --> 00:39:57,600
Speaker 1: the ground and was covered over by some some mountain vines.

690
00:39:58,080 --> 00:40:00,200
Speaker 1: I guess so. But it seems like after all these

691
00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:04,000
Speaker 1: years a bone or one of those leather shoes or

692
00:40:04,120 --> 00:40:07,840
Speaker 1: something would have been found. Yeah, you'd think both of

693
00:40:07,880 --> 00:40:10,440
Speaker 1: those would still be intact. Yeah, I mean, what I

694
00:40:10,480 --> 00:40:13,799
Speaker 1: did not see was any sort of speculation that he

695
00:40:13,880 --> 00:40:19,040
Speaker 1: had had any nefarious like actions. Um, but we did

696
00:40:19,120 --> 00:40:23,000
Speaker 1: put a pin in something. I don't remember what it was.

697
00:40:23,160 --> 00:40:25,880
Speaker 1: I saw a couple of theories that they they speculate

698
00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:28,799
Speaker 1: that all of these guys went to the cabin at

699
00:40:28,840 --> 00:40:33,479
Speaker 1: one point and maybe, uh, we are wasn't doing so well,

700
00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:36,600
Speaker 1: so they all set out independently to go look for

701
00:40:36,680 --> 00:40:41,520
Speaker 1: help and each died or maybe in pairs, maybe since

702
00:40:41,520 --> 00:40:43,800
Speaker 1: the two guys were kind of found together. But I

703
00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:45,839
Speaker 1: don't know. I mean, it's all just speculation. You saw

704
00:40:45,920 --> 00:40:50,080
Speaker 1: that they don't think they were all there? Yeah, what

705
00:40:50,200 --> 00:40:54,719
Speaker 1: I saw was that um Jackie Hewitt and um Bill

706
00:40:54,800 --> 00:40:59,160
Speaker 1: Sterling and um Jack Madruga hadn't had never made it

707
00:40:59,200 --> 00:41:01,600
Speaker 1: to the to the trailer, that they would have split

708
00:41:01,680 --> 00:41:04,960
Speaker 1: up on the way up. No, No, that they were,

709
00:41:05,360 --> 00:41:11,440
Speaker 1: That they had um or died during that twenty mile hike. Yes, interesting.

710
00:41:11,560 --> 00:41:15,920
Speaker 1: And then Ted and Gary had continued on upped and

711
00:41:16,000 --> 00:41:18,040
Speaker 1: made it, made it to the trailer, and then what

712
00:41:18,120 --> 00:41:22,360
Speaker 1: I think happened after that was Gary nurse Ted. Gary

713
00:41:22,400 --> 00:41:24,640
Speaker 1: had been in the army and the can opener that

714
00:41:24,719 --> 00:41:27,360
Speaker 1: was there was actually a very simple thing called the

715
00:41:27,440 --> 00:41:30,279
Speaker 1: P thirty eight, but you kind of had to have

716
00:41:30,360 --> 00:41:33,080
Speaker 1: been in the army to to know how to use it,

717
00:41:33,239 --> 00:41:35,319
Speaker 1: and Ted wouldn't have been and Gary would have been,

718
00:41:35,880 --> 00:41:40,040
Speaker 1: So I think Gary may have stayed, probably fed both

719
00:41:40,080 --> 00:41:42,600
Speaker 1: of them, and then like you said, seeing Ted was

720
00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:45,440
Speaker 1: not doing so well, set out again with Ted shoes

721
00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:49,960
Speaker 1: and died um going off to get helps somehow, That's

722
00:41:49,960 --> 00:41:52,520
Speaker 1: what I think happened. Yeah, I would have think they

723
00:41:52,600 --> 00:41:54,000
Speaker 1: get split up on the way up though, Like I

724
00:41:54,320 --> 00:41:57,680
Speaker 1: just don't even know, like these guys would have died

725
00:41:57,880 --> 00:42:00,879
Speaker 1: that quickly on on the way on this twenty mile hike,

726
00:42:01,160 --> 00:42:05,439
Speaker 1: I mean six to eight foot snow drifts. That's cold. Yeah,

727
00:42:05,480 --> 00:42:08,720
Speaker 1: but they're also on this snow packed trail supposedly. Sure,

728
00:42:08,880 --> 00:42:13,040
Speaker 1: but they also have like they're dressed for mild weather,

729
00:42:13,120 --> 00:42:16,240
Speaker 1: Like they didn't have jackets, sweaters, their shoes were like

730
00:42:16,239 --> 00:42:20,600
Speaker 1: like like converse kind of things, aside from the the

731
00:42:20,680 --> 00:42:25,120
Speaker 1: platform shoes that, like I did, it's entirely possible that

732
00:42:25,400 --> 00:42:30,640
Speaker 1: twenty mile hike up a mountain they succumbed to the weather. Yeah,

733
00:42:30,680 --> 00:42:34,000
Speaker 1: And you also, like it was hard to determine what

734
00:42:34,120 --> 00:42:41,600
Speaker 1: level of intellectual impairment these boys had, so I don't

735
00:42:41,600 --> 00:42:44,359
Speaker 1: know how much that plays into it, if at all.

736
00:42:45,200 --> 00:42:47,920
Speaker 1: Like when they get to this cabin, like did um

737
00:42:48,120 --> 00:42:50,959
Speaker 1: Matthias is because you know he didn't have his meds

738
00:42:51,000 --> 00:42:54,080
Speaker 1: after that, did he start kind of breaking down with

739
00:42:54,080 --> 00:43:00,120
Speaker 1: with some episodes of schizophrenia and leave? Did the other

740
00:43:00,160 --> 00:43:02,239
Speaker 1: guy not fully understand? I mean at that point, he's

741
00:43:02,239 --> 00:43:06,960
Speaker 1: exhausted and maybe hurt and scared. Was he not even

742
00:43:07,080 --> 00:43:09,600
Speaker 1: able to figure out maybe to light a fire light

743
00:43:09,640 --> 00:43:12,120
Speaker 1: of fire or how to use that can opener or

744
00:43:12,239 --> 00:43:14,520
Speaker 1: maybe he felt he couldn't get out of bed because

745
00:43:14,560 --> 00:43:18,760
Speaker 1: of his feet. Yeah, and he he was just stuck

746
00:43:18,840 --> 00:43:22,200
Speaker 1: there after Gary struck out to go get help that

747
00:43:22,280 --> 00:43:24,239
Speaker 1: there was nothing he could do, and the poor guy

748
00:43:24,320 --> 00:43:26,839
Speaker 1: starved to death. But what were they doing up there

749
00:43:26,840 --> 00:43:30,600
Speaker 1: to begin with? That's the basic root of this whole thing. Yeah,

750
00:43:30,640 --> 00:43:34,040
Speaker 1: but that's that's why they call this the American diet

751
00:43:34,080 --> 00:43:37,319
Speaker 1: law pass Right, we gotta do an episode on that

752
00:43:37,360 --> 00:43:39,640
Speaker 1: one too. But because there's some there's like a mystery

753
00:43:39,640 --> 00:43:41,879
Speaker 1: within a mystery within a mystery, there's so many many

754
00:43:42,040 --> 00:43:45,920
Speaker 1: like other mysteries. Yeah, that that just kind of um

755
00:43:46,280 --> 00:43:49,799
Speaker 1: crescendo from the first mystery, which is what were they

756
00:43:49,840 --> 00:43:53,200
Speaker 1: doing there? Yeah? Well, like and like you said, some

757
00:43:53,239 --> 00:43:56,640
Speaker 1: of the parents firmly believe like they witnessed something at

758
00:43:56,640 --> 00:44:03,520
Speaker 1: this basketball game and we're then chased up this mountain. Yeah,

759
00:44:03,680 --> 00:44:05,719
Speaker 1: Like I don't even know what that means, like like

760
00:44:05,760 --> 00:44:08,799
Speaker 1: they witnessed a crime, I came after him or something.

761
00:44:08,920 --> 00:44:12,960
Speaker 1: That's what Ted Weird sister in law always believed. And

762
00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:15,840
Speaker 1: speaking of Ted Weir, you got anything else on this, no,

763
00:44:16,120 --> 00:44:18,960
Speaker 1: except to only say if that was the case, then

764
00:44:19,280 --> 00:44:22,520
Speaker 1: why was the car seemingly driven very slowly and carefully

765
00:44:22,560 --> 00:44:25,920
Speaker 1: up this road? If they were being chased. Oh okay,

766
00:44:25,960 --> 00:44:27,600
Speaker 1: So you make a good point. And I think I

767
00:44:27,600 --> 00:44:31,360
Speaker 1: saw that elsewhere too, that that like that virtually proves

768
00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:36,120
Speaker 1: that they weren't chased. If anything, it shows that they

769
00:44:36,160 --> 00:44:38,960
Speaker 1: that that says something happened to them and somebody ditched

770
00:44:39,000 --> 00:44:42,200
Speaker 1: their car. Who who knew the area? I think more

771
00:44:42,280 --> 00:44:46,000
Speaker 1: likely um Jack Madrugo. It just would have driven extraordinarily

772
00:44:46,040 --> 00:44:49,600
Speaker 1: slowly because this is his, his baby car. Yeah, it's

773
00:44:49,600 --> 00:44:51,520
Speaker 1: all just very sad. I think it's just one of those.

774
00:44:52,560 --> 00:44:55,360
Speaker 1: It's probably like Okam's razor. It's probably the most simple

775
00:44:55,360 --> 00:45:00,279
Speaker 1: explanation is you know, maybe they just went on a

776
00:45:00,320 --> 00:45:03,959
Speaker 1: little joy ride, got a little lost, got turned around

777
00:45:03,960 --> 00:45:08,040
Speaker 1: in the woods, and succumbed to nature. Yeah, so I

778
00:45:08,120 --> 00:45:11,279
Speaker 1: find this. I said at the beginning that this is

779
00:45:11,320 --> 00:45:14,680
Speaker 1: just a very sad story to me. And one of

780
00:45:14,719 --> 00:45:17,080
Speaker 1: the things that got me was in that Washington Post

781
00:45:17,719 --> 00:45:20,760
Speaker 1: articles called five Boys Who Never Come Back by Cynthia Gorney.

782
00:45:21,960 --> 00:45:25,840
Speaker 1: You can find it online. But um they she describes

783
00:45:26,560 --> 00:45:31,120
Speaker 1: Ted Weir as you're ready for this that Ted got

784
00:45:31,160 --> 00:45:34,040
Speaker 1: a good chuckle out of phoning Bill Sterling and reading

785
00:45:34,080 --> 00:45:37,160
Speaker 1: from newspaper items or a ball names from the telephone

786
00:45:37,200 --> 00:45:40,000
Speaker 1: book like that's what he was into, that's what made

787
00:45:40,040 --> 00:45:42,279
Speaker 1: him happy. And I'm sure Bill Sterling thought it was

788
00:45:42,360 --> 00:45:44,920
Speaker 1: hilarious too, But like they were just this group of

789
00:45:44,960 --> 00:45:47,319
Speaker 1: friends and can't you just imagine my kid, we're like

790
00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:50,040
Speaker 1: going through the phone book looking for silly names and

791
00:45:50,080 --> 00:45:53,000
Speaker 1: going and picking up the phone and calling his friend

792
00:45:53,120 --> 00:45:55,719
Speaker 1: Bill Sterling and saying, Bill, get a load of this one,

793
00:45:56,120 --> 00:45:58,600
Speaker 1: and Bills just laughing on the other end of the line,

794
00:45:59,080 --> 00:46:01,640
Speaker 1: and like that they just had like this such a

795
00:46:01,719 --> 00:46:06,080
Speaker 1: pure life, like almost like an enviable life in a

796
00:46:06,120 --> 00:46:09,319
Speaker 1: lot of ways, and that they died so horribly is

797
00:46:09,360 --> 00:46:13,080
Speaker 1: just just bitterly sad to me. Yeah, I mean, they

798
00:46:13,080 --> 00:46:17,000
Speaker 1: weren't troublemakers and even um, even the one who had

799
00:46:17,120 --> 00:46:21,720
Speaker 1: had gotten convicted of assault a couple of times. Gary, Yeah, Gary,

800
00:46:21,719 --> 00:46:24,600
Speaker 1: it seems like all signs point to the his mental

801
00:46:24,640 --> 00:46:26,600
Speaker 1: illness is playing a big factor in that which he

802
00:46:26,640 --> 00:46:29,920
Speaker 1: had gotten in check, right, exactly. All very sad. It

803
00:46:30,080 --> 00:46:33,759
Speaker 1: is very sad. Well, if you have any theories on

804
00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:36,800
Speaker 1: the what you call him the Ubi City six five,

805
00:46:37,000 --> 00:46:40,920
Speaker 1: Uba County or Uba City five, Ubis City five, um,

806
00:46:41,160 --> 00:46:43,360
Speaker 1: we want to hear him. You can find all of

807
00:46:43,360 --> 00:46:46,120
Speaker 1: our social media connections on our website Stuff you Should

808
00:46:46,120 --> 00:46:48,399
Speaker 1: Know dot com and if you like, you can also

809
00:46:48,440 --> 00:46:51,640
Speaker 1: send us an email to shoot it off to Stuff

810
00:46:51,719 --> 00:46:55,080
Speaker 1: Podcast at how Stuff Works dot com. Wait, we haven't

811
00:46:55,080 --> 00:46:58,759
Speaker 1: done listener mail, have we know? You're just gonna let

812
00:46:58,800 --> 00:47:01,319
Speaker 1: me keep going, weren't you? You know? All right? Well,

813
00:47:01,320 --> 00:47:04,480
Speaker 1: hold on, everybody, hold on, don't stop yet, don't stop yet.

814
00:47:05,200 --> 00:47:08,240
Speaker 1: Since I said some stuff I'm not supposed to say,

815
00:47:08,560 --> 00:47:13,239
Speaker 1: it's time for listener mail. Yes. And speaking of which,

816
00:47:13,320 --> 00:47:18,600
Speaker 1: this listener mail is rated rated R. Okay, that's all

817
00:47:18,640 --> 00:47:21,600
Speaker 1: I'll say. Use the S word no, but it doesn't

818
00:47:21,680 --> 00:47:24,720
Speaker 1: use curse words. It's just um talks very frankly about

819
00:47:24,840 --> 00:47:27,200
Speaker 1: sex and it's good. P s A though, so we

820
00:47:27,640 --> 00:47:31,120
Speaker 1: know the stuff. Uh. And this is from Emily, not

821
00:47:31,280 --> 00:47:34,600
Speaker 1: my wife. Hey, guys, listen to the Select episode on

822
00:47:34,680 --> 00:47:37,040
Speaker 1: condoms the other day. Thanks for all the great info.

823
00:47:37,480 --> 00:47:41,560
Speaker 1: Appreciate you covering topics maybe slightly controversial or divisive and

824
00:47:41,600 --> 00:47:43,680
Speaker 1: do so with such grace. I wanted to throw a

825
00:47:43,680 --> 00:47:46,640
Speaker 1: little extra P. S A in there though, for your listeners.

826
00:47:47,040 --> 00:47:49,000
Speaker 1: Most people are aware that you can and should use

827
00:47:49,040 --> 00:47:51,680
Speaker 1: condoms to prevent pregnancy and or s t I S

828
00:47:51,680 --> 00:47:54,560
Speaker 1: when a penis is involved, but there's far less awareness

829
00:47:54,560 --> 00:47:57,719
Speaker 1: about protection when you've only got vaginas in the mix.

830
00:47:58,200 --> 00:48:01,320
Speaker 1: Although you certainly can't get pregnant, it is possible to

831
00:48:01,560 --> 00:48:04,800
Speaker 1: spread or contract an s t I from sex between

832
00:48:04,840 --> 00:48:08,279
Speaker 1: two women or other vagina having people. But you can

833
00:48:08,320 --> 00:48:10,719
Speaker 1: greatly reduce your risk of this by using a dental dam.

834
00:48:11,040 --> 00:48:13,680
Speaker 1: It's a sheet of latex placed over the bulba or

835
00:48:13,719 --> 00:48:17,080
Speaker 1: anus for oral sex. That's all, uh, And that's all

836
00:48:17,120 --> 00:48:19,120
Speaker 1: there really is to it. If you don't have one

837
00:48:19,120 --> 00:48:21,839
Speaker 1: on hand, you can safely d I Y one by

838
00:48:21,960 --> 00:48:25,400
Speaker 1: unrolling a regular condom, cutting off the clothes end and bam,

839
00:48:25,440 --> 00:48:28,560
Speaker 1: it's a dental dam. In the case of digital sex,

840
00:48:29,200 --> 00:48:32,680
Speaker 1: not as in computers, as in fingers, latex gloves are

841
00:48:32,680 --> 00:48:35,400
Speaker 1: perfect or perfect for the job. Of course, these can

842
00:48:35,440 --> 00:48:38,000
Speaker 1: also be used by absolutely anyone. There's a lot more

843
00:48:38,000 --> 00:48:41,719
Speaker 1: awareness of protection for heterosexual and male homosexual couples, and

844
00:48:41,760 --> 00:48:45,640
Speaker 1: not a lot for queer women. Well that's my stuff

845
00:48:45,680 --> 00:48:47,640
Speaker 1: you should know, and now you know it. Thanks for

846
00:48:47,680 --> 00:48:50,640
Speaker 1: consistently great work and outstanding effort and educating and entertaining

847
00:48:50,680 --> 00:48:54,000
Speaker 1: us every week and Happy Pride month. Uh And she

848
00:48:54,120 --> 00:48:56,440
Speaker 1: wrote back, I just realized I gave an incomplete d

849
00:48:56,520 --> 00:48:59,279
Speaker 1: I Y instruction. You would cut off the close end

850
00:48:59,280 --> 00:49:03,719
Speaker 1: of the condom uh, and the ring on the open end,

851
00:49:04,760 --> 00:49:09,440
Speaker 1: then cut down the middle and now it's a flat sheet. Bam.

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00:49:09,480 --> 00:49:12,560
Speaker 1: So that is from Emily. Thanks a lot, Emily, Happy

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00:49:12,600 --> 00:49:18,920
Speaker 1: Pride Month. Indeed good info. Uh yeah, it was good info.

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Speaker 1: And if you out there want to send us good info,

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