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Speaker 1: This is the business of sports. Should Major League Baseball

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Speaker 1: shorten up the season? How do we present football to

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Speaker 1: the audience of the future. I don't think that most

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Speaker 1: players understand the power that they have. Michael. The future

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Speaker 1: of IndyCar racing is looking bright. Scott Sashnik very basic

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Speaker 1: math here, more bidders means more money. Evan, Nobody Williams.

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Speaker 1: The team value has essentially quadruples. And the leaders in

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Speaker 1: the sports industry time to bring in our guest, Holsteinbrunner,

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Speaker 1: National Hockey League Commissioner Gary Betman, Atlanta Braves president Derek Schiller,

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Speaker 1: Patriots president Jonathan Kraft. Bloomberg Business of Sports from Bloomberg Radio. Hello,

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Speaker 1: I'm Scott, I'm Evan, Novie Williams, and I'm Michael bar

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Speaker 1: And this is the Bloomberg Business of Sports. Were Scott,

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Speaker 1: Evan and I nice gold Change Medina explore the big

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Speaker 1: money issues? Evans like he's one oh man? Uh? Speaking

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Speaker 1: of winning, Let's talk about Liverpool. You see that smooth

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Speaker 1: don't to come back on to the championship finals beating

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Speaker 1: out Barcelona four? Says stay with Barthelona, Right, Okay, you

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Speaker 1: want to hear some action. Let's let's let's hear it

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Speaker 1: from the announcers, Quick Clay, wonderful King rega brilliant credit

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Speaker 1: from Liverpool, Blona Chaotic captains, tropics to late Thal not

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Speaker 1: on the night, but catch klisnik. Do we explain aggregate

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Speaker 1: for there may be some listening, all right when you're

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Speaker 1: scoring in the aggregate. It's a two game series. The

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Speaker 1: first game in Barcelona, Barcelona won three nil, three nothing.

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Speaker 1: So game two in Liverpool, Liverpool has to win by

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Speaker 1: four and if they give up a goal at home

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Speaker 1: then they need to go to five. It's the total

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Speaker 1: scoring of the two game series. So what were the

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Speaker 1: odds of Liverpool being able to defeat Barcelona? By the way,

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Speaker 1: the Barcelona uh social media person when Liverpool scored scored

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Speaker 1: early in like the seventh minute, they put up something

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Speaker 1: on the Twitter feed that said, well, they're gonna have

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Speaker 1: to score five because we're gonna get at least one,

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Speaker 1: right oops. So they needed to to win for nothing

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Speaker 1: to advance three. Would have kept playing, but they needed

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Speaker 1: to win four and wouldn't you know, for nothing Liverpool,

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Speaker 1: I mean, this is some long shot stuff. I don't

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Speaker 1: think I don't think anybody betting would have placed money

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Speaker 1: on this. Well as a matter of fact, somebody I think,

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Speaker 1: I think there was odds where I think fifty to

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Speaker 1: that Liverpool would win for nothing. Um, you know, we

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Speaker 1: see this, I mean every couple of years in the

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Speaker 1: Champions League, certainly when it happened Barcelona, Barcelona, and and

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Speaker 1: beating Paris as your man a couple of years ago,

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Speaker 1: which was I think even a bigger comeback than this.

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Speaker 1: But Liverpool moves on to the Champions League final. That's

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Speaker 1: not a two game series, that's a one, one, one

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Speaker 1: off event. The winner of that I think typically pulls

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Speaker 1: it over a hundred million dollars for winning, you for revenue,

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Speaker 1: that's yeah. The runner up is in the is in

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Speaker 1: the nineties certainly an important kind of a massive milestone

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Speaker 1: also for for Liverpool itself. Uh they were if if

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Speaker 1: you remember runner up last year as well. An English

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Speaker 1: team hasn't won the I mean one English team has

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Speaker 1: won the Champions League in the past ten years. That

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Speaker 1: was Chelsea back in two thousand twelve. I'm not sure

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Speaker 1: if if Liverpool has ever. Liverpool has back in one

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Speaker 1: so so this would be their first title since one. Um.

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Speaker 1: But you know, just like we talked about with you know,

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Speaker 1: with Super Bowl teams, right, just just being at the

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Speaker 1: biggest game in your sport um comes with it. You

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Speaker 1: know a lot of ancillary benefits like merchandise sales, like

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Speaker 1: ticket sales and who else is a winner? By the way,

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Speaker 1: bar you know the tie one Lebron James because because

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Speaker 1: years ago when Fenway Sports Group and they had the

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Speaker 1: marketing tie in with Lebron's folks, don't you know Lebron

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Speaker 1: got a piece of the Liverpool Football Club. They paid

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Speaker 1: six and a half million bucks for his steak. That's

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Speaker 1: six and a half million bucks is now worth thirty million.

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Speaker 1: That's not bad. That's not bad. He tweeted. You'll never

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Speaker 1: walk alone. He's showing us LFC love Liverpool. Also, according

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Speaker 1: to a number of different reports in in kind of

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Speaker 1: the final stages of negotiating a deal with with Nike,

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Speaker 1: that that would probably be the most expensive apparel partnership

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Speaker 1: ever in in the Premier League. That may have added

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Speaker 1: a little bit of money to it. In the wake

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Speaker 1: of yesterday's performance, we should probably say the club is

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Speaker 1: owned by John Henry Funway Sports, so American owner doing

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Speaker 1: doing okay with Liverpool right now and they're Also, you

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Speaker 1: know this weekend, if they win in Manchester City Falters,

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Speaker 1: they will also win the ep L um And if

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Speaker 1: you can win the e p L and the Champions

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Speaker 1: League in the same season, that is a tremendously successful campaign.

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Speaker 1: We gotta talk about the Rams. Uh. They want St.

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Speaker 1: Louis to pay half of e p L team. Sorry,

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Speaker 1: how to go over the Los Angeles Rams. They want

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Speaker 1: the St. Louis Convention and Visitors Commission, managers of the

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Speaker 1: city's downtown football stadium, to pay as much as twelve

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Speaker 1: million dollars for the settlement fees, and the team is

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Speaker 1: taking the commission back to arbitration to do so. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: this is this is a weird one and I go

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Speaker 1: sports teams are not your friends. I can kind of

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Speaker 1: lay it out here for people who are curious. Um.

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Speaker 1: But when the when the Rams left St. Louis UH

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Speaker 1: to go to Los Angeles, they there was a class

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Speaker 1: action lawsuit filed by a number of Rams fans dating

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Speaker 1: back to seat licenses, which are one time fees to

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Speaker 1: get the ability to buy season tickets. So back twenty

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Speaker 1: one years ago, when the Rams are coming to St. Louis,

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Speaker 1: they sold thirty year seat licenses, right, So, so fans

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Speaker 1: paid a decent amount of money for the right to

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Speaker 1: have season tickets for thirty years. Well, the Rams didn't

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Speaker 1: make it third years in St. Louis. They they left

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Speaker 1: after twenty one years to go to l A. So

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Speaker 1: these for fans sued saying, hey, listen, you know we

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Speaker 1: we paid for a thirty year seat license. You left

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Speaker 1: it for twenty one years. There's nine more years there

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Speaker 1: that we paid for that we never got the lead.

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Speaker 1: The Rams have settled that lawsuit for million dollars, but

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Speaker 1: are asking for the city, by way of the St.

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Speaker 1: Louis Convention and Visitors Commission, to pay for half of that.

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Speaker 1: Their argument being that before the Rams sold the seat licenses,

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Speaker 1: they were being sold by a community led group called

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Speaker 1: Fans Inc Right, which which was doing that before the

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Speaker 1: Rams were even tied to the project. So the fact

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Speaker 1: that this was led by a community led effort before

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Speaker 1: the Rams came in is how the Rams are arguing

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Speaker 1: that the that the community should be on the hook

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Speaker 1: for half of it. Okay, in other words, there's gonna

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Speaker 1: be a chance in hell that St. Louis is going

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Speaker 1: to pay this because when you think about it, uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, okay, the RAMS decided to leave, all right, Okay,

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Speaker 1: see you by and the people who had the season tickets,

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Speaker 1: they had a point, say listen, you was nine years Okay,

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Speaker 1: here it is, so now why should St. Louis kick

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Speaker 1: in some funds? Also, you were making a legal argument.

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Speaker 1: I thought you were gonna point to I gonna go

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Speaker 1: Mike McCann on us. Yeah, there's there's so much legal

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Speaker 1: nuance here. I don't know. I mean, who there's a

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Speaker 1: chance that the thirty year number was something that the

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Speaker 1: RAMS didn't put into the thing, but that the that

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Speaker 1: the community did in that case, maybe the RAMS has

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Speaker 1: that argument. I don't know exactly. Optics are bad. Cronky

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Speaker 1: Sports and Entertainment is a pretty big operation. He's an

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Speaker 1: eight billion, he's eight billion dollars, he's building what's the stadium? Now?

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Speaker 1: What's the up to five plus billion? And and we're

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Speaker 1: asking St. Louis to four over twelve million? Now, see

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Speaker 1: that's that's what I'm getting. Let's just go optics. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I don't understand that at all. You know, if you

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Speaker 1: want to leave, okay, that's across. The band has cowboy

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Speaker 1: boots that are worth more than twelve million dollars. One

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Speaker 1: boot is worth more than twelve million dollars. Well, now

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Speaker 1: you know where he's trying to put that, and this

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Speaker 1: is this is just a small portion of the plethora

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Speaker 1: of different lawsuits and arguments that St. Louis and the RAM.

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Speaker 1: I mean, they're fighting over the practice facility that the

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Speaker 1: Rams left behind. You know, the city put in I

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Speaker 1: believe it was sixteen million dollars to scope out and

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Speaker 1: plan for a potential new venue that would have kept

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Speaker 1: the Rams in St. Louis. You know, the tens of millions,

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Speaker 1: if not more, dollars public money has been spent on

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Speaker 1: either trying to keep the Rams in St. Louis, which

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Speaker 1: you know ended up being being a non fruitful endeavor,

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Speaker 1: but also kind of trying to unwind the situation once

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Speaker 1: the Rams left. Far. This is gonna sound weird for

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Speaker 1: somebody who does what I do or for what we do,

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Speaker 1: But if every professional sports team in town picked up

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Speaker 1: and left, I really think I'd be just fine. I mean,

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Speaker 1: they weren't like hearing that, but now, yeah, you got

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Speaker 1: to explain that. I'm serious. If every single do I

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Speaker 1: enjoy every now and then go, I'm not gonna say

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Speaker 1: which ones, but I do have my favorite one or

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Speaker 1: two that I go to. But worst case scenario if

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Speaker 1: they picked up and left town so that I would

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Speaker 1: now be forced to just watch these games on TV,

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Speaker 1: maybe have my fill up some minor league stuff, or

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Speaker 1: just go to the park and play. I think I'd

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Speaker 1: be just fine. I'm sorry, I would be sure, and

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Speaker 1: I am here in New York. If the Detroit Tigers

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Speaker 1: ever said, hey, it's been real see you, I would

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Speaker 1: be shattered. I was having a tough time back in

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Speaker 1: the day when the Tigers moved from Michigan and Trumbull

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Speaker 1: from the old Tiger Stadium to the new Comerica Park.

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Speaker 1: I mean it's it's great. It's not even new anymore now,

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Speaker 1: but I mean it's a beautiful park. But I love

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Speaker 1: Michigan and Trumbull. Now they just decided to leave the city,

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Speaker 1: I would be heartbrokenly. Yeah, even though, do you view

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Speaker 1: these teams as civic trusts or do you view them

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Speaker 1: as what we do every day? Are they just businesses?

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Speaker 1: Well that's the part I have to separate that what

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Speaker 1: we do here, Yes, the business of sports. It is

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Speaker 1: a business. But if you're a fan of the team,

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Speaker 1: obviously you have some emotion tie to that. There's some

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Speaker 1: emotional attachment, So it wouldn't you be hurt? Is it

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Speaker 1: unrequited love? See? This is Evans not saying a word,

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Speaker 1: which is why I'm just say, does the team love

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Speaker 1: you the way you love the team? Name? There you go.

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Speaker 1: But there's a I mean, there's a kind of a

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Speaker 1: third part to that, right, which is that the this

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Speaker 1: is also a business for on the civic side. Right,

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Speaker 1: Like one of the reasons St. Louis wants the Rams

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Speaker 1: to stay in St. Louis partially because fans in St.

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Speaker 1: Louis love the Rams, but there's also a business value

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Speaker 1: to the city for having the team there, right, So

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Speaker 1: it's not just business of the of the of the

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Speaker 1: team versus love of the fans. There's also this other

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Speaker 1: entity here, the city and other businesses which which benefit

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Speaker 1: largely for St. Louis for having to tease dollars. I

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Speaker 1: think that that's the money goes somewhere else. That's all.

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Speaker 1: We got to move on to UM and the women's

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Speaker 1: hockey players. They are boycotting. They want the NHL to

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Speaker 1: help do some funding. So last Thursday, more than two

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Speaker 1: hundred of the best women hockey players in the world

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Speaker 1: announced they would not suit up for any North American

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Speaker 1: pro women's hockey teams this season until there is a

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Speaker 1: league in place with resources and support for paying the

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Speaker 1: players livable wages, and uh god bless him. I hope

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Speaker 1: something happens. Have you been to a women's hockey game.

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Speaker 1: I had seen the Connecticut team play at Chelsea Pierce

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Speaker 1: and Stanford. I believe it was the first game. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's tough. Women, women occupayers put all niche sports are tough.

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Speaker 1: You have to make a go. And again, I always say,

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Speaker 1: these are meritocracies. These sports leagues are maritimes. I do

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Speaker 1: not like it when somebody tells me you should watch this,

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Speaker 1: or they get they should get more this, and that

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Speaker 1: goes men. Women doesn't matter. Like I don't watch the

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Speaker 1: Arena Football League. I don't care. I've never watched one.

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Speaker 1: I've never gone. I do not care. But enough people

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Speaker 1: do where it's a sustainable business. Is that true of

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Speaker 1: some other leagues. Well, yeah, it's been a tough certainly

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Speaker 1: a tough year for professional women's hockey that there were

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Speaker 1: you know, as of a couple of weeks ago, there

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Speaker 1: were two professional women's leagues, the Canadian Women's in the

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Speaker 1: National Women's Hockey League. The Canadian League folded. Um, the

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Speaker 1: National Women's Hockey League is all that's left. And these

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Speaker 1: two hundred women are saying, we will not play in

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Speaker 1: any professional league, but really that league, because it's the

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Speaker 1: only option. We will not play in that league this year. UM.

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Speaker 1: That league has a I believe it's a hundred thousand

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Speaker 1: dollar salary cap total in a lot of it. In

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Speaker 1: a lot of minimum salary is two thousand, which seems

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Speaker 1: to me nothing. But it seems to me that the

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Speaker 1: panacea seems to be an affiliation with the National Hockey League. Absolutely,

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Speaker 1: And yet the w NBA players are saying, this has

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Speaker 1: been a long standing commitment from the NBA. And yet

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Speaker 1: I'm hearing the same argument from w NBA players. We

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Speaker 1: don't get enough and we need more promotion. We need more.

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Speaker 1: Delee has to do more, more, more and more more.

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Speaker 1: Now I'm gonna ask something because the w n b

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Speaker 1: A tried something years ago, and they tried putting their

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Speaker 1: game on uh lifetime, which is more geared for women,

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Speaker 1: and unfortunately call it television for wine, and it didn't

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Speaker 1: like Lifetime. I like, I like Life, Marshall's Wick and

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Speaker 1: ed Hirsk Edswick and Marshall Hurskimittz. Those were the yeah

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Speaker 1: and them that can do for the if you had

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Speaker 1: the w N agent. I don't think the places the problem.

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Speaker 1: It's the revenue generating who who what, What media entity

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Speaker 1: is gonna pay big dollars to have. Look at the XFL.

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Speaker 1: Fox isn't even paying for the or in the ESPN

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Speaker 1: they're not paying for the XFL. You gotta see if

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Speaker 1: it works. I'm not gonna pay you money unless I

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Speaker 1: know eyeballs are coming. Speaking of that, did you see

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Speaker 1: that video by the way on Twitter where they were

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Speaker 1: cheering when they were you know, when they were announcing

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Speaker 1: the networks involved. And I just wonder, is that if

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Speaker 1: if they need to do something like this even I've

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Speaker 1: just I don't know. Yeah again, I think for for

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Speaker 1: professional women's talking that getting a hefty media payment from

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Speaker 1: a network is not gonna happen anytime. Just getting anything

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Speaker 1: people to go to your games, getting sponsors, getting anything,

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Speaker 1: there's momentum. They're right. The n w h l's All

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Speaker 1: Star Game in Nashville was the highest attended professional women's

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Speaker 1: hockey game on US Soil. Ever, Um, the new team

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Speaker 1: they added in Minnesota sold out every game, albeit in

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Speaker 1: a seat arena. Sure, yeah, it's part of it is markets.

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Speaker 1: But also there is a benefit and I'm happy to

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Speaker 1: make this argument. There's a benefit to the NHL for

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Speaker 1: growing the game nationwide, right, and that absolutely and that

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Speaker 1: that includes women. And when young women in America have

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Speaker 1: a see a professional opportunity that they can strive for

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Speaker 1: through playing hockey, I think that is a good thing

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Speaker 1: for the NHL. NHL is only investing a hundred thousand

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Speaker 1: dollars a year in professional women's hockey. The NBA pays

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Speaker 1: what do we think, a hundred times that for the

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Speaker 1: w n B A if not more. The investment between

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Speaker 1: what the the NBA puts into professional women's basketball and

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Speaker 1: what the NHL puts into professional women's hockey are so

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Speaker 1: so different. You see human board, I got it. I

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Speaker 1: see it, okay, And just like that. This has been

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Speaker 1: the Bloomberg Business of Sports podcast. I'm Michael Barr, along

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Speaker 1: with Scott Sasni and Evan Nobody Williams. We are here

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Speaker 1: each and every Monday, Wednesday and Thursday exploring the world

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Speaker 1: of money in sports. Join us again, at the end

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Speaker 1: of the week when we speak with Chris Ripley, CEO

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Speaker 1: of Sinclair's. Gotta hear he did something big this week. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: a few rs ns now belong to him. A billion

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Speaker 1: dollar movement, only ten plus billion dollars. You're listening to

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Business of Sports on Bloomberg Radio around the world

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Speaker 1: and online where you get your podcasts.