WEBVTT - What We Know About Immunity

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to Prognosis. I'm Laura Carlson. It's day one forty

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<v Speaker 1>two since coronavirus was declared a global pandemic. Today's main story.

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<v Speaker 1>Scientists have been focused on studying virus antibodies to develop

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<v Speaker 1>a vaccine, but encouraging new research shows our bodies may

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<v Speaker 1>be developing other weapons that could be key to slowing

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<v Speaker 1>the outbreak. But first, here's what happened in virus news today.

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<v Speaker 1>Vietnam confirmed its first death from the pandemic after a

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<v Speaker 1>sudden cluster of cases emerged in the coastal city of

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<v Speaker 1>Da Nang. For more than three months, the country appeared

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<v Speaker 1>to have beaten back the virus. The death of a

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<v Speaker 1>seventy year old man comes seven months after the nation

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<v Speaker 1>recorded its first virus cases. The US government pledged its

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<v Speaker 1>biggest investment yet in a vaccine. The Trump administration will

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<v Speaker 1>provide as much as two point one billion dollars in

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<v Speaker 1>funding to vaccine partners Sunafi and Glaxo Smith Klein. The

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<v Speaker 1>funding will support clinical trials and manufacturing, while allowing the

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<v Speaker 1>US to secure one million doses of the shot if

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<v Speaker 1>it's successful. The country has an option to receive an

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<v Speaker 1>additional five hundred million doses. Longer term, the US has

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<v Speaker 1>made billions of dollars and commitments to other experimental vaccines,

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<v Speaker 1>stoking concerns that some countries will be left behind. In England,

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<v Speaker 1>more than four million people are being forced inside a

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<v Speaker 1>large part of the country's northern region must comply with

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<v Speaker 1>new tighter lockdown rules. Prime Minister Boris Johnson is rushing

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<v Speaker 1>to tackle a new spike in cases, and his administration

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<v Speaker 1>has forbidden residents in the Greater Manchester area and parts

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<v Speaker 1>of East Lancashire and West Yorkshire from meeting indoors with

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<v Speaker 1>members of other households. And now for today's main story.

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<v Speaker 1>In the race to study immunity to the virus, scientists

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<v Speaker 1>first focused on antibodies, proteins that stick to and disable

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<v Speaker 1>foreign invaders. That's because creating antibodies is the basis for

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<v Speaker 1>most successful vaccines, so scientists are interested in learning who

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<v Speaker 1>develops coronavirus antibodies, how long they stick around, and how

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<v Speaker 1>effective they are keeping people from getting infected again. But

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<v Speaker 1>recent studies show there may be another weapon inside the

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<v Speaker 1>human body that can rouse fresh antibodies soldiers long after

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<v Speaker 1>the first have left the battlefield. Bloomberg Senior editor Jason

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<v Speaker 1>Gale explains that T cells may be part of the

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<v Speaker 1>key to blunting the coronavirus contagion. Let's start with the

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<v Speaker 1>antibody tests. That is, the possibility of an antibody test

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<v Speaker 1>and showing that COVID antibodies fade quickly, but it's still

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<v Speaker 1>not known if an antibody response will give future imming

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<v Speaker 1>the antibodies. What does that mean? It means these are

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<v Speaker 1>We've heard a lot about antibodies during the pandemic. Having

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<v Speaker 1>specific antibodies against sarsko V two may prevent us from

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<v Speaker 1>catching the virus again. Some governments have suggested that they

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<v Speaker 1>could serve as the basis for an immunity passport or

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<v Speaker 1>risk free certificate that would enable people to travel or

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<v Speaker 1>to return to work, assuming they are protected against reinfection.

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<v Speaker 1>Problem is, there's currently no evidence that people who have

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<v Speaker 1>recovered from COVID nineteen and to have antibodies are protected

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<v Speaker 1>from a second infection. Scientists think they probably do, but

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<v Speaker 1>there's no proof. What's more, these antibodies don't appear to

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<v Speaker 1>stick around lock, at least in people who have had

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<v Speaker 1>a mold b out of the disease. Researchers in Los

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<v Speaker 1>Angeles reported last week the rapid decay of anti Saskvy

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<v Speaker 1>to antibodies and patients who had a mild case of

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<v Speaker 1>COVID nineteen. They said their findings, published in the New

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<v Speaker 1>England Journal of Medicine, suggested we should treat with caution.

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<v Speaker 1>The idea of immunity passports, as well as the durability

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<v Speaker 1>of any vaccines that are produced, sounds kind of depressing, right, Well,

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<v Speaker 1>maybe not when it comes to the immune system. Antibodies

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<v Speaker 1>aren't a solo act. They're part of an entire orchestra

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<v Speaker 1>of immune defenders that collectively make up our white blood cells.

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<v Speaker 1>In the front row are the innate crew that respond

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<v Speaker 1>to a viral infection immediately and crudely. Then there's a

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<v Speaker 1>more sophisticated bunch of adaptive immune responders that remember what

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<v Speaker 1>games there fought in case they have to do battle

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<v Speaker 1>with them again. Antibodies are one component of that adaptive

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<v Speaker 1>immune response which immunization seeks to create without causing any disease,

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<v Speaker 1>Which are the plants that are made from the cells

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<v Speaker 1>and the ones that bind to a virus and neutralize.

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<v Speaker 1>This is Professor Alessandro setting He's a researcher at Lahoya

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<v Speaker 1>Institute for Immunology in San Diego who has been studying

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<v Speaker 1>the immune system for some forty five years. So if

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<v Speaker 1>you have a high level of antibodies, you can neutralize

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<v Speaker 1>the virus and avoid infection. Alessandro is interested in another

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<v Speaker 1>component of the adaptive immune system, T cells. We recognize

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<v Speaker 1>and destroy effect itselves. This is very important because when

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<v Speaker 1>you have an infection, when a virus gets inside the cell,

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<v Speaker 1>it becomes an invisible for antibodies. We antibodies cannot get

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<v Speaker 1>to it anymore. He's getting inside the cell. Some T

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<v Speaker 1>cells directly kill these virally infected cells. Others play a

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<v Speaker 1>support role, helping to regulate the immune system and remember

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<v Speaker 1>microbial foes. Without a helper T cells, the antibody response

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<v Speaker 1>is weak. Uh, it doesn't find very strongly, doesn't last

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<v Speaker 1>very long. Good news is that Alexandro and his colleagues

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<v Speaker 1>have found that when people are infected with sisk V two,

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<v Speaker 1>they amount a strong T cell response, and unexpectedly, he

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<v Speaker 1>found some people who had never encountered sarask v two

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<v Speaker 1>also had T cells that recognized the pandemic strain, which

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<v Speaker 1>was odd since this is a completely new virus, and

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<v Speaker 1>so this was very puzzling and we we looked at

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<v Speaker 1>this data from right from left, from top from bottom,

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<v Speaker 1>and we really became convinced that this was absolutely real.

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<v Speaker 1>Scientists in the Netherlands, UK, Germany and Singapore have reported

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<v Speaker 1>the same thing, so it's really all over uh, different

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<v Speaker 1>groups and different continents. So this was remarkable. So how

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<v Speaker 1>do you explain how someone whose immune system has never

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<v Speaker 1>seen this coronavirus before as some memory of it. And

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<v Speaker 1>the most reasonable hypothesis, but we want to emphasize that

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<v Speaker 1>this is an hypothesis at this point, is that this

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<v Speaker 1>is due to exposure to common called coronaviruses. There are

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<v Speaker 1>four of them in circulation that caused the usual sore

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<v Speaker 1>throat coffin running knows that we routinely experience in winter.

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<v Speaker 1>Alessandre says Sis givy two is like a cousin of

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<v Speaker 1>these less dangerous coronaviruses. This viruses evil cousin common called corona.

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<v Speaker 1>So if you've seen this other viruses recently, maybe you

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<v Speaker 1>have a little bit of cross ripping. In other words,

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<v Speaker 1>if you have encountered one of these cold causing coronavirus

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<v Speaker 1>is recently, could it give you at least partial immunity.

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<v Speaker 1>Alexandra says scientists are looking into this and are especially

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<v Speaker 1>interested in studying people living on an island off the

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<v Speaker 1>coast of Tuscany, where the incidents of COVID nineteen was

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<v Speaker 1>very low, despite infected travelers from mainland Italy bringing it across.

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<v Speaker 1>That island was reported to have had the year before

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<v Speaker 1>particularly bad common called the season, and so some of

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<v Speaker 1>the people I talked there were speculated, well, maybe this

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<v Speaker 1>has something to do, and I think that they were, uh,

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<v Speaker 1>trying to set up and starting to look at this

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<v Speaker 1>and more details. Alessandra says more research is needed to

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<v Speaker 1>determine whether pre existing T cells that cross react with

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<v Speaker 1>the Sasko V two virus may explain why some COVID

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<v Speaker 1>patients are barely affected while others get very sick and

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<v Speaker 1>even die. Figuring out the role of cells in protecting

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<v Speaker 1>against COVID it's pretty important since these white blood cells

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<v Speaker 1>will be critical for achieving durable immune protection from many

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<v Speaker 1>vaccines that are developed. The immune system is all about memory,

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<v Speaker 1>and so is vaccination. You create a memory, so if

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<v Speaker 1>maybe you have a pre existing little bit of memory response,

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<v Speaker 1>your immune system has a head start compare to someone

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<v Speaker 1>that doesn't. We still don't know yet whether it's possible

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<v Speaker 1>to develop vaccines that will stimulate potent antibodies against aus

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<v Speaker 1>COVID two and prevent someone from getting COVID nineteen. According

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<v Speaker 1>to Alessandro, the hope is that immunization will at least

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<v Speaker 1>generate an immune response that lessens the severity of disease

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<v Speaker 1>and the time it takes to recover from the infection,

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<v Speaker 1>and this should go some way to blunt the pandemic.

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<v Speaker 1>That was Jason Gale, and that's it for our show today.

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<v Speaker 1>For coverage of the outbreak from one hundred and twenty

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<v Speaker 1>beers around the world, visit Bloomberg dot com Flash Coronavirus

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<v Speaker 1>and if you like the show, please leave us a

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<v Speaker 1>review and a rating on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. It's

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<v Speaker 1>the best way to help more listeners find our global reporting.

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<v Speaker 1>The Prognosis Daily edition is produced by Tophor Foreheads, Jordan Gaspure,

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<v Speaker 1>Magnus Henrickson, and Ni Laura Carlson. Today's main story was

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<v Speaker 1>reported by Jason Gale. Original music by Leo Sedrin. Our

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<v Speaker 1>editors are Rick Shine and Francesca Levi. Francesca Levi is

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<v Speaker 1>Bloomberg's head of podcasts. Thanks for listening.