1 00:00:00,560 --> 00:00:03,440 Speaker 1: Hi, I'm George Nori and welcome to the new iHeartRadio 2 00:00:03,520 --> 00:00:06,760 Speaker 1: and Coast to Coast AM paranormal podcast network. Like us 3 00:00:06,760 --> 00:00:10,200 Speaker 1: on Facebook, tell your friends and share us with everyone. 4 00:00:10,560 --> 00:00:13,560 Speaker 1: This is an exciting new network that will feature podcasts 5 00:00:13,600 --> 00:00:17,479 Speaker 1: of the paranormal, supernatural, and the unexplained. Now please sit 6 00:00:17,560 --> 00:00:27,520 Speaker 1: back and enjoy Dark Becomes Light with Heidi Hollis. Welcome 7 00:00:27,560 --> 00:00:31,360 Speaker 1: to our podcast. Please be aware the thoughts and opinions 8 00:00:31,360 --> 00:00:34,800 Speaker 1: expressed by the host are their thoughts and opinions only 9 00:00:35,120 --> 00:00:39,760 Speaker 1: and do not reflect those of iHeartMedia, iHeartRadio, Coast to 10 00:00:39,840 --> 00:00:45,080 Speaker 1: Coast AM, employees of premier networks, or their sponsors and associates. 11 00:00:45,479 --> 00:00:47,800 Speaker 1: We would like to encourage you to do your own 12 00:00:47,840 --> 00:01:04,440 Speaker 1: research and discover the subject matter for yourself. You are 13 00:01:04,560 --> 00:01:11,240 Speaker 1: listening to Darkbecome Light with Me, Heidi Hollis, iHeartRadio Coach 14 00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:17,640 Speaker 1: Coach they Am. You're a normal podcast network blocomes in 15 00:01:17,760 --> 00:01:20,920 Speaker 1: my show. Remember each week this is the place you 16 00:01:20,959 --> 00:01:23,080 Speaker 1: go to when you want to learn the latest and 17 00:01:23,640 --> 00:01:29,840 Speaker 1: mysterious encounters, holly encounters, cryptozoological encounters, and if you or 18 00:01:29,880 --> 00:01:32,560 Speaker 1: someone you know has experienced anything out of the ordinary 19 00:01:32,760 --> 00:01:35,400 Speaker 1: and you want to share you want to learn, or 20 00:01:35,480 --> 00:01:38,280 Speaker 1: you want to comment, or you want to ask anything, 21 00:01:39,200 --> 00:01:42,240 Speaker 1: go to my main website, which is Heidi Hollis dot 22 00:01:42,240 --> 00:01:45,880 Speaker 1: com or shadow folks dot com. Tell me your story's 23 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:49,000 Speaker 1: give as much detail as you would like. Because of 24 00:01:49,080 --> 00:01:51,720 Speaker 1: more details are better. And I mean, we open up 25 00:01:51,720 --> 00:01:54,600 Speaker 1: the floodgates for anything and everything out of ordinary because 26 00:01:54,840 --> 00:01:57,080 Speaker 1: it's important to paint a picture of what is going 27 00:01:57,160 --> 00:01:59,920 Speaker 1: on and what is possible in this world. I mean, 28 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:02,279 Speaker 1: how else are we going to learn about this stuff 29 00:02:02,360 --> 00:02:05,920 Speaker 1: unless we break down these stories. And I mean, if 30 00:02:05,920 --> 00:02:08,200 Speaker 1: you got photos, I get a lot of people say 31 00:02:08,200 --> 00:02:11,800 Speaker 1: how do I submit photos or drawings? Just write me 32 00:02:11,919 --> 00:02:14,440 Speaker 1: at Heidi Hollis at gmail dot com. How about that 33 00:02:14,760 --> 00:02:17,680 Speaker 1: or through that website as well, and just you know, 34 00:02:18,280 --> 00:02:20,120 Speaker 1: I'll take it up. I'll take it, We'll look at it. 35 00:02:20,440 --> 00:02:22,200 Speaker 1: And you know what, you guys, you are in for 36 00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:26,160 Speaker 1: a treat today because I have one of the world's 37 00:02:26,280 --> 00:02:30,000 Speaker 1: top researchers. On the shroud of Turin, that is the 38 00:02:30,240 --> 00:02:34,680 Speaker 1: burial cloth of Jesus Christ. There is an image of 39 00:02:34,720 --> 00:02:40,560 Speaker 1: a man who was obviously crucified, and it's been studied 40 00:02:40,880 --> 00:02:45,119 Speaker 1: for a very long time, but then it got tested 41 00:02:45,680 --> 00:02:48,600 Speaker 1: for the time period from which this cloth came from, 42 00:02:49,160 --> 00:02:53,800 Speaker 1: and it was shown to be that this was actually 43 00:02:53,919 --> 00:02:57,040 Speaker 1: dated not during Jesus's time, and people are like, it's 44 00:02:57,080 --> 00:03:01,679 Speaker 1: a fake, it's a fraud. No, no, no. If you've 45 00:03:01,760 --> 00:03:06,840 Speaker 1: kept up with what occurred after that conclusion, it was 46 00:03:06,960 --> 00:03:11,760 Speaker 1: shown that it was tested from a repaired section of 47 00:03:11,960 --> 00:03:16,440 Speaker 1: the shroud. How did they come to that conclusion. Well, 48 00:03:17,040 --> 00:03:22,120 Speaker 1: Joseph Marino knows because he and his wife are responsible 49 00:03:22,200 --> 00:03:25,799 Speaker 1: for that conclusion. So you guys, you've got to hear 50 00:03:25,840 --> 00:03:28,919 Speaker 1: this story because it's amazing. The story on the shrouded 51 00:03:28,919 --> 00:03:35,000 Speaker 1: Turn is not over. It is absolutely unexplainable what occurred here, 52 00:03:35,600 --> 00:03:40,680 Speaker 1: how this image of a man was impressed upon this cloth. 53 00:03:41,400 --> 00:03:44,040 Speaker 1: Much more testing and much more work needs to be done. 54 00:03:44,120 --> 00:03:47,560 Speaker 1: And Joseph Marino, he's going to tell you all about 55 00:03:47,600 --> 00:03:51,800 Speaker 1: it and his story because it's something you've never heard before. 56 00:03:52,080 --> 00:03:54,560 Speaker 1: And I know you're going to enjoy him. He's really 57 00:03:54,560 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 1: really insightful and wow, mind blowing stuff. But to be 58 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:02,200 Speaker 1: in with you guys, I got a couple of your emails. 59 00:04:02,320 --> 00:04:05,680 Speaker 1: M yes, I do. I am going to read these 60 00:04:05,720 --> 00:04:07,960 Speaker 1: things off here and I grab them randomly. I want 61 00:04:07,960 --> 00:04:10,560 Speaker 1: them to be short, so I look for short ones 62 00:04:10,640 --> 00:04:14,960 Speaker 1: and totally I never read these things beforehand. I really 63 00:04:15,000 --> 00:04:19,760 Speaker 1: try not to and just dive in so you get 64 00:04:19,760 --> 00:04:22,839 Speaker 1: the raw me when I'm checking these things out and 65 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:26,760 Speaker 1: let you just never know what we got. I just 66 00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:30,480 Speaker 1: love it, all right. Okay, So this first email says, 67 00:04:30,480 --> 00:04:36,240 Speaker 1: Dear Heidi, I see every evening black orbs and shadow 68 00:04:36,320 --> 00:04:40,279 Speaker 1: lines in my room. I don't know what they are 69 00:04:40,360 --> 00:04:44,440 Speaker 1: or what they want. Harry, Hey there, Harry, how's it going. 70 00:04:45,480 --> 00:04:48,320 Speaker 1: That's interesting. I don't get many people talking about the 71 00:04:48,360 --> 00:04:53,320 Speaker 1: black orbs. I personally had an encounter that wasn't very 72 00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:58,800 Speaker 1: pleasant myself, and being that shadow beings are connected to 73 00:04:58,960 --> 00:05:04,800 Speaker 1: aliens and vice versa, I mean, it's it's hard to 74 00:05:04,839 --> 00:05:07,480 Speaker 1: exactly say what these things are, but I could tell 75 00:05:07,480 --> 00:05:10,680 Speaker 1: you what they have done to myself, and I've heard 76 00:05:10,720 --> 00:05:15,080 Speaker 1: from others too. They seem very alien because they are 77 00:05:15,480 --> 00:05:21,960 Speaker 1: perfectly round, right, and they can form rows. They can 78 00:05:22,000 --> 00:05:28,160 Speaker 1: operate together or solo, right, but they're black. I haven't 79 00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:30,640 Speaker 1: seen them personally shape shift or anything like that. But 80 00:05:31,279 --> 00:05:33,200 Speaker 1: I'll just tell you what happened. Okay. I know I 81 00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:35,360 Speaker 1: spoke of it here on the program, but I think 82 00:05:35,360 --> 00:05:38,800 Speaker 1: it was a while ago. So this one night, I 83 00:05:38,880 --> 00:05:42,080 Speaker 1: was sleeping on my couch. Okay, I was watching television. 84 00:05:42,920 --> 00:05:46,120 Speaker 1: My college roommate was in the next room that kind 85 00:05:46,120 --> 00:05:48,080 Speaker 1: of opened up to the living room right there, right. 86 00:05:48,520 --> 00:05:54,240 Speaker 1: So I'm sleeping and I hear my friend's scream. I'm like, 87 00:05:54,440 --> 00:05:58,799 Speaker 1: what you know? And I wake up and I am 88 00:05:59,240 --> 00:06:06,839 Speaker 1: floating up towards the ceiling and there was this big, big, 89 00:06:06,880 --> 00:06:10,279 Speaker 1: black like crack in the ceiling. It's so weird. It 90 00:06:10,360 --> 00:06:13,760 Speaker 1: was like an interdimensional looking thing, right, And I was like, whoa, 91 00:06:14,040 --> 00:06:17,960 Speaker 1: you know, and I wiggle free and boom, I am 92 00:06:18,360 --> 00:06:22,320 Speaker 1: dropped from the ceiling onto its futon. It wasn't comfortable, okay, 93 00:06:22,760 --> 00:06:29,520 Speaker 1: boom onto the futon. And I literally scurried and I'm 94 00:06:29,600 --> 00:06:34,680 Speaker 1: crouched and I'm looking up at the ceiling and all 95 00:06:34,680 --> 00:06:36,920 Speaker 1: in the room, all in the room, the living room, 96 00:06:37,240 --> 00:06:39,239 Speaker 1: and you know, the TV's on, and it's like lighting 97 00:06:39,320 --> 00:06:42,679 Speaker 1: up these black orbs okay, and oh, I get chills. 98 00:06:42,880 --> 00:06:45,039 Speaker 1: And they were just like floating in the middle of 99 00:06:45,040 --> 00:06:48,400 Speaker 1: the room. And then they all floated up to the 100 00:06:48,480 --> 00:06:52,919 Speaker 1: ceiling right and and like lined up like perfect little rows, 101 00:06:53,200 --> 00:06:58,840 Speaker 1: and the crack closed and and these these black orbs 102 00:06:59,400 --> 00:07:04,080 Speaker 1: started to fade away right, and and my friend and 103 00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:06,280 Speaker 1: I were both crouched out on the on the ground 104 00:07:06,880 --> 00:07:09,240 Speaker 1: and we're like, oh my gosh, oh my gosh, I 105 00:07:09,240 --> 00:07:11,800 Speaker 1: could still see that, I could still see them, and 106 00:07:12,160 --> 00:07:13,920 Speaker 1: and we didn't even want to reach up to turn 107 00:07:14,080 --> 00:07:17,040 Speaker 1: like the light on, to you know, get a better look. 108 00:07:17,080 --> 00:07:19,680 Speaker 1: We're just like too scared to raise up because they 109 00:07:19,720 --> 00:07:22,560 Speaker 1: were some of them were still gathering up onto the ceiling, 110 00:07:23,120 --> 00:07:26,560 Speaker 1: and um, it was. It was weird. It took a 111 00:07:26,560 --> 00:07:30,480 Speaker 1: while for them to like saddle and fade, but we 112 00:07:30,560 --> 00:07:33,560 Speaker 1: could still see this outline, like a kind of transparent 113 00:07:33,600 --> 00:07:37,840 Speaker 1: outline of them, and we finally just you know, as 114 00:07:37,880 --> 00:07:40,840 Speaker 1: they faded more, we got the nerve to flick the 115 00:07:40,960 --> 00:07:45,880 Speaker 1: light on and was like, what in the heck? It 116 00:07:46,000 --> 00:07:51,320 Speaker 1: seemed like they were transporting me, um, creating an interdimensional 117 00:07:51,400 --> 00:07:56,040 Speaker 1: crack of some kind, like pulling time apart and creating 118 00:07:56,080 --> 00:07:59,600 Speaker 1: this rift to yank me through. It was really odd 119 00:07:59,640 --> 00:08:02,520 Speaker 1: and it had a negative vibe to it, very much 120 00:08:02,520 --> 00:08:08,679 Speaker 1: like shadow beings would, but also mechanical spying even so 121 00:08:09,520 --> 00:08:12,440 Speaker 1: to say exactly what they are, I've heard of glowing 122 00:08:12,640 --> 00:08:16,680 Speaker 1: orbs that would take people by surprise because they would 123 00:08:16,680 --> 00:08:18,760 Speaker 1: be like I don't know what this is about, flying 124 00:08:18,840 --> 00:08:21,480 Speaker 1: parallel to the ground, going at a very fast speed, 125 00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:24,240 Speaker 1: or being like these little orby things that kind of 126 00:08:24,880 --> 00:08:27,840 Speaker 1: hang in the night sky and have a look at 127 00:08:27,840 --> 00:08:30,760 Speaker 1: people and people feel like they're probe Like, you know, 128 00:08:30,800 --> 00:08:34,440 Speaker 1: they're too small to actually house a entity in there. 129 00:08:34,520 --> 00:08:37,319 Speaker 1: But I mean, we have drones, right, we have drones 130 00:08:37,360 --> 00:08:40,200 Speaker 1: where we can use a camera to spy and stuff, 131 00:08:40,200 --> 00:08:42,560 Speaker 1: so you know, maybe these things are kind of like that. 132 00:08:42,600 --> 00:08:45,400 Speaker 1: But they also seem to have this ability to open 133 00:08:45,520 --> 00:08:50,880 Speaker 1: up doorways. Okay. Also when you think of the orbs, 134 00:08:51,120 --> 00:08:55,440 Speaker 1: the ghost orbs that people shows, it shows up in 135 00:08:55,440 --> 00:08:57,719 Speaker 1: a lot of a lot of photos. They have been 136 00:08:57,800 --> 00:09:03,559 Speaker 1: known to spin and to open up portals as well. Okay, 137 00:09:04,320 --> 00:09:08,880 Speaker 1: there's great imagery out there photos of these things doing that. 138 00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 1: Like they get together and they pull energy together, and 139 00:09:11,840 --> 00:09:14,679 Speaker 1: they they're able to do things that gives you the 140 00:09:14,760 --> 00:09:19,320 Speaker 1: hebe jeebies from head to toe. Yes it does. So 141 00:09:19,520 --> 00:09:22,160 Speaker 1: I hope that's helpful for you, Harry. I mean, I'm 142 00:09:22,240 --> 00:09:27,880 Speaker 1: not psychic or guru, but you know, there seems to 143 00:09:27,920 --> 00:09:30,480 Speaker 1: be that there's a pulling together of energy with these things. 144 00:09:30,520 --> 00:09:35,240 Speaker 1: So personally, I would bless my space because alien or not. 145 00:09:36,000 --> 00:09:37,959 Speaker 1: If you don't want them there in your home, then 146 00:09:37,960 --> 00:09:42,240 Speaker 1: they shouldn't be there, you know, clear the air. All right, 147 00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:43,760 Speaker 1: So I want to get to this next one. I 148 00:09:43,800 --> 00:09:45,959 Speaker 1: don't want to run out of time. There's another short one, 149 00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:48,920 Speaker 1: all right, and this one comes to us from Robert. 150 00:09:49,000 --> 00:09:53,000 Speaker 1: It goes Hiidi. I know I've lived past lives. Was 151 00:09:53,040 --> 00:09:56,280 Speaker 1: wondering if my one true perfect love partner from my 152 00:09:56,400 --> 00:10:01,560 Speaker 1: past might be again walking this earth and searching for me. Hmm, 153 00:10:01,880 --> 00:10:04,280 Speaker 1: that's cool. That's a nice, warm, fuzzy thought. I like 154 00:10:04,360 --> 00:10:08,240 Speaker 1: that also. I believe animals pets also come back into 155 00:10:08,280 --> 00:10:11,680 Speaker 1: physical form, but I hear stories of people who come 156 00:10:11,720 --> 00:10:16,439 Speaker 1: across over to heaven and meet their long lost pets. 157 00:10:17,720 --> 00:10:20,400 Speaker 1: How long do people and pets stay in heaven before 158 00:10:20,440 --> 00:10:24,520 Speaker 1: they once again take earthly forms. Well, that's a good question. 159 00:10:25,080 --> 00:10:28,840 Speaker 1: I like that one, Oh, Robert, all right, you know, 160 00:10:28,920 --> 00:10:31,160 Speaker 1: I'll tell you. It's like I personally am again. I'm 161 00:10:31,160 --> 00:10:33,679 Speaker 1: not a psychic, but I've had people come on this 162 00:10:33,720 --> 00:10:35,760 Speaker 1: program and I wish I could remember names better than 163 00:10:35,840 --> 00:10:38,080 Speaker 1: I do. But there was a researcher that came on 164 00:10:38,120 --> 00:10:41,880 Speaker 1: who was an expert in reincarnation, and he said in 165 00:10:41,920 --> 00:10:47,920 Speaker 1: Asian countries and other countries who believe in reincarnation, like outright, 166 00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:50,560 Speaker 1: like I'll see you soon, you'll be back. You know, 167 00:10:51,520 --> 00:10:56,280 Speaker 1: the proven cases of reincarnation were it was just a 168 00:10:56,280 --> 00:10:59,120 Speaker 1: few months, like like six months. I think it was 169 00:10:59,160 --> 00:11:02,400 Speaker 1: the average or something like that of people past loved 170 00:11:02,480 --> 00:11:06,880 Speaker 1: ones coming back into human form. Isn't that something? But 171 00:11:07,160 --> 00:11:10,080 Speaker 1: Western cultures, you know, us people who have these thick 172 00:11:10,120 --> 00:11:13,400 Speaker 1: skulls who don't like to believe in such things as reincarnation. 173 00:11:14,120 --> 00:11:19,400 Speaker 1: It's years sometimes decades. Is that something? So because we 174 00:11:19,440 --> 00:11:21,600 Speaker 1: think that we should wait for others on the other side, 175 00:11:21,640 --> 00:11:24,800 Speaker 1: that that was literally said by this researcher, that we 176 00:11:24,920 --> 00:11:27,720 Speaker 1: believe that, well, i'll see you on the other side. 177 00:11:27,760 --> 00:11:29,680 Speaker 1: It's like, well, shoot, now I gotta sit here and 178 00:11:29,720 --> 00:11:31,240 Speaker 1: wait for you to come so we could have a 179 00:11:31,240 --> 00:11:34,520 Speaker 1: conversation when I could have been reborn already and been 180 00:11:34,559 --> 00:11:38,480 Speaker 1: your been your baby or something. And it's interesting how 181 00:11:38,520 --> 00:11:42,200 Speaker 1: they interchange and switch it up like that, you know. Um, 182 00:11:42,559 --> 00:11:45,400 Speaker 1: you know, one time your your brother and sister, another 183 00:11:45,480 --> 00:11:49,440 Speaker 1: time your your cousins. You know, it's it's really really 184 00:11:49,720 --> 00:11:54,160 Speaker 1: interesting the patterns and stuff. So, um, I think it's 185 00:11:54,160 --> 00:11:56,360 Speaker 1: fascinating that you know that you've lived past lives. A 186 00:11:56,440 --> 00:11:59,240 Speaker 1: lot of people question, you know the validity of that, 187 00:11:59,400 --> 00:12:01,880 Speaker 1: or if you're saying that, you would say something like that. 188 00:12:01,960 --> 00:12:06,079 Speaker 1: But it was taught before in the Bible. I mean, 189 00:12:06,080 --> 00:12:08,679 Speaker 1: it's there. I've spoke to you a monk not too 190 00:12:08,679 --> 00:12:11,080 Speaker 1: long ago who said, well, yeah, that's that's true. You 191 00:12:11,120 --> 00:12:15,080 Speaker 1: know John the Baptists was Elijah reborn. It's mentioned right there, 192 00:12:15,080 --> 00:12:16,959 Speaker 1: and it used to be taught in the church. Well, 193 00:12:17,080 --> 00:12:20,640 Speaker 1: kum bay yah, that's awesome. I'm glad to know that. 194 00:12:20,679 --> 00:12:24,520 Speaker 1: But for some reason Western cultures just don't address those 195 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:28,280 Speaker 1: things as much as they once did. But we are 196 00:12:28,559 --> 00:12:32,280 Speaker 1: greater than we are allowed or led to believe. You guys, 197 00:12:32,360 --> 00:12:35,920 Speaker 1: I don't know why that is, but never questioned the 198 00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:39,960 Speaker 1: human potential. And also know that God made us the 199 00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:43,400 Speaker 1: way he did for a reason. We're not perfect, We're flawed. 200 00:12:43,400 --> 00:12:46,040 Speaker 1: We're meant to fall down, get back up, come back again, 201 00:12:46,200 --> 00:12:50,160 Speaker 1: and recycle. It happens. But I think that there's something 202 00:12:50,200 --> 00:12:53,800 Speaker 1: that's capturing souls and that is hello, hat man, that 203 00:12:53,960 --> 00:12:57,800 Speaker 1: is stopping the natural progression of our days and times, 204 00:12:57,920 --> 00:13:01,439 Speaker 1: and you know time is coming to an end. He 205 00:13:01,559 --> 00:13:03,560 Speaker 1: likes to call himself Satan, well, he's going to play 206 00:13:03,600 --> 00:13:06,760 Speaker 1: that role and get thrown in the dungeon and kept there. 207 00:13:07,080 --> 00:13:08,880 Speaker 1: All right, you guys, do you guys stick around because 208 00:13:08,920 --> 00:13:12,720 Speaker 1: we've got a fabulous show coming up here with Joe Marino. 209 00:13:12,880 --> 00:13:16,480 Speaker 1: You are listening to Dark Becomes Like with me Hetty Hollis, 210 00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:21,840 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast. They am para normal podcast network. 211 00:13:21,960 --> 00:13:37,320 Speaker 1: We'll be right back, welcome back. You are listening to 212 00:13:37,480 --> 00:13:41,479 Speaker 1: Dark Becomes Lights with me Heidi Hollis on the iHeartRadio 213 00:13:42,080 --> 00:13:46,959 Speaker 1: and Coach Coast. They am paranormal podcast network. As promised, 214 00:13:47,000 --> 00:13:50,360 Speaker 1: I have a fabulous guest, Joseph Marino, who has a 215 00:13:50,480 --> 00:13:54,120 Speaker 1: BA in theological studies and is a long time syndonologist 216 00:13:54,400 --> 00:13:56,960 Speaker 1: who is one who studies the Shroud of Turin. He 217 00:13:57,080 --> 00:14:00,640 Speaker 1: has research, written, and lectured extensively on the shrouds nineteen 218 00:14:00,720 --> 00:14:04,640 Speaker 1: seventy seven. He became ordained to priesthood in nineteen ninety four, 219 00:14:04,720 --> 00:14:08,120 Speaker 1: becoming a benedicting monk as a result of his interests 220 00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:12,000 Speaker 1: in the Shroud. In nineteen ninety seven, Marino received a 221 00:14:12,120 --> 00:14:16,080 Speaker 1: call from M. Sue Benford, who informed him on her 222 00:14:16,280 --> 00:14:20,440 Speaker 1: spiritual insights about the Shroud. After many discussions by phone 223 00:14:20,480 --> 00:14:23,960 Speaker 1: and emails about the shroud and other spiritual matters, he 224 00:14:24,080 --> 00:14:27,360 Speaker 1: began to experience God in a whole new way. He 225 00:14:27,520 --> 00:14:31,360 Speaker 1: felt powerfully drawn to leave the monastery to pursue shroud 226 00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:35,640 Speaker 1: research and other spiritual paths with Benford. Marino believes that 227 00:14:35,680 --> 00:14:37,800 Speaker 1: if the shroud can be shown to be the burial 228 00:14:37,800 --> 00:14:42,040 Speaker 1: cloth of Jesus, it would be an interesting archaeological object. However, 229 00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:45,320 Speaker 1: he believes that it's more important for the spiritual message 230 00:14:45,360 --> 00:14:49,200 Speaker 1: it can bring most definitely. So I am excited to 231 00:14:49,240 --> 00:14:53,440 Speaker 1: introduce my guests, Joseph Marino. How are you doing today there, Joe, 232 00:14:53,880 --> 00:14:58,400 Speaker 1: good honey, how are you doing fabulous? I am always 233 00:14:58,440 --> 00:15:01,640 Speaker 1: trying to follow and keep top of the latest research 234 00:15:01,680 --> 00:15:04,120 Speaker 1: when it comes to the Shroud of Turen And it's 235 00:15:04,160 --> 00:15:06,880 Speaker 1: an honor, honestly to be talking to one of the 236 00:15:06,960 --> 00:15:13,560 Speaker 1: leading researchers on this. But your background is so diverse, 237 00:15:13,640 --> 00:15:15,480 Speaker 1: I mean, you want to tell us a little bit 238 00:15:15,520 --> 00:15:20,440 Speaker 1: about how you became the person you are as you 239 00:15:20,520 --> 00:15:25,400 Speaker 1: are currently, because it's it's quite the story. Well, I 240 00:15:25,400 --> 00:15:29,920 Speaker 1: grew up in Saint Louis, Missouri, and I was born 241 00:15:29,960 --> 00:15:32,720 Speaker 1: and raised a Catholic. I was the youngest of five, 242 00:15:33,560 --> 00:15:41,840 Speaker 1: and I was very into sports, both playing officiating, following 243 00:15:41,880 --> 00:15:45,160 Speaker 1: professional teams in Saint Louis that sort of thing, and 244 00:15:45,560 --> 00:15:48,080 Speaker 1: kind of thought at some point, I you know, they 245 00:15:48,640 --> 00:15:51,200 Speaker 1: they always kind of recommend do something that you likes. 246 00:15:51,520 --> 00:15:53,080 Speaker 1: You don't have to work a day in your life. 247 00:15:53,080 --> 00:15:59,000 Speaker 1: I'll do something in sports. Probably wasn't quite good enough 248 00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:01,840 Speaker 1: to be, you know, professional athletes, so you know, you 249 00:16:01,920 --> 00:16:05,920 Speaker 1: start thinking about being a writer or broadcaster or that 250 00:16:06,000 --> 00:16:08,920 Speaker 1: sort of thing. And you know, so I, you know, 251 00:16:09,640 --> 00:16:14,200 Speaker 1: did did a broadcasting class at uh in College and 252 00:16:14,240 --> 00:16:16,200 Speaker 1: that sort of thing. But it's it's not as easy 253 00:16:16,200 --> 00:16:20,800 Speaker 1: as it looks, you know. But yeah, and I was 254 00:16:20,840 --> 00:16:25,120 Speaker 1: into into music a lot. Just I don't didn't play anything. 255 00:16:25,200 --> 00:16:28,000 Speaker 1: My dad was a musician, but but he didn't leave 256 00:16:28,040 --> 00:16:31,280 Speaker 1: many me any genes to to learn how to play 257 00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:35,440 Speaker 1: an instrument. Um. So, you know, I like the Beatles 258 00:16:35,440 --> 00:16:38,359 Speaker 1: and the Moody Blues, and I still do to this day. 259 00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:43,840 Speaker 1: There's still my my two go to bands. And um, 260 00:16:43,960 --> 00:16:48,160 Speaker 1: I saw out of after high school. Um, I went 261 00:16:48,200 --> 00:16:51,840 Speaker 1: to college for two years. Um after two years, you know, 262 00:16:51,880 --> 00:16:54,200 Speaker 1: you have to start declaring a major and that sort 263 00:16:54,200 --> 00:16:59,680 Speaker 1: of thing. And still wasn't sure what I wanted to do. Um. 264 00:17:00,720 --> 00:17:03,360 Speaker 1: I had kind of become, you know, an agnostic like 265 00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:06,040 Speaker 1: many people in those days, in the seventies, and I 266 00:17:06,080 --> 00:17:10,639 Speaker 1: guess that still happens today, of course. So I got 267 00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:14,760 Speaker 1: a job with the federal government, working full time for 268 00:17:14,840 --> 00:17:21,439 Speaker 1: the Veterans Administration, and things seem to be going okay. 269 00:17:21,480 --> 00:17:25,160 Speaker 1: I played to continue to play basketball after high school 270 00:17:25,160 --> 00:17:29,280 Speaker 1: and that thing in men's league and whatnot. And I 271 00:17:29,359 --> 00:17:32,960 Speaker 1: was kind of sick of academics after my second year 272 00:17:33,000 --> 00:17:36,200 Speaker 1: of college, and so I took like a three year 273 00:17:36,280 --> 00:17:39,880 Speaker 1: break from reading anything academic and I pretty much only 274 00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:43,600 Speaker 1: read the sports page in the comics. Got yeah. And 275 00:17:43,680 --> 00:17:46,000 Speaker 1: after about three years of that, it's like, oh, you 276 00:17:46,119 --> 00:17:48,080 Speaker 1: better start getting on the ball. You're in your mid 277 00:17:48,119 --> 00:17:49,920 Speaker 1: dumb in my mid twenties. You know, I got to 278 00:17:49,960 --> 00:17:55,680 Speaker 1: get get going here, you know. So the background having 279 00:17:55,800 --> 00:17:59,439 Speaker 1: so many different varied interest music, sports, and then all 280 00:17:59,440 --> 00:18:05,240 Speaker 1: of a sudden year digging into this uh theological life. 281 00:18:05,280 --> 00:18:08,840 Speaker 1: I mean, how'd that come about? Well, I thought, you know, 282 00:18:09,200 --> 00:18:14,480 Speaker 1: I can remember so clearly. In nineteen seventy two, the 283 00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:20,840 Speaker 1: National Collegiate Championship Basketball Championship was in Saint Louis that year, 284 00:18:21,800 --> 00:18:24,160 Speaker 1: I just watched it on TV, and I thought, isn't 285 00:18:24,200 --> 00:18:28,440 Speaker 1: this great? And then it's like I heard this void, 286 00:18:28,520 --> 00:18:32,040 Speaker 1: almost exterior voice say to me, but it was really 287 00:18:32,080 --> 00:18:35,680 Speaker 1: me saying to myself, isn't there more to life than basketball? 288 00:18:36,520 --> 00:18:38,720 Speaker 1: But I still didn't do anything with that for about 289 00:18:38,760 --> 00:18:41,119 Speaker 1: three or three or four more years after that, and 290 00:18:41,240 --> 00:18:44,560 Speaker 1: finally I thought, you know, I you know, I'd thrown 291 00:18:44,600 --> 00:18:49,280 Speaker 1: off my Catholic background, but I thought, you know, there's 292 00:18:49,280 --> 00:18:53,280 Speaker 1: got to be something to you know, in religion or 293 00:18:53,320 --> 00:18:56,520 Speaker 1: philosophy that can give me more meaning to life. So 294 00:18:57,440 --> 00:19:00,760 Speaker 1: I started with a clean slate and just started reading 295 00:19:01,400 --> 00:19:08,760 Speaker 1: anything about philosophy and religion, even non Christian religions. And 296 00:19:08,800 --> 00:19:11,840 Speaker 1: I remember in seventy seven, finally, about five years after 297 00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:15,360 Speaker 1: I graduated from high school, when i'd go to a bookstore, 298 00:19:15,400 --> 00:19:18,560 Speaker 1: I'd always go to the philosophy and religion section, and 299 00:19:20,400 --> 00:19:24,280 Speaker 1: I saw a book with a kind of an odd 300 00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:26,600 Speaker 1: face on the cover, and it said, is this the 301 00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:31,160 Speaker 1: face of Jesus Christ? And it was a book about 302 00:19:31,160 --> 00:19:33,879 Speaker 1: the shot of Turin, which I had never heard of, 303 00:19:34,119 --> 00:19:37,440 Speaker 1: even though I had gone to Catholic school. I mean, 304 00:19:37,480 --> 00:19:40,879 Speaker 1: we learned about Veronica's Vale, which is really a legend. 305 00:19:40,880 --> 00:19:44,240 Speaker 1: It's not in the Bible, but supposedly some lady named 306 00:19:44,320 --> 00:19:48,840 Speaker 1: Veronica had had a cloth and she met Jesus on 307 00:19:48,920 --> 00:19:52,560 Speaker 1: his road to go golf and press the linen to 308 00:19:52,720 --> 00:19:56,760 Speaker 1: his face, and it supposedly she got an image. And 309 00:19:57,720 --> 00:20:00,320 Speaker 1: you know, long story shot on that. That's probably probably 310 00:20:00,359 --> 00:20:05,280 Speaker 1: a story that was invented to explain that there was 311 00:20:05,920 --> 00:20:10,159 Speaker 1: a linen cloth with an image on it. Now, the story, 312 00:20:10,400 --> 00:20:13,280 Speaker 1: both the book and the story of Ronica only deal 313 00:20:13,320 --> 00:20:15,760 Speaker 1: with the face, but the Shroud of Turin actually has 314 00:20:15,880 --> 00:20:20,160 Speaker 1: a full front and back image. You know, he's about 315 00:20:20,240 --> 00:20:22,640 Speaker 1: six feet tall, so you see the full front image 316 00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:25,000 Speaker 1: and you see the full back image because the cloth 317 00:20:25,119 --> 00:20:29,840 Speaker 1: is like fourteen feet long, so the body was presumably 318 00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:32,880 Speaker 1: laid on, you know, one half of it, and then 319 00:20:32,920 --> 00:20:37,600 Speaker 1: the other longer part of the cloth is big enough 320 00:20:37,640 --> 00:20:40,720 Speaker 1: to fold over so that it covers fully the front 321 00:20:40,720 --> 00:20:45,480 Speaker 1: and the back. So I took that book home that 322 00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:47,600 Speaker 1: night and read it in one sitting, and I want 323 00:20:47,640 --> 00:20:51,919 Speaker 1: to tell you, I was just fascinated. There wasn't a 324 00:20:51,920 --> 00:20:55,760 Speaker 1: lot of evidence back then. I mean, it was the 325 00:20:55,760 --> 00:20:58,960 Speaker 1: cloth was fairly well known in Europe, but not really 326 00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:01,080 Speaker 1: not in the United States. I mean, there were only 327 00:21:01,119 --> 00:21:04,240 Speaker 1: a couple books available in the United States, a few 328 00:21:04,359 --> 00:21:09,760 Speaker 1: articles here and there, but based on the evidence back then, 329 00:21:10,119 --> 00:21:12,960 Speaker 1: and that was only about a year year and a 330 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:17,040 Speaker 1: half before the group of American scientists called STIRP actually 331 00:21:17,080 --> 00:21:19,520 Speaker 1: went over to touring and studied it for five days. 332 00:21:19,520 --> 00:21:22,720 Speaker 1: And after that as when we got the big explosion 333 00:21:22,760 --> 00:21:29,320 Speaker 1: of information that we still deal with today. But based 334 00:21:29,359 --> 00:21:34,880 Speaker 1: on the scant evidence, relatively scant at the time, I 335 00:21:34,920 --> 00:21:39,840 Speaker 1: thought the cloth that had a good chance of being authentic. So, um, 336 00:21:40,040 --> 00:21:43,199 Speaker 1: you know, I looked at the bibliography and started, uh, 337 00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:47,040 Speaker 1: you know, looking for articles and more books and things, 338 00:21:47,080 --> 00:21:53,280 Speaker 1: and started keeping a collection. And you know, I started 339 00:21:53,280 --> 00:21:55,640 Speaker 1: out with about seven articles and I thought, wow, look 340 00:21:55,640 --> 00:21:59,119 Speaker 1: at this collection I'm getting it was virtually nothing. Today 341 00:21:59,160 --> 00:22:03,520 Speaker 1: I probably do have one of the top one or 342 00:22:03,520 --> 00:22:09,600 Speaker 1: two personal English language collection of shrawd materials in the world. Wow, 343 00:22:09,960 --> 00:22:13,399 Speaker 1: so my whole basement is practically a shroud museum. Absolutely 344 00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:17,080 Speaker 1: divinely guided. It sounds like, I mean, just like this 345 00:22:17,200 --> 00:22:21,480 Speaker 1: was not popular in the United States and it inspired you, 346 00:22:22,040 --> 00:22:26,040 Speaker 1: like down to the core. That's yeah. It just totally 347 00:22:26,119 --> 00:22:31,880 Speaker 1: changed my life. It actually helped. It was a vehicle 348 00:22:32,119 --> 00:22:35,000 Speaker 1: for me to actually come back, at least temporar early 349 00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:39,640 Speaker 1: to my Catholic roots, and within about three years I 350 00:22:39,760 --> 00:22:45,639 Speaker 1: joined a monastery in Saint Louis, where I managed to 351 00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:51,080 Speaker 1: survive for eighteen and a half years. Yeah, that's amazing, 352 00:22:51,280 --> 00:22:55,520 Speaker 1: eighteen and a half years. But I don't regret it 353 00:22:55,560 --> 00:23:03,360 Speaker 1: because what happened was in nineteen ninety seven, I received 354 00:23:03,359 --> 00:23:11,159 Speaker 1: a call from a woman from Ohio and she said 355 00:23:11,240 --> 00:23:15,880 Speaker 1: that she claimed that she was having these um interactions 356 00:23:15,880 --> 00:23:18,520 Speaker 1: with Jesus and stuff. And I'm open to that. I mean, 357 00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:20,840 Speaker 1: you got to be careful. You can't. I mean, you 358 00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:24,520 Speaker 1: can't accept at face value when people say those things. 359 00:23:25,440 --> 00:23:28,160 Speaker 1: You got to investigate it on a case by case basis. 360 00:23:28,160 --> 00:23:34,040 Speaker 1: And she sounded normal, she didn't sound crazy, and so 361 00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:36,200 Speaker 1: we started talking on the phone. She said she had 362 00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:45,720 Speaker 1: survived childhood cancer and she was a weightlifter and but we, 363 00:23:45,720 --> 00:23:49,560 Speaker 1: you know, we had we talked on the phone about 364 00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:52,280 Speaker 1: spiritual things in the Shroud and we kind of just 365 00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:55,240 Speaker 1: you know, made it a connection on the phone, and 366 00:23:56,280 --> 00:23:58,679 Speaker 1: she was she said she had seen a program on 367 00:23:58,720 --> 00:24:01,280 Speaker 1: the Shroud on TV and she wanted to learn more. 368 00:24:02,440 --> 00:24:08,320 Speaker 1: And um, you know, we continued to talk and she 369 00:24:08,440 --> 00:24:14,280 Speaker 1: actually sent me a picture from an article that was 370 00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:16,880 Speaker 1: written about her in her hometown of Columbus. She had 371 00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:20,000 Speaker 1: she was running two businesses out of her home. She 372 00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:27,560 Speaker 1: had two young kids, um her her husband had left 373 00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:31,879 Speaker 1: her a couple of years before that, and so she 374 00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:37,320 Speaker 1: sent me an article that had a color picture of 375 00:24:37,400 --> 00:24:39,119 Speaker 1: her in it. And you know, I had no idea 376 00:24:39,160 --> 00:24:40,960 Speaker 1: what she looked like, how old she was. But we 377 00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:44,000 Speaker 1: you know, we just had a good kind of spiritual 378 00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:47,760 Speaker 1: connection right after that. And when when she sent me 379 00:24:47,800 --> 00:24:52,760 Speaker 1: the article, I opened it and I can remember my 380 00:24:52,800 --> 00:24:57,080 Speaker 1: exact words, which were, oh, because here was this too 381 00:24:57,200 --> 00:25:01,280 Speaker 1: much to my surprise, here was this young looking, vivacious 382 00:25:01,320 --> 00:25:04,520 Speaker 1: woman which did not match to Mike. You know, she 383 00:25:04,600 --> 00:25:07,960 Speaker 1: said she had survived cancer, she was a powerlifter, and 384 00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:12,000 Speaker 1: that picture of her just did not match to that 385 00:25:12,160 --> 00:25:16,439 Speaker 1: at all. Another life changing moment. We gotta get to 386 00:25:16,640 --> 00:25:19,679 Speaker 1: our next break, Joe. We're gonna be right back to finish. 387 00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:22,800 Speaker 1: This is amazing, all right, You guys, don't forget to 388 00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:26,760 Speaker 1: go to Heidi Hollis dot com or shadow Folks dot com. 389 00:25:26,800 --> 00:25:28,640 Speaker 1: Tell me your stories, tell me what's on your mind 390 00:25:28,680 --> 00:25:30,560 Speaker 1: out there, and tell me what your thoughts are about 391 00:25:30,800 --> 00:25:34,080 Speaker 1: the shroud of tourist. As we continue our conversation with 392 00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:37,800 Speaker 1: Joseph Marino. All right, you are listening to Dark Becomes 393 00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:42,520 Speaker 1: Light with me Heidi Hollis, I Hurt Radio and Coach 394 00:25:42,680 --> 00:26:05,040 Speaker 1: Coach Damn Paranormal Podcast. Stick around, Okay, right back, welcome back. 395 00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:08,200 Speaker 1: You are listening to Dark Becomes Blight with me Heidi 396 00:26:08,280 --> 00:26:12,360 Speaker 1: Hollis on the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast Ay am 397 00:26:12,720 --> 00:26:17,080 Speaker 1: Tera Normal podcast Network. I have a Joe Marino and 398 00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:21,520 Speaker 1: he is telling us all about his really inspiring journey 399 00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:28,120 Speaker 1: going from a sports loving music playing I'm sorry enthusiast, 400 00:26:28,520 --> 00:26:32,000 Speaker 1: you wish that you could play, Yeah, exactly, but you 401 00:26:32,080 --> 00:26:36,480 Speaker 1: didn't inherit that And then you came across this mother 402 00:26:36,560 --> 00:26:41,120 Speaker 1: of two, single mother of two who has this fascination 403 00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:44,360 Speaker 1: with a shrouded toura as yourself, which is a Sue Benford, 404 00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:48,560 Speaker 1: and you're you're impressed by her photo and knew you 405 00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:55,080 Speaker 1: were in trouble. Huh yeah, yeah, yeah, oh just came 406 00:26:55,119 --> 00:26:58,760 Speaker 1: out and it's like, oh, I wasn't expecting this. And 407 00:26:59,200 --> 00:27:01,960 Speaker 1: you know when you make a connection on one level 408 00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:04,600 Speaker 1: with a person and then you add another, you know, 409 00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:09,280 Speaker 1: big level like that. Yeah, you know you kind of 410 00:27:09,320 --> 00:27:12,800 Speaker 1: know off the bat that things could cook, you know. Yeah, well, 411 00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:16,800 Speaker 1: how do you say Benedictine Benedictine monk. Yeah, yeah, that's um, 412 00:27:17,480 --> 00:27:20,239 Speaker 1: that that's that's you know, surprising. I mean I think 413 00:27:20,240 --> 00:27:22,840 Speaker 1: it surprises a lot of people. But you know, from 414 00:27:23,119 --> 00:27:27,760 Speaker 1: more recent research myself and looking into uh various topics, 415 00:27:27,800 --> 00:27:30,359 Speaker 1: I've found that there's a lot of former nuns and 416 00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:33,520 Speaker 1: priests who you know, start another life, you know, as 417 00:27:33,560 --> 00:27:36,600 Speaker 1: one phase of their life and they move on to another. Um. 418 00:27:36,960 --> 00:27:43,520 Speaker 1: So how did things uh progress between the two of you. Well, um, 419 00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:47,000 Speaker 1: she um actually asked if she could come out and 420 00:27:47,119 --> 00:27:51,880 Speaker 1: visit me, and um, you know she did, and we 421 00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:56,800 Speaker 1: eventually even met with my my personal spiritual director, who 422 00:27:56,880 --> 00:28:02,240 Speaker 1: was a diocesan priest. UM and I still when I 423 00:28:02,280 --> 00:28:04,360 Speaker 1: go back to Saint Louis usually every Christmas, I get 424 00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:09,200 Speaker 1: together with him. And he was impressed by her too. 425 00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:13,840 Speaker 1: But you know, he was advising me to be cautious 426 00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:17,760 Speaker 1: and I think I was. And Sue came out several 427 00:28:17,800 --> 00:28:22,360 Speaker 1: times and and you know, it wasn't it wasn't very 428 00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:26,240 Speaker 1: long before I thought, you know, and we were connecting 429 00:28:26,320 --> 00:28:30,000 Speaker 1: really a lot on the shroud level in terms of 430 00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:34,200 Speaker 1: wanting to do research and stuff, and we had ideas 431 00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:39,840 Speaker 1: for research and whatnot. And so she came out several times, 432 00:28:39,840 --> 00:28:43,720 Speaker 1: and you know, even by say, by the second time, 433 00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:46,640 Speaker 1: I was I already began to think that, you know, 434 00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:50,560 Speaker 1: I could be in for a life change. And just 435 00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:55,640 Speaker 1: weird things started happening. Some people call him godwink, some 436 00:28:55,720 --> 00:28:58,920 Speaker 1: people call him synchronicities. But I want to tell you 437 00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:03,760 Speaker 1: I just for almost every day for about a year, 438 00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:11,160 Speaker 1: strange things would would happen that seemed to me, seemed 439 00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:18,040 Speaker 1: to be drawing us closer together. And eventually I just 440 00:29:18,200 --> 00:29:22,520 Speaker 1: my heart and conscience, even though it it surprised me 441 00:29:22,560 --> 00:29:26,040 Speaker 1: as much as anybody else, my heart and conscience began 442 00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:29,880 Speaker 1: to tell me that I actually needed to to leave 443 00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:34,240 Speaker 1: the monastery and be with her. And that's what I 444 00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:37,960 Speaker 1: ended up having happening. And I never regretted it. I mean, 445 00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:42,240 Speaker 1: it was tough. Um, you know, I'd expected to be 446 00:29:42,320 --> 00:29:44,800 Speaker 1: in that monastery for the rest of my life and everything. 447 00:29:45,480 --> 00:29:49,320 Speaker 1: But I remember the when I when I kind of 448 00:29:49,320 --> 00:29:51,520 Speaker 1: reached the stage where I knew that I needed to 449 00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:55,160 Speaker 1: do that. I want to see my spiritual director by myself, 450 00:29:55,160 --> 00:29:59,440 Speaker 1: Father Tom, And I said, you know, he was kind 451 00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:02,640 Speaker 1: of sup word of of it, and I was really 452 00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:05,200 Speaker 1: kind of hoping he'd come up with a reason that 453 00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:08,200 Speaker 1: I shouldn't do it, because I was kind of apprehensive 454 00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:15,560 Speaker 1: about taking that step. And so eventually I knew I 455 00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:17,880 Speaker 1: had to do it, and I've never regretted it. I mean, 456 00:30:17,920 --> 00:30:21,280 Speaker 1: I eventually I lost Sue to cancer in two thousand 457 00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:26,480 Speaker 1: and nine, but we ended up doing really really significant 458 00:30:26,520 --> 00:30:30,320 Speaker 1: SHROUD work that we would have never been able to 459 00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:36,440 Speaker 1: have been to have accomplished. We stayed apart, I would say, honestly. 460 00:30:36,480 --> 00:30:43,560 Speaker 1: I mean, you and Sue did research that saved SHROUD 461 00:30:43,720 --> 00:30:49,160 Speaker 1: research to continue to this day. I mean, I wish 462 00:30:49,240 --> 00:30:52,600 Speaker 1: that my show was longer sometimes that we could dive 463 00:30:52,680 --> 00:30:57,360 Speaker 1: into all the details. But tell us about, you know 464 00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:00,520 Speaker 1: how that came about, because so you've you've are so 465 00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:04,720 Speaker 1: well published, and you're so well researched when it comes 466 00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:08,280 Speaker 1: to the Strate of Turan and yourself and Sue quite 467 00:31:08,280 --> 00:31:11,880 Speaker 1: the team you it. Tell us about some of the 468 00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:16,280 Speaker 1: articles that you put out and how you helped turn 469 00:31:16,600 --> 00:31:20,320 Speaker 1: a lot of heads and minds about you know, where 470 00:31:20,360 --> 00:31:25,720 Speaker 1: the research should go. Okay, well, that's STIRP team that 471 00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:29,000 Speaker 1: I mentioned in nineteen seventy eight. They studied the shroud 472 00:31:29,080 --> 00:31:33,440 Speaker 1: for five days around the clock, and their main mission 473 00:31:33,520 --> 00:31:36,320 Speaker 1: had been to try to figure out how the image 474 00:31:36,320 --> 00:31:40,360 Speaker 1: got on the cloth, and they had the best science 475 00:31:40,400 --> 00:31:43,000 Speaker 1: and technology available at the time. They had guys from 476 00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:50,920 Speaker 1: NASA and Los Almost National Laboratory, Sandy National Laboratories. I mean, 477 00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:53,160 Speaker 1: these guys, and there were a few women on a team. 478 00:31:53,160 --> 00:31:55,160 Speaker 1: I don't want to give them short shrift, but um, 479 00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:57,640 Speaker 1: you know, a lot of the scientists on a team 480 00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:02,760 Speaker 1: built bombs and help put men into space. And these 481 00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:06,880 Speaker 1: were bright guys, you know. But they couldn't figure out 482 00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:11,600 Speaker 1: how the image got on the shroud. So the evidence 483 00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:19,240 Speaker 1: seemed to be pointing that it was unnatural event of 484 00:32:19,320 --> 00:32:22,240 Speaker 1: some kind, and it had all the wounds. The man 485 00:32:22,280 --> 00:32:25,000 Speaker 1: on the shroud has all the wounds that the Gospels 486 00:32:25,040 --> 00:32:28,800 Speaker 1: described as having happened to Jesus. So there's that big 487 00:32:28,920 --> 00:32:33,960 Speaker 1: Jesus connection. And Stirp concluded that it was not the 488 00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:37,080 Speaker 1: product of an artist. Okay, they didn't they didn't know 489 00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:40,320 Speaker 1: how it got on the cloth. So from seventy eight 490 00:32:40,360 --> 00:32:43,720 Speaker 1: to eighty eight, you know, the world was above buzz 491 00:32:43,800 --> 00:32:48,080 Speaker 1: with the idea that the shroud was probably authentic and 492 00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:51,640 Speaker 1: then in nineteen eighty eight the church allowed a carbon 493 00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:58,480 Speaker 1: fourteen dating radiocarbon dating, and that's a whole story in itself. 494 00:32:58,520 --> 00:33:01,240 Speaker 1: I wrote an eight hundred page book on how things 495 00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:05,080 Speaker 1: got screwed up with the test, and I put additional 496 00:33:05,920 --> 00:33:09,040 Speaker 1: entries after the book was published, and those are available 497 00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:13,520 Speaker 1: online on my academia page. There's just tons of information 498 00:33:13,560 --> 00:33:20,120 Speaker 1: that things were just royally screwed up. But the bottom 499 00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:23,600 Speaker 1: line was that the three labs said that the shroud 500 00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:26,640 Speaker 1: dated to twelve sixty to thirteen ninety eight D, which 501 00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:30,360 Speaker 1: means obviously that would be too late to have been 502 00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:34,320 Speaker 1: Jesus's cloth. And by that time I had been studying 503 00:33:34,320 --> 00:33:39,120 Speaker 1: the shroud eleven years, and I I just sort of 504 00:33:39,240 --> 00:33:42,000 Speaker 1: knew that something had to be wrong with that C 505 00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:46,840 Speaker 1: fourteen tests, and I wasn't sure at that time. So 506 00:33:48,240 --> 00:33:55,600 Speaker 1: once I got together with Sue at one point, I 507 00:33:55,720 --> 00:33:59,360 Speaker 1: came out into Ohio and in nineteen ninety eight, so 508 00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:04,440 Speaker 1: about another ten years passed after the CEA fourteen, and 509 00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:07,080 Speaker 1: during that period everybody was saying, oh, you know, the 510 00:34:07,160 --> 00:34:11,759 Speaker 1: shroud was a fake and this and that, and I 511 00:34:11,800 --> 00:34:17,400 Speaker 1: guess it was around two thousand year two thousand Sue 512 00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:22,319 Speaker 1: got one of her kind of spiritual insights and was 513 00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:26,800 Speaker 1: told that the that the area where they took the 514 00:34:26,920 --> 00:34:32,440 Speaker 1: Sea fourteen sample from was a repair. So since I 515 00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:35,279 Speaker 1: had such a great collection, she had me get out 516 00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:37,960 Speaker 1: some of the better pictures of that corner and we 517 00:34:38,000 --> 00:34:41,480 Speaker 1: started looking at it and stuff, and we thought we 518 00:34:41,560 --> 00:34:49,240 Speaker 1: could see some um abnormalities in that area in different 519 00:34:49,760 --> 00:34:52,360 Speaker 1: kind of the weavel would look different in places and 520 00:34:52,400 --> 00:34:59,759 Speaker 1: stuff like that. So we took some high quality photos 521 00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:06,520 Speaker 1: and she literally took the photos to a tailor downtown 522 00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:11,400 Speaker 1: in downtown Columbus. He was a French a European trained 523 00:35:12,080 --> 00:35:18,080 Speaker 1: UM taylor, and she showed him the picture and did 524 00:35:18,640 --> 00:35:20,359 Speaker 1: not tell him that it was from the shroud, And 525 00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:22,360 Speaker 1: she says, what can you tell me about this photo? 526 00:35:23,080 --> 00:35:27,239 Speaker 1: And basically he said, um, well, it looks like there's 527 00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:30,080 Speaker 1: been some manipulation in the area. And we said, ah, 528 00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:35,600 Speaker 1: that that sounds interesting. So then she sent the same 529 00:35:35,600 --> 00:35:40,960 Speaker 1: photos to a couple of world renowned linen Um companies, 530 00:35:41,520 --> 00:35:47,000 Speaker 1: one in in Um, Ireland and one in Albany, New York. 531 00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:49,920 Speaker 1: And again we did we didn't tell him that it 532 00:35:50,200 --> 00:35:52,719 Speaker 1: that it that it was the shroud. So they were 533 00:35:52,760 --> 00:35:56,440 Speaker 1: blinded to it, and each each of those two also 534 00:35:56,560 --> 00:36:01,719 Speaker 1: independently said in you know, different worlds, that basically that 535 00:36:01,800 --> 00:36:05,399 Speaker 1: there was a repair of some kind. So we had 536 00:36:05,480 --> 00:36:12,360 Speaker 1: three independent textile experts who were blinded to the fact 537 00:36:12,400 --> 00:36:16,279 Speaker 1: that it was the shroud, all who have said that 538 00:36:16,360 --> 00:36:20,480 Speaker 1: they thought they were repairs in the area. So there 539 00:36:20,560 --> 00:36:24,360 Speaker 1: was going to be a big international conference in or Viato, 540 00:36:24,480 --> 00:36:28,680 Speaker 1: Italy in August of two thousand and Before we had 541 00:36:28,719 --> 00:36:34,719 Speaker 1: that idea about that, we hadn't planned to attend. But 542 00:36:34,840 --> 00:36:37,120 Speaker 1: once we got that idea, we said, you know, we 543 00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:39,800 Speaker 1: got to go to this conference and present the paper. 544 00:36:40,880 --> 00:36:46,120 Speaker 1: So we did, and you know, several people told us 545 00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:48,200 Speaker 1: that it was really the hit of the conference. And 546 00:36:48,280 --> 00:36:53,120 Speaker 1: Barry Schwartz, who was the documenting photographers first Start and 547 00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:57,760 Speaker 1: as the editor and publisher of the biggest and best 548 00:36:57,880 --> 00:37:02,759 Speaker 1: shroud Side, which is shroud dot com, if you if 549 00:37:02,800 --> 00:37:05,759 Speaker 1: your listeners go there, they better bring some food and 550 00:37:05,800 --> 00:37:08,440 Speaker 1: snacks and drinks because you could spend the rest of 551 00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:11,960 Speaker 1: your life there. Um. So Barry put it up there. 552 00:37:12,560 --> 00:37:17,239 Speaker 1: And one of the guys on the Start team, whose 553 00:37:17,320 --> 00:37:21,120 Speaker 1: name was Ray Rogers, he was the chemist, the head 554 00:37:21,120 --> 00:37:25,160 Speaker 1: of the chemist Chemistry aspect of the testing for STIR. 555 00:37:25,680 --> 00:37:29,719 Speaker 1: He had kind of gotten out of Shroud Research. He 556 00:37:30,800 --> 00:37:36,040 Speaker 1: had accepted the nineteen eighty eight dating results, but he 557 00:37:36,120 --> 00:37:39,520 Speaker 1: kept up with Barry site, and when he saw the 558 00:37:40,200 --> 00:37:45,000 Speaker 1: paper on Barry side, he kind of he called Barry 559 00:37:45,080 --> 00:37:48,120 Speaker 1: up and read him the Riot Act. Why are you 560 00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:51,640 Speaker 1: publishing this nonsense? These people are part of the lunatic fringe. 561 00:37:51,680 --> 00:37:53,920 Speaker 1: I can prove them, prove him wrong in five minutes, 562 00:37:54,440 --> 00:37:57,480 Speaker 1: and Barry's as well. Well, Right, do what you need 563 00:37:57,520 --> 00:38:02,880 Speaker 1: to do, because it was so fascinating that he was 564 00:38:03,000 --> 00:38:07,080 Speaker 1: literally he had samples from nineteen seventy eight from the 565 00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:09,719 Speaker 1: main part of the cloth. Okay, we got to hold 566 00:38:09,760 --> 00:38:11,760 Speaker 1: it right there because I gotta get to our next break. 567 00:38:11,760 --> 00:38:14,560 Speaker 1: You guys, you are listening to Dark Becomes Blight with 568 00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:18,400 Speaker 1: me Heidi Hollis on the iHeart Radio and Coast to 569 00:38:18,480 --> 00:38:22,479 Speaker 1: Coast am para normal podcast network. Stick around so we'll 570 00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:38,040 Speaker 1: be right back with Lord Joe Marino. Welcome back. You 571 00:38:38,080 --> 00:38:41,560 Speaker 1: are listening to Dark Becomes Light with me Heidi Hollis 572 00:38:41,600 --> 00:38:44,560 Speaker 1: on the iHeart Radio and Coast to Coast a am 573 00:38:45,239 --> 00:38:48,560 Speaker 1: para normal podcast network. I have Joe Marino here, who 574 00:38:48,719 --> 00:38:53,239 Speaker 1: is sharing about honestly probably one of the greatest finds 575 00:38:53,280 --> 00:38:58,680 Speaker 1: in Shadow Terren's history, and not allowing the nineteen eighty 576 00:38:58,680 --> 00:39:03,680 Speaker 1: eight death to stand. And I watched to continue where 577 00:39:03,719 --> 00:39:06,319 Speaker 1: you left off there, Yeah, because it's death. Fascinating how 578 00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:11,640 Speaker 1: this came to be. Yeah. So Ray Rogers thought that 579 00:39:11,760 --> 00:39:16,520 Speaker 1: he could prove our theory wrong because he had samples 580 00:39:16,560 --> 00:39:18,879 Speaker 1: from the main part of the cloth from nineteen seventy eight, 581 00:39:18,960 --> 00:39:23,719 Speaker 1: and he had been given another point some samples that 582 00:39:23,880 --> 00:39:28,480 Speaker 1: were right next to the C fourteen sample area, so 583 00:39:29,080 --> 00:39:33,239 Speaker 1: he could compare the two and if they were exactly 584 00:39:33,239 --> 00:39:35,600 Speaker 1: the same, that would show that there was no repair. 585 00:39:36,560 --> 00:39:42,320 Speaker 1: So he got out his microscope and Barry said he called. 586 00:39:43,640 --> 00:39:45,640 Speaker 1: He called Barry back about an hour and a half 587 00:39:45,680 --> 00:39:47,360 Speaker 1: after he said it would take him five minutes, and 588 00:39:47,440 --> 00:39:49,640 Speaker 1: he says, I can't believe it. I think they're right. 589 00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:53,919 Speaker 1: He looked at both samples and he found that the 590 00:39:55,200 --> 00:39:59,560 Speaker 1: area in the C fourteen corner was chemically different than 591 00:39:59,600 --> 00:40:02,879 Speaker 1: the main part of the shroud. And then later on 592 00:40:03,000 --> 00:40:06,760 Speaker 1: he was actually given a leftover sample from the actual 593 00:40:06,880 --> 00:40:11,080 Speaker 1: Sea fourteen piece and that they had the same and 594 00:40:11,080 --> 00:40:16,400 Speaker 1: they had the same characteristics as the you know area 595 00:40:16,600 --> 00:40:20,359 Speaker 1: next to it. Which he had previously had, so they 596 00:40:20,360 --> 00:40:24,440 Speaker 1: were different. And then he found he found like a 597 00:40:24,600 --> 00:40:28,840 Speaker 1: dye and he found a splice linen and cotton thread, 598 00:40:29,320 --> 00:40:33,040 Speaker 1: which means that cotton was used to repair that area 599 00:40:33,080 --> 00:40:36,799 Speaker 1: and they used dye to make the color look exactly 600 00:40:36,800 --> 00:40:40,240 Speaker 1: like the original. So then that kind of makes sense 601 00:40:40,320 --> 00:40:43,719 Speaker 1: because a big chunk had been a big portion of 602 00:40:43,760 --> 00:40:46,439 Speaker 1: that corner had been taken out for relics. And if 603 00:40:46,640 --> 00:40:48,319 Speaker 1: you know, if you have a piece of linen and 604 00:40:48,520 --> 00:40:50,799 Speaker 1: you have a big piece of it taken out, if 605 00:40:50,800 --> 00:40:55,959 Speaker 1: you don't repair it or restore it, it unravels, So 606 00:40:56,040 --> 00:41:00,120 Speaker 1: it makes sense that at least some repair work was 607 00:41:00,160 --> 00:41:02,919 Speaker 1: done on it to tidy up the corners and where 608 00:41:03,080 --> 00:41:09,719 Speaker 1: where it was cut. And Ray Rogers wrote a peri 609 00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:14,439 Speaker 1: viewed scientific article in a high end chemical journal called 610 00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:19,760 Speaker 1: Thermal Chemica Acta in January two thousand and five, and 611 00:41:20,320 --> 00:41:24,879 Speaker 1: he said that that sample in the C fourteen area 612 00:41:25,080 --> 00:41:30,239 Speaker 1: was different, and he gave some other details that we 613 00:41:30,280 --> 00:41:32,960 Speaker 1: don't have time to go into now, but basically he 614 00:41:33,080 --> 00:41:39,239 Speaker 1: said that the C. Fourteen sample was not valid for 615 00:41:39,800 --> 00:41:43,920 Speaker 1: being able to determine the dating of the shrouds. So, 616 00:41:43,920 --> 00:41:46,440 Speaker 1: in other words, that twelve to sixty to thirteen ninety 617 00:41:46,480 --> 00:41:52,480 Speaker 1: date cannot be accepted because there was apparently it was 618 00:41:52,520 --> 00:41:58,560 Speaker 1: a mixture of first century cloth and sixteenth century cloth. 619 00:41:59,360 --> 00:42:03,400 Speaker 1: So that kind of jump started research to a degree 620 00:42:03,440 --> 00:42:09,560 Speaker 1: back uh into the more research again. I mean people 621 00:42:09,600 --> 00:42:13,160 Speaker 1: hadn't stopped completely, but that it really did give it 622 00:42:13,200 --> 00:42:16,120 Speaker 1: a boost. And and you know it's been full steam ahead. 623 00:42:16,160 --> 00:42:20,160 Speaker 1: And since then there's been statistical studies that show that 624 00:42:20,280 --> 00:42:24,239 Speaker 1: the what the labs did with the data was a 625 00:42:24,280 --> 00:42:28,920 Speaker 1: little um shall we say, manipulative. They didn't they didn't 626 00:42:29,000 --> 00:42:31,440 Speaker 1: use all the dates, they threw out the bad dates 627 00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:35,319 Speaker 1: and when they constructed their statistics to come up with 628 00:42:35,360 --> 00:42:42,239 Speaker 1: a twelve sixty to thirteen ninety date with supposedly confidence, right, 629 00:42:43,040 --> 00:42:48,960 Speaker 1: So wow, that's that's wild. I mean, all because Sue, 630 00:42:49,239 --> 00:42:53,239 Speaker 1: your wife had a vision and and that kind of 631 00:42:53,280 --> 00:42:56,520 Speaker 1: gets skipped over. Do you find uh in the research? 632 00:42:56,920 --> 00:43:00,520 Speaker 1: You know, like you two having brought the attention to 633 00:43:00,560 --> 00:43:02,799 Speaker 1: have a look at that, you know what you what 634 00:43:02,920 --> 00:43:06,440 Speaker 1: you discovered and uh, but they like the nuts and bolts. 635 00:43:06,440 --> 00:43:11,440 Speaker 1: They don't like spiritual insight. But God still talks everybody 636 00:43:11,520 --> 00:43:15,520 Speaker 1: and this is still around and it's like that is uh, 637 00:43:15,600 --> 00:43:20,640 Speaker 1: it's so amazing. And I've seen a couple of shows 638 00:43:20,680 --> 00:43:23,680 Speaker 1: that has you and Sue speaking of your discovery and 639 00:43:23,760 --> 00:43:26,880 Speaker 1: getting the credit that you deserve, but not getting the 640 00:43:26,960 --> 00:43:33,360 Speaker 1: opportunity to speak to uh it having come from a vision, right, Yeah, 641 00:43:33,360 --> 00:43:38,680 Speaker 1: people do have problems with that. Um, you know, it's 642 00:43:38,680 --> 00:43:41,080 Speaker 1: just it's just one of those things of human nature 643 00:43:41,160 --> 00:43:46,640 Speaker 1: that some things make us uncomfortable. And you know people 644 00:43:46,719 --> 00:43:51,560 Speaker 1: that supposedly get spiritual insights or yeah, or one of them, 645 00:43:51,880 --> 00:43:54,560 Speaker 1: and so yeah, people pretty just pretty much ignore that. 646 00:43:55,400 --> 00:43:58,080 Speaker 1: It's amazing you having the background that you that you 647 00:43:58,160 --> 00:44:02,600 Speaker 1: do as a as a monk and being open to that. 648 00:44:02,719 --> 00:44:06,960 Speaker 1: I mean, that's that's inspiring right there, because I'm a 649 00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:10,200 Speaker 1: firm believer that you know, we all get guidance and 650 00:44:10,640 --> 00:44:12,560 Speaker 1: you know, it's whether we pay attention to it or not. 651 00:44:12,640 --> 00:44:16,480 Speaker 1: And because she did and you both having the know 652 00:44:16,600 --> 00:44:18,879 Speaker 1: how and understanding of the shout a trend that this 653 00:44:19,040 --> 00:44:23,680 Speaker 1: was something important to pursue. And yeah, I mean do 654 00:44:23,760 --> 00:44:26,920 Speaker 1: you find though too that I have that uh, you know, 655 00:44:26,920 --> 00:44:30,080 Speaker 1: it's still having to prove to people that the carbon 656 00:44:30,160 --> 00:44:32,640 Speaker 1: dating was was wrong. I mean do you feel like 657 00:44:32,719 --> 00:44:39,960 Speaker 1: sort cover that up, patch that up? Yeah? Um, there's 658 00:44:40,040 --> 00:44:43,360 Speaker 1: tons of still tons of YouTube videos and all sorts 659 00:44:43,400 --> 00:44:45,920 Speaker 1: of things where people do not want to have an 660 00:44:45,960 --> 00:44:50,640 Speaker 1: authentic shroud because, um the repercussions of that are scary 661 00:44:50,680 --> 00:44:56,000 Speaker 1: for them if especially if they're agnostic or atheists. Um, 662 00:44:56,160 --> 00:45:00,160 Speaker 1: so they do everything in their power to try to 663 00:44:59,480 --> 00:45:03,520 Speaker 1: u prove it. And nobody has been able to come 664 00:45:03,600 --> 00:45:07,319 Speaker 1: up with a reasonable explanation of how that image got 665 00:45:07,320 --> 00:45:10,200 Speaker 1: on the class So they just they give a lot 666 00:45:10,200 --> 00:45:13,960 Speaker 1: of half truths and falsehoods and continue to try to 667 00:45:15,480 --> 00:45:19,960 Speaker 1: say it's nonsense. That's a shame because it is a 668 00:45:20,000 --> 00:45:27,040 Speaker 1: common uh discussion honestly, and I'm just like, I don't understand. Uh, 669 00:45:27,200 --> 00:45:32,400 Speaker 1: you know, the erasing um Christ having been such a 670 00:45:32,520 --> 00:45:36,680 Speaker 1: huge marker on the history of this planet is absolutely 671 00:45:36,680 --> 00:45:39,560 Speaker 1: in motion all the time. I mean, it's BC is 672 00:45:39,560 --> 00:45:42,400 Speaker 1: no longer before Christ, It's before the common Era, you know, 673 00:45:42,440 --> 00:45:46,399 Speaker 1: it's BC. You know, you know, it's like, why do that? 674 00:45:46,680 --> 00:45:49,040 Speaker 1: And one of my favorite arguments I would love to 675 00:45:49,360 --> 00:45:52,040 Speaker 1: tell my friends who you know, don't believe Jesus is 676 00:45:52,600 --> 00:45:54,400 Speaker 1: it was a big deal. I'm like, oh, what's the 677 00:45:54,480 --> 00:45:58,319 Speaker 1: what's the year again? You know, we we marked our 678 00:45:58,360 --> 00:46:02,040 Speaker 1: calendars our years to the day of him. Having passed 679 00:46:02,080 --> 00:46:06,520 Speaker 1: because he wasn't is a big deal. Yeah, and you'll 680 00:46:06,560 --> 00:46:10,799 Speaker 1: probably have noticed, like I have that it's amazing how 681 00:46:11,440 --> 00:46:16,680 Speaker 1: how many videos and articles and different sites try to 682 00:46:16,719 --> 00:46:21,480 Speaker 1: put forth the idea that Jesus never even existed. I 683 00:46:21,520 --> 00:46:24,000 Speaker 1: mean they did, that's how far they take it. Um, 684 00:46:25,040 --> 00:46:26,879 Speaker 1: you know, and that's kind of silly because I mean, 685 00:46:28,120 --> 00:46:33,120 Speaker 1: he's he's probably the best attested ancient figure in history, 686 00:46:33,560 --> 00:46:41,080 Speaker 1: but because of the religious connections, people try to totally 687 00:46:41,120 --> 00:46:44,600 Speaker 1: erase him from history and say he never existed. But 688 00:46:45,040 --> 00:46:48,280 Speaker 1: you know, the main obviously those are kind of people 689 00:46:49,360 --> 00:46:51,560 Speaker 1: not in the main I guess there's a few in 690 00:46:51,600 --> 00:46:55,560 Speaker 1: the mainstream, but um yeah, it's just it's just the 691 00:46:55,560 --> 00:46:58,200 Speaker 1: world we live in today that people don't want to 692 00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:01,640 Speaker 1: real Shroud and they don't want to real us either. Yeah. 693 00:47:01,640 --> 00:47:04,000 Speaker 1: It's just uh yeah, it's a it's a shame. But 694 00:47:04,680 --> 00:47:06,640 Speaker 1: first first name out of their mouths when they're in 695 00:47:06,680 --> 00:47:12,480 Speaker 1: trouble though, you know, my goodness, you know, where is 696 00:47:12,600 --> 00:47:16,040 Speaker 1: the where's the research going? Now? I mean you're always 697 00:47:16,200 --> 00:47:18,520 Speaker 1: updating something. I think I got to notice on my 698 00:47:18,560 --> 00:47:22,640 Speaker 1: phone just now Joe Marino updated something on Academia dot edu. 699 00:47:22,880 --> 00:47:26,680 Speaker 1: I mean, you are constantly working, you're constantly uh, you know, 700 00:47:27,239 --> 00:47:31,919 Speaker 1: pulling in new facts and figures. Where are things going now? Yeah, 701 00:47:31,960 --> 00:47:34,799 Speaker 1: that's a good question. I mean people are obviously, um 702 00:47:35,880 --> 00:47:40,200 Speaker 1: wondering if if any new testing will be allowed, whether 703 00:47:40,200 --> 00:47:43,560 Speaker 1: there'll be another C fourteen test or I kind of 704 00:47:43,600 --> 00:47:46,480 Speaker 1: doubt if they'll ever be another C fourteen test, um, 705 00:47:49,040 --> 00:47:53,319 Speaker 1: partly because we don't you know, we haven't worked out 706 00:47:53,320 --> 00:47:57,279 Speaker 1: all the bugs on the old on that system, on 707 00:47:57,320 --> 00:48:02,239 Speaker 1: the C fourteen testing already, and then there's new new 708 00:48:02,320 --> 00:48:05,560 Speaker 1: dating methods out and those need a lot of work too. 709 00:48:06,160 --> 00:48:13,239 Speaker 1: But I've heard that even though Pope Francis has background 710 00:48:13,239 --> 00:48:17,960 Speaker 1: in chemistry, um, my sources tell me that there'll be 711 00:48:18,000 --> 00:48:21,360 Speaker 1: no new testing as long as he's Pope. But you 712 00:48:21,400 --> 00:48:25,160 Speaker 1: know he's I think he's what eighty six or something now, 713 00:48:26,280 --> 00:48:29,239 Speaker 1: and you know, I don't know how much longer he'll 714 00:48:29,239 --> 00:48:34,680 Speaker 1: be around. But perhaps the next the next Pope will 715 00:48:34,760 --> 00:48:38,640 Speaker 1: allow testing. But you know, one of the amazing things 716 00:48:38,680 --> 00:48:41,560 Speaker 1: about the in my eight hundred page book is the 717 00:48:41,600 --> 00:48:47,680 Speaker 1: fact that Cardinal Ratzinger, who became Pope Benedict the sixteenth, 718 00:48:47,920 --> 00:48:53,200 Speaker 1: he actually had allowed, he had approved rather uh stirp 719 00:48:53,280 --> 00:48:56,640 Speaker 1: to have two weeks with the Shroud, including a C 720 00:48:56,840 --> 00:49:01,240 Speaker 1: fourteen test, and a lot of the politics and backstabbings 721 00:49:01,280 --> 00:49:05,160 Speaker 1: and agenda's got in the way, and STIRP was eliminated 722 00:49:05,239 --> 00:49:12,160 Speaker 1: from not only doing their new test of multidisciplinary aspects, 723 00:49:12,560 --> 00:49:15,239 Speaker 1: but they weren't even allowed to be involved in the 724 00:49:15,280 --> 00:49:18,399 Speaker 1: C fourteen test, which was part of the reason there 725 00:49:18,600 --> 00:49:21,759 Speaker 1: was a fiasco there. That's a shame. Well, Joe, we've 726 00:49:21,800 --> 00:49:23,920 Speaker 1: got to wrap it up. How how can people get 727 00:49:23,920 --> 00:49:27,000 Speaker 1: ahold of your books, your works? What's your website? My 728 00:49:27,120 --> 00:49:32,759 Speaker 1: website is homestead dot com Slash new Vista's all right, Well, 729 00:49:32,760 --> 00:49:34,440 Speaker 1: I want to thank you so much for coming on 730 00:49:34,480 --> 00:49:38,239 Speaker 1: the program today. This was really insightful, inspiring. Oh I 731 00:49:38,320 --> 00:49:41,040 Speaker 1: enjoyed it. Thanks for having me for sure. Now be 732 00:49:41,120 --> 00:49:43,920 Speaker 1: sure to go to Amazon dot com and look for 733 00:49:44,080 --> 00:49:48,040 Speaker 1: Joseph G. Marino for his twenty twenty updated new version 734 00:49:48,080 --> 00:49:51,120 Speaker 1: of his book and his other book. All Right, you guys, 735 00:49:51,360 --> 00:49:54,719 Speaker 1: don't forget to go to Heidi Hollis dot com or 736 00:49:54,840 --> 00:49:57,120 Speaker 1: shadow folks dot com. Tell me your stories, tell me 737 00:49:57,160 --> 00:49:59,080 Speaker 1: what's going on out there in the world. Tell me 738 00:49:59,160 --> 00:50:04,240 Speaker 1: your thoughts, your questions, your experiences. I don't care. Throw 739 00:50:04,239 --> 00:50:06,879 Speaker 1: it my way, and we will take a look at 740 00:50:06,880 --> 00:50:09,160 Speaker 1: it and dissect it. Because every other show, what do 741 00:50:09,239 --> 00:50:12,400 Speaker 1: we do. We take your emails and your phone calls 742 00:50:12,840 --> 00:50:15,239 Speaker 1: if you care to jump on an interview. I'm just 743 00:50:15,400 --> 00:50:19,840 Speaker 1: joking you guys never ever do that, so you're welcome. 744 00:50:20,080 --> 00:50:22,520 Speaker 1: Be sure to follow me on social media at one 745 00:50:22,719 --> 00:50:28,080 Speaker 1: Heidi Hollis. That is Twitter, TikTok, Facebook, Instagram, everything but YouTube, 746 00:50:28,239 --> 00:50:31,000 Speaker 1: which is just Kidi Hollis. All right, and be sure 747 00:50:31,080 --> 00:50:33,759 Speaker 1: to go to the Outlanders Comic dot com for my 748 00:50:33,840 --> 00:50:36,319 Speaker 1: paranormal comic strip. We have come to the bottom of 749 00:50:36,360 --> 00:50:39,720 Speaker 1: another fabulous program. You have been listening to Dark Becomes 750 00:50:39,800 --> 00:50:44,040 Speaker 1: Light with me Heidi Hollis on iHeartRadio and Coast to 751 00:50:44,080 --> 00:50:48,919 Speaker 1: Coast ay AM Paranormal Podcast Network. We'll see you next time. Hey, 752 00:50:48,920 --> 00:50:59,240 Speaker 1: thank for everybody. Goodbye. Well, if you like this edition 753 00:50:59,320 --> 00:51:02,279 Speaker 1: of Dark Comes Light, wait till you hear the next one. 754 00:51:02,760 --> 00:51:05,520 Speaker 1: You've been listening to the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast 755 00:51:05,560 --> 00:51:07,880 Speaker 1: AM Paranormal Podcast Network.