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Speaker 1: Welcome into Northside Territory. Foul Territory Networks Cubs Podcast. I'm

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Speaker 1: Sahad Sharma with my partner Patrick Mooney. We are your

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Speaker 1: Cubs beat writers over at the Athletic Patrick. The Cubs

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Speaker 1: no longer have a lame duck team President Jed Hoyer

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Speaker 1: assigned an extension with the Cubs comes just days before

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Speaker 1: the trade deadline. I don't think they were spending hours

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Speaker 1: and hours hammering this out and distracting themselves from trade talk.

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Speaker 1: So for anyone concerned about that, that's not what was happening.

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Speaker 1: I'm sure this was close to being done for a

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Speaker 1: little while and then they just finalized things. And I

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Speaker 1: think you and I both kind of felt that this

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Speaker 1: was going to happen, that it felt inevitable. I wasn't

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Speaker 1: sure exactly when it was going to happen, but I

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Speaker 1: didn't think they would wait till the off season. Uh,

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Speaker 1: it just felt like it was going to be before

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Speaker 1: the season. He the way this team is playing this season,

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Speaker 1: the farm system is looking better than it was, you know,

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Speaker 1: five years ago. It seems like things are being run

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Speaker 1: the way Tom Ricketts kind of wants them to be run,

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Speaker 1: and they're winning uh, kind of simple in that sense. Uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, they have a good relationship. Jed Hoyer is

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Speaker 1: doing what what's being asked of him, and and you

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Speaker 1: know he's a I'm not sure what else what else

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Speaker 1: Tom Ricketts would be looking for.

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Speaker 2: All Right, that was a great show. The Jed Howyer contract.

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Speaker 2: That sums it up, like they were, like, I mean what,

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Speaker 2: I don't think Jed wanted to go anywhere else. I

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Speaker 2: saw the Washington Post, you know, did sort of a

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Speaker 2: rundown on names for potential Nationals uh team president slash GM,

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Speaker 2: and you know, I think his name was thrown in there.

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Speaker 2: But look, I mean he's got a family that's very

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Speaker 2: established in the area. Here fourteen seasons now with the Cubs,

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Speaker 2: I don't think he was interested in at all in

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Speaker 2: like backing up and moving and starting over. Plus he

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Speaker 2: thinks this team's gonna be really good for a long time.

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Speaker 2: And yeah, you know Tom Ricketts, you know, how he

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Speaker 2: runs this team obviously gets scrutiny, But I generally think,

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Speaker 2: like if you're a GM or president of baseball operations,

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Speaker 2: like he's a pretty good guy to work for. I

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Speaker 2: think he's shown that over the years. He lets people

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Speaker 2: do their jobs, gives people, you know, the number, do

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Speaker 2: with it what you want, just kind of keep me updated.

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Speaker 2: Like he doesn't meddle, And I think that's very attractive

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Speaker 2: if you want to run a baseball team. Maybe you

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Speaker 2: won't get every last dollar the way you know your

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Speaker 2: counterparts with the Dodgers and Mets do, but you get

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Speaker 2: a lot of room to operate, and you know your

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Speaker 2: owner is not going to be chatting up agents trying

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Speaker 2: to make deals or like squashing trades because you know

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Speaker 2: he likes a particular player or thinks it might not

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Speaker 2: play well in the media or for the fan base.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, this was the outcome. I think we all

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Speaker 2: expected it was. You know, it does take something away

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Speaker 2: from the trade deadline because I think everyone's kind of

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Speaker 2: curious here of like, how all In is jed for

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Speaker 2: this year? How much of the farm system is he

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Speaker 2: willing to sacrifice? I guess we won't know or won't

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Speaker 2: see until roughly five pm on Thursday. And he's jed,

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Speaker 2: as we know, is not a very reckless executive, so

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Speaker 2: I don't think he would have just emptied the farm

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Speaker 2: system anyways. But it does bring a lot of clarity

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Speaker 2: and stability moving forward.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, there were people that kind of felt

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Speaker 1: like this was a big deal in the sense of,

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Speaker 1: now Jed won't you know, give away Owen Casey for rental?

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Speaker 1: Does this change how he'll behave? You know, I get

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Speaker 1: the thinking, I totally do. I understand where all that

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Speaker 1: thinking is coming from. I just never felt like Jed

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Speaker 1: Hoyer was that type of person, that type of executive

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Speaker 1: he's I mean, he will make the aggressive move We've

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Speaker 1: seen aggressive moves in recent past, but I just don't

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Speaker 1: see like, whether he had an expiring deal or not,

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Speaker 1: I didn't see him being reckless with the farm system

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Speaker 1: doing the type of deals that we see the Gunslinger

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Speaker 1: GM doing. He's not a j perell or Uh. He's

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Speaker 1: not Dave Dombrowski. Uh. He's not you know, the that's

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Speaker 1: not who he is. Like he just he he thinks

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Speaker 1: differently and he he is uh, you know, value is

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Speaker 1: important to this front office. Uh. I didn't see him

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Speaker 1: behaving much differently whether he had the extension or not. Uh.

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Speaker 1: But I do understand the premise of that that that suggestion. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And I and I agree, like having some clarity maybe

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Speaker 1: puts him at ease in a sense, But I don't.

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Speaker 1: I just don't know, Like it's not like, was he

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Speaker 1: on the verge of making a deal yesterday and then

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Speaker 1: he puts his name on the dotted line, and now

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Speaker 1: it's like, Okay, actually, now that I'm going to be

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Speaker 1: here for X number of years, I don't want to

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Speaker 1: make that deal. I don't think anything like that was

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Speaker 1: was even, you know, on on his mind.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know. I definitely think it was on

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Speaker 2: his mind earlier in the year. I think it'd be

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Speaker 2: only natural. I mean, now it's that at spring train.

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Speaker 1: Yeah No, no, no, I mean, like I'm saying, like him

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Speaker 1: him doing doing making a trade I got yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 1: I don't think that was like he wasn't going to

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Speaker 1: change the way he behaves, not drastically for sure. No.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's kind of like the Kyle Tucker deal.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it looked like it kind of looked like a

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Speaker 2: move of a you know, front office on the hot

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Speaker 2: seat that knows jobs are on the line. But it

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Speaker 2: was also like the natural next step and outgrowth of

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Speaker 2: all these other incremental moves they had made in terms

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Speaker 2: of rearranging the farm system and setting up a good

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Speaker 2: foundation at the major league level and just missing the

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Speaker 2: playoffs two years in a row. So yeah, he's he's

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Speaker 2: on the clock now.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I am very curious to see what these

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Speaker 1: next three days hold, like it does matter hugely, Like

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Speaker 1: it's it's incredibly important. They have very obvious needs. This

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Speaker 1: team is is slightly flawed. I mean all teams are flawed.

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Speaker 1: This one is one of them. So there, these are

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Speaker 1: big next few days for Jed Hoyer. But some stability.

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Speaker 1: Let's talk about some of his strength, some of his weaknesses,

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Speaker 1: what he's what he's done over the past few years.

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Speaker 1: Patrick Gate. If we're gonna talk about like what Jed

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Speaker 1: Hoyer is good at, what he's not great at, I

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Speaker 1: think where I start. I know there's been so many

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Speaker 1: different he's made big moves, he's he's avoided the big

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Speaker 1: splash at times. I think he sticks to his guns

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Speaker 1: more often than not, like he rarely strays from his philosophy.

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Speaker 1: Maybe you could point to the Kyle Tucker trade as

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Speaker 1: as straying from the philosophy, but I always point to

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Speaker 1: the bullpen whether he's right or wrong, and he is.

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Speaker 1: You know, we've talked to him about certain deals that

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Speaker 1: he doesn't love they may look good for a couple

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Speaker 1: of years. He doesn't love giving multi like more than

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Speaker 1: two years to a reliever. He doesn't. He just doesn't

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Speaker 1: like spending big on relievers in general. Look, Tanner Scott

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Speaker 1: isn't tearing it up in La right now. That was

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Speaker 1: a deal that they Maybe they got saved by the

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Speaker 1: Dodgers being so aggressive because they avoid those types of deals.

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Speaker 1: But they were willing to put out big money for

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Speaker 1: Tanner Scott. They they built bullpens without spending huge money.

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Speaker 1: It's an imperfect way of doing it because there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of risk. I think it bit them in twenty three,

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Speaker 1: maybe to a degree at the beginning of twenty five

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Speaker 1: or but you go look around baseball, very rarely do

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Speaker 1: you see the best bullpens. It's like all a bunch

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Speaker 1: of you know, high priced free agents that that litter

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Speaker 1: those bullpens. It's it's it can it's such a random game.

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Speaker 1: And he sticks to his guns on there, and and

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Speaker 1: he they he's constantly searching for the edge in that area,

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Speaker 1: whether it's it's trusting guys like Tommy hotteby hiring a

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Speaker 1: guy like Tyler zambro H, Craig Breslow over the in

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Speaker 1: previous seasons that he's always looking for ways to find

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Speaker 1: an edge because you know, you can always find a

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Speaker 1: random reliever and turn him into Brad Keller stud stet

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Speaker 1: Up guy or something like that.

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Speaker 2: Yes, goes back to how you let off the show

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Speaker 2: of like he's running the team the way the owner wants,

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Speaker 2: and part of it is building that pitching infrastructure, getting

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Speaker 2: kind of more of an assembly line of pitching coming

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Speaker 2: to the major leagues. And that's done with investments behind

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Speaker 2: the scenes, not just you know, in players. It is

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Speaker 2: how they scout players, how they draft players, how they

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Speaker 2: develop players. Like that is integrated in a way that

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Speaker 2: makes sense to Jed and makes sense to ownership. You know,

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Speaker 2: this is a very become a very data heavy organization,

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Speaker 2: and you see first round picks contributing at the major

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Speaker 2: league level or being used in the Kyle Tucker deal

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Speaker 2: in the case of Cam Smith, I think not only

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Speaker 2: you know, I think the bullpen is a good sort

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Speaker 2: of like kind of Jed trademark. I also think just

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Speaker 2: the the group of everyday players, they're pretty well rounded,

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Speaker 2: they're sound defensively, Yeah, they needed a Kyle Tucker no doubt,

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Speaker 2: but there are just like certain free agents that pop

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Speaker 2: up and you're like, oh, yeah, that's a kind of

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Speaker 2: jet debt player, or you look at you know, players

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Speaker 2: maybe on base percentage, or they can't feel at all

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Speaker 2: like there's just there're just certain attributes that they like.

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Speaker 2: And I think it felt a little haphazard at the

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Speaker 2: beginning because the farm system was so bad, the budget

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Speaker 2: was so uncertain, and there were so many players all

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Speaker 2: up for free agency at once. But like you know,

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Speaker 2: Dansby Swanson, for example, was not necessarily the best shortstop

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Speaker 2: of that class. It looks like they got the best deal,

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Speaker 2: but he's also been probably the best fit on the

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Speaker 2: most reasonable contract. And yes he's not a star, superstar hitter.

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Speaker 2: But the Cubs have run into some good intangibles as well,

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Speaker 2: even though they don't necessarily like hunt that. I think

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Speaker 2: we see it every day dealing with these people. It's

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Speaker 2: largely a professional group of players who enjoy their craft

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Speaker 2: and are very focused and dedicated. I think all things

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Speaker 2: have come together here now with a very good record,

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Speaker 2: a Brewers team that simply will not go away and

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Speaker 2: took the division lead at the time of US taping

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Speaker 2: this year.

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Speaker 1: But.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it's definitely gonna be a marker though,

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Speaker 2: like Cubs record since Hoyer extended, We'll see what happens

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Speaker 2: here down the stretch. But like there's been a lot

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Speaker 2: of unpopular moves that have put the Cubs in a

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Speaker 2: pretty popular place right now.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean he he does prioritize defense at key positions.

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Speaker 1: You know, the Dansby Swanson signing, I think people would

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Speaker 1: have looked at that as the fourth best shortstop in

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Speaker 1: that on the market at the time. The trade. Turner

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Speaker 1: has been pretty solid for the Phillies. He's not a

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Speaker 1: great defender though, and I'm not sure if that would

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Speaker 1: have worked. I think, you know, I don't think anybody

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Speaker 1: would be thrilled if they had Xander Bogarts or Carlos

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Speaker 1: Torrea right now. You know, like carl Correa is injured

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Speaker 1: far too often, and Xander Bogarts, I don't even know

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Speaker 1: what he's doing right now. I think he's both injured

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Speaker 1: and not as effective as he once was. I don't

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Speaker 1: think he'd be a very good shortstop at the moment

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Speaker 1: he went with the glove. I know it's frustrating at times,

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Speaker 1: the offensive production. My guess is Dasy Swanson's gonna get

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Speaker 1: hot at some point over these final two plus months

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Speaker 1: and helped them win a lot of games. He's certainly

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Speaker 1: done that with his glove. He's incredibly impressive. The peak arms,

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Speaker 1: I mean, the twenty twenty one deadline in general. Uh,

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Speaker 1: kind of ushering them through that is something that stands

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Speaker 1: out to me. I mean, he got, he got dealt

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Speaker 1: kind of a raw he got. He got like a

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Speaker 1: bad hand in the sense like Theo's like, all right,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna resign now, and knowing what needed to be done,

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Speaker 1: Like THEO knew what needed to be done at that point,

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Speaker 1: and instead of just doing it himself and then leaving,

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Speaker 1: which I don't I don't think Jed like it was

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Speaker 1: a bad thing that THEO did. He's like, this is

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Speaker 1: Jed's team. Let him make these decisions. Uh. I understand

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Speaker 1: the thought process. Uh, but those were hard decisions to make,

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Speaker 1: and Jed like, inevitably people were going to be mad.

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Speaker 1: Fans were going to be mad. There was no way

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Speaker 1: you could move on from that team no matter what

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Speaker 1: he got at that point in time, he was going

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Speaker 1: to take a lot of criticism. That was a loved,

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Speaker 1: beloved group of players. He didn't hit a home run

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Speaker 1: on every trade. Craig kimberrel trade will always be looked

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Speaker 1: at as you know, they they that stings to a sense.

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Speaker 1: Didn't get a lot for Chris Bryant. We'll see what

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Speaker 1: you got for Anthony Rizzau. But you won one of

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Speaker 1: those trades, a home run trade in the hobby bias trade. Right,

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Speaker 1: Peter Armstrong is a superstar. He acquired him for two

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Speaker 1: months of hobby bias. That's a big deal, Like getting

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Speaker 1: one superstar at that deadline is a big deal and

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Speaker 1: just kind of leading ushering the organization through such a

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Speaker 1: difficult moment. I think that matters in general and should

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Speaker 1: be looked at as you know, he handled it well.

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Speaker 1: He didn't overthink things, he didn't and he you know,

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Speaker 1: he didn't go halfway. He did what he had to do.

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Speaker 2: He also got Daniel Plancy out of that deal, which

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Speaker 2: was not not that he was any sort of sure thing,

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Speaker 2: but also, you know, put him in a system that

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Speaker 2: had gotten better at developed pitchers and you know, put

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Speaker 2: him in a major league infrastructure that has done well

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Speaker 2: in terms of putting relievers in positions to succeed. And

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Speaker 2: I think the other piece of this too. We wrote

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Speaker 2: about this before around your trip to Japan of just Jed,

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Speaker 2: and it wasn't only Jed, but Jed really pushed to

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Speaker 2: build this presence in Japan and create a fear of

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Speaker 2: influence there. And obviously Saya Suzuki was kind of signed

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Speaker 2: to be part of the quote next great Cubs team

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Speaker 2: showed him. Naga sort of fell in their laps, but

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Speaker 2: they also had a ton of information on him. They

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Speaker 2: had the relationships there in place and the credibility with

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Speaker 2: all the various stakeholders in that marketplace, and that has

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Speaker 2: obviously paid off each here.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, the great point on Japan, that's that's turned out

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Speaker 1: really well for them. He's he's revamped so much of

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Speaker 1: this organization, so it's his organization fully. Now this is

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Speaker 1: his team and we'll see where it goes from here.

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Speaker 1: Let's take a quick break and talk about some of

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Speaker 1: the reaction we got in the Cubs clubhouse in Milwaukee.

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Speaker 1: Patrick. Jed Hoyer hired Craig Counsel. He targeted him. He's

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Speaker 1: always had, you know, he's always kind of had a

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Speaker 1: fascination with what Counsel was able to do with those

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Speaker 1: Brewers teams for years. He was part of the group

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Speaker 1: that drafted Ian happ and he was, you know, like

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Speaker 1: we talked about before he signed dansby Swans and we

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Speaker 1: talked to all those people about Jed Hoyer's extension obviously

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Speaker 1: they had nothing but good things to say. I think

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Speaker 1: for me what always stands out is the relationship he

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Speaker 1: has with Dansby. It's almost like a partnership. I know

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Speaker 1: Dansby's kind of taking a step back in the sense

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Speaker 1: like he's not in his ear all the time. But

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Speaker 1: I remember in twenty three it was a big deal

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Speaker 1: how Dansby was constantly talking to Jed about, Hey, I

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Speaker 1: think we can do something ere, you know, don't give

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Speaker 1: up on us type thing, you know, look to improve

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Speaker 1: this team, don't dismantle it. Almost worked out, almost worked out,

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Speaker 1: But but Dansby was, you know, like he he he

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Speaker 1: feels like he's you know, like Jed. He can confide

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Speaker 1: in Jed, talk to Jed openly. I think that's a

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Speaker 1: you know, it's not always the case with the front

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Speaker 1: office and and players.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that there's that piece, plus what council

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Speaker 2: outlined in Milwaukee of just that Jed feels young in

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Speaker 2: a sense, but he's don this for a long time.

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Speaker 2: I mean, almost half of his life in baseball operations,

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Speaker 2: and that there's almost nothing that he's never seen before.

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Speaker 2: I know, you never know what's going to happen when

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Speaker 2: you go to the park each day. But broadly in

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Speaker 2: terms of like the circuses he had to deal with

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Speaker 2: in Boston, the star players he had, you know, both

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Speaker 2: in Austin in Chicago, the epic droughts that he helped

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Speaker 2: end in Boston. In Chicago, Uh, he's dealt with Hall

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Speaker 2: of Fame caliber managers.

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Speaker 1: Uh.

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Speaker 2: He briefly worked in a very small market, uh in

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Speaker 2: San Diego, And as you know, it's hot of the

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Speaker 2: baseball industries, kind of small, so you keep seeing the

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Speaker 2: same people over and over and over again. And I

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Speaker 2: think Jed's relationships matter. H he has a lot of

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Speaker 2: credibility in those conversations. I don't think, you know, there's

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Speaker 2: an agent and he hasn't dealt with before, you know,

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Speaker 2: in terms of the big the big ones, like it

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Speaker 2: just kind of keeps happening over and over, these cycles,

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Speaker 2: and that you know, in Council's mind, Jed is often

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Speaker 2: ahead of these things, like he's seen it happen before

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Speaker 2: and for an organization, Council said, it's a very comforting feeling.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I have to give credit to Jed for really

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Speaker 1: bringing outsiders in THEO. Brought a lot of ex Boston

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Speaker 1: people around and that that worked. Obviously they won a

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Speaker 1: World Series. Jed has reshaped the organization, bringing in people

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Speaker 1: he didn't have previous relationships with. Right now it appears

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Speaker 1: to be headed in the right direction. So he's he's

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Speaker 1: modernized the front office and and really whether it comes

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Speaker 1: to player development, amateur scouting, R and D, all those

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Speaker 1: different departments. He's constantly looking ahead and trying to find

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Speaker 1: the next best thing to make sure that this team

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Speaker 1: is on the cutting edge. Sometimes it's an imperfect science,

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Speaker 1: so it doesn't always work. But I think he's at

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Speaker 1: least he's he's not just hiring, Oh here's a guy

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Speaker 1: I do that I met, you know, fifteen years ago,

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Speaker 1: that that I knew that that could maybe handle this department.

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Speaker 1: He's he's going outside, uh maybe even his comfort zone

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Speaker 1: at times and finding finding anyone to to help build

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Speaker 1: a stronger organization. I also have to give him credit

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Speaker 1: for always being available, like good times, bad times. He

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Speaker 1: faces the media. He's not afraid to talk to us.

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Speaker 1: You know, I know fans may not. I think fans

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Speaker 1: appreciate that, understand Like, I mean, how often do you

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Speaker 1: hear like, where is this guy you know from from

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Speaker 1: other families? How Bulls are the Bears. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: he's and it helps you yeah yeah, explain exactly exactly.

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Speaker 1: So so he's yeah, you're right. He knows, he's not

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Speaker 1: an idiot. He knows like this is the best for him,

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Speaker 1: best way to go about business for him. Uh, he's

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Speaker 1: got a critical few days here. I think we all

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Speaker 1: agree on that. Uh, this team needs to get better.

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Speaker 1: Uh we're recording this on a Tuesday, and and they're

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Speaker 1: coming off a tough loss in Milwaukee, so that they

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Speaker 1: need to get better and better fast. He loves these deadlines.

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Speaker 1: He's going to be active. We'll see what happens over

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Speaker 1: the next couple of days, but an important few days,

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Speaker 1: a couple of days here for this organization, extending the

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Speaker 1: head of baseball ops and now and now we'll see

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Speaker 1: what direction this team goes and what Jed can do

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Speaker 1: to improve their chances not only this season, but beyond.

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Speaker 1: Thanks so much for listening everyone. This is Northside Territory.

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Speaker 1: Make sure to rate, review, subscribe, subscribe to the YouTube channel,

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Speaker 1: and subscribe to The Athletic where Patrick and I are

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Speaker 1: on top of all things Cubs. Thanks for listening everyone.

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Speaker 1: Take there's just two day