Speaker 1: Johnny, I've pulled me over at a dinner recently in London. Ruthie,
Speaker 1: come and meet my great friend Linda Evangelista. Well, I
Speaker 1: thought there'd be lots of topics to discuss, what it's
Speaker 1: like to be in her profession, what it's like to
Speaker 1: have worked with the world's greatest photographers, and to have
Speaker 1: done so much work in fashion. But Linda greeted me
Speaker 1: with so much enthusiasm. Ruthie Rogers the River Cafe. Wow.
Speaker 1: All she really wanted to do was talk about food,
Speaker 1: where to eat, what she cooks for her son, how
Speaker 1: a restaurant kitchen works. Linda's the opposite of cool. She's warm,
Speaker 1: She's engaging and curious. I realize we're pretty much the same.
Speaker 1: She loves being home, I love being home. She adores
Speaker 1: her son, I adore mine. I'm not a model, she's
Speaker 1: not a chef. But we shared an immediate intimacy, so
Speaker 1: we thought, let's continue this conversation on table four. And
Speaker 1: here we are today in New York with my newest
Speaker 1: and loveliest, warmest, most wonderful friend, Linda Evangelista.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much.
Speaker 1: So it is true that's how we met, You know,
Speaker 1: we met over food. We then saw each other again
Speaker 1: over food, and here we are. I love podcasts, which
Speaker 1: is really talking about memories and how we cook and
Speaker 1: what we grew up with. So we have heard one
Speaker 1: of the things we love to eat is nyoki, and
Speaker 1: so we have a recipe for you to read, which
Speaker 1: is knochi with slow cooked tomato sauce. You would like
Speaker 1: to read the recipe, and when you read it, you
Speaker 1: can change it, you can question it, you can add
Speaker 1: to it or take away. But that's the recipe that
Speaker 1: was in our most recent cookbook. It's a book for children,
Speaker 1: so it's quite a kind of simplification of how to
Speaker 1: make yaki. But we can talk more about that after
Speaker 1: you read the recipe.
Speaker 2: Okay, this is great to see something in writing, because
Speaker 2: I learned to make yocchi with my grandmother, but it
Speaker 2: was never written down. And it was a little bit
Speaker 2: of this and this, many eggs depending how big they are,
Speaker 2: and some potatoes.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and some potatoes. That's how we learned to I mean,
Speaker 1: that's a beautiful way to learn. She did she ever
Speaker 1: write anything down?
Speaker 2: She couldn't write. Yeah, she didn't know how to write.
Speaker 1: She didn't know how to write. English. She didn't write all.
Speaker 2: She didn't know how to write it. Also as a peasant.
Speaker 2: She was born in Italy, as was my father and
Speaker 2: my mother and all my grandparents.
Speaker 1: And do you speak Italian?
Speaker 2: Very badly? I speak it, and my family speaks dialect.
Speaker 2: I know you're friend and proper Italian, but at home
Speaker 2: they speak dialect. My parents spoke English to us growing up,
Speaker 2: and only when they were arguing did they speak to
Speaker 2: each other in Italian. So I can tell you where
Speaker 2: to go in Italian, but I can't ask you are
Speaker 2: you having a nice day?
Speaker 1: Or kind words? It's been Richard Dad's father had Italian
Speaker 1: parents and he had the same thing that he heard
Speaker 1: Italian spoken again, a very similar story when there was
Speaker 1: an argument, I think, and then when he did learn Italian,
Speaker 1: a lot of it came back because he had kind
Speaker 1: of grown up for it. Right.
Speaker 2: So this grandmother, she never did learn him to speak English.
Speaker 2: And in our neighborhood it was quite Polish, some Ukrainians
Speaker 2: and Italians.
Speaker 1: Where was it?
Speaker 2: Where was the name Saint Catharine's, Ontario, Canada, across the
Speaker 2: lake from Toronto in Niagara Region, right near the border
Speaker 2: of the United States, And my grandmother went to Italian mass,
Speaker 2: shopped at the Italian store, worked picking fruit on the
Speaker 2: farm with the Italian ladies, so she didn't really need
Speaker 2: to speak English. I remember how excited they all got
Speaker 2: that generation when Canada went metric. I was about ten
Speaker 2: years old or so, I approximately, and then they ender stood, oh,
Speaker 2: this is how many grams of meat I'm buying? And
Speaker 2: so they were very happy when that happened.
Speaker 1: When did they leave. The family comes from between Naples
Speaker 1: and Rome.
Speaker 2: Yes, it's a town called Pinatado Interamna, which is near
Speaker 2: Casino and Monte Casino, where the big battle of World
Speaker 2: War two took place. And my father would have come over,
Speaker 2: and he was born in nineteen forty and I think
Speaker 2: he came over nineteen fifty six. And my mother was
Speaker 2: born in forty three inch came over in nineteen fifty.
Speaker 1: And the grandmother that you were describing was that your
Speaker 1: mother's mother.
Speaker 2: That was my father's mother, but my mother's mother's kind
Speaker 2: of the same.
Speaker 1: And they all came, they all eventually, they were all yes.
Speaker 2: And they came with the few belongings that they had.
Speaker 2: And I have the two handmade hammered copper pop that
Speaker 2: my one grandmother came over with and she would make
Speaker 2: her Sunday you know, tomato sauce in and I have them.
Speaker 2: They're like there are precious belongings. There's no painting, there's
Speaker 2: no paintings.
Speaker 1: Yes, sauce fam is a memory and it is what
Speaker 1: she cooked with, so bring that with her was part
Speaker 1: of her. Why did they leave?
Speaker 2: You know, they left in search of a better life.
Speaker 2: They had lost everything. Well, they didn't have anything much.
Speaker 2: They worked their land, so it's not like they had
Speaker 2: vocations and they just went in search of a better
Speaker 2: life for their children.
Speaker 1: In Canada rather than the United States.
Speaker 2: Well, they were heading to the United States, but at
Speaker 2: the time they closed their doors and then they were
Speaker 2: not receiving any more immigrants. And somebody in the United
Speaker 2: States found a sponsor for my grandfather in Canada, and
Speaker 2: the other one similar story. So, yeah, one grandfather was
Speaker 2: a prisoner of war. They were both in the war.
Speaker 2: My grandfathers My mom was born during the war forty.
Speaker 1: Three and she spoke Italian.
Speaker 2: She speaks proper and dialect. She speaks both.
Speaker 1: When you say dialect, do you mean the dialect of
Speaker 1: that region between Yeah, and.
Speaker 2: It gets even worse because then you know, it takes
Speaker 2: on a life of its own in Canada, not quite
Speaker 2: like the way the Americans. They like totally butchered the language.
Speaker 2: And I don't like the way they cut off the
Speaker 2: ends of the words when they say mozzarella.
Speaker 1: When they say mozzarell, I know that's Tony Soprano. Do
Speaker 1: you remember Tony's in watching the Sopranos, they would always call
Speaker 1: it mozzarell. Yeah. Yeahs. And so your mother also, your
Speaker 1: mother had both her mother and her mother in law
Speaker 1: correct with her. Yeah. And did they all cook together? Yeah?
Speaker 2: I think early on they did. And you know my
Speaker 2: mother is because she came over quite young, she got
Speaker 2: quite americanized, and you know she she you know, she
Speaker 2: has an education and she cooks with recipes she but
Speaker 2: she also has all the recipes in her head, like
Speaker 2: what she grew up making.
Speaker 1: Who is the best cook of all of them? Do
Speaker 1: you think me? You good? Okay, we're gonna get to that.
Speaker 1: I like your answer. Okay, So do you want to
Speaker 1: read the recipe TOI with Tomato sauce Ganaki?
Speaker 2: I'm joking, okay. Yaki with tomato sauce served six in
Speaker 2: my family, three one yeah, okay, two tablespoons of extra
Speaker 2: virgin olive oil. Two clothes of garlic finally sliced. I
Speaker 2: would say a little, you can add more?
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, good?
Speaker 2: Eight hundred grams of ten peeled plum tomatoes. One kilogram
Speaker 2: of white floury potatoes.
Speaker 1: Your grandma will be happy that this is in grams.
Speaker 2: Wouldn't yet she would one hundred and thirty grams of
Speaker 2: double zero flour, one large egg, lightly beaten, and ten
Speaker 2: basal leaves interesting. Heat the olive oil in a large
Speaker 2: frying pan over a medium heat. Add the garlic and
Speaker 2: cook until soft. Add the tomatoes, breaking them up, season well,
Speaker 2: and cook for thirty minutes on low heat. Bring a
Speaker 2: large saucepan of salted water to a boil and add
Speaker 2: the potatoes and cook until they are easily pierced with
Speaker 2: a fork. Drain and peel when they are cool enough
Speaker 2: to handle. Immediately. Put the potatoes through a food milk
Speaker 2: and then sift the flour over them, making a well
Speaker 2: in the center. Add the beaten egg, using your hands,
Speaker 2: quickly mixed to form a smooth, soft dough. Do not
Speaker 2: overwork the dough or you will make the nyoki too heavy.
Speaker 2: Divide the dough into four using your hands. Roll the
Speaker 2: dough into a sausage and then cut into pieces. Cook
Speaker 2: the yoki until they rise to the surface. Remove the
Speaker 2: yaki with a slotted spoon, and then stir into the
Speaker 2: tomato sauce. Add the basil, and if you like, grated partamigiano.
Speaker 2: Now we ran our yoki along a fork toge to
Speaker 2: get the ridges.
Speaker 1: You can do that. We sometimes do ridges and sometimes
Speaker 1: we don't. I prefer without, Yeah, you prefer without. We
Speaker 1: were also talking today about yaki. I was talking to
Speaker 1: Joseph Trevelli, one of my chefs. He was saying, do
Speaker 1: you remember Ruthie, how the cook in our house in
Speaker 1: Italy called Giovanna made yaki and she said to us,
Speaker 1: when you form them, the was like you're doing a book,
Speaker 1: Like you're making a book of the flower and the mixture,
Speaker 1: because if you it is really true that if you
Speaker 1: handle them too much, they do get tough, and so
Speaker 1: you want to touch the flower gets it gets overdeveloped,
Speaker 1: and the idea that you want to make them as
Speaker 1: light and actually I also used to say that what
Speaker 1: we do is we make the potatoes and add a
Speaker 1: little bit of flour and then put one in and
Speaker 1: then they'd fall apart. And then you would add a
Speaker 1: little bit of flour, and you would do it so
Speaker 1: gradually that then you would know that you need that
Speaker 1: amount of flour for them not to fall apart, but
Speaker 1: the least amount makes them as light as you can.
Speaker 2: And then once you've done them so many times, you just.
Speaker 1: Know, yeah, and do you do them?
Speaker 2: You know. I have to tell you the one thing
Speaker 2: in the kitchen that intimidates me, well, there's two things,
Speaker 2: is flower like pizza does and pasta does, and pastry
Speaker 2: I don't even I get so intimidated by it, and
Speaker 2: I make a mess and I'm never successful with it.
Speaker 1: And we should do it when you come. When you
Speaker 1: come to London next time, we'll go into the cafe
Speaker 1: because you heard her say it, because actually the young
Speaker 1: chef we teach how to make it. And I really
Speaker 1: relate to what you're saying. I'm not a pastry chef person.
Speaker 1: You know. I'm never good with it. I can do
Speaker 1: the science of cakes, but i'd always the measuring.
Speaker 2: The measuring is it has to be so precise, and
Speaker 2: I like to venture off.
Speaker 1: A little bit.
Speaker 2: I have to tell you about a recipe of yours
Speaker 2: that I tried to venture off with.
Speaker 1: Oh what was that?
Speaker 2: You're olive oil cake with polenta? The polenta cake, I
Speaker 2: tried to do it with olive oil, and then I
Speaker 2: tried I tried to do it with a little ricota.
Speaker 1: Yeah that's okay, yeah matter.
Speaker 2: And then I would love to get to the olive oil,
Speaker 2: almond flour and ricotta.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we could do that. Pastry chefs really enjoyed cooking
Speaker 1: with olive oil now as opposed to butter. But I
Speaker 1: do think butter is so good and butter and cakes
Speaker 1: so delicious. And there's something about that polenta cake which is,
Speaker 1: you know, there's just polenta, there's almonds, there's butter and
Speaker 1: sugar and you put it all in that.
Speaker 2: But yeah, once I've made it a couple of times,
Speaker 2: though I want it just you know, change things. But
Speaker 2: this was during the pandemic and I had plenty of
Speaker 2: time to you know, like play with it. But it didn't.
Speaker 1: You never made bread though, right If you don't like that,
Speaker 1: I'm not a bread nose.
Speaker 2: You can buy beautiful bread from great artisans and bakeries,
Speaker 2: and I did with my friend a couple of times.
Speaker 2: But I made such a mess in the kitchen, and yeah,
Speaker 2: I get it, it just wasn't worth it. What what
Speaker 2: what did you do in the pandemic? What did you cook?
Speaker 1: Oh?
Speaker 2: I lived in the same house as my brother, but
Speaker 2: on different floors in New York. In Canada. I wanted
Speaker 2: to be able to go outside, and I'm very immunocompromised.
Speaker 2: I have a disease that affects my lungs, and living
Speaker 2: in New York you have to you know, in a
Speaker 2: tall building. It's difficult. But I wanted to be with
Speaker 2: my family. So we did a lot of barbecuing and
Speaker 2: smoking and cooked a lot outside. Even made pizzas outside.
Speaker 1: Did make pizzas? Did your brother make the dough? No?
Speaker 2: I had a friend come over to re teach me
Speaker 2: a dough. But it's like a three day ordeal, and
Speaker 2: I'm like, I'm not I guess, like really sour dough.
Speaker 2: You know, I did different doughs, but I'm not good
Speaker 2: at dough.
Speaker 1: I don't know what it doesn't have to be.
Speaker 2: It baffles me because I'm really good at other things.
Speaker 1: So what do you mostly liked? But what if you
Speaker 1: if I come for dinner or lunch, what would you
Speaker 1: What would you want to make.
Speaker 2: Depends what I would find out the market.
Speaker 1: Good answer. Yeah. We always say, don't go to the
Speaker 1: market with a shopping list in your head. No that thing.
Speaker 1: Do you remember when I started cooking, I would be
Speaker 1: running all over London trying to find the ingredient, some ingredient,
Speaker 1: and then you realize it's just when I lived in
Speaker 1: Paris for four years. That was one of the lessons
Speaker 1: I took away, which was it we lived over market
Speaker 1: and you go downstairs and then you see what's there
Speaker 1: and then you cook. And that's what we do in
Speaker 1: the River Cafe. You know, we change the menu for
Speaker 1: every meal because we come in like a domestic cook
Speaker 1: and see what's in the fridge, see what's been ordered,
Speaker 1: see what we have, and then we start to cook.
Speaker 2: That is the hardest menu to choose from.
Speaker 1: Oh really wait, it's not a very long menu.
Speaker 2: No, but you want everything. It's like really difficult to
Speaker 2: choose from that menu.
Speaker 1: I love being there that night. I love we were
Speaker 1: at separate tables, which Johnny just said that was annoying.
Speaker 1: It was just to see your enthusiasm and your happiness
Speaker 1: for being there. Do go out to restaurants a lot,
Speaker 1: I do, I do. What do you look for in
Speaker 1: a restaurant?
Speaker 2: It can't I don't want like inferior food. If I'm
Speaker 2: going to eat pasta, that's like an indulgence for me.
Speaker 1: It has to be because it's cars well, because I.
Speaker 2: Just try and watch my weight and healthy and I
Speaker 2: always have. But if I'm going to eat pasta, it
Speaker 2: has to be great pasta. If I'm going to eat
Speaker 2: a steak, I mean I eat everything. I don't want
Speaker 2: to eat a crappy steak. It has to be like
Speaker 2: the best steak. Otherwise I'll eat at home, you know.
Speaker 2: So I can get disappointed sometimes at certain restaurants.
Speaker 1: Do you go back to the saved on silver? And
Speaker 1: I again, I do. Does the mood of the restaurant
Speaker 1: matter to you? How the waiters are, how the absolutely
Speaker 1: when you walk in, you want to feel welcome and
Speaker 1: taken care of. And yeah, you live downtown.
Speaker 2: My place is in Chelsea.
Speaker 1: Yeah, oh that's a good areas. That good air for
Speaker 1: food you've got, No, it's okay. Shopping art galleries, art galleries,
Speaker 1: art galleries. That's good to have, isn't it. My son
Speaker 1: lived on Nineteenth Street, you know the building by Jean Novelle.
Speaker 1: Its opposite that Frank Carey building. Yeah right there, Yeah,
Speaker 1: that is beautiful. It's around the corner. Yeah. The River
Speaker 1: Cafe is excited to announce the return of our Italian
Speaker 1: Christmas gift boxes, our alternative to the traditional hamper. We
Speaker 1: bring you all of our favorites from the River Cafe, kitchen,
Speaker 1: vineyards and the designers from all over Italy. They're available
Speaker 1: to pre order now on shop the River Cafe dot
Speaker 1: co dot uk. So let's go back to the beginning.
Speaker 1: You grew up with an Italian grandmothers two two, two
Speaker 1: grandfathers two your parents. What was food like growing up
Speaker 1: in the Evangelista household?
Speaker 2: Well, I complained a lot because we always ate homemade
Speaker 2: food and I wanted to have TV dinners or frozen
Speaker 2: meals or something out of a can.
Speaker 1: I wanted to close from Cyr's roebook. I was really Oh,
Speaker 1: my clothes were from Cyrus. I didn't think to my mother,
Speaker 1: not that we had money, but why can't we buy
Speaker 1: clothes out of a catalog?
Speaker 2: That sounds so my clothes were from CERs and Woolworth.
Speaker 2: So yeah, So it was a lot of homemade food
Speaker 2: and I appreciate that now, but like growing up, you know,
Speaker 2: I wanted the TV dinners with the compartments, you know,
Speaker 2: and the little apple pie in the corner. And but yeah,
Speaker 2: my father took us out for dinner every Friday because
Speaker 2: my mother worked late. She was where in retail. But
Speaker 2: my father let us choose the restaurant. And by restaurant,
Speaker 2: I mean McDonald's or Denny's or the pizzeria or A
Speaker 2: and W, you know, fast food. And so that was
Speaker 2: a big deal because we were very spoiled with that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and fresh.
Speaker 2: We had homemade pasta Wednesdays and Sundays. We had roast
Speaker 2: beef once a week. We would have steak or barbecue
Speaker 2: once a week. My father really spent a lot of money,
Speaker 2: I think on food because he didn't have much growing up.
Speaker 2: They ate like a chicken or a rabbit once a week.
Speaker 1: This is what until he was sixteen, until came to America. Yeah,
Speaker 1: until he got.
Speaker 2: A good job at General Motors. And the food went
Speaker 2: on the table family style.
Speaker 1: How many of you were there, you me.
Speaker 2: And two brothers, two brothers, and he would serve us
Speaker 2: and he would put like this mound on your plate
Speaker 2: and you had to eat it all. And for him,
Speaker 2: the most important thing was you weren't hungry, that you
Speaker 2: were nourished, that you ate. He also didn't want a
Speaker 2: lot to talk at the table because where he worked
Speaker 2: was so noisy, so there wasn't a lot of conversation.
Speaker 2: It was sort of like dive into your food and
Speaker 2: finish it because you're not leaving the table too.
Speaker 1: Did you dread dinners or did you No?
Speaker 2: I didn't dread it. A couple times I did. I
Speaker 2: wouldn't eat the liver.
Speaker 1: And what would he do? And you say, you have
Speaker 1: to do it? Would you understand if you really couldn't.
Speaker 2: They gave up trying to make me the liver.
Speaker 1: I have a friend who had an amazing posture. She
Speaker 1: would just sit. I once said, you had, you know,
Speaker 1: very new. How is it that you sit so well?
Speaker 1: She said, well, because at the meal at the table,
Speaker 1: my father and mother said we had to always sit straight.
Speaker 1: It was just the thing. And she said, as a result,
Speaker 1: I hated every meal. She said, I just couldn't bear going.
Speaker 1: You know, she had great pasture, but it came from,
Speaker 1: you know, just this feeling of just dreading a family dinner.
Speaker 1: And it's interesting about not having to finish your plate
Speaker 1: when you don't want to.
Speaker 2: No, in general, I was like, OK food, Yeah, And
Speaker 2: maybe because we had to eat what was put in
Speaker 2: front of us, we weren't there weren't cooking different meals
Speaker 2: for us, like we all ate the same. And it's
Speaker 2: crazy because like today, I love dandelion and I used
Speaker 2: to go with my father in the country where no
Speaker 2: person or dog had walked. There was lots of farmlands
Speaker 2: and we would pick the little baby tender. Yeah, like
Speaker 2: I grew up on broccoli rub. Everybody had a garden
Speaker 2: and what they produced in these gardens was unbelievable. Tell
Speaker 2: me about everything like tomatoes and cucumbers and peppers and
Speaker 2: different like ridico and and then there were the fruit
Speaker 2: trees and then there was like basil, all the earth,
Speaker 2: you name it, onions and it was just all there.
Speaker 1: And so you had your own garden full of.
Speaker 2: Everybody had the whole backyard was a garden, but shared
Speaker 2: what the other one didn't have. And it's not like
Speaker 2: we had a swimming pool or we didn't play in
Speaker 2: our backyards. We played on the street or parking lot.
Speaker 1: Did they bring the seeds? Do you think for Italy?
Speaker 1: I get the seeds are a whole thing.
Speaker 2: The seeds was like a network and whoever had like
Speaker 2: the best tomatoes that year would do the seeds and
Speaker 2: hand them out. And it's so funny. Now you see
Speaker 2: all these heirloom tomatoes and I'm like, but those are
Speaker 2: the tomatoes I grew up with, Like none of them
Speaker 2: were nice little round tomatoes. And then the fruit trees
Speaker 2: and my father he had a green thumb and he
Speaker 2: would graft. He would do these sensational things like the
Speaker 2: apricot tree had plums on it and the red apple
Speaker 2: tree had a branch with yellow apples, and he would
Speaker 2: graft and it would be it would just be incredible,
Speaker 2: and then he would make his gropas.
Speaker 1: So do you think that then he would go work
Speaker 1: at general motives? Do you think that in his real
Speaker 1: passion would have been to have been a farmer or
Speaker 1: to have done this whole day? Absolutely? Yeah.
Speaker 2: Well, he grew up. He didn't get an education because
Speaker 2: he had to work the land. And I know he
Speaker 2: had a donkey and whenever he referred to Italy he
Speaker 2: referred to it as the good old days. I think
Speaker 2: that would have been what he would have loved to
Speaker 2: have done because he was so good at it. We
Speaker 2: also had it was so embarrassing at the time. We
Speaker 2: had some chickens and some rabbits, but we didn't live
Speaker 2: in zoning that allowed those in the roosters when they
Speaker 2: would go off at five height.
Speaker 1: So this was a suburban. It was a suburban suburb
Speaker 1: and you were all This community was Italian, was it?
Speaker 1: Everybody had the gardens that you're Polish, and then you
Speaker 1: grew up with this culture, with this food, with these gardens, and.
Speaker 2: Then and then you had to pickle it, yeah, or
Speaker 2: put it in a jar or cure it for the winter.
Speaker 2: So we would make sausages and they would buy the animal.
Speaker 2: Don't ask me how it got divided up and who
Speaker 2: did what. And then they would make pro chutto and capricolo,
Speaker 2: and we made our own tomato sauce. But they would
Speaker 2: have to buy more tomatoes because we would make enough
Speaker 2: to get you through the winter. And that would be
Speaker 2: like a pasata. And everything got pickled like egg plants.
Speaker 1: And did you have olive oil?
Speaker 2: No funny you say that, but they do buy We
Speaker 2: don't have olives in Canada, but they would get somehow
Speaker 2: from I don't know which dealer some olives and maybe
Speaker 2: make some jars of olives, but they didn't make olive oil.
Speaker 2: They bought that.
Speaker 1: It sounds it just is a description of life in
Speaker 1: an Italian hilltown. You know, well it was, It absolutely was.
Speaker 1: It continue it does continue.
Speaker 2: We still make the tomato sauce every year.
Speaker 1: When you say we, who would that be?
Speaker 2: The whole family. My father took a motor off of
Speaker 2: a washing machine for clothing and he rigged it up
Speaker 2: to the machine that pureds you know, and separates the
Speaker 2: seeds and peels with the passata, so you know, you
Speaker 2: wouldn't have to do it by hands. This thing grows.
Speaker 2: That makes a lot of noise, but I don't know
Speaker 2: how many bushels we do at it per day, like
Speaker 2: bushels and bushels and bushels of tomatoes.
Speaker 1: They say that now in Italy because everyone is, you know,
Speaker 1: younger generation are leaving these hill towns. They're kind of empty.
Speaker 1: They're they're going. But you can't understand also why younger
Speaker 1: generation of women might not want to peel tomatoes for
Speaker 1: the next season, you know, or to do that through
Speaker 1: the winter. But it is a tradition and it's a
Speaker 1: beautiful tradition of it would be sad it is.
Speaker 2: It's one of it's like you come together that day
Speaker 2: to do it because it's too much work to do.
Speaker 2: You know, you need multiple people doing it because the
Speaker 2: tomatoes have to get dropped in boiling water. You know,
Speaker 2: they have the jars. The sausage is a lot of
Speaker 2: work too, you know, the casings. That's the one thing
Speaker 2: I didn't like, washing the casing.
Speaker 1: I know. Did you see the movie nineteen hundred Pertulucies
Speaker 1: movie and there's a very graphic part of it which
Speaker 1: shows making up the sausages.
Speaker 2: I did not.
Speaker 1: It's a great movie. You should see it. It takes place
Speaker 1: in Parma, much more further north. But when you left,
Speaker 1: because you went to work quite at an early age,
Speaker 1: I was eighteen, almost nice, Oh you were What was
Speaker 1: that like, leaving this culture of food? What did you do?
Speaker 1: How did you eat?
Speaker 2: I think I ate really simple. I was in New
Speaker 2: York for about a month or so, and then they
Speaker 2: shipped me off to Paris, who shipped you off the
Speaker 2: agency because I wasn't doing so well in New York.
Speaker 2: They said, maybe you'll be more successful At nineteen and
Speaker 2: I was first in the Hotel sant Andre DA's art,
Speaker 2: but I got bad bugs there, so I went to
Speaker 2: the Hotel La Louisia.
Speaker 1: And my mom Louisiana.
Speaker 2: My mom found out our.
Speaker 1: Hotel, our hotel room in the Louisiana was being used
Speaker 1: during the day. I'm not kidding what ye many once
Speaker 1: came home and they would rent it out during the day.
Speaker 1: Oh my god. Yeah, So we left the Louisa.
Speaker 2: That was an upgrade for me. It was ten dollars
Speaker 2: more a night, and my mom had to approve that.
Speaker 2: And so I would go to the market on Rula
Speaker 2: Boussie and I would like, get it, but get and
Speaker 2: a piece of breeze and a piece of fruit, and
Speaker 2: that's how I would eat on a budget.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we moved into the hotel Descend. You remember that
Speaker 1: one that was next door to a big step up. Yeah,
Speaker 1: what year was that, Well, it was in seventy twenty three,
Speaker 1: maybe seventy two.
Speaker 2: They're in like eighty forty.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so that was later, so I'm sure, but I
Speaker 1: remember my sid it was a pretty rough the vestory
Speaker 1: about the hotel we stayed in. Renzo Piano came to
Speaker 1: visit me. Richard and his partner. They were doing the
Speaker 1: Pompany Center. I was sick, so I was in bed.
Speaker 1: Sorenza came up and talked to me until Richard came back.
Speaker 1: He was at dinner and we were just talking and
Speaker 1: you know, was sneezing, and then the phone rang and
Speaker 1: it was a concierge and he said, madam, your husband
Speaker 1: is on the way up. And I thought that was
Speaker 1: so cool. At the hotel, they were mourning me because
Speaker 1: they thought that I was in bed with my lover.
Speaker 2: That's good.
Speaker 1: I thought that was in a cheap hotel. That was
Speaker 1: a pretty good service if I needed.
Speaker 2: It, very good service.
Speaker 1: So I know, we don't want to talk about things
Speaker 1: that everybody else talks about. But you were working as
Speaker 1: a model. We can recognize that you were doing that
Speaker 1: in Paris. And what were the restrictions and food because
Speaker 1: for your professional life, did you have to be in
Speaker 1: the day in the day eat and so you had
Speaker 1: a metabolism that crazy crazy.
Speaker 2: I think it started to slow down close to thirty.
Speaker 2: I started working out like when I was twenty seven
Speaker 2: twenty eight, because I was like, oh, I think things
Speaker 2: are a little different. And back then, if you overindulge
Speaker 2: for too long. If you cut back on everything for
Speaker 2: three days, you would drop.
Speaker 1: Five pounds, you know.
Speaker 2: And now it's very easy to gain five pounds in
Speaker 2: a weekend.
Speaker 1: Now being your age now, absolutely, yeah, absolutely, But the
Speaker 1: tyranny of the stories we hear of models having to starve.
Speaker 1: And I went to a show in London even now,
Speaker 1: and we had Edward NFL you know, I love Edwards
Speaker 1: and he spent so much time talking about body image
Speaker 1: and what that means and how fashion has to adapt
Speaker 1: women's sizes rather than women adapt to fashion.
Speaker 2: Well, there were years. Maybe that's today, and that's great
Speaker 2: because Edward is a crusader and he cares about humanity
Speaker 2: and he cares about women, and he has done an
Speaker 2: amazing job with diversity. We have to be so grateful
Speaker 2: for Edward and the Edwards of this world. But in
Speaker 2: the nineties a model had to adapt.
Speaker 1: And adapt to to fit the clothes. Yeah, correct. I
Speaker 1: think it's still now because I went to see a
Speaker 1: show in London and for me, it was kind of
Speaker 1: painful to watch.
Speaker 2: I don't want to see that.
Speaker 1: It was really painful. They were so so sid you know,
Speaker 1: and he just thought, what did you do to you know?
Speaker 1: Maybe as you said, a lot of them. Maybe they
Speaker 1: had a huge pape of food by fild up.
Speaker 2: Some probably did there, maybe not all. I know that
Speaker 2: when I was you know, flying every other day and
Speaker 2: working and running around and jet setting and globe trotting,
Speaker 2: I had to work on keeping the weight on, keeping
Speaker 2: it on, keeping it on. Yeah, And then there became
Speaker 2: a period where I had to really watch and I
Speaker 2: started doing cleanses all the time. And I loved doing
Speaker 2: these cleanses, but I think they were very harmful to me.
Speaker 1: What were they?
Speaker 2: Well, I did the Master Cleanse quite a few times,
Speaker 2: but I would do like medicinal cleanses where it's like
Speaker 2: a powdered drink, like the rice based like Metagenics. There's
Speaker 2: different brands that do them. Or I would go to
Speaker 2: Weak Care once or twice a year for a week,
Speaker 2: you know, we Care. It's out in the desert near
Speaker 2: Palm Springs, Palm Desert, and you just do liquids. It's
Speaker 2: mostly you know, waters with lemon and mint and teas
Speaker 2: and you get a glass of juice a day and
Speaker 2: then you get a very diluted, watered down vegetable on
Speaker 2: a day called a soup. But it's basically a liquid us.
Speaker 2: It's a starvation, but it's amazing. Yeah, it's been like
Speaker 2: quite the journey. And I will never do the deprivation.
Speaker 2: I won't do that again.
Speaker 1: I won't try it again.
Speaker 2: No, but there's something to be said for like a
Speaker 2: nice twenty four hour fast with celery ches. I mean,
Speaker 2: I do still enjoy like doing something like that. I
Speaker 2: find it refreshing and you kickstart your head in your
Speaker 2: mind into like a new place of like, Okay, I'm
Speaker 2: going to get on this like healthy track, and eating
Speaker 2: healthy can be very very delicious.
Speaker 1: Of course.
Speaker 2: I just happen to love vegetables.
Speaker 1: Your son. Tell me what you cook for your son,
Speaker 1: and what does he like to eat?
Speaker 2: Well, he loves meat and chicken, and he loves protein.
Speaker 2: He loves my soups.
Speaker 1: Tell me about your soups.
Speaker 2: Like the other day, I made parade and I even
Speaker 2: passed it through the sieve to make it super super
Speaker 2: smooth mixed vegetable soup. I make lots of minas tons
Speaker 2: and I made my first one last week and he went, oh,
Speaker 2: it's that season again, and that's good. He's happy if
Speaker 2: I give him crunchy bagat or crunchy sour dough bread
Speaker 2: or something to dip in there. Yeah, with some parmesan.
Speaker 2: He's happy as can. He just turned seventeen.
Speaker 1: Apetite. Do you have a place where you can grow it?
Speaker 2: No, I don't have a place. I will, I will.
Speaker 2: I'm getting there when he's going to go off to
Speaker 2: school in two years, and then I'm gonna You know,
Speaker 2: does your father still love?
Speaker 1: No, he passed, but you would you know how to
Speaker 1: graft an apricut onto a prune.
Speaker 2: Or I mean I've seen him do it, but probably not,
Speaker 2: but you could kind of green thumb. And the stuff
Speaker 2: he used to do, like his basil leaves were like
Speaker 2: bigger than the size of my hand. I tell you
Speaker 2: the groppa. He made it for years and it was
Speaker 2: just awful, and then suddenly it kicked in and he
Speaker 2: would make it from pairs from plums, I think, peaches.
Speaker 2: And then they would do homemade wine, which all the
Speaker 2: Italians do. It's totally illegal, you know, they would make
Speaker 2: in their basements.
Speaker 1: And did they go back? Did they go back to Italy?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 2: I took my father back. He hadn't been there for
Speaker 2: forty years when I took him back. I think it
Speaker 2: was forty years. I go back every few years, we visit.
Speaker 1: To the town Yea where they came from.
Speaker 2: And then we are so grateful and thankful that we
Speaker 2: grew up in Canada because it would have been a
Speaker 2: completely different life had we, you know, grown up there,
Speaker 2: but we appreciate it.
Speaker 1: I'm glad to different out there because I might have
Speaker 1: had you in our lives, and it's it's important to
Speaker 1: have you in them. So, as I started out by saying,
Speaker 1: we often talk about food, and we know that you've
Speaker 1: described it as part of your culture and the garden
Speaker 1: and your parents and your family. And if you had
Speaker 1: a food that would give you comfort that you look
Speaker 1: to when you need comfort, is there one food that
Speaker 1: you might go to now, Linda Evangelista.
Speaker 2: Oh, my mom's egg plant part of Mejiona. She made
Speaker 2: it for me for Thanksgiving in Canada. It's the first
Speaker 2: Monday of October, so it was just home for that.
Speaker 1: It's a different Thanksgiving.
Speaker 2: I remember that it is, and we make regular Thanksgiving food,
Speaker 2: all the traditional things. But if you're Italian, the Italian
Speaker 2: food makes its way.
Speaker 3: Also.
Speaker 2: It didn't make any sense, it was not cohesive. But
Speaker 2: my stepfather farms with his son, and there were beats
Speaker 2: and Swiss chart which are not Thanksgiving foods, but they
Speaker 2: were on the table. It was a mishmash. It was
Speaker 2: delicious eggplant farm. Jena is good. That's a good comfort food.
Speaker 2: I should bring her to London. She sounds great, she
Speaker 2: is great. Well, you're great to thank you for coming.
Speaker 2: Thank you wonderful, No, thank you, We'll see. I do
Speaker 2: mean what I said about the River Cafe. Do I
Speaker 2: need to bring an apron or I think we'll.
Speaker 1: Give you one? Yeah, thank you, thank you very much. Beautiful,
Speaker 1: really nice, really nice so far.
Speaker 3: I was like, I know, if you like listening to
Speaker 3: Ruthie's Table four, would you please make sure to rate
Speaker 3: and review the podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, o,
Speaker 3: wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 1: Thank you.
Speaker 2: Ruthie's Table four is produced by Atami Studios for iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2: It was hosted by Ruthie Rogers.
Speaker 1: It's produced by William Lensky.
Speaker 2: Our executive producers are Sad Rogers and Fay Stewart.
Speaker 1: Our production manager is Caitline Paramount.
Speaker 2: Special thanks to everyone at the River Cafe.