Speaker 1: Welcome to Haunted Road, a production of I Heart Radio
Speaker 1: and Grimm and Mild from Aaron Minky listener discretion is advised.
Speaker 1: Back in I was investigating a legendary aircraft carrier, the
Speaker 1: U s S. York Town, with the show Ghost Hunters.
Speaker 1: This was not the first ship I had investigated, and
Speaker 1: would very much not be my last. But I had
Speaker 1: an encounter on board that vessel that is indicative of
Speaker 1: just how wildly haunted these ships can be. During our
Speaker 1: investigation of the York Town, Adam Bury and I were
Speaker 1: standing on the flight deck of the carrier when off
Speaker 1: in the distance, we saw a man walking very purposefully
Speaker 1: across the deck. He wasn't coming toward us, rather, he
Speaker 1: was walking toward the other end of the ship. We
Speaker 1: were told we were alone on board save for one
Speaker 1: security guard who would be in his office should we
Speaker 1: need him. We also had a radio directly to this man,
Speaker 1: so we meet at ly walked him to see if
Speaker 1: he had left his post. He had not, so who
Speaker 1: were we looking at? Had someone managed to make it
Speaker 1: on board? We called out to this man as he walked.
Speaker 1: He did not stop. He did not hesitate or slow down.
Speaker 1: Most people when they catch sight of a camera crew,
Speaker 1: they have a response like a deer in the headlights,
Speaker 1: they freeze. Even so, most people who hear other people
Speaker 1: yelling for their attention at the very least slow down
Speaker 1: or look their way. This man didn't done of those things.
Speaker 1: He just kept walking like he knew what he was
Speaker 1: doing and where he was going, until he disappeared behind
Speaker 1: the edge of the Aircraft Carriers Island, which is the
Speaker 1: command center for flight deck operations. Adam and I, puzzled,
Speaker 1: had begun running towards this man. Our camera operator and
Speaker 1: sound guy in tow just seconds after the man rounded
Speaker 1: that corner. We were there as well. We were upset
Speaker 1: someone had contaminated our investigation. We take what we do
Speaker 1: very seriously, and we were very determined to know who
Speaker 1: this was and how they got on board. Except when
Speaker 1: we went around that corner we found an empty space.
Speaker 1: There was one door, but it was padlocks shut with
Speaker 1: a lock that looked like it hadn't been touched in years,
Speaker 1: judging by the amount of rust on it. The only
Speaker 1: place that man could have gone was overboard, and we
Speaker 1: most definitely would have heard a splash. I was not surprised,
Speaker 1: as someone who has investigated over a dozen ships, some
Speaker 1: multiple times. I found them well stocked with ghosts and spirits,
Speaker 1: many still doing the jobs they so faithfully and dutifully
Speaker 1: performed in life. So join me as we take a
Speaker 1: trip to another of these haunted ships. She's lovingly called
Speaker 1: the Sea Witch. I'm Amy Brunei, and welcome to Haunted Road.
Speaker 1: The U S. S. Salem actually had post war beginnings
Speaker 1: plans for heavy cruisers to take on global navies pre
Speaker 1: day World War Two, of course, but when the war
Speaker 1: came to a close in early September nineteen forty five,
Speaker 1: America's latest and greatest answer to naval warfare was in
Speaker 1: its infancy. The United States military needed a fleet, and
Speaker 1: one that hadn't seen the dogs of war and been
Speaker 1: chewed to pieces in the process. The US was solidifying
Speaker 1: its position in the Pacific and trying to outpace the
Speaker 1: Russians in naval supremacy. Construction on the us AS Salem
Speaker 1: started on July four, ninety five, in Quincy, Massachusetts. The
Speaker 1: Salem launched on March twenty five, nineteen forty seven. There
Speaker 1: were two iterations of the Salem before this heavy cruiser.
Speaker 1: The first Salem was named for the city in Massachusetts.
Speaker 1: The second Salem was named in honor of the first ship,
Speaker 1: and the third Salem was again named for the city
Speaker 1: in Massachusetts. She was the last of her kind and
Speaker 1: today is the only remaining heavy cruiser in the world,
Speaker 1: which really puts into perspective how special she is and
Speaker 1: how lucky New England is to have her. Now some
Speaker 1: logistical history of the Salem, because she has seen some
Speaker 1: things in her time. The Salem was commissioned at the
Speaker 1: Boston Navy Yard on May fourteenth, nineteen forty nine. The
Speaker 1: ship stopped in her namesake town on July four ninety nine,
Speaker 1: before undergoing three months of rigorous testing at Guantanamo Bay.
Speaker 1: After that, she again returned to Boston to undergo repairs.
Speaker 1: Her crew nicknamed her the Sea Witch, a name that
Speaker 1: has very much remained after spending three months aboard her
Speaker 1: docked at Salem. In May of nineteen fifty, Salem became
Speaker 1: the first flagship for the U. S sixth Fleet, headquartered
Speaker 1: in Naples, Italy. During this the first of seven deployments
Speaker 1: to the Mediterranean as fleet flagship, Salem punctuated her training
Speaker 1: at sea with ports and Malta, Italy, France Greece, Turkey, Lebanon,
Speaker 1: and Algeria. Salem also reported to Guantanamo every year to
Speaker 1: complete training. She also participated in other trainings performed with
Speaker 1: other countries, though she very notably never fired her mighty
Speaker 1: guns and anger. The Salem's very presence served as a
Speaker 1: stimulus for peace during the troubled times that became known
Speaker 1: as the Cold War. According to history books, she served
Speaker 1: as a lady of diplomacy rather than as a means
Speaker 1: of exerting brute force. She resumed her flagship duties in
Speaker 1: nineteen fifty six during the Suez Crisis. That battle over
Speaker 1: the Suez Canal was also an attempt to remove Egypt's
Speaker 1: president Gamal abdel Nasser from power. Israel first invaded Egypt,
Speaker 1: followed by the UK and France. They eventually extricated themselves,
Speaker 1: though after the US Soviet Union and the U N
Speaker 1: applied political pressure. This event concluded the end of Britain's
Speaker 1: superpower status. But what about In pop culture? In nineteen
Speaker 1: fifty six, the Salem was cast as the German pocket
Speaker 1: battleship Admiral Graf Spy in the Battle of the River Plate.
Speaker 1: There were significant differences between the graf Spy and the Salem,
Speaker 1: not the least of which was that one was a
Speaker 1: German ship during World War Two. The differences were explained
Speaker 1: by the historical fact that the ship's carpenters often camouflaged
Speaker 1: graph spe to resemble foreign vessels. Salem had another cinematic
Speaker 1: moment when she made a cameo in the action packed
Speaker 1: thriller from Disney called The Finest Hour, starring Casey Affleck
Speaker 1: and Chris pine In. In nineteen fifty eight, Salem made
Speaker 1: the trek to Monaco for the celebration of the birth
Speaker 1: of Princess Grace Kelly's and Prince Rainier the third son,
Speaker 1: Albert the second. All very interesting, but why is she
Speaker 1: so haunted? And what kind of activity do people experience
Speaker 1: on board? While the Salem never fired a shot in anger,
Speaker 1: she saw her fair share of death. Most famously, she
Speaker 1: was one of the first ships to arrive to provide
Speaker 1: aid during the Great Cafalonia earthquake in Greece in August
Speaker 1: of nineteen fifty three. To put into perspective what happened
Speaker 1: on the islands, let me describe the conditions the Salem
Speaker 1: arrived too. Now, the nineteen fifty three Ionian Earthquake, also
Speaker 1: known as the Great Cafalonia Earthquake, struck the southern Ionian
Speaker 1: Islands on August twelfth, nineteen fifty three. In mid August,
Speaker 1: there were over one hundred thirteen recorded earthquakes in the
Speaker 1: region between Cafalonia and Zecinthos, and the most destructive was
Speaker 1: at August twelfth earthquake. The event measured six point eight
Speaker 1: on the moment magnitude scale, and it raised the whole
Speaker 1: island of Cavalonia by twenty four inches and caused widespread
Speaker 1: damage throughout the islands of Cafalonia and Zecanthos. When disaster
Speaker 1: struck on that Wednesday, August twelve, a m Argostolian was
Speaker 1: a town of about eighty five hundred people, swollen by
Speaker 1: vacationers from the Greek mainland. It was the biggest community
Speaker 1: in the three Ionian Sea islands and it took the
Speaker 1: brunt of the quake. After the large quake, nothing was
Speaker 1: left of the city but piles of bricks and splintered wood,
Speaker 1: a few cracked shells of houses, and shocked survivors crowding
Speaker 1: the Argostolian Bay sides. British medical officers with the destroyer
Speaker 1: Darling were the first to arrive with outside aid. They
Speaker 1: set up first aid stations on the beach and treated survivors.
Speaker 1: The Salem arrived Thursday morning, the first unit of the
Speaker 1: sixth Fleet to reach the scene. The Greek government sent
Speaker 1: to amphibious vessels and a contingent of soldiers. According to
Speaker 1: newspaper articles of the time, the doctors and orderlies of
Speaker 1: these ships treated perhaps a thousand casualties, but they never
Speaker 1: could confirm. Many said there were just too many to count.
Speaker 1: The most seriously hurt were evacuated. The rest remained on
Speaker 1: the beaches bandaged, and Dull was shocked, asking only to
Speaker 1: leave sailors aboard. The Salem reported finding the local hospital
Speaker 1: leveled and a local insane asylum destroyed as well. Desperate
Speaker 1: nurses had changed patients of the asylum to trees. One
Speaker 1: medic from the Salem called it real snake pit stuff.
Speaker 1: They have got one nurse and one old attendant watching
Speaker 1: fifty inmates. There was a jail too, with about two
Speaker 1: fifty prisoners. When the jail collapsed, the prisoners ran loose.
Speaker 1: Greek soldiers and police rounded them up and put them
Speaker 1: in an improvised stockade surrounded by barbed wire. Leading the
Speaker 1: American rescue work was Lieutenant RB. Jacobs of the Salem,
Speaker 1: the ship's control officer from Revere, Massachusetts. He sent search
Speaker 1: teams into the hills and digging through town looking for
Speaker 1: trapped people. They found scores of living victims trapped beneath debris,
Speaker 1: some had been there for two days. They also found
Speaker 1: people hiding and afraid to return to Argostolian. Local legends
Speaker 1: said one day Argostolian would fall into the sea, and
Speaker 1: as far as they were concerned, it was happening. There
Speaker 1: are many rumors as to how many people were treated
Speaker 1: on the actual ship itself. Most articles of the time
Speaker 1: point to make shift hospitals and operating rooms being assembled
Speaker 1: on the shore, but it also stands to reason that
Speaker 1: some of the more seriously injured would have been brought
Speaker 1: aboard for treatment than perhaps evacuated to other local hospitals.
Speaker 1: Many rumors point to the ship having been used as
Speaker 1: a morgue for the between four hundred forty and eight
Speaker 1: hundred people killed, but this also remains unsubstantiated and, considering
Speaker 1: the heavy presence of other rescue ships in the area,
Speaker 1: highly unlikely. Regardless The tragedy of the Greek earthquakes and
Speaker 1: subsequent rescue mission surely left an indelible scar on the
Speaker 1: Salem and her crew. Today, there are reports of Greek
Speaker 1: speaking ghosts aboard the Salem, including the apparition of an
Speaker 1: angry Grecian girl encountered in the mess hall. Folks claim
Speaker 1: she only speaks Greek and half her face is missing.
Speaker 1: There was also a ghost rumor to have been a
Speaker 1: civilian volunteer during the earthquake who died by suicide after
Speaker 1: coming upon the corpse of his mutilated wife, a good story,
Speaker 1: but again completely unproven. The rescue mission in Greece was
Speaker 1: not the only source of potential hauntings on board. There
Speaker 1: was at least one incident where sailors from another ship
Speaker 1: were brought aboard after an explosion. The Salem's medical facilities
Speaker 1: were better suited to treating them, but three perished. People
Speaker 1: have reported hearing footsteps when no one is around. Others
Speaker 1: have heard disembodied voices and loud bangs. Chairs have also
Speaker 1: reportedly been thrown. The printer at the museum, Peter Bloomberg,
Speaker 1: reported a mysterious figure appearing before him in one of
Speaker 1: the ship's hallways. The figure stared at him, then descended
Speaker 1: the staircase. Peter was alone on the ship at the time.
Speaker 1: Salem's head archivist, John Connor, heard his name called when
Speaker 1: he was in a sleeping quarter. He also has heard
Speaker 1: mysterious footsteps that he can't find the source for. He
Speaker 1: says these happenings don't bother him, but that you get
Speaker 1: the feelings someone is watching you, and you get chills
Speaker 1: up your spine. There's the spirit of a man they
Speaker 1: called John, who is apparently the spirit of a former
Speaker 1: tour guide. Reportedly, people see him and talk to him,
Speaker 1: especially in the area of the anchor windless room. There
Speaker 1: the anger would be reeled in and out. There are
Speaker 1: also rumors of babies crying, which doesn't seem to mesh Historically,
Speaker 1: some investigators have said babies were born on the Salem
Speaker 1: because in the hospital area there is a table with stirrups,
Speaker 1: But as any woman will tell you, those stirrups aren't
Speaker 1: always used just for childbirth. While women never served on
Speaker 1: the Salem, it does stand to reason perhaps this table
Speaker 1: and its stirrups were there for rescue efforts, though as
Speaker 1: of now there is no documentation to verify any babies
Speaker 1: were born on the ship. The U S S. Salem
Speaker 1: was decommissioned in January of nineteen fifty nine. In there
Speaker 1: was talk of reactivating her service as she was still
Speaker 1: very capable, but the funding from Congress was not guaranteed,
Speaker 1: so she was not resurrected. In October, the Salem came
Speaker 1: full circle and made her way to her birthplace, Quincy, Massachusetts.
Speaker 1: She's been a museum ship ever since. Up next, we
Speaker 1: will talk to paranormal investigator and ship volunteer Don D. Christopharo.
Speaker 1: He's a no nonsense veteran and historian with some great
Speaker 1: ghost stories from the Salem. He's also a man who
Speaker 1: I think the ship has a soft spot in her
Speaker 1: heart for. Also, you'll hear about my experience on the Salem,
Speaker 1: one that I've never experienced before and have never encountered since.
Speaker 1: I am sitting here now with Don D. Christopharo, who
Speaker 1: is a paranormal investigator who's very involved in the USS Salem.
Speaker 1: We have worked with him in the past. If you
Speaker 1: saw our episode of Kindred Spirits that we did um
Speaker 1: the Ship, Don was our client there and it's very
Speaker 1: all around solid dude who knows a lot about the
Speaker 1: history of the ship and I think has a very
Speaker 1: special relationship with the Salem. So thanks for joining us down.
Speaker 1: Thanks for asking me, Amy, I appreciate it, of course. Now,
Speaker 1: we filmed on the Salem during the pandemic. That was
Speaker 1: one of our first cases that we kind of ventured out,
Speaker 1: and I know you are close to tours at the time.
Speaker 1: How have things changed at the Salem since then? Well,
Speaker 1: I mean we've gotten much more back to normal in
Speaker 1: terms of how we managed the tours. You know, we
Speaker 1: tried last year to do it as normally I guess
Speaker 1: is the only word I can use, as possible, you know,
Speaker 1: but we split into smaller groups and kind of spread
Speaker 1: people out a little bit more, which, as you know,
Speaker 1: on the ship isn't really an easy thing to do.
Speaker 1: But this season, you know, we we have bigger groups now,
Speaker 1: and of course we're not wearing masks at least for
Speaker 1: the time being, right, so things are much more the
Speaker 1: way they used to be at the moment. I'm fortunate
Speaker 1: and that I've actually been to the Salem quite a
Speaker 1: few times times, and you know, I just I love
Speaker 1: how involved everyone is with the ship and just kind
Speaker 1: of keeping her in this state of availability to people
Speaker 1: to come and check out. I know there's a lot
Speaker 1: of paranormal investigations on board, but what else happens on
Speaker 1: the Salem. The ship is open all weekend Friday, Saturday,
Speaker 1: and Sunday during the summer, open to the public. And
Speaker 1: it's not just the Salem. It'st the United States Naval
Speaker 1: Shipbuilding Museum UM, the museum spaces below decks. Most of
Speaker 1: the areas that were cruise berthing when the ship was
Speaker 1: active have been converted into museum spaces. And Quincy has
Speaker 1: a very, very long and rich shipbuilding tradition, and the
Speaker 1: Salem is the great celebration of that. So she's open
Speaker 1: quite a bit, and there there are other events that
Speaker 1: take place, community type events on the ship as well.
Speaker 1: You know, the volunteers, as you said, are are all
Speaker 1: very very invested and working as hard as they can
Speaker 1: to keep the ship up, and we worked very hard
Speaker 1: to make show the ship is not going to go
Speaker 1: anywhere to be frank, yeah, thankfully. Now do you think
Speaker 1: that any of the hauntings on board have anything to
Speaker 1: do with the various artifacts that you have brought in
Speaker 1: for the museums, Well, it's kind of interesting that you
Speaker 1: should say that, because just recently we've started to hear
Speaker 1: some music that's much older than the ship itself, and
Speaker 1: we're looking at some of the artifacts in the museum
Speaker 1: that are related to the shipyard rather than the ship,
Speaker 1: and trying to determine whether or not some of this
Speaker 1: stuff has something to do with those objects instead of
Speaker 1: the ship itself. Yeah, I mean, that's really interesting. It
Speaker 1: wouldn't surprise me because I remember just going through the collections,
Speaker 1: they're just amazed at everything you guys have curated. A
Speaker 1: lot of those artifacts have seen some, you know, really
Speaker 1: interesting times in history. So who knows what you could
Speaker 1: have brought on board in addition to the spirits you
Speaker 1: already have lately. Oh, absolutely, no, you're absolutely right. I guess.
Speaker 1: I guess crazy active is is the best question I
Speaker 1: can use, you know. I mean, we have our quiet
Speaker 1: nights like everybody else does, but they are a few
Speaker 1: and far between, and to the point where we're kind
Speaker 1: of spoiled when we go other places because of the
Speaker 1: volume of activity on the ship. The shadow activity is
Speaker 1: picking up, the noise activity is ridiculous. At this point,
Speaker 1: the e vps are becoming much more clearer, and I think,
Speaker 1: as you know, they have context a lot of them,
Speaker 1: which is which is really awesome. Yeah, and I love that.
Speaker 1: That's kind of my favorite kind of haunting, you know.
Speaker 1: And to this day, the Salem is where I had
Speaker 1: one of my strangest paranoral experiences. And I when I
Speaker 1: try to explain it to people, I guess it doesn't
Speaker 1: seem that intense, but for me it really was because
Speaker 1: basically I was standing in the mess hall area and
Speaker 1: I was looking kind of towards that little it's it's
Speaker 1: next to the kitchen area that it's like it's kind
Speaker 1: of a storage area I think for pots and pans
Speaker 1: or what have you, and the two scullery the two
Speaker 1: scullery areas. Yeah, and I'm staring at that, and I
Speaker 1: see these kind of twinkling lights up in the corner,
Speaker 1: and my brain is processing it as there's some sort
Speaker 1: of window there and there is some sort of like
Speaker 1: ship going by with a mast or like some sort
Speaker 1: of lights going by, and I kind of just filed
Speaker 1: it away as you know, something outside that I'm seeing
Speaker 1: through a window. And then it dawned on me there's
Speaker 1: no window there, and I'm just looking at these little
Speaker 1: twinkling lights, and I'm thinking, what am I looking at
Speaker 1: right now? And it went on for like a solid
Speaker 1: twenty seconds, I feel like, and then they just kind
Speaker 1: of stopped, and I just remember, like almost I thought
Speaker 1: something medically, what was wrong with me? I was like, like,
Speaker 1: what's happening? Am I having like a stroke or like?
Speaker 1: And I started kind of having a little panic attack
Speaker 1: and I was like no, no, And literally later it
Speaker 1: was either later on that day or the next night,
Speaker 1: you just happened to run into us in the library
Speaker 1: and you were Oh, by the way, I forgot to mention,
Speaker 1: sometimes people see these little twinkling fairy lights in this area,
Speaker 1: which is exactly what I saw. Yeah, I remember that. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I was very thankful. And I don't think we've really
Speaker 1: addressed that part of it on the show, because I
Speaker 1: think we just saw you in passing. I don't know
Speaker 1: that they were cameras rolling, but I remember just thinking,
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, Okay, it wasn't in my head. I
Speaker 1: don't need to go see a medical doctor, but yeah,
Speaker 1: that was. I mean, I don't know what causes that.
Speaker 1: What what do you think? I know other people have
Speaker 1: seen that. What do you think causes something like that. Well,
Speaker 1: it's kind of interesting. We were at the point now
Speaker 1: where we've determined that there are a lot of spirits
Speaker 1: on the ship we weren't aware of previously that maybe
Speaker 1: aren't from the ship itself, that are from the shipyard
Speaker 1: and things like that, And I've kind of come to
Speaker 1: the conclusion that there are many of them that aren't
Speaker 1: quite strong enough to really manifest in a solid way,
Speaker 1: that is to say, in an audio way or visually.
Speaker 1: And I've come to believe that the lights are their manifestation,
Speaker 1: something that's not quite strong enough to do something that's
Speaker 1: going to jump out at us, but that are making
Speaker 1: themselves known in a little bit less obvious way. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean that makes perfect sense to me. I mean
Speaker 1: I still to Like I said, it just still stands
Speaker 1: as one of my strangest experiences because so many paranormal
Speaker 1: experiences are kind of fleeting or quick, but this I
Speaker 1: just stared at for so long without even realizing what
Speaker 1: I was looking at. I wondered too, just because how
Speaker 1: often do you all host paranormal investigations on board? Would
Speaker 1: you say? Pretty much every weekend? Now, this past weekend
Speaker 1: was both Friday and Saturday night. Ah, and I think
Speaker 1: that other spirits might be coming in. You know, we've
Speaker 1: seen that before with these locations where you're hosting investigations
Speaker 1: on a regular basis and you have a bunch of
Speaker 1: people sitting in the dark just intensely thinking that they
Speaker 1: would like to see a ghost or make contact and
Speaker 1: anything he wants to talk, or anyone who wants to
Speaker 1: talk and come forward. And it makes you wonder, you
Speaker 1: know how many of these kind of wayward spirits sense
Speaker 1: that and that kind of attracts them to a place
Speaker 1: like that. Oh, that's definitely a possibility, you know. I
Speaker 1: mean people bring things with them as well, and we
Speaker 1: think that's part of it. We've had psychics come aboard,
Speaker 1: sensitives who as soon as they walk into the main wardroom,
Speaker 1: which is where we kind of gather as groups, who
Speaker 1: say that they're just coming at them from all directions
Speaker 1: as soon as they come aboard. So you know, as
Speaker 1: I said, they're not all pronounced, they don't all make
Speaker 1: themselves known to us on a regular basis. But there's
Speaker 1: no doubt in our minds now that we can't even
Speaker 1: estimate the number of entities there are aboard the ship. Okay,
Speaker 1: so I know that obviously they say famously that Salem
Speaker 1: never fired a shot in anger, right, So we never
Speaker 1: really saw any action per se, but definitely saw its
Speaker 1: share of tragedy, like there was the earthquake rescue mission,
Speaker 1: and I'm sure a number of deaths on board for
Speaker 1: other reasons. Who do you think is haunting the ship?
Speaker 1: Maybe that actually did spend time him on the ship.
Speaker 1: What have you seen evidence wise of that? Well, the
Speaker 1: most pronounced spirits, at least the ones that we've made
Speaker 1: contact with, seemed to be from an accident that took
Speaker 1: place about three years after the earthquake, when the Salem
Speaker 1: had left Boston and was on the way back to
Speaker 1: Greece or the Mediterranean, and she was sailing with the
Speaker 1: destroyer named John R. Pierce, and the Pierce was doing
Speaker 1: some kind of anti aircraft practice shooting at a toad target.
Speaker 1: For some reason, they stopped the practice so stop the drill,
Speaker 1: and then when they restarted again, what I'm told is
Speaker 1: that they reloaded a gun that had already been loaded.
Speaker 1: So when they fired at the gun, mount exploded and
Speaker 1: one guy was killed immediately, but several other guys were
Speaker 1: brought from the Pierce by helicopter over to the Salem
Speaker 1: because she's much bigger and had much better facilities, and
Speaker 1: several of those guys died aboard Salem. So I think
Speaker 1: that in terms of people that spent a significant amount
Speaker 1: of time on the ship, those are the guys that
Speaker 1: are most pronounced at this point, I see, And what
Speaker 1: kind of activity do you get stemming from them? Are
Speaker 1: you ever getting any names or anything like that. We're
Speaker 1: starting to get some names, you know, and that's one
Speaker 1: of the difficult things because of so many of the
Speaker 1: tools we use are prone to yes or no and
Speaker 1: things of that nature. It's kind of hard to get
Speaker 1: them to express themselves in other ways. But we have
Speaker 1: a list of names that we try. One of the
Speaker 1: problems we have is that the Cruelest, you know, the
Speaker 1: Salem once she was active, had about sixteen d guys aboard,
Speaker 1: and over a ten year period, you're talking guys that
Speaker 1: spent multiple years, so you're talking ten thousand guys anyway,
Speaker 1: and our solid crue list is about six names. We
Speaker 1: try as hard as we can. We ask a lot
Speaker 1: of names. We have sensitives that come up with names,
Speaker 1: and we use those names as much as we can,
Speaker 1: but there are very few guys that we actually have
Speaker 1: names for. Yeah, that's hard. I mean we ran into
Speaker 1: that as well, just when we were investigating. You know,
Speaker 1: I'm always very heavy on the history. I love and
Speaker 1: really want to identify some of these spirits, especially the
Speaker 1: ones who just come off as more aggressive or insistent.
Speaker 1: You know, I always am concerned that there's some reason
Speaker 1: why they're trying to kind of break through so much.
Speaker 1: And I remember going through some of the manifests and
Speaker 1: just having a lot of trouble because you don't know, like,
Speaker 1: are you dealing with someone who actually passed away here
Speaker 1: or are you dealing with someone who just felt like
Speaker 1: a really strong emotional attachment and is choosing to revisit
Speaker 1: for some reason. And so it's just so hard to
Speaker 1: narrow it down. And like you said, lots of tools
Speaker 1: that use yes or no answers, which isn't doesn't help
Speaker 1: a lot. And of course it's easier now than it was,
Speaker 1: you know, years ago, with newspaper databases and things of
Speaker 1: that nature. You struggle to find the name John our Pierce,
Speaker 1: for example, associated with us as Salem, and then you
Speaker 1: kind of work backwards from there, and we were able
Speaker 1: to find some names by getting too obituaries of guys
Speaker 1: that were killed aboard the ship or that that were
Speaker 1: injured aboard the Pierce and died aboard the Salem. So
Speaker 1: that that's how you do it. It's painstaking and takes
Speaker 1: a lot of work, but that's just such a huge
Speaker 1: pat of what we do, especially at a location like
Speaker 1: the Salem. You know, the history is just so important
Speaker 1: in terms of the paranormal and not the paranormal. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so we worked very very hard at it, and we
Speaker 1: and we're trying. But it's not easy. No, it's not.
Speaker 1: Have you been able to dispel any popular rumors about
Speaker 1: the history of the ship or is there anything that
Speaker 1: you think people have talked about that's just completely untrue
Speaker 1: at this point? Well, I'm not going to say that
Speaker 1: we've found our completely untrue, but there are some rumors
Speaker 1: about the ship that don't make a whole lot of
Speaker 1: sense when you really think about it. You know, I
Speaker 1: think when you guys were there, we talked a little
Speaker 1: bit about the so called morgue, and you know they
Speaker 1: talk about body stacked on bodies in the ships makeshift more.
Speaker 1: But you know, when you think about it, the only
Speaker 1: time there were that many deaths at one time aboard
Speaker 1: the ship was during the Greek earthquake. And when you
Speaker 1: think about it, you wonder, why would they if the
Speaker 1: ship is in Greece and the people are Greek, why
Speaker 1: would they have all those bodies on the ship. They
Speaker 1: would take them off the ship, they would take them home.
Speaker 1: That's something that a lot of people like to talk about,
Speaker 1: you know. And that room in particular is something that
Speaker 1: a lot of people like to talk about. It's called
Speaker 1: the butter room, and you'll hear people say, you know,
Speaker 1: it's kind of wild because nobody really knows why they
Speaker 1: call it the butter room, And personally, I think it
Speaker 1: probably has something to do with the metal plaque above
Speaker 1: the door that says butter room. You know, you got
Speaker 1: to use that research brain of yours, you know. You know,
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna say we've thoroughly dispelled things, but there
Speaker 1: are a lot of talk about the ship, which to
Speaker 1: some extent we like. I mean, those are the kinds
Speaker 1: of things that bring people to the ship. And if
Speaker 1: you burst their balloon a little bit when you get here,
Speaker 1: that's okay, because the ship usually makes up for it
Speaker 1: in in what it shows them over the course of
Speaker 1: the night. Oh absolutely. I mean I think that probably
Speaker 1: the actual history is even more fascinating than the history
Speaker 1: people might have heard through that kind of historical game
Speaker 1: of telephone that people love to play. But for some reason,
Speaker 1: makeshift morgues are a big deal. Like I've investigated so
Speaker 1: many places that have supposedly become a makeshift morgue for
Speaker 1: some sort of disaster, and I don't think I've ever
Speaker 1: been able to substantiate one of them. And I think
Speaker 1: I revisited it again when we were researching for this
Speaker 1: episode of the podcast, and I think we found it
Speaker 1: on one like ghost Tour Company's blog, but there's zero,
Speaker 1: you know, historical information that we could find to verify it.
Speaker 1: So who knows is And I don't think that's a coincidence. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: you know. I also I dug up a lot of
Speaker 1: information about other haunts that people have seen on board.
Speaker 1: They're including someone reporting a dog or they called it
Speaker 1: a hellhound or something in the mess hall. Have you
Speaker 1: heard of that one before? I can tell you that
Speaker 1: the first paranormal experience I had aboard the ship was
Speaker 1: hearing a dog wow, And someone else said they got
Speaker 1: an e v P of a pig too, which is
Speaker 1: just not what you would expect at all. Why do
Speaker 1: you think that would happen? I've heard that. I'm not
Speaker 1: entirely sure. It sounds like a pick to me, but
Speaker 1: maybe it's the dog. Anything's possible, you know. It's interesting though,
Speaker 1: when you think, while it's a naval ship, that situation
Speaker 1: in Greece in nineteen three must have been really really chaotic,
Speaker 1: and the possibilities abound when you think about what may
Speaker 1: or may not have come or have been brought aboard
Speaker 1: the ship. So while I personally think it's d unlikely
Speaker 1: that anyone has ever heard or recorded a pig, I'm
Speaker 1: not gonna say it's entirely impossible because, as I said,
Speaker 1: people in that kind of distress, who the heck knows
Speaker 1: what they felt like they wanted to bring with them
Speaker 1: aboard the ship or what they were concerned about. And
Speaker 1: I bet you in a lot of cases, the people
Speaker 1: taking care of them said, fine, if that's going to
Speaker 1: make these people feel a little bit better, that's it,
Speaker 1: okay with us. Yeah, Now, what would you say is
Speaker 1: like the most prevalent type of activity people encounter on board, well,
Speaker 1: at this point in time, I'm gonna say it's shadow activity.
Speaker 1: I think, you know, we're at the point now where
Speaker 1: a couple of weeks ago a group came aboard, and
Speaker 1: before we even started investigating, when I was giving them
Speaker 1: a tour of the ship with the lights on just
Speaker 1: to kind of show them where we were going to
Speaker 1: be going later on in the night and things of
Speaker 1: that nature, we had a shadow run across the hallway
Speaker 1: in front of us as we were making our way
Speaker 1: up the ship. So these are the kinds of things
Speaker 1: that are happening on a really gular basis. Now I'm
Speaker 1: going to say shadow activity right now. That's interesting. I mean,
Speaker 1: I've I've investigated a few ships in my time, and
Speaker 1: shadows seem to be very prevalent. And I don't know
Speaker 1: if it's because it's that kind of like residual activity
Speaker 1: of people kind of making their rounds or just still
Speaker 1: kind of tending to their duties or what, but it's
Speaker 1: just hard to think, you know, when we go into
Speaker 1: these places, it's our groups of you know, however many people,
Speaker 1: but then you think about how many people were actually
Speaker 1: on board at any one time and what that must
Speaker 1: have looked like and how they just knew their way
Speaker 1: around so well that they would bolt from place to place.
Speaker 1: So it kind of makes sense that you would see
Speaker 1: these shadows running up and down these ladder steps and
Speaker 1: down the hallways. It's so strange, absolutely, And that's one
Speaker 1: of the great things about the Salem is that it's
Speaker 1: such a mixed bag. There are sailors who died aboard
Speaker 1: the ship, as we all know, there are civilians people
Speaker 1: that were Greek that were killed during the earthquake who
Speaker 1: are still aboard. And then, as you well know, we
Speaker 1: have my friend back half, who I don't think died
Speaker 1: aboard the ship, but I think this is a guy
Speaker 1: who this is where he chose to come and vend eternity.
Speaker 1: So I think pretty much, you know, whatever you think,
Speaker 1: whatever you look at in terms of these entities, I
Speaker 1: think they're representative board the ship. Yeah, now, that gentleman.
Speaker 1: For people who aren't familiar, he's in kind of the
Speaker 1: mess hall area. And I know when we investigated he
Speaker 1: swore at us repeatedly in our recorders, but he seems
Speaker 1: to have kind of an affinity towards you. How are
Speaker 1: things going with that, Well, it's kind of interesting, you're right,
Speaker 1: he and I I think because we're kind of both
Speaker 1: grumpy old sailors. I think we kind of developed a
Speaker 1: relationship over the years. But it's kind of interesting. We
Speaker 1: have some new things happening on the ship. We have
Speaker 1: an entity that has kind of become dominant, and the
Speaker 1: chief this seems to be kind of laying low at
Speaker 1: the moment. We've had sensitives tell us that he is
Speaker 1: going to just kind of sit back and let us
Speaker 1: figure out what's going on and and then he'll come back.
Speaker 1: He's not bothered by the assentity, but he just doesn't
Speaker 1: want anything to do with it. So he seems to
Speaker 1: be kind of laying low at the moment. We don't
Speaker 1: hear from him very much. Well, I mean, he's not shy,
Speaker 1: so I feel like when he's ready, he'll probably very
Speaker 1: much make himself. No, No, he most certainly is not shy.
Speaker 1: That e VP that you recorded of him telling me
Speaker 1: exactly what he thought I should do was about as
Speaker 1: clear as a recording I've ever heard. I think, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure he dropped an F bomb if I
Speaker 1: remember correctly, generally didn't. Yeah, that was very very clear.
Speaker 1: So so you're welcome for that. That's what we bring
Speaker 1: out in the ghosts when we come around. So you
Speaker 1: said that you said you would had never been so
Speaker 1: happy to hear somebody tell you to fops as that
Speaker 1: too funny. Um. Now, is there any activity aboard that
Speaker 1: you would consider to be potentially dangerous? I don't think so.
Speaker 1: People certainly get touched regularly aboard, but never anything of
Speaker 1: any consequence. You know, women occasionally have somebody blow in
Speaker 1: the area. I will kind of let my you know,
Speaker 1: I'm working at home now, I don't have to go
Speaker 1: to the office, so I have nobody to impress, and
Speaker 1: I'll kind of let my hair go. And when I
Speaker 1: go back AFT. I think the chief lets hisself be
Speaker 1: known by pulling my hair occasionally, if by telling you
Speaker 1: need a haircut, telling me I need a haircut. But
Speaker 1: like I said, this new entity is an enigma to
Speaker 1: us and we're trying to figure him out. We don't
Speaker 1: think that he's entirely friendly. But I certainly wouldn't characterize
Speaker 1: anything aboard the ship is dangerous. Yeah, I mean, I
Speaker 1: think people wonder that. To me. The only thing I
Speaker 1: ever worry about in spaces like that is that it's
Speaker 1: not very easily traversed. You know, there's a lot of
Speaker 1: places you can trip, are a a lot of places you
Speaker 1: could fall, and so you know, I always warn people like,
Speaker 1: if you do get startled, you know, make sure you
Speaker 1: know where they always keep about your wits, know where
Speaker 1: you are, stay planted, because you know you could jump
Speaker 1: and accidentally fall down a set of stairs or something.
Speaker 1: I think that's the most dangerous. I think anything could be. Yeah, no,
Speaker 1: you're absolutely right, And that's kind of part of my
Speaker 1: spiel when I keep people before we get going. And
Speaker 1: you know, it's a big ship, so you can't expect
Speaker 1: a one time visitor to know their way around. But
Speaker 1: I do try to tell people to try to be
Speaker 1: as aware as possible of where they are in relation
Speaker 1: to hatches, in relation to ladders. You know, you certainly
Speaker 1: don't want somebody to turn and dart the wrong direction
Speaker 1: real quick, because if they don't know where they are
Speaker 1: or where they're going, there can be very nasty consequences there.
Speaker 1: There are a couple of places on the ship that
Speaker 1: when I give my tour, I'll stop in a certain
Speaker 1: place because it's concerning that you walk through a hatch
Speaker 1: and there's an open hatch, right on the floor next
Speaker 1: to you. So there are definitely areas like that that
Speaker 1: can be dangerous, and we do the best we can
Speaker 1: to warm people about that and wanted them to keep
Speaker 1: their wits about them when they walk around the ship. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, it's amaze. We're really fortunate. We were there,
Speaker 1: you know, for four days or so, and we have
Speaker 1: our small crew and us so just by ten of
Speaker 1: us total. And there were many times where I would
Speaker 1: go check on a camera or something, or go try
Speaker 1: to look for some information in one of the museum
Speaker 1: areas or something, and then just be completely turned around.
Speaker 1: And I think I remember correctly. There might be yellow
Speaker 1: stripes or some sort of stripe or something on the floor.
Speaker 1: I would cling to that thing. I would find that
Speaker 1: and know that I would be able to find my
Speaker 1: way back. But you know, if we didn't do a
Speaker 1: headcount at the end of the night, I very well
Speaker 1: could still be there on the Salem months later lost
Speaker 1: and that wouldn't be an entirely bad thing. No, I mean,
Speaker 1: my daughter would probably miss me, but it's fine. Yeah,
Speaker 1: there is a there's a broad yellow line that goes
Speaker 1: down the passageways on the main deck. When I give tours.
Speaker 1: I tell people just think back to when you were
Speaker 1: in prison and follow the yellow line, and as long
Speaker 1: as you don't screy, you should be okay. But you're right.
Speaker 1: The museum areas in particular, it's very very easy to
Speaker 1: get turned around because they're all connected. And that's the
Speaker 1: one part of the ship where you could go down
Speaker 1: a ladder and if you come up a different ladder,
Speaker 1: you could be on the other side of the ship.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, I'm pretty sure I did that a
Speaker 1: couple of times, but I made it so ultimately with
Speaker 1: the ghosts on board the Salem and just you know,
Speaker 1: what you do there and everything. What are your hopes
Speaker 1: for the Salem over time? You know, that's a good question,
Speaker 1: and it's something we kind of wrestle with a lot
Speaker 1: of the time. We have people come aboard who talked
Speaker 1: to us about helping people cross over, and you know,
Speaker 1: if you're in a position to help these entities, then
Speaker 1: certainly that's what you want to do. But we wrestle
Speaker 1: with it because it's what we do, so we do
Speaker 1: kind of go back and forth. But we have been
Speaker 1: able to help some people go over, and there are
Speaker 1: certainly enough entities aboard the ship that are looking for
Speaker 1: loved ones and things of that nature that ultimately we
Speaker 1: would love to help get to where they ultimately want
Speaker 1: to be. And that's really all you can you know.
Speaker 1: I don't think there's anything else you can really hope for.
Speaker 1: I mean, we certainly hope to make the Salem well
Speaker 1: known enough that enough people visit her that she can
Speaker 1: stay in Quincy. I think that's where she belongs, and
Speaker 1: it's a constant battle to keep her there. But yeah,
Speaker 1: other than that, I think, you know, helping the amphonies
Speaker 1: as best we can, I think that's really all we
Speaker 1: can hope for. Yeah, I mean, I think that's something
Speaker 1: that I've found is I've investigated for so long, you know,
Speaker 1: I definitely kind of thought of that idea of crossing
Speaker 1: things over long ago, and I think over time my
Speaker 1: theory has evolved to this idea, which I talked about
Speaker 1: in my book a lot. But this idea that I
Speaker 1: can't cross someone over to place that I don't even
Speaker 1: know for sure exists, and so I've been striving more
Speaker 1: to figure out why they're still here, and that usually
Speaker 1: produces more reaction or activity, Like I do feel like
Speaker 1: they're here, not because they don't know where they need
Speaker 1: to go, but because there's something that they left behind,
Speaker 1: you know, that kind of classic unfinished business. And you know,
Speaker 1: I could see that really being the case with the Salem.
Speaker 1: You know, there were a lot of lives that ended
Speaker 1: very suddenly, either on board or because of the earthquake,
Speaker 1: or people who may have left something behind emotionally even
Speaker 1: if they didn't die on board. Oh sure. You know.
Speaker 1: One of the entities that I speak too, primarily with
Speaker 1: dowsing rods, I found is a young man that we
Speaker 1: call Nko, a Greek man, and and he seems to
Speaker 1: enjoy talking to us. You know, he always comes to
Speaker 1: us and we enjoy interacting with him. But I always
Speaker 1: feel terrible after we talked to him because he tells
Speaker 1: us that he's looking for his family. And you think, man,
Speaker 1: if there was anything you could do to help this individual,
Speaker 1: whether it was send him to wire his family is
Speaker 1: or bring his family forward to him, whatever it would be,
Speaker 1: you can't help. But wishing you you could do, Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's hard. I mean we have done in the past
Speaker 1: where we found kind of wayward spirits like that, where
Speaker 1: we have tracked down their family line or their ancestors
Speaker 1: and descendants even and kind of produced that, like brought
Speaker 1: them actual birth certificates and death certificates and census records
Speaker 1: and just showed them like, this is what happened to
Speaker 1: your family, this is where they ended up, this is
Speaker 1: you know, and tell them the story and that sometimes help.
Speaker 1: But until you can identify Nico for sure, that might
Speaker 1: be really hard to do, especially with a mass casualty
Speaker 1: like that. Sure, yeah, you're absolutely right. I don't think
Speaker 1: there are any records in terms of in terms of
Speaker 1: the Greeks that suation. In terms of the names, no,
Speaker 1: I looked. I looked. You can't find out who was
Speaker 1: brought on board and who wasn't things like that. So
Speaker 1: it's tough. It is really tough. Well, how now with
Speaker 1: the Salem, how what can people do? They can take tours,
Speaker 1: they can go on investigations. How do they find out
Speaker 1: all that information? Well, the Salem's website is uss dash
Speaker 1: Salem dot org and they can get plenty of information there.
Speaker 1: My organization, the Great of Boston Paranormal Associates, we're all
Speaker 1: over the place www dot v g, b p A
Speaker 1: dot com. We're on Facebook as well, and we have
Speaker 1: a page now called the USS Salem Paranormal Experience on Facebook,
Speaker 1: that's where we advertise our events and things of that nature.
Speaker 1: There are plenty of opportunities to get aboard the ship,
Speaker 1: but I always try to urge people if they're to
Speaker 1: local anyway, it's a great take. You know, on a
Speaker 1: Saturday or Sunday afternoon, she's kind of beat up on
Speaker 1: the outs side, but once you get aboard, she is
Speaker 1: amazingly well preserved. It's a great thing, a great place
Speaker 1: to go and get a good understanding of our shared history. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I find it to be fascinating. I think that New
Speaker 1: England is very lucky to have her. You know. I
Speaker 1: brought my daughter when we were filming and she just
Speaker 1: loved exploring and learning all about the history there. So
Speaker 1: hats off to you and everyone associated with the Salem
Speaker 1: for keeping her local and keeping her going in some way,
Speaker 1: because you know, these kind of opportunities are becoming harder
Speaker 1: and harder to come by for people to experience. I'll
Speaker 1: be sure I appreciate that. But as there are a
Speaker 1: lot of people involved in not only I mean just
Speaker 1: in doing what we do, I'm very very fortunate, you know.
Speaker 1: I tell people the ship is my obsession, and I
Speaker 1: was fortunate to find a group of people who are
Speaker 1: dumb enough to to buy into it. But the truth
Speaker 1: is I'm the luckiest guy in the world in terms
Speaker 1: of the team that we put to other and and
Speaker 1: that's just the paranormal side. The ship itself has a very,
Speaker 1: very dedicated group of volunteers and fought too many to
Speaker 1: mention absolutely well. I really appreciate you taking the time.
Speaker 1: I can't wait to get back, hopefully very soon. I
Speaker 1: think this is going to be great for people to
Speaker 1: get a greater understanding of all the work that goes
Speaker 1: on behind the scenes and also what they can expect
Speaker 1: to encounter if they climb on board the U S. S. Salem.
Speaker 1: Thank you very much for having to appreciate it, and
Speaker 1: we would love to have you back anytime. Yes, thank
Speaker 1: you so much. The US S. Salem, like so many
Speaker 1: of the haunted places we visit, holds a special place
Speaker 1: in the hearts of the many volunteers and benefactors who
Speaker 1: worked tirelessly to keep her afloat. When you visit the ship,
Speaker 1: just about every volunteer you meet is a VET, and
Speaker 1: while the Salem is no longer in service, you can
Speaker 1: tell the sense of pride and nostalgia they feel as
Speaker 1: they show you around. It's also goes aside, just a
Speaker 1: wonderful place to visit and take in some very important history.
Speaker 1: So I urge you, next time you're in the New
Speaker 1: England area, pay a visit to the United States Naval
Speaker 1: ship Building Museum and the U. S. S. Salem. If
Speaker 1: you see don tell him I say hi. And if
Speaker 1: you get lost in her depths, don't forget. The yellow
Speaker 1: line leads back to the top deck until next time.
Speaker 1: I Maybe Bruney and this was Haunted Road. Haunted Road
Speaker 1: is a production of I Heart Radio and Grimm and
Speaker 1: Mild from Aaron Mankey. The podcast is written and hosted
Speaker 1: by Amy Bruney. Executive producers include Aaron Manky, Alex Williams,
Speaker 1: and Matt Frederick. The show is produced by rema Ill
Speaker 1: Kali and Trevor Young. Taylor Haggerdorn is the show's researcher.
Speaker 1: For more podcasts from I Heart Radio, visit the I
Speaker 1: Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.