WEBVTT - Part Two: Louis van Schoor: The Deadliest Security Guard in History 0:00:01.800 --> 0:00:03.840 Also media. 0:00:06.920 --> 0:00:09.680 Here we go, Welcome back. It's a podcast. Oh my god, 0:00:11.080 --> 0:00:14.120 you're fuck yeah. I don't know why. I don't know 0:00:14.120 --> 0:00:15.400 why I opened it that way. 0:00:15.520 --> 0:00:16.160 Nobody does. 0:00:16.600 --> 0:00:19.360 Nobody's gonna like that, and nobody's gonna be happy with it, Sophie, 0:00:19.440 --> 0:00:20.000 What am I doing? 0:00:20.040 --> 0:00:22.000 I think some of the fans really do like it. 0:00:22.320 --> 0:00:23.720 I don't know if it's like a Stockholm suit. 0:00:23.840 --> 0:00:27.840 They are sickos. They are sickos. You're right about that, Mollie. 0:00:28.040 --> 0:00:29.280 Did it bring you joy? 0:00:29.440 --> 0:00:29.800 Robert? 0:00:30.280 --> 0:00:30.480 No? 0:00:30.640 --> 0:00:33.199 Nothing does anymore believe that brings me joy is the 0:00:33.240 --> 0:00:36.680 film Twisters, which I'm still gonna talk about. I know 0:00:36.760 --> 0:00:39.000 I talked about it at the Tuesday opening. But you 0:00:39.000 --> 0:00:42.280 know what I really appreciate about Twisters, Mollie, and about Twister. 0:00:42.440 --> 0:00:44.320 Hopefully some of the fans have had time to see 0:00:44.360 --> 0:00:46.400 it since they listened to the first episode, so now 0:00:46.400 --> 0:00:47.040 they're on board. 0:00:47.080 --> 0:00:49.239 You gotta go watch out and see it. You know, 0:00:49.320 --> 0:00:51.879 you gotta go watch it. They're gonna stop making tornado 0:00:51.960 --> 0:00:54.280 movies if we don't watch them, right, and then what's 0:00:54.320 --> 0:00:55.760 gonna happen to Oklahoma's tour? 0:00:55.880 --> 0:00:58.080 You have to support the tornado based economy. 0:00:58.960 --> 0:01:01.279 What I love about these movies is that they all 0:01:01.320 --> 0:01:04.680 decided and this is the smart decision from a filmmaking standpoint. 0:01:05.160 --> 0:01:08.440 The tornadoes had to be sentient like these these are 0:01:08.560 --> 0:01:12.200 tornadoes that have enemies and that have grudges and that 0:01:12.280 --> 0:01:15.679 are targeting city centers to do as much damage as possible. 0:01:16.360 --> 0:01:17.600 Talking about that, that's no. 0:01:18.120 --> 0:01:21.160 There is a scene where the tornado roars at our 0:01:21.240 --> 0:01:25.560 main characters and then throws a semi truck at them because. 0:01:28.160 --> 0:01:31.280 They're fighting, Like these people are trying to destroy tornadoes. 0:01:31.400 --> 0:01:34.040 Yes, yes, yes they are. They're going to war against 0:01:34.080 --> 0:01:35.560 the tornadoes sold. 0:01:35.319 --> 0:01:38.200 To just like learn from the tornado scientists. They want 0:01:38.200 --> 0:01:38.839 to when you're. 0:01:38.720 --> 0:01:41.240 Going to escalate. Yeah, the initial movie there, but their 0:01:41.240 --> 0:01:42.679 goal is they want to learn from it so they 0:01:42.680 --> 0:01:45.040 can predict them in so that what's her name doesn't 0:01:45.080 --> 0:01:46.560 have her dad sucked out into the. 0:01:46.480 --> 0:01:49.200 Sky again, right, that was about like predicting for like evacuation. 0:01:49.480 --> 0:01:51.560 This is about like physically fighting it. 0:01:51.720 --> 0:01:54.440 Yes, because no one So one of the through lines 0:01:54.480 --> 0:01:57.320 and twisters is that no one who lives in Tornado 0:01:57.440 --> 0:01:59.920 Alley has ever heard of a tornado or knows what 0:02:00.160 --> 0:02:03.640 to do. None of the houses have shelters, and the 0:02:03.680 --> 0:02:06.320 only people are are heroes who are a bunch of 0:02:06.360 --> 0:02:10.080 like weirdo stormchaser YouTube nerds have to like go into 0:02:10.120 --> 0:02:14.280 towns and warn everyone to evacuate because Oklahomans just don't 0:02:14.280 --> 0:02:16.600 know about tornadoes and nobody. 0:02:16.280 --> 0:02:18.440 Believes these out of towners. 0:02:19.280 --> 0:02:21.600 Well, no, it's always very clear because there's a giant 0:02:21.639 --> 0:02:24.560 tornado the size of an aircraft carrier in the sky. 0:02:25.280 --> 0:02:28.000 Does Glenn Powell just like hip check the tornado and 0:02:28.040 --> 0:02:29.440 his wrangular jeans and. 0:02:29.680 --> 0:02:33.560 No, he drives a very cool truck and shoots fireworks 0:02:33.560 --> 0:02:37.480 into it. So well, actually someone else forgot and irangular 0:02:37.600 --> 0:02:41.079 jeans he's wearing. Well, i'd actually I don't think we 0:02:41.120 --> 0:02:41.840 get a shirt. 0:02:41.880 --> 0:02:43.040 Got sucked into the tornado. 0:02:43.120 --> 0:02:45.360 He's very wet a lot of the time, though, so 0:02:45.800 --> 0:02:50.120 he doesn't get to show off. Yeah, anyway, I guess 0:02:50.120 --> 0:02:51.680 should we talk about this racist Molly? 0:02:52.639 --> 0:02:55.000 I was having more fun talking about a sentient tornado, 0:02:55.160 --> 0:02:56.560 but I knew that couldn't last. 0:02:56.680 --> 0:02:58.960 It's less fun than Glenn Palell. I don't think Glenn 0:02:58.960 --> 0:03:00.760 Palell has killed dozens of people. 0:03:01.400 --> 0:03:03.920 You don't know? You know, actually we found out about 0:03:03.960 --> 0:03:04.440 Army Hammer. 0:03:04.520 --> 0:03:06.840 But here's what I'll say if Glenn Powell has been 0:03:06.919 --> 0:03:10.320 killing people. I'm sure they're an even mix of white, black, 0:03:10.360 --> 0:03:12.480 every color of the rainbow. 0:03:12.600 --> 0:03:15.480 I just feel confident he didn't use dogs. 0:03:15.480 --> 0:03:18.079 Definitely, not a not He would never never stoop to 0:03:18.160 --> 0:03:21.200 dogs for his killing. He might use dogs. He might 0:03:21.280 --> 0:03:29.080 use dogs. It's not a zero percent chance we're back. 0:03:29.200 --> 0:03:33.919 I hope Glenn Powell is not a listener because we're 0:03:34.000 --> 0:03:36.120 kind of being needlessly mean to a man as far 0:03:36.160 --> 0:03:38.800 as I'm aware, hasn't ever done anything bad to anyone. 0:03:39.160 --> 0:03:41.800 Sorry, I said you made Sorry. 0:03:44.160 --> 0:03:45.320 There's there's a Yeah. 0:03:45.560 --> 0:03:46.760 I still don't know who he is. 0:03:47.280 --> 0:03:50.200 Yeah, it's he's very good looking, Molly, but again in 0:03:50.240 --> 0:03:52.520 a way that's kind of off putting. Yeah, he probably 0:03:52.480 --> 0:03:54.040 he has to know that, right. 0:03:54.320 --> 0:03:55.160 I'm sure he knows. 0:03:55.440 --> 0:03:59.560 Lewis fan sure not very good looking in my opinion. Uh, 0:04:00.040 --> 0:04:02.080 As I noted last episode, it's a little bit hard 0:04:02.120 --> 0:04:05.520 to triangulate the price precise length of time that Lewis 0:04:05.640 --> 0:04:08.440 was killing people, but the bulk of his murdering seems 0:04:08.440 --> 0:04:11.280 to have occurred from around nineteen eighty six to nineteen 0:04:11.360 --> 0:04:14.480 eighty nine. These are the twilight years of the apartheid 0:04:14.560 --> 0:04:17.520 regime and the anxious business owners in middle class whites 0:04:17.520 --> 0:04:20.000 of East London saw Lewis again as a hero. He 0:04:20.120 --> 0:04:22.760 is their own private batman, and that is how they 0:04:22.839 --> 0:04:26.359 look at him. Most of the businesses that contracted with 0:04:26.400 --> 0:04:29.719 his company had silent alarms. When someone broke in, Van 0:04:29.760 --> 0:04:31.680 Sure would be alerted and he would rush to the 0:04:31.680 --> 0:04:34.880 scene to surprise the intruder. He always showed up alone 0:04:35.040 --> 0:04:38.240 in a private vehicle, no sirens, and as was his 0:04:38.320 --> 0:04:42.080 wont he went barefoot. He later told a reporter it's quiet, 0:04:42.160 --> 0:04:44.520 you don't have your shoes squeaking on tiles and stuff. 0:04:44.560 --> 0:04:47.320 So again, his interest is not to stop robberies or 0:04:47.400 --> 0:04:49.839 to arrest people. It is to sneak up on them 0:04:49.880 --> 0:04:52.160 so that he can murder them, very, very brutally. 0:04:52.360 --> 0:04:54.760 I just don't like the idea that he's not wearing shoes. 0:04:55.160 --> 0:04:58.200 Yeah, yeah, that's just extra creepy, right, It's like a 0:04:58.240 --> 0:05:02.160 reverse diehard. Now, he claimed to not turn on lights 0:05:02.240 --> 0:05:05.360 and that he usually avoided flashlights. He's inconsistent on that 0:05:05.440 --> 0:05:08.080 last point, so I suspect he did use a flashlight 0:05:08.080 --> 0:05:10.479 to at least try to shock his targets. But to 0:05:10.520 --> 0:05:12.880 the press he would claim that his primary sense for 0:05:13.000 --> 0:05:14.800 hunting was his sense of smell. 0:05:15.240 --> 0:05:18.080 Qu wait, sense for what now? Hunting? 0:05:18.400 --> 0:05:22.760 Hunting? Yes, that's how he describes this great great he's 0:05:22.839 --> 0:05:25.039 just talking openly about when the press coming like, seems 0:05:25.040 --> 0:05:26.480 like you're shooting a lot of people who's like, yeah, 0:05:26.520 --> 0:05:29.040 I love hunting people. You know, I hunt by sense 0:05:29.040 --> 0:05:32.480 of smell. If somebody breaks in, the adrenaline gives off 0:05:32.520 --> 0:05:35.840 an odor and you can pick that up. Okay, I 0:05:36.320 --> 0:05:39.359 don't know that. I think you can. But that's a 0:05:39.520 --> 0:05:43.000 very unsettling thing to say. That's something a monster, says Lewis. 0:05:43.720 --> 0:05:45.520 I mean, I guess you know, like gamblers, you have 0:05:45.560 --> 0:05:48.840 a system, you have superstitions, you have these beliefs about 0:05:48.839 --> 0:05:49.479 your craft. 0:05:49.800 --> 0:05:53.320 Yes, and some people have better senses than others. So 0:05:53.320 --> 0:05:56.160 I'm not gonna say, like, it's definitely true that like fear, 0:05:56.240 --> 0:05:59.839 sweat is different, smells different. You can kind of tell 0:06:00.760 --> 0:06:01.480 sometimes if. 0:06:01.360 --> 0:06:03.200 Somebody you can't smell a guy in the back of 0:06:03.200 --> 0:06:04.520 the CBS. 0:06:04.160 --> 0:06:06.080 You're not go I don't think you're going to. But 0:06:06.160 --> 0:06:09.640 maybe Lewis is the predator. You know, he is a predator. 0:06:10.040 --> 0:06:12.320 He spent a long time with dogs, but he did 0:06:12.360 --> 0:06:13.840 not develop any dog like. 0:06:13.800 --> 0:06:17.720 Some of the dogs have taught me their skills. Yeah. Now. 0:06:17.800 --> 0:06:20.520 The adrenalines with Van Schuur were mostly conducted at the 0:06:20.520 --> 0:06:22.840 start of the nineties, before he was charged with any 0:06:22.960 --> 0:06:25.640 crimes for his many murders. He was a subject of 0:06:25.680 --> 0:06:28.240 amusement for a lot of reporters, and their stories helped 0:06:28.279 --> 0:06:30.200 build him a legend and earn him the love of 0:06:30.240 --> 0:06:33.800 many in the local white community. The vast majority of 0:06:33.839 --> 0:06:36.440 his victims were very poor, the kind of people who 0:06:36.480 --> 0:06:40.120 often broke into stores to steal food or cash, and 0:06:40.160 --> 0:06:43.000 as a result, their deaths made very little impact in 0:06:43.040 --> 0:06:46.000 the local papers. If they were mentioned, it usually wasn't 0:06:46.040 --> 0:06:50.560 by name, robbers shot, breaking into pharmacy or whatever. White 0:06:50.640 --> 0:06:53.479 business owners and middle class residents knew of Lewis, at 0:06:53.560 --> 0:06:57.719 least by reputation, and overwhelmingly considered him a hero. Black 0:06:57.760 --> 0:07:01.360 residents also knew him. Stories read in Zosha of a 0:07:01.360 --> 0:07:05.240 bearded man nicknamed Whiskers who would stalk men through the 0:07:05.279 --> 0:07:09.440 streets and make them disappear forever as journalists. Dominic Jones, 0:07:09.440 --> 0:07:11.920 one of the first to report on Lewis, said Lewis 0:07:11.960 --> 0:07:15.600 van Shore was basically going out and murdering people for sport. 0:07:16.080 --> 0:07:19.800 Lewis himself would tell the BBC during an investigation decades later, 0:07:20.000 --> 0:07:22.120 every night is a new adventure, if you want to 0:07:22.120 --> 0:07:23.960 put it that way, I know, I don't. 0:07:24.040 --> 0:07:24.360 I don't. 0:07:24.360 --> 0:07:27.960 I don't know at all. What do you mean an adventure? 0:07:28.360 --> 0:07:30.120 And this is going on for long enough that he's 0:07:30.120 --> 0:07:32.960 becoming this sort of like real life Boogeyman in these 0:07:32.960 --> 0:07:36.520 communities like they of course he is. And I guess 0:07:36.520 --> 0:07:38.520 they don't know where he's going to be or which 0:07:38.560 --> 0:07:39.960 alarms go to his phone. 0:07:40.160 --> 0:07:42.320 No, and you probably because of how it's being reported, 0:07:42.680 --> 0:07:44.720 some people are probably aware it's all this one guy, 0:07:44.760 --> 0:07:47.560 but like a lot of locals, both whites and blacks 0:07:47.640 --> 0:07:51.200 are probably think this is more a bunch of people 0:07:51.240 --> 0:07:53.600 committing murders because of how many people he's shooting. You 0:07:53.600 --> 0:07:56.440 wouldn't nactually would Why would you? All of these are 0:07:56.560 --> 0:08:01.080 one guy. It's a lot for one guy, right. That's 0:08:01.240 --> 0:08:04.840 very now. At the time, things had changed enough in 0:08:04.880 --> 0:08:07.400 South Africa that Lewis had to claim he never went hunting, 0:08:07.480 --> 0:08:10.600 quote with the intention of killing black people. He just 0:08:10.640 --> 0:08:14.920 found stocking. He does call it hunting a lot, He 0:08:14.960 --> 0:08:17.840 says he just found it exciting. And I do think 0:08:18.040 --> 0:08:20.160 parts of this are true, although not in a way 0:08:20.200 --> 0:08:23.160 that makes it better. Lewis fan sure to me, feels 0:08:23.200 --> 0:08:24.720 like a guy who would have taken a job that 0:08:24.760 --> 0:08:27.320 let him hunt and kill humans in any society where 0:08:27.480 --> 0:08:32.120 that job existed. He's again definitely racist, but I think 0:08:32.160 --> 0:08:35.240 that the killing was more the motivation than the racism. 0:08:35.280 --> 0:08:38.520 The racism provides the opportunity and the legal cover to 0:08:38.640 --> 0:08:41.080 do the killing, right, This is my take on it. 0:08:41.720 --> 0:08:44.559 Lewis reported every murder to the local police, and when 0:08:44.559 --> 0:08:47.240 he was criticized for being a serial killer, he would 0:08:47.280 --> 0:08:50.000 defend himself by saying his actions were quote all within 0:08:50.040 --> 0:08:53.959 the law. This was untrue in a strict textual sense, 0:08:54.000 --> 0:08:56.360 but it was accurate in that the cops supported what 0:08:56.440 --> 0:09:00.439 he was doing. As Lewis said, every officer and London 0:09:00.480 --> 0:09:03.079 knew what was going on. All the police officers knew. 0:09:03.320 --> 0:09:06.360 Not once did anybody say, hey, Louis, you're on the borderline, 0:09:06.440 --> 0:09:08.640 or you should cool it or whatever. They all knew 0:09:08.640 --> 0:09:10.320 what was happening, right. 0:09:10.240 --> 0:09:12.320 So you're saying, like not people didn't know was all 0:09:12.360 --> 0:09:14.000 one guy. But like whoever's processing the. 0:09:14.120 --> 0:09:19.240 Cops, the cops definitely know. Yes, the cops are not 0:09:19.600 --> 0:09:22.120 are fully aware because they also are showing up at 0:09:22.120 --> 0:09:25.400 the scene every time he shoots someone, which is all 0:09:25.480 --> 0:09:27.320 the time. He is always shooting people. 0:09:27.440 --> 0:09:31.080 Is they never a conversation about, like, did you do 0:09:31.120 --> 0:09:31.640 a crime? 0:09:33.160 --> 0:09:35.679 I don't think there's an interest in having that conversation. 0:09:35.760 --> 0:09:37.760 And obviously, as Lewis said, I don't think he's lying 0:09:37.800 --> 0:09:40.880 about this. I think like he seems to be legitimately 0:09:40.920 --> 0:09:44.080 frustrated because he does get in trouble eventually where he's like, look, 0:09:44.120 --> 0:09:45.960 I talked to the cops. None of them said I 0:09:46.080 --> 0:09:49.319 was like a borderline right. Nobody ever said to stop 0:09:49.400 --> 0:09:50.200 shooting people? 0:09:50.760 --> 0:09:54.760 Why are yeah? Like they should have told me sooner. 0:09:54.880 --> 0:09:56.920 They needed to tell me the exact amount of people 0:09:56.960 --> 0:10:00.480 I needed to shoot. Now, obviously we shouldn't. I don't 0:10:00.520 --> 0:10:02.960 necessarily think he's lying there, but we shouldn't take his 0:10:03.080 --> 0:10:06.040 word for it. That said one of the local journalists. 0:10:06.040 --> 0:10:06.920 They didn't stop him. 0:10:07.120 --> 0:10:09.480 They didn't stop him. One of the local journalists who 0:10:09.480 --> 0:10:12.040 put together a team to start looking into Lewis was 0:10:12.080 --> 0:10:15.479 and this is another great South African name, Patrick Goodenough 0:10:16.840 --> 0:10:20.440 literally just the words good enough stuff together. What was 0:10:20.480 --> 0:10:22.839 going on in that country that that became a last 0:10:22.920 --> 0:10:28.800 name for you people? Huh right, yeah, good enough. Oh, 0:10:28.960 --> 0:10:31.679 because you just know every year a journalism school, whenever 0:10:31.679 --> 0:10:34.319 he turns into an assignment, you know his teachers are 0:10:34.320 --> 0:10:36.080 making fun of that name one way or the other. 0:10:36.360 --> 0:10:39.360 You know, Yeah, this is good enough, not good enough, 0:10:39.720 --> 0:10:42.880 not good enough. Sorry, Patrick, I'm sure you had a 0:10:42.920 --> 0:10:44.840 tough road to hoe. You seem to have turned into 0:10:44.840 --> 0:10:46.439 a fine man, because he's going to be one of 0:10:46.480 --> 0:10:51.400 the heroes of this story. Good enough, he said of 0:10:51.440 --> 0:10:54.400 the police in East London. There's the support for him 0:10:54.440 --> 0:10:56.160 was massive. He would not have been able to get 0:10:56.200 --> 0:10:58.160 away with the fraction of what he got away with 0:10:58.160 --> 0:11:01.280 without it. Now, another of the journalists who dug into 0:11:01.280 --> 0:11:04.280 this story back before it was a story was Isad Jacobson, 0:11:04.320 --> 0:11:07.760 who I quoted last episode. Here's the BBC discussing her 0:11:07.880 --> 0:11:10.880 very early efforts to uncover what was going on. In 0:11:10.920 --> 0:11:13.720 the police records held in public archives, Miss Jacobson found 0:11:13.720 --> 0:11:16.200 instances of killings where the officers had been present at 0:11:16.240 --> 0:11:18.400 the time of the shootings at no point that they 0:11:18.400 --> 0:11:21.920 appear to question Van Schure as a suspect. In many instances, 0:11:22.000 --> 0:11:24.520 the police failed to take photos of the deceased at 0:11:24.559 --> 0:11:26.680 the scenes of the shooting. And failed to collect key 0:11:26.720 --> 0:11:30.280 forensic evidence, such as bullet casings. Van Shure was often 0:11:30.320 --> 0:11:32.960 the only witness to his shootings, so this evidence could 0:11:32.960 --> 0:11:35.400 have been crucial for determining what had actually happened. In 0:11:35.400 --> 0:11:38.360 each case, these were cover ups. He had the backing 0:11:38.400 --> 0:11:41.560 from police officer of from police officers from junior rank 0:11:41.600 --> 0:11:45.480 and senior rank. Said mister goodenough, they wouldn't investigate. They'd 0:11:45.480 --> 0:11:47.640 sit down with him and have a cigarette while chatting 0:11:47.640 --> 0:11:53.760 with bodies lying nearby. Yeah, that's not good, pretty gross. 0:11:53.920 --> 0:11:54.840 I think I'm going. 0:11:54.760 --> 0:11:56.920 To guess the cops are doing some of this too. 0:11:57.360 --> 0:12:00.840 He was doing it when he was a cop, likehooting, 0:12:01.880 --> 0:12:04.000 murdering people too. It's just happening. 0:12:04.200 --> 0:12:07.920 It's just understood. He is probably talking shop with a 0:12:07.960 --> 0:12:13.360 guy who also just killed someone a lot of the time, right. 0:12:12.320 --> 0:12:14.440 So it's not like they are too stupid to realize 0:12:14.480 --> 0:12:16.880 he's shot all the back on the ground. 0:12:17.640 --> 0:12:19.760 I don't know how much all of the local like 0:12:19.800 --> 0:12:22.200 white business owners, are aware of the specifics of what 0:12:22.320 --> 0:12:24.480 Lewis is doing, but the cops are. They don't, like, 0:12:24.520 --> 0:12:26.880 they don't they don't give a shit, no, no, no, 0:12:27.320 --> 0:12:29.640 except for you know, a good number of journalists actually 0:12:29.640 --> 0:12:33.920 do like there is a it takes a significant journalistic effort. 0:12:34.120 --> 0:12:36.040 This is actually a case of a murderer who is 0:12:36.120 --> 0:12:38.240 caught by the press and prosecuted. 0:12:38.880 --> 0:12:41.120 And I guess once a hundred guys are missing. 0:12:41.960 --> 0:12:45.000 That is funny you say that, family, because by nineteen 0:12:45.040 --> 0:12:47.280 eighty nine, Lewis has been involved in at least one 0:12:47.360 --> 0:12:51.360 hundred shootings, probably a lot more. No, no, he is 0:12:51.640 --> 0:12:54.600 at least one hundred shootings. And Lewis himself will say, like, 0:12:54.640 --> 0:12:56.959 I have no idea how many people I shot. There 0:12:56.960 --> 0:12:58.840 were way too many of them to keep track of, 0:12:59.000 --> 0:12:59.840 so normally. 0:12:59.520 --> 0:13:01.760 I would say I don't know how many people they've killed. 0:13:01.840 --> 0:13:04.440 Is a very bad thing to say, but I think 0:13:04.559 --> 0:13:07.559 once you get into a certain number, it's gonna be 0:13:07.600 --> 0:13:11.040 bad regardless. Probably better that he doesn't know because he's 0:13:11.120 --> 0:13:12.560 keeping meticulous records. 0:13:12.559 --> 0:13:13.080 That's worse. 0:13:13.360 --> 0:13:13.880 That's worse. 0:13:14.559 --> 0:13:17.600 I talked to a drone pilot once who was told, 0:13:17.720 --> 0:13:19.920 at like the end of his time of service by 0:13:19.960 --> 0:13:22.800 his superior the number of people that had been killed 0:13:22.840 --> 0:13:25.280 in drone strikes he participated in, and it was in 0:13:25.360 --> 0:13:27.920 the thousands, And he was like, why didn't you tell me? 0:13:28.320 --> 0:13:30.560 This is just ruined my life. 0:13:30.800 --> 0:13:33.400 Like, there's no amount of therapy that can undo that moment. 0:13:33.800 --> 0:13:37.000 You should know, right it actually it should be traumatic 0:13:37.120 --> 0:13:39.640 to blow people up with a drone. It's better than 0:13:39.640 --> 0:13:40.800 it's traumatic. Right. 0:13:41.320 --> 0:13:43.800 It just seems like telling him was a rude thing 0:13:43.840 --> 0:13:44.080 to do. 0:13:44.200 --> 0:13:47.120 It is kind of a dick move from your boss though, right. 0:13:47.440 --> 0:13:49.640 Okay, ay man, good job, jum. 0:13:49.840 --> 0:13:53.200 Want to let you know you've been responsible for the 0:13:53.200 --> 0:13:57.079 deaths of thousands. Yeah, Statistically about a third of them 0:13:57.080 --> 0:13:59.760 were innocent, at least, maybe more like seventy percent based 0:13:59.800 --> 0:14:02.760 on a lot of our analyzes. Anyway, have a good 0:14:02.760 --> 0:14:03.680 time as a civilian. 0:14:04.360 --> 0:14:06.280 We have the Mackenzie Intern figure out how many of 0:14:06.400 --> 0:14:06.960 more kids? 0:14:07.240 --> 0:14:08.720 Yeah, oh a bunch. 0:14:09.160 --> 0:14:09.520 Yeah. 0:14:09.559 --> 0:14:12.280 So, by nineteen eighty nine, Lewis had been involved in 0:14:12.320 --> 0:14:14.760 at least one hundred shootings. Now these numbers are not 0:14:14.880 --> 0:14:17.480 available to anyone, right, They are all buried in a 0:14:17.520 --> 0:14:20.840 police filing system that doesn't always name Lewis and was 0:14:20.920 --> 0:14:25.040 designed to frustrate outside observers, like reporters from the East 0:14:25.080 --> 0:14:30.520 London Daily Dispatch, where Patrick Goodenough worked. He'd gotten good enough. 0:14:31.520 --> 0:14:33.160 There's people are gonna be like, no, it's in South 0:14:33.200 --> 0:14:35.560 African we pronounce it Gowden, weef damn it? How do you? 0:14:35.800 --> 0:14:36.840 How can you not know that? 0:14:37.080 --> 0:14:39.760 But we're not doing that, You're mate, We're absolutely not 0:14:39.840 --> 0:14:40.160 doing that. 0:14:40.200 --> 0:14:43.160 I don't care disrespecting it on bur is Patrick good enough, 0:14:43.240 --> 0:14:44.320 and by god he is. 0:14:44.560 --> 0:14:44.680 So. 0:14:45.160 --> 0:14:48.240 Patrick got onto the story when he interviewed one of 0:14:48.280 --> 0:14:52.520 the men who had survived Lewis, a guy named Ciabanga Tom, 0:14:52.600 --> 0:14:54.080 which is another excellent name. 0:14:54.200 --> 0:14:55.640 Yeah seriously, Now. 0:14:55.600 --> 0:14:58.880 Unfortunately Seabanga Tom is a child when he is shot. 0:14:58.920 --> 0:15:02.200 I think he's like fourteen something. That Patrick had also 0:15:02.280 --> 0:15:06.240 interviewed Lewis, who had bragged the first time the number 0:15:06.240 --> 0:15:08.240 comes out. Is that Patrick is just talking to this 0:15:08.280 --> 0:15:11.400 guy who he started to think might be a serial 0:15:11.480 --> 0:15:14.000 killer because cia Banda Tom says like, I wasn't trying 0:15:14.040 --> 0:15:16.720 to run, he just kind of tried to execute me, right. 0:15:17.280 --> 0:15:19.680 So Patrick comes across a couple other cases of shootings 0:15:19.680 --> 0:15:21.360 this guy is involved and finds out like it seems 0:15:21.360 --> 0:15:23.240 like there's a lot of bodies tied to this guy. 0:15:23.640 --> 0:15:27.120 So he sits down with Lewis, thinking like, all right, 0:15:27.160 --> 0:15:28.720 you know, this is going to be maybe one of 0:15:28.720 --> 0:15:30.440 the tougher interviews of my life. I've got a man 0:15:30.480 --> 0:15:32.360 here that I think is a serial murderer. You know, 0:15:32.400 --> 0:15:35.640 he's probably doing some terrible things and getting away with it, 0:15:35.720 --> 0:15:38.080 and I'm trying to bring him down. He's gonna know that. 0:15:38.160 --> 0:15:39.520 You know, we're going to be playing this game of 0:15:39.560 --> 0:15:42.080 cat and mouse, this real like Hannibal Lecter moment with 0:15:42.120 --> 0:15:44.440 a murderer. And as soon as the interview starts, Lewis 0:15:44.520 --> 0:15:46.000 is like, yeah, I shot more than like a hundred 0:15:46.040 --> 0:15:48.640 people than the last couple of years. It's crazy how 0:15:48.640 --> 0:15:53.120 many guys I'm shooting. Just very funny. 0:15:53.880 --> 0:15:57.040 Oh the vibes in that room, Yeah, insane. 0:15:57.360 --> 0:15:59.720 It's like, yeah, I reckon, I've shot like a hundred people. 0:16:00.360 --> 0:16:03.320 I don't know, can't really count that high. Anyway, what's 0:16:03.360 --> 0:16:04.920 this article about? 0:16:06.840 --> 0:16:08.640 But that wasn't even part of the eneview. He's just 0:16:08.640 --> 0:16:09.360 making small talk. 0:16:09.440 --> 0:16:11.640 No, he just likes He just likes killing. He likes 0:16:11.640 --> 0:16:14.040 talking about killing. He's just a big fan of it. 0:16:15.000 --> 0:16:17.880 You will not be surprised to hear that. This convinced 0:16:17.920 --> 0:16:20.720 Patrick he was onto a big story. Now. He had 0:16:20.760 --> 0:16:23.480 nearly finished an article on the shooting, but unfortunately the 0:16:23.600 --> 0:16:26.920 article was centered because the first survivor he's talked to 0:16:27.000 --> 0:16:30.360 is Ciabanga, Tom right. So his article is centered on 0:16:30.440 --> 0:16:34.160 Tom's experience because Tom also gives him an eyewitness account 0:16:34.560 --> 0:16:38.160 of Lewis breaking the law right him execute, you know, 0:16:38.480 --> 0:16:41.920 just shooting people. Right. The problem is that, like all 0:16:42.000 --> 0:16:46.000 of Lewis's victims Ceabanga, Tom gets charged with breaking and entering, 0:16:46.120 --> 0:16:49.520 and in South Africa they have this thing where if 0:16:49.640 --> 0:16:52.480 someone gets charged, the case is now what they called 0:16:52.560 --> 0:16:56.000 sub justice, which meant you're not allowed to report on 0:16:56.080 --> 0:16:59.360 it until the accused gives a statement in court. Oh, 0:17:00.440 --> 0:17:03.440 I can see why you would have a rule like this. 0:17:03.520 --> 0:17:07.119 I can understand how, even theoretically, it can develop out 0:17:07.160 --> 0:17:11.360 of good intentions. Right, you don't want yellow pressed, tabloid 0:17:11.440 --> 0:17:15.120 journalism or whatever affecting how a court case goes, right, 0:17:15.160 --> 0:17:15.840 So you want. 0:17:15.800 --> 0:17:17.880 And a lot of countries have pretty strict laws about 0:17:17.880 --> 0:17:20.240 how the pass is allowed to report on crime. 0:17:20.640 --> 0:17:24.919 Yes, so I do understand why some of why this 0:17:24.960 --> 0:17:26.520 may have come into place. But in the case like 0:17:26.600 --> 0:17:30.000 you really see the weakness of that here because every 0:17:30.080 --> 0:17:32.439 time Patrick gets close to being able to report on 0:17:32.520 --> 0:17:36.840 Lewis actively shooting people, that person will get charged and 0:17:36.880 --> 0:17:40.479 he can't publish the article. Right. So it's this kind 0:17:40.520 --> 0:17:45.680 of maddening state of affairs for him. So furious, Patrick 0:17:45.720 --> 0:17:48.320 decides that the story he has is not good enough 0:17:48.359 --> 0:17:51.400 and he can contacts a local legal aid charity called 0:17:51.440 --> 0:17:55.000 Black Sash to try to get Seabanga a lawyer. He 0:17:55.040 --> 0:17:58.720 talked with their coordinator, Charlene Craig, about Lewis, who he'd interviewed, 0:17:59.000 --> 0:18:01.159 and let her know, Hey, hey, there's this like white 0:18:01.240 --> 0:18:04.000 former cop security guard who just told me he shot 0:18:04.040 --> 0:18:08.840 one hundred people. You guys are like dealing with, you know, 0:18:09.200 --> 0:18:12.160 legal justice issues in our town. Have you looked into 0:18:12.200 --> 0:18:14.800 this at all? And it turns out that Charlene had. 0:18:15.000 --> 0:18:16.840 She hands him a copy of a statement that she 0:18:16.960 --> 0:18:20.240 had taken a month earlier from a local man named Zumzie. 0:18:20.600 --> 0:18:23.640 Quote and this is from the book The Color of Violence. 0:18:24.119 --> 0:18:25.840 In it, he said he was on his way home 0:18:25.880 --> 0:18:28.280 in October nineteen eighty eight after trying to get work 0:18:28.320 --> 0:18:30.280 at a bakery when a man in a backie it's 0:18:30.280 --> 0:18:32.760 a kind of vehicle asked him if he wanted a job. 0:18:33.119 --> 0:18:35.040 He said, He climbed into the vehicle and the two 0:18:35.080 --> 0:18:37.640 drove a short way to the Turnbull Bowling Club, where 0:18:37.640 --> 0:18:39.840 the man who said his name was Van Schure told 0:18:39.880 --> 0:18:41.520