Speaker 1: In early as COVID triggered a global public health crisis,
Speaker 1: the travel and tourism industry cutback service and slowed down.
Speaker 1: The cruise industry went further. It completely shut down as
Speaker 1: ships at idle. Operators scrambled to survive with no financial
Speaker 1: precedent to guide them. All of a sudden, the revenue
Speaker 1: just turns off. They did not teach this in business school,
Speaker 1: by the way, so you know it turns off and
Speaker 1: you you have to figure out how you're going to
Speaker 1: ensure that the company has liquidity needs in order to
Speaker 1: be able to get to the other side of it.
Speaker 1: No revenue at all, but you have costs and expenses.
Speaker 1: That's right. What you learned in the pandemic is that
Speaker 1: leadership really matters. For Royal Caribbean Cruises, the lesson was
Speaker 1: stark and clear. After generating almost two billion dollars in
Speaker 1: annual profit before COVID, the company lost more than five
Speaker 1: billion dollars in both At the end of one longtime CEO,
Speaker 1: Richard Fain, stepped down after thirty three years, handing the
Speaker 1: reins to CFO Jason Liberty. What was it like that
Speaker 1: transition going from CFO to sea and we were still
Speaker 1: kind of coming out of the pandemic. We were still
Speaker 1: ramping up our fleet, ramping up our occupancy, and so
Speaker 1: we had to keep our eye on the ball on
Speaker 1: because historically we would bring about three ships up a
Speaker 1: year um and here we brought up sixty four ships.
Speaker 1: And it's a big change to herculean efforts helping the
Speaker 1: new CEO meet those challenges. New CFO and if Tally Holt,
Speaker 1: who moved up from VP of Finance, I had hired
Speaker 1: him I think about six months before the pandemic. I
Speaker 1: was looking for somebody with with a lot of really
Speaker 1: strong work ethics, somebody who was strategic, um, you know,
Speaker 1: somebody who who understood how to you to get things
Speaker 1: done inside of an organization. And I saw those qualities
Speaker 1: and off Tolly. And he has done an exceptional job
Speaker 1: coming into the role. He hit the ground running. That
Speaker 1: dynamic in the C suite is help Royal Caribbeans come back,
Speaker 1: maintain momentum. What's it like becoming CFO working for the
Speaker 1: individual who was CFO and is now CEO. I feel
Speaker 1: very fortunate because I have someone who has been in
Speaker 1: the job for many years is still with a company.
Speaker 1: Obviously as much more responsibly. But he understands what what
Speaker 1: I what, what what it means to be in my job.
Speaker 1: So what was that like for you? Having been in
Speaker 1: the CFO role for so long? What did you expect
Speaker 1: of him? I rely on him very much to be
Speaker 1: my eyes and ears, my strategic partner. And I'm also
Speaker 1: very transparent with him in terms of what I'm thinking
Speaker 1: about and doing um And sometimes he will sit there
Speaker 1: and did we really need to spend money on that?
Speaker 1: And also, yeah, we really need to spend money on that.
Speaker 1: I'm a very direct person and I care and I
Speaker 1: feel that that's that's important for me to make sure
Speaker 1: that if I feel differently, you know, at least we
Speaker 1: have a conversation. And you know, many times I would
Speaker 1: I would I would think one way and then he
Speaker 1: would point his point of view and it would make sense,
Speaker 1: and I would say, you know what you're write and
Speaker 1: you know and I get behind advancing the company's long
Speaker 1: term mission through honest conversation. That's how enough Tally Holt
Speaker 1: takes the CFO roll forward. And maybe many years ago
Speaker 1: we was about making sure that the numbers are correct
Speaker 1: and everything is on time and and we report correctly
Speaker 1: and I think involved today too much more than that.
Speaker 1: You know, what is the strategy that we're going to
Speaker 1: embark on, what does that mean to the financial performance
Speaker 1: of the company, and how does how do we invest
Speaker 1: a view dot um. That's one aspect of it, and
Speaker 1: the other is just making sure that we are always
Speaker 1: on the polls with its full fleet returning to the season,
Speaker 1: Royal Caribbean has enjoyed a financial rebound booking or robust
Speaker 1: and they've been accelerating every quarter. In novemb Or, the
Speaker 1: company announced the Trifecta Program, a three year initiative designed
Speaker 1: to exceed performance in key financial metrics by the end
Speaker 1: of Inside the industry, they're going to fit in because
Speaker 1: there's bent up demand. People want to travel. We have
Speaker 1: a hundred and thirty thousand people sailing with us right
Speaker 1: now as we talked, and they are spending more than
Speaker 1: they did a month ago. They're spending more than they
Speaker 1: did a year ago. They're spending more than they did
Speaker 1: pre COVID on travel experience. We know the ships that
Speaker 1: are coming in. These ships are huge money makers, very
Speaker 1: high yielding. Because of the inventory mix, there's more space
Speaker 1: for onboard revenue venues they're very fuel efficient. Intent to
Speaker 1: cruise is climbing. Whether or not that can be sustained,
Speaker 1: I think is a question to be answered. And there
Speaker 1: are a couple of different elements of that, the first being, UH,
Speaker 1: the economy. Do you get a little nervous with all
Speaker 1: the recession talk or another black swan who would have thought, right,
Speaker 1: what happened the last couple of years. It's hard to
Speaker 1: plan for it right. So what we are focused on
Speaker 1: is to making sure that we have the best business
Speaker 1: the right so the business is run well. We are
Speaker 1: obviously are focused on liquidity and and our and our
Speaker 1: on our financial metrics, and we want to fix the
Speaker 1: balance sheet, um, you know, to to get to back
Speaker 1: to where we were. Fixing the balance sheet, that's a
Speaker 1: heavy lift. Royal Caribbean is carrying nearly twenty four billion
Speaker 1: dollars in debt. Though it's paid down most of its
Speaker 1: short term obligations, the debt still looms large. It's a
Speaker 1: dark cloud over the entire cruise industry. The valuations for
Speaker 1: the major cruise lines have gone down and UH and
Speaker 1: the debt levels are very high, so they will have
Speaker 1: difficulties to to receive more debt and it might be
Speaker 1: very high interest rates. The debt that we took on.
Speaker 1: Half of it was in order for us to deal
Speaker 1: with UH not operating for those for those eighteen months
Speaker 1: and ramping our business back up, staying a lot, that's right. UM.
Speaker 1: The other half of it was actually because we were
Speaker 1: growing and we were taking on new ships, and those
Speaker 1: new ships we get incredible export credit financing for and
Speaker 1: we've done a lot of refinancing and we do believe
Speaker 1: over the coming years we're gonna be a much better
Speaker 1: place to do two things, one is de leverage and
Speaker 1: also improve our rating, and so that will also lower
Speaker 1: our capital costs. Are you comfortable with that level of
Speaker 1: debt and being able to service it, well, we were
Speaker 1: not happy with it. We want to get Our goal
Speaker 1: is to get back to the balance sheet we had
Speaker 1: um which is an investment, great profile. We're back sailing
Speaker 1: UM You occupancies were generating cash flow from operations, so
Speaker 1: you know we Our goal is now to continue to
Speaker 1: grow Ibada, continue to grow the cash flow so we
Speaker 1: can pay down to debt and bring the balance sheet back.
Speaker 1: This business is very resilient. We always said that we
Speaker 1: wanted to have a balance sheet that could take a punch,
Speaker 1: and we proved that we had a balance sheet that
Speaker 1: could actually take a meteor um And so I think
Speaker 1: that's why you know, NOF is very focused. I'm very
Speaker 1: focused on getting back to a investment grade balance sheet.
Speaker 1: I'm getting back to an unencumbered balance sheet. You know
Speaker 1: that that sets us up for events as they as
Speaker 1: they as they come forward, can Royal Caribbean perform its
Speaker 1: way back to unencumbered financial stability. The cruise line generates
Speaker 1: about six revenue from sales of tickets. Most of the
Speaker 1: rest comes from on board spending. At the moment, higher
Speaker 1: prices aren't holding down demand in either category. On the
Speaker 1: ticket pricing side as well as on onboard spend, um
Speaker 1: you are pricing is up versus nineteen. We use nineteen
Speaker 1: as our reference point. Onboard experiences have really been become
Speaker 1: a much more integral part of the experience. What we
Speaker 1: have seen in the past couple of years is that
Speaker 1: we we have a much more penetration of onboard board
Speaker 1: experiences for a guest. So people just want to consume more,
Speaker 1: They're willing to spend more, and that's obviously much um
Speaker 1: that helps them. The yields and the revenues as well
Speaker 1: as the margin pre pandemic. Unless we're impressed by Royal
Speaker 1: Caribbeans margin expansion. Operating margins double during Jason Liberty's first
Speaker 1: seven years as CFO. The barriage ahead may not be
Speaker 1: a smooth especially if inflated costs eat into revenue gains.
Speaker 1: We've seen huge inflation costs on the on the food. However,
Speaker 1: you are supply chain teams have done really an exceptional job.
Speaker 1: So we do believe as which is what the basis
Speaker 1: of our Trifector program is moderate yields and good cost control.
Speaker 1: And for us, good cost control is is low single
Speaker 1: digit um change your ear. If you think about the
Speaker 1: cruise industry, there's a course that vantage full labor because
Speaker 1: they don't have debate the minimum weights is and there's
Speaker 1: also ghost advantage in supplies like food and beverage supplies
Speaker 1: because they buy it in quantity. Jason, what are the
Speaker 1: conversations you have with enough Tolly about costs because it's
Speaker 1: such a big component of of you know, when you
Speaker 1: look at your financial statements, where I really focused no
Speaker 1: off on is where can we become more efficient? Where
Speaker 1: can we use technology for us to become more efficient?
Speaker 1: The food side, what we we want to make sure
Speaker 1: is that the experience that we offer to the guests
Speaker 1: is great, because that's our mission. Maybe we can source
Speaker 1: more locally, maybe we need some of it to source
Speaker 1: more globally. Just reimagine of how do we deliver on
Speaker 1: the service and on the fuel side. UM, we have
Speaker 1: an active hedging program and you know, we're very focused,
Speaker 1: which is good for also for our environment, is to
Speaker 1: minimize the reduced the consumption of fuel UM and that
Speaker 1: is UM. You know, obviously one of the things that
Speaker 1: we can control the most. What Royal Caribbean can't control
Speaker 1: head winds caused by world events that threatened growth. COVID
Speaker 1: zero has meant zero cruising in China since the start
Speaker 1: of war in Ukraine and recession signals are concerns in Europe.
Speaker 1: All this put strain on the supply chain that provides
Speaker 1: Royal Caribbean's most important commodity passengers are sourcing for Our
Speaker 1: guests come from a hundred different locations around the world,
Speaker 1: and we created a platform for it to be very nimble,
Speaker 1: and so we're always sourcing the highest shielding guests from
Speaker 1: anywhere in the world. But our assets, our business moves.
Speaker 1: It's fluid, so when events do happen around the world,
Speaker 1: we have we have the ability really on a dime,
Speaker 1: to move our deployment around or move our sourcing around
Speaker 1: to help mitigate that. So yeah, we're, you know, like
Speaker 1: we always are. We're nimble, and we've you know, are sourcing,
Speaker 1: and our deployment is going to be different. Um and
Speaker 1: then we'll see what brings. Uncertainty about the future of
Speaker 1: travel has weighed on crew stocks over the last two years.
Speaker 1: Despite suns of a rebound, investors remain cautious. What was
Speaker 1: it going to take for Wall Street to be like,
Speaker 1: we're comfortable with this. Well, I think they're getting more
Speaker 1: comfortable with it and and and I think once they
Speaker 1: start seeing guidance and they see the level of profitability,
Speaker 1: the level of cash flow, I think at that point,
Speaker 1: you know what, we'll we'll start to see the the
Speaker 1: the overall crystallization of where we are um and then
Speaker 1: and then begin to think about where we're gonna be going.
Speaker 1: It's Ason Liberty took over as Chief executive of Royal
Speaker 1: Caribbean Cruises in January two, replacing Richard Fayne, who had
Speaker 1: been CEO since and remains chairman of the company's board.
Speaker 1: Liberty's promotion fits with a trend. According to Christ Colder's
Speaker 1: annual survey, more new CEOs are coming to the job
Speaker 1: directly from a CFO chair than ever before. The role
Speaker 1: of the CFO. I think has changed over time, right.
Speaker 1: They become much more strategic, um, you know, and of
Speaker 1: course this world has become more data driven UM, and
Speaker 1: so being able to you know, to to think in
Speaker 1: that way, and and of course being brought up that
Speaker 1: way and putting people in the CFO position that think
Speaker 1: that way versus maybe just doing accounting or treasury related activities.
Speaker 1: I think that's why you're starting to see more CFOs
Speaker 1: rise into the CEO spot, which because there's a lot
Speaker 1: of that kind of commonality that comes in the day
Speaker 1: to day of the CEO job. Royal Caribbean CFO and
Speaker 1: of Tally Holtz brings a strategic and data driven background
Speaker 1: to the CFO role, and he's mission driven as well.
Speaker 1: I was born and raised in Israel UM and like
Speaker 1: everybody else, I enlisted into Israeli Air Force. I had
Speaker 1: a four very meaningful years serving my country and giving back,
Speaker 1: and then I always wanted to be to move to
Speaker 1: the United States. I had some family here, but I
Speaker 1: was just aspiring to the country the opportunity, and I
Speaker 1: thought that the best way for me to do it
Speaker 1: is through going through business school. And I was fortunate
Speaker 1: to get into Chicago Booth and learned from the best
Speaker 1: and get some of those finance skills and knowledge UM.
Speaker 1: And then I started on Wall Street and it was
Speaker 1: just the natural I was, you know, transition. I really
Speaker 1: felt compelled and and interested about UM investments and the
Speaker 1: markets and companies and their stories. And I really learned
Speaker 1: a lot UM and you know, through transactions interacting with
Speaker 1: CEOs and CFOs. So how do you think having a
Speaker 1: career on Wall Street finance background maybe makes you a
Speaker 1: better CFO. Obviously, all the skills that I had UM,
Speaker 1: you know, in my career on Wall Street, understanding how
Speaker 1: to raise capital, what investors are looking for, helped us
Speaker 1: in the beginning of the pandemic when we had to
Speaker 1: raise capital UM to make sure we get to the
Speaker 1: other side. So, you know, just understanding the different instruments
Speaker 1: in the different ways to raise the capital, understanding the
Speaker 1: capital a location, how we will prioritize investments, how we
Speaker 1: were prioritizing the cash flow that this business generates a
Speaker 1: lot of cash low um is something that I'm focused on,
Speaker 1: and obviously I've seen a lot of those in my
Speaker 1: career on Wall Street. A cruise ship is much more
Speaker 1: than a flotilla of financials and numbers. If Tally Holt
Speaker 1: shown me around the celebrity beyond Royal Caribbeans newest ship
Speaker 1: rolling out, not the red carpet, instead the magic carpet,
Speaker 1: an example of investment that's yielding returns in several different ways. Originally,
Speaker 1: actually we designed it because we wanted to have a
Speaker 1: really nice platform for tender in because sometimes we can't
Speaker 1: homeport exactly value functional. And then we looked at it
Speaker 1: and said, why don't we just make it a really
Speaker 1: cool feature spot where people can enjoy it beyond the
Speaker 1: functional space, and we may create that this bar it
Speaker 1: went up and down. It take about the Instagram conues
Speaker 1: become bad at about that I can instagram a moment
Speaker 1: with the sunset, having a drink with your friends or family.
Speaker 1: I mean, that's that's that's amazing. So what does it
Speaker 1: take to do something like this? And I'm thinking cost
Speaker 1: engineering time, Yeah, a lot of effort, from a lot
Speaker 1: of people. So starts from just the design and the
Speaker 1: conceptual aspect of it. Then we need to figure out
Speaker 1: a lot of technical factors, the wait, the wind, and
Speaker 1: so lots of lots of hours of really hard work.
Speaker 1: And every time we up the game, we see that
Speaker 1: customer willing to spend more. Is there like a bunch
Speaker 1: of other innovative ideas that you guys are working on.
Speaker 1: Is there other things that maybe are in the hopper
Speaker 1: that might be like this that we might see in
Speaker 1: future ships. Yes, you know, obviously the ships are core
Speaker 1: to to We delivered the bestifications in the world, um
Speaker 1: and a couple of years ago we saw an opportunity
Speaker 1: to extend that even to land, so we built some
Speaker 1: private islands and exclusive destinations. Cook is one example of it.
Speaker 1: And we have a lot of great ideas and projects
Speaker 1: in the hopper. And you know, we're very focused on
Speaker 1: being discipline. You know, we we deploy billions of dollars
Speaker 1: on behalf of our shareholders, so we we have for
Speaker 1: ourselves and for them, you know, a return expectations. So
Speaker 1: we just to make sure that as we as we
Speaker 1: invest the money, it's it's it's it's getting the returns
Speaker 1: we want in every corner of celebrity beyond, there's evidence
Speaker 1: of careful investment designed to give customers every opportunity to
Speaker 1: spend money. And for passengers who want to spend a
Speaker 1: little more money, there's ample opportunity to upgrade. So this
Speaker 1: is our exclusive retreat area and guests can upgrade right
Speaker 1: and and buy a room a stateroom here and enjoy
Speaker 1: the exclusive access to those facilities. And you can see
Speaker 1: there's a pool, there's cabanas obviously, lots of opportunities for
Speaker 1: food and beverage. The segmentation of giving you know, passengers
Speaker 1: and opportunity to have a different experience, maybe pay up
Speaker 1: for a more premium experience. Is this kind of where
Speaker 1: it's all going. Yeah, And I think it's really about
Speaker 1: every Everyone has maybe a little bit different um you know,
Speaker 1: um desire of what their ultimate vacation is. Some people
Speaker 1: want to go and meet people. Some people just want
Speaker 1: to because it came in with their their where their family,
Speaker 1: just to go and spend their time alone. So it's
Speaker 1: really designed to do to be like the ultimate vacation,
Speaker 1: depending on what do you want. Royal Caribbean is one
Speaker 1: of three companies that together control about three quarters of
Speaker 1: the global cruising market. Its capacity share was second only
Speaker 1: to Carnival and more than twice that a third place
Speaker 1: Norwegian cruise line. Royal Caribbean operates it ships under three
Speaker 1: brands with three distinct profiles. And the Royal Caribbean brand,
Speaker 1: you know, they're more family focused, multigenerational. Our Celebrity brand
Speaker 1: is more of a premium luxury and then we have
Speaker 1: Silver Sea which is ultra luxury and expedition. So it's
Speaker 1: not a one size fits all business. And as passengers
Speaker 1: demand more choices, one way to fulfill them is bigger ships.
Speaker 1: In October, Royal Caribbean unveiled plans to launch what will
Speaker 1: be the largest ship in the world, Icon of Disease.
Speaker 1: It will carry over seven thousand passengers. Its first cruise,
Speaker 1: set for January, sold out within hours. If you're going
Speaker 1: on a on a seven day void, you're going to
Speaker 1: be able to do anything and everything that you could
Speaker 1: possibly dream of and and you know, it might be
Speaker 1: what you want to do, it might be what your
Speaker 1: daughter wants to do, it might be what your parents
Speaker 1: want to do, and everybody can have different experiences on
Speaker 1: a We describe it as the thrill and the child.
Speaker 1: We offer much a lot more on the ship. They
Speaker 1: become much more profitable because there's so much more to do.
Speaker 1: There's economies of scale um and their efficiencies and operations,
Speaker 1: so it ship that we deliver is actually much more profitable.
Speaker 1: Caribbean is also investing in technology to drive profits to
Speaker 1: say that cruising industry is actually one of the leaders
Speaker 1: when it comes to digital transformation, and I see that
Speaker 1: accelerating in the future. We want to make sure that
Speaker 1: we create a frictional ness experience. Right. The expectations today
Speaker 1: from the consumer is that the experience is friction less.
Speaker 1: Especially through the pandemic, people got very comfortable for on
Speaker 1: demand services. They wanted groceries, they went to instacart and
Speaker 1: so for here all through your phone. That's exactly right.
Speaker 1: People want to organize themselves well in advance of getting
Speaker 1: on our ships. So they want to be able to
Speaker 1: book their spa appointments, they want to be able to
Speaker 1: book their short excursions well in advance of them ever
Speaker 1: getting onto the ship. And of course when they do that,
Speaker 1: they actually tend to spend more money, which is also
Speaker 1: a a good thing. So we have to take friction
Speaker 1: and we have been taking friction out of that experience.
Speaker 1: Is there some application where there's the app and there's
Speaker 1: kind of a metaverse where I can kind of walk
Speaker 1: through the ship before I even get on and decide
Speaker 1: what I want to do or where I want to go. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think it's even I think it's even greater than that.
Speaker 1: I actually think in the metaverse, where we're gonna be
Speaker 1: able to do is to help people begin to dream
Speaker 1: what their vacation is going to be and to be
Speaker 1: able to put on either oculus is or using their phones,
Speaker 1: um to really understand what they're going to expect location
Speaker 1: by location. We are working on this already and it's
Speaker 1: and I think it's going to change. Um, it's going
Speaker 1: to change how people book cruises. And then that that
Speaker 1: content helps us understand how we need to modify and
Speaker 1: change our product not a beautiful thing, that's awesome. Royal
Speaker 1: Caribbean already understands the need to make its operations greener.
Speaker 1: The company just opened a state of the art zero
Speaker 1: energy cruise terminal in Galveston, Texas at a cost of
Speaker 1: one million dollars. Even the behemoth Icon of the seas
Speaker 1: is being built with sustainability in mind, that ship will
Speaker 1: have l en g um as as the base fuel
Speaker 1: for that ship. Now LG is not perfect um to
Speaker 1: transitional fuel UM, it will produce less carbon. We're putting
Speaker 1: a mega watch fuel cell onto the ship and we're
Speaker 1: looking at trifuel engines, so that will be prepared for
Speaker 1: things when whether it's methanol or hydrogen or other comes
Speaker 1: into place. Sustainability is UH is table stakes going forward.
Speaker 1: Six and ten. Consumers in the US are concerned about
Speaker 1: the travel industry's impact on climate change. And when we
Speaker 1: ask consumers who is responsible for fixing it, a plurality
Speaker 1: say it's the responsibility of companies in the industry. The
Speaker 1: cruise line has to go green. There is no a
Speaker 1: lot of options because millennials are the biggest group of
Speaker 1: consumers today already and in the future even more, and
Speaker 1: they are choosing those cruise lines that are sustainable and
Speaker 1: and there's no room for creen washing in the area.
Speaker 1: It's one of our goals right to reduce our carbon
Speaker 1: intensity by double digits and innovation around the environment is
Speaker 1: something that the company has done for many, many years.
Speaker 1: I'll give you a quick example. Um in Um the
Speaker 1: last couple of years we've we wanted to reduce used
Speaker 1: the waste of food on the ship. It's good for business,
Speaker 1: it's also good for the environment. We've used technology for that.
Speaker 1: Really understand how much is it that we have the
Speaker 1: waste of the food and we've implemented technology to help
Speaker 1: us UM reduce that that waste. We are working really
Speaker 1: closely with ports around the world because when the ship
Speaker 1: is on port, we can maybe plug into their green
Speaker 1: grid and or have or powered the ship with the
Speaker 1: fuel cell and then part of it is really the
Speaker 1: fuel of the future, which UM. You know, we continue
Speaker 1: to have a lot of partnerships in R and d UM,
Speaker 1: you know as as we as we continue that journey,
Speaker 1: so we're we're focused on it. There is so much
Speaker 1: to focus on. As a CFO engaged in the company's
Speaker 1: restart following a complete shutdown, I asked n if Tally
Speaker 1: holds what he sees when he looks ahead. What's the
Speaker 1: opportunity for Royal Caribbean and the next ten years that
Speaker 1: most excites you. Continue to grow our market share in
Speaker 1: the leisure in the leisure space just even beyond cruising.
Speaker 1: So what's the challenge for the company in the next
Speaker 1: ten years. That keeps you up at night, Well, I
Speaker 1: sleep quite okay at night. But I think we just
Speaker 1: continue to you know, I think what we want to
Speaker 1: really focus on, to me is to continue to innovate,
Speaker 1: continue to be retaining the best talent and the culture
Speaker 1: of innovation and DNA and kind of making sure that
Speaker 1: we continue to evolve and and and with with the
Speaker 1: with the with the world and the consumer. What's the
Speaker 1: best advice for the future that you would give to
Speaker 1: someone who was promoted to CFO today, Listen a lot um,
Speaker 1: really get into the business and what is it that's
Speaker 1: really driving it to be really impactful and influential. With
Speaker 1: two thoughtful and experienced financial leaders at the helm, Royal
Speaker 1: Caribbean is setting a course for its next chapter. Jason
Speaker 1: Liberty enough Tally Holtz feel prepared for whatever the future brings.
Speaker 1: I'm Carol Masser. This is Bloomberg. Do