WEBVTT - The Mark Moss Show Dec 10, 2021 0:00:00.000 --> 0:00:02.920 Hey, everyone, welcome to another episode of The Mark mo Show, 0:00:02.920 --> 0:00:05.600 where of course we're always talking about bitcoin. We're talking 0:00:05.600 --> 0:00:09.959 about cryptocurrencies, we're talking about the decentralized revolution that is coming. 0:00:10.920 --> 0:00:12.559 It's the most important part of your week. You should 0:00:12.560 --> 0:00:14.000 tune in with me each and every week. Make sure 0:00:14.040 --> 0:00:16.079 to grab your phone, put a calendar reminder right now 0:00:16.120 --> 0:00:18.040 for the station that you're listening to this time, and 0:00:18.040 --> 0:00:20.800 I'll be back with you each and every week. Now, 0:00:20.840 --> 0:00:23.959 today I have something special. I'm sitting down in the 0:00:24.040 --> 0:00:27.800 studio with my good friend Peter McCormick. You've probably heard 0:00:27.800 --> 0:00:31.720 of him. He runs the biggest podcast in bitcoin, What 0:00:31.760 --> 0:00:34.120 Bitcoin Did? You should definitely be checking out, And I 0:00:34.159 --> 0:00:38.160 recorded a monster episode with him um yesterday, so stay 0:00:38.159 --> 0:00:40.320 tuned for that coming out. But Peter, thanks so much 0:00:40.360 --> 0:00:42.360 for sitting down with me today. Look, thanks for having 0:00:42.400 --> 0:00:44.600 me Mark. I told you I don't like being a guest, 0:00:44.600 --> 0:00:46.360 but I was very happy to have you on my 0:00:46.400 --> 0:00:48.200 show yesterday. That bols a monst the show. I can't 0:00:48.240 --> 0:00:50.040 wait to get that out. Yeah, I can't wait to 0:00:50.040 --> 0:00:51.880 get that out as well. It was It was fun 0:00:51.920 --> 0:00:53.840 because it was a thesis that I've been working on 0:00:53.880 --> 0:00:57.080 and i've presented to a camera talking on a YouTube 0:00:57.120 --> 0:00:58.840 video gets very lonely, like you're just talking to a 0:00:58.880 --> 0:01:00.360 camera all the time. There's like no if you back, 0:01:01.080 --> 0:01:02.560 and I've done it on stage once or twice. But 0:01:02.800 --> 0:01:05.560 to be able to like discuss it was was super cool. Well, 0:01:05.560 --> 0:01:08.720 I think it's gonna start a chain of sessions we're 0:01:08.720 --> 0:01:10.800 gonna do now. I already know the next one we're 0:01:10.800 --> 0:01:13.039 gonna make following up from that. I can see us 0:01:13.080 --> 0:01:14.840 doing this every six months now, which will be great 0:01:14.840 --> 0:01:18.080 because I think you are an absolute gem and I 0:01:18.120 --> 0:01:21.600 think the knowledge you've brought with this thesis you've got incredible. 0:01:21.600 --> 0:01:24.000 So thank you so much, Thanks Peter. I appreciate that, 0:01:24.319 --> 0:01:26.520 and I would also, you know, say the same compliment 0:01:26.560 --> 0:01:29.160 you as well. Um you know your interviews. I've been 0:01:29.160 --> 0:01:30.360 listened to him for a long time. I think you've 0:01:30.400 --> 0:01:34.640 done like four hundred episodes or something. I think it's 0:01:35.360 --> 0:01:38.440 so several years, and I love I love your approach 0:01:38.520 --> 0:01:42.319 because you're so curious with your questions and so um 0:01:42.360 --> 0:01:44.280 you know, you ask questions that I don't typically think of, 0:01:44.360 --> 0:01:46.000 and I think it's been really good. So i'd recommend 0:01:46.000 --> 0:01:48.200 everyone listen to that. But I want to dig in 0:01:48.200 --> 0:01:49.680 a little bit. I mean, you've been doing this for 0:01:49.720 --> 0:01:55.480 like four years now talking about bitcoin, um, and you've 0:01:55.520 --> 0:01:59.160 been traveling all over the world. I guess, uh, you've 0:01:59.200 --> 0:02:02.880 probably learned a lot from talking to these people. One 0:02:02.880 --> 0:02:04.880 of the things that I think, I like to think 0:02:04.920 --> 0:02:08.040 of bitcoin is like a bait and switch. People come 0:02:08.120 --> 0:02:12.320 in on the price I want to get rich, and 0:02:12.360 --> 0:02:13.880 then we get to the bait and then we get 0:02:13.880 --> 0:02:16.720 switched into going dang, like this is like a technology 0:02:16.760 --> 0:02:18.760 that could like give us freedom or like in the 0:02:18.840 --> 0:02:21.160 state or like things like that. Do you see it 0:02:21.200 --> 0:02:23.519 like something like that? Yeah, I do. I do. I 0:02:24.160 --> 0:02:27.160 think about it like in terms of my life, there's 0:02:27.200 --> 0:02:29.959 like before bitcoin and after bitcoin, which you know it 0:02:30.000 --> 0:02:33.400 sounds a little bit cringe or hyperbolic, but um, I 0:02:33.440 --> 0:02:36.840 think when you start to understand money, and you start 0:02:36.840 --> 0:02:39.560 to understand your relationship with money, it starts to affect 0:02:39.720 --> 0:02:43.600 your relationship with other parts of your life. Historically, before bitcoin, 0:02:43.680 --> 0:02:46.600 I I would say I was one financially literate and 0:02:46.639 --> 0:02:49.840 to financially irresponsible. I've always had good jobs and own 0:02:49.880 --> 0:02:52.560 good money, but I was never really good at conserving 0:02:52.600 --> 0:02:55.959 my capital or deployed particularly well. And I've learned a 0:02:56.040 --> 0:02:58.560 very painful lesson in my first year in bitcoin. And 0:02:58.840 --> 0:03:00.960 you know, I was traded bitcoin also of trading all coins, 0:03:01.400 --> 0:03:03.440 and I made and lost a lot of money very quickly, 0:03:03.880 --> 0:03:06.120 and it was a very painful lesson. But I had 0:03:06.160 --> 0:03:07.720 to kind of do a three six at that point 0:03:07.760 --> 0:03:09.800 and think, Okay, I don't want to do this again. 0:03:09.960 --> 0:03:13.000 This is painful. So I spent time going down the 0:03:13.040 --> 0:03:15.600 rabbit hole. I tried to conserve my capital with bitcoin 0:03:15.639 --> 0:03:17.880 and doing that that kind of brought a whole shift 0:03:17.919 --> 0:03:20.160 to a number of elements of my life in terms 0:03:20.200 --> 0:03:23.160 of thinking about the future and what I want out 0:03:23.160 --> 0:03:25.359 of life. So I just think, what it does? It? 0:03:25.600 --> 0:03:29.240 You know, it teaches you about time preference, something safety. 0:03:29.240 --> 0:03:31.840 He talks about a lot um and that time preference 0:03:31.880 --> 0:03:36.600 thing isn't just a financial thing. It's affects every aspect 0:03:36.640 --> 0:03:39.240 of your alive and then secondary for that and it does. 0:03:39.360 --> 0:03:41.920 This doesn't get everyone, but it has for me. It's 0:03:42.720 --> 0:03:49.880 pushed me closer to thinking about how the world works, governance, democracy, freedom, 0:03:50.000 --> 0:03:52.840 And yeah, I've been you know, not as much as 0:03:52.840 --> 0:03:55.000 some bitcoins, but I've certainly been pushed down that rabbit 0:03:55.040 --> 0:03:57.480 hole just thinking a lot about how the world is 0:03:57.520 --> 0:04:00.440 and how the kind of world we want to live in. Yeah, 0:04:00.480 --> 0:04:02.440 it's uh, it is. It's kind of a bait and 0:04:02.480 --> 0:04:04.160 switch on that way too. It coming in to make yeah, 0:04:04.240 --> 0:04:06.040 coming in to get rich. And then I mean, you're 0:04:06.120 --> 0:04:08.200 stay for the revolution, stay for the revolution. But the 0:04:08.240 --> 0:04:10.840 it's the education revolution, right, It's got all these people 0:04:10.880 --> 0:04:13.600 like interested. I wanted to talk about that. The very 0:04:13.600 --> 0:04:15.720 first show that I did on the station is UM. 0:04:15.720 --> 0:04:18.440 I had Alex Gladstin on, and the reason why I 0:04:18.440 --> 0:04:20.080 had him on is I said, look, the first thing 0:04:20.120 --> 0:04:23.320 I want to talk about is not money. I want 0:04:23.360 --> 0:04:25.440 to talk about human rights. Yes, and I want to 0:04:25.560 --> 0:04:28.320 establish that that's what we're talking about on this show. However, 0:04:28.360 --> 0:04:29.840 of course I still talk about the price on the show, 0:04:29.880 --> 0:04:31.920 because it's the bait and switch. And so we saw 0:04:31.960 --> 0:04:35.680 this week bitcoin's price dipped all the way back down 0:04:35.680 --> 0:04:37.720 to where it was a few weeks ago. Um. The 0:04:38.240 --> 0:04:40.240 new variant, I guess is spook in the markets and 0:04:40.279 --> 0:04:44.560 bitcoins price dip. Is that something that you pay attention to. 0:04:45.080 --> 0:04:48.480 I mean I pay attention to price of course, because 0:04:49.440 --> 0:04:51.240 of my net wealth is in bitcoin, probably more now, 0:04:51.320 --> 0:04:53.920 maybe closer to you know, if you take away my 0:04:54.040 --> 0:04:56.240 assets like my house and my car, it's pretty much 0:04:56.240 --> 0:04:58.159 everything is in bitcoin. So I do pay attention to price. 0:04:58.200 --> 0:05:01.840 But also if you I talked about this with someone 0:05:01.920 --> 0:05:04.719 previously that once you've done four years in bitcoin, it 0:05:04.720 --> 0:05:07.520 becomes easy. It's like your's your first tour of duty 0:05:07.560 --> 0:05:09.960 that starts. Your hands get stronger. Yeah, your hands get stronger, 0:05:10.000 --> 0:05:13.440 and then price affects you less because one you've experienced it, 0:05:13.839 --> 0:05:16.280 but hopefully you've been through one of those ten x five, 0:05:16.279 --> 0:05:19.000 ten x periods. So even though the total number dip 0:05:19.160 --> 0:05:22.320 is quite significant, you should be in a better financial position. 0:05:22.720 --> 0:05:25.520 So I pay attention to price, and I do get 0:05:25.520 --> 0:05:27.719 wrapped up in the excitement when the price runs up, 0:05:27.720 --> 0:05:29.400 but I also try to kind of bring myself back 0:05:29.400 --> 0:05:31.479 and say, well, what does this actually mean? You know, 0:05:31.560 --> 0:05:33.840 what does this mean for other people? But yeah, I 0:05:33.880 --> 0:05:35.560 mean it's it's hard not to get caught up in 0:05:35.600 --> 0:05:37.600 price sometimes. And you know what the interesting on the 0:05:37.640 --> 0:05:39.960 price right now, it's about the same price it was 0:05:39.960 --> 0:05:42.919 in February, which was like, huh really, So if you 0:05:42.920 --> 0:05:44.920 told me that it was a bit of a surprise. Yeah, 0:05:44.920 --> 0:05:46.200 we haven't had a lot of traction this year. I 0:05:46.200 --> 0:05:48.200 mean we jumped from I think we started the year 0:05:48.279 --> 0:05:50.560 thirty thousand, so we're almost double. But I mean it 0:05:50.600 --> 0:05:52.560 jumped really quickly to February to your point, right, and 0:05:52.640 --> 0:05:55.280 we've kind of fallen back down. By the way. You're 0:05:55.279 --> 0:05:56.720 listening to the Mark mar Show, and of course we're 0:05:56.720 --> 0:05:58.920 talking about bitcoin, and I'm sitting in the studio with 0:05:58.920 --> 0:06:02.360 with Peter McCormick for what bitcoin did. Check him out. 0:06:03.200 --> 0:06:05.440 Now we're talking about bitcoin, obviously we're talking about the 0:06:05.440 --> 0:06:09.599 price action. Um. I try to not get too excited 0:06:09.600 --> 0:06:11.000 when the price goes up because I don't want to 0:06:11.000 --> 0:06:12.520 get too excited when it goes up, because I don't 0:06:12.560 --> 0:06:14.760 want to feel like the press when it comes down. 0:06:15.680 --> 0:06:19.640 I constantly say that the price is a distraction, right, 0:06:19.680 --> 0:06:23.320 I mean, if you're in it for the education, the revolution, 0:06:23.400 --> 0:06:26.520 the technology, whatever, the price is just a distraction. I say, 0:06:26.520 --> 0:06:28.680 there's two things that we should really be focusing on, 0:06:29.600 --> 0:06:31.480 not the price. The things we should be focused on 0:06:31.480 --> 0:06:33.880 one and in a new technology, we'd focus on the 0:06:33.880 --> 0:06:37.520 the growth of the network metcast law. Is the network 0:06:37.520 --> 0:06:41.560 expanding and to the development on the network is the 0:06:41.760 --> 0:06:43.640 is the network growing? Is the development happening on the 0:06:43.640 --> 0:06:45.360 network and I think as long as those two things 0:06:45.400 --> 0:06:48.560 continue to grow, then the price takes care of itself. Yeah, 0:06:48.560 --> 0:06:50.400 and that's been happening. I mean, we had a massive 0:06:50.440 --> 0:06:52.760 upgrade to the network, we say with top proods something 0:06:52.839 --> 0:06:55.120 I don't understand fully what it's about, but I'm aware 0:06:55.160 --> 0:06:58.880 of what it brings to the network. We have, interestingly, 0:06:58.960 --> 0:07:03.080 a growing investment in developers in the network. We have 0:07:03.120 --> 0:07:07.200 a decentralization of the developers in the network with you know, 0:07:07.279 --> 0:07:09.520 historically a lot of developers are based out in the US, 0:07:09.600 --> 0:07:12.240 but John Newbery created a brink in the UK to 0:07:13.000 --> 0:07:15.120 support open source derev where a lot of the companies 0:07:15.160 --> 0:07:19.040 have started investing in supporting open sourced coin base, even 0:07:19.080 --> 0:07:22.720 did it um. So that's for me, that reassures me 0:07:22.800 --> 0:07:24.680 that that there are people out there who care for 0:07:24.720 --> 0:07:27.320 the network, care that there's enough developers and ensuring that 0:07:27.560 --> 0:07:32.320 we have this kind of decentralized base of developers. So 0:07:32.360 --> 0:07:34.960 that's super important. But I also agreed, like growth of 0:07:35.000 --> 0:07:37.720 the network and in growth in the network comes with 0:07:37.760 --> 0:07:39.480 a couple of things. There's obviously the amount of people 0:07:39.480 --> 0:07:41.880 are buying and accumulating bitcoin and holding it, which is 0:07:41.920 --> 0:07:45.880 super important, but also just this general awareness that's happening 0:07:45.880 --> 0:07:50.119 with bitcoin, whether it's the institutional adoption, whether it's whether 0:07:50.160 --> 0:07:53.360 it's the media reporting and good or bad. The growth 0:07:53.360 --> 0:07:55.560 in podcast I mean, there's so many podcasts now, so 0:07:55.600 --> 0:07:58.240 that all the things that sit outside of bitcoin itself 0:07:58.600 --> 0:08:01.480 that adds to the network, that support its growth, that 0:08:01.520 --> 0:08:04.480 support the education is also that's super important. And this 0:08:04.560 --> 0:08:06.760 last year, I mean it's funny. It's mark you can 0:08:06.800 --> 0:08:09.200 go online almost every day and see a story which 0:08:09.240 --> 0:08:11.160 is the kind of story four years ago which would 0:08:11.160 --> 0:08:13.320 have had read it going absolutely wild. And we kind 0:08:13.320 --> 0:08:15.080 of stories like that every day. It might be a 0:08:15.080 --> 0:08:18.880 bank in Thailand, it might be an institution in the US, 0:08:18.920 --> 0:08:20.880 it might be what's happening in El Salvador. But there's 0:08:20.960 --> 0:08:24.240 big news constantly happening with bitcoin. And you know, we 0:08:24.280 --> 0:08:26.440 talked about yesterday and you took you know, you mentioned 0:08:26.720 --> 0:08:28.840 the network takes, you know, a period to get to 0:08:28.880 --> 0:08:30.840 ten percent, and the time it takes the ten percent, 0:08:30.880 --> 0:08:32.439 it's the same period it goes from ten to ninety. 0:08:32.800 --> 0:08:35.720 I feel like we're about to do that ten to ninety. Yeah, yeah, 0:08:35.720 --> 0:08:38.720 that's exactly right. So we have the growth of the network, 0:08:38.720 --> 0:08:40.880 like the user base, so that's the Metcalf's lots like 0:08:40.920 --> 0:08:43.320 Dublin is becoming more valuable. And then the development, as 0:08:43.320 --> 0:08:45.160 you said, there's all these people developing. We have all 0:08:45.160 --> 0:08:49.720 these companies developing. This week we had big news of 0:08:50.120 --> 0:08:52.960 maybe an even bigger development happening. And one thing is 0:08:53.000 --> 0:08:55.839 it's the growth of the network, the development, but also 0:08:55.960 --> 0:08:59.600 the mind share that's being sucked into it. We had 0:08:59.600 --> 0:09:03.760 the c foe of Ray Dalio's Bridgewater Capital leave Bridgewater Capital, 0:09:03.880 --> 0:09:05.920 the biggest hedge fund, to go work at a bitcoin company. 0:09:06.000 --> 0:09:07.880 And we had a bigger announcement this week which I 0:09:07.880 --> 0:09:10.560 want to share with you in just a minute. By 0:09:10.559 --> 0:09:12.000 the way, you're listening to the Mark mo Show. We're 0:09:12.000 --> 0:09:16.320 talking about bitcoin, cryptocurrencies in the decentralized Revolution. I'm in 0:09:16.320 --> 0:09:18.600 the studio with my good friend Peter McCormick from the 0:09:18.640 --> 0:09:23.800 host of What Bitcoin Did, and we're talking about ignore 0:09:23.840 --> 0:09:26.240 the price. It's a distraction, but there's two bigger things 0:09:26.280 --> 0:09:28.160 that you should focus on. There was big news this 0:09:28.200 --> 0:09:30.199 week that just broke. I want to discuss when we 0:09:30.320 --> 0:09:32.800 come back from a break. So don't go away, all right, 0:09:32.840 --> 0:09:35.040 welcome back. You are listening to the markma Show, and 0:09:35.080 --> 0:09:37.920 we're talking about bitcoin. Of course, each and every week 0:09:37.960 --> 0:09:41.920 we're talking about cryptocurrencies. We're talking about the de centralized revolution. 0:09:42.720 --> 0:09:44.599 And I'm in the studio with a special guest, my 0:09:44.600 --> 0:09:47.640 good friend Peter McCormick. He's the host of What Bitcoin Did, 0:09:48.440 --> 0:09:51.640 probably the biggest bitcoin only podcast. You should be checking 0:09:51.679 --> 0:09:54.480 it out for sure. I was just on their last 0:09:54.640 --> 0:09:56.880 night recording, so make sure it tuned on that. Now. 0:09:56.880 --> 0:09:59.280 Before the break, we were talking about how the price 0:09:59.320 --> 0:10:01.400 of bitcoin it's down a little bit, all the way 0:10:01.400 --> 0:10:02.800 down to where it was a couple of weeks ago. 0:10:03.760 --> 0:10:06.360 And I was saying, how the bitcoin price is a distraction. 0:10:06.840 --> 0:10:09.120 I think it is the short term prices distraction. We 0:10:09.160 --> 0:10:10.719 want to look at the growth of the network and 0:10:10.760 --> 0:10:13.200 the development of the network. Now, I was teasing that 0:10:13.200 --> 0:10:14.760 there was some big news this week, and that is 0:10:14.840 --> 0:10:19.760 that the CEO of Twitter, Jack Dorsey, stepped down. Um, 0:10:19.800 --> 0:10:21.360 we don't know all the details of that, but he 0:10:21.360 --> 0:10:24.479 stepped down and he's running Square, which he's now rebranded 0:10:24.520 --> 0:10:28.360 from Square to Block. And then he had Square Crypto, 0:10:28.440 --> 0:10:31.720 which was a company that I think helps the bitcoin 0:10:31.760 --> 0:10:34.959 ecosystem grow. They rebranded that to Spiral and the news 0:10:34.960 --> 0:10:38.200 says that Spiral is going to be now funding open 0:10:38.240 --> 0:10:42.080 source dev for bitcoin, and he wanted to change the 0:10:42.160 --> 0:10:43.800 name because he don't want to say crypto. He just 0:10:43.840 --> 0:10:48.120 wanted to be bitcoin only and development on the network, 0:10:48.240 --> 0:10:51.760 stealing some of the best mind share in the world 0:10:52.520 --> 0:10:54.920 to come work to dedicate the rest of his career. 0:10:55.000 --> 0:10:56.920 It seems like on bitcoin, I mean, you gotta be 0:10:56.960 --> 0:10:59.319 bullish on that. Yeah, I mean, I think it's something 0:10:59.360 --> 0:11:02.400 that's been coming or for quite some time. Jack, as 0:11:02.480 --> 0:11:06.040 the CEO of Twitter has it could take a lot 0:11:06.040 --> 0:11:09.080 of flak over this last year or two, specifically with 0:11:09.160 --> 0:11:12.760 regards to censorship on Twitter. And I think there's a 0:11:12.800 --> 0:11:15.439 couple of things that play here. I'm only guessing. I 0:11:15.480 --> 0:11:18.480 can't answer for him. But firstly, whilst he's the CEO, 0:11:18.600 --> 0:11:21.120 there is a board, and there's a management team within 0:11:21.160 --> 0:11:23.120 the company, and the company has a share prize, and 0:11:23.160 --> 0:11:27.120 I think internally there's two pressures. Firstly, it's monetization of Twitter. 0:11:27.440 --> 0:11:29.920 Twitter has always kind of put monetization to the back. 0:11:29.960 --> 0:11:32.840 Whilst it's you know, it does bring in significant revenues, 0:11:32.880 --> 0:11:36.160 it's been way behind something, for example, like Facebook, but 0:11:36.720 --> 0:11:39.079 for the benefit of Twitter, I think of Twitter is 0:11:39.120 --> 0:11:41.400 more like the tortoise and Facebook as the hair. Now 0:11:41.400 --> 0:11:44.080 Facebook is facing the situation when nobody really trusts it. 0:11:44.120 --> 0:11:47.200 No one trusts Huckerberg, and I don't. I don't really 0:11:47.200 --> 0:11:49.600 know the long term position of Facebook is because most 0:11:49.600 --> 0:11:51.720 people I talked it, they're like, I don't really use 0:11:51.760 --> 0:11:54.280 it anymore. I know the kids don't use it. So 0:11:54.559 --> 0:11:57.000 I think he's done a really good job of being 0:11:57.040 --> 0:11:59.080 a steward of Twitter and making sure he doesn't ruin 0:11:59.160 --> 0:12:02.480 the it doesn't ruin the experience of Twitter by filling 0:12:02.480 --> 0:12:06.439 in it with commercial opportunities. I can imagine there is 0:12:06.480 --> 0:12:11.400 some pressure internally to expand the commercial revenue opportunities with Twitter, 0:12:11.760 --> 0:12:13.680 and that may be to the detriment of the experience. 0:12:13.679 --> 0:12:15.800 We've just seen now on my Twitter, Like every time 0:12:15.800 --> 0:12:17.480 there's a tweet, you're going to read the replies, there's 0:12:17.480 --> 0:12:19.840 always an ad there now, and it's just annoying. It 0:12:19.960 --> 0:12:22.800 ruins the experience. So I think that's one pressure. But 0:12:22.840 --> 0:12:25.760 I think the censorship one is a big issue. There 0:12:25.760 --> 0:12:28.000 are a lot of people concerned that the leader of 0:12:28.000 --> 0:12:30.120 the free world, Donald Trump, could be removed from Twitter. 0:12:30.160 --> 0:12:32.280 How he was. I won't get into the what I 0:12:32.440 --> 0:12:36.920 think of that, but there's also been a lot of Yeah, 0:12:37.120 --> 0:12:38.439 there has been a lot of action on Twitter in 0:12:38.559 --> 0:12:41.800 terms of like people being censored or removed for sharing opinions, 0:12:42.040 --> 0:12:44.920 you know, having thoughts discussed some particular topics, you know, 0:12:45.559 --> 0:12:49.000 specifically one with the election and two with COVID. I 0:12:49.040 --> 0:12:51.040 don't think Jack likes this, but I don't think he 0:12:51.080 --> 0:12:54.040 gets to control every decision within the company. And I think, 0:12:54.080 --> 0:12:55.559 you know, is he in it for the money. He 0:12:55.600 --> 0:12:57.560 doesn't need the money. So I think he's such a 0:12:57.600 --> 0:13:00.360 mission driven person. He's realized the best impact he can 0:13:00.360 --> 0:13:01.920 now have on the wall it is with freedom money, 0:13:02.000 --> 0:13:04.120 and it was with bitcoin, and now he's focused on 0:13:04.160 --> 0:13:05.760 that and he's going to work on that, and I 0:13:05.840 --> 0:13:07.680 salute that. I'm a big fan of Jack, so I 0:13:07.679 --> 0:13:10.959 think of him as a proper bitcoin Yeah. Yeah, that's 0:13:11.000 --> 0:13:13.439 a that's that's a good insight into that. By the way, 0:13:13.440 --> 0:13:15.760 you're listening to the Markma Show, we're talking about bitcoin. 0:13:15.800 --> 0:13:17.640 I'm sitting down with Peter McCormick, the host of What 0:13:17.679 --> 0:13:21.760 Bitcoin Did, and we're talking about how bitcoin is sucking 0:13:21.800 --> 0:13:23.840 in some of the greatest mind share in the world. 0:13:23.840 --> 0:13:26.440 And Jack Dorsey, who's built some amazing companies with Square 0:13:26.480 --> 0:13:28.560 and Twitter has now left to go work on bitcoin 0:13:28.640 --> 0:13:33.040 full time. I was saying last night we were talking about, um, 0:13:33.080 --> 0:13:35.880 you know, the direction of the world. Things aren't looking 0:13:35.920 --> 0:13:37.440 so bright in the short term. I think they're right 0:13:37.440 --> 0:13:39.720 in the long term. And I made a comment, I said, 0:13:39.840 --> 0:13:43.680 I'm bullish on what happens when millions of entrepreneurs backs 0:13:43.679 --> 0:13:46.760 are up against the ball. And Jack is one of 0:13:46.800 --> 0:13:49.200 those entrepreneurs, and so, um, you know, you have all 0:13:49.240 --> 0:13:52.240 these people that are like we call them no coiners, 0:13:52.440 --> 0:13:57.840 right or crypto people, and they're like, I think bitcoin's scam. 0:13:57.880 --> 0:14:00.880 I think bitcoin's ridiculous. I think bitcoin's pondsy. Bitcoin is 0:14:00.920 --> 0:14:03.040 never gonna go in whatever it is, right, And I'm like, 0:14:03.920 --> 0:14:06.679 are you smarter than Jack Dorsey? Are you smarter than 0:14:06.720 --> 0:14:10.520 Michael Sailor? Like? Do you put yourself there? I certainly don't. 0:14:10.559 --> 0:14:12.920 I'm humble enough to recognize that. You know, we're all 0:14:12.960 --> 0:14:16.160 geniuses in different ways. But when you see someone like 0:14:16.320 --> 0:14:19.400 Jack at Dorsey leave to go work on bitcoin, I mean, 0:14:19.440 --> 0:14:22.080 it's got to be reassuring, at least for me. Yeah, 0:14:22.120 --> 0:14:24.440 totally reassuring. Look, I mean he has the luxury of 0:14:24.520 --> 0:14:27.080 being able to work on whatever he wants. Not everybody 0:14:27.080 --> 0:14:29.080 has that, But why would he choose that? If that's 0:14:29.200 --> 0:14:31.320 he can do anything he wants. Well, I mean I 0:14:31.320 --> 0:14:34.320 think he's mission driven. What he realized is that important? Yeah, 0:14:34.360 --> 0:14:36.960 I think he realized it's important. He's mission driven. You know, 0:14:37.040 --> 0:14:39.880 he's clearly somebody has a conscience. He clearly has empathy 0:14:39.920 --> 0:14:42.320 in the world. You can see where he supports projects 0:14:42.360 --> 0:14:44.360 and where he puts money towards and he does a 0:14:44.360 --> 0:14:46.560 lot of that while in the face of having a 0:14:46.800 --> 0:14:50.040 huge amount of critics. Um, I just think there's like 0:14:50.680 --> 0:14:53.560 when he comes down to bitcoin versus say, all coins, 0:14:53.600 --> 0:14:56.920 I think it comes down to do you care? Like, 0:14:57.000 --> 0:14:59.600 what do you care about? You know? Because bitcoin is 0:14:59.840 --> 0:15:01.640 a chance to make money, but it's also a mission. 0:15:01.720 --> 0:15:04.600 Like we had a long, deep conversation and that has 0:15:05.080 --> 0:15:07.160 had a profound effect on me. I can't stop thinking 0:15:07.160 --> 0:15:09.880 about it, and it's made me realize the mission here 0:15:10.160 --> 0:15:12.200 is that if we do this, if we separate money 0:15:12.200 --> 0:15:15.160 and state, we create this great form of decentralized money, 0:15:15.560 --> 0:15:17.360 the impact on the world could be profound. It can 0:15:17.400 --> 0:15:19.720 take us away from a very scary outcome that's happening 0:15:19.720 --> 0:15:23.000 now where we are sliding towards totalitarianism across the world 0:15:23.440 --> 0:15:25.720 in places where you wouldn't exist in places that talk 0:15:25.720 --> 0:15:28.320 about freedom, like the US is meant to be the 0:15:28.440 --> 0:15:31.400 front lines of freedom, and Boris Johnson talks about the 0:15:31.480 --> 0:15:34.440 UK being a bastion of freedom. Not really, we are 0:15:34.560 --> 0:15:38.080 slipping into totalitarianism. So yeah, bitcoin is one of the 0:15:38.120 --> 0:15:40.680 most powerful weapons we have. What else would you want 0:15:40.720 --> 0:15:44.920 to work on? Well, both of us sitting here right now, 0:15:45.040 --> 0:15:46.440 by the way, you're listening to the market my show, 0:15:46.440 --> 0:15:48.840 we're talking about bitcoin. We're sitting down with Peter McCormick 0:15:48.840 --> 0:15:51.360 from what bitcoin did, but both of us have decided 0:15:51.400 --> 0:15:54.960 to dedicate our careers to working on bitcoin as well. So, um, 0:15:55.000 --> 0:15:58.680 we've already done it. Obviously Jack's at a whole other level. 0:15:59.240 --> 0:16:01.520 But I mean, it's just assuring and like I said, 0:16:01.600 --> 0:16:04.240 the short term price, it's a distraction. It's gonna take 0:16:04.280 --> 0:16:07.400 care of itself. I think you want to focus on 0:16:08.040 --> 0:16:11.080 I talked about it. I I still am, but I 0:16:11.120 --> 0:16:13.000 started my career as a real estate investor and I 0:16:13.040 --> 0:16:15.080 talked about it like, um, let's say that you know 0:16:15.120 --> 0:16:18.240 outside of town, Um, there's nothing out there. It's like empty, 0:16:18.240 --> 0:16:21.760 and we're at the city council meeting, and they said, hey, 0:16:21.800 --> 0:16:24.200 we're gonna build a new stadium out a footballer stadium 0:16:24.200 --> 0:16:27.360 out there in five years, right, And we're like, dang, tomorrow, 0:16:27.440 --> 0:16:29.600 let's go buy some land around that area because once 0:16:29.640 --> 0:16:31.080 that stadium was gonna be worth a lot of money. 0:16:31.240 --> 0:16:33.160 So we buy the lamb and in a year from 0:16:33.200 --> 0:16:37.200 now the lot next to us is cheaper. What should 0:16:37.240 --> 0:16:39.880 we panic? Should we sell the lot? Well, I don't 0:16:39.880 --> 0:16:43.160 know is the is the stadium still on track, are 0:16:43.200 --> 0:16:45.080 they working on the plans, have they got the permits, 0:16:45.120 --> 0:16:46.640 do they have the funding? And if all those things 0:16:46.680 --> 0:16:49.280 are there, we should maybe buy the cheaper land, right 0:16:49.960 --> 0:16:52.000 or if they found out that there's nuclear waste on 0:16:52.040 --> 0:16:54.040 the land, we'll shoot. We should probably sell as fast 0:16:54.040 --> 0:16:56.520 as we can. And so like the price is dipped, 0:16:57.080 --> 0:17:00.200 but Jack is leaving to go keep working on right. 0:17:00.240 --> 0:17:03.680 The development is still happening. Blocks are still being produced 0:17:03.720 --> 0:17:07.800 every ten minutes um anyway, so there's nothing goes up 0:17:07.840 --> 0:17:09.720 in the straight line, you know, if you go back. 0:17:09.720 --> 0:17:12.359 We talked yesterday about the Internet. I was there at 0:17:12.359 --> 0:17:14.800 the start of the Internet. I was coding HTML pages, 0:17:15.200 --> 0:17:18.639 I was developing websites, and back then I didn't buy 0:17:18.680 --> 0:17:21.439 any shares and companies. But I remember the crash, remember 0:17:21.480 --> 0:17:23.840 pet dot com. I remember with than and you know 0:17:23.880 --> 0:17:26.119 there were survivors. One of the survivors was Amazon, but 0:17:26.160 --> 0:17:29.680 their share price was really hit, dropped from it went 0:17:29.720 --> 0:17:32.760 from five to eighty and then like back down to five. Yeah. 0:17:32.840 --> 0:17:34.480 And you know some people would have thought, oh the 0:17:34.520 --> 0:17:36.560 prices did, maybe I should sell this, maybe I should 0:17:36.560 --> 0:17:38.880 be scared, but smart people accumulated. Look at the share price. 0:17:38.920 --> 0:17:41.960 Now Amazon is like one of the top three largest 0:17:41.960 --> 0:17:44.280 companies in the world. So listen, that's going to happen 0:17:44.320 --> 0:17:47.000 with bitcoin. But the truth is with bitcoin is that 0:17:47.080 --> 0:17:49.840 good money kills bad. Good money kills bad, and bitcoin 0:17:49.960 --> 0:17:51.640 is good money. So whether it goes up and down, 0:17:51.680 --> 0:17:54.480 I don't care. I'm thinking about five to ten years, Mark, 0:17:54.680 --> 0:17:56.520 I'm thinking about what my money means to me then, 0:17:56.760 --> 0:17:58.639 and will bitcoin be worth more than five to ten 0:17:58.680 --> 0:18:02.679 years certainly. Yeah. You're listening to the markma Show. We're 0:18:02.680 --> 0:18:05.360 sitting down with Peter McCormick, the host of What Bitcoin Did, 0:18:05.400 --> 0:18:09.200 probably the largest podcast in the bitcoin space, and we're 0:18:09.200 --> 0:18:11.240 gonna be right back all right, Welcome back. You are 0:18:11.280 --> 0:18:13.760 listening to the Mark Moa Show, where we are talking 0:18:13.800 --> 0:18:17.080 about bitcoin each and every week. Make sure pull out 0:18:17.080 --> 0:18:19.440 your phone put a reminder join me each and every week. 0:18:19.480 --> 0:18:22.240 It's going to be the most profitable, the most important 0:18:22.240 --> 0:18:26.840 part of your week talking about bitcoin the largest. It's 0:18:26.880 --> 0:18:29.159