Speaker 1: Jay Shetty's podcast On Purpose is the number one health
Speaker 1: and wellness podcast. The President participated in an interview with
Speaker 1: Jay Shetty, who you all may know, to discuss the
Speaker 1: administration's effort to tackle the mental health crisis.
Speaker 2: It's President says, a pleasure good, thank you for this.
Speaker 3: On that, thank you very very grateful. The day will
Speaker 3: come when you open that closet door and you smell
Speaker 3: the fragrance of her dresses, or you're going by that
Speaker 3: park where you walk with your child or or your boy,
Speaker 3: or your husband, or the thing that reminds you that
Speaker 3: for the longest time, we'll just bring a tear to
Speaker 3: your eye. But eventually, everyone in a while, I'll bring
Speaker 3: a smile that before bring the tear to your eye.
Speaker 3: When that happens, you know you're going to make.
Speaker 1: It the best selling authoring cloth the.
Speaker 3: Number one health and wellness podcast.
Speaker 1: On Purpose with Ja Shetty.
Speaker 2: I'm so grateful and honored that you're here with me
Speaker 2: right now. Thank you so much for all your love
Speaker 2: and all your support for On Purpose. It's incredible what
Speaker 2: we've been creating together, what we've been building together, and
Speaker 2: I'm so excited to share some big news with you.
Speaker 2: This is an extremely special interview today as I'm sitting
Speaker 2: down with the President of the United States, Joe Biden.
Speaker 2: This is only possible because of all your love and
Speaker 2: support for the podcast and making us a platform that
Speaker 2: the President and his team felt was right to talk
Speaker 2: about mental health. This conversation is dedicated to the person
Speaker 2: behind the podium. I always want to get to know
Speaker 2: the human behind the title, behind the position, behind what
Speaker 2: they do in the world, and spotlight and shine a
Speaker 2: light on mental health. We talk about so many of
Speaker 2: the things that he's gone through in his personal life.
Speaker 2: I'm so grateful that I got to have this conversation
Speaker 2: that we're going to share with the world at large
Speaker 2: and make sure that mental health is a mainstream conversation
Speaker 2: because it's so integral to all of our lives. I
Speaker 2: hope you enjoy this conversation. Thank you for all your
Speaker 2: love and support. Means the world to me. Hey everyone,
Speaker 2: welcome back to On Purpose, the number one health and
Speaker 2: wellness podcast in the world. Thanks to each and every
Speaker 2: one of you that come back every week to learn, listen,
Speaker 2: and grow. Now you know our mission here is to
Speaker 2: make the world happier, healthier, and more healed. And I
Speaker 2: believe that learning about people's stories of healing, of grief,
Speaker 2: of loss of growth is a powerful way to do that.
Speaker 2: And today I've been graciously invited to the White House
Speaker 2: and I'm sitting with mister President, and I'm so grateful
Speaker 2: and honored to be here and to have you on
Speaker 2: our platform, and for you to choose our platform to
Speaker 2: have this conversation. I couldn't be more honored. Thank you
Speaker 2: so much, Thank you. I'm on interview me absolutely Well,
Speaker 2: let's dive straight in. The first question I'd like to
Speaker 2: ask you is what is your earliest childhood memory that
Speaker 2: you believe defines who you are today and passing you've become.
Speaker 3: The earliest memory I have is there's two of them.
Speaker 3: One is there was a bully in the neighborhood lived
Speaker 3: down an area called the Plot, and we lived up
Speaker 3: the hill, and I was out with my friends in
Speaker 3: the alley behind our house and my mother was at
Speaker 3: the pantry looking out. The tough guy in the neighborhood
Speaker 3: smacked me. Was a couple years older than me, and
Speaker 3: I came in hold on my face, and my grandfather
Speaker 3: was at the kitchen table and sw what's the matter, Joey,
Speaker 3: and he said, that's a shame. I walked in and
Speaker 3: my mother said, Joey, go back out there. So go
Speaker 3: back out there. I said, walk up to wait till
Speaker 3: he walks up to you. As soon as he does,
Speaker 3: smack him right in the nose. And the nose. She said,
Speaker 3: I'll give you fifty cents if you do it. And
Speaker 3: I said, why Mom, She said, you won't be able
Speaker 3: to walk in that alley again if you don't. I
Speaker 3: was scared to death. I walked out, popped him in
Speaker 3: the nose. That bled. He ran, and I thought, huh,
Speaker 3: it worked. But I think the lesson I learned the
Speaker 3: most so is I used to stutter badly and I
Speaker 3: would talk like like like that, and then I'd catch
Speaker 3: my rhythm and and it was something that I thought
Speaker 3: was the worst curse could happen to me because everybody
Speaker 3: makes fun of it.
Speaker 2: I had a similar experience with being bullied, so that
Speaker 2: resonates very strongly with me.
Speaker 3: I think everybody does. Yeah, I was the run of
Speaker 3: the litter, No, it really was. I was a little guy,
Speaker 3: and I was a relatively good athlete even when I
Speaker 3: was a kid. But I literally was the runt of
Speaker 3: the litter.
Speaker 2: Well, well, for me, it was my weight. I was
Speaker 2: overweight growing up, and it was the color of my skin.
Speaker 2: I grew up in an area where I wasn't surrounded
Speaker 2: by a lot of Indian people. And so those were
Speaker 2: the two reasons. Except my mother didn't give me that advice.
Speaker 2: Sometimes I wish she did. My mother did the opposite.
Speaker 2: She actually came into my school and spoke to the teachers,
Speaker 2: which it's really embarrassing at that age, and you know,
Speaker 2: no helpful for him.
Speaker 3: No, I think maybe it is. You know, I had
Speaker 3: a similar thing I when I was in I went
Speaker 3: to Catholic grade school in high school, and you're sitting
Speaker 3: in those days, sat in alphabetical order, and I was
Speaker 3: in the first row, Biden, four people down and reading class.
Speaker 3: Everybody read a paragraph. I got to my paragraph, and
Speaker 3: I remember what it was because I used to try
Speaker 3: to memorize it rather than have to look at the
Speaker 3: word when I was rereading it. And I said, and
Speaker 3: he was a gentle man and this, And the teacher said,
Speaker 3: what's that, mister Biden? He wanted she minded to say gentleman,
Speaker 3: but it's easier to not start her say gentle man,
Speaker 3: I said, gent I said, mister Biden, what is that?
Speaker 3: And I got up and walked out and walked home
Speaker 3: about two miles and my mother was sitting there tapping
Speaker 3: the table when I walked in and see get in.
Speaker 3: The car went down in the car. We walked in,
Speaker 3: went to the principal's office, sat me outside. The door
Speaker 3: of the door was cracking. I was one of those
Speaker 3: opaque glasses glass windows and it didn't go to the
Speaker 3: ceiling anyway. To make a long story short, she said,
Speaker 3: I'd like to speak to the teacher. My mother said,
Speaker 3: and she said, mister by said, I'd like to speak
Speaker 3: to the teacher. So the teacher walks in and looked
Speaker 3: at me like you're in trouble now. Biden walked in,
Speaker 3: sat down. There was a crack and the door. I'll
Speaker 3: never forget this. And my mother, Catherine Eugenia Finnigan Biden,
Speaker 3: and she she looked and like, I said, what should
Speaker 3: you say to my son? She said, did you say,
Speaker 3: but Bob Biden. So I'm just trying to make a point,
Speaker 3: missus Biden. She said, if you ever do that again,
Speaker 3: I'll come back and rip that bonnet off your head.
Speaker 3: Do you understand me. Swear to God, get up, walked out,
Speaker 3: go back to class, Joey. But you know, it's everybody
Speaker 3: has something that is tough, particularly when you're younger, and
Speaker 3: it makes such a difference when when somebody reaches out.
Speaker 3: I'm sure you had also had some experiences someone say,
Speaker 3: come on, like, for example, there's more than a handful
Speaker 3: of young stutterers. They're not so young anymore that I
Speaker 3: still keep in touch with it. One young kid he
Speaker 3: introduced me when I ran for president, took such courage
Speaker 3: because he talked to talk like that, and he practiced,
Speaker 3: He practiced, he practiced, but it's had a profound impact
Speaker 3: on his life. Another young man, when I was vice president,
Speaker 3: he was I could tell you can tell a stutter
Speaker 3: if you're a stutter, just by when he was in
Speaker 3: line with his mom was in Tennessee and I was
Speaker 3: doing a thing for al Gore, and she introduced her
Speaker 3: son and I could see him go the lips. I said,
Speaker 3: I said, hey, I'm about to finish my speech. Why
Speaker 3: don't you come help me write it? And the mother
Speaker 3: looked at me, and he looked at me and took
Speaker 3: him in and I showed him how I marked up
Speaker 3: my speeches so that I could get a little cadence
Speaker 3: with what I did. Did you ever see the movie
Speaker 3: The King Speech? Yes, of course. Well the gentleman who
Speaker 3: had that had a copy of the King's speech? Who
Speaker 3: did it? Sent me a copy, and I don't know
Speaker 3: if I have my book with me, but there's one
Speaker 3: of these days I'll show you my speeches. I looked
Speaker 3: at it and I marked it up the same way.
Speaker 3: Every speech I mark up is the same way they
Speaker 3: might have it. See the slash marks I put on. Yes, well,
Speaker 3: it's just to help me. But you know there are
Speaker 3: people who reached out to me too. Maybe that impediment
Speaker 3: was the best thing ever happened to me.
Speaker 2: It's incredible, isn't it. How I challenge that you're going
Speaker 2: through actually helps you become more compassionate and empathetic towards
Speaker 2: other people.
Speaker 3: It's kind of human nature for most people. When you
Speaker 3: understand the pain someone's feeling, your first instinct is, look.
Speaker 3: We have an expression in the family. From the time
Speaker 3: I was a kid, it's all about showing up to
Speaker 3: just being there. I mean, I imagine the times when
Speaker 3: you were down because they're making fun of your Indian heritage,
Speaker 3: an all white population. That having someone come up and say, hey,
Speaker 3: come on you and mean let's do boom, it makes
Speaker 3: a difference.
Speaker 2: Absolutely. Yeah, I'll never forget. You've just reminded me. Ian
Speaker 2: Winds was his name. He was the toughest kid in
Speaker 2: school and he had my back. That was that pass
Speaker 2: and that reached out to me. So if anyone had
Speaker 2: a problem with me, they had a problem with him,
Speaker 2: he take care of him. I felt very safe, felt
Speaker 2: very safe with you.
Speaker 3: Well, it really is all about reaching out, isn't it.
Speaker 3: I mean, for real, think of all the young people today.
Speaker 3: I think that there's more anxiety and loneliness today than
Speaker 3: there's been in a long long time. You know, my
Speaker 3: friend I appointed, Admiral mcmurthy, he was telling me about,
Speaker 3: you know, the percentage of young people today who are
Speaker 3: feeling lonely alone, and sometimes it's just just touching, just
Speaker 3: showing up. I used to get see son, Beau, who
Speaker 3: should be sitting here instead of me? Would I always say, Dad,
Speaker 3: you don't have time to make that call, you know,
Speaker 3: I'd get in a plan and go home. And because
Speaker 3: so someone had a serious problem, lost a wife or daughter,
Speaker 3: and I said, Dad, you don't have time when he
Speaker 3: passed away. The hundreds of people have told me how
Speaker 3: he called, he showed up, he was there, And because
Speaker 3: the people have showed up for me too, this really matters.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you've been through you mentioned it there. You've been
Speaker 2: through so much tragic loss in your life, as you
Speaker 2: just mentioned there. You didn't run for presidency in twenty sixteen,
Speaker 2: shortly after the loss of your son. You've lost your
Speaker 2: first wife and daughter in a horrific accident. I can't
Speaker 2: even begin to understand how someone has the courage to
Speaker 2: process that much loss in grief, let alone move forward
Speaker 2: in the way you have. It's truly admirable. How did
Speaker 2: you begin?
Speaker 3: I had an overwhelming advantage in the loss, and that
Speaker 3: was I had a really close family that was there.
Speaker 3: For example, when my wife and daughter were killed, my
Speaker 3: first wife and my two boys were very badly injured.
Speaker 3: Attractor trailer brought side of I was not in an accident.
Speaker 3: When I got home from the hospital, my sister and
Speaker 3: husband already gave up their apartment and moved in helped
Speaker 3: me raise my kid my brother. We lived in a
Speaker 3: suburban area that was more country than suburban, and there
Speaker 3: was a little barn on a prock garage bar and
Speaker 3: my brother came and he turned the loft to the
Speaker 3: barn into an apartment for himself. They were there for
Speaker 3: me all the time. That was a gigantic difference, my
Speaker 3: best friend in my life and my sister and my brothers.
Speaker 2: And.
Speaker 3: So I had an enormous advantage. And I think that
Speaker 3: when you see people who were going through something tough,
Speaker 3: it does matter if you reach out. I mean it
Speaker 3: does matter. Like for example, you know you have a
Speaker 3: when you're a senator. For all the years I was
Speaker 3: in a small state, you know so many people and
Speaker 3: people would pass away, show up at the wake of
Speaker 3: the funerrmal matter what was happening. I learned it early on.
Speaker 3: People would stop and just come and throw their arms
Speaker 3: around me because if they know you know the pain
Speaker 3: they feel, they get some solace in it. It's not
Speaker 3: always easy, but it's it just matters just to just
Speaker 3: to reach out, let people know you see them.
Speaker 2: How did you allow yourself to receive that help too?
Speaker 2: I feel like, as you were mentioning earlier, with the
Speaker 2: loneliness and anxiety that exists, a lot of people either
Speaker 2: struggle to know what to say. I think we live
Speaker 2: in a society where people are like, but what do
Speaker 2: I say if they've gone to them? And the opposite
Speaker 2: end what you just said. Being able to be open
Speaker 2: enough to actually receive help requires a certain amount of
Speaker 2: courage and strength as well. I was.
Speaker 3: Raising a family, for real, extended family, my grandparents as well,
Speaker 3: where my dad. In an expression, family is beginning, middle
Speaker 3: and end. There was a rule in the family growing up,
Speaker 3: not a joke. We didn't notice the time, but whenever
Speaker 3: you wanted to speak to your mother or father, I mean,
Speaker 3: they said, can we he had a problem. No matter
Speaker 3: what they were doing, they stopped. No matter what they
Speaker 3: were doing, they stopped and heard, listen to you. And
Speaker 3: I did the same with my children, and they did
Speaker 3: the same with theirs, because it's a matter of them
Speaker 3: knowing that they are the most important thing in your life.
Speaker 3: Have they got a problem, You're there to listen. I
Speaker 3: have seven grandkids, four of them five, and mold them
Speaker 3: up to talk on the phone. You know, every day
Speaker 3: I either text them or call them. And a matter
Speaker 3: of fact, or in any campaign they were having a I
Speaker 3: didn't realize they're having an interview. The four oldest grandchildren,
Speaker 3: they said, And just at the time, and they said,
Speaker 3: they call me pop. Pop calls us every day or
Speaker 3: text us every day, and I call them the phone. Right. Well,
Speaker 3: I give my word. I had no idea, but it's
Speaker 3: a look. I just think being there is is important
Speaker 3: and it makes such a difference. I think knowing that
Speaker 3: someone's going to be there for you, just to listen,
Speaker 3: just to just to hold you, just to hug you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I believe you're right. I believe we often over
Speaker 2: complicate things. We think we have to say the perfect thing,
Speaker 2: we have to have the solution, we have to be
Speaker 2: able to fix.
Speaker 3: I agree, But it's just half of just showing up.
Speaker 3: Even people you don't know that well, but you've met
Speaker 3: the fact you'd call and say I'm thinking of you.
Speaker 3: I learned this from my experience. The day will come
Speaker 3: when you open that closet door and you smell the
Speaker 3: fragrance of her dresses, or you're going by that park
Speaker 3: where you where you where you walked with your child,
Speaker 3: or your or your wife or your husband, or the
Speaker 3: thing that reminds you, and for the longest time, I'll
Speaker 3: just bring a tear to your eye. But eventually everyone
Speaker 3: in a while, I'll bring a smile that before bring
Speaker 3: the tear to your eye. When that happens, you know
Speaker 3: you're going to make it. That's the moment, you know.
Speaker 3: I doesn't mean you still don't cry, doesn't mean that
Speaker 3: pain still isn't isn't real even years later, but you
Speaker 3: know you can make it. I think there's an advantage
Speaker 3: sometimes if you have deep faith, whether you're you know, Catholic, Protestant, Hindu, Jewish, Muslim,
Speaker 3: you know whatever. My family, when I want to get
Speaker 3: an important message to me, they tape it on the
Speaker 3: mi in the bathroom. I'm serious.
Speaker 2: So you wake up in the morning and yeah.
Speaker 3: No, it's on the mirror. I guess I was down
Speaker 3: early on. I missed ten years ago. I was down
Speaker 3: from me and my daughter actually taped on she's a
Speaker 3: social worker, taped on my mirror. Happiness is something something
Speaker 3: to do, someone to love, and someone to look forward to.
Speaker 3: Even dad, you have all those things just remind you,
Speaker 3: you know.
Speaker 2: I think what you just said about the smile before
Speaker 2: the tear is probably one of the realist things I've
Speaker 2: ever heard. I think we often are trying to create
Speaker 2: a world in which we only have smiles and where
Speaker 2: we put pressure on ourselves and the people around us
Speaker 2: to be forever happy. And what you just said there
Speaker 2: was really really resonated with me. It really hit me, actually,
Speaker 2: the idea that you will cry, it will happen, But
Speaker 2: that tiny smile that you experience even through a loss,
Speaker 2: even through grief, You're fortunate that you've got to have
Speaker 2: that experience that allowed you to find that smile at
Speaker 2: that time. And I feel like you've been through so
Speaker 2: many obstacles in your life, but I'd love to know
Speaker 2: what you see as the relationship between vulnerability and strength,
Speaker 2: especially as a leader, because I think leaders have an
Speaker 2: overarching pressure to display strength in a certain way. I'll
Speaker 2: give you an example. I coach several CEOs and individuals,
Speaker 2: athletes and others, and one of the CEOs who leads
Speaker 2: a large organization called me a few months ago and
Speaker 2: we were working through some things together and at one
Speaker 2: point I said to them, I said, it would be
Speaker 2: really wonderful for you to tell your teams that you
Speaker 2: lead what you've been going through and growing through. And
Speaker 2: they said, Jay, I don't know if I can tell them.
Speaker 2: I don't know if I can tell them. And I
Speaker 2: said why, and they said, well, because it will look
Speaker 2: like I'm weak. And I said to them, well, no,
Speaker 2: you being vulnerable and sharing your growth is the greatest strength.
Speaker 2: That's not a weakness, but that was you. Because so
Speaker 2: many leaders feel they have to portray a set and
Speaker 2: type of strength. But even today I can see there's
Speaker 2: a grace in the way you're sharing.
Speaker 3: Well, I have a rule that I thought that everybody
Speaker 3: in my staff knew because I had when I was
Speaker 3: a Senator for a long time. At one point, I
Speaker 3: don't know how they measured it, but I had the
Speaker 3: same staff longest than anybody in the Senate at the time.
Speaker 3: For example, we were doing a very very important Supreme
Speaker 3: Court hearing. I was chairman of the shared Committee, and
Speaker 3: we worked on it very hard and did all the
Speaker 3: research and you know, anyway, and there was the one
Speaker 3: young man with people say he was invaluable because he's
Speaker 3: the guy who knew all the detail about certainty. And
Speaker 3: I found out that he was having trouble at home
Speaker 3: and I said, I want you to go home, don't
Speaker 3: come into hearing. Said I can't go home, go home,
Speaker 3: And you know why, because I would go home. I
Speaker 3: have a thousand bosses, but only one me knowing. And
Speaker 3: so I know when I had Cristies at home raising
Speaker 3: the boys, I went home. I don't know how many
Speaker 3: years ago it was, but in this job and as
Speaker 3: vice president, another person was having some trouble at home
Speaker 3: and I found out. But I said, go home. They said, no, no,
Speaker 3: I can't. I got I said, if you don't go home,
Speaker 3: I'm going to fire you. Go home. Give relationship. It
Speaker 3: was a hell a lot more important to whatever you're
Speaker 3: doing for me. So that's a rule we have. Not
Speaker 3: a joke, absolutely not. And they never have to tell
Speaker 3: me why. All you got to say is I'm not gonnent.
Speaker 3: I take you to your word. If it turns out
Speaker 3: you're playing games with me, I'll learn. But I know
Speaker 3: you too well take the time because you're not any
Speaker 3: better than your relationship. And that's a little bit what
Speaker 3: you were just talking about. And you know, I think
Speaker 3: you have to ask my staff. I don't know, but
Speaker 3: I think they as long as they know, that's more important,
Speaker 3: more important than doing whatever specific thing you're doing at
Speaker 3: that moment for me.
Speaker 2: How do you apply that rule when it feels like
Speaker 2: what they are working on this specific moment seems obviously
Speaker 2: to be the most important thing in the world. How
Speaker 2: do you.
Speaker 3: Well, Because there's only one advantage of getting older, You've
Speaker 3: had a lot of experience and you can imply a
Speaker 3: little bit of wisdom. It's really critical. Yeah, and by
Speaker 3: the way, there's a selfie aspect to it, because when
Speaker 3: you have a problem with someone you love or some
Speaker 3: problem you're you know, you got to deal with it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you can't even perform as well.
Speaker 3: Exactly right. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, You've every day for years had to make difficult
Speaker 2: and stressful decisions, high stakes, hugely impactful on so many people.
Speaker 2: When you're making decisions. Do you follow your head, your heart,
Speaker 2: your gut? How do you think about decision making?
Speaker 3: I don't know how to separate the three. Many times
Speaker 3: my heart brings me to the problem, and my gut
Speaker 3: tells me what I think I want to do, But
Speaker 3: my head, meaning the research the back, sometimes says that's
Speaker 3: the wrong answer. I think you're driven by a value set.
Speaker 3: You know what you value, you know what you think
Speaker 3: is important in life, you know what you think is consequential.
Speaker 3: And I think people who know what they value doesn't
Speaker 3: mean they're better work. But if you follow your value set.
Speaker 3: To me, they're kind of basic things. My dad used
Speaker 3: to have an expression for real, said Joey. Everyone's entitled
Speaker 3: to be treated with dignity. Everybody dignity. This word dignity
Speaker 3: and what I find myself looking through the prison. For example,
Speaker 3: I was at an event the other day where I
Speaker 3: was talking and we were talking about a problem a
Speaker 3: mom was having providing for the hell the needs of
Speaker 3: a child of actually a teenager. I said, all I
Speaker 3: can think of one hearing about not being able to
Speaker 3: afford the treatment was how she's deprived of her dignity.
Speaker 3: Imagine being a parent and you can't do anything about
Speaker 3: it because you don't have the financial wherewithal, because you
Speaker 3: don't have the connection, but you don't know where to go.
Speaker 3: It's a little bit like you know, I think the
Speaker 3: most dangerous, the most hated word in English language and
Speaker 3: any other language translated is cancer. You can't it's just
Speaker 3: strikes fear and everybody. Well, it's one thing to get
Speaker 3: an analysis by great doctor, but you still need someone
Speaker 3: to guide you through. Located and we're finding significant breakthroughs
Speaker 3: in cancer, but you need someone to sort of lead
Speaker 3: you through who knows about it. I think it's the
Speaker 3: same way with about any problem people have. If there's
Speaker 3: a way to let people know there's an avenue, there's
Speaker 3: a way through. You know. I used to have a
Speaker 3: friend named Bob Gold who who died of a heart attack.
Speaker 3: And I used to say, Bob, do you understand me?
Speaker 3: Said Joe, And I don't understand you. I overstand you,
Speaker 3: but you got to know how to know. And that's
Speaker 3: why we can be so little things it can be
Speaker 3: of enormous value. It's like, you know, you're walking across
Speaker 3: an intersection. They don't let me do that anymore, but
Speaker 3: you walk across the intersection and there's a you know,
Speaker 3: an elderly man or woman knowing they're waiting to see
Speaker 3: if they have enough time, just grabbing their hand and
Speaker 3: walking across. It's a little tiny thing, but it anxiety.
Speaker 3: It relieves.
Speaker 2: Yeah, No, that resonates the idea of the more we're
Speaker 2: a part of the solution, the less the problem feels overwhelming.
Speaker 3: I think so now I have to admit, when you've
Speaker 3: been through something that's been particularly difficult, helping someone going
Speaker 3: through it again forces you to relive your experience, like,
Speaker 3: for example, the people I admire when we have functions
Speaker 3: where we're trying to make a point of how we
Speaker 3: can help someone with health care, whatever it is. The
Speaker 3: people have been through it who show up and support it.
Speaker 3: I always compliment them because it's like it happened yesterday.
Speaker 3: When you start to focus on it, and it's hard,
Speaker 3: we underestimate what we can do. I'm not about time
Speaker 3: being president, I mean just what we can do in
Speaker 3: terms of dealing with people. I try to understand and
Speaker 3: what is motivating the other person when I'm doing things
Speaker 3: internationally or personally, because if you can understand what motivates them,
Speaker 3: there's a shot, even with the bad guys, you can
Speaker 3: break through and get something done. There's a way to
Speaker 3: expose the meanness without causing direct conflict. For example, I
Speaker 3: remember I went to a Catholic grade school and we
Speaker 3: didn't often get invited to the katillion, which was in
Speaker 3: the local school down the street at Mount Pleasant School,
Speaker 3: And so I got invited and I was going to go.
Speaker 3: I was all excited about going. I think it was
Speaker 3: ninth grade, maybe the eighth grade. A little dance and
Speaker 3: there was a guy who was a good athlete that
Speaker 3: was a relatively good athlete. He was a good athlete
Speaker 3: from the school. The other school, big guy became friends.
Speaker 3: But so I'm getting dressed and I didn't have a
Speaker 3: shirt to wear. So my mother got my uncle's shirt,
Speaker 3: who was a smaller man than my dad, and French
Speaker 3: cuffs and rolled up the cuffs so who looked like
Speaker 3: it fit? And I couldn't find my dad's. We couldn't
Speaker 3: find my dad's cuff links. So my mom went and
Speaker 3: got a nut in a bolt. I wondered why she
Speaker 3: was down downstairs in the laundry room looking for it and
Speaker 3: put him in. I said, Mom, I can't do this.
Speaker 3: They'll make fun of me. I'll be embarrassed seeing anybody
Speaker 3: comes up and says they do you look at them
Speaker 3: and say, and here's what to say. This guy, Frank
Speaker 3: came up to me and said, hey, look, adbye, look
Speaker 3: what he's got here.
Speaker 4: Hey?
Speaker 3: And I looked at him and said, you don't have
Speaker 3: a pair of these? And he said, well, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: I got a pair. But I'm serious.
Speaker 2: How do you assess people's motivations like you were just
Speaker 2: saying that when you can understand someone's motivation, you can
Speaker 2: almost disalm them without exposing them, which is what you
Speaker 2: just gave that example of now, how do we do
Speaker 2: that so that we go to the roots of it.
Speaker 2: I think often we get it's so caught up in
Speaker 2: what someone's what we think someone's thinking, or what we
Speaker 2: think someone's saying, but actually going to the heart of
Speaker 2: it and the root of it.
Speaker 3: You know, it's hard to explain. I get credit for
Speaker 3: these days for sort of whole in the international community together,
Speaker 3: and I try to understand what the circumstance the other
Speaker 3: world leader is facing and see if there's a way
Speaker 3: what needs to be done. Is the way through that
Speaker 3: he doesn't or she doesn't have to make a great
Speaker 3: sacrifice to do what she's doing, but help make the
Speaker 3: case why they're helping others. But there's ways to do that,
Speaker 3: and it's doesn't require the person if they have a
Speaker 3: fundamental difference with you on a subject. But if they're
Speaker 3: doing something because they don't have the political bandwidth to
Speaker 3: be able to do it at home, you can provide it.
Speaker 3: I will say to this leader sometimes, well why don't
Speaker 3: you let me criticize you for this or thank you
Speaker 3: for that, or And most of the time, now you
Speaker 3: don't do off the top of your head. You got
Speaker 3: to know some of these people. They'll go, okay, or
Speaker 3: why don't you why why don't you criticize me? Why
Speaker 3: don't you criticize me for my not doing something? And
Speaker 3: then I'll respond and say okay, and then you can
Speaker 3: do what you want to do. It's just basic human nature.
Speaker 3: But I think I think trying to figure out what
Speaker 3: leeway a person has. I don't expect everybody to that
Speaker 3: I'm dealing with to appear in the second editions the
Speaker 3: profiles and courage nor may. I mean, it's hard, but
Speaker 3: there's ways you can work. Not always, but you can
Speaker 3: work through things where you can allow the other person
Speaker 3: to save face and still get to where you want
Speaker 3: to go. Yes, and sometimes it works with your working
Speaker 3: with two people, yes, to get that done. Yeah. But
Speaker 3: it's just trying to figure out what is really what
Speaker 3: impediments are in their way to keep them from being
Speaker 3: able to do what you know, you feel in your gut,
Speaker 3: you know they know they should do.
Speaker 2: That's a great perspective. I'm so happy you said that,
Speaker 2: because so many of us are fixated on what we
Speaker 2: want out of something, or where we want to get to,
Speaker 2: or what our challenges are. But mister President, I'm so
Speaker 2: grateful for your graciousness and kindness in giving me this
Speaker 2: time today. We end every on purpose interview with a
Speaker 2: final five Oh and these final five questions are questions
Speaker 2: we ask every guest, and there are some great ones
Speaker 2: in here for you. So the first question I'm going
Speaker 2: to ask you is what is the best advice you've
Speaker 2: ever received? And what's the worst advice you've ever received.
Speaker 3: I guess the best advice I've received is show up,
Speaker 3: Just show up there and get up. My mother used
Speaker 3: to say, Joey, get up, never bow, never been, never
Speaker 3: get up, just get up. But showing up is just
Speaker 3: that's a big part. And I guess the worst advice
Speaker 3: I've ever received was holding a grudge, because lots of
Speaker 3: times when people do something that is really not good,
Speaker 3: it's because they were fearful and they did it, not
Speaker 3: fearful of you, but their circumstance, and it gets you nowhere,
Speaker 3: which means people doubt. Well, I'm really irish. The joke
Speaker 3: inside was really irish, But all getting aside, remembering is important,
Speaker 3: but holding a grudge is it's not helpful, very true,
Speaker 3: very true. Fast.
Speaker 2: I'm for both of those answers.
Speaker 3: I love it. Okay.
Speaker 2: Second question, a lot of Americans today are seeking therapy
Speaker 2: as a form of support. Where does the president seek
Speaker 2: support and guidance in your own challenges?
Speaker 3: And Jenny, Well, my best friend is my wife, a
Speaker 3: woman who has probably had more to do with my
Speaker 3: success than anyone. Is my sister Valerie and my brother Jim,
Speaker 3: And I think that's the place where I go most.
Speaker 3: But also I have a great advantage over the years,
Speaker 3: I've grown to have some great, great relationships with people
Speaker 3: have worked with and or run of my staff. And
Speaker 3: I think most of my staff would tell you the
Speaker 3: senior staff is I don't treat them like they work
Speaker 3: for me. I treat them which they are. They know
Speaker 3: reason I hire them. I want them to know more
Speaker 3: than I know. And there are some things that I
Speaker 3: seek advice from a religious perspective, but that's really personal.
Speaker 2: Yeah, beautiful, Okay, bad question. I believe it's been said
Speaker 2: that you told your first wife when you met her
Speaker 2: that you wanted to be or one day you would
Speaker 2: be the president of the United States. Is that true?
Speaker 3: No, it's not true. I love it. I read all
Speaker 3: this what I did tell her, and I and the
Speaker 3: same with no man deserves one great love, let alone
Speaker 3: too for real. The two women that I married one
Speaker 3: passed away were women I knew when I went out
Speaker 3: with them the first time. I wanted to marry them.
Speaker 3: My first wife, I told her when I met her.
Speaker 3: We went to I went to I had eighty nine
Speaker 3: dollars tax returned. I'm want five guys down to Florida,
Speaker 3: and I don't drink. So I was bored with all this,
Speaker 3: so I went to with three. I went to Nassau
Speaker 3: for you could apply for twenty five bucks round trip.
Speaker 3: And I met my deceased wife and I told her
Speaker 3: when I hung out with her for four days down
Speaker 3: there on the beach, and that I was going to
Speaker 3: marry her, and she looked at me, said I think so.
Speaker 3: And I started commuting every day every weekend when I
Speaker 3: was a senior in college. That's how I up to Syracuse.
Speaker 3: She's in there and my present wife was. It was
Speaker 3: a blind date that my brother set up for us,
Speaker 3: and I know what I saw her. I was on
Speaker 3: that TEMOCLLS bachelor's list for five years. And it's not
Speaker 3: a fun thing because there are a lot of it.
Speaker 3: Don't get me wrong. A lot of nice people, but
Speaker 3: I've kind of given up on They're thinking I could
Speaker 3: have us, and I got the blind date. I'll never fear.
Speaker 3: My brother said, you'll like her. She doesn't like politics.
Speaker 2: I'm glad I asked that question. Question number four. This
Speaker 2: is very important to social media. So the question is
Speaker 2: there are so many shows today based on the presidency,
Speaker 2: the White House mirroring it shows on TV eaming platforms.
Speaker 2: Which one is the most accurate and which one is
Speaker 2: the least accurate?
Speaker 3: Mission impossible, the most the most look. I uh. One
Speaker 3: of the problems I have is I don't and I should.
Speaker 3: I don't watch much television. No, it's not because I'm
Speaker 3: above it or anything like that. It's just that, For example,
Speaker 3: for thirty six years after the accident occurred, and I
Speaker 3: commuted every day three hundred miles a day, and the
Speaker 3: press actually I had won. I got to know all
Speaker 3: the conductors so well. I became friends. And one day
Speaker 3: as Vice president, I was going home on the train,
Speaker 3: which the secret surf doesn't like because there's so many
Speaker 3: opportunities to interrupt the train. And this particular guy, I'm
Speaker 3: not going to embarrass him and say his name. Company
Speaker 3: grab me and cheek is Joey baby. I thought they're
Speaker 3: going to shoot him any I said, no, no, he's He said,
Speaker 3: I just read in the paper you traveled a million,
Speaker 3: one hundred thousand miles on air Force planes. Because I
Speaker 3: have a list how many miles a travel on And
Speaker 3: he said, big deal, he said, Joey, we had a
Speaker 3: retirement dinner. He said, you know what you figured out?
Speaker 3: You know how many miles you travel on Amtrak? I
Speaker 3: said no. He said a million, two hundred thousand miles,
Speaker 3: one hundred and nineteen days a year, three hundred days,
Speaker 3: three hundred miles round trip, thirty six years plus. My
Speaker 3: point was I was on the training lot, and so
Speaker 3: when I get home, there wasn't much to watch. I
Speaker 3: mean not it was the watch. But I'd always make sure,
Speaker 3: I think, and I think you know all your guests
Speaker 3: know this, that children need to know that they're the
Speaker 3: most important thing in your life. So even if I
Speaker 3: got home late, I'd climb in bed or my two
Speaker 3: boys at the time, and just even if they were asleep,
Speaker 3: and get up in the morning. And it wasn't like
Speaker 3: Ouzzie and Harriet. I wasn't fixing their breakfast but I'd
Speaker 3: be there and have breakfast them, they'd take off for school.
Speaker 3: I'd take off for the train. So I've been back
Speaker 3: and forth so much. I haven't I just haven't watched
Speaker 3: many problem And by the way, there's a lot of
Speaker 3: good stuff, I'm sure. I mean, everyone's wanted to turn on.
Speaker 3: And by the way, they got a great advantage here.
Speaker 3: You got a movie theater and so yeah, and they
Speaker 3: tell me, I get this list what movies are in
Speaker 3: and we have the uh, the the new one, that's
Speaker 3: the the Oppenheimer Oppenheimer.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I haven't seen it yet. They're the movies I
Speaker 4: see these days. I get to see them at night
Speaker 4: once in a while. Okay, very nice, amazing, all right.
Speaker 4: Fifth and final question. We asked this question to every
Speaker 4: guest has ever been on the show, but it truly
Speaker 4: is unique asking you this question.
Speaker 2: If you could create one law in the world that
Speaker 2: everyone had to follow, what would it be.
Speaker 3: I don't think it's a matter of being able to
Speaker 3: have any one law that could change people's attitudes. I
Speaker 3: think I'm optimistic. I think we have we're on the cusp.
Speaker 3: We're in the time of real change, and we're an
Speaker 3: inflection point. In moral history. Whether I'm president or not,
Speaker 3: things are going to change drastically, and you see it
Speaker 3: happening all around the world. We have an enormous opportunity.
Speaker 3: But the thing I want to I could want to
Speaker 3: change is American attitude that we can do anything. We
Speaker 3: can do anything. There's nothing we've ever set our mind
Speaker 3: that we've not been able to do. We've done together
Speaker 3: for real. And so I laid out four things that
Speaker 3: I thought were critically important in my stateud you know.
Speaker 3: One was to make a fundamental change in cancer treatment.
Speaker 3: We can cure that, and that's why we put another
Speaker 3: six billion dollars. I mean, pick the impossible thing I have.
Speaker 3: Caroline Kennedy gave me a copy of President Kennedy's. Part
Speaker 3: of President Kennedy's speech when about going in the morning,
Speaker 3: he said, because we refuse to postpone, we have to
Speaker 3: refuse to postpone anymore. There's so oh much we can do,
Speaker 3: and I mean it. I believe it with every fiber
Speaker 3: in my baby. I've been doing this a long time
Speaker 3: and I've never been more optimistic about our chances than now.
Speaker 3: And that's why when I ran, I said, I ran
Speaker 3: for three reasons one to restore the soul of America,
Speaker 3: sense of decency, just the way we talk to one another. Secondly,
Speaker 3: to build this country from the middle out and the
Speaker 3: bottom up. The wealthy still do very well, but everybody
Speaker 3: has a shot. And thirdly, to unite the country. And
Speaker 3: I think we can do it. I really genuinely do.
Speaker 3: But then again, as my offer referred to, I'm a
Speaker 3: cock eyed optimist, but I really believe it.
Speaker 2: Mister President, Thank you so much for the autum. I'm
Speaker 2: so grateful. I have two tiny requests for you. I'd
Speaker 2: love for you, if you don't mind, to walk me
Speaker 2: through what's here, because I saw these beautiful pictures when
Speaker 2: I walked in, and I thought they looked really special,
Speaker 2: and I'd love to shad them this one.
Speaker 3: My dad was a real gentleman and a well read man.
Speaker 3: Never got a has to go to college. And he'd
Speaker 3: always said, Joey, never explained, never complained. And so we
Speaker 3: were having my fourth reelection effort as a senator in
Speaker 3: the late nineties, and my dad was over at our
Speaker 3: house to you know, to be there with me, and
Speaker 3: I was standing on this back porch overlooking this pond.
Speaker 3: I built a smaller home when the home we had
Speaker 3: when everybody moved out. But it sits on a pond,
Speaker 3: a ten acre pond. And I was saying, my deceased wife,
Speaker 3: she lived in Lake Skinny Atlas and the finger legs beautiful.
Speaker 3: She I said, you know, I wish nearly could have
Speaker 3: seen this. And my dad thought, I was man, feel
Speaker 3: sorry for myself. So he came. He said I'll be back,
Speaker 3: and he took off, and he went up to the
Speaker 3: local Hallmark store and came back with this cartoon. This
Speaker 3: is his philosophy life. It's Hagar the horrible lightning strikes,
Speaker 3: his boat's going down. He's looking up to God and
Speaker 3: having to say why me. The next frame of voice
Speaker 3: mevericans by why not? My dad always say, what makes
Speaker 3: you so special? You don't have these problems. I'll put
Speaker 3: it down here. The other ones, there's a bunch there,
Speaker 3: but one of my well, one of my favorite ones
Speaker 3: is of that one. My son BeO. This is when
Speaker 3: he came home from being a rack for a year
Speaker 3: with his unit, and uh, this is his son. Little
Speaker 3: Hunter got on his shoulders and wouldn't get off his shoulders,
Speaker 3: just would not, I mean for hours, was on his shoulders.
Speaker 3: The others are my mom and dad. My that's my daughter,
Speaker 3: the love of my life, the life of my love. Anyway,
Speaker 3: there's a lot up there. I'm Beautiful'm pally born the
Speaker 3: hell out of you.
Speaker 2: It was wonderful to see them when I came in,
Speaker 2: so thank you.
Speaker 3: Well, like I said, my dad really was one of
Speaker 3: these guys, and it was about and so was my
Speaker 3: mother's side of family. That family. My dad would say,
Speaker 3: it's the beginning in the middle of the end. I
Speaker 3: believe it is. I mean, I know what you're trying
Speaker 3: to do is all those folks out there that are lonely,
Speaker 3: all those folks out there that are feeling uneasy, all
Speaker 3: those folks out there that aren't sure. I don't know.
Speaker 3: I just just sometimes just reaching out it makes a difference.
Speaker 2: Thank you, mister president.
Speaker 3: Thank you, thank you so much. You're doing good work
Speaker 3: for people. I really mean it. Thank you, thank you.
Speaker 2: That means the world coming from you, and I look
Speaker 2: forward to many more conversations.
Speaker 3: Thank you.
Speaker 2: Thank you to