WEBVTT - A Top Crypto Exchange CEO Explains Why The 2020 Boom Is Different 0:00:10.880 --> 0:00:15.040 Hello, and welcome to another episode of the Odd Lots Podcast. 0:00:15.200 --> 0:00:19.279 I'm Joe Wisenthal and unfortunately this week my co host 0:00:19.320 --> 0:00:22.599 Tracy Alloway is off, though she's not going to be 0:00:22.720 --> 0:00:26.040 joining us, and I swear, or she swears that it's 0:00:26.079 --> 0:00:30.360 not just because we're going to be talking about cryptocurrencies today. 0:00:30.480 --> 0:00:33.400 She really couldn't make it. But in fact, we are 0:00:33.479 --> 0:00:37.559 doing another crypto episode, and I'm really excited about our 0:00:37.600 --> 0:00:42.080 guest today, a very important player in the industry. Of course, 0:00:42.479 --> 0:00:46.120 over the last several months, along with everything else, everything 0:00:46.200 --> 0:00:49.240 is going to the moon these days, stocks, gold, bonds, 0:00:49.320 --> 0:00:52.960 you name it. Cryptocurrencies are no exception, and it feels 0:00:53.000 --> 0:00:56.160 like there is certainly the most amount of enthusiasm that 0:00:56.200 --> 0:01:01.200 we've seen in crypto pribace since the the boom in 0:01:01.600 --> 0:01:06.000 UH And still the questions are remain and that there's 0:01:06.000 --> 0:01:08.200 still plenty of skeptics. What's it for? Where is this 0:01:08.319 --> 0:01:10.959 all going? Is this just another bubble that will burst 0:01:11.000 --> 0:01:14.000 like last time? So we're gonna dig into some of 0:01:14.040 --> 0:01:18.160 these questions today. Very excited to bring in our guest, 0:01:18.600 --> 0:01:22.440 Katherine Coley. She is the CEO of Finance US, a 0:01:22.520 --> 0:01:27.240 cryptocurrency exchange in the u S a wholly owned subsidiary 0:01:27.360 --> 0:01:31.360 subsidiary of Finance, which is one of the biggest cryptocurrency 0:01:31.440 --> 0:01:34.679 exchanges in the world. Katherine, thank you very much for 0:01:34.800 --> 0:01:37.480 joining us. Thank you so much. Joe really excited to 0:01:37.520 --> 0:01:41.479 be on. So I do remember last time, during last 0:01:41.680 --> 0:01:47.120 the last boom, we did see the emergence of Finance, 0:01:47.280 --> 0:01:50.080 which is the company that owns you. Just what is 0:01:50.120 --> 0:01:55.680 the structure and relationship of Finance and Finance US. I 0:01:55.720 --> 0:01:57.440 hate to come out of the gates correcting you on 0:01:57.480 --> 0:02:00.960 a couple of things, but I'm going to Okay, that's fine, 0:02:01.000 --> 0:02:04.480 that's fine. So Binance dot com it's a global ecosystem 0:02:04.560 --> 0:02:07.720 that really has been around for about last three years, 0:02:08.639 --> 0:02:12.200 really expanding the access around the world for people to 0:02:12.639 --> 0:02:17.919 engage with digital assets. And around last year in the summertime, 0:02:19.160 --> 0:02:22.880 I joined to become the CEO of Finance US, which 0:02:22.880 --> 0:02:26.080 is actually an independent entity entirely run out of the 0:02:26.120 --> 0:02:29.720 United States, with the ability to license the technology that 0:02:30.080 --> 0:02:33.239 Finance dot Com has, So you think about matching engine, 0:02:33.280 --> 0:02:35.600 the tech st act that's really there. We're able to 0:02:36.000 --> 0:02:39.560 really bring that into the US as well as customize 0:02:39.600 --> 0:02:43.080 it entirely for an American audience. So when you think 0:02:43.120 --> 0:02:46.960 about a cryptoo crypto global platform, so many things are 0:02:47.120 --> 0:02:51.720 so different in the United States on ramps, a c H, 0:02:51.840 --> 0:02:55.200 debit cards, wires, all the dollar components, so everything has 0:02:55.240 --> 0:02:58.079 to be custom fit and made specifically to the US. 0:02:58.520 --> 0:03:01.160 So that's really where Finance US comes in. The other 0:03:01.200 --> 0:03:06.120 components are the US regulation, so uh in terms of 0:03:06.200 --> 0:03:09.640 violence US, we're registered with fins in we have are 0:03:09.840 --> 0:03:12.520 are regulated by the state level, with the money transmitter 0:03:12.600 --> 0:03:16.120 licenses fully operating in thirty eight states, with the newest 0:03:16.160 --> 0:03:19.520 state being Florida, and so everything we're doing is in 0:03:19.600 --> 0:03:22.760 line with the U S regulation as well as catered 0:03:22.800 --> 0:03:26.440 to an American user. Got it? Okay, with that out 0:03:26.440 --> 0:03:28.760 of the way, and I appreciate you clarifying it, and 0:03:28.800 --> 0:03:31.200 I want people to understand what the exact structure is. 0:03:31.840 --> 0:03:33.959 Let me start with what I see as sort of 0:03:34.360 --> 0:03:39.760 one of the issues or problems with the crypto currency 0:03:39.960 --> 0:03:44.000 industry at large as a market and carried out I 0:03:44.040 --> 0:03:46.440 want to hear. I'm sure you'll disagree with me, but 0:03:46.600 --> 0:03:48.800 this is this is something that I think about a lot. 0:03:48.920 --> 0:03:52.800 So late seventeen or you know, people started getting like 0:03:52.880 --> 0:03:57.840 super into bitcoin. Also ethereum, and maybe a couple of others, 0:03:57.960 --> 0:04:02.360 and then by like no member and December of that year, 0:04:02.920 --> 0:04:06.400 suddenly the market was just flooded with supply, and suddenly 0:04:06.400 --> 0:04:09.840 it's like and now here buy some bitcoin cash. And 0:04:09.880 --> 0:04:14.119 then here by like eight more hard forks of bitcoin cash. Oh, 0:04:14.200 --> 0:04:16.520 and there's like fifty other I c o s, And 0:04:16.600 --> 0:04:19.679 so basically you have this thing which kind of started 0:04:19.720 --> 0:04:22.279 off essentially as bitcoin and bitcoin alone. And one of 0:04:22.279 --> 0:04:25.200 the big selling points was the fact that it's unique 0:04:25.279 --> 0:04:28.719 that there's a fixed supply of it. But then the industry, 0:04:28.920 --> 0:04:34.000 strikes me, is manufacturing so many new assets to capture 0:04:34.040 --> 0:04:38.839 the demand for crypto, and so suddenly exchange has become, 0:04:39.000 --> 0:04:43.400 in my mind, flooded with new coins, new project very fast. 0:04:43.880 --> 0:04:47.240 The incentive for new players is not to jump on 0:04:47.400 --> 0:04:50.520 a project that, say, has already gone up ten percent, 0:04:50.839 --> 0:04:53.400 but to start a new project that could itself go 0:04:53.480 --> 0:04:57.480 up ten thousand percent. And so then eventually it all 0:04:57.520 --> 0:05:01.120 sort of comes crumbling down because the investor the empire 0:05:01.279 --> 0:05:05.520 is just sort of choked with so much supply, and so, hey, 0:05:05.560 --> 0:05:08.159 I'm curious if you think that phenomenon is real. It 0:05:08.200 --> 0:05:10.680 seems like that way to me. And are we seeing 0:05:10.680 --> 0:05:13.919 it again this time with the sort of numerous, the 0:05:13.960 --> 0:05:16.800 hundreds of new coins that seemed to be emerging onto 0:05:16.839 --> 0:05:21.080 the ecosystem every day, you hit the nail on the head. 0:05:21.440 --> 0:05:25.960 So when Satoshi Knakamoto came out with IS or her 0:05:26.560 --> 0:05:32.200 imagination for a peer to peer network with this scarce asset, 0:05:33.320 --> 0:05:37.680 you realized that this would be absolutely possible assuming no 0:05:37.760 --> 0:05:42.200 other coin was manufactured, no other supply came in to 0:05:42.279 --> 0:05:44.880 dilute it, and this was the only way that would 0:05:44.920 --> 0:05:48.800 be But you forget that humans have a competitive need, 0:05:49.320 --> 0:05:53.040 and so we really can't take people away from building 0:05:53.080 --> 0:05:56.840 something that can be better, faster, stronger, or better marketed 0:05:57.040 --> 0:05:59.480 or cater to a different audience. And so you're going 0:05:59.520 --> 0:06:02.640 to always see people try to riff on it or 0:06:02.800 --> 0:06:06.440 fork as the you know, the industry says along when 0:06:06.440 --> 0:06:08.839 you're using the same elements of the blockchain and just 0:06:09.480 --> 0:06:13.120 rebranding it. Uh. And so with that, I agree with 0:06:13.160 --> 0:06:15.440 you that it does seem like, oh no, I can't 0:06:15.480 --> 0:06:18.240 I can't really see which one I'm going to be 0:06:18.320 --> 0:06:20.599 involved in. But that's really the element that we face 0:06:20.640 --> 0:06:23.000 into all things in life. You know, it wasn't that 0:06:23.200 --> 0:06:25.880 Coca cola was the only carbonated beverage that was out there. 0:06:26.240 --> 0:06:28.559 You're always going to see something come up new, something 0:06:28.560 --> 0:06:30.599 that was going to either be capturing a new market 0:06:30.600 --> 0:06:33.080 audience or something that was going to be delivering a 0:06:33.080 --> 0:06:36.800 different need. So that that's really where I see the 0:06:37.240 --> 0:06:41.280 human need for competition continuing and we have to accept that. Um. 0:06:41.320 --> 0:06:43.600 The best part about that is you get innovation of 0:06:44.160 --> 0:06:47.920 so where there's things like the birth of Ethereum, which 0:06:47.960 --> 0:06:51.280 then has let us see items as humorous as crypto 0:06:51.360 --> 0:06:55.240 kitties and then as impactful as stable coins, you're also 0:06:55.279 --> 0:06:58.440 seeing it change the way we're we're seeking yield now. 0:06:58.760 --> 0:07:01.840 So you've got different components that are letting people really 0:07:01.880 --> 0:07:05.680 evaluate how this industry can change the game. And I'm 0:07:05.680 --> 0:07:11.280 all for it. Okay, So your comparison to Coca Cola 0:07:11.360 --> 0:07:14.680 and then you know, Pepsi emerged and there's other sodas 0:07:15.440 --> 0:07:17.360 that kind of makes sense to me. It's like, right, 0:07:17.400 --> 0:07:22.520 that's capitalism, that's human nature. We're going to compete, ingenuity, innovate, 0:07:22.840 --> 0:07:25.600 so forth. Coca Cola is still around, but people have 0:07:25.760 --> 0:07:29.720 other options. They're being said, it's one thing to have 0:07:29.760 --> 0:07:33.400 a new competitor to Coca Cola, on the market. It's 0:07:33.440 --> 0:07:38.840 another thing for the listed exchanges to capitalize on the 0:07:38.920 --> 0:07:44.440 hype for Cola and suddenly list every new Cola project 0:07:44.600 --> 0:07:47.560 as something that trades. So, okay, you have Coke shares, 0:07:47.600 --> 0:07:50.360 But what if you know, over the next few months 0:07:50.360 --> 0:07:53.760 there was a boom and coke suddenly all kinds of 0:07:53.800 --> 0:07:59.480 new cola startups existed primarily to um well quench investor 0:07:59.600 --> 0:08:05.520 thirst for soda related assets, so to related financial assets. 0:08:06.160 --> 0:08:10.440 Doesn't this end up just sort of diluting and swamping 0:08:11.040 --> 0:08:14.880 the sort of supply demand supply demand effects that was 0:08:14.920 --> 0:08:17.560 pushing the original asset asset up of the first place 0:08:18.240 --> 0:08:20.520 Insider it more of a marketplace. I'm going to have 0:08:20.720 --> 0:08:23.240 Coca Cola, I'm going to have Mountain Dew, I'm going 0:08:23.280 --> 0:08:25.680 to have a sprite, I'm going to have a variety 0:08:25.680 --> 0:08:28.240 of options because i know that my user base is 0:08:28.240 --> 0:08:30.680 going to be demanding it. So I'm going to make 0:08:30.720 --> 0:08:33.400 sure that what I'm serving isn't poison. I'm going to 0:08:33.440 --> 0:08:36.840 make sure that what I'm providing is in demand of 0:08:36.880 --> 0:08:39.480 the market, and I'm going to be possibly pushing the 0:08:39.520 --> 0:08:44.400 market into seeing if something you know is worthwhile keeping 0:08:44.440 --> 0:08:47.080 on our menu. So so that's really how we view 0:08:47.400 --> 0:08:50.400 offering digital assets. There's going to be the majors, the 0:08:50.440 --> 0:08:53.120 ones that we see as having the largest adoption so far, 0:08:53.559 --> 0:08:56.640 the ones that have either been there the longest when 0:08:56.640 --> 0:08:59.680 you think about it, or we're going to be providing 0:08:59.720 --> 0:09:04.720 things where the current market environment is both approval of 0:09:04.760 --> 0:09:07.840 a from a regulatory standpoint as well as the market 0:09:07.880 --> 0:09:10.800 is demanding it, asking for it to be included in 0:09:10.880 --> 0:09:14.520 certain things because there's actual growth or team and and 0:09:14.600 --> 0:09:16.680 a mission behind it that's going to be catered to 0:09:17.160 --> 0:09:21.840 a US growth that concept um or the idea that 0:09:21.840 --> 0:09:24.240 we're going to be needing this from a utility perspective. 0:09:24.440 --> 0:09:27.560 So we've launched a series of coins forty six of 0:09:27.600 --> 0:09:30.400 them in total today, and we break them through with 0:09:30.400 --> 0:09:33.400 with different you can kind of put them in categories too, um, 0:09:33.440 --> 0:09:36.079 you've got your diet sodas, you've got your caffeine free, 0:09:36.400 --> 0:09:39.840 you've got your fruity fruity drinks, uh, And you can 0:09:39.880 --> 0:09:41.640 kind of break them through in that where you see 0:09:41.640 --> 0:09:44.199 governance tokens being something as a need for people to 0:09:44.280 --> 0:09:47.560 understand and want to be involved in. You see staking 0:09:47.600 --> 0:09:49.760 as something where people want to be involved in these 0:09:49.800 --> 0:09:52.880 proof of steaks where if you park your deposits you're 0:09:52.920 --> 0:09:55.839 able to earn um you know, rewards on top of that. 0:09:56.200 --> 0:10:00.000 So those are kind of the subcategories to which digital 0:10:00.000 --> 0:10:03.160 assets provide people different ways to interact with the markets. 0:10:03.520 --> 0:10:05.720 You don't have to be high frequency trader in order 0:10:05.720 --> 0:10:09.439 to capitalize on digital assets. You could possibly be very 0:10:09.480 --> 0:10:13.120 involved in staking having large deposits there. You could be 0:10:13.280 --> 0:10:17.400 involved in the governance of these defy or decentralized finance 0:10:17.920 --> 0:10:21.240 UH protocols and and so forth. So that that's really 0:10:21.240 --> 0:10:23.880 how we break it down and offer people that variety, 0:10:24.120 --> 0:10:27.480 because being a gatekeeper in this industry is way too soon. 0:10:28.440 --> 0:10:30.559 This gets to UH something that you know, you need 0:10:30.600 --> 0:10:34.960 to help educate me on. And during that boom, you know, 0:10:35.000 --> 0:10:38.959 I thought I was pretty reasonably informed on various goings 0:10:38.960 --> 0:10:42.760 on in the crypto industry, and I'd like to think 0:10:42.800 --> 0:10:47.360 that I would have been reasonably informed, except I don't 0:10:47.360 --> 0:10:49.120 know if you've noticed, but a bunch of other things 0:10:49.120 --> 0:10:52.720 that have happened in and so I have to admit 0:10:53.040 --> 0:10:56.640 that I haven't paid as close attention to all the 0:10:56.679 --> 0:10:59.120 development as I did back then because I've kind of 0:10:59.120 --> 0:11:01.719 been distracted with some of this other stuff that's been 0:11:01.760 --> 0:11:05.720 happening this year. So to a sort of nubie in 0:11:05.800 --> 0:11:09.520 the space or someone who like isn't paying attention, how 0:11:09.559 --> 0:11:12.000 would you describe this world? I mean, all this stuff 0:11:12.120 --> 0:11:17.320 staking and stable coins and yield farming and governmentce tokens 0:11:17.400 --> 0:11:19.839 like I actually have, I don't really understand it. So 0:11:20.120 --> 0:11:23.000 you were to like describe to someone what the big 0:11:23.080 --> 0:11:25.959 new things are in that were sort of characterized the 0:11:26.000 --> 0:11:30.480 ecosystem versus what's your sort of like I don't know, 0:11:30.559 --> 0:11:32.880 elevator pitch for it all because I see these charts 0:11:32.920 --> 0:11:34.880 of like a million coins interacting with each other, and 0:11:34.920 --> 0:11:36.240 I just have to admit I don't really get it. 0:11:36.559 --> 0:11:39.240 If you could have predicted, I would have given you 0:11:39.280 --> 0:11:43.920 all my money in So, Uh, there's certainly some components 0:11:43.960 --> 0:11:47.319 that none of us saw happening. Um, but of those 0:11:47.760 --> 0:11:50.440 I break it down into two. Really the benefits of 0:11:50.480 --> 0:11:53.559 the freedom of digital assets. And that sounds like a 0:11:53.600 --> 0:11:57.120 big jarble of words, so I'll break it down. I 0:11:57.160 --> 0:12:00.719 am currently trapped in my living room, uh, with a 0:12:00.800 --> 0:12:05.520 limited amount of exposure externally, unable to get most of 0:12:05.559 --> 0:12:08.760 my news or media except for online or Bloomberg TV. 0:12:09.679 --> 0:12:13.920 And the components to which I can interact with other persons, 0:12:14.120 --> 0:12:17.360 my team, a company of business all have to be digital. 0:12:18.520 --> 0:12:20.559 So when you look at a space that allows you 0:12:20.640 --> 0:12:29.760 to interact, access funds, invest trade from a mobile device, 0:12:30.600 --> 0:12:34.560 you think about how that benefits us for whatever may come. 0:12:35.440 --> 0:12:38.640 Unless we're all underwater and the internet is bad there. 0:12:39.280 --> 0:12:42.920 But the the components that we've currently faced in this 0:12:42.960 --> 0:12:48.880 pandemic have all been suited for a resilient industry to 0:12:49.000 --> 0:12:52.240 take off. And that's really where digital assets has thrived 0:12:52.800 --> 0:12:56.520 is the idea that you anyone with an Internet connection 0:12:57.360 --> 0:13:00.920 can access their funds in digital sets. And the digital 0:13:01.000 --> 0:13:05.360 assets can either be placed in highly volatile assets staple 0:13:05.400 --> 0:13:08.960 assets pegged to the dollar, or ones that reward you 0:13:09.040 --> 0:13:11.560 for keeping it parked there and not trading it, or 0:13:11.679 --> 0:13:14.640 ones that help you, uh, you know, build on top 0:13:14.679 --> 0:13:18.079 of it and create different things, be it tokens or 0:13:18.160 --> 0:13:20.920 chips that are rewarded, or things that unlocked doors like 0:13:20.920 --> 0:13:40.640 a chucky cheese or a gaming token. Let's say, I'm 0:13:40.679 --> 0:13:44.280 actually really curious on the tokens that pay you for 0:13:44.320 --> 0:13:48.000 not doing anything, and so people collect yield and this 0:13:48.080 --> 0:13:49.920 is something I don't still don't quite understand, but you 0:13:49.960 --> 0:13:53.720 can buy a token, stake it somewhere, which basically means 0:13:53.840 --> 0:13:55.920 kind of like it seems to me, like putting it 0:13:55.960 --> 0:13:58.400 in a c D kind of where you commit to 0:13:58.600 --> 0:14:01.120 locking it up for a certain out of time and 0:14:01.160 --> 0:14:05.160 then you get some yield, some above market yield. How 0:14:05.200 --> 0:14:08.959 does that whole world work? And who is paying me 0:14:09.280 --> 0:14:11.960 that yield? So I get some sort of income from it, 0:14:12.280 --> 0:14:15.040 But who's the one, uh, you know, spending that money 0:14:15.080 --> 0:14:19.680 that's becoming my income. There's a common word from every 0:14:19.720 --> 0:14:23.320 part of finance that you know before this that is 0:14:23.360 --> 0:14:28.160 not changing, and that's liquidity. So the need for a 0:14:28.280 --> 0:14:32.080 market to have enough supply to be able to meet 0:14:32.120 --> 0:14:35.680 the demands without fluctuating the price of the asset is 0:14:35.720 --> 0:14:39.480 still something that is a component in any marketplace. Um, 0:14:39.520 --> 0:14:42.080 I only have one soda and I have thirty people 0:14:42.120 --> 0:14:44.440 that need it, that's going to be a very expensive soda. 0:14:45.160 --> 0:14:47.040 If I have an infinite supply of this soda, or 0:14:47.080 --> 0:14:48.880 if people want to give me their sodas so that 0:14:48.920 --> 0:14:51.480 I can sell them for other people, I can lower 0:14:51.520 --> 0:14:53.520 that price. I can have a better market, I can 0:14:53.560 --> 0:14:56.200 have more users. So we think about it in ways 0:14:56.240 --> 0:14:59.720 where yield farming, which is this you know foreign word 0:14:59.760 --> 0:15:02.000 that comes up with the same thing as you know, 0:15:02.080 --> 0:15:03.960 seeking yield, which is what you do in f X 0:15:04.040 --> 0:15:06.240 when you're deciding to go into the AUSI dollar. But 0:15:06.880 --> 0:15:11.400 the components of being able to provide your supply of 0:15:11.440 --> 0:15:16.200 a token to a provider so that they can make 0:15:16.280 --> 0:15:20.240 markets with it allows you to then be rewarded for 0:15:20.320 --> 0:15:24.280 sacrificing the chance to BILO so high during those times. 0:15:25.160 --> 0:15:29.000 So because you're actively taking a stance that says I'm 0:15:29.040 --> 0:15:31.440 not going to touch it, I'm not going to you know, 0:15:32.120 --> 0:15:35.800 seek to trade this thing actively, I am sacrificing some 0:15:35.920 --> 0:15:39.200 element of the market that is out there currently so 0:15:39.320 --> 0:15:43.160 that this whole entire marketplace can have more supply to 0:15:43.240 --> 0:15:47.560 be able to make healthier markets. That's where you're getting 0:15:47.560 --> 0:15:49.880 this reward or this this staking reward or the yield 0:15:50.640 --> 0:15:55.600 guilt in return. So the yield payer in this case, 0:15:55.800 --> 0:15:57.320 I don't even know that's called. I'm not sure if 0:15:57.320 --> 0:15:59.680 I'm using the right term. But whoever is paying me 0:15:59.760 --> 0:16:03.320 that a market maker who is then using that coin 0:16:04.560 --> 0:16:08.880 to engage in a facilitate a more a liquid trading environment, 0:16:08.920 --> 0:16:12.880 basically in in a in our old world, in our 0:16:13.240 --> 0:16:16.800 centralized world, that is a market maker in this new world, 0:16:17.080 --> 0:16:20.240 it is anyone. So that is that that is the 0:16:20.280 --> 0:16:24.680 component that gets people, especially you know as a former banker, 0:16:24.800 --> 0:16:28.400 gets them going confused, like what about what about my counterparty? 0:16:28.560 --> 0:16:30.120 How do I know who they are? How how am 0:16:30.120 --> 0:16:33.640 I familiar with this? And that's the feature, not the bug, 0:16:34.240 --> 0:16:36.400 that you're going to be able to give up your 0:16:36.560 --> 0:16:42.880 assets into um an unknown pool that someone, anyone can 0:16:42.920 --> 0:16:45.720 be able to use to then make markets on. And 0:16:45.800 --> 0:16:47.720 so that is a huge benefit to people that are 0:16:47.800 --> 0:16:52.560 not classified as the Susquehannas Steve r twos of the 0:16:52.600 --> 0:16:55.920 world UM that would naturally have that as a business. 0:16:56.520 --> 0:17:00.240 And you're able to see you first time traders able 0:17:00.240 --> 0:17:02.360 to pick up and learn about this as well as 0:17:02.520 --> 0:17:08.280 provide automated market making strategies and build this out and 0:17:08.520 --> 0:17:12.400 therefore take advantage of a bad advantage but be able 0:17:12.440 --> 0:17:17.880 to capitalize on visibility to provide markets safely. So that's 0:17:17.880 --> 0:17:19.800 like the unusual component. But you can break it down 0:17:19.800 --> 0:17:22.679 into I'm giving up my asset into a to a 0:17:22.760 --> 0:17:24.639 market maker, and the market maker is paying me for 0:17:24.680 --> 0:17:27.760 that service, and then you have to flip it and say, 0:17:27.760 --> 0:17:31.119 in decentralized finance, I'm giving that up to an unknown entity, 0:17:31.160 --> 0:17:33.320 and that unknown entity is then doing what they want 0:17:33.320 --> 0:17:37.080 with it um, which is a benefit if you are 0:17:37.840 --> 0:17:42.119 democratizing the access to this capital. Right, two questions. The 0:17:42.240 --> 0:17:44.520 first one is a very short one. So again I'm 0:17:44.560 --> 0:17:47.359 assuming that for a lot of listeners this is like 0:17:47.400 --> 0:17:50.560 pretty new stuff. Yield forming, locking up your coin is 0:17:50.600 --> 0:17:54.560 actually collecting an interest rate on a cryptocurrency. First question 0:17:54.680 --> 0:17:57.520 is how big is this market or like how you know, 0:17:57.600 --> 0:18:03.199 how how big is this growth? This has grown astronomically 0:18:03.400 --> 0:18:10.200 in the last few weeks, with the astronomic being still 0:18:10.320 --> 0:18:13.800 under you under ten billion dollars we're talking about the 0:18:13.840 --> 0:18:17.879 stable coin industry inside of digital assets is ten billion dollars. 0:18:17.920 --> 0:18:22.159 But this component of yield farming and decentralized finance is 0:18:22.200 --> 0:18:25.600 now eclipsing these centralized exchanges. So for the first time 0:18:25.600 --> 0:18:29.760 ever you saw unit swaps volume, daily volume exceed coin basis. 0:18:30.119 --> 0:18:33.080 You know, as a as a company that's also working 0:18:33.080 --> 0:18:37.520 on eclipsing other people's market share. Um, there is an 0:18:37.560 --> 0:18:40.080 ability to do this, but it's also just the differentiation 0:18:40.119 --> 0:18:43.080 of your of your feature or of your platform. So 0:18:43.600 --> 0:18:47.920 the the excellence of these decentralized platforms is that they 0:18:47.960 --> 0:18:53.480 are allowing a global participation level, not just a regional 0:18:54.000 --> 0:18:55.960 So I said, I had two questions, but I'm going 0:18:56.040 --> 0:18:58.399 to ask a question in between again for the purpose 0:18:58.400 --> 0:19:03.000 health listeners. You know, the hot exchange was coin based. 0:19:03.640 --> 0:19:07.119 That's more or less a regulated bank in the sense 0:19:07.200 --> 0:19:09.600 that you can wire your money to them, put it 0:19:09.640 --> 0:19:12.760 on deposit, and then they hold something for you that 0:19:12.840 --> 0:19:15.200 they call a bitcoin or some other coin that's really 0:19:15.280 --> 0:19:17.480 just their liability, and when you want to take it off, 0:19:17.520 --> 0:19:20.440 they'll send it to you. But it's like people in regulation. 0:19:21.000 --> 0:19:25.239 Something like nice swap is just a protocol. There's no 0:19:25.359 --> 0:19:28.720 actual fiat money held, and it's a sort of purely 0:19:28.800 --> 0:19:35.280 digital algorithmic exchange on chain that essentially has there's no 0:19:35.560 --> 0:19:37.600 custodial aspect to it at all. Is that more or 0:19:37.680 --> 0:19:40.240 less right? Very accurate? I except for the fact that 0:19:40.280 --> 0:19:43.359 I'm sure coin base in myself would both say we 0:19:43.400 --> 0:19:45.879 are bank life, but definitely not. We did none of 0:19:45.880 --> 0:19:50.080 our banking licenses to be a chartered bank, so just 0:19:50.160 --> 0:19:52.520 to be just for every everyone out there listening, we 0:19:52.600 --> 0:19:55.800 have our money transmission licenses, but I'm not the bank 0:19:55.920 --> 0:19:59.000 chart an important distinction. Okay, So then this gets to 0:19:59.000 --> 0:20:03.040 me to my other question, which is one of the 0:20:03.119 --> 0:20:09.840 common complaints of um crypto towards crypto from skeptics. So like, yeah, okay, 0:20:09.840 --> 0:20:13.520 it's kind of interesting. Maybe the technology is interesting, but 0:20:13.560 --> 0:20:17.560 all it's used for basically is speculation and games and trading. 0:20:18.280 --> 0:20:20.520 And when you we sort of look at the last 0:20:20.560 --> 0:20:23.880 three years and the you know, I guess innovation that's 0:20:23.920 --> 0:20:27.080 taken place. There are a lot of new things that 0:20:27.119 --> 0:20:29.920 have been built, but it seems like still the only 0:20:29.960 --> 0:20:33.360 thing in the end is more speculation in trading. There's 0:20:33.400 --> 0:20:35.520 just sort of like a new layer. It's it's a 0:20:35.560 --> 0:20:39.520 more sophisticated market. Maybe it's more liquid, maybe there are 0:20:39.520 --> 0:20:42.399 more participants in more different different ways of profit. But 0:20:42.520 --> 0:20:45.639 in the end, what's being built is yet another layer 0:20:45.800 --> 0:20:49.840 for a speculative game. Having been someone that's dedicated her 0:20:50.000 --> 0:20:54.760 entire career too speculative assets, and my first five years 0:20:54.760 --> 0:20:58.280 were with Morgan Stanley and Foreign Exchange, not that much 0:20:58.280 --> 0:21:04.400 as different. So uh, to clarify, the past three years 0:21:04.400 --> 0:21:07.760 have been dedicated to crypto. I have stayed busy, I've 0:21:07.800 --> 0:21:12.240 stayed employed, and I've constantly been learning. So for an 0:21:12.280 --> 0:21:16.560 industry to be able to provide that much opportunity as 0:21:16.560 --> 0:21:19.440 well as give me the chance to hire and bring 0:21:19.440 --> 0:21:21.879 in new voices and names and give them careers in 0:21:22.000 --> 0:21:25.280 something that is an added benefit any industry would hope 0:21:25.280 --> 0:21:30.399 to have. So the the benefits of anything blossoming, whether 0:21:30.400 --> 0:21:33.120 it is for a speculative purpose or not, is that 0:21:33.440 --> 0:21:37.960 this is able to build a sustainable ecosystem for enthusiasts 0:21:38.040 --> 0:21:41.919 as well as experts as well. As the on ramps 0:21:41.960 --> 0:21:45.840 into crypto are so much wider than the on ramps 0:21:45.880 --> 0:21:50.640 into finance, into technology, and with that it's it's a 0:21:50.680 --> 0:21:54.800 global benefit of people's curiosity. So I see it as 0:21:55.040 --> 0:21:58.280 despite the skepticism, I've been able to stay off the 0:21:58.280 --> 0:22:02.760 streets because of crypto um and there's so much benefit 0:22:02.800 --> 0:22:07.840 in that that people underestimate. And for the ability to have, uh, 0:22:07.920 --> 0:22:11.159 you know, a woman's CEO of of an American exchange. 0:22:11.760 --> 0:22:14.240 We only just got our first woman in banking as 0:22:14.280 --> 0:22:16.679 the CEO. So the changes we can make inside of 0:22:16.680 --> 0:22:20.440 the digital asset industry, whether it is seen as skeptical 0:22:20.680 --> 0:22:25.240 or you know, concerning for folks, is merely a birth 0:22:25.359 --> 0:22:27.399 of a new industry that is giving more people an 0:22:27.440 --> 0:22:31.120 opportunity to seek it out. I'm actually like how did 0:22:31.160 --> 0:22:33.320 you go crypto? Because you know, over the years there're 0:22:33.359 --> 0:22:36.240 been stories is like longtime banker makes the leap, but 0:22:36.359 --> 0:22:38.400 they jump into some new thing. They launched their own 0:22:38.400 --> 0:22:41.520 new thing, or like one of the exchanges will pluck 0:22:41.640 --> 0:22:45.440 a well known exact from the legacy finance world. What's 0:22:45.480 --> 0:22:48.880 your story, like, how did you decide um to make 0:22:48.880 --> 0:22:51.840 the dive to leave Morgan Stanley than you went to 0:22:51.960 --> 0:22:55.120 Ripple than to finance us? But what was that like 0:22:55.240 --> 0:22:59.040 making that decision to sort of leave the warm embrace 0:22:59.080 --> 0:23:02.159 of traditional finance into this new world. Well, I definitely 0:23:02.160 --> 0:23:06.520 wouldn't call it a warm embrace, but the I've always 0:23:06.520 --> 0:23:09.560 wanted to be in front of the biggest wave out there, 0:23:09.720 --> 0:23:13.200 and so right after college, I threw myself into Hong 0:23:13.280 --> 0:23:18.480 Kong FCS trading and saw a world that was wild 0:23:18.600 --> 0:23:20.719 and it was you know, while while we were comparing 0:23:20.760 --> 0:23:23.000 ourselves with our New York and London colleagues, we were 0:23:23.000 --> 0:23:25.399 the wild West. We were you know, Asian and the 0:23:25.560 --> 0:23:29.719 f's we were um these wild options on China. Uh, 0:23:30.119 --> 0:23:35.960 the the components inside of the Asian market landscape. We're 0:23:36.000 --> 0:23:40.480 still wild, We're still untamed and had so many idiosyncratic 0:23:41.000 --> 0:23:45.360 features to them. It kept you captivated. And so when 0:23:45.359 --> 0:23:47.399 I moved to London with Morgan Stanley and was you 0:23:47.440 --> 0:23:50.400 know then just doing huge size of euro and sterling 0:23:50.400 --> 0:23:54.840 and nothing, nothing, nothing too exotic, you saw that kind 0:23:54.840 --> 0:23:56.639 of Uh, this is this is, this is where my 0:23:56.680 --> 0:23:59.080 future is headed. And so I leaned into the electronic 0:23:59.119 --> 0:24:02.600 trading side. UM being able to provide this for our 0:24:02.680 --> 0:24:04.760 users to have that autonomy, to be able to trade 0:24:04.760 --> 0:24:09.760 without me, which helped for a human errors, be prioritization 0:24:09.800 --> 0:24:13.040 of my own personal time and see better execution from 0:24:13.160 --> 0:24:15.760 a trading standpoint. They were able to use algos, they 0:24:15.760 --> 0:24:18.480 were able to have trade cost analysis. Um, it was 0:24:18.560 --> 0:24:22.200