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Speaker 1: Ridiculous crime is a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Zaren, Elizabeth, are you serving over there? Don't get me started.

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Speaker 2: What I'm serving? I can't say over the air.

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Speaker 3: I know I'm serving soft serves in my mind. You

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Speaker 3: know it's ridiculous.

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Speaker 2: Oh brother, do I spill it? So in this two

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Speaker 2: thousand book, a year two thousand, there was a book,

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Speaker 2: and that that's not wasn't called the two thousand book,

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Speaker 2: but it was a book that came out in two

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Speaker 2: thousand by authors Anthony Summers and Robin Swan robb Y

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Speaker 2: n Robin. Now in that book they described how close

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Speaker 2: we once got to World War three and how get this, Elizabeth,

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Speaker 2: Henry Kissinger prevented a nuclear war? What I know, I

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Speaker 2: was surprised too.

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Speaker 3: But according to uh and you killed him?

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Speaker 2: I did? You did with my mind? And so according

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Speaker 2: to George Carver, this is like Vietnam Specialist. In nineteen

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Speaker 2: sixty nine, the North Koreans they shot down like a

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Speaker 2: U two spyplane, and it made uh Dick Nixon all angry.

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Speaker 3: Right on.

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Speaker 2: Richard Nixon was known to UH get a little tossed

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Speaker 2: late at night in the White House, right he would get.

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Speaker 4: Heated and I'd be like, I want to bomb them, right. So,

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Speaker 4: according to Carver quote, Nixon became incensed and ordered a

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Speaker 4: tactical nuclear strike. The Joint chiefs were alerted and asked

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Speaker 4: to recommend targets, but Kissinger got on the phone to them.

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Speaker 4: They agreed not to do anything until Nixon sobered up

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Speaker 4: in the morning.

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Speaker 5: Oh my god.

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Speaker 4: So Nixon was trying to call a nuclear strike on

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Speaker 4: North Korea in the middle of the Cold War, which

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Speaker 4: would have caused a nuclear exchange for me though the

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Speaker 4: Russians were the Chinese, and then.

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Speaker 3: We wouldn't even be here. Yes, never would have been born.

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Speaker 4: All because Nixon like we got heated and was like

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Speaker 4: we should bomb them. And even Kissinger was like that's

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Speaker 4: just not a good idea or whatever.

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Speaker 2: Big.

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Speaker 3: You know, what the problem is is that men are

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Speaker 3: too emotional in hormonal.

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Speaker 2: I say this all the time. I love it.

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Speaker 4: Told the Joint use of Staff ignore the president's order,

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Speaker 4: and they did. They waited till the morning. They're like,

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Speaker 4: he'll sober up, and this wasn't the only time he did.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's why they're like, okay, fine, you there you go.

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Speaker 3: That is ridiculous. Do you want to know what else

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Speaker 3: is ridiculous.

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Speaker 2: I'm sorry, Elizabeth.

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Speaker 4: He literally had to say, Henry, we got to nuke them.

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Speaker 3: He knew what he was, he knew it. Where it

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Speaker 3: came out of this is.

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Speaker 2: How crazyly close we've gotten.

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Speaker 3: How much does that mess up a mind to be

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Speaker 3: able to say, like, we've got to nuke them. I

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Speaker 3: have it. I think it's like it's this coin toss

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Speaker 3: right of humanity, so that like, if you have the

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Speaker 3: power to say, let's nuke them, which is just in

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Speaker 3: that abstract kind of language, is disgusting. But aside from that,

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Speaker 3: either to hold it as the most like incredible, you know,

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Speaker 3: fragile weight that you that you carry for humanity, or

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Speaker 3: as like, you know, I've got a a pipe swinging

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Speaker 3: thing on this one, you know what I mean?

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Speaker 2: Like I'm five high balls.

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Speaker 3: It feels like two sides to the coin, and which

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Speaker 3: one are you? You know what I mean?

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Speaker 4: Like, Yeah, I'm just saying It's basically my point is

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Speaker 4: we've avoided World War three in the past, and so.

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Speaker 3: Again it can be avoided again. Yes, even though you

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Speaker 3: killed Henry Kissinger, we can avoid this. We can do it.

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Speaker 3: You guys, thank you for the credit for that yeah,

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Speaker 3: you're welcome always. Okay. You know what else is ridiculous? No,

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Speaker 3: I do not trying to do a good town dirty

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Speaker 3: Oh this is ridiculous crime A podcast about absurd and

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Speaker 3: outrageous capers his cons. It's always ninety nine percent murder

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Speaker 3: free and one hundred percent ridiculous.

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Speaker 2: You damn right, Saren.

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Speaker 3: Close as I'm kidding, Zaren, I have run up on me.

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Speaker 3: I'm not of sound mind. I have allergies.

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Speaker 2: Oh, in my eyes.

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Speaker 3: In my nose and my throat, and my teeth and

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Speaker 3: my toes. It's in my face. I always ask my dogs,

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Speaker 3: are you hungry? In your face and your body? They

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Speaker 3: answer me anyway. Allergies. It's we had that heat wave

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Speaker 3: and just boom.

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Speaker 2: Everything the air.

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Speaker 4: I got very lucky that everyone in my family has allergies. No,

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Speaker 4: I don't have them.

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Speaker 3: Okay, so we're not keeping our eyes open right now.

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Speaker 3: I want to read to you from the Tuesday, May thirteenth,

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Speaker 3: eighteen seventy nine edition of the San Francisco Chronicle. Hell yeah,

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Speaker 3: and I don't want you to worry. This is not

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Speaker 3: a California centric day, just happens to be. From the

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Speaker 3: Chronicle headline, a circus fraud, a man who subsists by

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Speaker 3: using other men's names. Yeah, here's the text. About five

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Speaker 3: o'clock last evening, a chronicle reporter, while standing upon the

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Speaker 3: northwest corner of Bush and Kearney Streets, overheard the somewhat

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Speaker 3: unintelligible remark he's the high daddy of the whole of them.

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Speaker 2: What the high daddy?

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Speaker 3: It evidently referred to a short, thick set, dark complexioned

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Speaker 3: individual with full face which was ornamented with a heavy,

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Speaker 3: dark mustache, and who was leaning carelessly against a building

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Speaker 3: on the opposite side of the street. There was nothing

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Speaker 3: about the man to indicate why he should possess the

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Speaker 3: high sounding title as high Daddy, and yet the strange

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Speaker 3: appearance of his ever moving black eye, the constant tapping

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Speaker 3: of his long slender fingers upon the window glass behind him,

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Speaker 3: coupled with a certain undefinable something in his dress and manner,

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Speaker 3: stamped him at once as a peculiar personage. Inquiry revealed

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Speaker 3: the fact that he was the proprietor of a circus,

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Speaker 3: or at least he had been overheard a short time

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Speaker 3: before to represent himself as such. Upon further inquiry, however,

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Speaker 3: it was ascertained that the man whose name is George

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Speaker 3: Diavolis represents himself as an attache of almost every circus

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Speaker 3: that exists.

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Speaker 4: By the way, from now on, can you introduce me

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Speaker 4: as as the high Daddy?

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Speaker 3: Is my friend the lady host the high Daddy? Okay,

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Speaker 3: that's that works. It works so beautifully. He's the high

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Speaker 3: Daddy of the whole of them. So much happened in

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Speaker 3: that param God. Yeah, like my eyes spun around like

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Speaker 3: slot machines, and then I was like.

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Speaker 4: You're seeing those rooms where they have like ping pong

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Speaker 4: balls sitting on mouse traps and you throw in one

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Speaker 4: ping pong.

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Speaker 2: That was my brain.

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Speaker 3: That's how it worked. It was beautiful, and I became

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Speaker 3: hungry for it in my face and my body. So

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Speaker 3: all right, who are you? I'm the representative of every

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Speaker 3: circus on the plane. Where'd you go to school for that?

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Speaker 3: All right?

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Speaker 2: So this guy that technical college, apparently.

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Speaker 3: He'd been at the circus con for some time, like, hey, Elizabeth,

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Speaker 3: what's the circus con?

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Speaker 2: Trying to keep on?

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Speaker 3: Saren?

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Speaker 2: What is the circus con? Keep up Zaren? Look behind

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Speaker 2: you there.

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Speaker 3: I am Essentially someone comes to town and hypes up

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Speaker 3: a circus. They sell tickets, they sell sponsorship, advanced space. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: and then the circus never materialized. Oh that comes to town,

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Speaker 3: and no one ever sends in the clowns because they're

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Speaker 3: already here in the dupes who bought the tickets.

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Speaker 2: So surprise, you're the clowns.

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Speaker 3: So this guy on the San Francisco Street corner in

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Speaker 3: eighteen seventy nine was well known for this, a high

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Speaker 3: daddy of the craft. And according to the article, in

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Speaker 3: the past he'd passed himself off as an advanced agent

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Speaker 3: of Rens's German circus and said he was in town

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Speaker 3: looking for talent, and like he's doing this talent search

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Speaker 3: and oh, can I also borrow thirty bucks because I'm

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Speaker 3: waiting for a wire transfer to come in from London.

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Speaker 3: There's no wire transfer, of course, Luckily the mark figured

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Speaker 3: that out and got the money back. This same guy, Diabolos.

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Speaker 3: He once impersonated Harry Cordonna, the famous stilt performer Harry.

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Speaker 3: Another time he told folks that he was Hernandez, the writer,

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Speaker 3: like the Hernandez the writer, the writer rid like ride

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Speaker 3: them cowboy Hernandez. There was once a real circus in

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Speaker 3: town Montgomery Queen's circus. The money man for that circus

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Speaker 3: got a bill one day from a hotel five days

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Speaker 3: board seven dollars borrowed money, and the legit circus guys like,

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Speaker 3: I don't what is this about. I don't any think

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Speaker 3: about it. The innkeepers like, it's for Romeo Sebastian. You know,

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Speaker 3: Romeo Sebastian, your circus star.

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Speaker 2: Was that one of Lenny Kravitz's early names. Yes, that

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Speaker 2: was Romeo Blue.

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Speaker 3: He was Romeo Blue and then he was Romeo Sebastian

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Speaker 3: and then he became lennyra In Europe, That's what the

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Speaker 3: posters will translate to Romeo Sebastian, the circus star. The

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Speaker 3: guy's like, I've never heard of him. Diabolis so diabolis.

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Speaker 3: He gets a free he got a free hotel room

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Speaker 3: in San Francisco once by telling the place.

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Speaker 2: That he was p. T.

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Speaker 3: Barnum. Oh did he look like Pete Barney? Probably not,

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Speaker 3: not in the least was the circus in town.

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Speaker 2: No, I would claim that I was Bailey from Barnum

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Speaker 2: and Bay. Yeah, no one knows what Bailey looks like.

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Speaker 2: I'm one of the rings, one of the brothers.

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Speaker 3: I'm the forgotten Ringling Brothers.

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Speaker 4: Crazy how bad circus hit bad times where they had

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Speaker 4: to combine were like Ringling Brothers was its own circus,

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Speaker 4: its own circles.

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Speaker 3: Used to be that they had like what seven it's

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Speaker 3: like media monopoly. There's seven owners of media. Now we

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Speaker 3: get Now we're down.

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Speaker 2: To like two circus exactly.

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Speaker 3: So Diabolos told the hotel that he was I'm Pete Barnum. Hi.

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Speaker 3: I don't know if you know me. I'm in town

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Speaker 3: to scout out locations and such, but like keep it

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Speaker 3: quiet because like I don't like the attention. I'm Pete Barnes,

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Speaker 3: I'm business, I'm a private. He went up to Sacramento

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Speaker 3: and told him that he was the advance man for

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Speaker 3: an Australian circus. All good night, right, and they're like,

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Speaker 3: what even is that? It's not Australian. He's like, oh, Barbie.

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Speaker 3: So he managed to borrow a couple hundred bucks, which

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Speaker 3: was a lot, yeah, and then he skipped town. The

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Speaker 3: point of the article was to let the public know

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Speaker 3: that although Diabolis had done eighteen months in San Quentin

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Speaker 3: for his scams, he was back at it and while

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Speaker 3: a good number of people felt bad for him, and

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Speaker 3: thought his cons were actually the work of a mentally

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Speaker 3: unwell compulsive liar. The public needed to know that this

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Speaker 3: criminal was out there and should be avoided.

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Speaker 2: You guys like a public service.

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Speaker 3: So circuses they really started back in ancient Rome. Let's

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Speaker 3: go back to.

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Speaker 2: It started with me the second Then I.

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Speaker 3: Want you to forget all that the modern circus attention

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Speaker 3: it did. I was like, let me say, Rome Vikings Memet,

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Speaker 3: get his attention right now, you're listening.

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Speaker 2: Great, totally.

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Speaker 3: The modern circus, Oh I lost him again, came around

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Speaker 3: in like the seventeen hundreds in England. It was mostly

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Speaker 3: like trick riding on horses.

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Speaker 2: I was wondering what the attractions are, But then.

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Speaker 3: They added in acrobats and like tight rope walkers and

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Speaker 3: clowns and.

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Speaker 2: Jugglers and people from far away places.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, selling far away spices. So circuses have always kind

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Speaker 3: of freaked me out.

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Speaker 2: The type.

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Speaker 3: I'm not a fan.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, some people are afraid of clowns, but you're not

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Speaker 2: in circ Like.

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Speaker 3: I don't like when they exploit animals, but just like, oh,

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Speaker 3: that's what it is. That's a big thing. Like when

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Speaker 3: I was a camp counselor during the summer, like in college.

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Speaker 3: In college, that's what I did. And we took the

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Speaker 3: kids to the circus at the Oakland Arena once because

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Speaker 3: it was like a city of Oakland, sure, and it

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Speaker 3: was so depressing and the elephants and the lions looked

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Speaker 3: so sad, and then the kids were bummed out by

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Speaker 3: it too.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, like a threadbare lion. Not Obama kid out?

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Speaker 3: Are you like, do you have clown issues?

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Speaker 2: Do you have?

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Speaker 3: No? No?

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Speaker 2: But I've known people like, like, my sister wants scared

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Speaker 2: somebody by putting a clown, a clown doll in the closet,

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Speaker 2: and when they opened the closet, we could hear that

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Speaker 2: person shrieking.

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Speaker 3: Did you know your sister loved us?

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Speaker 2: You could hear this guy shrieking from like, I don't know,

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Speaker 2: a block away. It was insane.

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Speaker 3: I'm not scared of him. They they just also bummed

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Speaker 3: me out.

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Speaker 2: I've known a few people off.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I knew someone who did clowning as a political statement.

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Speaker 2: There you go. I knew protest as a career protest.

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Speaker 2: They went to clown college and everything, and they called

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Speaker 2: it clowning.

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Speaker 3: Oh really, I don't even want to get into it.

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Speaker 3: I don't want you to either yea and something off

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Speaker 3: and I don't like it circus anyway.

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Speaker 2: But wait a minute, do you not like like the

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Speaker 2: harlequin clowns? No, none of them to not like?

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Speaker 3: What about not afraid of?

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Speaker 2: What about the sad bum clowns?

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Speaker 3: You know, like I kind of want one of those

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Speaker 3: oil paintings. Yeah, that clown but for the kitsch factor.

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Speaker 3: But they don't scare me. They just kind of bummed

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Speaker 3: me out. Or there's just something off, something's not right,

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Speaker 3: and I don't know what that is.

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Speaker 4: Clowns because they're chaotic, bucket of confettiant children love that

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Speaker 4: chef Harlem globe trotterers, They're they're clowns.

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Speaker 2: They're kind of clowns. Yeah, see what I'm saying, broad,

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Speaker 2: got a broad?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I do. I need to know. I don't. I'm

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Speaker 3: stuck in my ways. So in the beginning modern circuses,

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Speaker 3: they took place in big arenas. In eighteen twenty five

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Speaker 3: in the US, Joshua Perdy Brown was the first circus

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Speaker 3: owner to use a large canvas tent for the circus.

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Speaker 2: The Big Top.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, moobile circus action right totally. P. T. Barnum then

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Speaker 3: got in on the action revolutionized the whole thing. He

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Speaker 3: added the freak show or the side show. The exploitation

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Speaker 3: of that is very upsetting, and I went, I was

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Speaker 3: going to do this whole side thing, and I was like,

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Speaker 3: why do I do this to myself?

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Speaker 4: Like the Lizard boy, the stay Happy, Stay Happy. He

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Speaker 4: also brought in like Jumbo the elephant. Yeah, like the

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Speaker 4: crazy sized animals.

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Speaker 3: Everything was outsized and weird and either enough exactly. The

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Speaker 3: thing about circuses is that there's always like a thin

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Speaker 3: halo of crime around it.

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Speaker 2: That's why I like like a fuzzy show.

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Speaker 3: Fuzzy aura in the air, like a thin cluster of

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Speaker 3: gnats erratically buzzing above and around them crime bats. Did

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Speaker 3: you like that show, the old HBO show that.

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Speaker 2: Stuff? Did you like those clowns?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, they don't have clowns.

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Speaker 2: They don't just freaks, just like the strong Man Bearded Lady,

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Speaker 2: and like.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I love that show. The most prevalent in the

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Speaker 3: olden days took place in the side show area, the

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Speaker 3: freak show area, and stuff like that, things like three card,

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Speaker 3: Monty Bunco, total stuff. And I would imagine that the

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Speaker 3: circuses of today have to contend with like drug use

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Speaker 3: and drug dealer as their kind of side crimes.

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Speaker 2: Okay, don't you think how do we even contend? Like

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Speaker 2: from the performers, keep them away from.

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Speaker 3: The math some time about like the crime that buzzes

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Speaker 3: around it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they're selling drugs like they travel around sure, or

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Speaker 2: like you've been.

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Speaker 3: To a carnival and like you see who runs the carnival.

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Speaker 4: I've been involved in supplying drugs people inside. Just I

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Speaker 4: used to know a bunch of people are involved. Who

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00:15:23,400 --> 00:15:26,960
Speaker 4: did the car like they would get all excited summer

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Speaker 4: was coming coming, Right, there's definitely.

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Speaker 3: A low level crime going There was and remains another

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Speaker 3: flavor of circus crime, the advance con like I was

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Speaker 3: telling you, yes.

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Speaker 2: The advance mancus is.

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Speaker 3: Coming saw the stuff?

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Speaker 2: No it's not.

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Speaker 3: And then there's the crime inside legit circuses in the

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Speaker 3: form of embezzlement. Oh right, I have a bunch of

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Speaker 3: these for you today. But the kicker, the final one

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Speaker 3: is a serious chef's kiss. We're going to be going

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Speaker 3: out with a bang today. I love banks so but

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Speaker 3: running up to it, there are tons of stories and

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Speaker 3: papers from the late eighteen hundreds and early nineteen hundreds

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Speaker 3: about circus scamps, one I particularly enjoyed was a nineteen

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Speaker 3: oh nine article in the Saturday Evening Post entitled the

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Speaker 3: Confessions of the con Man Life with the Old Time Circus.

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Speaker 2: Oh I bet that was good.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, it was great. It starts off this circus

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00:16:18,840 --> 00:16:22,200
Speaker 3: was a little nine car concern which had some territory

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Speaker 3: in Indiana and Michigan. We cut a zig zag course

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Speaker 3: all the season. We showed a few poor trapees and

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Speaker 3: bareback turns, a small menagerie and some clowns.

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Speaker 2: Can you imagine having a circus train like giraft that

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00:16:36,320 --> 00:16:42,200
Speaker 2: top and like you got bars totally in the juggler again,

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Speaker 2: sitting there with the conductor or whatever zerin. Close your eyes,

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Speaker 2: get out of town.

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Speaker 3: I'm kidding. So the article of the article reminded me

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Speaker 3: so much of what you said Carnival, the HBO show

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Speaker 3: that I love anyway.

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Speaker 2: Really, I mean, that's such a great period it is.

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Speaker 3: It's fantastic. So the article gives readers this like rare

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Speaker 3: first person explanation of circus related fraud from the perspective

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Speaker 3: of a working con man. There's this explanation of the

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Speaker 3: inner divisions in the circus quote. A circus is always

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Speaker 3: divided into two camps, the performers we call them kinkers,

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Speaker 3: and the gamblers. The kinkers are the most retiring and

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Speaker 3: exclusive people in the world. Half of them can't tell

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Speaker 3: you the name of the town they're playing. They don't

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Speaker 3: seem to have any interest in anything but their acts.

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Speaker 3: They go to their bunks when their performance is over,

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Speaker 3: get up the next morning, gets stop practice, do their turns, eat,

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Speaker 3: and then back to the bunks again. They hate the

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Speaker 3: grafters on principle because the gambling games make so much

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Speaker 3: noise and trouble. The canvas men as a rule side

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Speaker 3: with the grafters. So those are just the rightnecks who

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Speaker 3: put the all the tents up.

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Speaker 2: Well, I like the kinkers because it's like, you know,

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Speaker 2: that's like the lady who's got the snakes in and

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Speaker 2: you like whatever a basket in the training car, and

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00:17:57,600 --> 00:17:59,960
Speaker 2: she's like, she's got to ten dollar of her snake.

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Speaker 2: Like the mentalist, right, he's gonna go on clean his

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Speaker 2: turbans or whatever, like tend to his jewels.

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Speaker 3: So, according to his account, the fraudsters in his group,

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Speaker 3: they targeted circus audiences because of like these unique social conditions.

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Speaker 3: You know when they'd come to a rural area, they

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Speaker 3: get a huge crowd, a lot of farm families who

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00:18:20,359 --> 00:18:23,359
Speaker 3: didn't have a lot of exposure to professional entertainment totally,

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Speaker 3: and people who had traveled long distances and like came

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Speaker 3: to the circus and were ready to spend some money.

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Speaker 2: Before there was like TV, you know, like you're talking

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Speaker 2: like before it basically nineteen forty eight. You have this

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00:18:35,280 --> 00:18:38,760
Speaker 2: just desire, set the money aside, and like I'm gonna

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Speaker 2: know spring is common, to summer's common.

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Speaker 3: You're gonna get treats.

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Speaker 2: We're gonna you know, like the freak show.

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Speaker 3: Will be here to see the freak show. And then

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Speaker 3: also the kids can look at the nice lady's got

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Speaker 3: three legs.

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Speaker 2: That kind of but I mean to imagine like it

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Speaker 2: would open your eyes.

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Speaker 4: You're just this farm boy, Oh yeah, your farm girl,

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Speaker 4: and you're just going out to see like whatever you

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Speaker 4: name a freak.

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Speaker 3: But that also made them the perfect marks for the bunk,

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00:19:00,520 --> 00:19:03,440
Speaker 3: of course, and so these con artists, they knew the

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00:19:03,520 --> 00:19:07,399
Speaker 3: visitors were vulnerable, not necessarily because they lacked intelligence, but

386
00:19:07,600 --> 00:19:11,760
Speaker 3: just like the festive atmosphere just encouraged impulsive behavior and

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00:19:11,840 --> 00:19:16,280
Speaker 3: kind of lowered their their skeptic. Yes, So he tells

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Speaker 3: the story of a working circus uh in rural Michigan

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Speaker 3: that he was on in logging country and they duped

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Speaker 3: a bunch of French Canadian lumbermen who then came after them.

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Speaker 3: And he claims that two hundred lumberjacks came came calling

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Speaker 3: to the tents at the end of the night looking

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Speaker 3: a rumble and they wanted to take on the twenty

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Speaker 3: five grafters, which is like, okay, I know who's embellishing

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Speaker 3: their story.

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Speaker 5: And there was.

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Speaker 3: There was a punch in, there was a kicking, and

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Speaker 3: the conment one and quote quote we carted off seven

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00:19:54,080 --> 00:19:56,560
Speaker 3: frenchmen to the hospital. I don't know that any of

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00:19:56,640 --> 00:19:59,200
Speaker 3: them were disabled for life, but some looked to be

401
00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:02,120
Speaker 3: pretty badly hurt. Besides a few bruises and cut heads,

402
00:20:02,160 --> 00:20:04,399
Speaker 3: the only injury we had was one broken arm.

403
00:20:04,480 --> 00:20:05,600
Speaker 2: Were they like shooting them?

404
00:20:08,160 --> 00:20:11,680
Speaker 3: These are ruffians, to be sure of that. Let's take

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Speaker 3: a break and we come back some more contemporary circus crime.

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Speaker 3: Zaren Elizabeth arn Okay, so I've talked a lot about

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Speaker 3: circus crimes.

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Speaker 2: Of the past. Yes, you always are going on a

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Speaker 2: short amount of.

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00:20:44,800 --> 00:20:48,800
Speaker 3: Time, but we have some that happened today, just today,

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Speaker 3: like right now outside. The Better Business Bureau website has

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Speaker 3: all sorts of complaints against circuses sold tickets to shows

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00:20:58,960 --> 00:21:01,960
Speaker 3: that never happened. I found a bunch of complaints about

414
00:21:02,040 --> 00:21:05,600
Speaker 3: Garden Brothers Circus and they're mostly from twenty twenty four.

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00:21:05,720 --> 00:21:10,080
Speaker 3: Garden Brothers looks totally unhinged based on their website.

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00:21:10,080 --> 00:21:11,479
Speaker 2: It's called Garden Brothers.

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00:21:11,600 --> 00:21:16,960
Speaker 3: Garden Brothers. They advertise as Garden Brosden Brothers Nuclear Circus.

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Speaker 3: What human's gone wild?

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00:21:19,200 --> 00:21:21,239
Speaker 2: Oh my god, this sounds like it sounds like it's

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Speaker 2: Juggal related.

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00:21:22,280 --> 00:21:26,920
Speaker 3: It's one hundred minutes of NonStop entertainment there timed it. Yeah,

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00:21:27,160 --> 00:21:29,680
Speaker 3: and then they kick you out immediately. There's a lot

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00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:33,879
Speaker 3: of acrobatics and dance clowns, dog tricks.

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Speaker 2: Oh, I can get with that.

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Speaker 3: And then but there's too many people. I don't do

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00:21:37,960 --> 00:21:41,960
Speaker 3: crowd anyway. And then there's both the Globe of Death

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Speaker 3: and the Wheel of Death, oh.

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Speaker 2: With the motorcycles inside.

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Speaker 3: So the globe is for the motorcycles and the wheel

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00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:47,760
Speaker 3: is for acrobats.

431
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Speaker 2: Okay, but there's death involved. They have two wheels they

432
00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:51,679
Speaker 2: go around each other.

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00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:55,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, right now it looks like they're traveling up

434
00:21:55,040 --> 00:21:59,080
Speaker 3: and down the Eastern Seaboard with forays into like Indiana, Illinois, Missouri.

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00:21:59,160 --> 00:22:01,240
Speaker 2: Oh, I'm so taking you a circus this summer.

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00:22:03,280 --> 00:22:06,639
Speaker 3: Here when you read, okay, maybe not. Here's what they

437
00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:09,560
Speaker 3: say about themselves on their website. This is interesting. Garden

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00:22:09,600 --> 00:22:12,959
Speaker 3: Brothers Circus has been entertaining families for more than a century.

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00:22:13,400 --> 00:22:16,119
Speaker 3: Founded in the nineteen thirties, which is not more than

440
00:22:16,160 --> 00:22:20,879
Speaker 3: a century, but okay, they're getting close more than a century.

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00:22:21,600 --> 00:22:23,359
Speaker 2: Okay, they're writing from the future.

442
00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:27,040
Speaker 3: Founded in the nineteen thirties by Scottish immigrants William and

443
00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:31,200
Speaker 3: Robertson Garden, it began as a small vaudeville act in Canada.

444
00:22:31,680 --> 00:22:34,639
Speaker 3: Today it stands as the largest circus on Earth, touring

445
00:22:34,720 --> 00:22:38,560
Speaker 3: across the United States and bringing unforgettable live entertainment to

446
00:22:38,680 --> 00:22:39,879
Speaker 3: cities of every size.

447
00:22:40,080 --> 00:22:42,399
Speaker 2: How can I be just on earth? And I've never

448
00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:42,800
Speaker 2: heard of that?

449
00:22:42,960 --> 00:22:45,120
Speaker 3: That's a good question. And also when I just read

450
00:22:45,160 --> 00:22:49,120
Speaker 3: the line, I almost said uncomfortable instead of unforgetable, unforgettable

451
00:22:49,840 --> 00:22:51,880
Speaker 3: or unforgivable. I don't know. I'm not worrying. I don't

452
00:22:51,880 --> 00:22:55,080
Speaker 3: wear my glasses anymore because to hell with it. In

453
00:22:55,280 --> 00:23:00,560
Speaker 3: nineteen sixteen, William and Robertson Gardens settled in Canada. William

454
00:23:00,640 --> 00:23:03,560
Speaker 3: pursued a career in vaudeville, forming the act Garden and

455
00:23:03,640 --> 00:23:07,280
Speaker 3: Shaw with his wife Jean. They later established the Canadian

456
00:23:07,359 --> 00:23:11,879
Speaker 3: Vaudeville Exchange, which evolved into Garden Amusements Limited. In nineteen

457
00:23:11,960 --> 00:23:15,159
Speaker 3: thirty two, William was contracted to produce a circus at

458
00:23:15,200 --> 00:23:18,760
Speaker 3: the Coliseum in Toronto. By nineteen forty nine, his brother

459
00:23:18,920 --> 00:23:22,760
Speaker 3: Robertson joined as a partner, and together they relocated to California.

460
00:23:23,320 --> 00:23:26,160
Speaker 3: During its early years, the circus was North America's sole

461
00:23:26,359 --> 00:23:31,400
Speaker 3: full time indoor circus. After William's passing in the nineteen fifties,

462
00:23:31,520 --> 00:23:36,160
Speaker 3: his sons Bill, George and Ian launched smaller circuses, eventually

463
00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:39,200
Speaker 3: adopting the name Garden Brothers Circus. In nineteen fifty nine.

464
00:23:39,560 --> 00:23:42,879
Speaker 3: They transitioned to indoor performances and introduced a circus tent

465
00:23:42,920 --> 00:23:46,400
Speaker 3: in nineteen sixty. In nineteen sixty seven, Ian and Dick

466
00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:50,080
Speaker 3: Garden took over, with Ian continuing the indoor Garden Brothers

467
00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:54,440
Speaker 3: tour throughout eastern Canada. In nineteen ninety, Ian passed the

468
00:23:54,520 --> 00:23:57,680
Speaker 3: reins to his sons Richard and Ian Junior, who carried

469
00:23:57,760 --> 00:24:00,879
Speaker 3: on the tradition until around twenty ten. The Garden Brothers'

470
00:24:00,880 --> 00:24:04,240
Speaker 3: circus title remained dormant until Nile's Garden revived it in

471
00:24:04,359 --> 00:24:08,479
Speaker 3: March of twenty fifteen. So it really is a family circus.

472
00:24:08,680 --> 00:24:11,360
Speaker 3: It truly is, and they get their shriff complaints.

473
00:24:12,280 --> 00:24:14,160
Speaker 2: So here's a good one from Garden Bros.

474
00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:16,400
Speaker 3: Here. This is a good one from July of twenty

475
00:24:16,520 --> 00:24:21,720
Speaker 3: twenty four. This company is the biggest scam. On Sunday,

476
00:24:21,800 --> 00:24:23,920
Speaker 3: July seventh and twenty twenty four, I had the so

477
00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:27,880
Speaker 3: called quote free tickets to attend the circus. These tickets

478
00:24:27,920 --> 00:24:30,560
Speaker 3: are nothing more than a bait and switch scam. I

479
00:24:30,680 --> 00:24:33,560
Speaker 3: had already paid twenty dollars to park my car, and

480
00:24:33,640 --> 00:24:35,800
Speaker 3: when I got to the gate to give my tickets,

481
00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:38,760
Speaker 3: they showed me in small print which was not worded

482
00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:41,719
Speaker 3: properly to fully understand that you need to purchase an

483
00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:45,160
Speaker 3: adult ticket to use the quote free ticket. The ticket

484
00:24:45,240 --> 00:24:48,520
Speaker 3: says free in big bold letters, but the rules are

485
00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:52,040
Speaker 3: in small fine print that you can't really understand. When

486
00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:53,960
Speaker 3: I went over to the window to purchase a ticket,

487
00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:58,520
Speaker 3: the price was sixty three dollars per adult. Then I

488
00:24:58,680 --> 00:25:01,520
Speaker 3: was told they were sold out general admission tickets and

489
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:04,159
Speaker 3: I would have to purchase a VIP ticket, which was

490
00:25:04,280 --> 00:25:08,000
Speaker 3: twenty dollars extra, and a child's VIP ticket, which was

491
00:25:08,040 --> 00:25:11,240
Speaker 3: an additional ten dollars. So the free ticket wasn't free

492
00:25:11,320 --> 00:25:14,840
Speaker 3: at all. I most certainly was not paying eighty dollars

493
00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:18,840
Speaker 3: to sit in a tent. Then the ticket also said

494
00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:21,200
Speaker 3: at the bottom that the first one hundred people to

495
00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:24,840
Speaker 3: pay online would only be charged fourteen dollars. So I

496
00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:27,640
Speaker 3: went to the parking lot and attempted to buy tickets online.

497
00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:30,440
Speaker 3: Of course, the fourteen dollar tickets were sold out and

498
00:25:30,520 --> 00:25:35,000
Speaker 3: the online price was fifty dollars. That's four different prices listed.

499
00:25:35,480 --> 00:25:38,320
Speaker 3: So are they just charging what they feel like? At

500
00:25:38,359 --> 00:25:40,480
Speaker 3: this point, I just wanted to leave, so I asked

501
00:25:40,520 --> 00:25:42,800
Speaker 3: the man working in the ticket booth if I could

502
00:25:42,840 --> 00:25:45,000
Speaker 3: get my twenty dollars back for the parking since I

503
00:25:45,160 --> 00:25:47,520
Speaker 3: did not attend the show. The man in the ticket

504
00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:49,520
Speaker 3: booth told me that I could get a refund if

505
00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:52,040
Speaker 3: I gave the parking attendant my red ticket that I

506
00:25:52,160 --> 00:25:55,120
Speaker 3: was given when I paid. When I approached the parking attendant,

507
00:25:55,200 --> 00:25:57,840
Speaker 3: he told me that there were no refunds. I explained

508
00:25:57,880 --> 00:25:59,920
Speaker 3: to him that the man working in the ticket booths

509
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:01,720
Speaker 3: to me, I could get my money back since I

510
00:26:01,840 --> 00:26:04,600
Speaker 3: did not attend the show, but he then rudely told me,

511
00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:08,240
Speaker 3: I'm sorry, no refunds. This whole operation is a scam,

512
00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:10,560
Speaker 3: and I wonder why they're still even in business.

513
00:26:10,840 --> 00:26:12,840
Speaker 2: So did you find a chalk mark on your back?

514
00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:19,000
Speaker 2: Hundred percent pure? Carni moves, Oh god, yeah, directing them all.

515
00:26:19,480 --> 00:26:21,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's a classic one. There are other complaints about

516
00:26:21,560 --> 00:26:24,680
Speaker 3: the tent being too hot, uh huh, like a yeah,

517
00:26:24,800 --> 00:26:26,639
Speaker 3: diabetics who said that they had to go to the

518
00:26:26,680 --> 00:26:29,640
Speaker 3: hospital for heat exhaustion due to the conditions in the tent.

519
00:26:30,119 --> 00:26:33,240
Speaker 3: And then there's this one, this complaint. We bought tickets

520
00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:36,440
Speaker 3: for our visiting family on October fifth, twenty twenty four,

521
00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:40,320
Speaker 3: five adult tickets at three hundred and fifteen dollars, and

522
00:26:40,560 --> 00:26:43,760
Speaker 3: our young child. They drove three hours to see us

523
00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:46,400
Speaker 3: and attend the circus. The tickets said the tent would

524
00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:49,360
Speaker 3: be climate controlled. It was so hot inside the tent

525
00:26:49,440 --> 00:26:51,920
Speaker 3: that we couldn't stay inside and see the event due

526
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:54,480
Speaker 3: to the excessive heat and concern for our young child

527
00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:58,080
Speaker 3: and elderly family. It was eighty degrees outside and it

528
00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:01,760
Speaker 3: was easily ninety plus degree inside the tent. We wish

529
00:27:01,840 --> 00:27:04,080
Speaker 3: to be refunded for our tickets three hundred and fifteen

530
00:27:04,119 --> 00:27:06,440
Speaker 3: dollars as we were unable to stay in attend the

531
00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:10,159
Speaker 3: event in the extreme temperatures inside. We submitted a refund

532
00:27:10,240 --> 00:27:12,440
Speaker 3: request to the box office and was handed a flyer

533
00:27:12,520 --> 00:27:14,960
Speaker 3: with an email address. We emailed the company and have

534
00:27:15,119 --> 00:27:16,879
Speaker 3: not received any communication from them.

535
00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:19,920
Speaker 2: If they're charging with like sixty sixty one bucks a

536
00:27:20,040 --> 00:27:23,320
Speaker 2: ticket for adults, how much do you think they're making

537
00:27:23,640 --> 00:27:24,280
Speaker 2: per night?

538
00:27:24,520 --> 00:27:27,480
Speaker 3: It's got to be And then the concessions. How many

539
00:27:27,600 --> 00:27:31,040
Speaker 3: inflatable alien balloons do you think they sell?

540
00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:33,520
Speaker 2: Oh? I got in big bags of stale popcorn.

541
00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:35,440
Speaker 3: Yes, and like hard cotton candy, Oh.

542
00:27:35,560 --> 00:27:36,639
Speaker 2: The hardest cotton candy.

543
00:27:36,840 --> 00:27:38,880
Speaker 3: There's so much going on, huge sodas.

544
00:27:39,040 --> 00:27:41,080
Speaker 2: You could brain a man with that cotton candy.

545
00:27:41,880 --> 00:27:44,640
Speaker 3: Well, my favorite was someone who threatened to report them

546
00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:48,880
Speaker 3: to the state Attorney General. You're selling waters and sodas

547
00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:52,840
Speaker 3: from Sam's Club marked not for resale at a huge markup,

548
00:27:53,800 --> 00:27:56,879
Speaker 3: So it looks like circuses are still sort of skirting

549
00:27:56,960 --> 00:27:58,960
Speaker 3: the edges of the law in their operations.

550
00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:00,919
Speaker 2: Ever done that's on the ground.

551
00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:04,439
Speaker 3: There's also white collar circus crime. Oh and that's got

552
00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:06,119
Speaker 3: to be a heck of a reveal when you go

553
00:28:06,200 --> 00:28:14,000
Speaker 3: to prison, What are you in for defrauding my circus? Okay?

554
00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:18,119
Speaker 3: So that's the story of George Pace. George Pace was

555
00:28:18,200 --> 00:28:22,320
Speaker 3: the board president of Circus Flora and Circus Flora is

556
00:28:22,359 --> 00:28:26,280
Speaker 3: a nonprofit, one ring theatrical circus and that like a

557
00:28:26,359 --> 00:28:28,840
Speaker 3: total Saint Louis cultural institution.

558
00:28:29,119 --> 00:28:32,679
Speaker 2: Okaylay which yeah, clothes.

559
00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:36,480
Speaker 3: So the circus was commissioned by this Italian composer, gian

560
00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:41,280
Speaker 3: Carlo Menotti for the Spiletto Festival USA in nineteen eighty six.

561
00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:46,360
Speaker 3: Spoletto USA is this huge annual performing arts festival in Charleston,

562
00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:47,120
Speaker 3: South Carolina.

563
00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:48,080
Speaker 2: Really have you heard of that?

564
00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:54,200
Speaker 3: I had vague I've heard, Yeah, it does. It's a nodi. See.

565
00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:56,480
Speaker 3: He wanted to have like festivals like that he had

566
00:28:56,520 --> 00:29:01,920
Speaker 3: back in Europe, specifically Spoletto, Italy had these credible festivals,

567
00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:04,760
Speaker 3: and so he wanted a place as charming as Spiletto.

568
00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:08,680
Speaker 3: So he picked Charleston and the next year, you know,

569
00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:13,080
Speaker 3: so he does this, this festival has this Circus Flora.

570
00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:15,840
Speaker 3: The next year, the circus found a permanent home in

571
00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:19,840
Speaker 3: Saint Louis and so, but they travel around. It has

572
00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:24,440
Speaker 3: elements of like traditional European circus mixed in with modern theater,

573
00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:28,800
Speaker 3: and the performances are all originals, so Circus Flora doesn't

574
00:29:28,880 --> 00:29:31,720
Speaker 3: just perform in Saint Louis. In nineteen ninety seven they

575
00:29:31,800 --> 00:29:34,320
Speaker 3: were their big top was the first to ever be

576
00:29:34,440 --> 00:29:38,800
Speaker 3: put up at the Kennedy Center in Washington, DC, and

577
00:29:38,920 --> 00:29:41,320
Speaker 3: then two thousand and two they put the tent up

578
00:29:41,360 --> 00:29:44,600
Speaker 3: at Lincoln Center, New York City at the Big Festival there.

579
00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:50,400
Speaker 3: They've done six appearances at the Spiletto Festival talking about yeah,

580
00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:53,760
Speaker 3: and they've done five different appearances on the island of Nantucket,

581
00:29:54,040 --> 00:29:57,160
Speaker 3: like these kind of vacations. But it so by the

582
00:29:57,240 --> 00:30:01,160
Speaker 3: early twenty twenties, it wasn't just like some entertainment brand.

583
00:30:01,240 --> 00:30:05,240
Speaker 3: It was a donor supported local nonprofit with board governance,

584
00:30:06,040 --> 00:30:08,480
Speaker 3: bank relationships, credit facilities.

585
00:30:08,160 --> 00:30:10,640
Speaker 2: Legit, legit yeah yeah, not like a fly by night

586
00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:11,800
Speaker 2: loaded up in the van.

587
00:30:11,920 --> 00:30:14,240
Speaker 3: We got go, not taking the profits and putting it

588
00:30:14,320 --> 00:30:17,560
Speaker 3: into a cigar box. The Lumberjacks are run, run, The

589
00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:22,960
Speaker 3: Lumberjacks are coming and their French Canadian, so he pays.

590
00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:25,800
Speaker 3: He joined the board of Circus Flora in twenty twenty

591
00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:28,920
Speaker 3: and then later became the board president, and that put

592
00:30:29,000 --> 00:30:33,640
Speaker 3: him in this position of like authority over the organization's finances,

593
00:30:33,760 --> 00:30:39,360
Speaker 3: their banking transactions. Up the known fraud, the fraud that

594
00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:42,800
Speaker 3: we know of ran from December of twenty twenty two

595
00:30:42,960 --> 00:30:46,520
Speaker 3: through at least like September of twenty twenty three, and

596
00:30:46,640 --> 00:30:49,920
Speaker 3: he used that period to exploit the circus a bunch

597
00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:52,400
Speaker 3: of different ways. It was rather than like one single

598
00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:56,000
Speaker 3: theft or like bookkeeping maneuver. And so in those nine

599
00:30:56,080 --> 00:30:58,640
Speaker 3: months he embezzled more than one hundred and twenty three

600
00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:02,000
Speaker 3: thousand dollars from a nonprofits.

601
00:31:03,760 --> 00:31:04,600
Speaker 2: Not traveling a lot.

602
00:31:04,680 --> 00:31:08,120
Speaker 3: You know what that is. That's ridiculous. So one part

603
00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:11,760
Speaker 3: of the one part of the scheme was credit cards.

604
00:31:12,640 --> 00:31:15,840
Speaker 3: So he was supposed to help close a circus floor

605
00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:18,880
Speaker 3: a line of credit at Enterprise Bank and open a

606
00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:24,480
Speaker 3: new one at umb Bank, and instead he kept the

607
00:31:24,840 --> 00:31:27,520
Speaker 3: Enterprise account alive, and he got a card in his

608
00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:29,680
Speaker 3: own name tied to the circus and he used it

609
00:31:29,760 --> 00:31:33,280
Speaker 3: for his personal spending. And so he then also got

610
00:31:33,400 --> 00:31:38,560
Speaker 3: like a second card for additional unapproved personal spending. This

611
00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:44,400
Speaker 3: is stuff like fancy restaurants, nail salon membership, yeah, skin

612
00:31:44,560 --> 00:31:48,440
Speaker 3: care treatment, horseback riding related expenses.

613
00:31:49,320 --> 00:31:51,320
Speaker 2: He was like, you know, I just charged the circus

614
00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:53,520
Speaker 2: put the horses on the car.

615
00:31:55,000 --> 00:31:58,760
Speaker 3: The scheme wasn't just unauthorized spending. He had to conceal

616
00:31:58,840 --> 00:32:03,520
Speaker 3: it too. And so another circus official reviewed the expenses

617
00:32:03,600 --> 00:32:07,480
Speaker 3: on one of the cards, and Pace didn't admit to like, oh, yeah, no,

618
00:32:07,560 --> 00:32:11,520
Speaker 3: those are my I got acrylics on my hands. Yeah, no,

619
00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:15,600
Speaker 3: that was my skin treatment. He said the card was stolen,

620
00:32:16,200 --> 00:32:19,360
Speaker 3: and then he presented forged account statements to make it

621
00:32:19,480 --> 00:32:21,880
Speaker 3: look like the disputed charges had been resolved.

622
00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:23,120
Speaker 2: Wow.

623
00:32:23,360 --> 00:32:26,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, Like straight up deliberate deception on that one.

624
00:32:26,240 --> 00:32:27,560
Speaker 4: I mean if you just said like, oh, yeah, the

625
00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:30,560
Speaker 4: car got stolen and like, you know, dispute the charges.

626
00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:34,360
Speaker 3: That he's and guys car, guys, I'm ahead of you.

627
00:32:34,560 --> 00:32:37,080
Speaker 3: I already disputed the charges. And when you have an

628
00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:40,440
Speaker 3: old statement, this is the new statement. Yeah. A second

629
00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:43,960
Speaker 3: part of the fraud involved checks and debt payments. So

630
00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:48,480
Speaker 3: Pace diverted checks that were drawn on Circus Flora's bank

631
00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:51,880
Speaker 3: account to himself instead of using them to pay down

632
00:32:51,880 --> 00:32:55,200
Speaker 3: a line of credit. And then at first that was

633
00:32:55,320 --> 00:32:58,840
Speaker 3: like around fifty grand, but then interest racks up who knows,

634
00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:02,720
Speaker 3: and that tacked on thousands of dollars compounds it does,

635
00:33:03,040 --> 00:33:06,280
Speaker 3: it does a third part of the fraud really like

636
00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:09,800
Speaker 3: hit at donor confidence because oh.

637
00:33:09,760 --> 00:33:11,720
Speaker 2: Right, he's a nonprofit. They're counting on donor.

638
00:33:12,680 --> 00:33:17,160
Speaker 3: He deposited thousands of dollars in donor checks made payable

639
00:33:17,240 --> 00:33:21,320
Speaker 3: to circus Flora into his personal bank account, and like

640
00:33:21,760 --> 00:33:23,400
Speaker 3: for a nonprofit.

641
00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:26,200
Speaker 2: That's real bad. That's serious and really easy to track.

642
00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:28,680
Speaker 3: It's super easy to track. But like, okay, so that's

643
00:33:28,720 --> 00:33:32,760
Speaker 3: not just their revenue, but these people have trusted a donation.

644
00:33:33,560 --> 00:33:35,320
Speaker 3: This happens like you're out of lot and.

645
00:33:35,320 --> 00:33:37,600
Speaker 4: You're like you're a circus relying on donors, and if

646
00:33:37,640 --> 00:33:39,720
Speaker 4: you lose and burn your donors.

647
00:33:39,560 --> 00:33:42,520
Speaker 3: You're a circus full stop. Like right there, it's an

648
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:44,760
Speaker 3: uphill battle, right.

649
00:33:45,360 --> 00:33:49,440
Speaker 2: Okay, you're not relying on like the fake tickets.

650
00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:55,600
Speaker 3: Exactly. So Saint Louis Magazine reported that executive director Jack

651
00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:58,760
Speaker 3: Marsh had a lot of damage control to do before

652
00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:02,800
Speaker 3: criminal charges became public, so he had to like quietly

653
00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:05,560
Speaker 3: inform donors of the problem and like hope they'd be

654
00:34:05,680 --> 00:34:09,839
Speaker 3: understandings and the organization. Like they hoped that the money

655
00:34:09,880 --> 00:34:12,480
Speaker 3: could be recovered with out law enforcement, but then they

656
00:34:12,600 --> 00:34:14,719
Speaker 3: had to go to authorities when they saw like the

657
00:34:14,800 --> 00:34:15,320
Speaker 3: scope of it.

658
00:34:15,480 --> 00:34:18,359
Speaker 2: I'm sure once you tried to see five figure.

659
00:34:18,440 --> 00:34:21,600
Speaker 3: Yeah and so, and it was. Everything came to light internally.

660
00:34:21,680 --> 00:34:24,480
Speaker 3: It wasn't because of a public audit or like a whistleblower.

661
00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:27,320
Speaker 3: They just started noticing these things in the books and

662
00:34:27,360 --> 00:34:31,560
Speaker 3: then you know, put it together. Marsh told Saint Louis

663
00:34:31,600 --> 00:34:35,160
Speaker 3: magazine that the circus became alarmed when the bank records

664
00:34:35,200 --> 00:34:38,719
Speaker 3: didn't match up. There's basically two books, and he said that,

665
00:34:38,840 --> 00:34:41,200
Speaker 3: you know, something seemed to be missing. They start digging.

666
00:34:41,520 --> 00:34:44,040
Speaker 3: He said, it was like unpeeling in the onion. And

667
00:34:44,160 --> 00:34:47,359
Speaker 3: eventually they figured, Okay, this isn't some hacker, this isn't

668
00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:52,000
Speaker 3: a clerical error. It's coming from our board president, the

669
00:34:52,120 --> 00:34:55,960
Speaker 3: king of the circus. So September twenty twenty three, according

670
00:34:56,000 --> 00:34:59,880
Speaker 3: to Marsh, circus Flora confronted Pace like there was a

671
00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:02,560
Speaker 3: clown with like a bowling pin, like slapping it on

672
00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:03,000
Speaker 3: the sand.

673
00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:07,279
Speaker 2: He resigned to hold him.

674
00:35:09,239 --> 00:35:12,920
Speaker 3: Pace resigned, and even then it didn't become public knowledge,

675
00:35:13,080 --> 00:35:16,240
Speaker 3: and they kept operating and like privately dealing with the fallout,

676
00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:19,440
Speaker 3: but that you know, there's such a beloved institution in

677
00:35:19,520 --> 00:35:21,920
Speaker 3: Saint Louis, and people really were just like, if you

678
00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:23,880
Speaker 3: can get rid of him, although there were like rumors

679
00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:25,920
Speaker 3: online of people like, well, if he got away with it,

680
00:35:26,040 --> 00:35:30,560
Speaker 3: what else are they doing? Anyway, so marsh said, Circus Flora,

681
00:35:30,840 --> 00:35:33,759
Speaker 3: they put on their twenty twenty four season and they

682
00:35:33,840 --> 00:35:37,240
Speaker 3: tried to fulfill their mission, but it was a low point.

683
00:35:38,000 --> 00:35:40,440
Speaker 3: So the fraud, it did not collapse the circus, but

684
00:35:40,560 --> 00:35:44,040
Speaker 3: it left this like huge financial hole that they had

685
00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:48,920
Speaker 3: to address preserving the donor confidence, having like stability to

686
00:35:49,080 --> 00:35:53,240
Speaker 3: the public. So the criminal case became public on November twentieth,

687
00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:56,120
Speaker 3: twenty twenty four, and the US Attorney's Office for the

688
00:35:56,200 --> 00:35:59,879
Speaker 3: Eastern District of Missouri announced a six count federal wire

689
00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:04,200
Speaker 3: fraud indictment. And so at that stage the government was like, look,

690
00:36:04,640 --> 00:36:07,600
Speaker 3: these are allegations. He's presumed innocent.

691
00:36:08,239 --> 00:36:08,520
Speaker 6: Wink.

692
00:36:09,760 --> 00:36:13,720
Speaker 3: Then, but they lay out those three principal avenues of fraud,

693
00:36:13,840 --> 00:36:19,200
Speaker 3: right the credit cards, the checks, the depositing donor checks,

694
00:36:19,239 --> 00:36:23,600
Speaker 3: diverting you know, paydown debt. And then it also alleged

695
00:36:23,640 --> 00:36:27,440
Speaker 3: a separate strand of misconduct involving applications to the Small

696
00:36:27,480 --> 00:36:31,560
Speaker 3: Business Administration. So, like the circus thought it was just

697
00:36:32,400 --> 00:36:36,640
Speaker 3: credit cards payments, they get the FEDS involved, and the

698
00:36:36,680 --> 00:36:39,920
Speaker 3: FEDS are like, oh wait, there's no more. Yeah, so

699
00:36:40,440 --> 00:36:45,600
Speaker 3: the Small Business Administration broadened everything out. He applied on

700
00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:49,239
Speaker 3: August ninth, twenty twenty two, for an eighteen two ndred

701
00:36:49,239 --> 00:36:53,840
Speaker 3: dollars SBA Disaster Assistance loan by misrepresenting his income and

702
00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:54,560
Speaker 3: bank balance.

703
00:36:54,880 --> 00:36:57,200
Speaker 2: Are they doing like covid era loon, Yeah, twenty twenty

704
00:36:57,239 --> 00:36:57,839
Speaker 2: That's what I'm thinking.

705
00:36:57,920 --> 00:37:01,360
Speaker 3: It's like PPPs and stuff like that. He applies again,

706
00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:08,840
Speaker 3: like eleven days later for another eleven grand, while hiding

707
00:37:08,920 --> 00:37:12,320
Speaker 3: the fact that he already received two PPP loans that

708
00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:14,880
Speaker 3: totaled more than thirty eight thousand. He's like, no, no, no,

709
00:37:15,000 --> 00:37:17,680
Speaker 3: that wasn't me. That was another guy. That was another clown.

710
00:37:18,640 --> 00:37:21,080
Speaker 2: It was Flora's circus Flora.

711
00:37:21,200 --> 00:37:24,280
Speaker 3: It's easily confused. So by the time he pleaded guilty,

712
00:37:24,640 --> 00:37:28,680
Speaker 3: he admitted to making two fraudulent SBA disaster loan applications

713
00:37:28,760 --> 00:37:32,759
Speaker 3: totaling almost thirty grand, although the government denied both. But

714
00:37:32,840 --> 00:37:34,320
Speaker 3: he got in trouble for just trying.

715
00:37:34,200 --> 00:37:36,800
Speaker 2: Going there I thought that that low amount would be

716
00:37:36,840 --> 00:37:37,160
Speaker 2: like here.

717
00:37:37,080 --> 00:37:39,600
Speaker 3: You go, and that it wasn't the same base. It

718
00:37:39,719 --> 00:37:42,000
Speaker 3: wasn't like the direct loss of Circus Flora. But it's

719
00:37:42,080 --> 00:37:44,879
Speaker 3: just like, Okay, this guy is a creep at the sun.

720
00:37:45,880 --> 00:37:48,760
Speaker 3: How did he become a board member at the circus?

721
00:37:48,880 --> 00:37:49,680
Speaker 2: Little curious about that.

722
00:37:49,840 --> 00:37:52,360
Speaker 3: He was a local executive, so he'd been high up

723
00:37:52,400 --> 00:37:56,239
Speaker 3: in digital marketing and was a chief executive officer of

724
00:37:56,360 --> 00:37:59,920
Speaker 3: the US office of the London based advertising firm Partner

725
00:38:00,200 --> 00:38:04,080
Speaker 3: andrews Aldridge. Yeah right, I don't know. Before that gig,

726
00:38:04,160 --> 00:38:06,920
Speaker 3: he was a senior VP and client partnership director at

727
00:38:06,960 --> 00:38:11,360
Speaker 3: a marketing firm called Ancira. Sounds he did like adjunct

728
00:38:11,360 --> 00:38:15,759
Speaker 3: professor work at Washington University. Sounds impressive enough. Business guy

729
00:38:15,840 --> 00:38:19,160
Speaker 3: well connected, but not like the wise guy connected where

730
00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:22,560
Speaker 3: obviously like they would not and they would not steal

731
00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:26,400
Speaker 3: from an Italian inspired circus exactly like they have standards.

732
00:38:26,520 --> 00:38:28,560
Speaker 2: He's connected, like I've had a job before.

733
00:38:28,800 --> 00:38:35,240
Speaker 3: Yes, he's like, I have a business cards, connections, papers,

734
00:38:35,320 --> 00:38:38,120
Speaker 3: it's a card, It's a card. According to Saint Louis

735
00:38:38,200 --> 00:38:41,280
Speaker 3: magazine quote. In two thousand and seven, the Business Journal

736
00:38:41,400 --> 00:38:44,320
Speaker 3: reported that Drive Agency was one of the fastest growing

737
00:38:44,400 --> 00:38:47,480
Speaker 3: privately held companies in Saint Louis, and that Pace, who

738
00:38:47,560 --> 00:38:51,440
Speaker 3: had recently purchased the agency, had added two million dollars

739
00:38:51,560 --> 00:38:54,040
Speaker 3: to its billing. By two thousand and eight, that's one

740
00:38:54,080 --> 00:38:57,760
Speaker 3: year later, however, the company had ceased operations and Pace

741
00:38:57,840 --> 00:39:02,120
Speaker 3: listed its value as zero in a twenty thirteen bankruptcy filing.

742
00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:05,640
Speaker 3: The filing showed more than a million dollars debt, much

743
00:39:05,680 --> 00:39:08,600
Speaker 3: of it credit card debt, and few assets other than

744
00:39:08,640 --> 00:39:12,680
Speaker 3: the family home in LaDue, a nineteen eighty nine jeep Cherokee,

745
00:39:13,400 --> 00:39:15,240
Speaker 3: and two dogs and two chickens.

746
00:39:15,880 --> 00:39:18,239
Speaker 2: His assets were a chicken and an eighty nine jeep

747
00:39:18,320 --> 00:39:18,600
Speaker 2: chair and.

748
00:39:18,719 --> 00:39:21,279
Speaker 3: Eighty nine jep Cherokee, two dogs and two chickens. He

749
00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:24,200
Speaker 3: puts that on his assets. He said he had one

750
00:39:24,280 --> 00:39:27,560
Speaker 3: hundred and seventy five dollars in the bank. Like sometimes

751
00:39:27,560 --> 00:39:29,480
Speaker 3: I'm like, you know what I'm doing? All right? I'm

752
00:39:29,520 --> 00:39:30,080
Speaker 3: doing all right.

753
00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:33,040
Speaker 2: I see this, I'm like, you know what, not a chicken?

754
00:39:33,080 --> 00:39:36,319
Speaker 2: I've got two chicken two and a dog in the cakes.

755
00:39:36,320 --> 00:39:37,680
Speaker 3: And he stole from the circuit.

756
00:39:37,719 --> 00:39:39,360
Speaker 2: So they make pets assets.

757
00:39:40,120 --> 00:39:45,920
Speaker 3: So the case shifted decisively own them twenty eight twenty

758
00:39:46,000 --> 00:39:49,000
Speaker 3: twenty six. So just a few months ago, he pleaded

759
00:39:49,040 --> 00:39:52,320
Speaker 3: guilty in federal court to four council wire fraud. He

760
00:39:52,440 --> 00:39:56,800
Speaker 3: admitted the core fax and he also admitted that the

761
00:39:57,520 --> 00:40:01,320
Speaker 3: he got specific with the loss amount they were giving ballpark.

762
00:40:01,360 --> 00:40:04,600
Speaker 3: He's like, no, actually, let me tell you I do

763
00:40:04,719 --> 00:40:08,200
Speaker 3: fraud of them one hundred and twenty three thy fifteen

764
00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:10,040
Speaker 3: dollars in ninety four cents?

765
00:40:10,520 --> 00:40:11,920
Speaker 2: Was he like an accountant or is he going for

766
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:12,800
Speaker 2: like a circus rerecord?

767
00:40:12,840 --> 00:40:15,560
Speaker 3: They were like, get out of here, nerd. He's scheduled

768
00:40:15,600 --> 00:40:18,120
Speaker 3: to be sentenced May fourth, twenty twenty six.

769
00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:20,520
Speaker 2: So we could go, oh, he's still sentence.

770
00:40:20,600 --> 00:40:24,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, he's just in limbo. The DOJ said. Each

771
00:40:24,680 --> 00:40:28,359
Speaker 3: wirefrog count carries a potential maximum penalty of twenty years

772
00:40:28,400 --> 00:40:31,360
Speaker 3: in prison and a two hundred and fifty thousand dollars fine.

773
00:40:31,320 --> 00:40:35,400
Speaker 2: Each charged wire Frog. Yeah not why any circus.

774
00:40:35,480 --> 00:40:37,280
Speaker 3: Flora is like, can we talk restitution?

775
00:40:37,680 --> 00:40:39,640
Speaker 2: Yeah? Please, we'll see. Can we sell the chicken?

776
00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:41,040
Speaker 3: I hope they get it, but I feel like a

777
00:40:41,160 --> 00:40:43,759
Speaker 3: dude like that might be judgment proof at this point.

778
00:40:43,880 --> 00:40:45,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think so, let's.

779
00:40:45,239 --> 00:40:48,840
Speaker 3: Take a break and upon our return, the star of

780
00:40:48,960 --> 00:41:11,560
Speaker 3: the show Oh that's right, Zaren.

781
00:41:13,680 --> 00:41:15,840
Speaker 2: By the way, can I just say how much I

782
00:41:16,000 --> 00:41:19,840
Speaker 2: love Carnie Crime and Circus Crime. You know, I have like,

783
00:41:20,120 --> 00:41:22,160
Speaker 2: I have a book, a picture book of like.

784
00:41:23,680 --> 00:41:25,920
Speaker 4: Side I think it's called Sideshow, And it's just all

785
00:41:26,040 --> 00:41:29,120
Speaker 4: photographs from like this, mostly the South, but a little

786
00:41:29,120 --> 00:41:31,400
Speaker 4: bit of the Midwest, like Missouri and stuff, which is

787
00:41:31,480 --> 00:41:34,080
Speaker 4: like kind of south, kind of Midwest. And I so

788
00:41:34,280 --> 00:41:35,560
Speaker 4: want to show it to you, but I think it

789
00:41:35,560 --> 00:41:39,520
Speaker 4: would scare you because it's like nineteen fifties, nineteen sixties

790
00:41:39,600 --> 00:41:42,960
Speaker 4: black and white photography, and it's just like the you

791
00:41:43,040 --> 00:41:46,440
Speaker 4: know whatever, like the snake charmer lady. Yeah, behind the

792
00:41:46,520 --> 00:41:49,200
Speaker 4: scenes and she's just sitting there smoking with it really.

793
00:41:49,160 --> 00:41:49,880
Speaker 2: Interesting to me.

794
00:41:49,960 --> 00:41:52,359
Speaker 3: And there's a when I was reading, there's a big

795
00:41:52,400 --> 00:41:56,279
Speaker 3: debate about you know, people with disabilities who were exploited,

796
00:41:56,800 --> 00:41:59,600
Speaker 3: but at the same time, you know, their families couldn't

797
00:41:59,600 --> 00:42:02,200
Speaker 3: afford to feed them or they would never have at.

798
00:42:02,160 --> 00:42:03,280
Speaker 2: The time of steady employment.

799
00:42:03,400 --> 00:42:05,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, they wouldn't have employment, and so there in some

800
00:42:06,120 --> 00:42:08,480
Speaker 3: cases they actually could could make money.

801
00:42:08,320 --> 00:42:10,920
Speaker 2: And like have some fame and find a community. Like

802
00:42:11,760 --> 00:42:12,960
Speaker 2: but you're still being exploded.

803
00:42:12,960 --> 00:42:16,240
Speaker 3: You're being completely exploited and that's like those rare cases

804
00:42:16,320 --> 00:42:19,000
Speaker 3: for the most part, in these small circuses. You know,

805
00:42:19,120 --> 00:42:22,160
Speaker 3: you're you're stripping people of their humanity and you're making

806
00:42:22,760 --> 00:42:27,480
Speaker 3: you're setting back disability rights issues so far because you're

807
00:42:27,520 --> 00:42:29,880
Speaker 3: saying like you're not part of the community. And so

808
00:42:30,320 --> 00:42:33,560
Speaker 3: what really decimated that were the advances and disability rights

809
00:42:34,600 --> 00:42:38,400
Speaker 3: and so yeah, like I it's it's a fascinating thing.

810
00:42:38,480 --> 00:42:41,719
Speaker 3: It fascinates me, like those kind of weird fringe people

811
00:42:41,840 --> 00:42:44,040
Speaker 3: like a snake charmer, like how did you wind up there?

812
00:42:44,239 --> 00:42:46,120
Speaker 2: And also there's a lot of places they create a

813
00:42:46,120 --> 00:42:49,200
Speaker 2: little community amongst themselves, like you know, and they also

814
00:42:49,280 --> 00:42:50,680
Speaker 2: it's like, you know, people would have pointed at me

815
00:42:50,680 --> 00:42:52,040
Speaker 2: at least now I'm getting money.

816
00:42:51,840 --> 00:42:54,960
Speaker 3: You know, yeah, exactly at that time before we had

817
00:42:55,040 --> 00:43:01,239
Speaker 3: disability exactly exactly. So yeah, it's like the the atmosphere

818
00:43:01,239 --> 00:43:03,759
Speaker 3: of it, Like you said, HBO's Carnival, if you haven't

819
00:43:03,800 --> 00:43:09,719
Speaker 3: seen it, it's fantastic. I love it anyway. So I

820
00:43:09,800 --> 00:43:11,359
Speaker 3: have a story to share with you that I love

821
00:43:11,440 --> 00:43:12,480
Speaker 3: the whole lot.

822
00:43:12,680 --> 00:43:14,560
Speaker 2: I love stories. I love when you love a story.

823
00:43:14,760 --> 00:43:19,600
Speaker 3: It's about a guy named f. Bam Morrison.

824
00:43:19,840 --> 00:43:21,000
Speaker 2: Great name, Oh my god.

825
00:43:21,440 --> 00:43:23,840
Speaker 3: Now this guy he doesn't have enough to get his

826
00:43:23,960 --> 00:43:26,839
Speaker 3: own whole episode, which is a shame. And I think

827
00:43:26,920 --> 00:43:29,600
Speaker 3: that maybe with months or years of research, like more

828
00:43:29,640 --> 00:43:31,840
Speaker 3: of the story could be discovered. But I have a

829
00:43:31,880 --> 00:43:34,920
Speaker 3: busy on the go lifestyle, so I can't. I just can't, Saren,

830
00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:37,879
Speaker 3: I want to tell this story, can get this much

831
00:43:37,960 --> 00:43:41,080
Speaker 3: time from you? Right? So I had to build in.

832
00:43:41,320 --> 00:43:43,560
Speaker 3: I had to build it into something else. And originally

833
00:43:43,960 --> 00:43:46,080
Speaker 3: I was going to try and find a ridiculous crime

834
00:43:46,239 --> 00:43:50,319
Speaker 3: involving the singer Van Morrison and make this the Van

835
00:43:50,600 --> 00:43:54,360
Speaker 3: and Bam Morrison show. But I couldn't find anything that

836
00:43:54,480 --> 00:43:56,640
Speaker 3: worked for old Van the Man other than being like

837
00:43:56,800 --> 00:44:02,160
Speaker 3: anti vaccin, cranky and yet my mother's favorite singer, go figure.

838
00:44:02,320 --> 00:44:06,279
Speaker 3: So oh yeah, So I found other circus crimes, all

839
00:44:06,360 --> 00:44:09,160
Speaker 3: in the service of telling you this story. Oh yeah,

840
00:44:09,360 --> 00:44:09,960
Speaker 3: we had fun.

841
00:44:10,040 --> 00:44:11,240
Speaker 2: We've had fun totally.

842
00:44:11,360 --> 00:44:14,800
Speaker 3: We're about to have more. Nineteen fifty, a man named

843
00:44:15,080 --> 00:44:19,319
Speaker 3: f Bam Bam Morrison, at least that's what he said.

844
00:44:19,320 --> 00:44:26,279
Speaker 3: His name was F Bam rolled into town Watumka, Oklahoma,

845
00:44:26,480 --> 00:44:29,600
Speaker 3: Oh heck, population twenty five hundred. The town got his

846
00:44:29,760 --> 00:44:33,600
Speaker 3: name from the Muscogee Creek people driven out of their

847
00:44:33,680 --> 00:44:38,000
Speaker 3: ancestral homeland in with Tempka, Alabama. So they made it

848
00:44:38,080 --> 00:44:42,400
Speaker 3: to what is now Watumka. They dropped the p in Watumka, Oklahoma.

849
00:44:42,560 --> 00:44:44,239
Speaker 3: They gave it the name they knew best. That's the

850
00:44:44,320 --> 00:44:49,880
Speaker 3: Muscogee word for rumbling waters. In Watunka, everybody knows everybody.

851
00:44:50,760 --> 00:44:53,480
Speaker 3: When the ranchers come into town. They visit with Rgie

852
00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:57,680
Speaker 3: Taylor at the farmers exchange. Yeah, they go see Logan

853
00:44:57,800 --> 00:45:01,439
Speaker 3: Walker at the filling station, and they may say hello

854
00:45:01,560 --> 00:45:05,239
Speaker 3: to Mayor Herman Darks and Armand Gibson and his father

855
00:45:05,400 --> 00:45:08,280
Speaker 3: Harley who's better known as Hoot Gibson.

856
00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:11,960
Speaker 2: Gibson's Oklahoma's.

857
00:45:12,360 --> 00:45:14,160
Speaker 3: He did like, can we start a sign with like

858
00:45:14,239 --> 00:45:15,640
Speaker 3: all of our favorite names? Right?

859
00:45:16,000 --> 00:45:17,759
Speaker 2: We come across so many great names on here.

860
00:45:17,880 --> 00:45:24,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's Julian Pashoto, the grocery guy, Pashoto, p E

861
00:45:25,280 --> 00:45:27,120
Speaker 3: I x O T T O.

862
00:45:27,600 --> 00:45:28,440
Speaker 2: I did not expect that.

863
00:45:28,800 --> 00:45:30,279
Speaker 3: You didn't see that coming, did you not?

864
00:45:30,360 --> 00:45:30,640
Speaker 2: At all?

865
00:45:31,400 --> 00:45:33,600
Speaker 3: Right on top of me, you think you're so smart

866
00:45:34,120 --> 00:45:39,000
Speaker 3: at all. Bill Tankers, the Baker Tankers and the good

867
00:45:39,080 --> 00:45:41,840
Speaker 3: people who keep the town running, all of them, And

868
00:45:42,000 --> 00:45:45,919
Speaker 3: so then then there's f Bam and no one could

869
00:45:46,080 --> 00:45:48,880
Speaker 3: really remember how it was that he turned up, but

870
00:45:49,120 --> 00:45:51,480
Speaker 3: in short time he had the town just like eating

871
00:45:51,600 --> 00:45:53,160
Speaker 3: out of his grubby little hand.

872
00:45:53,480 --> 00:45:55,919
Speaker 4: I would like to believe that the F is his name.

873
00:45:56,000 --> 00:45:58,759
Speaker 4: It's not like short for Francis, it's just F. His

874
00:45:58,880 --> 00:46:03,239
Speaker 4: family just called him F Yeah, f bam so f bam.

875
00:46:03,440 --> 00:46:06,959
Speaker 3: As Pashoto recalls him, was a man past middle age

876
00:46:07,560 --> 00:46:10,960
Speaker 3: with like sandy hair. He had like rugged red, honest

877
00:46:11,040 --> 00:46:14,600
Speaker 3: looking face, good clothes, but like not not a dandy,

878
00:46:15,000 --> 00:46:19,080
Speaker 3: and had one of those voices. But in other accounts

879
00:46:19,840 --> 00:46:23,000
Speaker 3: it was much different. Time magazine called him a tall,

880
00:46:23,120 --> 00:46:26,960
Speaker 3: talented gentleman. Another source that he wore a checkered vest

881
00:46:27,040 --> 00:46:30,719
Speaker 3: and a large gold chain. Grant Herring, who worked at

882
00:46:30,760 --> 00:46:34,600
Speaker 3: Herring Hardware, quote describe the stranger as kind of a

883
00:46:34,719 --> 00:46:37,560
Speaker 3: short man, dressed real flashy, probably in his forties.

884
00:46:37,960 --> 00:46:40,000
Speaker 2: We have tall and short, we have tall and short.

885
00:46:40,400 --> 00:46:44,239
Speaker 3: He's every man. It's all in him, like we.

886
00:46:44,280 --> 00:46:47,360
Speaker 4: Have red and white checker. And someone said flashy clothes.

887
00:46:47,840 --> 00:46:49,560
Speaker 4: I assume those are talking about the same thing.

888
00:46:49,640 --> 00:46:51,880
Speaker 3: And then they said, but he's not flashy. He's well dressed,

889
00:46:51,880 --> 00:46:58,160
Speaker 3: but he's not a dandy. Julian Pashotto's son, David was

890
00:46:58,200 --> 00:47:01,279
Speaker 3: a boy scout at the time. He remembers f Bam

891
00:47:01,560 --> 00:47:04,480
Speaker 3: as kind of little and on the heavy side, and

892
00:47:04,600 --> 00:47:07,640
Speaker 3: to me older, maybe in his fifties, and he dressed nice.

893
00:47:07,680 --> 00:47:13,360
Speaker 3: He was nice and mannerly. Jerry Herring, grandson said, we

894
00:47:13,480 --> 00:47:15,360
Speaker 3: didn't know if that was his real name, and he

895
00:47:15,480 --> 00:47:18,040
Speaker 3: didn't even know how the guy came in by automobile,

896
00:47:18,239 --> 00:47:20,640
Speaker 3: rode the bus or what he feels like.

897
00:47:20,719 --> 00:47:22,560
Speaker 2: He came in like on his own wagon, like a

898
00:47:22,600 --> 00:47:23,080
Speaker 2: snaked ug.

899
00:47:24,800 --> 00:47:27,319
Speaker 3: Yes, exactly, a creek parked on the edge of town.

900
00:47:27,840 --> 00:47:30,520
Speaker 3: So f BAM's voice had a lot to do with

901
00:47:30,640 --> 00:47:33,720
Speaker 3: his magnetic personality, like he had this tone of voice

902
00:47:34,080 --> 00:47:36,719
Speaker 3: that would conjure up like the sound of a calliope,

903
00:47:39,600 --> 00:47:44,040
Speaker 3: because that kind of like the peaks, and his excitement

904
00:47:44,160 --> 00:47:47,480
Speaker 3: made adults feel like there were kids again. And so,

905
00:47:47,560 --> 00:47:51,240
Speaker 3: according to reporting from the Saint Louis Post Dispatch, quote,

906
00:47:51,600 --> 00:47:55,680
Speaker 3: when f Bam talked of the beautiful gymnasts, every man

907
00:47:55,800 --> 00:47:59,000
Speaker 3: in town saw pink tights. When he talked of the

908
00:47:59,160 --> 00:48:03,680
Speaker 3: elephants and camels, people smelled the hay and the sawdust,

909
00:48:04,040 --> 00:48:07,920
Speaker 3: and there was a lingering taste like roasted peanuts in

910
00:48:08,040 --> 00:48:11,759
Speaker 3: their mouths, like isn't this great? So he was the

911
00:48:11,840 --> 00:48:16,120
Speaker 3: kind of person in verbiage you may recognize from treaky

912
00:48:16,239 --> 00:48:21,279
Speaker 3: Southern obituaries that never met a stranger, never met a stranger, so.

913
00:48:21,440 --> 00:48:23,680
Speaker 2: He could talk. That boy got to get to gab.

914
00:48:24,040 --> 00:48:28,319
Speaker 3: He seemed oddly familiar to people, so he worked that angle.

915
00:48:28,400 --> 00:48:30,560
Speaker 3: Has anyone ever told you like, do I know you?

916
00:48:31,719 --> 00:48:31,959
Speaker 2: People?

917
00:48:33,960 --> 00:48:36,080
Speaker 3: I know, they don't. I just thought i'd swing in

918
00:48:36,120 --> 00:48:39,200
Speaker 3: the midst. That happens to me every now and that

919
00:48:39,280 --> 00:48:41,480
Speaker 3: people like do I know you? Like? And it's like

920
00:48:41,760 --> 00:48:44,000
Speaker 3: we have absolutely nothing in common, and I'm always tempted

921
00:48:44,040 --> 00:48:45,120
Speaker 3: to be like, oh my god, yeah.

922
00:48:45,040 --> 00:48:45,320
Speaker 2: What's that?

923
00:48:45,520 --> 00:48:48,239
Speaker 3: Like? Where would where would where do we go to

924
00:48:48,280 --> 00:48:49,279
Speaker 3: school together? Oh? Yes?

925
00:48:49,480 --> 00:48:50,480
Speaker 2: Do you do? Like a whole thing?

926
00:48:50,640 --> 00:48:50,680
Speaker 3: Like?

927
00:48:50,800 --> 00:48:52,759
Speaker 2: Is that like, let's let's spend five minutes.

928
00:48:53,120 --> 00:48:56,080
Speaker 3: Well, who else? Who's my good doppelgang around?

929
00:48:56,760 --> 00:48:57,920
Speaker 2: A people? Who we know?

930
00:48:58,080 --> 00:49:00,839
Speaker 3: Who's the good twin out there?

931
00:49:01,160 --> 00:49:01,440
Speaker 2: Someone?

932
00:49:01,520 --> 00:49:04,560
Speaker 4: It's just not a vibe thing. It's that you look Okay. Yeah,

933
00:49:04,600 --> 00:49:06,080
Speaker 4: I think I don't even know how this plays.

934
00:49:06,120 --> 00:49:08,479
Speaker 3: I don't even know either. Maybe people aren't really talking

935
00:49:08,560 --> 00:49:11,240
Speaker 3: and I'm imagining they say these things to me. Maybe

936
00:49:11,280 --> 00:49:16,680
Speaker 3: I'm standing I'm good talking to a mirror. I don't know,

937
00:49:17,239 --> 00:49:20,560
Speaker 3: you do you know? I don't know. Okay. So he

938
00:49:21,400 --> 00:49:24,440
Speaker 3: worked this angle of seeming oddly familiar to people by

939
00:49:24,600 --> 00:49:27,440
Speaker 3: telling the people of a Tunka that they'd met him before,

940
00:49:28,200 --> 00:49:31,320
Speaker 3: and he was like, I was here twenty five years

941
00:49:31,440 --> 00:49:34,760
Speaker 3: prior and I brought a carnival to town to benefit

942
00:49:34,840 --> 00:49:38,680
Speaker 3: the volunteer fire department. And people were like, yeah, I

943
00:49:38,760 --> 00:49:41,920
Speaker 3: think there wasn't there a carnival while, but yeah, I

944
00:49:42,120 --> 00:49:45,200
Speaker 3: remember you. And then like they'd talk some more and

945
00:49:46,000 --> 00:49:49,479
Speaker 3: he'd have this like gregarious, charming guy persona and they're

946
00:49:49,520 --> 00:49:52,279
Speaker 3: like remembering him and then remembering how great they thought

947
00:49:52,320 --> 00:49:53,279
Speaker 3: he was at the time.

948
00:49:53,680 --> 00:49:55,160
Speaker 2: This works, It totally works.

949
00:49:55,200 --> 00:49:57,680
Speaker 3: And then they were like, I really liked him back then,

950
00:49:57,760 --> 00:49:59,520
Speaker 3: and I always wanted him to come back, and here

951
00:49:59,600 --> 00:50:02,200
Speaker 3: he is. Huh, So I don't need to tell you

952
00:50:02,320 --> 00:50:04,000
Speaker 3: that he'd never been to town before.

953
00:50:04,200 --> 00:50:04,840
Speaker 2: I'm guessing that.

954
00:50:05,000 --> 00:50:08,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's just prime con man behavior, like top shelf

955
00:50:08,200 --> 00:50:10,960
Speaker 3: work on that. He told everyone that he was the

956
00:50:11,080 --> 00:50:16,680
Speaker 3: advance man for the Bonds United circus shows Bond bo

957
00:50:17,080 --> 00:50:22,640
Speaker 3: h n apostrophs, Oh, you know the Bonds United forty

958
00:50:22,840 --> 00:50:28,480
Speaker 3: Rides forty shows. Even a guy named tex Walker, the

959
00:50:28,880 --> 00:50:36,000
Speaker 3: text Walker. So in all of my investigations, all of

960
00:50:36,120 --> 00:50:40,400
Speaker 3: my diggins, I only saw that name connected to this story.

961
00:50:40,560 --> 00:50:46,399
Speaker 3: Bonds United Circus shows nowhere else anyway, So Oklahoma, f bam.

962
00:50:46,880 --> 00:50:49,560
Speaker 3: He came through town because he remembered the fine folks,

963
00:50:49,600 --> 00:50:51,160
Speaker 3: and he's like, you know what, you deserve to have

964
00:50:51,280 --> 00:50:55,840
Speaker 3: a circus here, not some other RinkyDink town. This place,

965
00:50:55,960 --> 00:50:58,760
Speaker 3: what Tonka's special? You deserve nice things.

966
00:50:58,800 --> 00:51:00,680
Speaker 2: Like music, man everything.

967
00:51:00,840 --> 00:51:03,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, so he told them how the circus is gonna.

968
00:51:03,760 --> 00:51:06,839
Speaker 3: You know, when a circus comes to town, it can

969
00:51:06,960 --> 00:51:10,040
Speaker 3: attract thousands of people from all over the countryside, and

970
00:51:10,120 --> 00:51:13,800
Speaker 3: you know they spend money at these things food, lodging, gas,

971
00:51:14,040 --> 00:51:16,280
Speaker 3: you know, and then sales just to the circus itself

972
00:51:16,760 --> 00:51:18,920
Speaker 3: you throw in the visitors. Boy howdie, it is a

973
00:51:19,080 --> 00:51:21,560
Speaker 3: moon for a town that gets a circus. But he

974
00:51:21,640 --> 00:51:23,960
Speaker 3: didn't run it as a hard cell right. No, it

975
00:51:24,120 --> 00:51:27,200
Speaker 3: wasn't an outright pitch. He was just like sharing fun facts.

976
00:51:27,440 --> 00:51:28,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, talked about what.

977
00:51:28,560 --> 00:51:31,880
Speaker 3: Life was like on the road with a circus. I

978
00:51:32,040 --> 00:51:34,799
Speaker 3: just want to share time was crazy. This town got

979
00:51:34,840 --> 00:51:38,000
Speaker 3: this like all these cool stories, tales of stops in

980
00:51:38,040 --> 00:51:40,560
Speaker 3: other towns. He just let it like, you know, permeate

981
00:51:40,680 --> 00:51:45,759
Speaker 3: sink into him. Julian Pashoto, the grocer, He told the

982
00:51:45,800 --> 00:51:49,279
Speaker 3: Post Dispatch quote, I remember noticing him around town with

983
00:51:49,360 --> 00:51:51,560
Speaker 3: a bunch of placards under his arm, and I thought

984
00:51:51,600 --> 00:51:54,560
Speaker 3: maybe he was a traveling photographer. I saw him with

985
00:51:54,640 --> 00:51:56,800
Speaker 3: the Chief of police and they were very friendly, and

986
00:51:56,880 --> 00:51:58,920
Speaker 3: then someone told me he was promoting a show for

987
00:51:59,000 --> 00:52:00,439
Speaker 3: the benefit of the round Up Club.

988
00:52:00,680 --> 00:52:02,280
Speaker 2: He feels like a guy who would have a cigar

989
00:52:02,400 --> 00:52:04,480
Speaker 2: ready to give out to, like a chief of police.

990
00:52:04,560 --> 00:52:07,560
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, So the round Up Club was an organization

991
00:52:07,719 --> 00:52:10,040
Speaker 3: of people who were interested in horses and riding.

992
00:52:10,120 --> 00:52:13,439
Speaker 2: Yeah. I caught that, ye roundup the show.

993
00:52:13,480 --> 00:52:15,719
Speaker 3: Doo got a call from someone who was like, no,

994
00:52:16,040 --> 00:52:18,600
Speaker 3: it's not the round Up Club. It's going to benefit

995
00:52:18,680 --> 00:52:21,520
Speaker 3: the Boy Scouts. And don't forget his son was in

996
00:52:21,600 --> 00:52:24,680
Speaker 3: the Boy Scouts. And so here's how he describes their

997
00:52:24,760 --> 00:52:27,200
Speaker 3: meeting quote. They sent him over to see me. He

998
00:52:27,400 --> 00:52:30,959
Speaker 3: was very friendly, very warm, and very convincing. He didn't

999
00:52:30,960 --> 00:52:33,000
Speaker 3: try to high pressure me. I asked him where the

1000
00:52:33,080 --> 00:52:35,240
Speaker 3: circus was and he said it was over in Arkansas.

1001
00:52:35,640 --> 00:52:38,279
Speaker 3: He started explaining that when they came, they would buy

1002
00:52:38,400 --> 00:52:42,080
Speaker 3: a lot of groceries about fifteen hundred dollars worth. I

1003
00:52:42,160 --> 00:52:44,600
Speaker 3: knew they couldn't eat fifteen hundred dollars worth of groceries

1004
00:52:44,600 --> 00:52:46,719
Speaker 3: in a day, but he had a quick answer for that.

1005
00:52:47,120 --> 00:52:49,640
Speaker 3: He said they put up bags of groceries as prizes

1006
00:52:49,760 --> 00:52:52,720
Speaker 3: in the game of chance. Well, I wound up buying

1007
00:52:52,760 --> 00:52:55,919
Speaker 3: the science space above the main entrance cost me thirty bucks.

1008
00:52:56,280 --> 00:52:59,040
Speaker 3: I also bought one hundred pounds of hot dogs, which

1009
00:52:59,120 --> 00:53:01,000
Speaker 3: he said the hot dog stands would be kneeding.

1010
00:53:01,719 --> 00:53:01,759
Speaker 5: No.

1011
00:53:03,320 --> 00:53:05,800
Speaker 3: So now that the grocer's in for thirty bucks and

1012
00:53:05,840 --> 00:53:08,560
Speaker 3: one hundred pounds of hot dogs, f Bam goes to

1013
00:53:08,600 --> 00:53:12,399
Speaker 3: see Bill the baker. According to Bill quote, he told

1014
00:53:12,480 --> 00:53:15,160
Speaker 3: me they were gonna need buns for all these hot dogs.

1015
00:53:15,520 --> 00:53:17,840
Speaker 3: So a couple of days before the circus day, I

1016
00:53:17,920 --> 00:53:22,000
Speaker 3: started baking buns. Baked four hundred of them. I talked

1017
00:53:22,000 --> 00:53:24,120
Speaker 3: to f. Bam for quite a while, but I didn't

1018
00:53:24,160 --> 00:53:26,759
Speaker 3: get to say much. When he first approached me, I

1019
00:53:26,880 --> 00:53:29,160
Speaker 3: turned him down that sort of insulted him. He really

1020
00:53:29,200 --> 00:53:31,960
Speaker 3: started talking there, and the first thing I knew I

1021
00:53:32,040 --> 00:53:35,400
Speaker 3: had agreed to everything he wanted, including money for an

1022
00:53:35,440 --> 00:53:41,719
Speaker 3: ad on the soundtruck. So from this he goes on

1023
00:53:42,320 --> 00:53:45,399
Speaker 3: from anyone else, I'd have required a deposit for four

1024
00:53:45,480 --> 00:53:49,120
Speaker 3: hundred buns, but somehow he made me believe he was

1025
00:53:49,160 --> 00:53:52,120
Speaker 3: an exception. Then there was all those loaves of bread

1026
00:53:52,160 --> 00:53:54,359
Speaker 3: to go into those bags of groceries he was gonna

1027
00:53:54,360 --> 00:53:57,120
Speaker 3: buy from Julian. All I could see was hundreds of

1028
00:53:57,200 --> 00:53:59,320
Speaker 3: loaves of out of town bread in those bags, and

1029
00:53:59,360 --> 00:54:00,360
Speaker 3: I couldn't stay that.

1030
00:54:01,640 --> 00:54:03,799
Speaker 2: What an era of America? Right?

1031
00:54:04,360 --> 00:54:07,200
Speaker 3: So f Bam he ran up tabs and paid for

1032
00:54:07,280 --> 00:54:10,560
Speaker 3: them with VIP tickets. He went to see Floyd Franklin

1033
00:54:10,800 --> 00:54:14,919
Speaker 3: over at the Meter's hotel. He told Floyd that they're

1034
00:54:14,960 --> 00:54:19,440
Speaker 3: going to need like thirty rooms. Yeah, Floyd blocked him off,

1035
00:54:19,880 --> 00:54:22,880
Speaker 3: and that's not going to cost him anything like unless

1036
00:54:23,000 --> 00:54:26,320
Speaker 3: he has to turn people away. But see, Floyd was

1037
00:54:26,400 --> 00:54:29,840
Speaker 3: too nice. He wanted the best for these visiting performers.

1038
00:54:30,239 --> 00:54:32,239
Speaker 3: So he went out and bought a new mattress for

1039
00:54:32,320 --> 00:54:33,480
Speaker 3: each of the thirty rooms.

1040
00:54:33,640 --> 00:54:34,320
Speaker 2: Are you kidding?

1041
00:54:34,320 --> 00:54:35,040
Speaker 3: No, I'm not kidding.

1042
00:54:35,160 --> 00:54:38,480
Speaker 2: Thirty mattresses like one for the juggler, one for an acrobat. Yes.

1043
00:54:38,719 --> 00:54:42,480
Speaker 3: Floyd f Bam told Logan Walker at the filling station

1044
00:54:42,600 --> 00:54:44,520
Speaker 3: that the circus was going to buy oil and gas

1045
00:54:44,600 --> 00:54:47,359
Speaker 3: from him exclusively, and so he was like, oh great,

1046
00:54:47,600 --> 00:54:50,840
Speaker 3: can I buy an ad thirty dollars f bam rolling

1047
00:54:50,920 --> 00:54:55,200
Speaker 3: in cash. People were like comping him for everything. And

1048
00:54:55,280 --> 00:54:56,719
Speaker 3: then he said he had to leave town for a

1049
00:54:56,760 --> 00:55:00,640
Speaker 3: few days, but the circus would be there on schedule. Zaren,

1050
00:55:01,400 --> 00:55:05,239
Speaker 3: close your eyes. Oh yes, I want you to picture it.

1051
00:55:09,640 --> 00:55:13,640
Speaker 3: It's June twenty fourth, nineteen fifty. You are a six

1052
00:55:13,800 --> 00:55:16,560
Speaker 3: year old boy who drove all day yesterday with his

1053
00:55:16,719 --> 00:55:19,160
Speaker 3: family to come stay with your aunt here in with

1054
00:55:19,360 --> 00:55:22,800
Speaker 3: Tunka and see the circus. It's all you've been thinking

1055
00:55:22,840 --> 00:55:25,239
Speaker 3: about since you heard about it a week ago. You

1056
00:55:25,480 --> 00:55:28,000
Speaker 3: begged and begged come see your aunt Sadie and go

1057
00:55:28,120 --> 00:55:30,960
Speaker 3: to the circus. You've never been to the circus before.

1058
00:55:31,040 --> 00:55:33,799
Speaker 3: They don't come out your way. You live far south

1059
00:55:33,880 --> 00:55:38,040
Speaker 3: of here, in Choctaw Nationland, almost at the Texas border. Wa.

1060
00:55:38,160 --> 00:55:40,960
Speaker 3: Tunka is about ninety miles east of Oklahoma City, but

1061
00:55:41,040 --> 00:55:45,560
Speaker 3: it feels like light years away. You spent six long, hot,

1062
00:55:45,800 --> 00:55:48,279
Speaker 3: dusty hours in the car with your ma and Pa

1063
00:55:48,560 --> 00:55:52,200
Speaker 3: and little sister and grandma just to give here, and

1064
00:55:52,320 --> 00:55:55,279
Speaker 3: today is the big day. You woke up early, far

1065
00:55:55,440 --> 00:55:59,040
Speaker 3: before everyone else. Strands of puffy clouds are lit from

1066
00:55:59,080 --> 00:56:01,840
Speaker 3: below by the right sun as it kisses the horizon.

1067
00:56:01,920 --> 00:56:04,480
Speaker 3: Good morning. Your aunt lives a few blocks off of

1068
00:56:04,520 --> 00:56:07,400
Speaker 3: Main Street. The whole house is still asleep. As you

1069
00:56:07,520 --> 00:56:10,799
Speaker 3: slip down the hallway. You tiptoe away from the twin

1070
00:56:10,920 --> 00:56:13,560
Speaker 3: bed you shared with your sister last night. Her gentle

1071
00:56:13,640 --> 00:56:16,799
Speaker 3: breathing matched beat for beat by the snoring of your

1072
00:56:16,840 --> 00:56:20,239
Speaker 3: aunt's old bloodhound Buddy as he lays puddled at the

1073
00:56:20,320 --> 00:56:23,840
Speaker 3: foot of the bed. Ever vigilan, you quietly open the

1074
00:56:23,920 --> 00:56:27,320
Speaker 3: back door and slip out into the yard. You know Watumka.

1075
00:56:27,840 --> 00:56:29,879
Speaker 3: You come here every summer and stay with your aunt

1076
00:56:29,960 --> 00:56:32,600
Speaker 3: for almost a month. It's your favorite time of year.

1077
00:56:33,160 --> 00:56:35,440
Speaker 3: She dotes on you and tells you what a special

1078
00:56:35,480 --> 00:56:39,080
Speaker 3: boy you are. She cuddles your sister. She is love

1079
00:56:39,600 --> 00:56:41,839
Speaker 3: and all of her friends in town are just as

1080
00:56:42,000 --> 00:56:45,600
Speaker 3: kind and warm. It's a special place. You walk down

1081
00:56:45,640 --> 00:56:48,400
Speaker 3: the driveway to the road. Turn right, you'd head to

1082
00:56:48,480 --> 00:56:51,759
Speaker 3: the railroad tracks left takes you to Main Street. You

1083
00:56:51,920 --> 00:56:54,440
Speaker 3: turn on your heel to your left and begin to skip.

1084
00:56:55,040 --> 00:56:57,600
Speaker 3: You wonder what kind of animals they'll have at the circus,

1085
00:56:57,760 --> 00:57:00,560
Speaker 3: and will there be a cowboy doing tricks? Maybe an

1086
00:57:00,640 --> 00:57:05,239
Speaker 3: acrobat flipping high into the air. You are buzzing with anticipation.

1087
00:57:06,080 --> 00:57:08,200
Speaker 3: There's supposed to be a parade in a few hours,

1088
00:57:08,280 --> 00:57:11,320
Speaker 3: coming right down main Street. You're determined to get a

1089
00:57:11,400 --> 00:57:14,000
Speaker 3: prime spot. You don't want to miss a thing. As

1090
00:57:14,040 --> 00:57:16,240
Speaker 3: you get closer to Main Street, you remind yourself to

1091
00:57:16,320 --> 00:57:18,920
Speaker 3: be a good boy, to not get underfoot, to not

1092
00:57:19,120 --> 00:57:22,640
Speaker 3: annoy any of the adults. A good boy, not some baby,

1093
00:57:22,880 --> 00:57:26,240
Speaker 3: a grown boy. You get to Main Street and it's

1094
00:57:26,320 --> 00:57:29,800
Speaker 3: suspiciously silent. You look both ways up and down the road,

1095
00:57:29,880 --> 00:57:32,080
Speaker 3: and you don't see any sign of a parade. Just

1096
00:57:32,200 --> 00:57:35,040
Speaker 3: some men walking up and down the street. One stops

1097
00:57:35,120 --> 00:57:38,120
Speaker 3: right near you, places his hands on his hips and exhales.

1098
00:57:38,600 --> 00:57:40,240
Speaker 3: You look up at him, and he lifts the cowboy

1099
00:57:40,320 --> 00:57:43,560
Speaker 3: hat from his head and fans himself with it. Hey there, mister,

1100
00:57:43,960 --> 00:57:45,840
Speaker 3: are you excited for the parade. I'm going to get

1101
00:57:45,880 --> 00:57:48,360
Speaker 3: the best spot for watching it. You gesture at the

1102
00:57:48,400 --> 00:57:51,800
Speaker 3: next block, maybe over there. The man looks at you,

1103
00:57:51,920 --> 00:57:54,680
Speaker 3: his eyes tender. He makes a little frown that just

1104
00:57:54,840 --> 00:57:58,360
Speaker 3: accentuates the briskly white mustache that runs in a thick

1105
00:57:58,440 --> 00:58:01,440
Speaker 3: line from one side of the chin up across his

1106
00:58:01,520 --> 00:58:03,560
Speaker 3: upper lip, and then back down to the other side

1107
00:58:03,560 --> 00:58:06,320
Speaker 3: of his chin. He shuffles his feet on the pavement.

1108
00:58:06,600 --> 00:58:10,680
Speaker 3: He smells of tobacco and boot polish. Son, I don't

1109
00:58:10,680 --> 00:58:13,080
Speaker 3: know if we're going to have a parade today. You

1110
00:58:13,160 --> 00:58:16,720
Speaker 3: stare at him in disbelief, unsure you've heard what he

1111
00:58:16,960 --> 00:58:20,040
Speaker 3: just said. A door slams shut on a storefront down

1112
00:58:20,080 --> 00:58:22,680
Speaker 3: the street, and the sound causes a mass of tiny,

1113
00:58:22,920 --> 00:58:26,280
Speaker 3: delicate flapping from a tree behind you. The sky above

1114
00:58:26,320 --> 00:58:30,120
Speaker 3: you now crowds with starlings and a murmuration. They undulate

1115
00:58:30,240 --> 00:58:33,240
Speaker 3: as one mask, twisting and contorting in the sky, headed

1116
00:58:33,280 --> 00:58:35,920
Speaker 3: for the fields outside of town. You'd love to fly

1117
00:58:36,040 --> 00:58:39,600
Speaker 3: away with them right now. Are you Sadie's kin? The

1118
00:58:39,680 --> 00:58:43,800
Speaker 3: man asks you, yes, sir. You reply, I'm Clifton. He

1119
00:58:43,920 --> 00:58:46,640
Speaker 3: tells you, Sadie's late husband was one of my cousins.

1120
00:58:47,000 --> 00:58:49,400
Speaker 3: You can call me Hawk. You think on that for

1121
00:58:49,480 --> 00:58:52,480
Speaker 3: a moment. You tell him your name is Hugh, and

1122
00:58:52,560 --> 00:58:56,200
Speaker 3: what should you call me? You ask, Let's call you Tiger.

1123
00:58:56,920 --> 00:59:01,040
Speaker 3: You love that tiger. Hawk asks if you want to

1124
00:59:01,080 --> 00:59:02,680
Speaker 3: hop in his truck and look and see if there's

1125
00:59:02,720 --> 00:59:05,800
Speaker 3: anyone at all from the circus around You agree, you're

1126
00:59:05,880 --> 00:59:08,240
Speaker 3: Tiger now, and that's the sort of thing Tiger would

1127
00:59:08,240 --> 00:59:11,280
Speaker 3: do with Hawk. Hawk shouts down the block to another

1128
00:59:11,360 --> 00:59:13,440
Speaker 3: man that he's gonna go check out the rodeo grounds.

1129
00:59:13,640 --> 00:59:16,160
Speaker 3: The man nods you and Hawk get into his old

1130
00:59:16,200 --> 00:59:19,720
Speaker 3: bookout it roars to life. The engine sputters a little,

1131
00:59:20,040 --> 00:59:22,400
Speaker 3: and then reliably chugs you both down the road to

1132
00:59:22,480 --> 00:59:26,680
Speaker 3: the rodeo grounds. Hawk whistles a lonesome tune. You stare

1133
00:59:26,720 --> 00:59:29,439
Speaker 3: out the window, tracking the starlings on their dance across

1134
00:59:29,560 --> 00:59:32,520
Speaker 3: the fields. You get to the rodeo grounds and it's empty,

1135
00:59:32,840 --> 00:59:36,440
Speaker 3: save a man in a plaid shirt. Argie. Hawk calls

1136
00:59:36,480 --> 00:59:39,240
Speaker 3: it to him. He walks over to the truck, Hawk

1137
00:59:39,280 --> 00:59:42,720
Speaker 3: cuts the engine. They quietly discuss the situation at hand.

1138
00:59:43,280 --> 00:59:47,640
Speaker 3: No parade, no circus. You gather that some guy named

1139
00:59:47,880 --> 00:59:52,080
Speaker 3: f Bam Morrison's skipped town. He took everybody's money. Half

1140
00:59:52,160 --> 00:59:54,440
Speaker 3: the folks are spitting mad, and the other feel half

1141
00:59:54,640 --> 00:59:59,000
Speaker 3: like fools suckers. Argie looks into the cab at the

1142
00:59:59,040 --> 01:00:03,000
Speaker 3: truck and sees you. Who's this? He asks, It's Sadie's nephew,

1143
01:00:03,200 --> 01:00:08,160
Speaker 3: names Tiger. Howdy Tiger, Argie says, for all the disappointment

1144
01:00:08,280 --> 01:00:11,120
Speaker 3: of missing the parade and the circus and the balloons

1145
01:00:11,280 --> 01:00:14,040
Speaker 3: and the feats of daring. Do you are filled with

1146
01:00:14,120 --> 01:00:17,480
Speaker 3: a new pride. You really are a grown boy. You're

1147
01:00:17,520 --> 01:00:21,680
Speaker 3: not underfoot, you're not annoying, You're just a good boy.

1148
01:00:25,600 --> 01:00:27,720
Speaker 2: By the new nickname, I want to be called Hawk.

1149
01:00:27,840 --> 01:00:31,080
Speaker 3: Now, Hawk, you can be hawk. That's a good name, right, Totally.

1150
01:00:31,880 --> 01:00:34,240
Speaker 3: I have to confess, I, you know, was going through

1151
01:00:34,400 --> 01:00:38,280
Speaker 3: like current and past, uh, like social media posts from

1152
01:00:38,280 --> 01:00:43,920
Speaker 3: people from the town and news reports, newspapers, names so hard,

1153
01:00:44,960 --> 01:00:50,480
Speaker 3: so great, the people of the town, they went back

1154
01:00:50,520 --> 01:00:56,520
Speaker 3: to their days. The visitors dispersed, and I had to

1155
01:00:56,600 --> 01:00:59,240
Speaker 3: have to have something there, and so all the merchants

1156
01:00:59,240 --> 01:01:01,480
Speaker 3: they're left holding the bag, right of course, but this

1157
01:01:01,640 --> 01:01:04,600
Speaker 3: is a plucky town. I can't tell you what a

1158
01:01:04,720 --> 01:01:07,640
Speaker 3: soft spot I have for this place that I've developed

1159
01:01:07,680 --> 01:01:10,320
Speaker 3: in researching them. Like of course, you know, I go

1160
01:01:10,400 --> 01:01:14,120
Speaker 3: to Google street View. It looks so much now like

1161
01:01:14,320 --> 01:01:17,000
Speaker 3: a lot of small towns that I've visited or known

1162
01:01:17,080 --> 01:01:20,760
Speaker 3: well or lived in like this rich agricultural past, a

1163
01:01:20,880 --> 01:01:23,840
Speaker 3: lot of industry that boomed and then left, and they

1164
01:01:23,920 --> 01:01:26,680
Speaker 3: suffer all the ills that we can throw at them.

1165
01:01:26,760 --> 01:01:29,080
Speaker 3: But they hang on. They have like a main street,

1166
01:01:29,160 --> 01:01:31,440
Speaker 3: and they have a main street that's like you know

1167
01:01:31,720 --> 01:01:34,800
Speaker 3: a lot of stop empty storefronts and like yeah, and

1168
01:01:35,040 --> 01:01:38,840
Speaker 3: it's and especially there they're also dealing with like you know,

1169
01:01:39,520 --> 01:01:45,040
Speaker 3: native populations and having to you know, Surger, you mentioned

1170
01:01:45,080 --> 01:01:50,560
Speaker 3: that definitely totally. And so they're plucky, right, they hang on.

1171
01:01:50,840 --> 01:01:53,360
Speaker 3: And that's what they did in the wake of f BAM.

1172
01:01:54,760 --> 01:01:57,280
Speaker 3: They had all the fixings for a party. Why not

1173
01:01:57,400 --> 01:02:01,440
Speaker 3: go ahead and have one. McWilliams, the publisher of the

1174
01:02:01,480 --> 01:02:05,360
Speaker 3: Watunka Gazette, decided that they didn't have to hang their

1175
01:02:05,400 --> 01:02:08,560
Speaker 3: heads in shame. They could celebrate this whole fiasco and

1176
01:02:08,640 --> 01:02:11,720
Speaker 3: have a good laugh. Once we decided to laugh about

1177
01:02:11,760 --> 01:02:14,120
Speaker 3: it and chalk it up to experience, we all felt better,

1178
01:02:14,240 --> 01:02:18,040
Speaker 3: said Argie Taylor. So the boy Scouts they served up

1179
01:02:18,080 --> 01:02:21,160
Speaker 3: the one hundred pounds of hot dogs for free from

1180
01:02:21,240 --> 01:02:24,439
Speaker 3: booths in the middle of main street businesses, hid little

1181
01:02:24,480 --> 01:02:26,880
Speaker 3: bits of money and all that hay that was ordered

1182
01:02:26,920 --> 01:02:28,840
Speaker 3: for the circus animals, and they let the kids dig

1183
01:02:28,920 --> 01:02:32,360
Speaker 3: around and find treasure. It turned into this huge party,

1184
01:02:32,480 --> 01:02:35,200
Speaker 3: and then they wanted to have one every year. And

1185
01:02:35,360 --> 01:02:36,800
Speaker 3: that's when Sucker's.

1186
01:02:36,440 --> 01:02:38,600
Speaker 2: Day was born Suckers Day.

1187
01:02:38,600 --> 01:02:41,560
Speaker 3: They created a holiday from it called Sucker's Day.

1188
01:02:41,760 --> 01:02:44,040
Speaker 2: I have loved you know, they talk about city mouse

1189
01:02:44,080 --> 01:02:49,160
Speaker 2: and country mouse. I love country It's so pure every time.

1190
01:02:49,280 --> 01:02:52,640
Speaker 3: So they're like, you know, he got away with some cash, right,

1191
01:02:52,760 --> 01:02:55,360
Speaker 3: but Sucker's Day is worth way more than that. This

1192
01:02:55,560 --> 01:02:58,400
Speaker 3: one kid in Watunka was asked about it, and he said,

1193
01:02:58,680 --> 01:03:02,000
Speaker 3: we couldn't have put him in jail. We'd come unsuckered

1194
01:03:02,000 --> 01:03:06,720
Speaker 3: if we did that. So the nineteen fifty one, like

1195
01:03:06,840 --> 01:03:09,520
Speaker 3: the next year, had a small parade. So there was

1196
01:03:09,960 --> 01:03:14,120
Speaker 3: a float that had this mock grave of the advanced

1197
01:03:14,160 --> 01:03:17,800
Speaker 3: man who'd fooled the town's dam, and it said died

1198
01:03:17,840 --> 01:03:22,280
Speaker 3: from laughing. Ten thousand people from fifteen different states came

1199
01:03:22,320 --> 01:03:23,560
Speaker 3: to this one the next year.

1200
01:03:23,560 --> 01:03:26,680
Speaker 4: Not fifteen different cities, fifteen different states states.

1201
01:03:26,720 --> 01:03:28,320
Speaker 2: So they told their family, their cousins.

1202
01:03:28,400 --> 01:03:31,160
Speaker 3: Yes, everybhere, it gets surrounded, probably runs in papers at

1203
01:03:31,200 --> 01:03:35,000
Speaker 3: this story. Each year. The celebration got bigger. Soon it

1204
01:03:35,080 --> 01:03:37,640
Speaker 3: was starting at noon the day before with his giant

1205
01:03:37,720 --> 01:03:41,480
Speaker 3: free barbecue. On the eve of Sucker's Day, Creek Indians

1206
01:03:41,560 --> 01:03:45,120
Speaker 3: in their native costumed dances, they played a game of

1207
01:03:45,200 --> 01:03:48,680
Speaker 3: Indian stickball at the school stadium. The next day there

1208
01:03:48,760 --> 01:03:52,280
Speaker 3: was the parade. Bands played, they had drill teams from

1209
01:03:52,360 --> 01:03:54,480
Speaker 3: the town, and like all these surrounding towns.

1210
01:03:54,400 --> 01:03:58,200
Speaker 4: I Michael imagining, like Midwest syndicated columnists like Mike Reiko.

1211
01:03:57,920 --> 01:03:58,720
Speaker 2: Writing about this.

1212
01:03:59,080 --> 01:04:03,680
Speaker 3: There was hog call pie, eating pop drinking, catching a

1213
01:04:03,760 --> 01:04:07,560
Speaker 3: greased pig. They had a softball game the fact, and

1214
01:04:07,600 --> 01:04:10,080
Speaker 3: then they would have like this, gather around and we're

1215
01:04:10,120 --> 01:04:13,080
Speaker 3: gonna tell the tale of Succer Day, like how it

1216
01:04:13,160 --> 01:04:13,600
Speaker 3: came about.

1217
01:04:13,680 --> 01:04:15,800
Speaker 2: I can't believe this isn't like a play or a movie.

1218
01:04:16,360 --> 01:04:20,040
Speaker 3: There was a greased pole climbing contests, a can can

1219
01:04:20,240 --> 01:04:23,400
Speaker 3: dance done by quote beautiful Hollywood dancers who turned out

1220
01:04:23,400 --> 01:04:27,560
Speaker 3: to be local businessmen in costumes, and then at night,

1221
01:04:27,720 --> 01:04:29,680
Speaker 3: to top it all off, a big square dance up

1222
01:04:29,720 --> 01:04:34,240
Speaker 3: and down main streams like it sounds dreamy, it sounds amazing,

1223
01:04:34,360 --> 01:04:37,560
Speaker 3: and it fills me with joy and hope and I

1224
01:04:37,760 --> 01:04:40,440
Speaker 3: love it. So. A couple of years after the very

1225
01:04:40,520 --> 01:04:44,120
Speaker 3: first Suckers Day, people jammed the sidewalks overflowed into the

1226
01:04:44,160 --> 01:04:47,320
Speaker 3: street because they were looking for f. Bam Morrison. He

1227
01:04:47,480 --> 01:04:49,640
Speaker 3: promised to come to Sucker's Day that year.

1228
01:04:49,840 --> 01:04:50,479
Speaker 2: Get out.

1229
01:04:50,680 --> 01:04:52,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, one thought they'd ever hear from him again,

1230
01:04:52,600 --> 01:04:55,600
Speaker 3: But then Rgie Taylor got a long distance call from

1231
01:04:55,640 --> 01:05:00,680
Speaker 3: authorities in Warrensburg, Missouri. They had f. Bam Morrison in

1232
01:05:00,800 --> 01:05:05,400
Speaker 3: jail there. According to the Post dispatch quote, it seems

1233
01:05:05,480 --> 01:05:07,920
Speaker 3: that f. Bam in nineteen fifty one had gone to

1234
01:05:08,040 --> 01:05:11,000
Speaker 3: the little town of Holden near Warrensburg, where he had

1235
01:05:11,040 --> 01:05:13,560
Speaker 3: painted a glowing picture of the circus he was bringing

1236
01:05:13,600 --> 01:05:16,800
Speaker 3: to town. He collected money from the merchants and departed,

1237
01:05:17,160 --> 01:05:19,280
Speaker 3: but he made the mistake of going back to hold

1238
01:05:19,320 --> 01:05:22,400
Speaker 3: In this spring, and they recognized him. They called the

1239
01:05:22,480 --> 01:05:26,120
Speaker 3: sheriff at Warrensburg and f. Bam was arrested, charged with

1240
01:05:26,200 --> 01:05:29,560
Speaker 3: obtaining money under false pretenses. He pleaded guilty, was fined

1241
01:05:29,640 --> 01:05:31,760
Speaker 3: fifty dollars and give him thirty days in jail.

1242
01:05:31,880 --> 01:05:33,960
Speaker 2: I figured he had a blown tire or something to

1243
01:05:34,040 --> 01:05:34,480
Speaker 2: leave town.

1244
01:05:34,680 --> 01:05:38,320
Speaker 3: The jail sentence was suspended, however, on condition that he

1245
01:05:38,440 --> 01:05:42,400
Speaker 3: pay the fine and leave town. F Bam succeeded after

1246
01:05:42,440 --> 01:05:45,160
Speaker 3: a few long distance calls in raising the money, so

1247
01:05:45,280 --> 01:05:48,280
Speaker 3: he was released after having spent about ten days in jail.

1248
01:05:48,960 --> 01:05:52,440
Speaker 3: Warrensburg authorities wanted to know if we still wanted f.

1249
01:05:52,560 --> 01:05:55,919
Speaker 3: Bam Ourgie Taylor related we had sent out an arrest

1250
01:05:56,080 --> 01:05:59,000
Speaker 3: order for him back in nineteen fifty. I told him

1251
01:05:59,040 --> 01:06:00,560
Speaker 3: that we still wanted them all all right, but not

1252
01:06:00,680 --> 01:06:02,760
Speaker 3: for the same reasons. I asked to talk to him.

1253
01:06:03,280 --> 01:06:05,240
Speaker 3: They brought him to the telephone and it was f

1254
01:06:05,320 --> 01:06:07,520
Speaker 3: bam all right. I told him we don't want to

1255
01:06:07,600 --> 01:06:09,960
Speaker 3: prosecute him, but we did want him as our guest

1256
01:06:10,040 --> 01:06:12,920
Speaker 3: for Suckers Day. Offered to pay his expenses and give

1257
01:06:13,000 --> 01:06:15,600
Speaker 3: him one hundred dollars. He promised he would be here.

1258
01:06:15,960 --> 01:06:18,440
Speaker 3: A couple of weeks later, he called me from Saint Louis.

1259
01:06:18,640 --> 01:06:21,960
Speaker 3: Collect Of course, he said he needed twenty five dollars.

1260
01:06:22,400 --> 01:06:25,960
Speaker 3: I didn't send it to him, and we've never heard

1261
01:06:25,960 --> 01:06:28,280
Speaker 3: from him since. He said when he called he had

1262
01:06:28,320 --> 01:06:30,680
Speaker 3: a job with a show over in Kansas and he

1263
01:06:30,800 --> 01:06:32,920
Speaker 3: needed twenty five bucks to tide him over until his

1264
01:06:33,080 --> 01:06:36,240
Speaker 3: check came through from his last job. You know, said Argie.

1265
01:06:36,520 --> 01:06:39,960
Speaker 3: He sounded so convincing. I came within an ace of

1266
01:06:40,120 --> 01:06:45,760
Speaker 3: sending him that money. So Sucker's Day continued through the fifties,

1267
01:06:45,920 --> 01:06:47,760
Speaker 3: then it fell off, then it was revived in the

1268
01:06:47,840 --> 01:06:51,160
Speaker 3: late seventies, and I think they still celebrate it today. Really,

1269
01:06:51,320 --> 01:06:55,560
Speaker 3: and I would love to attend. Yes, grand trip, Let's

1270
01:06:55,600 --> 01:06:55,800
Speaker 3: do it.

1271
01:06:56,040 --> 01:06:56,840
Speaker 2: I'm so down.

1272
01:06:58,560 --> 01:07:00,640
Speaker 3: Sucker's Day, and I just want to tell these people

1273
01:07:00,680 --> 01:07:02,800
Speaker 3: how much I love them. Even though I don't know them,

1274
01:07:03,240 --> 01:07:04,560
Speaker 3: I love them absolutely.

1275
01:07:04,720 --> 01:07:06,360
Speaker 2: This is like the best of America.

1276
01:07:06,480 --> 01:07:08,680
Speaker 3: It is is there, And what's your ridiculous takeaway?

1277
01:07:09,120 --> 01:07:12,000
Speaker 4: I cannot believe this is real. I can't wait for

1278
01:07:12,080 --> 01:07:14,400
Speaker 4: you to be like a sucker, you know at the

1279
01:07:14,680 --> 01:07:17,040
Speaker 4: very end, this is incredible.

1280
01:07:18,000 --> 01:07:21,520
Speaker 2: So I keep repeating myself with this, but this is

1281
01:07:21,600 --> 01:07:23,800
Speaker 2: like the America that I think we all can agree

1282
01:07:23,920 --> 01:07:26,080
Speaker 2: that the innocence, and then like let's make the best

1283
01:07:26,120 --> 01:07:27,880
Speaker 2: of this and come together as a community, and the

1284
01:07:27,920 --> 01:07:29,760
Speaker 2: boy Scouts will sell the hot dogs. I mean, like

1285
01:07:30,080 --> 01:07:31,040
Speaker 2: you just gotta love.

1286
01:07:31,200 --> 01:07:36,760
Speaker 3: I think that's what like my takeaway, That's what resonates

1287
01:07:36,840 --> 01:07:39,280
Speaker 3: with me too with this particular story, is that it's

1288
01:07:39,320 --> 01:07:41,640
Speaker 3: like we talk about like this is what the America

1289
01:07:41,800 --> 01:07:44,080
Speaker 3: that we know and we love. So we have these

1290
01:07:44,120 --> 01:07:47,600
Speaker 3: people who have been crapped on, yeah, and they're not

1291
01:07:47,840 --> 01:07:50,680
Speaker 3: bitter about it and they're not embarrassed like they were

1292
01:07:50,840 --> 01:07:52,840
Speaker 3: ashamed at first and then they realized, wait a second,

1293
01:07:52,880 --> 01:07:55,439
Speaker 3: I have nothing to be ashamed. Of yeah, and they're

1294
01:07:55,480 --> 01:07:57,720
Speaker 3: willing to admit Yeah, you know what, I fell for it.

1295
01:07:58,400 --> 01:08:00,480
Speaker 3: So if you could admit your mistake and you can

1296
01:08:00,520 --> 01:08:03,920
Speaker 3: admit your failings and then turn around and turn it

1297
01:08:04,000 --> 01:08:07,960
Speaker 3: into this really beautiful event to celebrate this community that

1298
01:08:08,120 --> 01:08:09,280
Speaker 3: loves and cares for each other.

1299
01:08:09,440 --> 01:08:10,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, come up with a reason to get together.

1300
01:08:11,160 --> 01:08:14,280
Speaker 3: Idea that if this attraction was coming to town, how

1301
01:08:14,440 --> 01:08:17,200
Speaker 3: awesome they were going to make it for everybody who attended.

1302
01:08:17,800 --> 01:08:19,960
Speaker 3: They weren't looking out for their own interests. I mean

1303
01:08:19,960 --> 01:08:22,960
Speaker 3: they were, but it was like the overarching theme was like,

1304
01:08:23,080 --> 01:08:25,800
Speaker 3: let's have something really great here. Yeah, and it's going

1305
01:08:25,840 --> 01:08:27,960
Speaker 3: to benefit all of us. So it was like a

1306
01:08:28,080 --> 01:08:30,840
Speaker 3: collective of them all working together and to turn that

1307
01:08:30,960 --> 01:08:34,400
Speaker 3: into this like collective action of just the best party

1308
01:08:34,479 --> 01:08:36,479
Speaker 3: ever that just keeps growing and growing.

1309
01:08:36,920 --> 01:08:39,240
Speaker 4: And also not getting mad at the guy who condom

1310
01:08:39,520 --> 01:08:41,280
Speaker 4: because he didn't take him for too much.

1311
01:08:41,400 --> 01:08:43,719
Speaker 2: You know. It's like just at the level they're like, okay,

1312
01:08:43,760 --> 01:08:45,639
Speaker 2: but you have to hear.

1313
01:08:45,520 --> 01:08:48,639
Speaker 3: You can take money, but he couldn't take who they are, Yeah, exactly,

1314
01:08:48,800 --> 01:08:51,439
Speaker 3: and so these are good, good people and you can't

1315
01:08:51,520 --> 01:08:54,800
Speaker 3: take that, And like we need to remember that, like

1316
01:08:55,320 --> 01:08:58,040
Speaker 3: when we feel like and we have had things taken

1317
01:08:58,120 --> 01:09:01,280
Speaker 3: from us. They're so they're affables that can't be taken

1318
01:09:01,320 --> 01:09:04,240
Speaker 3: from us, and that's who makes us who we are. Yeah,

1319
01:09:04,360 --> 01:09:06,600
Speaker 3: And so it's just like we can feel bitter and

1320
01:09:06,640 --> 01:09:10,240
Speaker 3: we can feel irritated or you know, damaged and wounded

1321
01:09:10,280 --> 01:09:12,800
Speaker 3: by things, but the truth of the matter is like

1322
01:09:13,040 --> 01:09:14,960
Speaker 3: who we are doesn't change, and we need to like

1323
01:09:15,479 --> 01:09:19,080
Speaker 3: recognize that, celebrate that in ourselves and in each other,

1324
01:09:19,280 --> 01:09:21,320
Speaker 3: like when we see it in each other too. And

1325
01:09:21,439 --> 01:09:23,200
Speaker 3: sometimes you got to take the hit in order for

1326
01:09:23,280 --> 01:09:25,519
Speaker 3: the greater good. You know, they didn't pay him for

1327
01:09:25,600 --> 01:09:29,040
Speaker 3: the hundred hot dogs, but we're talking about it and

1328
01:09:29,200 --> 01:09:31,760
Speaker 3: how much joy did that give people, like in the

1329
01:09:31,840 --> 01:09:35,000
Speaker 3: face of that. So anyway, God, I love that story.

1330
01:09:36,560 --> 01:09:48,920
Speaker 6: So we need to talk back now too, God, I let.

1331
01:09:52,760 --> 01:09:55,360
Speaker 5: He's Aaron and Elizabeth. I just had a funny story

1332
01:09:55,400 --> 01:09:57,759
Speaker 5: for you. The first time I ever listened to you guys,

1333
01:09:58,160 --> 01:10:00,320
Speaker 5: I was on a four hour flight and it was

1334
01:10:00,439 --> 01:10:07,599
Speaker 5: the Disney World Theft Guy, Fiery pcp Man and Frank

1335
01:10:07,680 --> 01:10:10,840
Speaker 5: Sinatra Junior episodes, and you guys had me laughing so

1336
01:10:11,000 --> 01:10:13,960
Speaker 5: hard I was crying, which made the guy sitting next

1337
01:10:14,000 --> 01:10:18,479
Speaker 5: to me very uncomfortable throughout the flight. So awesome job

1338
01:10:18,600 --> 01:10:19,720
Speaker 5: and keep up the good work.

1339
01:10:20,439 --> 01:10:23,519
Speaker 3: That's we've won. That's all I got, isn't that the

1340
01:10:23,760 --> 01:10:26,160
Speaker 3: It's like the best and worst feeling when you're listening

1341
01:10:26,200 --> 01:10:29,880
Speaker 3: to something or reading something and you're just dying laughing

1342
01:10:30,000 --> 01:10:31,040
Speaker 3: and no one knows what it is.

1343
01:10:32,320 --> 01:10:33,280
Speaker 2: What do you get?

1344
01:10:34,080 --> 01:10:35,960
Speaker 3: And it's it feels so good, but it's also like

1345
01:10:36,040 --> 01:10:37,920
Speaker 3: you want it to just stop, like hold on, I

1346
01:10:38,000 --> 01:10:40,240
Speaker 3: gotta focus. And now everyone's looking at me because I'm

1347
01:10:41,000 --> 01:10:43,479
Speaker 3: got well. I am so happy that A we got

1348
01:10:43,520 --> 01:10:45,640
Speaker 3: you through a four hour flight, yeah for real, and

1349
01:10:46,080 --> 01:10:49,639
Speaker 3: uh B that we made you chuckle. That's my life's goal.

1350
01:10:50,160 --> 01:10:51,960
Speaker 2: Same make this person laugh.

1351
01:10:52,320 --> 01:10:55,120
Speaker 3: I did it. I can die no, all right, So

1352
01:10:56,000 --> 01:10:58,120
Speaker 3: that's it for today. You can find us online at

1353
01:10:58,200 --> 01:11:02,599
Speaker 3: ridiculous Crime dot com. We're at ridiculous Crime on blueski

1354
01:11:02,760 --> 01:11:10,599
Speaker 3: and in stogram YouTube, Ridiculous Crime, podebe otube, utube. Sorry,

1355
01:11:10,680 --> 01:11:14,880
Speaker 3: I'm just learning. Email us at ridiculous Crime at gmail

1356
01:11:14,960 --> 01:11:18,320
Speaker 3: dot com. Leave a talkback on the iHeart app. Please

1357
01:11:18,400 --> 01:11:27,000
Speaker 3: please please, I love those reach out. Ridiculous Crime is

1358
01:11:27,040 --> 01:11:30,679
Speaker 3: hosted by Elicath Dutton and Saren Burnett, produced and edited

1359
01:11:30,760 --> 01:11:35,360
Speaker 3: by Circusman to the Stars Dave Kusten, starring Amilie Rutger

1360
01:11:35,600 --> 01:11:40,400
Speaker 3: as Judas. Research is by contortionist Mursa Brown and happy

1361
01:11:40,479 --> 01:11:43,800
Speaker 3: clown Jabbari Davis. The theme song is by Thomas Lee

1362
01:11:43,920 --> 01:11:46,400
Speaker 3: and Travis Dutton, two men who were recently eaten by

1363
01:11:46,479 --> 01:11:49,439
Speaker 3: a lion. Post wardrobe is provided by Botany five hundred

1364
01:11:49,520 --> 01:11:53,519
Speaker 3: guest Haron, makeup by Sparkleshot and mister Andre. Executive producers

1365
01:11:53,560 --> 01:11:57,880
Speaker 3: are Ben Ringling Brothers Bowlin and Noel Garden Brothers Brown.

1366
01:12:03,120 --> 01:12:08,719
Speaker 3: Ridicous Crime, Say It One More Time Pridiquious Crime.

1367
01:12:09,840 --> 01:12:13,160
Speaker 1: Ridiculous Crime is a production of iHeartRadio. Four more podcasts

1368
01:12:13,200 --> 01:12:16,320
Speaker 1: from my heart Radio. Visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

1369
01:12:16,439 --> 01:12:18,240
Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.