1 00:00:01,120 --> 00:00:05,480 Speaker 1: Hey, welcome to sign Stuff, a production of iHeartRadio or 2 00:00:05,559 --> 00:00:08,879 Speaker 1: Hitchham and today we are answering the question why does 3 00:00:08,920 --> 00:00:14,080 Speaker 1: frog taste like chicken? Or why does alligator or rabbit 4 00:00:14,120 --> 00:00:17,759 Speaker 1: for that matter. Those are all very different animals, and 5 00:00:17,840 --> 00:00:22,560 Speaker 1: yet people say they all taste like poultry. To verify this, 6 00:00:22,680 --> 00:00:25,040 Speaker 1: we're going to do a taste test, and then we're 7 00:00:25,040 --> 00:00:28,120 Speaker 1: going to talk to several experts, including a couple of 8 00:00:28,240 --> 00:00:31,640 Speaker 1: meat scientists and a biologist. It's going to take us 9 00:00:31,680 --> 00:00:35,560 Speaker 1: through millions of years of evolution to find out where 10 00:00:35,600 --> 00:00:40,840 Speaker 1: all meat comes from. So apologies to vegans, but get 11 00:00:40,880 --> 00:00:43,120 Speaker 1: ready to get to the meat of the matter as 12 00:00:43,159 --> 00:00:47,360 Speaker 1: we answer the question why does frog taste like chicken? 13 00:00:53,840 --> 00:00:54,000 Speaker 2: Hey? 14 00:00:54,080 --> 00:00:56,840 Speaker 1: Everyone, Okay, In this episode, we're going to take a 15 00:00:56,920 --> 00:01:00,600 Speaker 1: deep dive into what makes meat taste to way it does. 16 00:01:01,320 --> 00:01:03,920 Speaker 1: But first I wanted to find out if it really 17 00:01:04,040 --> 00:01:08,560 Speaker 1: is true that so many different animals taste like chicken. 18 00:01:09,400 --> 00:01:11,560 Speaker 1: I mean, it's kind of a recurring joke to have 19 00:01:11,680 --> 00:01:15,399 Speaker 1: someone eat an unusual kind of meat and then say, hmm, 20 00:01:16,120 --> 00:01:20,880 Speaker 1: taste like chicken. So in the name of science, I 21 00:01:20,959 --> 00:01:24,319 Speaker 1: decided to try this out. And to do this, I 22 00:01:24,360 --> 00:01:27,920 Speaker 1: started by going to a specialty meat store here in 23 00:01:27,959 --> 00:01:38,640 Speaker 1: Los Angeles. I'm standing outside a butcher shop called Harmony Farms, 24 00:01:39,200 --> 00:01:48,320 Speaker 1: and outside I see signs of turkey, chicken, lamb, buffalo, venison, rabbit, peasant, quail, deer, elk. 25 00:01:49,520 --> 00:01:51,640 Speaker 2: All right, let's go inside. 26 00:01:52,840 --> 00:01:56,120 Speaker 1: So I'm looking to buy some meat that people say 27 00:01:56,320 --> 00:01:57,520 Speaker 1: taste like chicken. 28 00:01:58,440 --> 00:02:00,920 Speaker 3: On top of my hand, trying to think rabbit. They 29 00:02:00,920 --> 00:02:04,120 Speaker 3: say it tastes like chicken. Rattlesteaks another one. But this 30 00:02:04,200 --> 00:02:07,320 Speaker 3: is legal to sell in California. You can get in Nevada, 31 00:02:07,680 --> 00:02:09,079 Speaker 3: but not in California. 32 00:02:09,440 --> 00:02:12,040 Speaker 2: I've heard alligator meat also tastes like chicken. 33 00:02:12,720 --> 00:02:15,440 Speaker 3: I want to say, that's more like a fishy taste. 34 00:02:15,800 --> 00:02:17,040 Speaker 4: Okay, but we do have that. 35 00:02:17,120 --> 00:02:20,520 Speaker 3: Also, I don't have a customer that bought some. She's 36 00:02:20,520 --> 00:02:23,880 Speaker 3: a chef from downtown LA. She bought alligator to make 37 00:02:23,960 --> 00:02:24,720 Speaker 3: the beach out of it. 38 00:02:25,919 --> 00:02:26,560 Speaker 5: That's interesting. 39 00:02:26,560 --> 00:02:28,120 Speaker 2: What about a frog? Do you have frog? 40 00:02:28,200 --> 00:02:30,160 Speaker 3: We also have frog in that one. Consider that like 41 00:02:30,200 --> 00:02:32,720 Speaker 3: another fishy taste because you can see off the bat 42 00:02:32,840 --> 00:02:35,400 Speaker 3: texture is real white and it looks like fish. 43 00:02:35,800 --> 00:02:40,400 Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, so frog, alligator? Have you tried these meats? 44 00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:41,280 Speaker 6: I tried. 45 00:02:42,240 --> 00:02:44,000 Speaker 3: I like rabbit it's pretty good. It's like a white 46 00:02:44,080 --> 00:02:46,760 Speaker 3: meat you can fry, you can do a soup. 47 00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:48,919 Speaker 2: I think I will take all the ones you put 48 00:02:48,919 --> 00:02:49,160 Speaker 2: it up. 49 00:02:50,200 --> 00:02:53,800 Speaker 3: Do you think some seasoning, maybe some lemon pepper seasoning, 50 00:02:53,960 --> 00:02:55,560 Speaker 3: or you know, salt and peppers also good? 51 00:02:55,639 --> 00:02:57,720 Speaker 5: So you want to take the meat you don't want 52 00:02:57,760 --> 00:03:02,720 Speaker 5: to with like a right good thickness. Thank you, yes, sir? 53 00:03:04,520 --> 00:03:08,360 Speaker 1: All right, exotic meats secured. The next thing I needed 54 00:03:08,400 --> 00:03:11,960 Speaker 1: to do was to do a taste test. So I 55 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:16,040 Speaker 1: took each kind of meat and cooked it. I sprinkled 56 00:03:16,040 --> 00:03:19,920 Speaker 1: the little salt, little corn starch, and then I roasted 57 00:03:19,919 --> 00:03:25,760 Speaker 1: them and for tasters, I decided to recruit my kids. 58 00:03:28,080 --> 00:03:30,959 Speaker 1: That's because A I did this the night before the 59 00:03:31,120 --> 00:03:33,760 Speaker 1: edit for this episode was due, and they were the 60 00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:36,520 Speaker 1: only ones willing to eat a bunch of mystery meats 61 00:03:36,600 --> 00:03:40,520 Speaker 1: late at night, and b because kids are notoriously honest 62 00:03:40,800 --> 00:03:43,320 Speaker 1: about what they think when it comes to food. 63 00:03:43,960 --> 00:03:45,560 Speaker 2: If you're a parent, and I think you. 64 00:03:45,520 --> 00:03:52,360 Speaker 1: Know what I'm talking about. So here's how that experiment went. Okay, 65 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:55,320 Speaker 1: I'm gonna give you four meats and you're just gonna 66 00:03:55,320 --> 00:03:56,520 Speaker 1: tell me what do you think of it? 67 00:03:57,200 --> 00:03:57,640 Speaker 7: Okay? 68 00:03:59,000 --> 00:03:59,560 Speaker 1: Very dark? 69 00:04:01,160 --> 00:04:06,960 Speaker 5: Yeah, what do you think very extra quish? Oh, it 70 00:04:07,120 --> 00:04:09,200 Speaker 5: was like very hard. 71 00:04:13,160 --> 00:04:18,520 Speaker 6: It's like an overpowering like gamey game me. 72 00:04:18,680 --> 00:04:24,479 Speaker 5: Tastes tastes like chicken. Does not taste like chicken. Chicken. 73 00:04:24,960 --> 00:04:29,039 Speaker 6: Probably the rabbit or the alligator alligator meat. 74 00:04:29,839 --> 00:04:37,960 Speaker 8: Yeah, that was the alligatory. 75 00:04:40,320 --> 00:04:41,120 Speaker 1: Now I can. 76 00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:47,400 Speaker 6: Say, okay, it's just a lot better. Very chicken, very chicken, 77 00:04:47,680 --> 00:04:53,919 Speaker 6: chicken chicken like the texture yea, the taste and. 78 00:04:54,240 --> 00:04:56,480 Speaker 5: Taste that is actually chicken. 79 00:04:57,240 --> 00:05:01,160 Speaker 1: Oh, just kidding, it's not one. 80 00:05:02,839 --> 00:05:10,200 Speaker 5: It's rabbit. Let's have cannibalism. No, this is probably the 81 00:05:10,279 --> 00:05:10,920 Speaker 5: frog meat. 82 00:05:13,279 --> 00:05:17,560 Speaker 8: Yup, what do you think it is very mushy? No, 83 00:05:18,560 --> 00:05:23,400 Speaker 8: how about the taste chicken. Taste tas like chicken. That 84 00:05:23,640 --> 00:05:32,240 Speaker 8: was actually chicken. Okay, last one. 85 00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:38,160 Speaker 5: Tastes like chicken. What does it look like? 86 00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:42,600 Speaker 4: Frog remains taste more like chicken than the others. 87 00:05:43,279 --> 00:05:46,479 Speaker 5: Tastes more like chicken than the chicken. Yeah. So the 88 00:05:46,520 --> 00:05:52,719 Speaker 5: alligator meat definitely tastes like chicken. Tastes like overcooked. Okay. 89 00:05:52,800 --> 00:05:54,200 Speaker 5: What do you think of your dad experimenting? 90 00:05:55,880 --> 00:05:56,560 Speaker 7: I'm sewing. 91 00:05:59,560 --> 00:05:59,880 Speaker 2: Okay. 92 00:06:00,000 --> 00:06:03,279 Speaker 1: I was pretty surprised by these results. So to recap, 93 00:06:04,200 --> 00:06:09,200 Speaker 1: alligator doesn't quite taste like chicken. Rabbit could totally pass 94 00:06:09,200 --> 00:06:14,400 Speaker 1: his chicken, and frog apparently tastes more like chicken than chicken. 95 00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:19,040 Speaker 1: And this is surprising because all these animals are pretty 96 00:06:19,080 --> 00:06:23,280 Speaker 1: far away from each other in the evolutionary tree of life. 97 00:06:23,640 --> 00:06:27,120 Speaker 1: I mean, a chicken is a bird, frogs are amphibians, 98 00:06:27,520 --> 00:06:32,080 Speaker 1: alligators are reptiles, and rabbits are mammals. They couldn't be 99 00:06:32,160 --> 00:06:35,440 Speaker 1: more different from each other, and yet they all taste 100 00:06:35,680 --> 00:06:36,760 Speaker 1: fairly similar. 101 00:06:37,360 --> 00:06:38,000 Speaker 2: How can that be? 102 00:06:38,640 --> 00:06:40,720 Speaker 1: To get to the bottom of this, I reached out 103 00:06:40,760 --> 00:06:44,480 Speaker 1: to a couple of meat experts. The first is Professor 104 00:06:44,560 --> 00:06:45,880 Speaker 1: John Gonzalez. 105 00:06:48,920 --> 00:06:51,960 Speaker 4: My name is doctor John Michael Gonzalez. I am a 106 00:06:52,120 --> 00:06:55,560 Speaker 4: professor at the University of Georgia and the Department of 107 00:06:55,560 --> 00:07:00,280 Speaker 4: Animal Dairy Sciences. My special reality is muscle bio ging 108 00:07:00,360 --> 00:07:05,320 Speaker 4: and meat science. So we study anything from embryo development 109 00:07:05,520 --> 00:07:08,960 Speaker 4: all the way through the powder rays livestock species to 110 00:07:09,200 --> 00:07:14,640 Speaker 4: produce poadable and nutritious muscle products for consumers to eat. 111 00:07:14,760 --> 00:07:18,320 Speaker 4: And so I've been doing this around thirteen years now professionally. 112 00:07:19,680 --> 00:07:22,440 Speaker 1: Okay, So my thinking going into this was that what 113 00:07:22,520 --> 00:07:26,040 Speaker 1: people think of as meat is usually the muscles of 114 00:07:26,080 --> 00:07:29,200 Speaker 1: the animal and so I wanted to know, how is 115 00:07:29,200 --> 00:07:33,120 Speaker 1: the muscle of say a frog or a rabbit different 116 00:07:33,280 --> 00:07:37,720 Speaker 1: than the muscle of say a chicken. Okay, so for 117 00:07:37,760 --> 00:07:40,880 Speaker 1: those of us that are not familiar, meat is usually 118 00:07:40,960 --> 00:07:44,200 Speaker 1: the muscle of the animals. Do all animals use the 119 00:07:44,320 --> 00:07:45,800 Speaker 1: same muscles? 120 00:07:46,080 --> 00:07:48,680 Speaker 4: Yeah, that's a great question. I would say, for the 121 00:07:48,720 --> 00:07:52,080 Speaker 4: most part, most animals on the earth do have the 122 00:07:52,120 --> 00:07:55,320 Speaker 4: same type of skeleton muscle. And so when I think 123 00:07:55,360 --> 00:08:00,360 Speaker 4: about our livestock species and anything birds, cattle, pigs, deep, 124 00:08:00,680 --> 00:08:03,480 Speaker 4: you know, my dogs that are there, the overall principle, 125 00:08:03,520 --> 00:08:06,600 Speaker 4: it's the same of how muscle contraction works, how the 126 00:08:06,720 --> 00:08:09,440 Speaker 4: muscles put together. There is a colleague that I had 127 00:08:09,920 --> 00:08:13,920 Speaker 4: from Kansas State University, and she studied the fruit fly 128 00:08:14,960 --> 00:08:19,120 Speaker 4: in fly muscles, and they had the same exact biology, 129 00:08:19,280 --> 00:08:21,480 Speaker 4: and so I would say, yes, for the most part, 130 00:08:21,520 --> 00:08:23,200 Speaker 4: they're all exactly the same. 131 00:08:23,440 --> 00:08:26,560 Speaker 1: Wow, So maybe we should be asking whether fly meat 132 00:08:26,600 --> 00:08:28,000 Speaker 1: tastes the same as chicken too. 133 00:08:28,440 --> 00:08:29,320 Speaker 5: Yeah. 134 00:08:29,440 --> 00:08:30,880 Speaker 4: I don't even know how you would be able to 135 00:08:30,920 --> 00:08:34,800 Speaker 4: collect that much fly meat. I guess sure mostly must 136 00:08:34,840 --> 00:08:36,640 Speaker 4: have eaten a fly once or twice in our lives 137 00:08:36,679 --> 00:08:40,040 Speaker 4: of accident. So my hypothesis would be it would taste 138 00:08:40,040 --> 00:08:40,880 Speaker 4: the same as chicken. 139 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:42,760 Speaker 9: All right, this is. 140 00:08:42,720 --> 00:08:46,000 Speaker 1: A really big clue about the mystery we're trying to 141 00:08:46,080 --> 00:08:52,680 Speaker 1: solve today. As different as animals like alligators, birds, raccoons, snakes, 142 00:08:53,120 --> 00:08:58,360 Speaker 1: even fruit flies and dinosaurs are their meat or mussels 143 00:08:58,840 --> 00:09:03,280 Speaker 1: are kind of the same. Can you dig a little 144 00:09:03,280 --> 00:09:07,200 Speaker 1: bit deeper. You mentioned muscle structure. Can you give us 145 00:09:07,240 --> 00:09:09,960 Speaker 1: a breakdown of what muscle is for all of these 146 00:09:10,120 --> 00:09:10,880 Speaker 1: different animals. 147 00:09:11,040 --> 00:09:13,560 Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, the whole muscle that we're used to seeing 148 00:09:13,600 --> 00:09:17,160 Speaker 4: the steak in the grocery retail case that is comprised 149 00:09:17,320 --> 00:09:22,319 Speaker 4: of many bundles. Those muscle bundles are composed of muscle fibers. 150 00:09:24,080 --> 00:09:27,680 Speaker 1: So the basic unit of muscle is the muscle fiber. 151 00:09:28,120 --> 00:09:31,440 Speaker 1: Some interesting facts about muscle fibers are that they're the 152 00:09:31,480 --> 00:09:35,280 Speaker 1: only cells in animals and in your body with more 153 00:09:35,360 --> 00:09:39,880 Speaker 1: than one nucleus. Every other cell has one nucleus each, 154 00:09:40,360 --> 00:09:45,280 Speaker 1: but muscle fibers can have hundreds of nuclei. Also, the 155 00:09:45,400 --> 00:09:49,240 Speaker 1: number of muscle cells you or any animal is born 156 00:09:49,280 --> 00:09:52,120 Speaker 1: with is the number of muscle cells they're going to 157 00:09:52,160 --> 00:09:54,000 Speaker 1: have for the rest of their lives. 158 00:09:56,120 --> 00:10:00,120 Speaker 4: Your muscle cell numbers determined that birth are certainly at 159 00:10:00,520 --> 00:10:03,640 Speaker 4: depending on species. So I always tell students to compare 160 00:10:03,679 --> 00:10:05,920 Speaker 4: me to the rock. He probably has a lot more 161 00:10:06,080 --> 00:10:08,800 Speaker 4: muscle cells than I do. Because I don't know, I 162 00:10:08,840 --> 00:10:11,160 Speaker 4: blame my mom, I guess, so she hears it should 163 00:10:11,200 --> 00:10:13,400 Speaker 4: be mad at me. But but yeah, I say, my 164 00:10:13,440 --> 00:10:15,800 Speaker 4: mom didn't give me a lot of muscle sell and 165 00:10:15,840 --> 00:10:18,160 Speaker 4: I will admit to you, Yes, I do not work out. 166 00:10:18,200 --> 00:10:20,959 Speaker 4: So that's part of the small too. 167 00:10:21,120 --> 00:10:23,880 Speaker 2: No, no, it's biology. I taken solid. Yeah, it's not 168 00:10:24,000 --> 00:10:24,920 Speaker 2: your fault. 169 00:10:26,360 --> 00:10:26,760 Speaker 5: Okay. 170 00:10:26,960 --> 00:10:32,160 Speaker 1: So inside muscle fibers are repeated bundles of long proteins 171 00:10:32,200 --> 00:10:35,480 Speaker 1: called actin and myocin. You might have heard of these. 172 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:38,720 Speaker 1: They pull and slide past each other, and that is 173 00:10:38,760 --> 00:10:43,559 Speaker 1: how muscles contract and create a force. These two proteins 174 00:10:43,760 --> 00:10:48,479 Speaker 1: are the workhorse of all movement in the animal kingdom. 175 00:10:48,800 --> 00:10:53,079 Speaker 1: All animals basically use these two proteins, and that includes 176 00:10:53,120 --> 00:11:04,319 Speaker 1: animals as diverse as jellyfish, octopuses, elephants, hyenas and ticks, slugs, salamanders, pterodactyls, whales, 177 00:11:04,960 --> 00:11:08,840 Speaker 1: all animals. We'll get to why all animals have the 178 00:11:08,880 --> 00:11:12,360 Speaker 1: same muscles later in the program, but this is one 179 00:11:12,440 --> 00:11:17,360 Speaker 1: reason frogs tastes like chicken. The meat is basically made 180 00:11:17,440 --> 00:11:20,760 Speaker 1: of the same proteins. If you were to strip down 181 00:11:20,920 --> 00:11:23,520 Speaker 1: the meat of any animal on Earth down to the 182 00:11:23,640 --> 00:11:27,840 Speaker 1: proteins acting and lycin, they would all taste the same. 183 00:11:28,240 --> 00:11:31,840 Speaker 1: Now you're probably thinking, but orgey, then what makes beef 184 00:11:32,160 --> 00:11:36,120 Speaker 1: taste like beef or pork tastes like pork? And you 185 00:11:36,160 --> 00:11:41,760 Speaker 1: still haven't answered why specifically frogs tastes like chicken. Well, 186 00:11:41,800 --> 00:11:44,559 Speaker 1: when we come back, we'll answer all of these questions 187 00:11:44,600 --> 00:11:48,120 Speaker 1: and trust me, we'll serve it to you. Well done, 188 00:11:48,280 --> 00:12:06,280 Speaker 1: so stay with us. You're listening to sign stuff and 189 00:12:06,320 --> 00:12:06,760 Speaker 1: we're back. 190 00:12:08,000 --> 00:12:08,360 Speaker 5: Okay. 191 00:12:08,520 --> 00:12:11,559 Speaker 1: We talked about how all animals use the same two 192 00:12:11,760 --> 00:12:16,160 Speaker 1: proteins myocin and actin to build their muscles, which means 193 00:12:16,440 --> 00:12:20,240 Speaker 1: they should all taste the same. Everything should taste like chicken. 194 00:12:20,960 --> 00:12:25,000 Speaker 1: But clearly and thankfully, if you like meat, that doesn't happen. 195 00:12:25,559 --> 00:12:28,960 Speaker 1: Lamb doesn't taste like turkey, which doesn't taste like fish 196 00:12:29,440 --> 00:12:32,440 Speaker 1: or snake. So what is it about the different meats 197 00:12:32,559 --> 00:12:35,440 Speaker 1: that make them taste the way they do? I asked 198 00:12:35,440 --> 00:12:40,079 Speaker 1: doctor Gonzalaz this question. Okay, let's get into the topic 199 00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:45,120 Speaker 1: of taste in meat. What makes meat taste a certain way. 200 00:12:45,640 --> 00:12:47,960 Speaker 4: So surprisingly you don't have anything to do with the 201 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:50,880 Speaker 4: miralofibular or the mussel protein. It has to do with 202 00:12:50,960 --> 00:12:54,880 Speaker 4: the fat. So it's all fat driven. Okay. So chickens, 203 00:12:54,880 --> 00:12:57,960 Speaker 4: a private example, should not have a lot of fat 204 00:12:58,000 --> 00:13:01,800 Speaker 4: in it, and so it's a lie lean source of protein, 205 00:13:02,240 --> 00:13:04,200 Speaker 4: but doesn't have the most fat in the world, and 206 00:13:04,240 --> 00:13:06,600 Speaker 4: so it's not very flavorful. And so if you think 207 00:13:06,600 --> 00:13:09,680 Speaker 4: about beef has a lot more fat, people go for 208 00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:13,080 Speaker 4: the beef flavor because they enjoy how that tastes, and 209 00:13:13,120 --> 00:13:14,840 Speaker 4: so it all has to do with how much fat 210 00:13:14,920 --> 00:13:17,040 Speaker 4: you have in there. So I go to Japan a 211 00:13:17,080 --> 00:13:20,040 Speaker 4: lot eating that wagou beef. You know, I don't even 212 00:13:20,080 --> 00:13:22,719 Speaker 4: really have to put salt on that type of wagoo 213 00:13:22,840 --> 00:13:25,960 Speaker 4: because it's so flavorful that And so when you go 214 00:13:26,240 --> 00:13:29,520 Speaker 4: and you buy different types of lean grinds and say 215 00:13:29,600 --> 00:13:32,560 Speaker 4: for handiger meat eighty twenty seventy three whatever, you could 216 00:13:32,559 --> 00:13:36,360 Speaker 4: probably taste the difference there of how much beefy flavor 217 00:13:36,440 --> 00:13:39,199 Speaker 4: you would have going through there. And so that's why 218 00:13:39,240 --> 00:13:41,280 Speaker 4: a lot of those species, you know, like frogs, that 219 00:13:41,360 --> 00:13:43,560 Speaker 4: have a lot of lean tissue and not very much 220 00:13:43,600 --> 00:13:45,640 Speaker 4: fat in there. They all taste the same. 221 00:13:45,880 --> 00:13:48,240 Speaker 1: So what you're saying is that really the taste of 222 00:13:48,360 --> 00:13:50,880 Speaker 1: what we think of as a chicken is really just 223 00:13:50,920 --> 00:13:55,000 Speaker 1: a taste of that myofibrillar, those myofibrillar sells. 224 00:13:54,760 --> 00:13:57,520 Speaker 4: Yeah, for the most part, yes, because it doesn't have 225 00:13:57,559 --> 00:13:59,040 Speaker 4: a lot of fat in it. It does have a 226 00:13:59,040 --> 00:14:02,360 Speaker 4: little bit of fat, but it doesn't have the most 227 00:14:02,480 --> 00:14:03,880 Speaker 4: compared to the other species. 228 00:14:05,120 --> 00:14:07,760 Speaker 1: So what doctor Gonzalez is saying is that it's not 229 00:14:07,880 --> 00:14:11,160 Speaker 1: really the mussel to give a meat it's distinct flavor. 230 00:14:11,720 --> 00:14:12,880 Speaker 2: It's the fat in it. 231 00:14:13,240 --> 00:14:16,600 Speaker 1: And so the reason frog or rabbit taste like chicken 232 00:14:16,880 --> 00:14:20,440 Speaker 1: is that these are all lean meats with low fat, 233 00:14:20,520 --> 00:14:23,200 Speaker 1: and so most of what you're left with is the protein, 234 00:14:23,640 --> 00:14:26,480 Speaker 1: which is what we associate with the taste of chicken. 235 00:14:27,040 --> 00:14:29,440 Speaker 1: If you had never eaten chicken in your life, and 236 00:14:29,480 --> 00:14:32,200 Speaker 1: you lived in a culture that ate frog all the time, 237 00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:35,040 Speaker 1: then when you did eat chicken for the first time, 238 00:14:35,520 --> 00:14:39,160 Speaker 1: you would probably say it tastes like frog. In fact, 239 00:14:39,200 --> 00:14:42,840 Speaker 1: the protein and the fat are so interchangeable that doctor 240 00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:46,560 Speaker 1: Gonzalad says, you can make any meat taste like any 241 00:14:46,600 --> 00:14:47,200 Speaker 1: other meat. 242 00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:52,280 Speaker 4: You know, I could take the fat from a lamb, 243 00:14:52,560 --> 00:14:54,680 Speaker 4: and I could mix it in ground beef and make 244 00:14:54,720 --> 00:14:57,760 Speaker 4: it taste like lamb a little claw, yeah, and it 245 00:14:57,800 --> 00:15:00,600 Speaker 4: would be like, ooh, that's kind of different profile if 246 00:15:00,600 --> 00:15:03,040 Speaker 4: you told them supposed to be beef flavors some people, 247 00:15:03,200 --> 00:15:05,680 Speaker 4: let's say that, you know, wow, that's all. Or I 248 00:15:05,720 --> 00:15:07,560 Speaker 4: could take some pork fat and mix it in with 249 00:15:07,640 --> 00:15:11,000 Speaker 4: something and it would taste very Dutch like pork too. 250 00:15:11,200 --> 00:15:14,240 Speaker 4: And so you could always manipulate by taking those fat 251 00:15:14,360 --> 00:15:17,440 Speaker 4: sources and doing that. Now hardly nobody does that, but 252 00:15:17,560 --> 00:15:20,479 Speaker 4: that's how you can manipulate some of those products. 253 00:15:20,720 --> 00:15:23,840 Speaker 1: That is fascinating. I feel like you're saying that all 254 00:15:23,880 --> 00:15:25,440 Speaker 1: meat tastes like chicken. 255 00:15:25,880 --> 00:15:29,320 Speaker 4: Yeah, and theory, if it has zero very little fat 256 00:15:29,360 --> 00:15:31,440 Speaker 4: in it, they all should taste the salmon. As being 257 00:15:31,520 --> 00:15:34,840 Speaker 4: taught meat science, they said, if we took every specta 258 00:15:34,880 --> 00:15:36,840 Speaker 4: fat out of a meat product and put them all 259 00:15:36,920 --> 00:15:38,360 Speaker 4: in front of you, you wouldn't be able to tell 260 00:15:38,400 --> 00:15:39,560 Speaker 4: us what species it is. 261 00:15:40,400 --> 00:15:45,200 Speaker 1: Wow. Okay, So that answer is the first big question 262 00:15:45,320 --> 00:15:48,720 Speaker 1: we had, which is why does frog taste like chicken? 263 00:15:49,040 --> 00:15:51,800 Speaker 1: And the answer is that both meats are lean with 264 00:15:51,960 --> 00:15:55,000 Speaker 1: low fat, and so most of what you're tasting are 265 00:15:55,000 --> 00:15:59,400 Speaker 1: the proteins which all animals share. But now this raises 266 00:15:59,520 --> 00:16:03,720 Speaker 1: two one how exactly does the fat give you the 267 00:16:03,880 --> 00:16:08,000 Speaker 1: unique taste of each kind of meat? And two why 268 00:16:08,040 --> 00:16:12,200 Speaker 1: is it that all animals use the same muscles? To 269 00:16:12,240 --> 00:16:16,080 Speaker 1: answer the first question, taker Gonzalez preferring meat to Professor 270 00:16:16,240 --> 00:16:21,040 Speaker 1: Jared Legeco, another meat scientist and one who specializes in 271 00:16:21,160 --> 00:16:22,640 Speaker 1: meat flavor. 272 00:16:25,520 --> 00:16:29,640 Speaker 9: I am a faculty member at Texas Tech University, and 273 00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:33,600 Speaker 9: I study food and meat science. My research tends to 274 00:16:33,640 --> 00:16:36,480 Speaker 9: focus on safety, but more so on the quality. Again, 275 00:16:36,560 --> 00:16:39,560 Speaker 9: where we're looking at things like how meat holds up 276 00:16:39,640 --> 00:16:44,240 Speaker 9: during storage, the factors that influence tenderness, juiciness, and flavor. 277 00:16:44,600 --> 00:16:47,440 Speaker 1: Fantastic. It sounds like you're a perfect expert for us 278 00:16:47,480 --> 00:16:49,800 Speaker 1: to talk to today, So I thought I'd start by 279 00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:53,320 Speaker 1: asking you what makes meat, any meat taste the way 280 00:16:53,360 --> 00:16:53,800 Speaker 1: it does. 281 00:16:54,160 --> 00:16:57,200 Speaker 9: Right when we say it tastes, we use that term 282 00:16:57,520 --> 00:17:01,560 Speaker 9: to predominantly meat flavor. Flavor is the combination of taste 283 00:17:01,600 --> 00:17:08,119 Speaker 9: and aroma. So taste would be those five sensations sweet, sour, salty, bitter, 284 00:17:08,680 --> 00:17:12,080 Speaker 9: and then more recently you mommy, which is the savory 285 00:17:12,160 --> 00:17:16,479 Speaker 9: type sensations. But then aroma's perceived then the back of 286 00:17:16,520 --> 00:17:19,840 Speaker 9: the throat through the nose. When you're eating, we have 287 00:17:20,160 --> 00:17:23,159 Speaker 9: small what are referred to as volatile compounds, meaning they 288 00:17:23,160 --> 00:17:26,400 Speaker 9: can just kind of float in the air, and we 289 00:17:26,560 --> 00:17:30,760 Speaker 9: perceive those and so with that we get that response 290 00:17:31,160 --> 00:17:33,560 Speaker 9: from both the tongue and then the nose. 291 00:17:33,840 --> 00:17:34,040 Speaker 4: Oh. 292 00:17:34,160 --> 00:17:37,280 Speaker 1: Interesting, So those aromatics come in, you said, to the 293 00:17:37,320 --> 00:17:39,480 Speaker 1: back of the throat. It's not like me smelling and 294 00:17:39,520 --> 00:17:40,400 Speaker 1: chewing at the same time. 295 00:17:40,480 --> 00:17:42,960 Speaker 9: It's kind of described that way that it kind of 296 00:17:42,960 --> 00:17:45,440 Speaker 9: comes in through the back of the throat. Odor would 297 00:17:45,480 --> 00:17:49,119 Speaker 9: be when you're maybe sniffing or smelling something prior to eating, 298 00:17:49,160 --> 00:17:52,840 Speaker 9: and that can have an influence. But classically we think 299 00:17:52,880 --> 00:17:57,119 Speaker 9: about the aroma kind of coming in combined with taste 300 00:17:57,160 --> 00:17:59,360 Speaker 9: when the food is in the mouth during consumption. 301 00:18:01,000 --> 00:18:03,640 Speaker 1: So this is kind of interesting. First of all, your 302 00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:08,280 Speaker 1: tongue really can only detect the broad strokes of flavor, 303 00:18:08,680 --> 00:18:14,920 Speaker 1: whether it's generally sweet, salty, bitter, sour, or savory or mommy, 304 00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:18,800 Speaker 1: what we send as complex or unique to a particular 305 00:18:18,880 --> 00:18:23,000 Speaker 1: food really mostly comes from your nose, and it comes 306 00:18:23,000 --> 00:18:26,680 Speaker 1: in through the back of your throat, according to doctor Legaco, 307 00:18:27,080 --> 00:18:30,200 Speaker 1: and second for us to detect them as aromas. What 308 00:18:30,240 --> 00:18:34,119 Speaker 1: we sense has to be volatile, meaning it has to 309 00:18:34,160 --> 00:18:36,720 Speaker 1: evaporate easily and float in the air. 310 00:18:37,480 --> 00:18:39,000 Speaker 2: Okay, back to doctor Legaco. 311 00:18:40,800 --> 00:18:44,400 Speaker 1: So then what makes lamb meat taste like lamb and 312 00:18:44,800 --> 00:18:48,520 Speaker 1: dug tastes like dug? You know, Byson tastes like bison. 313 00:18:48,800 --> 00:18:51,919 Speaker 9: Right, All those are going to be derived from the 314 00:18:52,000 --> 00:18:56,520 Speaker 9: components of the meat products. We have enzymes breaking down 315 00:18:56,840 --> 00:19:00,920 Speaker 9: skeletal muscle and releasing things that will in part tastes 316 00:19:01,160 --> 00:19:05,800 Speaker 9: you mommy. In particular is from amino acids. Maybe've heard 317 00:19:05,840 --> 00:19:10,960 Speaker 9: the term of aging of meat, so you have spoilage organisms. 318 00:19:11,520 --> 00:19:16,000 Speaker 9: They can also impart some unique flavors oftentimes. But then 319 00:19:16,040 --> 00:19:18,719 Speaker 9: the other thing that we have here are fats, and 320 00:19:18,920 --> 00:19:22,760 Speaker 9: fats are unique to species. Then that's where a lot 321 00:19:22,760 --> 00:19:26,280 Speaker 9: of this comes from. The components of skeletal muscle that 322 00:19:26,320 --> 00:19:30,160 Speaker 9: can vary a lot too across species, but the big 323 00:19:30,359 --> 00:19:33,320 Speaker 9: source of variation is from the fats. So you think 324 00:19:33,359 --> 00:19:36,879 Speaker 9: about red meats, they tend to have saturated fats, but 325 00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:40,000 Speaker 9: they also have a large amount of monounsaturated fats and 326 00:19:40,119 --> 00:19:44,800 Speaker 9: poly unsaturated. Lamb is very unique in that it also 327 00:19:45,000 --> 00:19:49,399 Speaker 9: has some branch chain fatty acids that are very I 328 00:19:49,400 --> 00:19:52,119 Speaker 9: guess specific to lamb. We don't see those show up 329 00:19:52,160 --> 00:19:55,119 Speaker 9: in other species. So not a lot of lamb consumers 330 00:19:55,160 --> 00:19:57,280 Speaker 9: in the US. But if you are, you know it 331 00:19:57,359 --> 00:20:00,919 Speaker 9: has a very unique flavor compared to be compared to, 332 00:20:01,320 --> 00:20:03,720 Speaker 9: certainly to any of the poultry products. 333 00:20:05,280 --> 00:20:10,080 Speaker 1: Okay, here is a key piece of information. Animals all 334 00:20:10,200 --> 00:20:13,360 Speaker 1: use the same proteins to make muscles, but they use 335 00:20:13,359 --> 00:20:17,800 Speaker 1: different fats which give each meat its own signature flavor. 336 00:20:18,480 --> 00:20:21,760 Speaker 1: Now I've been oversimplifying a little bit when I've said 337 00:20:21,880 --> 00:20:25,160 Speaker 1: all animals use the same proteins to make muscles. It's 338 00:20:25,200 --> 00:20:28,960 Speaker 1: true that all animals basically use actin and myocin to 339 00:20:29,040 --> 00:20:32,760 Speaker 1: make muscles, but how those proteins are arranged can vary. 340 00:20:33,119 --> 00:20:35,520 Speaker 1: And this is where the concept of red meat and 341 00:20:35,680 --> 00:20:39,439 Speaker 1: white meat comes in. Here's how doctor Legeko explains it. 342 00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:44,399 Speaker 9: So maybe a metaphor as you think about cars are 343 00:20:44,440 --> 00:20:47,600 Speaker 9: all similar for the most part. Right, they have four wheels, 344 00:20:48,080 --> 00:20:52,280 Speaker 9: maybe some doors, so they have a cross species similar components, right, 345 00:20:52,800 --> 00:20:56,800 Speaker 9: But it's how they're put together, and so muscle fibers 346 00:20:57,359 --> 00:20:59,960 Speaker 9: are going to vary in their type or composition. 347 00:21:00,520 --> 00:21:03,280 Speaker 1: So there's a different muscle fibers. How many would you 348 00:21:03,320 --> 00:21:04,120 Speaker 1: say there are. 349 00:21:04,160 --> 00:21:08,639 Speaker 9: Well, there's really three or four predominant types. We have 350 00:21:08,680 --> 00:21:11,040 Speaker 9: what's referred to as type one, and this is really 351 00:21:11,080 --> 00:21:14,160 Speaker 9: where the term red meats come from, because they have 352 00:21:14,680 --> 00:21:18,879 Speaker 9: the metabolism that lends them to appear more red. They 353 00:21:19,080 --> 00:21:25,200 Speaker 9: are doing more predominantly aerobic type metabolism. The metaphor there 354 00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:28,800 Speaker 9: is like the long distance runners, right, So they're using 355 00:21:28,880 --> 00:21:33,040 Speaker 9: oxygen and with that they require a lot of myoglobin, 356 00:21:33,400 --> 00:21:36,320 Speaker 9: which is a red pigment molecule that kind of makes 357 00:21:36,359 --> 00:21:38,399 Speaker 9: them look red. And then we have a few that 358 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:41,240 Speaker 9: are type two. That's not incredibly important, but if we 359 00:21:41,320 --> 00:21:44,280 Speaker 9: just lump all the twos together, you go to the 360 00:21:44,320 --> 00:21:47,400 Speaker 9: white meats. So they're short bursts of energy you think 361 00:21:47,400 --> 00:21:50,879 Speaker 9: about like a bird flapping its wings. It's really rapid, 362 00:21:51,080 --> 00:21:53,560 Speaker 9: and they tend to be those that use a lot 363 00:21:53,600 --> 00:21:58,199 Speaker 9: of glucose for their metabolism and contract really rapidly, and 364 00:21:58,240 --> 00:22:02,159 Speaker 9: they appear more white because they don't require the amount 365 00:22:02,160 --> 00:22:05,600 Speaker 9: of oxygen that we would see over for the red fibers. 366 00:22:06,960 --> 00:22:09,840 Speaker 1: So there are different types of meat and they have 367 00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:13,480 Speaker 1: different color, but what really makes them taste different is 368 00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:16,959 Speaker 1: how much fat they keep around to use as energy. 369 00:22:17,440 --> 00:22:20,879 Speaker 1: The slower red meat uses more fat, whereas the faster 370 00:22:21,080 --> 00:22:23,240 Speaker 1: white meat uses more glucose. 371 00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:28,120 Speaker 9: The type ones tend to, because of their metabolism, need 372 00:22:28,400 --> 00:22:32,040 Speaker 9: fat associated with them and near them so that they 373 00:22:32,080 --> 00:22:37,040 Speaker 9: can do their metabolism. Your locomotive muscles tend to be 374 00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:42,240 Speaker 9: more towards that type two. White type fiber poultry is 375 00:22:42,280 --> 00:22:44,560 Speaker 9: a great example. You go over to the breast meat. 376 00:22:44,800 --> 00:22:47,560 Speaker 9: There's a very lean muscle. There's a lack of fat 377 00:22:47,680 --> 00:22:51,760 Speaker 9: associated with that muscle because of the fiber type within it. 378 00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:55,119 Speaker 1: I see that fiber type doesn't need as much fat 379 00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:59,560 Speaker 1: lying around it, right, all right? The last thing I 380 00:22:59,640 --> 00:23:03,040 Speaker 1: asked Firleigeka was how do we go from those fats 381 00:23:03,080 --> 00:23:05,840 Speaker 1: in the meat to the flavors we smell through the 382 00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:09,840 Speaker 1: bag of our throats. Now, what's the connect ch between 383 00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:12,800 Speaker 1: the fatty types of fats and the flavor. 384 00:23:13,280 --> 00:23:17,080 Speaker 9: There's some research that is becoming stronger that shows that 385 00:23:17,119 --> 00:23:20,199 Speaker 9: we may be able to perceive some fatty acids on 386 00:23:20,280 --> 00:23:23,040 Speaker 9: the tongue. But classically we talk more about the fat 387 00:23:23,520 --> 00:23:29,960 Speaker 9: being degraded during cooking to form smaller volatile components. That's 388 00:23:30,000 --> 00:23:32,919 Speaker 9: where we get that flavor is through the breakdown of 389 00:23:32,920 --> 00:23:36,080 Speaker 9: those during cooking. You can also see this in storage, 390 00:23:36,119 --> 00:23:38,920 Speaker 9: and if it becomes too predominant, you get off odors, 391 00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:43,119 Speaker 9: off flavors. If there's too much breakdown during storage. 392 00:23:42,760 --> 00:23:47,320 Speaker 1: During storage, you might ruin those delicious smelling fatty acids. 393 00:23:47,560 --> 00:23:48,000 Speaker 3: Yeah. 394 00:23:48,320 --> 00:23:51,320 Speaker 1: Right, So then it's those fatty acids. When they get cooked, 395 00:23:51,480 --> 00:23:54,600 Speaker 1: they break down into volatail compounds which go up to 396 00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:57,960 Speaker 1: our nose, and that tell us us, hey this is lamb, 397 00:23:58,080 --> 00:23:59,679 Speaker 1: or hey this is meat. 398 00:23:59,720 --> 00:24:01,120 Speaker 2: Or bit or anything. 399 00:24:01,200 --> 00:24:01,680 Speaker 9: Yeah. 400 00:24:01,800 --> 00:24:02,320 Speaker 10: I see. 401 00:24:02,560 --> 00:24:05,480 Speaker 1: It kind of sounds like if someone lost their ability 402 00:24:05,520 --> 00:24:09,440 Speaker 1: to smell completely, then a lot of these meats would 403 00:24:09,440 --> 00:24:11,119 Speaker 1: taste the same. Is that true? 404 00:24:11,240 --> 00:24:13,399 Speaker 9: You know, it's a great question. I don't know the answer, 405 00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:16,080 Speaker 9: but that's a really good hypothesis. If we can gather 406 00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:19,080 Speaker 9: enough people that have that condition, then I guess we 407 00:24:19,080 --> 00:24:19,880 Speaker 9: could test it out. 408 00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:24,679 Speaker 1: Okay, when we come back, we're going to tackle the 409 00:24:24,800 --> 00:24:28,919 Speaker 1: last question in this meaty mystery, which is why is 410 00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:33,119 Speaker 1: it that every animal on Earth uses the same muscles? 411 00:24:33,560 --> 00:24:36,760 Speaker 1: Just how far back in evolution does the taste of 412 00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:40,640 Speaker 1: chicken go. We're going to find out, So stay with us, 413 00:24:41,040 --> 00:24:51,640 Speaker 1: we'll be right back. Welcome back, Okay, we are answering 414 00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:55,560 Speaker 1: the question why do frogs taste like chicken? And so 415 00:24:55,680 --> 00:24:59,520 Speaker 1: far we've learned that it's the unique fat content of 416 00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:03,720 Speaker 1: a meat that determines its flavor, and the reason frog 417 00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:06,640 Speaker 1: tastes like chicken is that both kinds of meat are 418 00:25:06,760 --> 00:25:11,119 Speaker 1: pretty lean and at their core. Basically, all animal muscle 419 00:25:11,600 --> 00:25:17,080 Speaker 1: is the same bugs, sea creatures, dogs, cats, lizards, birds, 420 00:25:17,560 --> 00:25:21,320 Speaker 1: They all use the same two proteins acting in miocin 421 00:25:21,560 --> 00:25:25,680 Speaker 1: to move. So to really answer the question of why 422 00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:28,679 Speaker 1: frog tastes like chicken, we need to go back and 423 00:25:28,800 --> 00:25:34,440 Speaker 1: figure out why every animal on Earth uses the same muscles. 424 00:25:35,080 --> 00:25:37,880 Speaker 1: In other words, why does every animal on the planet 425 00:25:38,200 --> 00:25:42,480 Speaker 1: in theory tastes like chicken. To answer this question, I 426 00:25:42,560 --> 00:25:45,640 Speaker 1: reached out to a scientist who thinks he's found the 427 00:25:45,680 --> 00:25:49,639 Speaker 1: origin of muscles, doctor Ulrich technav. 428 00:25:50,800 --> 00:25:51,000 Speaker 4: Well. 429 00:25:51,040 --> 00:25:55,119 Speaker 7: I'm a professor for developmental biology at the University of Vienna, 430 00:25:55,600 --> 00:25:59,000 Speaker 7: and I have a long standing interest in the evolution 431 00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:03,840 Speaker 7: of development, which also sometimes is shortly termed by evo devo. 432 00:26:04,080 --> 00:26:06,960 Speaker 10: If you think of worms and sea urchins and sea 433 00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:07,720 Speaker 10: stars and. 434 00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:12,480 Speaker 7: Vertebrates, they all looked extremely different from each other, but 435 00:26:12,600 --> 00:26:14,840 Speaker 7: we all are related, you know, we all come from 436 00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:15,800 Speaker 7: a common ancestor. 437 00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:18,800 Speaker 1: I was going to say, evil Divo sounds like an 438 00:26:18,920 --> 00:26:19,880 Speaker 1: eighties rock band. 439 00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:24,159 Speaker 11: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think it was coined by somebody 440 00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:24,680 Speaker 11: in the US. 441 00:26:24,720 --> 00:26:28,120 Speaker 10: I forgot who it was. I think that's what Americans 442 00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:30,440 Speaker 10: are usually very good for, you know, coining these kind 443 00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:31,000 Speaker 10: of channes. 444 00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:34,199 Speaker 1: I guess the main question we're asking you today is 445 00:26:34,960 --> 00:26:37,760 Speaker 1: what is the origin of muscle tissue? 446 00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:40,600 Speaker 11: Right? What if I had the answer that I would 447 00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:41,840 Speaker 11: stop researching? 448 00:26:43,119 --> 00:26:45,680 Speaker 1: Okay, doctor tech now is being a little modest here. 449 00:26:46,119 --> 00:26:49,479 Speaker 1: In twenty twelve, he and several colleagues published a paper 450 00:26:49,560 --> 00:26:54,360 Speaker 1: in the prestigious journal Nature titled Independent Evolution of Striated 451 00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:58,840 Speaker 1: Muscle in Nidarians and by Latarians, in which they trace 452 00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:03,320 Speaker 1: the evolution of must back to before animals even existed. 453 00:27:03,840 --> 00:27:07,320 Speaker 1: That's right before animals existed. 454 00:27:08,800 --> 00:27:10,920 Speaker 11: So when you ask, you know how the muscles arise. 455 00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:15,280 Speaker 10: Later studies have shown that even certain microbes, the aki are, 456 00:27:15,320 --> 00:27:18,520 Speaker 10: which are dating back like three billion years, you know, 457 00:27:18,760 --> 00:27:23,320 Speaker 10: they even have filamentous acting in them. So this is 458 00:27:23,359 --> 00:27:26,919 Speaker 10: a very very ancient protein, you know, which we can 459 00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:29,000 Speaker 10: trace back in evolution very deeply. 460 00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:32,600 Speaker 1: All right, what doctor tech now is saying is that 461 00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:36,399 Speaker 1: actin one of the two key proteins in all muscles, 462 00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:40,720 Speaker 1: was around pretty close to the beginning of life itself. 463 00:27:41,240 --> 00:27:43,720 Speaker 1: It's been found in Archaea, which is one of the 464 00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:47,240 Speaker 1: basic life forms that have been around since before any 465 00:27:47,359 --> 00:27:52,439 Speaker 1: animal or plant or fungi existed billions of years ago, 466 00:27:53,040 --> 00:27:58,000 Speaker 1: and actual muscle what's called smooth muscle and strayated muscle, 467 00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:01,479 Speaker 1: can be found in jellyfish, which is one of the 468 00:28:01,520 --> 00:28:06,959 Speaker 1: oldest animals that evolved about five hundred million years ago. 469 00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:10,080 Speaker 1: So the same muscle structure you and I have has 470 00:28:10,119 --> 00:28:12,600 Speaker 1: been around for a long time. 471 00:28:13,840 --> 00:28:17,080 Speaker 7: Because if you think about what animals are really known for, 472 00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:19,880 Speaker 7: I mean, they can move, you know, and some can 473 00:28:19,920 --> 00:28:20,919 Speaker 7: move very fast. 474 00:28:21,000 --> 00:28:24,800 Speaker 11: It's all based on muscle movement. So that's why it's 475 00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:27,600 Speaker 11: hard to imagine once you have evolved that you would 476 00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:31,200 Speaker 11: lose it again because it means it also allows you 477 00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:35,520 Speaker 11: to explore new territories, which allows you more easily to disperse. 478 00:28:35,840 --> 00:28:39,480 Speaker 11: So there's a lot of reasons why muscles are important. 479 00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:43,280 Speaker 1: So the reason frogs and chickens and pretty much every 480 00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:46,680 Speaker 1: animal on Earth have the same muscle is that it 481 00:28:46,760 --> 00:28:50,760 Speaker 1: evolved in its basic form a long time ago. Basically 482 00:28:50,880 --> 00:28:56,080 Speaker 1: since the beginning of animals and it stuck around. In fact, 483 00:28:56,200 --> 00:28:59,680 Speaker 1: you might say it's what made animals animals because it 484 00:28:59,720 --> 00:29:02,520 Speaker 1: allows help them to move. All right, I think that 485 00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:05,959 Speaker 1: answers our question for today. Why does frog taste like chicken? 486 00:29:06,480 --> 00:29:10,040 Speaker 1: The answer is that actually all meats taste like chicken 487 00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:14,800 Speaker 1: because all animals use the same proteins to build their muscles. 488 00:29:15,320 --> 00:29:18,280 Speaker 1: The structure of muscle is something that evolves super early 489 00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:22,440 Speaker 1: in the evolutionary history of animals, and it's stuck around. 490 00:29:23,040 --> 00:29:26,120 Speaker 1: It's a useful mutation. Then, what gives a meat its 491 00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:30,360 Speaker 1: unique flavor is actually the fat, which is related to 492 00:29:30,400 --> 00:29:33,560 Speaker 1: what the animal eats. It's biology and the kind of 493 00:29:33,680 --> 00:29:37,240 Speaker 1: energy each type of muscle uses. Okay, I'm going to 494 00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:40,800 Speaker 1: close out the episode by asking our experts a potentially 495 00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:46,920 Speaker 1: tasteless question, which is how does one become a meat scientist. 496 00:29:48,440 --> 00:29:51,960 Speaker 9: It's you know, it's not your normal field. Right when 497 00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:55,200 Speaker 9: you go to like the kindergartener graduation, they're talking about 498 00:29:55,200 --> 00:29:58,520 Speaker 9: being a fireman, a doctor, whatever it may be. It 499 00:29:58,600 --> 00:30:02,800 Speaker 9: rarely does a meat scientists unlock, if ever. But it's 500 00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:06,000 Speaker 9: it's a very dynamic feel, you know, It's there's a 501 00:30:06,040 --> 00:30:07,520 Speaker 9: lot of aspects to it. 502 00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:10,040 Speaker 4: Yeah, meat science really cool world. It's funny because I'll 503 00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:12,880 Speaker 4: tell you one last story. I was providing products for 504 00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:15,680 Speaker 4: a fundraiser and they're like always a meat scientist at 505 00:30:15,680 --> 00:30:18,280 Speaker 4: the University of Georgia. And one person there was like, Phil, 506 00:30:18,720 --> 00:30:21,360 Speaker 4: that's a made up thing. Just started laughing, like that 507 00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:26,040 Speaker 4: meat science is made up. You said it right, Friday. 508 00:30:26,120 --> 00:30:27,920 Speaker 4: I just started laughing like, yeah, a lot of people 509 00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:31,320 Speaker 4: are unaware of you know that. See, science is a discipline. 510 00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:33,680 Speaker 4: There's a lot of science that goes into what we do. 511 00:30:33,760 --> 00:30:36,000 Speaker 4: So thank you for letting us let me have this 512 00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:37,320 Speaker 4: platform to talk about it. 513 00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:39,960 Speaker 1: I feel like you're saying that when you bring home work, 514 00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:48,720 Speaker 1: you're literally bringing home the bacon. Yes, thanks for joining us. 515 00:30:49,200 --> 00:30:53,640 Speaker 1: See you next time you've been listening to Science Stuff. 516 00:30:53,840 --> 00:30:58,120 Speaker 1: Production of iHeartRadio bringing and produced by Me or hit Chim, 517 00:30:58,120 --> 00:31:02,160 Speaker 1: Credited by Rose Seguda, executive producer Jerry Rowland, and audio 518 00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:05,160 Speaker 1: engineer and mixer Kasey peckrom And you can follow me 519 00:31:05,200 --> 00:31:08,280 Speaker 1: on social media. Just search for PhD Comics and the 520 00:31:08,360 --> 00:31:10,960 Speaker 1: name of your favorite platform. Be sure to subscribe to 521 00:31:11,040 --> 00:31:14,360 Speaker 1: Sign Stuff on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever 522 00:31:14,480 --> 00:31:17,600 Speaker 1: you get your podcasts, and please tell your friends we'll 523 00:31:17,640 --> 00:31:21,400 Speaker 1: be back next Wednesday with another episode.