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Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to save your prediction of iHeartRadio. I'm

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Speaker 1: Annie Reese.

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Speaker 2: And I'm more in Vogelbaum, and today we have an

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Speaker 2: episode for you about Bulgogie.

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Speaker 1: Yes, yes, fun with pronunciations for sure, Oh my goodness.

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Speaker 2: Yes, I don't know Korean, as it turns out, and

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Speaker 2: so that is going to be a theme throughout this episode.

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Speaker 1: Yes, it will be, It will be. Was there any

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Speaker 1: particular reason this was on your mind? Lord? Uh?

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Speaker 2: You know, I think I've been wanting to do Beban

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Speaker 2: Bop for a while, but it's a little bit trickier

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Speaker 2: to nail down. This seemed as I was getting into

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Speaker 2: it famous last words, like it was going to be

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Speaker 2: relatively straightforward. I love I love Korean food. Here in Atlanta,

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Speaker 2: We're lucky to have a number of amazing Korean restaurants.

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Speaker 2: And yeah, the cravings in this one, Yes, the cravings, Yes,

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Speaker 2: very much.

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Speaker 1: I remember the first time I had bolgolgy, and it's

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Speaker 1: been bolin is to thank for this our colleague and

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Speaker 1: friend D and D compatriot because I've said a million times,

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Speaker 1: but I came from a small town. There was no

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Speaker 1: book golgy to be had there. And when I came

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Speaker 1: to Atlanta, I got introduced to all these things, but

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Speaker 1: I remember it was Ben Bolin. I think you kind

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Speaker 1: of mentioned it in passing and I was like, oh,

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Speaker 1: what is that? I want that? And I loved it.

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Speaker 1: And at the time you could get it at Trader

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Speaker 1: Joe's not a sponsor, and I would get it there

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Speaker 1: and cook it for my family. But my older brother

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Speaker 1: there was something in there that, like his stomach didn't

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Speaker 1: sit well with making. But it was a very beautiful

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Speaker 1: period of mind when I discovered bulgogi.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, I don't think I had had any

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Speaker 2: before before I was in Atlanta because right, yeah, I

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Speaker 2: also did not have access to that cuisine when I

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Speaker 2: was growing up.

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Speaker 1: And it was.

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Speaker 2: Actually it was actually a coworker at like the job

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Speaker 2: I had before.

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Speaker 1: How stuff works.

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Speaker 2: So a full fifteen ish years ago, I had a

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Speaker 2: co worker from South Korea who was like, oh, man,

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Speaker 2: we have to go to this restaurant. But he was yeah,

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Speaker 2: in Boston at the time, so but yeah, but then

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Speaker 2: I came back here and I was like, oh, this

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Speaker 2: is everywhere cool.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, not hard to find. We're very lucky, as

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Speaker 1: you said, Yes, you can see our episodes we've done

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Speaker 1: on things like kim chi for more context and GoChi jang. Yes,

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Speaker 1: but I guess that brings us to our question, Sure,

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Speaker 1: bull golgi, what is it? Well?

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Speaker 2: Well, googie is a type of dish made of very thin,

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Speaker 2: bite sized slices of meat, usually beef, marinated in a savory, sweet,

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Speaker 2: pungent salty sauce made from soy sauce, sugar, garlic, ginger,

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Speaker 2: and sesame oil, among other seasonings. The meat is then

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Speaker 2: usually grilled until tender, with a little crisp and char

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Speaker 2: at the edges, maybe a tiny bit saucy from the marinade.

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Speaker 2: It's often served family style or even cooked on a

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Speaker 2: mini grill like at the table, with a range of

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Speaker 2: accompaniments including steamed white rice, large leaf lettuce, various spicy

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Speaker 2: pickled vegetables, and various sauces for dipping in or drizzling.

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Speaker 2: You like make yourself little lettuce wraps with a little

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Speaker 2: bit of everything you want in each bite. It can

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Speaker 2: also be served over a bowl of rice, maybe made saucier,

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Speaker 2: or you can cook the marinated beef into a soup.

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Speaker 2: You can use other proteins or add mixins to the

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Speaker 2: marinade like sliced onion or mushrooms. It is so satisfying,

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Speaker 2: Like you eat beef. This is just a perfect preparation

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Speaker 2: of it, you know, like meltingly tender, chewy and with

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Speaker 2: fatty richness tempered by those sweet, funky, tart spicy flavors.

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Speaker 2: You get some crunch from the lettuce and the pickles,

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Speaker 2: some soft fluff from the rice. It's almost like it's

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Speaker 2: like meat noodles. It's like it's like if perfect stir

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Speaker 2: fried flat noodles were made of the best barbecue you've

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Speaker 2: had in your life.

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Speaker 1: It's just a perfect comfort food.

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Speaker 2: It's like it's like when the heat picks on and

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Speaker 2: you put yourself just right in front of the radiator

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Speaker 2: or like on top of the heat vent and just

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Speaker 2: instant full body warmth.

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Speaker 1: Well, now you've made the cravings worse anytime. It's a skilled.

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Speaker 2: I was so mad the entire time I was doing

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Speaker 2: this reading, Like I was like, don't you cannot order.

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Speaker 1: Und right now? Okay?

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Speaker 2: Anyway, okay, So, so bulgogi is a type of a

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Speaker 2: quick cooking barbecue. You're you're looking to get your main

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Speaker 2: ingredient to a place where it'll cook through in just

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Speaker 2: a couple of minutes and be nice and tender and

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Speaker 2: in bite sized pieces. Beef is the most traditional, you know,

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Speaker 2: like a something already tender with nice marbling is preferred

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Speaker 2: like a like a cut like a ribbi or sirloin,

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Speaker 2: and then cut as thin as possible against the grain.

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Speaker 2: Some recipes will recommend freezing a steak for a little

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Speaker 2: bit before cutting it to help. Some recommend using an

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Speaker 2: electric meat slicer to get it really thin. Tougher cuts

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Speaker 2: of beef can be marinated for longer, though chicken is

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Speaker 2: also common, as is often spicier marinated pork. I've seen

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Speaker 2: recipes for vegetarian versions too, using some kind of vegetarian

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Speaker 2: protein substitute or sliced mushrooms and peppers and onions, something

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Speaker 2: like that.

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Speaker 1: Then the marinade. Okay.

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Speaker 2: The ingredients can vary by personal taste or regional or

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Speaker 2: family recipe, but commonly you we'll start with soy sauce

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Speaker 2: for salt and savory flavors as well, some kind of bright,

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Speaker 2: clean tasting rice wine, maybe some brown sugar to help

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Speaker 2: balance the saltiness, sesame oil, grated garlic and ginger, and

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Speaker 2: a little bit of black pepper. You might also add

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Speaker 2: things like gucci jung, which is a spicy from a

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Speaker 2: did chili pepper sauce, or maybe the juice or puree

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Speaker 2: of things like Asian pear or kiwi or sesame seeds

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Speaker 2: for extra naughty punch. Yeah, sometimes you'll blend the sauce

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Speaker 2: into a smooth liquid. Sometimes you won't. End then marinad

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Speaker 2: science all right, as we've as we've talked about before

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Speaker 2: in our episodes about various meat dishes turkey, pastrami, saviche,

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Speaker 2: fried chicken, others. Sure, I don't know. There are a

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Speaker 2: number of ways to muck around with protein molecules in

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Speaker 2: your food, either before or instead of heating them up

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Speaker 2: in order to make your finished product what you want

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Speaker 2: it to be. Acids and alcohols will make protein fibers

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Speaker 2: kind of clamp up. Salt and some enzymes found in

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Speaker 2: various fruits and vegetables like Asian pears and kiwis and

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Speaker 2: the recently discussed papaya will make those fibers relax. In

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Speaker 2: the case of bulgogie, you're exposing such thin and cross

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Speaker 2: grain slices of meat to the marinade so that the

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Speaker 2: proteins in them are in much more in direct contact

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Speaker 2: with those things than they would be if you were

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Speaker 2: marinating like a whole steak or like a chicken thigh

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Speaker 2: or whatever.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 2: That's why a lot of recipes call for only marinating

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Speaker 2: your protein for a short period of time, like half

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Speaker 2: an hour. More time might start to affect the texture

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Speaker 2: of the meat. But depending on what protein you're using,

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Speaker 2: or you know your personal taste, you might want to

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Speaker 2: affect the texture of meat. And I can't tell you

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Speaker 2: what to do. In the proportions that that things go

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Speaker 2: into Bulgogi marinade, the effect is going to be overall

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Speaker 2: relaxing on the proteins due to salt and possibly that

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Speaker 2: fruit enzyme content. I think any alcohol in there is

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Speaker 2: really just for its own flavor and or to like

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Speaker 2: help with sauce caramelization. If anyone wants to do a

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Speaker 2: scientific study on this, I welcome you to.

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Speaker 1: I dare you.

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Speaker 2: The Internet is really full of really confusing, conflicting information

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Speaker 2: about marinades, and I couldn't really find anything about you know,

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Speaker 2: what happens in a cross section of beef like this.

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Speaker 2: So here we are, yeah, okay, cooking the thing. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: so all right, you add your thin sliced whatever to

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Speaker 2: your marinade and let it soak. You might also add

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Speaker 2: sliced onion or mushroom or other vegetables. At this point,

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Speaker 2: after whatever amount of time you deem appropriate, you remove

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Speaker 2: the stuff from the sauce and cook it quickly on

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Speaker 2: a grill preferably heated by charcoal to get a little

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Speaker 2: bit of that flavor in there. Yeah, and then it

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Speaker 2: can be served simply over rice, usually at that point

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Speaker 2: with a couple of vegetable side dishes, or alongside rice,

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Speaker 2: often with leaf lettuce to make handheld wraps, and then

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Speaker 2: with a kimchi or other fermented vegetables and sauces like

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Speaker 2: some jong, which is a type of a spicy, funky

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Speaker 2: condiment made with fermented soybean paste and gochu jong and

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Speaker 2: other stuff that's often served or pretty much always served

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Speaker 2: with lettuce wraps. A note here that I've been saying lettuce,

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Speaker 2: but the leaf wrap does not have to be lettuce

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Speaker 2: at Any leafy green that's good, either fresh or steamed

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Speaker 2: or blanched, could be used, depending on what's local and

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Speaker 2: deemed tasty. For this traditional approach, either in restaurants or

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Speaker 2: at home, you might have a small grill either built

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Speaker 2: into the table or like portable and brought to the table,

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Speaker 2: and each diner might grill or pluck off their own

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Speaker 2: pieces as they go as they're eating. The grill top

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Speaker 2: and be graded or like a dome that allows cooking

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Speaker 2: liquid to collect in a ring around the bottom. Though

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Speaker 2: from what I understand, this table side stick is considered

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Speaker 2: sort of old fashioned and a little kitchy by South

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Speaker 2: Koreans these days. I get the idea like sort of

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Speaker 2: in the way that we perceive fondue and is often

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Speaker 2: reserved for special occasions. Yes, Korea is where this dish

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Speaker 2: is from. But yeah, yeah, you can do whatever else

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Speaker 2: you want with marinated stuff. You know, you can cook

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Speaker 2: it in a stove top pan if that's what you've got.

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Speaker 2: You can leave the marinade in to make a nice sauce.

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Speaker 2: You can add some nice glass type noodles to make

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Speaker 2: a noodles sort of stir fry. You can toss your

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Speaker 2: cooked stuff in a sandwich bun, well, googi, philly, I

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Speaker 2: don't know. Or instead of a stovetop or grill top,

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Speaker 2: you can add the raw pieces to a hot pot

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Speaker 2: or or otherwise to some kind of hot broth for

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Speaker 2: a soup situation, and depending on the region of Korea

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Speaker 2: you're in, this might be the more traditional preparation.

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Speaker 1: You can.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so this is both a home and a restaurant product.

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Speaker 2: You can also buy bottled bulgogie sauce. Markets catering to

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Speaker 2: Koreans all over the world sell pre sliced and marinated

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Speaker 2: bulgogi meat that's like ready to cook. You can also

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Speaker 2: find ready to heat bulgogi frozener refrigerated.

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Speaker 1: It's out there, it is, it is indeed.

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Speaker 2: Oh well, what about the nutrition, Oh, it depends. You know,

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Speaker 2: usually lots of protein can be heavy on the fats

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Speaker 2: and salts, depending It'll definitely help fill you up, you know,

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Speaker 2: Drink water, eat, eat a vegetable, get down, let us

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Speaker 2: yeah or whatever, leafy green whatever. Yeah, well, we do

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Speaker 2: have some numbers.

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Speaker 1: For you, we do.

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Speaker 2: Okay, So, I did a lot of reading for this one, y'all,

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Speaker 2: and I read a lot of numbers, but like really

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Speaker 2: dynamic ones, we're a little bit hard to isolate around

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Speaker 2: this dish specifically, but okay is a very popular food

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Speaker 2: in South Korea and also a very popular Korean dish

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Speaker 2: in foreign cultures. You know, people people like barbecue So

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Speaker 2: for example, in nineteen ninety six, the South Korean Ministry

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Speaker 2: of Culture and Sports named bulgogi one of the top

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Speaker 2: ten symbols of Korea. As of twenty twenty three, Jaiju AYR,

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Speaker 2: which is a budget airliner out of South Korea, bulgogi

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Speaker 2: over rice had been the most popular in flight meal

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Speaker 2: for five years running, comprising a full quarter of in

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Speaker 2: flight food sales YEA. And in a study out of

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Speaker 2: South Korea nineteen ninety five, of eleven Korean dishes sampled

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Speaker 2: by American study participants, the participants rated bulgogi the tastiest. Also,

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Speaker 2: between nineteen eighty and two thousand and five, the New

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Speaker 2: York Times mentioned bulgog forty seven times. The only Korean

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Speaker 2: foods mentioned more often during that period were kim chi

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Speaker 2: and scallion pancakes. Oh yeah, yeah, also delicious. But all

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Speaker 2: of that was Those two American examples, anyway, were before

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Speaker 2: the really big surge in Korean culture internationally referred to

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Speaker 2: as the Korean Wave or sometimes by the Chinese term

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Speaker 2: how you, and that started in the early two thousands. So,

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Speaker 2: just for example, like a market study found that American

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Speaker 2: interest in Korean cuisine spiked almost ninety percent during twenty

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Speaker 2: twenty one alone, just about doubled that year. A different

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Speaker 2: survey from the end of twenty twenty two found that

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Speaker 2: in twenty six countries around the world, about three quarters

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Speaker 2: of respondents said the Korean cuisine is either very or

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Speaker 2: moderately popular where they live, and a survey of wave

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Speaker 2: trends overall found that as of twenty twenty three, Korean

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Speaker 2: food was the most popular cultural item outside of the Peninsula,

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Speaker 2: capturing some forty nine percent of the public's interest. That

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Speaker 2: was followed by music and movies. Wow, it's pretty impressive. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 2: it's I I like food, so I can't really argue,

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Speaker 2: but you.

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Speaker 1: Know, yeah, oh wow. Well, if you want to learn

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Speaker 1: more about this. Incidentally, we did talk about this K

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Speaker 1: wave and K pop and K dramas over on Spin

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Speaker 1: d oh cool. Stefan never told you, so you wanted

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Speaker 1: to learn more about that. Yeah, it's pretty big deal.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, a little bit big deal, A little bit, just

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Speaker 2: a little bit of a thing, huh.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, uh huh. Well, we do have a history for you.

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Speaker 1: We've got a history.

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Speaker 2: We heckn do, and we are going to get into

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Speaker 2: that as soon as we get back from a quick

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Speaker 2: break forward from our sponsors.

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Speaker 1: And we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So this one was quite a history to wrangle. Yes, yep,

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Speaker 1: as mentioned pronunciation fun times for us, but historians believe

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Speaker 1: that Bulgogi's origins go all the way back to the

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Speaker 1: evolution of a meat preparation similar to Kabob's first US

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Speaker 1: in Korea, sometime between thirty seven BCE UH to six

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Speaker 1: six eight six hundred and sixty eight CE. I don't

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Speaker 1: know why I mixed up my numbers like that sometimes,

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Speaker 1: but you know what I.

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Speaker 2: Mean, it's it's fun. Saying numbers out loud is really wild.

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Speaker 2: Just try it if y'all aren't used to reading a

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Speaker 2: number out loud. It's it's really wacky.

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Speaker 1: We promised.

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Speaker 2: It's not just us, but okay, that that time span

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Speaker 2: is because this was in the ancient kingdom of Golguryu,

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Speaker 2: which ruled during that period in the north central part

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Speaker 2: of the Korean Peninsula and then up further north into

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Speaker 2: what's now like China Russia.

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Speaker 1: Right, and this preparation was called mechchuk and consisted of

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Speaker 1: pre marinated, skewerd roasted meat. Over time, the meat was

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Speaker 1: marinated and soaked in water perhaps three times according to

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Speaker 1: some things I read, and it usually came into a

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Speaker 1: brothy dish. So that was a long time ago, big

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Speaker 1: time skip. By the twentieth century, this dish evolved again

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Speaker 1: into a very thinly sliced, marinated, seasoned, and charboled meat

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Speaker 1: that was much loved by the well off, called neo biani.

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Speaker 1: And again I looked up. I even watched videos in

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Speaker 1: Korean and was trying to find where's the pronunciation. I'm

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Speaker 1: very sorry if I butchered it. I did not discover it.

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Speaker 1: We try, we try, we do try, but always write

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Speaker 1: in US. Oh yeah, yeah. The seasoning typically called for salt, pepper,

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Speaker 1: soy sauce, garlic, scallion, sesame oil, sugar, and pear juice,

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Speaker 1: which was yes, largely Asian pear from what I understand, Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 2: Asian pear also called the apple pear or sand pear,

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Speaker 2: among other common names. The botanical name is Pyris pyrifolia,

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Speaker 2: and they're those large, roundish, golden speckled pears that often

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Speaker 2: come individually wrapped in like the weird little like webbing

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Speaker 2: kind of stuff to keep them fresh. Yeah, they're crisp

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Speaker 2: like an apple and have this really nice, delicate, sweet

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Speaker 2: tart sort of flavor, adding it adding it to the

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Speaker 2: ever growing.

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Speaker 1: List I love I love an Asian pear. Oh my goodness,

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Speaker 1: me too. Yeah, yeah, but okay. This is where a

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Speaker 1: series of complicated factors came into play to eventually arrive

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Speaker 1: at what we now know as bolgogi, which can refer

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Speaker 1: to both the brothy dish and the straight up grilled meat.

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Speaker 1: One of the big things about this was the increasing

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Speaker 1: widespread availability and commercialization of beef in Korea beginning in

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Speaker 1: the nineteen twenties and thirties. Previously, cows were too limited

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Speaker 1: and important to not use for their labor in the region.

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Speaker 1: As the population of cattle grew, though, naturally, beef ended

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Speaker 1: up in more dishes and it was accessible for more folks,

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Speaker 1: especially in bigger cities where early records show people were

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Speaker 1: raising beef specifically for their meat. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: The twenties and thirties were during Japan's colonization of Korea,

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Speaker 2: which happened from nineteen ten through the end of World

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Speaker 2: War Two, and due to a number of factors around

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Speaker 2: industrialization and harsh Japanese rule, a lot of people during

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Speaker 2: this time were moving from rural to urban areas, and

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Speaker 2: so food ways were changing.

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Speaker 1: Right, And at the same time, bulgogi was becoming cemented

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Speaker 1: in dining out culture and thus commercialized as well. Bulgogi

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Speaker 1: continued to evolve pretty much splitting along those to basic

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Speaker 1: pass the one with the broth and the roasted dish.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, because beef was becoming more available, like production of

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Speaker 2: a lot of stuff was on the rise, but meat

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Speaker 2: would have still been expensive for the average person, And

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Speaker 2: at this time the roasted type of bulgogie was probably

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Speaker 2: considered like a side dish instead of a maine And

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Speaker 2: it's similarly like a soup is a really tasty way

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Speaker 2: to stretch a limited amount of meat?

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Speaker 1: Yes, yes, it is. The rise of iron production and

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Speaker 1: the long standing popularity of certain broths and stews is

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Speaker 1: also believed to have had a key in popularizing bulgogi.

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Speaker 1: The term bulgogi first appeared in a written document in

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Speaker 1: nineteen twenty two, so the context kind of suggests that

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Speaker 1: it had been used to refer to any type of

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Speaker 1: roasted meat, like, not just the thinly sliced we would

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Speaker 1: think of.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a little bit difficult to tell from the

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Speaker 2: piece in question because Okay, this wasn't a short story

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Speaker 2: that appeared like in a literary magazine in nineteen twenty two.

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Speaker 2: And I love this reference. In the story, the narrator

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Speaker 2: refers to his romantic rivals expression like facial expression as

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Speaker 2: they're entering this sort of polite but tense public standoff,

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Speaker 2: and the narrator says, this is in translation. Perhaps obviously

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Speaker 2: his face was like a lump of bulgogie being cooked

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Speaker 2: over brightly burning charcoal.

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Speaker 1: That's great, right, because it's like you can see it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yes, but right, so it's hard to tell exactly

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Speaker 2: what type of cut of meat is being referred to

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Speaker 2: by that. It's a sick burn, is what we can say.

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Speaker 1: Uh. The Memoir of the first Mayor of Soul Sokria

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Speaker 1: mentions bulgogi and meat broth in reference to a dish

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Speaker 1: he had in nineteen twenty six while visiting Korean relatives

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Speaker 1: in Hawaii. It was written later, though, So that's one

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Speaker 1: of those things where it's.

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Speaker 2: Like, yeah, because he wrote it in the nineteen eighties,

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Speaker 2: the memoir, and so like rite what it was and

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Speaker 2: what his project is.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. A nineteen twenty seven text out of Japan

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Speaker 1: suggests that bulgogi was sold commercially and widely available in

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Speaker 1: Korean restaurants.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, a bulgogi was adapted into Japanese cuisine under the

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Speaker 2: name yakimiku. So if you've ever had that in a

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Speaker 2: Japanese restaurant, that's bulgogi basically.

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Speaker 1: Yeah uh, and I love this fact. A nineteen thirty

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Speaker 1: five article detailed an incident in which bolgogi was banned

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Speaker 1: in a famous Pyongyang amusement park because it was believed

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Speaker 1: that the smoke from cooking bolgogi in the open air

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Speaker 1: was drying out in the nearby trees. So what we

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Speaker 1: can take from this at least is that the grilled

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Speaker 1: or roasted version was the specialty of the serial, or

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Speaker 1: at least it was pretty it was well known. Yeah yeah.

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Speaker 2: There are a few other documents other than this, like

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Speaker 2: park band Yeah that.

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Speaker 1: Plays the grilled version in that city. Right. Also, bulgogi

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Speaker 1: was mentioned in the nineteen thirties pop song, which again

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Speaker 1: goes to show that it was well known at the time.

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Speaker 2: I love this one too, Okay. The singer of the

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Speaker 2: song A Lady is talking about this rude guy, possibly

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Speaker 2: a boyfriend. It's it's sort of like no scrubs like

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Speaker 2: the bulgogi version. And one of the things that the

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Speaker 2: that the lady says about this guy is that he

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Speaker 2: like he eats all of her side dishes, like he

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Speaker 2: eats the bulgogi and the rice cakes and gives her

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Speaker 2: only bean sprouts.

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Speaker 1: Oh no, yeah, get out of there. That's not acceptable,

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Speaker 1: not at all. I love this, okay.

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Speaker 2: However, after World War Two, there were a lot of

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Speaker 2: serious supply shortages, especially of expensive things like beef. This

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Speaker 2: was during the Division of Korea very basically after the

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Speaker 2: Second World War ended. The Allies kicked to Japan out

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Speaker 2: and split the peninsula into the USSR run zone in

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Speaker 2: the north and the United States run zone in the south,

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Speaker 2: which was supposed to be temporary but led to the

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Speaker 2: divide between North and South Korea that continues to this

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Speaker 2: day and also more immediately directly to the Korean War

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Speaker 2: in the early nineteen fifties. So all of these were

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Speaker 2: lean times for South Korea, and one can assume for

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Speaker 2: North Korea as well. The government there has never liked

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Speaker 2: information about their goings on, you know, getting out. So

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Speaker 2: this is also kind of where our timeline splits along

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Speaker 2: that North South divide and the rest of this is

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Speaker 2: focusing on South Korea, though of course refugees from the

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Speaker 2: North would have brought their food traditions with them, so right, Yes.

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Speaker 1: It did take a few decades for the beef industry

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Speaker 1: to bounce back from all of this. Reviews written about

400
00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:12,160
Speaker 1: restaurants serving bulgogi credit these restaurants with bringing this dish

401
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Speaker 1: to the masses in the nineteen sixties. I also found

402
00:24:14,280 --> 00:24:17,560
Speaker 1: a really interesting article about the shift of like not

403
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Speaker 1: fine dining, like dining with a family versus a huge

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00:24:20,640 --> 00:24:23,480
Speaker 1: git together that was happening during this time that bulgogi

405
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Speaker 1: was also part of. Around the same time beef broth,

406
00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:30,359
Speaker 1: bulgogi first debuted on a large scale.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that was also happening in restaurants, where right, it

408
00:24:34,040 --> 00:24:37,360
Speaker 2: was considered more practical as a small family meal than

409
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Speaker 2: as a large gathering kind of meal. But bulgogi was

410
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Speaker 2: also being made in middle class homes, as is evidenced

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Speaker 2: by recipes and women's magazines from the time.

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Speaker 1: The first bulgogi girl was patented in nineteen sixty two,

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Speaker 1: and this is around the time reports of bolgogi's popularity

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Speaker 1: in places like Thailand started popping up. Though the term

415
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Speaker 1: seemed to largely refer to roasted meat a lot of

416
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Speaker 1: the times.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, to hard to suss out again like the face thing,

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Speaker 2: like like how big of a lumper meat is that?

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Speaker 1: I'm not sure right.

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Speaker 2: The dish was, of course adapted to local tastes and

421
00:25:12,760 --> 00:25:16,680
Speaker 2: supplies wherever it developed and spread. Just for one example,

422
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Speaker 2: down in the southeast city of Ulsan, I hope I'm

423
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Speaker 2: not butchering that which had iron and salt and access

424
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Speaker 2: to local cattle and charcoal, this specific style of almost

425
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Speaker 2: like ground beef style crispy.

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Speaker 1: Grilled bulgogie developed.

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Speaker 2: It's called on Yang bulgogi uh and yeah, like like

428
00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:40,720
Speaker 2: first is a side dish for working class folks out

429
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Speaker 2: in the country town where it gets its name from,

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Speaker 2: and then later is like a tourist known local delicacy.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, other variations would have used seafood like squid

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Speaker 2: or vegetables like eggplant.

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Speaker 1: Well. As Korean immigrants arrived in the US after the

434
00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:04,240
Speaker 1: Green they bought bulgolgi with them, And yeah, it became

435
00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:06,520
Speaker 1: one of the most well known Korean dishes in the

436
00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:12,040
Speaker 1: country for non Koreans, and soon after the Sole Olympics

437
00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:15,840
Speaker 1: in nineteen eighty eight, the popularity of bulgogi started to

438
00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:19,920
Speaker 1: decline in South Korea specifically, Yeah yeah, yes. In South

439
00:26:19,960 --> 00:26:23,879
Speaker 1: Korea specifically, you served by the non marinated, non season

440
00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:28,320
Speaker 1: sirloin and golpi. According to one article from the time,

441
00:26:28,359 --> 00:26:30,840
Speaker 1: this was due to the lack of trust people had

442
00:26:30,920 --> 00:26:34,320
Speaker 1: in restaurants. Another sited a new preference to taste the

443
00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:40,240
Speaker 1: un seasoned freshness of ingredients. The price of cuts typically

444
00:26:40,280 --> 00:26:43,159
Speaker 1: used for bulgogi dropped by over twenty percent because of

445
00:26:43,200 --> 00:26:47,080
Speaker 1: all this, and to combat this, the Korean Council of

446
00:26:47,119 --> 00:26:51,919
Speaker 1: Beef Consumption Promotion launched the Let's Eat Volgogi campaign in

447
00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:57,919
Speaker 1: two thousand and four. Yes, which kind of related. The

448
00:26:58,000 --> 00:27:02,200
Speaker 1: bulgogi burger debuted on the menus of fast food chains

449
00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:05,320
Speaker 1: in Korea in nineteen ninety two and was available until

450
00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:06,280
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety six.

451
00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:10,440
Speaker 2: I think there's still one on McDonald's South Korean menu.

452
00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:13,320
Speaker 2: It's like a ground pork patty topped with sweet bl

453
00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:15,120
Speaker 2: googie sauce, lettuce.

454
00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:19,720
Speaker 1: And mayo right in listeners, Yeah, yeah, I've heard it's delicious.

455
00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:22,040
Speaker 1: But yeah.

456
00:27:22,560 --> 00:27:25,480
Speaker 2: The aforementioned Korean wave got started in like the nineteen

457
00:27:25,560 --> 00:27:27,879
Speaker 2: nineties and early two thousands as a whole bunch of

458
00:27:27,960 --> 00:27:32,240
Speaker 2: legal factors, such as travel from South Korea and censorship

459
00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:34,480
Speaker 2: of media there began opening.

460
00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:37,919
Speaker 1: Up in twenty ten while gogi was part of the

461
00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:43,520
Speaker 1: menu offered to Korean astronauts. And in twenty fourteen in

462
00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:48,879
Speaker 1: the US we started seeing these generic bulgogi advertisements.

463
00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:51,920
Speaker 2: Like featuring a Korean American outfielder for the Texas Rangers.

464
00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:55,080
Speaker 1: Okay, yes, And they started popping up here as part

465
00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:59,199
Speaker 1: of an ad campaign around Korean culture, and it confused

466
00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:04,399
Speaker 1: many people, including MPR employee Luise Clemens, who tried to

467
00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:06,720
Speaker 1: get to the bottom of the ads and wrote, and

468
00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:09,360
Speaker 1: what was with the promotion of a national dish rather

469
00:28:09,440 --> 00:28:12,480
Speaker 1: than a brand? It's hard to imagine an equivalent ad.

470
00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:15,920
Speaker 1: It's like justin Timberlake appearing in a British newspaper ad

471
00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:20,600
Speaker 1: touting the great taste of Hamburgers. Not Burger King or

472
00:28:20,720 --> 00:28:26,880
Speaker 1: McDonald's or Wendy's, Nope, just Hamburgers. Uh. Yeah.

473
00:28:26,960 --> 00:28:29,240
Speaker 2: It turned out to be part of of a too

474
00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:34,240
Speaker 2: be fair convoluted chain of soft power marketing attempts.

475
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:35,360
Speaker 1: Yeah.

476
00:28:35,720 --> 00:28:38,840
Speaker 2: I feel like Clemens was being kind of purposefully obtuse

477
00:28:39,160 --> 00:28:44,200
Speaker 2: about that for humor, but also objectively like the ad

478
00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:46,800
Speaker 2: is funny in a way that does not immediately reveal

479
00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:53,240
Speaker 2: whether the advertisers are like in on the joke. Yeah,

480
00:28:53,280 --> 00:28:56,000
Speaker 2: but no, I mean, I mean soft power is absolutely

481
00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:58,720
Speaker 2: a very large part of the spread of dishes like this,

482
00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:00,720
Speaker 2: And we've talked about that countless times. We talked about

483
00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:05,240
Speaker 2: it in fondo for a lot of different different countries.

484
00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:06,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, m hm.

485
00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:11,720
Speaker 2: And on a slightly more general note, and twenty eighteen,

486
00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:15,480
Speaker 2: I just found this interesting. South Korea became the biggest

487
00:29:15,560 --> 00:29:19,600
Speaker 2: importer of beef produced in the state of Colorado, buying

488
00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:23,200
Speaker 2: up almost a third of the state's billion dollar beef exports,

489
00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:27,720
Speaker 2: beating out Japan and Canada, which, yeah, just points to

490
00:29:27,880 --> 00:29:31,440
Speaker 2: the general popularity of dishes like Bulgo Gate on the

491
00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:32,440
Speaker 2: Korean food market.

492
00:29:36,200 --> 00:29:40,520
Speaker 1: Well, hi, I tell you, the craving is strong. First stand,

493
00:29:41,520 --> 00:29:45,960
Speaker 1: really strong, now really strong. So good.

494
00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:47,880
Speaker 2: I don't I don't eat a lot of meat. I

495
00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:51,640
Speaker 2: don't usually crave it, but holy heck, looking looking at

496
00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:53,520
Speaker 2: photos of this for the past couple of days, I

497
00:29:53,560 --> 00:29:56,080
Speaker 2: was just like, oh no, oh, no.

498
00:29:57,680 --> 00:30:03,760
Speaker 1: Dang, it added to our huge feast. Yeah.

499
00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:10,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, but yeah, you know, Annie and I have relatively

500
00:30:11,280 --> 00:30:19,400
Speaker 2: little little experience with this, so if anyone has stories, history,

501
00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:22,760
Speaker 2: anything that we missed, any personal memories you want to

502
00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:24,520
Speaker 2: add in there. We would love to know about them.

503
00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:29,640
Speaker 1: Yes, yes we would. But we do have some listener

504
00:30:29,680 --> 00:30:30,960
Speaker 1: mail already prepared for you.

505
00:30:31,080 --> 00:30:32,840
Speaker 2: Oh we do, and we're going to get into that

506
00:30:32,880 --> 00:30:34,600
Speaker 2: as soon as we get back from one more quick

507
00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:36,080
Speaker 2: break for a word from our sponsors.

508
00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:48,360
Speaker 1: We're back, Thank you, sponsor, yes, thank you, And we're

509
00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:59,440
Speaker 1: back with snow the charring of the face or the

510
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:06,400
Speaker 1: meat either way or both both? Ay no, no, dear.

511
00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:12,960
Speaker 1: So we have a message from Eric who wrote about

512
00:31:12,960 --> 00:31:17,120
Speaker 1: a couple things loved the bree revisit always fun to

513
00:31:17,160 --> 00:31:20,160
Speaker 1: go back the old one ounce serving size. That is

514
00:31:20,240 --> 00:31:23,400
Speaker 1: amazing self control for someone who can pull that off.

515
00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:27,480
Speaker 1: Trying to do a cheese royalty family tree will definitely

516
00:31:27,560 --> 00:31:31,640
Speaker 1: lead to a heated cheese debate. And then who is

517
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:37,200
Speaker 1: going to start a coup to overthrow the king? I

518
00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:39,240
Speaker 1: say we take over the month of March and turn

519
00:31:39,320 --> 00:31:45,960
Speaker 1: it into Feastuary. Okay for the many episodes, maybe Savor

520
00:31:46,040 --> 00:31:49,160
Speaker 1: tapas are Savor small bites. Anyway, I do agree. I

521
00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:52,480
Speaker 1: do agree with Lauren on Bill Ferrell. I don't dislike him,

522
00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:55,360
Speaker 1: but his humor is not really my style. I also

523
00:31:55,480 --> 00:31:58,560
Speaker 1: agree that elf on the shelf is really pretty creepy.

524
00:32:00,840 --> 00:32:03,800
Speaker 1: That maple syrup pasta seems like it could work if

525
00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:06,200
Speaker 1: you do a light touch with the maple syrup and

526
00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:13,920
Speaker 1: maybe had some chopped bacon or panzetta panchetta, panzetta, panchetta panchetta.

527
00:32:14,040 --> 00:32:18,920
Speaker 1: I can't get anything right. If you had to do candy,

528
00:32:19,440 --> 00:32:22,240
Speaker 1: maybe a few of those small cinnamon candies like red

529
00:32:22,280 --> 00:32:25,680
Speaker 1: hots or whatever it is people decorate some sugar cookies with.

530
00:32:26,120 --> 00:32:30,280
Speaker 1: I think the salt of bacon or pinchetta would work better,

531
00:32:30,320 --> 00:32:33,280
Speaker 1: though I also like the idea of upset and gellog

532
00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:38,720
Speaker 1: with junkie cereals. The Doritos flavored Li Coeur would depends

533
00:32:38,760 --> 00:32:42,040
Speaker 1: on how you feel about Doritos. They are one of

534
00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:44,640
Speaker 1: those chips that I really only want if I get

535
00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:48,600
Speaker 1: a graping for them. And the fun of holiday meals.

536
00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:51,040
Speaker 1: I'm still trying to convince people that we can just

537
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:54,840
Speaker 1: do pizza and beer. We did buy a pre cooked

538
00:32:54,880 --> 00:32:57,080
Speaker 1: prime rip for Christmas this year that just needed to

539
00:32:57,120 --> 00:32:59,480
Speaker 1: be warmed up, but I still put together a bunch

540
00:32:59,520 --> 00:33:04,400
Speaker 1: of sides roasted carrots with pomegranate molasses, mushroom gravy, mushy peas,

541
00:33:04,520 --> 00:33:08,000
Speaker 1: caramelized onion, mushroom and goat cheese on puff pastry and

542
00:33:08,040 --> 00:33:12,760
Speaker 1: grotten potatoes with gouda mozzarella, goat cheese, cheddar, and parmesano regiano.

543
00:33:13,400 --> 00:33:19,640
Speaker 1: Oh my god, Oh that sounds so good. Yeah wow,

544
00:33:19,840 --> 00:33:21,440
Speaker 1: I mean I love how you're kind of like, oh,

545
00:33:21,480 --> 00:33:24,360
Speaker 1: we just did this this year. Yeah, like pizza or whatever,

546
00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:25,720
Speaker 1: but this simple.

547
00:33:25,440 --> 00:33:29,680
Speaker 2: Thing with all of those delicious Yeah, okay, yeah, I'm

548
00:33:29,680 --> 00:33:30,040
Speaker 2: with you.

549
00:33:30,080 --> 00:33:34,040
Speaker 1: I do like doing the fancy meal, but because we

550
00:33:34,080 --> 00:33:38,760
Speaker 1: have so many in a quick succession, it's just like, oh,

551
00:33:38,800 --> 00:33:42,240
Speaker 1: come on, yeah, give it a rest sometimes. Yeah, let's

552
00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:45,440
Speaker 1: just order in do something easy. Yeah, you don't have

553
00:33:45,520 --> 00:33:46,000
Speaker 1: to do this.

554
00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:49,160
Speaker 2: Yeah we could do Yeah, we could save it for

555
00:33:49,840 --> 00:33:51,080
Speaker 2: I don't know, but you don't want to warm up

556
00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:53,160
Speaker 2: your whole kitchen like that when it's when it's hot out.

557
00:33:53,280 --> 00:33:55,680
Speaker 1: So it's true. For a while, I tried to convince

558
00:33:55,720 --> 00:33:59,800
Speaker 1: my family that we should do essentially, we should move

559
00:33:59,840 --> 00:34:05,080
Speaker 1: the Thanksgiving to June so then they would be equally

560
00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:08,400
Speaker 1: spread out. And we tried it like two years, and

561
00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:13,040
Speaker 1: I think it was a hit, but we stopped doing it. Yeah. Yeah,

562
00:34:13,120 --> 00:34:22,640
Speaker 1: it's hard, you know. Yes. Also, so most of these

563
00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:26,440
Speaker 1: notes are from the short we did about holiday advertising.

564
00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:32,239
Speaker 1: I did forget to mention in this maple pasta that

565
00:34:32,400 --> 00:34:37,880
Speaker 1: is from Elf the movie. Apparently pop tarts are involved.

566
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:41,799
Speaker 1: I did not mention that in the episode, but there

567
00:34:41,800 --> 00:34:47,359
Speaker 1: are pop tarts also. Okay, Yeah, it's a lot, I

568
00:34:47,360 --> 00:34:55,920
Speaker 1: mean it is. It's an endeavor. I do think the

569
00:34:55,960 --> 00:35:00,359
Speaker 1: salt would help. I think if you went light, yeah,

570
00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:03,719
Speaker 1: you're able syrup and had something to counteract to balance it.

571
00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:05,120
Speaker 1: Sure yeah.

572
00:35:05,160 --> 00:35:06,759
Speaker 2: And I like the idea of spice in there too,

573
00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:11,320
Speaker 2: you know, sure yeah.

574
00:35:11,440 --> 00:35:13,319
Speaker 1: If anyone's had it, you've got to let us know.

575
00:35:13,640 --> 00:35:25,560
Speaker 1: You've got to let us know. Okay. Kelly wrote is

576
00:35:25,640 --> 00:35:27,120
Speaker 1: it too late to still.

577
00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:29,480
Speaker 2: Wish you a happy New Year? I have had email

578
00:35:29,520 --> 00:35:31,680
Speaker 2: saver languishing at the bottom of my to do list

579
00:35:31,719 --> 00:35:34,279
Speaker 2: for literally more than a year now. Twenty twenty three

580
00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:38,520
Speaker 2: was relentless, and I've accumulated a couple of topics. Apologies

581
00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:40,480
Speaker 2: for lumping them all together, but at least I'm finally

582
00:35:40,520 --> 00:35:44,040
Speaker 2: sending the message first. A little over a year ago,

583
00:35:44,120 --> 00:35:46,399
Speaker 2: some of your other wonderful listeners wrote in and did,

584
00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:51,600
Speaker 2: in fact help solve my cookie mystery. Pariser wafers are

585
00:35:51,640 --> 00:35:55,879
Speaker 2: definitely the ones I remember from childhood, sometimes called cream wafers. Yes,

586
00:35:56,200 --> 00:35:59,080
Speaker 2: so a huge and hugely belated thank you to all

587
00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:02,160
Speaker 2: of them. A few weeks ago, when you did the

588
00:36:02,160 --> 00:36:05,400
Speaker 2: Pizzelle episode, it reminded me of a different Norwegian cookie

589
00:36:05,560 --> 00:36:08,319
Speaker 2: that we've always had around the holidaysk kak.

590
00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:09,520
Speaker 1: Yeah.

591
00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:12,239
Speaker 2: I think they are similar to pizzelee and made with

592
00:36:12,280 --> 00:36:14,399
Speaker 2: the same kind of iron, except that as soon as

593
00:36:14,400 --> 00:36:16,160
Speaker 2: you take it off the iron, you wrap it around

594
00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:18,600
Speaker 2: a cone shaped mold, similar to a waffle cone or

595
00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:21,400
Speaker 2: a canoli shell. Also, I think they're usually flavored with

596
00:36:21,480 --> 00:36:24,440
Speaker 2: vanilla or almond. I'm not sure if annis or other

597
00:36:24,480 --> 00:36:29,399
Speaker 2: flavors are used for krun kake. Finally, I also wanted

598
00:36:29,400 --> 00:36:32,360
Speaker 2: to mention that your episode on Chinese five spice reminded

599
00:36:32,360 --> 00:36:35,280
Speaker 2: me that Indian cooking also uses a different five spice

600
00:36:35,320 --> 00:36:37,640
Speaker 2: blend called and I looked this up. I couldn't find

601
00:36:37,640 --> 00:36:42,000
Speaker 2: it Punch for punch for on Sure, it's often used

602
00:36:42,040 --> 00:36:45,799
Speaker 2: in Dahl and the name literally means five spices. It's

603
00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:48,840
Speaker 2: also connected to the English word punch, meaning the drink,

604
00:36:48,960 --> 00:36:51,360
Speaker 2: which originated in India during the years of the British

605
00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:55,240
Speaker 2: Empire and was typically made with five ingredients water, sugar, alcohol,

606
00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:57,080
Speaker 2: lemon or lime, juice, and spices.

607
00:37:00,040 --> 00:37:08,520
Speaker 1: M I loved all. Yeah, that's interesting. We could definitely

608
00:37:08,520 --> 00:37:10,840
Speaker 1: do an episode on that. And I feel like, again,

609
00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:12,960
Speaker 1: we could have a mini series on cookies. At this point,

610
00:37:13,000 --> 00:37:17,440
Speaker 1: we're getting so many cookie information that's excellent.

611
00:37:17,800 --> 00:37:20,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, absolutely, well we'll have to, We'll have to.

612
00:37:20,880 --> 00:37:22,959
Speaker 2: I feel like, yeah, there could be be a little

613
00:37:23,040 --> 00:37:27,080
Speaker 2: little like many many episodes about some of those, because right,

614
00:37:27,239 --> 00:37:29,600
Speaker 2: it's just like what kind of cookie are you making today?

615
00:37:29,680 --> 00:37:31,720
Speaker 2: And then some of them are very long episodes because

616
00:37:31,719 --> 00:37:36,120
Speaker 2: you have whole histories of cookie irons. And yeah, yeah,

617
00:37:36,400 --> 00:37:39,160
Speaker 2: you know, we could have like a cookie table sometimes

618
00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:45,600
Speaker 2: long episode about a brand that made this whole cookie

619
00:37:45,640 --> 00:37:47,480
Speaker 2: a thing, or a short episode.

620
00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:51,279
Speaker 1: Could be anything. It could be anything. Also, I do

621
00:37:51,400 --> 00:37:55,240
Speaker 1: love that the listeners, the good listeners, helped you solve

622
00:37:55,239 --> 00:37:58,120
Speaker 1: your mystery. Yes, I remember reading that. Yeah, I remember

623
00:37:58,160 --> 00:38:02,040
Speaker 1: people writing in this is the power of the audience.

624
00:38:02,680 --> 00:38:05,520
Speaker 2: Go yes, yes, yes, I'm glad that the message made

625
00:38:05,560 --> 00:38:06,120
Speaker 2: its way through.

626
00:38:06,360 --> 00:38:14,560
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yes, that's so great. I love it so much. Yes, Well,

627
00:38:14,920 --> 00:38:18,080
Speaker 1: thank you to both of these listeners for writing in.

628
00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:20,400
Speaker 1: If you would like to write to us, you can

629
00:38:20,520 --> 00:38:22,760
Speaker 1: our emails Hello at savorpod dot com.

630
00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:24,960
Speaker 2: But we're also on social media. You can find us

631
00:38:25,000 --> 00:38:27,960
Speaker 2: on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram at saver pod and we

632
00:38:28,000 --> 00:38:30,880
Speaker 2: do hope to hear from you. Save is production of iHeartRadio.

633
00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:33,160
Speaker 2: For more podcasts my Heart Radio, you can visit the

634
00:38:33,160 --> 00:38:36,319
Speaker 2: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your

635
00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:39,840
Speaker 2: favorite shows. Thanks as always to our superproducers Dylan Fagan

636
00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:42,000
Speaker 2: and Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening, and we

637
00:38:42,040 --> 00:38:51,640
Speaker 2: hope that lots more good things are coming your way