1
00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:02,519
Speaker 1: Welcome to How the Money. I'm Joel and I'm Matt

2
00:00:02,600 --> 00:00:05,320
Speaker 1: and today we're talking how to hack your home and

3
00:00:05,360 --> 00:00:27,160
Speaker 1: live for free with Craig curl Up. Yeah, today we're

4
00:00:27,200 --> 00:00:30,520
Speaker 1: talking with our friend Craig curlp. And back in seventeen,

5
00:00:30,600 --> 00:00:33,720
Speaker 1: Craig had a negative net worth of thirty thousand dollars,

6
00:00:33,920 --> 00:00:37,640
Speaker 1: but by implementing different tactics to earn more, to spend less,

7
00:00:37,640 --> 00:00:40,600
Speaker 1: and then invest the difference, he was able to reach

8
00:00:40,680 --> 00:00:44,320
Speaker 1: financial independence two years later in twenty nineteen. And house

9
00:00:44,360 --> 00:00:47,960
Speaker 1: hacking it played a major role in Craig's rapid assent

10
00:00:48,200 --> 00:00:51,880
Speaker 1: towards financial freedom, and that is what we're talking about today.

11
00:00:51,960 --> 00:00:55,240
Speaker 1: Craig's written the book The House Hacking Strategy, and we're

12
00:00:55,240 --> 00:00:57,200
Speaker 1: gonna cover all of the ins and outs of house

13
00:00:57,200 --> 00:00:59,960
Speaker 1: hacking and how it is that it changed Craig's life.

14
00:01:00,160 --> 00:01:02,880
Speaker 1: We're going to discuss the different house hacking methods because

15
00:01:02,920 --> 00:01:04,920
Speaker 1: there are a variety of options that you can go

16
00:01:04,959 --> 00:01:07,480
Speaker 1: with um and some of that actually too depends on

17
00:01:07,480 --> 00:01:10,039
Speaker 1: your personal situation, like if you're single, if you have

18
00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:12,280
Speaker 1: a family, and so we're going to cover what you

19
00:01:12,280 --> 00:01:15,639
Speaker 1: need to know before you start house hacking as well. Craig,

20
00:01:15,640 --> 00:01:18,240
Speaker 1: thank you for joining us today on the podcast. Matt

21
00:01:18,240 --> 00:01:20,000
Speaker 1: and Joel, thank you so much for having me on.

22
00:01:20,080 --> 00:01:22,240
Speaker 1: Thanks for the great introduction. And yeah, it was amazing

23
00:01:22,240 --> 00:01:24,600
Speaker 1: to meet you guys a couple of months back. That's right. Yeah,

24
00:01:24,600 --> 00:01:26,720
Speaker 1: we got to hang out in person, Craig, which was

25
00:01:27,480 --> 00:01:29,839
Speaker 1: a true honor, a pleasure. And yeah, we love meeting

26
00:01:29,840 --> 00:01:31,920
Speaker 1: our fellow money nerd friends. We got to see his

27
00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:35,679
Speaker 1: mustache in real life, which was always you'll be able

28
00:01:35,680 --> 00:01:39,880
Speaker 1: to touch it? Maybe, oh, impress empty there. That's um,

29
00:01:39,920 --> 00:01:42,759
Speaker 1: that's a very very kind of you to offer, Craig.

30
00:01:44,240 --> 00:01:48,440
Speaker 1: The first question, right, Yeah, the first question we ask

31
00:01:48,480 --> 00:01:51,000
Speaker 1: everyone who comes on the show, though, is you know,

32
00:01:51,040 --> 00:01:52,920
Speaker 1: Matt and I, everybody knows that we like a good

33
00:01:52,960 --> 00:01:56,240
Speaker 1: craft beer and we don't mind spending money on it.

34
00:01:56,240 --> 00:01:59,040
Speaker 1: It's something that we splurge onn while we're also trying

35
00:01:59,080 --> 00:02:02,240
Speaker 1: to save and invest well for the future. So yeah,

36
00:02:02,320 --> 00:02:04,400
Speaker 1: for you, do you have a craft your equivalent, something

37
00:02:04,400 --> 00:02:06,800
Speaker 1: that you exploge on in the here and now while

38
00:02:07,040 --> 00:02:10,160
Speaker 1: also house hacking and saving your money. So this might

39
00:02:10,160 --> 00:02:12,040
Speaker 1: be a cheap, but tell me and if it is,

40
00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:16,600
Speaker 1: I'll make him another one. But I splurge on having

41
00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:20,280
Speaker 1: people like do things for me if that makes you know,

42
00:02:20,440 --> 00:02:23,320
Speaker 1: So it's like, you know, an example is I had

43
00:02:23,320 --> 00:02:25,560
Speaker 1: this table that I had to put together, and I

44
00:02:25,600 --> 00:02:27,920
Speaker 1: just kept dreading it and dreading it, and so I

45
00:02:27,960 --> 00:02:30,840
Speaker 1: just called a task Rabbit and for thirty dollars, they

46
00:02:30,840 --> 00:02:32,720
Speaker 1: came and put together at the table in like an hour,

47
00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:34,440
Speaker 1: and I was like, that is the best of the

48
00:02:34,520 --> 00:02:37,400
Speaker 1: dollars I've ever spent. And like, you know, those lingering

49
00:02:37,440 --> 00:02:39,160
Speaker 1: tasks that like you gotta get it done, you gotta

50
00:02:39,160 --> 00:02:41,320
Speaker 1: get done because like you never find times to do it.

51
00:02:41,639 --> 00:02:43,960
Speaker 1: I just have been hiring those out and they're usually

52
00:02:43,960 --> 00:02:46,119
Speaker 1: like thirty to fifty dollars to get done. I feel

53
00:02:46,160 --> 00:02:48,880
Speaker 1: like that's a splurge. And it's just so amazing to

54
00:02:49,120 --> 00:02:50,720
Speaker 1: have things that you don't want to do already done

55
00:02:50,720 --> 00:02:53,440
Speaker 1: for you, especially when you are able bodied and you know,

56
00:02:53,600 --> 00:02:55,800
Speaker 1: like you're like I could do that, I just don't

57
00:02:55,800 --> 00:02:58,440
Speaker 1: want to. Yeah, I think if that is a splurge

58
00:02:58,560 --> 00:03:01,200
Speaker 1: and occasionally a worthwhile one. So yeah, I like definitely

59
00:03:01,200 --> 00:03:02,840
Speaker 1: a splourish, But dude, for me, I think it would

60
00:03:02,840 --> 00:03:05,240
Speaker 1: be so difficult because I get a sense of satisfaction

61
00:03:05,480 --> 00:03:08,160
Speaker 1: when I'm able to accomplish, you know, even if it's

62
00:03:08,160 --> 00:03:11,000
Speaker 1: a menial task where something that's more where the physical

63
00:03:11,080 --> 00:03:16,520
Speaker 1: labors involved, that sense of accomplishment like yeah, I like

64
00:03:16,680 --> 00:03:18,560
Speaker 1: not doing it and having it get done and being like,

65
00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:21,400
Speaker 1: holy crap, it's done. Well. Someday, Craig, you're gonna hire

66
00:03:21,440 --> 00:03:22,919
Speaker 1: one of those tasks out and it's gonna be Matt

67
00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:24,840
Speaker 1: who's the task grab it that actually shows up because

68
00:03:24,840 --> 00:03:27,360
Speaker 1: it makes me so happy. If it makes you so

69
00:03:27,360 --> 00:03:29,920
Speaker 1: happy putting the other furniture, like dropping random things off

70
00:03:29,960 --> 00:03:32,160
Speaker 1: at random places, it does for myself. I'll say that

71
00:03:32,480 --> 00:03:36,040
Speaker 1: maybe maybe less uh anomaly for everybody else who's looking

72
00:03:36,080 --> 00:03:38,480
Speaker 1: to hire out there. But you know, Craig, let's kind

73
00:03:38,480 --> 00:03:41,040
Speaker 1: of dive into this. You've called yourself an average guy

74
00:03:41,120 --> 00:03:45,440
Speaker 1: just doing average things. You've said that motivation is your

75
00:03:45,520 --> 00:03:48,240
Speaker 1: distinguishing factor, and so you know, question we have for you,

76
00:03:48,400 --> 00:03:51,520
Speaker 1: like do you really think that basically anyone can incorporate

77
00:03:51,560 --> 00:03:54,160
Speaker 1: the strategies that you're using to build wealth? Yeah? I

78
00:03:54,160 --> 00:03:57,080
Speaker 1: mean I think anybody, anybody on this earth can do

79
00:03:57,280 --> 00:04:00,160
Speaker 1: what I've done. Right. Um, And as you start are

80
00:04:00,200 --> 00:04:02,640
Speaker 1: doing things and you start being a little different, is

81
00:04:02,680 --> 00:04:05,880
Speaker 1: when more and more opportunities start to come your way.

82
00:04:05,960 --> 00:04:08,160
Speaker 1: And so people may say, oh, yeah, well, like you

83
00:04:08,200 --> 00:04:10,360
Speaker 1: wrote a book from your pockets. Well it's like, well

84
00:04:10,400 --> 00:04:12,920
Speaker 1: that came like three years into my journey and I

85
00:04:12,960 --> 00:04:15,560
Speaker 1: had written fifty or sixty blog posts for them and

86
00:04:15,600 --> 00:04:17,560
Speaker 1: all that stuff, and so there was an opportunity that

87
00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:20,480
Speaker 1: came right. And so I think that if you start

88
00:04:20,600 --> 00:04:22,720
Speaker 1: doing things a little differently, you'll see more and more

89
00:04:22,720 --> 00:04:26,760
Speaker 1: opportunities pop up. And you know, that's when your life

90
00:04:26,760 --> 00:04:29,480
Speaker 1: really opens up. Okay, all right, I like it. So, yeah,

91
00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:32,320
Speaker 1: there's an element of you gotta put in the work,

92
00:04:32,480 --> 00:04:34,479
Speaker 1: and you've got to be motivated to put in the

93
00:04:34,520 --> 00:04:36,480
Speaker 1: work before you're going to see the results. And I

94
00:04:36,480 --> 00:04:39,680
Speaker 1: think sometimes in like the Instagram world we live in,

95
00:04:39,920 --> 00:04:43,919
Speaker 1: we see results on display all the time and we

96
00:04:43,960 --> 00:04:47,080
Speaker 1: don't see like the backstory of what it took to

97
00:04:47,080 --> 00:04:49,320
Speaker 1: actually achieve that. And so yeah, I think that can

98
00:04:49,400 --> 00:04:53,640
Speaker 1: be demotivating for some people, um when it doesn't happen,

99
00:04:53,720 --> 00:04:56,880
Speaker 1: success doesn't happen overnight for them. But but let's specifically,

100
00:04:56,920 --> 00:05:00,160
Speaker 1: let's talk about house hacking, and can you get us

101
00:05:00,160 --> 00:05:02,400
Speaker 1: a set up, like, how do you define house hacking?

102
00:05:02,720 --> 00:05:06,040
Speaker 1: What does it mean? Yeah? For sure, so house hacking

103
00:05:06,320 --> 00:05:10,400
Speaker 1: is the idea that you purchase a one to four

104
00:05:10,520 --> 00:05:14,400
Speaker 1: unit property with zero to five percent down, so you're

105
00:05:14,400 --> 00:05:18,840
Speaker 1: doing a low percent down purchase on a wonderful unit property.

106
00:05:18,960 --> 00:05:21,520
Speaker 1: You need to live in that property for one year

107
00:05:21,560 --> 00:05:23,760
Speaker 1: because that's what allows you to get the low down

108
00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:27,320
Speaker 1: down payment. And while you're living there, you're renting out

109
00:05:27,360 --> 00:05:29,520
Speaker 1: either the other rooms if you're living in a single family,

110
00:05:29,600 --> 00:05:31,240
Speaker 1: or you're renting out the other units if you're living

111
00:05:31,240 --> 00:05:33,800
Speaker 1: in a two, three or four unit. That rent that

112
00:05:33,839 --> 00:05:36,640
Speaker 1: you're getting covers your mortgage and you're able to live

113
00:05:37,040 --> 00:05:40,440
Speaker 1: for free, thereby reducing or eliminating what likely is your

114
00:05:40,560 --> 00:05:43,640
Speaker 1: largest expense in housing. So this is obviously something that

115
00:05:43,640 --> 00:05:47,120
Speaker 1: you've done. But why is this? Like it seems like

116
00:05:47,120 --> 00:05:49,320
Speaker 1: this is one of your favorite wealth building tactics, you know.

117
00:05:49,400 --> 00:05:51,839
Speaker 1: So so first of all, why is that? And then

118
00:05:52,080 --> 00:05:54,200
Speaker 1: I guess, maybe, yeah, what got you so excited to

119
00:05:54,240 --> 00:05:58,159
Speaker 1: share this with other people? So you know, everyone probably

120
00:05:58,160 --> 00:06:01,000
Speaker 1: listened to this podcast understands financial dependence, right, and that

121
00:06:01,000 --> 00:06:04,080
Speaker 1: that basic formula of hey, once you're passive income exceeds

122
00:06:04,080 --> 00:06:07,120
Speaker 1: your expenses, your financially independent and for me, the quickest

123
00:06:07,160 --> 00:06:10,120
Speaker 1: way to achieve financial independence was to just pick up

124
00:06:10,240 --> 00:06:13,280
Speaker 1: enough rental properties with that rent or passive income exceeds

125
00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:16,920
Speaker 1: my expenses. And with house hacking, you really only need

126
00:06:17,240 --> 00:06:19,919
Speaker 1: such a fraction. You know, you only need three or

127
00:06:19,920 --> 00:06:22,120
Speaker 1: five percent down. Right, So let's say you're gonna buy

128
00:06:22,120 --> 00:06:24,520
Speaker 1: a five hundred thousand dollar house, right, which is a

129
00:06:24,600 --> 00:06:27,200
Speaker 1: fairly expensive house for most of the United States. You're

130
00:06:27,200 --> 00:06:30,480
Speaker 1: gonna put three percent down. That's fifteen thousand, maybe twenty

131
00:06:30,800 --> 00:06:34,599
Speaker 1: dollars after miscellaneous costs. So with twenty dollars, you're able

132
00:06:34,640 --> 00:06:37,640
Speaker 1: to purchase this five hundred thousand dollar asset that's gonna

133
00:06:37,680 --> 00:06:40,320
Speaker 1: pay you, hopefully a thousand dollars a month of passive income.

134
00:06:40,640 --> 00:06:43,279
Speaker 1: It's going to increase in value over time if you

135
00:06:43,279 --> 00:06:45,800
Speaker 1: hold it long enough, you're going to get tax advantages,

136
00:06:46,080 --> 00:06:48,360
Speaker 1: and you're gonna get loan paid down, So your net

137
00:06:48,360 --> 00:06:51,839
Speaker 1: worth increases in four different ways by putting such a

138
00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:54,919
Speaker 1: small amount down, such that your return on investment is

139
00:06:54,920 --> 00:06:59,000
Speaker 1: pretty much over every single time. Like I've done five

140
00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:01,279
Speaker 1: house hacks now, every single one has been a hundred

141
00:07:01,279 --> 00:07:04,360
Speaker 1: percent or more return on investment, and I've helped out

142
00:07:04,600 --> 00:07:07,800
Speaker 1: hundreds and hundreds of people directly get house hacks at

143
00:07:07,839 --> 00:07:10,720
Speaker 1: almost every single time their returns on investment are a

144
00:07:10,760 --> 00:07:12,720
Speaker 1: hundred percent or more. And I just don't know any

145
00:07:12,760 --> 00:07:15,880
Speaker 1: sort of real estate or any sort of investment in

146
00:07:15,920 --> 00:07:19,920
Speaker 1: general that you can consistently achieve one hundred percent returns

147
00:07:20,360 --> 00:07:24,320
Speaker 1: without the risk and without speculation. Okay, Yeah, Matt and

148
00:07:24,360 --> 00:07:26,400
Speaker 1: I we like real estate a lot too, and we

149
00:07:26,480 --> 00:07:29,840
Speaker 1: have participated in various house hacks. I had a renter

150
00:07:29,960 --> 00:07:31,960
Speaker 1: in the back of a duplex for a while, and

151
00:07:32,000 --> 00:07:34,239
Speaker 1: actually the first house I bought, I had a roommate

152
00:07:34,240 --> 00:07:36,120
Speaker 1: in that house who paid most of the mortgage, So

153
00:07:36,160 --> 00:07:37,880
Speaker 1: I totally get where you're coming from. Matt had an

154
00:07:37,880 --> 00:07:40,920
Speaker 1: Airbnb in this basement, which is now our podcasting studio.

155
00:07:41,400 --> 00:07:44,600
Speaker 1: But while you you've just sung the praises, you also

156
00:07:44,680 --> 00:07:46,440
Speaker 1: in the book you do mention the downsides, which I

157
00:07:46,480 --> 00:07:50,400
Speaker 1: appreciate because even as exciting of a prospect this house

158
00:07:50,440 --> 00:07:53,320
Speaker 1: hacking can be for people, it's nice to know all

159
00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:56,360
Speaker 1: the information. So, yeah, what would you say if are

160
00:07:56,600 --> 00:08:00,280
Speaker 1: the worst things about house a house hacking? What are

161
00:08:00,280 --> 00:08:02,119
Speaker 1: the downsides that people need to be aware of before

162
00:08:02,120 --> 00:08:04,520
Speaker 1: they like jump in with both feet. Yeah, so the

163
00:08:04,560 --> 00:08:07,080
Speaker 1: downside is that it is more it is work. You

164
00:08:07,120 --> 00:08:10,560
Speaker 1: have additional responsibility if something breaks in the house. You know,

165
00:08:10,600 --> 00:08:13,440
Speaker 1: if the rooms aren't filled like you're in, there's higher

166
00:08:13,520 --> 00:08:16,560
Speaker 1: risk because your mortgage without any tenants is going to

167
00:08:16,560 --> 00:08:19,160
Speaker 1: be more than your rent probably and so you will

168
00:08:19,560 --> 00:08:23,080
Speaker 1: probably lose in the short term if you don't get tenants.

169
00:08:23,080 --> 00:08:24,400
Speaker 1: So you have a little bit of pressure and a

170
00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:26,760
Speaker 1: little bit of responsibility to get that thing filled, to

171
00:08:26,760 --> 00:08:29,320
Speaker 1: make sure your tenants get along, make sure your leases

172
00:08:29,360 --> 00:08:32,199
Speaker 1: look good, make sure you screen your tenants wisely, make

173
00:08:32,240 --> 00:08:34,800
Speaker 1: sure the property is working right, and so there is

174
00:08:34,840 --> 00:08:38,000
Speaker 1: a little bit more work that is involved in the

175
00:08:38,040 --> 00:08:40,680
Speaker 1: short term, right, But the whole idea is that you're

176
00:08:40,720 --> 00:08:44,000
Speaker 1: building assets when you're relatively young, so that in five

177
00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:46,079
Speaker 1: to ten years from now you can offload that to

178
00:08:46,160 --> 00:08:48,320
Speaker 1: a property manager. It's a little to no work for

179
00:08:48,360 --> 00:08:51,720
Speaker 1: you and you're just chilling with the passive income. Got it,

180
00:08:51,840 --> 00:08:53,520
Speaker 1: And you know, Craig reo quick I want to talk

181
00:08:53,520 --> 00:08:55,040
Speaker 1: about too. I mean, like Joel mentioned, were in the

182
00:08:55,120 --> 00:08:57,720
Speaker 1: real estates here a little bit in addition to the

183
00:08:57,760 --> 00:09:01,120
Speaker 1: other pursuits that we have, but you specifically zero to

184
00:09:01,160 --> 00:09:04,680
Speaker 1: five percent down. We often talk about down to avoid

185
00:09:04,720 --> 00:09:06,960
Speaker 1: p M. I can you share with our listeners how

186
00:09:07,000 --> 00:09:09,320
Speaker 1: they can go about getting a property with even zero

187
00:09:09,360 --> 00:09:13,200
Speaker 1: dollars down. Yeah, so zero dollars down that is typically

188
00:09:13,400 --> 00:09:16,880
Speaker 1: reserved for military folks. The v A loan allows you

189
00:09:16,920 --> 00:09:20,040
Speaker 1: to purchase a property with zero percent down. Now, the downside,

190
00:09:20,080 --> 00:09:21,920
Speaker 1: so that is the v A loan is a little

191
00:09:21,920 --> 00:09:24,880
Speaker 1: bit harder to get accepted by sellers. So in a

192
00:09:24,880 --> 00:09:28,120
Speaker 1: competitive market, you just might have a little bit of trouble.

193
00:09:28,280 --> 00:09:30,680
Speaker 1: But because you're putting zero percent down, you can probably

194
00:09:30,679 --> 00:09:33,160
Speaker 1: afford to go a little bit higher, right because you

195
00:09:33,200 --> 00:09:35,280
Speaker 1: don't have any down payment, So that might be a

196
00:09:35,280 --> 00:09:38,120
Speaker 1: way to counteract that. Another way to get zero percent

197
00:09:38,200 --> 00:09:40,240
Speaker 1: down is what's called the U. S d A loan,

198
00:09:40,600 --> 00:09:43,439
Speaker 1: And yes it's the same you know, the same corporation

199
00:09:43,559 --> 00:09:46,160
Speaker 1: or the same entity that grades your beef like U.

200
00:09:46,200 --> 00:09:49,880
Speaker 1: S d A graded the opera housing loans, but it's

201
00:09:49,920 --> 00:09:51,880
Speaker 1: more for people in rural areas, so you'll have to

202
00:09:51,880 --> 00:09:54,080
Speaker 1: just look online to see if your area qualifies. But

203
00:09:54,120 --> 00:09:56,439
Speaker 1: if you're anywhere near like a bigger city, you probably

204
00:09:56,480 --> 00:09:58,600
Speaker 1: won't qualify for that. Okay, I go to the same

205
00:09:58,640 --> 00:10:01,160
Speaker 1: place for my stake and from a home loans personally,

206
00:10:03,559 --> 00:10:05,400
Speaker 1: and I love kind of how how you talk about

207
00:10:05,400 --> 00:10:07,960
Speaker 1: real estate in general, you say that a big part

208
00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:10,679
Speaker 1: of the problem is that we're just thinking about housing

209
00:10:10,720 --> 00:10:13,319
Speaker 1: all wrong. Like the way we think about buying homes

210
00:10:13,440 --> 00:10:17,080
Speaker 1: needs like a refresh, because we're looking to basically buy

211
00:10:17,360 --> 00:10:20,599
Speaker 1: the nicest single family home that we can comfortably afford

212
00:10:20,960 --> 00:10:23,880
Speaker 1: into our budget. Like why why is that method, which

213
00:10:23,880 --> 00:10:25,880
Speaker 1: is the traditional method, which is the route that most

214
00:10:25,880 --> 00:10:28,079
Speaker 1: people go, Why is that such a bad idea? Well,

215
00:10:28,080 --> 00:10:30,360
Speaker 1: that's such a bad idea because you put yourself in

216
00:10:30,400 --> 00:10:33,319
Speaker 1: a position where if you lose your job, which can

217
00:10:33,360 --> 00:10:36,800
Speaker 1: literally happen tomorrow, or you suddenly stopped liking your job,

218
00:10:37,080 --> 00:10:40,040
Speaker 1: your life becomes miserable because you need to work. Right,

219
00:10:40,280 --> 00:10:42,280
Speaker 1: Don't get me wrong, I'm all about owning a home.

220
00:10:42,400 --> 00:10:44,800
Speaker 1: And we're actually under contract for a million dollar forever

221
00:10:44,880 --> 00:10:48,240
Speaker 1: home right now, but that's after seven house acts. Between

222
00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:51,160
Speaker 1: me and my girlfriend. We've got twenty something properties, and

223
00:10:51,200 --> 00:10:56,000
Speaker 1: our income from those properties can easily satisfy our mortgage payment.

224
00:10:56,320 --> 00:11:00,520
Speaker 1: And so you know, it took five plus year of

225
00:11:00,960 --> 00:11:04,400
Speaker 1: of kind of hustle and living in unideal situations to

226
00:11:04,520 --> 00:11:06,920
Speaker 1: live now in our ideal situation, which we're very comfortable,

227
00:11:07,120 --> 00:11:11,000
Speaker 1: comfortably able to afford and so I'm not totally against it.

228
00:11:11,040 --> 00:11:13,440
Speaker 1: I'm just totally against first home is your forever home

229
00:11:13,520 --> 00:11:14,800
Speaker 1: jump right out of the gate and you're paying to

230
00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:17,840
Speaker 1: three tho dollars a month in a mortgage payment. Yeah,

231
00:11:17,840 --> 00:11:19,680
Speaker 1: I think that's a different mentality that a lot of

232
00:11:19,920 --> 00:11:23,079
Speaker 1: especially first time homebuyers, homebuyers need to keep in mind

233
00:11:23,160 --> 00:11:25,840
Speaker 1: as they're starting to look at properties. They I think

234
00:11:26,080 --> 00:11:28,320
Speaker 1: they do have that mindset when they're looking at houses

235
00:11:28,320 --> 00:11:30,839
Speaker 1: for the first time, and they thinking about it more

236
00:11:30,880 --> 00:11:33,160
Speaker 1: as an investment, as a you know, compared to something

237
00:11:33,320 --> 00:11:35,800
Speaker 1: that is just going to be your forever home right

238
00:11:35,840 --> 00:11:37,559
Speaker 1: out of the gate. Is an important thing to keep

239
00:11:37,559 --> 00:11:39,839
Speaker 1: in mind a little bit that sacrifice early on can

240
00:11:39,840 --> 00:11:43,720
Speaker 1: pay off big dividends down the road. Totally. Yeah, yeah, Craig.

241
00:11:43,760 --> 00:11:46,720
Speaker 1: So currently the market is really hot right now, you know,

242
00:11:46,800 --> 00:11:50,560
Speaker 1: prices are they're up double digits year over year. Do

243
00:11:50,600 --> 00:11:52,960
Speaker 1: you feel that it's possible right now to still find

244
00:11:53,040 --> 00:11:55,760
Speaker 1: an investment property that makes sense, you know, to house hack,

245
00:11:55,800 --> 00:11:58,839
Speaker 1: even in this climate. Yeah. So, you know, it's funny.

246
00:11:58,840 --> 00:12:00,800
Speaker 1: I actually just did a TikTok I went like semi

247
00:12:00,880 --> 00:12:05,000
Speaker 1: viral about this exact thing where you know, in everyone works.

248
00:12:05,000 --> 00:12:08,160
Speaker 1: By the way, you will never hear me saying congrat

249
00:12:08,520 --> 00:12:11,320
Speaker 1: thank yeah, it's my second one. So I'm like, oh,

250
00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:15,040
Speaker 1: I'm gonna roll. So you know, in seventeen I bought

251
00:12:15,040 --> 00:12:16,480
Speaker 1: my first place and everyone was scared of the market

252
00:12:16,520 --> 00:12:18,080
Speaker 1: was going to crash, and people were like, yeah, I'm

253
00:12:18,080 --> 00:12:23,040
Speaker 1: gonna wait, right, every year is the same story, right,

254
00:12:23,080 --> 00:12:25,360
Speaker 1: And so the point is it is just like the market,

255
00:12:25,400 --> 00:12:29,000
Speaker 1: you really can't time it. You can't time the real

256
00:12:29,120 --> 00:12:31,400
Speaker 1: estate market either. So if you're just able to buy

257
00:12:31,480 --> 00:12:33,959
Speaker 1: a house every year on the year, and you can

258
00:12:34,000 --> 00:12:37,200
Speaker 1: make sure that it cash flows, then it doesn't matter

259
00:12:37,200 --> 00:12:39,440
Speaker 1: with the market. Dose right, My houses can all lose

260
00:12:39,480 --> 00:12:43,160
Speaker 1: half their value tomorrow and they'll still be cash fling

261
00:12:43,200 --> 00:12:45,199
Speaker 1: me a thousand dollars or so a month. And even

262
00:12:45,240 --> 00:12:48,679
Speaker 1: if rents decrease by they'll still cash for me eight

263
00:12:49,080 --> 00:12:52,679
Speaker 1: dollars a month. So that is like the whole thing is,

264
00:12:52,720 --> 00:12:54,680
Speaker 1: if you can hold on and you're not forced to sell,

265
00:12:54,720 --> 00:12:56,880
Speaker 1: then nothing will happen. What happened to two thousand eight

266
00:12:56,960 --> 00:12:58,480
Speaker 1: was there was a bunch of flippers and a bunch

267
00:12:58,480 --> 00:13:01,080
Speaker 1: of people trying to make a quick buck and that's why,

268
00:13:01,120 --> 00:13:03,800
Speaker 1: and they were forced to sell and that's why the prices,

269
00:13:04,200 --> 00:13:07,120
Speaker 1: you know, the market crashed. So I don't see there

270
00:13:07,120 --> 00:13:10,120
Speaker 1: being a big crash. What I see is there may

271
00:13:10,160 --> 00:13:13,599
Speaker 1: be a a a crash in some other market I

272
00:13:13,640 --> 00:13:17,719
Speaker 1: don't know, potentially crypto, potentially student loans, student whatever, right,

273
00:13:17,960 --> 00:13:21,360
Speaker 1: that may cause the market to go down. And then

274
00:13:21,480 --> 00:13:24,559
Speaker 1: because the market goes down, people will have less liquidity,

275
00:13:24,600 --> 00:13:27,600
Speaker 1: maybe they lose their jobs and whatnot, and so then

276
00:13:27,800 --> 00:13:31,000
Speaker 1: the housing price the housing market will then just kind

277
00:13:31,040 --> 00:13:32,680
Speaker 1: of go down a little bit, right, But I don't

278
00:13:32,720 --> 00:13:34,560
Speaker 1: see the big crash because I don't see real estate

279
00:13:34,760 --> 00:13:37,520
Speaker 1: as being like the fundamental flaw of this next crash

280
00:13:37,520 --> 00:13:40,959
Speaker 1: whenever it happens. Yeah, there could be some reverberations because

281
00:13:41,000 --> 00:13:43,800
Speaker 1: of other financial issues in the economy potentially, but but

282
00:13:43,920 --> 00:13:46,400
Speaker 1: still yeah, like because it's a physical place, uh that

283
00:13:46,520 --> 00:13:49,320
Speaker 1: that you own, and people always need a place to live,

284
00:13:49,760 --> 00:13:52,079
Speaker 1: there's a certain element to which you're right, Like rents

285
00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:54,800
Speaker 1: can decrease, but they're not going to go to zero

286
00:13:55,120 --> 00:13:58,160
Speaker 1: and uh, Craig. We want to get into your story though,

287
00:13:58,160 --> 00:14:00,960
Speaker 1: because you just mentioned the fact that you're buying a

288
00:14:01,000 --> 00:14:03,880
Speaker 1: million dollar home now. But we we want to like

289
00:14:03,880 --> 00:14:05,600
Speaker 1: discuss like all the hard work that it took to

290
00:14:05,600 --> 00:14:08,079
Speaker 1: get there, because your story and the specific house hacks

291
00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:11,240
Speaker 1: that you undertook are really interesting. So yeah, we're gonna

292
00:14:11,240 --> 00:14:23,520
Speaker 1: ask you all about that right after this break. Alright,

293
00:14:23,520 --> 00:14:26,120
Speaker 1: we'll back to the break. We're talking with Craig Curlap

294
00:14:26,520 --> 00:14:29,360
Speaker 1: about house hacking, and uh, let's let's start way back

295
00:14:29,400 --> 00:14:31,320
Speaker 1: at the beginning. Craig, we want to talk about your

296
00:14:31,360 --> 00:14:35,080
Speaker 1: your first ever Craig and diapers right now, the first

297
00:14:35,080 --> 00:14:37,160
Speaker 1: alice that you purchase. Tell us about your first house ack,

298
00:14:37,760 --> 00:14:40,640
Speaker 1: because you're all about living for free, but this one

299
00:14:40,680 --> 00:14:43,120
Speaker 1: didn't get you to that point immediately. Can you tell

300
00:14:43,160 --> 00:14:46,000
Speaker 1: us a little bit about that one. Yeah, So it

301
00:14:46,080 --> 00:14:49,160
Speaker 1: was back in two seventeen UM. I was coming from

302
00:14:49,160 --> 00:14:52,160
Speaker 1: a job that I hated to Denver, right, so kind

303
00:14:52,200 --> 00:14:54,920
Speaker 1: of wipe the slate clean and I pretty much went

304
00:14:54,960 --> 00:14:58,440
Speaker 1: all out right, So I was living. I found a duplex.

305
00:14:58,520 --> 00:15:02,600
Speaker 1: It was up down duplex, totally redone like very pretty,

306
00:15:02,680 --> 00:15:05,280
Speaker 1: very good looking. But they were both one bed, one

307
00:15:05,280 --> 00:15:07,400
Speaker 1: bathroom apartments and it was a mile and a half

308
00:15:07,480 --> 00:15:09,400
Speaker 1: from the office as to where it worked. So I

309
00:15:09,480 --> 00:15:11,920
Speaker 1: knew I could bike or walk to work pretty easily.

310
00:15:12,520 --> 00:15:15,200
Speaker 1: And so what I did was I rented out the

311
00:15:15,240 --> 00:15:18,040
Speaker 1: top and lived in the bottom. However, the rent from

312
00:15:18,080 --> 00:15:22,320
Speaker 1: the top didn't quite cover my mortgage fully, so I

313
00:15:22,400 --> 00:15:25,360
Speaker 1: rented out my bedroom on Airbnb and kind of put

314
00:15:25,440 --> 00:15:27,480
Speaker 1: up like a curtain in a room divider with a

315
00:15:27,480 --> 00:15:30,880
Speaker 1: food on in the living room and rented out my bedroom.

316
00:15:31,000 --> 00:15:35,240
Speaker 1: And so that allowed me to you know, live a

317
00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:37,720
Speaker 1: d percent for free and even make like six dollars

318
00:15:37,760 --> 00:15:39,960
Speaker 1: a month on my living What do you call that?

319
00:15:40,040 --> 00:15:43,000
Speaker 1: Like blue collar house hacking? Like that, that's like house

320
00:15:43,000 --> 00:15:46,680
Speaker 1: hacking to it's like furthest possible extent. It seems like, yeah,

321
00:15:46,800 --> 00:15:48,920
Speaker 1: I would say maybe one step further is like getting

322
00:15:48,920 --> 00:15:50,920
Speaker 1: a camper and like putting that in the driveway and

323
00:15:50,960 --> 00:15:53,920
Speaker 1: living in the camper. To some people is actually probably

324
00:15:54,040 --> 00:15:57,040
Speaker 1: more desirable because at least you have your own private space. Um,

325
00:15:57,720 --> 00:15:59,480
Speaker 1: but I didn't think of that at the time. So

326
00:16:00,400 --> 00:16:02,960
Speaker 1: the living room is kind of you know what I did,

327
00:16:03,040 --> 00:16:04,560
Speaker 1: and that's kind of like, oh my god, I would

328
00:16:04,560 --> 00:16:07,280
Speaker 1: never do that. But that whole thing allowed me to, say,

329
00:16:07,320 --> 00:16:09,480
Speaker 1: of another thirty or forty grand in the next year

330
00:16:09,720 --> 00:16:11,400
Speaker 1: so that I can then purchase the next one, right,

331
00:16:11,440 --> 00:16:13,480
Speaker 1: So I knew that it was just like a foundational

332
00:16:14,280 --> 00:16:17,920
Speaker 1: approach to it was a building block, yeah, exactly. And

333
00:16:17,960 --> 00:16:19,640
Speaker 1: so it's like, you know, if you're listening to this

334
00:16:19,680 --> 00:16:23,840
Speaker 1: and you're like, then you're single and you don't have

335
00:16:23,880 --> 00:16:27,560
Speaker 1: a family or anything, like you gotta take your situation

336
00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:29,000
Speaker 1: that you're in and make the most of it. And

337
00:16:29,040 --> 00:16:31,760
Speaker 1: the most of that situation is kind of living like

338
00:16:31,880 --> 00:16:34,200
Speaker 1: kind of like a bum right, Like do that for

339
00:16:34,240 --> 00:16:36,160
Speaker 1: a year to save, and then you'll, you know, then

340
00:16:36,200 --> 00:16:38,560
Speaker 1: you can start buying house hack after househack after house hack,

341
00:16:38,560 --> 00:16:40,760
Speaker 1: and after four or five house as you'll find yourself,

342
00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:42,880
Speaker 1: you know, with a pretty sizable net worth, with a

343
00:16:42,880 --> 00:16:44,960
Speaker 1: good amount of passive income, and then you can start

344
00:16:45,000 --> 00:16:47,520
Speaker 1: doing some more fun things. You can start giving back

345
00:16:47,640 --> 00:16:52,080
Speaker 1: in your life. I mean, it becomes easier, you can

346
00:16:52,160 --> 00:16:55,080
Speaker 1: regain some of that privacy. Did you like a deadline

347
00:16:55,160 --> 00:16:57,240
Speaker 1: or an end insight? Because now you're engaged, you're buying

348
00:16:57,240 --> 00:16:59,320
Speaker 1: your own home. This was this was like, you know,

349
00:16:59,360 --> 00:17:02,360
Speaker 1: almost five years ago at this point when you undertook

350
00:17:02,440 --> 00:17:04,479
Speaker 1: like living in the living room of this duplex in

351
00:17:04,560 --> 00:17:09,440
Speaker 1: order to maximize the dollars the cash flow into your life.

352
00:17:09,680 --> 00:17:11,879
Speaker 1: Like did you say, all right, I'm gonna do this,

353
00:17:11,920 --> 00:17:14,639
Speaker 1: I'm gonna grin and bear it for six months, nine months,

354
00:17:14,720 --> 00:17:17,840
Speaker 1: or a year. Obviously, this wasn't something you wanted to

355
00:17:17,880 --> 00:17:20,880
Speaker 1: do for a decade. This this was, like Matt said,

356
00:17:20,880 --> 00:17:22,720
Speaker 1: a building block. How did you know how long you

357
00:17:22,760 --> 00:17:25,320
Speaker 1: were actually going to be willing to Yeah, commit to

358
00:17:25,320 --> 00:17:29,119
Speaker 1: the strategy. Yeah, So ultimately I knew my life would change, right.

359
00:17:29,160 --> 00:17:30,880
Speaker 1: I knew I would it. Some day, I would meet

360
00:17:30,920 --> 00:17:33,119
Speaker 1: somebody it. Some day I'd want to settle down and

361
00:17:33,119 --> 00:17:35,160
Speaker 1: that this was not a forever thing. But I figured

362
00:17:35,560 --> 00:17:38,760
Speaker 1: until then, why not just hustle and get it done.

363
00:17:38,920 --> 00:17:41,480
Speaker 1: And so you know, the first one again, that was

364
00:17:41,560 --> 00:17:44,159
Speaker 1: really aggressive, right, I really it wasn't as bad as

365
00:17:44,160 --> 00:17:46,800
Speaker 1: people thought. Most days were totally fine. There were a

366
00:17:46,840 --> 00:17:50,160
Speaker 1: couple of nights where it was rough, but um, that

367
00:17:50,320 --> 00:17:52,680
Speaker 1: was kind of like I just knew. It was like, okay,

368
00:17:52,680 --> 00:17:54,639
Speaker 1: this is one year. It's one year. And so you know,

369
00:17:54,640 --> 00:17:56,399
Speaker 1: if you ever read the read the book, or you

370
00:17:56,440 --> 00:17:59,119
Speaker 1: know the comfort continuum, I was like, you know, the

371
00:17:59,320 --> 00:18:02,600
Speaker 1: trade off, it's comfort and profit. I was very little comfort,

372
00:18:02,720 --> 00:18:04,879
Speaker 1: very high profit. But when you have next to nothing, right,

373
00:18:04,920 --> 00:18:06,159
Speaker 1: like you said in the beginning of the show, I

374
00:18:06,160 --> 00:18:09,679
Speaker 1: had negative thirty net worth and so I had nothing.

375
00:18:10,000 --> 00:18:12,320
Speaker 1: So I need to make the return on investment that

376
00:18:12,359 --> 00:18:14,880
Speaker 1: I do have really really high so that I can

377
00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:17,600
Speaker 1: get there faster. And then as you build up your

378
00:18:17,640 --> 00:18:20,320
Speaker 1: nest egg, you need a smaller return to achieve the

379
00:18:20,359 --> 00:18:23,639
Speaker 1: same amount of passive income. And so I'm okay taking

380
00:18:23,640 --> 00:18:28,040
Speaker 1: a smaller return being less profitable, but more comfortable because

381
00:18:28,240 --> 00:18:30,840
Speaker 1: you know, I start valuing having my own room, eventually

382
00:18:30,920 --> 00:18:33,639
Speaker 1: having my own place. And now we have, like, you know,

383
00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:36,520
Speaker 1: our fully owned place with our own yard and everything.

384
00:18:36,680 --> 00:18:38,800
Speaker 1: And so it don't get me wrong, We're still gonna

385
00:18:38,800 --> 00:18:40,720
Speaker 1: house act that million dollar home. We're gonna probably rent

386
00:18:40,760 --> 00:18:42,840
Speaker 1: out the basement and put some tiny houses on the backyard,

387
00:18:43,160 --> 00:18:46,080
Speaker 1: but like very nice. You know, it's at least something

388
00:18:46,080 --> 00:18:48,800
Speaker 1: that we enjoy and and will have a really pretty

389
00:18:48,840 --> 00:18:51,000
Speaker 1: space for us. Yeah. Well, so you know, kind of

390
00:18:51,040 --> 00:18:53,240
Speaker 1: as we're at this end of the spectrum, right, you're

391
00:18:53,240 --> 00:18:56,840
Speaker 1: on the profit profitability end of the spectrum. A lot

392
00:18:56,880 --> 00:18:59,040
Speaker 1: of times you're dealing with roommates. And you know, we've

393
00:18:59,040 --> 00:19:02,560
Speaker 1: talked on the show before about screening for tenants. How

394
00:19:02,560 --> 00:19:05,280
Speaker 1: does this change the equation? Is it a similar process

395
00:19:05,359 --> 00:19:08,159
Speaker 1: or is it different when you are screening roommates. So

396
00:19:08,240 --> 00:19:11,480
Speaker 1: when you're screening roommates. Um, really, you need to look

397
00:19:11,480 --> 00:19:13,520
Speaker 1: for a background. You need to do a background check

398
00:19:13,520 --> 00:19:15,679
Speaker 1: in the credit check. I like to use a company

399
00:19:15,680 --> 00:19:18,920
Speaker 1: called a rent Ready and rent Ready. Basically you can

400
00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:22,520
Speaker 1: send your prospective tenants and application. You know, they put

401
00:19:22,560 --> 00:19:25,080
Speaker 1: in their social Security number and there whatever, and they'll

402
00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:26,840
Speaker 1: pull a background check and a C check on that.

403
00:19:27,160 --> 00:19:29,160
Speaker 1: So as long as they meet your criteria, there you're good.

404
00:19:29,600 --> 00:19:32,240
Speaker 1: You can then call and ask for employer references for

405
00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:35,080
Speaker 1: previous landlord references to make sure that they're actually at

406
00:19:35,119 --> 00:19:37,919
Speaker 1: their job and to make sure that they you know,

407
00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:40,560
Speaker 1: they didn't cause trouble for previous landlords. You know, you're

408
00:19:40,560 --> 00:19:42,280
Speaker 1: probably gonna meet them to show them the house. You

409
00:19:42,280 --> 00:19:44,080
Speaker 1: can get a pretty good feeling for who they are there,

410
00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:46,920
Speaker 1: and so they kind of check all your boxes. Then

411
00:19:46,960 --> 00:19:48,760
Speaker 1: you're like, Okay, I want to live with you, or

412
00:19:49,200 --> 00:19:51,760
Speaker 1: it's not gonna work out. Yeah, And I appreciate that

413
00:19:51,800 --> 00:19:53,960
Speaker 1: you do all those things because, honestly, Matt, and I've

414
00:19:53,960 --> 00:19:56,359
Speaker 1: said this many times on the show before, that's where

415
00:19:56,359 --> 00:19:58,680
Speaker 1: so many landlords fall flat on their face. They do

416
00:19:59,000 --> 00:20:01,480
Speaker 1: so many things well and right, and then they skip

417
00:20:01,480 --> 00:20:05,199
Speaker 1: out on the on the screening process. They don't do

418
00:20:05,240 --> 00:20:08,320
Speaker 1: a thorough job, and they don't call the previous and lords.

419
00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:11,720
Speaker 1: They don't verify employment. Uh, they're they're they're not checking

420
00:20:11,720 --> 00:20:13,639
Speaker 1: the credit score. And if you don't do all of

421
00:20:13,680 --> 00:20:16,520
Speaker 1: those things, then the chances that you're going to get

422
00:20:16,560 --> 00:20:20,560
Speaker 1: someone who doesn't pay just increase exponentially. Let's talk Craig

423
00:20:20,600 --> 00:20:23,040
Speaker 1: about your next house acts. You have the duplex, living

424
00:20:23,320 --> 00:20:26,040
Speaker 1: in the living room, essentially like two househacks in one,

425
00:20:26,560 --> 00:20:29,040
Speaker 1: and then you've got enough cash to to purchase your

426
00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:31,879
Speaker 1: next property. Where did you go from there? Yeah, so

427
00:20:31,920 --> 00:20:35,160
Speaker 1: I got a little bit smarter. I bought a five bedroom,

428
00:20:35,240 --> 00:20:37,720
Speaker 1: two bathroom house a little outside the city, probably like

429
00:20:37,760 --> 00:20:40,720
Speaker 1: seven miles north of Denver, but still right along the highway.

430
00:20:40,720 --> 00:20:42,800
Speaker 1: You can get to downtown Denver in ten fifteen minutes.

431
00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:46,359
Speaker 1: And so that one I bought, and I lived in

432
00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:48,800
Speaker 1: one bedroom and rented out the other bedrooms, right, And

433
00:20:48,840 --> 00:20:50,639
Speaker 1: so I think that's kind of you know, and I

434
00:20:50,640 --> 00:20:52,119
Speaker 1: talked about a lot about that in the book, and

435
00:20:52,160 --> 00:20:53,440
Speaker 1: so I think that's where the rent by the room

436
00:20:53,480 --> 00:20:57,400
Speaker 1: model got pretty popular. And that's probably my my recommended method,

437
00:20:57,440 --> 00:21:00,320
Speaker 1: because honestly, I actually made more on that from a

438
00:21:00,320 --> 00:21:03,800
Speaker 1: casual perspective, and it was a lot more comfortable because

439
00:21:03,840 --> 00:21:06,240
Speaker 1: I had my own bedroom with like door and a

440
00:21:06,320 --> 00:21:08,600
Speaker 1: closet and a window and and all those great things

441
00:21:08,600 --> 00:21:11,560
Speaker 1: that you'd expect in the bedroom, not just cardboard and

442
00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:14,480
Speaker 1: a curtain, a partition like you're in a hospital wing

443
00:21:14,520 --> 00:21:17,560
Speaker 1: or something that the Charlie Munger approach to building buildings

444
00:21:17,600 --> 00:21:21,240
Speaker 1: to where windows are not a priority exactly. Well, Greig, yeah,

445
00:21:21,280 --> 00:21:23,040
Speaker 1: I mean you kind of hinted at it, but you know,

446
00:21:23,080 --> 00:21:25,639
Speaker 1: in your book you talk about six different house acking

447
00:21:25,640 --> 00:21:28,240
Speaker 1: strategies that you share, and you know, it's it's nice

448
00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:30,359
Speaker 1: to know that there isn't just one way to do it.

449
00:21:30,560 --> 00:21:32,800
Speaker 1: There are like a few different flavors. And so what

450
00:21:33,119 --> 00:21:34,680
Speaker 1: are some of the different, you know, some of your

451
00:21:34,680 --> 00:21:38,320
Speaker 1: favorite house acking strategies that folks can implement. You actually

452
00:21:38,359 --> 00:21:40,320
Speaker 1: just kind of hinted at one of them or at

453
00:21:40,320 --> 00:21:42,159
Speaker 1: one end of the spectrum talking about the trailer in

454
00:21:42,200 --> 00:21:44,119
Speaker 1: the yard thing, But that is actually one of the

455
00:21:44,119 --> 00:21:46,800
Speaker 1: approaches you talk about. Yeah, I mean I know plenty

456
00:21:46,840 --> 00:21:48,480
Speaker 1: of people that have done that. I know it's very

457
00:21:48,520 --> 00:21:52,080
Speaker 1: common amongst like rock climbers and kind of van life

458
00:21:52,119 --> 00:21:54,280
Speaker 1: for people they're like, well, I do this anyway, So

459
00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:57,360
Speaker 1: why not buy a house and rented out? And so

460
00:21:57,680 --> 00:21:59,320
Speaker 1: that's kind of one end of the spectrum, right, that's

461
00:21:59,359 --> 00:22:02,080
Speaker 1: like the profit of ability side of the spectrum. The

462
00:22:02,119 --> 00:22:04,159
Speaker 1: other side is the comfort ability. Now, this is what

463
00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:06,840
Speaker 1: I recommend families, and you know people that are like, oh,

464
00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:08,840
Speaker 1: I don't want to live with people do right, So

465
00:22:08,880 --> 00:22:11,560
Speaker 1: you're you're at the utmost comfort side. It's still better

466
00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:13,760
Speaker 1: than not doing it at all, but you just won't

467
00:22:13,760 --> 00:22:16,920
Speaker 1: profit as much. So you can buy a house with

468
00:22:17,359 --> 00:22:19,359
Speaker 1: you know, the house of your dreams basically right like

469
00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:21,879
Speaker 1: you name it. You've got the Florida glass ceiling windows,

470
00:22:21,880 --> 00:22:24,000
Speaker 1: the pool in the back, whatever, whatever you need. But

471
00:22:24,080 --> 00:22:26,040
Speaker 1: maybe you have like an additional dwelling unit in the

472
00:22:26,080 --> 00:22:29,040
Speaker 1: back right where you can rent out that one bed,

473
00:22:29,080 --> 00:22:31,159
Speaker 1: one bath or two bed, one bath a d U

474
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:34,800
Speaker 1: and you can rent that on Airbnb. That brings in

475
00:22:34,840 --> 00:22:37,399
Speaker 1: you know, maybe that covers half your mortgage. So instead

476
00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:39,119
Speaker 1: of paying three thousand dollars a month for your mortgage,

477
00:22:39,160 --> 00:22:42,240
Speaker 1: you're paying a month. That's still a massive savings and

478
00:22:42,280 --> 00:22:45,000
Speaker 1: you still come out very far ahead. You know. Another way,

479
00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:46,520
Speaker 1: if you can't find a house with an a d U,

480
00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:48,720
Speaker 1: which because those are a little bit uncommon. Maybe you

481
00:22:48,760 --> 00:22:50,960
Speaker 1: can find a house that you can section off, Maybe

482
00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:52,679
Speaker 1: you can section off the basement and you rent out

483
00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:55,360
Speaker 1: the basement on Airbnb. That brings in. You know, that's

484
00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:58,000
Speaker 1: what we're kind of doing now. Uh. You know, buy

485
00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:01,080
Speaker 1: mortgagees three thousand dollars a month and we're making up

486
00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:03,400
Speaker 1: we're you know, going to make about three thousand dollars

487
00:23:03,400 --> 00:23:05,399
Speaker 1: a month in Airbnb. So I'm living on the top floor,

488
00:23:05,520 --> 00:23:08,639
Speaker 1: three bed, two bath, me and my fiancee. You know,

489
00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:11,320
Speaker 1: we're living basically for free in a great area. So

490
00:23:11,400 --> 00:23:14,040
Speaker 1: you know, it's a win win all around. So basically

491
00:23:14,119 --> 00:23:17,120
Speaker 1: you're saying, like there's a spectrum and uh and and

492
00:23:17,920 --> 00:23:21,320
Speaker 1: almost everybody you think can get in on at one

493
00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:24,080
Speaker 1: end of the spectrum or somewhere in the middle based

494
00:23:24,119 --> 00:23:27,800
Speaker 1: on kind of their desire for privacy and profitability. And yeah,

495
00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:30,840
Speaker 1: you're right, Greig, because that I think for me, Yeah,

496
00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:32,440
Speaker 1: I was willing to do the roommate model, do the

497
00:23:32,480 --> 00:23:34,840
Speaker 1: duplex model, and now that I've got like three kids.

498
00:23:34,880 --> 00:23:36,520
Speaker 1: We even't did the duplex model with a with a

499
00:23:36,560 --> 00:23:39,280
Speaker 1: tenant in the back for years while we had kids.

500
00:23:39,280 --> 00:23:41,000
Speaker 1: But now we've got three kids and we're like, now,

501
00:23:41,160 --> 00:23:42,640
Speaker 1: we don't want to mess with that, but we would

502
00:23:42,640 --> 00:23:44,520
Speaker 1: totally do the a du thing. And so I think, yeah,

503
00:23:44,800 --> 00:23:47,640
Speaker 1: as like your needs change as your life changes, Like

504
00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:51,560
Speaker 1: there's there's something on that spectrum for everybody. Uh, if

505
00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:54,800
Speaker 1: you care about like saving money and potentially living for free,

506
00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:57,600
Speaker 1: right for sure? Yeah, And again it's your largest expense.

507
00:23:57,600 --> 00:23:59,480
Speaker 1: So I think if you can if you can knock

508
00:23:59,520 --> 00:24:02,040
Speaker 1: a signific can amount off of that, you can have

509
00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:04,359
Speaker 1: all the coffees you want, right and like you know,

510
00:24:04,400 --> 00:24:06,360
Speaker 1: if you can buy the organic protace, it doesn't matter.

511
00:24:06,480 --> 00:24:08,720
Speaker 1: Just like my thing is like keep the housing and

512
00:24:08,760 --> 00:24:11,840
Speaker 1: transportation costs low and the rest of your legal take

513
00:24:11,840 --> 00:24:14,040
Speaker 1: care of itself. Yeah, yeah, well, Craig, I want to

514
00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:16,399
Speaker 1: kind of get specific to about some numbers when it

515
00:24:16,480 --> 00:24:20,240
Speaker 1: comes to maintaining a property. Oftentimes you hear like put

516
00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:21,960
Speaker 1: one percent of the of the value of the home

517
00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:25,760
Speaker 1: towards maintenance and repair. With these maybe shorter term rentals,

518
00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:28,919
Speaker 1: whether they're on Airbnb or just with when you're cycling

519
00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:30,840
Speaker 1: three more, folks, I can imagine that there's going to

520
00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:34,560
Speaker 1: be potentially more damage to a property. Do you change

521
00:24:34,560 --> 00:24:37,280
Speaker 1: the amount of money that you set aside to handle

522
00:24:37,359 --> 00:24:40,480
Speaker 1: those repairs. It's funny, actually the short term rentals are

523
00:24:40,720 --> 00:24:42,920
Speaker 1: less they're less changing. You know, I was going to

524
00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:46,240
Speaker 1: ask that because I found that it never got super dirty. Yeah,

525
00:24:46,520 --> 00:24:48,720
Speaker 1: whenever someone is only there for just like a day

526
00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:51,720
Speaker 1: or two. Uh, it never gets super grimy in there, right, exactly,

527
00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:54,400
Speaker 1: Cleaners coming in two or three times a week. They're

528
00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:58,040
Speaker 1: probably not using the appliances and stuff because they're probably

529
00:24:58,040 --> 00:25:00,400
Speaker 1: going out to eat. They're hardly ever, they're because who

530
00:25:00,400 --> 00:25:03,080
Speaker 1: comes to a house just just to stay in the airbnb? Right?

531
00:25:03,080 --> 00:25:05,040
Speaker 1: Who comes to a city just to stay in the airbnb?

532
00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:07,760
Speaker 1: And so you find that there's actually not a lot

533
00:25:07,760 --> 00:25:10,080
Speaker 1: of damage done. I mean maybe they like knock a

534
00:25:10,119 --> 00:25:12,640
Speaker 1: suitcase into the corner and there's a chip here and there,

535
00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:15,560
Speaker 1: but you know, those are easy enough to fix. Um,

536
00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:18,280
Speaker 1: it's it's the long term tenants that have their you know,

537
00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:21,200
Speaker 1: their curry sitting in the pot that starts to make

538
00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:26,200
Speaker 1: the walls turn orange or whatever is really the damaging stuff. Gotcha. Yeah,

539
00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:27,800
Speaker 1: all right, Okay, we got a few more questions to

540
00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:30,320
Speaker 1: get to include. We want to talk about like where

541
00:25:30,359 --> 00:25:33,840
Speaker 1: do you go location wise to get the most successful

542
00:25:33,880 --> 00:25:36,040
Speaker 1: house ACKs? Will We'll get to that question and some

543
00:25:36,119 --> 00:25:47,480
Speaker 1: others for you right after this break. All right, we're

544
00:25:47,520 --> 00:25:50,920
Speaker 1: back again. We're talking with Craig curl Op about house

545
00:25:50,960 --> 00:25:54,679
Speaker 1: acking and like Joel alluded to before the break, Craig,

546
00:25:54,840 --> 00:25:56,760
Speaker 1: you know, real estate in general, it's all about location

547
00:25:57,240 --> 00:25:59,679
Speaker 1: and when it comes to house acking, like how do

548
00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:02,360
Speaker 1: is what part of the country you live in impact

549
00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:05,760
Speaker 1: your ability to successfully house hack. You mentioned how you

550
00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 1: had that smaller duplex there in the city, but you

551
00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:11,240
Speaker 1: found it to be more profitable further out of the city.

552
00:26:11,560 --> 00:26:13,199
Speaker 1: Is there a dynamic that folks you keep in mind

553
00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:16,840
Speaker 1: when it comes to house hacking and a more suburban

554
00:26:16,840 --> 00:26:20,199
Speaker 1: area versus a more urban environment for sure. So so

555
00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:22,240
Speaker 1: there's a bit of a trade off, right I say

556
00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:25,120
Speaker 1: that property didn't cash flow me that well, Um, but

557
00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:27,399
Speaker 1: you know a few years later it really does. It

558
00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:29,160
Speaker 1: cash flows and you four a thousand dollars a month,

559
00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:31,359
Speaker 1: And because it's in such a great area, it's also

560
00:26:31,359 --> 00:26:34,160
Speaker 1: appreciated by far the most out of any property. So

561
00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:36,640
Speaker 1: appreciation is how you really get rich in real estate.

562
00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:38,919
Speaker 1: So if that's kind of your goal, like from a

563
00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:41,520
Speaker 1: net worth perspective, Um, you know they're being in the

564
00:26:41,520 --> 00:26:42,720
Speaker 1: city is okay, But you just have to know what

565
00:26:42,760 --> 00:26:45,240
Speaker 1: you're getting into, right, Like, if you're in San Diego

566
00:26:45,359 --> 00:26:47,640
Speaker 1: or l A or something like that, Like it's gonna

567
00:26:47,680 --> 00:26:50,760
Speaker 1: be hard to you know, get a property that's gonna

568
00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:52,320
Speaker 1: cash on a thousand dollars a month, but it's gonna

569
00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:55,399
Speaker 1: appreciate probably a couple hundred grand next year. Right, So, um,

570
00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:57,240
Speaker 1: there's that trade off that you need to think about.

571
00:26:58,080 --> 00:26:59,960
Speaker 1: One thing that I really like are kind of these

572
00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:04,439
Speaker 1: like secondary tier cities, right, Like think about Denver, right,

573
00:27:04,480 --> 00:27:06,440
Speaker 1: you definitely would not put that in the same ballpark

574
00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:09,679
Speaker 1: as l A, San Diego, San Francisco, Boston, Chicago, New York, right,

575
00:27:09,680 --> 00:27:12,119
Speaker 1: Like those are cities of their own. But like think

576
00:27:12,160 --> 00:27:15,120
Speaker 1: about like a Denver or a Seattle or in Austin word,

577
00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:17,639
Speaker 1: like the average person can pretty much still buy a

578
00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:20,320
Speaker 1: home in these cities, and especially in the suburbs. And

579
00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:22,920
Speaker 1: so getting out into the suburbs, right and some people

580
00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:24,720
Speaker 1: want to want to live acquired for life. And there's

581
00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:27,640
Speaker 1: they're bigger, you know, they're bigger homes, there's more bedrooms

582
00:27:27,640 --> 00:27:30,760
Speaker 1: that you can potentially rent out, there's a yard for

583
00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:34,359
Speaker 1: the dog, and so being out in the suburbs in

584
00:27:34,440 --> 00:27:38,360
Speaker 1: growing cities is really good because as that city grows, right,

585
00:27:38,359 --> 00:27:40,119
Speaker 1: it's going to grow from the city of the center

586
00:27:40,119 --> 00:27:43,440
Speaker 1: the city center outward and so eventually you know your

587
00:27:43,480 --> 00:27:46,600
Speaker 1: housing is going to appreciate quite a bit. So one

588
00:27:46,600 --> 00:27:48,680
Speaker 1: of the things you mentioned too was being close to

589
00:27:48,840 --> 00:27:52,199
Speaker 1: work and and you know prior you prioritize biking, which

590
00:27:52,640 --> 00:27:55,280
Speaker 1: we're with you on that is that do you like

591
00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:58,800
Speaker 1: when it comes to infrastructure and specific location in a

592
00:27:58,880 --> 00:28:03,240
Speaker 1: city beyond just the like suburbs versus like interior of

593
00:28:03,240 --> 00:28:05,720
Speaker 1: the city debate, like what else are you looking for?

594
00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:08,399
Speaker 1: What other amenities nearby? Are you saying? Like that's going

595
00:28:08,440 --> 00:28:11,520
Speaker 1: to make this house hack more successful than maybe another one.

596
00:28:12,720 --> 00:28:15,200
Speaker 1: So if you can get somewhere close to public transportation,

597
00:28:15,480 --> 00:28:17,719
Speaker 1: that's a pretty big bonus. And it also depends on

598
00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:20,119
Speaker 1: what city you're in, right, Um, I know Denver is

599
00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:22,440
Speaker 1: really not huge and their public transportation, but it's still

600
00:28:22,520 --> 00:28:25,000
Speaker 1: like a nice little perk, right if you can kind

601
00:28:25,000 --> 00:28:28,000
Speaker 1: of walk or a short ride or maybe even a

602
00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:32,640
Speaker 1: bike ride to restaurants and um in bars, that's superplus.

603
00:28:33,320 --> 00:28:35,359
Speaker 1: My first three house ACKs, I really wanted to be

604
00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:38,560
Speaker 1: close to bike paths because I like to bike to work,

605
00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:40,800
Speaker 1: and so in biking on the bike path is a

606
00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:43,719
Speaker 1: lot more pleasant than biking on the streets and stopping

607
00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:46,600
Speaker 1: at every red light and whatnot, So that was kind

608
00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:49,800
Speaker 1: of a priority for me. But again, like I would say,

609
00:28:49,880 --> 00:28:52,360
Speaker 1: most people probably aren't riding their bikes to work, and

610
00:28:52,360 --> 00:28:54,200
Speaker 1: it was just like a thing for me, So I

611
00:28:54,200 --> 00:28:57,160
Speaker 1: could also cut down on my transportation costs. Right yeah,

612
00:28:57,200 --> 00:28:59,680
Speaker 1: and again that's the second largest line item on our

613
00:28:59,680 --> 00:29:01,680
Speaker 1: monthly budgets. Right, yeah, you're killing two birds with one

614
00:29:01,720 --> 00:29:04,760
Speaker 1: stone by being on the bike path in that duplex. So, Craig,

615
00:29:04,800 --> 00:29:06,440
Speaker 1: you know, let's talk about debt. Let's talk about leverage

616
00:29:06,440 --> 00:29:08,880
Speaker 1: a little bit. Obviously, you believe that it can be

617
00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:12,040
Speaker 1: used well, right, it can be powerful in helping folks

618
00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:15,280
Speaker 1: to accelerate their wealth building potential, But you can also

619
00:29:15,320 --> 00:29:18,000
Speaker 1: get in over your head with too much leverage. Are

620
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:20,720
Speaker 1: you worried about folks who might be taking things too

621
00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:24,360
Speaker 1: far and over extending themselves. I'm not worried about anyone

622
00:29:24,480 --> 00:29:27,960
Speaker 1: who who educates himself, anyone who's listening to this podcast,

623
00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:31,960
Speaker 1: anyone who's actually, you know, wisely buying properties, right, Like

624
00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:35,120
Speaker 1: I would be scared if someone was over leveraging a

625
00:29:35,160 --> 00:29:37,720
Speaker 1: property that they wouldn't be able to cash flow, right,

626
00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:39,760
Speaker 1: But like as long like the name of the game

627
00:29:39,880 --> 00:29:44,360
Speaker 1: is like can you service your mortgages if the market

628
00:29:44,400 --> 00:29:47,760
Speaker 1: were to decline? And so if you can, then you

629
00:29:47,760 --> 00:29:51,000
Speaker 1: won't be over leveraged, right, I mean I've got so

630
00:29:51,080 --> 00:29:54,080
Speaker 1: much debt, right, but they're all mortgages. It's probably like

631
00:29:54,320 --> 00:29:57,480
Speaker 1: three or four million dollars worth of debt, which may

632
00:29:57,520 --> 00:29:59,880
Speaker 1: scare a lot of people. But I don't pay it off, right,

633
00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:03,520
Speaker 1: tenants do. And so you know, if all my tenants

634
00:30:03,560 --> 00:30:06,560
Speaker 1: were to move out, then you know, then that would

635
00:30:06,560 --> 00:30:08,959
Speaker 1: be a problem. But like the odds of that happening

636
00:30:08,960 --> 00:30:11,160
Speaker 1: are just so low, right, and so you have to

637
00:30:11,240 --> 00:30:14,280
Speaker 1: like play your odds wisely. So, so what numbers are

638
00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:16,480
Speaker 1: you crunching than Craig, Like, as you're looking at a

639
00:30:16,520 --> 00:30:20,520
Speaker 1: property and you're saying, like, what are the specific numbers

640
00:30:20,520 --> 00:30:22,640
Speaker 1: that you're looking at to say, yes, this one works, yes,

641
00:30:22,680 --> 00:30:25,360
Speaker 1: this one doesn't. That's definitely one I want to buy

642
00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:27,320
Speaker 1: and invest in because I think it's gonna make sense.

643
00:30:27,520 --> 00:30:29,880
Speaker 1: And especially when you're talking about different ways of making money,

644
00:30:29,880 --> 00:30:34,160
Speaker 1: whether it's an airbnb, right, Uh, that's that's a different way,

645
00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:36,960
Speaker 1: potentially more lucrative but there's like a little more risk

646
00:30:37,040 --> 00:30:41,680
Speaker 1: reward there versus like a long term lease on a property, Like, yeah,

647
00:30:41,760 --> 00:30:43,480
Speaker 1: what numbers are you running and how are you figuring

648
00:30:43,520 --> 00:30:46,240
Speaker 1: out whether this is like going to be profitable for you,

649
00:30:46,280 --> 00:30:47,960
Speaker 1: like in the short term and in the long term

650
00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:51,240
Speaker 1: for sure? Yeah, I love that question. So the first

651
00:30:51,240 --> 00:30:52,800
Speaker 1: thing you want to do is obviously talk to a

652
00:30:52,880 --> 00:30:55,040
Speaker 1: lender and figure out what your monthly payment will be

653
00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:57,760
Speaker 1: because everyone's interest rate will be different all that stuff.

654
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:00,840
Speaker 1: So what's your principal interest, taxes, insurance in your p

655
00:31:01,000 --> 00:31:03,080
Speaker 1: m I every single month? Right? And so you know

656
00:31:03,160 --> 00:31:05,520
Speaker 1: those are physics fixed expenses that you need to pay

657
00:31:05,600 --> 00:31:09,480
Speaker 1: each month. And then you go to you know, rent

658
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:13,160
Speaker 1: Dometer or Zilla or whatever when you look at comps

659
00:31:13,160 --> 00:31:15,480
Speaker 1: and you figure out, okay, like what can this place

660
00:31:15,640 --> 00:31:18,960
Speaker 1: rent for? Now? If you're in a city like in Denver,

661
00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:21,600
Speaker 1: You're you're hardly ever going to find like a single

662
00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:23,720
Speaker 1: family house that can rent out as a single family

663
00:31:23,920 --> 00:31:25,920
Speaker 1: the house and totally cash flow to the way you

664
00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:28,480
Speaker 1: wanted to be. But like I look for, can I

665
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:30,880
Speaker 1: split this single family house up into two units? Right?

666
00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:34,640
Speaker 1: Like it does the layout easily accommodate that? And if

667
00:31:34,640 --> 00:31:36,160
Speaker 1: it does. I'm like, okay, well I can get a

668
00:31:36,160 --> 00:31:38,720
Speaker 1: lot more if I split this up. And so I

669
00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:41,760
Speaker 1: like to show I like to make a thousand dollars

670
00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:46,200
Speaker 1: over my mortgage in rent without me living there. So um,

671
00:31:46,240 --> 00:31:48,120
Speaker 1: and how that looks is just you know, a thousand

672
00:31:48,200 --> 00:31:50,680
Speaker 1: words over the mortgage. That'll be enough for me to

673
00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:53,840
Speaker 1: cover any vacancy, any repairs, any maintenance, all that kind

674
00:31:53,840 --> 00:31:56,120
Speaker 1: of stuff. And that's just kind of my number. Different

675
00:31:56,160 --> 00:31:59,120
Speaker 1: things work for different people. My most recent purchase, you know,

676
00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:01,400
Speaker 1: our mortgages three thousand, we expect that we could rent

677
00:32:01,400 --> 00:32:03,959
Speaker 1: out if we didn't do Airbnb. We expect we can

678
00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:07,080
Speaker 1: rent the top out and we can rent the bottom

679
00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:09,920
Speaker 1: out for I think like eighteen hundred or so. So

680
00:32:10,800 --> 00:32:13,240
Speaker 1: that's about four thousand dollars or three thousand dollar mortgage,

681
00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:16,320
Speaker 1: Like it kind of pencils out on Airbnb. However, right,

682
00:32:16,320 --> 00:32:18,160
Speaker 1: I'm gonna be able to rent out the bottom for

683
00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:21,000
Speaker 1: even more. And so like I'm so, I have got

684
00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:23,959
Speaker 1: multiple strategies that can get me to that thousand dollars,

685
00:32:24,360 --> 00:32:26,160
Speaker 1: you know, and in the thousand dollars is just my number, right,

686
00:32:26,160 --> 00:32:28,520
Speaker 1: you might be comfortable with five hundred and and I'm

687
00:32:28,560 --> 00:32:29,960
Speaker 1: not saying that would be a bad deal. I would

688
00:32:29,960 --> 00:32:32,400
Speaker 1: say it's it's more important to act quicker than it

689
00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:34,440
Speaker 1: is to like make sure that your number is exactly

690
00:32:34,600 --> 00:32:36,120
Speaker 1: pencil out when it comes to hot secking, And you

691
00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:38,000
Speaker 1: probably want to be a little conservative when you're running

692
00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:39,959
Speaker 1: these numbers two, Right, you don't want to assume that

693
00:32:40,040 --> 00:32:42,720
Speaker 1: if you put it on Airbnb, that it's rented out

694
00:32:42,960 --> 00:32:45,120
Speaker 1: twenty eight nights out of the month. You might want

695
00:32:45,120 --> 00:32:47,120
Speaker 1: to assume that it's gonna be renting out for seventeen

696
00:32:47,160 --> 00:32:48,880
Speaker 1: or eighteen nights out of the month, and just make

697
00:32:48,920 --> 00:32:52,320
Speaker 1: sure that you're not like over assuming the income that

698
00:32:52,320 --> 00:32:55,040
Speaker 1: that property can provide. Yeah, I would say you don't

699
00:32:55,040 --> 00:32:56,880
Speaker 1: want to be over conservative, but you also don't want

700
00:32:56,920 --> 00:32:59,080
Speaker 1: to be so conservative that you're scared and you don't

701
00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:02,920
Speaker 1: take action. Because with house hacking, it's it's more like

702
00:33:03,400 --> 00:33:05,440
Speaker 1: any other type of real estate investing. Yeah, you want

703
00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:08,080
Speaker 1: to get like the best deal, but when your house hacking,

704
00:33:08,440 --> 00:33:10,440
Speaker 1: it's all about the timer, right, Like, so your timer

705
00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:12,720
Speaker 1: doesn't start until you close on that first deal, and

706
00:33:12,760 --> 00:33:14,360
Speaker 1: then you can buy the second one third, one fourth

707
00:33:14,400 --> 00:33:16,400
Speaker 1: one and that's where the power comes in. You're not

708
00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:18,240
Speaker 1: gonna get that rich off one house. You're not gonna

709
00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:20,280
Speaker 1: get that much passive income up one house, and so

710
00:33:20,320 --> 00:33:23,479
Speaker 1: you can get a killer deal and you may makes

711
00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:25,240
Speaker 1: of cash flow instead of a thousand dollars a month

712
00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:28,040
Speaker 1: cash flow. But I'd rather have two houses making a

713
00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:31,480
Speaker 1: thousand dollars each basically in like thirteen months than having

714
00:33:32,040 --> 00:33:35,680
Speaker 1: two houses making three thousand dollars in two years. Right, Yeah,

715
00:33:35,680 --> 00:33:38,000
Speaker 1: this is one of those instances where for you having

716
00:33:38,000 --> 00:33:40,560
Speaker 1: it be pretty damn good is going to be better, uh,

717
00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:44,160
Speaker 1: multiple times than having perfection staring you in the face. Right,

718
00:33:44,720 --> 00:33:47,240
Speaker 1: exactly right. So Craig, you know, like we've talked about

719
00:33:47,280 --> 00:33:49,600
Speaker 1: the passive income obviously that's one of the benefits of

720
00:33:50,200 --> 00:33:52,480
Speaker 1: house hacking, but you know you're not a c p A.

721
00:33:52,600 --> 00:33:54,920
Speaker 1: But you're right about the tax benefits as well. When

722
00:33:54,920 --> 00:33:57,040
Speaker 1: it comes to investing in real estate. What are the

723
00:33:57,240 --> 00:34:00,720
Speaker 1: top tax perks of house hacking? So the biggest one

724
00:34:00,760 --> 00:34:02,720
Speaker 1: is that you can write off a lot of the

725
00:34:02,800 --> 00:34:05,240
Speaker 1: things in your house that you wouldn't typically write off,

726
00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:10,160
Speaker 1: think like toilet paper, dish soap plates, bowls, forks, nis,

727
00:34:10,280 --> 00:34:13,040
Speaker 1: especially if you leave them with your house when you leave, right,

728
00:34:13,080 --> 00:34:16,040
Speaker 1: So it's it's housemade items. Also, the one of the

729
00:34:16,040 --> 00:34:20,040
Speaker 1: biggest things is depreciation. Depreciation is probably the biggest thing,

730
00:34:20,719 --> 00:34:22,719
Speaker 1: the biggest tax right off that you get, right, And

731
00:34:22,760 --> 00:34:25,520
Speaker 1: so the I R S says that your house will

732
00:34:25,560 --> 00:34:28,400
Speaker 1: depreciate to a zero dollar value over twenty seven and

733
00:34:28,400 --> 00:34:31,440
Speaker 1: a half years, so they allow you to take that reduction.

734
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:34,080
Speaker 1: You know, let's say it's a five thousand dollar house.

735
00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:36,920
Speaker 1: You divide up by twenty seven and a half and

736
00:34:36,960 --> 00:34:38,719
Speaker 1: whatever that number is, you can take that as a

737
00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:41,680
Speaker 1: deduction on your taxes year over year over year for

738
00:34:41,719 --> 00:34:43,960
Speaker 1: the next twenty seven and a half years. Right, And

739
00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:46,920
Speaker 1: so let's say you make I don't know, twenty dollars

740
00:34:46,960 --> 00:34:49,840
Speaker 1: on your rental property, Well, you're acting. Typically you'd be

741
00:34:49,840 --> 00:34:52,520
Speaker 1: taxed on that, like if you made and a job

742
00:34:52,560 --> 00:34:55,520
Speaker 1: to be taxed on it. But because you've got that depreciation,

743
00:34:55,600 --> 00:34:57,719
Speaker 1: it will offset that. And if you end up with

744
00:34:57,760 --> 00:35:02,239
Speaker 1: a negative number, which oftentimes you do in deppreciation, you

745
00:35:02,280 --> 00:35:05,360
Speaker 1: can actually offset that to your regular W two income.

746
00:35:05,880 --> 00:35:07,480
Speaker 1: And so you can actually like let's say you make

747
00:35:07,520 --> 00:35:11,320
Speaker 1: a hundred thousand dollars a year from your job and

748
00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:14,839
Speaker 1: after the depreciation, all that your rental property taxes show

749
00:35:14,880 --> 00:35:18,000
Speaker 1: that you lost twenty dollars you'r. The I R S

750
00:35:18,040 --> 00:35:19,960
Speaker 1: will show that, hey, you actually know you only made

751
00:35:19,960 --> 00:35:22,399
Speaker 1: eighty thousand dollars this year, so you could potentially lower

752
00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:26,000
Speaker 1: your tax brackets or lower percentage tax as well as

753
00:35:26,000 --> 00:35:28,960
Speaker 1: the amount you're actually tax on. And so that you know,

754
00:35:29,480 --> 00:35:31,719
Speaker 1: in itself is super powerful. And that's how you see

755
00:35:31,760 --> 00:35:34,520
Speaker 1: a lot of people who are like really rich, uh,

756
00:35:34,719 --> 00:35:37,440
Speaker 1: don't pay any taxes because they buy these massive buildings

757
00:35:37,480 --> 00:35:40,200
Speaker 1: and take a massive depreciation expenses on them. There you

758
00:35:40,239 --> 00:35:42,560
Speaker 1: go a little tax hack in addition to the house hack,

759
00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:45,920
Speaker 1: a little two hacks in one. But I'm not an

760
00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:48,360
Speaker 1: account so right now, but it's true. It's true. I

761
00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:51,120
Speaker 1: mean that is That is definitely one of the things

762
00:35:51,120 --> 00:35:54,120
Speaker 1: about real estate investing. It it can be helpful from

763
00:35:54,120 --> 00:35:57,920
Speaker 1: a tax perspective. Even though your house isn't necessarily depreciating,

764
00:35:57,960 --> 00:36:00,200
Speaker 1: the I R S says that it is, and that

765
00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:04,040
Speaker 1: helps you out when it comes to your bottom line. Um, craig,

766
00:36:04,280 --> 00:36:06,560
Speaker 1: just final thoughts, what else do do people need to

767
00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:08,560
Speaker 1: know about house hacking that we didn't cover? Do you

768
00:36:08,560 --> 00:36:10,719
Speaker 1: have any parting words of wisdom for somebody who's like,

769
00:36:10,880 --> 00:36:13,799
Speaker 1: all right, I'm intrigued and I feel like, obviously it's done.

770
00:36:13,880 --> 00:36:16,480
Speaker 1: It's been great for Craig and they've they've heard Matt

771
00:36:16,480 --> 00:36:18,719
Speaker 1: and I stories over the years about how real estate

772
00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:21,439
Speaker 1: investing has been helpful. Obviously we have not house hacked

773
00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:23,719
Speaker 1: to the degree that you have. But yeah, what are

774
00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:25,000
Speaker 1: what are the final things that you would say to

775
00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:27,680
Speaker 1: them at the end of this episode. I would say,

776
00:36:27,719 --> 00:36:29,600
Speaker 1: make sure you know. I would say you need to

777
00:36:29,640 --> 00:36:32,200
Speaker 1: take action. And one thing that will make your life

778
00:36:32,239 --> 00:36:35,319
Speaker 1: a lot easier is finding a team that knows what

779
00:36:35,360 --> 00:36:38,920
Speaker 1: you're doing. So, you know, finding an investor, friendly realtor,

780
00:36:39,200 --> 00:36:41,399
Speaker 1: finding someone that has house acts of their own. Finding

781
00:36:41,440 --> 00:36:44,920
Speaker 1: someone that invests on their own will allow you, you know,

782
00:36:44,960 --> 00:36:46,839
Speaker 1: they'll be able to help you, you know, figure out

783
00:36:46,880 --> 00:36:48,560
Speaker 1: what house works, what house does it. They'll be able

784
00:36:48,600 --> 00:36:51,040
Speaker 1: to help you. They probably have a whole list of

785
00:36:51,120 --> 00:36:53,400
Speaker 1: vendors of contractors and stuff they work with. They have

786
00:36:53,640 --> 00:36:56,120
Speaker 1: lenders that understand house hacking can help you qualify for

787
00:36:56,120 --> 00:36:58,400
Speaker 1: the second house. So just having a team in a

788
00:36:58,440 --> 00:37:00,640
Speaker 1: community that knows what you're doing will beach mendestly helpful.

789
00:37:00,680 --> 00:37:02,000
Speaker 1: And so if there's one thing you do, I would

790
00:37:02,040 --> 00:37:05,160
Speaker 1: recommend doing that nice And of course that is what

791
00:37:05,200 --> 00:37:08,200
Speaker 1: you do because you are a realtor and that's something

792
00:37:08,239 --> 00:37:10,520
Speaker 1: that I know that you do for your clients. There, Craig,

793
00:37:11,120 --> 00:37:13,319
Speaker 1: But man, we really appreciate you coming on the show.

794
00:37:13,360 --> 00:37:15,960
Speaker 1: We appreciate you talking about not only your personal journey

795
00:37:16,239 --> 00:37:18,880
Speaker 1: with house hacking, but sharing how it is that others

796
00:37:18,920 --> 00:37:21,920
Speaker 1: out there, like honestly, wherever they are in life, like

797
00:37:21,960 --> 00:37:25,160
Speaker 1: whatever their family status, there are different ways that you

798
00:37:25,200 --> 00:37:27,839
Speaker 1: can house hack yourself. And so, uh, yeah, where can

799
00:37:27,920 --> 00:37:30,640
Speaker 1: listeners learn more about you and what you're up to. Yeah,

800
00:37:30,680 --> 00:37:33,560
Speaker 1: So we have a podcast of our own. It's called

801
00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:36,399
Speaker 1: invest to five or actually we're rebranding to invest to five,

802
00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:38,720
Speaker 1: but it's also called the five Team Podcast. So search

803
00:37:38,760 --> 00:37:41,200
Speaker 1: either one of those and you'll you'll se you'll find us,

804
00:37:41,680 --> 00:37:44,239
Speaker 1: and also on Instagram and TikTok I am at the

805
00:37:44,239 --> 00:37:46,520
Speaker 1: five Guy. Awesome, Well, Craig will link to all that

806
00:37:46,560 --> 00:37:49,160
Speaker 1: stuff in the show notes. Hey, we really really appreciate

807
00:37:49,160 --> 00:37:51,400
Speaker 1: you joining us today. I appreciate you guys having me on.

808
00:37:51,480 --> 00:37:54,680
Speaker 1: It's been a pleasure. All right, what an information laden episode.

809
00:37:54,719 --> 00:37:56,399
Speaker 1: I feel like we just had. We had a lot

810
00:37:56,400 --> 00:37:59,000
Speaker 1: of questions for Craig and he brought the answers. We

811
00:37:59,200 --> 00:38:01,160
Speaker 1: were able to talk through just a ton of the

812
00:38:01,160 --> 00:38:04,120
Speaker 1: different things that folks need to keep in mind as

813
00:38:04,160 --> 00:38:06,440
Speaker 1: they are thinking through First of all, just you know,

814
00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:09,520
Speaker 1: thinking about their homes differently, right, Like it's almost like

815
00:38:09,520 --> 00:38:11,960
Speaker 1: this mindset shift that needs to take place in order

816
00:38:11,960 --> 00:38:14,960
Speaker 1: for you to think about your first especially your first home,

817
00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:16,719
Speaker 1: not as a place that you're gonna be living out

818
00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:18,640
Speaker 1: for the rest of your life, but thinking about it

819
00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:21,640
Speaker 1: like like a stepping stone. They're building blocks that are

820
00:38:21,680 --> 00:38:24,400
Speaker 1: going to get you closer to financial freedom. But that

821
00:38:24,440 --> 00:38:27,200
Speaker 1: wasn't my big takeaway, by the way, But what what

822
00:38:27,239 --> 00:38:29,279
Speaker 1: was your what was your big your key takeaway for

823
00:38:29,320 --> 00:38:31,319
Speaker 1: this episode? Yeah, this is definitely a topic near and

824
00:38:31,320 --> 00:38:33,840
Speaker 1: dear to both of our hearts as real estate investors

825
00:38:33,880 --> 00:38:36,879
Speaker 1: and has people who have seen just the reality that

826
00:38:37,040 --> 00:38:40,080
Speaker 1: investing in real estate and house hacking can dramatically lower

827
00:38:40,120 --> 00:38:43,440
Speaker 1: your housing expenses, can just make you more nimble, more flexible,

828
00:38:43,480 --> 00:38:46,520
Speaker 1: provide more financial freedom. And so yeah, it was like

829
00:38:46,920 --> 00:38:48,600
Speaker 1: we we know this, We've talked about it, but let's

830
00:38:48,600 --> 00:38:50,200
Speaker 1: talk to the let's talk to the expert, the guy

831
00:38:50,200 --> 00:38:51,680
Speaker 1: who wrote the book on it, and and Craig is

832
00:38:51,680 --> 00:38:53,680
Speaker 1: definitely that and so yeah, I don't I think My

833
00:38:53,760 --> 00:38:57,279
Speaker 1: big takeaway was just the spectrum. I think sometimes when

834
00:38:57,280 --> 00:38:59,440
Speaker 1: we talk about house hacking, it sounds like maybe some

835
00:38:59,480 --> 00:39:01,279
Speaker 1: of our listener might too not they might be like, well,

836
00:39:01,719 --> 00:39:04,000
Speaker 1: I don't want to own a quadplex and where they're like,

837
00:39:04,040 --> 00:39:05,880
Speaker 1: I don't want to have to share up my bedroom

838
00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:07,960
Speaker 1: exactly if they don't want to do it. Craig did,

839
00:39:08,000 --> 00:39:09,399
Speaker 1: and I certainly don't want to do it. Craig did,

840
00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:11,000
Speaker 1: but I'm proud of him for doing it. Is live

841
00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:12,760
Speaker 1: in the living room while you're running out the bedroom.

842
00:39:13,239 --> 00:39:16,400
Speaker 1: But he had a time frame in mind, he had

843
00:39:16,400 --> 00:39:18,960
Speaker 1: a mission in mind, and he knew, hey, I can

844
00:39:19,000 --> 00:39:21,000
Speaker 1: put up this with this for a short time because

845
00:39:21,000 --> 00:39:23,800
Speaker 1: it's going to provide so many opportunities, so much freedom

846
00:39:23,840 --> 00:39:26,120
Speaker 1: for me, not too far in the future. So yeah,

847
00:39:26,120 --> 00:39:27,680
Speaker 1: I don't know. I like that there's a spectrum though,

848
00:39:27,719 --> 00:39:29,440
Speaker 1: and I think for a lot of our listeners they

849
00:39:29,520 --> 00:39:32,480
Speaker 1: might say, you know what, I can house hack. I

850
00:39:32,480 --> 00:39:34,560
Speaker 1: didn't think it was possible before. I thought that it

851
00:39:34,600 --> 00:39:37,880
Speaker 1: was gonna be like too cumbersome, too intrusive on my lifestyle.

852
00:39:38,080 --> 00:39:40,320
Speaker 1: But I do think that there is a strategy for everyone,

853
00:39:40,480 --> 00:39:42,880
Speaker 1: And yeah, I think that's just helpful to note and

854
00:39:43,200 --> 00:39:45,720
Speaker 1: he definitely goes into more detail in his book about

855
00:39:45,840 --> 00:39:48,799
Speaker 1: how you can accomplish those strategies and which ones are

856
00:39:48,800 --> 00:39:51,040
Speaker 1: best for which kinds of folks, depending on what state

857
00:39:51,080 --> 00:39:55,080
Speaker 1: of life they're in. But yeah, that's just as helpful knowledge. Yeah. Also,

858
00:39:55,160 --> 00:39:56,479
Speaker 1: I'm just so glad that we got to talk about

859
00:39:56,480 --> 00:39:59,319
Speaker 1: his mustache at the beginning of the episode. I feel

860
00:39:59,320 --> 00:40:00,680
Speaker 1: like you and I we need more friends in our

861
00:40:00,680 --> 00:40:04,480
Speaker 1: lives that have a nice, burly mustache. But my my

862
00:40:04,520 --> 00:40:07,400
Speaker 1: big takeaway, I wanted to highlight the fact that Craig

863
00:40:07,480 --> 00:40:09,480
Speaker 1: was talking about the V A loan or the U.

864
00:40:09,560 --> 00:40:12,160
Speaker 1: S D A loan, and those are mortgages that only

865
00:40:12,200 --> 00:40:15,120
Speaker 1: require zero or five percent down. I wanted to talk

866
00:40:15,160 --> 00:40:17,160
Speaker 1: about that because it's not something that we typically talk

867
00:40:17,239 --> 00:40:19,279
Speaker 1: about here on the show. Ideally, yes, you know you

868
00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:22,319
Speaker 1: are able to put down when you're purchasing at home,

869
00:40:22,600 --> 00:40:26,160
Speaker 1: when you are purchasing an investment property, but I do

870
00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:29,839
Speaker 1: think that this is a sound strategy, especially if your

871
00:40:29,840 --> 00:40:32,240
Speaker 1: house hacking right. And so if you find the right property,

872
00:40:32,440 --> 00:40:34,640
Speaker 1: maybe you don't have all the money set aside, and

873
00:40:34,640 --> 00:40:36,640
Speaker 1: like you said, uh, it can be a little more

874
00:40:36,640 --> 00:40:39,800
Speaker 1: difficult to win a bid right to actually snag a

875
00:40:39,880 --> 00:40:41,920
Speaker 1: property with some of these loans because they may not

876
00:40:41,960 --> 00:40:45,000
Speaker 1: be as competitive in a really hot market. But if

877
00:40:45,000 --> 00:40:47,440
Speaker 1: that is the only option you have, and specifically, if

878
00:40:47,440 --> 00:40:49,520
Speaker 1: you find the right house and you can see how

879
00:40:49,640 --> 00:40:52,480
Speaker 1: you are going to be able to positively cash flow.

880
00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:54,520
Speaker 1: If you can see that right out of the gate

881
00:40:54,600 --> 00:40:57,359
Speaker 1: that you're going to be making a thousand dollars on

882
00:40:57,400 --> 00:41:00,440
Speaker 1: a specific property, what gives you a ton of margin,

883
00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:02,640
Speaker 1: you know, as opposed to if this was a house

884
00:41:02,760 --> 00:41:04,600
Speaker 1: for yourself, that where you weren't on a house hack

885
00:41:04,680 --> 00:41:07,080
Speaker 1: and you are just kind of maxing out what you

886
00:41:07,120 --> 00:41:09,839
Speaker 1: could afford and there is no income potential. Right. There's

887
00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:12,799
Speaker 1: a big difference between purchasing a home with zero sent

888
00:41:12,920 --> 00:41:16,359
Speaker 1: down for a lifestyle versus an investment where you're cash

889
00:41:16,400 --> 00:41:18,719
Speaker 1: flowing a ton of money every single month. And so

890
00:41:18,800 --> 00:41:20,440
Speaker 1: you know, that's not a strategy that you and I

891
00:41:20,480 --> 00:41:22,319
Speaker 1: often talk about, but it is worth noting that that's

892
00:41:22,320 --> 00:41:24,759
Speaker 1: an option that's available out there. Yeah, I agree, man,

893
00:41:24,760 --> 00:41:27,160
Speaker 1: I think those are two completely different circumstances. If you're

894
00:41:27,440 --> 00:41:29,200
Speaker 1: buying a house to live in that you don't plan

895
00:41:29,239 --> 00:41:31,160
Speaker 1: on house hacking, that you don't plan on making any

896
00:41:31,200 --> 00:41:33,440
Speaker 1: income from, Like you need to do the hard work

897
00:41:33,440 --> 00:41:36,040
Speaker 1: and say about the down payment, and I think that's lifestyle. Yeah,

898
00:41:36,080 --> 00:41:39,560
Speaker 1: ideally even for house hackers like you would have more

899
00:41:39,600 --> 00:41:42,360
Speaker 1: than three to five percent to put down. You would

900
00:41:42,360 --> 00:41:45,120
Speaker 1: have ten to twenty maybe even to put down. But

901
00:41:45,160 --> 00:41:48,640
Speaker 1: if you don't, it is still a different calculation because

902
00:41:48,760 --> 00:41:51,680
Speaker 1: of the fact that you can instantly be making money

903
00:41:51,680 --> 00:41:53,719
Speaker 1: from that property. But you want to make sure you're

904
00:41:53,760 --> 00:41:55,960
Speaker 1: running the numbers, like Craig mentioned, you want to make

905
00:41:55,960 --> 00:41:58,400
Speaker 1: sure it's actually going to be profitable even if you

906
00:41:58,400 --> 00:42:00,920
Speaker 1: don't come to the table with that percent down that

907
00:42:01,040 --> 00:42:04,279
Speaker 1: we find preferable. Totally. Alright, man, let's go ahead, shift gears.

908
00:42:04,360 --> 00:42:06,320
Speaker 1: Let's get to the beer that you and I enjoyed

909
00:42:06,360 --> 00:42:09,280
Speaker 1: on this episode. This was a beer by Reformation Brewery

910
00:42:09,560 --> 00:42:13,960
Speaker 1: and it's called Jogger the Juicy Loggers. Then, what were

911
00:42:13,960 --> 00:42:15,600
Speaker 1: your thoughts on this beer? This is a local one

912
00:42:15,600 --> 00:42:17,480
Speaker 1: by the way to us here in Atlanta. Ye, just

913
00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:20,359
Speaker 1: up the road up in Woodstock, Georgia. And yeah, this

914
00:42:20,400 --> 00:42:23,080
Speaker 1: was I would say light and hoppy at the same time.

915
00:42:23,080 --> 00:42:24,920
Speaker 1: It was kind of like a pale ale mixed with

916
00:42:24,960 --> 00:42:27,680
Speaker 1: a pilsner, and I kind of I kind of liked it,

917
00:42:27,719 --> 00:42:30,040
Speaker 1: like it's not a style that I don't think I've

918
00:42:30,080 --> 00:42:33,760
Speaker 1: ever had. What's anything that's been called a juicy logger

919
00:42:33,840 --> 00:42:36,960
Speaker 1: necessarily usually I don't know, like loggers are usually a

920
00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:40,000
Speaker 1: little more dry, fewer hoppy notes than this. But this

921
00:42:40,040 --> 00:42:43,200
Speaker 1: is kind of running that middle ground between that the

922
00:42:43,239 --> 00:42:45,600
Speaker 1: I p A or a pale and a pilsner. And

923
00:42:45,800 --> 00:42:47,839
Speaker 1: it was nice. It was like light and refreshing and

924
00:42:47,960 --> 00:42:50,239
Speaker 1: I like hops, So yeah, I kind of it kind

925
00:42:50,239 --> 00:42:53,600
Speaker 1: of almost like a session I p A or something. Yeah, yeah,

926
00:42:53,880 --> 00:42:57,080
Speaker 1: maybe it is. And they just called it juicy logger,

927
00:42:57,520 --> 00:42:59,279
Speaker 1: but I totally agree. This is a really good one,

928
00:42:59,640 --> 00:43:01,839
Speaker 1: that kind of beer that you could crush after going

929
00:43:01,880 --> 00:43:04,520
Speaker 1: for a run. Perhaps it's got a pretty low A

930
00:43:04,640 --> 00:43:06,919
Speaker 1: b v H to boot And so yeah, I'm glad

931
00:43:06,920 --> 00:43:09,160
Speaker 1: you and I got to enjoy these for this episode.

932
00:43:09,160 --> 00:43:11,480
Speaker 1: While we talked with Craig, curl up, but Joel, that's

933
00:43:11,480 --> 00:43:13,120
Speaker 1: gonna be it for this episode. We'll make sure to

934
00:43:13,200 --> 00:43:16,160
Speaker 1: link to any resources we may have mentioned during this episode,

935
00:43:16,280 --> 00:43:17,839
Speaker 1: and you can find that up on the website at

936
00:43:17,840 --> 00:43:20,360
Speaker 1: how to money dot com. No doubt, So start saving

937
00:43:20,360 --> 00:43:22,399
Speaker 1: your money for that next home purchase. In that next

938
00:43:22,440 --> 00:43:25,120
Speaker 1: home purchase, let's hope it actually makes you money. Yeah,

939
00:43:25,239 --> 00:43:27,360
Speaker 1: all right, that's gonna do it for this episode until

940
00:43:27,400 --> 00:43:30,000
Speaker 1: next time. Best Friends Out, Best Friends Out,