WEBVTT - Deadly Agents

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<v Speaker 1>H four days before his execution, Changsung Tex sat inside

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<v Speaker 1>the Mansuda Assembly Hall behind a wood paneled desk, flanked

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<v Speaker 1>by hundreds of his fellow politicians and bureaucrats. Seated before

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<v Speaker 1>him behind an ornately carved ais was his nephew and

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<v Speaker 1>judge Kim Chang n Aschangue fidgeted in his chair, the

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<v Speaker 1>Polite euro issued its judgment to pretended to uphold the

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<v Speaker 1>party and leader was engrossed in such factional antists, dreaming

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<v Speaker 1>different dreams and involving himself in double dealing. Behind the scene,

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<v Speaker 1>Tongue looked sullen. Two soldiers approached him, grabbed him up

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<v Speaker 1>by the elbows, and escorted him out of the room.

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<v Speaker 1>The sixty seven year old official looked hunched and frail,

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<v Speaker 1>as if on the verge of collapse. Within days he

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<v Speaker 1>would be dead. The so called dreams and double dealings

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<v Speaker 1>Uncle Tongue committed were never specified. All we know is

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<v Speaker 1>that Kim jong nun considered him a threat, and some

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<v Speaker 1>believe Kim jong nam factored into his death sentence. Chang

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<v Speaker 1>Song Tech clearly had a favorite nephew. He and Kim

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<v Speaker 1>jong nam spoke on the phone regularly and shared common

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<v Speaker 1>goals for the country. Chang reportedly wired money to his

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<v Speaker 1>nephew and Macao. Some murmured that Change was hoping to

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<v Speaker 1>install Kim jong Nam as the next leader. Others suggested

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<v Speaker 1>that China was providing security for Kim jong Nam as

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<v Speaker 1>a favorite to Uncle Change as a thank you for

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<v Speaker 1>his Chinese friendly policies. Few know what conversations were had

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<v Speaker 1>in Beijing, but rumors have swirled China was taking a

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<v Speaker 1>close look at Kim jong Nam just in case the

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<v Speaker 1>incumbent leader needed to be well replaced. Kim Jong Nam

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<v Speaker 1>was an obvious choice for that, because you know, he's

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<v Speaker 1>known to be quite friendly to China. He was somebody

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<v Speaker 1>I think that China felt could be counted on and

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<v Speaker 1>was beholden to them, And that is why I think

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<v Speaker 1>he was living in Macau as well, a Chinese terror ary,

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<v Speaker 1>a place where he could come and go easily, but

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<v Speaker 1>under the protection of China. Even if China provided Kim

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<v Speaker 1>jong Nam with security, it didn't provide much support financially,

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<v Speaker 1>because shortly after Uncle Tang was dispatched from this planet

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<v Speaker 1>with anti aircraft guns. No less, Kim Jong Nam's lavish

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<v Speaker 1>lifestyle began to flounder. The man who was accustomed to

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<v Speaker 1>staying at five star hotels and oceanside villas was now

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<v Speaker 1>desperately reserving airbnbs. Another former school friend of Kim Jong

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<v Speaker 1>Nam told me that Kim jong Nam seem to have

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<v Speaker 1>been kind of cut off from the regime finances once

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<v Speaker 1>Kim Jong Nun took over. For reasons that aren't clear,

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<v Speaker 1>the revenue stream Kim jong Nam had secured running his

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<v Speaker 1>gambling sites may have dried up. He was clearly working

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<v Speaker 1>for a living, working for himself, and making money for himself.

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<v Speaker 1>In the final years of his life. With Uncle Chang dead,

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<v Speaker 1>Kim jong Nam became increasingly desperate for cash, and just

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<v Speaker 1>days before his assassination in February, he took one of

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<v Speaker 1>the biggest risks of his life, apparently in a bid

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<v Speaker 1>to make much needed money. He flew to Malaysia, away

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<v Speaker 1>from the protection of his Chinese minders, and visited Langkawi,

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<v Speaker 1>an archipelago known for its serene, palm dazzled islands, white

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<v Speaker 1>sandy beaches, and turquoise waters. During his stay at a

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<v Speaker 1>Western hotel hell on Langkawee, security footage would catch Kim

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<v Speaker 1>jong Nam backpack and tow meeting a suspicious stranger. So

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<v Speaker 1>some of the last footage of Kim jong Nam showed

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<v Speaker 1>him in a hotel elevator with a man of Asian ethnicity.

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<v Speaker 1>The man's identity is a mystery, but according to South

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<v Speaker 1>Korea's intelligence agency, the man was not some childhood friend

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<v Speaker 1>from Switzerland, nor a friendly comrade from back home, nor

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<v Speaker 1>even one of Kim jong Nam's gambling clients. He was

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<v Speaker 1>American and he worked for the c I A I'm

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<v Speaker 1>even lee. In this episode, we delve into the twisted

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<v Speaker 1>relationship between Kim jong Nam, the United States and North Korea,

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<v Speaker 1>and a big question was Kim jong Nam an American asset?

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<v Speaker 1>And it's so did the US government know what could

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<v Speaker 1>happen to him? The regime has every interest to keep

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<v Speaker 1>tabs on his brother. North Korea has chemical weapons capability,

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<v Speaker 1>but the willingness to use UH is there. Kim jong

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<v Speaker 1>Nam had been acting as an informant to the CIA,

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<v Speaker 1>giving them information what he knew about Kim Jong Lan

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<v Speaker 1>and the regime. This is big brother in North Korea.

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<v Speaker 1>There may be no worse crime than working with or

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<v Speaker 1>being sympathetic to the Americans. And that's because the United

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<v Speaker 1>States in North Korea's eyes is public Enemy No. One.

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<v Speaker 1>The DPRK's behavior, it's obsession with weapons of mass destruction,

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<v Speaker 1>it's devotion to military first policy, even the way it

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<v Speaker 1>killed Kim Jong Nam, all tied into the country's tense

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<v Speaker 1>relationship with the US. But to understand why, we have

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<v Speaker 1>to go back to June the outbreak of the Korean War.

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<v Speaker 1>I would say, with just the slightest exaggeration, that the

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<v Speaker 1>Korean War launched modern international history. As Dr Lee explains,

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<v Speaker 1>the Korean War transformed the United Nations from a paper

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<v Speaker 1>organization into a global force. It's why American troops are

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<v Speaker 1>stationed at basis in more than seventy foreign countries, and

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<v Speaker 1>it deepened the tensions that would come to define the

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<v Speaker 1>Cold War. The Korean War was deeply consequential, and yet

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<v Speaker 1>the conflict would be largely hidden from the American public.

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<v Speaker 1>The Korean War has long been dubbed in the United

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<v Speaker 1>States It's as the Forgotten War. But for the five

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<v Speaker 1>hundred thousand Korean War veterans still alive today from the

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<v Speaker 1>various countries that fought in it, very little has been forgotten,

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<v Speaker 1>especially in Korea. The war touched upon the lives of

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<v Speaker 1>the vast majority of the people in both South Korea

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<v Speaker 1>and North Korea in a tragic negative way. Virtually every

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<v Speaker 1>Korean had a family member or relative who was maimed

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<v Speaker 1>or killed or lost. Over fifteen percent of North Korean

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<v Speaker 1>civilians were sacrificed, ten million people probably displaced from home,

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<v Speaker 1>hundreds of thousands of orphans. So the death toll and

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<v Speaker 1>the suffering, and it's one relevant factor metric, of course,

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<v Speaker 1>But of course that doesn't tell the entire story. That

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<v Speaker 1>entire story really it's with the indiscriminate splitting of the

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<v Speaker 1>Korean peninsula at the thirty eighth parallel, the line dividing

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<v Speaker 1>North and South. So late night on August tenth, the

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<v Speaker 1>United States came up with a plan for temporarily dividing

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<v Speaker 1>Korea at the halfway the midway point at the thirty

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<v Speaker 1>eighth parallel, to block further advancement of the Soviet troops.

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<v Speaker 1>So this was a proposal submitted by the United States

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<v Speaker 1>to stalin North and South Korea. In other words, were

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<v Speaker 1>inventions of other nations. No Koreans had a seat at

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<v Speaker 1>the table when their homeland was divided. The haphazard manner

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<v Speaker 1>in which the partitioning of the Korean Peninsula came to

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<v Speaker 1>take place is a source of ire for the people

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<v Speaker 1>of Korea, but the initially the intention was to say

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<v Speaker 1>at least half a loaf half of the Korean peninsula,

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<v Speaker 1>to put South Korea under the U s fere influence.

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<v Speaker 1>The line, however, was not something Koreans on either side

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<v Speaker 1>recognized culturally or politically, so the United States and Soviet

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<v Speaker 1>Union made a promise the division would be temporary. In

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<v Speaker 1>the United Nations tried to erase the dividing line and

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<v Speaker 1>unite the peninsula under one government with an election, but

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<v Speaker 1>when it came time to vote, the Soviet Union refused

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<v Speaker 1>to let the UN Commission cross into North Korea. Locked

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<v Speaker 1>out of the North, the UN decided to hold assembly

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<v Speaker 1>elections anyway, but only in the South, and with that

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<v Speaker 1>the government of South Korea was officially established and any

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<v Speaker 1>chance of uniting the peninsula peacefully vanished. And then two

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<v Speaker 1>years later, in June fifty, the Korean War began. Under

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<v Speaker 1>the strangest of circumstances, Koreans invaded Korea with the goal

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<v Speaker 1>of unifying Korea. There's no doubt who started it, Kimils

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<v Speaker 1>Hung and the communist North, but American officials refused to

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<v Speaker 1>believe the North Korean leader was actually responsible. When news

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<v Speaker 1>of the North Korean invasion of South Korea broke, President

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<v Speaker 1>Truman himself almost immediately decided to take action due to

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<v Speaker 1>a misreading of the situation. Do you too seeing North

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<v Speaker 1>Korea's invasion of the South as Stalin and Mao's ploy

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<v Speaker 1>viewing the North Korean leader Kim Is Sung as a

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<v Speaker 1>mere puppet to Stalin and Mao. In fact, the high

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<v Speaker 1>ranking State Department official said that the relationship between Stalin

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<v Speaker 1>and Kimmi Sung is exactly the same as that between

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<v Speaker 1>Won't Disney and Donald Duck. Kimi Song is not his

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<v Speaker 1>own man, and Stalin is pulling the strings. In an

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<v Speaker 1>effort to beat back the attack, the United Nations pour

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<v Speaker 1>troops into the peninsula, both what out of misreading the situation.

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<v Speaker 1>Within weeks, North Korea had nearly taken over the entire

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<v Speaker 1>South Korean peninsula, But with the backing of the U

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<v Speaker 1>n the South Korean military would soon receive international support.

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<v Speaker 1>Sixteen countries, including Turkey and Ethiopia, deployed military troops. Thirty

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<v Speaker 1>nine other countries gave financial and material support, but it

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<v Speaker 1>was the United States that provided the bulk of foreign

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<v Speaker 1>manpower and weaponry. The U n Forces, led by General

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<v Speaker 1>Douglas MacArthur, slowly began to beat back the Northern invasion.

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<v Speaker 1>Only five is removed from World War Two. American officials

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<v Speaker 1>chose a playbook that had successfully repelled Imperial japan air power.

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<v Speaker 1>The air force weaken the North Korean advance by targeting

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<v Speaker 1>the military's rear, disabling the chain of troops in charge

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<v Speaker 1>of supplying the front with AMMO, gasoline, and food. They

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<v Speaker 1>also heavily targeted North Korean cities. This strategy, while effective,

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<v Speaker 1>would lead to the most destructive bombing campaign in military history.

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<v Speaker 1>As the U. S Secretary of Defense, Robert Lovett explained,

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<v Speaker 1>we keep on tearing the place apart, we can make

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<v Speaker 1>a most unpopular fair for the North Koreans. We ought

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<v Speaker 1>to go right ahead. The extent of the bombing was unimaginable.

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<v Speaker 1>North Korea was flattened. More than five percent of the

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<v Speaker 1>country's buildings were destroyed. Some cities, like sina Ju, were

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<v Speaker 1>transformed into rubble. American pilots also targeted irrigation dans that

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<v Speaker 1>have provided water for three quarters of the country's crops,

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<v Speaker 1>flood waters destroyed squads of farmland. Suffering ensued. With their

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<v Speaker 1>cities gone, millions of North Koreans resorted to living underground,

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<v Speaker 1>and the hell fire continued. With a new lethal innovation

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<v Speaker 1>that had been tested in World War Two, but now

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<v Speaker 1>in the Korean War, made its real debut, napalm. This

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<v Speaker 1>is what an a pound bomb does. When it hits,

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<v Speaker 1>it's searing flames spreads four hundreds of feet. The infantrymen

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<v Speaker 1>then take over and advance at the crucial rate, despite

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<v Speaker 1>the pounding of red buckers. It is a harrowing foot

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<v Speaker 1>by foot operation. Deep in their trenches. There are still

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<v Speaker 1>plenty of the enemy and after to pour fire into

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<v Speaker 1>the attackers, but the flamethrower silence system at a smoke

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<v Speaker 1>screen masks the attack. Grim is the word for Korea.

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<v Speaker 1>Napalm charred the countryside and the people in it. From

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<v Speaker 1>June to October, the US would drop more than eight

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<v Speaker 1>hundred sixty six thousand gallons of napalm on North Korea.

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<v Speaker 1>By the war's end, more napalm was dropped on the

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<v Speaker 1>DPRK than any other nation in history. Vietnam included to

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<v Speaker 1>be clear, we're not trying to stoke sympathy for the

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<v Speaker 1>North Korean regime, nor to excuse the terrible atrocities that

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<v Speaker 1>has committed both during a war it started and in

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<v Speaker 1>the decades since. But the widespread bombing of North Korea

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<v Speaker 1>is vital to understanding the country's attitude toward the United States,

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<v Speaker 1>because while the Korean War might be forgotten in the US,

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<v Speaker 1>in the DPRK, the air bombardment is taught in every

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<v Speaker 1>school today. Most of North Korea as anti American propaganda

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<v Speaker 1>is built on easily disproved lies. But the difficult truth

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<v Speaker 1>is that the foundation the spark for much of this

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<v Speaker 1>anti americanism, according to journalist Blaine Harden, is quote rooted

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<v Speaker 1>in a fact based narrative, one that North Korea obsessively remembers.

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<v Speaker 1>That lingering resentment is just one of many unintended consequences.

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<v Speaker 1>Another is North Korea's obsession with weapons of mass destruction.

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<v Speaker 1>Because in late n the U N Forces did more

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<v Speaker 1>than just repel North Korean attacks. They cross the thirty

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<v Speaker 1>eighth parallel with the goal of unifying Korea for the South.

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<v Speaker 1>But on the other side, a goliath was waiting. China

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<v Speaker 1>kept issuing threats. If you enter North Korean territory. If

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<v Speaker 1>you approach our border, we will fight you. We will

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<v Speaker 1>send true and MacArthur dismissed those Chinese threats as just

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<v Speaker 1>empty threats. But MacArthur was wrong. China did step in

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<v Speaker 1>not wanting Western soldiers anywhere near its border. China would

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<v Speaker 1>send more than three million people to North Korea's aid.

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<v Speaker 1>General Douglas MacArthur, who believed he could win the war

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<v Speaker 1>with quote one hand tied behind his back, argued that

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<v Speaker 1>the best way to cut off the Chinese advance was

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<v Speaker 1>to drop nuclear weapons in Korea. I visualize a cul

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<v Speaker 1>de sac. I see here a unique use for the

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<v Speaker 1>atomic bomb to strike a blocking blow at the Pentagon.

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<v Speaker 1>The Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff rejected MacArthur's proposal,

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<v Speaker 1>but MacArthur pushed and pushed and pushed again. He'd request

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<v Speaker 1>a total of twenty six atomic bombs, and although those

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<v Speaker 1>requests were denied, he would remain a shameless advocate for

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<v Speaker 1>nuclear attack. I would have dropped between thirty and fifty

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<v Speaker 1>atomic bombs strung across the neck of Manchuria. The bomb

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<v Speaker 1>wasn't MacArthur's only go to. He also suggested releasing chemical weapons.

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<v Speaker 1>Arguing that the military should spread radioactive waste across the border,

0:17:21.200 --> 0:17:24.359
<v Speaker 1>creating a chemical fence that would keep Communist ground troops

0:17:24.480 --> 0:17:29.560
<v Speaker 1>barricaded up North. Instead, President Harry Truman would fire him

0:17:29.600 --> 0:17:35.159
<v Speaker 1>for in subordination, but MacArthur's replacement, General Matthew Ridgeway, was

0:17:35.359 --> 0:17:39.720
<v Speaker 1>also a fan of nuclear weapons. He would request thirty

0:17:39.880 --> 0:17:45.480
<v Speaker 1>eight atomic bombs. The Pentagon did not approve. It did, however,

0:17:45.960 --> 0:17:49.399
<v Speaker 1>later approve of request from the Joint chiefs of Staff, who,

0:17:49.440 --> 0:17:54.080
<v Speaker 1>according to Korean war scholar Bruce Cummings, ordered quote atomic

0:17:54.160 --> 0:17:58.720
<v Speaker 1>retaliation against Manchurion bases if large numbers of new troops

0:17:58.760 --> 0:18:04.160
<v Speaker 1>came into fighting. By ninette, the possibility of a nuclear

0:18:04.200 --> 0:18:08.080
<v Speaker 1>attack on North Korea seemed so inevitable that Air Force

0:18:08.119 --> 0:18:12.600
<v Speaker 1>pilots started flying practice runs dropping dummy bombs on would

0:18:12.640 --> 0:18:16.119
<v Speaker 1>be targets. By the time the armistice was signed in

0:18:16.240 --> 0:18:20.960
<v Speaker 1>nineteen fifty three, with both sides effectively agreeing to a stalemate,

0:18:21.680 --> 0:18:25.200
<v Speaker 1>North Korean civilians and leaders were paranoid about the threat

0:18:25.200 --> 0:18:31.320
<v Speaker 1>of nuclear annihilation, and that paranoia would only grow. By

0:18:31.400 --> 0:18:35.840
<v Speaker 1>nineteen sixty seven, the United States was storing approximately nine

0:18:35.960 --> 0:18:40.919
<v Speaker 1>hundred fifty nuclear warheads in South Korea. The United States

0:18:40.920 --> 0:18:44.960
<v Speaker 1>removed the last of these weapons from the peninsula, but

0:18:45.680 --> 0:18:50.320
<v Speaker 1>to this day, submarines and stations nearby provide a so

0:18:50.440 --> 0:18:56.720
<v Speaker 1>called nuclear umbrella, and that fact has fueled North Korea's

0:18:56.760 --> 0:19:00.359
<v Speaker 1>decision making. It isn't irrational for North kore you to

0:19:00.560 --> 0:19:04.600
<v Speaker 1>think it might need um greater security. That again is

0:19:04.720 --> 0:19:08.960
<v Speaker 1>Jenny Town of the Simpsons Center. The nuclear attack is possible,

0:19:09.080 --> 0:19:12.320
<v Speaker 1>they don't rule it out. It's you know, during the

0:19:12.359 --> 0:19:16.520
<v Speaker 1>Korean War, UM, the US did threaten to use nuclear weapons,

0:19:17.160 --> 0:19:20.600
<v Speaker 1>and there have been in the past US nuclear weapons,

0:19:20.640 --> 0:19:23.679
<v Speaker 1>you know, stationed in South Korea, and there is the

0:19:23.760 --> 0:19:27.119
<v Speaker 1>US nuclear umbrella, right, So there are reasons. It's a

0:19:27.160 --> 0:19:33.680
<v Speaker 1>small country in the middle of economic and political giants, um,

0:19:33.760 --> 0:19:38.119
<v Speaker 1>and it's a country that doesn't necessarily have any real allies,

0:19:38.760 --> 0:19:42.000
<v Speaker 1>you know, it has a relationship with the Chinese, relationship

0:19:42.000 --> 0:19:45.800
<v Speaker 1>with the Russians. Doesn't really trust that, you know, in

0:19:45.880 --> 0:19:48.960
<v Speaker 1>the case of something happening, not really. And you're looking

0:19:49.000 --> 0:19:53.359
<v Speaker 1>at a nuclear dense region as well, right, China has

0:19:53.480 --> 0:19:57.439
<v Speaker 1>nuclear weapons, Russia has nuclear weapons, US has nuclear weapons,

0:19:57.480 --> 0:20:00.680
<v Speaker 1>and South Korea and Japan have nuclear weapons by default,

0:20:00.800 --> 0:20:05.520
<v Speaker 1>So there is a sense of insecurity that drives a

0:20:05.560 --> 0:20:08.600
<v Speaker 1>lot of their decisions. The North Koreans look at the

0:20:08.760 --> 0:20:12.240
<v Speaker 1>history um and especially you know from the Korean War

0:20:12.400 --> 0:20:17.320
<v Speaker 1>on and say that it's possible, no matter where you

0:20:17.440 --> 0:20:21.520
<v Speaker 1>go in Korea, North or South, you cannot escape the

0:20:21.600 --> 0:20:26.240
<v Speaker 1>dynamics created by the Korean War and the antagonistic relationship

0:20:26.359 --> 0:20:30.359
<v Speaker 1>that followed. It's one of the reasons North Korea is

0:20:30.520 --> 0:20:35.360
<v Speaker 1>constantly rattling its saber, trying to look tough. It's one

0:20:35.400 --> 0:20:39.800
<v Speaker 1>of the reasons Kimill's hung embraced che later investing obscene

0:20:39.840 --> 0:20:42.600
<v Speaker 1>portions of his country's GDP to build up one of

0:20:42.640 --> 0:20:46.840
<v Speaker 1>the world's largest militaries. And it's why North Korea has

0:20:46.880 --> 0:20:51.040
<v Speaker 1>worked so hard to develop its own deterrent, a deterrent

0:20:51.119 --> 0:20:56.320
<v Speaker 1>that Kim jong nam was well aware of because remember

0:20:56.440 --> 0:21:01.480
<v Speaker 1>his rendezvous in Langkawee, Malaysia. A few days after that

0:21:01.600 --> 0:21:05.280
<v Speaker 1>hotel meeting with an American spy, Kim Jong Nam would

0:21:05.280 --> 0:21:07.919
<v Speaker 1>try to leave the country with multiple vials of an

0:21:07.920 --> 0:21:12.200
<v Speaker 1>antidote designed to combat the toxic nerve agent v X.

0:21:13.600 --> 0:21:18.760
<v Speaker 1>Kim Jong Nam knew something, and that's this. When Western

0:21:18.840 --> 0:21:23.600
<v Speaker 1>Powers began installing nuclear weapons in South Korea, the DPRK,

0:21:24.320 --> 0:21:27.800
<v Speaker 1>then two Poor to counteract the arsenal with atomic bombs

0:21:27.800 --> 0:21:32.000
<v Speaker 1>of its own, came up with a strategy one they

0:21:32.040 --> 0:21:37.080
<v Speaker 1>believed that could neuter the US is atomic power. North

0:21:37.160 --> 0:21:41.159
<v Speaker 1>Korea would build a stockpile of chemical weapons so large

0:21:41.720 --> 0:21:44.240
<v Speaker 1>it could end all human life as we know it,

0:21:45.440 --> 0:22:02.080
<v Speaker 1>and North Korea wouldn't be afraid to use it. In

0:22:02.119 --> 0:22:06.560
<v Speaker 1>the nineteen fifties, as blood and bombs spilled over the

0:22:06.640 --> 0:22:10.919
<v Speaker 1>Korean Peninsula, chemists in the United Kingdom were waging a

0:22:11.200 --> 0:22:17.520
<v Speaker 1>very different kind of battle against insects. The pesticide industry

0:22:18.040 --> 0:22:22.440
<v Speaker 1>was booming and Dr Ron J. Ghosh, a chemist working

0:22:22.480 --> 0:22:26.680
<v Speaker 1>for Imperial Chemical Industries in gelts Hill, England, was looking

0:22:26.680 --> 0:22:32.399
<v Speaker 1>for chemicals that could kill common pests, specifically mits. Ghost

0:22:32.520 --> 0:22:35.560
<v Speaker 1>was directed to look closely at secret research on a

0:22:35.600 --> 0:22:39.040
<v Speaker 1>group of toxic pesticides called g agents, which have been

0:22:39.080 --> 0:22:43.160
<v Speaker 1>developed by German scientists during the nineteen thirties. Glos went

0:22:43.240 --> 0:22:46.680
<v Speaker 1>to work, and in nineteen fifty two, at the height

0:22:46.720 --> 0:22:51.240
<v Speaker 1>of the Korean War, he and a fellow chemist named J. F. Newman,

0:22:51.359 --> 0:22:55.719
<v Speaker 1>discovered a substance an organo phosphate esther of substitute amino

0:22:56.160 --> 0:23:03.200
<v Speaker 1>ethiol called Amaton. The men celebrated the discovery. Ghost was

0:23:03.240 --> 0:23:07.760
<v Speaker 1>convinced he had found the pesticide to end all pesticides.

0:23:08.800 --> 0:23:15.040
<v Speaker 1>Advertisers believed it too. By Amaton was being marketed across

0:23:15.080 --> 0:23:19.919
<v Speaker 1>the United Kingdom as the next great bug killer, but

0:23:20.520 --> 0:23:23.760
<v Speaker 1>within three years it would be pulled off the shelves.

0:23:24.840 --> 0:23:29.879
<v Speaker 1>Turns out Amaton was much more than an insecticide. It

0:23:30.040 --> 0:23:34.680
<v Speaker 1>was a nerve agent. So Ghosh went back to work.

0:23:35.359 --> 0:23:38.359
<v Speaker 1>He continued trying to turn the Nazi G agents into

0:23:38.440 --> 0:23:43.080
<v Speaker 1>effective and safe pesticides, but every time he attempted to

0:23:43.080 --> 0:23:48.800
<v Speaker 1>discover a less toxic substance, he failed. In fact, each

0:23:48.920 --> 0:23:53.800
<v Speaker 1>new advancement seemed to make the G agents more toxic.

0:23:55.760 --> 0:24:01.040
<v Speaker 1>The most noxious, most deadly, most terrified rying agent Ghosh

0:24:01.080 --> 0:24:05.280
<v Speaker 1>concocted would be so potent that only a few milligrams

0:24:05.280 --> 0:24:09.600
<v Speaker 1>were needed to kill a human. It would be named

0:24:10.280 --> 0:24:20.479
<v Speaker 1>Venomous Agent X. Today it's just called v X. And

0:24:20.560 --> 0:24:26.000
<v Speaker 1>that is where our stories collide. Because during the Korean War,

0:24:26.320 --> 0:24:30.040
<v Speaker 1>as American planes rain bombs and bullets on North Korean cities,

0:24:30.560 --> 0:24:34.200
<v Speaker 1>Kimilsung directed his military to build a labyrinth of underground

0:24:34.200 --> 0:24:38.879
<v Speaker 1>tunnels and bunkers for protection. North Korea hasn't stopped digging

0:24:39.000 --> 0:24:43.760
<v Speaker 1>since you might remember our friend historian Benjamin Young. They

0:24:43.880 --> 0:24:48.320
<v Speaker 1>remembered the years of the US air bombardment, and so

0:24:48.400 --> 0:24:50.640
<v Speaker 1>there's a reason why North Korea has built so many

0:24:50.680 --> 0:24:55.879
<v Speaker 1>of its military facilities under the ground, in mountainous ravines,

0:24:56.440 --> 0:25:01.280
<v Speaker 1>under mountains. They have a massive tunnel system. So North

0:25:01.359 --> 0:25:06.280
<v Speaker 1>Korea's history has made it into this very deeply paranoid,

0:25:07.080 --> 0:25:12.720
<v Speaker 1>almost subterranean system. Today, it's estimated that North Korea has

0:25:12.800 --> 0:25:18.440
<v Speaker 1>up to fifteen thousand underground layers acting as aircraft hangars,

0:25:18.800 --> 0:25:24.040
<v Speaker 1>material depots, and weapons storage facilities. It's believed the majority

0:25:24.160 --> 0:25:29.280
<v Speaker 1>of the country's military supplies are protected by these underground bunkers.

0:25:29.840 --> 0:25:33.200
<v Speaker 1>I think that one day, perhaps the regime will collapse

0:25:33.240 --> 0:25:36.280
<v Speaker 1>and we'll go then and we'll see just how huge

0:25:36.400 --> 0:25:40.280
<v Speaker 1>their tunnel system was underneath the ground, and just how

0:25:40.440 --> 0:25:44.000
<v Speaker 1>prepared they were for any sort of airbombardment. And that

0:25:44.160 --> 0:25:46.000
<v Speaker 1>might be one of the secrets that Kim Jong nam

0:25:46.119 --> 0:25:49.639
<v Speaker 1>was harboring as the son of the dear leader. He

0:25:49.760 --> 0:25:52.960
<v Speaker 1>knew that these underground cities held North Korea's war chests

0:25:52.960 --> 0:25:58.440
<v Speaker 1>of chemical weapons, including what maybe the largest stockpile of

0:25:58.560 --> 0:26:04.800
<v Speaker 1>VX nerve agent in the world. Today, North Koreas cash

0:26:04.800 --> 0:26:08.399
<v Speaker 1>of chemical weapons is the world's third largest, lagging behind

0:26:08.480 --> 0:26:11.560
<v Speaker 1>only the US and Russia. The country is home to

0:26:11.640 --> 0:26:15.600
<v Speaker 1>at least eleven chemical weapons facilities, almost all of them

0:26:15.640 --> 0:26:19.000
<v Speaker 1>buried underground, that may produce and store up to five

0:26:19.040 --> 0:26:24.200
<v Speaker 1>thousand metric tons of these deadly agents. But truth be told,

0:26:24.960 --> 0:26:28.560
<v Speaker 1>nobody certain how much they really have. North Korea has

0:26:29.200 --> 0:26:32.320
<v Speaker 1>um you know, chemical weapons capability, the extent of which

0:26:32.359 --> 0:26:36.720
<v Speaker 1>we don't really know, but the willingness to use uh

0:26:36.920 --> 0:26:40.159
<v Speaker 1>is there. We do, however, have a good idea of

0:26:40.160 --> 0:26:49.440
<v Speaker 1>what's in North Korea's stockpile. Anthrax, smallpox, amaton, mustard, gas saren,

0:26:50.280 --> 0:26:57.040
<v Speaker 1>the plague, and yes, VX agent, all of which are

0:26:57.160 --> 0:27:01.520
<v Speaker 1>ready for their neighbors to the south or anyone else

0:27:01.560 --> 0:27:04.960
<v Speaker 1>who messes with them near their turf. North Korea has

0:27:05.119 --> 0:27:08.440
<v Speaker 1>the capability of attaching you know, chemical weapons, even to

0:27:08.520 --> 0:27:12.720
<v Speaker 1>their short range ballistic missiles. Chemill Song was right to

0:27:12.800 --> 0:27:17.840
<v Speaker 1>bet on chemical weapons. Chemical missiles are cheaper and potentially

0:27:18.000 --> 0:27:22.760
<v Speaker 1>more lethal than nuclear warheads. It would only take one

0:27:22.800 --> 0:27:29.240
<v Speaker 1>gallon of anthrax to end all human life. Indeed, for decades,

0:27:29.840 --> 0:27:34.399
<v Speaker 1>this chemical stockpile has been a remarkable deterrent and a

0:27:34.560 --> 0:27:39.040
<v Speaker 1>threatening bargaining chip. The US won't use its nukes because

0:27:39.240 --> 0:27:42.320
<v Speaker 1>that would compel the North to release its chemical weapons,

0:27:42.880 --> 0:27:45.800
<v Speaker 1>and the North won't use its chemical weapons because that

0:27:45.800 --> 0:27:49.200
<v Speaker 1>would compel the US to use its nukes. It's led

0:27:49.240 --> 0:27:53.719
<v Speaker 1>to a strategic standoff, a menacing game of chicken that

0:27:53.760 --> 0:27:58.560
<v Speaker 1>allows North Korea to act belligerent lee with few consequences.

0:27:59.560 --> 0:28:05.560
<v Speaker 1>Anything else would be catastrophic. In the n nineties, the

0:28:05.600 --> 0:28:08.840
<v Speaker 1>Pentagon calculated the cost of a pre emptive strike on

0:28:08.920 --> 0:28:13.040
<v Speaker 1>North Korea. The results suggested that an attack would cost

0:28:13.080 --> 0:28:16.600
<v Speaker 1>the US more than a trillion dollars and require at

0:28:16.680 --> 0:28:21.120
<v Speaker 1>least a hundred thousand body bags just for American troops alone.

0:28:21.520 --> 0:28:25.080
<v Speaker 1>The potential loss of life in a second Korean conflict

0:28:25.400 --> 0:28:28.800
<v Speaker 1>is you know, millions of people. You have. You have

0:28:28.880 --> 0:28:32.040
<v Speaker 1>to remember that Soul the capital of South Korea. It's

0:28:32.080 --> 0:28:35.160
<v Speaker 1>only thirty miles away from the d m z Um

0:28:35.200 --> 0:28:37.840
<v Speaker 1>and about a quarter of the population lives there. Um

0:28:37.880 --> 0:28:41.680
<v Speaker 1>The response time that it takes to defend Soul and

0:28:41.720 --> 0:28:44.560
<v Speaker 1>the amount of damage that can be done very quickly

0:28:45.080 --> 0:28:48.960
<v Speaker 1>is enormously high. This standoff has done more than preserved

0:28:48.960 --> 0:28:53.640
<v Speaker 1>North Korea's existence. It's been a boon to the country's economy.

0:28:53.840 --> 0:28:58.320
<v Speaker 1>It essentially uses weapons of mass destruction to extort foreign

0:28:58.400 --> 0:29:04.840
<v Speaker 1>countries into lifting ancients. It's also a valuable export. These

0:29:04.920 --> 0:29:08.840
<v Speaker 1>chemical weapons can be shipped rogue nations and terrorist groups.

0:29:09.200 --> 0:29:12.959
<v Speaker 1>North Korea never really admits to having chemical weapons are

0:29:12.960 --> 0:29:16.680
<v Speaker 1>actually using it. That again is Sue Kim, our ex

0:29:16.800 --> 0:29:22.040
<v Speaker 1>CIA analyst. But we know that it's actually tried to

0:29:22.120 --> 0:29:25.680
<v Speaker 1>transfer chemical weapons to other countries. It's got the technology

0:29:25.720 --> 0:29:29.160
<v Speaker 1>and equipment, so it should be a concern. In fact,

0:29:29.680 --> 0:29:34.560
<v Speaker 1>we know that North Korea exported chemical equipment to Syria

0:29:34.880 --> 0:29:39.360
<v Speaker 1>coincidentally around the same time Syrian President Bashar al Assad

0:29:39.600 --> 0:29:44.920
<v Speaker 1>was gassing his own citizens. Meanwhile, in the US, there's

0:29:44.960 --> 0:29:49.040
<v Speaker 1>practically no VX at all in accordance with the Chemical

0:29:49.080 --> 0:29:54.520
<v Speaker 1>Weapons Convention in agreement North Korea disregards the United States

0:29:54.600 --> 0:29:58.560
<v Speaker 1>has destroyed almost all of its stock of VX. Today,

0:29:59.040 --> 0:30:03.000
<v Speaker 1>one of America's largest collections of VX rockets. It's resting

0:30:03.160 --> 0:30:06.440
<v Speaker 1>at the bottom of the ocean, just off the coast

0:30:06.480 --> 0:30:10.880
<v Speaker 1>of Atlantic City, New Jersey. All of that's to say,

0:30:11.000 --> 0:30:14.600
<v Speaker 1>while North Korea is nuclear weapons get most of the attention.

0:30:15.000 --> 0:30:18.240
<v Speaker 1>Perhaps it's time the country's chemical arsenal commands more of

0:30:18.280 --> 0:30:23.320
<v Speaker 1>our scrutiny. We do talk constantly about the came regime's

0:30:23.560 --> 0:30:27.440
<v Speaker 1>missile development, the provocations and those are all of course

0:30:27.720 --> 0:30:33.560
<v Speaker 1>valid um incredible security concerns, but the chemical warfare component

0:30:33.880 --> 0:30:38.440
<v Speaker 1>um the cyber components, I think are just as deadly

0:30:38.800 --> 0:30:43.680
<v Speaker 1>and in some cases even more deadly. The chemical weapons

0:30:44.280 --> 0:30:50.040
<v Speaker 1>in combination with the ballistic missiles, can lead to, I

0:30:50.040 --> 0:30:55.240
<v Speaker 1>would say, much more broader, far reaching implications than the

0:30:55.400 --> 0:30:58.600
<v Speaker 1>time to think. Because of this perception that Earth crews backwards,

0:30:58.600 --> 0:31:01.520
<v Speaker 1>because it's it's poor, because weird has a funny looking reader,

0:31:01.880 --> 0:31:04.640
<v Speaker 1>we tend to sort of dismiss a lot of these

0:31:05.440 --> 0:31:08.480
<v Speaker 1>serious developments. I think it's an advantage for North Korea

0:31:08.560 --> 0:31:13.560
<v Speaker 1>to play this on all the while developing so many

0:31:13.880 --> 0:31:18.239
<v Speaker 1>lethal options later to threaten the international community to use it,

0:31:18.320 --> 0:31:21.200
<v Speaker 1>or to actually do try to use it. As the

0:31:21.240 --> 0:31:25.960
<v Speaker 1>world found out in It's exactly the kind of weaponry

0:31:26.000 --> 0:31:30.760
<v Speaker 1>one might use too quickly and silently kill a target

0:31:30.920 --> 0:31:47.760
<v Speaker 1>in a very public place. Over the course of this podcast,

0:31:48.120 --> 0:31:51.480
<v Speaker 1>we've gone over a plethora of theories of who killed

0:31:51.560 --> 0:31:55.960
<v Speaker 1>Kim Jong nam and why was it Kim Jongan ensuring

0:31:56.080 --> 0:32:00.080
<v Speaker 1>his throne wouldn't be jeopardized. Was it North Korea and

0:32:00.120 --> 0:32:03.920
<v Speaker 1>elites with an eye on his money making software. Was

0:32:03.920 --> 0:32:07.040
<v Speaker 1>it someone else in the regime who was threatened by

0:32:07.120 --> 0:32:11.680
<v Speaker 1>his reform minded ideas To be honest, It may not

0:32:11.920 --> 0:32:16.520
<v Speaker 1>just be one, because Kim jong Nam had evaded death before.

0:32:17.480 --> 0:32:21.240
<v Speaker 1>In the early two thousand's, somebody masterminded a plot to

0:32:21.320 --> 0:32:25.240
<v Speaker 1>kill him in Austria, but that, as you may remember,

0:32:25.720 --> 0:32:32.080
<v Speaker 1>was thwarted, and in shortly after Kim Jongan was annointed successor,

0:32:32.640 --> 0:32:36.160
<v Speaker 1>a North Korean spy paid a Chinese taxi driver to

0:32:36.360 --> 0:32:39.880
<v Speaker 1>run over Kim jong Nam with his car. The hit

0:32:40.000 --> 0:32:45.040
<v Speaker 1>and run failed, and in after Yoji Komi published his

0:32:45.160 --> 0:32:49.560
<v Speaker 1>tell all book, Kim jong Nam reportedly dodged another attack,

0:32:50.360 --> 0:32:54.360
<v Speaker 1>the details of which are murky, but according to South

0:32:54.440 --> 0:32:58.880
<v Speaker 1>Korean intelligence, the exiled prince was so distressed that he

0:32:58.920 --> 0:33:02.560
<v Speaker 1>wrote a letter to his brother pleading for his life.

0:33:03.080 --> 0:33:05.840
<v Speaker 1>Please withdraw the order to punish me and my family.

0:33:06.800 --> 0:33:10.760
<v Speaker 1>We have nowhere to hide. The only way to escape

0:33:10.800 --> 0:33:14.280
<v Speaker 1>is to choose suicide. No matter who was trying to

0:33:14.360 --> 0:33:17.520
<v Speaker 1>kill him, Kim jong Nam knew the bucks stopped with

0:33:17.560 --> 0:33:23.120
<v Speaker 1>his brother. It seems Kim jong N didn't listen, and

0:33:23.200 --> 0:33:27.280
<v Speaker 1>after Chang Song Tech was killed, North Korean spies apparently

0:33:27.360 --> 0:33:31.920
<v Speaker 1>began tailing Kim jong Nam's movements. Even if Kim jong

0:33:32.000 --> 0:33:37.080
<v Speaker 1>Nam wanted to divorce himself from all of his connections

0:33:37.080 --> 0:33:40.040
<v Speaker 1>in North Korea, it's not up to him. The regime

0:33:40.280 --> 0:33:43.200
<v Speaker 1>that the Kim jong N leadership has every interest to

0:33:43.280 --> 0:33:47.480
<v Speaker 1>keep tabs on this this brother one because of course

0:33:47.520 --> 0:33:52.160
<v Speaker 1>he was family, and too because of the potential threat

0:33:52.320 --> 0:33:55.640
<v Speaker 1>that he would pose to Kim jong N as the leader.

0:33:56.360 --> 0:34:00.520
<v Speaker 1>But actions, of course, can have unintended consequences, just as

0:34:00.560 --> 0:34:04.400
<v Speaker 1>the U. S air bombardment and nuclear weapons inadvertently encouraged

0:34:04.400 --> 0:34:07.720
<v Speaker 1>North Korea to build tunnels and beef up on chemical weapons,

0:34:08.120 --> 0:34:12.240
<v Speaker 1>cutting off Kim jong nam slash fund had unexpected results too.

0:34:13.280 --> 0:34:17.680
<v Speaker 1>Kim jong Nam needed money. According to the Washington Post,

0:34:18.200 --> 0:34:22.200
<v Speaker 1>the circumstances may have quote thrust Kim jong Nam into

0:34:22.239 --> 0:34:25.560
<v Speaker 1>the arms of foreign intelligence services as he tried to

0:34:25.640 --> 0:34:30.839
<v Speaker 1>maintain his lifestyle. So a very reliable source obviously can't name,

0:34:31.360 --> 0:34:36.040
<v Speaker 1>told me that Kim jong Nam had been providing intelligence

0:34:36.239 --> 0:34:41.879
<v Speaker 1>to the CIA while he was living in exile. I mean,

0:34:41.960 --> 0:34:45.800
<v Speaker 1>we know that he was having to earn money for himself,

0:34:45.840 --> 0:34:50.440
<v Speaker 1>that it wasn't the beneficiary of the regime's larges anymore

0:34:50.560 --> 0:34:54.839
<v Speaker 1>after Kim Jong nun took power. Um, so it stands,

0:34:54.880 --> 0:34:56.879
<v Speaker 1>you know, it makes sense that he would be having

0:34:56.920 --> 0:34:58.640
<v Speaker 1>to earn a living, and you know what is his

0:34:59.760 --> 0:35:03.600
<v Speaker 1>more was unique marketable skill, I guess, is giving intelligence

0:35:03.640 --> 0:35:07.160
<v Speaker 1>about about Kim jongan and what's going on in North Korea.

0:35:07.719 --> 0:35:10.520
<v Speaker 1>Journalists at the Wall Street Journal would later corroborate five

0:35:10.560 --> 0:35:14.560
<v Speaker 1>fields reporting suggesting that Chong Nam occasionally met CIA handlers

0:35:14.560 --> 0:35:19.319
<v Speaker 1>and undisclosed locations in Malaysia and Singapore. He wasn't an

0:35:19.360 --> 0:35:21.880
<v Speaker 1>agent or anything like that, but he was providing the

0:35:21.920 --> 0:35:25.120
<v Speaker 1>information that he had. There have also been multiple reports

0:35:25.160 --> 0:35:27.200
<v Speaker 1>since then that he was doing the same for South

0:35:27.280 --> 0:35:33.160
<v Speaker 1>Korea also potentially Japan. To learn more, we prodded deeper

0:35:33.239 --> 0:35:37.839
<v Speaker 1>with Sue Kim, hoping she'd spill some CIA secrets to us.

0:35:38.680 --> 0:35:44.000
<v Speaker 1>She was understandably unable to confirm these suspicions. You know,

0:35:44.080 --> 0:35:48.359
<v Speaker 1>I can't really comment about how the the Intel organizations

0:35:48.360 --> 0:35:51.359
<v Speaker 1>obtained sources, so I'm not sure if I could help

0:35:51.400 --> 0:35:54.640
<v Speaker 1>you with this question. But she was able to help

0:35:54.680 --> 0:35:59.040
<v Speaker 1>provide us with the rationale. If the CIA did hypothetically

0:35:59.760 --> 0:36:02.399
<v Speaker 1>see gout Tong Num, there would be I would say

0:36:02.440 --> 0:36:07.320
<v Speaker 1>great value because he has lived inside the country. Um.

0:36:07.360 --> 0:36:10.200
<v Speaker 1>He is the son of Kim jong so he knows

0:36:10.239 --> 0:36:12.240
<v Speaker 1>a lot about the system. He knows a lot about

0:36:12.320 --> 0:36:17.200
<v Speaker 1>his family members. UM. He also knows how North Korea thinks. Um,

0:36:17.280 --> 0:36:20.919
<v Speaker 1>not just the leadership, but just North Korean. I would say,

0:36:21.360 --> 0:36:24.640
<v Speaker 1>just the the culture. So there would be a lot

0:36:24.719 --> 0:36:27.840
<v Speaker 1>of value. And as much as there's a lot of

0:36:27.920 --> 0:36:32.680
<v Speaker 1>value for foreign intel services, it's going to be an

0:36:32.719 --> 0:36:36.839
<v Speaker 1>even greater threat for North Korea. We don't know what

0:36:36.960 --> 0:36:39.520
<v Speaker 1>Kim jong nam told the CIA or how long he

0:36:39.520 --> 0:36:42.960
<v Speaker 1>worked with them. All we know is that when Kim

0:36:43.040 --> 0:36:48.239
<v Speaker 1>jongan was announced his successor, intelligence agencies had little information

0:36:48.280 --> 0:36:53.640
<v Speaker 1>about him. They scramble to learn anything they could, and

0:36:53.719 --> 0:36:58.560
<v Speaker 1>what better source than his older brother. If the United

0:36:58.600 --> 0:37:02.359
<v Speaker 1>States for South Korea were able to form relationship with

0:37:02.520 --> 0:37:08.719
<v Speaker 1>Kim Jong nam, think about how much more vulnerable Kim

0:37:08.800 --> 0:37:11.880
<v Speaker 1>Jong nan is going to feel about his decision making,

0:37:11.920 --> 0:37:15.440
<v Speaker 1>about his health, about his interesting quirks. And on the

0:37:15.520 --> 0:37:18.520
<v Speaker 1>day Kim jong nam met with the suspected CIA agent

0:37:18.560 --> 0:37:23.200
<v Speaker 1>in Langkawi, he took the man into his hotel room. There,

0:37:23.600 --> 0:37:27.960
<v Speaker 1>it's believed he shared intelligence from his computer. We know

0:37:28.080 --> 0:37:31.600
<v Speaker 1>this because days after Kim jong nam died, police found

0:37:31.640 --> 0:37:35.279
<v Speaker 1>evidence that somebody had extracted extensive amounts of data with

0:37:35.320 --> 0:37:39.200
<v Speaker 1>the USB drive. Cheng Nam would also try to leave

0:37:39.239 --> 0:37:42.760
<v Speaker 1>the country with four bricks of cash, each bundle amounting

0:37:42.760 --> 0:37:47.640
<v Speaker 1>to around thirty dollars, and of course those vials of antidote.

0:37:48.400 --> 0:37:51.600
<v Speaker 1>Did Kim jong Nam request this his payment or did

0:37:51.600 --> 0:37:57.080
<v Speaker 1>the CIA offer it as an exchange. Honestly, nobody outside

0:37:57.120 --> 0:38:03.600
<v Speaker 1>of those involved in the exchange knows, But we do

0:38:03.760 --> 0:38:06.840
<v Speaker 1>know that Kim Jongan's own spies may have been lurking

0:38:06.840 --> 0:38:10.400
<v Speaker 1>in the shadows the DPR case seemed to be aware

0:38:10.400 --> 0:38:14.359
<v Speaker 1>of Toeng Nam's itinerary. It's possible that because they were

0:38:14.400 --> 0:38:17.920
<v Speaker 1>tailing him, they knew that he was talking to American spies,

0:38:18.760 --> 0:38:22.520
<v Speaker 1>and if that's true, that would present yet another reason

0:38:22.600 --> 0:38:25.440
<v Speaker 1>for his half brother to want him out of the picture.

0:38:26.480 --> 0:38:29.600
<v Speaker 1>The CIA has a history of trying to take down

0:38:29.680 --> 0:38:35.080
<v Speaker 1>foreign governments. It had tacitly endorsed the overthrow Vietnam's prime minister,

0:38:35.520 --> 0:38:39.040
<v Speaker 1>had helped organize the downfall of Chile's president, and had

0:38:39.160 --> 0:38:42.720
<v Speaker 1>plotted to assassinate the Democratic Republic of Congo's first prime

0:38:42.760 --> 0:38:47.200
<v Speaker 1>minister with a deadly virus, And of course they famously

0:38:47.320 --> 0:38:53.480
<v Speaker 1>tried and failed to poison Fidel Castro's cigars, So what

0:38:53.600 --> 0:38:56.480
<v Speaker 1>was stopping the CIA from trying the same with Kim

0:38:56.560 --> 0:39:00.239
<v Speaker 1>jong un. Sue Kim is wary of how much Tongu

0:39:00.320 --> 0:39:04.520
<v Speaker 1>Nam's links with the agency might have influenced North Korea's decisions.

0:39:05.160 --> 0:39:09.360
<v Speaker 1>I think it had much more to do with leadership insecurities.

0:39:09.680 --> 0:39:12.840
<v Speaker 1>The fact that this this oldest son who was roaming

0:39:12.880 --> 0:39:17.600
<v Speaker 1>about freely outside North Korea getting to enjoy life, occasionally

0:39:17.719 --> 0:39:23.480
<v Speaker 1>making these nonchalant comments about the North Korean system, the leadership,

0:39:23.640 --> 0:39:27.280
<v Speaker 1>and and you know, just being critical about the country.

0:39:27.560 --> 0:39:29.680
<v Speaker 1>It was not going to be. It wasn't going to

0:39:29.800 --> 0:39:34.440
<v Speaker 1>reflect well, obviously upon Kim Jongan. North Korea watchers like

0:39:34.480 --> 0:39:38.520
<v Speaker 1>Michael Madden also questioned whether the CIA connection was really

0:39:38.600 --> 0:39:43.200
<v Speaker 1>all that significant. In his opinion, the prince was already

0:39:43.239 --> 0:39:46.560
<v Speaker 1>a marked man. Disregard all of us, disregard all of

0:39:46.560 --> 0:39:49.160
<v Speaker 1>the stuff about Kim Jong Nam being a source for

0:39:49.160 --> 0:39:52.640
<v Speaker 1>foreign intelligence. That's just a really nice story for the

0:39:52.680 --> 0:39:59.080
<v Speaker 1>news media. There'd be other motivations but that begs the question,

0:39:59.800 --> 0:40:02.719
<v Speaker 1>if there had been so many reasons to kill this

0:40:02.760 --> 0:40:07.840
<v Speaker 1>man for decades, now, why did it take so long

0:40:08.000 --> 0:40:12.759
<v Speaker 1>for North Korea to pull the trigger. Madden suggests the

0:40:12.800 --> 0:40:17.160
<v Speaker 1>reason Kim jong Nam lived until was because he still

0:40:17.200 --> 0:40:20.920
<v Speaker 1>had a number of advocates in the regime. There were

0:40:20.960 --> 0:40:24.360
<v Speaker 1>other elites, people who considered Kim jong Nam as family.

0:40:25.320 --> 0:40:28.799
<v Speaker 1>There was Rios, a nineties something former hit man who

0:40:28.840 --> 0:40:32.239
<v Speaker 1>was like a grandfather to the prince. He died in November.

0:40:34.280 --> 0:40:37.239
<v Speaker 1>A few months later, a former female comrade of Kim

0:40:37.239 --> 0:40:40.720
<v Speaker 1>Il Song, also close to Kim jong Nam, died as well.

0:40:41.760 --> 0:40:45.440
<v Speaker 1>By the end of Kim jong Nam's circle of influence

0:40:45.480 --> 0:40:49.719
<v Speaker 1>had either defected, We're trapped in prison camps or were

0:40:49.719 --> 0:40:54.120
<v Speaker 1>buried underground. He no longer had friends or family to

0:40:54.160 --> 0:40:58.440
<v Speaker 1>speak up for him. Were put in motion Kim jong

0:40:58.560 --> 0:41:03.400
<v Speaker 1>Nam's assassination. I really think that's a huge factor. Madden

0:41:04.160 --> 0:41:09.360
<v Speaker 1>might be onto something, because in late North Korea spies

0:41:09.440 --> 0:41:14.040
<v Speaker 1>began hatching one of the most elaborate assassination plots ever devised.

0:41:15.400 --> 0:41:18.600
<v Speaker 1>Since Kim jong Nam enjoyed protection in China and was

0:41:18.640 --> 0:41:22.800
<v Speaker 1>now spending time with foreign intelligence agents, the spies realized

0:41:23.160 --> 0:41:28.000
<v Speaker 1>they had to be careful and strategic. So the hitman

0:41:28.200 --> 0:41:31.960
<v Speaker 1>likely decided that the best way to assassinate Kim Jong

0:41:32.040 --> 0:41:36.800
<v Speaker 1>Nam was to kill him with a unique method, a

0:41:36.960 --> 0:41:48.360
<v Speaker 1>method that was understated, bloodless, immediate, and immaculately lethal, deep underground,

0:41:48.960 --> 0:41:53.920
<v Speaker 1>stalked away in its hidden tunnels, North Korea had the

0:41:54.080 --> 0:42:03.360
<v Speaker 1>perfect murder weapon on its hands. What we know about

0:42:03.440 --> 0:42:07.200
<v Speaker 1>VX nerve agent comes largely thanks to research done by

0:42:07.320 --> 0:42:10.920
<v Speaker 1>Dr Van and Sim, the former director of human research

0:42:11.000 --> 0:42:14.239
<v Speaker 1>at Edgewood Arsenal in Maryland, where the U. S. Army

0:42:14.360 --> 0:42:18.680
<v Speaker 1>used to test the effects of various chemical weapons. From

0:42:19.640 --> 0:42:24.120
<v Speaker 1>eight to ninety Under the direction of Dr Sim, more

0:42:24.120 --> 0:42:28.440
<v Speaker 1>than seven thousand American service members were exposed to substances

0:42:28.520 --> 0:42:34.359
<v Speaker 1>like ketamine, LSD and nerve agents like the X. The

0:42:34.480 --> 0:42:38.719
<v Speaker 1>Army believed live human experiments were important not only for defense,

0:42:39.160 --> 0:42:43.280
<v Speaker 1>but for intelligence gathering. As RAPI catch a Dorian writes

0:42:43.360 --> 0:42:46.359
<v Speaker 1>in The New Yorker, Doctors like Sim wanted to know

0:42:46.560 --> 0:42:50.719
<v Speaker 1>quote could an operative dose and adversary with a handshake,

0:42:51.640 --> 0:42:56.080
<v Speaker 1>So Dr Sim started drugging American soldiers to find out.

0:42:56.920 --> 0:43:01.400
<v Speaker 1>It sounds wildly unethical, and it is, but at the

0:43:01.480 --> 0:43:05.680
<v Speaker 1>time Dr Sim's work was well regarded. He was a

0:43:05.719 --> 0:43:09.680
<v Speaker 1>fearless researcher who always tested every chemical on himself before

0:43:09.680 --> 0:43:13.480
<v Speaker 1>exposing any soldiers to it. When he first encountered v

0:43:13.760 --> 0:43:21.640
<v Speaker 1>X in Sim intravenously infused small doses straight into his bloodstream.

0:43:21.680 --> 0:43:26.319
<v Speaker 1>It nearly killed him, but it thanks to doctor Sim

0:43:26.320 --> 0:43:29.680
<v Speaker 1>and the servicemen he experimented on that we now know

0:43:29.840 --> 0:43:33.120
<v Speaker 1>what v X does to the human body and what

0:43:33.200 --> 0:43:38.400
<v Speaker 1>the North Korean spies had planned for Kim Jong Nam.

0:43:38.480 --> 0:43:42.920
<v Speaker 1>Upon contact, a small drop of VX quickly penetrates the

0:43:42.960 --> 0:43:46.800
<v Speaker 1>skin and soaks into the bloodstream, and it wastes no time.

0:43:47.480 --> 0:43:50.680
<v Speaker 1>The nerve agent blocks enzygns that help your muscles to relax.

0:43:51.400 --> 0:43:57.200
<v Speaker 1>Within minutes, every muscle starts to contract uncontrollably. The eyes burned,

0:43:57.520 --> 0:44:02.760
<v Speaker 1>the pupils narrow, sweat beads as vision blurs, The chest titans,

0:44:02.840 --> 0:44:07.400
<v Speaker 1>making breathing more and more difficult. Muscles twitch and tire

0:44:07.760 --> 0:44:11.960
<v Speaker 1>as the nose runs and the mouth drools. Fluid floods

0:44:12.040 --> 0:44:15.760
<v Speaker 1>the airway, coughing, fits sputter as the whole body clenches.

0:44:16.360 --> 0:44:21.440
<v Speaker 1>After just ten minutes, nerve ending scream with pain. The

0:44:21.520 --> 0:44:26.040
<v Speaker 1>body can't handle this type of stimulation, so the muscles

0:44:26.080 --> 0:44:32.400
<v Speaker 1>become exhausted, and eventually they curl in on themselves, contracting

0:44:32.440 --> 0:44:35.680
<v Speaker 1>to the point where the victim can no longer breathe.

0:44:37.080 --> 0:44:43.320
<v Speaker 1>Consciousness fades, but not quickly enough. The victim's final thoughts

0:44:43.320 --> 0:44:49.080
<v Speaker 1>will be consumed by one horrifying realization that their own

0:44:49.120 --> 0:44:56.279
<v Speaker 1>body is suffocating them and it doesn't take much feex

0:44:56.680 --> 0:45:00.400
<v Speaker 1>to kill you. Dr sim concluded that it's it's just

0:45:00.560 --> 0:45:03.800
<v Speaker 1>ten milligrams of v X, about the same as three

0:45:04.000 --> 0:45:08.040
<v Speaker 1>rain drops to kill a human. This has prompted the

0:45:08.080 --> 0:45:11.640
<v Speaker 1>CDC to call v X quote the most potent of

0:45:11.760 --> 0:45:18.680
<v Speaker 1>all nerve agents. Tasteless, odorless, and deadly in small, almost

0:45:18.880 --> 0:45:24.879
<v Speaker 1>undetectable quantities. V X is also shockingly portable. It can

0:45:24.880 --> 0:45:29.080
<v Speaker 1>be broken down into two harmless compounds, allowing two people

0:45:29.120 --> 0:45:32.840
<v Speaker 1>to hold these separate ingredients in their hands with minimal

0:45:32.960 --> 0:45:37.799
<v Speaker 1>risk to themselves. That is, until you mix the two

0:45:37.840 --> 0:45:44.600
<v Speaker 1>compounds together. On the next and last episode of Big Brother,

0:45:45.440 --> 0:45:48.440
<v Speaker 1>the elaborate means to which North Korea would go to

0:45:48.480 --> 0:45:53.480
<v Speaker 1>wash its hands of an assassination of international proportions, and

0:45:53.520 --> 0:46:01.320
<v Speaker 1>how Kim Jong Nam's death triggered a daring rescue Big

0:46:01.360 --> 0:46:03.880
<v Speaker 1>Brother is a production of School of Humans and I

0:46:04.000 --> 0:46:08.240
<v Speaker 1>Heart Radio and hosted by me Eat and Lee Lucas.

0:46:08.360 --> 0:46:12.520
<v Speaker 1>Riley is our writer, co director and associate producer. Amelia

0:46:12.560 --> 0:46:16.640
<v Speaker 1>Brock is our senior producer, co director and editor. Executive

0:46:16.640 --> 0:46:21.200
<v Speaker 1>producers are Virginia Prescott, Brandon Barr, Else Crowley, and Jason English.

0:46:21.320 --> 0:46:25.480
<v Speaker 1>Our fact checker is Aaron Blakemore. Music composed by Jason

0:46:25.560 --> 0:46:30.360
<v Speaker 1>Todd Shannon and Tune Walters. Original score mix by Vick Stafford.

0:46:31.000 --> 0:46:34.800
<v Speaker 1>Audio editing by Jesse nice Swanger, Sound design and mixed

0:46:34.840 --> 0:46:39.600
<v Speaker 1>by Harper W. Harris. Audio correction by Josh Fisher. Voice

0:46:39.600 --> 0:46:43.920
<v Speaker 1>acting by Mark Chung, June Yune, Ben Holst, Thiago Lima

0:46:44.160 --> 0:46:47.759
<v Speaker 1>and Mike Coscarelli. We'd like to acknowledge the work of

0:46:47.880 --> 0:46:52.320
<v Speaker 1>Dr Bruce Cummings. Special thanks to Ryan Murdoch and Will Pearson.

0:46:53.120 --> 0:46:57.440
<v Speaker 1>Sound licensed from Critical Past. If you're enjoying the podcast,

0:46:57.880 --> 0:47:00.239
<v Speaker 1>help us get the word out by leaving Obra in

0:47:00.280 --> 0:47:23.440
<v Speaker 1>your favorite podcast app. Until next time, I'm evenly School

0:47:23.440 --> 0:47:25.879
<v Speaker 1>of Humans m HM.