Speaker 1: This is me Eat podcast coming at you shirtless, severely,
Speaker 1: bug bitten and in my case, underwear listening podcast. You
Speaker 1: can't predict anything presented by first light, Go farther, stay longer,
Speaker 1: all right. First off, right before we do anything YouTube,
Speaker 1: Right now, you can go watch The B Side of
Speaker 1: Fishing with our very own beloved Joseph Melli. So Joseph
Speaker 1: Melli used to be in the old days, it was
Speaker 1: hook Shots with Joe Sph Melli. But now Joseph Melli
Speaker 1: works with us. It's got a brand new fishing series
Speaker 1: that we're launching on YouTube called The B Side of
Speaker 1: Fishing with Joel Sph Melli. You can go right now
Speaker 1: and watch. And we're doing it like how they used
Speaker 1: to do in the old days, in the old days
Speaker 1: when you had to uh when there would be a day.
Speaker 1: So on Tuesdays, we're gonna keep putting out B Side
Speaker 1: of Fishing with Joel Sph Mellie's tune in every Tuesday.
Speaker 1: While you're there. Subscribe, so you go to the met
Speaker 1: Eater YouTube channels subscribe, you know, to get all our
Speaker 1: stuff because you're a subscriber. So check it out now.
Speaker 1: Joseph Melli is great also you should go follow Joe's Hey,
Speaker 1: what's Joe Simmelli's Instagram handle? And look, if you want
Speaker 1: to keep track of all of our fishing stuff and
Speaker 1: Joe Surmelli in particular, and all of our fishing stuff,
Speaker 1: Seth will tell you it's Joe dot Surmelli one three eight.
Speaker 1: What the one three eight's all about? I don't know
Speaker 1: j O E dot c E r m E l
Speaker 1: E one. Yeah, go because Joe, Like, that's a long story.
Speaker 1: Hook shots Joe, He's now b side of Fish and Joe.
Speaker 1: And then also the Bent Podcast. If you if you
Speaker 1: love Joe and I do, you can also listen to
Speaker 1: Joe on on the on the Bent Podcast. We got
Speaker 1: a lot more stuff. I'm gonna be fishing with Joe
Speaker 1: in New Jersey coming up here real soon. What are
Speaker 1: you fishing for stripers? You didn't know about that? Heck,
Speaker 1: yeah that's cool. I'm not gonna tell people why, but yeah,
Speaker 1: fishing stripers. And Joel sah Mellie sweet the bite uh
Speaker 1: speaking on Instagram Unbelievable engagement a podcast list that wrote
Speaker 1: in that he had the greatest trail camp video I
Speaker 1: ever taken, and I was like, can't be true, send
Speaker 1: it to me. It's the kind of trail camp video
Speaker 1: where he needed to explain it before it because he
Speaker 1: felt it was irresponsible to send it without first explaining
Speaker 1: what it was. It is a trail cam that they
Speaker 1: had set up on a field edge and they caught
Speaker 1: a farmer driving by an attractor and the farmer, without
Speaker 1: stopping the tractor, opens the door and hangs out of
Speaker 1: the tractor to defecate, not even stopping the tractor. Doug
Speaker 1: during I ran us by Doug durn and Doug during
Speaker 1: acts surprised that there's any other way to go, as though,
Speaker 1: you know, he has his coffee in the morning and
Speaker 1: then goes and gets in a tractor like very common practice.
Speaker 1: A guy. Half million people watched this farmer. There's some
Speaker 1: great comments I had will blur out the farmer's face,
Speaker 1: but I also left it open that I was so
Speaker 1: impressed with the farmer's work ethic that if he wants
Speaker 1: to come work with us, he's hired right now. Any
Speaker 1: man that that bleeds in his job that much, that
Speaker 1: doesn't even stop to you know, him and the Amazon
Speaker 1: workers have a lot in common, Yeah, but the differences
Speaker 1: they complain he didn't. Yeah, he looks he might make
Speaker 1: a plaining. He looked fine to me. You don't know.
Speaker 1: You you got to talk to talk, you know what.
Speaker 1: You're right, Rick, he could be he could be uh
Speaker 1: real upset about that he has to keep He's like,
Speaker 1: I'm on such a tight schedule. He's Doug also pointed
Speaker 1: out that he's pulling him anwer spreader, so it could
Speaker 1: be in his mind he's like, listen, they're paying me
Speaker 1: the spread manure. Why would I right not contribute? Why
Speaker 1: would I go off in the bushes when my whole
Speaker 1: thing is I'm out here spreading ner don't long haul
Speaker 1: truckers engage in something similar. Yeah, yeah, when you're driving
Speaker 1: down the road and you see a yeah, have you
Speaker 1: repeated the jug? Yeah? I did it the other day.
Speaker 1: I was stuck on the freeway in l A. And
Speaker 1: I had to do it. Man, I did analogy. I
Speaker 1: swear to God, you know that. Yeah, I was thinking
Speaker 1: about it. Trap. The angle can be tricky because if
Speaker 1: it's tilted to tilted it was. It was nerve racking, terrifying.
Speaker 1: It's hard moving along. Um I gotta do uh okay,
Speaker 1: a few episodes to go. I was complaining about my
Speaker 1: new tooth, my molar complaining bad. And it was thinking
Speaker 1: about how my dentist listened to the show. I like,
Speaker 1: I wasn't listen. I'm the one that is my tooth problem,
Speaker 1: and I should have alerted him. I shouldn't have chosen
Speaker 1: that way to let him know that I wasn't happy
Speaker 1: with my tooth. But boy did he make it right. Uh,
Speaker 1: he heard me talking about it had me down. It
Speaker 1: went for me my least favorite tooth and my most
Speaker 1: favorite tooth. You put a little gap in there so
Speaker 1: stuff doesn't took the gap out. Oh it's tight. Here's
Speaker 1: what happened. Remember how I was telling you that you
Speaker 1: should get your molar replaced because your teeth migrate. Okay,
Speaker 1: Well he put the tooth in and then the other
Speaker 1: tooth like moved away from the tooth, and that's what
Speaker 1: made that food trap. Didn't like it, no, but now
Speaker 1: it's my best tooth. I asked my dentist if he
Speaker 1: needs an endorsement. He said he's been around long enough
Speaker 1: that it doesn't that he doesn't need to go out
Speaker 1: and look for clients. But he's a hunting dentist. Kevin,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna tell you his name, Kevin Pierce. I'm gonna
Speaker 1: be I'm gonna be a client of his BDS. You
Speaker 1: should go to him. He is the reason I bringing
Speaker 1: this up. He is very concerned about how you won't
Speaker 1: replace your molar. I know. That's why I want to
Speaker 1: go down there and talk to him about that. He
Speaker 1: previewed for me how he's gonna convince you of the
Speaker 1: need to get a new molar. And it has to
Speaker 1: do with a doll sheep he shot one time. Well,
Speaker 1: I hope he's I think that. Hope he's bringing his
Speaker 1: a game. My dentist. Ah, this is funny because it's
Speaker 1: gonna tie into a thing we're gonna talk about a
Speaker 1: little bit, uh about where krim and who's unfortunately not
Speaker 1: with us right now. It's curious why we always have
Speaker 1: to turn everything into a competition who did most of what,
Speaker 1: to the point where there seems to be a bragging
Speaker 1: about who's been shot most um. But uh, he's gotten
Speaker 1: double digit mountain goats because he grew up in Alaska. WHOA, yeah,
Speaker 1: he grew up where like you get out of school
Speaker 1: and go hunt mountain goats for a couple of hours.
Speaker 1: That's like the casual. Yeah, he's telling me a great
Speaker 1: story about his old man got mauled by a grizzly
Speaker 1: mauled by a brown bear, and then his old man
Speaker 1: killed the brown bear, and then the other brown bears
Speaker 1: came and ate that brown bear, and the whole thing
Speaker 1: was so vicious and heavy and everything that he said,
Speaker 1: it stripped all the blueberry bushes were all broken off
Speaker 1: and gone. And he and his brother were back there
Speaker 1: recently and he said, you can still tell that area
Speaker 1: because the blueberry bushes that grew back as high as
Speaker 1: the blueberry bushes around it. You said, there's still a
Speaker 1: big like death circle around where he's like they're walking
Speaker 1: along and said, that's the tree where dad got mauled.
Speaker 1: That's crazy. Yeah. Cool dentists, man, Yeah, great dentists. Yeah,
Speaker 1: totally cool. Like man did not just you know publicly. Uh,
Speaker 1: it's my favorite tooth now. Um. Another thing I want
Speaker 1: to touch on real quick. I had my kids got
Speaker 1: this new game. It's called on a scale of one
Speaker 1: to t Rex. And in this game, it's kind of
Speaker 1: hard to explaining, but we're playing the game a lot
Speaker 1: and you have to it's like there's a shade component
Speaker 1: to it. In one of the shrades as you need
Speaker 1: to act like you're driving a car and someone's pursuing you.
Speaker 1: And we were playing the game, and that night I
Speaker 1: had a dream that uh needs to be turned into art,
Speaker 1: and I had to dream of a fox riding a
Speaker 1: horse with the rabbits in his a rabbit in his mouth,
Speaker 1: looking over his shoulder as though being pursued. I bring
Speaker 1: that up. You should have him with a chicken in
Speaker 1: its mouth, like the fox in the henhouse. He's being
Speaker 1: pursued with a chicken. I'll bring that up for any
Speaker 1: artists out there. Uh inspiration. Oh yeah, amazing. It'd be
Speaker 1: an amazing painting. A fox riding a horse would wrap
Speaker 1: in his mouth, looking over his shoulder, as though very
Speaker 1: alarmed about who's pursuing him. Kelsey fan art. Um, he's
Speaker 1: too busy, Robert abernathey's here with us. We're gonna get
Speaker 1: to you. We gotta take care of a few things
Speaker 1: up top. Hang tight, you're actually gonna come into this
Speaker 1: in a minute here. Uh. Tons of listener responses that
Speaker 1: we've had to deal with about because we like to
Speaker 1: talk about flashing and how South's super good at flashing stuff. Um.
Speaker 1: The whole thing of like pressure water. Like it was like,
Speaker 1: oh you should pressure water. You've met this Robert pressure
Speaker 1: water like flushing raccoons and a pressure washer. Flushing beavers
Speaker 1: with a pressure washing. It's not a really granted like
Speaker 1: some people do it. It is. It is not a
Speaker 1: thing worth recommending to people. Um, I agree. Now, a
Speaker 1: friend of mine who is a professional hide handler, and
Speaker 1: I asked him what his take on it is, and
Speaker 1: he said, here's his sentence. Just imagining beaver fat and
Speaker 1: meat spread over an acre after being sprayed in every
Speaker 1: direction has limited my interest. And it's and he says
Speaker 1: also that it only works when it's they do it
Speaker 1: in the winter and it's frozen outside, that you can't
Speaker 1: do it. But yeah, it's like you take a pressure
Speaker 1: washer and you take a hide that you want to
Speaker 1: get tanned or tan yourself and strip it of fat
Speaker 1: and meat, clean down the leather with a pressure washer.
Speaker 1: This dude, Stu. I was watching this because like it
Speaker 1: has a horrible I mean blows the stuff everywhere. So
Speaker 1: there's a professional fur handler named stew and he's got
Speaker 1: this thing. If you want to learn like great fur
Speaker 1: handling techniques. This dude stuff coon Creek Outdoors. He does
Speaker 1: a big explanation of like why it is complete horseshit.
Speaker 1: He's a video on his channel about it. Right, He's like, here,
Speaker 1: let's set it up. Let's do everything just right and
Speaker 1: set it up. It's just not the same thing. He's
Speaker 1: a guy that throws him in the washing machine too, right.
Speaker 1: He does wash all of his hides in the washing
Speaker 1: machine after fleshing or before. He's adamant that it's pre flashing.
Speaker 1: Whoa why is that it's easier to dry with fat
Speaker 1: and stuff on it? So when he everything he does.
Speaker 1: When he skins a fox, he skins the fox, no detergent,
Speaker 1: just cold water, washes it in the classic washing machine.
Speaker 1: He's got washing machine in his first chet with no
Speaker 1: lid on I noticed. Puts it down in there and
Speaker 1: washes it, pulls it out, hangs it the dry. But
Speaker 1: the dude is very very attention to detail, very attention
Speaker 1: to detail. If you want to learn, nothing gets you said, no, No,
Speaker 1: I I go to him all the time. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: go to his channel, you know, to learn stuff. What's
Speaker 1: his last name is, Steve Miller? I don't remember. Has
Speaker 1: he been on here? He should be uh? He hasn't
Speaker 1: Coon Creek Outdoors great stuff? I mean, like, if you
Speaker 1: just like seeing how to do stuff, he does an
Speaker 1: interesting job of explaining how to do stuff. Uh well,
Speaker 1: I was thinking about why that's the wrong way to
Speaker 1: do it. There's this book and I'm gonna do a
Speaker 1: major book report on this book. But Alaska's Wolfman, which
Speaker 1: I've been talking about a lot. In this book, he
Speaker 1: goes to his prospector's house and the prospect of houses
Speaker 1: that he talks about it is the kind of the grossest,
Speaker 1: grimiest place he's ever spent night. But the prospect or
Speaker 1: keeps his plates screwed to the table able top. I read.
Speaker 1: I read the book. Yeah, it's great book. Isn't read
Speaker 1: that book? Really? I remember? You know what you mean?
Speaker 1: My brother Daniel the only people that ever read that book.
Speaker 1: He has dogs, and the guy wonders like, why are
Speaker 1: the plates screwed to the table permanently? And it's because
Speaker 1: he just eats, and then the dogs and get up
Speaker 1: and lick the plates clean, and the plate doesn't move
Speaker 1: around so they can get an extra clean and then
Speaker 1: that's how he does. Is I like that idea, dude?
Speaker 1: And I'm just saying that that that's deud be like
Speaker 1: people if I if every time me and Seth talked
Speaker 1: about washing dishes, if someone's like, oh, non't no, you
Speaker 1: don't need to wash dishes. Just screwed the plate to
Speaker 1: a dog. Get a dog. That's like the pressure washing flasher. People,
Speaker 1: but steal plate. I don't know. Yeah, imagine you can't
Speaker 1: you can't drill hole? Yeah no, no, you could take
Speaker 1: specialized equipment. Uh, you're familiar with pressing Pittman. Robert has
Speaker 1: a big turn you man. He was on the show.
Speaker 1: We're still on our listener feedback section here. Robert. He
Speaker 1: was on the show and he was talking about how
Speaker 1: he got shot twice. And then Karin, our producer, was curious,
Speaker 1: why did we then get so many emails of people
Speaker 1: talking about that ain't nothing uh based on how many
Speaker 1: times I've been shot? And a guy writes in the
Speaker 1: guy named Zach. He writes in, I've been listening to
Speaker 1: episode two sixty four of the podcast The Guests was
Speaker 1: shot twice, and you all think that's crazy. My father
Speaker 1: has been a guiding outfitter for almost forty years. He's
Speaker 1: been shot thirteen times. Jeez, the question and it has
Speaker 1: had several dog shots. Just find you might all find
Speaker 1: that interesting. Karin asked, why do folks dare I say,
Speaker 1: mostly men in my own experience, seems so often to
Speaker 1: give into the tendency of making something a competition. I
Speaker 1: understand that some things might reasonably and legitimately be structured
Speaker 1: as competitive, but why is there an impulse in this
Speaker 1: case to one up Preston regarding the number of times
Speaker 1: he's been shot because it didn't kill him. My dad
Speaker 1: was shot one time he was hunting. What happened? Uh,
Speaker 1: As he likes to point out, made it all the
Speaker 1: way through World War Two without getting scratched by a bullet,
Speaker 1: got scratch brother stuff I've never scratched, but shot through
Speaker 1: his rain poncho during the war, shot through rain. Never
Speaker 1: I brought us up, never forgave the Germans. Um got home.
Speaker 1: It was hunting rabbits with his nephew and his nephew.
Speaker 1: They're walking along and his nephew put a load of
Speaker 1: bird shot right into the side of his foot, and
Speaker 1: they kept a secret. Was he aiming at a rabbit?
Speaker 1: Just walking? Just shot? They were walking side by. I
Speaker 1: saw it and shot it right into his foot, and
Speaker 1: they kept kept it secret, and he was at his
Speaker 1: and he went and laid on his couch. I came here.
Speaker 1: If he was a grammar, if he was at his
Speaker 1: grandma's or his mom's or something, was laid up on
Speaker 1: the couch, and every time about how lazy he was
Speaker 1: now and everything. But it's because he's been shot in
Speaker 1: the foot. Yeah, but how did he It must not
Speaker 1: have been a serious wind or did no? He would
Speaker 1: he would, he would back when he used to X
Speaker 1: ray your foot, see if you should fit right? Uh,
Speaker 1: this is before my time. He would go and show
Speaker 1: everybody all those shotgun pelts in his foot. Oh wow, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I've explained as much when I when we had I
Speaker 1: ran all of his ashes through a screen. Did you
Speaker 1: get the lead back? Yeah? But I think you know, melted, melted. Ye.
Speaker 1: I couldn't find it. Found all kinds of dental work,
Speaker 1: and I couldn't find the lead, says the guys and
Speaker 1: shot thirteen times? Just where have you been? Well? I know,
Speaker 1: but just bringing that up again and saying that, I
Speaker 1: feel it sounds like anybody that wants to brag about
Speaker 1: being shot thirteen times, it's probably their problem. Like they
Speaker 1: got to think about who they're hunting with and where
Speaker 1: they're hunting. He's a guy, he's he's hut with clients. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, but you should do a better job. There's
Speaker 1: something he's not doing something. But yeah, so to take
Speaker 1: on Charnce thing about it's not like I think, Krint,
Speaker 1: God bless you. It's not bragging. I don't think you're bragging.
Speaker 1: Like generally, like I I'm put in my note here
Speaker 1: at any given moment for creing to see everyone at
Speaker 1: any given moment, most people are trying not to get shot.
Speaker 1: Like generally, among all the other things you're doing, you're
Speaker 1: trying not to get shot. Yeah, and it's there. It's
Speaker 1: only the survivors that wrote in. So it's you're not
Speaker 1: you're not bragging. You're like observing about it. Because if
Speaker 1: you were said, like I go to the gym every day,
Speaker 1: look at my big muscles, that's bragging because you're trying
Speaker 1: to get them and then you got them and you
Speaker 1: alert people. But if you go through life trying not
Speaker 1: to get shot and then you get shot, it's not
Speaker 1: a bragging point. It's more of a you're right that
Speaker 1: people make stuff into competition. We had we had a
Speaker 1: bench press competition your day and a pull up competition. Right,
Speaker 1: there is a sense that if you get if you
Speaker 1: get shot and you survive it, that it's a madge
Speaker 1: of honor that you've avoided something that could be far worse.
Speaker 1: So once or twice is like I got struck by lightning.
Speaker 1: It's like, look and I made it like somehow miraculous.
Speaker 1: That man is that man bragging the man that says
Speaker 1: I've been struck by lightning. Well, if somebody then goes,
Speaker 1: but I've been struck, that's pretty cool. But I've been
Speaker 1: struck five times. What it's just called one upsmanship. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so it's related. It's related to attention seeking impulse, like
Speaker 1: this unique fact about me. We might all be similar looking,
Speaker 1: but guess what, guys, I've been shot three times. However,
Speaker 1: if we were sitting here, one guy got struck by
Speaker 1: lightning and then the other guy got struck five times, legitimately,
Speaker 1: it would be very hard for him to sit here
Speaker 1: and not saying I was the same. It's like when
Speaker 1: people go talking about their international travels. This one time
Speaker 1: I went to Papa, New Guinea, and then somebody else
Speaker 1: was like, oh, that's pretty cool, But I lived in
Speaker 1: I don't know. With the Bush people, you know, they
Speaker 1: it's one up and ship, so it is related to uh.
Speaker 1: I think it is gender related to us for sure.
Speaker 1: But we all know that I'm has your dad been
Speaker 1: shot Chester? My dad has not been shot, not that
Speaker 1: I'm aware, we all know. We all now know I'm
Speaker 1: cooler than Chester because my dad was shot. So that
Speaker 1: story was great. So like like that's better than Chester,
Speaker 1: Like that makes me better than Chester, clearly, And that
Speaker 1: impulse actually helped. I think it's like a storytelling them.
Speaker 1: S room girl, my dad's kind of been struck by lightning.
Speaker 1: Well yeah, but if somebody were to say I've been
Speaker 1: struck thirteen times by lightning, I would be very curious
Speaker 1: why they keep getting struck by lightning. Well, I got
Speaker 1: a question. Are they counting like if he's running, like
Speaker 1: if he's doing like bird hunting, are they counting incidents
Speaker 1: of him getting shot? Or they counting like the amount
Speaker 1: of babies in his Like, Oh, I'm sure it's instances
Speaker 1: because you can't count. We'll have to have we'll have
Speaker 1: we'll have to have currency. If you can get the
Speaker 1: guy to come on the show for a minute, we'll
Speaker 1: ask him how he keeps getting shot, maybe we can
Speaker 1: give him some insight by how to at least reduced
Speaker 1: the amount of shootings you're involved in because one of
Speaker 1: them is eventually going to get him. Wonder what he
Speaker 1: considers shot. Listen, it might be I've been shot if
Speaker 1: you count catching bird shot. Yeah, same like dove hunting
Speaker 1: and stuff. Just like oh, someone d away from me,
Speaker 1: I don't count smacks you. But the reason I bring out,
Speaker 1: the reason I bring Oh. Then krit also went on
Speaker 1: to say, then she also has asked, like, why do
Speaker 1: people like this competitive thing I think gets into like
Speaker 1: fishing contests, kyot hunting contests. It's different. Those are completely different.
Speaker 1: I don't know, talking about whether you've been shot or not.
Speaker 1: It is not the same thing as going to a
Speaker 1: fishing derby. No, But I also don't know if it's
Speaker 1: a gender thing, because like I'm very on competitive and
Speaker 1: I know women that are extremely competitive, like I have
Speaker 1: friends were very competitive. So I don't know if it's
Speaker 1: like because she's saying it is a gender thing, I
Speaker 1: think if you took she she's saying, in her experience,
Speaker 1: it seems to be waited that way, And I would
Speaker 1: think that if you took um a hundred men, hundred
Speaker 1: American man, randomly selected men, and a hundred randomly selected
Speaker 1: American women, and put a question to them like, um,
Speaker 1: raise your hand if you been in a competition in
Speaker 1: the last week. I feel I have a suspicion that
Speaker 1: more male, and it could there's it could it's social,
Speaker 1: you know, cultural social. I'm not saying it's like it's
Speaker 1: like like like a genetic thing, but but I just
Speaker 1: think you'd have more I think the hundred dudes that
Speaker 1: have more hands, shoot, yeah, but it could be like
Speaker 1: it could be like totally socially constructed. I do think
Speaker 1: when people are asked if they're competitive, it's sometimes in
Speaker 1: certain circles is a negative thing. Oh no, if you're competitive,
Speaker 1: you care too much about like little things. I could
Speaker 1: I could get real upset if we like we're trying
Speaker 1: to make baskets into a trash, can make it like
Speaker 1: throw So I would just be like, God, I lost,
Speaker 1: I didn't get my we played horse today. I mean,
Speaker 1: I really don't want to lose. Ever, I lose all
Speaker 1: the time, but I mean it upsets me. It doesn't
Speaker 1: matter how minor. But there's also thing that happen but
Speaker 1: there's like a bullshit thing that happens to women where
Speaker 1: it's more like if a dude is described as competitive,
Speaker 1: he's a competitive you know, it's like that's laudatory. But
Speaker 1: it can also be a thing that you'd say about
Speaker 1: a woman that would be like like not flattery. Right, Well,
Speaker 1: she's very competitive, and it's like it's bad, it's a
Speaker 1: bad double standard. We the reason go ahead, I would say,
Speaker 1: we amongst our friend group, we have a little shed
Speaker 1: hunting competition going a must be out of the friend group. Well,
Speaker 1: it's just like it's yeah, me too, man, it's a
Speaker 1: different it's a different friend group, but just like like
Speaker 1: the not the not good friends, not other good friends.
Speaker 1: It's better. But anyway, this is not the points still different. Um,
Speaker 1: the most competitive person in this little shed hunt competition
Speaker 1: is Kelsey, my girlfriend. Literally she's out there right now
Speaker 1: for the competition purpose and she loves to do it,
Speaker 1: but yeah, she wants to win, wants to win. There
Speaker 1: you have, it settles that the reason I bring this up, Robert,
Speaker 1: you were you were actually uh um, you expressed some
Speaker 1: opinions about bird shot that people use, and I noticed
Speaker 1: you actually factored in the experience of one being shot
Speaker 1: right in your bird shot selection. All right, I've been
Speaker 1: shot twice, not thirteen times, just twice. But I counted
Speaker 1: as peppering. I mean, if I get peppered and it
Speaker 1: penetrates clothing, you know it didn't. It didn't have to
Speaker 1: draw blood. But I got shot turkey hunting, and uh,
Speaker 1: the guy shot me with a duplex load back up.
Speaker 1: I gotta I gotta get a couple of things straight.
Speaker 1: You're saying that you count it being shot if it
Speaker 1: penetrates your clothes. Yea, if he aims a gun at
Speaker 1: me and pulls the trigger with the intent of causing
Speaker 1: bodily harm. That's what the turkey hunter did. He thought
Speaker 1: I was a turkey. Yeah, I got shot me and
Speaker 1: then a kid shot me pheasant hunting. The pheasant flush
Speaker 1: between us, and I saw the shotgun barrel. I looked
Speaker 1: down the shotgun barrel and hit the dirt and the
Speaker 1: gun went off as I was falling, and it went
Speaker 1: through my hat and luckily didn't didn't draw blood. One
Speaker 1: pellet hit me between the eyes, and if it had
Speaker 1: been a half an inch to either side, it was
Speaker 1: gone through an eye. But it hit me on the
Speaker 1: bridge of the nose, and uh, and two or three
Speaker 1: pellets in the shoulder or something, but they didn't penetrate
Speaker 1: the skin. But it wasn't getting rained on you. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that has all the time that it rains down on you.
Speaker 1: But the turkey hunt. And I've been working a bird
Speaker 1: and it quit goblin and just like one did this morning,
Speaker 1: quick goblin. And so I slipped down in this little
Speaker 1: bottom and I was looking, and there was a clear cut,
Speaker 1: and I said, well, maybe he went out in that
Speaker 1: clear cut. And I was glass and I was looking.
Speaker 1: I heard a clock up on the up on the
Speaker 1: hill and and one of gobble. It was clock was
Speaker 1: just one clock. And hunters never just make one cluck.
Speaker 1: They're they're like they're just calling calling, it's just one clock.
Speaker 1: But there was a firebreak running up the hill, and
Speaker 1: I just thought, you know, if there's somebody walking that firebreak,
Speaker 1: maybe he's but it's eighty yards the top of the hill.
Speaker 1: I'll see him if if it's a hunter. But I
Speaker 1: got behind a tree anyway, and thinking about getting shot. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I got behind a tree. But why were you thinking
Speaker 1: he was gonna shoot you? I'd been shot once and
Speaker 1: didn't want to get shot again. And I got shot
Speaker 1: that morning. I don't want to shot a third time.
Speaker 1: And uh but uh but I turned to look out
Speaker 1: into the clear cut and as I turned, I picked
Speaker 1: my leg up and set it on a stump, so
Speaker 1: you know, I was standing up straight and I kind
Speaker 1: of went like that to rest myself and he shot me,
Speaker 1: and uh two pellets hit me in the leg and
Speaker 1: one hit me on the side of the head. If
Speaker 1: I hadn't if I hadn't turned my head at that moment,
Speaker 1: it would hit me in the face. It was only
Speaker 1: one pellet and I yelled and he came running down
Speaker 1: the hill. He was when that when the game wardings
Speaker 1: investigated the incident, he said, oh, well, it looks like
Speaker 1: you're okay. Well, we'll see you later and he left
Speaker 1: and I called, you know, he's supposed to report an incidents.
Speaker 1: I reported. He was eighty five yards away when we
Speaker 1: found the shell. We found the shell. That that's how
Speaker 1: we knew it was a duplex shell. And then we
Speaker 1: went down to the tree I was standing behind. There
Speaker 1: were twenty five pellets in the tree that I was
Speaker 1: standing behind, and he was shooting a three and a
Speaker 1: half inch duplex shell. With two sports and sixes or
Speaker 1: two sixes seven a half, so I'm not sure. But
Speaker 1: the two it is what penetrated the seam on my pants.
Speaker 1: And it's the only one that really stung. The sixes,
Speaker 1: you know, they didn't staying it wasn't bad, but the
Speaker 1: number two penetrated the uh you know, my my camouflage,
Speaker 1: you know, not just the cloth, but the seam of
Speaker 1: the cloth and went in. And you know number two
Speaker 1: is number twos. Tell you up. Some states it's legal
Speaker 1: to shoot turkey's buckshot. Some of the states there's no left.
Speaker 1: I mean, he shouldn't be anything. Oh dude. And um,
Speaker 1: you know the same thing with rifles. You got people
Speaker 1: in you can that's a whole debate. But you got
Speaker 1: people in hunting full camo, no blaze, orange and other
Speaker 1: people using rifles. How does he how I just don't
Speaker 1: understand anybody, like, especially after this week where the turkeys
Speaker 1: come in. They came in within like twenty five yards, right,
Speaker 1: forty maybe? Yeah, how do you confuse that with a person? Well,
Speaker 1: he he came over this hill and and and I
Speaker 1: don't know, it was early in the morning, you know,
Speaker 1: it was first hour of daylight and he saw that
Speaker 1: movement of my leg and he he said, what he
Speaker 1: saw was a gobbler with a red head going to
Speaker 1: full strut. How God's name, and he shot at eighty
Speaker 1: five yards, I mean five yards, and uh, I saw
Speaker 1: a gobbler going into full strut for the first time
Speaker 1: in my life on this trip. Close close, and I
Speaker 1: would never think, like, oh, that dude's leg definitely looks
Speaker 1: exactly like that turkey. But that's so that's a question
Speaker 1: that comes up whenever people get shot, is in an
Speaker 1: offer to you know, deer hunters shoot people like so
Speaker 1: not only did you think that that man was a deer,
Speaker 1: you thought you were aiming like behind the shoulder. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's a good point too. Yeah, and that you, uh
Speaker 1: like had seen what it has on its head and well,
Speaker 1: And it can happen to him more experienced hunner than
Speaker 1: a less experienced hunter, because the hunter is expecting something
Speaker 1: and his brain process is what he says faster, and
Speaker 1: he processes it wrong, and so he might say a
Speaker 1: bit of movement or he might be yeah, today, you
Speaker 1: gotta be careful, we gotta hunt defensively. Today. I saw
Speaker 1: a raccoon, yeah, and I thought it was a hen. Well,
Speaker 1: to your credit, though, there was a gobbler ripping right
Speaker 1: on the other side of the log. The raccoon was on, Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I thought it was a turkey like the back
Speaker 1: a fan or a hen slinking over a lot. But
Speaker 1: did you start firing shots over there? Absolutely no unload
Speaker 1: on the raccoon and be like, oh, I thought it
Speaker 1: must have been a turkey. Yes, sorry, guys, And and
Speaker 1: we we looked at a lot of hunting accident reports
Speaker 1: and one of the highest incidents, and they now call
Speaker 1: him incidents. They don't call him accidents anymore. You don't
Speaker 1: have hunting accidents. You have hunting incidents. And that's because
Speaker 1: it's not an accident until it's been investigated. Until then,
Speaker 1: it's an incident. And most of them are buddies shooting
Speaker 1: other buddies. The shooter knows the victim. In most instances,
Speaker 1: especially turkey hunting, where somebody might separate and say, hey,
Speaker 1: I'm going to hunt on this side the road. You
Speaker 1: hunt on that side the road, and the guy on
Speaker 1: this side of the road, here's the bird just tearing
Speaker 1: it up on the other side, and he's going, you know,
Speaker 1: there's there's no way you can hear that bird. He
Speaker 1: didn't hear that birth. I know he didn't hear that bird.
Speaker 1: And pretty soon he's crossing the road and he's hunting
Speaker 1: the same bird, but his buddies hunting, and that's where accidents,
Speaker 1: that's where accidents happened. You just that's why I like
Speaker 1: hunting remote areas, like like we were hunting. I like
Speaker 1: hunting as remote areas possible, or private land. But statistically,
Speaker 1: in the Southeast, more accidents occur on private land than
Speaker 1: public land because it's nineties some percent exactly, it's the
Speaker 1: most common type of land. I know dudes that were
Speaker 1: this is in Pennsylvania. They were working a bird and
Speaker 1: the bird kind of did the same thing the one
Speaker 1: did this morning, came close and then like drifted away.
Speaker 1: And there was there's three or four of them together hunting,
Speaker 1: and they got up and we're standing in a group
Speaker 1: together talking about what had just happened, and someone shot
Speaker 1: all of them. Yeah, what was he thinking? I have
Speaker 1: no clue, dude. I feel like there's some bad intent there.
Speaker 1: It's like god to be if you can't just remember
Speaker 1: he heard he had a bird. You know, you'd have
Speaker 1: asked the shooter, but he alread a bird gobbling and
Speaker 1: decided to slip up on it. And the chances that
Speaker 1: it's just so hard you can't You can do it,
Speaker 1: Sure you can do it, but the odds are you
Speaker 1: just can't do it. Just you you're supposed to set
Speaker 1: up and call the animal to eat. Yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: that's that's how it works. But he's just gotta be careful.
Speaker 1: He's just gotta be super careful, super careful. Do you
Speaker 1: know what type of hunting has the most incidents? Bird?
Speaker 1: Usually bird? Right swinging and I think it's swinging on
Speaker 1: the bird, swinging on game. Yeah, swinging on game. Most
Speaker 1: you're you're focused on you, and you also get trained
Speaker 1: doing it where you're shooting through brush and all the
Speaker 1: time you're focused on the bird, you're not focused on
Speaker 1: most between you and the bird. Yeah, that's how That's
Speaker 1: how Dick Cheney Yeah, yeah, shot his body. Yeah, everybody
Speaker 1: had a good time with that. And I don't I'm
Speaker 1: not trying to stick off for shooting your body, but
Speaker 1: uh definitely see how that would happen. Not forgiving it,
Speaker 1: but I mean just realistically, it's like, but you gotta
Speaker 1: look at the odds. You gotta look at the statistics.
Speaker 1: That's the it's much much safer. I mean, the most
Speaker 1: dangerous thing you do when you go deer hunting as
Speaker 1: you get in the car and you drive down the highway,
Speaker 1: and you know that's the most dangerous thing you're doing
Speaker 1: because the car w rex. Of course car accidents. And
Speaker 1: then the second most dangerous as you climb up on
Speaker 1: a tree stand, and the the accident rates with tree
Speaker 1: stand has gone down dramatically because people wear belts. Now,
Speaker 1: they wear safety harnesses. I mean when when I was
Speaker 1: coming along, we didn't wear it. We didn't wear any
Speaker 1: horses a lot of two tree stands and climb, climb
Speaker 1: back up and come on hunting. But I got buddies
Speaker 1: that that didn't climb back up, that crawled out of
Speaker 1: the woods, and um, it's it's But I had one
Speaker 1: buddy it fell out and broke broke a leg and
Speaker 1: crawled out of the woods and we got to the highway.
Speaker 1: It was a chain link fence. He's gonna get to
Speaker 1: the highway, except he had a leatherman and he sat
Speaker 1: there and he cut the chain link fence and crawled
Speaker 1: through the chain link fence and got on the edge
Speaker 1: of highway and started flashing his blaze orange vest. If
Speaker 1: he hadn't had it, if he hadn't had wirecutters. You know,
Speaker 1: is that guy still alive? Yeah, as far as I know,
Speaker 1: I haven't heard from him a long time, but yeah,
Speaker 1: far as I know. Had another guy fell out of
Speaker 1: a tree stand. He climbed all the way up there
Speaker 1: and and uh, it was one of those climbers and
Speaker 1: by the time he got to the top, the tree
Speaker 1: had gotten smaller as they do, as they all do.
Speaker 1: Not not as bad with a long leaf pine, that's right,
Speaker 1: they don't have taper. And he had gotten up there,
Speaker 1: and you know, he was kind of hanging down, so
Speaker 1: he turned around and he reached around the tree and
Speaker 1: he he opened it up and readjusted it on both sides.
Speaker 1: He missed, he missed the pens. So when he slid
Speaker 1: it around and put the pins in, they didn't they
Speaker 1: didn't go through the bar that went around and he
Speaker 1: sat back down and leaned back make sure it was sturdy,
Speaker 1: went straight over back, didn't have a safety built on,
Speaker 1: went over back, landed on his leg, broke his lower
Speaker 1: egg and they only kept him the only thing kept
Speaker 1: him from bleeding to death was he had high top
Speaker 1: snake boots and so his leg immediately swoll up and
Speaker 1: effectively acted like a tourniquet because it was a it
Speaker 1: was a compound fractor through the leg. And then he
Speaker 1: started screaming and he had a buddy of a couple
Speaker 1: of hare yards away. Tree stands are dangerous. I mean,
Speaker 1: you gotta be careful. We gotta be They got warnings,
Speaker 1: They got multiple warnings on everyone on them, and you know,
Speaker 1: so so you know, we're talking about shooting as an accident,
Speaker 1: but there's there's a lot more things out there that
Speaker 1: are a lot higher risk than going hunting. But that
Speaker 1: doesn't mean you shouldn't be careful and you shouldn't be
Speaker 1: defensive and be aware and don't lean your shotgun against
Speaker 1: the side of a car, you know, go go laid
Speaker 1: on the ground, or go put it in the crotch
Speaker 1: of a tree or something. Just you gotta think about
Speaker 1: out All the time, I was looking at these statistics
Speaker 1: about injuries hunting related injury ease compared to other sports,
Speaker 1: Like if you call it a sport and other sports,
Speaker 1: I mean, you line up all like the sports that
Speaker 1: we talked about, and think about um hunting ranks and
Speaker 1: at pool and billiards. Oh for safety. Wow? Well yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean because you're when you compare it to like football. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you can start comparing to like skiing, climbing dude, you
Speaker 1: want to man? Yeah, skiing injuries, dude, everybody I know
Speaker 1: that skis is always breaking an arm, breaking a collar
Speaker 1: bone something. All right, we're gonna move on. Yeah not no,
Speaker 1: I'm good with that. Oh you know that guy. You
Speaker 1: know what what the guy finished for us, our electrical
Speaker 1: our engineer. What we got a guy that's we're getting
Speaker 1: We're taking possession of it soon. It's a master light
Speaker 1: in the middle of the table. And everyone has an
Speaker 1: interest dial. Oh, you're doing it. You're an engineer, made
Speaker 1: it for us. Every when he has an interest dial. Yeah.
Speaker 1: But it calculates all input. Oh, it comes up with
Speaker 1: an average for this. So if someone's talking about something
Speaker 1: that you don't think it's interesting, you don't need to
Speaker 1: hurt their feelings personally. You just very quietly, Oh, dude,
Speaker 1: that's gonna turn your dial. But I don't know, that's
Speaker 1: kind of psychologically you turn your dial down. No one knows,
Speaker 1: like it's it's like, you know, when they used to
Speaker 1: do the executions with the fire and squad, and they'd
Speaker 1: give some of the guys a blank, give some of
Speaker 1: the guys a blank. Right, it's like that, So you
Speaker 1: don't have ownership over the Yeah, but the someone will
Speaker 1: sitting there talking and they'll see that light just getting
Speaker 1: dimmer and dimmer and dimmer and later and be like,
Speaker 1: oh no, bro, I was cranked up. Yeah I was.
Speaker 1: I was fascinating. I cracked my thing all the way up.
Speaker 1: That MU must spend other people. That probably will happen.
Speaker 1: Must other people didn't like your story, But how are
Speaker 1: people going to transition out of that once they see
Speaker 1: that light turning color? Better day? Better wrap it up
Speaker 1: or get you a good part. Listen, I got some stories.
Speaker 1: I got some stories I'm gonna tell where I'm gonna
Speaker 1: be like, I know that sucker is gonna dim down. Oh,
Speaker 1: but you're just gonna test just playing it, yeah, because
Speaker 1: then I know that it's gonna start getting bright. Yeah,
Speaker 1: right right right now, it is dim. Interested, No, damn
Speaker 1: is not interested. Now you're like, oh, yeah, it's it's
Speaker 1: dim now, buddy, you wait a minute, it's right up.
Speaker 1: I wonder if you could do a thing where it
Speaker 1: gets to a point it's just like it's too bad.
Speaker 1: And if everybody has the problem is the guy that
Speaker 1: is making us. It turned into a lot more work
Speaker 1: than he reckoned with. So if I told him I
Speaker 1: also wanted to have the capability of shutting that person's
Speaker 1: mic off, I think I might need to send it
Speaker 1: back in a year and have work on that. Let's
Speaker 1: not do that to him. Feel is gonna play the
Speaker 1: um the Bitcoin Update song the Continuing Adventures of Chester
Speaker 1: the Investor. Come that's it? Come on? Can you sing
Speaker 1: your little song? Chester? What's on your favorite little m Hmmm?
Speaker 1: What I want to do? I want to revamp the
Speaker 1: Chester the Investor theme, so it has wh yeppoo ye
Speaker 1: boo some element of that in there. How's it going, Chester?
Speaker 1: I understand that bitcoin has really just stabilized, and you're
Speaker 1: not very close to the Walleye boat. Uh, it's stabilized.
Speaker 1: It went up to day to uh sixty one thousand
Speaker 1: dollars per bitcoin, and immediately some some gambling folks sold
Speaker 1: and oh some short term urs and it went down
Speaker 1: just a little bit. It's sitting at thousand, but it's
Speaker 1: kind of been that fifty five to six for quite
Speaker 1: some time, which is fine. Chester put he had a
Speaker 1: bunch of money in a drawer in his house. Was
Speaker 1: it a sock drawer? It was a nightstand. He was
Speaker 1: keeping all his money in his nightstand. And just to
Speaker 1: be clear, I don't it's not there anymore in my house.
Speaker 1: If anyone, he moved into a different drawer different that
Speaker 1: in his car, he moved the bitcoin. He took the
Speaker 1: money out of his nightstand and invested it in cryptocurrency
Speaker 1: because he knows that it's blown up and just saving
Speaker 1: for a Walleye boat. Okay, good, Um, I was it
Speaker 1: was funny today as Chester. Can we talk about your
Speaker 1: family planning? Yeah, well it's not okay, I can say this,
Speaker 1: could can still leave this in that I would that
Speaker 1: I could say that. Um, it's not inaccurate to say
Speaker 1: that Chester may someday desire to have a family. That
Speaker 1: is not that's true, okay, And I was observing to Chester,
Speaker 1: if that's the case, he might think about getting this
Speaker 1: walleye boat first, to which Robert said, he might think
Speaker 1: about getting his hooks first, because money can get tight. Yes, exactly. Hey,
Speaker 1: that's that's why I'm doing a little investing. You know. Uh,
Speaker 1: there's a guy though, um Alfred. Uh, he's an investor sort.
Speaker 1: He was saying, this is good news for you Chester.
Speaker 1: He's saying how a lot of asset managers are purchasing
Speaker 1: cryptocurrencies such as bitcoin to gain exposure in this new
Speaker 1: asset class. The theory is that bitcoin is the bell
Speaker 1: weather of an altogether new asset class to which they
Speaker 1: should have some exposure, for example, one percent of net
Speaker 1: asset value. And he goes on to say this if
Speaker 1: sovereign central banks by as well. He's saying there's going
Speaker 1: to be increased meaningful demand for a finite asset. I
Speaker 1: read that to say Walleye boats, Yes, for sure, but
Speaker 1: like we're talking about in the last segment, might keep
Speaker 1: that in there, sell my drift boat here real soon
Speaker 1: and uh, get a walleye boat with that, keep the bitcoin,
Speaker 1: keep the bitcoin rolling. But what's the opportunity costs of
Speaker 1: not having that walleye boat? Like, how much is it
Speaker 1: costing you? He fishes out of sets wallet boat. Well,
Speaker 1: then it's not costing me anything. Yeah, it is to
Speaker 1: hang out with my wife because she'd be had a
Speaker 1: fit in the boat right now. If if we have
Speaker 1: my boat and we can only fit three people in there. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but you guys only usually fish together. It's like one
Speaker 1: of you's going out. You want more people in the boat.
Speaker 1: What you're saying you can't bring you're Yeah, Like if
Speaker 1: if Chad a boat, I could bring my gal out
Speaker 1: and then we have two other people. You can come, Chris, Chris,
Speaker 1: you're out. But I only got my invitation. Uh, guy
Speaker 1: rode in. Oh, you good on that? Yeah, I'm good
Speaker 1: on it. Oh, I gotta proposal for you. We're gonna
Speaker 1: start a thing. We're gonna start a thing called the
Speaker 1: me Eater auction House of Oddities for Conservation, and we're
Speaker 1: gonna sell one of the kind of oddities and raise
Speaker 1: it for our Land Access Initiative. Love. Yeah, we got
Speaker 1: a lot of items are putting into auction house. I
Speaker 1: guess some things I regret doing other stuff with that.
Speaker 1: I wish how to putt in the auction house. But
Speaker 1: we got cool stuff that's going to the auction house.
Speaker 1: What if you knew what amount you needed out of
Speaker 1: your boat, and we've sold your boat at the auction
Speaker 1: house knowing that you could peel off. Yeah, every in
Speaker 1: there's a minimum bid and that's what you need. Yeah,
Speaker 1: every extra dollar we get goes into our Land Access initiative.
Speaker 1: Oh man, that's a good idea around Chester, kicking around. Uh.
Speaker 1: Guy wrote in about how they had a buck. You know,
Speaker 1: everybody names bucks. You guys name bucks, Robert, I don't know,
Speaker 1: I mean we you know, you look at the antlers
Speaker 1: and say, well that one, we got one with a
Speaker 1: broken antler. We got one with five on one side,
Speaker 1: four one of the other. But we don't. I don't
Speaker 1: name them. You don't. They don't become like Dave and Bob.
Speaker 1: Now that's a little too personal for something to eat,
Speaker 1: you know. Yeah. This guy listener named Marty wrote in
Speaker 1: they had a buck um in Michigan's Upper Peninsula, an
Speaker 1: eight point buck. He said it was he was so
Speaker 1: regular that he would enter their hayfield from the tree
Speaker 1: line of the neighbor's property every afternoon at the same time,
Speaker 1: within five minute, and he says they went he was
Speaker 1: so regular they named him Meta Musel. Then his brother
Speaker 1: shot at the buck and missed it, and they never
Speaker 1: saw it again. Man, I never saw it again. Got
Speaker 1: plugged right up. But butch your feedback on tularemia. Also,
Speaker 1: we found this out. Okay, a lot of feedback on tularemia,
Speaker 1: because we're talking about two laremia, and Brody mentioned how
Speaker 1: they they'll teach you all the time, and we even
Speaker 1: mentioned this in our Wilderness Skills. But when we talk
Speaker 1: about like the risk of tularemia UM, and we mentioned
Speaker 1: that it's a common practice. You probably noticed, Robert, what
Speaker 1: do you do with Steve Rabbit has to arema? You
Speaker 1: tell me, I don't now. It was like this thing
Speaker 1: he's supposed to look at the liver. I didn't know that.
Speaker 1: Maybe it's probably good that you didn't. If there's a
Speaker 1: thing like you can look at the liver and you're
Speaker 1: looking for spots on the liver, and that would beative,
Speaker 1: that would be indicative of toulremia. So a guy wrote
Speaker 1: in UM he's a molecular microbiologist, studied toulremia and its
Speaker 1: pathology on human cells, wrote his master's thesis onto aremia.
Speaker 1: He went on to say this, as you know, and
Speaker 1: he goes on to plug our own Wilderness Skills book,
Speaker 1: as you know, and it may also be found a
Speaker 1: meter's Guide to Wilderness Skills and survival. Well sero glandular
Speaker 1: forms of the disease can be contracted by humans following
Speaker 1: interaction with small rodents and laga morphs lagomars. People like
Speaker 1: to say rabbits are rodents, rabs are not rodents, Rabbins
Speaker 1: are lagomorph's. Rabbits and hairs are lagomorphs as well as
Speaker 1: through mechanical and vector transmission by biting arthropods. So that's
Speaker 1: the thing, Like when you're carrying a rabbit around, I
Speaker 1: feel like we, I don't know what, weren't you guys
Speaker 1: here and we did this thing. It was about the
Speaker 1: guy that went to a dude who's selling He was
Speaker 1: a Tonka truck enthusiast and bought old Tonka truck from
Speaker 1: a guy on Craigslist, but also bought a rabbit and
Speaker 1: brought the rabbit home. The rabbit scratch his daughter about
Speaker 1: killed her. I heard about that, but yeah, this guy
Speaker 1: rolled in to clarify some points about that stuff. So
Speaker 1: if you kill a rabbit in the early season, in
Speaker 1: the fall, and you're carrying that rabbit around and all
Speaker 1: of a sudden you realize he's got little mites, little
Speaker 1: fleas biting your arm all the time. That's why, like
Speaker 1: in the old days, I think still now We were
Speaker 1: always tot you don't hunt rabbits until you've had a
Speaker 1: good bunch of freezes. But it's funny because that doesn't
Speaker 1: work in the south. So do you ever hear anything
Speaker 1: that you don't kill rabbits till some point in the winter.
Speaker 1: Hunters that would hang him in a tree. They'd shoot
Speaker 1: him and hanging that tree and swing around the field,
Speaker 1: come back two hours later, pick him up. Because as
Speaker 1: as the body temperature left, a rabbit flas or jump off,
Speaker 1: and we would and people would tell us, were kids
Speaker 1: like that's why you like, oh, you don't hunt right,
Speaker 1: you don't hunt rabbit stil January because as the cold
Speaker 1: weather comes, it kills off the parasite load and there's less.
Speaker 1: I'm jumping on your arm and biting you so you
Speaker 1: can get to laremia from cutting your hand and you
Speaker 1: just get the bacteria in your hand, or the little
Speaker 1: bug can jump and get you and bite you and
Speaker 1: that can give you to aremi. He also points out,
Speaker 1: in addition, inhalation of Francis Sella to the to Lorenus
Speaker 1: to Lawrensis, Francis Cella to Lawrensis. He's given us the
Speaker 1: Linnaean name for this species, it's very problematic. Only a
Speaker 1: few bacterium need to cause the pulmonary disease. And he
Speaker 1: mentions that this is what happened. Remember, I was talking
Speaker 1: about the person that hit a rabble of the lawnmower
Speaker 1: that was in Martha's vineyard. On Martha's vineyard, someone hit
Speaker 1: a dried out rabbit with a lawnmower inhaled and then
Speaker 1: got to lorimi that way inhaled the bacteria and how
Speaker 1: that was deadly for that person, right, the one I'm
Speaker 1: I don't know if the one they're talking about, but
Speaker 1: the one I'm thinking of, the person died from it.
Speaker 1: How deadly is it if you get a cut or
Speaker 1: bit by one of the treatable treatable you don't want
Speaker 1: your lungs. Goes on to say this, rabbits are famous
Speaker 1: for uh, not showing sickness, not demonstrating sickness. Then also,
Speaker 1: I'm just dying. And he was saying, if you are
Speaker 1: going around looking for tolremia by a cursory glance at
Speaker 1: the liver, it's not a great idea to loremi infected
Speaker 1: rabbits may this may um have necrotic tissue on the liver.
Speaker 1: Spleen or lymph nodes. But this would be in late
Speaker 1: stage disease and more than likely wouldn't be the indicator
Speaker 1: that a rabbit was sick and shouldn't be eaten or
Speaker 1: better yet, even handled, Meaning it's only at the last
Speaker 1: minute that that shows up. In this country. One point
Speaker 1: one percent of Laga morphs in the northern hemisphere have toularemia.
Speaker 1: It's pretty that's pretty high. I don't think so. Yeah,
Speaker 1: every hundred rabbit you clean, be careful, he suggests, Um
Speaker 1: the first nine, it's only gonna be the last YEA.
Speaker 1: What he recommends here, He's like, at a minimum, handling
Speaker 1: rabbits late light, latex or nitrile gloves. If you want
Speaker 1: to go the next layer up, get a face mask. Oh,
Speaker 1: wear a mask. Here's some of your equipment to take
Speaker 1: your leftover COVID mass and pop put it on your face.
Speaker 1: You're saying that, but he's saying, like, I, at a minimum,
Speaker 1: wear gloves and long sleeves and hang your rabbits in
Speaker 1: the tree. Did they care the plague do? I don't know,
Speaker 1: but everything does. Yeah, but I know rodents, I've never
Speaker 1: heard of rabbits. I know that a couple, a young
Speaker 1: couple in Mongolia Um contracted plague from mormots eating marmot liver.
Speaker 1: They were extracting marmot liver. I believe it's a popular dish.
Speaker 1: Should feel like the really, the guy wrote in the
Speaker 1: guy we had on the squirrel doctor. We had on
Speaker 1: a squirrel doctor um who researched the squirrels. And he's
Speaker 1: talking about the very impressive how squirrel nuts sacks swell
Speaker 1: and shrink. You know what this yea like. Some days
Speaker 1: you look at squirrels like, oh my gosh, he can't
Speaker 1: bring his legs together, and other times they don't and
Speaker 1: as it's breeding season comes, it swells. This guy rolled
Speaker 1: in tok about how that's not uncommon. There's a monkey,
Speaker 1: a vervet monkey that when it's ready to breed, not
Speaker 1: only do they swell, they turned a brilliant blue. Whoa,
Speaker 1: he was so impressed by the blue. He's going to
Speaker 1: his local hardware store and have him do a color match.
Speaker 1: He says he's gonna paint a wall in his house
Speaker 1: with it. So what is he doing and bringing in
Speaker 1: a picture of the like he wants to paint. He
Speaker 1: wants monkeyball blue, he says, just a brilliant I want
Speaker 1: to see the picture that he's bringing into the ace
Speaker 1: hardware wherever he's going, because if it's a tight shot,
Speaker 1: that's one thing. But if it's like a wide where
Speaker 1: you see the monkey and everything, like, give me that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: let me quiz you on something. Let's say you're gonna
Speaker 1: transition as I am about to between that story and
Speaker 1: albino porcupines, what would you go with? Are you gonna
Speaker 1: give me an option? All right? There? There you go, Oh,
Speaker 1: that is a beautiful blood be like, you know what,
Speaker 1: it's incredible. I'd be like, you know what doesn't have
Speaker 1: a blue scroll? It is a white porcupine? Yeah, something
Speaker 1: like that. Speaking of colors, that's what Krane thought would
Speaker 1: be good. M Krane went with speaking of colors and
Speaker 1: presenting the material that we've pulled together here uh albino porcupines.
Speaker 1: We talked about an albino porcupine on the show that
Speaker 1: a guy got a road found a road kill albino porcupine,
Speaker 1: and supposedly cabella Is offered him what sixty dollars sixty
Speaker 1: dollars for his albino porcupine. Apparently everybody every time Dick
Speaker 1: and Harry on the planet's got an albino porcupine. We
Speaker 1: heard from all kinds of them. Carl in Northern Minnesota
Speaker 1: shot one while hunting, and he hasn't mounted. He hasn't mounted,
Speaker 1: almost nibbling on moose antlers. Hilarious. He also has two
Speaker 1: real nice walle i mounted there. Yeah, so the albino
Speaker 1: porcupines are all over the damn place. Really, that's what holy?
Speaker 1: So that's that's a good percentage of them. That's incredible.
Speaker 1: Did the guy steted for sixty before they did all
Speaker 1: that research? What God is talking about? It was the
Speaker 1: fact that uh he I. I find that it's like
Speaker 1: a thing people say a lot, is that they were
Speaker 1: offered exorbitant amounts of money for things by places like Capella's.
Speaker 1: But I do know some cases where some people have
Speaker 1: done some great transactions. Um, and we got talking about
Speaker 1: is that really true? Because the first guy that had
Speaker 1: an elpino porcupine, his old man turned down an offer
Speaker 1: from Cabella's of sixty grand and then that let me believe,
Speaker 1: like really really for road kills porcupine. But he could
Speaker 1: be independent, independently wealthy. That's probably why they just got
Speaker 1: bought by bass Pro because they're spending that much money
Speaker 1: freaking it's like, good god man, Yeah, the diligence process.
Speaker 1: So I haven't all that money, but you should have
Speaker 1: seen the nuts on this squirrel. You just you dug
Speaker 1: deep too. Yeah, we've paid half a meal for that one.
Speaker 1: Uh worth it? Barwood is Robert. I'm learning all sorts
Speaker 1: of No, we're gonna get too things. We're gonna get
Speaker 1: something coming up soon that you'll be able to play on.
Speaker 1: So we uh oh oh, no, oh no, I want
Speaker 1: we want to talk about this one. First. I was
Speaker 1: saying on the show, I don't know why I had
Speaker 1: the idea, Robert, do you remember the Kiss song Beth, Beth,
Speaker 1: I hear you're calling. I don't remember. I went into
Speaker 1: heavy metal. Well, it's symphonic for starters if it's kiss.
Speaker 1: I never listened to Kiss, so I don't remember the song. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I wanted to do I wanted to do a rewrite.
Speaker 1: I don't have time to do. I wanted to do
Speaker 1: a rewrite that was instead of Beth, I hear you calling,
Speaker 1: it was Seth, I hear you calling, And it was
Speaker 1: gonna be a turkey hunting song and a lot of
Speaker 1: guys wrote in and wrote the song. So Hayden one
Speaker 1: of our audio guys, and and Cal and then uh
Speaker 1: Fill the engineer. They took the best lines from the
Speaker 1: versions that came in and they have done Seth. I
Speaker 1: hear you're calling, which will Phil. We'll share with you then.
Speaker 1: I think in the end what we'll do is, instead
Speaker 1: of the songs we normally use at the end of
Speaker 1: the show, if you want to hear the whole Seth,
Speaker 1: I hear you calling, then you want to hear a
Speaker 1: little bit of it. You're here here, let me hear
Speaker 1: you with it. You'll recognize it. Oh it's good, Setha,
Speaker 1: here you call it. But we can't hunt birds at night.
Speaker 1: The flip flop flesh shoes. Eager to use that turkey
Speaker 1: con just right. Just a few hours and we leave Rouse.
Speaker 1: I think I hear them call him, Seth. What can
Speaker 1: I do? What can I do? Ut? Cal normally only Um,
Speaker 1: not only Cal things a lot of Neil diamond. So
Speaker 1: I was excited to see that Cal has um expanded. Yeah,
Speaker 1: has expanded. A guy wrote in to say this. He says, Uh,
Speaker 1: we're always talking about pot calls and strikers getting gunked. Up,
Speaker 1: but we never talked about how to fix the problem.
Speaker 1: He's a chemist, that's what he says. As the credentials
Speaker 1: are and he says, as a chemist, here's my tip. Soaker,
Speaker 1: section of clean paper, toweling pure non dyed acetone. Rub
Speaker 1: it on the striker service or pot surface, making sure
Speaker 1: to wet it well with the acetone, use mild four worse.
Speaker 1: Then dry it with a fan or your cars a
Speaker 1: c so that it's dry. Air. Repeat two more times.
Speaker 1: This will remove the grime. Karin took this piece of
Speaker 1: feedback to Jason Phelps. Phelps Game Calls. He was not
Speaker 1: familiar with this hot tip. He tried it. He said
Speaker 1: it works, but I don't know how much better it
Speaker 1: works than just wiping it with a rag. Uh. Okay,
Speaker 1: here's not here's a rule thing. Do we want to clarify.
Speaker 1: We talked about a recent thing you're in in in
Speaker 1: there are rules coming out again, like like laws saying
Speaker 1: that you can't do the turkey hunting strategy of fanning
Speaker 1: or reaping. And we were talking about, well, how do
Speaker 1: you explain like how what is the legal ease or
Speaker 1: what is the verbiage? Well, South Carolina, this was the
Speaker 1: first year where it was illegal to use a tail
Speaker 1: fan on public land. Yeah, and I was just curious, like,
Speaker 1: how do they describe what's legal? It's what I have
Speaker 1: right here. This this is one from South Carolina where
Speaker 1: we're sitting right now. Um. Fanning slash reaping. So fanning
Speaker 1: or reaping is defined as hunting or stalking wild turkeys
Speaker 1: while holding or using for hunter concealment any of the
Speaker 1: following items. A tail fan, a partial or full decoy
Speaker 1: with a tail fan, or a tail fan mounted to
Speaker 1: a firearm. Tail fans include those made of real or
Speaker 1: synthetic feathers, or an image or likeness of a tail
Speaker 1: fan applied to any material. This regulation does not prohibit
Speaker 1: the use of mail decoys or decoys with tail fans
Speaker 1: that are placed away from a hunter. So pretty clear
Speaker 1: they did a good job of explaining it. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: thought they did, because I mean, if you're hunting on
Speaker 1: public land, you don't. You don't have a tail fan
Speaker 1: with you, period, you just don't. But if you're not
Speaker 1: on private land, you're fine. Legally, you're fine. Yeah, what
Speaker 1: do you do you know? Is it more like they're
Speaker 1: heading off trouble or is there already been trouble. I'm
Speaker 1: not as up on that subject as I was ten
Speaker 1: years ago when I was with the National Wild Turkey Federation,
Speaker 1: But I have not hurt any incidents where the there
Speaker 1: was a problem with somebody being shot because they were
Speaker 1: hunting with a tail fan. There. We we've had some
Speaker 1: come in. I don't know, but I hadn't heard with
Speaker 1: this state. But yeah, there's been a number of cases. Yeah,
Speaker 1: So so that's that's the reasoning. I know when this
Speaker 1: started coming up eight years ago when I was with
Speaker 1: the Turkey Federation, there was debates, that was discussion among
Speaker 1: the biologists about this, and then I went to work
Speaker 1: for the long Leaf Alients and kind of got away
Speaker 1: from the hunter access, hunter incident, hunter accidents um on
Speaker 1: public land. I mean it, you know, it's another it's
Speaker 1: another way to get shot. We're talking about geting shop before.
Speaker 1: But the tail fans are um. I would I would
Speaker 1: never use it where there's rifles available. I mean, you
Speaker 1: ever see those ones where it's a hat. No, yeah,
Speaker 1: they make it that it's a tail fan mounted to
Speaker 1: your hat. Let's put some deer owlers up there for
Speaker 1: the fall. I mean, that's that's not smart. But you know,
Speaker 1: you gotta be careful. I don't know, but like I've viewed,
Speaker 1: I've used that for sure. I've crawled up on turkeys
Speaker 1: and start the shotgun barrel out between the feathers of
Speaker 1: the fan trigger. You gotta be careful where you're using
Speaker 1: it and how are you using it, Like anything else.
Speaker 1: I mean, there's been a lot of decoy shot that
Speaker 1: didn't have a tail fan. You just have to you
Speaker 1: gotta be careful. You gotta be careful. You gotta be careful.
Speaker 1: You gotta be careful. How you put your boot up
Speaker 1: on a stump you get shot, don't put it up.
Speaker 1: Don't put it up on a stump like a turkey
Speaker 1: fan and out. Uh, Robert, you know what I wanted
Speaker 1: to tell you? What I wanted you to tell me, Um,
Speaker 1: because I feel like I told this story before and
Speaker 1: messed it up. But can you share with me the
Speaker 1: story about the guy in Mexico? Yeah, that when they
Speaker 1: were arranging to get Gould's tell that story. Yeah, So
Speaker 1: we were trapping goold turkeys in Mexico when I was
Speaker 1: with the Turkey Federation. We were working with Arizona gamed
Speaker 1: Fish and US Fish and Wildlife Service APIs Animal Animal
Speaker 1: Plant Health Inspection Service because we were bringing poultry across
Speaker 1: an international border into Arizona, and we were down in
Speaker 1: the Sierramadre trapping turkeys, and we were working with a
Speaker 1: local um guide who knew all the landowners. And the
Speaker 1: deal we had worked out with him is for every
Speaker 1: landowner that lets us trap a turkey on their property,
Speaker 1: we'll give him a hundred bucks for that turkey, because
Speaker 1: the whole problem of getting the google s. While turkeys
Speaker 1: they're they're not very many in Arizona, New Mexico, which
Speaker 1: is where they were found down in the Sky Islands.
Speaker 1: And we were down there and one of the other
Speaker 1: one of the other biologist, Bobby madre Um I was
Speaker 1: down there the week before I was, and he was
Speaker 1: setting stuff up and then I was coming down. But
Speaker 1: we had one rancher that they had contracted with. Were
Speaker 1: you guys flying in and out? Both we were driving
Speaker 1: and we were flying out. How are you moving the turkeys? Both?
Speaker 1: Sometimes driving, sometimes flying? When I was down there work
Speaker 1: and we flew I can't remember it was thirty birds,
Speaker 1: but we flew about thirty birds across the border in
Speaker 1: small aircraft and we had a little bit of a
Speaker 1: challenge with that too. That's another story, but that one next. Okay, well,
Speaker 1: remind me about that small aircraft a crossing the international
Speaker 1: border from Mexico. And uh so, so this rancher every
Speaker 1: day for you know, a couple of months. Every so
Speaker 1: if he would walk up to his property six or
Speaker 1: seven miles out of the little the little town of Yaka,
Speaker 1: he'd walked up there with two five gallon buckets of
Speaker 1: corn and bait the turkeys where we were going to
Speaker 1: trap him. And we went up there and man, his
Speaker 1: place was wrapped up with turkeys. We caught thirty six turkeys.
Speaker 1: And so when Bobby started paying the guy thirty six
Speaker 1: hundred dollars in US one all bills, thirty six hundred bucks,
Speaker 1: he started crying. It was it was like no, no, no,
Speaker 1: it's too much, it's way too much. And of course
Speaker 1: he was speaking Spanish that we didn't understand. We were
Speaker 1: speaking English, and we had a translator, and something's getting
Speaker 1: lost in the translation. And finally we figured out that
Speaker 1: he had been working for us for two months debate
Speaker 1: those turkeys so that we could go trap him with
Speaker 1: the expectation of getting a hundred dollars for trapping on
Speaker 1: his property, and we were giving him a hundred dollars
Speaker 1: a bird, and we taught thirty six turkeys. He got
Speaker 1: thirty six when he realized that, he started crying, and
Speaker 1: we found out later that that was enough to go
Speaker 1: buy enough cattle to start his cattle herd on this
Speaker 1: high mountain ranch in this here Madres. That's pretty cool.
Speaker 1: That's a little bit of money for wildlife and and
Speaker 1: the poaching of turkeys during that time period in that
Speaker 1: town and in that surrounding mountain range when we were
Speaker 1: in there trapping ended nobody was selling turkeys in the
Speaker 1: market for three dollars but that but when we were
Speaker 1: flying them out. So we had another biologist in the
Speaker 1: US that was meeting the plane and we were we were,
Speaker 1: you know, talking on cell phones, saying, okay, the planes
Speaker 1: planes getting ready to come in, and and the border
Speaker 1: patrol is sitting there watching on their radar and said,
Speaker 1: we'll see a plane. We'll see a plane. And the
Speaker 1: guys saying, no, we're crossing the border right now, we're
Speaker 1: coming in. We're coming in. And and apparently the pilot
Speaker 1: we had hired to cross the border didn't know how
Speaker 1: to fly above a hundred feet and so when he
Speaker 1: crossed the border, he came in under radar and and
Speaker 1: then came in and landed, and the plane had to
Speaker 1: land in a little circle. They directed, okay, you gotta
Speaker 1: land over there. And then border patrol comes up with
Speaker 1: the with the sniffer dogs and everything, and they had
Speaker 1: a Labrador Treever that was a sniffer dog, and they
Speaker 1: tell us Bobby told the story that sniffer dog went
Speaker 1: berserk on that plane. Turkey says he was full of turkeys,
Speaker 1: not cocaine, not marijuana, not any kind of drugs. And
Speaker 1: when they opened the door, there was a breast feather
Speaker 1: that flew out of the door, because you know the turkeys.
Speaker 1: It flew out of the door, and that dog caught
Speaker 1: it on his nose and just sucked it right against
Speaker 1: it is the best smell he'd ever had. And then
Speaker 1: they let us go. Uh, there's are two things I
Speaker 1: want you explained. You've been explaining to me down here.
Speaker 1: Is um explain the dog hunt thing around here for
Speaker 1: deer on the whole thing about the Department Energy and
Speaker 1: all that stuff, real quick, however long you want to
Speaker 1: spend on it. Well, this is fascinating, man, I had
Speaker 1: no idea this went on. So dog hunting in south
Speaker 1: is traditional, it's been around that part. But we go on.
Speaker 1: So when um, the deer population start to start to
Speaker 1: increase on Savanna riversite, one of the things that they
Speaker 1: did is they had dog hunts and still hunts. But
Speaker 1: but you gotta explain what the site is. Oh, the
Speaker 1: Spanner Risites two thousand acre UM Federal facility Department of
Speaker 1: Energy that was administered by the U. S Stomic Energy Commission,
Speaker 1: and so since the nineteen fifties it was making radioactive
Speaker 1: material for the use on atomic weapons. And they moved,
Speaker 1: like this is a crazy story man, in the fifties,
Speaker 1: how to the Cold War, Like there's no debating whether
Speaker 1: this is important business or not. Moved declared this area
Speaker 1: that that's what this is for, and moved twenty thousand people.
Speaker 1: You're just like, your farm is not here anymore. It's
Speaker 1: now over there, your town, We're moving your town over
Speaker 1: to their right. New Ellington, Dunbarton, Patterson Mill, all these
Speaker 1: little towns in the nineteen fifties. I don't know, I
Speaker 1: don't remember if it was two years or three years
Speaker 1: to get out, but they were condemned and that was
Speaker 1: that was part of the deal. That's how they I mean,
Speaker 1: this is all this isn't. This isn't the West where
Speaker 1: you got a lot of national forests and you got
Speaker 1: you got BLM land, you got federal land. It's all
Speaker 1: private land. And they wanted two hundred thousand acres, you know,
Speaker 1: basically a circle so you could put the reactors in
Speaker 1: the middle of it. So you had a five mile buffer.
Speaker 1: And they condemned the property, took the property and paid
Speaker 1: the people. You know. But it's like, if you want
Speaker 1: your house moved, will move of it. If it's here,
Speaker 1: we're burning it, tearing it down, burning cemeteries. If they
Speaker 1: can find a descendant who's alive, will dig up the
Speaker 1: bodies and move it. If not, it stays. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: So there's a little out And then hired, then hired
Speaker 1: twenty five people had to come in and build the
Speaker 1: reactors Billy reactors at the time. And then they had
Speaker 1: and they had to plant all the agricultural fields. So
Speaker 1: the ventilation on the reactors was, as I understand it,
Speaker 1: it was forced air ventilation and you couldn't have dust,
Speaker 1: and so all these agricultural fields all the pine trees
Speaker 1: on Savannar River site. I don't right now, it's been
Speaker 1: too long. I don't remember how many tens of thousands
Speaker 1: of acres of agricultural fields on the site, and the U. S.
Speaker 1: Far Service was brought into plant the fields, plant all
Speaker 1: the trees, and for three years they planted trees. They
Speaker 1: planted slash lolli and long leaf pine to get something
Speaker 1: growing on that land so they wouldn't have dust storms
Speaker 1: and because there were no longer any crops on it,
Speaker 1: and it was the largest tree plant in operation in
Speaker 1: the United States at that time. It took all the
Speaker 1: trees from the Southeast for either two or three years
Speaker 1: and directed him to the Spinnery River site to plant
Speaker 1: I don't know, a hundred thousand acres. I can't remember.
Speaker 1: That's a nuts story, man, Yeah, it's it's it's an
Speaker 1: interesting site. And you were talking about the deer hunting,
Speaker 1: so you're like, it's like the weirdest sort of rewilding
Speaker 1: process and the and the deer um. I had read
Speaker 1: a wildlife survey from the from nine fifty two UM
Speaker 1: and there were not very many deer. I remember the turkeys.
Speaker 1: They estimated there were twelve turkeys on the property two acres.
Speaker 1: There weren't hardly any deer, but with this rewilding, the
Speaker 1: deer populations began to increase. Eventually had deer car collisions,
Speaker 1: and that it was the justification to start hunting the site.
Speaker 1: And they had still hunting and dog hunting, and then
Speaker 1: the still hunting was outlawed in I came was outlawed
Speaker 1: in the eighties, sometime in the nineteen eighties, and they
Speaker 1: went to just dog hunts, and you would get drawn
Speaker 1: for a dog hunt as a standard or you would
Speaker 1: be a dog man that would bring a helper and
Speaker 1: six dogs and then you would you would have a
Speaker 1: dog hunt. But they put the standards out a hundred
Speaker 1: standards a day, nine hundred feet apart and turn the
Speaker 1: dogs loose. Yeah, it's crazy because you told me my
Speaker 1: dial was red hot. But then you told me a
Speaker 1: lot more about this that you're not telling everybody. Now,
Speaker 1: I want to tell everybody all the parts. Which what
Speaker 1: am I leaving out? That they take the hunters like
Speaker 1: you apply to go hunt. Oh yeah, yeah, so so
Speaker 1: now ten person minivan used to be school buses right now.
Speaker 1: It used to be school buses or or you know
Speaker 1: big buses and now and now it's small buses. And
Speaker 1: you know, you ten person vans and you drop them
Speaker 1: out nine feet apart. And then you got a guy
Speaker 1: that runs around, picks up a dead deer and carries
Speaker 1: him over and designated skinner, got a designated gutter and
Speaker 1: I'm skinning he got them, puts him in a refrigerator
Speaker 1: truck so the meat dunge, boil and at the end
Speaker 1: of the day, and then you got dog men. Yeah, wait,
Speaker 1: but does anybody know each other? Like how does this work? Man?
Speaker 1: Because you're randomly you're randomly distributed. Now that now the
Speaker 1: look of the draw about where they make you get
Speaker 1: out of the van, so you could get paired with
Speaker 1: somebody everybody has Yeah, yeahs are illegal his buckshot only
Speaker 1: the dog men have generally been doing this for years
Speaker 1: and years and years because once once they know they
Speaker 1: have a highly qualified hunter with good dogs, as long
Speaker 1: as he wants the hunt, he comes. If somebody drops
Speaker 1: out with twenty five helpers, six dogs of peace, all
Speaker 1: turned loose, and and then you got all those dudes
Speaker 1: in the vans distributed around with buckshot to get everything
Speaker 1: stirred up. Dude, what was the thoughts, amazing hunt to
Speaker 1: get rid of the still hunting. Hunting. They just don't
Speaker 1: want it doesn't make a good story. It doesn't make
Speaker 1: a good story. The guy got killed, so yeah, he
Speaker 1: got killed. So they were they were, they had to
Speaker 1: still they had still hunting. And as I understand it,
Speaker 1: he went in before daylight and climbed up in the
Speaker 1: tree stand, had had a climber, had some country stand up.
Speaker 1: It was either I think it was in the eighties,
Speaker 1: I don't remember when it was in the eighties. And um,
Speaker 1: as he was sitting his stand before daylight, there were
Speaker 1: other hunters coming into the woods and he could see flashlights,
Speaker 1: he could see people climbing the tree stand and uh,
Speaker 1: but that's not a still hunt, that's an ambush. Well
Speaker 1: that's climbing. Yeah, hunting out of a tree. I mean
Speaker 1: down here they call it still hunt. Really, you don't
Speaker 1: know what still hunting is down here? Yeah, they call
Speaker 1: it still hunt. You know what still hunting is. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you're slipping through the woods, you're walking still huntings where
Speaker 1: he sits still, And you don't sit still when you're
Speaker 1: still hunting, right, when you're still hunting, you move right.
Speaker 1: You're sitting still, that's ambush hunt. Well, if you're still
Speaker 1: hunting in the south, then you move, you fall out
Speaker 1: of a trick. Then you gotta called Doug Durn. Then
Speaker 1: you gotta called Doug during and asked him what the
Speaker 1: mooch is. It's yeah, it's it's it's sort of a
Speaker 1: combo of still hunting and stand hunting. It's a move.
Speaker 1: They had to come over the Hall of their words
Speaker 1: to describe this method. But this guy, this guy decidurday,
Speaker 1: we don't want to get it. And they suspect this.
Speaker 1: I mean they don't know what for a fact, but
Speaker 1: they suspect it because right at sunrise he climbed out
Speaker 1: of his tree, started to walk out, and he got
Speaker 1: He got shot and he got He was carrying a
Speaker 1: stand on his back. He got shot in the back
Speaker 1: and he turned around the second shot, so I think
Speaker 1: it shot once. He got shot twice and he got killed.
Speaker 1: And that was the end of still hunting on on
Speaker 1: the Savaner side, and they went to dog hunting only
Speaker 1: after that. Let me tell you some more interesting stuff, Chris,
Speaker 1: that Robert shared with me earlier. Got my dial. You
Speaker 1: don't budge when they drop you off if you get
Speaker 1: a hit and gotta track it, they come track it
Speaker 1: for you, or a dog man will come. Yeah. Wait,
Speaker 1: so lay this out for me. They dropped the hunter,
Speaker 1: I don't know. They dropped the hunters off and it
Speaker 1: designated spot nine ft apart from each other. They do
Speaker 1: not move now, that don't move. They stay right there
Speaker 1: and so they're waiting for the dog to drive the
Speaker 1: deer to Is it like a deer drive. It's a
Speaker 1: deer drives. I mean, but that's traditional. That's that's not
Speaker 1: a different than all the southern States and Ontario, Canada.
Speaker 1: Also they hunt with dogs. So they just pushed the deer.
Speaker 1: One thing. But this is a whole. This is like
Speaker 1: the organization to this and I'm not dogging on it.
Speaker 1: I would do it right now if I couldn't. And
Speaker 1: it's extremely effective. And that was why they did it,
Speaker 1: because you know, a still hunter, the guy sitting in
Speaker 1: a tree stand the average success in a in a
Speaker 1: You put a hundred still hunters in the woods, tenem,
Speaker 1: we're gonna kill You put a hundred hunters in the
Speaker 1: woods with dogs on these hunts, you're gonna kill fifty deer.
Speaker 1: Now that was before Kayat so the is a crazy story.
Speaker 1: Now this is where this story starts to make its
Speaker 1: own gravy here. Yeah, so that was before the hunts
Speaker 1: in the eighties and the early nineties killed a bout
Speaker 1: a thousand deer on the Savanna River out of two acres,
Speaker 1: and then the numbers started dropping about I'm not sure
Speaker 1: when late nineties. John Kilgo would not and um, the
Speaker 1: late nineties, we're gonna get this guy on the show.
Speaker 1: But you can preview all this. Yeah, so the numbers
Speaker 1: started dropping and everybody says, you know, why why are
Speaker 1: we not killing the bucks. Well, on one of the
Speaker 1: one of the hunts, the scanner was talking to buy
Speaker 1: oologists and he's going, he said, you know, I'm killing
Speaker 1: six month old deer this year this fall. You know,
Speaker 1: dear born in spring fall, there's six months old. We
Speaker 1: have killed six month old deer this year or today.
Speaker 1: And they killed about a hundred deer a day. And
Speaker 1: he said, no, that's crazy about what you kill is
Speaker 1: younger the gear, it's the this is six month old deer.
Speaker 1: And uh. They went back and looked at the data
Speaker 1: and it's like we've killed two and then went back
Speaker 1: to the weekend before to see how many they killed,
Speaker 1: and it was two or three or four. There were
Speaker 1: no funds, No funds were being were no funds were
Speaker 1: entering the population. In the follow of the year, they
Speaker 1: were gone. They were gone by the fall of the year.
Speaker 1: And so that's when US four Service came along and
Speaker 1: started doing some radio telemetry work by putting intry uter
Speaker 1: and devices into the uterus of the does and which
Speaker 1: he gave birth. The fond would come out and the
Speaker 1: transmitter would come out and go into mortality mode. So
Speaker 1: when that transmitter quit moving with the movement of the dough,
Speaker 1: it would stop and after an hour of no movement
Speaker 1: or two hours of no movement, it would start ticking
Speaker 1: and they would go in. And you know, the fawns
Speaker 1: are just tiny at that time. You catch them, put
Speaker 1: a put a collar on. They dispatch out like grand
Speaker 1: students field or something to go scour the woods. I
Speaker 1: didn't know they could even do that. Oh yeah, we
Speaker 1: saw them. We find him hunting Morrel's No then, really
Speaker 1: like the no no, no, sorry fawns. Yeah, yeah, like
Speaker 1: brand brand new funds. Yeah, you can reach that and
Speaker 1: pick them up. I mean, that's why you're not supposed
Speaker 1: to because you can't. They they're just I mean, only
Speaker 1: this big. People think you're crazy when you say they're
Speaker 1: they're literally you know, the size of a ham there,
Speaker 1: smaller than my dad's buddy had a fish bowl, uh
Speaker 1: his body, Eugene Grots had this fish bowl. In this
Speaker 1: fish bowl he had was full of from alde hide
Speaker 1: and had two white tail fawns curled up in a
Speaker 1: fish bowl sitting on the counter as a decoration, had
Speaker 1: like a cap on it. Yeah, but in his house.
Speaker 1: It's amazing. Man. We just when we were kids that
Speaker 1: we stare at that thing NonStop. Wow, it's gorgeous, beautifully done.
Speaker 1: So the first year, the first year they put radio
Speaker 1: collars on, it was about ten years ago. So i'm
Speaker 1: I'm I don't have all the date on the tip
Speaker 1: of my tongue, but my memory tells me that they
Speaker 1: put radio collars on seventeen fawns and within two weeks,
Speaker 1: fifteen of them are dead. And well, back up, maybe
Speaker 1: I was thinking about that fish bowl. So I'll make
Speaker 1: sure everybody's the listeners are getting this. So you covered
Speaker 1: this right, that the sensor passes out, goes into more clicks.
Speaker 1: Then you go out and hunt around and find the fawn,
Speaker 1: put a radio collar on, like a full on collar, yeah,
Speaker 1: on the neck, put that collar on it, and then
Speaker 1: wait for that to have a mortality signal. Right, and
Speaker 1: then when that one has mortality, you go in determine
Speaker 1: why the fawn died. And within two weeks, and you know,
Speaker 1: John may come on and say, now he's got it
Speaker 1: all wrong. It was within three weeks, or I remember
Speaker 1: it being within two weeks, the fifteen of the seventeen
Speaker 1: fauns were dead, and fourteen do by Coats and one
Speaker 1: by Bob Kat, which we never had Coats here in
Speaker 1: the in the eighties. They didn't show up to the nineties.
Speaker 1: So this is a new predator in a new system,
Speaker 1: and all of a sudden this is happening to the
Speaker 1: fun production. Well, you couldn't you couldn't kill dose. If
Speaker 1: you had that kind of depredation on your on your
Speaker 1: dare population, there's there's you wouldn't have it. You wouldn't
Speaker 1: have any deer. And so some of the hunt clubs started,
Speaker 1: you know, well, maybe we don't need to kill as
Speaker 1: many does, or maybe we don't need to do this
Speaker 1: and and or do win need to bring in a coyote,
Speaker 1: trapper or what do we what do we need to do?
Speaker 1: What do we need to do? And the research I
Speaker 1: haven't kept up with the research, but the research has continued.
Speaker 1: And it's not true all over the South. It's weird,
Speaker 1: it's in it's in some areas. Coyotes have become extremely
Speaker 1: effective predators on fonds, extremely effective, and that is new
Speaker 1: to the South because we did not have cotes in
Speaker 1: the South. The big predator in the South was red wolves.
Speaker 1: They got wiped out a long time ago, except for
Speaker 1: coastal Louisiana coastal Texas, and that was maybe in the
Speaker 1: seventies that red wolves were all captured and put into
Speaker 1: a captive breeding program to keep them from going extinct,
Speaker 1: and then re released on Bull's Island, South Carolina and
Speaker 1: on Alligator River National Wilife Refuge in eastern North Carolina.
Speaker 1: So the big mega predator in the East disappeared hundreds
Speaker 1: of years ago and they're back. I mean, we can
Speaker 1: my SunShot one ky weight forty four pounds. I don't
Speaker 1: know if that's a big cut or a little cute,
Speaker 1: but it seemed big to me. Um, they had big
Speaker 1: old choppers, but that was you know, that's that's what
Speaker 1: it was. It was just interesting. Here was this issue
Speaker 1: that came up because the skinner on a hunt said, hey,
Speaker 1: there's something going on here. The biology started talking with
Speaker 1: him and started looking at him. It raised a question.
Speaker 1: They went out and did research, came up with some
Speaker 1: preliminary answers. But as most of your viewers are gonna say,
Speaker 1: it was only seventeen deer. That's the stample size is
Speaker 1: too small. And that's true. But it raised a question,
Speaker 1: and then they started doing more research, more research and
Speaker 1: more research, and so it's been going on about ten
Speaker 1: years now. And the hunt began as a management tool
Speaker 1: because there was too many deer running around. Right, they're
Speaker 1: not killing a thousand deer now. But now everybody likes
Speaker 1: the process. Yeah, so they want they want. Yeah, it's
Speaker 1: it's it's not going away. I mean, it's it's a
Speaker 1: it's a public hunt. If you want to if you
Speaker 1: want to hunt, you put in. If you get drawn,
Speaker 1: you hunt. Is it still a nuclear facility now? Uh,
Speaker 1: it is still nuclear facility and it's pretty much in
Speaker 1: clean up mode. Got you yea? How do they determine?
Speaker 1: So do you get your own deer? Oh? Yeah, it's
Speaker 1: tag when comes in it is you're giving your you know,
Speaker 1: you gotta go get your back. Yeah, you get your
Speaker 1: dear back. You know how you guys call you know,
Speaker 1: still hunting. You know what I means, slipping through the woods.
Speaker 1: Real quiet. But you're saying sitting in the stand, why
Speaker 1: do you call it gutter? A skinner? I just did.
Speaker 1: I don't know, you can't. Yeah, he was a gutter.
Speaker 1: You can't defend that. No, I can't defend that he
Speaker 1: was a gutter. I mean he didn't skin the deer.
Speaker 1: Skinner sounds more noble. Yeah, my daddy was a skinner.
Speaker 1: I was mistaken. He was a gutter. Yeah, I like skinner.
Speaker 1: What do they managed that property for? Well, it's an
Speaker 1: ecological research park in addition to this, so they do
Speaker 1: a tremendous amount of ecological research on it. UM. A
Speaker 1: lot of the University's, University Georgia Clempson, University of South Carolina, UM,
Speaker 1: a lot of the A lot of universities do research
Speaker 1: on it because it's it's got gays, it's protected, your
Speaker 1: scientific equipment doesn't get disturbed. You can go out there
Speaker 1: and and it's done some ground, groundbreaking research for you.
Speaker 1: Know that you could run for twenty years and not
Speaker 1: have your you know, still go to the same spot
Speaker 1: and it's not turned into a subdivision. It's still still
Speaker 1: like that. That's cool. Anything else, seth, No, go ahead, man,
Speaker 1: That's all I had. And will it stay as its
Speaker 1: current designation? Is kind of like a wildlife Is there
Speaker 1: any plans to They talk about it all the time.
Speaker 1: What's what's gonna become the site? There's yeah. I went
Speaker 1: into public when I when I worked out there between
Speaker 1: ninety and nine. I go to public meetings and there'd
Speaker 1: be at least one old guy. Two old guys stand
Speaker 1: up at the public meetings and say, I want my
Speaker 1: lamb back. You're not generating you know, nuclear radio new
Speaker 1: clads anymore. You're not generating radioactive material. I want my
Speaker 1: farm back. So I would totally understand that if it
Speaker 1: was my arm. But I'm so happy. Like every time
Speaker 1: you had to drive, like yeah, I used to on
Speaker 1: that it would be terrible. But I think it's just
Speaker 1: if you can imagine just various places, it's just nice
Speaker 1: to have a chunk like that. It's a big chuckle land.
Speaker 1: It is, man, and I'm not And it's like the
Speaker 1: you know, I'm not putting the farmer has a broken egg,
Speaker 1: but like you know, breaking eggs, making omelets, all that
Speaker 1: kind of stuff. Like I understand, man, but it is
Speaker 1: just in two generations because because you're at the time,
Speaker 1: at the time is probably presented as your patriotic duty. Yeah, right,
Speaker 1: was right after right after the Second World War. And
Speaker 1: then that ends. You're like, okay, cool, I'm an American
Speaker 1: and I understand. We gotta eat the Rooskies and then
Speaker 1: that all ends, and he kind of gotta be like, okay,
Speaker 1: I know, so it's not the Russians anymore. In my mind,
Speaker 1: having intact ecological systems is also our patriotic duty, which
Speaker 1: I know I'm just getting into. I'm offering the as
Speaker 1: you as you said, the very understandable perspective of the
Speaker 1: individual who has removed from his property. I know what,
Speaker 1: dude head is farm taking by eminent domain for golf course.
Speaker 1: No way would I allow that to happen. I know,
Speaker 1: I would be the crazy guy hold up in the house,
Speaker 1: talk about a chap ass over that one man he
Speaker 1: has to go by and see like a bunch of
Speaker 1: people where and the domain over a golf course. I
Speaker 1: would make everyone you know what, I'd give that guy's
Speaker 1: place back and then make all those people that ever
Speaker 1: played golf on there be his farm hands for no compensation. Really.
Speaker 1: Oh it's terrible. Oh my god, it's a war on Christmas.
Speaker 1: Like my dad used to hunt geese there and all
Speaker 1: sorts of water founder all sort of in China, the
Speaker 1: holdouts they call him, they call him nail houses. I
Speaker 1: don't know, but like somebody that refuses in a big development,
Speaker 1: everybody else will sell, but they'll refuse, and they'll just
Speaker 1: be like they're little golf course. Yeah goodness. Yeah, that's
Speaker 1: a damn shame. I'd rather be a mini golf course. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'd be like, at least tell me it's put putt golf.
Speaker 1: Oh that's a travesty. Okay, Robert, you ready to switch gears?
Speaker 1: We can. You gotta tell everybody all about long leaf pines. Okay.
Speaker 1: So in the South they dominant pine spaces. The dominant
Speaker 1: ecosystem in four was long leaf pine. Um. It's a
Speaker 1: tree that grows three fifty four hundred years. Most people
Speaker 1: that don't that aren't foresters or botanists, and they're looking
Speaker 1: at a pine. It's pine. It's pine tree. They can't
Speaker 1: tell the difference. I didn't know that. I want to
Speaker 1: school for it. So in the South we've got a
Speaker 1: bunch of different pines, but the two most common one
Speaker 1: three most common ones are slash, lab lolli and long leave.
Speaker 1: And oh, when you said slash slash pine, I thought
Speaker 1: you meant it was some kind of like a cultivar. No, No,
Speaker 1: it's a species, is thought. I think you meant like
Speaker 1: a hybrid, and you're seeing slash like like slash hyphen
Speaker 1: or something that's a species. Species. So we've got three
Speaker 1: that are we got more species in that we got
Speaker 1: white pines, and we've got spruce pines, but the slash,
Speaker 1: lob lollie and long leave for the three important commercial pines.
Speaker 1: So before settlement and and really up to nineteen hundred,
Speaker 1: the long leaf pine was one of the dominant species.
Speaker 1: In fact, we think that it probably covered about ninety
Speaker 1: two million acres in the South based on the habitat
Speaker 1: and the soils and where we think it grew. By
Speaker 1: nineteen fifty it was way below half and by nineteen
Speaker 1: let's see nine nine, it was down to three million acres.
Speaker 1: Because of what good question. The first thing was cutting
Speaker 1: it down, UM, make turpentine out of it. You would
Speaker 1: you would bark the trees draining of turpentine. And during
Speaker 1: the wooden ships industry, that's what you used to calk
Speaker 1: the ships was tar. Was rope or calking that had
Speaker 1: been soaked in tar and then hammered between those boards
Speaker 1: to keep it from leaking. Um. So when you're when
Speaker 1: you're getting that material out, so so the long leaf
Speaker 1: sap produces what rosin and well the sap comes out
Speaker 1: you you you bleed the tree and that's that's fatal
Speaker 1: to the tree eventually, eventually, eventually, but they would leave. Um,
Speaker 1: they might box the tree. Is called box on a tree.
Speaker 1: You might box the tree on both sides. Because a
Speaker 1: really big tree you might put three boxes on it.
Speaker 1: I've seen one stump that had four boxes and they
Speaker 1: would leave maybe a three inch strip of bark between
Speaker 1: the boxes. So the tree wouldn't die. So as long
Speaker 1: as it as long as it had something where the
Speaker 1: flow them and the xyleum would connect from the roots
Speaker 1: to the to the needles and needles to the roots
Speaker 1: that be in exchange and tree could survive. The tree
Speaker 1: could live. To see how he gestured towards Seth when
Speaker 1: he said flomansylum over your head and yeah, Chris don't
Speaker 1: know it at home. Robert didn't be very very sort
Speaker 1: of like a like a little gesture, now this is
Speaker 1: over everyone a little, that little moment there about the
Speaker 1: zooman them. So after you tapped the tree, uh, there
Speaker 1: would be a period of time where they would produce
Speaker 1: the crop and a crop of turpentine, crop of sap
Speaker 1: that you would then processed into turpentine. Okay, I want
Speaker 1: to I want to get this right. Um. That goes
Speaker 1: on for so long, but the tree dies. Yeah, eventually
Speaker 1: it dies. And if we get cut it get cut down.
Speaker 1: And generally you didn't turn that that face into lumber.
Speaker 1: And I say, generally they would cut the tree down,
Speaker 1: cut that face off, leaves the face in the woods.
Speaker 1: Oh you mean the part that was all the scarred
Speaker 1: from the boxed section. Uh, leave it in the woods,
Speaker 1: and cut the upper part into timber heart pine, timber
Speaker 1: red heart, timber um. But it's kind of interesting on
Speaker 1: if you own that land, you weren't gonna waste those trees.
Speaker 1: So you went ahead and sought out those butt logs.
Speaker 1: And we've we've located east four or two by four's
Speaker 1: in my grandmother's house that was built that actually has
Speaker 1: the cut marks on it from the now. So my
Speaker 1: grandfather when he cut the trees taken to the sawmill,
Speaker 1: he didn't leave that butt log laying in the woods.
Speaker 1: He hauled at the sawmill and he sawed it up
Speaker 1: into two by fours And there's only one you can see,
Speaker 1: but if you go up in the attic, there's two
Speaker 1: others of the ceiling choices that that has the cat
Speaker 1: face on it where they cut it out of the trail, Yeah,
Speaker 1: which is really cool. And then they use them for
Speaker 1: fence posts because they don't rot. They last forever. We've
Speaker 1: got fence posts have been in the ground. This year
Speaker 1: will be a hundred years they've been in the ground. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they've gone through here. They've gone through two or three
Speaker 1: um metal fences. The metal, the metal doesn't last long.
Speaker 1: And they have big camps. Yeah, the turpentine camps this
Speaker 1: stuff right, And that was that was uh yeah forever
Speaker 1: because it's out in the booneties. I mean, you go
Speaker 1: where the trees are. It wasn't something you could bring
Speaker 1: into town to do. And so you'd have the folks
Speaker 1: out there tapping the trees and and processing it out
Speaker 1: in out in the camp. Robert was explaining to me
Speaker 1: how they needed labor right and they made vagrancy laws,
Speaker 1: so you were highly encouraged to go work in the
Speaker 1: turpentine camp. If you didn't have a job, you could
Speaker 1: be picked up for vagrancy. Had to have a job
Speaker 1: against the law and not have a job, no loitering.
Speaker 1: If you get picked up for vagrancy, you go to prison.
Speaker 1: When you're in prison, you get rented out to the
Speaker 1: turpentine camp. Oh god, dude, the choices or turpentine camp
Speaker 1: for turpentine camp, won't wat you're going to the camp.
Speaker 1: You're going down to work. It was bad and that
Speaker 1: that really that that program didn't peter out until the
Speaker 1: Second World War, and when there were so many jobs
Speaker 1: during the Second World War. Uh, they could they could
Speaker 1: get out of the camps, and they could they could
Speaker 1: go they had options. They could work at the naval shipyards.
Speaker 1: So what do you call what trips out of the
Speaker 1: longleaf pine and SAP. Yeah, I don't know if that's
Speaker 1: exactly the correct term. I may be mistaken on that,
Speaker 1: but it's SAP. It's pine, sap pitch, but there's they
Speaker 1: make a bunch of products from it, right that it's
Speaker 1: basically tar, pitch and turpentine, and they were all used
Speaker 1: in the naval industry. Then the naval stores they called
Speaker 1: naval stores. Of course when I went through school, it's
Speaker 1: like what was the number one export in colonial North Carolina?
Speaker 1: And I was born in North Carolina? Those naval stores. Good,
Speaker 1: you got that correct, But nobody knew what naval story.
Speaker 1: Teach you what naval stores were. That was just the
Speaker 1: question on the test when you were in the eighth grade.
Speaker 1: But the naval stores was the tar pitch and turpentine
Speaker 1: that allowed the ships to be waterproof and resistant to
Speaker 1: marine worms that could bore through the bottom of the
Speaker 1: wooden ship. It would waterproof the rope, it would waterproof
Speaker 1: the Tarpolians. The word Tarpolian had tar on it. Um.
Speaker 1: You still see that in old h if you're reading
Speaker 1: like old books, how two books and wilderness travel books.
Speaker 1: The last time about getting it, always thought it was
Speaker 1: pronounced tarpaulin. Yeah, but like t A R p A
Speaker 1: U l I N And it's taken now or just
Speaker 1: to mean like I remember, uh, like guys, my dad's
Speaker 1: age would even call plastic tarp a tartet, blue tart hurricane.
Speaker 1: The bruise are all covered in blue tarts. Yeah, but
Speaker 1: they called a tarpaulin, right, And so then the so
Speaker 1: you so you asked why how did we lose all
Speaker 1: the long ly? So we used him until we used
Speaker 1: them up. Every time somebody needed to grow a field
Speaker 1: of corn, you had to cut trees down. Corn won't
Speaker 1: grow in the shade, and so you cut the trees
Speaker 1: down and cut them up, build your house like my
Speaker 1: grandfather did, and then you can plant your corn crop
Speaker 1: or eat a back or crop or whatever. And then
Speaker 1: in the nineteen fifties, um the pulp mills came to
Speaker 1: the south and lah blah pine could produce more pulp
Speaker 1: faster and more timber faster on an acre land than
Speaker 1: long leaf was. So they would cut out the long
Speaker 1: leaf and convert long leaf to lovellli And that was
Speaker 1: pretty much the death now because the landowner could make
Speaker 1: the landowner could grow the same sized tree could grow
Speaker 1: the landowner. Like where we were hunting those trees that
Speaker 1: were twenty inches in diameter, but thirty eight year old trees,
Speaker 1: they were love blally pine. To get a thirty eight
Speaker 1: to get a inch long leaf might take two d years.
Speaker 1: And so why would the landowner plant of species that
Speaker 1: he would never see return on if he can plant
Speaker 1: a species that he can get three or four returns
Speaker 1: on in his lifetime. And people, people were whacking them,
Speaker 1: and then you as more and more of them were cut.
Speaker 1: The wildlife that was dependent upon that coast system, the
Speaker 1: red cockaded woodpecker, the gopher toward us, the indigo snake
Speaker 1: down in Georgia and Florida, they became more and more
Speaker 1: and more rare. And the red cockaded pine or the
Speaker 1: red cockaded woodpecker was actually one of the first um
Speaker 1: species put on the endangered species list. So when they
Speaker 1: organized the first h endangered Species list, the r CW
Speaker 1: was on it because there the habitat was disappearing so rapidly.
Speaker 1: We met. We don't need to get into who this is,
Speaker 1: but we hunted on a property of a woman who
Speaker 1: was right eighty six years old. They used to run
Speaker 1: cattle when she was young, as in her forties, I
Speaker 1: guess they quit running cattle and her her and her
Speaker 1: husband went out and she hand planted every tray on
Speaker 1: that property. How many hand planted well out of a
Speaker 1: out of a tractor. The husband drove the tractor and
Speaker 1: she sat on the tree planner and she had her
Speaker 1: box of seedlings and she's just sitting there backwards, going through,
Speaker 1: going through the fields, sticking trees in the ground. She
Speaker 1: planted every one of those and when she was in
Speaker 1: her fifties and now she's eighty six and planted. She's
Speaker 1: cutting those trees and she's thinned them three times. And
Speaker 1: and she just you know, one of the areas that
Speaker 1: we were hunting, she clear cut this past January. And
Speaker 1: it's it's you know, you you shot that, you shot
Speaker 1: your turkey in a stand Deptember that when we uh,
Speaker 1: we started leasing the property ten years ago, that stand
Speaker 1: Deptember was so thick you couldn't walk through it. It
Speaker 1: was blackberries and pine trees. And she thinned it once.
Speaker 1: She thinned it. About when does she oh, she thinned
Speaker 1: it last year when she cleared cut the piece beside it,
Speaker 1: she thinned that piece and um, and we shot turkeys
Speaker 1: in it. M hm called into long beards and jake
Speaker 1: and a hen and you kill that and that really
Speaker 1: nice bird. Um. So yeah, that's a that's a working forest,
Speaker 1: um generating income for her and yeah, she's her kids
Speaker 1: will get income from it. And as long as it
Speaker 1: stays in the in the family. But if you just
Speaker 1: strolled over there at two years ago would have been
Speaker 1: long leaf, find it would have been a long leaf
Speaker 1: and there was there is a long leaf around there.
Speaker 1: There's long leaf in the boundary line trees. There's long
Speaker 1: leaf by the road, the place that we call that
Speaker 1: jake In. And then we went down by the lake,
Speaker 1: that area was long leaf. That the some of the
Speaker 1: big trees there was still we're still long leaf. The
Speaker 1: trees we were leaning against when we call that jake in,
Speaker 1: we're all lob lolly. But the thicket that we were facing,
Speaker 1: all those big trees in that thicket, those were long leaf.
Speaker 1: Explain what um, what was lost in the cop between
Speaker 1: the combination of cutting off and heart killing, harvesting all
Speaker 1: the long leaf, but also with fire suppression. So when
Speaker 1: when we lost the long leaf ecosystem, we didn't lose
Speaker 1: just the tree, We lost the ecosystem long leaf. Some
Speaker 1: people described it as a grassland with trees, because the
Speaker 1: entire the canopy of a of a long leaf forest
Speaker 1: is not like most pine forest. It's lets a lot
Speaker 1: of sunlight in and that sunlight um allows grasses to grow,
Speaker 1: but only if you have fire. So the South has
Speaker 1: one of the highest incidents of lightning strikes I know,
Speaker 1: in North America, I think in the world, but one
Speaker 1: of the highest incidence of lightning strikes. It's it's evidence
Speaker 1: shows that it probably burned on a three to five
Speaker 1: year uh basis um. You know, wrap often frequent, low
Speaker 1: intensity fires. You didn't have the Western fires. You didn't
Speaker 1: have crowned out kill everything. You had flames that might
Speaker 1: be anywhere from a foot high to six ft high,
Speaker 1: because it burned every year. There was anything to burn,
Speaker 1: burning burning pine needles, burning grasses, uh, small bushes, But
Speaker 1: after years and years and years and years, the bushes
Speaker 1: were knocked down pretty good. I mean, the hardwoods were
Speaker 1: killed in the uplands and driven down into the swamps.
Speaker 1: So you had hardwood swamps, but you didn't have any
Speaker 1: hard ones in the uplands. In the Lower Piedmont and
Speaker 1: the Coastal Plain, the mountains, you had hardwoods. But what
Speaker 1: I'm talking about is the Lower Piedmont and the Coastal
Speaker 1: Plain all the way from Virginia around to Texas, so
Speaker 1: nine states. This was the dominant ecosystem. So what was
Speaker 1: lost was that ecosystem and the animals that depend on it.
Speaker 1: And that's a lot of I think there's twenty nine
Speaker 1: species of state or federally listed animals that in plants
Speaker 1: and animals that inhabit that that longly find ecosystem. It's
Speaker 1: surprising driving around here how much evidence you see controlled burning.
Speaker 1: Though it's good that it is, it's really good. Um.
Speaker 1: The Longleaf Alliance touts it a lot. The Turkey Federation
Speaker 1: helped people with it. The Longleaf Alliance helps Fish and
Speaker 1: Wildlife Service will provide funding through their Ecological services for burning.
Speaker 1: The NRCS Natural Resource Conservation Service through the U S
Speaker 1: Department of Agriculture, will help landowners pay for burning, and
Speaker 1: and the whole, the whole we had. I was given
Speaker 1: a presentation at the University UM just late March, and
Speaker 1: one of the women, one of the students, asked me
Speaker 1: the question, well, if you're doing all this burning, you're
Speaker 1: killing the hard woods, aren't you. And I said, yeah,
Speaker 1: you are, You're knocking them back. But the species that
Speaker 1: we want are those species that are adapted to this ecosystem,
Speaker 1: and the hardwoods that are getting killed and knocked out
Speaker 1: are not adapted to it. The turkey oaks that are
Speaker 1: adapted to it. The big ones don't get killed. The
Speaker 1: little ones get killed. And if you lay all fire,
Speaker 1: or maybe you have a creek down here or something,
Speaker 1: then there'll be some that grow up and they'll they'll
Speaker 1: become big. But we have a lot of land in
Speaker 1: the South that is a thicket, and so the animals
Speaker 1: that require a thicket have a lot of land. We
Speaker 1: don't have a lot of land that is a grassland.
Speaker 1: And so like even that clear cut, that one year
Speaker 1: old clear cut that we were hunting in, there were
Speaker 1: bachman sparrow that morning when we were listening for turkeys
Speaker 1: to gobble. There were bachman sparrow's calling all over that
Speaker 1: entire clear cut because it was it was a grassland.
Speaker 1: It was coming up. So they like that one year
Speaker 1: old clear cut, but they like they had the bunch
Speaker 1: grasses and the habitat that they required. Um Seth went
Speaker 1: up on the National Forest and shot some some video,
Speaker 1: or Rick did. Rick went up and shot some video
Speaker 1: on the National Forest. And that area is a grassland
Speaker 1: with widely widely space trees that let enough sunlight in
Speaker 1: so that the grass will grow. Now, the one where
Speaker 1: you're shooting the drone videos were UM, lob lolly and
Speaker 1: and short leaf. There was there's only one long leaf
Speaker 1: on that whole track on that that I've found and
Speaker 1: that anybody else has found that I know about. Um.
Speaker 1: It used to be a mixture of shortleaf, lah blahi
Speaker 1: and long leaf because the habitats the ranges were coming
Speaker 1: together in that Upper Piedmont area right there. UM. So
Speaker 1: you asked, what if we lost We've lost the system,
Speaker 1: We've lost the animals and the plants that are associated
Speaker 1: with that system in exchange for in exchange for a
Speaker 1: cheap paper lumber for your house, to buy fours for
Speaker 1: your house, toilet paper, notebook paper, newsprint packaging, UM, all
Speaker 1: of that. I mean, it's a tradeoff. It's not you
Speaker 1: can't blame land on it for making the most money. UM,
Speaker 1: it's it's it's us. It's our society that demands UH
Speaker 1: a paper product which is renewable, UM, timber which are
Speaker 1: renewable and UM. And the landowner is gonna try to
Speaker 1: make the most money as possible. And what what we're
Speaker 1: hoping is one of the things that's coming along now
Speaker 1: is carbon sequestration to help with you know, global warming.
Speaker 1: If the landowner could be paid to grow trees longer,
Speaker 1: then is currently profitable for them. So if they're raising
Speaker 1: blah blahllipine just for money, they're gonna thin thin clear
Speaker 1: cut at age thirty or thirty five, plant a new
Speaker 1: crop thin thin clear cut at age thirty five. Well,
Speaker 1: if we had a way to pay them to take
Speaker 1: those thirty five year old trees to fifty or seventy
Speaker 1: five or a hundred and offset the funds that they're
Speaker 1: going to be losing, that would sequester carbon and help
Speaker 1: with the reduction of you know, climate change, and encourage
Speaker 1: the land owner to grow older trees on his property,
Speaker 1: which would help all the wildlife associated with that. But
Speaker 1: then we'd be doing the burning. And we were talking
Speaker 1: about that because when you burn, your release carbon into
Speaker 1: the air. But and that's true, but where the big
Speaker 1: worry is the fossil fuels, because we're digging carbon up
Speaker 1: out of the out of the ground instead of what
Speaker 1: is naturally rotting burning. And in this country, it's gonna burn.
Speaker 1: It's either gonna burn with a lightning strike. It's gonna
Speaker 1: burn with wildfire, or it's gonna burn with prescribed fire.
Speaker 1: There's no getting around it. And we can burn every
Speaker 1: three to five years with prescribed fire during the during
Speaker 1: the right conditions where the smoke that we're sending up
Speaker 1: is not as as hazardous, not as toxic. That's what
Speaker 1: it would be in all consuming wildfire like you see
Speaker 1: out west. That it was bad that we were out
Speaker 1: there health hunting it is. I went through Medicine Boat
Speaker 1: National Forest in Wyoming and it was sixty miles of
Speaker 1: smoke on the interstate and Campton, Nebraska, and you could
Speaker 1: still smell the smoke in Nebraska. Dude. We had orange
Speaker 1: like orange all day and ash raining in our backyard.
Speaker 1: They were having orange sunsets on the East coast. My
Speaker 1: folks were saying in Pennsylvania that the smoke was coming
Speaker 1: that far from those California fires. So that's not that's
Speaker 1: what we don't want. We don't want catastrophic wildfire, and
Speaker 1: one of the ways to prevent it is to is
Speaker 1: to do prescribe fire. We burn our place up in
Speaker 1: North Carolina and the highest flame heights we get are
Speaker 1: three or four feet and burn every four or five
Speaker 1: years and just creep the fire, back it in and
Speaker 1: once you back it off the line, you can go
Speaker 1: through and set a strip head fire that that runs
Speaker 1: ahead fire and then set another one. It runs at
Speaker 1: another one, it runs that, another one it runs and
Speaker 1: you gotta get permit, you gotta have train and work
Speaker 1: with the State Forestry Commission on all that. What is
Speaker 1: my last question for you, What if we look at
Speaker 1: how quail numbers just every decade seems to be worse,
Speaker 1: And people point to a lot of things that fire ants, right, proliferation,
Speaker 1: fire ants, um. But this has to be a factor
Speaker 1: in that. Well, it's a huge factor. So I was
Speaker 1: raising North Carolina quail hunt and we go down eastern
Speaker 1: North Carolina weak quail hunt. The quail population started crashing
Speaker 1: where weak quail hunted in eastern North Carolina. It started
Speaker 1: crashing in the seventies and by the nineties that you
Speaker 1: that means no point in quail hunt and there were
Speaker 1: no fire ants there at all. They didn't make it
Speaker 1: there until the late nineties early two thousand too, and
Speaker 1: they're there now. But my point is it couldn't have
Speaker 1: been fireingts that caused the crash in the Carolinas because
Speaker 1: there were no fire ants. It could have, it could have.
Speaker 1: It could be an extending um circumstance in Alabama, Mississippi,
Speaker 1: George and Florida because they got there first. They came
Speaker 1: in and I think they came in in mobile, but
Speaker 1: they can't. They came in from South America, and um.
Speaker 1: Fire ants are contributing. Uh. Nest predation with raccoons are
Speaker 1: are a factor, But it's habitats, habitats, habitat habitat. If
Speaker 1: you've got it, if you've got enough highly, if you've
Speaker 1: got enough good habitat, you're gonna have quail. You're gonna
Speaker 1: have all those species associated with it. She put in
Speaker 1: that clear cut and last year, and I don't know
Speaker 1: where they came from. I jumped coveys of quail three
Speaker 1: different times. It's not enough to go buy a dog
Speaker 1: and start training a dog. But you could hear when
Speaker 1: I was scouting, I heard quail calling in that fifty
Speaker 1: acre clear cut. Almost every day. They were in. They
Speaker 1: were in there, and you make a place for him,
Speaker 1: and there they are, and they and they show up,
Speaker 1: and they breed and they produced and they survive. Uh.
Speaker 1: But the problem is those trees then grow up into
Speaker 1: where you killed your turkey. Wide open pine straw, no habitat,
Speaker 1: and they need grass, they need they need bunch grasses
Speaker 1: where those little ones can run around and catch insects.
Speaker 1: They need thickets where they can get away from the
Speaker 1: avian predators, from the hawks. And they need bare ground
Speaker 1: where they can actually pick up a seat. And that
Speaker 1: habitat is rare for for Bob White quail um Man
Speaker 1: a lot. Sorry I get into it. I started talking
Speaker 1: about that's that's why that here. But we had a
Speaker 1: great time hanging out with you. We had a blast here.
Speaker 1: Did you and I meet in Hell's Canyon? We met
Speaker 1: in the spring of two thousand and twelve, nine years ago. Yeah,
Speaker 1: has a good conversation since then. Yeah, that was a
Speaker 1: good hunt, going by jet boat, take mules into Hell's
Speaker 1: Canyon wilderness area, turkey out for a week. It's a
Speaker 1: great time. It was a great time. The best thing
Speaker 1: about it was meeting you because then I got to
Speaker 1: come down here and hunt turkeys with you in your
Speaker 1: well and you invite me in Florida. Pull my hamstring, Robert,
Speaker 1: thank you very much, Well, thank you all. This was
Speaker 1: a blast. Ladies, and gentlemen, Robert every dathew, thank you, yeah,
Speaker 1: thanks throwing us around, man, and thank your wife for
Speaker 1: the food. I will yeah, you guys are very very hospital.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna be good for a week for the food.
Speaker 1: Y'all left, all right, thank you very much. Man, Satha
Speaker 1: here you call it, But we can't hunt birds at night?
Speaker 1: The flip flops shoes eager do you use that turkey?
Speaker 1: Con justice? Drive? Just a fuel hours and the birds
Speaker 1: will leave the ruse. I think I hear them call him, Seth,
Speaker 1: What can I do? What can I do? Seth? What
Speaker 1: can I do? Seth? I hear you call them to
Speaker 1: know that you who won't stop? But I have to
Speaker 1: take a growler and I just can't find a ruck.
Speaker 1: Just a few more hours and the birds will leave
Speaker 1: the ruse. I think I hear them calling, Seth, what
Speaker 1: can I do? What can I do? Seth? What can
Speaker 1: I do? No