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Speaker 1: Hi'm Alec Baldwin and you're listening to Here's the thing,

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Speaker 1: my chance to talk with artists, policymakers and performers, to

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Speaker 1: hear their stories. What inspired their creations, what decisions changed

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Speaker 1: their careers, what relationships influenced their work. Well, I never

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Speaker 1: thought about me being in show business. I was a fan,

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Speaker 1: didn't watch TV, and I loved the movies. My guests

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Speaker 1: today both worked in film and TV during the Golden

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Speaker 1: Age of Hollywood. Robert Osborne began his career acting, but

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Speaker 1: his fascination with show business, drama on and off the

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Speaker 1: set led to a very different job, one he seems

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Speaker 1: to have been made for. Hi. I'm Robert Osborne, and

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Speaker 1: our Jimmy Cagney tribute continues now with Jimmy and this

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Speaker 1: is the Third Man. Osborne has been host of Turner

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Speaker 1: Classic Movies for almost two decades. His knowledge of the

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Speaker 1: film industry is encyclopedic, and he will tell you it's

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Speaker 1: rare when a movie comes along and inspires a whole

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Speaker 1: generation of actors, singers and directors. Just sing Singing in

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Speaker 1: the Rain is one of those movies. It also transformed

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Speaker 1: the life of its leading lady, Debbie Reynolds my first

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Speaker 1: guest this Hour. Reynolds was just a twenty year old

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Speaker 1: actress under contract at MGM, but after her performance in

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Speaker 1: that iconic film, she was destined to become a star.

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Speaker 1: Some of the highlights of Reynolds's career include Tammy in

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Speaker 1: Tammy and The Bachelor, with a song that reached number

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Speaker 1: one on the Billboard Charts, I have a cotton Woods

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Speaker 1: Whispering Able Jimmy jim ted Love. Reynolds was nominated for

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Speaker 1: an Academy Award for her leading role in The Unsinkable

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Speaker 1: Molly Brown and received a Tony nomination for her Broadway

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Speaker 1: debut in the musical Irene. Debbie Reynolds was born in

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Speaker 1: Texas and raised in Burbank, California, but after her career

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Speaker 1: took off, the small town girl found herself living in

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Speaker 1: a universe occupied by the biggest stars of her time.

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Speaker 1: Right across the street was Jimmy Stewart and Lucille Ball,

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Speaker 1: and everybody was on that one street. It was like,

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Speaker 1: let's have a party every night. George Burns and Eddie

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Speaker 1: Cannor lived on one block, so I would drive over

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Speaker 1: there because that street was more fun than my phone.

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Speaker 1: There was a lot of fun to be had back then.

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Speaker 1: This was still the golden age of Hollywood, but it

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Speaker 1: was also the studio system where executives bought and sold

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Speaker 1: actors like property. Although a parny to Reynolds, it had

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Speaker 1: its upside too. When we were under contract, most of us,

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Speaker 1: Shirley McClain and Elizabeth Theater were at MGM, and everything

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Speaker 1: was done for us, you know, the makeup of hair.

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Speaker 1: It sent cars for us. We were very spoiled. We

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Speaker 1: didn't kind of know what to do when they dropped everybody,

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Speaker 1: like when television came in. You remember what year around

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Speaker 1: there was. The end of the studio system kind of

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Speaker 1: died as you get into the fifties. It is slowly

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Speaker 1: died a death. You know. It was like interesting to

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Speaker 1: watch it was. I didn't realize it was the end,

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Speaker 1: you know, I didn't know that it was that you

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Speaker 1: didn't know what the change meant. Well, I was a

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Speaker 1: young girl, so I didn't And I wasn't an intellectual.

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Speaker 1: I wasn't educated. I'm from Burbank, Burbank and originally from

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Speaker 1: You want to be a gym teacher, that's me, you

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Speaker 1: know what I always aim high me too. I love, Jim,

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Speaker 1: you know I love. I wanted to be a lifeguard

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Speaker 1: son girls. Well yeah, swim, yes, Well, I was never

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Speaker 1: that ambitious. I wanted to be a gymnast. I wanted

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Speaker 1: to work on the bars and Entropedes work. I loved

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Speaker 1: all that stuff as a young girl in Burbank. And

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Speaker 1: you're athletic, no doubt. What's the first thing that happened

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Speaker 1: that says show business to you? Well, I never thought

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Speaker 1: about me being in show business. I was a fan

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Speaker 1: and I would go to the movies because my mother

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Speaker 1: let me. But no one else in our church was

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Speaker 1: allowed to go to films because movie stars were all

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Speaker 1: evil creatures, just dreadful. My mother let me go to films.

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Speaker 1: His mother was very religious, very my family said my dad.

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Speaker 1: My father used to say, no, no, no, I'm not

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Speaker 1: going to go to church with you. I've told you

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Speaker 1: that I'm not going to go because all those good

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Speaker 1: people will be killed. If I walked down, the roof

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Speaker 1: would fall in. And he was always teasing my mother

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Speaker 1: by asking what church did you go to? Churches and Nazarene,

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Speaker 1: which is like hard shell Baptist, kind of like your

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Speaker 1: mom was a heart. She was a Texan She was

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Speaker 1: a Texan Texan Baptist. She was tough and strict and

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Speaker 1: there were so many rules. How many kids in the family.

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Speaker 1: Just my brother and I were in the family. And

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Speaker 1: then my mother discovered what's your brother's name? Bill? And

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Speaker 1: do you know who Bill is? To me? You don't know.

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Speaker 1: Do you know that Billy Reynolds was my makeup artist

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Speaker 1: on nuts Landing for a year? Oh my gosh, was

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Speaker 1: he your brother? Billy isn't He was my makeup artist

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Speaker 1: and he's one of the people that helped me survived

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Speaker 1: that experience because those three broads from the Joan Colins

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Speaker 1: School where they were having the makeup put on with

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Speaker 1: a trowel every day. I'd have federally funded programs to

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Speaker 1: pay for the makeup for them. Billy Reynolds would turn

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Speaker 1: to me and he'd sit there and say, you know,

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Speaker 1: did you bring a book with you? We're in a

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Speaker 1: be here for a while. These girls are three hours

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Speaker 1: in the chair. And then he told me that he

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Speaker 1: was Elvis's makeup artist. Yes, And you know that every

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Speaker 1: time he mentioned Elvis, he didn't mention it a lot

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Speaker 1: because he was very shy, very shy. He mentioned Elvis

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Speaker 1: once or twice, and he started to cry. He would

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Speaker 1: turn away from me and hid to say. He said

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Speaker 1: to me, almost was the greatest man I ever worked with. Well,

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Speaker 1: the other used to play Elvis used to tease him

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Speaker 1: a lot and put snakes down his pants, and popcorn

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Speaker 1: and pop pop popcorn and put it in his drawers.

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Speaker 1: You know, they used to kid my brother. They used

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Speaker 1: to just pick on him kind of, but he didn't care.

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Speaker 1: My brother was a baseball player, really man's man. He

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Speaker 1: lives men in my house with me. Will you give

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Speaker 1: him my love? I don't even know if he'll remember me.

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Speaker 1: She Oh, he remembers everything. He just doesn't talk about it.

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Speaker 1: You know some men that are like almost reclusive, but

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Speaker 1: not really, because underneath all of that is a great

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Speaker 1: sense of where I adore my brother. I think our

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Speaker 1: life was rather tedious and hard because we didn't have

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Speaker 1: any money. I mean, my dad made two hundred a month.

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Speaker 1: Now that's better than nothing, but it's still also advised

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Speaker 1: very little. So our life was a little bit meager.

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Speaker 1: You know, we never had a Christmas tree. We never

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Speaker 1: had so when the opportunity came along for you to

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Speaker 1: get into the business, and I'm from the same school. Actually,

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Speaker 1: I'm wondering where you was enticed by and where you

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Speaker 1: was thrilled by as much about making money to help

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Speaker 1: your family as you were about your own glory. Well,

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Speaker 1: mostly I thought it was a joke that I won

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Speaker 1: this contest, and then all of a sudden, I'm in movies.

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Speaker 1: The silliest thing I was the contest. It was a

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Speaker 1: Miss Burrbank, Mrs Burbank. Don't don't, don't, don't downplay that.

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Speaker 1: No change my whole life and made my whole life

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Speaker 1: wonderful and marvels travel all over the world and meet

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Speaker 1: all these fabulous interesting people and see different countries. So

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Speaker 1: I'm very proud to say I was Miss Burbank and

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Speaker 1: had a hole in my bathing suit and there my

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Speaker 1: rear end was hanging out, and I didn't have shoes,

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Speaker 1: high heel shoes, so I had I'm very grateful for

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Speaker 1: stumbling in the show business step to Miss Burbank. What happened?

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Speaker 1: They took me to Warner Brothers and made a little

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Speaker 1: screen test and asked me why I wanted to be

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Speaker 1: a movie star. So of course I told him I

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Speaker 1: didn't want to. And after they laughed and they said

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Speaker 1: of course you do. I said, no, I don't. I

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Speaker 1: don't really. I mean, this is just fun. You're just

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Speaker 1: this is your kidding around, right. I was very square

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Speaker 1: and my family were very virginal, you know, very go

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Speaker 1: to church Wednesday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday. You're glad they were square.

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Speaker 1: I'm grateful for that kind of upbringing throughout your career.

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Speaker 1: And I'm not just saying this, I mean I wouldn't

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Speaker 1: waste your time of mind. You know, you're a gorgeous woman,

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Speaker 1: and everybody thinks of you and think of you being

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Speaker 1: three things beautiful and talented, but also being very straight laced.

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Speaker 1: I mean your career with something where there's a kind

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Speaker 1: of a in the sensuality quote and there's any of

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Speaker 1: a gardener over here. It's kind of working that whole thing.

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Speaker 1: And then there's you, who you didn't work that whole thing.

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Speaker 1: Did you find that that was something that was because

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Speaker 1: of your childho your upbringing. I just grew up that way,

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Speaker 1: so I thought that's the way everybody was until after

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Speaker 1: three husbands. Now I realized that ass totally wrong. Concept

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Speaker 1: unlucky and love unlucky. What else happens when you're unlucky

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Speaker 1: and I just made it up. You just wrote that

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Speaker 1: just for you. Okay, well we should record you later.

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Speaker 1: Good morning, We've danced the whole night through. Good morning,

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Speaker 1: good morning to you, and you and you and you're

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Speaker 1: good morning, good morning. It's great to stay in Blake.

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Speaker 1: Good morning, good morning to you. What fun you see?

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Speaker 1: I can't sing to save my life. If you put

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Speaker 1: a gun to my head and said saying you almost

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Speaker 1: sang on, when did you know you could sing? When

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Speaker 1: did you know you? When did you realize you could?

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Speaker 1: Just started singing like other a pole? So what you're saying,

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Speaker 1: you started by doing mimicry. I started mimic McDonald's I've

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Speaker 1: never tried and the ricks. She's a soprano, but I

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Speaker 1: would do the alto and ethel Mermon anybody with a

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Speaker 1: big voice, you know, I'd always do their voices. Because

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Speaker 1: I I enjoy comedy, comedies everything. I love vaudeville, that's

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Speaker 1: my favorite thing. I enjoy drama somebody else doing it,

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Speaker 1: I personally don't want to do it Debbie Reynolds, because

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Speaker 1: it's so serious. It makes me sad, it takes me

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Speaker 1: where it goes, and so I don't accept any parts

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Speaker 1: that are devastating, because I don't want to be unhappy

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Speaker 1: in my life. I'll just live my life. Is that's

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Speaker 1: tough enough, So I don't need any parts that make

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Speaker 1: me miserable. So when you're at Warners and you say

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Speaker 1: to them I don't want to be an actress and

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Speaker 1: they do the screen test, what happens there that you

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Speaker 1: wind up banking over to mgm Well, what happens is

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Speaker 1: they send me to a meeting and so they all

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Speaker 1: Gene Kelly in the room and Mr Mayer says, here, Jean,

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Speaker 1: this is a new girl that you're going to have

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Speaker 1: as you're leading lady. And I'm seventeen, and but I

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Speaker 1: had never danced before, I'd never acted before, nothing, nothing, person,

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Speaker 1: just a girl's scout. So there was a Jene Kelly

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Speaker 1: a movie. So I couldn't believe the whole scene. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I just thought the whole thing was silly. I really

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Speaker 1: thought it was silly. So Mr Kelly said, can you

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Speaker 1: do a time step? I said, oh, oh, yes, I

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Speaker 1: learned that a girl scout cap. So he said to

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Speaker 1: do time step. So I did a little awful time step.

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Speaker 1: Then he said, can you do a MAXI Ford, and

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Speaker 1: I said I don't have a car. Well, obviously that

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Speaker 1: was the wrong answer. He looked at Mr Mayor and

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Speaker 1: he said, you're kidding me, boss, and Mr Mayer said, no,

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Speaker 1: I'm not getting you meeting you. This is this is

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Speaker 1: the leading lady. And that was it. He was stuck

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Speaker 1: with me, poor thing. Can you imagine Jane Kelly and

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Speaker 1: these guys were assuming me, like like many of the

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Speaker 1: actors I know today, they're pretty no nonsense people when

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Speaker 1: it comes to the quality of their their product, and

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Speaker 1: they're very hard. But Gene Kelly, of course the most

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Speaker 1: brilliant dancer. Jean said, all right, I'll take her. I

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Speaker 1: can I can fix her. I can fix it up

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Speaker 1: because she's right for the part. The acting bar but

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Speaker 1: a Stare taught you too. He helped me. I was

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Speaker 1: trying to learn everything, like with Donald run up the

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Speaker 1: wall and flip backwards. I mean, I knew I was

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Speaker 1: a flip, but you know, I had to learn how.

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Speaker 1: I wanted to learn everything, and then I'd be crying

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Speaker 1: under the piano. One day a pair of legs go

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Speaker 1: by and I'm some crying away and the legs say,

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Speaker 1: who is that under the piano? Who is crying. So

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Speaker 1: I said, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. It's just me, Debbie.

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Speaker 1: So it was fred is stare. He said, Debbie, get out,

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Speaker 1: get out from underneath. They pulled me out and he said,

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Speaker 1: now you come and watch me with hers. I never

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Speaker 1: allow anybody. He always had a guard at the security guard.

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Speaker 1: No one was ever allowed. But he let me watch

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Speaker 1: and for maybe over forty minutes, and his face turned

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Speaker 1: already just used a cane and a drum after about

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Speaker 1: half an hour, and his face turning red. And he's

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Speaker 1: doing brilliant work. Of course, he looked over at me, says, now,

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Speaker 1: Debbie wants you to go back in there, stop crying

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Speaker 1: and be great. In order to be a great dancer,

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Speaker 1: you have to practically kill yourself. This is what it

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Speaker 1: takes to be a great dancer. Now running there, just

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Speaker 1: running there, Shut up and do what help you? Oh? Yes,

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Speaker 1: I just felt like I was a big sissy, and

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Speaker 1: I don't like to be a big sissy. In those

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Speaker 1: days or any other day. When you you finished the movie,

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Speaker 1: when it was done, how did you feel when it

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Speaker 1: was over? I think you you've learned a great deal.

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Speaker 1: Either that or you already quit because in order to

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Speaker 1: keep up with these great talents, you had to devote

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Speaker 1: yourself totally. I didn't go home. I slept in my

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Speaker 1: dress room. We didn't have a Saturday off, we only

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Speaker 1: had Sunday off. And that practice all the time. And

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Speaker 1: I don't think I changed at all. I just learned

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Speaker 1: how to apply myself. And what about people's perception of you?

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Speaker 1: That must have changed. The picture came out what year,

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Speaker 1: I don't remember what year, in ninety two, something like that,

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Speaker 1: you're a movie star now, correct, Well I was popular.

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Speaker 1: They couldn't believe a young girl had gotten that far

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Speaker 1: and no talent, no no experience. So I was newsworthy.

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Speaker 1: But in those days we had movie magazines and they'd

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Speaker 1: write all kinds of stories for free. You know, the

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Speaker 1: studios would give It was the golden era. So what

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Speaker 1: kind of story did they write about you? Then? When

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Speaker 1: you're only seventeen eighteen years old? What do they make

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Speaker 1: it up? You know, they'd give a little party. They'd

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Speaker 1: give a party. They had Rock Hudson going out with

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Speaker 1: his secretary. You know, Rock didn't want to go out

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Speaker 1: with this secretary. It was Paul. Yes, that's John, Sam

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Speaker 1: and Joe. What's the next picture you did. After Singing

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Speaker 1: in the Ring, After Singing in the Rain, I did

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Speaker 1: How the West was One with every star you've ever

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Speaker 1: heard about. The first movie I ever saw in the

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Speaker 1: movie theater, My Life Ever was a wonderful picture. Spencer

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Speaker 1: Tracy narrated the whole thing starting You'll Never See Again,

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Speaker 1: and John Wayne was in that everybody. It took two

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Speaker 1: years to make that picture. I started out playing a

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Speaker 1: sixteen year old and ended up a ninety year old,

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Speaker 1: so it felt like my life. I worked very hard

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Speaker 1: on that picture, and Henry Hathaway was the director, and

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Speaker 1: he was really tough and very hard on everybody. You know,

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Speaker 1: it's not very kind of actors, but we were all

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Speaker 1: a little bit stupid and employees slow. He thought it

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Speaker 1: was slow. So he I had heard this about him.

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Speaker 1: You know, he was a very tough director. So when

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Speaker 1: he came over to Fox Studio where I was making

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Speaker 1: another film with Andy Griffith, I said to him, he

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Speaker 1: wanted me to do it the first part of it,

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Speaker 1: How the West Was On. I said, well, sir, the

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Speaker 1: truth of it is that I've heard really such bad

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Speaker 1: things about you. I don't want to work with you.

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Speaker 1: So I just stared at me, said, what the is that? What?

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Speaker 1: He's cussed like crazy? Oh? Yeah, cuss, he said, you

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Speaker 1: little snot nose it little? Oh yes, he attacked you aggressive.

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Speaker 1: He bawled me out. He just said, you have no

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Speaker 1: right to say that I'm boss here, that I cuss

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Speaker 1: and all that. I said, well, what are you doing now?

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Speaker 1: For goodness sake, what do you think You're yelling at me?

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Speaker 1: For the commissary there are people staring at everything. I said,

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Speaker 1: this is why I would never work for you, because

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Speaker 1: I don't want to be miserable. So I turned it down.

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Speaker 1: And then he wouldn't let me turn it down. He said, no,

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Speaker 1: you're going to do it, and he talked to the

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Speaker 1: president of Fox and MGM, which owned my contract. They

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Speaker 1: said I had to do it, So I had to

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Speaker 1: do it. There's a one missing where I'll build you

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Speaker 1: a home in the mid So back then, you signed

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Speaker 1: those contracts and people, I think the the distance that

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Speaker 1: the studio system has now, which we seated so far

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Speaker 1: for audiences today, they don't understand that notion that you

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Speaker 1: signed a contract and you didn't get to pick the films.

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Speaker 1: You were in your own It's like a bondage is

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Speaker 1: indentured servitude. That's exactly. How did the picture go with him? Was?

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Speaker 1: He was? He was? He? Well, I went on. I

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Speaker 1: did the first section is the one that I was

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Speaker 1: signed for, and went on location and he said, all right,

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Speaker 1: walk over there. I said, where am I walking? To sir?

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Speaker 1: You just walk where, I said, pointing to I said,

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Speaker 1: I have to understand where Why am I walking? What

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Speaker 1: am I saying? He said, no, you're Oh, you just

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Speaker 1: do what I say. I said, this is what I

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Speaker 1: told you that day we had the lunch that you

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Speaker 1: were going to be rude and terrible to work with then.

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Speaker 1: So I'm going to go lie down to rest. He said, no,

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Speaker 1: you're not. You're going to walk over there and you're

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Speaker 1: going to shut up. I said, no, I'm not. I'm

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Speaker 1: going to faint because you've upset me too much. So

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Speaker 1: I fainted, and what happened. I love this. I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: do that one. I'm going to do that now. You

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Speaker 1: just pass out when I need a director like I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna faint. Oh my god, you've upset me some boom

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Speaker 1: boom fall. Just fall down. Just let him kick you.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't matter. So laid down so if you're lame dude,

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Speaker 1: half awake, come up and kick you did he kind

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Speaker 1: of poke you with his boot. He poked me. He

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Speaker 1: poked me with a boot. Seriously, No, you know this foot.

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Speaker 1: You know he poked me because you wake up your

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Speaker 1: silly some what you cussing kidding me? I wouldn't open

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Speaker 1: my eyes at all because I was just in my mind.

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Speaker 1: I said, just stay here all day, just say they

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Speaker 1: can't wake make you wake up. So they put some

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Speaker 1: that chlora what's that stuff under ether under your nose. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: well I didn't still wake up. I just breathed really

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Speaker 1: deeply like yoga. You know, no, I was doing this

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Speaker 1: iron vading breathing of smelling souls. That's how obstinate you were.

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Speaker 1: I was not going to wake up. He couldn't get

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Speaker 1: me up. Was the conclusion with this what happened, I'm

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Speaker 1: assuming because you're here, you eventually got up. He walked

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Speaker 1: away from it, and he said, she's faking. I know

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Speaker 1: she's faking, and I'm gonna kill a little kid. And

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Speaker 1: then he became amused by it because he thought he

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Speaker 1: knew I was faking, but I wasn't going to wake up,

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Speaker 1: and he kind of respected you a little bit. I

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Speaker 1: wasn't going awake. He knew I wouldn't do it. I

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Speaker 1: was a lot like Hathaway say, so you really aren't

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Speaker 1: this wholesome that Nazarine from Burnbank. You're with me, you

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Speaker 1: can feel like trouble day trouble, but no, I just

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Speaker 1: get very wilful. I'm aries, I'm born April Fool's Day.

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Speaker 1: Who's a director that you loved? I really loved all

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Speaker 1: the directors. I loved Hathaway too. I became very dear

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Speaker 1: friends and visited together areas are you're in areas and

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Speaker 1: I'm not big on astrology, but people who are areas there,

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Speaker 1: we say they love to bury the hatchet and have

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Speaker 1: people get along. And even though you can have a

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Speaker 1: bad temper and you can have grudges against people, they

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Speaker 1: don't laugh. You just speak up right. You're kind of

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Speaker 1: rigorously honest if we if you will, but for you,

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Speaker 1: you buried the hatchet with Hathaway and he became a friend.

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Speaker 1: You're someone that doesn't like the hold of grudge with people. No,

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Speaker 1: I don't, but I'm rather like an elephant. I I

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Speaker 1: remember everything. And Debbie Reynolds has had her share of

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Speaker 1: hatchets to Bury. In nineteen fifty five, she married singer

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Speaker 1: Eddie Fisher. It was the show business wedding of the year.

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Speaker 1: Four years later, Fisher famously left Reynolds for her best friend,

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Speaker 1: Elizabeth Taylor, whose husband had recently died in an airplane accident,

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Speaker 1: but she patched things up with Elizabeth the years later.

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Speaker 1: They had known each other since they were kids. You know,

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Speaker 1: when a man wants to go, he wants to go,

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Speaker 1: he goes. I've learned that that certainly, So of course

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Speaker 1: I forgave her years after that, because she she forgave her.

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Speaker 1: So Marriages two and three were less public, but no

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Speaker 1: less painful for Reynolds. Now she's sworn off that institution.

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Speaker 1: In a minute, she'll talk about her relationship with her daughter,

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Speaker 1: actress Carrie Fisher. I'm Alec Baldwin, and here's the thing.

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Speaker 1: Take a listen to our archive more in depth conversations

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Speaker 1: with artists, policymakers and directors like Judd Apatow. I need

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Speaker 1: constant approval of my writing as I'm doing it, so

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Speaker 1: I will show people the first scene, the first ten pages. Anybody,

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Speaker 1: listen to more of my conversation with judd apataw at,

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Speaker 1: here's the thing, dot Org. This is Alec Baldwin. My

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Speaker 1: is Debbie Reynolds. In six she played Albert Brooks mother

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Speaker 1: in his film Mother. It was her first starring role

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Speaker 1: in over twenty five years. The other one is he

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Speaker 1: staying with me for a while. In real life, Debbie

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Speaker 1: is mother to Carry Fisher, who introduced Debbie to her

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Speaker 1: friend Albert Brooks. Carrie Fisher is of course a star

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Speaker 1: in her own right. Her solo show Wishful Drinking discusses

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Speaker 1: her battles with drugs, alcohol, manic depression, and being the

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Speaker 1: child of Hollywood royalty. It's poignant and hilarious. Having waited

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Speaker 1: my entire life to get an award for something, you know, anything,

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Speaker 1: I don't care. All right, fine, not acting, but what

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Speaker 1: about like a tiny one for writing? I now get

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Speaker 1: awards all the time for being mentally ill. I am

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Speaker 1: apparently very good at it, and I get honored for

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Speaker 1: it regularly. So she is so funny. Oh, yes, she's idiot.

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Speaker 1: She's a brilliant. The children were really little. I was

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Speaker 1: very worried about my health. I was on the road

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Speaker 1: and I was just working like mad in Vaudeville, and

400
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Speaker 1: I was concerned and the children were very small, and

401
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Speaker 1: I called up Jeane Dixon, who was a prophet and

402
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Speaker 1: lived in Washington, and I mean she did you know

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Speaker 1: she did with the government and all kinds of and

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00:23:23,600 --> 00:23:26,600
Speaker 1: she was it was the truth. She was sensational. Gave

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Speaker 1: me an appointment and I sat down and she told

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Speaker 1: me exactly what my children have become and everything that happened.

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Speaker 1: She told me I was married to Harry Carl at

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Speaker 1: the time. She said, when you go home, you're going

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Speaker 1: to have to face the divorce, and he has taken

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Speaker 1: all of your money. When you go home, you will

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Speaker 1: find that out, so you don't know anything about it.

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Speaker 1: I said, well, no, I I let him take care

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Speaker 1: of the money. She said, well he is. Carrie was

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Speaker 1: going to be in white robes and sand on a stage.

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Speaker 1: Astrologer Jane Dixon, Jane Dixon, who is very world famous.

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Speaker 1: Did she predict Kennedy's assassination as well? She predicted everything. Yes, Kennedy,

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Speaker 1: Robert Kennedy and Jack Kennedy. Yes, you wrote in your

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Speaker 1: book that you're unlucky in love? Why were you unlucky

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Speaker 1: in love? What do you mean because I'm just too

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Speaker 1: old fashioned, you know. Well, of course I picked the

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Speaker 1: wrong man, but that's because I am easy. You know,

422
00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:23,960
Speaker 1: I'm easy. I don't ever argue. I mean, you need

423
00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:26,440
Speaker 1: the money here, you take it? Oh you need that? Well?

424
00:24:26,480 --> 00:24:29,359
Speaker 1: Do you trust people? Well, I'm very trusting. How was

425
00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:31,760
Speaker 1: Carrie like you? And how it was Carrie like Eddie?

426
00:24:31,800 --> 00:24:35,679
Speaker 1: Can you see the lines that? Well, Carrie was born

427
00:24:36,480 --> 00:24:39,600
Speaker 1: with Eddie as the father, and he was on speed.

428
00:24:40,280 --> 00:24:44,080
Speaker 1: So Carrie was born was manic, depressive, bipolar. So she

429
00:24:44,200 --> 00:24:46,600
Speaker 1: will have that for the rest of her life. And

430
00:24:46,640 --> 00:24:50,800
Speaker 1: it's a dread disease. Got that from him, Yes, from Eddie.

431
00:24:51,359 --> 00:24:54,760
Speaker 1: It was very sweet of him. Carrie has an illness

432
00:24:54,960 --> 00:24:58,600
Speaker 1: that is a severe problem over the whole world, and

433
00:24:58,760 --> 00:25:01,640
Speaker 1: they do not have any answers for you. She's taking

434
00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:06,080
Speaker 1: shock of treatments right now and it's the family's pain.

435
00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:09,320
Speaker 1: We all have it because we so want carry to

436
00:25:09,480 --> 00:25:12,120
Speaker 1: be well, and that's what we pray for all the time.

437
00:25:12,520 --> 00:25:17,119
Speaker 1: And she's so funny. Her daughter is divine and she

438
00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:20,359
Speaker 1: goes to school here in New York and she's the

439
00:25:20,440 --> 00:25:26,240
Speaker 1: most beautiful young smart, really smart, and she's taking accounting.

440
00:25:26,320 --> 00:25:30,360
Speaker 1: So I think we'll be all right, those things will

441
00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:34,320
Speaker 1: come to me for about money. And Carrie's going to

442
00:25:34,440 --> 00:25:38,399
Speaker 1: be fine. She's brilliant and she's a great writer. Get

443
00:25:38,440 --> 00:25:51,960
Speaker 1: from you, from me, what did she get? Laughter? If

444
00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:55,320
Speaker 1: you could give people laughter, that would be the ideal thing.

445
00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:57,840
Speaker 1: I know this is going to sound really cliched and

446
00:25:58,000 --> 00:26:01,960
Speaker 1: kind of silly, but you know, you come from such

447
00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:06,200
Speaker 1: a great era of movie stardom. Your name means something.

448
00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:08,320
Speaker 1: When you say someone's name, you kind of go okay.

449
00:26:08,880 --> 00:26:11,240
Speaker 1: But your name, you say a certain kind of a film.

450
00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:14,280
Speaker 1: People automatically think, like the big Golden age of Hollywood

451
00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:16,760
Speaker 1: musicals and you and Kelly and all these movies and

452
00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:20,280
Speaker 1: Unsinkable Molly Brown and all these great films. Even though

453
00:26:20,320 --> 00:26:23,440
Speaker 1: people don't realize that you stopped making films. I wrote

454
00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:26,399
Speaker 1: this down. You stopped making films by and large and

455
00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:30,359
Speaker 1: around What's the Matter with Helen in seventy one, and

456
00:26:30,400 --> 00:26:36,280
Speaker 1: then from nineteen seventy one to six, according to your biography,

457
00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:39,880
Speaker 1: most of what you do is voiceovers or retrospective releases

458
00:26:39,920 --> 00:26:42,080
Speaker 1: like that's entertainment. You know. You don't work a lot

459
00:26:42,240 --> 00:26:44,680
Speaker 1: during that period in films. I just do nightclubs, I

460
00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:48,640
Speaker 1: work theater. I would do a club act over forty

461
00:26:48,720 --> 00:26:52,000
Speaker 1: two weeks a year. I would every day. Where would

462
00:26:52,000 --> 00:26:58,440
Speaker 1: you go? Everywhere? Colorado to the country, Sex is, Yes, Australia, England.

463
00:26:59,160 --> 00:27:03,920
Speaker 1: I did five a day in England. So came a

464
00:27:04,040 --> 00:27:07,360
Speaker 1: vaudevillion for twenty years to make a living from my children.

465
00:27:07,840 --> 00:27:10,600
Speaker 1: And then and then you go and do the movie

466
00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:13,800
Speaker 1: with Albert Brooks? Yes, I did. Mother. Did he convince

467
00:27:13,840 --> 00:27:16,200
Speaker 1: you to do that movie? No, Carrie called me, she's

468
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:19,240
Speaker 1: a mother. I read a script Albert Brooks, who they

469
00:27:19,280 --> 00:27:22,280
Speaker 1: were very good friends, did, and it's so funny. You

470
00:27:22,359 --> 00:27:24,639
Speaker 1: have to do it. I said, well, you know, nobody

471
00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:27,120
Speaker 1: wants me for movies anymore. Dear. She said, well, mother,

472
00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:29,480
Speaker 1: I want you to fly up here. I was in

473
00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:32,239
Speaker 1: Vegas and I owned a little hotel and I had

474
00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:34,760
Speaker 1: a nightclub and I was happy as a hog in heaven.

475
00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:37,560
Speaker 1: So she said, well, no, I don't care, mother, you

476
00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:39,960
Speaker 1: have to fly. So I flew in and I met

477
00:27:40,040 --> 00:27:42,960
Speaker 1: Albert and I read a scene for him and he

478
00:27:43,119 --> 00:27:46,800
Speaker 1: said to me, you've got it. And I said, what

479
00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:49,720
Speaker 1: does that mean, Albert? He said, well, you've got it.

480
00:27:49,880 --> 00:27:52,480
Speaker 1: You you've got the part. I said, Albert, I have

481
00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:56,239
Speaker 1: to meet the director oh, I am the director. Debby. Oh,

482
00:27:56,359 --> 00:27:59,240
Speaker 1: I didn't know Albert, and I said, because you know

483
00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:01,800
Speaker 1: I know him since he's a young boy. And then

484
00:28:02,240 --> 00:28:04,680
Speaker 1: I said, well you have to see the producer, then, dear,

485
00:28:04,960 --> 00:28:08,280
Speaker 1: you can't just suddenly hired Debby. Well, I, yes I can.

486
00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:12,200
Speaker 1: I'm the producer. I'm the producer, I'm the director. I

487
00:28:12,400 --> 00:28:17,320
Speaker 1: wrote it. And yes, you're going to do I said, Albert,

488
00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:21,040
Speaker 1: you'll get into trouble. He said, no, you really are

489
00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:23,520
Speaker 1: going to get it now because you're bossing me. So

490
00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:26,440
Speaker 1: now you're just like my mother. So you've got the

491
00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:32,760
Speaker 1: partner shore. Can you eat lamb chops? What the hell

492
00:28:32,880 --> 00:28:34,920
Speaker 1: is a lamb? It's meat. I told you I don't

493
00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:37,960
Speaker 1: eat it. That's not a cow. I didn't know if

494
00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:40,200
Speaker 1: it was the animal. You were siding with the whole thing.

495
00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:45,920
Speaker 1: It's open, wasn't she Albert was very sweet. He wanted

496
00:28:45,960 --> 00:28:48,360
Speaker 1: Doris today, but she just wouldn't do it because she

497
00:28:48,400 --> 00:28:51,120
Speaker 1: would have been terrific. But as we all know, Doris

498
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:54,640
Speaker 1: doesn't want to go back on the screen. And I

499
00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:56,760
Speaker 1: didn't want it because I was in Vegas and I

500
00:28:56,880 --> 00:28:59,640
Speaker 1: was running my hotel. I'm happy, I did. I think

501
00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:01,600
Speaker 1: a lot of films on a lot of TV shows

502
00:29:01,600 --> 00:29:06,280
Speaker 1: since then, Will and Grace, Where did you play? Well,

503
00:29:06,440 --> 00:29:09,520
Speaker 1: what do you mean? I played Grace's mother. You're Grace's

504
00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:14,240
Speaker 1: mom Adler. Her name was Adler and so as she

505
00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:17,080
Speaker 1: sang a lot did impressions. It was a lot of

506
00:29:17,120 --> 00:29:20,680
Speaker 1: fun to do. And you have you stopped the club actor?

507
00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:22,440
Speaker 1: You're still doing that? You still I still do my

508
00:29:22,520 --> 00:29:25,840
Speaker 1: club act. I've been under the weather for about four months,

509
00:29:25,920 --> 00:29:28,920
Speaker 1: so I've been kind of taking it easy and getting

510
00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:34,560
Speaker 1: my health contest. And you look fantastic. Well, you look gorgeous.

511
00:29:34,560 --> 00:29:38,240
Speaker 1: You give me me my birthday party. You look beautiful.

512
00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:41,120
Speaker 1: Thank you, dear, And I wish you all happened is

513
00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:44,360
Speaker 1: with your new wife and a baby. Your life is

514
00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:47,320
Speaker 1: all ahead of you. I love my baby so much.

515
00:29:47,400 --> 00:29:49,960
Speaker 1: And even though they're all grown in your age, practically,

516
00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:54,000
Speaker 1: you know, there's nothing like it. It's just so special.

517
00:29:54,080 --> 00:29:56,880
Speaker 1: I'm really looking forward, you know when I think of

518
00:29:57,000 --> 00:29:59,120
Speaker 1: you and you being part of that, you know, great

519
00:29:59,360 --> 00:30:03,000
Speaker 1: era of studio filmmaking. Do you ever watch your stuff

520
00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:04,760
Speaker 1: that you did? You ever go back and watch those films?

521
00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:08,000
Speaker 1: You don't bother? Well, some of the films I watch

522
00:30:08,080 --> 00:30:11,960
Speaker 1: everybody else's films Bettie Davis, so I loved her in

523
00:30:12,080 --> 00:30:14,920
Speaker 1: Katherine Hepburna. When you watch a movie, you watch a

524
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:17,920
Speaker 1: movie from back then. Oh, yes, I only watch all movies.

525
00:30:18,040 --> 00:30:19,640
Speaker 1: You don't go to see You don't exactly, So you

526
00:30:19,680 --> 00:30:22,960
Speaker 1: don't go see movies today, not really don't. Not even

527
00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:26,720
Speaker 1: screeners from the Academy or DVDs at home. If someone

528
00:30:26,760 --> 00:30:29,800
Speaker 1: tells me it's really wonderful, I'll go, Like Titanic, you'd

529
00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:33,880
Speaker 1: watch or something. No, I did go to see You've

530
00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:40,040
Speaker 1: been there. No, I did that movie. So I just

531
00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:43,240
Speaker 1: did a film with It was about Liberaci Behind the

532
00:30:43,440 --> 00:30:50,240
Speaker 1: Candelabra Michael Douglas. Michael Douglas and played Mrs Liberaci because

533
00:30:50,400 --> 00:30:53,200
Speaker 1: I like to do dialection and I knew Mrs Liberaci

534
00:30:53,480 --> 00:30:56,480
Speaker 1: and I knew Lee. We were working a now very

535
00:30:56,600 --> 00:31:00,640
Speaker 1: good friend. Yes, we were really dear friend. Ends and

536
00:31:00,760 --> 00:31:02,760
Speaker 1: you know, he's called me up after the show and

537
00:31:02,920 --> 00:31:06,479
Speaker 1: we go out together and say, were white all white

538
00:31:06,920 --> 00:31:10,600
Speaker 1: Danby and your jewelry And then he'd arrived in the

539
00:31:10,720 --> 00:31:14,160
Speaker 1: limousine with the chauffeur's hat on and he drive me.

540
00:31:14,680 --> 00:31:18,280
Speaker 1: I mean, he was so much fun. I lovedly Broach.

541
00:31:18,320 --> 00:31:21,240
Speaker 1: She was great so I did his mother. How was

542
00:31:21,320 --> 00:31:23,600
Speaker 1: Soderberg to work with? Did you like Soderberg? Oh, he

543
00:31:23,720 --> 00:31:26,560
Speaker 1: was wonderful. The director was wonderful, great director. I just

544
00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:30,800
Speaker 1: had a little part, you know, and she had antsy,

545
00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:34,840
Speaker 1: she was she was the Only thing hard is dialected

546
00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:37,680
Speaker 1: to be real and to have to do doone when

547
00:31:37,720 --> 00:31:41,040
Speaker 1: you're doing their dialect is polish, and so you have

548
00:31:41,160 --> 00:31:44,480
Speaker 1: to talk like really the real little one and to

549
00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:49,760
Speaker 1: be unbelievable. Because I am very good at dialects, I

550
00:31:49,920 --> 00:31:52,240
Speaker 1: love to do them. You know what's amazing to me,

551
00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:55,920
Speaker 1: is you still enjoy doing this? Yes, even though this

552
00:31:56,040 --> 00:31:58,480
Speaker 1: is something that you came into almost accidentally. You know,

553
00:31:58,560 --> 00:32:00,560
Speaker 1: you won the contest and you would over to Warner

554
00:32:00,600 --> 00:32:03,440
Speaker 1: Brothers said we want you to be in the movie business,

555
00:32:03,480 --> 00:32:05,840
Speaker 1: and you laughed when they said that. And yet here

556
00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:08,760
Speaker 1: you are when you were sixteen years old and now

557
00:32:08,840 --> 00:32:12,640
Speaker 1: you're eighty one years old, sixty five years later. You

558
00:32:12,760 --> 00:32:16,440
Speaker 1: still enjoy doing this, don't you. Absolutely? If you're blessed

559
00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:20,080
Speaker 1: enough to be able to have something to do that

560
00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:24,400
Speaker 1: you love besides marriages, I mean, that's the only thing

561
00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:27,520
Speaker 1: that's been a disappointment to me in my life. Honey,

562
00:32:27,600 --> 00:32:29,320
Speaker 1: You're looking at the man you should have married here.

563
00:32:29,520 --> 00:32:32,520
Speaker 1: It's me here, I am. I wouldn't have stolen your money,

564
00:32:32,840 --> 00:32:34,760
Speaker 1: will you? And I would be home right now watching

565
00:32:34,840 --> 00:32:37,800
Speaker 1: turn of classic movies, eating popcorn. I'll be giving you

566
00:32:37,880 --> 00:32:42,440
Speaker 1: a foot, rub. I have a wonderful life, I really do.

567
00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:45,280
Speaker 1: God bless everybody. I really am very But you're another

568
00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:47,320
Speaker 1: thing you have and you don't have to confirm us.

569
00:32:47,520 --> 00:32:49,040
Speaker 1: But I bet you I know another thing you have,

570
00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:53,640
Speaker 1: which is when you meet people you're fans. I bet

571
00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:55,560
Speaker 1: you they just love you. They're my friends. Are not

572
00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:58,440
Speaker 1: my fans. You know, everybody I meet, I just feel

573
00:32:58,520 --> 00:33:02,440
Speaker 1: like I know them six five years and they they

574
00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:06,040
Speaker 1: made me, they gave me my work, and they stay

575
00:33:06,160 --> 00:33:08,520
Speaker 1: by me all these years. You know, I work in

576
00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:11,160
Speaker 1: Vegas all the time, and I work in Loughlin, which

577
00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:16,640
Speaker 1: is called is invad right, Yeah, anywhere there's a job

578
00:33:16,800 --> 00:33:18,920
Speaker 1: I work. You enjoy doing it live that way? How

579
00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:21,400
Speaker 1: long is your show? Sure? The whole act of our

580
00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:23,800
Speaker 1: half hour and a half an hour and a half.

581
00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:26,080
Speaker 1: I do a lot of comedy. Well, I mean I

582
00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:29,640
Speaker 1: try to make it funny. Let me end with this.

583
00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:33,520
Speaker 1: Acting for me is very strange. Now I'm kind of

584
00:33:33,560 --> 00:33:34,800
Speaker 1: done with it, and I mean, I don't think I

585
00:33:34,840 --> 00:33:37,400
Speaker 1: want to do it much longer. And the world has

586
00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:39,640
Speaker 1: changed now, as you well know, it's very different. The

587
00:33:39,720 --> 00:33:44,360
Speaker 1: way is that your phone? I think it is your phone?

588
00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:57,360
Speaker 1: Where is my Isn't that odd? Yeah? Where's Oh? What

589
00:33:57,440 --> 00:34:01,560
Speaker 1: you're listening to now is Debbie Reynolds taking her it's

590
00:34:01,640 --> 00:34:04,080
Speaker 1: my son, I'll bet you Patty Reynolds is now taking

591
00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:06,960
Speaker 1: out all the kucham on her little asia. But I don't.

592
00:34:07,000 --> 00:34:10,080
Speaker 1: I can't find you can't find them. Let's find it there,

593
00:34:10,120 --> 00:34:12,960
Speaker 1: it is there, it is well, and this is this

594
00:34:13,120 --> 00:34:16,240
Speaker 1: is how my son was born, nine pounds three ounces.

595
00:34:16,280 --> 00:34:19,879
Speaker 1: Took a long time to get it out. I was hello,

596
00:34:22,680 --> 00:34:29,120
Speaker 1: good heavens, that's hard to find. Can you say it again? Hello?

597
00:34:29,600 --> 00:34:32,360
Speaker 1: Did I get you too late? That's the story of

598
00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:34,799
Speaker 1: my life, isn't it? Must be a man? Well, I'm

599
00:34:34,840 --> 00:34:37,720
Speaker 1: going to hang up now. I'm visiting with Alec Baldwin.

600
00:34:38,000 --> 00:34:40,680
Speaker 1: He's a big star. Yes, he lives in New York.

601
00:34:41,000 --> 00:34:43,520
Speaker 1: Just got married again, a young girl. They always pick

602
00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:47,880
Speaker 1: him younger. Yeah, I'm might as that's one thing that

603
00:34:47,960 --> 00:34:51,640
Speaker 1: hasn't changed. Yeah, then nothing has changed. I wanted to

604
00:34:51,760 --> 00:34:54,919
Speaker 1: say I'd love to work with you one day. I'd

605
00:34:54,960 --> 00:34:57,160
Speaker 1: love anytime. I'd love to work with you one day.

606
00:34:57,560 --> 00:34:59,640
Speaker 1: If there's a movie and there's a partner of for

607
00:34:59,719 --> 00:35:02,600
Speaker 1: you to play my crazy aunt, will you come in there?

608
00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:04,880
Speaker 1: Would be fun to do the crazy ant or the

609
00:35:05,080 --> 00:35:08,640
Speaker 1: street lady or anybody you like that. I like to

610
00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:13,520
Speaker 1: do characters where I could faint. Debbie Reynolds's latest book

611
00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:17,520
Speaker 1: is Unsinkable, and she has a huge collection of Hollywood

612
00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:20,879
Speaker 1: memorabilia that you too can have a piece of. I'm

613
00:35:21,040 --> 00:35:24,360
Speaker 1: selling an online. So if Debbie Reynolds, Debbie mill studio

614
00:35:24,440 --> 00:35:27,239
Speaker 1: store dot com, Debbie Reynolds Studio store dot com, You're

615
00:35:28,400 --> 00:35:31,320
Speaker 1: of wonderful things, I'm going to go buy something on there. Okay,

616
00:35:31,440 --> 00:35:36,399
Speaker 1: Chaplin's Aunt, how about that? Coming up My next guest

617
00:35:36,520 --> 00:35:40,560
Speaker 1: film historian Robert Osborne, who had this to say about

618
00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:43,040
Speaker 1: Debbie Reynolds in the minute she came on the screen.

619
00:35:43,120 --> 00:35:46,239
Speaker 1: It's a very young girl. She was so adorable, so bright,

620
00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:49,759
Speaker 1: so comfortable on camera. But I think I admire the

621
00:35:49,840 --> 00:35:53,799
Speaker 1: most about her, though, is her survival instincts. Even when

622
00:35:53,880 --> 00:35:57,239
Speaker 1: she wasn't so popular anymore, She's stuck in there and

623
00:35:57,400 --> 00:36:00,200
Speaker 1: she's still forged ahead and still kept this career going,

624
00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:04,760
Speaker 1: and she truly is unsinkable. Film historian and Turner Classic

625
00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:12,600
Speaker 1: Movies host Robert Osbourne. After this, I'm Alec Baldwin and

626
00:36:12,680 --> 00:36:15,160
Speaker 1: you're listening to Here's the Thing. The next film in

627
00:36:15,200 --> 00:36:18,040
Speaker 1: our Oscar marathon saluting nominees and winners in the category

628
00:36:18,080 --> 00:36:20,680
Speaker 1: of best Screenplay is one of the real biggias from

629
00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:23,680
Speaker 1: that banner of film year of nineteen nine. It's Wuthering

630
00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:27,200
Speaker 1: Heights from Robert Osborne has been hosting Turner Classic Movies

631
00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:30,840
Speaker 1: for almost two decades. I was lucky enough to guest

632
00:36:30,880 --> 00:36:33,480
Speaker 1: host the show with him for three of those years. Now,

633
00:36:33,600 --> 00:36:35,560
Speaker 1: something you may not know about the Third Man is

634
00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:38,520
Speaker 1: there were actually two versions of this film. No one

635
00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:42,040
Speaker 1: knows more about movies than Robert. He's the master of

636
00:36:42,120 --> 00:36:45,600
Speaker 1: the relevant anecdote. He serves as an ambassador to a

637
00:36:45,719 --> 00:36:48,600
Speaker 1: bygone era that he's helped make more popular than ever.

638
00:36:56,160 --> 00:37:00,480
Speaker 1: In Osbourne's own story, the players are legendary, the backdrop

639
00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:03,040
Speaker 1: his epic, and the plot twists will make you say

640
00:37:03,239 --> 00:37:07,840
Speaker 1: that could only happen in the movies. We opened in Colfax, Washington,

641
00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:11,239
Speaker 1: just west of the Rockies, a world away from Hollywood.

642
00:37:12,080 --> 00:37:14,279
Speaker 1: I grew up in a small town where I went

643
00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:16,080
Speaker 1: to the movies a lot and fell in love with

644
00:37:16,120 --> 00:37:18,880
Speaker 1: all these people also fell in love with the movie business,

645
00:37:19,000 --> 00:37:21,279
Speaker 1: so all I saw were actors on the screen. So

646
00:37:21,360 --> 00:37:23,080
Speaker 1: I thought, well, that's what I have to be if

647
00:37:23,080 --> 00:37:24,480
Speaker 1: I want to be a part of the movie business.

648
00:37:29,120 --> 00:37:31,520
Speaker 1: He headed to Los Angeles, where he met an agent

649
00:37:31,560 --> 00:37:34,040
Speaker 1: who took him to Fox, where he signed a six

650
00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:37,560
Speaker 1: month contract and was cast in a television show. The

651
00:37:37,640 --> 00:37:40,480
Speaker 1: TV show finished and he went to the casting director

652
00:37:40,560 --> 00:37:43,719
Speaker 1: to thank him for the work. The casting director suggested

653
00:37:43,760 --> 00:37:47,840
Speaker 1: that he contact Lucille Ball's office. Lucy herself picked up

654
00:37:47,880 --> 00:37:51,200
Speaker 1: the phone and invited him over. She said, let's watch

655
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:54,800
Speaker 1: your screen tests. Now, Lucy was somebody that the minute

656
00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:58,719
Speaker 1: she wanted something, she did it. So when it was over,

657
00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:02,000
Speaker 1: he didn't really say anything. She's just thanked me for

658
00:38:02,080 --> 00:38:04,560
Speaker 1: coming by, and I thought, well, she wasn't that impressed,

659
00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:05,960
Speaker 1: but at least I got to spend some time with

660
00:38:06,040 --> 00:38:09,600
Speaker 1: Lucille Ball. Okay, like a week later, a message comes

661
00:38:09,680 --> 00:38:15,759
Speaker 1: on my voice, Uh, you're answering. Absolutely answering service called

662
00:38:15,800 --> 00:38:19,120
Speaker 1: Lucille Ball's office right away. Here's the number. Hello Lebray

663
00:38:19,360 --> 00:38:23,640
Speaker 1: nine two, calling this answer phone. Yes, I called the number,

664
00:38:23,719 --> 00:38:25,640
Speaker 1: and the second he said, well, Lucille Ball wants you

665
00:38:25,719 --> 00:38:28,520
Speaker 1: to come to dinner on Friday night if you're available,

666
00:38:28,600 --> 00:38:32,320
Speaker 1: and meet DESI. I thought, well, that's interesting. So I

667
00:38:32,480 --> 00:38:35,760
Speaker 1: go to Lucy's house at Friday night. There's no Desi,

668
00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:41,919
Speaker 1: but there's Lucy. There's Janet Gayner, there's Joseph Cotton, there's

669
00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:46,880
Speaker 1: Kay Thompson, Chuck Walters, Charles Walters, the director Roger Eden's,

670
00:38:47,440 --> 00:38:49,880
Speaker 1: and a couple of other people, and her sister Cleo

671
00:38:50,160 --> 00:38:52,440
Speaker 1: who was actually her cousin but raised as her sister,

672
00:38:52,960 --> 00:38:56,720
Speaker 1: and me. After the dinner and they were all chatting

673
00:38:56,800 --> 00:39:00,520
Speaker 1: and laughing and all of that drinking. Not Lucy wasn't

674
00:39:00,520 --> 00:39:03,360
Speaker 1: no drinker at that point. She she learned how to

675
00:39:03,440 --> 00:39:05,560
Speaker 1: drink a little bit later on, but not at that point.

676
00:39:05,960 --> 00:39:09,360
Speaker 1: So we went in the living room and where was

677
00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:14,840
Speaker 1: the house on Roxbury right next door to Jack Benny exactly,

678
00:39:15,280 --> 00:39:17,279
Speaker 1: and just down the street from Ira gersh one and

679
00:39:17,320 --> 00:39:23,280
Speaker 1: around the corner from Cety. Map with you. So anyway,

680
00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:26,400
Speaker 1: after dinner we went in the living room. She pushes

681
00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:29,480
Speaker 1: the button and the painting goes up, puts an the button,

682
00:39:29,560 --> 00:39:32,560
Speaker 1: the screen comes down, and I'm thinking, did you ever

683
00:39:32,680 --> 00:39:34,279
Speaker 1: believe that you would ever be? And then I thought, no,

684
00:39:34,320 --> 00:39:35,719
Speaker 1: wait a minute, I always knew I was going to

685
00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:40,200
Speaker 1: be here. I remember that thought. I first started to

686
00:39:40,280 --> 00:39:43,360
Speaker 1: say automatically, did you ever think God this and that

687
00:39:43,480 --> 00:39:45,880
Speaker 1: was the beginning for you? Yeah? And I thought no,

688
00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:48,040
Speaker 1: I always knew I was going to be with people

689
00:39:48,120 --> 00:39:51,359
Speaker 1: like this. And I relaxed. Then I really relaxed as

690
00:39:51,360 --> 00:39:54,399
Speaker 1: I thought, no, this is where you're supposed to people. Yeah,

691
00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:56,640
Speaker 1: and do you when you love? This is where I'm

692
00:39:56,640 --> 00:39:59,600
Speaker 1: supposed to be where? What movie do you remember? Funny Face,

693
00:39:59,719 --> 00:40:05,640
Speaker 1: which was which was about three years old? That what? No,

694
00:40:05,800 --> 00:40:08,520
Speaker 1: But what was great about it was there's a part

695
00:40:08,600 --> 00:40:11,120
Speaker 1: in Funny Face when Kate Thompson and Andre Heppurn get

696
00:40:11,160 --> 00:40:12,719
Speaker 1: up and do a number called on how to Be

697
00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:16,120
Speaker 1: Lovely Together. Kay Thompson got up by the screen and

698
00:40:16,200 --> 00:40:18,560
Speaker 1: did the numbers. So and it was, you know, fun

699
00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:22,000
Speaker 1: watch the movie. The movie was over, everybody starts to go,

700
00:40:22,480 --> 00:40:25,040
Speaker 1: so I think, well, I'm supposed to go to I

701
00:40:25,120 --> 00:40:28,160
Speaker 1: still don't know quite why I'm here, and it certainly wasn't.

702
00:40:28,200 --> 00:40:30,440
Speaker 1: Lucy was saying, you know, stay around a little boy

703
00:40:30,880 --> 00:40:33,400
Speaker 1: or anything like that. Wasn't that. So we got to

704
00:40:33,480 --> 00:40:35,640
Speaker 1: the front door. I was thanking Lucy for the evening.

705
00:40:35,719 --> 00:40:37,480
Speaker 1: She said, well, have you signed the papers yet? And

706
00:40:37,560 --> 00:40:40,680
Speaker 1: I said, put papers. I want you another contract. And

707
00:40:41,360 --> 00:40:47,279
Speaker 1: I said, well, nobody's ever mentioned we're doing business, yes,

708
00:40:47,360 --> 00:40:51,120
Speaker 1: you idiot, nobody's ever mentioned anything about a contract or anything.

709
00:40:51,160 --> 00:40:54,560
Speaker 1: And she said give them the address tomorrow and signed

710
00:40:54,560 --> 00:41:00,239
Speaker 1: the paper anyone, So I was under contract. Then Todesku

711
00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:03,560
Speaker 1: didn't pay us much money at all, but it was

712
00:41:03,640 --> 00:41:05,960
Speaker 1: like a masterclass for me. That's when I first met

713
00:41:06,040 --> 00:41:08,520
Speaker 1: Bettie Davis. Bettie Davis came to l A in a

714
00:41:08,560 --> 00:41:11,560
Speaker 1: play called The World of Carl Sandberg. So she took

715
00:41:11,640 --> 00:41:13,640
Speaker 1: us to the play and then took us backstage afterwards

716
00:41:13,719 --> 00:41:16,359
Speaker 1: to meet Betty Davis and Vivian Lee. Came a duel

717
00:41:16,400 --> 00:41:20,240
Speaker 1: of angels, and so she went backstage and settled it vivianly.

718
00:41:20,280 --> 00:41:22,719
Speaker 1: It took us with her. Anytime there was somebody like that,

719
00:41:22,840 --> 00:41:26,759
Speaker 1: Noel Coward or Marlena Dietrich, she would take us there

720
00:41:27,239 --> 00:41:29,719
Speaker 1: pick up the tabs because again she knew she wasn't

721
00:41:29,760 --> 00:41:32,439
Speaker 1: paying enough money to keep for us to be able

722
00:41:32,440 --> 00:41:35,239
Speaker 1: to do that. So we got this terrific education and

723
00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:38,960
Speaker 1: she also now Desi at this point was womanizing. He

724
00:41:39,120 --> 00:41:43,960
Speaker 1: wasn't around much. So she would get movies that we

725
00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:46,239
Speaker 1: wanted to see her hadn't seen because they weren't that

726
00:41:46,360 --> 00:41:48,799
Speaker 1: accessible in those days, and run them at her house.

727
00:41:49,480 --> 00:41:52,600
Speaker 1: Or she would show us I love Lucy's show. She'd

728
00:41:52,640 --> 00:41:55,800
Speaker 1: done bad ones and show us why they didn't work,

729
00:41:56,160 --> 00:41:57,960
Speaker 1: then show us a good one and why it did work.

730
00:41:59,640 --> 00:42:01,680
Speaker 1: She all. So, the first day any of us were

731
00:42:01,719 --> 00:42:04,600
Speaker 1: in a contract there and we first met, she arrived,

732
00:42:04,640 --> 00:42:07,840
Speaker 1: she's just gone to a bank and she got twelve

733
00:42:08,360 --> 00:42:11,840
Speaker 1: savings accounts that she opened, put like fifty dollars in,

734
00:42:12,560 --> 00:42:14,600
Speaker 1: and she gave us in each of our names, gave

735
00:42:14,680 --> 00:42:17,200
Speaker 1: us the books, and she said, every week you have

736
00:42:17,320 --> 00:42:19,719
Speaker 1: to put something away. And we were, as I say,

737
00:42:19,800 --> 00:42:22,680
Speaker 1: making very little money, and say, Lucy, you know we

738
00:42:22,800 --> 00:42:25,840
Speaker 1: don't barely enough to to live on. She said, it

739
00:42:25,920 --> 00:42:29,200
Speaker 1: can be only five dollars, but every week put something away.

740
00:42:29,400 --> 00:42:33,000
Speaker 1: You won't miss it. It'll add up. Very maternal, and

741
00:42:33,080 --> 00:42:35,880
Speaker 1: she said, no matter what the thing you must do

742
00:42:36,719 --> 00:42:38,680
Speaker 1: is have enough money that you don't have to make

743
00:42:38,719 --> 00:42:43,480
Speaker 1: decisions based on money. For a kid from Colfax, Washington,

744
00:42:43,600 --> 00:42:46,120
Speaker 1: this was just invaluable. I've been to college, but I

745
00:42:46,239 --> 00:42:48,959
Speaker 1: never had these kind of life lessons. In the course

746
00:42:49,000 --> 00:42:51,440
Speaker 1: of it, she meant, my folks, and she got to

747
00:42:51,520 --> 00:42:54,719
Speaker 1: know me. She said to me early on, you can

748
00:42:54,760 --> 00:42:57,680
Speaker 1: do this as an actor. But she said, and I

749
00:42:57,760 --> 00:42:59,640
Speaker 1: think you could do well, but it's not gonna make

750
00:42:59,680 --> 00:43:02,320
Speaker 1: you half babe. This is not the right line of

751
00:43:02,400 --> 00:43:05,680
Speaker 1: work for you. And she said, you love old films,

752
00:43:05,800 --> 00:43:08,680
Speaker 1: you love history, you love everything about the business. And

753
00:43:08,800 --> 00:43:12,200
Speaker 1: you're a journalist and major in college. We have enough actors.

754
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:14,840
Speaker 1: You should write about movies. And the first thing you

755
00:43:14,880 --> 00:43:17,040
Speaker 1: should do is write a book. She said. It doesn't

756
00:43:17,080 --> 00:43:18,520
Speaker 1: even have to be a good book, but find a

757
00:43:18,560 --> 00:43:21,920
Speaker 1: subject about the movies that nobody's done and write a

758
00:43:21,920 --> 00:43:25,279
Speaker 1: book about it. And I said why, She said, if

759
00:43:25,320 --> 00:43:27,400
Speaker 1: you write a book, it shows you have the discipline

760
00:43:27,400 --> 00:43:29,680
Speaker 1: to sit down and do that. Yes, I did. What

761
00:43:30,080 --> 00:43:31,840
Speaker 1: it was a book about the oscars? Is this the

762
00:43:31,840 --> 00:43:34,640
Speaker 1: book right here? Oh my god? Yeah, academy words the

763
00:43:34,719 --> 00:43:41,760
Speaker 1: listeners to know that stunned expression. Yes, indeed, a copy

764
00:43:41,840 --> 00:43:46,279
Speaker 1: of the book. Yeah, and that is amazing. Yes, there

765
00:43:46,440 --> 00:43:49,200
Speaker 1: he was. Do you think you clearly make a choice

766
00:43:49,239 --> 00:43:51,640
Speaker 1: at this point in your life made for you well.

767
00:43:51,800 --> 00:43:54,239
Speaker 1: The choice was kind of made for me because I

768
00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:56,759
Speaker 1: was not getting parts like Night mus Fall that I

769
00:43:56,880 --> 00:43:58,759
Speaker 1: love doing. And I did a soap opera for a

770
00:43:58,840 --> 00:44:01,800
Speaker 1: couple of years called The Young Married's. I was always

771
00:44:01,840 --> 00:44:04,920
Speaker 1: in a suit with the tie and with a briefcase,

772
00:44:05,280 --> 00:44:08,000
Speaker 1: helping the plot along. But it wasn't interesting, and I

773
00:44:08,160 --> 00:44:11,440
Speaker 1: wasn't interesting. Did a lot of commercials. I thought, you know,

774
00:44:11,480 --> 00:44:13,200
Speaker 1: if this is the best I can do at this point,

775
00:44:13,600 --> 00:44:15,879
Speaker 1: I gotta get out of this altogether, because I would

776
00:44:15,960 --> 00:44:19,319
Speaker 1: look at a part and I think George Bopard could

777
00:44:19,320 --> 00:44:21,800
Speaker 1: do this so much better than I can, or Tony

778
00:44:21,880 --> 00:44:24,480
Speaker 1: Perkins would be great in this. He fell out of love. Yeah,

779
00:44:24,840 --> 00:44:30,040
Speaker 1: and I was on stage struck an example. Instead, Robert

780
00:44:30,120 --> 00:44:33,000
Speaker 1: decided to pursue a career as a writer in Hollywood,

781
00:44:33,480 --> 00:44:36,399
Speaker 1: and he continued to land himself in right time, Right

782
00:44:36,480 --> 00:44:40,799
Speaker 1: place situations. He interviewed actress Olivia to have aland, who

783
00:44:40,920 --> 00:44:43,280
Speaker 1: later called on him to escort her to a tribute

784
00:44:43,520 --> 00:44:47,400
Speaker 1: to Betty Davis. Being friendly with the Haviland led to

785
00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:50,840
Speaker 1: an appearance on the Dinah Shore Show. There, he confronted

786
00:44:50,920 --> 00:44:55,000
Speaker 1: a furious Shelly Winters about her false Academy award nomination

787
00:44:55,040 --> 00:44:59,840
Speaker 1: to claim people took note that Robert Osborne knew his stuff.

788
00:45:00,960 --> 00:45:03,759
Speaker 1: He met with Teach Wilkerson Miles, the publisher of The

789
00:45:03,840 --> 00:45:07,680
Speaker 1: Hollywood Reporter, but the interview fell flat. One day, an

790
00:45:07,719 --> 00:45:10,520
Speaker 1: old friend who worked at the Reporter called. She had

791
00:45:10,560 --> 00:45:13,200
Speaker 1: a plan to get him in, but Robert Osborne still

792
00:45:13,239 --> 00:45:16,040
Speaker 1: had a day job and I said, well, I'm working

793
00:45:16,440 --> 00:45:19,200
Speaker 1: in the box office of the Greek Theater. And she said, well,

794
00:45:19,239 --> 00:45:22,040
Speaker 1: can you get off for this two week period? Thank Grant,

795
00:45:22,040 --> 00:45:26,120
Speaker 1: who writes the main column Rambling Reporter, is staying in

796
00:45:26,200 --> 00:45:29,239
Speaker 1: vacation and they've asked me to write the column for him.

797
00:45:29,760 --> 00:45:32,080
Speaker 1: And she said, I'll tell them I will, and then

798
00:45:32,160 --> 00:45:33,960
Speaker 1: at the last minute I'll tell him I can't for

799
00:45:34,080 --> 00:45:36,920
Speaker 1: some reason. I'll recommend you do it. They'll have to

800
00:45:36,960 --> 00:45:39,640
Speaker 1: get somebody to do it. This is your life story. Well,

801
00:45:39,760 --> 00:45:43,439
Speaker 1: there's a lot of struggle in there beforehand, but once

802
00:45:43,480 --> 00:45:47,080
Speaker 1: it started, it started going, it really started. But this

803
00:45:47,160 --> 00:45:49,920
Speaker 1: is a great opportunity for you. Yeah, so I got

804
00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:52,800
Speaker 1: called in. I had stories ready, I've been doing it

805
00:45:52,880 --> 00:45:55,640
Speaker 1: for about three days. I'm gonna call from teaching Wilkerson

806
00:45:55,719 --> 00:45:58,719
Speaker 1: Miles and she said, do you work for us? And

807
00:45:58,840 --> 00:46:01,520
Speaker 1: I said, no, I don't, but I'm just coming in

808
00:46:01,600 --> 00:46:03,759
Speaker 1: to help out. She said, would you like to work

809
00:46:03,880 --> 00:46:06,960
Speaker 1: for us? And I said yes I would. She said, well,

810
00:46:06,960 --> 00:46:10,040
Speaker 1: you've got a job. It's lu come up here now.

811
00:46:10,480 --> 00:46:13,600
Speaker 1: So I showed up for work. She was not around.

812
00:46:13,719 --> 00:46:16,200
Speaker 1: She was on some trip. The editors said, well, I

813
00:46:16,239 --> 00:46:18,480
Speaker 1: don't have any room for you in here, so just

814
00:46:18,920 --> 00:46:21,960
Speaker 1: kind of wander around and get to know the paper.

815
00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:25,000
Speaker 1: When she comes back, we'll ask her what she plans

816
00:46:25,040 --> 00:46:27,960
Speaker 1: for you to do. Just before she came back, Marjorie,

817
00:46:28,440 --> 00:46:31,840
Speaker 1: who wrote a column called on Location where you go

818
00:46:32,000 --> 00:46:34,880
Speaker 1: visit film sets for the paper. She got in a

819
00:46:34,960 --> 00:46:38,320
Speaker 1: fight at the paper and she quit. And when she

820
00:46:38,440 --> 00:46:40,520
Speaker 1: was going out the door, they said, what are we

821
00:46:40,560 --> 00:46:43,560
Speaker 1: gonna do your columns? Do you have to have a

822
00:46:43,640 --> 00:46:46,600
Speaker 1: column for tomorrow? She said, have Osborne do it. He's

823
00:46:46,600 --> 00:46:48,879
Speaker 1: not doing any anything around. Isn't it amazing how people

824
00:46:48,920 --> 00:46:51,720
Speaker 1: who don't know these kinds of businesses, like the newspaper business,

825
00:46:52,120 --> 00:46:54,719
Speaker 1: how it's really true? How do you become the drama critic? Yeah,

826
00:46:54,960 --> 00:46:57,960
Speaker 1: you're writing the gardening column and the drama critic drops

827
00:46:58,000 --> 00:47:00,440
Speaker 1: dead at his typewriter, and like Osborne get over here

828
00:47:00,480 --> 00:47:03,279
Speaker 1: and and so that's exactly what's right here. So all

829
00:47:03,320 --> 00:47:05,880
Speaker 1: of a sudden, I wasn't writing for the in the

830
00:47:06,160 --> 00:47:09,359
Speaker 1: editorial department. I had a column. How do you feel

831
00:47:09,360 --> 00:47:12,520
Speaker 1: about that? I loved it, except I don't think I

832
00:47:12,600 --> 00:47:14,040
Speaker 1: was very good at it because I'll tell you what,

833
00:47:14,600 --> 00:47:17,880
Speaker 1: it really is supposed to be a gossip column, or

834
00:47:18,080 --> 00:47:23,320
Speaker 1: at least have inside dirt. And I never felt comfortable

835
00:47:23,360 --> 00:47:26,040
Speaker 1: intruding upon people to want to keep a secret, because

836
00:47:26,040 --> 00:47:29,200
Speaker 1: I think secrets are important to have. You're very discreet.

837
00:47:29,840 --> 00:47:32,600
Speaker 1: I've been around you many, many hours, and you're never seen.

838
00:47:32,760 --> 00:47:34,600
Speaker 1: So there's a story that so and so to me,

839
00:47:34,640 --> 00:47:37,560
Speaker 1: and you never get into that, and so that was

840
00:47:37,640 --> 00:47:42,480
Speaker 1: problematic for you, and writing that it's like, you know,

841
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:45,560
Speaker 1: it's it's so. I'd worked for during one period during

842
00:47:45,640 --> 00:47:48,440
Speaker 1: for a PR firm, and for a while Rock Hudson

843
00:47:48,560 --> 00:47:50,239
Speaker 1: was a client of ours, so I knew him well,

844
00:47:50,800 --> 00:47:53,680
Speaker 1: and so I knew when he got AIDS that he

845
00:47:53,760 --> 00:47:58,399
Speaker 1: had AIDS, but I would not write about that. At

846
00:47:58,440 --> 00:48:00,920
Speaker 1: that time, I was also doing the evening news because

847
00:48:00,960 --> 00:48:04,239
Speaker 1: all TV stations at one point had entertainment reporters. The

848
00:48:04,360 --> 00:48:07,040
Speaker 1: Lady Who a wonderful lady, Marsha Brandwyn, who was the

849
00:48:07,480 --> 00:48:09,440
Speaker 1: kind of news head there, and I got in a

850
00:48:09,480 --> 00:48:12,320
Speaker 1: big argument that she knew I knew about Rock Hudson,

851
00:48:12,520 --> 00:48:14,399
Speaker 1: and she said You've got to go on the air

852
00:48:14,480 --> 00:48:17,200
Speaker 1: with that, and I said, no, he doesn't want that. Know,

853
00:48:17,760 --> 00:48:19,960
Speaker 1: this is a very sick man. I said, if it

854
00:48:20,080 --> 00:48:23,080
Speaker 1: was the president that affects all of us in this country,

855
00:48:23,440 --> 00:48:26,600
Speaker 1: he's an actor. So I wasn't that good at that.

856
00:48:27,200 --> 00:48:29,000
Speaker 1: I mean, I think I wrote a lively column and

857
00:48:29,080 --> 00:48:31,040
Speaker 1: an interesting one. How long did you write the column

858
00:48:31,120 --> 00:48:35,799
Speaker 1: for Oh Boy? For about twenty years? So you're doing

859
00:48:35,880 --> 00:48:38,520
Speaker 1: the Reporter. It's twenty years at the Reporter? And then okay.

860
00:48:38,800 --> 00:48:41,560
Speaker 1: Then the CBS morning program in New York asked me

861
00:48:42,040 --> 00:48:44,960
Speaker 1: if I do entertainment reports at night in Los Angeles

862
00:48:45,120 --> 00:48:47,680
Speaker 1: that could be put on the air on a new

863
00:48:47,920 --> 00:48:50,680
Speaker 1: CBS morning program and the next day. I'd always wanted

864
00:48:50,680 --> 00:48:52,799
Speaker 1: to live in New York, so I said, what if

865
00:48:52,840 --> 00:48:54,759
Speaker 1: I did them live in New York. The minute I

866
00:48:54,840 --> 00:48:56,919
Speaker 1: got to New York, I thought, I can't ever go back.

867
00:48:57,440 --> 00:49:00,160
Speaker 1: What about New York? Appealed to some more serious to know.

868
00:49:00,320 --> 00:49:02,080
Speaker 1: Every time I was in New York, I felt alive.

869
00:49:02,200 --> 00:49:05,400
Speaker 1: I saw people reading books and I saw there was

870
00:49:05,440 --> 00:49:10,520
Speaker 1: so much activity going on. Yes, and it was also cars,

871
00:49:10,640 --> 00:49:13,160
Speaker 1: and you only you had to drive to get anywhere

872
00:49:13,200 --> 00:49:14,680
Speaker 1: on the New York. You're on the street, you run

873
00:49:14,719 --> 00:49:16,359
Speaker 1: into somebody and you go have a drink with them.

874
00:49:16,800 --> 00:49:19,560
Speaker 1: I mean, I loved all that. That's when Dorothy Lamore

875
00:49:19,640 --> 00:49:22,680
Speaker 1: came to town and she said, look, they're honoring Jimmy Stewart.

876
00:49:22,920 --> 00:49:25,080
Speaker 1: I'm gonna come back for two days. Why don't you

877
00:49:25,719 --> 00:49:28,320
Speaker 1: take me to the Jimmy Stewart Thing. I have the

878
00:49:28,360 --> 00:49:30,600
Speaker 1: tickets and everything, and then we'll finally have that dinner

879
00:49:30,680 --> 00:49:34,440
Speaker 1: the next night. So I said, where would you like

880
00:49:34,520 --> 00:49:37,319
Speaker 1: to have the dinner and she said, well at one

881
00:49:37,640 --> 00:49:40,400
Speaker 1: when I was a star. That's about the only place

882
00:49:40,640 --> 00:49:42,960
Speaker 1: that's still in New York. That was around when when

883
00:49:43,040 --> 00:49:45,200
Speaker 1: I used to come to New York. So I took

884
00:49:45,200 --> 00:49:47,520
Speaker 1: out the Jimmy Stewart thing and that night she said, look,

885
00:49:47,560 --> 00:49:50,840
Speaker 1: I got a problem. I'm doing some promotional work for AMC,

886
00:49:51,640 --> 00:49:53,960
Speaker 1: and the people at AMC want to take me to dinner.

887
00:49:54,000 --> 00:49:55,160
Speaker 1: And the only night I can do it is the

888
00:49:55,239 --> 00:49:57,120
Speaker 1: night we were going to go to twenty one? Would

889
00:49:57,160 --> 00:50:00,520
Speaker 1: you mind if very nice guy Brad Siegel and a

890
00:50:00,640 --> 00:50:04,319
Speaker 1: publicity guy with him, Jim Weiss, if they joined us,

891
00:50:04,400 --> 00:50:06,319
Speaker 1: and I said no, not at all. And we all

892
00:50:06,440 --> 00:50:08,800
Speaker 1: just sat around and at her favorite table and we

893
00:50:08,960 --> 00:50:12,080
Speaker 1: talked and told stories and all of that. And soon

894
00:50:12,120 --> 00:50:14,080
Speaker 1: after Brad called me and he said, you know a

895
00:50:14,120 --> 00:50:16,560
Speaker 1: lot about movies and I said, yeah, I guess I do.

896
00:50:17,320 --> 00:50:19,719
Speaker 1: And he said, well, we're going to get rid of

897
00:50:19,760 --> 00:50:21,719
Speaker 1: our afternoon guy at AMC. I'd love you to come

898
00:50:21,760 --> 00:50:24,239
Speaker 1: and be the afternoon guy. This was a big deal

899
00:50:24,640 --> 00:50:27,719
Speaker 1: and I thought it's perfect for me. Everything was negotiations

900
00:50:27,800 --> 00:50:30,200
Speaker 1: were underway. All of a sudden he called. He said,

901
00:50:30,600 --> 00:50:32,960
Speaker 1: I'm I'm not going to be here. I'm leaving. I'm

902
00:50:33,000 --> 00:50:35,279
Speaker 1: gonna go work for Ted Turner in Atlanta. And I

903
00:50:35,360 --> 00:50:37,680
Speaker 1: was really disappointed because I like Brad's siegal a lot.

904
00:50:38,360 --> 00:50:41,279
Speaker 1: And uh. A couple of months went by and then

905
00:50:41,360 --> 00:50:43,120
Speaker 1: he called and he said, Hey, have you signed with

906
00:50:43,320 --> 00:50:45,680
Speaker 1: the AMC thing yet? And I thought he was badgering

907
00:50:45,719 --> 00:50:47,480
Speaker 1: me to and I said no, no, but I got

908
00:50:47,560 --> 00:50:50,000
Speaker 1: the papers all do He said, well don't. Ted's gonna

909
00:50:50,040 --> 00:50:52,000
Speaker 1: start his own movie channel and I want you to

910
00:50:52,080 --> 00:50:54,480
Speaker 1: be the head guy. He said, I just want to

911
00:50:54,560 --> 00:50:58,279
Speaker 1: tell you if you come with TCM, you'll start with

912
00:50:58,360 --> 00:51:01,560
Speaker 1: only six million viewers. If you go with am C,

913
00:51:01,760 --> 00:51:04,719
Speaker 1: you'll have sixty million. If you come with t c M,

914
00:51:04,719 --> 00:51:06,399
Speaker 1: you're gonna have to come to Atlanta at least once

915
00:51:06,440 --> 00:51:09,000
Speaker 1: a month. If you go with a m C, you

916
00:51:09,040 --> 00:51:12,560
Speaker 1: can work in New York. But the library, he said,

917
00:51:12,600 --> 00:51:14,040
Speaker 1: if you come with t c M, you're gonna have

918
00:51:14,120 --> 00:51:17,960
Speaker 1: the MGM Library, the Archaeo Library, the Warner Brothers Library,

919
00:51:18,320 --> 00:51:21,320
Speaker 1: and all of that. And so there was really no choice.

920
00:51:21,719 --> 00:51:27,360
Speaker 1: They launched TCM. You as of that vehicle. Now, I

921
00:51:27,400 --> 00:51:29,279
Speaker 1: want to go back to something you said, which is

922
00:51:29,320 --> 00:51:32,440
Speaker 1: that you saw that film business had changed, and you

923
00:51:32,520 --> 00:51:34,279
Speaker 1: were in those rooms with those people and you were

924
00:51:34,320 --> 00:51:37,800
Speaker 1: their friend, and then realism came. What was a movie

925
00:51:37,880 --> 00:51:39,520
Speaker 1: you saw at that period that you said to myself,

926
00:51:39,560 --> 00:51:42,680
Speaker 1: my god, the movies have changed. Well, Easy Rider. I

927
00:51:42,840 --> 00:51:47,040
Speaker 1: happen to be in London, a place I never went

928
00:51:47,160 --> 00:51:49,239
Speaker 1: to very often, but I happened to be at the

929
00:51:49,320 --> 00:51:52,080
Speaker 1: Royal Court Theater. In the row in front of me

930
00:51:52,200 --> 00:51:54,800
Speaker 1: was Dennis Hopper, who had just come back from I

931
00:51:54,880 --> 00:51:58,839
Speaker 1: believe the can Film Festival where they showed Easy Rider

932
00:51:58,960 --> 00:52:01,000
Speaker 1: and it won some award, or maybe it was the

933
00:52:01,080 --> 00:52:04,040
Speaker 1: Venice film test whatever, and they were talking about it,

934
00:52:04,200 --> 00:52:07,560
Speaker 1: and I thought the way the papers were writing about that,

935
00:52:07,840 --> 00:52:11,640
Speaker 1: I thought, this is something very strange that that movie

936
00:52:12,120 --> 00:52:16,360
Speaker 1: about a couple of motorcycle guys on cycles and no stoking,

937
00:52:16,400 --> 00:52:19,239
Speaker 1: a lot of grass stories and no plot. You know,

938
00:52:19,360 --> 00:52:22,560
Speaker 1: this is this is really a seminal change. I think

939
00:52:22,640 --> 00:52:24,000
Speaker 1: that was a big turning. Do you think that the

940
00:52:24,160 --> 00:52:26,759
Speaker 1: Vietnam War was responsible for that change? I think I

941
00:52:26,840 --> 00:52:30,360
Speaker 1: think Kennedy being assassinated changing has changed the world. That

942
00:52:30,520 --> 00:52:34,320
Speaker 1: shot changed everything about America and made a cynical and

943
00:52:34,440 --> 00:52:38,520
Speaker 1: made people discontent angry. You know, for me, when I

944
00:52:38,680 --> 00:52:40,399
Speaker 1: was young, there was a man who when you saw

945
00:52:40,520 --> 00:52:43,880
Speaker 1: this man on TV, he was the movie business, and

946
00:52:43,960 --> 00:52:47,000
Speaker 1: that was Walt Disney. And to me, you are the

947
00:52:47,080 --> 00:52:49,920
Speaker 1: Walt Disney of your generation. You come on TV and

948
00:52:50,000 --> 00:52:52,600
Speaker 1: right away people because you have become so synonymous. I mean,

949
00:52:52,640 --> 00:52:55,960
Speaker 1: people just love you, they love your show, and you

950
00:52:56,320 --> 00:52:58,759
Speaker 1: mean the movie business. To do you sense that when

951
00:52:58,800 --> 00:53:00,680
Speaker 1: you're out of the street with people. I get a

952
00:53:00,760 --> 00:53:03,200
Speaker 1: sense of that, but I honestly don't see it. Who

953
00:53:03,239 --> 00:53:04,759
Speaker 1: do you think you're talking to when you talk to

954
00:53:04,840 --> 00:53:07,680
Speaker 1: the camera when you do the three people? I talked

955
00:53:07,719 --> 00:53:10,919
Speaker 1: to my aunt who lives on a farm who loves

956
00:53:11,000 --> 00:53:13,479
Speaker 1: old movies but doesn't know much about him. I can't

957
00:53:13,520 --> 00:53:17,440
Speaker 1: say Berta Lucci without explaining that he's a director. I

958
00:53:17,480 --> 00:53:21,120
Speaker 1: also talked to a guy that is now a young man,

959
00:53:21,280 --> 00:53:23,920
Speaker 1: but he was in his early twenties worked for the

960
00:53:23,960 --> 00:53:26,800
Speaker 1: Hollywood Reporter. That called me one time and said, you know,

961
00:53:26,880 --> 00:53:28,600
Speaker 1: I just saw this great movie the other night. I

962
00:53:28,719 --> 00:53:30,520
Speaker 1: was wondering if the lady in it made any of

963
00:53:30,560 --> 00:53:32,160
Speaker 1: the movies. I'd like to see some of those movies.

964
00:53:32,200 --> 00:53:34,640
Speaker 1: And I said, well, what's that was the movie? Said

965
00:53:34,640 --> 00:53:36,600
Speaker 1: I didn't get the name of it. Well, who's the actors?

966
00:53:36,640 --> 00:53:38,719
Speaker 1: I don't know what her name was. Will describe the

967
00:53:38,760 --> 00:53:41,040
Speaker 1: movie to me. He described it and it was gilded

968
00:53:41,120 --> 00:53:44,000
Speaker 1: with three to Hayworth. He's interested in movies. He wants

969
00:53:44,040 --> 00:53:46,520
Speaker 1: to learn about movies and all of that. And I'm

970
00:53:46,520 --> 00:53:48,600
Speaker 1: also talking to a friend of mine who died recently,

971
00:53:48,840 --> 00:53:52,160
Speaker 1: called Robert Rosterman in Chicago, who knows as much about

972
00:53:52,200 --> 00:53:56,040
Speaker 1: movies as any of us know. And he worked for

973
00:53:56,160 --> 00:54:00,399
Speaker 1: years as a booker for twenty century Fox. Kind yeah,

974
00:54:00,480 --> 00:54:03,560
Speaker 1: but he was a dedicated movie fan. But I want

975
00:54:03,600 --> 00:54:06,400
Speaker 1: to say something in each introduction, that's also going to

976
00:54:07,040 --> 00:54:09,400
Speaker 1: be news to him. So I tried to gear it

977
00:54:09,520 --> 00:54:12,799
Speaker 1: for those three people, my aunt and my friend John

978
00:54:13,120 --> 00:54:18,480
Speaker 1: and Robert Rostherin to cover all basses. Robert Osborne is

979
00:54:18,560 --> 00:54:21,720
Speaker 1: eight one. Last year, I went to a book party

980
00:54:21,800 --> 00:54:25,760
Speaker 1: for Keith Richards. I found myself seated directly opposite Richards

981
00:54:26,120 --> 00:54:28,759
Speaker 1: and his wife, Patty Hanson. The long story short as

982
00:54:28,800 --> 00:54:31,480
Speaker 1: Patty Hanson says, we just so love you, Alec, we

983
00:54:31,719 --> 00:54:34,520
Speaker 1: love you on that TV show, and I thought, oh

984
00:54:34,600 --> 00:54:36,719
Speaker 1: good God, to go. Patty Hanson to Keith Richards, don't

985
00:54:36,719 --> 00:54:39,640
Speaker 1: watch thirty Rock. This is preposterous. She's just being so polite,

986
00:54:40,760 --> 00:54:42,960
Speaker 1: and she says, what's that show? She says, it's Keith,

987
00:54:43,040 --> 00:54:45,680
Speaker 1: that show we watch every week. We watched and Keith

988
00:54:45,800 --> 00:54:48,839
Speaker 1: Richards looks at the Eagles. We watch you on turn

989
00:54:48,920 --> 00:54:53,880
Speaker 1: a Classic Movies Man every weekend. It was so fantastic.

990
00:54:54,360 --> 00:54:58,920
Speaker 1: We love that show. And I thought Osbourne has staged

991
00:54:58,960 --> 00:55:05,799
Speaker 1: me again. M take a listen to our archive more

992
00:55:06,040 --> 00:55:11,000
Speaker 1: in depth conversations with artists, performers, and policymakers like Martin Horn,

993
00:55:11,520 --> 00:55:15,440
Speaker 1: former head of New York City's Department of Corrections and Probation.

994
00:55:15,719 --> 00:55:17,960
Speaker 1: I would legalize drugs across the board. You would really

995
00:55:18,000 --> 00:55:23,120
Speaker 1: legalize which draft all of them? You would legalize all drugs. Yes,

996
00:55:23,400 --> 00:55:27,040
Speaker 1: that's a pretty well stunned well, I wouldn't say that.

997
00:55:27,480 --> 00:55:29,720
Speaker 1: I wouldn't say that while I worked for a governor

998
00:55:29,840 --> 00:55:32,640
Speaker 1: or a mayor. Learn more about the impact of the

999
00:55:32,719 --> 00:55:35,600
Speaker 1: drug war from Martin Horn and David Simon of The

1000
00:55:35,680 --> 00:55:44,120
Speaker 1: Wire and Here's the Thing dot Org. This is Alec Baldwin.

1001
00:55:44,680 --> 00:55:47,600
Speaker 1: Here's the Thing is produced by Emily Boutine and Kathy

1002
00:55:47,680 --> 00:55:52,480
Speaker 1: Russo with Chris Bannon, Jim Briggs, ed Herbstman, Melanie Hoops,

1003
00:55:52,640 --> 00:55:57,759
Speaker 1: Monica Hopkins, Trey k Sharon Mashehe and Louekowski. Thanks to

1004
00:55:57,920 --> 00:56:02,400
Speaker 1: Larry Josephson and the Radio O Foundation. I'm Alec Baldwin

1005
00:56:02,600 --> 00:56:08,399
Speaker 1: and you're listening to Here's the Thing. Oh,