WEBVTT - Smart Talks with IBM: Clicks, Not Code: Transforming Digital Experiences with Salesforce 0:00:00.040 --> 0:00:05.000 Hey everyone, it's Robert and Joe here. Today we've got 0:00:05.040 --> 0:00:06.960 something a little bit different to share with you. It 0:00:07.080 --> 0:00:10.680 is a new edition of the Smart Talks podcast series, 0:00:10.720 --> 0:00:14.319 which is produced in partnership with IBM. This season of 0:00:14.360 --> 0:00:18.640 Smart Talks with IBM is all about new creators, the developers, 0:00:19.040 --> 0:00:22.600 data scientists, c t o s, and other visionaries creatively 0:00:22.640 --> 0:00:27.120 applying technology and business to drive change. They use their 0:00:27.160 --> 0:00:30.640 knowledge and creativity to develop better ways of working, no 0:00:30.720 --> 0:00:34.840 matter the industry. Join hosts from your favorite Pushkin Industries 0:00:34.920 --> 0:00:38.560 podcast as they use their expertise to deepen these conversations. 0:00:39.040 --> 0:00:41.800 Malcolm Gladwell will guide you through this season as your 0:00:41.840 --> 0:00:45.000 host to provide his thoughts and analysis along the way. 0:00:45.320 --> 0:00:48.600 Look out for new episodes of Smart Talks with IBM 0:00:48.680 --> 0:00:52.040 every month on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, 0:00:52.159 --> 0:00:55.480 or wherever you get your podcasts. And learn more at 0:00:55.520 --> 0:01:03.600 IBM dot com slash smart Talks. Hello, Hello, Welcome to 0:01:03.680 --> 0:01:07.679 Smart Talks with IBM, a podcast from Pushkin Industries, I 0:01:07.840 --> 0:01:12.840 Heart Radio and IBM. I'm Malcolm Glabwell. This season, we're 0:01:12.840 --> 0:01:17.640 talking to new creators, the developers, data scientists, ct o s, 0:01:17.959 --> 0:01:22.200 and other visionaries who are creatively applying technology and business 0:01:22.240 --> 0:01:26.400 to drive change. Channeling their knowledge and expertise, they're developing 0:01:26.440 --> 0:01:31.479 more creative and effective solutions no matter the industry. Our 0:01:31.520 --> 0:01:36.280 guest today is Phil Weinmeister, had a product Salesforce America's 0:01:36.440 --> 0:01:40.839 at IBM. Drawing on IBM's offerings and expertise, Phil helps 0:01:40.880 --> 0:01:46.520 businesses craft better digital experiences for their customers, employees, and 0:01:46.640 --> 0:01:51.200 business partners. A lack of highly specialized software engineers is 0:01:51.240 --> 0:01:55.400 a major challenge for companies trying to improve their digital experiences, 0:01:56.040 --> 0:02:00.000 so using the Salesforce platform, Phil teaches people with little 0:02:00.240 --> 0:02:04.400 or no technical background how to make custom digital solutions 0:02:04.440 --> 0:02:08.679 on their own without needing to write code. On today's show, 0:02:09.000 --> 0:02:13.400 you'll hear Phil's thoughts on human centric design, unlocking the 0:02:13.440 --> 0:02:17.120 potential of the low code, no code approach, and how 0:02:17.160 --> 0:02:23.560 ib AM consulting powers digital transformations with the Salesforce platform. 0:02:23.680 --> 0:02:27.400 Phil spoke with Jacob Goldstein, host of the Pushkin podcast 0:02:27.680 --> 0:02:32.320 What's Your Problem and former host of nprs Planet Money. 0:02:32.639 --> 0:02:35.880 Jacob has been a business journalist for over a decade, 0:02:36.160 --> 0:02:40.160 reporting for NPR, The Wall Street Journal, the Miami Herald, 0:02:40.560 --> 0:02:43.480 and is the author of the book Money, The True 0:02:43.520 --> 0:02:47.480 Story of a made up thing. Okay, let's get to 0:02:47.520 --> 0:02:53.280 the interview, just very briefly, sort of what's your role 0:02:53.320 --> 0:02:56.519 at IBM. Yeah, it's a good question because my role 0:02:56.639 --> 0:03:00.600 is it's a bit unique. So we're for having consulting, 0:03:00.639 --> 0:03:04.200 which is a consultancy. Salesforce is one of the platforms 0:03:04.240 --> 0:03:08.720 that we um deliver services for. My team is a 0:03:08.720 --> 0:03:13.920 product team, so we're like a product organization within a consultancy, 0:03:14.000 --> 0:03:16.959 and I had that team up. So yeah, it's really 0:03:16.960 --> 0:03:21.519 cool because we get to combine the client needs client 0:03:21.639 --> 0:03:25.520 problems that are brought to us through consulting engagements, but 0:03:26.320 --> 0:03:29.480 we're ultimately product development, so we get to build solutions. 0:03:29.480 --> 0:03:32.000 So I kind of love the sweet spot that we're 0:03:32.040 --> 0:03:36.280 in there. So basically, businesses have problems, and you build 0:03:36.400 --> 0:03:40.760 solutions for those problems, for those problems, but also thinking 0:03:40.800 --> 0:03:43.400 about future clients, so we build it so that we 0:03:43.480 --> 0:03:46.880 can reuse it in the future for different clients. So 0:03:46.920 --> 0:03:49.280 that that's what makes it a little bit unique at 0:03:49.320 --> 0:03:53.360 the consultancy versus you know, typical engagement. You solve a 0:03:53.400 --> 0:03:55.400 problem and you move on to the next problem, but 0:03:55.480 --> 0:03:59.960 we solve it while taking a step back and saying, well, 0:04:00.000 --> 0:04:03.800 are similar problems that other clients, UM, that could be 0:04:04.040 --> 0:04:07.120 solved through the same application that we build. If that 0:04:07.160 --> 0:04:09.520 makes sense. It does, and I think we'll get into 0:04:09.600 --> 0:04:16.159 some specific examples which will really help help us everybody understand. Um, 0:04:16.200 --> 0:04:18.920 Can you just talk a little bit about the kind 0:04:19.080 --> 0:04:23.480 of challenges around digital transformation that a lot of businesses 0:04:23.480 --> 0:04:26.279 are facing right now. There are a few things that 0:04:26.920 --> 0:04:30.120 I personally seem quite a bit um, one of which 0:04:30.320 --> 0:04:34.240 is that businesses simply don't have the data they need 0:04:34.440 --> 0:04:37.920 to provide the right type of experience. I mean, at 0:04:37.960 --> 0:04:41.279 the end of the day, customers want something very easy, 0:04:41.360 --> 0:04:45.440 and ironically it it's actually somewhat hard to provide an 0:04:45.440 --> 0:04:50.719 easy experience. A lot of experiences are probably overthought, over engineered, 0:04:51.400 --> 0:04:55.799 and that creates this divide between an organization and their customers. 0:04:55.800 --> 0:04:59.320 I mean, organizations want to know their customers, they want 0:04:59.320 --> 0:05:01.480 to know their partner, they want to know their employees, 0:05:02.120 --> 0:05:05.280 and if they do that right, it's a game changer, 0:05:05.360 --> 0:05:11.120 it's absolutely transformational. But without that, and that's all data centric, 0:05:11.200 --> 0:05:15.520 data driven, you don't know your customer. You can't give 0:05:15.560 --> 0:05:17.800 them what they want because you don't know who they are. 0:05:18.080 --> 0:05:20.520 There's a phrase that I know is important in your work, 0:05:20.640 --> 0:05:22.479 and that I want to make sure we touch on 0:05:22.600 --> 0:05:26.640 here and and that phrases human centric innovation. Tell me, 0:05:26.720 --> 0:05:28.919 tell me what that means, you know in this case 0:05:28.960 --> 0:05:34.080 and more generally in your work. Yeah. Absolutely, So when 0:05:34.080 --> 0:05:42.240 we think about a solution, especially with digital experiences, we 0:05:42.320 --> 0:05:47.159 are always thinking about who is the end user? Right, 0:05:47.800 --> 0:05:51.279 And with the digital experiences, one thing I'd like to say, 0:05:51.720 --> 0:05:54.719 do a lot of presentations at Salesforce events, and I've 0:05:54.760 --> 0:05:58.480 spoken on topic of personalization a few times. I think 0:05:58.520 --> 0:06:01.480 it's useful to start with where things have been and 0:06:01.480 --> 0:06:04.480 where we're coming from, which is really a one size 0:06:04.520 --> 0:06:08.440 fits all web experience and that still exists throughout the 0:06:08.440 --> 0:06:11.320 web in quite a few places. Is this is a 0:06:11.360 --> 0:06:15.080 dissemination of information, right, It's a push. I have information 0:06:15.120 --> 0:06:17.520 I want to get out, or I have actions that 0:06:17.560 --> 0:06:21.279 I want you to complete, and I'm going to set 0:06:21.360 --> 0:06:25.040 up an experience. Do you know, get the information you 0:06:25.080 --> 0:06:27.039 need or do the things I want you to do. 0:06:27.760 --> 0:06:32.440 And we're seeing that the demands have significantly changed, right, 0:06:32.480 --> 0:06:37.120 Customers expect a lot more these days and simply one 0:06:37.160 --> 0:06:40.120 size fits all. So that direction we're headed towards is 0:06:40.839 --> 0:06:44.159 starting with that end user and really thinking about who 0:06:44.240 --> 0:06:47.960 is this person, what do they want, what are they 0:06:48.080 --> 0:06:52.680 trying to achieve? And starting from that perspective, so the 0:06:52.680 --> 0:06:56.520 the audiences that we're building a solution for now become 0:06:56.560 --> 0:07:00.359 more critical than ever and they're not and after thought, 0:07:00.640 --> 0:07:03.719 but instead who are these audiences that are going to 0:07:03.720 --> 0:07:07.120 be part of the solution. We do things like journey 0:07:07.160 --> 0:07:10.840 mapping right where we walk through the flow from beginning 0:07:10.920 --> 0:07:13.920 to end. What does their experience look like? What do 0:07:14.040 --> 0:07:17.240 they want at each stage? And we have to think 0:07:17.240 --> 0:07:22.080 about that in the solution. So, uh, you mentioned Salesforce, 0:07:22.680 --> 0:07:24.840 and Salesforce is It's kind of a funny thing, right 0:07:24.880 --> 0:07:28.520 in the world of business. Salesforce is this gigantic company 0:07:28.520 --> 0:07:32.400 that has transformed software, has transformed business in a lot 0:07:32.400 --> 0:07:36.040 of ways, but outside of kind of enterprise scale business, 0:07:36.120 --> 0:07:38.720 lots of people have never heard of it, right, amazing, 0:07:39.080 --> 0:07:43.240 So just like, very briefly, what is Salesforce? You know, 0:07:43.560 --> 0:07:48.320 it's it's been a complete game changer. It is technically 0:07:48.320 --> 0:07:52.560 it's a customer relationship management platform, and that though I 0:07:52.600 --> 0:07:54.880 don't think, really captures what it is. And when I 0:07:54.920 --> 0:07:58.080 describe to people I know, technical or non technical, I 0:07:58.680 --> 0:08:01.280 describe it as this is a platform on which you 0:08:01.280 --> 0:08:05.520 can run your business. For me personally, um, it's been. 0:08:05.560 --> 0:08:09.640 It's been completely revolutionary because I came from an organization 0:08:09.680 --> 0:08:13.480 at the time that had everything custom built, homegrown, which 0:08:13.480 --> 0:08:14.640 I think it was a little bit of a sense 0:08:14.680 --> 0:08:17.840 of pride at that organization. But what was happening was 0:08:19.040 --> 0:08:24.920 everything required hundreds of hours. Any change was a major project, 0:08:25.240 --> 0:08:29.200 super costly, and things broke when changes were made. And 0:08:29.240 --> 0:08:32.640 when I started on the Salesforce platform, I think the 0:08:32.640 --> 0:08:36.120 biggest thing is stuck to me was the low and 0:08:36.200 --> 0:08:41.079 no code development capabilities that business minded people who are 0:08:41.160 --> 0:08:44.160 not necessarily technical in the sense that they write code 0:08:44.559 --> 0:08:48.880 can now be empowered to actually deliver solutions. So I 0:08:48.960 --> 0:08:50.960 think that's how i'd say it. It's it's a platform 0:08:50.960 --> 0:08:53.800 you can run your business on. It is that single 0:08:54.080 --> 0:08:57.880 source of truth. It's the interface that your employees are 0:08:57.880 --> 0:09:00.120 going to interact with on a daily basis to get 0:09:00.120 --> 0:09:03.960 their jobs done. So there was a phrase you mentioned 0:09:03.960 --> 0:09:07.880 in in passing. That phrase was a low code or 0:09:07.960 --> 0:09:11.320 no code development, and I'm glad you did because it's 0:09:11.320 --> 0:09:14.000 one of those phrases that I've been hearing and that 0:09:14.160 --> 0:09:17.000 sounds kind of amazing, but I also feel like I 0:09:17.040 --> 0:09:19.760 don't quite get So let me take this opportunity to 0:09:19.920 --> 0:09:24.840 ask you what is low code or no code development? Well, 0:09:24.880 --> 0:09:28.800 I love the question because I'm personally very passionate about this, 0:09:29.559 --> 0:09:33.040 coming from where I was before, at an organization that had, 0:09:33.080 --> 0:09:37.480 like I said, custom built solutions, any change to the 0:09:37.520 --> 0:09:42.400 digital experience required code. That that is where I was 0:09:42.440 --> 0:09:44.520 coming from, and that's where a lot of organizations are 0:09:44.559 --> 0:09:47.920 coming from today. So what that means is you are 0:09:48.160 --> 0:09:53.120 always dependent on a technical resource to make that change. However, 0:09:53.720 --> 0:09:57.440 when you want to make some basic changes, some let's 0:09:57.440 --> 0:10:02.000 say some process automation or update like that that maybe 0:10:02.120 --> 0:10:07.200 isn't wildly complex, it is fairly limiting to not be 0:10:07.320 --> 0:10:10.440 able to actually implement any of these changes yourself. So 0:10:10.679 --> 0:10:13.880 when we say lower no code platform, essentially what that 0:10:13.920 --> 0:10:17.360 means is there's another phrase that's used by Salesforce clicks 0:10:17.760 --> 0:10:21.160 not code. So think about it this way. Salesforce has 0:10:21.240 --> 0:10:24.160 done all the hard work and written many millions of 0:10:24.240 --> 0:10:29.720 lines of code behind the scenes to provide an interface 0:10:29.840 --> 0:10:34.600 where through clicks we can essentially build a solution. So 0:10:34.880 --> 0:10:37.760 I wrote a book a few years ago called Practical 0:10:37.800 --> 0:10:42.280 Salesforce development without code, right, it's still development. You're building 0:10:42.320 --> 0:10:45.840 a solution that can be implemented and drive value for 0:10:45.960 --> 0:10:49.760 a customer. But it is literally through clicks. Now that 0:10:49.800 --> 0:10:52.240 doesn't mean it's you know, always super easy, it can 0:10:52.280 --> 0:10:56.360 get pretty advanced, but literally through clicks you can do that, 0:10:56.520 --> 0:11:00.439 So that that's a completely different way of thinking. And 0:11:00.559 --> 0:11:03.280 what when you say clicks, you just mean you're using 0:11:03.320 --> 0:11:05.719 like a graphical user interface. You're pointing and clicking at 0:11:05.720 --> 0:11:08.280 different buttons, dragging things around. Just to be clear, when 0:11:08.280 --> 0:11:11.160 you say clicks, that's the kind of thing you made, right, Yeah, exactly, 0:11:11.240 --> 0:11:15.400 exactly right. It's sort of democratizes the technology a little bit. 0:11:15.440 --> 0:11:18.040 And I think the biggest thing though, is you have 0:11:18.160 --> 0:11:22.800 all these you know, smart business people who are business 0:11:22.960 --> 0:11:28.679 minded in throughout the world who don't necessarily code, and 0:11:28.800 --> 0:11:33.640 it just allows them so much more ability to drive change, 0:11:33.800 --> 0:11:36.320 is I think what we're seeing. So it's it's a 0:11:36.360 --> 0:11:39.600 great thing and I and I personally love it because 0:11:39.679 --> 0:11:42.839 it gives us more tools in our arsenal. For sure. 0:11:44.400 --> 0:11:48.360 You work for IBM at kind of the intersection of 0:11:48.360 --> 0:11:50.600 of IBM and Salesforce, right, I mean, can you tell 0:11:50.640 --> 0:11:56.120 me about the way IBM uses Salesforce tools to to 0:11:56.200 --> 0:12:01.000 help businesses improve, become more efficient, adopt a more data 0:12:01.080 --> 0:12:06.400 driven approach. Yeah. Absolutely, we're approached for a number of 0:12:06.400 --> 0:12:10.800 different reasons. A lot of times we work with organizations 0:12:10.840 --> 0:12:15.959 who are coming at us with industry specific requests. They 0:12:15.960 --> 0:12:18.920 have needs, There's quite a variety, so we have we 0:12:18.960 --> 0:12:23.240 are set up to have experts in each of those areas, right, 0:12:23.400 --> 0:12:29.200 business experts, technical experts, and we've gone through a number 0:12:29.280 --> 0:12:32.439 of solutions in each of those paths. At the same time, 0:12:32.720 --> 0:12:37.280 then we have more horizontal experts as well, who are 0:12:37.600 --> 0:12:42.040 Salesforce technical architects for example, business analysts, those that know 0:12:42.160 --> 0:12:48.520 the platform. By combining those, we can not only understand 0:12:49.120 --> 0:12:53.480 what's needed in those industries. But the reality is you 0:12:53.559 --> 0:12:55.800 have to know the platform well, right. You can't just 0:12:55.920 --> 0:12:58.920 come in with industry knowledge and try to build a 0:12:58.920 --> 0:13:02.600 solution on the sales Force platform without knowing it very well. 0:13:02.640 --> 0:13:07.319 And it's now just so massive. There are so many 0:13:07.360 --> 0:13:11.960 clouds they call various products under the platform, umbrella clouds 0:13:12.679 --> 0:13:15.760 and these are these are Salesforce clouds right, sales right, 0:13:15.880 --> 0:13:19.640 so megap products exactly. You know, we it started with 0:13:19.720 --> 0:13:25.320 sales cloud service, cloud marketing cloud, there's philanthropy cloud, consumer 0:13:25.360 --> 0:13:28.120 goods Cloud just launched, right, higher education cloud. There are 0:13:28.120 --> 0:13:31.439 all these different areas of expertise. So it's it's that 0:13:31.559 --> 0:13:36.160 combination of the industry knowledge, platform knowledge. And then you 0:13:36.200 --> 0:13:41.760 mentioned human centered design and thinking really trying to putting 0:13:41.800 --> 0:13:44.240 the end user at the center of the experience and 0:13:44.320 --> 0:13:48.240 thinking about their journey and then designing a solution that 0:13:48.360 --> 0:13:50.960 at the end of the day will deliver what they need, 0:13:51.960 --> 0:13:56.800 keep them happy, and keep the business moving along. So 0:13:56.960 --> 0:14:02.000 that idea of combining industry specific knowledge and salesforce specific 0:14:02.040 --> 0:14:06.880 knowledge seems really interesting and powerful. Are there any specific 0:14:06.960 --> 0:14:10.640 examples of that in action that you that you want 0:14:10.640 --> 0:14:18.959 to share? Yeah? Sure, So we recently we built a 0:14:19.000 --> 0:14:25.560 manufacturing solution on the Salesforce platform. Essentially, what this was 0:14:25.560 --> 0:14:29.560 was based on the industry expertise, so we internally we 0:14:29.720 --> 0:14:35.440 met with individuals who had expertise in manufacturing. The audience 0:14:35.480 --> 0:14:38.960 here for these organizations was their partners. So the concept 0:14:39.000 --> 0:14:41.120 of us, how do we deliver a solution like a 0:14:41.400 --> 0:14:45.960 basically a PRM solution for the manufacturing industry. What CRM 0:14:46.000 --> 0:14:52.200 stand for Partner relationship management, So UH, manufacturers often are 0:14:52.280 --> 0:14:56.160 interacting with suppliers, distributors, all of those and that's a 0:14:56.240 --> 0:15:00.400 common need, especially digitally, and you can imagine this is 0:15:00.400 --> 0:15:03.800 one of those areas that was widely neglected for many 0:15:03.880 --> 0:15:08.520 years with either very poor or non existent digital experiences. Right, 0:15:08.640 --> 0:15:12.440 So we met with industry experts internally to understand what 0:15:12.560 --> 0:15:15.760 these use cases were, and then we took a step 0:15:15.760 --> 0:15:19.560 back and looked at how we could leverage this on 0:15:19.720 --> 0:15:23.120 the platform. So the solution we came up with was 0:15:23.200 --> 0:15:27.680 essentially a template. It was a a digital experience template 0:15:28.480 --> 0:15:35.240 that organizations could employ really with a few clicks. Obviously 0:15:35.280 --> 0:15:38.280 they would have to configure it, they could customize it, 0:15:38.360 --> 0:15:42.840 but it was a rapid accelerator that allowed for these 0:15:43.200 --> 0:15:48.720 specific use cases for example, distributing and assigning leads to 0:15:48.840 --> 0:15:56.280 these distributors, providing reporting metrics on opportunities or leads, all 0:15:56.320 --> 0:16:00.600 that type of data we provided and it was a 0:16:00.640 --> 0:16:04.440 template so they could start quickly, right, get up and 0:16:04.520 --> 0:16:08.760 running in a few weeks, and then leveraging our professional services, 0:16:09.280 --> 0:16:12.080 they could customize it as well, so they would work 0:16:12.080 --> 0:16:15.720 with us and they could provide their you know, individual 0:16:15.760 --> 0:16:17.840 client needs and take it from there. So that's one 0:16:17.880 --> 0:16:22.080 example of a solution that we built that again took 0:16:22.120 --> 0:16:26.280 the industry needs, but also it was it was married 0:16:26.320 --> 0:16:31.680 to a platform specific technology. If you were trying to 0:16:31.760 --> 0:16:35.000 boil it all down and you wanted to give just 0:16:35.400 --> 0:16:38.520 one tip for a business that's trying to improve their 0:16:38.560 --> 0:16:43.280 digital experience, what would that tip be. I would say 0:16:43.320 --> 0:16:45.720 that you need to be open to change and be 0:16:45.800 --> 0:16:49.920 open to breaking away from the old way of doing things. 0:16:50.080 --> 0:16:53.800 I think I think a lot of times customers can 0:16:54.000 --> 0:17:00.880 hurt themselves by being tied to what exists today, right 0:17:01.040 --> 0:17:04.879 maybe for cultural political reasons that their company that maybe 0:17:04.880 --> 0:17:07.560 they feel like, you know, they've invested so much in 0:17:07.560 --> 0:17:10.200 a solution already that they want to try to get 0:17:10.200 --> 0:17:13.040 as much out of that as they can. But I 0:17:13.080 --> 0:17:17.720 think being open to the innovation, being open to new technology, 0:17:18.080 --> 0:17:20.159 I think makes a world of difference because if the 0:17:20.200 --> 0:17:24.520 client is open to a new solution and we come 0:17:24.520 --> 0:17:28.040 in and we can listen to them, really anything is possible, 0:17:28.080 --> 0:17:31.200 and that's where I think the biggest changes are made. So, 0:17:32.160 --> 0:17:34.480 while it may sound very simple, I think that would 0:17:34.480 --> 0:17:37.480 be my number one tip is just be open to 0:17:38.000 --> 0:17:41.800 a new way of doing things. Film mentioned certain areas 0:17:41.840 --> 0:17:46.879 of business like manufacturing or distribution often neglect the digital experience. 0:17:47.480 --> 0:17:52.080 By finding and connecting experts across IBM, Salesforce and a 0:17:52.200 --> 0:17:56.680 client's industry, Phil helps businesses bridge these gaps in their 0:17:56.720 --> 0:18:01.879 digital experiences, and Jermaine cognizant their human end users. The 0:18:01.960 --> 0:18:06.320 clicks not Code approach becomes so important here because it 0:18:06.359 --> 0:18:10.480 empowers almost anyone in an organization to create human centric 0:18:10.760 --> 0:18:15.760 digital solutions. As Jacob and Phil continue their conversation, Field 0:18:15.760 --> 0:18:19.720 explains how he got involved in teaching Salesforce to begin with, 0:18:20.280 --> 0:18:25.240 and how he cultivates creativity in his professional life. So 0:18:25.280 --> 0:18:28.439 I want to talk some about creativity and want to 0:18:28.480 --> 0:18:32.679 start with with your writing. And you're teaching right. You 0:18:32.760 --> 0:18:37.760 have a blog about Salesforce features and the Salesforce platform. 0:18:38.440 --> 0:18:43.879 You've written books on Salesforce, CRM online courses. I'm curious 0:18:43.920 --> 0:18:46.960 how you sort of got into writing and teaching in 0:18:47.000 --> 0:18:51.360 the first place. Yeah, it's a great question. When I 0:18:51.400 --> 0:18:55.879 first started building solutions on the Salesforce platform, I was 0:18:56.000 --> 0:18:59.160 very excited about that, being able to do more than 0:18:59.200 --> 0:19:02.080 I ever had and able to before through the clicks 0:19:02.080 --> 0:19:07.720 not Code approach, and I started sharing what I was 0:19:07.840 --> 0:19:13.439 learning with other employees. Personally, I feel like it's a 0:19:13.440 --> 0:19:16.239 benefit to everyone, and it's a benefit to myself. So 0:19:16.280 --> 0:19:20.000 I started communicating to other employees, you know, a little 0:19:20.040 --> 0:19:23.320 tips and things like that, and one employee my company said, hey, 0:19:23.480 --> 0:19:27.080 have you ever thought about writing a blog? And I hadn't. 0:19:27.520 --> 0:19:30.639 I thought that could be kind of interesting. So now, 0:19:30.680 --> 0:19:35.080 about maybe eight to ten years ago, I started sharing 0:19:35.160 --> 0:19:38.120 some tips. You know, here's how to solve this business 0:19:38.119 --> 0:19:42.720 problem using Salesforce, that type of thing. And you know, 0:19:42.760 --> 0:19:46.120 it was surprising to me how quickly it was picked 0:19:46.200 --> 0:19:48.080 up and people would respond and say, hey, this this 0:19:48.160 --> 0:19:50.280 really helped me out a lot. And then one day 0:19:50.320 --> 0:19:54.960 I got a phone call from a publisher and they said, 0:19:55.320 --> 0:19:59.639 you know, we want to start publishing books that have 0:19:59.720 --> 0:20:02.840 to do a salesforce. Would you be the author of 0:20:02.920 --> 0:20:05.560 the first book we're going to publish on Salesforce? And 0:20:05.800 --> 0:20:08.960 he said you can call me if you think that, 0:20:09.160 --> 0:20:11.119 you know, I'm pranking you or something, Because I was, 0:20:11.560 --> 0:20:13.880 I was like, where, you know, it was pretty surprising. 0:20:13.960 --> 0:20:17.960 So my first thought was, you know, Salesforce has a 0:20:18.000 --> 0:20:22.160 lot of help documentation. What would the benefit of another 0:20:22.560 --> 0:20:25.160 book be, you know, So I kind of went through 0:20:25.160 --> 0:20:28.360 the is this really going to help anyone out? And 0:20:28.560 --> 0:20:32.760 it's been awesome. Um, I really put my heart into 0:20:32.800 --> 0:20:35.479 these books, and I try to communicate as clearly as 0:20:35.480 --> 0:20:38.000 I can. I use a lot of visuals, a lot 0:20:38.080 --> 0:20:42.080 of examples, so I walk people through, you know, with 0:20:42.280 --> 0:20:46.760 actual data, and it's just been amazing because so at 0:20:46.760 --> 0:20:51.480 this point, I've sold over seven thousand books, which to 0:20:51.600 --> 0:20:53.480 me that that seems like a lot. That there are 0:20:53.520 --> 0:20:55.199 a lot of people out there that using it. And 0:20:55.240 --> 0:20:59.320 I've received a lot of feedback from people who have said, 0:20:59.400 --> 0:21:02.480 you know, this really help to get me back on track, 0:21:02.560 --> 0:21:05.480 or this help me learn this concept and really made 0:21:05.480 --> 0:21:08.280 a difference in my day to day job. And that 0:21:08.440 --> 0:21:12.120 just you know, kind of fuels fuels the creativity more. Right, 0:21:12.520 --> 0:21:14.480 It's just an exciting thing to see. It's the best 0:21:14.520 --> 0:21:18.160 part of writing is getting that feedback. So I'm curious 0:21:18.560 --> 0:21:22.400 to you, you know, what does creativity look like? How 0:21:22.400 --> 0:21:24.480 do you how do you think of yourself as a 0:21:24.560 --> 0:21:30.920 creative technologist slash business person. So I would say that 0:21:31.960 --> 0:21:36.320 creativity and business is definitely related to just being creative 0:21:36.320 --> 0:21:40.960 in general. And I think that for those who are creative, 0:21:41.280 --> 0:21:43.920 you know, in the business world, they are probably creative 0:21:44.040 --> 0:21:47.760 just across the board in their personal life, right, I 0:21:47.760 --> 0:21:51.360 think it's about being open, it's about being inquisitive, and 0:21:51.400 --> 0:21:55.800 it's being resourceful, at least for me. Also, one thing 0:21:55.840 --> 0:21:59.439 that is unique about this ecosystem is there are a 0:21:59.440 --> 0:22:02.680 lot of nation shares and there are a lot of collaborators, 0:22:02.720 --> 0:22:07.000 and so just being willing to talk to others and 0:22:07.040 --> 0:22:10.040 work with others absolutely is a piece of that too, 0:22:10.560 --> 0:22:13.080 because I learned a lot from other people. I mean, 0:22:13.080 --> 0:22:15.720 I learned a lot of new ideas seeing what others 0:22:15.720 --> 0:22:18.080 have done, and so we kind of build on each 0:22:18.119 --> 0:22:22.280 other's shoulders. One thing that I'll mention is I think 0:22:22.800 --> 0:22:27.000 sometimes being creative actually is just being able to ask 0:22:27.040 --> 0:22:30.560 the right questions. Right. If we go in maybe slightly 0:22:30.680 --> 0:22:34.440 arrogantly thinking, you know, this is all just I'm coming 0:22:34.480 --> 0:22:36.680 up with all of this in my own mind, we're 0:22:36.680 --> 0:22:39.320 missing out a lot. So I, you know, I try 0:22:39.359 --> 0:22:43.960 to be open to others thoughts and work with them 0:22:44.000 --> 0:22:48.960 on things. And so just being able to solicit what's 0:22:49.000 --> 0:22:51.800 in other people's minds and then have conversations about it, 0:22:51.840 --> 0:22:54.240 I think is one way that you know, I come 0:22:54.320 --> 0:22:57.520 up with new ideas too, is asking people the right 0:22:57.600 --> 0:23:00.760 questions and then like I said, listening as well, I'm 0:23:00.800 --> 0:23:06.440 curious about what what you have learned from these collaborations. Clearly, 0:23:06.840 --> 0:23:09.200 you know you're bringing things to the clients all the time. 0:23:09.920 --> 0:23:13.960 Are there examples of you know, skills or insights that 0:23:14.000 --> 0:23:21.719 you've recently paid thanks to these partnerships. Yes, definitely. So. 0:23:21.800 --> 0:23:26.119 I recently was at dream Force, which came back in 0:23:26.280 --> 0:23:30.040 almost full effect after a few years of being on 0:23:30.119 --> 0:23:34.000 pause because of the pandemic. Enforce is the big salesforce 0:23:34.880 --> 0:23:40.120 gathering you got it? Yeah, it used to be north 0:23:40.240 --> 0:23:43.840 of a hundred and fifty thousand people in San Francisco 0:23:44.000 --> 0:23:46.560 for a week. Um. They toned it down a bit, 0:23:46.600 --> 0:23:50.000 only only thirty five thousand. Um, you know a few 0:23:50.040 --> 0:23:54.280 weeks ago. How big the salesforce universe is, right, people 0:23:54.280 --> 0:23:58.919 who are not in kind of enterprise software business applications universe. 0:23:59.000 --> 0:24:01.960 It's like this giant force behind everything we touch. We 0:24:02.040 --> 0:24:05.880 just don't know it, you know exactly. Yes, it is 0:24:06.119 --> 0:24:10.000 actually very very large. So um, it was a great 0:24:10.040 --> 0:24:14.600 opportunity for me. I was selected to speak UM in 0:24:14.640 --> 0:24:18.000 a few sessions so on stage at Dreamforce in front 0:24:18.000 --> 0:24:21.000 of different audiences, which is very cool. And I was 0:24:21.080 --> 0:24:24.400 asked to be a part of one particular session that 0:24:24.560 --> 0:24:28.720 had to do with Salesforce and Slack. UM and so 0:24:29.160 --> 0:24:31.920 a colleague of mine, Jared Kingston, who I would also 0:24:31.960 --> 0:24:35.560 call a definitely a you know, a creative mind and 0:24:35.600 --> 0:24:40.760 a great collaborator. He and I worked with Salesforce and 0:24:40.880 --> 0:24:45.960 Slack to deliver a session around It was called build 0:24:46.000 --> 0:24:49.920 the Way You Want with Slack and the Salesforce platform. 0:24:49.960 --> 0:24:53.040 The whole idea was to show the different ways that 0:24:53.160 --> 0:24:55.840 Slack could be used, whether it's you know, with clicks, 0:24:55.880 --> 0:25:01.600 with code to deliver solutions and so speaking about collaboration 0:25:01.640 --> 0:25:05.520 and me learning new things, this was a great example 0:25:05.520 --> 0:25:09.240 of that because we took different roles on this presentation 0:25:09.480 --> 0:25:14.000 and I learned a lot from my colleague Jared because 0:25:14.040 --> 0:25:18.760 he and UM, a seasoned member of his team, built 0:25:18.840 --> 0:25:23.040 out some actual solutions. So we're very keen on live 0:25:23.080 --> 0:25:26.160 demos in our sessions, so we we do. I've done 0:25:26.160 --> 0:25:28.400 a lot of presentations over the past few years, and 0:25:28.880 --> 0:25:34.879 UM I very much MS supporter of live demonstrations on 0:25:34.920 --> 0:25:37.159 the Salesforce platform. That's one of the great things that 0:25:37.200 --> 0:25:39.400 we can do it that is, instead of just going 0:25:39.440 --> 0:25:42.840 through slides and trying to convince people of the great 0:25:42.880 --> 0:25:44.800 things that can be done. Why don't we show them 0:25:44.920 --> 0:25:48.240 live you actually do the thing. You actually do the 0:25:48.240 --> 0:25:51.000 thing right there on stage that you're talking about exactly, 0:25:51.000 --> 0:25:54.800 and it really resonates. People love to see you doing 0:25:54.880 --> 0:25:57.360 a B and C and then they see the end results. 0:25:57.359 --> 0:26:02.800 So um, he and his colleague built out this solution 0:26:03.080 --> 0:26:07.320 with slack it, you know, showing how you can automatically 0:26:07.359 --> 0:26:11.000 post a Slack, automatically create a spin up, a channel 0:26:11.040 --> 0:26:14.639 for collaboration, all of this. That was part of that 0:26:14.680 --> 0:26:18.359 session and it was great because I learned quite a 0:26:18.359 --> 0:26:21.080